MMA Fighting - Fighter vs. Writer: Anthony Smith Talks Magomed Ankalaev, Jorge Masvidal vs. Colby Covington and Jake Paul Saying He Could KO Conor McGregor in MMA

Episode Date: March 29, 2022

One-time UFC title challenger Anthony Smith returns to co-host episode 29 of The Fighter vs. The Writer as he discusses the latest happening with his career including possible matchups against either Magomed Ankalaev or Paul Craig. Smith will also react to the recent altercation where Jorge Masvidal allegedly attacked Colby Covington outside a Miami restaurant with the UFC’s only “BMF” champion later arrested on aggravated battery and criminal mischief charges. Was Masvidal completely out of bounds with his actions or did Covington invite trouble with some of the things he said in the lead up to their recent fight at UFC 272? Smith will also breakdown the action from UFC Columbus where Curtis Blaydes defeated Chris Daukaus in the main event before calling for an interim heavyweight title shot with reigning champion Francis Ngannou likely out until 2023 while he’s recovering from knee surgery. Finally, Smith will give his take on Jake Paul’s latest declaration where he says he would knockout ex-two-division UFC champion Conor McGregor in the first round if they ever met in a mixed martial arts contest. All this and more on the latest episode of The Fighter vs. The Writer! Subscribe: Apple Podcasts Subscribe: Spotify Read More: MMA Fighting Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. Back to the Fighter versus the writer. I'm your host, as always, Damon Martin. And today I am happy to be joined by one of my favorite commentators and, of course, one of the top light heavyweights in the sport. He hosts his own show. He hosts actually multiple shows now, including the one he does with Michael Bisping, on top of his own show.

Always welcome in the great Anthony Smith. Anthony, how many shows do you have now, like 14? That's how it feels sometimes, doesn't it? Right now it's just the two. You know, me and me and Lorisenko every once in a while we'll jump on our YouTube channel if there's something we really want to talk about. But both of us have just gotten so busy. So that one's kind of kind of just hanging out, not doing much.

And then I co-host the Believe You Me podcast, Michael Bisping once a week. And then I'm on Sirius XM Radio, Channel 156 on Tuesdays. So I'm a busy guy. You're very busy. I love that you ended up doing the show at Bisping. I get Bisping on a lot. He was actually the first ever co-host on this podcast. and boy I tell you what he's like one of the best dudes you'll ever made it's so funny

like people always had this opinion of michael bisming when he was a fighter and i always like i always knew him really well and i would tell people like dude if you knew michael bisping you would be the biggest fan of this guy like i know he's a great trash talk or all that kind of stuff but if you actually knew him you would totally love this guy but now that he's not a fighter now he's retired like everyone loves michael bism it's so funny like how the entire world has come around on michael bism yeah you just no one i don't know him that's i think he's you you kind of hit it on the head there. Like no one actually knew.

They just seen how he acted and, and I guess spoke to and about his opponents. But I'm with you, man. Michael Bisbing is one of the best people I've ever met. He's a lot of fun. He's hilarious. He's got an interesting perspective on the sport. I love his analysis.

He's made the transition from fighter to analysts beautifully. Yeah, I mean, we have a lot of fun too on that podcast. It's not all just fights. you know, we, I bet half the show is kind of non-MMA related stuff. And it's stuff that we think is weird or funny or, you know, it's just kind of world news and this whatever's going on in our own lives. I mean, we'll go off on tangents and not even talk about half the shit we were going to talk about. It's a lot of fun, man.

I really look forward to Mondays when we record. Yeah, he's a great dude. Great dude. So before we get into all the other stuff we're going to talk about, of course, I was at UFC Columbus last night. So we're going to talk about that. of course some of the other craziness going on in the world of MMA. Of course,

we're going to talk about the madness surrounding Jorge Mazel on Colby Covington, because I haven't even really had a chance to address that yet. You know, still kind of ongoing as a couple days ago. But before we get to any of that, let me ask about you. How are you? How is everything I know last time we talked? You were still, you know, looking to come back with the knee injury

and you were kind of looking at the lay of the land of who you were going to fight. So how are you feeling and, you know, kind of where you are right now? Man, I feel great. We're back. I'm 100% healed feeling good trying to get in shape and be less fat and tired all the time. So it's going good, man. I'm just waiting to get a fight. Is it, it's so funny.

Like you had the Ankyloyala thing popped up when he fought. Then you had Paul Craig calling you out. And I know you said on Twitter like, you're never going to turn anybody down. What is next? Like what does make sense you got? I know that you probably heard looks like they're going to rebook Jan Bolhovic and Alexander Rackich as much as I know you wanted either. or one of those fights.

It looks like they're going to fight in May. So that's off the table. We're new Glover and Yeri are going to fight in June. So what does make the most sense? Like what is most intriguing to you right now? Well, I think what makes the most sense and what's most intriguing are two completely different fights, to be honest with you.

What makes the most sense is me in Uncle life. I don't know what the holdup is. To be honest, you'd have to ask the UFC because I've been begging for an opportunity. So that's all. I was just waiting on a contract. on a name, you know what I mean? Like, that's on them to figure it out and they know, they know how to get a hold of me.

But I think Uncle Life makes the most sense, the most intriguing that's available. Paul Craig is intriguing to me. I respect his respectful callout, like his confidence and his, you know, a little bit of arrogance, but in a respectful way. I think the jiu-jitsu part of the matchup is fun. It's just something that's different that I haven't seen in a long time. I haven't had to prepare for a jiu-jitsu guy in a really long time. So I think that part of it would just be a nice change up to like the training camp, you know.

So I think that one just sounds like a lot of fun. You know, I think about if I with Paul Craig, it just feels fun. Uncle life is stressful. You know what I mean? You're like you got to really put, I don't want to say put the work in, but you got to really, I don't know, streamline your way into training camp. it's got to be super specific and you got to be really dialed in and focused, which is fine. I'm okay with doing that.

But Paul Craig, you can kind of just train and just be better, you know, than you were before. And then at least in my mind, I can just go in and just be the best version of myself and I win that fight. But, and that doesn't mean it's easier. It's just different. You know, I don't have to do anything special for Paul Craig. Uncle I's a little different. Yeah. But I like Paul Craig very much.

You know, him pulling off the win he did against last couple of weekends ago was, amazing. That was an incredible submission, but I'm not going to lie to you, man. Like I think the Angola fight would be better only because, like I said, it went over him. I think to that you're pretty much, you know, right there for a title shot. And I know, of course, you got to deal with the racket situation where he's at. I think Yon Blahovic beats him. Maybe I'm wrong. I don't know. We'll see. Maybe I'm wrong. But I think Belhovic beats him, but we'll see. But I think he can for sure, especially because of a couple of the things that Belhovic is really good at that give certain people that have certain

styles a lot of problems. I said, I think I told you, I think before the Adasani fight that I thought Blahobos was going to beat Adasania. And it was only for a couple of reasons. The pace at which Yon fights at is very different. He kind of lulls you into this pace that he's very comfortable at. The people that have beat him have been the people that have been able to pull him out of that. Like your Tiago Santos is that kind of pulled, it got him into a fight that he doesn't typically like to fight. Glover, it's just that dude's kind of a fucking hammer. you know what I mean, and just got in his face and was able to hurt him and get a takedown. But, um, it rackage, the way that he fights, he fights it, he wants to fight at a very slow,

methodical kind of pace. He wants to plot around and that's exactly what Blahovic wants to do. And I think Blahovic is better at that. I think Blahovitch has more power in his hands. Rackich isn't that great of a boxer. Has he hurt people before? Yeah, for sure. But like at a high level, he's a kicker. He wants to kick. He, wants to kick from the outside. And I said from the beginning, whoever wins the kicking game, or is the better kicker between Tiago Sanchez and Rackage will win that fight.

Turns out that it was Rackage. But Blahovich is also very, very, very, very underrated when it comes to kick defense. You're going to watch the Luke Rockhold fight. He dealt with the kicking game of Luke Rockhold very well, enough to where he made Luke so uncomfortable on his feet that he wanted to grapple. And then same with Adasania. He dealt with the kicking game of Adasania very, very well. he didn't take a lot of clean late kicks he checks maybe it might be a stupid fucking stat

but i bet if you checked like who's checked the highest percentage of late kicks in their ufc career i would fucking bet my life that it's yonbovich is number one yeah yeah he's he's really good and i and i do like that matchup and uh listen they're not giving ankelaio a title shot you and i both know that i mean he didn't have the kind of performance against tago santo and i hope we don't have to see uncle i fight rackage because i think they might combined for like nine strikes thrown over five rounds. Yeah. The way they fight.

But I think the Ankyloyalaya fight makes sense. I mean, again, I like Angolao. I think he's a monster. He's just had this weird couple of fights now where it's like his output hasn't been great. He's not the boogey man. He's not the boogeyman. He's not the boogeyman that everyone keeps talking about. I've been saying that for a long time.

Is he good? 100%. He is solid. He doesn't make a lot of mistakes. He doesn't have any glaring holes in his game at all. But he is not the boogeyman that everyone's made him out to be. it's it's been people you know say oh anthony's ducking uncle like i'm not ducking that dude come on i got 50 something fights not ducking anybody he i'm just not singing his praises because i'm not

that impressed can he be he's got power in his hands he's got some decent wrestling but everyone talking about this this this this russian ground-of-pound guy that's got all these wrestling abilities like he going into the tago santo's fight he had a lower takedown percentage than tago santoes did like he hasn't even attempted a submission in the ufc not even attempted not one not one time so like like what are we talking about here like is again is he good for sure i see his skills i see his abilities i see his knockout power i see his his technical advantages that he has over a lot of people on his feet honestly he fights southpaw i would again bet my life that he's probably right-handed um because of the way that he moves and

fights and he just has all the tail-tale signs of a right-handed person that fights as a southpaw so he's different in a couple places but he's not the boogeyman that everyone keeps talking about and the higher the competition that he's been fighting the the less it looks like that to me he looks like he's right there with everybody else he doesn't stand ahead above anybody in the division at least at the top of it no i agree i think this last couple of fights have proven that i mean like it said it's not like he's gone out there and just blowing people out of the water um in his last couple of fights but again i i i do like that fight for you you know i don't know what timeline we're looking at here. Cards are filling up.

Looks like probably June July is like the earliest we're looking at now. I mean, they're filling up cards. I've heard, you know, fights being booked at the end of July. So I know you want to get back in there. And, you know, like I said, that's what I'm hoping for is that end of July card. That's kind of what's been talked about. Yeah, I like that. I like that a lot. Let's shift gears talk about the heavyway division because last night we saw Curtis Blades got a big knockout. Over Chris Dachas got a second straight win for him. Of course, second straight loss. second straight knockout loss for Chris Dachas. And afterwards, Curtis talked about, you know, the interim title fight.

He wants to be part of the interim title fight. Of course, Dana White has already said. Chances are they're going to crown an interim champion with Francis and Gano out of action. Now, unlike the last time, Anthony, you know, this is actually time where interim championship might make sense at heavyweight because we know Francis is going to be out until sometime in 2023. That's already been determined. He had ACL reconstruction surgery. We know he's not fighting again this year. He just had the surgery a week or two ago.

he's not going to be back till next year. It's going to end up being about a year out of action. So an interim champion now makes sense. Did not make sense for Cyril Gahn and Derek Lewis whatsoever. But we also know there's a contract situation with Francis going on where he may not come back. I mean, he may, and I hope he does, because I love Francis and Gano. I think he's a monster. He has all the potential in the world to be one of the greatest heavy weights of all time,

if not the greatest heavyweight of all time. But we don't know. So an interim champion now kind of makes sense only because if Francis is either gone or completely gone from the UFC, they still have a title. I'm curious your thoughts because Curtis Blades, he wants to be one half of it.

I have a hard time disagreeing with that based on his resume. He says Cyril Garner Steepie. I think that makes sense. I know we've got the John Jones thing out there. Listen, at this point, I'm done talking about John Jones. Until John Jones signs a contract,

I'm done talking about it. Thank you. Why is he in the conversation? We have no idea what's going on with John Jones. until John signs a contract with someone, I just, I'm imagining he's not, he's not in the equation because you can't,

we can't talk about what ifs. And John is a big what if. So I just completely, I think best case is everyone just pulls John out of it. And let's just stop talking about it until he decides what he wants to do. So John Jones out of the picture. Curtis Blades has got to be one half of it. Number one,

out of anybody that we're talking about, Curtis Blades is the only one that's coming off a win. Yeah. You know, Steve hits coming off a loss. Cyril gone is coming off a loss. It's got to be Curtis versus one of those guys. I wouldn't, I wouldn't doubt if it is steeping or they try to make that,

try to make that fight. Especially because Cyril did just lose to Francis and then if he wins and then for whatever reason, Cyril doesn't fight again, then it's, and then Francis comes back, then we got to do that again. So I don't know. and no one else stands out to me.

I mean, tie two of us is ranked number three right there. I don't know. I find it hard to believe that they're going to throw a tie right into an interim title shot. Yeah, I mean, I like Ty. I think Ty, but I do too. I love Ty. It seems like that's really quick. Yeah.

Like it's, I think it'd be almost unfair to tie because he just kind of gets, he's getting his wheels under him. You know what I mean? Like he had a bad run and then he's starting to figure out. He's got this new gym. He's just now starting to get good and technical. And like things are really clicking for him. Like it would suck to put him in a really big situation that maybe he's not ready for because to be very honest,

I don't think that Tai Tiu Vasa is ready for a guy like Curtis Blades. He can be just not right now. I agree. I said this actually funny enough right after that event. I had Michael Bispying on. We did the podcast right after that event. And I said, listen, I love Taitouet Voss. a incredibly fun guy to watch.

But I, and I say this with the utmost respect, I feel like he's kind of hit his ceiling a little bit right now, because I don't know that I like him to beat Curtis Blaze. I don't know that I like him to beat Steepa. I don't know that I like him to beat Cyril. I don't know that I like him to beat Francis. Now, there's nothing wrong with that. That's the four, the four best heavyweights arguably in the UFC.

There's absolutely zero shame in not beating those guys, but I just don't know that I, as you said, he just had this one monumental win over Derek Lewis. awesome win, yes, absolutely. But I think we got to see a little bit more. He had some struggle there. You know, he had some adversity there. Like, let's just not blow him up right now, you know, like, let him, let him build

off of it. Like, he's starting to feel himself a little bit. He's got a little bit of momentum. Like, let's not just throw him into the deep end and sink or swim. Like, give him, like, I really, I didn't mind the Aspinall, the Aspenol call out for Ty. I think, although Aspernel. and all is, I think, in my opinion, definitely the better fighter.

You know, I think he can be hit at times. He does put himself in some trouble sometimes or at least in some precarious spots. But those are the kind of guys that Ty's going to have to worry about. Like, those are the, maybe that's more of the level he needs to fight at your, your Jarzino Rosen Strikes and you're, like, those kind of guys. I think that's kind of where I'd like to see him hang out and see if he can get over on more guys than not. Yeah. But as far as what else do you, I mean, I can't even think, there's no one else to even pops on my head when it comes in the interim title fight.

There's, it's, I mean, I think you kind of just nailed it. It's, it's steep A, Cyril gone, and Curtis Blades. And I think, I think no matter what Curtis has to be half of that, in my opinion. I agree. But to me, and I listen, I like Cyril gone very much, but I think it's got to be steep. And also, we got to look at the reality of the steepa factor. Now, you know this, Anthony. You know you will not find a bigger Steve Miochage guy in the world than me.

I'm an Ohio guy. I mean, that's my guy. I've covered Steve A since his NAA, since he was in the, in whatever that promotion was in Cleveland, like before he was in the UFC. Yeah, I was around Stebe back then. So I, you will not find a bigger Stepe guy in the world than me. That being said,

Steve A can't wait forever. I mean, he just can't. I mean, I'm not saying he is. I'm not saying he's sitting out and telling the EOC and trying to dictate his course. I'm just saying like he can't wait for, we just today, where we're recording today is the one-year anniversary of him losing to Francis Iganu.

He can't sit out another eight months and wait and see what's going to happen. So I think it's got to be Steepa. He is the greatest heavyweight in UFC history, maybe the greatest heavyweight of all time. Him and Curtis Blaze has never happened before. We've never seen it before. There's history. And listen, yes, I know Curtis has lost to Francis twice.

But again, if he can go out and beat Stebe Miyoch, who's going to complain about him getting a third fight with Francis and Gano? And then if Steve A wins, once again, we're looking at the trilogy with Francis and Gano, assuming he comes back. So I like Cyril gone very much, but he is coming off a loss. It wasn't a particularly close fight.

I mean, it wasn't the most exciting fight in the world, but he never really had Francis in trouble. There was never a moment where like, oh, man, it's almost going to happen for Cyril. If he would have won, it would have been a 48, 47 decision. It's Steve and Curtis to me, man. I just don't, I don't see another option to make sense. And that is a good fight.

I mean, Curtis, incredible wrestling, We know the power he has. Stebe incredible wrestler. We know the power he has. Is Steve A still the guy? You know, is he, you know, 39 going on 40? Is he still the guy? Or is Curtis Blades or, you know,

ready to ascend and finally kind of reach his potential? I think that's the one to make. I totally agree with you. I don't, and I couldn't sell it any better than that. I think that that is the fight to make. One thing that Curtis said at the Post-Fight press conference, and I want to get your opinion on this, Anthony. Now, I'm a big proponent in listening.

and you fight where you believe you deserve to, you know, where you belong, meaning weight clash. You know, if you believe you're a light heavyweight, hey, you're a light heavyweight. I'm not going to falter for that. But, you know, Curtis said he thinks that Chris Dawkes is probably going to be better served at light heavyweight. He's not the biggest guy. We all know he's not like this ripped up, you know, heavyweight walk around. He's got some body fat, you know, and listen, I'm not one to speak about that because, listen, I'm not, I'm not one to sit here and critique anyone's physique. That being said, you know, Curtis is like, no offense.

I don't think he's a heavyweight. I think he's a light heavyweight, you know, kind of masquerading as a heavyweight. Listen, I don't know, as Chris Dawkins ever tried to cut, I have no idea. Has he ever gone through? Has he ever gone to the PI and said, you know, what could I do? I have no idea. You look at him, though. You are a fighter and you're a guy who fought and kind of killed yourself to make middleweight for years. Now you're a legit light heavyweight one of the top guys of the world. Do you look at Chris Dawkins and say, that's the guy I think could be a light heavy late. That's the first thing I said when he walked in the octagon. It's the first thing I said. I looked right at my wife and I said that guy should be a 205. She was like, well,

what do he weigh in at? I said, I don't know, like 240. Like, you don't think there's 30 pounds hanging around his waist? You know what I mean? Like he, and I don't mean that disrespectfully at all. Like, again, I don't like to criticize people's physique. It's not my place. But, we're looking at this strictly from an athletic competitor position. You know, making weight starts in the kitchen. He's clearly putting the work. he's training, he's getting in shape. You know, he can, he can fight at a high level. Could he make 205?

Absolutely. By looking at him, I do believe so. I mean, dude, I'm fucking 235 right now. I mean, he's, he's less than 10 pounds heavier than I am. Yeah. Fighting it, you know, at heavyweight. Like, that's doable, you know, it's doable. And I don't kill myself to get there.

I'm not miserable at all. I've been enjoying myself and I don't miss a meal and I still get to 205 fairly easy. So he does, he is carrying some, some extra weight around his waist for sure. Everyone, it did look a little odd though, because his legs look in shape, his arms and chest look in, you know, decent shape. He's just, he just carries, you know, carries that kind of spare tire around his midsection. So if I was him and there was an opportunity that I could do it and do it in a healthy way

and not kill yourself and feel like shit and really diminish whatever returns you would gain by going to 205, I say he gives it a shot. Yeah, it's funny. Curtis said something great. And I never really heard it put that way. He said, just because you weigh 245 doesn't mean you're a heavyweight. I was like, that's pretty brilliant. Like, that's true.

Like, just because he weighs that much doesn't mean he's actually a heavyweight fighter. Right. No, I mean, just because I'm 235, that doesn't make me a heavyweight at all. And Curtis would know better than all of us. Like, he felt him. He was in there with him. He felt his power. If Curtis says he's not a heavyweight, he's probably not a heavy weight.

And I'm a light heavyweight. looked at him and said, I think that guy should be at 205. And he's a, he's a super talented guy. I said the same thing about Stepe, though. Yeah. So the same thing about Stepey and look how he's done. So, I mean, uh, I don't think steepe is a heavyweight either. But he's a, he's a really thick, dense 240.

Like it's, it's different. And he's been as low as 230, not that long ago. Then the last couple years, Steve has been in the two 30s. And I think, and I actually, I, I remember talking to Steve about this years ago, several years ago about it and he kind of like chuckled when I said that and he's like you know we thought about it at one point but we just realized like it just wouldn't work for me but at this point I think I think stepe is 38 or 39 I'm not saying he's going to retire tomorrow you know what I mean but I think he's kind of yeah I think at this stage in his career like I think you know he wants

the rematch of francis he wants maybe one more run at heavyweight title and then I think stepe's going to move on to other things and that's okay like there's absolutely nothing wrong with that I don't I don't see Steepay, and it's not because he doesn't love what he does. I absolutely believe he does. But, like, Matt Brown, I'm going to fight on 45 till the wheels fall. If I talked to Holly home a couple days ago, she just turned 40. She said the same thing. She's like, I'm going to fight till the wheels fall off.

I love this. I'm not going anywhere. I think Steepay loves it, but I also think Steve A, you know, he's obviously a very dedicated fireman. He's got other things going on. Like, I don't see Steve A fight into 45. I just don't. I don't know why I can't give you a great reason why. I just have a gut feeling.

he's not that guy. You know, I think in terms of Matt Brown and Holly home love both of them. Huge Matt Brown mark for sure. I think that the weight of the bank account changes that conversation, to be very honest with you. Stepe is a very humble guy.

He lives a fairly humble life. You know, like he, he's not blowing money and going to clubs. And you know what I mean? Like he saves most of his money. So I would, I would guess if you had a pretty full goddamn bank account and you never really had anything to worry about the rest of your life,

making that walk is probably tougher the older you get. You know, if you're still trying to build up that nest egg and you see, you still got five years left to do it, you're probably going to want to do that. But Steepa's nest egg and his kids is nest egg and his grandkids nest egg. Everyone's egg is good right now in the Stepea, Miotich family.

So I would kind of go on a limb and say, I think that the amount of money that he's made, you know, in the last five years probably contributes to that a little bit. Yeah. So Andy, let's talk about the hot button subject of the, of the MMA world.

Unfortunately, you know, listen, I'm not going to, I'm not going to throw, I'm not trying to throw anybody under the best, to be honest, but we've had kind of a weird week this last week

with a lot of legal entanglements from fighters. And somebody asked me, the other day, they were talking to me about, like all the coverage I had done on the Jorge Mazadol, Colby Coventon situation. I'm like, man,

you got a lot of stories on that. It's like, I was like, trust me, I don't want to do stories about guys getting arrested and guys, you know, guys getting charged with crimes in our sport. But last week was crazy. We had Horan Colby and then right on top of that, we had Connor McGregor getting arrested for driving recklessly, which again, I'm not, I'm not giving Connor a pass,

but like in the grand scheme of things, driving really fast while stupid is not, you know, it's not, you know, he wasn't driving drunk. He wasn't doing anything like wildly, stupidly crazy. I kind of gave him a past. again, I don't want to call it that. But like when I read it, I was like, I don't really care. Yeah. Like it's,

he drives fast in a $300,000 car. Like, yeah. And I've been in Dublin with Connor when he's gotten pulled over. I don't know how fast Connor was actually driving. The police are doing Connor no favors, even back then years and years ago. We're talking 2017, 2016,

they weren't doing him any favors. then before he was who he is now. So I don't want to say he's being targeted, but there's a possibility that maybe Connor wasn't driving as fast as, you know, Connor, maybe he wasn't as reckless as they claimed or whatever. They're not huge fans of Connor. Yeah. Yeah. But listen, if I had a $300,000 Bentley or Lamborghini, I might be driving really fast too. So I understand. No, my foot to be on the floor. That's some bitch all the time. But, yeah, and then of course, the end of the week, we had, you know, everything going on with Chels on. and I'm not going to even really get into that because we don't know all the facts of the case.

It's a very ugly situation. I don't know everything is going on. A lot of it happened when I was at UFC Columbus, so I haven't really read in depth about everything going on. But of course, the big one was the Horace without Colby Covington. Now I'm not going to, we're not going to sit here and wax intellectual about the legal aspect

because I'm not a lawyer, you're not a lawyer. I don't know what the legal. I said on Twitter the other day, to me it all sounds like this is going to end up in a plea agreement, you know, he's going to pay restitution for the damage done supposedly to Colby's watch or whatever it was.

But the big debate right now is going on is like, you know, who's right and who's wrong? Now, again, I'm not placing judgment in anybody, who's right and who's wrong. But I've had a lot of people like, George shouldn't have done what he did. Horace shouldn't have done what he did. It was a sucker punch, all this kind of stuff.

Colby had it coming. He talks all this trash. Again, I'm not going to ask you to pass judgment on Andy, but what do you make of this situation? Because when I heard about it, my first, my honest to God, first reaction was, Doesn't surprise me. Yeah.

No, I think both sides are right, to be honest. The way that I grew up in the world that I grew up in, in the region that I grew up in, like you talk shit, you're probably going to get smacked. That's just how it is. Or if I'm going to go run my mouth about somebody, I should expect that there's going to be something coming my way. And that's how I grew up, and I accepted that.

If you're going to run your mouth, you're going to, you know, that that thing is probably coming your direction. You're going to have to answer for that at some point in time. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow. But it might be a month down the road. Like, it's coming back your way. So I do sympathize with Massoudal a little bit on that. But one, he did just have 25 minutes to try to do something about it and wasn't able to.

I think Massvedal is a little more street than the average Joe. So, and he's probably a little more street than the average street guy. So I would guess that wasn't enough for him, you know, and Colby took it too far. And I won't, I won't stand up for Kobe. Colby, I won't say, well, you know, you get to say whatever you want if you're going to have, if you're going to go in there and fight. He knows Massadol. And I would guess he wasn't that surprised to Massadol did what he did. So I think both guys are equally wrong and equally right.

Like Colby has the right to say whatever he wants as long as he's willing to answer for that. And I think Massvedal has the right to try to make him answer for that. I don't like the way that Maspedal did it, though. I don't like the cheap shot sucker punch thing. Like if you want to go in face to face, you know, and as long as as Covington sees it coming, I really don't have that big of an issue with it. Now, it keeps happening repeatedly.

Like once, like I feel like Massadol got his one back, if that makes any sense. Like he broke a tooth or whatever he did, busted his watch like all right like you kind of proved your point you got your one back now if colby keeps talking shit and keeps poking at him and then masphidal comes back that's kind of just how it goes um and i know that maybe a lot of your listeners won't like that because that's not the most civilized answer in the world but like we take our shirts off and fight for a bag of money inside of a steel cage like in front of the world so like i don't know what

what you're expecting of these two guys. Like these aren't, this isn't a dispute, uh, amongst staff in a, in a hospital or a nursing home or something. Like these guys are, these guys are different.

And this is, this is the only way that they know how to really solve a conflict. And the conflict wasn't solved at the end of that fight. So, um, I think that's kind of my take on it. I don't like the fact that he sucker punched him. Um,

but I also not sure that I would do anything different. if Colby was talking about my family and my children the way that he was Maspedals. So I'm not sure how many better. Yeah, I said the other day, I said, you know,

Colby, Colby has gotten away with a lot in what he said. And, you know, you can sit here and say, you know, is it over the line, is it not over the line.

You know, I'm a big believer. And, you know, listen, you know, ultimately it's just words. But,

you know, words matter. And, you know, Colby. Well, especially when it comes to kids in this day and age, with social media, cell phones, all the, all the content that's being put out.

And you have kids that are like consuming that. Like that's where I draw the line. Yeah. Well, see, the problem is, is that Colby, you know, Colby, when he first started the whole, I'm Colby Covington, the left, you know, the right wing lunatic Colby Covington. You know, I'm not going to say everything he said was funny or clever, but he had some funnier, clever things in there. And some of the things he were saying was kind of, you know, whatever.

But then like it's, I said this before. When it got so low brow, when you're not able to really pick on your opponent for anything other than family, that's when you know you've run out of material. You've run out of anything interesting to say. And I said the same thing about Connor when he was going after Dustin's family. It's like, what do you, you're saying something about Dustin's family because you can't say anything about him as a fighter. He just knocked your ass out three months earlier, four months early. You can't say anything about him in that regard.

So now you've got to try to insult his wife and his kid, which is just really low-hanging fruit. And I said the same thing about Colby. Colby, you know, for all his weird, you know, right-wing, you know, Trumpism, whatever, that's fine. Got no problem with that. But when you start talking about people's families, you do start crossing the line. And then I said this the other day, I'm not saying, I'm not justifying it. But I'm saying, Jorge Mazvedal is that guy. You do not.

This is the guy used to fight in Kimbo's backyard, okay? This is not the guy you're going to say bad things. And when he says, I'm going to come at you on the street, he's going to come at you on the street. he's going to come at you on the street. Now, Colby said the same thing. Colby's like, oh, if I see him on the street, no, Colby's not that guy. He's not a street guy. No, he's not at all.

But George is. Jorge Mazadol is a guy. So you do not play that game with him. You may be able to do it with, you know, you may be able to do it with Dustin. You may be able to do it with Tyron Woodley. Maybe they'll do it with, you know, Kamar Usman. They're not that guy. They're much more civilized.

They're just not going to pay attention to it. They're going to move on. Mazadol is not that. guy. I'm not saying it's right. I'm not saying it's right, but I'm saying that you can't be that surprised that it happened. You can't jump in the water with a great white shark and then be shocked when it bites you. Like at what point is that your fault? Like you know what's going to happen. You know it. Like so was the shark wrong or are you wrong for fucking swimming? That's that's how I look at it. And Colby, listen, you know, as I said, you know, there's, I've heard some really vicious track.

Like, one of the most vicious, I mean, I remember like, to me, one of the most vicious trash talk lines I've ever heard in this history of the sport. And it's, and it sticks by him. And it's a guy that I like very much as a person, a guy I know you know. But when Connor pulled that, who the fuck is this guy on Jeremy Stevens? Like, that was the most savage, because it was so well-timed and, like, really funny in that moment. And that was, again, purely based on the moment. It was great reaction, probably, you know, that, you know.

But when you start talking about families and kids. and like, you know, Colby, like I said, there, there is a line you can cross. And Colby has done it. And I say it, I said this the other day, it's like the Dave Chappelle line. He's a habitual line stepper. And at some point, somebody's going to call you on that. And the problem is, is that Colby, you know, he has started to kind of live his own gimmick. Like at the beginning, and we all heard this.

He became this kind of like character to get attention and to kind of save his job and to start building his persona. And I, again, he kind of took on the pro wrestling thing. and I know the guy who manages him, it was a very orchestrated plan to build up Colby to become this guy he is. Again, fine. I got no problem with that.

Chale Son is very much the same way. When you meet Chale outside of, you know, being Chale, he's one of the nicest guys in the world. And when I met Colby at his fight with Hoffield de Sanios, he's an incredibly nice guy to me. I did not have a bad word to say incredibly nice guy. I've chatted with him over the phone, like off, you know, whatever, incredibly nice guy.

but I feel like Colby started to kind of live his own gimmick and now it's like instead of being on 50% of the time he's on 100% of the time and when you do something like what he did with and then he kept poking the bear after the fight he's posted on Instagram every single day and do it you don't do that with Mazvedal you just I'm not saying it's right but I'm saying you can't be that shock that this guy's going to run up on you and punch you a couple of times when he finally sees you right and that's you know I made a very similar point Like it's, you know what you're doing.

You know, and as good of friends as they were. Like even if they, if that part of it's overblown, you train with that man long enough to know. If you keep fucking with him, he's going to clap back and it's not going to be with his mouth or social media. And that's, you know, again, I think the whole thing's a goddamn mess. I think everything is,

even Connor, I'll even say, let's take that out of it, but the stuff that's happening kind of end, in the MMA world right now, like the, you know, your John Jones situation and the jail stuff and then this stuff, like, it's just not a good look right now at all. Yeah, it is. It's ugly.

And as I said the other day, like, I wish I didn't have to write about a fighter getting arrested, you know, once a week. Like, that's the last thing I want to cover. You know what I mean? I don't want to write about that. I don't want to look at these daughters. I hate it. I hate it. I hate when people are asking me, like, oh, do you think of this? Like, I wish I didn't have to think anything about it. you know when diaz is coming out being like you motherfuckers are fucking up like when deez is coming out saying that shit you know this it's got bad yeah it's so funny i was gonna say Nate D the Diaz brothers are kind of the same way like they're not the ones to cross in that kind of regard

but you know it's funny I don't I've never written a story about Nate Diaz being arrested he knows better he's not that guy like he's not going to go do something stupid and get arrested like he may be the guy you run into him a show and you talk smack he's gonna smack you right back in the mouth. He's done it. We all know that in certain fight shows. But again, yeah, I think that's hilarious you say that. When you've crossed the line to where Nate Diaz is telling you to calm down, maybe you really, really, really

screwed up. That's 100% true. So here, okay, before we get out of here, we're going to talk about your favorite subject Anthony. I know you love this. And I want to talk about this because I genuinely want to hear your real reaction to this.

Okay. Are you ready? Yeah. Jake Paul says he could knock out Connor McGregor in the first round in a UFC fight Hold on That's that extra caveat there

Hold on all right all right Jake Paul Says he can knock out Connor McGregor in the first round In a mixed martial arts contest Now I know you're a massive Jake Paul fan We've had this conversation before

Yeah But I read this headline today Now before I give you a chance to Angela Let me throw this out there I actually have come around a little bit on Jake Paul in terms of him as a person. I like, I've interviewed Jake a couple times. I know Jake's manager. Kind of, you know, kind of the way I've always judged Connor.

You know, I said this about Connor. I think I've said this publicly before. When I lost my job at Fox Sports and I got let go, two people reached out to me that day, like immediately after it happened. Max Holloway was one. Connor McGregor was the other. On Twitter, reached out to me right away and says, BS. I can't believe they did that, whatever.

I don't know if he wants to put that out there, but I will always remember Connor for that. He's never been anything but gracious to me in person. Never been anything but gracious to me in person. Jake Paul, when I met him in Cleveland for his fight, when I interviewed him a couple times, incredibly nice guy. I remember he was running late for her.

He was like 15 minutes late for our interview, and he, like, apologized profusely at the start of our interview. Like, I am so, so sorry, I wasted your time, blah, blah, blah. He didn't have to do that, but I was like, that's cool. Like, I appreciate that he was gracious enough to do that. So I've come around a lot on Jake. I like a lot of what Jake says about fighter pay. I like a lot of what Jake says about, you know, better treatment of fighters.

I don't mind that he's making money in boxing. Those are all cool. I got no problem with that. Keep doing what you're doing, man. Go fight Tyre Woodley 30 times if that's what you want to do. I don't care. Make that money. Good for you.

Go beat up Tommy Fury, whatever. But let's slow down on that you're going to beat Connor or anybody else in the MMA fight in your debut. You're going to knock out Connor McGregor in the first. let's slow down here. Yeah, I've come around on Jake a little bit too, to be honest with you. I still think he's kind of a douchebag, but it's okay to be a douchebag. You know what I mean? Like, it's just, he's not my type of dude. Like, I'm not sure that him and I could hang out and be friends. But, you know, I've, if he's, if he's truly out here trying to help people and he's trying to get pay up and it seems like he's going into his own pocket to help people on his own shows and stuff, I have a hard time knocking that.

I've always said, I don't have any problem with him making money. Like, if you can, if you can get it, get it. I think everyone has the right to be able to compete if they want to. It seems, I've always, I've always stuck up for him and said he has the right to compete. He has the right to be here. He has a place at the table. And he trains hard. He takes it very serious.

He busts his ass. And he's not as bad as people want to pretend. You know, like I got a lot of shit from the very beginning of this. You know, there was all the, every fighter you talk to you. that dude sucks, he can't fight, that dude is shit. And I said from the very beginning, like, I don't think so, guys. Like, I think he's okay. Is he going to beat anyone that I was like, I super respect their skills and abilities?

Right now, no. But he's a pretty skilled, really heavy-handed amateur, in my opinion. Like, that dude can fucking fight. Like, and people hate him so much, they forget that. But him fighting, first of all, first of them, all. Conner's half his size right now. People do miss that. Jake Paul is a big dude, and he's fighting short stocky wrestler welterweights.

Jake Paul's my size. He's a big goddamn dude. He's way north of 200 pounds. So him fighting Connor like in a boxing match, that'd probably be a pretty good fight, you know, I was with you. But is he going to knock him out at an MMA fight? No. Now when Connor gets kicking, he's going to kick Jake Paul's head right off the shoulder.

in an MMA fight but people say that Jake can wrestle a little bit so maybe you know he might be able to keep it a little bit competitive for like a minute or so but no in an MMA fight he's gonna get barbecue it's it's like I had more belief in Connor McGregor boxing Floyd Mayweather than I had belief

in Jake doing that in MMA and it's because at least in boxing like Connor legitimately does have power in his left hand like we know that and he actually is like he actually has boxing skills he wasn't going to be Floyd Mayweather. I mean, we know that, but he could hang with Floyd Mayweather a little bit. And yes, Floyd probably carried him for several rounds to kind of get people their money's worth.

That's all fine. I got no problem with that. But he wasn't beating Floyd, but at least he didn't get massacred by Floyd. It was the same kind of thing when people said Anderson Silva going over. I knew Anderson Silva was going to do well, and he has done well. I think Anderson Silva knocks out Jake Paul in boxing. That's not a knock on Jake Paul. I just think Anderson Silva's a freaking badass.

Right. But come on. MMA is a whole other animal. When you mix in takedowns, kicks, knees, elbows, dude, it is all, I mean, I like, and I say this and honestly, I like Jake Paul very much. I don't think there's a middle weight. I'm saying middleweight because it's kind of in the middle where he's at. If he's 200 pounds, let's say middleweight.

There's not a middleweight on the roster right now that he would be none, none. There's not a middle weight in the UFC that Jake Paul would be. Zero, none. And there's definitely not a 205. no i mean that's worse that's worse i mean you actually give him someone his size even strong even someone that's been struggling like say like what would jimmy crew do to jake paul that fight would last that fight wouldn't last two minutes no even devon clark devon clark would bulldoze that dude over and smash him it would last it would last

it would last as long as the m mhm a fighter wanted it to last it would last as it would take for either one of those guys to walk across the octagon. However long that takes, seven, eight seconds, I don't know. Yeah. You know, but he's getting headlines. I get it. Like, he's playing the game. He's keeping Connor's mouth as much as he can because it's beneficial to him.

You know, he's got a fight coming up allegedly. He's seen he had something. He's back in August is what he keeps saying. So I don't know. Tommy Fury's been talking about. He's got some big announcement too. So I wonder if that's what that shit is. Yeah.

Yeah, like I said, dude, I got no problem to making money. I got no problem with him. Go ahead. I'm only bringing it up because I've come around so far on Jake Paul in terms of where I was at the beginning to where I am now, where I will legitimately say I am a fan of a lot of what Jake Paul does. And I had a blast in his boxing match. It was a lot of fun being there.

It was a really fun crowd to be around in Cleveland. Again, I've come full circle on Jake Paul, 100%. I've definitely eased up off of them a lot. Like, all right. But he ain't, he ain't been. Connor. He ain't, I mean, he ain't beating D. Come on. I mean, let's just come on. I mean, come on. I mean, like,

maybe he beats CM Punk. I guess that's kind of the level where I'd give him. That would be a good MMA fight. That would be a good MMA fight. Yeah. Then maybe we're talking, but he, come on now. They should look that. There you go.

Punk. You just made a fight. Look at that. Yeah. Find a couple hundred million dollars. I'd put those two together. For sure. Yeah. That were, we could actually have a debate on who wins that one. He's not beating.

He's not beating. Could you imagine? You said, Jimmy, could you imagine? Could you imagine what he would do to him? Could you imagine? I mean, come on. I mean, I'm talking. And I, when I say,

I'd pay for it, though. I would pay for it a second. I'd pay to watch it, that's for sure. In a second, I would pay to watch that. But come on now. Let's let's, let's, I just, I'm knocking it down because, come on. Let's just, you know, we can say crazy things, but let's, let's, you know, come on now. Let's keep it in this world.

Yeah. Let's keep it within, let's keep it within like some realm of possibility. You know what I mean? Yeah. Anthony, it's always a pleasure to have you on, man. I know you're such an incredibly busy guy. And like I said,

you have a million things going on. So I always appreciate you coming on and coast and the show. Anything else you got coming up? You want to plug anything else coming up? We should be keeping an eye out for you. I know you're always doing the analyst gig. Of course, you mentioned believe you me. What else you got coming up in the next few weeks?

Oh, man. I think I'm, uh, yeah, excuse me. Oh, here I am yawning right at you. You're not boring me. Taking a nap. You're not boring me. I'm just tired. I think I, I think I'm Arizona. I think that's my next one. Okay.

Phoenix. Is that Phoenix? It's in Phoenix, right? Yeah, Phoenix. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I'll be working the, working the desk for the Phoenix of it. Okay. That's the, uh, 273, right? 274. 274. Sorry. There's 273 is in Jacksonville, right? That's right. Yeah. 274. Oh, yeah. That's okay.

That's, yeah, that's, uh, that was that was a, that was a, that was a, that was a, that was a Gaci and Oliver. Ooh, boy. Yeah. That's a good one. Carlos Barser Rosannaovianus. Give me a good card. Got a couple good paper views coming up recently.

I'm really looking forward to the next couple. We got, of course, Peter Yon, Aljimane Sterling and Volcanowski. Comzat's coming up. So we got some good fights coming up. We actually have an off week this week. No UFC card this week. I know. It's weird.

Like it's been a while. It feels like it's been a while since we haven't. That's why we're talking about Jake Paul. We only have fights talking about this weekend. Yeah, we got nothing up. Perfect. Well, I appreciate you, man. Thank you. Hey, it's always a pleasure, Anthony. Appreciate it. We'll talk soon, okay? All right, man.

A big thank you, as always, to Anthony Smith for coming on and co-hosting the podcast with me. Of course, we had a lot to talk about this week coming off the hills of USC Columbus, and of course everything else happening in the world of mixed martial arts. Make sure you to check out all of the work he's doing, of course, with the Believe You Me podcast with Michael Bisping, who is also a frequent co-host on this podcast, as well as his own show on Sirius XM Radio. as always appreciate everyone tuning in to the podcast each and every week. Make sure you check us out on all of your favorite podcast platforms, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher. And of course, you can always find us over on MMAfighting.com.

We will see you guys next week for another edition of the Fighter versus the Writer. Thanks for tuning in. We'll see you then. You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network.