MMA Fighting - Fighter vs. Writer: Matt Brown Reacts to Jon Jones Already Returning from Retirement, Jake Paul Getting Ranked After Latest Win

Episode Date: July 8, 2025

On the latest episode of The Fighter vs. The Writer, Matt Brown and Damon Martin react to the news that Jon Jones is already planning to end his retirement with hopes of fighting at the White House plus does Conor McGregor teasing his return for that card even matter anymore? Plus we discuss Jake Paul earning a ranking by the WBA after his lopsided win over Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. and much more. Subscribe to MMA Fighting Check out our full video catalog Like MMA Fighting on Facebook Follow on Twitter Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. To the fighter versus the writer, I am Damon Martin. He is UFC legend Matt Brown. And Matt, we are rolling into our next UFC fight. We actually had a week off on July 4th. I didn't realize that. But we did. We got UFC 318 coming up in a week in a little while.

We got UFC going to the White House. John Jones out of retirement. It never slows down. Yeah, we won't have July 4th off next year, will we? Probably not. Probably not. Not looking like it. Who knows?

You think that's confirmed? You think they're really going to do that? I mean, listen, if you would have told me, if you would have told me a decade ago that a sitting president would be like a regular UFC events, I would have said absolutely not. You know, a decade ago or I guess maybe a little over a decade ago, no one would have thought Donald Trump was going to be president. You know what I mean?

Because remember when he first announced his candidacy in like 2014, 2015? I was like, Donald Trump, come on now. Yeah, there's a little bit of that. Yeah. But there was also a lot of like back in that. day, 2014 and 12, whatever, back then, a lot of people asked them about being president one day, remember? Like, even like Oprah Winfrey and like, people, people ask the rock about being president.

Fair, fair, fair. But like, I think, and I think that's what, I think, am I'm not trying to get political or I think that's part of what made Trump such an appeals because everyone, like, immediately dismisses him, you know what I mean? Like, oh, it's a joke, you know what I mean? And then it gets popular. He's already a huge, you know, national figure. And people don't see him coming.

They don't say, I think that's a mistake they made in 2016. No one took him seriously. like, oh shit. Like, he actually has a chance to win this thing. So everyone had told me a decade ago that a sitting United States president would be like a regular fixture at UFC events. I would have laughed in your face. So to say that they're not going to pull this off, I mean, nothing gets said by mistake.

And the fact that like immediately afterwards, Dana's jumping all over to UFC's a reposting the clip, there's, I mean, there's got to be something to it. Now, will they actually hold the White House on the grounds of the White House? I have no idea. But I don't discount the possibility. it's going to be hot like they'd be an outdoor show on July 4th that's a rough time

bro yeah I don't know when I don't know like I know they're talking about doing this for you know next year is the 250 250th anniversary of the signing a declaration would be pretty sick to be honest I mean listen I'm not getting political but like you couldn't do it with most sports

like they couldn't just say we're going to hold an NFL game on the lawn of the way I'm going to have a NASCAR race yeah you couldn't do that but like this is something they actually could do and and I think the relationship between Dana and Trump, like it's real, like, they're buddies. Like, they are literally close friends. Yeah.

To say it's impossible. Like, if Dana said it, I'd be like, oh, come on, Dana. Like, you're, it's Trump who said it. Like, he's the one who said it. And he's, obviously, he pulls the strings. So I don't discount it. He's crazy enough to do it, too. And that wouldn't be sick, though, if they shut down D.C.

Like, to do Vegas and had an F1 event on July 4th also and a UFC event in the middle. Yeah. Like, I went to, I went to the battle for the troops. show down in Kentucky when they did that show with uh and dude that was insane because like to get on the army base like you have to go through metal detectors and i mean it's like like to go like i remember we were there in media and we were sitting there was in a hanger in a giant hangar yeah and to get up to go to the bathroom you had to walk over to your army escort and the army escort and the army escort to take you out to a porta potty stand there wait for you to do whatever you're

going to do and then take you back to your seat like and that's an army base so i can only imagine what the security would be at the White House. It's going to be wild. I mean, I don't discount the possibility. I'm not saying, listen, I don't know if it's going to happen, but you got to admit, it would be pretty cool. I mean, you got, yeah, that's what I'm saying. You got to admit it'd be cool.

Like, you know, politics aside, because, you know, like, if you're doing it at the White House, it's going to be some political shit, right? Of course. Bro, like, we can't forget being UFC fans in 2001. and like just wanting to be able to watch a fight you know like like when it was like blacked out was i think i was around 2000-dleton right when it was blacked out maybe a little bit earlier you know it was it's completely blacked out like you can't even get it on paper view you're waiting for the bhs to come out to watch these fights you know we're going on the underground just to see what happened

and shir-dog and shit and now we're on the white house lawn so to be a you know a historical thing to be a part of that come up of the UFC, you know, business aside, you know, politics aside, it's a cool thing to see, man. Well, it's also, you remember, like, for years, like, the goal was getting New York, right? Like, because New York was so against it, you know, MMA and they had that one dude who ended up getting busted on corruption charges, neither here nor there, but, like, they had that one, like, they were so against MMA. And, like, that was, because you remember every press conference, Dana, what's going

out in New York? What's going on in New York? Because everyone, that's such a big market. And now they're there and they do an event every year and it's always massive and it's a huge deal. And I was at the first ever event at Madison Square Guard when Connor fought Eddie Alvarez and it was cool.

Like it was just cool. Like I've been to New York a million times but like to be there for a UFC event was cool. Like the very first one. Like that was a really cool event. And then like I said like no one else can really do this. You can't hold a baseball game on the lawn of the wilds. You can't hold a, you know, I just have football.

You know what I mean? Like UFC is like one of the only sports you could actually just like build a, Octagon, build a couple of those stands, you know, like you do for like the inauguration or whatever, and you got an event. Like, I mean. Think about it, boxing's been around for

hundreds of years. It's never been on the White House. Yeah, I mean, like it or not, dude, it's a cool idea. Now, will it happen? And also when I heard the announcement, I was like, boy, did they just give the UFC an extra chip to throw in for the old broadcast deal for next year. Like, be the, be the broadcaster who gets

to broadcast the first ever event on the White House lawn. Like, you do imagine, like, hey Netflix you want to chuck in a couple extra million here right for sure yeah and then what john jones decides to come out of retirement like the next day like like wait white house i didn't know about this put me in so let let's talk about this because john we talked about john retiring and i boy did i already stick my foot in my mouth i felt like at 38 and the whole tom aspinall thing the heavyweight it's almost like when john because here's the thing i know everyone's like basically i know dana more or less said he was lying. But John said I was basically done last November and, you know, I just,

you know, didn't officially announce it and, you know, they just kept trying to convince me to stay. Now, that sounds like a familiar gameplay because that's what happened with Khabib. Remember when Kibb retired in October and they were like still like, hold on, don't, you know, don't give up the belt yet. Don't walk away. Like, let's talk. Let's talk. And it wasn't until, you know, a few months later they crowned a new champion when Kibb retired. I could see that where John's like, I'm done guys like I'm done and they're just like hold on don't don't quit yet don't walk away and eight months later they finally were just like well I guess he's really not going to fight so he can retire and I was I was up to mind like that's it he's 308 like it's not like he's a young guy

and doing this or it's not like he's a broke guy like he's made money like he's probably made some of the most money of anybody in the sport so it's not that so I thought he was really done and now two weeks later I'm back in the drug testing pool and I want to I'm just like I'm done like I give up trying to to predict these retirements anymore. Now, we've got to, we can't, we be remiss to not talk about the conspiracy theory here though, right?

So, correct me if I'm wrong, Tom Aspinall gets a fight in the meantime, and then John decides to come back. Yeah, so Tom, Tom went to Vegas for UFC 317, and while he was there, he said he did book a fight. He's not announcing it. He would let the UFC

do that. I get that. He said it again in other interviews, like, I got a fight, I got an opponent. I got a date. I'm just waiting for them to announce it. My guess, and I think everyone's guess, is Cyril Gahn. And I think that, you know, we're looking at probably November, Madison Square Garden or December for the year-in show. I don't really think they'd put that with Abu Dhabi in October.

That doesn't really make sense. I think that's more Islam territory or, you know, something like that. So probably New York or L.A. New York or Vegas, November, December. And Cyril Gahn seems to be the most likely candidate of that. but it is ironic that Tom goes there, books a fight, moves on, he's the undisputed champion, and now John's like, hey man, I'm back. But if you're the UFC and you hear John's coming back,

do you not stop and say it's the real gone? Do you not just call surreal and be like, hey, bro, sorry. We got to delete this contract. We need John in there. It's got to be Tom and John. How could these two fight anybody? else, if John is actually coming back, how could any other fight be made? Like, you cannot do it. It's not cool. So let me last, when we talked two weeks ago, whatever was when John retired,

and we talked about his legacy, how people will remember him. And I said that, you know, there's going to be that narrative that he retired rather than fight Tom Asple. Now, you and I disagree. He's a legend. He doesn't need to fight anybody. He's proved it, blah, blah, blah. But John's not helping himself by doing this. Like, Tom says, okay, I moved on. And by the Tom has been absolutely nothing but respectful towards John. He's like, I wish him the best. You know, it was never about John. It was about the title, which, okay, it's the thing you've got to say, but let's be

honestly, are you going to get as excited to fight Cyril, gone and jeltz and I'm made as you are, John Jones, again. But like, the fact that Tom's like, okay, cool, have a great career, have a great life, man, and, you know, enjoy your retirement. I'm going to go to Vegas, book a fight, I got a fight book, got an opponent, I'm ready to go. And then a week later, Trump makes this announcement. Suddenly that's the catalyst for John to be like, put me back in the drug testing pool. I'm not saying, like, we consider the conspiracy theory, you're absolutely right.

Like, we consider all day and say it's just a matter of circumstance, right? Like John heard this announcement for the White House. He got excited. He wants to come back. But the narrative, the look, is that he retired. Tom gets a fight. And he's like, okay, now I'll come back and fight. That's what it looked like.

And look, I'm as big of John Jones fan as anybody. and I've always defended. He's not afraid of Tom. He's willing to fight anybody. It's hard to not fall into that narrative here, though. You know, like, to me, like, fighting in the White House, like, that doesn't do it. But maybe I'm a different person. You know, maybe everybody looks at different.

For me, like, you tell me they're going to have a fight at the White House, like, cool, all right, like, it'd be cool to do it. If not, whatever, like, it fights a fight. Maybe John looks at it different. Maybe that, you know, got him motivated, sparked his interest enough. But man, I'll tell you, like, this, this looks bad, in my opinion. Like, and I got the most respect for John. Like, I talk about it all the time, right? The dude was kicking people's asses while on cocaine.

You know, like, like, I've done enough cocaine to know, I cannot do that. Like, respect, John, like, you are a bad motherfucker. But this looks like ducking. Yeah, I mean, whether it's true or not, it doesn't matter. It's the look, right? Like, you retire, Tom gets a fight, and then the White House announcement makes you decide that you, I mean, I know he's a Trump guy. And he won when he beat Steve A's outside the cage. That's fine.

That's whatever. You can be a fan of Trump. I'm not even saying, and I'm not saying it wouldn't be cool. We just said, like, two minutes ago, it would be cool to do that, right, to fight at the White House. But there's a lot of guys who could do that. There's a lot of guys who can fight at the White House. John, that that's really the catalyst that's going to make you decide that you're really not retiring.

Like, we don't even know. That's why I'm really hoping that I'm proven totally wrong here. And that, you know, when he announced a comeback, they call it's real gone or Jalton, whoever it is. And he said, sorry, bro. Like, we'll put you on the undercard, whatever. You know, we'll still help you out. But John and Tom, man, do it.

Fucking, I hope it happens, man. Let me ask you this, Matt, because we talked about this with the retirement that right after we got that story about him being charged with a misdemeanor for leaving the scene of an accident, which, you know, he still has a court date in July coming up. We'll see what happens. It's ultimately a misdemeanor. It's even allowed in the White House. Which, I mean, the misdemeanor basically it's going to mean, you know, it's not really going to mount to about you. But remember, we talked about that and John's lawyer came out and, you know, said, oh, it's all bogus, whatever. But our natural instinct because of John's history is to believe he did it, right?

because it's just so many instances, including that hit and run, which he did do, we know for a fact he did, in 2014 or whatever it was. Our natural instinct with John when something bad happens is to kind of believe that it happened, right? Like, we don't err on the side of caution with John because unfortunately history says John does dumb shit. That's what I'm talking about in this situation. Like, I'm with you. We said 100 times over. He's not ducking. He's not scared of Tom Aspernel.

He's not scared to anybody. and maybe he's not, but it looks that way. It looks that way. I thought you were going somewhere else with that because that's actually another great point. If you're Dana White, do you put all your trust into John to make it to this fight? Like you're talking to the White House show,

the 250th anniversary of America, and you're going to rely that John Jones is going to get there and, you know, at a year from now, like nothing happened in this entire year? Yeah, I mean, do you bank on that? I mean, I don't think you can. That's a hard bank, right? Right.

Like, there are certain guys, like, like, Dustin Porre is retiring in a week. You put Dustoporio on there, you know he's going to show up. Like, Dustin shows up. Probably do his own detriment from time to time where he's like, I probably shouldn't have fought, but he fights. Yeah, like, and it's like, we'll talk about Connor in a second, but like, Connor coming out and said, I want to fight. Like, dude, come on now. Like, let's just, let's slow down all this. Same thing.

Like, are you going to bank on, on Connor? You know, a guy that hasn't fought in how many years? and, you know, we see what he's doing, you know, according to the social media that he puts out at least. Are you, so here's my question. If John is serious about coming back and he's already back at the drug testing pool, which I don't know if he ever got out of it, good Lord. If you're the UFC, do you just lay down the law and say, if you're coming back, John, we love you, we want you to come back.

You've got to fight Tom Aspinall. You're not going to fight anybody else. Like you can't because now he's not champion. Now he's not champion. He doesn't have that belt anymore, which was like that big, like, you know, the big black cloud hanging over everything.

Right. He doesn't have that anymore. So he can be like, give me Alex Prow now. I want Alex Pera now. If you're the UFC, if you're Dana White, you're the guys at WME,

whatever, TKO, are you saying, great, John, come on back, but you got to fight Tom Aspinall. That's the only fight. If I'm Dana White, I'm like,

cool, John, fight whoever you want. But I'm saying if you're John Jones, like there's no other fight. Like, if you're Dana White, you're like, is John Jones.

Like he's going to fight somebody and it's going to sell. Like, you know, we all know who he is. And hell, even the fact that it's not Tom Aspinall, hey, it's going to get more people talking. More people are going to want to watch, you know? Like, like people are talking, then they're watching. That's all it matters. But if you're John Jones, I can't imagine, you know, feeling good about fighting anybody else. I mean, as John, like, like Dana probably doesn't give a fuck, really, right?

I mean, it's true. you know i mean when he had the the title i think dana should have given a fuck maybe he did maybe didn't but he probably should have um he doesn't have a title now so like who cares like okay you john jones is fighting cool we got the star on there but if you're john i like i don't know how you justify it to yourself to fighting anybody else yeah i mean john is the you know you just want to fight you know you want to just come in and and fight for money and be on the white house lawn and everything cool you know that is in my opinion damages legacy like because now people will be saying he chose not to fight tom aspinall like like again you could we could argue

ducking or scared whatever that's all you know i highly doubt it right but choosing not to fight him it's basically a fact at that point if he comes back and fights anybody else. 100%. I don't care if that's the truth or not. I don't care if in the back of John's head he's just like, fuck this guy, I don't want to fight him. It looks bad.

If you come back and write Alex Prairie, you fight anybody. I don't care who it is. If you fight anybody other than Tom Aspen, after all this, you are damaging. Because if he just walks away right now and retires, I mean, as we said a couple weeks ago, we're like, yeah, we'll talk about it for a week or two.

and then a year from now, no one cares. A year from now he'll be in the UFC Hall of Fame. No one's going to care. We're going to talk about John's greatness and this and that and whatever. To add to that, the dependent factor in that, too, depends on the rest of Tom's career, too. Sure, sure. If Tom goes on to be, you know, the next John Jones,

then it's going to be the fight that got away, right? But if he goes on, is just, you know, another heavyweight champ, yeah, no one's going to care. But it all comes down to, like, you know, again, And I'll be very clear. Like, I don't believe that John is scared of him or ducking him or any of that shit. But if he chooses not to fight him, makes the choice. If he comes back in fights, he is choosing not to fight Tom Aspinall.

And I don't know if we necessarily say that's a bad look, but it's saying, I mean, it's saying exactly what it is. He chose not to fight Tom Aspinall. And that's, you know, it's not. cool I guess. What's the old say if it walks like a duck and it talks like a duck and it quacks like a duck and it's a duck and I've never said and I never will, I never will believe in my heart of hearts of John Jones has ducked anybody.

But if you come back from retirement and you fight anybody other than Tom Aspinall, I don't care whether it's true. That's what it looks like. You know what I mean? Like we can sit there and say all day we don't think it's true. But if you go through all this, you retire, you come back, and you say I'm fighting Alex Prayer. I'm sure we'll watch.

It's John Jones. He's still the greatest ball time. We're going to watch it. But you fight anybody other than Tom Aspinall. After everything we just went through, it's going to look like you were ducking Tom As well? I don't care if it's true or not. And again, I'm going to argue that, you know, to the bitter end,

like he chose, you know, and probably not out of fear. But, you know, maybe it wants a lower risk, once, you know, an easier pay day, he doesn't want to train as hard, whatever it is. Like, I'm going to argue, like, he's not afraid. It's not a fear thing. Like, he's making the choice. He's choosing not to fight him.

And again, if you're Dana, like, why do you give a fuck? But if you're John, choosing not to fight Tom Aspinall, you got to understand how that looks. You just do, right? You got to understand that everybody's going to say you're ducking. Well, you talk about legacy. Like him retiring without fighting Tom, we said, we'll move on. We'll all move on.

John, Tom will go on and fight. We'll move on. If you come back and you don't fight Tom, then we are talking about your legacy because now you're making the choice, as you said, you're making the choice. I don't care what's true or not. You're making the choice to fight and not fight Tom. We said when John was active, there's no fight, nothing. There's nothing out there you need to fight Tom Aspinall.

if you come back and you don't fight Tom you've hurt whatever legacy you're putting together whatever whatever you know maybe maybe it's a little bit like you know fighting's a funny sport right like how many times did Floyd Mayweather come out of retirement and he didn't he didn't fight the toughest fight it took him forever to fight Pacquiao right that was the fight everybody thought he was finally going to lose

you know and he would come back and he would fight you know somebody that we didn't really know about or any you know that was like a lesser champion or something, just get another belt or whatever. And Floyd talked the right game and everybody believes he's one of the greatest ever, TBE, you know, and anybody that knows knows. But, you know, I don't know if John is fair of a comparison. But it's, I think it starts to raise that question, right? Where everybody, you know, because he's making that choice.

When he makes that choice, if he makes that choice, it starts to, open the doors to that are you the greatest ever is your legacy tarned and shit and it's like why open that door bro you know what I mean like you're choosing for people to open that door like you have the choice right now like if you're

going to come back fight Tom especially I mean you go beat them like there's no question you lose to them okay maybe some people start making questions right but you choose not to fight them there's a lot of questions I mean come on now like you're

doing a fight at the White House, how'd that be bigger? The American legend against the British champion? I mean, come on. That's like the 1776. That's like the perfect anniversary fight right there. That really is. Yeah, good call. Did you, did you, I know, you probably didn't see it because I think at this point

we've all kind of tuned out. Like, it's so funny. We've gotten so, like, and I always bow down to the great Matt Brown for this one. When we talked like two years ago about Connor coming back, you know, he's never coming back, man. And I was like, I think. he's coming back. I think he's going to do it. The fight got scheduled even then you're like, hey man,

credit, you're fighting, but let's wait until he fights. Never fought. And then when this thing in the White House, he does like the AI generated image of him and Michael Chandler staring down and Trump in the background. And of course, Chandler jumps. Dude, you know I like Michael Chandler. I consider Michael Chandler's a buddy of mine.

I've known Michael since he left college and started fighting in Bellator. I've known him for many, many years. You've got to let that go, man. I know you're playing into it for social media and it's fun. you're never going to fight Connor because Connor's never going to fight again. Like I, it's so funny.

John does it because of the timing and everything, we all jump on it because we're like, oh my God, this is so John Jones to retire and come back two weeks later. Connor says it, it's almost like the world just kind of ignores it now. Like we're not even like taking it serious. Like we wouldn't take it seriously like two years ago.

Now everyone's like he's never fighting again. Why are we even going to, why are we even going to placate this? Yeah, it's kind of funny, right? Hey, man. We keep talking about him, right? You know, and he's doing a good job. I don't want to see him back personally, right?

I don't know how many people want to see him come back. I don't know how many people are, like, even if he was to actually come back, like how many people would be excited, like, would people even care that much? I know he's got the big enough name. He's got the brand and he's going to talk some shit. You know, he's going to do something crazy. I don't know if he's the type of guy you want to let on the White House lawn. You know, me doesn't even interest me.

you know like I don't I don't want to see it I especially don't want to see him fight Michael Chandler you know like Michael Chandler needs to get a win you know he needs to go get a you know put a winning street together I want to see him fight some you know the right guys you know he's been around a long time and done some great things

he needs a couple wins I'd love to see I think Hooker has a match up I'd love to see him rematch Hooker I think you know I think it's a good time for that actually I'm not opposed to that. But yeah, it's just funny. Like, we just, we, it's gotten to the point now. Yeah, we're talking about only because, like, it was, you know, it was just funny.

But, like, none of us take it serious anymore. Like, none of us are, like, none of us are even contemplating that actually could have. We're almost like, okay, bro. Like, that's how you were two years ago now. And I kind of agree with you because, like, I've enjoyed, like, the con or the BKFC Conner, where he's, like, becomes, like, the promoter, gets up there and shouts. And I love, like, he jumps in the ring and congratulates the guys into that one time. I think it was in Spain.

Yeah, it was in Spain. Guys put on, I mean, it was a fucking incredible fight. It was a five-round battle. It was a great fight. And afterwards, he comes in and tells them, not only am I going to, you're going to both make your show and win bonus, and we're also giving you, like, another bonus on top of that.

That's cool. Conner just made that call. And I was like, that's a cool thing to do. You know what I mean? That's something Dana would do in the UFC. Be the promoter, man. Like, be the promoter, do your, do your whiskey or your beer, whatever you're doing in Ireland.

Like, you can still be a, you can still be a presence in the sport. But, dude, I just. you know, like I'm with you. Like, I don't know at this point because now it has been four years. Like it has been four years since he fought. He's 37, I think. Like, what are we going to get out of it? Like, we're not going to get another Connor run.

That's gone. Like, that's over. Like, we're not going to get, you know, people talking about, like, him coming back and fighting. Like, what, what point is there at this? You know what I mean? Like, there's still, just to put this in context, there's still people who like, maybe Rhonda will come back.

Guys, Rhonda is never fighting again. Let it go. But there's still people to bring that up. But like, I'm with you. I'm like, I don't know. I know, the interest in terms of him being a superstar, sure, but like, what do we expect? Like, that was like Tyson fighting Jake Paul, and I'm not trying to say that Conner's Mike Tyson, I'm just saying, like, when Mike Tyson was fighting Jake Paul, we're all kind of like, oh, God,

like, this is just, we love Mike Tyson, but like, come on now. And like, it's not that with Conner. He's not to that level, of course. He's not 58 years old, but what are we expecting? Like, what are we expected if he did book a fight? I mean, that's one of those fights that reminds you, like, the fighters never. actually retired. That's true. When Mike Tyson came back, it's like

it's like yeah, man, the fighter could fight when he's in the nursing home, man. Like that's just you know, some of us, probably the vast majority of us get to a certain level. It's like, the dude just got in his blood, man. I mean, hell I hang out with Mark Coleman all the time. I'm always

nervous he's going to book a fight next weekend. I mean, he still brags to me. He's like, you know, I'd never retire from the UFC. I remember, like, I remember he was in the a hospital uh i got him out of the i picked him up at the hospital after he had a heart attack and and he was like yeah i think i'm good enough i'm gonna go fight i was like what do you mean you you just had a heart attack bro that's wild yeah that's true no fighters ever truly retired yeah yeah and

yeah you know conerman like he does have a big enough name he could come back in five 10 years and you know do a freak show fight and yeah people will watch and I'll probably fucking watch too, unfortunately, and wish that I didn't. But you, but I think, I think you made a good point. Like, how interested are we really at this? You know what I mean? In the UFC, like, you know, like we talked about before. If you came back and did bare knuckle, that'd be kind of fun, right?

Something fun, different, you know, something like that would be interesting. Or you said, like, coming back 10 years now on like a freak show fight, but like, how much interest do you really have in Connor fighting Chandler in 2026? Because that's when it would be a year from now. Like, and then it's another year. So you'd be like, like, five years removed from the UK. Like, how much interest do we really have at that point? We got to learn to let things go a little bit.

You know, I think we're, we're gild. Not the MMA audience, I'm going to say to us in particular, but like the MMA communities, we're guilty of, like, Lord, we say we want guys to go out on their own terms, but then we don't want to let him go. We're like, oh, come on back for one more fight. Come on back. Like, Connor will probably never use the word retirement, but we should all kind of treat it like that.

Like he's just not there anymore, dude. Like, Connor's been a huge part of the sport, biggest star ever, did some really cool things over the time he was in the UFC but those days are gone we got to move on yeah it's exactly right he built it up yet changed the sport forever and he you know he should be commended for that and i'm glad he's living a good life man yeah don't care to see you fight it was the night before the gathering and all through the house the host rapid cozy cashmere throw from homesense for their spouse kids toys for six ninety nine under the tree and crystal glasses for just 1499 for their Brother Lee, a baking dish made in Portugal for Tom and Sue, and a nice $599 candle, perfectly priced just for you.

Happy holidays to all, and to all a good price. Home Sense, endless presents perfectly priced. I mentioned that Mike Tyson a second ago, Jake Paul, and that's a good segue to someone who wanted to mention to you, because Jake Paul beats Julio Cesar Chavez, Jr., who got arrested and is getting deported right after the file. What the fuck's going on here? So apparently he's... Talk about timing. He cries Jake Paul in three days later.

He's in detention. He's getting deported back to Mexico. But that's not trying to get into that. But Jake Paul wins. He's like 12 and 1 now, whatever. And Julio Seusser Chavez Jr. is not good. He was never good in his prime. He was not great.

I was talking to a real boxing guy. I'm not going to mention the name. Who it is? Somebody really deeply entrenched in boxing. He's like, at his absolute best, Chavez was like, barely decent. Like everyone knew it. Like he got by with his name. He was never like a great boxer.

I think he could have been a great boxer. Potential. I think he had potential. Yeah. I do think he had the potential. But everybody has potential, so it doesn't mean shit. Jake Paul beats him

and now I think I want to make sure it's cool. The WBA has ranked him number 14 at Cruiserweight. Now, Matt, I know a lot of fighters have a love-hate relationship with rankings because I talked to Joshua Van who had an incredible win last two weeks ago against Brandon Roy Val. And we had many conversations and he hated the rankings because he was ranked like number 14 and nothing happened. Nothing happened. And he just gets dropped out of the rankings one week. Like this is going back like this is going back like six months ago or whatever.

But he's like he's like, he's like, what the fuck? Like I didn't fight. Nothing happened. I just got bashed out of the rankings. because somebody just has changed their flip-flop, whatever the number was. And to be clear, I don't vote on the EOC rankings. I thought you meant nothing happened after he beat Royval.

No, no, I'm saying like this is like when he was like number 14 and then nothing happened and he just got bounced from the rankings. He's like more or less was like, fuck the rankings. Now he's number one and he's just like, I'm not worried about the rankings, man. When I get that C next to my name, that's all I care about. And that's probably the mentality he should have. He went from number 14 to number one. Yeah, he's number one.

I think he was number 11 when he actually because he got bumped up for, yeah, he got bumped up from the Bruno Silva fight and he got now he's number one. Matt, you were, you were ranked. You were very close to a title shot. You know, obviously when you had the five, Robbie Lawler, so you were ranked. I think rankings do matter to a certain extent. I think it helps with marketing.

I think it helps with, you know, when you're saying like, hey, man, I deserve a shot at this guy. I deserve a shot at this guy. I'm number five. I should be fighting the number four. There's arguments to be made for rankings. But Jake Paul, I'm not going to sit there and say cruiserweight's a great division. Cruiserweight is not

a great division in boxing, okay? It's not. But let's just say, let's compare it to, let's say, light heavyweight in the UFC. Light heavyweight is not great right now in the UFC. It's just not a good, nor heavyweight. Let's just say heavyweight. Let's go to heavyweight. Heavyweight's not good right now in the UFC. Like, when you're like 14, 15, they're just like kind of filling spots. But what does it say that Jake Paul, without any wins? No wins over

legit current boxing competition. Nobody. And I'm not, don't tell me who this. I don't care what his record was. He's 39. He's not a cruise weight. That's not a,

quality win. What does it say when that guy gets the number? And we know what it is. It's all promotion. I know that's what it is. But what does it say? Do we have to, like, does WBA lose some legitimacy for ranking this guy when we know it's not out of merit?

We know he didn't earn that ranking. Yeah, you know, I think there is like partially, you know, partially there, there is some, what's the word I'm looking for? So a little piece is the fact that like Cruiserweight sucks. That is a fact, right? Cruiserweight's been one of the weakest divisions in boxing for years. Yeah. So I think that does actually play a role in it. Another piece, too, though, you know, to stick up for Jake Paul a little bit in the WBA,

I mean, I'd have to look at the boxers next to them there, you know, at 15, 16, 13, or whatever. Jake Paul is following a path of a boxer, right, fighting lesser competition, increasingly more challenging, but you always know you're going to win, right? Like you're facing different challenges, but not loseable challenges. Like this is a standard boxing way. So I bet anything. Again, I don't even know the Cruiserweight Division. I don't even know who's champion right now.

As a matter of fact, and I follow boxing fairly close. I think one of them, one, there's two. I think there's two, WBC and WBA have Cruiserweight champions. WBC is Badi Jack. And I think the guy, Gilberto, whatever the guy who fought on the under, he was the co-made event to Jake's card. He's the other cruise relationship.

Go-Gerto, I can't know what his last name is. But they're the two-cha-old. Yeah, but that's a good one. But with that said, you know, without doing any research, I bet you could go through those 13, 14, 15 guys or whatever. And their records are probably comparable to Jakes. You know, those top, you know, 10 to 20 guys,

those guys ranked in 10 to 20 like what is he 9 and 0 now Jake? He's like 12 and 1 12 and 1 12 and 1 I think it's 12 1 1 yeah Like I bet he's very comparable Now the other guys that That that those 10 to 20

Ranked you know Number 10 to number 20 guys fought We're probably actual boxers But you know It's like then how do you define actual boxer Because a lot of times those guys are Yeah you know they boxed but they're boxed to get beat too.

You know what I mean? They're not athletes sometimes. Like they're not professional, sometimes, all kinds of different things. So I think before we would get too harsh and critical about that, I think we would need to dig deeper and look in and say, okay, is this ranking valid? Is the cruiserweight division that horrid?

You know, because look, Jake's not a bad boxer. You know, whether he's a top 20, guy I don't know but he's not a terrible boxer um you just you don't we don't know I don't know what the competition is next to him though yeah I know I know I saw an interview I think I saw an interview on TMZ with the number 15 guy and he was pretty pissed like Jake got in front of it when he's like you know building his career and he's like got a legit you know whatever record I don't know what his record is but like here's my my biggest problem is this is because to me it just it it reeks of a PR stunt right like I'm not

I'm not saying that Jake is it, like I understand what you're saying because you've made this defense of Jake numerous times. And you're absolutely right. I backed you up on this when you say that Jake's like Jake just has a bigger name. So when he fights, it matters more. But fighting Anderson-Silva fighting Nate Diaz, that's really no different than the guys that Canello fought at 12 and 0 or 11-0. And they were just weren't names and they were just bums. Like that happens. Like that happens.

Like guys build their career to like 20 and 0 before they actually fight like real competition. That absolutely happens in boxing. It's way different than MMA. You don't get that luxury in MMA. So I agree with you on that. And I do. But here's, like, when this happens, like, like, there's so many things that you can rank him for. You can talk about rankings.

And I think part of it is cruiserweight is dreadful. I think that's part of it. They're just like, cruiserweight sucks, though. Let's just throw in a guy who's got a name. But then, like, I think my problem is, is they're ranking him after beating Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. And I'm just like, I don't know. that's really the one you want to hang your hat on guys. Like, here's my question.

Here's my question. If Jake Paul is one of the 15 best cruiser weights in the sport right now, why aren't you ranking Tommy Fury? Yeah. Tommy's got a win over Jake. And he won since then against some random dude, but he won. He's undefeited. Why aren't you ranking Tommy?

What way does he fight at? I have no idea. I'm just making the point. Like, if Jake Paul is rankable, why aren't you ranking Tommy Fury? So the guys that dropped out, I'm just looking here at the WBA rankings. Yeah. The guys that got kicked out of the rankings because of Jake. It's got Smith Jr.

I think I've heard of him before. Let me see. Joe Smith Jr. I've heard of him 28 and 5. This other guy, Arslan, 56 and 9. And this guy, Pujalo, 25 and 3. So, yeah, it's not, it doesn't look. It's not a great look.

for Jake Paul here, you know, in the WBA. I can tell you that much. It just, it just screams publicity. And I'm not like, if you're the WBA, we've now mentioned their name. We mentioned their name more in this segment. Do we probably ever spoke in the words WBA before in history of this podcast? Right, right. I mean, I guess there's something to be said.

But, you know, you do get, again, you got to kind of go through the rankings and see these guys' records that these guys are going against. because it's kind of interesting. Like a lot of these records are comparable to Jake's on here. You know, the 13 guys, 12 and 0, right? The 11 guys, 12 and 3. You know what I mean? So at that point, if you, like, just look at the numbers, it's like, okay, well, it's a pretty fair ranking.

We have to look at, you know, who are these guys fighting? Yeah. Is there almost a bit? Here's my question. is there a risk now for Jake? Because if Jake gets a ranking, now he's called out by Baudu Jack. I don't think he's going to fight Baudu Jack.

I don't think they're actually going to make that fight. I bet Badojadu Jack would love that. Oh, I'm sure he would. I'm sure he would love to take that fight. But that's what I'm talking about. When you start talking rankings, like you're no longer. You can't sit here and say, well, I'm going to fight. Because to me, if you're that proud of your ranking,

then you got to fight for that ranking. You've got to fight guys who are going to get you higher in that ranking. You can't fight KSI. and expect that to move you up in the rankings. Yeah, so, hey, it's going to be interesting to see how this plays out, you know. You know, he said he wanted to be a legit boxer. I'm going to argue again, you know, digress a little bit, say, look, he's taking the boxer path. Like, this is a standard path that boxers take.

He's done in a much higher profile way, obviously. We'll see how it plays out for him, right? because at some point, if he, like you're saying, he's ranked now, if he wants to continue to move up, their point comes where he's got to fight somebody, right? It can't be a Julio or Chavez. It can't be, you know, KSI, right? It can't be an inmate fighter.

He has to fight an actual ranked boxer if he wants to keep going up. And then the truth will start coming out, right? Like that's a beautiful thing about combat sports. I mean, he's going to hit his ceiling before. the truth comes out. Yeah, you're 100% right. I mean, the only way I justified it was when I looked at Cruiserwood, I was like, okay, I know I'm not a

boxing, like, expert by any stretch of imagination. My first reaction was, who are these guys? Because I don't know who, I didn't recognize hardly either. I know Badojack, obviously. I do know him very well, but, yeah, I was just, when it comes, like, when it comes to this, and you're right, and you've said this over and over again, and you're absolutely right.

What the path Jake is following is not that different than any boxer, it's true. And I remember going back to look at a Canelo's record. I don't think he fought a fighter with a winning record until he was like 20 and O or something like that. So he's not following, he's not, and so he's not following the unfamiliar path in the sport. I think when it comes to the ranking, though,

I'm just like this reeks of a PR stunt because you beat Chavez Jr. who is like a wash 39-year-old dude who is not a cruiserweight. Like, yes, he's fought at cruiserweight. That dude is not a cruise. Like, that dude was fighting Canello like, what, 154 pounds? Is that what he fights that? Like something like that?

like come on now that dude's not a 200 pounds he's not fight at 205 pounds it's not that he's not yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah like that's not a yeah yeah like that's not a cruiser weight like like like i actually would say a win over like Anderson Silva means more now whatever job is because Anderson actually was a legitly middleweight uh or you know whatever but yeah i just when it happened i'm like i mean i don't really i mean i don't really care i mean ultimately i don't really care about any of this but it's just like to me To me, it just feels dirty. You know, it just feels like, like, it like,

was the fact that, like, I think the, the biggest issue I got here is the fact that he lost Tommy Fury. Like, where's Tommy Fury ranked? Nowhere. That's where he's ranked. Nowhere. Yeah. I mean, it hasn't been very active either as far as I know.

But, yeah, I mean, that, yeah, that's kind of crazy. So, so Tommy should just come rematch him, beat him again, and now he's ranked. Yeah. It's just hilarious. I just it kind of like I can't there was an instance where this kid has happened before where some fighter had some hype in the UFC and I can't remember who it was now they were a legit fighter they weren't Jake Paul like they weren't you know an influencer like they were like a real but like they got kind of popular and like two fights in they got ranked and everyone's like hold on now like you can't what like two fights in and like you remember the backlash when sage Northca blew up and they found out what Sage Northgo was getting paid and they're like The fuck. Like, how's he getting paid this? And I'm making this. And I've been around. And, you know, but remember what you just said?

The truth will come out. I'm not trying to knock Sage North Carolina. I'm not trying to knock him. I like Sage. Stage has always been a super nice guy to me. I'm not trying to knock him. Yeah, great kid, yeah. But the truth came out. He was not a top 10 fighter in the UFC.

Like, he just wasn't. Like, he never got to that level. The truth will come out. So if Jake is like, I'm number 14. Give me Bado Jack. I have an itchy suspicion to Badojack will show where Jake Ball is actually right because body jack's legit

yeah which again like we don't know what's going to happen look look Jake is automatically going to you get a lot of detractors because he's got the mouth he's got the profile all that we don't know what's going to happen man

it's combat sports he doesn't look that bad he doesn't look body jack level I'm not I'm not picking him to fucking beat body jack but hey it's a it's a tough fucking sport bro and we don't know we can't say you know like you can't just discount someone because they're famous and they're talking shit and they're and they're um you know they're they're in a high profile you know you just can't bro like like he has a shot he's a human like everybody you know you got to think Jake is putting in the time and look he's

got the money to have the resources too, you know? Will he pass a drug test, you know? Like, Badu might put that in the contract. You're going to have some Vado testing or some shit, you know, that might be a problem, you know? So, hey, I personally, Jake's got me interested at this point. You know, now that he's got a ranking, now I'm interested. I just, here's my thing is like, I just want to see, because I don't know that we even know what, how good Jake is because he hasn't fought anyone to tell us that.

Like, I'm not saying you have to get beat up to show me how good for. Yeah. But, like, you remember, like, when, like, this is, I know it's a different sport, totally a different level, of course, but, like, there was always that question, like, you know, what happens when you run into stiffer competition? Remember that was Shane Carwin? Shane Carwin was just killing guys, just absolutely mauling guys. And then he had that fight with Brock where he couldn't finish him in the first round.

He just gassed hard in the second round of Brock. And that's happened. That's been the biggest. I think there's been one question about Tom Aspinall. It's like, what happens when he gets in the second, third, fourth round? because we've never seen him get there. We have no idea. He may have the greatest cardio in heavyweight history.

We just have no idea. We've never seen it. Like what happens? John Jones was the same thing. Like what happens when he gets in trouble? We saw an Augustusen fight. When he finally fought Alexander Gustafson, we saw what he's made up because he had to gut his way through a really tough fight

and find a way to win. I don't, like, I haven't seen Jake really get hit. Even the Tommy Fury fight, he didn't get hurt. Like he got you. Right, right. I haven't seen him get hurt since, like, the Tyron Woodley. fight. That was like five years ago when he got hit that one punch with Woodley

in the fight where Woodley caught him in the first right. The one I was at in Cleveland, which was like his first professional fighter, second professional fight. That's like five years ago. We still haven't seen him really get tested since then. Like no one's threatened. He never got hurt fighting Mike Perry. He never got hurt fighting Nate Diaz. Like, I don't know because we haven't seen him

actually get tested. You haven't seen it, bro. I know. So it'd be his time is coming you know everybody wants to talk shit and and hate on him and i you know i've talked my shit and hated on him um he's proved this wrong you know not not with the most difficult test right but he's proved us wrong so far other than time of fury and maybe now we'll get to see so let's fucking go let's see it i i got to say matt brown defending jake paul's ranking was not on my lottery card today i got to admit i didn't think that was going to be on

not totally defending the ranking. Let me be clear on that. Not totally defending it, but again, we have to do the research to defend it. I mean, you make valid points. I mean, you make valid points. The A, cruiserweight is terrible. That is true. Like, that's just not a good division.

Like, they're not putting them ranked alongside like Canello and Terrence Crawford and guys in deeper divisions where, you know, guys are, you know, really, you know, highly ranked. And also, as you said, like, you could probably dig into the record. of the guys ranked around him and they're probably similar and they probably haven't fought anybody either and they probably haven't fought like just because he fought, I mean, you can say like Nate Diaz

is the name and has no boxing record but the guy that the number 12 guy fought who's 0 and 8, you know, just because he has an 08 record in boxing, it doesn't mean anything better. So you make a valid point like when you think about box because I always have to remind myself boxing is not MMA, you know what I mean? I always have to remind myself like boxing works totally different than MMA

in terms of like how you build your career because you don't get that opportunity in MMA. You just don't. Even on the regional scene, if you're fighting LFA, you're fighting in Kage Fury Fury fighting whatever, you're not fighting just 0 and 8 bums. They're not going to do that. They don't do that in MMA. Like, I'm not saying you can't pad your record in MMA, you can, but it's still

harder to do it in MMA and there. And there's a reason why Sean Shelby and Mick Maynard and you know from Joe Silva back to the day, like, they would look at your resume and if you didn't have a good win on those, like, you're not getting into UFC. Like, we're not going to pick you up with like, I don't care if you're 20 and O. Like, you've got to have somebody on your record that matters.

Yeah, you got to be a badass before you get to the UFC to get to the UFC 100%. Yeah, totally different world, man. And it's a, there's pros and cons of both, too. Yeah. So, I don't like people. You make a valid point, though. Yeah, it's a valid point. And, you know, the reason I say is a lot of people hate on boxing model.

Some people hate on the UFC model. And there's pros and cons of both. That's all there is to it. Yeah. No, you're right. I just, when I saw it, I was just like, good Lord, this wreaks publicity stunt. But at the same time, did it work? Well, we're talking about it.

He's doing good. I mean, we're talking about it. I mean, you know, just like you talk about the Connor thing. Like, we're talking about it. Whether you like it or not, we're talking about Jake getting ranked got us to, because I, I tell you way. And we keep thinking like, you know, who's he going to fight now? He's got to fight somebody. And he keeps finding another guy that's like the perfect guy for him to fight, you know.

he's doing a great job publicity wise and making money wise and all that shit you know and building his career so I say good for him again what's the ceiling I don't just don't know what the ceiling is you know yeah it's funny you said that about Jake it's it's funny you say that because it's like I do we didn't talk anything about his fight because A I didn't care and B the fight was terrible from everything I hear like everyone's like it was just not a good fight but in the aftermath that him getting ranked actually got us to talk about him because I didn't really I didn't expect him to beat the hell out of Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. Like Anderson Silva beat him like four years ago and he beat Anderson. I knew Jake was good. There was a foregone conclusion Jake was

going to win that fight in my mind. Like that was Jake would have to slip on a banana pill and smack his head on the way to the ring for me to think he was going to lose to Chavez Jr. So I didn't think that at all. But him winning and now getting ranked I actually have something to talk about because I certainly didn't have anything to talk about with the fight. Yeah, that's true too. I don't know to me it's a little bit interesting to see what his ceiling is right I don't think it's championship level but you know again cruiserweight's not like the toughest division out there

yeah I mean there's like one of there's like 10 sanctioning bodies he could get like I don't know if I bF I'm making up letters now I don't know if that's a real thing there's IBF WBA WBO yeah yeah there's some there's some letter combination that could justify putting him at a title fight in that division. I think, it was funny because when Jake first started fighting, we thought he was going to be around middleweight

because he was fighting a lot of middleweight. It seemed like he's continued to pack on pounds and now he's like a bigger guy and he's like, I think I found my wheelhouse in like the weakest division in boxing. Because cruiserweight is bad, man. I don't think cruiserweight. Has cruiserweight ever been good? Has there ever been like a really good cruiserweight?

Like all the best cruiser weights moved up to heavyweight, right? In Vander Holyfield, like Roy Jones. He went through cruiserweight a little bit. Wasn't Usik a cruiserweight? Ucic was cruiserweight? Yeah, that was what I said. Like the best ones that I know of moved up to heavyweight. Yeah.

And I know Jake, like, and the one, I know Jake talked about Bodoo, Jack. He also talked about Anthony Joshua. Do not fight Anthony Joshua. That will not, that probably will not end well for you. I don't think. I don't see that ending well for him. That's, yeah, that's a. Like, you know, it's funny.

I understood. Like, remember when they ranked Francis after the Tyson Fury fight? They put him at like number 15 by one, like, WBC. I was like, even though he's 0 and 1, I kind of got that because he took Tyson to like a close split decision. Like that was a really close fight and he knocked him down. He got a knockdown on at that time the best heavyweight in the world. Even not at 0 and 1, I was like, I kind of see it because like, you know, Francis did take the heavyweight champion to a split decision or whatever. So that one I actually understood a little bit.

But this one I was just like, oh man, like come on now. Like we know. Yeah. But you're right. So I had to Google that because I was like, man, what cruiser weights were there? So I looked up, you know, best cruiser weights ever, right? Yeah, we just named two of them, Ussick and Holyfield. And then when you go down the list, it's not that great, bro.

James Tony, that was a great one, but he did his best work. I think in middleweight, you know, did a couple heavyweight fights. There was another good one that I couldn't remember. Well, that was all my understanding of cruiserweight was always like, if you were a good cruiserweight, you became a heavyweight. Like that was just always the transition. Like most cruiser weights would just move up to heavyweight. They wouldn't stick around there.

It's different than like light heavyweight and heavyweight in the UFC. Like you would just move to heavyweight if you're a cruiserweight. Because so many cruiser weights or so many lighter guys have done well at heavyweight. They look at Vanderholyfield. He was never the biggest guy. He was an incredible heavyweight boxer. But Mike Tyson wasn't one of the biggest guys. He's short and, you know, stocky and huge power.

But he was never like this massive like six foot eight dude or anything, you know? Yeah. David Hay. Okay. I know that. Spinks. I thought he was a cruiserweight. but I'm not seeing him on here.

A Holyfield and Hussig, the best, two best, you know? Yeah, and we don't think of them at all at Cruiserweight. We think of a heavyweight. Like, we don't think of it. Exactly, exactly. We don't think of it. Like, if you might mention if Vandor, Holyfield, do you, you'd be like heavyweight champ. Usick, greatest heavyweight right now.

Like, we would not even mention cruiserweight. Right. Now, how much are you going to lose your mind if Jake goes on, be a cruiserweight champion, and then moves up to heavyweight and becomes champion? Dude, good for him. I hope he does it. he does. Like, I don't wish him. I don't wish, I don't wish, I don't wish him bad. I hope he does great. I just, it bugs me. I don't wish him bad, but how wild would that be?

Oh, dude, it would be insane. But you know what? I don't discount anything from happening because I've seen wilder shit. Like, boxing in particular, I'm not trying to knock boxing, but boxing, like you, I'm not saying you can skate by being an unskilled guy. Like, you put him in there with Alexander Usik right now. He's getting murdered. Like, he is absolutely getting murdered. Right, right. You know, but, uh, but, um, but, um, but, um, but, but, um, but, You can, you can, like you talk about, you know, padding the record fighting guys who probably don't, you know, aren't really good, blah, blah, blah, you can do that. And it just, you don't get to do that in MMA. Like, you just don't.

And there's so many skills in MMA where, like, you know, you can be the best striker. We've seen it a million times ever, best kickboxers in the world. I always remember when, when Gokon Saki came over, greatest striker, that guy's a nasty striker. And he got knocked a knock cold by Glow Round Tree. You know what I mean? Now I'm not saying Cluickl is a very good striker in his own right. but when you start having to prepare for, when you started to prepare for takedowns and grappling and knees and elbows,

things, all these different things. The different world, man. Yeah. So, yeah, you know, boxing man not exposed this quick. So maybe he will. You know what? I hope he does.

I don't care. Like, if he does it, good for him. Like, that's all I said, good for him. You know, but right now I'm just not in my head. I can't wrap my head around saying Jake is one of the 15 best boxers in the world. Even though I know cruiser way is bad. It's just hard for me to wrap my head around that. It just blows your fucking mind on it.

It does. It does. All right. That's our show. Oh, man. We got a lot of stuff there. John Jones and Connor. Jake Paul.

Like the trifect of this week. Next week, Matt, we're going to be doing our UFC 318 preview. You're going to be going down to a retreat you're going to in Costa Rica. So you're going to miss the post-UFC 318 show. But we'll do the pre-318 show next week to preview the show. Obviously, we're going to talk about Destipor-Porier's retirement fight. That's kind of taking center stage. you know, Danny, he's fighting Patricio Pitbull.

That's a really fun fight. Brinandine Allen and Marvin Vittoria fight, and there's a lot of bad blood there. But everyone's going to be talking about Max and Dustin, fighting for the third time and Dustin's final fights. We'll talk about some of our favorite Dustin moments and get ready and preview that card next week and go into New Orleans. Have you been everywhere?

I've assumed you've been to New Orleans. I've never been to New Orleans. You never been to New Orleans? No. I'd love to go. Great town, man. I love that city. I've heard.

I've heard. I've heard. I've been a couple times. sometime. It's amazing. I've been there twice. It is so much fun. It was a great city. I would love to check it out someday, so anybody in New Orleans with a seminar ready

to bring me down? Let's go. Bring it on. Matt, where can people check you out? They want to support you what you got going on. I'm the Immortal, Instagram, Twitter, the Immortal My Brown on Facebook. And as always, we appreciate everyone tuning in the show. Make sure you check us out on all your favorite podcast platforms,

Apple Podcast, Spotify. And of course, over the best website in the world, MMA fighting, for Matt Brown. I am Damon Martin. We'll see you next week for another edition of the Fighter versus the Rider. Thanks for tuning in. We'll see you then. We're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network.