MMA Fighting - DAMN! They Were Good | Kimbo Slice: An Internet Legend Turned MMA Superstar

Episode Date: January 26, 2024

DAMN! They Were Good celebrates the careers of our favorite fighters in MMA history. On this episode, the MMA Fighting staff takes a deep dive into the late Kimbo Slice, an internet legend who became the biggest star in MMA. Back in the early 2000s when MMA was still making its way into the mainstream, the more sophomoric corners of the internet birthed an entirely different kind of combat sport: bareknuckle fights in backyards and boatyards all across Miami. At the time, Kimbo Slice - real name Kevin Ferguson - was a driver and bodyguard for a pornography company, and began engaging in street fights for extra money. Not long after that, Kimbo's friends decided to video those fights and upload them to the internet, and almost overnight, a sensation was born. Thanks to those videos, Kimbo Slice became one of the most talked about fighters on the planet, rubbing shoulders with real life celebrity A-listers. Soon afterwards, he made the move into MMA, headlining the first MMA show on network television and then even joining up with the UFC. A move to Bellator and then boxing followed, and all the while, Kimbo remained a beloved figure in the space until his tragic passing in 2016 at age 42 due to congestive heart failure. But though Kimbo is gone, his spirit lives on as do the many legendary moments he gave us. Which of those were our favorite and what was it like to live through the Kimbo Slice era? Listen in as the MMA Fighting crews remembers remembers the life and times of one of MMA's greatest stars. Follow Jed Meshew: @JedKMeshew Follow Shaheen Al-Shatti: @shaunalshatti Follow Alexander K. Lee: @AlexanderKLee Subscribe to MMA Fighting Check out our full video catalog Like MMA Fighting on Facebook Follow on Twitter Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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DarkTrace is the cybersecurity defenders deserve and the one they need to defend beyond. Visit darktrace.com forward slash defenders for more information. Listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. Hello, friend. My name is Jed Mishu, and this is another episode of, Damn, they were good. And you can hear the joy in my voice because, ladies and gentlemen, this is a podcast of the people.

We all know it. But sometimes, sometimes we got to do one for us. And that's what we're doing this week. We're doing the Kimbo slice. Damn, they were good. Kevin Ferguson. And to do so. To talk about one of the most electrifying men's in the history of combat sport,

I had to get together, you know, the main crew, the big guns, the Chris Ryan and the Sean Finis to my Bill Simmons. I'm talking, of course, about Alexander Kaley and Shaheen Al-Shadi. Boys! Come on. Come on. You guys are as excited as I am about this one, are you? Maybe more excited.

Yes, maybe more excited than I've ever been. This is, this is so good. This is going to be so good. It's so much fun. So, full disclosure, we were talking in the green room beforehand, and Shaheen just asked like, hey, what's the why are we doing kimbo here like what because you normally i try and tie it to an anniversary of some kind he's like none there they're nothing to anniversary this sort of time period and i wanted to do one for us

boys because look we're going to get into it kimbo's not you know he's not an all time great he's not even an all time good fighter but um i i loved his whole run uh i am very sad that he is no longer with us, our IP, and we'll talk all about his whole life and career. But I had even more fun than I thought I would when I dug into the research, because research always takes a lot of time. With Kimbo, maybe there was less research in the fighting aspect, but because of who he was, you could get down such a rabbit hole for the rest of the Kimbo slice experience. Did you guys have the same sort of experience as you were doing this? 1,000%

Because here's the thing about Kimbo, right? There are so many rabbit holes available to go down with Kimbo. You can go down the fights, you can go down the street fights, go down all the Bellator stuff, you go down whatever. You go down the other weird videos

of him tackling dudes for money and things like this. The internet was a wonderful place. That's ultimately where I'm coming to with all this. It's like the Kimbo era of the internet was just maybe the most, beautiful era of the internet period. I would argue it was the best era of the internet ever.

Like, everything was so innocent. Everything was so naive. It was before everything got real dark and seedy and people kind of realized how you could use the internet to ruin the world with this shit. Like it was just so beautiful, so pure. And Kimball was the embodiment of all of this man. Kimball was, I remember so vividly in high school. I think it was like freshman or sophomore year in accounting class. All of us just gathered around, Miss Marshall's class. I love it. Marshall, she would just let us do whatever we want. Shout out Ms. Marshall. Shout out, Ms. Marshall. You are wonderful. And she would just let us kind of do whatever we wanted as long as we got the work done.

And everyone just crowding around our computers, our primitive, terrible computers, and watching whatever the first versions of these videos that were coming out of Miami and seeing this man, this man, Kimbo Slice, who seemed like a superhero at the time, who seemed superhuman and just being awestruck by the gravitational pull that this man had over everybody. tremendous man. I won't one. Shout out to Miss, what was her name? Miss Marshall.

Shout out to Miss Marshall. We love allowing students to watch unsanctioned street fines in the middle of their high school classes. That's just good teaching as far as I'm concerned right there. But I had similar experiences, man, you know, like, because this was that time. And I, you know, with a show like this, there, I am always concerned about running we run the risk of, you know, things were just better back in my day. And you kids today will never know how great of an experience it was. And it's really true with the internet.

Like it's just the internet today is different. And I'm sure that there are plenty of good experiences if you're coming up on those internet streets today. But there is nothing like going to eBOM's world, you know, back in 2005 and watching Kimmel's slice uppercut some dude in a boat. you are and you you don't they're not good fighters and if if you're an m ms fan at that point you can even recognize that they're probably not great fighters but the spectacle of it is still captivating and interesting in a way that multi-million dollar fight production companies can't pull together to draw the same level of interest as kimbo and the dudes from reality kings the porn company did with like one cam quarter and 300 bucks like it is

it was so you had to have been there in such a real way and it just took me back getting there to my own experiences in computer lab in high school and being like hey you guys see this or whatever and just going through rotten dot com and all of that and kimbo felt very much like part of that experience which i think was fairly ubiquitous at the time though aka this would be a great Was that also the Canadian sort of high school that era experience as well? Or did you guys just use the internet to be really nice to each other and compliment everyone all the time? I don't know how Canada interneted in the early 2000s. Well, guys, I can't speak for all of Canada, especially when it comes to M-M-A stuff.

As you guys, as anyone who's listened to any previous episodes of Damn Probably know, I do tend to be behind the curve on these things a lot. I've had to do a lot of catching up in M.A. Fandom, that was the case with Kimbo as well. I was not in the moment watching Street Fights. I definitely knew people who were. I definitely knew people who wouldn't shut up about it, who were probably trying to get me, like, kind of poking me, like, yeah, have you seen this Kimbo thing? Have you seen this Kimbo thing?

And I think I was still in my like, sir, I'm just like, I'm getting into M.A. now, and it is a serious sport. Get away from me with this freak show stuff. Like, I don't want this freak show stuff. But, you know, you couldn't ignore him. And I was trying to remember. Do you guys remember when he was on the cover of, of ESPN?

Or was a Rolling Stone? No, he was all the magazine. Featron Rolling Stone. He was in the magazine. That would have been before the Seth Petruzelli fight, before the James Thompson fight? It was 2008. 2008.

So that year, that was where he just got super hot. And at that point, you couldn't ignore it. And my gosh, what a, I mean, he's just, the cover of him on ESPN, people can Google it who listen to this. You just call ESPN Kimbo. It's just his face. It's just a huge shot.

And ESPN was a big magazine. I don't think it exists anymore. It was this big, huge format magazine. And it was popping out at you from a, from a store, you know, rack. And I was like, wow, that's a, that's somebody. That is somebody. I got to know more. I've been hearing a lot of this Kimbo thing.

So yeah, I was behind on it. But boy, once you started looking into it, it was exciting in a hilarious, which is a word I think we're going to use a lot, by the way, during this episode. And kind of scary. I said you didn't know anything about him, just so imposing. And then you watch the footage and you're like, man, I don't know if I'm comfortable watching this, but it is. I am engaged.

I am really engaged. And then you're here, he's getting into quote unquote, legitimate MMA. And there's no chance that you weren't going to tune in. There was no story like it up to that point that there hasn't been since. And yeah, again, like I said, I was late to the party. But man, when I got on that bandwagon, I was hooting and hollering and just like everybody else. I love that we were talking about 2000s, MMA. And then AK comes in with ESPN the magazine, which there may be listeners to this who didn't

ESPN Howard magazine because it's so outdated at this point. But I will say, what were you going to say? What, AK, what you said about, I am just getting to MMA, I want nothing to do with this gimmick stuff. It's so funny in retrospect to look back on this because for so long, the Kimbo story, especially when it comes to our world, right, the MMA world, because that's what we, that's what we specialize in. It was so adversarial. And so you look at the evolution of the relationship of the relationship.

relationship between Kimbo and MMA. MMA fans at large at that point in time and history were so deeply insecure of themselves, because I was too, right? Like, this is our thing. This MMA thing is our thing. We need to protect it. We need to protect it from stupid things. We need to protect it from gimmickery.

We need to protect it from the idea of what the public actually thinks of what this is. And Kimbo being associated with it, at least at the beginning, was so, again, adversarial, so contentious, so controversial for so many fans within this space, because here's the secret, right? Like Kimbo jumps in MMA and instantly he is a top five star in MMA without having fought in MMA once or having one professional fight like right after his first one. He is a top five star in MMA. And I think even now, like you look back throughout the 30, 35, 40 years of this sport, Kimbo's lies is like a top 10 star in MMA history, unquestionably.

Like just star power, name power, how people feel about him, whether they know him or not. I remember very vividly, my father passed away in 2012. My father was Kuwaiti. And so after he passed away, I went over to Kuwait with my brother, Kuwait's in the Middle East. And me and my brother, Ken, Kame, we were just kind of meeting a lot of family that we hadn't met for a really long time. We hadn't seen a lot of these people for years, if not decades at that point in time. you're meeting all this family and you tell them, hey, what do you do? And, oh, you know, I'm a MMA journalist.

I cover MMA for a living. I follow MMA for a living. The first thing, almost 95% of the people who I told this to across the world in the middle of the Middle East in 2012 asked me when I said what I did for a living, do you know Kimbo Slices? Have you seen Kimbo Slice? In 2012, in the middle of the Middle East, people were still, that was their first association with MMA was either Brock Lesnar or Kimbo Slice. Those were the two names that I heard

almost above all else during that point in time. And keep in mind, during that trip, GSP fights Carlos Condit. Like, that fight happens while I'm over there. The only names people knew were Kimbo in Brock. It was ubiquitous even at that point in time, which at that point is 2012, like, it had already come and gone. And it's still like people knew Kimbo Slice. So his star power, the way he was able to sort of elevate MMA within the public consciousness at that point in time people hated it but you look back on it it was a very real thing

and him being involved in this sport made this sport bigger yeah when you say top five sport when he top five star on the sport when he came in it was just top one he was just the biggest star like he's the guy who got MMA on CBS and we'll talk about that

but he is the guy who got I won't say he is the only reason MMA push into the mainstream. It was heading that way inexorably. But when you look at that ESP in the magazine article, AK, that article is about Kimbo and kind of his journey and is sort of the unique path. And then how that sort of coincides with what he is and where MMA is and how he is helping to push this thing across the line.

We knew MMA was heading towards mainstream. But again, if you're a newer fan, if you weren't part of the fan base at this point in time, From about 2003, which is like 2002, 2003 is when I started getting involved in the sport, up until 2009, maybe 2010, one of the primary conversations that MMA fans had was getting the sport mainstream. Like is it mainstream? You know, can it get mainstream? It was a real concern. Like it was, we fred it was the dominant concern for everything.

It's like, oh, we can't. We don't want the. the human cockfighting label that John McCain had once famously kind of associated with it was still very much a thing to try and push back against. And Dana and the UFC, every time they were doing tough and stuff, the narratives were all, look at this guy, he's college educated. And he's, these are athletes, not fighters. And then there was a very reflexive pushback from, you know, the hardcore position of,

hey, this guy is, is kind of against all of those things. Like he is just a backyard street fighter and he doesn't represent MMA, but he has now become the figure out of MMA. And totally missing the forest for the trees is actually he is a perfect, a perfect avatar for this sport and an entryway to get this sport into the homes a million Americans who can then from their branch off past him. Nobody saw it like that. It was a very reflexive where I don't like it.

Nope, he's not. He lost to Sean Gannon. and he's not even a real MMA fighter. And it was a super weird time. It was a really weird time in the sport, boys. And we were all insecure. It was the most insecure time in the sport in the history. Yes.

In a sport that's deeply insecure by nature, it was probably the most insecure time of it ever. And I think we're going to dig into this more later, I assume. But in some ways, it was a strange time and also ahead of its time, the whole Kimbo phenomenon. again, I don't want to tip off like some of the points I'm going to be making later in some other damn categories.

But certainly when you look at influencer boxing today, you just feel like this was, there's Kimbo DNA in there. That sounds a little gross. There's Kimbo DNA. There's Kimbo DNA in there. I'll say it again. And we're going to talk about some missed opportunities

and what could have been later. Kimbo walked so Jake Paul can run. So all these. For sure. All these influencers, their names escape me now, B-Y-B-69-9-I-D-N-N-N-N-N-N-N-N-N-R-N-R-N-R-Y-N-X-N-Y-D-Y-D. Sorry. Dean the Great. Dean-the-Gra-Churts.

Thank you. Don't act like you hadn't been on this beat. I'm on the influence of the box and beat. You are. We can talk about them. Let's go. Salt Poppy. I still believe in the poppy.

Yes. So we'll get into that more, but it has, it is important to say, like, as strange as it was at the time, it's like, it's one of those things 10 years later, it doesn't seem that strange. at all. So it's very important we do the show. It is. So we don't have an unanswerable question section like, you know, the rewatchable is a podcast. We are, you know, very indebted to. But we do have a section that's, you know, about that's sort of like that.

And one of the big ones I had is like, man, what if Kimbo came a little bit later? Because like Kimbo could be thriving right now. He might not have thrived in the same way because I, think some of his mystique and the way he captivated imaginations was because of that time. And like you were talking about Gene, how he was part of that internet culture and it's spilling over into the real world. So maybe it doesn't hit the same. But in a lot of other respects, man, he was way more built for 2023 than than 2008, you know? One thousand percent. And I know we'll get to it. So I don't want to step too much on it. But that was my biggest question of all of this is he came.

Did he come up at the wrong time? Because you could very easily imagine him coming up right now, seeing little snippets on Twitter or TikTok or Instagram or whatever of this dude. Again, we said this during the crew. He would have owned TikTok. Dude, we said this during the Crowcott thing of like, there was a point in time where a lot of these guys were street fighter characters. And Kimbo was a freaking street fighter character, man.

From everything from his name to his look, to his attitude to just the way his fights, like the majesty of his fights. Again, the gravitational pull. I keep coming back to that word, the gravitational pull of everything he was involved in was so strong, AK, you said it when you saw the magazine cover, that ESPN the magazine cover is iconic, and it's just his face. And again, it was just the aesthetic. The aesthetic of everything to do with him was so instantly like, oh, I don't know what this is, but I kind of want to see what this is. He would crush right now. He would crush right now. He would be so stupidly rich, and I'm sure he never lacked when it came to money once this became big. But he would be so stupidly rich, so stupidly famous. He would be all over everything.

He would be on the influencer scene. He would be the final boss of the influencer scene. He was so terrifying of a presence once he got going. But also, dude, like, what's big right now? What's Mike Perry making a killing doing right now? Bare knuckle fighting. Bear knuckle fighting is at the 8th. of it of like the history of modern civilization right now and or like the history of its like history within modern civilization kimbo would be crushing it in bkFC he he him and mike perry being on shows together would get like ufc pay-per-view level members probably at this point time if this if he came up right now and it was his world missed it man he missed it's calling can i can i just say that um one of the things that stuck out to me as i went diving into this is

What a missed opportunity. Game bread, boxing slash MMA slash bare knuckle, whatever it's doing is doing because by not just going full bore into the boat yard aesthetic. They're doing it in rings and like, no, just do it in a, in some dude's backyard. It's so much better. And it would be so much more fitting for Horacell who famously got his start. you know, they are like a Hoori Mosphidal a ponytail. We talked about it on the Mossadol episode.

You know, they're missing it. And I thought this was like, man, Kimbo would be doing great right now. And what we need is to bring a little bit more of Kimbo. We need to put more of Kimbo's essence into Bear Knuckle these days. BKFC's doing their own thing, but game bread, step it up, baby. Come on. We can do better here.

All right. Normally I would ask you another question, but the only question I really have here is one that I think we'll end up touching on a lot. We sort of already have. And it's, is Kimbo Sites the coolest man who's ever lived because I'm not willing to say he's not. Like if you look at that, because there is a difference.

You talk about that ESPN magazine cover. You know, it's an old adage in show business. You have it or you don't. There is an indescribable quality to some people. And Kimbo, Kimbo was just like the point. perfect encapsulation of it. You just look at that doom. Like I would like to know more, please.

Yes. Double click on that, that man. I would double click more more information. Not everyone has it and I don't, I honestly don't know how it happened, but he's just like the coolest man who ever lived and doing all of his research was just like, I don't know what, where are the bad things? I'm sure that there must be some, but everything I see is just charming and delightful. and what a great individual, and I wish he was still around. So ponder on that as we dive into the categories, because I think we can just sort of discuss all of this writ large as we get to them. And if this is your first episode, welcome.

Happy to have you on the damn podcast feed. We break things down into categories. Pretty simple. There are a bunch of categories. We talk about all the fights through them. And our first category, normally I would give a rundown of his Kimbo's career, but it just doesn't need it. was not that kind of fighter where you talk about his many accolades.

Instead, we're just going to dive right in our first category. We always start with the Mount Rushmore. You got four fights, boys. Four for the Kimbo history. If you're writing it, you have four. I had a real hard time here. Oh, really? Really?

A couple of auto includes. A couple of auto includes. Yeah, I'm with Jed. And then figuring out, so there were, there were two that I was undeniably on. There was a third that I think I had to, like I felt that compelled to do so. And is good enough that I'm comfortable.

And then the last one that I don't feel good about, but I couldn't not put it in. So I was really grappling with myself. We'll start. We'll start at the beginning for me, boys. Jed, Jed, before you go, before you go, can I add a couple of somber notes before we go on?

real quick. Sure. I love to bring down the good violence. Listen, that's what I'm here for. I, because I want to get out of the way because I don't forget later

or so it doesn't get Barry in some of the show. First of all, this is the first damn that we're doing on someone who is no longer with us on a deceased fighter. I believe that that is correct.

I had to look back. I had to look back. So thankfully, all the other people we've talked about are still with us. But yeah, Kimmel is the first one. And I have to dedicate my portion of this episode to Derek Schott.

I don't know if you guys know, Derek shot for he was Punisher base. He was contributor over on Bloody Elbow, a long time moderator. And I, I want to dedicate, again, my part of the episode to him because we had started writing. We wrote together a long time ago, a tough 10 retrospective. That's the Kimball Slice season. And this was before I was getting paid to be a writer.

We were just doing it for fun. But it's one of those things where like I learned a lot just from on, you know, how to write and how to edit and just to, you know, stay on the, be on that grind and how to get the work done. So it was very formative writing series for me. So Derek, this one's for you, Punisher Base. This one's for you, buddy. I'm sure he'll love, he'll love us in this episode. He's a big, big Kimmel guy. I didn't realize that you wrote that, that you wrote about Tough 10, because obviously I saw the news. So that is an unfortunate twist of fate, how this is gone. But I accept you bringing the vibes down for at least just for a moment, yeah.

at least good cause. So back to the good vibes and the awards. The first one I'm putting on my Rushmore is the fight where it all began. It is Kevin Ferguson because that's Kimbo Slices' true name, Kevin Ferguson. And it's him at the time, not known as Kimbo Slices at the time, known as Kimbo to some. Or from the videos, you can hear them screaming, Ferg a lot. Let's get him, Ferg! Put him there, Berg.

A lot of ferg. There's a lot of fur. So much fur going on. I am speaking, of course, of the fight that kind of made him who he was. Big D. This is all of the moniker we have for this gentleman. Don't know his name. Don't know what he does.

If he's around, I hope he is. God bless. But the fight that made Kimbo Slice kind of the big one people gravitated to is this fight with Big D. And if you don't know the story of Kimbo Slices, I guess we maybe could have done a little bit better in telling it. So it is this.

Kimbo grew up in Florida, was a football player of some success in high school, didn't ever really make it happen in college, was homeless for a bit after a hurricane destroyed his house, was living in his car, got on with Reality Kings, a porn production company as a driver slash bodyguard. And then while he was doing this,

he also started. engaging in street fights for money. And then they filmed it. The Reality Kings people kind of found out he was doing this for money. And they were like, hey, we should film this and put it up on the internet. They did. And almost overnight Kimbo Slices became internet sensation. And the first big one is this fight with Big D or Big D gets a gnarly cut over one of his eyes.

I want to say it's his right eye, but I don't quote me on that. And then that is what leads to the name Kimbo Slice. Kimbo was apparently a nickname of his growing up and sliced for the big cut. I don't know how you leave off. You have to at least have one of the street fights for, if not multiple, on the Mount Rushmore. And this is obviously the biggest one, the most meaningful and a terrific performance from Kimbo, if we're, if we're, you know, gauging his street fighting acumen. Like, just roughhousing, makes Big D quit. Just like, no, I'm good.

We're done here. And it's sort of the entire essence. So Big D is my first entry. Do you agree, gentlemen? Yeah. First, let me say, Kimbo-Slices, I mean, easily the best nickname in M.A. history. If you count as a nickname, which I don't, which I don't. I think it's ineligible.

I think it's ineligible. Because it is essentially his name. It is his name. Yes, he's Kevin Ferguson. I'm sure that's one on what's on his legal documents. But he's Kimball Slice. I think it has to be disqualified from the nickname competition. Otherwise, it's clearly the best one.

It was organically made. There's just a weird simple poetry to it. It's very memorable. You hear it once. You're pretty much never going to forget it. So great name, great moniker again. I won't call it a nickname, but great moniker. And yes, the origin is fantastic.

I didn't know. I think, yeah, Big D, I think I settled on. You definitely have to include one of the street. I think, can we not just lump them all together? Can we not include that as one? We cannot. No, we can't have one. They're not all the same.

No, they're all different in a very appealing ways. But we can't have one head on Mount Rushmore that's like a bunch of little heads. That would be a cool looking like feature on Mount Rushmore. I mean, for anyone who wants a quick recap, if you just Google, once you Google, you're talking about the hydro. Exactly. Yeah. One of the heads is a hydra.

If you go to, if you YouTube Kimbo Slice Street Flight, I think the first thing that should pop up is a compilation of some of his flights. And so it's really easy to run through them very quickly. This is on. And honestly, Big D is one of the first one. Like I haven't Googled that specifically. But like it probably is the one that pops up the most because it. Shout us.

The most famous of the street fights. Of course. Shout us to Real Fight Channel. I think they also hosted some of the individual, but they have a compilation as well. So I'm just going, yeah, big D's in there. Dreds. Dreds.

That's the cleanest. That's the cleanest, that's the cleanest, K.O., I think. It's just this one shot. It's just this one. You're done. Big Mac. Love the big, the two for one.

What's the two for one? And the other guy who's in asterisk. Afro puff. This is a bunch of amateur hour here. What is this? Come on. Adrian. Is the first.

funniest. Adrian is the funniest one. Adrian, if you guys, he's this super jacked, like, white guy. That's Adrian with a Y? Adrian with a Y, of course. I think people knew that. Very conscious. Very conscious decision there. It is. He looks super jacked. You're like, oh, like, oh, this guy, he comes out like, oh, like, I'm pumped, I'm crazy. Has no idea how to fight. Zero. No, it's horrible. The credit to him, because he's scraps. Several of these other dudes are like trying to fight. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's true. Try to fight, but don't know how. So they're like holding their hands and like boxing position but can't do shit.

Yeah. He's just coming out and charging it in, you know? And it wouldn't go well for him, but no. He's there to, he's there to do something. He did not want to get. He could not get up after getting pummeled by Kimbo. Chico, very respect, probably the most respect. The most respectable.

Chico is terrific. The most respectable, like an actual fight. That's a fight. That's like a legitimate fight. And then there's the bouncer who's the biggest guy. And Kimbo kind of has to mix the martial arts. He actually takes, like there's a crazy ass take down. The bouncer drops, Kimber.

Kimbo. He does he drop him, though, or does he step on Kimbo? And then like kind of push him backwards. In street fights, that's all the same, baby. Like, this isn't, this isn't an organized squared circle. Step it on the feet's fine. It's true. He goes for an illegal strike and a downed opponent.

And that just brings out the beast in Kimbo. Cambo's not having none of that and gets a tick, kind of tick down into a garage. And then the fight ensues from there. But I guess if you have to pick one, we go with Big D. But, man, there's so many. I don't know. Shaheen, did you go with Big D as well? So, yeah, hold on.

Can we just properly deep dive into this world that these people created? Because it's so, it's magnificent, frankly. The fact that I right now, as a 34-year-old man who has not watched any of these in like 15 years, was able to vividly remember all of them and pull up, like, as I'm watched going through this rewatch and remember all of the nicknames, all of the stupid taglines and the gimmicks and everything, And like exactly, even like the fight arenas. They created their own like mortal combat here. They created their own moral combat roster.

I mean, he did a really good job of it. With the levels like like you said, the boatyard, the backyard. Like there's one, it's the same one Masfodal fought it with like a yellow, red type of background. It's clearly like behind a restaurant or something like this. Like all of this is so well executed to be so bizarrely memorable on like such a weird. Wallace level. Where is he with Apple? Like this. Go ahead Jed. Just think about it like this, right? Like

if you're playing a fighting game you get to pick the venue too. Like it's our year of the two dudes and it's the venue. In the UFC you, I don't, I haven't played the UFC 5 so I don't know, but there's not like that variety because it's all the octagon in the nameless arena. Whereas

this is like, hey, do you want to fight Chico in the in the backyard or do you want to fight Big Mac and Afro puff in the boat you or whatever and it's like there's legitimately captivating part of this dude i was going to ask is afro puff and big mac was that at a hanger was that like guile stage and street fighter there's a hanger right weren't there's a boatyard there's a boatyard there was like a bunch of just like broken down boats there and in a bunch of boats in a boat hanger all of it brings such a visceral level to it but also like a real

element of danger to it right where it's like dude you could get hit into one of these very sharp boats or you could get land backwards on the concrete and someone's dead. Like that's the bouncer. The bouncer gets tackled into someone's garage. Yeah. It's incredibly funny. It's just the world that they were able to create is iconic in a way that is really kind of inexplainable to again.

I'm 34 years old. I have not looked at any of this up since I was in high school basically. And if you would have asked me a week ago before I've rewatched all of this, hey, name like five Kimbo opponents from the backyards. I could have told you, Big D Afropuff. I could have told you all these dudes just screamed off my head because they did such a, it's so lazy. The naming on all of this is so lazy and so dumb,

but it's so tremendous and successful. So I don't know what you're talking about. Adrian with a Y, that's high level naming right there. That's just, that's just what you do. It was incredible. It was perfect. It is. It really was perfect.

And so going back to sort of where we started, Yes, Big D or Big Bird. I've also also called him, seen him refer to as Big Bird. That was in my... You can hear you hear Bird yelled several times in the fight as well. Yeah. So unclear, unclear what his actual name is, but Godspeed, I hope you're out there, D. Hope you're out there, Big D, Big Bird.

I hope you're doing well. Well, this did sit me down a little bit of a Big D rabbit hole of like what happened to this guy and did he lose his eyeball? because it kind of almost looks like he's about to lose his eyeball on this. I mean, it's not great. And it doesn't seem like things would very well for Big D throughout life. So, you know, I'm sorry to hear that. There are other street fight videos you can find of Big D though, and he has a very messed up eyeball in those videos.

So I don't know if this is an injury he carried with him for life. Well, you can't. If so, that's unfortunate. You can't tease us like this. What's happening to Big D? What happened to him? If you did the research, we got to know. Well, look, this is all very unsubstantiated research, so I don't want to just be willy-nilly.

All of this part of the Kimbo story may or may not be true. I don't want to just be throwing things out, Willie, Neely. Just look up what happened to Big D. You might find the same stuff as me. It seems like he maybe had a bit of a hard life and that injury might have been like a pretty serious injury that he carried with him. But just this video, this video is the catalyst of all of this, right? Because I don't know about y'all, but this is the first video I saw of Kimbo. This is the one in Miss Marshall's class that we were watching, that 20 people were gathered around the computer watching.

And it is so easy to be 30 seconds into this video and just be all in and like understand exactly what you're watching and understand exactly what's about to happen. This dude has no idea what he is in for until about 20 seconds in this fight. And it's the first one I vividly remember seeing it. And he lets like at one point Kimbo puts his hands down and just says, Come on, hit me. And like, let's this dude punch him and it does zero to him. It does less than zero. And at that point that you've built a superhuman, like you've built, you've built a superstar just with that one moment.

And then what happens happens and he just gets his eyeball ripped out of his socket. And like at several points, he's like, chill, dog, chill. Like, I'm done, dog. I'm done. And then everyone around, the peer pressures. I respect you. Calm down. Everyone around.

Just peer pressure is to continue. The peer pressure. that moment must have been extraordinary for all these videos of like 20 akimbo's dudes just being around like dude it's not done the fight's not over what are you doing this is if you build a mountain rushmore or kimboard this is the number one easy guaranteed has to be in there that's the beauty of that that the breaking of big d is really uh indicative of the beauty of his fights so and his nickname he wasn't he's not like knocking guys out cold in these fights uh again i think dreads maybe the closest.

Agent actually was knocked out pretty bad. But it's more like he's literally slicing them up and just probably fracturing some facial bones so badly they do not want to continue. They're like, they probably physically can get up and shout us to Big Mac, by the way, who gets up like twice when he probably shouldn't. But it's not this highlight reel of one shot chaos, guys are always called walkoffs. No, it's a lot of like, do you want to get up? He's talking to them, get up.

Do you want to get up, pick them up after hug them? Like they're still like cognizant, basically of what's going to. going on after, but also they always make sure his team is so good. Get that zoom in on their face. Get it in their face. Look how messed up this person is. This guy did that. You know, Kimbo, our guy did that with his fist, his magical fists.

He did that. And you just could- They knew how to captivate audiences. You couldn't sell someone. You couldn't do it. You couldn't sell someone better than that. And the thing is Kimbo, like, it's pretty clear he has, I don't know, training, but he's just like instinctively a level above some of these guys.

He's got some defense. He's working the body and stuff. But at the same time, I don't know if you guys got this kind of a question for you guys. It was a bit absurd to think that he would become a serious, competitive, like mixed martial artist after watching these clips, right? As instinctively good as he was. Okay, okay. Well, that was the controversy. He was a backyard borrower.

That was always the problem that a lot of MMA fans at that point in time had with the whole thing, right? is like this guy is representing us, but he is so clearly unskilled in the way that like actual MMA fighters are skilled. Yeah. I mean, he's just definitely not. We all knew it. And that or,

you know, all the MMA fans knew it. And then all the other people didn't. And that's sort of part of the story of everyone kind of learning that. And then ultimately it not mattering. Because whenever, when the world writ large figured it out and the M. M.M.

world knew it because Sean Gannon happened and everyone knew it almost immediately. But when the world figured it out, it didn't change the fact that because wins and losses were beside the point with him. I mean, it's obviously better to win and those are the things, but that's not, you know, you read any of the histories about Kimbo Sice or any of this stuff done by him. And he was a celebrity in a way that is not common, even amongst athletes, not just fighters. And fighters are the least likely to reach this level. Like, you know, you can hear people talk about Lamar Odom saying, having a quote out there that's like, Pey Manning was born to throw a football, Babe Ruth was born to swing a bat, Kimbo Slices was born to kick ass. At that point, it doesn't matter.

Like, Lamar Odom can watch better people fight, but it is what Kimbo is drawing you in in a different way. And so, yeah, I think largely people were aware. I not think I know most everyone was aware it was going on, but it was really beside the point. Because that's sort of the ineffable thing about the fight game. Your ability to attract people is not necessarily tied with you being good at all. Okay, so we're all on board of Big D. Shout out to Big D. Shout out to Big D.

I hope whatever mystery troubles that Shaheen is talking about are not true. And they are from some other man brawling in boatyards in the 305. my next one this is the one i think you just have to put on there um it's james thompson i think you got to put there for the for the arc and the story of him is the biggest fight in american in may actually still be i didn't i didn't look it up to see if it still has the most it is not me it is not anymore but it was until kane velasquez and junior dos Santos debuted on fox in 2011 can yeah okay yeah it was the biggest fight in american internet history the most eyeballs ever seen six million people or something insane.

This was the first fight on CBS. You know, it was this was the fight that everyone in the deep in May corners of the world was concerned. Well, this is what's going to be our representation on mainstream media and then here it is and it actually ended up kicking ass. Arguably, honestly, Kimbo's best performance.

Like, I don't know where you would put it, but there aren't, like, as far as actual, like, MMA performances go, Kimbo James Thompson, I think is his best showing. He's very, he's clearly taking the sport a little bit more seriously. He is training. He's showing some ground game and gets a stoppage that I was lamented by the commentary team. The quote, terrible stoppage. Kimbo caught a break is deeply, deeply amusing to me as you rewatch this.

because James Thompson is out on his feet and his ear has been blown off the side of his own head. And yet the commentary team's like, ah, Kimbo got lucky. I don't know. Bad stop it. It's like, okay, I don't know what else needed to happen other than a dead body. But you weren't that far away from it, my friend. So James Thompson, do you also, do you gentlemen also agree that this one goes on the rush more? absolutely 1,000%

it's not on mine it's not on mine I guess I'll have to explain later I guess I guess I only went with one elite XC fight and this is and I touched upon another one later but James Thompson is not on mine you have made a really good point

why it should be but I think I'm okay I think I'm okay with what I went with as the largest fight in MMA history up to that point in time yes and that's that's why it is this number right here is why it is 6.5 million people that's a lot of people six point is that a small amount of people million people watched this and for probably 5.5 of those people it was their first introduction to mama was watching james thompson's ear explode off of his head on primetime

television in a gruesome site legitimately the first time i'd ever seen that too um because you know my MMA fandom had not was only five years in or something at that point uh and now that was the first time i'd ever seen cauliflower ear like go go in that bad of a way uh it was it was pretty gnarly and there was like a there's like a there's like a journey you take in that fight where like oh that ear is like real floppy oh that ear's getting pretty damaged oh no this ear might be a thing Oh, boy, he's about to blow up this year. Oh my God, he's about to end. And then it happens and it's just the grossest thing ever.

Like, you take a real roller coaster throughout that journey of this year. Are you guys looking at the rest of this card? An important question before then, though. This or Sakaraba at Dynamite 2010, which is the worst ear falling off? I think Thompson is worse. I think it's this. I think it's this. But I don't know.

Maybe I'm just because we're talking about it now. I just think it's this because you get the visual of like grandma on a Saturday night watching some CBS and then seeing this, you know, like this is just real. Not what you tuned in for. That's a compelling argument because I, I think in a vacuum, Sakharov is worse because it actually looks like his entire ear is falling off of his head and not just like clearly the cauliflower ear has fallen off of Thompson's own ear. in a gross way, but not a ton of grandmas are watching dynamite 2010. So I might be a really good argument, Gene. And if they were, I'll tell you. CBS.

If they were. If they were. If they were, some of them might have been loving that Sakharava fight. Because I can tell you when I went to Japan and saw a death match show there, the front row had several older women who looked like they were very excited to see guys. bloods in each other and draw blood from each other. So I don't, I'm sure that's not the majority of the elderly, uh, Japanese female population in that country.

But, uh, I've seen it and it wouldn't surprise me if some people said, give me more. Shats to Sakharaba. Saka Raba, you will be the last damn we ever do because we can't top you. We can't top you. Like after you're just the, you're the apex of damn and the image of you having your head wrapped like a mummy after your ear fell off is, it's iconic. It's terrific. Shouts to Sakharama.

So this card, Elite XC, prime time. It's weird. It's so weird to look at it. Because it was on prime time. It's well named. Calvin Cater was on our future UFC featherweight contender. Calvin Cater, fighting at 135 pounds. Wilson Hayes fought for the UFC flyweight title.

Calvin Gator lost. I didn't realize as well. Yes. To James Jones, if you remember, like he actually pops up on a few other people's records, James Jones. Um, Zach McCovsky, future Bellator, bantamway champion. Yeah, Gina Carrano, of course. Phil Broney's on there.

Robbie Lars Scott Smith, that was a no contestant iPogue, wasn't it? Yes, I remember that. I poke. Oh, the infamous Nick Serra butt scooting to his own demise. That's right. I was trying to refuse to stand up and was this qualified. You haven't seen that too often. So pretty wild card as it was.

And, of course, could only be capped off by, uh, Kimbo Slice destroying a man's ear. I mean, just a very quick shout out to Elite XE who do exactly what they were doing. Yes. They were going to be on, you know, this is our big card. Gina Carano, Robbie Lollah, Kimbo Slice. Let's just put those three there. That's the best we got.

And, you know, I have no idea. I mean, it worked. It did work because this was not what ended the ElitexC run. But we need more of that in MMH. Just lead with your, play your best players, you know? That's just what you got to do. Okay, so AK has decided James Thompson isn't there. We'll circle back.

We'll put a pin in a circle. My next one, I think AK is going to be the fight you chose. You said you didn't choose multiple fights from there. So I'm going to say that this is the one you chose. This is the one I felt the worst about putting on, but I just don't think you tell the story of Kimbo-Slic and his significance in the sport without doing it. It's Seth Petrazzelli. lead XC heat. It is the follow-up to the James Thompson fight. Kimbo gets knocked out in 14 seconds.

It is arguably, I'm not even sure it's arguable, the biggest bag fumbling in the history of this sport, if not all of combat sports. We've talked about it on several programs on MMFighton.com website. We've talked about it sort of loosely with other dams because of sort of the significance of the moment, but I still cannot believe 16 years later, still cannot believe how this unfolded. And the thing I remember most about it, guys, is the immediacy with which everyone who knew anything knew what was about to happen. Because this fight is supposed to be Ken Shamrock.

He, Kimbo-Slic and Kim Shamrock, they ultimately do fight in Belto a little bit later. But this has been the big buildup between these two. is very on brand for lead ex C. Let's take this old dude out and let's let Kimbo take him behind the barn and shoot him and it'll be great. Ken Shamrock gets a cut over his eye backstage beforehand requires stitches is out of the fight.

And so during the broadcast, we are informed that this has happened and that instead Seth Petrazzelli will be stepping in to face Kimbo Slice in the main event. Petrazzelli was, who is he supposed to? to fight on that card. I don't remember who he was supposed to fight on that. That's a good question.

That's a terrific question. I was literally looking that up right now while you were talking. While you try and figure that out, Seth Petrazzellie, who is, if somehow you've never seen this moment, he has black and pink hair is the exact opposite image of a human being you would want to derail the Kimbo-Slic hype train, which is at its end. apex after James Thompson. It will never get bigger than that moment. And he comes in and in 14 seconds, knocks him out.

And it's the shittiest knockout you've ever seen, too. Because Kimbo just kind of bulls his way in, charges across. And Seth catches him with a really short shot backed up against the fence from the live TV angle. You can't even see it happen. You're just like, ooh, Kimbo's now on a knee. And Seth Petrazel is hitting him and then the fight's over. And then on replay, you see that Kimbo gets. caught coming in and it killed delete xe the promotion died that moment with one short left hand

from seth petrazelli 14 seconds into a fight that never should have happened it's just such a seminal moment in the sport that i couldn't couldn't not put it on as mount rushmore a k is this the fight you were talking about yeah of course of course it has to be on there it's historically notable um god bless gus johnson uh who tried to it to sell the moment as, oh, this is a real life Rocky story. I'm like, this has no parallels to the Rocky, to any sort of Rocky story.

It's just not. It just doesn't, it doesn't work that way. I miss the Gus Johnson and MMIA face. And it's funny because Gus Johnson, it seemed like he was like the perfect guy to do MMA and the returns were not as good as we hoped. He didn't handle a lot of those situations, I think

farfully. I talked about like he did give us sometimes these things happen in MMA. Exactly. Exactly. He did his best, but it should have, what should have been like, oh, Gus Johnson is going to be the greatest, and May commentator like of all time instead became like, he was memorable and he was okay.

He wasn't terrible. He was just okay. He was just okay. He wasn't properly equipped, I think, for this society. Yeah, you got to go with the Petrazzelli thing. It's amazing to think how different it would have been if things just goes planned and Kimbo knocks out Ken Chammock. Because Ken Chambrook still had a massive name at the time.

Still someone, this was, I think he had, He had come off a run with the UFC. Not a good run. He'd lost his last few fights. But he was still viewed as the UFC guy, Ken Shamrock. His name was so strongly attached to that brand. And if Kimbo beats him in their minds, it's like, oh, wow, he just beat UFC star Ken Shamrock. This is crazy.

This guy's legit. And to go from that, even if he had beaten Seth Petrozil, I'm honestly not sure where that would have gone. It was so important for them for this part of the plan to go forward. and for it not to happen is just the ripples of it I think are still being felt I think that's one reason why I put this one over the Thompson fight

yes the James Thompson fight was the most viewed you know fight in comics in my history of the time but when people talk about the Seth Petrozzelli fight more I don't think that's an exaggeration which is not to say

the James Thompson fight is forgotten it certainly isn't if just the visual again of James Thompson's freaking ear no longer existing but the Petrozzelli fight is the, it's to this day, it's still like meme worthy. People still bring it up.

People still bring it up as the fight that killed a company. So historically, again, you could just have both. That maybe was the way to go. But I wanted to fit a different button there. And if I had to pick one, I had to go with the Seth's Petrazzelli thing. Surreal in the moment, still surreal to look back on. And yes, somewhat depressing, but also somewhat darkly hilarious. That might define my Mount Rushmore, actually.

It's a bit trollish, I think, as you'll see with some of my other choices. But, Shaheen, what were you? Where are you on Seth? Well, first of all, Seth Petrosilly was about to fight Aaron Rosa, the immortal Aaron Rosa. Oh, Rosa. There we go. Really? Also, I don't know if this turned up for you all on your research, but the wonderful Chuck Mendenhall wrote a retrospective on this event this evening for a good little website called www.com. Great website.

Go check it out. where apparently, and I did not realize this at the time and certainly how I missed this, but apparently Frank Shamrock, Ken Shamarck's brother who was doing commentary at the time, offered to step in. I was like, hey, I remember that. I do remember that. I'll do it. I didn't recall that at all.

But, you know, offer, offer to step in. And then Kimball was like, nah. So another thing. But Sheim, you were saying. Smart. Frank Shamrock does not give you. Frank might know how to do business Yeah

Seth is Seth is clearly too done to do business And like even in some of the after Like after interviews there's You know Petrazzelli talking about the promoters like You know hinting at you should take a dive without saying that But like we'll offer you you know there's a knockout of the night bonus So don't shoot takedowns basically

And that became a whole thing I'm not sure you would need to tell that to Frank Frank Frank might just know how to do business well enough. Both of you were wrong. I love you both dearly, but you're both wrong. And I refuse to bring negative vibes to a one for us good vibes podcast. This doesn't belong on the list. Wow.

Wow. Look, I told you this was the one that I really struggled with. I didn't, James Thompson, I put for the reasons we talked about, but I wasn't like sold. It wasn't, that was not one of the two that had to have been there for me. but I ultimately decided on this was the one I grappled the most with because I hate I hate bringing the negative vibes but at the same time

I spend so I spend an inordinate amount of my personal time thinking about this fight and how do I not put it here because of it's the funniest thing that's ever happened in the sport if you were deep in the game at this point you are clued like you are tuned in because the Kimbo experience is so big

and it's so meaningful and you are a deep MMA fan. You're like, we're, you know, we're mainstream. And here's Kimbo. And yes, Ken Shamark is a bit of a sham, but also, Ken Shamark could absolutely beat Kimbo-Sliced because we didn't think Kimbo could fight at all. And Kim, and Ken was washed, but Kim could, Ken could fight at one point in time. And then the most, just the most insane thing happens. And then they say Seth Petrcelli.

And everyone is like, this is, I, this is an awful idea. how did everyone everyone knew it was bad except for the elite ex C people who ran the ball I'll never get over how funny it is yeah I'm in full agreement man it's it's darkly

it's darkly hilarious I'm glad if you can look back on it and laugh now I'm sure a lot of people involved at the time did not find it so funny but boy yeah how can you not have a little bit of a chuckle at this truly bizarre and completely unforeseeable turn of events that killed what really was a promising and enjoyable anime promotion.

I will say, there's not a lot of... With the death of pride, they were like a legitimate number two because they had the biggest event in history. Absolutely. We're joking, but like, that's very serious. They were the precursor to strike force, basically. They were the people once Pride died. Not a lot of guys out there could say they murdered entire MMA promotion.

So good on you. Petrazelli. Good, on you, Seth Petrazzelli. We'll get to you an episode 536 of damn. They were good. So my last one, I'm going to wait

because I've never been more confident in a single thing in my life than I am that it is also on both of your lists. We have not explicitly said it to each other, but we all know

what it is and it's, It's on all of ours. So before we get to the final one for all of us, Shaheen and AK, you both have one open spot on your Mount Rushmore. Sheen, let's start with you. Since you choose not to honor Seth Petruzzelli, the organizational murderer, what have you chosen to honor? Yes, this is a good vibes only podcast.

And to me, the story of Kimbo Slice, the legend of Kimbo Slice, the resume at Kimbo Slice, who cares about the MMA fights? You have to, it's mostly in the street fight. So for me, I did a second street fight because if, if this Mount Rushmore is half street fights, half real fights, then that's fine. That feels emblematic to me of what this is. So for me, the secondary street fight that qualifies for this is, you know me, I love gimmicks. Just give me a good gimmick.

And I'm in. You're fighting two guys at the one time on a boathyard? Dude, I'm in. One of those guys named Afropuff? even better. The other dude's name, the other dude's name Big Mac, and he's going to get knocked down five times

and still get up and want to keep fighting? Dude, yeah, I'm all in. That's it. That's all you needed to tell me. So Afropuff slash Big Mac. What a day. What an afternoon for Kimbo's life. Big Mac is so funny.

Just two things. Two things for this fight, because I had not watched this since I was a kid. And watching as an adult was just as delightful as it was when I was a kid. Afro puff. Doesn't really seem like he knows what he's getting into. And then pretty quickly realizes what he's getting into.

And doesn't get knocked out at all, kind of like doesn't really fight at all. Kind of just looks terrified. Looks super terrified and then takes a slight punch and then very slowly takes a knee and then just stays there for 30 seconds. And you will never see a more shook person in a fist fight of some kind than this man. And they are ruthless to him too. And the peer pressure in that moment, good on you, Afropuff. Man, you wouldn't even get hit. Dude on.

30 seconds, come on. Good on you, Afropuff, for sticking to your guns because you knew what was going to happen if you stood up. It was going to only be bad for you. Man, just let all that peer pressure go by the wayside. And instantly, it was just like, nah, dude, I'm done. Whatever this is, y'all aren't paying me enough to do this. Like, I don't care.

I don't care what you're saying. I bet he's doing better than Big D right now. So I'm just going to wager. So good for you, Afro puff. And you know what? Bet he's doing better than Big Mac because Afropov taps out and immediately. Just don't be big.

Don't be big against Kimbo. Dude, Afro puff taps out and everyone's making fun of this man. And then immediately they're like, whatever, just get Big Mac in here. And this dude steps in without them even cutting the camera. He is already just revving, ready to go. He must have been like right on the sideline,

ready to watch this. And whatever Afro puff is on the spectrum of like, you came to do this and you didn't come to do this, Big Mac is like on the. complete opposite side. He very much came to do this. He knew the assignment. He understood the assignment. The dude, I'm down five different times and still wanted to get up and keep going to the point where like I see Mike who was like Kimbo's handler is like, dude, you have to stop. You might die. We need you to stop. You're not getting paid well enough for this. That is a legendary moment

in the history of the internet. That's on my Mount Rushmore. It's so you make a compelling case because it's so funny to watch Big Mac get up. It's like if you ever watch seen, cool hand Luke when they do the boxing match and Luke can't beat him and he just keeps getting up and it gets progressively more sad how easy he's just like tipping him over to the ground

that's Big Mac and Big Mac don't want quit he's got he's got the fire in him but the dog in him man have the ability he had the dog in him for sure this is a compelling case and I don't hate it I really don't hate it I think you've made

the listeners at home can decide for themselves, but you've made a great argument for leaving Seth Petrazzellie off the list. AK, what is your argument for leaving the biggest fight in MMA history at that point in time off the list? Yeah, Shaheen, that was smart because I was agonizing, as I said before. Like, I was agon, which street fight do I pick? Like, I can only pick one. I'm like, wait a minute.

And I should have realized, I don't have to only pick one. Like, why do I have to only pick one? You can get two. I know. Now I wish I'd done another. I did not. First of all, shame on both of you for your. Kimbo in the UFC erasure.

I feel like you have to pick one of these fights. You certainly cannot pick the Matt Mitchell. You certainly do not. You very much do not. I'm feeling we may cover that later. That fight is, we talk about depressing. That is a rough one. But the Houston Alexander fight.

Once again, Houston Alexander, the Altruiter 10 finale. Once again, shout-out to my boy, Puncher Base, Derek Schott. He loved this fight. He loved joking about this fight. It is a, we keep saying, this was the first time you saw Kimbo, if this was first time we saw Kimbo, there was layers.

There's always another, I think, another audience for Kimbo to reach as his career kept progressing. And this was finally, and I think a lot of people had probably watched the ultimate fight on the Ultimate Fighter as well.

We'll talk about that later, the Ron Nelson fight. But if by some chance you hadn't, by some chance you are the most casual of UFC fans and you're just like, I'm only going to tune into like actual events. And I don't watch other promotions. And this was the first time you saw Kimbo slice

and you heard some of the hype. And it is a mesmerizing fight, not necessarily in a good way. It's not high on action. It's the right matchup. I think their heart was in the right place. God bless the UFC, their heart was in the right place. They said Houston Alexander is a first round knockout guy.

Kimball Slice just puts hands on people. This won't last more than two minutes. We're going to have some great footage to get from this. And Kimball Slice would be our start. The fight does not turn out like that at all. There's quite a bit of, again, circling. There's quite a bit of inconsequential grappling. A few exchanges that get the blood up.

But I know I'm not alone in this And I totally respect it Not making your Mount Rushmore's As I was looking for this fight It's right there on YouTube 42 million views So this was put up three years ago It's also on Fight Pass

But it's on YouTube for free You don't even need Five Pass 42 million views You're watching the pleasure of watching this fight anytime you want It's the seventh most viewed video On that channel of all their videos On the Uly's channel?

On the UDIS channel It is number seven That's incredible And it's only behind That's what, dude, and it's only behind- Kimbo-Syce. Kimbo-Cyce. You should save that for the stats category.

No. Holy shit, that's impressive. And it's only behind-10 star in the history of M-M-M-A. We're not lying. Guys, we're not lying. And it's only behind two fights. There's only two fights. The other stuff's like compilations, I think, some interviews, things like that.

Connor Nate, for sure. No, it's ahead of Connor. In fairness, it is also, I think, was put up two years before Connor Nate, so I'm sure Connor Nate. It doesn't matter. That's, I don't matter. I'm stunned. It is behind only Habib Gaitji and Rousey Tate, too.

That's it of fights. I would never bet Hib Gigi. Holy. The Habib crowd goes hard on YouTube. The Habeek crowd goes wrong. They do. That's the best fun with stats answer I've ever heard, AK. I should have saved it.

Just loop it back. It's the best one I've ever heard. I didn't even consider to look into that. So it's on my Mount Rushmore, and I get the weird feeling it's on a lot of people's Mount Rushmore somehow. So I have this in honor roll mention. I have a couple of points I want to make. First, arguably his actual best MMA performance as well. It's this or James Thompson.

He actually shows a level of a diverse game. Arguable, definitely. This is he shows diverse game and largely like the best cardio of his career, even though I still wouldn't. say that that's a standout ability of his. Okay. Best in quotations. Well, you know, he goes 15, he goes 15 minutes and, you know, still is competing as he doesn't do in some other fights. Jed, he wins a decision.

He has a win. In the UFC, he's, again, we talked to him that you know, but he has a UFC win on his record, you know, that's there. That no one can ever think that way. Of course. Not a fake one. Houston Alexander is for real, AK. Okay.

We will not settle for this Houston, Alexander, erasure. I was there to watch him just obliterate Keith Jardine and blow Joe Rogan's mind. Thank you very much. The other thing I want to talk about, because I think when we talked about this fight, that's when I wanted to have this discussion. And it might take us down a little bit of a row, but we're going to go there. What in God's name was the UFC doing? Do you, did you guys look back at the tough, at the tough heavyweight finale?

card that this on. This is third. This is the feature bout of the card. The main event is Roy Nelson, Brendan Schaubb, the tough finale that like, sure main event, but also no one cares. The co-main is Matt Hamill, John Jones, the fateful

one career loss of John Jones. Kimbo Slice has proven to be one of if not the biggest stars in the sport and they put him third billing here? What the fuck are we doing? Can someone explain this to me? This will, I will say, I don't, I'll let Sheen speak on it because

this will kind of tie in to, I think, my sliding doors thing I have later. So I don't have a strong, I don't have a strong point to make about it now. I want to save that. Sheen, I don't know if you want to speak on this. I'm just, I'll step all over because when we get to the international player haters ball award, the nitpicking of fires career, that is my number one takeaway. Is this how you really wanted to leverage all of this fame and notoriety, you have seen? Like there are so many different ways that you could have leveraged what you had here. You had Kimbo agreeing to do this dumb reality show.

You had Kimbo on a contract and this is how we spend it doing dumb shit like this. Like the UFC chapter, people just forget it happened because it was so unmemorable. It was so managed poorly. I think, and I've said it on this podcast already,

I think that the Kimbo Elite XC thing is maybe the biggest, but like bag fumbling in the history of MMA. I think the UFC and their approach to him would never happen today and is right there with it because even the concept of putting him on that television show is outrageous. And you know, Dana at the time, I remember, was not big into the Kimbo. Like, he's not a real fighter. We've got real fighters in that aspect of things, which was foolish.

And okay, we'll take him if he comes on. on the ultimate fighter. Honestly, I hate to make this comparison because one of these people as cool as shit and the other sucks all the ass, a bit akin to Dylan Dennis

as things currently sit and saying, yeah, you can come on tough. Kimbo didn't need to because putting him on, like, we all knew the joke. Everyone was in on it

that this is a fictitious man, but he's a superhero, and instead of building that in a way that they kind of did with Houston and Alexander, as, okay, here's what we can do. We're going to put him on tough, and he's going to immediately fight Roy Nelson on tough

because tough is a competition show between the coaches who are just going to burn him because he's not actually good. And so instead you just don't. And then they bring him in and you do the Houston fight, which makes all the sense in the world and is good booking. But you book it as the third lead when this man is in the most watch fight in history.

And you are trying to show your legitimacy, I get it, but how is he the third lead in this event? How is Kimbo slice not, how did his career not end up fighting 12 times in the UFC in co-main events or feature bouts on paper views to juice up and help start building your big stars, your John Jones is your George St. Pierre's and making them even bigger because Kimbo's in the co-lead

mashing some dude who has big puffed up muscles and can't fight for shit. This was such a little. up that they rejected, like they went up for a dunk and hit the rim and the ball ricocheted back to the other end of the court and two points on themselves. I cannot believe how badly they fucked this all up. And here's the thing too is there would have been a never, there's never been a better era for them to have treated it properly. This is not an era of rankings that we're talking about. There is no rankings to speak of in the UFC. The UFC at this point in time

can just do whatever the hell they want and they don't really need to justify it to anybody. The Roy Nelson thing, even in the moment, was the most insane thing possible you could have done with Kimbo. Because sure, you put him on the show,

whatever. If you put him on the show, make sure he doesn't fight Roy Nelson first. Because this is a show that's going to last like three, four months with a lot of different fights and a lot of different rounds of this tournament. And you're putting up against the number one scene

who was like, right Nelson was like a top 10 heavyweight in the world at that. point in time. Like, yeah, man, Roy Nelson's going to beat Kimbo. He's going to lay on top of him and he's going to beat Kimbo. Like I told,

I could tell you that in the moment. It was ridiculous. We all knew it was dumb that Roy Nelson was going on tough because he was too good for tough. Like, why is he here? He's already one of the best every way to live. And then it was just so insane to me.

Can I tell, because I wouldn't look this up. Can I explain to you how dumb this is in a way that really drives the point home to me. Do you know the two events that happened after this one for the UFC? It's UFC 107 and UFC 108. 107 is BJ Penn versus Diego Sanchez. It's a legitimate star doing a legitimate pay-per-view. Do you know what UFC 108 was headlined by? Oh boy. Rashad Evans Tiago Silva. They passed up on all of the business that Kimbo could have brought them for what? so Dana could prove a point that this guy isn't good?

I don't, I truly do not understand what happened here. I'm, I'm purely speculating, but I have to imagine also that Kimbo cost a lot of money. Now, before you say, he would have made them so much more money than he costs. Of course he would have. That's just, that's obvious. But they didn't like anyone shaking the financial Apple cart back then, right? I mean, we just saw the recent documents him talking about like, I don't know what CM Punk, how much CM Punk was making and how other fighters got upset about that.

I don't know. Akimbo for sure knew how much in his team, for sure, knew how much he was worth. And they probably, I bet he wasn't signed to a four-fight deal right off of Ultimate Fighter. It was probably, I think, like a lot of Ultimate Fighter guys, is probably the one fight to fight Houston Alexander. And then if you win, you get some sort of deal. I don't know what that deal was. But, and then he loses his next fight and then, you know, you can cut anyone after a loss. But I think they never wanted to financially commit to him because he had to have been one of the three highest paid fighters at the time.

and like you said, why wasn't he there fighting like a dozen times against just random whatever's and the occasional like, you know, big name fight? They didn't want to, I think this didn't want to pay him. And you're right. And Dana White never loved him. That was part of him. That was part of the Ritza as well, never loved him, never got the whole Kimbo thing. But it also always just comes down to dollar and cents.

And there's like, no, we refuse to pay this guy more than whoever, whoever, these more experience, we just don't want to do it. That's certainly an element to it, I would imagine. Yeah. Because, again, Kimbo was a brand. like Kimbo, people knew Kimbo maybe not as much as the UFC but like pretty close to like

the same amount of people would know Kimbo who know the UFC. So like that's certainly an element to it. But also I go back to the idea like there was a real I don't know how you would describe but there was like a real movement within a certain space of the MMA fan base

and just even the UFC of Dana White of like we're going to take this guy and prove a point with him. Like we're going to prove that we are better than him. Like he is not among us. He does not belong among this space. And it's dumb.

Here's my thing. I think you can prove that point. I think you can do the Maditrione. And then you're still like, well, eyeballs. Like, what do you think they would do to have Kimbo slice right now? Oh my God. Like, what do you think?

How many crimes do you believe the UFC would commit as an entity to have a a Kimbo slice under contract right now as they head into a year where at the end of it, they're going to be negotiating a new TV rights deal. They just, it is. Dude, you could have, it blows my mind. You could have taken a UFC fight night event to whatever Miami arena and put him up against Parker Porter and sold 40,000 tickets. Dude, screw that.

They're going to Miami this year. Can you imagine Kimbo could co-main event with Sean O'Malley? and Sean O'Malley will be the biggest star in the UFC after it. It is. It really drove me insane as I looked up. Just when I clicked, it was like, yeah, tough heavyweight. He's third lead? He's third?

What are we doing? This is one reason I refuse to watch that UFC fight past whatever there, Kimbo retrospective thing. It's also available on free for free on YouTube. And I'm like, I don't need to see this revisionist history because I was there for this moment where the UFC and Dana White were doing everything in their power to kind of discredit him. And for them to then do a documentary later talking about the legend of Kimbo slice, to me is so disgusting. And I will have no part of it. I will say, because credit we're due,

to Dana's credit, after they parted ways with Kimbo, he was very complimenter of him. He was like, hey, you know, he was honestly better than I thought. He gave more. And, you know, we're just moving on a different direction. One of the very few times that the company has said, separated from somebody notable in this manner. And Dana didn't shit on him, which I think is meaningful. So there's that. That's fine. So I understand you putting it here, okay, though I disagree.

I've got a couple of honorable mentions just because I did want to at least mention the fights. But we can't get to those because we still have to close out with the big one. And ladies and gentlemen, if you're new to this podcast, this podcast network, us as individuals, You may not know what's about to come, but the unanimous, the only, no, I guess the second, unanimous choice on this, this Mount Rushmore, one of the five greatest fights in MMA history, and that's not hyperbolic. It is legitimately one of my five favorite fights and holds up on rewatch. I got to say, it's Kimbo versus Dada 5,000 at Bellator.

Boys, we've been waiting for a long time to talk about this fight. first impressions of do you agree because I know that when I say it I mean it with my whole chest is one of my five favorite fights in history do you all have the same level of love or is it you know top 10 top 15 where are you at on that I have said this on a lot of different programs over the years for the NBA fighting podcast network great network this is genuinely in more than a decade of doing this doing this a career, much of which was spent as a traveling reporter, so going to events. I've been to legendary events. I've been to iconic events that will be remembered for the throughout, as long as MMA is a thing, these events will be remembered, whether it's Connor McGregor, USC 200s, whatever you want to throw out, Brock Lesnar, any kind of star. I've been to these fights. I have never had more fun and enjoyed my job more than that week in Houston. when Bellator put on the most engorged monstrosity

that has ever happened in American mixed martial arts, and it was beautiful. It was absolutely beautiful. Can I say I have, I am almost never have this feeling. I am so deeply jealous that you got to be part. Like I am, and there are a lot of events that I would have loved to have been at, but like I have my own experience with them. and it was fine and it was glorious and I don't regret it.

I, there are maybe two fights in history that if you gave me a time machine and a magic lamp, that I would be like, I got to be for that one. I am so jealous of you having been there for all of this. You guys can see it. I don't get behind me. The viewers can't see it behind me. Behind me, I have sitting a minted premium program, official program. from that event and I will pass this down to my children and they will pass this down to their

children and it will just be within the Al-Shadi family forever because it is such a wonderful moment in time. That's your fate or squider of absolute victory right there. I mean, we can skip that category for his. He's got what he needs. So if you don't know what we are talking about. Did we even say what? Did we even say what we're talking about?

Kimbo Dada, 5000. If you don't know what we're talking about, Dada 5,000. and also a street fighter from Miami of some were known. They... Real name to defer Harris. He's not named after $1,000. Well, it's the same as AK said about Kimbo. Sure, his name's Kevin Ferguson,

but his name's Kimbo slice. His name's Donna 5000. The extent to which they actually had a beef, I felt like that was overblown just to sell this, but then they get a beef as we, get into the, you know, the build of this fight. This fight, it is hard to find on the internet for reasons that maybe are honest and maybe are a bit darker.

But if you've never seen it, it's the funniest fight that's ever happened because, and everyone watching it at the time universally agreed. This is not some like edgy internet corner thing. All of us watching it were, it was so bad that you can't help but laugh. at it and as it continues on it's the it just it's the gift that keeps on giving john mccart they both gas out instantaneously i've never seen two fighters gas out quicker and i honestly don't think i ever will kimbo gases after getting a takedown immediately and spending two minutes in mount doing nothing and he is just done big john restarts this fight seven times seven different different

times in this fight, Big John, intercedes is like, all right, do something, do something, do something, all right, restart, including once from the Mount. He one time stands his fight up with Kimbo in the Mount because fully justified. Fully justified. The only stand up for Mount in the history of the sport that was legitimate. The only one that has ever been legitimate at one point in time, Kimbo is. so tired that they're kind of just in a quote unquote clinch which is really them hugging and he just takes a knee like he just kind of sits down and then it's called a takedown as dada just sort of lays

over top of him but he he didn't do it and then dada gets taken down at one point when kimbo just leans on him and dada just sort of rolls over and kimbo moves into the mount that's the melt that ends up getting stood up. It is so fucking funny. It's so funny. And it was, because this is a thing that like kind of broke out into broader

broader consciousness a little bit because of the personalities involved, etc. Scott Van Pelt has a video. And this is a video you can find. You search Google Scott Van Pelt Kimbo. It's an ESP, it's Scott Van Pelt on ESPN doing a recap of this fight.

And his producer is cackling laughing during this as they show the highlights and scott van pelt is like yeah uh here well you know we thought that this is going to be a fight and they're already tired and oh and there's a takedown really it's he just sort of fell over it is it's so goddamn funny guys and it holds up on rewatch i fired this thing up three times this week and every single time like it never wasn't funny to me It was never not the funniest thing I've ever seen in the cage. I love it so much. Firstly,

shout out to Bobby Lasty and Chad Griggs. That's the other justified. I don't know if you were seeing that one. The other justified stand-up for Mounts, completely gassed Bobby Lashy. Yeah, it was the first loss of Bobby. I've definitely seen it because Bob was Bobby Lashley. First loss of his career, completely gassed,

could not do anything from full mount, had to get stood up, and then I think shortly after got Tki-O'd. When I, when I was the job I had before I'm a May fighting great website I was working at the score in Canada this and this was an office job I got to be in an office it was not a great not a great website no a good way come on good website Nick Baldwin shout us Nick Baldwin mediocre website so come on website come on we had the so you know you have big screens all over this office

for certain events things like that so we had one big screen and so sometimes it had UFC on it or may for one of the bigger fights and there's only two fights ever that mesmerized the whole office that everyone started like get that swell of people like like a couple of people come up to start watching then like two more people than like everyone to start gathering the first dyes mcgregor fight obviously especially the way it built up when people saw like oh wow mcgregor's actually kind of like getting his ass whipped here so very logical build up there and then everyone shows up and then another one was kimbo dada i mean people were just coming up and like the dyes mcgregor fight it was ufc's the people were like oh this is really cool the kimbo dada

fight feel like what the hell is this what are you watching i'm the only at this point it's a two-man department, it's me and someone else. And I think looking at me like, you're getting paid. You're getting paid to cover this. Like, you're on, you're on salary. You're covering this. And I'm like, yeah, this is a great fight. And people were just watching and just couldn't believe it. They were laughing. They were having a good time. Yeah, they weren't just like making fun of it.

They started making fun of it. And that's somewhere they're like, I can't look away. This is just fantastic. And then, I mean, the finale is just, I think everyone dispersed in a laugh at it was so great. again and and like you said jed i'm so jealous because i can't imagine chaheen what it was like to actually be there when when dada 5 000 finally does the looping kind of run around the cage fall on his face dude the finish oh god the fun of it's so the fight ends and the third round when kimbo i guess hits him technically but really dada just sort of stumbles around did they away like like a legitimate Rick flare pro wrestling flop and I guess at this point we should say in case someone isn't aware there's like a darker side to this fight as well dot off three thousand legit I was called him three thousand like he's Andre damn dot off 5,000 legitimately has a heart attack and um like dot like actually clinically dies after this fight he gets taken to the hospital um has serious complications and this

This is a tragically ultimate. He's still alive. He's still alive. He's alive. He is still alive. But like he, his heart stopped for two separate times directly after and as a result of this fight. And Kimbo, this is, of course, the final fight of his career. He dies several months later.

So there is a sort of dark side. And if Kimbo, Kimbo, Kimbo dies. Kimbo dies several months later. Kimbo dies. Correct. Kimbo dies a couple of months later, though it's not. You know, that is not necessarily related to this. If either of those things, you know, if those had happened and this had been the first major death in mixed martial arts, this fight would have gone from being hilarious to tragic instantaneously in a way that we would so fondly look back.

And there are plenty of sort of retrospectives on it that say this eloquently of like this was deeply fun and a moment that was unforgettable and delightful. and we should never do it again because of the risks associated. And that's exactly where it is. But God damn, if you were watching Bellator that night for one of the only times in the history of that promotion, buddy, you felt like you, that that was actually the place to be was to watch that one of the most fun times I've ever had watching a fight. Let me, let me just add quickly, because you mentioned the health things that I did not envy Big John McCarthy having to referee this fight. because there were many times, I feel like he could have just stepped in and stopped it.

Not off a knockdown, but just like looking at them, I would, like, you would have no problem. Like they were so out of shit, so gassed. He could have just stepped in and said, you know, this fight's over. Like this guy looks slightly more hurt. Okay, I'm stopping the fight here. Like you said, he stood them up a bunch of times. And now that we know, again, what happens to Dada afterwards.

That's functionally what he does with Dada. I, I mean, I think he just sort of falls over. I think it was too late. I think he could have saved him. the face line. I don't know, but I think Big John did a great job. I say, I think he did a great job. It was, this is one of the most difficult fights I think to officiate in

MMA history. I don't know. And Gene again, you were there. So, yeah, she and you were there. I don't, I don't know what kind of energy you were getting off of everyone involved in the cage. Oh, yeah. Okay. So, oh, yeah. We've talked a lot about the fight. Let Papa Al-Shadi take you to story time now. Oh, yeah.

So if you go back to this moment, what year was this? This was 2016. Bellator was a very different place in 2016 than it was the Bellator. You, the listener, probably think of it as. When Scott Coker comes on, it's following Bjorn Remney, a man named Bjorn Remedy, who was the founder of Belator, who was just objectively a crappy person. Like, he was just not a good guy, and he was doing a lot of really... A deeply not good human. Yeah, and Bellator was in a weird space.

They had a lot of bad press. They had a lot of bad press with fighters. They did not have a good reputation with fighters. Scott Coder Coker comes in as a replacement, and his edict from the beginning is two things. Improve our reputation, number one, amongst the fighters. Number two, we need big numbers. We need big ratings because this is now Bellator. Spike has, has Spike TV, which was the purveyor of UFC for a long time,

original purfair of UFC for the most part. Yeah. They essentially have picked up Bellator to be the new UFC and they want big numbers. So Scott Coker comes in with this plan, we're going to do big events. tent pulled headlined by big giant names that are splashy that will get people to watch them. And underneath them, we will put our prospects to get people, get eyeballs on these prospects. And instantly, it's a great plan, first of all, because instantly they start drawing huge numbers with just very bizarre circus fights. But also, instantly, it's just, you could see where this is going.

Like this is not a sustainable business model because all of these dudes are in their 40s or their 50s, the Ken Shamrocks, the Hoyst Gracies. and they don't have an ability to put on these fights for much very long before you run out of ideas and names. The fight right before this was Kimbo Slice versus Ken Shamrock, which was that the culmination of that fight that never happened, that killed Elite XC, all of this. That was the fight that was leading into this. And so this fight gets announced, Kimbo Slice versus Dada 5,000. No human alive outside of Miami had ever heard of Dada 5,000 when this fight gets announced. We all get this press release and it's dismayed his name, Dada 5,000. And there's just a unanimous core amongst the MMA media and fan base of just like,

what the fuck? Like, okay, this is the epitome. This is where we were going. Like, we were headed towards this. We were talking about how this was going to happen. It finally happens. And so I arrive in Houston that week. Also, I should note, this wasn't the headliner.

This fight did not headline this event. This was the co-main event. No, it did not. The headliner of this event. was a trilogy fight no one asked for between Kenj Shamrock and Hoyst Gracie who at that point in time had a combined age of 101 years old. Oh, I thought, I didn't think they were triple digits. I thought it was like 90. Oh, no, it was 1001. It was already triple digits. That is your headliner.

Shouts to Hoyst Gracie for scoring one of the few TKOs of his goddamn career. Oh, we'll get to that. We'll get to that because it's beautiful TKO. It's tremendous. When I call this event an engorged monstrosity, there are- Best fight, incredible time. No, that is not hyperbole. That is what this was. And I remember landing in Houston and being acutely aware of what I was walking into from the moment I touched down that week, because the day before I arrived, they had open workouts. And that was how Dada 5,000 introduces himself to the MMA world. Was that these open workouts? Oh my God, I forgot about the open workouts. Dude, if you, if you, they are on YouTube because I'm pretty sure Casey was there and Casey filmed this.

It is a spectacular introduction to Dada 5,000. It is the worst bag work in MIT work you will ever see at a major promotional MMA event, ever. You, you think you've seen bad at the stupid influencer, Jake Paul fights or whatever. Dude, I promise you Google, the Dada 5,000. Open Workout, Belator 149, you will really enjoy yourself. And then Donna 5,000 hops on the mic and like whatever you want to say about this dude's fighting ability, he was not very good. Man, knew how to promote a fight. Hops on the mic says, I'm going to obliviate this dude. Still have no idea what obliviate means, but I understand what you're going for. My definition of

MMA is not mixed martial arts. It's mass, mutilate, and annihilation. Again, don't know what any of that means. But I'm here for it. That's good. I mean that. What do you mean? That's very self-explanatory. I'm so here for it. And so I arrived to Houston the day after these open workouts. And at this point this event is reveling in its own

shamelessness. Like the vibe already in Houston on like Wednesday, Tuesday, whatever are tremendous. And then I get there. And the first thing we go to, man, the very first thing is this event's pre-fight press conference. And I swear to God,

it is the most beautiful pre-fight press conference you have ever seen in your entire fucking life. Like there is, to give you an example of what I mean, before a single question is asked, before a single question is asked. A reporter has not touched the mic yet. Scott Koker has this guy's like,

hey, you want to have an opening comment, you want to have an opening comment, pass it around. Goes to Kimbo. Do you want to have an opening comment? Nah, man, I'm good. I'll wait till I'm asked the question. All right. Goes right to Dada.

Dada has some, prescripted thing that he starts launching into, man gets four words into it. And Kimbo Slice cuts him off from across the stage. You're f***le. And just goes into the most bizarre rant that ends up at a place where this is the exact quote from Kimbo.

No, ends up, ends up suggested that it takes a while. He gets from A to B in about 12 seconds. That's important. Instantly, quote, pull your pain. down, let me see the size of them. I'll show my nuts right now. Let me see your nuts.

You got baby nuts, Dada. You got baby nuts. I wrote when I was with the athletic. I bet you my nuts are bigger than yours. And by the way, while he's doing all of this, Hoy's Gracie is like two inches away from a standing down, Kimbo Slice, who is threatening to pull his ball sack out of his pants exactly where Hoyce Gracie's like noses, more or less.

Like, it's just eye level with where hoists is. So all of this, I wrote when I was at The Athletic, and I did a retrospective of this piece. This paragraph was a paragraph that I put on a major website that is now owned by the New York Times, and it's maybe my best moment ever. Quote, if there were only one quick clip, you could show someone to perfectly encapsulate the Bellator 149 experience. It would be sliced taunting Harris about the slightness of his testicles at the events R-rated pre-fight press conference. I'd been in town for less than an hour, and already this is what we'd come to. Slice, standing in defiance over a hilariously uncomfortable hoist Gracie,

daring Dada 5,000 to plop out his kibbles in bits for all the world to see, all while poor Scott Coker nervously tried to talk the hogs back into the pants of his viral stars. This was literally five minutes into the press conference. I cannot stress this is enough. No one had even asked a question. Bro. It's so good. I remember being there for this fight week.

And so as this press conference happens, we leave whatever. I'm there with Luke Thomas. It was me and Luke covering this for this week. I remember me and Luke having several conversations as we're trying to do the thing you're supposed to do, right? Write our stories, film your videos, do the preview shows, whatever. We had so many conversations about how it was hard to talk about this event in all of this content without being insulting. And how the fact that that was true was in and of itself its own special brand of like really insulting. It was just so, I'm so happy.

I'm so happy that this happens. And then, you know, like you guys said, you guys went over the fight. The fight wasn't, it's like, it's, my favorite thing about this fight is that it's not bad in the traditional sense. Because like, it's not boring. It's so not boring. It was anything but boring. It's also competitive for whatever that word means. I have been in so many arenas over the course of my career.

I have never heard an arena react to a live fight the way that it was during Bellator 149's co-made event. Booker T, the wrestler, was right next to me during this fight. He was like on the side of the front row for this fight. dude was cackling. Like, like, cackling like he was at a Dave Chappelle show. Like he was just enjoying this and laughing so much throughout it that he was crying.

I vividly remember tears coming from Booker T's eyes. There were people on Media Row heckling. Like, like people you would recognize. Like people you would know and appreciate it for their professionalism were loudly heckling. From Caged side, and the worst part about all this or the best is that none of it felt out of place. Like that all of this was a real thing. All of us at the moment understood what the hell we were watching and how this was just tremendous.

It was so surreal. And like you said, like once we get to the point where Big John just stands Kimbo up from Mount, like, boy, we're off. It's there. It's just happening. Like, this is just pure magic. I'm so glad. I'm so, so glad that this happened. I one of the best parts of that stand-up which I guess you probably didn't experience since you were there is the commentary talking about it because it's from Mount and before it happens Jimmy Smith is like he he gave up trying to treat this as a real fight like well good you know you would think that they would have they they would have prepared a little more for this whatever it's like Jimmy Smith says if he can simply sit up and throw a couple of punches this could be over

And I don't know who is on commentary with him, but he's like, that looks like a pretty big if right now. And it just sent me. It just sent me for them to be like, yeah, that's not going to happen. This whole thing, I'm so glad you brought up the pre-fight. I forgot about the open workout entirely and how that was such a story for like a day and a half. And there's Dada's response was that I showed him what I wanted to see. like he was hiding something. He was hiding some more ability

that he just didn't unleash at the open workouts. Oh my God. That workout, highlights of that workout, yes, are available on M.A. Fighting YouTube, so people go,

please look that up. It's out there. If you, Jed, if you don't cut out, though, you got Baby Nuts clip and put it somewhere in this podcast,

you have done a disservice to our fan base. A few words. I'll just wait until I get asked the question Okay That I don't Listen I think each and every one of you guys You fool Shut up man

You ain't got shit to say I got something You look like shit in your training yesterday Nothing you can do can't hurt me Brother I'll listen to this right hell I'm gonna be here to protect you On you

You're gonna understand what it feels like To be helpless For the first time in a long time In your life Understand me At the end of the day You ain't never meet nobody Nobody that's gonna hit you as hard as me

You fuck with Ferg. You called me out. Listen. You called out Kevin Ferguson, bro. You are a non-factor, bro. Okay, I'm gonna show you. I hear you. I hear you, bro.

And guess what? I'm planning on doing the same thing to you do. I knock your ass out. I hear you. Listen to, dude. That sounds good. But at the end of the day, you're not capable, physically or mentally are doing none of that shit that you talk about, bro.

Physically, I'm not, bro. Man, listen, dude, I'm a manhander you, dude. Yeah. I promise you that. Okay. I promise you So let's I show my nuts right now

Let me see your nuts You got baby nuts, daughter You got baby nuts I bet you my nuts bigger than yours Come I here's the thing I think I was thinking about it

As we're going through it I think we may just have to rename the right leg hospital Left Leg Cemetery To the Baby Nuts As the greatest quote Because it's undeniably one of the greatest quotes in the history of the sport.

It's a new year. It's a new year. It's time for that to pass down. Some changes. Yeah. I've been flirting with making some changes. And I think Baby Nuts may be the new category because it is, it's so fast. It was so rapid to show me your and even the logical jumps to get there was like, Dada said something. Kimbo's like, you fool. Dada's like, whatever, I'm a beat your ass. You're not built for this. And Kimbo's like, you want to see my testicles? I won't show you.

Let me see yours. We'll see who's built for this. Boy's Gracie's face throughout all of this is just. And Ken Shamrock's on the other side, loving this. Like, this is what Ken Shamrock brings up. He was laughing. This is so much better. And I love that we're talking about because this is so much better than the trash talk that we've

gotten, you know, some of the horrible trash talk we got in the last quarter of 2023. Like, this is where trash talk should have. have gone and stayed. It never needed to evolve into this weirdly, like, deeply personal stuff. Like, it's school yard jibes are enough to get me into wanting to see a fight. They're just better. I do want to say, I will disagree with you guys on it not being a bad fight. I do think it's a bad fight. No, it's not. I think it's the, oh no, I do. I do think it's a bad fight. It's good bad. It's the best. It is the, it is, well, I have to call the bad fight because it is the best bad fight in

history. Absolutely. That's why I had to call that. Yeah, that's why. So that's, I have to classify it as bad so I can give it that compliment, designation. And I'll say probably top five funniest finishes in US. I'm going to hold this to USMMA because I think if we extend to Japan,

there's probably all kinds of hilarious shit we can bring up. But I'll say as far as major North American MMA, it's probably top three. I don't know what I was any top five. Top three. If you want to go number one, obviously wouldn't answer for it. So between it's number one. Between the second and the third round, Sean Grande's on commentary here. It's Sean Grande.

Yeah. If you don't know who Sean Grande is, he does the Boston Celtics broadcast. Like he's a very renowned broadcaster, Belator got him for like a little bit. I enjoyed it. Other people didn't, you know, it's whatever. Your mileage varies. Between the second and third round, Sean Grande says two lines that just sum up everything. We can't look away.

Don't pretend you can't either. Exactly, my man. That is exactly it. This was peak Belator. Belator was never better. than this night. Well, maybe like the first part

of the night. No promotions ever been better than this night. And so just I just want to I just want to quickly top off my

finite experience of this because the fight happens. It's whatever. It's the weirdest thing ever in the moment watching it. And then we instantly

pivot to Hoyst Gracie versus Ken Shamrock three combined age of 101. Fight doesn't last very long. Hoyst Gracie, very obviously. kicks Ken Shamrock in the balls.

Ken Shamrock does like a very over-exaggerated. I just got kicked in the balls. I'm going down. No one, at this point, the vibe in the arena is just like, dude, we didn't get out of here. Let it. Let it be. Reverie just lets it run.

Hoyst gets the win over TKO. And we all go into the back of this post-fight press conference, trying to understand what the fuck we just experienced. I'm so jealous. And the shamelessness in that room coming from the Bellator employees, just like they're they're so so clearly understanding what the hell they just put on uh was one of the most interesting vibes i have ever felt in a room in my entire life it was unbelievable i'm so jealous uh my last i know on this fight and then we can move on because it's been a hot minute uh one i love

the post fight speech kimbo underrated post fights uh you know speeches because because he's the most tired man that's ever been every time at the end of a fight. He can barely breathe and it's just like, thanks to hard work and God, we got to win. It was like, was there hard work? Was there hard work that got you the win as you gassed out immediately? And also just, you know, shout out to Dada, who literally died and came back to life. But like, he had a heart attack as a result of this and kept fighting, which I got to be honest. I don't think I would do.

I think if I have a heart attack, I'm probably not going to keep fighting. And credit to him, he, AK, would you agree that Dada has the dog in him? He's got some, he might have multiple dogs in him because he came back, man. I don't know what this guy has in him, but he came back. It looked like, if you're watching the fight, it looked like he might have just died on the spot. Because again, you're right, he didn't. It's like when you see someone in a sport got like a non-contact injury, you're like, oh my God, like I know that's bad. This was like he got a non-contact knockout

And you're like, oh, he might just be dead He was clearly exhausted He's a big guy, he's not in the greatest shape You're like, oh, holy crap, Did we just watch a guy have a friggin heart attack Like live on national television? And it actually came very clear. It was a kidney failure.

It wasn't a heart attack, right? It wasn't a kidney failure or something like that? We're dancing around the actual like sort of reason that they told us Man trained exclusively for months or at least weeks, I don't know how long you trade. But throughout long his training camp was, diet exclusively comprised of bananas and eggs. Bananas and eggs, baby.

That was a good fight diet right there. That's a good spot. Jed, I just want to add. A lot of potassium. When you were building this up and saying that, you know, there's clearly a unanimous choice for all of our Mount Mushmore's, I had to say, it has to be, I think, a unanimous choice for the Mount Mushmore of,

fights that I would show someone to get them into MMA or to understand why I love MMA, like I put that way. Now, maybe not to get them into it. 10,000. If you can, it's hard to find the fight. The fight has been wiped from the internet. And probably, but I remember coming home. I remember coming home from that five week and there were maybe two examples ever where

I came home and instantly bought the pay-per-view or whatever and then like showed people what I was just doing. The first of those was when was UFC 189 McGregor Mendez that whole like spectacle The greatest fight card of all time The second was this Because I remember landing home in Phoenix

After that week and showing Kimbo Dada To all of my buddies All of whom they instantly became obsessed with it Just like me And it became a running gag In our group of friends Where late at night during parties Someone would throw on Kimbo Dada

And then everyone will get sucked back into the TVness The silliness that is playing out on the TV. I love it. So it's, it's probably the closest MMA's been to a street fight in since the first UFC. Because like this is how street fights look. Two dudes get real tired almost immediately. And then it's just this sloppy, wretched mess of hilarity.

That's exactly what it is. It was, it was so good. Okay. We got to move on. we have to. The good thing is, I feel like we've touched upon other categories, though. I think of any fighter, yeah, I think of any fighter, it's Kimbo that was going to break the format of this show. Like, you couldn't, you just can't, yeah, too much stuff is connected and, yeah.

We have, and there are going to be a lot of categories coming up that we can kind of just touch on and move through quicker, but we really need to make some level of move on here. And so our next category, the second category, as we approach the two hour mark, the second category, the I'm not impressed by your performance award. This is for the low spot, the down moment of the career. I think you could go with a number of choices here. I'm not impressed by your performance. I went with one that I cannot confirm happened, but the internet says that it did. I could not find video of it, but I knew I was going to have the wonderful Shehina al-Shadi on this podcast.

And if you're going to have Sheen Al-Shadi, and you have an opportunity to talk about the legend, Jay Ellis. How do you pass that up? Kimbo's one amateur fight allegedly, again, no video, is a 24-second knockout loss to J-Frigan Ellis. Shaheen, you're shaking your head. It's not real. It's not real.

Is it not real? I've never, so I've never been able. So one of my life's missions is to write the J. Ellis feature. I could talk for an hour on how the pains and lengths I've gone to try to do this. It's never coming together at this point. It seems like he just refuses to talk to me. Whatever. It is what it is.

What if you Trojan Horset with the Kimbo fight? Hey, I've tried to Trojan Horset with a lot of. stuff over the years and it just, it never works out. From what I can tell, this is just another man named Kevin Ferguson. And we all just assume that it's Kimbo, but everything that I have been able to dig up tells me that this is not actually Kimbo. That's so disappointing. I'm so sorry to bring bad vibes. I'm so sorry to bring the bad vibes.

Stop that right now. Honestly, that's the worst answer because I thought what you were going to say is the internet just wanted to have fun with it and what would be funnier than Kimbo losing an ami fight to Jay Ellis because nothing is frankly the answer to that. And so I thought it was going to like, seems like this was just an internet gag as opposed to there's just another Kevin Ferguson out there. What,

that's just nonsense. We don't want that nonsense here. But it makes, honestly makes a ton more sense that J.L. has didn't K.O. Kimbo 24th. The thing is, that's the thing is like if you think about it,

if J.L. as K-O'd Kimbo on an amateur fight? Like, you don't think there's some kind of video somewhere of this happening. J. Ellis is not a big man. Probably, but also maybe Kimbo's team just got it removed because, like, it's not the craziest thing I've ever heard

that Kimbo gets knocked out by J. Ellis, you know? Like, that's, I could be sold. And so that's a devastating one. But it's okay, because I had backups. I have backups. I wonder if any of you, chose my backup so. So, AK, what was your choice here? No, not impressed. Jay Alice was my who to F is that guy. So that's out the window now. It is great. Great. Great. It is. And again,

this is on Sherdog. I will say, so I got excited because it is on Sherdog J. Ellis versus Kevin Ferguson. But again, this is so long. This was in 2005. Like you said, it's very likely. It could have just been another Kevin Ferguson. I had to reach out to the guys of Shurdog now. I would love for them to take back on this one. I don't think that anyone has ever been named Kevin Ferguson. I think that's a unique name and I'm going to choose to believe that he's the one. Topology doesn't have it. And yeah, so I don't know.

You know what? We know Spillo Shoredok about to reach out. Let's see if they can do some digging and figures out. I'm amazed they haven't done a whole post on this yet, but it wasn't my choice of career alone anyway. It's not for a lack of trying, man. It's not for a lack of trying. I was so badly want to write this story.

That does make sense. I feel like I had never I had never heard of this before and then I saw it and I was like what? I don't remember this at all. I had I hadn't really heard it until I was diving. I was like, oh, really this happened? I can't wait to talk with Shaheen about this. I think Shaheen's explanation makes the most sense. So for the for the low, I kind of went with, it's funny, I kind of went with the Houston

Alexander fight again. I know you called it, I'll be talking about Houston Alexander a lot. I'm not done talking with this fight. I know you called, I don't have much more to say anyway. I know you called it the best like martial arts performance of his career, but in some, for one thing, it probably is. For one thing, the lasting image of it for me is the gift of them at the end, just both their hands on the knees. And not in a cool, not in a cool like, oh, like, Condit Lawler. They're so exhausted.

What an unbelievable, like instant classic battle they did. This was not conned law. And this is not a fight, frankly. They didn't do much in this fight. They didn't do that much to like be that exhausted. a lot of circling. So that image is what last one is. And there's one other, which I'll mention later again.

I'm funny, at Goldberg says something like, we might finally get a knockout here in the last minute. And I'm like, there is nothing these guys could have done to knock each other on the last minute. It was not going to happen. And he also said, I see a future. I shoved each other and that might have knocked one of them out. Maybe.

And then he also adds, I see a future. And I think the world does tonight in Kimbo's Slice. And for me, this is why it's a low because I think, if anything, this did a lot to hurt the mystique of Kimbo. I'm praising him for the win. It's great to have the win. It's a memorable fight. But like I said,

if this was people seeing Kimbo for the first time, all they saw was a guy who, like, looks impressive as hell. But the fight is pretty bad. And I think this might have, like, really dropped his, you know, his reputation in the eyes of many. As much so I'm glad you wanted him, glad the way happened. He's trying to MM. And it's not pretty.

It's not just brawling. ATT ruined him. Spoiler for you. It really did. Spoiler for you. Okay. This was zero people's first time seen Kimbo. They had seen Kimbo at this point.

Yeah, true. All right. I don't know. Listen, I don't know. But it definitely, that's even worse than if you saw Kimbo O'4. It was their first time seeing him live. If you saw Kimbo before, this might have been like one of those things where you're telling all your people's like, oh, this is, you got to see this guy.

Oh, like you said, everyone's seen him. It was, it, it did. The Kimbo of old might have died for good that day. You know what I mean? Like, oh, no, he's like a real martial artist now. And it's like, so for me, it's a Mount Rushmore performance and also, also I think, career alone. That's incredible.

That's a first for this show. That's the first time someone's definitely a first time that's ever happened. Brief digression because I just, this popped up as I was looking at something else. Do you know that Beltor 149 had 2 million viewers? Yeah. On Spike 3. That's what I'm saying. It was working.

It worked, dude. It was the peak of Bellator. Two million viewers on Spike is nuts. Especially in that point in time. Like, that was... That's not 2016. When I say that was the peak of Bellator, I'm super not being hyperbolic at all.

Like, that was the peak of Bellator. Was the Kimbo era. They were never better than they were at that point. Oh, my God. Okay, Shaheen, who's your I'm not impressed? It's got to be Seth Petrazzelli fight. Again, how many... How many people could say they murdered an entire promotion by losing in 14 seconds?

Also, the fact that is 14 seconds. The fact that it's 14 seconds. That's even impressive. Seth Petrozile is like a light heavyweight. He should not be doing this. Like, Kimbo is a light heavyweight too. Kimbo was like 2.30. Yeah, but like that's not cutting.

He's a light. That's light heavyweight. And that's impressive. He killed an entire promotion. If you're not impressed by murdering a whole promotion, I don't know what's going to impress you. The correct answer of J. Ellis is fake. If J.S. is fake, the correct answer is Sean Gannon, ladies and gentlemen. No. No way. That's a great fight. Easily. It actually was way better than I remembered it being.

It's super competitive. It is. And Sean Gannon gets his face busted up, though Kimbo does lose by exhaustion, basically, again. But that's the fight for the whole time of Kimbo doing this at the internet was like, well, he lost to Sean Gannon who sucks. So he's not actually good. This is the one that more than any of the fights at the time, certainly were like, oh, yeah, he's not actually good. And that sort of followed him in the internet corner. That's the answer. But I have a better answer because they didn't know where to put this. And I want to make sure we remember the totality of the Kimbo experience. And this felt like a good place for my true answer if JLS is dead. Not dead.

Not an available option for this category. You guys remember when Kimbo punched David Blaine during a day? David Blaine special? No. What? I have not seen this. Oh my God. So David Blaine is doing, look it up as a short video clip, but you should have audio.

It's during one of David Blaine specials. And you know, Houdini used to had that gimmick thing where he would let people punch him. And he could take punches from anybody and would never fall down. And David Blaine's like, I'm going to do the Houdini gimmick. And he does it with Kimbo. And Kimbo's wrapping his hands. And it's the funniest thing. in the world because they're talking to Kimbo like he's like really deep in the game like what can happen

well you know could break a spleen rupture a spleen break a liver rupture a liver he's like doesn't know what else to say and they get him there and David Blaine gets punched in the stomach by Kimbo twice and Kimbo doesn't drop him he can't even drop David Blaine and it's like a magic trick but really it's just that David Blaine has abs and Kimbo doesn't hit like a an actual truck, he just hits hard. And it's, it was a thing. It was, I can't believe you guys don't remember this happened. I am, I'm now watching this video as you explain it.

I've never seen this before in my life. And I'm, I'm very upset that this is the first time that I'm being made aware of this existing. I am shocked. And apparently David talks about this on, on Joe Rogan. And now I kind of want to look up that clip. So that, I'm going to have to do that. Oh, I didn't watch that clip.

So, yeah, I'll have to watch. We'll have to watch that after because I did not look at him on Joe Rogan, but he hits him twice. And Kimbo hits him the first time. He's like, oh, damn, I'm really impressed by you. And they're like, all right, do it again. And then both times, what really happens is David just flexes his abs. And then as soon as he gets hit, he starts walking backwards so all the energy is dissipated. And Kimbo's like, oh, shit, you're real tough, man.

It's like, it's ridiculous. This is a ridiculous thing that's happening right now, boys. Not either of their best work. I think it's fair to say. No, David Blaine has done far more impressive things than they. So, and I didn't know where else to put it. And this seemed like a good category to do it. But I wanted to talk about that time.

Because again, can't stress to you enough if you didn't live through it. David Blaine was the biggest magician in the world at the time. Maybe he still is. I don't know. Kimbo is doing that's the level of stardom this dude had. Like people don't, I don't think a lot of people realize that who are listening to this. Our next category then. We're just, we're just not going to mention the MetMetriot.

fire right. It's just too, it's such a bummer. Yeah, that's. Okay. No acknowledgement. We all know what's happening there. He just gets a straight up beating in that fight and it is not fun in this lens. That's probably the actual like worst one, but also it's people kind of knew that was coming. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's fine. Saving and investing well is an art and a science. It requires high level math, an intimate knowledge of economic history and theory and a healthy dose of psychology. People have spent their whole careers and won Nobel prizes trying to figure out the best ways to do it. Betterment believes that you should be able to be a successful and sophisticated investor without having to get a PhD. They've spent over a decade creating

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Investing involves risk, performance not guaranteed. Support for this show comes from the Audible Original, the Downloaded 2, Ghosts in the Machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Roscoe Cadulian and the rest of the Phoenix Colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever. Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprise his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the Audible original blockbuster. The Downloaded, it's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey

where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking, What are you willing to lose to save the ones you love? The Downloaded 2. Ghosts in the Machine. Available now, only from Audible. The Who the Fuck is That Guy Award? This is for the weirdest opponent in their career history.

Who the fuck is that guy? You know, AK, I think you touched on. Did you say that this was where you put, Jay Ellis? Yeah, yeah. Would have been a good choice if that were real. There's a right answer here, though. There's a right answer here. Oh, you have, tell me your right answer then, because I have an answer.

I don't know if it's the right answer, but tell me your answer. Are we joking around? Is this serious? Is this serious podcast? Are you guys serious podcasts? What are we talking about? Is this serious podcast? I need to know who's the right answer.

Is Kimbo Slice choking out Olympic gold medalist and former heavyweight boxing champion Ray Mercer in 72 seconds? Okay. I can understand the argument. I didn't go with it here. But please tell us more about the submission wizard that is Kimbo Slice. That's it. You just, the elements to this. One, Olympic gold medalist,

heavyweight boxing champion, Ray Mercer is going to fight Kimbo Slice. Okay. Kimbo choking this man out. Noted submission specialist, Kimbo Slices choking this man out. And then happening in 72 seconds, like this has all the perfect elements.

Hit him with a guillotine. This has all the elements. This is the obvious pick. See, I went, I get your argument. And maybe you're correct. but like I I don't know why I didn't go that way

instead I went for a boxing match I went his boxing match with Brian Green so and the reason I did it is because you know there were speculation and talk about this certainly with the Petrazzellian stuff this was the one fight where people really really felt that some shenanigans were at play and that

Brian Green took a dive because you watch the fight Kimbo gets a knock out in the last like five seconds of the bout and it is not impressive to say like it's it's a bit Muhammad Ali phantom punchy there's an uppercut that lands and then Brian green who has like a pretty I won't say notable but a long mhm a career he fights a bunch of big names fought like 40 times in an mma he gets obliterated with an uppercut that is not much of an uppercut and there was a big conversation at the time of okay so this dude just through the fight such to the point that brian green comes out and gives

several interviews where he's like no this is ridiculous like i i didn't it wasn't the uppercut i got hit with a combination before the uppercut that already had me in trouble and the upper cut just kind of tapped me and i'm down and so uh i went with with this just because i kind want to talk about the moment and who remembers that brian green was like a person in the world I remember this specific thing And that was it Yeah I tell you I didn't remember

Until I looked into it The Brian Green had 40 some odd MMA fights And fought dudes like Brian Green fought Anthony Smith and Bellator Anthony Smith and Bellator Or like that's like a real opponent In a semi real organization

Are we sure it's the same Brian green Now I'm questioning everything I am No I'm in fact dead servant of this because like that's when you the interviews he gives he's like yeah like kimbo's kimbo i was a career middleweight and i have 40 ms fights you know i've been doing this i was doing this boxing i was trying to jump on this opportunity to get some shine off kimbo and then i got knocked out so it's definitely the same brian green and apparently this ryan green went on the mhm a hour shortly after and spoke about this

and apparently i wrote an article about it that i don't remember writing where he said i could in the words how bad this sucks. Correct. And then at the end of the article, he calls Kimbo overrated. So this is very much a thing. Now, I want to get. I actually,

I may have been your article that I was reading. I didn't realize it. But yeah, I was like, yeah, he went on the MMI to talk about this because there was very much

a pushback that this was thrown fight. I want to loop back to Ray Mercer for a second because I'm sure there's fans out there, and May fans specifically who are like, that name sounds so familiar. And of course, you, most fans know Ray Mercer

of course. from knocking out Tim Sylvia in nine seconds in an NBA fight. Now, that happened two years after the getting choked out by Kimbo, which is bizarre. That's one of the funniest things ever happened in an NBA fight too. What an NBA record by this man? This man has two fights at MMA, and these are the two. Kimbo and got choked up by Kimbo and knocked out Tim Sylvia in nine seconds. And by a minute in 21 seconds in those two fights.

The Tim Sylvia fight happened three. days after the Kimball Slice versus Roy Nelson episode of the Ultimate Fighter. That is very random and strange. What an odd, strange time. It's been. Yes. Next category, the Randomplex Awards for the best highlight, single individual highlight of the, of the fighter's career.

Easy. I'm really interested to see what everyone did with this one. Easy. It's so easy. It's the easiest one in the whole. I have an answer that I believe is easy, but I, I don't know if I want to choose it. Are you, tell us what you're thinking.

Because I have a guess on what you're saying is easy, but I want to know. The moment you told me that we were doing this, I filled this out because it's the easiest one of the whole thing. It's the big D eyeball. Okay. It's the one that launches all of this. It's the most iconic image of his entire career. It's the one that launches all of this.

And it's really the most gruesome, grossest, like highlight that he has is he literally took this guy's eyeball out of his head. That's probably the correct answer. I didn't have it because I knew we were going to, We talked about that. I had Big D. I wouldn't use this for others. That probably is the actual true answer as far as the spirit of this goes.

I had two boxing matches, and then I had the street fight with dreads, because I think as we mentioned earlier, picture perfect KO, probably his best, like, aesthetic street fight knockout. But his boxing matches against James Wade and Tay Bledsoe are both in his street fights and his MMA career, he didn't really have, like, the cleanest KOs. I guess Tank Abbott is pretty decent, but James Wade and Tay Bledsoe both get put down, down, like real, real bad.

They are softball matchups, no doubt, but he knocks them into the upper deck. Like, he launches those things out. So both of those are quick finds on the internet, and if you've got five minutes to kill, watch Kimbo Slic Smart or some dude, it's pretty sick. I went another way. Where are you going?

Did you go back to Houston Alexander? I don't know you guys heard about this. Did you hear, did you hear he fought Houston Alexander in the UFC? Did you guys hear about this? An unprecedented third Dammy Award win for the Houston Alexander Kimbo Slic fight. You know, we talk about the Randolphex a lot. We don't talk enough about the Kimbo Flex. Wait, are you being serious?

Is this actually your pick? I, the body lock picks him up. Is this a bit? Is this a bit or? Come on, it's not a bit. It's such a good bit. I do. No, honestly, I think about this slam a lot. And also, it's also, by the way, one of the only, like, notable, like, offensive things that happens in the fight. Besides, like, Q's now and Saturday, like, kicking him a lot.

And the crowd, like, immediately, like, the crowd knows they were watching a dog shit fight. And then, but then that happens. And for a moment, they, like, they wake up. The commentary wakes up. There's a thought, like, oh, maybe now something will happen. honestly not much comes of it but it cut one it shows you how just freakishly strong he was and like he and he had a good sense of the moment as well that's one thing I talked about we talked about his mystique he had a really pretty decent sense of the moment when he could muster up the

cardio to make something happen and I think the suplex is so great and I just think about it a lot apparently think about this fight a lot I'm realizing that from this this podcast I think about this fight a lot and this moment stands out for me so randleplex great kimboplex right up there Love the Kimballplex. I am. I can't believe. Anytime someone on a podcast goes, wait, is this a bit?

You know you're doing something right. Wait, or are you being serious right now? I also, I'm just moving past that ridiculous. Come on. I had hoped one of you would say this. This is actually maybe the answer that I think about way more often. it's it's the tackle it's the football tackle from that oh i was gonna i had it i had it for later i had it for later oh do you it's basically a jackass

set up you remember when johnny knoxfield did the jackass thing plays football it's that and he makes the man cry it's such a big monstrous hit it's such a good highlight it would be my number one choice, I think, in a normal circumstance. So I'll just say I have that. Sheem, what do you have that for? So I have that for memorabilia, the memorabilia category. What would you want? I want the custom Kimbo football pads that he has in this.

Because if you guys don't know what we're talking about, which you, there's a 99% chance you have no idea what we're talking about. Again, Google it. It's a beautiful era of the internet. Just such a beautiful era of the internet. And there's just a bunch of random Kimbo videos of him doing random stuff. And at one of them, it's these money talk guys. that he was doing everything with.

They just find a random skinny dude and be like, hey, act like you're running back. Kimbo's slice is going to tackle you. We'll give you some money afterwards. And it's like, it's like, it's not even in a park. It's just like in a grassy area by a street. And so there's cars parked like going by. It's just in Miami.

And this dude runs just like a baby post route. And Kimbo's lurking and he catches the ball. And kids sit to the ether. Beautiful tackle. picture perfect and also like in a situation like this you might think well kimbo kimbo like kimbo won't go whole no nope oh nope kimpbo's not at all what's happening here kimbo's here for the content baby he knows what we want to see and he destroys that man he he commits to things that's one of another one of the big things about kimbo's whole deals he he commits he's

If you put him in something, he's going to give your money's worth. This man does not half-ass anything. There's nothing. He doesn't, he never treated anything like it was beneath. No, man. If you tell that man, even as, if you tell that man, you're going to fight him and then 20 seconds sit, you're telling him, chill, dog, chill. You ain't, he ain't, man.

Sorry. And he was that guy for the rest. Like, even as his fame rose and he literally became a household name, like, in sports. He was still do, like, he's still doing stuff and doing gigs and having a laugh. Yeah, and having, doing it with a smile and never. They're never coming off with even the slightest, like, arrogance. Like, it's, it's really fun to watch them do stuff like that. This is spectacular.

And I didn't, I pulled that up and I'm watching it again. I didn't even think to have that for, for the Fador thing, but it's, it's perfect. The Money Talks jersey. Oh, as they're interviewing this dude who's just dying on the ground and this bright lime green penny with money talks plastered on it. Kimbo, oh, it's so good. Let's just run into that category then. The Fedor Sweater of Absolute Victory Award for Peace of Memorobilia you would want from the fighter. Shaheen, I think the program we've already established is going to be an heirloom for your children.

And you've just talked about the money toxins and any other Fador pieces of memorabilia here that you would care for. Oh, man. Just get me a dummy that you put the clothes on and give me those football pads with the Kimbo. just written in it very, very cruelly. All of it looks, it looks so dumb and half-assed. I just want that standing in my office. It's so janky. It's so jakey. It's perfect. I want that standing in my office.

So that when people walk in, they're like, for TikTok. What the hell is that? And then I can tell them this story. Kimbo was really built for TikTok. Like, think of all of his fights lasted like 20 seconds. They're perfect for TikTok. The, this, all he was just, man, TikTok could have come for him. A.K. What do you have for the Fedor sweater of Absolutely?

victory. I'm pretty basic here. I went, give me a game worn du reg. You know, give me a du rag that he worked out in

or did one. He's not, he's definitely not wearing it in all the street fights, but I'm pretty sure he's got it on and at least one or two of them. So give me a game worn do. Or one to get

or walkout. There you go. The David Blaine one. Or walk out, you had it on during a walkout. Give me a duke. So it's just such a great look. I can't pull it off.

I probably wouldn't wear it. But just to say I had it, I think would be magnificent. And a distinct part of his iconic look. I think our next preview show, you should rock a do rag. I don't think so. What happens, you know? This feels problematic.

I'll be honest. You're never going to know if you don't try. I think we'll know. I think we can know. I think we can know. I've got two. One that like legitimately if I was building a Hall of Fame, I would actually want this because I think it would be cool.

Is the the gold fit. chain that he always wore. It's just a chain with like the gold, the just golden fist medallion. That was sick as shit. It was just awesome. And like, I'm pretty confident I couldn't pull that off. But it was so cool I wanted to try.

It's like, man, that is just an incredible thing to rock with. You could put some other stuff in the grill, etc. But look, our own E.K. Sidon sent a video to AK. as we did some prep showing, and you can find it on Casey's Facebook, actually. It's showing background stuff of when Kimbo went on Jimmy Kimmel.

And I forgot that this happened. And it's insane to me that Kimbo Slice went on Jimmy Kimmel to promote the Tank Abbott fight, which is the funniest part of all of it. Like he's fighting Tank Abbott and Jimmy Kimmel is like talking to Kimbo, but that's again how big he was. and the best part of it it's it's so goddamn funny to me he goes on jimmy kimmel

wearing a milf hunter t-shirt I I can't explain to you how much I want that shirt just because he went on jimmy kimmel wearing a milf hunter t-shirt it's it's part of the ludicristeness of everything that went on here

if you don't know what milf hunter is don't google it just ask a friend of yours who's between the ages of 32 and 40 something like a male friend can probably clue you in but it's it's also fairly self-explanatory and I cannot believe he wore that on national television he's my freaking hero those are my fator choices here next category we're going to rename it it's uh previously the right like hospital left leg cemetery now it's the baby nuts category for the best quote buyer about the fighter i think we can all agree baby nuts is probably the runaway answer here let's uh i show my nuts right now let me see a little you got baby nuts daughter you got baby nuts

i bet you my nuts bigger than yours i hear you man yes yes but i also have one but so anyone anyone who knows me knows and again i haven't talked we haven't talked about a stint on the ultimate fighter enough, but I loved him on the ultimate fighter. I think a lot of even more people fell in love with him on that show. And one of the best moments was him discovering that his enemy was the inner me. So if you guys have never, it's clips by a few people on YouTube. I think that's a 25 second clip. And I can't read it with the gravitas that he does, but I'll just read the quote out.

He goes, I always felt like I'll fight anybody because everyone was the enemy, the enemy. the enemy. Now I'm here away from everyone, and I took the time to find out who the enemy was. And it's not that it was the enemy. It was the inner me, the inner me, the inner me, the inner me. The inner me. And again, I'm not doing it justice, guys, because the way he says it, it blends much more beautifully the way he says it. And I remember, I guess I was young and dumb when I was, I was like, I thought it was so, I knew it was just TV, like pop wisdom, but I was like, man, that is so profound and so cool and I love Kimbo so much and I'm like that is what's such a great moment so people that's there on YouTube use that for your kids you're out there use that for your yearbook quote

someday it's not it's not the enemy it's the it's the inner me I love that I think you could use this for your yearbook quote because it's my runner up and it's like AK it's one that I resonated with me though for very different reasons as you'll find out and it's one of my favorite quotes that has ever been said because I remember distinctly seeing this and then writing up about this quote he is giving it um after the ken shamrock fight and can shamrock actually maybe it was after dada um and he has popped for uh nangeloan or uh testosterone or maybe both and kin had also failed for uh at the the hoist fight and he's talking about he's like we're fighters man we're a little bit You got to look at athletes, like real professional athletes who put their bodies and themselves

through what's not the norm. Like the average guy would be at the desk or at the TV, for example, his testosterone levels don't need to be that high because he's just chilling at his job. But when you're working a job, when you're an entertainer, when you put your body through some serious workout, I think your level should be a little bit above normal because you've got to be able to compete on a professional level. I don't think commissioners should really blackball fighters for having to use a little extra vitamins to perform because we're entertainers. Extra vitamins is the best.

It's the best thing I've ever heard. I want him to put it on a t-shirt. It was so good at the time. And I still love the extra vitamins forever. To tie this back to another damn we did about Mark Hunt, if only Kimbo had been there to explain this to Mark Hunt before he fired. that lawsuit against the UFC. How much time could have been saved, right? And how much money could have been saved?

Need some extra vitamins. And then Mark Hunt would be like, okay, that makes sense. And we would never have would have heard any sort of trial, a lawsuit from there. But Kimbo, so wise. So wise. He nails every part of it for me with that one. So there we are. Next category.

Oh, wait, real quick, real quick. I just, oh, yeah. Obviously, Baby Nuts was my pick on that category, but I do have one honorable mention that I found in an under an old Kimbo article that I wrote. This is just coming from Kevin B in the comment section, and it really tickled me. It hit me in a nice spot. My favorite thing about Kimbo was seeing him pop up in the background of pornos.

Some girl is being, quote, talked into an illicit encounter with a guy she, quote, met on the street, and here is future MMA superstar Kimbo Slice, just chilling in the background playing Xbox. Kevin B, a poet for our time. I mean, Kevin Blee kind of gets to the heart of it. That's a real thing. Kevin B is not alone in this. I messaged a friend of mine who shall remain nameless.

I was doing Kimbo's Life podcast today. I was like, man, we're doing a podcast, Kimbo. I miss him. My friend's reply is, oh, man, was he a nice guy? I remember him being in a squad of porn things out of nowhere as a background guy back in the day. That is my friends, who is also an American man, but that is his recollection of Kimbo. So there's a whole, guys, it looks like there's a whole other podcast we should be doing. because we are missing out on this other aspect of life.

We're not doing it justice. Dude, if you go to any Reddit thread about Kimbo, one of the first comments will inevitable be something like, hey, I remember him in the back of a Melf Hunter video or whatever because he works security for these things and was there. Like, that's just a straight fact.

And they, even when he got big, he was still just like friends with him. They were part consistently part of his entourage. He, you know, he never let, never forgot the people who were there with him at the beginning.

So good, good for Kevin Ferguson. Our next category, uh, we're picking some nits here. Uh, if you've got, um,

you know, if you could make one change one, you know, one, one critique, what would it be? I went way off the board here, fellas.

And this might be, uh, potentially offensive and I'm sorry if it is, but he, he, he, he, he,

really had not the best names for his children. You can't name your daughter Kovina. You just can't do it. That's some rolled doll, Grandma Georgina shit. You got to give her her own name. You can't name it. We're not George Farman here.

We can't name all of our kids after ourselves. And I could not confirm that this is true, but I'm going the other way with it. If it's true, it's the best thing I've ever heard in my life. Apparently one of his grandchildren's is named, Kimbo Legacy, which is maybe my favorite thing I've ever heard in the history of the world. So just, just an interesting combination of names. Also, his mother's name is maybe the best name I've ever heard in my life.

Rosemary Clark feels like that should be a movie star. It's a great name. It's a perfect name. So to go from that to Kavina and Kevlar, I feel like we can do better. Kimbo Legacy And it's a great bit It's a great bit on the The Kimmel clip

When people find that If I'll look for that Kimbo and Kimball clip It's a great bit where he says All right gets names to Kimball And Kimball's just dying. It's hilarious. Kimball is like Kevlar, really? Yeah.

It's not great. Kimbo Legacy is so bad. It's good though. Kimbo Legacy has like a dash like a hyphenated it too. Kimbo dashed hyphenated legacy. I could not. I looked everywhere to

confirm that this is true. A couple of places have it down as true. I could not find whether that is truly the name of one of his grandchildren, but Wikipedia says it is. And that's either the best or the worst thing I've ever heard. That's unbelievable. She is staring at his computer trying to figure. I'm furiously Googling whether this is like a real thing or not.

Because if it is, that's just the best thing I've ever heard. I have another son on the way. And now I want to name him, Kim. Really Shaheen Legacy, right? Like that's, oh, I think I think Shaheen Legacy is the move. Yes. I might have to think about it.

I have to see what my wife thinks about this new idea, but we'll see. Shaheen, take it away. I don't have anything for this category. There's nothing. I'm saying I have nothing for this category. There's nothing about Kimbo I want to change. I love the whole experience. I'm copping out.

I got nothing. No, I think that's fine. I almost copped out here. Sheen, do you have anything for nitpicking? No, I mean, I said might earlier. It's just the like, that's how you're going to use all this UFC. That's what you're going to do with this. That's pretty trash.

Come on. Oh, that takes us to the Habib Tony Award for the fight that you never got that you wanted. I think there's one answer. I think there's only one answer that's reasonable. And if you guys have other ones, I'm open to it. It's Jake Paul, right? Like, it's just, it's him doing Jake Paul now. Like, we, Kimbo missed the window.

now to be fighting if kimbo had not tragically passed away and was still in decent health a thousand percent he would have already fought jake paul and i can't now think of anything else other than like all right after you beat tyron woodley jake paul kimbo slice sell 20 million pay-per-views and we're just we couldn't be more excited about that fight right it's it's jake or logan logan's the bigger one right it's yeah but it's possibly logan right logan's the bigger one like size wise you'll probably be Logan I put sure but Jake is the guy who fights m-ma fighters this is true uh yeah all I think about all I all I went once Jake started doing the fighting I may first thing all I can think about was what if Kimbo was here

today because he would they would make this happen the the parties involved would make this happen because there's so much money to you made I do have another name but I don't know what do you want to say about the Kimbo and the Paul Bros no I mean I think you nailed it I didn't even have that on my list and now I feel silly for not having that because I would have been something that we would have probably seen and it would have probably I don't even think it's probably I think there's no doubt that that fight's happening so far ahead of his time I'm almost glad it didn't know we don't need to see that uh I had I had I don't know I had the usual suspects because to me like we're I'm going to step into it now but like one of my alternate

universe awards the T.J. Grant is like as terms of biggest what ifs is like what if you'd just come around a few years earlier because in my mind. mind because like he hit this window and like whatever he was very successful he made a lot of money and so like i can't say he was at the wrong window but he hit this window where like if you come a bit later you're on the tictox you're on the ig's you're you're in bkfc like you're crushing it that way but if you come a bit earlier you're in pride he absolutely ends up in pride that's my alternate unvying pride all sorts of dumb shit monster circus fights and that felt like that was kind of his true calling. And so for me, a lot of mine were like the Bob Saps, the Butterbeams, the

Minoamah, man, give me Giant Silva. Like, give me Bob Sap versus those types in like a 70,000 Japanese people just watching this in the arena type of thing. So I would say that, but also one question, how did no one ever book the Sean Gannon rematch? How did we not get that from any of these promoters who were desperate for big fights? Great question. Great question. Great question. Let's put a pin in the pride stuff because that spoiler it's our next category and I also have that same thought I have one more but A.K. I want to hear

your other. Yeah. Technically I'm putting a pin in the pride thing because I have to pull out what name Shaheen mentioned because Bob Sapp just felt so obvious it felt like because there was a period when Kimbo was doing boxing instead right?

So a five year period in between the UFC and Bellatory he was doing boxing and I'm like at any moment was there no talks of him just going to Japan for a one-off and fighting Bob Sap for whichever promotion would have hosted at the time because this fight would have made like 500 million U.S. dollar, like 500 million U.S. They would have sold out the Tokyo Dome with this fight. Like this is, it's either him and Bob Sap or him in like Aco Bono or something.

Either one, it's just such an enormous fight. I am shocked that it was never, I've never heard of it discussed. It's possible Kimbo just didn't have any interest in doing that. There's a lot of money to you made stateside. I totally understand, no problem there. But I always thought, I think I joked, like people who I didn't know, I may joke like, whoa, when's Kim, we're going to go and fight Bob Sap in Japan? I'm like, yeah, I just got to do that, right?

So this was a fight that I felt like realistically could have happened and just for some reason didn't. But I'm very sad. It didn't. That was the one to do. Also, very much a fight that Bob would have been happy to take a dive in as just as peak his career. The other one I had, I went very opposite.

it in a way that this fight may not have been like great but feels a we felt weird yes remember when for one moment in time hershal walker fought an m m a for strike for oh yes oh yes yes and i mean herschel walker kimbo sliced that that's that's about a scott cocker a fight as i've ever even conceived that's the most watched fight in u.s history yes yeah that's number one like it's Herschel Walker, I can't. I was just like, how did that not happen in the same way you guys are talking about? This should have happened. Like Herschel gets his one win and it's like, all right, well, would you care to fight Kimbo?

This seems like people would pay money to watch that. And it would have been a carnival. And I would have absolutely handed over 50 hard-earned American dollars to watch that fight. So yeah, that's what. One of the most decorated college football players ever facing a street. fighting, you know, hard-knuck. Olympian? God.

Don't feel Harshal. Sure. Herschel's an Olympian? What a spectacular. They would definitely sell the, you know, again, Olympian versus street fighter. Oh, man. It's so perfect.

It's so perfect. We missed out on a lot with him. And the aesthetic of that, too, of just both guys being Adonis's like. Just incredible shit. Incredible. Incredible. Wood. Yeah.

Well, that leads us into the T.J. Grand Alternate Universe Award. And, uh, spoiler. alert here as we talked about i went the other way i know you said what if he came later and we've talked a lot about that and i think that that would be great i do think pride just i can't even conceive of how big he would have been in pride and in the opportunities we would have had to match him up there just even though his window hit it feels like it was maybe the the least optimal time it's like two years it was like two years too early two years or two years too late i should say or two years too late two years too late

Two years too later, three or four years too early, either side of it could have really been optimal for him. And so I didn't have like the specifics. I just thought I was just thinking pride deserved this man. Like what they could have done, how he could have been. We could have had some fun with him in pride there for me. And Shane, obviously you, AK, are you also in the pride, the timeline corner here? I'm kind of with what we touched upon before. actually more of the UFC possibilities that were missed out on.

I can't believe I'm saying this because so much of my Kimbo stuff is tied to his appearance on the Ultimate Fighter. But what if Dana had just and Co had just done the right thing and just signed him outright? Yeah, it would have cost him a lot of money. But again, like I said, the fan, the audience was there. It was built in with him. He brings an audience. Houston Alexander was totally the right matchup.

But imagine if they just said Kimbo and Crow Cop. Kimbo and, I don't know, Czech Congo. So step on Struve, just for the shits and giggles, like, just for the visual. Like, I don't have to go over this because we said it before, but they could have made so much money. Kimbo could have beaten Keith Jardine? Sure. I don't know why Kimbo couldn't knock out Keith Jardine. Rampage Jackson and Kimball.

Like, I mean, there was so much money to be made. And the fact that he only fought for the biggest promotion in the world twice, it feels so, so, so wrong. So that's it. So, again, we've touched fun. I don't want to dive into it too much more. I wish we'd seen more of him in the UFC and some. some bigger fights. I also wanted to note here on a separate thing.

I learned a thing as I was doing research that I escaped me at the time. Do you all know about Kimbo's cousin Roddy? Because I learned about Kimbo's cousin Roddy who Roddy Ferguson, R-H-A-D-I is basically the alternate universe Kimbo, like in a different way of, you know, Roddy apparently grew up in Maryland. Roddy was also a high school athlete, but Roddy went on to university at Brown. Let me confirm that before I go.

He went and played football in college, and then not only played football, but also wrestled and did some other sport. And then Roddy went on to become a like 12-time U.S. national champion in judo and compete in the Olympics and also become a BJJ black belt. and train MMA fighters and have several MMA fights. And it's just like a deeply successful athletic person, which is obviously Kimbo is like a very deeply athletic person.

And the way his life sort of unfolded is how it ended up happening. But in a very real sense, Roddy is kind of like exactly the other way that that could have gone on. He could have been the dude who competed at the 04 Olympics. or whatever. It's just not how it went down. So I went down a Roddy rabbit hole for a hot minute as I was looking at this. I'm looking at this now. This man is an absolute beast.

There's a unit. By the way, we should we should warn people. R-H-A-D-I-Fergason. I took me three tries. It's going to be three tries to find this after. R-H-A-D-I. Yeah.

Just a unit. Also, if you go to his wiki, it's great because again, I went down a rabbit hole here. During his competitive career, Ferguson stands 5-8, weighed 225 and had 6% body fat. That is a lot of person in not the biggest package. So, like, he's not as big as Kevin, but he was, like, he's deeply athletic, played three sports. It was at Howard University and just like, it's super weird. I had no idea that he existed. And it's like, actually he was.

a multiple time national champion in judo and alternate at the Olympics one year and competed in the Olympics another. I'm just like, oh, that's sick. This is insanely cool. Got a black belt from Ricardo O'Borio. Like, all right. Boating for flight 246 to Toronto is delayed 50 minutes.

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what technique, skill, etc. you want from him. I have two answers. One is the right choice. If you don't have this as your choice, I don't know what we're doing. It's charisma. The man, I don't need any of his punching ability or his fighting.

But if you could bottle and sell the charisma that he had, that it factor, you would be the richest person alive. He had a gravitational pull to him to steal sheen's phrase in a way that is very legitimate. and pull and made allowed him to pull off some outrageous things right like can you imagine what would happen if i showed up to our next uh preview show and i'm rocking the you know the the monastery monk haircut that he is doing the the shaved top but let all this let the the the you on the back of the head grow up tremendous or shave an arrow tremendous my chest and and and uh yeah and you're wearing a milf hunter t-shirt well that would be sick i'd be fired at

I think, but it would be great. The frequency with which he would shave one peck and then like manicure the hair on the other one for fights. Like pulling any of that off is just impossible. And yet he did it with with a plumb like is because he has so much charisma that he could do anything. He could have done any look at all and made it work because you just wanted to know more. That's the only answer I'm willing to accept here.

Please tell me you both have it. The chest air is a real roller coaster. Yeah. Like the chest hair for him was always like a real, like, what are you going to get this time? I mean, it's the aesthetic, right? Because I don't, it's, I'm more or less saying the same thing as you. Like, it's the aesthetic. It's the physicality. It's just the look, the imposing nature that draws you in. Like, it's absolutely that. If you could bottle that and give it to somebody now in the UFC, they would instantly become, like, the UFC would kill for that in a serum to just like, hey, drink this and you instantly get a little bit of that. how many people's face could you just put on the cover of a magazine and immediately be captivated by it? Like that's, there's just not that many people alive who'd be like, I need to buy this and read about whoever that is that is looking back at me from the pages of that.

It is, it's unbelievable. I agree with both of you. I wish we could channel whatever it is that made Kimbo star into like, imagine we could done that with like, Demetrius Johnson or God help us Leon Edwards or if Bell Tor could have done that for AJ McKee or like the entire UFC women's band and weight division like any there's any number of much better fighters than Kimbo that just for whatever reason could not connect with the wider audience and Kimbo just never had that problem and it is again maybe it just wouldn't work for other people I don't know but if it just a fraction a fraction of his mystique if you were able to apply that

I mean the we would have so many more household names in MMA because some people just just don't connect. And that's fine. They're great fighters. They're interesting in their own way. But the difference for doing me interesting and having star power. And that's what Kimbo had. And I just want to, I messaged Casey before.

I was asking if you had any stories. And he said that the esteemed Esther Lynn, who has photographed everyone in combat sports and great, great people. She said Kimbo was the most photogenic fighter that she has ever worked with. I believe it. 100% believe it. Yes. No greater authority than Esther Lynn has said he has just,

the magnetism is unmatched. I absolutely no questions asked. I believe that. I did have another thing that I just wanted to talk about here because we've been deep into this podcast and it hasn't really come up. But I do think it's pretty important. He seems like he was just a really, really good person.

He was a delight, dude. In a way. He was a delight. In a way that didn't, he probably wouldn't be expected, given the circumstances he came from as he talked about, you know, the hardships he had growing up and the fact that a lot of his friends went down bad paths and got in trouble and lived criminal lives. And even when, even though he stayed on the right side of the law in this sort of way, he's still doing, like, you know, he's working for a porn company,

which is certainly on the seedier side of things. And all of this. And there's, Bellator did a great sort of remembrance to him after he passed. and you can find that video out there and he sort of talks about this stuff and he's like, yeah, like I'm out in the streets and with my friends and I have to have this personality of I'll kill you.

You're coming in me. I will fight you to the death. But I have a mom and I have a little brother and I have family and I have to go home to them and be somebody that they look up to and that means something. You hear him talk about this and you can see why he never went to that side of things

despite having a lot of real. reason and an opportunity to do so. And I think part of that probably plays into why he is such a charismatic person. And it was one of the happier parts of going back through this is watching all the videos of him just interacting with people and just like you said, Cheyne, just being a delight. Just being like a good dude to talk with and be around. Like that's fucking rare in this sport in general. And he seemed awesome.

Like I would love like, there are not a lot of people I'd rather have a beer with than Kimbo from the sport of MMA. Like, he just seemed great. One of the most unexpectedly nice people I've ever encountered in all my years doing this. Like, just incredibly disarming, so charming. It was just such a cliche to be like, he would give you the shirt off his back. But like Kimbo was like such a nice guy. Would he give me the Mulf Hunter shirt off his back?

If you asked, he probably would. He would have. This is like, I didn't even, this didn't even come up at any point during this conversation to be able to say it. But like, I found this in the research that the Sean Gannon fight, did you know that all the profits from from the sales of the DVDs of that were donated like that whole thing was set up for charity and that all that was donated to st jew's children hospital like dude was just saw the earth man great guy it's really good dude really really good dude i wanted to make sure we talked about that part of him because i you know it's not the first thing you think of certainly but i it it was great to go back and be like man everybody you know when people die you're always going to get the best version of the story from other people because no one wants to drag the name of the dead through the mud or whatever but there just isn't a lot of bad to talk

about with kimbo in that respect it's like yeah he was it was just a great dude everyone loved being around him for very good reasons our next category the brad i'ms fun with stats award uh i didn't actually really have anything i wanted to ask okay one question here aka already answered this with the the youtube views that I have another one, but yeah. I have another one, but yeah. I'm happy to hear it because I just wanted to ask one question as the expert tough historian.

I believe that Kimbo is the only fighter in the history of Tough to get an individual introduction. And that's the only stat I would have here because he, you know, his, his intro to tough was super weird the way they did it. Hey, we're doing the heavyweights and we've got a secret guest coming. And then it's Kimbo. and all the fighters are kind of like pissed off because none of them like Kimbo the idea of him and he's clearly getting some special treatment in some regards but yeah tell me your

fun with stats here okay yeah well one i can't imagine he was paid the same as the other cast as well absolutely i i i assume generally it's a pretty flat rate for anyone that shows with the ultimate fighter and everyone's paid the same but for him that that just couldn't be possible given how much time they were taking out of for taking out of his life he has definitely made more money from tough than anyone other than maybe Connor McGregor as a coach last season. And he was worth it because, yes, the YouTube nothing was mind-blowing the Houston Alexander being the third most watched fight on their entire UFC YouTube channel. But this is a stat that I think people know about.

It's not obscure. This is people know easily the most viewed fight in Ultimate Fighter history. 5.3 million people tuned in to watch him fight Roy Nelson, an exhibition bout on the Ultimate Fighter. it's a staggering number back then it's a staggering number now even if you take into account you know of course declining viewership from streaming something like that people just watching tv less uh did what different being on a different networks by tv and if this was on like esPN plus this is still be like i think the equivalent now would be like a million people watching on

usbun plus something like that which would be an insane number for again an episode of the ultimate fighter for for reference i think the latest season the first episode which was the most watched episode of the McGregor Chandler season did 200 something thousand and that was considered like oh wow that's like a pretty decent number for the ultimate fighter these days so I think for me this this would be the equivalent of like one

million or at least close to one million people watching it was absurd and people were really talking about it and the whole season was hyped around it's unfortunately it couldn't happen later in the season they couldn't build it up even more because like you guys said this was like you know everyone in the show was like well we're just going to kick Kimball's ass like we're just going to take him out we're not we don't care

about making him a star we're trying to win a competition here. So it happened in week three. And, you know, ratings were strong for the season overall. But I remember people asking me like, oh, what is, does Kimball fight this week? Does Kimball fight this week? People who were fans, just casual fans that may want to know what's the episode. And I'm like, I let them know. And sure enough, I think a lot of people let their friends know because 5.3 million people tune in to watch an episode of Tough. That sounds crazy. And it was. Imagine how the UFC saw that. They saw what he generated on Tough. And we're like, we got to give him two fights and get him the hell out of here.

Can't, can't do it. It's the greatest unanswerable question in the history of the sport, I think, is what the hell they were thinking. Shaheen, what do you have here? Do you have anything here? Just for reference point of what that number means, what do you think the average viewership was for the NBA finals last year? 12. And that's probably high. Eight.

Single digit. 11 or 12. So Kimbo on the ultimate fighter had half of the viewership of the NBA finals. Jesus. It's not bad. It's ridiculous. That is. How do they look at that and be like, we can't do business with him.

We need him to leave. Business genius. What an incredible effort. Oh, that's going to make me anger all over again. Sheen, do you have anything or should we move on to Sean Farrant? So I had one. And I did this because I was very curious because we've gone through it. Kimbo's MMA resume.

It is what it is. What do you think the combined record of his MMA opponents is? Oh, this is a terrific idea. I didn't even consider it. Would you, if I put the over under at 500, would you go under or over? That's a great one. A great question. I'd go over because,

Ken Shamrock had a lot of wins, but now I'm thinking maybe Ken lost a lot down the stretch too. It's going to be close. I'm going to take over because I think Ken did enough, but maybe Tank is tanking the over under also. He's tank picked up a lot of L's down the stretch too. I don't feel confident. I'm taking over.

A.K. Yeah, I'm taking the over too. Yeah, I'm taking the over. So just barely gets there, but then gets there. it's 138 to 123 with four ties. Not bad. Better than I expected. So like 15 wins above 500.

Not bad. That is, well, I mean, you got to add one more because do you, do you all remember when Tank fought Scott Ferozo in the backyard? because that's not on his official resume, but got to add that one in there. Never forget, Tanks got to literally in someone's backyard. I will say the Tink Abbott episode.

J. Ellis. Not counting J. Ellis. Oh, yeah. The Take Abbott episode. That'll send it way the other way. When we do Tank Abbott in like 30 years on this, it's going to be great. No, we'll do Tanks sooner

because tank's another one for us. You know, that's just, we're just going to have a good time. Our next category. The easiest one of the whole bunch. We've actually mentioned this exact award before. The Sean Ferris Award for actor who should play them in a movie named after Sean Ferris, who plays Jake Tyler in the Cinerite Masterpiece that is never backed down. Incredibly easy answer here, gentlemen.

I hope you all got it because there's a correct one because there is a man who's playing Kimbo Slices in a film, his name. We talked about it, I think, on a previous one, because I chose this fellow in this category and then learned that he was set to play Kimbo. It's Winston Duke of Black Panther fame and several other films, obviously. But Winston Duke is set to play him. And honestly, a terrific choice in cast. Perfect.

Is that still happening? That was my question. In development still. I saw that this was in development in 2018. Is this still a thing? Because I would still be interested. No update since. No update sense.

Not unclear if it's still a thing. but he's still the choice i mean he would still certainly be the choice Winston uh duke's got the juice um he's coming out in the new movie fall guy um with Ryan gotling like if this is a movie that happens Winston duke remains the choice and uh I think that it's still why wouldn't it people love Kimbo feels like it's it would be a good thing to do so I think uh yeah yeah Abdul Matine the second would also be excellent you guys probably not watchman Aquaman he's done so many movies. What was the other? He's done so many movies. The Candyman. So he he'd be a good choice. He can't be a good choice. Let me tell you why. I literally almost messaged you this last.

Of course. Okay. Go. Because I watched Aquaman 2 last night. And I went and watched it. It's fine. It's actually, it's totally fine. As I was watching it, I was struck looking at him being like, he has to be John Jones. He's the most. Oh. There is no. like he has to be John Jones. That's a perfect. While I was watching Aquaman, I was like, is that John Jones? No, obviously it's not like, no, he's,

he is perfect for John. So he cannot fulfill Kimbo because we gotta save him for John. Is there, is there any thought to casting Kimbo Jr? He's not big enough. Yeah, straight up. He's not. He's not.

He's just not large enough. I don't know what Kimbo Legacy is going to be looking like in a few years ago. You're right. Let's revisit this. Let's revisit this. I got to tell you, nothing would make me happier than in 10 years, Kimbo Legacy is acting as his grandfather in the Kimbo Slice film. I might die of happiness if that.

Wait a minute. Did we know for sure Kimbo Legacy? Okay, Kimmel Legacy is a boy. Okay, I was going to check. I was like, I wasn't sure. It's a gender neutral name, I find. So, yes. I guess it actually is fair.

I think it's a boy. Next category, also incredibly easy for me. I don't know if it was easy for you. It's our penultimate category here. It's the Cole Conrad Career Change Award. What would Kimbo Slice do if he were not a professional fighter? This was super easy for me because he was a really good actor. Oh, yeah.

Like he was a very, you watch him in Blood and Bone, and I went and rewatched it, honestly, for this. And a couple of things. You just needed an excuse. Just need an excuse. I had a couple of thoughts here. One, Kimbo is really good in that role.

Like he's, I'm not saying he's Marlon Brando or whatever, but playing the heavy is, he could have done that forever. He could have been Danny Treo very easily of like a little bit of a typecast, but could do it exceptionally well because he, he has that natural charisma and he is not stilted or awful at translating that into an acting role.

He's really, really good at it. Also, I'm not sure why Michael Jai White is not in any of the John Wick movies. I feel like that's a misstep. Those were the two thoughts I had watching Blood and Bone. I was like, yeah, Michael Jai White should be a bad guy in John Wick, obviously. It makes all the sense in the world. So actor was my choice.

Get out of my head because I was literally thinking he would have an arc like Danny Treo. I would say, I agree. I think he'd be some sort of celebrity, maybe an actor, but some sort of celebrity. And I was thinking, yeah, I would go in the Danny Treo direction where someone would discover him. Like, he just has a look and an aura where someone would see him somewhere and maybe it would start small. Like, hey, can you be this guy in this movie? Can you do this?

Oh, do you want to have a line in this commercial? And it would just explode from there. And as we've said many times, in the age of social media, I mean, he's probably becoming a top influencer at the very least. I think, imagine him like beating Keith Lee to the food blogger thing. Like Kimball Slice doing restaurant reviews,

it would be killer. I think he would have been that guy. Yeah, right? Kimball Slice, sitting in his van, eating food from various restaurants. It would be amazing. So he's going to be famous no matter what. Yeah. There's no world where he doesn't become a celebrity, I think. If it's not in fighting, it's an acting or commercials or social influencing

something like that. I actually agree and I love that you all saw on Danny Treo because it was just like it was so perfect to me. I was like you could just be Danny Treo and parlay like being sort of a gimmick into well actually you have a ton of charisma and you are

very unique and you're a super hard work and just like now you're just famous. Like now very randomly Tarantino's like, I need somebody to play this specific role in my upcoming movie. I got to tell you, Kimbo in a Tarantino film, that feels like that fits. Feels like we can do something there. Shaheen, what do you have?

No, you guys nailed it. I mean, I think everything you said, right, the Danny Trao comp is A plus. That's perfect. I don't even have any notes on that. I had said initially like a Miami tough, like a Miami bodyguard just kind of in and around Miami stuff

and you just kind of see one of those guys you see them just kind of everywhere but no you guys got in the back of certain videos that you may pay to watch you know you know but you guys know that that's the right answer which brings us to our final category

before we close up shop here it's the Leon Edwards look at me now award for the moment the best moment the peak moment of the fighter's career don't down to me so I couldn't do it I'll just go very simply.

I don't think his combat sports career ever got bigger or better than James Thompson. Biggest fight in history at that point in MMA on CBS, 6 million people watching. He blows a dude's ear off his face. I'm willing to hear arguments for others, but to me, that is, that's peak Kimbo. That's Apex Kimbo. That's when Kimbo becomes a star that, you know, all of the other celebrities in the world want to associate and be around. David Blaine wants to be there, Lamar Otom, et cetera.

So James Thompson is my choice. A.K., what do you have? Have you heard of Houston Alexander? No. I would have been the best bit ever. I actually went with the tank Abbott fight before the James Thompson fight. I mean, he went on Kim in prep for that. Yeah, it's, I think it's for me, I think also, I think tank Abbott amongst the casual fan was a bigger name than James Thompson.

I know that James Thompson ended up being the more viewed fight. I think the tank of a fight gets him that, right? And the knockouts a little bit cleaner and less disgusting. It's a first rounder, right? So it has that viral element to it, I guess before we even had viral knockouts. And to me, this is where I think people started to believe that he could actually be a good fighter, even though the fight is. something they're at home about but I think this is where

people started to believe where Elite XC really really saw dollar signs again as if they didn't already know but I think it's after that knockout they're like yeah this is a guy we can build our company around then you get the James Thompson fight and they're just at that point they're just rolling right they're like oh we we have got the guy we have got their freaking guy the Ken Chambachamac fight comes along

but I think a lot of it starts with Tank Abbott and I just like watching that and seeing him sort of climb the cage and all that and just being like what and I didn't watch I was up but I missed this moment live. I did not see this fight as it happened. So I'm talking about this retroactively. And I feel like I'm trying to imagine that feeling of like, wow, Kimbo's like for real. He just knocked out a former, a long time UFC knockout artist. Yes, the guy who by that time was

already washed. But still, that name, I think, had value. So I'll go with the tank Abbott. I think James Thompson, right makes a lot of sense. But I think this is where the rise really started. And for me, it's like where I believe the most that there was a, there was an actual fighter. here, and even though it's, yeah, not necessarily the case, but I'll go tank. Here's a great argument for it. Not only did Kimbo go on Kimmel, Kimmo got Tank Abbott on Kimmel to talk about this fight. And despite Tank being, if you haven't seen the clip, it's incredible. Despite Tank being old and clearly not there, Tank walks out and Kimmel's first reaction is,

why would anyone fight you? I look at you. Like, he's like, looking at you. Why would anyone choose to fight you? So that's a great argument because not only did Kimbo get on, he got tank on the Jimmy Kimmel, which seems insane to think about as something that happened at that period of time. Shaheen, what about you?

You made a good case, okay, you made a good case. But ultimately, the way I look at this category, right, Leon Edwards, look at me now, award. It's the career peak. The peak was four months. It was June 2008 to September 2008, right after the James Thompson fight. Four months where Kimbo Slices essentially owned the world, right?

He's been on Rolling Stone. He is a glowing cover story on ESPN the magazine. He's still unbeaten. His aura was there. He's 3 in O an M.A. He's setting all these viewership records. He was minted. Like Kimbo Slices is the superstar of superstars in combat sports at that point in time.

It was never better than that moment. like all the rest of this was fun all the rest of this was cool but from June to September 2008 Kimbo Slice was the world dude like he could have done anything he wanted he had the most poll at that point in time that he ever had in his entire life

it's a great argument I mean I try not to make the the same rewatchables thing like there just because I want to distance ourselves to some extent from it but like yeah when you're talking about the most juice where you have like yeah it's he could have done anything in the entire history of the world

and no one would have batted an eye or been surprised or said that's probably not a good idea like yeah let's do it roll so that brings us finally at last gentlemen almost at three hours we close shop on Kimbo Slices with our final thoughts and so this is it you know we've had the eight MMA fights

several boxing matches, untold number of street fights. Look back at all of it and say your final thoughts for Kimbo's slice. A.K., let's start with you. Yeah, I'll go first. I'll be pretty brief. It's a theme, I think, of Dam that we talk about fighters who are singular. They're singular. They're unique. We'll never see anyone of their like again. And it sounds like a backhand compliment, but Kimbo is proof that,

you can fall into that category without having near the achievements of many of the fighters that we have previously covered on this show. Because, again, people could just look at his record. He's not like he ever fought for a major title or won a major title or beat a notable name in their prime. That's just not. And really, none of that matters. What strange to me is, like, I have a list of names here. I've got like, like, Fador, like Robbie Lawler, Ronda, Rousey, Anderson Silva, Habib

Kimbo I don't feel weird mentioning him next to those names at all and I think people at a glance would be like

oh why would the hell would you listen him with them but I think hopefully after everything we said

and argued for in this show they would understand why he does belong to be named along those

fighters because that is that is his mystique that is a mystique that will never be matched I don't think it'll ever be matched in M.A. People can talk about Connor McGregor.

But you got to remember, Conner McGregor, he also sort of backed those things up with his achievement. He does not, we've said it before, I think, talking about Connor a lot of shows. He does not become Connor if he doesn't win the Chad Mendo's fight. If he doesn't have the 13 seconds with Aldo, if he didn't keep backing up the talk when he was on his rise. That's what makes his rise so special, is he had the talk and he backed it up. Kimbo, not to say that he was like he didn't back it up, like he fought his heart out in that cage. but he didn't win. It wasn't about winning or losing fights with him.

It was about his story. It was about who he was as a person, which you only had to watch him for like five minutes in a skit or in a fight or in an interview to be like, wow, this guy is so intriguing and I need to see him do anything. And I will spend money to watch him. And again, I just don't, there's no one else in this show that we've covered that we can say that about exactly.

And I don't think we ever will. Yeah, he's very, very unique in that respect. Shaheen, what do we have to close shop? I would just add on to what AK said, and that, you know, we've done a lot of episodes of this show. And I think we hit a lot of consistent themes of like, hey, this was a moment that if you weren't there, it's hard to understand it. Like, maybe, you know, golden era type of stuff. But I mean, man, exactly what you just said, AK, we're like, we've done a lot of guys. And like, this is the first guy.

Maybe Brock Lezzer is part of this, but not even to this degree of, like, The fighting was such a small part of who Kimbo Slice was and why he was so important and why he was so distinguished and known throughout the world. Again, I just will never forget being in Kuwait in 2012 in like halfway across the world. And nobody that I'm talking to has any idea about what I'm talking about. George St. Pierre, no one, I say that name and I'm seeing blank faces. But the first thing they say is like, oh, you mean Kimbo? You talk about Kimbo?

The fact that this dude from the Miami streets, the backyards of Miami is reaching that kind of reach across the world. And I would bet you right now, if you go to Kuwait right now and say the same thing, they're still asking me about Kimbo probably to some degree. Like the length with which his legacy is last even. We need to test this. Send me out to Kuwait. Let's do it. Write the check. We need the answer.

Write the check, Vox. Write the check. But it's just crazy. It's crazy to me, man. And honestly, like as we sit here in 2020, I just can't help but smile when thinking about my own limited experiences with them, right? Because there is a personal element to it when someone passes away.

And this is the first one we've done where someone is, the guy's no longer here. If you would have told me that kid in Ms. Marshall's class about that one day, the monster that you're watching right now on this computer screen, one day you're going to be covering that man, you're going to be speaking to that man, you're going to be in his orbit. Like that kid would have never believed it because that human seemed just beyond us,

Like he really felt like a superhuman. And I will just always be grateful that I had the chance to cover Kimbo at all before he was taken from us to get even the smallest bit of experience from that. Because sure, you know, we touched into a little bit of like, hey, he was a nice guy. He was such a gentleman. Like he was so polite and so gregarious and all this. But he also just had something undeniable about him. Something captivating that you could feel it when you were there. And it was that something captivating that turns some throwaway event covering some circus show into like the most memorable experience of my.

career, right? Like all of this. I wrote it once before on a tribute piece for him, but I always come back to this line. I miss Kimbo. I miss him even though I didn't really know him. And so that to me speaks of something. If you can get to that point, if a figure leaves that kind of mark on you, that's when you know that they meant something, right? That they meant something powerful. So to me, there's always going to be one Kimbo slice, man. And I'm so glad that we got him. The miss him is what I came back to. And I never had the personal interaction at all that you had with him. But it was the thing that as I was doing the research I thought and the amount of times I would smile watching something and be transported back or just seeing something and maybe for the first time. And like I said, at the top of this, you know, this was a one for us.

We're not doing Kimbo. He's one of the greatest fighters ever. You know, a deeply significant figure in the history of MMA, but he wasn't great. He wasn't even good. but he was fun and that's one of the things that as I get older in this sport that I think I miss a lot is is just the fun of it because I think that fun should have a bigger place in the tapestry of MMA than it it does kind of take up these days as everyone's more focused on other other parts of it and with Kimbo that that was the whole conversation the

conversation wasn't about him being elite or whatever it was about his way to capture our imagination to make us feel things. And then once he capture our imagination, it never left. And it was so rare. Because with a guy like Mike Tyson, we have that feeling, right? Like we want to see Mike keep fighting because of a time where something meant something. With Kimbo, we had that. But even when we knew the game, okay, Kimbo's not actually that good.

We just wanted to be along for the ride. We just wanted to be part of the. experience of him because it it was awesome it was just super goddamn fun man and so like i thought about how much i missed him as we did as as as i did this a lot and and what we lost because i think we lost something pretty significant and how many more fights could we have had with kimbo how many other what did we miss out on what opportunities could have had what would kimbo the elder statesman of combat sports have looked like that i thought about all of those because Kimbo wasn't ever great or even good.

Damn. Kimbo was fun. And that is what I miss. I think the sport is a little bit less bright without him. And I hope that his family is doing well. And I hope one day Kimbo legacy comes and delivers unto us another feeling like this. Because that's what we all deserve, ladies and gentlemen. Kimbo, we love you and we miss you.

And damn, you were fun. And that's it. Boys and Girls, another episode in the books, three hours on Kimbo Slices. I don't care if you guys wanted it, we wanted it, and that's what happened. I hope you wanted it because Kimbo, Kimbo. Our next episode, okay, get excited. Get excited. Debated it, considered it, pulling the trigger, George Rush, St. Pierre, on the 15-year

anniversary of his epic clash with BJ Penn. Biggest fight in history at that point. time. We're doing it. GSP is next up. Until then, thank you, Sheehan, Ashadi. Thank you, Alexander Klee, for coming along on the Kimbo Rai. Thank you for listening, certainly if you made it three hours and changed into this. Love you so very much. See y'all next time.