MMA Fighting - BTL | UFC White House Updates, UFC Perth, Oliveira vs. Gamrot, Jake vs. Tank

Episode Date: September 25, 2025

UFC CEO Dana White gave fans and media a look at the renderings for what the UFC White House event may look like when the promotion puts on the historic card in June. How does it all look, plus what is this actually supposed to be in execution? On an all-new edition of Between the Links, the panel reacts to the renderings White shared to Fox News, and try to decipher what the event is — is it a massive UFC card on the White House's South Lawn, or will be a U.S. vs. the world type card? Additionally, topics include Charles Oliveira getting a new opponent for the UFC Rio main event against Mateusz Gamrot and if it was the right call, UFC Perth this Saturday headlined by Carlos Ulberg vs. Dominick Reyes, Jake Paul vs. Tank Davis getting a new location, and having the first two press conferences to promote the card, and much more. Host Mike Heck moderates the matchup between MMA Fighting's Jed Meshew and Morning Kombat's Brian Campbell. Follow Mike Heck: ⁠⁠⁠⁠@m_heckjr⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow Jed Meshew: ⁠⁠⁠⁠@JedKMeshew⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow Brian Campbell: ⁠⁠⁠⁠@BCampbell Subscribe:⁠⁠⁠⁠ http://goo.gl/dYpsgH⁠⁠⁠⁠ Check out our full video catalog: ⁠⁠⁠⁠http://goo.gl/u8VvLi⁠⁠⁠⁠ Visit our playlists:⁠⁠⁠⁠ http://goo.gl/eFhsvM⁠⁠⁠⁠ Like MMAF on Facebook: ⁠⁠⁠⁠http://goo.gl/uhdg7Z⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow on Twitter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠http://goo.gl/nOATUI⁠⁠⁠⁠ Read More: ⁠⁠⁠⁠http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Wi-Fi available to AeroPlan members on equip flights sponsored by Bell Conditions apply see Air Canada.com You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. On MMA Fighting Studios, this is Between the Links. And now, your host, my... The iconic voice of Esther Lynn welcomes you to a brand new edition of BTL. Happy Thursday to us all.

We are back. And classic BTL style, we got ourselves a matchup. A BTL rivalry writes its next chapter. and we have a lot to discuss this week. But let's get right into this. Let us introduce the combatants first. You know him? You'll love him.

Some of you might not, but he loves all of you either way. He is Mr. No Gray area, the hot take kid, and MMA's original climber from MMAFighting.com. Jed Bishu. Where is he? Go dogs, Jed.

How are you? Go dogs. Big weekend for the dogs coming up. Bamah. And I, you know what? Let's just get this out, right out of the gate. Hand up. I believe in accountability. It's the second best ability behind availability.

We're late because of me. I had some internet issues and that's why we're getting started a little late here. So hand up. You know, doc me points. This is I missed weight. I missed wait for this fight and, you know, there's going to be an asterisk. There's no bonus available for me, all that sort of thing. The Calvin Gasselm of BTL. So that'll be great for next week. I didn't miss weight by that. Oh man. And his opponent, he made weight. He made wait for this, this marquee matchup. He is a professional. And it has been a while since this man has been on the show. And we're happy to have him. He absolutely hammered me on the prop quiz game show. He's here looking to drop the hammer on Jed today for morning combat from the Brian Campbell experience and 18 other shows on YouTube. Hide your hot dogs because BC is back. Brian Campbell, how are you, man?

Yeah, yeah. Speaking of abilities, the probability of me winning today, pretty strong. So happy to be here. Yeah. I love you. You saying hide your hot dogs and not hide your weaners because that's what I would have gone for. Yeah, we're a classy show here on Thursdays, Jed.

If this is like a Wednesday show, perhaps we would have gone that direction. But guys, let's get into this because I want to start with the UFC White House card. And I know it's sort of a topic that's been sort of beaten to death that this. point, but I want to do this because this is a safe space. And I'm confused of what this actually could be. So hopefully throughout this round, we can work it out together. And we're going to get there in a moment. But first, I want to talk about what we got to see on Friday night. We got to see the renderings of what this event will actually look like. Dana White shared them on Fox News. You get to see the White House in the background. There's this big arch and there's pyro and there's all sorts of

wild lighting and fighters are going to walk out from the freaking oval office to the octagon. So, B.C., I'll start with you. When you saw the renderings and the concept thus far, what was your reaction to it? I kind of got a little bit of excited. And, you know, like I was like a lot of people going, why are we putting cage fighting on the damn White House lawn? What has become of this country ahead of the 250th birthday? I don't know if it's because I'm, you know, a quasi-TKO employee.

now. Shout out to Paramount in 26, but no, really even putting that aside, I have to say, look, you could go up and down the road about the politics of it and play a weird game there, or you can focus on the fact that deep inside we all are MMA fans, and the feeling I'm getting here is that this could really be a one-of-one supercard. Is it a, is it a little tacky, is it a little bit of a, I don't know, of a real show-me type event, of course. But I think, unlike the sphere, which was solid, but I feel from a matchmaking standpoint, wasn't well throw it out, was hastily put together. I think you can say the same thing about UFC 300, even though it turned out okay.

We had major concerns coming up here. This is a card that's more than nine months away. And whether they're just trying to fill news during a slow period or not, they kind of got me fired up, that this could be a unique one-on-one event. And maybe, as Dana White said on Fox News, the biggest card in the history of the sport. Will that affect matchmaking coming in and going out? Look, a lot of things have to happen between now and then for this to even remotely live up to what it could be. But if we want this sport to be in people's living rooms and we know that this is going to be live and direct for

free on CBS, I mean, this is pretty interesting. You've got the biggest names almost fighting over each other to get their hand raised in beyond this card. I wonder if we're going to end up, especially since there he seemed to be actually planning it from a distance with a mixture of the biggest fights you can make today, some alumni is coming out of retirement, almost like an all-star game type feel. I'm not going to do the whole, you know, Patriotic, let's celebrate our country thing.

I'm really just going selfishly from an MMA standpoint. Seeing all that weirdness and the spectacle of what it is, I don't know. For the first time I kind of said, look, rather than fight it, let's embrace it. Because this is going to be weird, and this is going to be special. And I hope they hit a home run.

I'm glad you said that. And I want to get to that in a second. But Jed, when you saw the renderings, what did you think? Were you like, oh, this is pretty sick? Or are you just like, eh? Because I've seen a mixture of both reaction-wise. Dude, it is the most complicated I've felt about something in this space for quite some time. Because originally I was like, oh, that's just not going to happen.

Because, like, I am old enough to remember when we were promised to fight, Island and Fight Island was going to be something cool and exciting and it was Yazurina which they'd already done events at and they didn't do anything cool. At the same time this feels a little it's starting to feel a little more like the sphere card right where like okay they're going to do something and even though like I think frankly we're honest about the spear card it was not like the best thing ever it was at least something different, which is what we are always asking for, that they try a little harder. And this feels like that.

And so at a baseline level, I think if that's the only way you want to sort of engage with this, there's nothing wrong with that. And that's fun, right? Like, this will be fun if that is all you are going to look at is, oh, this is something different. They're making an effort. They're trying. These are the things we always ask for them to be promoters.

Then, okay. the other side of it and we all like we don't try and be political on this show at all and I'm not going to veer too hard into the politics of it but it is impossible to separate politics and sport when you're doing a fight card on the White House lawn

like for years a big chunk of fandom frankly from both sides of the aisle have been like hey shut up and dribble and I know over the past few years that has obviously just not been the case Like there is a good argument that U.S.C. events broadly have become political rallies for the, you know, right-wing American political parties. But like when you're doing a fight card on the White House lawn, there is no separation of politics. It is intrinsic there. And I don't, I don't know how to feel about it. It seems really weird.

Like, just straight up, this is the most idiocracy thing that's ever happened in a world that is progressively getting more. videocracy every day. And it is insane to like think this is where we are. Like I have been a fan of this sport long enough, right? To remember when getting on Facebook early prelims was a big deal. When you couldn't watch all the fights for the UFC because like they all, you could only see the pay-per-view stuff. And so to go to watch them, you'd have to buy the videotapes or like find them online

places. and now it's just like, actually, this is going to be on CBS from the White House lawn. I don't know what to make of it. It's really, really strange world that we're living in right now. So here's where I need some help here, boys. We're going to play a fun game called WTF is this actually going to be. And B.C. kind of laid out some different options. And this was inspired by a couple of things.

One, Daniel Cormier goes on his YouTube channel and basically pleads with Dana White to let John Jones fight on the card and to essentially do it for America. We need an American fighter to get a win at the White House. And the second thing is, I reacted to this saying that the UFC does not need him to be on the card because they don't need anybody for anything. And I stand by that and I will always stand by that. But I was surprised that a lot of fans agreed with Daniel Corbier because of the reasons DC laid out.

So it kind of got me to thinking what this could actually be, Jed. Like, what is UFC White House really? Is this a, a, a, you? UFC event at the White House where we load this thing up like UFC 300, but it just happens to take place on the freaking South Law of the White House? Or is this USA UFC, a spin on Noce UFC, where it's the United States versus the world? Like, what do you think this is? Because that part has not been really laid out by anybody from what I've seen. I think it is both. And it's a little mealy mouth of me. I understand. But,

I do believe it is both because on the one hand, as BC pointed out, as Dana has said, as sort of like this looks like, assuming it happens and it seems like it is, I'm no longer of that this won't happen, camp. It's going to be the biggest spectacle the promotion has done, right? Like it is, but definitionally has to be because of the stakes, the terms of engagement being on the White House lawn. And so as a result of that, and to be quite frank, because Donald Trump is president and Donald Trump is running this, Donald Trump is not a person who wants some dog shit fight card to be associated with his brand, his name. And that is at a very basic level what is happening here.

You know, there are other levels, but this is a president Donald Trump presents UFC White House. And he is going to want the biggest stars. and the biggest star in the world, and I'm sure we'll talk about it, is Connor McGregor. And I think there's a decent chance Connor McGregor fights here. And you can't really do an America versus the world when it's Connor McGregor Michael Chandler, because Connor is the A side. Donald Trump, Dana White, et cetera, you know, maybe it won't be rooting. They will want Connor to beat Michael Chandler if that's what's happening. But outside of that, the rest of it is going to be a miracle versus the world.

like it is and so I was not at all so I was a little surprised Daniel Cormier was the guy to make the argument and I don't know if he's just trying to gin favor up or whatever but like absolutely the John Jones represents America versus knock on wood God hope if it could ever happen which it won't Tom Aspinall you know America versus England on July 4th on the White House lawn you know the rest of the card will shake out that way because again this is an overtly political event, like the whole aspect of it. This is not a fight card. This is an overtly political event and will, as a result of that, end up necessitating in America versus everybody thing.

And frankly, for the vibes, hope the Americans do well, because it would honestly be incredibly funny if on the 250th anniversary of the founding of the nation on the White House law, a whole bunch of Americans get tuned up by a bunch of, you know, like Europeans and Russians and South Americans, Brazilians, whatever, it would be hilarious. But that's not the vibe they're trying to cultivate here. So it's going to be both. I think at the top, there's a real chance it won't be America versus the world. But there's absolutely going to be the undercurrent of that through the rest of this card.

B.C., what do you think? And on top of that, is Donald Trump in the war room putting these fights together? Are we putting Mazadol and Colby and Bo Niby? like DT's favorite fighters. Is he the Turkey-all shake of UFC White House where it's like, yeah, Dave, I like what you're doing, but I want to see this. No, I don't think it'll go that far

with the influence that Turkey has because ultimately Turkey's paying for the big moments. That's why he gets that. It's a whole other topic on who is paying for this, by the way. And I think the M.M.A. Draw had an interesting story this week about that it could be the taxpayers of the U.S. But separate from that and obviously separate from the stuff Jed was teasing. Look, I work with Luke Thomas on a regular basis.

I get the American sports washing tie in here. I guess I just look at it as it's not really anything new. Like we've kind of been through this for better or worse. I think for a lot of times worse over the past couple of years. But it is what it is. Donald Trump shows up at these UFC events. He gets a huge walkout like the Imperial March and then everybody comes up and shakes hands. The idea of doing it at the White House, either I'm trying to blind myself or maybe I believe

this could be something. a little bit different. Will it also be all of the stuff we just said, yes? But could it really be an idea that we floated around for like decades? A Super Bowl, an annual Super Bowl. I'm not saying let's annually put a card on the White House lawn. I feel like this is ultimately a one of one that not only ties into the Trump administration, it ties in to the U.S.'s 250th birthday. But I mean that idea of having a literal supercard once per year that is, you know, it's kind of what international fight week was supposed to be, or maybe in some years, felt like when you had a can't miss main event, a can't miss co-main event, a deep card top to bottom, think UFC 200,

and, you know, a full fight week of fan fest and Hall of Fames and all that stuff. If this is ultimately that, only it's not the sphere, it's not 300, it's the most loaded card we've ever seen, I think that's super special. I think that's super unique. I think it's at a right time where this Paramount deal does offer UFC the, opportunity to go even more mainstream than they already have before. I really feel like this could be something super special in that vein. And I think at least in the main event, you kind of have to play up the rematch of 1776,

not just because it's England versus U.S. as if anyone's still holding on to a, you know, actual political rivalry there. But just the key, honest fact, there's one American champion at Kayla Harrison. I expect her to be on this card, probably against Amanda Nunes. but that's not the main event. I don't think you can main event a fight that does not have an American fighting for a championship. And I'm starting to wonder whether this is genius,

you know, reverse psychology being done by the UFC, Dana White, and now by extension, Daniel Cormier, to get John Jones back in line and doing what he should have done, you know, a year or two years ago, which is consummate the unification of that heavyweight title, face the next big thing in Tom Aspernel. To me, there is no other main event they can make, that matters the most.

The best fighter of all time facing the new heavyweight of the new era and a fight that isn't five and a half years Mayweather Pachiaw delayed, but certainly was delayed and should have already happened. That's the fight I think you almost have to have on the White House lawn if you're doing the America's birthday trick.

It means a lot historically, and maybe it plays out perfectly for the UFC where John got cold feet right when reportedly the $30 million offer from Uncle Turkey came in. yesterday's price will not be tomorrow's price, John. So if they could somehow get John in here on a discount using the historic nature of this to get the fights they want to get, guys, we actually could be looking at one of the most loaded and unique fight cards we've ever seen in history. I'm not saying it's easy to suspend all the other ish that's going on around it.

I'm not saying that there's a zero percent chance. It won't be Trump, Turkey, Bibi, Kadyrov and Putin sitting next to each other. by the cage for all we know. This could be an absolute shit show of weird politics. But I don't think we can stop this card from happening. Is there an MMA plus side? There certainly is. I almost want to see how big they are going to go,

depending on who's paying for it, of course. And could we get Nate Connor three in the Coleman? Could we get five title fights? Could we get D.C. out of retirement? This could be the craziest thing we've ever seen here. What do you laugh at, Jed? the funniest thing Brian Campbell's ever said

I will pay you any I will bet you anything you want by anything name it that Connor McGregor is not in the co-main event or fucking ever again of anything but certainly not of this card if Connor's coming back and fighting Oh has he?

He's lost the leverage I don't know if you've seen his headlines over the past couple years or seen the state of his sobriety he's lost that leverage. He pulled out of IFW years ago. Okay. Sir, you have lost the control you once had.

No, he has the exact same control, which is I ain't doing it unless I'm doing what I want to do. He ain't, there's not a universe we live in or other people live in. In the multiversal theory of everything, not in one of those motherfuckers is Connor McGregor playing second fiddle to anybody. He ain't, he's the last man walking. This ain't Croke Park, okay? This is the White House, bro. Then he just won't fight. Then he won't fight.

That's fine. They don't need them. He's the one. By the way, I'm not saying they do. I'm laughing at you for saying we might get Connor Nate in the co-made. Motherfucking, please. That ain't never happen.

I'm just saying we can't underestimate how grandeur and ridiculous this card is going to be. So if we're all in and I don't think we can get out of it, then let's be all in, all in. I'm fine with that. Like I said, I believe this, they are going to go big because, again, like, I think they have to. The nature of the card is them actually putting a massive effort into this. I don't know that I'll be able to separate all the feelings, but if you, if ever, I'm not saying anyone watching this should, right?

Like you do however you want to engage with this is a, okay, because you are right, BC, this won't be anything different. It'll be more, right? Like it won't be, you know, President Donald Trump walking out and getting a three-minute interlude. It'll be here is President Donald Trump coming out to the presidential anthem from the White House into the thing. Like the whole thing will have a real kind of grimy patina to it. But you don't have to care about it because if all you want to do is focus on the fights, I am confident the fights they are going to set for this are going to.

going to be big because they have to. Because I can't imagine a worse headline than whatever weekend. This is it's not going to happen on the fourth, right? I think they've already said it's going to happen the week before, whatever. Then, you know, June 29th or whatever the day is. UFC White House under delivers boring fights and nobody. Like that is the thing they cannot have happen. So it's going to be a big thing.

You know, you just may have to really do. associate any feelings you have about separating sports and politics. Well, perhaps Connor McGregor opened the door for John Jones to BC. I don't know if you saw this, but Connor decided to hit up Twitter, much like John Jones has done in the past, and tweeted out, quote, 100 million to fight at the White House along with 100 U.S. golden visas for myself and family and friends. I look very forward to entertaining the fighting world once again, a pleasure I never take for granted. What is this?

Is this just Connor saying shit? Like, what are we doing here? I think it's Connor hearing, you know, not that he watches any of our shows, but hearing punditry of White House card drafts and who should headline this show. And, you know, it's not like it's not lost on me the personal pride and ego that Connor has to even create an idea where he's in the co-main event. So I think this is just him being like, just so you know, if you want me, it's going to cost you.

And you'll have to get my friend Daniel Kinnahen, back in this country or whoever else is on his guest list there, whatever his writer says, what is it, only read M&Ms. I mean, good try, Connor, but it's good. Look, again, I don't feel like they need him. I think it's only a plus for them in terms of selling this card that he suddenly feels all aggressive like he's coming back. The reality is if the main event is him versus Michael Chandler,

even though I think it's still a very viable, interesting action fight between two well past their prime exciting fighters and either former champions or champions, and ship level guys. If that's the main event, this card is a disappointment. That's the reality of it. Jed, what's say you? What did you think of this tweet?

I mean, I think this is just smart tweeting. I disagree with BC that if that's the main event, this is a disappointment. I agree that it would be a disappointment to hardcore MMA fans, maybe because like we all know the game, but this is not a card for the fans. This is, this card has nothing to do with MMA fans.

fans and everything to do with everything else. And so that is absolutely 100%. No doubt about it, like the fight that the most people broadly would care about. You know, Connor McGregor fighting at the White House lawn, that sells itself. And on that note, I think Connor is probably not going to get what he has bargained for here. Right? Like that, it's a bit of a steep price. Not impossible.

and I think obviously this is him throwing out a starting position publicly of of whatever but I think I think he could get it too like if he really wanted to go to the mat on this like the U.C doesn't need to do it I am not saying they need him want to be very clear about that but they want him for this like and more importantly and again this is the part that I think people are underestimating I think Donald Trump plays a bigger role in this card than anybody is recognizing. Not that he is in the war room, as you put it, Mike, and like building the card, but that he functionally has the veto power over this card where it's like, hey, this is my baby.

This is associated with me forever. This is the Trump brand, right? Like, I am the one who pitched it. It is me as president. This will go down associated with me. The first time something like this has ever happened, he will want it to be the biggest thing because that is always what he wants he always wants the biggest spectacle he wanted you know the however expensive the military parade of his birthday he always wants that

and the biggest game in fighting is connor and so connor has a little bit of room to to ask for stuff and he might get it i don't know that he will but like it's not ridiculous because what does money matter at this point like this is a hundred million dollars and the golden visas things who gives a shit they'll just throw out they don't give a fuck about that so like could happen just saying it could happen this is going to be the ufc 300 story uh for the next several months can't wait for dana to say we got a main event that's going to knock your socks off and it's john jones versus talison teshara ladies and gentlemen to get john the big win that's the thing too because also with connor throwing it out like this again for hardcore fans for us nobody

cares right like that it bc is correct we would be disappointed quote unquote with that announcement but for this is stuff that breaks through to the broader mainstream conner fighting at the white house and if the ufc comes out and is like actually our main event is gala harrison versus samananan nunes hardcore friends like that's kind of banging and everyone else's like who the fuck are these people why why is connor mcgregor not fighting on the white house lawn like i saw one time. Like that he is setting the bar as good negotiation tactic for him. Yeah.

UFC 300 ended up being the event for us. I mean, they sort of just fell into it. And then we put it over as being like the hardcore fans event. This is not for us, as you said, but they are going to the fan base that they want to bring in. That is what this card is going to be.

This is for the fan base that they want that believes in the UFC. I think Dana is this top tier celebrity and he's the greatest thing since sliced bread. and he's associated with Trump. Like, that's who they're catering towards. Like, but they're just going to do a full court press on this one. So something to watch. Hopefully we get some sort of announcement soon.

But no better way from moving on from the UFC White House than to go to UFC Rio because, okay, point for round one goes to, even though he was late, Jed Mishu gets the point. Well done. Beautiful. He's bringing the A game today. And we like it. BC's stepping up too.

So let's talk lightweights, guys. Let's talk the best division in the sport. UFC Rio, October 11th, the Year of Our Lord 2025, has a brand new main event. Charles Olivera, the former UFC lightweight champion, has a new opponent for the UFC's return to Brazil. He's no longer fighting Rafael Fiziv, who's out due to knee injury. He is now fighting Patush Gamrott, who steps in on a little less than three weeks notice. Jed, your reaction to this change?

And is this the right replacement opponent? I don't know if it's the right replacement opponent. It's one that I'm the happiest with, which is a little weird because like I think the fight is probably, I mean, it's less fun, right? For the fans in the Hafeel-Fiziz fight. But, I mean, think about what happened when the Fizziv-Olavera fight got booked. Like the immediate reaction, at least for me and for many, was as a quick turnaround for Charles Olivera, he just got slept badly. and a three-month turnaround against the guy who hits as hard as Zafal Fazeve does,

that's a bit tough. And so, like, selfishly, I was like, oh, Madoosh Garamon can't hurt him, so that's nice. Like, Charles Olivero won't be at risk of, like, serious long-term injury, which is great,

whereas, like, the Viziv thing could have been brutal. Maybe he loses. You know, I don't want to sell Garamont short in that regard, but he's not going to come in, and Garmont's not going to Iliot to pari his ass, you know?

So in that regard, I feel better about, I do still think the fight is good. It will be fun, a very different dynamic of a fight, going from Fiziv, who is obviously striker first and a very good defensive wrestler, to Germott, who is maybe the sports preeminent spam wrestler right now. Certainly the lightweight division is preeminent spam wrestler. And so Charles Olaver, I think this is a better matchup for him than the Fiziv fight was. I'm intrigued by it. I don't know if it's the right one, right? But it might be the right one for these circumstances.

I still maintain the right fight is Max Holloway, but just not on such a quick turnaround. But because Olivera wants to fight in Rio, they need a main event. You know, Hanato Morcano was the other name that was kind of associated with this. That probably makes more sense, you know, a Rio main event. But I do think that this one is the one I feel the best about if that kind of follows. BC, what say you? Were you excited?

Were you over the moon? Were you saying to yourself, they should have saved this one for the White House card? What were you thinking? No, I wasn't saying that. Look, let's be straight up and honest about it. It's the safest bet they could have gotten, in my opinion, right here. We heard sexier options were asked about BSD,

Benoit St. Denis, maybe being the biggest one with his management, ultimately saying they respect Oliva too much to not have a full camp against him. Even if they would have gotten more. Oikano, it would have had the potential for, you know, as long as it could last on no notice being just a full-on, all-Brazilian love shit fest of action and craziness. But at least this holds together the sanctity of a strong main event that matters for the top ten of the division. Olivares still ranked number four, despite that absolutely devastating vacant title loss

to Deporia. Gamrod's come in, I think right around number seven, has won four of his last five, still very much in contention. So there is sort of, you know, consequences. and things at stake from the standpoint of Gamrock gets this win, he's really going to get catapulted to the top of this division and be in legit title contention, where Oliver gets that very quick turnaround to remind everybody

that he can still finish you, he's still willing to dye his hair gray at any given time and sleep with your girl, and that maybe, you know, people can bounce back from that type of devastating loss that he had. My whole feel here is, you know, I'm still not over losing that Vancouver main event and for what that meant to the middleweight title picture,

which I think ultimately is a huge downgrade and really hurts RDR's chances of doing what he thought he could, which is secure a title shot with a victory. At least this keeps it alive. Not the sexiest matchup, though, especially considering how Gamrod has fought at times. But since it'll be in Brazil, since it's Charles Alvara, I think ultimately it's a win-win for all of us.

So nothing to complain about here. Yeah, I like this fight for a number of reasons, and both of you guys sort of laid, out why, but the biggest reason are the stakes overall, BC, because to me, like, Fiziv was just like a fun, interesting match. I'm like, oh, this is a nice little step up for Frizeeb. Like, the UFC really likes him. They're giving him Gathe a second time.

Now they're giving him all of error. And, but I don't think like the stakes were as high here on both sides of the equation because Fizizizzi continuously gets these opportunities. You can make a case that this is a must win for both guys for a number of reasons. and we sort of laid some of this out. Oliver is coming off the knockout, lost to Tuporia. He's lost two out of three. He's lost three out of five.

And Gamrots coming off of a dominant win against a surging guy in the division. He is four and one in his last five, but he sort of become the forgotten guy at lightweight after the loss of Dan Hooker, which is wild because that was by far the most fun fight of Matush Gamrots UFC run, gets a fight of the night bonus.

That was like plus 50,000 that a Matush Gamrott fight would be fighting. the night, but it happened here, but it was a loss at a bad time in the toughest division in the sport. So I ask you, Brian Campbell, who needs to win more? Charles Olivera or Matush Gamrod. I think it's Charles Olivera, if

him or any of us still fashions himself as a true elite who is still in this title picture. Now, when you're a former champion who can, you know, it's got the record for finishes and you're exciting as hell, you're really only one phone call away at all times from a title opportunity. But you

You nail the succession of late two losses in his last three, three of his last five. When he loses, he certainly can lose big like he did against both Islam, both Islam and Toporia. So I think considering that a lot of people think Gamrod is a step down from where prime Olivera was when he was on top in the champion of this division, I think there's much more pressure on him. There's much more to lose than him. While on the flip side, there's obviously more to gain from Gamrod. This is the win that could take him to legitimate title contention and have people truly believing in his chances,

given the win street, given the names he'd be in, although not all wins were the same, he gets that Fiziv win due to a leg injury. Still, it counts. It is what it is. But I think this would put Olivera firmly into a place he might already be in reality, which is just legend mode the rest of the way. Jay, what do you think?

Because Oliver is one of the more popular guys on the roster, and people are just excited to see him. Like even when Tony Ferguson was losing all these fights, people are still pumped to see him out there. They cheered him, one of the most popular guys on the roster, despite being on a terrible win streak. So there are still fights for him that are interesting at 155. But for Gamrod, and we've seen it with Marab and Balal

and some of these other Magamette Angolaev, where they had to take these super long roads to get to a title fight, basically had to knockoff contender after contender after contender. From where Gamrod was after the Dan Hooker fight to where he is now, this is a huge opportunity for him. So do you agree with BC that Oliver needs this one more? Or do you feel like Matush Gamrod's lightweight championship aspirations, despite taking this on short notice and doing the UFC a favor,

they're essentially on the line here. I think Gamron needs it more. I will say, fun fact, Gamrod has one less fight of the night than Charles Olivera does. For a guy broadly viewed as boring, he has three Fight of the Night awards, to his name. And Charles Oliver only has four Fight of the Knights,

despite having a much longer UFC career. So just throwing that out there. I do think he needs this more, though, because I think this is his last opportunity. And this is a real, hey, step in on short notice, big opportunity because he wins this, his next bout is a title eliminator. But if he loses this,

maybe he could get back to it, but it just doesn't seem likely, right? Like he has a loss to Dan Hooker already. Armand Sarukian just like flat out won't fight his ass despite the fact that he beat Armand Sarukian. And so, like I don't know where he goes, even though it would be an explicable loss, short notice going to Rio against the top flight guy like Charles Oliver

that loss is explicable, it still is a good excuse to bury him again to make him, you know, fight the Grant Dawson's of the world and defend his position, and he's 34. And so there's just, he's old. Like he is, he's not old old, but he is on the back end of the window here. And so I think every fight is big for him, but this one is a, the delta between a win and a loss here is so vast,

because a win is so significant for him and a loss is so detrimental. Whereas Charles Olavera, he's still super popular. A loss is bad, right? And it will always be bad, functionally for as long as Ilya Teporeal holds the title. But Tuporia is mercurial. Maybe Teporea loses. We really haven't seen him at lightweight. So, like, we don't know.

Even though I think we all think he will hold the belt for some time, it could happen. And also, he could just bail. Because he bailed on featherweight after one title of defense. Like, I know he's talked about it already. He might just like, screw it. I'm going to try and do something different. So Olaver is kind of always in the mix, even if he loses here, right? I mean, shit, he lost Arm and Sarukian.

And Z fought for the belt over, Sarukin. So I think Gamron needs this more for multiple reasons. And Charles Oliver kind of playing with house money right now because he doesn't seem intent to retire anytime soon. He's a Hall of Fame or whenever he does retire. So that won't be an issue. And so, yeah, like this is, he's kind of free rolling at this point. Yeah, I think this worked out for the card because I don't know if you've looked at this

lineup or needs help too. So, yeah. Yeah, not having Charles Oliver on it. It would have been tough. Like, trust me, I love the Davis-Figuero, Montel-Jackson fight. Don't know if it's a main event. And that card is just, guys falling out. It's Brazil versus the world.

It's Brazil versus the world. Yes, it's Brazil versus the world. Yeah, can we do a fight card from the Vevela next year or what? Do it from the Brazil. What was it, their parliament, whatever their thing is? Do that. Where's the Brazilian presidency? Can we get to Spain first before we start opening those doors for God's sake?

We got to go back to Bakuio de Alvarado. I want to be doing UFC Rio from the Palacio del Alvarado, assuming that is in Rio. I don't actually know where that is. Hey, if they pay for it, it could happen. It's in Brazil. Sorry. Well, UFC, well, UFC Rio isn't great. This is UFC 300 compared to UFC Perth.

And that's where we're going right now. The point for round two goes to. Are we going there? We don't have to talk about it. Brian Campbell, nicely done, one to one. Let the confetti shine. Ladies and gentlemen, plus jet in BC. UFC Perth is coming up on Saturday.

We are out of the UFC Apex. We're at the RAC arena. The main event is Carlos Oldberg versus Dominic Reyes. A fight with significant stakes, especially with the light heavyweight title on the line next weekend of UFC 320. I got nothing bad to say about UFC 320 at all. In fact, I'm so excited for UFC Perth

just so it can be over so we can get to UFC 320. But BC, BTL is the trust tree, right? And here in the trust tree, we tell the truth. We say what's on our minds here. The rest of this lineup is real tough. We lost the co-made event, and I was almost relieved as a viewer

that we have one less fight. So I ask you, BC. This is a real question. Outside of the apex, heck, maybe including the apex, is this the worst card of the year on paper? Oh, boy.

I'm going to say no, hopefully, optimistically, only because there will be a crowd, although it might not be full and they might not be paying full price if you've been following Australian television of late. And look,

it's a really good main event with a pretty damn good story attached to it, which even that we don't get some of these apex cards in Las Vegas that are the real bottom third tier of UFC fight nights where we're going, look, is there literally a reason for me to tune in? So is this card deep?

No, good Lord. I mean, I didn't even love that co-main event when Ebo Arslam was going to take a tour of Tafa and even that's gone. But can we focus on the positives here of why this still kind of matters? First of all, none of us have to make the 30-hour flight to Perth or the 30-hour flight back.

So we don't have to deal with any of that BS. But this main event is so freaking evilly matched between the number three light heavy weight in the world, Carlos Olberg, and the number seven and Dominic Reyes. On paper in terms of, look, they're only 11 months apart in age, even though obviously the biggest thing separating them is the experience of Reyes. But they're 6'4, they both have 77 inch reaches. They both have a somewhat similar game. And certainly both are streaking an eight-fight win streak for Ulberg, although not against super elite competition. and there's been some hiccups in there. We're still kind of waiting for that big crossover moment

where we can stamp him, yes, you're a legitimate title challenger. And on the flip side, is there a better story going on right now for the feel good in us as MMA fans, as journalists for what Dom Cruz is, good Lord, Dom Reyes is doing. Four straight losses, three of the absolute most devastating knockout variety, including that last one against Ryan Span, by the way, who would go on to lose his next three. That was when Dom tried to reinvent him in himself in Poetons, Connecticut camp there with Coach Glover. And then, you know, he's got a couple 15 and 18 month layoffs in between.

He was supposed to fight Alberg twice in early 2024 when he's coming off of those losing skids where really his job was probably on the line. But fate is having some weird say in how this is going down. A year and a half later, this fight is much bigger. It's a quasi-number-one contender fight, even though, of course, you're going to have a have Yerry versus Roundtree, you're going to have a rematch of the title just next week with Poetan and Ankh. But you know that I know that we all know that if you're Dom Reyes and you're on Reyes and you're on this feel good story that if you shine or Oldberg for that matter,

if you shine above all else, you might get the next call. Dom Reyes was written off by all of us and in some ways including himself. And when you talk to him like I did this week and you really look at the details of how he's turned himself around, how he's riding the three-fight knockout streak all against strength fighters, all two rounds or less. There's almost this weird sort of fate streak carrying him. I'm not saying this is Tim Tebow winning an NFL playoff game or Jeremy Lynn lighten up Kobe at the garden, but there's some magic momentum following him here. Whether he gets over the hump or not, it's worth seeing.

We've always liked this guy at 35. I don't actually know if he's as good as he was when we all saw him beat John Jones. He says he's better. He says he's calm or smarter, all of those things that come with what he likes to call the fight game education that you get going through this. But this is at least a main event that's worth waiting up for. And depending on who wins here, we could get a really interesting story in how it affects the title picture. And what do we love more in American life here than the second chance? Dom Reyes, not Cruz, is a very likable figure who's in the midst of that right now.

Now, I don't know if he beats Oldberg. It's that close of a matchup on paper. But yeah, I'll watch a Toffa fight on the way there. I'll take a Jake Matthews. Throw me a couple down under blokes. Whatever. It's better than being in the warehouse. I'm into it a little bit this weekend.

Yeah, Dom Reyes. What a story that has been. Jed, I think your face says it all. But where does this one rank? It's probably not the worst on paper of the year. But the fact that I'm even asking, Ooh, oh, is it? Okay, please. I mean, it's the worst non-Apex on paper of the year.

I just made myself quite sad by going back through all the events of this year to, as BC was talking, to, you know, take a gander. And there have been nine apex events this year. And I would say this is better than, it's, it's on par or better than eight of those. I do think that this is the worst of the non-Apex cards. I do agree with what B.C. said right out of the gate, right? Like, even at its worst, it's going to have a crowd, though questionable on the crowd part. If you've seen some of the reporting from people in Perth, you've seen been slashing ticket prices apparently because this just ain't selling.

I would guess that eventually, you know, people will find a price point that they want to go to it. But, you know, are Carlis Zolberg and Dom Reyes really pulling in people off the streets of Perth when that's the fight poster? And that's it because there ain't nothing backing it up. Like, this is objectively awful on paper. It's just not a very good fight card. I am interested in the main event, right? Like, that's about it. There's, you know, a couple of other fighters I have some level of interest in.

Jake Matthews, Neil Magni, I think is a good fight. Some of these fights are good, right? or like make sense, right? They are solid matchmaking. But none of them are really above replacement level. And the main event, while I find it interesting because, as BC pointed out, Dom Reyes' story is so fascinating, I, you know, not here to tell you that this, this lay heavyweight, man.

It's not going to be gangbusters, probably. So I think this is the worst of the fight night cards as I went through them, everything else. They had two hooks, right? Like every other fight night had a second fight that was really drawing you in or drawing me in. And this one does not, which I think is a huge down side to it. And like this isn't like there are some apex cards that were really, really ranted this year. The one where the main event fell out like the day of and Aaron Blanchfield fought as like the surrogate main event within 26 hours or whatever. Like there's some really bad apex cards.

This is a really bad card on paper. might be fun, but it's bad. I mean, we lost at Aaron Blanchfield main event seconds before we're supposed to start with Bacey Barber. Like, that's been the kind of year. That was what it was. I was trying to remember while I was talking. I was like, there was a Blanchefield thing that happened.

Well, yeah. Barber missed Wade and then they accepted the fight and then it didn't happen anyways. But so we're clear. It's definitely not the worst because we got Marvin Vittori Roman Deleadze 2 this year. So nothing's going to be lower than that. that. That's true. Last thing here, we'll talk more about it on the preview show, which I think will be a pretty quick preview show tomorrow. If Dominic Reyes wins Jed, you have to give him a title fight, right? Like, it doesn't matter how he does it. He's next, right? I don't know if I

could say this about Carlos Oldberg, unless he just nukes Dominic Reyes, right? And even then, if Yuri and Khalil just annihilate each other, Khalil and Magamette have some heat. So press conferences could get real interesting between those two guys. But I kind of feel like if Reyes wins, you just have to pull the trigger and do it, right? They should for the funds of it, right? Like, it's just way fun. Like, that is a terrific story.

I guess actually here's what I'll say. He, his next fight needs to be for the title. He does not need to be next, right? So, like, if he beats Ulberg, his next fight is for the belt. And if that is fighting the winner of a Magermanankalaya of Uri Perashka, fight okay he weighs in as the backup sure if it's if a if alex perero beats magumankalive absolutely just run him in there that is we don't need to see perera fight yiri or kaleel or

third fight with hunk unless it's super controversial or whatever uh so if he should be a big alex prayer fan if he wins but if big onk if big onk time continues and defeats alks preera he could i would be more than okay with them doing it but i do think you probably give it to a yri or kale over uh, Reyes, because the area is, you know, super popular and super good. And Cleo is popular. Has that key probably more quote unquote deserving. But Reyes then just weighs in as the backup.

And his next fight with the way in is for the belt. You agree with that, BC? I mean, we love the feel good story. I kind of feel like just Ray is getting this fight sort of tells us that if he wins, they're just going to give it to him. Yeah. And I wouldn't be against it. I don't think anybody else would.

And what helps that is the fact that it's been around Robin atop of this division. We've seen all of these guys either hold the belt for, you know, for a second or get knocked out repeatedly by Pereira. So, yes, the Ank win in some ways reset the division, although they needed that immediate rematch, in my opinion, for everything Pereira accomplished and how willing he was to fight on short notice or hurt. And it just so happened that it caught up to him that time. I think with Reyes, with the fact that, look, sometimes MMA karma is a thing, right? Was it MMA karma that forced Tom Zott to miss weight by so much so Nate Diaz didn't have to take that loss? Or was it the UFC wanting to preserve a possible trilogy with Connor? We'll have to defend that by the fire one day over a cold one.

But I do think that everybody felt like Dom Reyes, even though he did get a title shot after the disputed loss to John Jones, and he just happened to lose it to Blahovic, I think there's this feeling like he never got what he deserved because his career fell apart so dramatically afterwards, because of the parody in this division, even with a new champion, I think you go in that direction. But don't discount Ulberg. If he gets a spectacular knockout here with that oceanic crowd chairing him on, I'm not going to pretend whether I know whether the Western Australian Rim folks

are going to chair for a New Zealander. But if you extend that win streak to nine, you know, it's going to be hard to be denied. We saw in the same division, Khalil Rauntry get a title shot wall, ranked number seven under some questionable circumstances in some ways maybe a reward to Poetan for his busy schedule before that. But yeah, without question, this is a quasi number one contender fight. I think we have to treat it like that. You put the good story on top of it.

It doesn't suck as bad as everyone on this show is trying to say it does. And I'm the one that tells you when it sucks. I'm the arbiter of sucketry, okay? Hey, no one saying the made event sucks. No one's saying the main event sucks. Without this native night, you have to cancel the whole card without this fight. This is all right. This is kind of all right for low expectations, right?

Like, like, you know, you remember Jed when you was at Georgia or Georgia State or whatever. When them lights come on in the bar, the pickings are slam, you know what I'm saying? And you'll, you'll change your strike zone. You know, I mean, you have. You've, you know what I mean? You've soiled your identity for a two for a two p.m. afternoon. this is going on at 10 p.m. We at 10 p.m.

That is when the main card starts. That's when Tom Nolan and Charlie Campbell. And I'm a Tom Nolan fan. But I don't need to watch his ass fight at 10 p.m. And I damn sure don't need to see Carlos Alberg and Dom Reyes at two in the morning fight. Is this a six fight main card too? Sure is. Unless somebody falls out.

I do not like I don't know why they're doing this not at local time. They should absolutely do No sense to me like do Perth local Why are you making these dudes fight at I'm assuming 10 p.m. our time is like 12 a is like noon for them right like I assume it's more than 12 hours out of you're paying for this shit I'm stunned by this It's not like this actually makes more sense to do it at per time because it's basically 12ish hours ahead as opposed to like middle grounding it for the for France card or whatever I don't get it

man. Well, something else that people don't get is where we're going round four. We're going to the world of boxing. If that's what you want to call it, uh, the point for round three goes to, I mean, I got to give it to BC because he's trying. He is pumped for UFC Perth. Pumped. For Perth.

I just like rim jobs. You know what I mean? And that's, that's, that's, no, I mean like the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the rim. Like the geography of it. Yeah, yeah. Guys, let's just, thank you, Casey.

Can you just retract his point for that? Yeah, referee's decision's final. It'll be deduct the point. I wish someone interfered and someone showed me some evidence of interference, but I can't do that. So let's just go ahead and rip this fucking Band-Aid off. Jake Paul is fighting

Tank Davis on November 14th. It's no longer happening at Atlanta, Georgia. I know. They're doing it. I know. But they're doing it in the only state that it could happen in. The state that allowed Evander Holyfield to almost die against Vitor Belford at almost 60 years of age. The state of Florida.

The state of Florida. Miami, to be exact, we have rules for this exhibition bout. Let me pull up these wonderful rules that will be abided by to the fullest. 10 rounds, 3 minutes each, 1.95 pounds max weight, 12. gloves, three judges will score the bout, and a winner will be determined. Jed, I would like to thank Alexander Cayley for giving me the times to work that I did. So I didn't have to watch either of these two press conferences that happened earlier this week. You watched both, I believe.

I did not watch the first one. You're not watched first one, but you watch the second one. Sure did. Where are you at with this one? Are you into this? Like, especially after the second one. I don't have any issue with this. I went into the second press conference

and he was going to suck because the first press conference was apparently awful. And while it wasn't great, I let Tank had some banger lines. It was really quite funny. Like, I did not have a bad time. I didn't have a good time.

But it was like, Tank Davis came out of his shell a little. He just got a little more comfortable. Jake is Jake. He's been doing the same thing for as long he's been here. He will once a press conference, say that if I walked on water,

they'd say I couldn't swim because he clearly thinks that is like the best line ever when it's actually cringy awful shit it's like when izzie was like frozen like elsa just over and over trying to make fetch happen but tank was like funny uh you know they made a two million dollar side bet and you know uh Jake was like I'll give some to cherry and Tate was like I'll give son to chair I'm not giving two million I'll come from the hood I ain't paying. I didn't give it $2 million a charity. That's ridiculous. Tank called out Jake for just having the crowd stocked with his guys to come up and ask questions or whatever. Because some dude like transparently came up and asked Jake was like, you give so much back to the

sporting community. What's it like to be the best guy ever and have a huge penis? And Tank was just like, you definitely paid that dude to ask that question because obviously he did. And so like it was It was actually pretty funny. I got no issues with this, right? We did not that long ago. We did a thing about freak show fights and wanting them to return in some space to combat sports. And that's what this is.

I have one issue with it, which I'll get to at the very end, but broadly speaking, like, this is a much better thing to sanction to let move forward than 60-year-old of Vanderholyfield taking head trauma. Then, frankly, Mike Tyson versus Jake Paul. that should have never been allowed to happen and we are all of us extremely lucky that serious injury did not fall anybody this one unlikely it's something like that's going to happen right

tank davis is in the prime of his athletic career he is giving up a significant amount of size but jake paul sucks so he's not going to really get hurt like he's jake paul is a is a above average boxer for a man of his talent like uh you know experience level but he's not like good and so like Like, this is fine. No one is going to suffer grievous injury here, which is always like the starting point.

And it is kind of interesting. Like I am legitimately curious to see how a man who's giving up 50 to 80 pounds, whatever, it will end up being, but is so vastly superior fare like fairs here because, you know, I used to play fight night and you take Manny Pack Yao and fight him at heavyweight because like it's a video game. You could do that shit. I'm kind of interested in this along those lines. the only, the absolute only criticism I have about it is the Jake Paul aspect of it where he tries to make this something that it's not.

Because this isn't Jake Paul silencing the doubters. This isn't Jake Paul sticking it to the haters by fighting a world champion. And so that part still grinds my gears a little bit because Jake is just the most disingenuous man in combat sports, which is saying something. But the other, you know, texture of this is fine. Small dude fights big guy. kind of fun. So like I'm pretty open. I am a little bit bummed.

It's not happening Atlanta. I was going to go. That would have been fun. And I got no major issues with it. I just was Jake Paul would quit pretending that this is some glorious act of heroism and bravery on his part, as opposed to fighting a man who he outweighs by 60 pounds. BC, you've dabbled in the boxing world. You're coming off of being boots on the ground for Canello versus Crawford and all that that became.

and all that that is in the history of the boxing world. Where are you at with Jake Paul versus Tank Davis, BC? Are you as up on it as Jet is? Just let's have some fun and do the fun thing, or is this trash for you? No, this is absolute trash. And I've had, you know, tolerance or even a taste at times for some of the Jake fights, you know, as a disruption, as something different.

Look, this crossover boxing circus bubble, somehow it's still alive, and you got to give Jake a lot of credit for that being at the center point, being the face of it. But it's old and it's played out. And what happened in the Mike Tyson fight really made it hard to stay on this Jake train because he can't figure out whether he actually is chasing a legitimate fight, whether that be a cruiserweight title shot against probably somebody the mainstream has never heard of, or it's potentially cashing himself out against the likes of Canello and Anthony Joshua,

which I do think he was willing to do. and I think there's a couple of theories as to why. But what have we seen from him since this Tyson fight, which really felt like a point of no return? Look, if Jake wanted to do that for the attention and the money and all of that and to help continue to build his promotional company, which is doing really good things in boxing, particularly on the women's side,

okay, it is what it is, but there's going to be a receipt for that. There's going to be a stink that lingers when you have not an exhibition, an actual legitimate officially sanctioned fight against Mike Tyson, and it looked like the way it did. What do we do since then? We get a Chavez Jr. Basically out of retirement, just short of deportation,

and get him into a fight that people didn't really care about. It was a few years too late, and there was nothing going on until the final round when Chavez decided to try. How do we top that? We pull one of the top 10 pound-for-pound best fighters in the world, one of its biggest draws and somebody who still has

unanswered questions about his own career we pull him out of that line and we put him into a fight that is ultimately meaningless you couldn't get it sanctioned they had a move stage just to hold it the fact that it's not a real fight really opens up the possibility

that it's not going to be contested in any form of real back and forth and it shouldn't be when there's this much weight between them and experience on top of that But even on top of that, even if you told me it's best case scenario, it'll be exciting and there'll be action. I think there's more opportunities for people to get hurt, for their own career arcs to get,

you know, shortened or cut in half by something weird and wacky happening. And on top of that, there's no juicer backstory. This isn't Jake trying to disrupt the MMA market and make Dana White mad by beating all of his aging guys. This isn't Jake even bringing in a Inganu or an old young. Dante Wilder to try to prove something. It's literally just two rich guys coming together, rubbing their brand together and doing what we do to get attention.

It would have worked, you know, before the Mike Tyson fight. But you brought up Canello Crawford. We're coming off of such a historic. And if you're a pure boxing fan, an absolutely beautiful and breathtaking, not as an action fight, but as a, oh, my God, these two greats are going to come together. And, oh, by the way, one of them has a chance to do something we've pretty much never seen before.

and skyrocketed himself to an even higher level of all-time greatness. We just had that caviar, right? It was great. And now we got to go back to this vending machine candy, which it could blow up in our faces. Now, look, Tank said yes to the fight. It wasn't that long ago that Tank was facing charges that could have put him back in prison and he dodged that.

We all wanted him to rematch Lamont Roach. We all want him eventually to fight Shakur Stevenson. We just want him to live out his own career and show us how great he can be. and instead we got this. And even though you know, you give Jake credit for what he's doing in women's boxing, there's a couple of women's title fights on there, it's not an undercard that, you know, true boxing fans are jumping over themselves to tune in for.

Even if it does big numbers, even if it turns into this kind of wacky back and forth, I don't care. I love real boxing. We've done this for too long. There's nothing here for me at all. And only it could, you know, potentially send Gervante deeper into not maximizing his potential and maybe even stepping away from the sport because if you watch the two press conference your biggest takeaway has to be tanks checked out tank don't care tank doesn't know what

date the fight actually is tank barely understands the rules that he signed up for so if he doesn't care why should i bc will this do better viewership on neffi big man small man big man um it has this better than 41 million i mean i'm not i'm not i'm not i'm not going to guarantee it does. When you have Mike Tyson coming out of retirement at basically 60, it's going to, it's an animal unto itself, even though I know Jake brought some, you know, fan base to that party too. It could end up doing more. I hope it doesn't. And to be fair, I hope it doesn't happen. You know what I'm saying? Because I just think it's so pointless and such a money grab that I don't want casual fans tuning in who may have seen. I mean, look,

on Netflix, I look that they're doing big super fights. But what have we gotten on Netflix? so far. Mike Tyson's ass, a Taylor Serrano trilogy that should have been this all-time great fight and was oddly passive and not that exciting. This absolute steak dinner of Canello Crawford that I hope we get more of,

we don't have to go back to these appetizers anymore. Enough with this bullshit. Thank you. I'm Brian Campbell and I approve this message. Chad, what... I didn't realize... I'm glad BC just declared these Brian Campbell because I, honest to God, I thought that

Luke Thomas had barged in because there was there was an air of superiority and being above it all and having these caviar tastes and smelling his own farts because I don't mind the fucking I thought this is a guy like the gas station hot dog you know he liked I love a vending machine candy bar look at me I have I have enjoyed a snicker not every meal you're going to end up in alcohol this isn't every meal you just said we just that fucking caviar this isn't every meal And from the aspect of wanting Tank Davis to be a real boxer, totally get it. And that's a fair criticism. I'm not coming from that, because I don't, I'd never have cared.

Like, Tank Davis has fights that are relevant that could be happening, but doesn't, doesn't mean too much to me if not. I'm, I'm interested in the absurdity of it. You know, if Tank shows up, totally checked out and this is boring, well, that sucks, but like, just change the channel or whatever to go. It's on Netflix. I don't have to change the channel. I can just back out of it and go watching Glory.

bastards. And I think that it will be interesting in a couple of respects outside of that. One, if Tank does just decide to just tune him up, that would be awesome. Like, that would be so funny, right? For this, for that to happen, people would talk about it. It would be this kind of thing like, oh, Jake Paul actually fought like a young real boxer. And despite getting a huge advantage, he still kind of got worked over. It would be tough. But what I'm most interested in is the question of viewership, Mike, because. now like I've never known how popular Jake Paul is. There is an idea that he is popular that seems true, right?

Like that seems to be the thing. But we have seen that Jake Paul's popularity doesn't always translate. When he fought those random bot like dudes, just the guys, those things weren't really huge events. That was an ego project for him to fight some professional boxers that nobody gave a shit about. But when he's had a dance partner, when there's been somebody else, who, you know, level set with him, he's done pretty well. And then when there's Mike Tyson, Mike Tyson, that thing did massive numbers. Now we get to find out what Jake is the A size.

I do think Jake is probably the A side here. What he is pulling as far as Netflix viewers. And we can basically just look at them, like, okay, well, Mike Tyson was responsible for X amount of views because that's the delta between the Tyson Paul and the Tank Paul thing. And so I think we're going to learn a couple of things that are interesting to me. I think the fight might not be that terrible because it's just absurdist. And I like an absurdist thing from time to time. And this isn't, nobody's getting hurt.

This isn't fine. Tank is wasting, you know, a good fight or two, but he can still go to those. I got no issues with this. Will more than 41 million people be in for the absurdity, Jed? Will this do better than Canelo Crawford? My guess is it's not going to do better than Canelo Crawford. What were the numbers for Katie Taylor, Amanda Serrano 3? Do you have those off the top of your head?

It was like $7 million. It'll do better than that, but worse than Canelo Crawford. I bet like 20. That would be my guess. I would agree with that. We shall see. I'm curious what the week of the fight is going to be like in terms of people in my life hitting me up about it.

because, I mean, I've never experienced anything like the Jake Paul Mike Tyson thing. And all my years covering the sport, never have I been hit up by just randos. Just anybody off the street that knew what I did all asked me unanimously about that fight. I've never seen anything like I'm curious. Connor Floyd was the only thing close. Like those two things were both of the same. No, Tyson Roy Jones as well. I don't think that people would have cared as much about Jake Mike Tyson.

if Tyson hadn't come back in 2020 against Roy Jones and actually looked really good in his 50s where you're like, oh crap, he's not like in a wheelchair. This is insane. I think that it all helped, but whatever. Well, that's it for Jake Tank Talk. The point for round four goes to, I mean, if I had to give BC positive points,

I got to give it to Jed. I mean, Jed knows how to play the game. He's been here a number of time. Veteran. You look like you had something else. doesn't know how to play the game, Jake Paul. Because Jake Paul is not leaning in. He should be promoting this as the heel.

Not as like the people don't like me thin. Like he should just out or be like, I'm up whip this tiny dude's ass because that is the thing to get this over. Like here's a big man bullying a small man. Like that is how you sell this fight. He's not doing enough of that. Well, time for the knockout round, ladies and gentlemen. One question to be asked.

minute apiece to answer said question. And we're going a little off the board here. I was going to go one direction, but I figured I think it's kind of fair to discuss something else going on. Jed, do you want to go first or do you want to hand it over to Brian Campbell? I'll go first. Sure.

All right. So yesterday. Fun pun for one direction, but I didn't have any. Fair. I don't know if you saw it. It's been kind of the PFL way. where they put something out and some people know about it, but not everybody does.

And I feel like maybe John Martin from PFL put out a little bit of a statement, a decree, so to speak, for the future of the professional fighters league. I'm not going to read this entire thing, but here's what he said in a tweet. Historically, the PFL crowd champions through its season or tournament format where the winner held the title for that year. I recognized that created some confusion about who truly sat atop each division. Confucian crew when the PFL and Bellator merge bringing in not only tournament champions, but also legacy Bellator champions who defended their belts, leaving fans unclear on who

was the definitive champion in each way class. We are now simplifying our championship system going forward. Each division will have one PFL world champion, the single undisputed title holder in that way class using Costello Vancinus as the example, talking about some of the upcoming fights, the two title fights October 3rd, the two title fights December 13th, will be a official PFL title fights. I also know there's been some confusion around unique distinctions in the past, like the Super Fight title won by Francis and Ghanu.

That was a special one-time designation going forward. Those belts may be used for occasional special events. And importantly, I will be engaging directly with Francis to determine what's next for him in the PFL. My goal is clear. One champ, one division, one world title, assistant that is simple for athletes to chase and for PFL fans to follow. Jed, grade this statement from PFL's John Martin.

Is this a step in the right direction? Is this, ma' where are you at? 60 seconds on the clock, go. It's a C, because it is a step in the right direction. But it's like, why did it take you this long? When like literally just any show that we did talking about PFL, like, I don't know why they got all the belt or guys and they have six belts in every way. Like what's happening right now?

Like this is day one promoter shit. And it took them three years to figure out you should have one belt. Right. And it's why like I tweeted this yesterday and I fundamentally believe it like. Grand Prix shouldn't award belts, right? Like tournaments aren't belts. Give a trophy because one, that's cooler and makes more sense. Belts are for the champions, the people who hold the title.

and then transfer that title. I'm glad they're finally doing the right thing. The fact that it took them so long is so strange. But look, you know, better late than never, I guess. And moving forward, give away cooler things for your supervites, swords, axes. Swords and axes, all right. All right, Brian, you have been the positive voice here on today's program, professional fighters league

I mean look we're trying to they're trying things I think this is a pretty decent year for fights for them they're trying to give fans what they want they're trying and that's all we ask and now John Martin puts up the statement so what do you grade Jed gives it a C

what do you grade at 60 seconds of the clock this is easily an A and the only reason why it's not an A plus is for you know kind of what Jed teased on the whole hedge of is it too little too late since we're in like the third straight year where we're like this is the make or break year if pfl's going to make it and i think all of us you know as this year started to come together we're like break i don't even know if they're going to get out of this year look it's

going to take a lot if it's even possible to clean up the don davis mess i don't know if all the decisions that we hated were all don davis but even when they came out and said they were going to change things up we're listening to the fans it wasn't enough if you got two quarterbacks you've got none if you've got multiple wives you're mormon and all Ultimately, the only way you're truly going to compete, whether people see you as the one B league or see you as the competition or just see you as another feeder to UFC, you're only going to matter if we know who your best fighters are and if they're active.

It's an A because this is a key move they needed to make. It can be an A plus if they ditch the tournament format after this, so their best fighters are constantly fighting and constantly on their broadcasts. There you have it. There you have it. We shall see how this all plays out for the PFL. Forgot their cards next week. And we get the Uspen Paul Hughes rematch leading into UFC 320.

So we get a lot, a lot going on. Multiple cards next week. Multiple cards. We also found out dirty boxings coming back in October and Gable Steven's going to do some dirty boxing. I thought for sure that was going to be our final question. I was like, is absolutely about to be getting Gable sees in a dirty boxing. Nah.

We'll see. I mean, look, Billy Swanson might not even be the opponent. Dirty boxing likes to shuffle up the decks. And we kind of know what this is, right? Billy Swanson, Bellator veteran. Great way to sell this fight. So we'll see.

What kind of hands Gables cut? You know, my honestly God, first reaction to seeing that was as, oh shit, Mike Perry's dumb than I thought. I like Mike Perry. And I think dirty boxing can catch some legs, but like I cannot imagine the price he is having to pay to get Gable into that is he is getting the value for money there. He's probably getting the John Jones discount.

John's a co-owner as well. The Cow has run this. I think it's more important that Gable gets the exposure. So this might not actually be a dumb move here. So if you want to give me an extra half point on there, I think I'll take it as well. I think it's a great move for Gable. I just have to assume that he is getting a good price that he is not bringing that level of value to him. I think they got to give him enough exposure and win so he could debut in the UFC on the White House lawn.

But they do that. He's 100% fighting on that card. They can do that easily. I am honestly not a little surprised he's not fighting a week 10 of contender series. Should be. He needs to be a straight up signing. But at this point, Oh, you go nickel him.

You sign him, but then you make him fight contender series. I think he's probably signed already. if we're being honest, but we've got to go through the motion here. Honestly, you might have just laid out like the best storyline for UFC White House because what if we live in a world where Gable fights on the White House card

and John Jones doesn't? It would be incredible theater. Is John going to corner him? Will he be jelly about it? Will their relationship sustain such a big move? Like, that is soap opera shit right there and I am here for it, gentlemen. No, you're almost,

there. What we do is Gable and John have a falling out in the next couple of weeks. Yes. And because John Jones comes into training one and he's like, hey Gable, I bet I could take you down. And suddenly, we've just got the John Jones Daniel Cormier heat

revived to a new level. And instead of getting John Jones versus Tom Aspinall, we get swerved. John versus Gable, White House lawn. Oh, with D.C. and Gable's corner, that's great. Oh, okay. That pregnant lady from Albuquerque can be the coach Latouria in their corner

or two. That'd be great. That's how you book it. Oh, my God. All right. See, look what we just did here. We just made this White House card so interesting. Just think of all the shows we could do. Think of how much more exciting the Apex cards are.

I mean, that's just terrific stuff. I love it. I love it all so much. Casey's here. I mean, I think David Cormier could get his referee license and ref Gable versus John. We could get that to happen, just really go full pro wrestling with it.

Yeah, let's just do all that. I still want the wheel of Kayla. PFL screwed that up. They didn't do it. You can't do that until the Nunes fight. Once Nunes is done, then we can wheel of Kayla. That we can do the wheel of Kayla.

But Casey's here. Casey, who won? It was a very close vote, but pulling away late with 53% of the votes is Brian Campbell I was ahead for a chunk too

because I saw it congratulations BC thank you everybody this one's for all them dirtbags out there that look exactly like Jed okay yeah

I own the show yeah you're not a dirtbag you have a high champagne tastes have you I only accept the best fights oh look at this

Brian Campbell just clinched the AFC East with his record of 14 and 5 overall. Congratulations to BC. Anything you want to say to the fine viewers before you get on out of here? No, I don't. Incredible. What a lot. That was spectacular.

Well, that was A plus. Wow. Unbelievable. I had a lost after that. That was a great exit. That was a great exit. Jed, what would you like to say? You know, I thought I had it.

I was feeling good. But this is ultimately the just outcome because I missed weight. And you don't ever want to win with an asterisk. And that's what it would have been. It would have been an asterisk. And so congratulations to Brian Campbell. All right. Well, that's that.

Thank you all for joining us. Thank you to Brian Campbell, who is now just a black background. But good for him. Great to have him back on the show. We'll get him back on a little bit more. Next week's a good one. We're getting ready for UFC 320, which is an absolute banger of a fight card.

Casey's here. Hi, Casey. How are you? And an Operation Ivy sleeveless, baby. Yeah, yeah. Bring it back to sleeves. Bring it back to sleep this. Yes, bring it back to give us.

Casey for Jen. I am late heck. I'm sure not a lot of UFC per talk next week, lots of UFC 320 talk right here on BTL. Good night, everybody. Love y'all. This has been between the links, an MMA fighting production on the Vox Media Network. Unwrap holiday magic at Holt Renfrew with gifts that say I know you.

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