MMA Fighting - Fighter vs. Writer: Matt Brown Unloads on UFC for Denying Arman Tsarukyan His Title Shot, UFC 324 Main Event Predictions

Episode Date: January 20, 2026

In the latest episode of The Fighter vs. The Writer, UFC legend Matt Brown and Damon Martin look ahead to UFC 324, Kayla Harrison’s injury and if Amanda Nunes should consider taking another fight while the champion is sidelined. Plus we’ll discuss Justin Gaethje vs. Paddy Pimblett and how much this fight really matters to the lightweight division and Arman Tsarukyan being stuck on the outside looking in despite being the clear cut No. 1 contender. We’ll also discuss Dana White saying he’s no longer interested in Conor McGregor vs. Michael Chandler and much more. Subscribe to MMA Fighting Check out our full video catalog Like MMA Fighting on Facebook Follow on Twitter Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. Welcome back to the fighter versus the writer. I am Damon Martin. He is UFC legend Matt Brown and Matt. After a long, long wait, six weeks away, we are finally back to UFC action, UFC 324, now just days away. We always talk about how it's kind of hard to get hype for shows because there's so many. How can you not be hype for this one after six weeks away?

Yeah, I mean, it's a pretty good car too, right? So, I mean, funny enough to me, like I'm not the most excited about the main event, right? Like, usually that's the fight that you're the most excited about, or that's the whole idea of it, but there's other fights on this car I like better. Let me ask, let's just start with this kind of the obviously thing that happened before, obviously, which is losing

Kayla Harrison and Amanda Nunes, which to me that was my favorite fight on the car just because it was just so much, you know, magnitude, so much, you know, history with Amanda. Come back from retirement, she's the goat, take it on Kayla, who I think has the potential to be the goat. Kala gets hurt, neck injury, has surgery, probably going to be at least

six months. Kind of a two-part question. Matt, what was your reaction? And did the UFC make the right call, like, not rebooking Amanda or, you know, waiting on this fight to happen? And we assume six months down the road. We really don't know yet. Yeah, you know, the base thing sucks for Kavah's, you know, the neck isn't something that just goes away in six months, right? Like, she gets a surgery. The neck surgery is not a thing to take lightly, obviously, but, you know, it's not one of those things that you heal from really ever for the most.

I don't know exactly what the injury was, but, you know, that's, it's pretty well known. Like, back and neck, like, you don't, you try to avoid the surgery, right? Because that's a major, major issue. And it's usually an issue for the rest of your life, like, no matter what you're doing. But particularly if you're trying to compete in the toughest combat sport in the world, right? Yeah. You know, yeah, but in terms of Amanda Nunes, I mean, you know, was it her or was it the UFC that made that decision? because if I'm glad.

I was going to say, I'm pretty sure it's the UFC, because I saw Amanda post on Instagram, like she was still in the gym, still training, and I think she's still going to Vegas just for, like, fight week, just like, I'm sure meet fans and you do like meeting greets and stuff, whatever, but yeah, I'm pretty sure it's the UFC's calling. I'll just, my two cents, like, I think they made the right call because what are you going to do? Like, I like Norman Dumont. I think Norman Dumont's a fine fighter, but like, or Giuliana Pena, but, like,

what are you really getting out of that? You're risking the biggest fight you could possibly have, and there is a chance that's a fight, It could go the other way, and Amanda that comes back rusty, doesn't look good. And then you just missed out on that. And if Giuliana Payne is the person, well, Kayla just destroyed her within two rounds. What are you going to get by having her go out there? Let's say she beats Amanda. Now you've got a rematch that nobody wants to see.

Or Norma Dumont pulls off like a split decision. Then you've got to fight that no one's going to be interested in the sea. So it sucks, the six-month thing or however long it's going to end up being. But you can't, this is too big. This isn't Steve A and John. No one was screaming for Steepa and John, even though John was like, oh, wait a year. No one was screaming for that one. This is like the one fight that actually works in this division.

Yeah, and here's where I'll somewhat disagree on that. So on the UFC side, yeah, if they're in control of everything, which they are, if they're the ones of control, yeah, they're like, yeah, Amanda, wait, like we need a big fight when you come back. We don't want you to get a tune-up, whatever. On Amanda's side, that's why I asked who made this decision, because on Amanda's side, it makes the most sense to come back and get a tune-up fight first, right? Like go against a Juliana or Norma Dumas and, you know, see where your skills are at. See where you're lacking.

See, you know, knock some of that rust off. And, you know, I'm not in one of those, you know, ring rust type guys either. You know, I think it's, I'm not going to call it a myth, but there's something to, especially when you retired and then you want to come back. So I think, you know, if she has any say in it, which a lot of times you don't because it's UFC, but if she has any sense, she should be working to come back, you know, on this card, which obviously she's not going to, but, you know, she needs a fight, you know, a tune-up fight would be ideal.

Like you're coming back in your first fight in what has it been two years? Three years, three years. Three years. Yeah, first fight in three years is going to be fucking Kayla Harrison. You know, that's dangerous enough. It's dangerous enough to fight Kayla when you're on a hot win streak in your prime. nonetheless a retired fighter coming back after three years. If I'm Amanda, I might try to push the UFC and say, hey, like, let me fight March.

Maybe they just didn't want her fight a new opponent on 10 days notice, you know what I mean? Because she's coming back from her two and a half a year layoff or whatever it is. Because I think June, June is technically three years, but it's coming up on it already. Of course, the UFC doesn't want her to fight, right, because of all the things you mentioned, right? Like there's the risk and, you know, it doesn't do a bunch for them. And again, like Norman Dumont wins. now there's a fight nobody wants to see. I mean, there's a lot of issues there.

So I get it from their side. And I think, like, it would be different if it was like Kayla was going to be out for a month. You know what I mean? Like she pulled a hamstring and she's just going to be out a month and, like, she just needs to recover. We're talking six months. And like you said, for my understanding, she had multiple herniated discs and that's what the next surgery was for. And as you said, like, that's not something you generally bounce back from, like immediately. Six months is the estimate.

That's the estimate. That's the estimate, six months. Like, who knows? Maybe it's going to be nine months. could be a year. And if you're Amanda Nunes, you've already been out for three years. Do you want to set up for four years? Like, so I understand not booking her on this card just because of the risk and like, you know, asking her and fight a new opponent on 10 days notice or whatever. And maybe you just only get a good fight out of it. But March, you got, you know, you got the Max Holloway

Charles Olivaire card. It's not like the stacked card, not this mega stack card. Find an opponent and put her on that card because, um, that's fair. Yeah. Because we're not dealing with, like, and that's like, I think they made the right call right now. But the problem is, with the injury that Kayla had in the surgery, you're looking at a, I mean, we're probably looking at July, August, probably at that point. I don't think they're going to put her on the White House card. They don't want to risk that for, you know, that's not in six months, it's barely six months from now. So it's like July, August, like, you know what I mean? Like, do you really want to wait that long if you're Amanda Nunes?

You've already been out for three years? At best, yeah. I mean, I have her any days in my back, and I've dealt with it my whole career and played a role in my retirement. And I, you said, so I can imagine what it is in the next. Like I said, it doesn't go away. It's something you have to change your training for the rest of your life. And, I mean, it affected me in many big ways throughout my career. And so for Kayla Harrison, there's a possibility.

I'm not going to go out on any limbs or anything, but there's a possibility she's never the same again from this, too. Yeah. You know, like that's a legit possibility. She doesn't get to train the same. She doesn't, you know, her strength. isn't the same. Neck is a

gigantic, important part of the body, right? So, you know, with that said, yeah, you know, I think you made the right call there,

right? Maybe Amanda and the UFC came together. So, okay, let's book something in a couple of months, right? Like, you know, coming back after three years

and you're going to give me a 10-day switch of opponent or whatever it was. Yeah, that's not really so fair to Amanda, either, to be fair. So,

yeah, That might be in how it played out. And I remember not to rehash history or anything, but I remember I think it was the Carlos Condefiite when it was scheduled when you hurt your back. I remember that when that happened. That was when my originally herniated at first. So I do remember that, because I remember talking to you about that.

And then, like, years later, like, you had back problems forever. Like, it never totally went away. I still have back problems. Like, I mean, I just had to get a Corazon shop two weeks ago because I hurt my back just training. You know, I think I was rolling with like some, like, white belt, you know, teenagers. You know, I mean, just like showing them some jih Tjitsu and stuff. And, bam, you know, flares up.

And, you know, I'm out for a week if I don't, you know, I wouldn't got a cortisone shot after one day. But, you know, you're going to be out for if you try to go without a cortisone shot. Again, back and neck may be different. So I'm not, I'm not say maybe some differences. But, you know, if I didn't do a cortisone shot, I'm out for, you know, a month, easy, six weeks, six to eight weeks. And then those cortisone shots, I mean, I've had 20, 25 of them in my life in the back.

And those things just tear your body to pieces. They're not good for you at all. And we got to remember, Kayla's 35. She's not like 22. Like I'm not saying it gets better, but like it or not, the younger you are, the more apt your body is to bounce back from injury and things like that. Like, the way you could go to the reason. And there's pros and cons to that, right?

Because, you know, the amount of hard training that she has put in, you know, she doesn't necessarily need to be doing that now exactly the same too, right? So, you know, if this happened when she's 20, it's like now you miss those years of the crazy hard training, right? Usually when you're older, like you kind of do smarter training versus the harder training when you're younger. So there's kind of pros and cons to it. Yeah, but it is, like I said, it's unfortunate, and I know, I don't know if you saw her message. Like, she was obviously torn up about it. She was crying.

I get it. It sucks, you know, and I mean, like I said, but the reality is you can't go into a fight like that, that compromise if she's really hurt. Like, I remember, I remember talking to you with that con to fight. I can't remember. I don't think we did an interview. I know I talked to you on the phone. And I remember you being like, yeah, man, my back's messed up. I had to drop out.

I was like, you're dropping out of a fight? Like, I feel like you'd be the guy to carry your broken leg to the octagon fight. So you know it's bad, I guess what I'm getting at. You know it's hurt. She had to have surgery. Clearly it's bad. So like you can tell she was brokenhearted because this is what she's wanted, you know, for years. This is a fight she's wanted since you got to the U.S.C.

Which is interesting. I know I know a great deal about hernia discs in the back. And I don't know what the differences are in the neck. But they wouldn't, I can't imagine a situation where they would do a surgery on hernia discs in the back straight away. So that, you know, I wonder how accurate that injury is. or, you know, like, where was the source from? Was it her just saying that? It was her saying, yeah, hernia discs in the neck.

Now, I do know. I remember Chris Wyman had that surgery and Algeman and Sterling had that surgery, too. They both had that similar. Well, the surgery that they had is one I'm probably going to be getting sued in my neck. Also, and they wouldn't normally do it off acute injury. As far as I know, I could be wrong on some of this. Don't quote me on this. But, okay, so just to explain to everyone,

sort of like what a herniated disc is. You know, you have a disc, they say, you know, say it's like a donut, right? And, or the, and then, you know, with cream inside of it, right? And then they squeeze it and then the cream comes out. That's the herniation. But the cream would still be touching the donut, not like falling over, right? And it, you know, and it pushes, it kind of balloons out the back, right? That's a herniation.

And it starts hitting on the nerves. So what they'll do, you know, I know a few people that have had this surgery, Mark Coleman, my friend, Mickey Gall, guys, you mentioned. You know, what they'll do is if it's a chronic thing, they'll go in and actually shave that part off, the herniation. They'll just shave it off. But generally, they're going to try to remedy it by natural ways first. Right.

So I find it very interesting that she would have a herniation. You know, and this, I'm not an expert talking either, right? So, you know, I'm a, I know a lot about the lower back. The neck is a little different. But, you know, I find it odd that they would want to do a surgery on a herniation, you know, a few days or less than a week or whatever after the acute part of the injury. Generally, all that stuff is reserved, at least in the lower back, for more chronic things. Yeah, I know her manager, Ali Abdel-Az, put out a little thing,

basically saying these are issues she's had for like four or five years. and it finally got to the point where she just couldn't like it just you couldn't be ignored any further is what he said online so um that that's what he said that makes more sense right it's something that's recurring and like do we just we just got to get this take care of it's probably a surgery she's been putting off and she's like oh now i'm out of a title fight for it you know against a legend you know biggest fight of my life okay let's get this shit done and i remember but if it but also if it is that surgery I forget the term for it, but it's, again, where they scrape, you know, they'll just cut off the piece that's bulging out, right? I remember Coleman saying, like, it was like a two-week recovery. Same with Mickey. I mean, it's a very, very short recovery. You know, it's mainly the incision is what needs to recover more than the actual surgical part, right? Because they're just removing something, right?

So maybe she's doing a different surgery. Again, I don't want to overstep my lane here. You know, I know what I know. Not a doctor, but I'm finding out, you know, hearing all this info from me, you know, I find it very interesting because it's not adding up in my head. Again, but I don't have an expert head either. Well, I remember when Algeman had his surgery and he had told me, I remember, because I remember talking to an interview him right around that time, and he had said, like,

it's a problem that he persisted with him. He was having like numbness in his arm and things. Like he just finally got to the point where he couldn't ignore it. And he was out for a while with that. And it was the same surgery that Chris Wyman had. And I remember talking to Chris. And I care who I didn't talk to Alan Joban, if I remember correctly, Alan had that surgery. And Alan's like, you're never the same.

He's like, I was never the same after having that surgery. He's like, I'm not saying you can't be great and you can't do great things. But he's like, I was never quite the same coming out of that surgery. Because I remember, I think I may have gotten algebraing connection with Alan because, like, Alan's like, I went to the same surgery. So I'm, but again, these are all speculation. I don't know the exact surgery she went through. But I do know when Al Jermaine had it. It was building, building, building,

and it got to get to the point where he's like, I got to have this surgery. And he was out for several months, too. And I think that's, if you remember, I think that's what delayed when they did that Peter Jan, Corey Sanhagen interim title fight. And then, you know, Al Jermaine came back and fought Peter Yon.

I remember correctly the timeline I'm thinking here. I think that's what happened. It's like it just got to the point where he couldn't ignore it anymore. Yeah, that's interesting because, like I said, Coleman had that surgery. I know Kurt Engel had that surgery during the training camp for the Olympics and like still went to the Olympics and won.

You know, so it's interesting because we're hearing like very different things for people who've experienced. They may be different things that the people experience too. You know, neither one of us are experts in this field. But, you know, it's pretty interesting stuff. And I'd be interested to hear just the, all the details of it and how she recovers. But, you know, ultimately, I think what we're getting at is right, you may never be the same after this. And she's 35, had a long, hard career, right, between judo and combat sports.

This is not a good thing. And, you know, from outside looking in, right? This is not a, I don't like this, right? But for her. But, you know, but she's an amazing athlete, too. I mean, she might come back and it's like it never even happened. Yeah, we'll see. But, yeah, it's unfortunate because, like I said, I think this was my favorite fight on the card. Certainly not knocking the other fights with the card. There was just so much attached, like, history to this fight. A man to come back in retirement. She's the goat, Kayla, you know, but it is what it is. And now you mentioned, so let's

talk about it. The main event, of course, the interim title between Justin Gaci and Patty Pimblit. We know the winner supposedly is going to fight Ilya Teporia. Ilya is now saying between April and June, he's starting to make the I think, I know you got some shit for like your bold prediction last week, but here's where I think you are a thousand percent

correct. Ilya's now going on Twitter saying, oh no, he's showing workout videos. He's like, I'll be back between April and June. He's hearing the footsteps. Patty talking about fighting Armin and Justin talking about this. He's hearing the footsteps. Like, now he's not being forgotten, but like people are kind of thinking about what if you're not around. And he's already like, I'm going to be back. Don't worry, April to June. To your point, I'm not saying he's coming back too soon. Maybe he'll be in the perfect headspace. It'll be ready to go April to June. But the fact that he said that made me ring true to what you said,

because if you got, like, he's getting in said, like, I got to come back. I got to reestablish myself. I've got to remind the world. I'm just saying you're right and thinking that could be a bad move. We don't know. We don't know it's going to be a bad move. But when he did that, when he did that, I thought about your comment because he's already getting that itch of like, I don't want to be gone too long. And I probably, you know how the internet is. Like every, you know, if they can dog you, they're going to, right?

But man, I'm probably taking more shit for that comment than any other comment I ever remember making. And I get a lot of shit for my comments. I mean, it's a fucking cesspool of shitbags out there, right? But, you know, I actually, I don't know if you've seen it on Twitter, I somewhat redacted that. I was like, man, I said, this wasn't my best take. And I kind of tried to explain it. Like, look, we were doing a prediction show. I just came up with a prediction.

You know what I mean? But it's very interesting that it must have been only the day after that when Ilya said what he said, right? And I was like, I wonder if I had any bearing on, right? If he was just like, like, nah, fuck this, I'm coming back. But as soon as he said that, I was like, man, maybe I shouldn't have redacted what I said. Right? Because he's like, you said it the best, man. He heard the footsteps.

And he's seen, you know, people like I said, people talk with shit about him. And he's starting to feel forgotten. and, you know, and like, again, again, you said it right, maybe it won't have any bearing on them at all. But that might be the biggest prediction, like the best Mystic Mac prediction of fucking MMA fighting.com history. I agree. And when he said that, that was my first thing. I was like, oh, man, like, that's exactly what you said. Don't, don't come back when you're not in the right headspace. When he's like, oh, no, I'll be back April to June. I'm like, hmm, I don't know.

I don't know. When he said that, I was like, well, maybe you want to call bad prediction right now, but let's talk again in about six, eight months and see where you're at there. Yeah. Look, whatever, and to all the internet dweeps out there, whatever he wants to say, if he comes back in April of June, you can at least say I was 50% right on the prediction. Because my first part of the prediction was he's coming back.

The second part is that he loses. Yeah. But my first part of the prediction was he comes back. So I get at least 50% credit there. I agree. I agree. But let me ask you Matt, because this fight with Justin and Patty is it, I think it's a good fight. It's not the most deserving fight.

We know that. It should be Armin in here. I'm not going to rehash what we said before. It should be Armin Saruka in here. We all know that, but it's not. This is a fight we're getting. Now, one thing you brought up to me, and I think this was around Anthony Smith's final fight, and you were very smart in that.

Now, I've had it in the back of my head ever since. When you told me the reason why you don't like when guys announced retirement fights before it happens because it kind of feels like you already got one foot out the door. And since you've said that, I think a couple other people announced that and they've lost. Like they've not gone in, like, Justin Porier. He went in and lost to Max Holloway.

And I had that concern going into that fight. And sure enough, Max, you know, I mean, obviously it doesn't have his moments, but he lost. Justin Gaichie has pretty openly said, like he knows he's coming to the tail end of his career. And it's almost been unanimously thought that if he loses at UFC 324, that's probably yet. Like he knows he's not going to get a title shot.

He's 37. So he's not calling this his retirement fight, but he's kind of putting the expectation that if he doesn't win, this is probably the last time we're going to see him. Does that change anything in that demeanor when you have that? Like he's not saying retirement yet, but I mean, his coach said, if we don't get it here, he's probably done. And so he's not going out on a, you know, he's not going to blaze the glory and said, I'm done either way. He's just saying if I lose, I'm done. But that still feels similar, doesn't it? Yeah.

Just the fact that he even said if, right? When you're getting ready for a fight, you don't say if I lose. You say when I win, you know what I mean? So the fact that that's even in his head, I mean, the crazy thing about this fight, this is the perfect time for Patty to strike when, you know, I mean, he's getting the right guy at the right time. I mean, it couldn't have been set up better for him. I'm not sure who's going to win.

I'm kind of 50-50 on this fight. But Patty is coming at the right place at the right place. right time against the right opponent. And if Justin isn't on point, you know, batty might take him out, right? But that's kind of where my head goes first with all that. Is it, you know, Justin doesn't even be saying all this if shit. Like, you should be, and that makes me feel really a lot less confident in Justin.

Because in their prime, in Justin's prime, like, I think I would have picked Justin to win his fight probably pretty easily. You know, maybe not easily. right, because we just don't really know where Patty's at, right? We don't know his level. You know, beating Michael Chandler doesn't tell me your level. That means you can beat Michael Chandler, right? We haven't seen him against the top 10 guy yet,

so we don't know his level, and he's going, and we don't know where Justin, where his head is, you know, like you said, in terms of retiring or, and he's been around for a long time, a lot of really tough fights. I don't know what kind of damage his body's been, have been through. So there's so many ifs in this fight,

that's why I'm kind of 50-50 on it. But I don't like where Justin's talking like that, and his head coach is talking like that. And here's the thing. I do think Patty is good, but you're right. We don't know his ceiling yet. We don't really know his floor yet. Like, we just don't know.

He hasn't fought anybody. Like, Michael Chandler's not a 15, top 15 fighter anymore. He's just not. Like it or not, he's not. And beating him dominarily. Was he ever a top 15 fighter either is the other question. I mean, who did you be? I think he was at a time, but, like, it's been a while.

He beat Dan Hooker? Who else did he be? Tony Ferguson when he knocked him out. Are those two wins, do you consider beating those two guys putting you in the top 15? I think Dan Hooker matters, because I still think Dan Hooker is a top 15 level guy, but not Tony Ferguson that point of screen. Since that fight, Dan Hooker's been a top 15 guy before that fight? I'll say this.

I think there was a time, I think there's a time for sure when Chandler was in his peak and he wasn't in the UFC when he was in Bellatory. He's beating Eddie Alvarez and those kind of fights. Like I think those. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, by the time he got to the UFC, he was already kind of tail end. And to give a comparison to Justin Gachie, you know a lot of the ways I pick fights on this show. With pick fights, I say, who has more ways to win? Like, that's one of my favorite ways to pick a fight because if you become one dimensional, you can become predictable. Justin Gachie, I'm not going to say he's predictable, but like he does one thing. He strikes. He strikes. He. He, he moves forward, he leg kicks, he throws him punches, he looks to knock you out. Now, he's gotten a lot better in terms of not just putting himself in harm's way for the sake of landing those punches. I think he's gotten better defensively, but I wonder, like, what could he do if he actually tried to wrestle Patty and just throw him off a little bit? Like, take him down, like, oh shit, we didn't expect to take down. Problem is, we know Justin so well. I just don't see him doing that. Like, maybe he'll surprise the whole world and do it, but I don't think it happens.

And Patty, like, I know Patty's talked about striking with Justin. I know. He said a lot of things. A lot of guys say a lot of things going into a fight. Patty is a legit grappler. Like, he's actually really good on the ground and a legit grappler. And say what you want about Michael Chandler. Like, Michael Chandler is a solid enough wrestler where you think he wouldn't just get taken down and mauled on the ground.

And Patty mauled him on the ground. Like, he absolutely mauled him on the ground. Like, in a way that even Charles Olivaire didn't do it one fight before. Like, Charles couldn't put Chandler away. And Patty just absolutely mauled him on the ground and finished him. So, like, my head says it's Patty who wins because he's just on a streak. he's got the momentum building and I think he's younger. I think that matters.

He's like 29, whatever. Like, he is younger. He's a massive lightweight. He's a huge lightweight. And I don't know, man. Like, Justin, like, I don't love the whole, like, you know, I know, like, it's do or die. One fight, win or lose. You know, when I go on, lose, I stop.

I don't love that mentality going in any fight. So, yeah, like, I favor Pat in this fight. Now, will I be shocked if Justin Gachie wins? Absolutely not. He's got that kind of nasty knockout power and that kind of style. It's like a human car crash. If he can draw Patty into that kind of fight, it could be a long or a very short night for Patty Pimbleau. But I just, I just, there's something about the momentum of this fight and the way I'm seeing it.

I'm like, it almost feels like the UFC made this fight as like an anointing of Patty Pimble. Like now we can, like, Ilya's out of the picture because of his divorce and everything. That's fine. We put him in there with Armin. He probably loses dominantly to Armin. Like, Armand, I think the only guy's got a real good shot of beating Armin right now besides Islam is Ilya. That's it, in my opinion. I think Armin, and I think right now if you force me to pick, I'd probably pick Armin to beat Armin to beat Armin to beat him

the hype. It's going to kill Patty. But if Patty can go out and beat Justin Gachey and do it like he did Michael Chandler, take him down, maul him in the ground and finish him on the ground, then you can say, well, he beat a top five guy, which he is. Justin Gaji's still that guy. Then you can justify and put him in there with Ilya. And then you can say, well, Armand's still kind of in the doghouse. We're going to set him aside. You can't deny Patty.

He's the interim champion. He's going to get the – he's got to unify the titles. I think that's the way it's going here. I think they know that this is a winnable fight for Patty versus an Armin fight, which is not very winnable. And then you can do the O'Leia fight in June, July, August, something like that. Yeah, I mean, it's certainly the most winnable fight for, you know, the most winnable fight that still makes sense to make it a world title fight.

I think that Gagee, if he is really hungry for this fight in the right head space, everything all the stars a line for him healthy all those things I think he should be able to beat Patty you know

I think he's right but we the problem again this is why I'm just kind of 50 50 on this fight like one of the problems

with Gagie is like you know he's got the wrestling and then he goes out and you know swings for the fences and gets taken down right and you're like why are you getting taken down right now like you're

you're good enough wrestler but I'm gonna go out on a limb here and I'm going to bet that Justin Gagie knows this is his last shot. He may or may not be thinking about retiring after this fight, but I think he's going to know, okay, this is my last shot. Everyone knows that I've been trying to knock him out for, you know, the last 10 years that I've been fired, whatever, how long it's been.

Let's go out there and take, put some, let's use the full toolbox this time. You know, this is my last try. Let's use the full toolbox. He's got too much to lose. You know, let's not play the old game plan of taking five shots to land my shot and hope for that it knocks him out. Let's go use the whole toolbox. I'm going to, I'm going to, again, it's kind of going out of limb, right? Because we've never seen Justin Gagey do this.

But I think he's going to, I think this would be the smartest fight that he's ever fought. And I'm still 50-50 because I don't know if it's going to be good enough to beat Patty because Patty's really good on the ground. I'll give him that. Like I think we know that is a certainty, right? Again, his peak, his ceiling, we don't know. But his ground game level is very, very high. I think we can absolutely give him that. So will it be enough for Justin to beat him?

That's where I'm 50-50. Or for Justin to beat Patty. That's where I'm 50-50. But I think we're going to see the best Justin Gage of this fight. Let me ask you this question, Matt, because if I, is determined to come back in April to June, which means he's going to fight the winner this fight. Once again, unfortunately,

Arm is going to get screwed, not get a title shot. Who do you give a, like, and I'm not saying you have to say one of them you're going to pick, because if you're making me say it right now, like, do I think Justin Gates your Patty Pimble beats I'm at Pippoor? You know? I don't.

I wouldn't pick any one of them. But if you had to lean one of like, who has a better shot at beating Ilya between Justin and Patty, who has a better shot of actually giving Ilya a fight? Not beating him, but like, challenging him in a different way, like, to the point where you could say, well, I could see it, even though we're both saying we wouldn't pick him to win. Like, I've got no offense to Justin or Patty.

It wouldn't pick either one of them to be Ilya. But who has a better chance of beating Ilya? You know, again, it's hard to say because I don't know where Patty's at. Right? Like, just simply matchup wise on paper, I would lean gaugy, right? Like, he's got good leg kicks, which nobody's really challenged Ilya with Ton. I mean, I think we've seen some earlier in his career. I haven't watched his fights in a while

but if I remember right like earlier in his career there were some guys maybe doing more diverse striking techniques with them but you know as he moved up through the ranks you know guys were kind of just boxing with him right there wasn't really guys that were attempting that but I think Gagie you know

and Gagie should be able to take him down also if he wants but Patty you know it's for him it's basically either get knocked out or or take him down. And hopefully you're, you can take him down and win.

You know what I mean? So, you know, I would, I lean towards Gage you on that, but, you know, again, we don't, we just don't know where Patty's at. And the real, I think the other thing that I got to mention, I can't not, I already kind of said it, but I got to say it again here is whenever you have an interim

title fight and you're building it, the winner's going to get the other, the other champion, the undisputed champion in that regard. Yeah. I remember, I remember back when Cyril gone fought Derek Lewis for an interim. heavyweight title. It made absolutely no sense whatsoever. Francis had just won three months earlier. They needed a main event and they decided to put an interim title up. It was the dumbest thing ever.

It didn't make any sense. And everyone saw through it going into that event. They're like, come on now. We know this isn't a real title. It's the dumbest interim title ever. The guy literally just won his belt three months ago and you want to just turn around and fight again. Like, come on. Here's my question, Matt. We live in a world where information is at our fingertips now. We don't live in the world of the EOC in 2002 when you get an event every three months or six months or whatever it was, and you didn't know everything about the fires. We know everything.

And if there's one thing we know going into this fight, everybody and their brother has an opinion about where Arben Saruka fits in this division. I would imagine the vast majority of people, 90% probably believe he is the true number one container, but he's not in this fight. So now you've got kind of two black clouds hanging over this fight a little way. You got I'll get I'll take him out because he's openly said, like I'm going to personal issues right now. I'm not fighting until a little later.

Okay, let's take him out. But how can we ignore the arms? Armin factor. Like the guy who should, whether it's Justin or Patty, Armid should be in this fight. We all know Armin should be in this fight. And the excuses the UFC keeps given just don't make a lot of sense. I get it.

The missing out in January and then the headboat with Dan Hooker, I get it. But everyone knows Armin is the guy. To me, that does knock a little luster off this fight. I don't care how you paint it. To me, it knocks because we're not looking at the true number one guy fighting another guy. Like, okay, let's just say Justin's number five and Patty's number seven. I don't know what the rankings are. But at least you have the number one guy in there.

You can say, well, he deserves it, right? We don't have that. We have the number five guy and the number seven guy. The number one guy's just like hanging out over here going, hey, guys, remember me? I think that knocks some of the Lester off this fight. I could not agree more. And I hate to keep rehashing. You know, there's just so many of these issues that come down to, you know, the UFC's monopoly control, you know.

And I hate to keep rehashing. you know, acting like I hate the UFC or anything. I love it for the entertainment value. But, you know, when you're a guy like Armand Saruky, Armand Sarukian, I mean, you're the one kind of getting fucked because of this system. And if it's not as clear as day with this situation as it could ever be that this, this UFC is entertainment and not sport, like I don't know what to tell you. like this is it is entertainment they're putting these two guys on at this fight is an entertainment

fight right this is not a sport fight this is not a no one no one was begging to see pemblit and gaugy no when you look at the numbers it's like well why do we have rankings you know what would you say gaugie's number five okay well i mean there's four guys there in front you know they got fucked over then right so again I'm I don't it's funny man you know

when I was at uh Josiah's fight there and I was shout out to him I don't know if you if you watched the fight I mean almost almost at

almost at the mighty arm bar you all almost in the mighty armory I was like oh it's so awesome he has Josiah he had a big win for him he just didn't finish the arm bar he did hit it yeah the the back arm bar

the mighty mouse um you know when I was there you know a bunch of fans coming up one take pictures there was at least three of the kind of like, bro, like, I love the stuff that you're doing, you know, in the courts and the legislature.

And I'm like, what? I'm like, I don't fucking do shit in the courts, bro. Like, what are you talking about? But everybody's hearing what I'm saying on this stuff. And I, my point of saying that is like, I never meant to be that guy. And I don't, I'm not saying I'm against it either. But, you know, I only want to speak the truth and I only want to speak my own personal mind, right? That's what that's what podcasting platform is about, right?

Like, you know, anybody in the world can speak their mind at length on a fucking internet that everybody can see, right? So that's the whole point of this thing. And so I just say what's on my mind. And but it's cool that people are waking up to it. Yeah. Whether it actually makes a difference, it probably fucking won't. I don't know, you know, because, you know, TKO is the most powerful organization. maybe the most powerful sporting organization in history,

keeping it real. But anyway, you know, wrapping all this up. The point is, you know, like, this is an entertainment fight, and it's a garbage fight, right? This is a co-main event fight on, you know, probably a big card or something, right? But this is a co-main event, number one contender fight after Arminalea fight.

That's what it should be. And just drilling it down to this situation in particular, here's the problem of what you're talking about with the whole monopolization and the UFC kind of ruling everything. Is Dana, every interview Dana does, they ask him, what about Armini? He's like, he had his chance. He had his chance. Now, I'm not saying you can't hold it against him for a little while,

and when he said at the time, you got to go win another one. I agreed with that. I was like, cool, make Joe go to the injury. You kind of fucked up fight week. I get it. But Jose Alda got injured. like what was it like nine days before he fought Connor in like the biggest fight ever at that point.

They didn't fucking fire him or punish him forever because he dropped out of a fight. Connor had to fight Chad Mendez on the card where you fought Tim Means. Did they punish Joseo forever? No. He didn't fight in June. They fought him in December and they did the book.

So like I'm like, why does it work for some and not for others? And if you noticed recently, Armin's kind of stopped talking about it because it's almost like he doesn't want to cause trouble for himself. Like he stopped because for a while out there he was talking out about it. Now he's like, oh, I understand whether it's like, oh, I understand whether they're not giving me their title shot. He's trying to play the game so you can get back in their good graces.

That's bullshit. That's absolute bullshit. You have to be in their good graces. He earned it. He is clear. Now, I agree. Right there, what you said, I just want to touch on that real quick. That to me is the number one issue that, you know, if I would speak out about anything,

it would be right there, okay. He wants to get in their good graces. You should be in their good graces by winning fights. Exactly. That is what should be. in a good grace. Sucking some guy's dick or, or, you know, talking about how great they are, whatever, bowing down to them, that's not what should be getting you in good graces.

Yeah. No, I'm just saying, like, that's what I'm talking about. Now he's playing the game, but it's like, okay, he didn't fight in January. He got injured on Fight Week. You probably shouldn't be doing shit that's going to get you injured on Fight Week. I agree in that moment, you don't just rebook him. I get that. He's got to win another fight.

Now, why they waited until, like, October for him to fight Dan Hooker. It doesn't make a lot of sense, but okay, neither here nor there. So he fights Dan Hooker and wins. I understand the headbut. It's dumb. It's stupid. But guess what? That's fighting.

People do dumb shit all the time. And ultimately, it didn't matter. Like, they still fought. He beat him by submission. He won the fight is what it is. Then you got this car coming up in January. He says, I'm ready to go. I'm healthy.

Let's go. And Dana's still saying, well, he had his shot. That's all Dana is saying. He had his shot. How do you have his shot? Yes, he messed up a year ago. He came back and did. He flew to Qatar, fought a guy.

He threw him in there when. He beat him dominole. He put him out within two rounds. Like, what are we doing here? Like, you know what I mean? Like, I would actually appreciate it, which Dana's never going to say this, but I'd appreciate it more. He's just like, no, we don't really like Armand, and we want Patty and Justin because we

know it's going to be a more exciting fight. Sure, I'm agree with it. Now, we can all get pissed off about that and be like, whoa, what are we doing here? That's, like, clearly not a sport when you're just saying, like, we don't want the best guy in there because he's not as exciting. But at least I'd appreciate the honesty. He had his shot.

That's such bullshit. Like, come on, that's a year ago. How long does he have to kiss the ring before he's going to be able to get back to get a title shot? Right, right. And all these things, this is why the, you know, certain organizations, the MMAFA

and people, you know, certain organizations are what they're vying for is a third party sanctioning bodies, right? Where they have rules and byrules and standards and, you know, where, okay, if you back out of a fight, you know, say, within seven days, you have to win another fight to get you know what I mean where it would be set in stone like this is if you do this this is what happens versus one person love them or hate them I like Dana personally but you know don't obviously don't agree with every decision but uh one person being in charge and saying you know whatever I feel is is how this goes I mean that's if that's not clearly an issue you know is it essentially a

a dictatorship sort of thing, right, or a monarchy, what you want to call it. I mean, that's a problem, right? Is that not obvious and clearly a problem? And the worst part about this, I know we talked about it before, but the worst part about this about Armand getting screwed out of this is that, like, he's going to get screwed even harder

because if Ilya really does come back in, you know, three to six months, then it's going to be Patty or Justin versus Armin, or versus Ilya. And Armand still on the outside looking at it. And he did nothing. He's still, so we're going to be like two years to wait because you had your chance. Bullshit.

Yeah. And that just brought like something to my mind too when we're talking about Ilya coming back. And if you're Ilya, that is the perfect time to come back, right? You have to. If you wait and then Armine gets in there, you know Armis going to beat all three of these guys.

I mean, you know, the, Illia is the tough fight, right? He may or may not. But you go in. He's beaten. Patty or Gagey. I put my life savings on that, right? So if you're Ilya, you don't let that happen, right? You say, I'm coming back and I'm going to fight one of these easier fights and then maybe I'll re-take time off, right? You know, like, right, bide your time, you know,

stay at the top as long as you can. That's, yeah, that just kind of struck me in the head. That might be what's going on there. It resets the clock because now you can be like well I could be out for another eight or nine months because I've just fought and by the way

I would pick I'll eat Justin I would pick I would pick Ilya to beat Patty I don't know that I'd pick I'llie to beat Armin though and I would pick Armin to beat both Justin and Patty

that's the reality and so it sucks because not only are you not giving that's what sucks about the whole situation in my opinion not to cut you off there but like

you got two guys fighting for a title that we would pick a lot of guys to beat them right like like they're there those aren't the only two guys that we would pick to beat both of them yeah yeah 100% 100% it's just title's supposed to be the baddest dude in the world right he's supposed to be you know the actual bmf right he's supposed to be the number one guy in the world that nobody can beat and everybody's challenging to try to beat this guy the top guy but you know he would like you it would be ridiculous I don't know if this has ever happened in in the past it probably has but you know, when you got a title, a guy holding a title belt, and then the challenger comes in and is the favorite.

Yeah. Yeah, you're absolutely right. That's ridiculous, right? They should never happen. And that kind of speaks. Unless Gable Stevenson. Less Gable Stevenson fights for the title. Yeah, I give you that.

But I remember years ago when they made George St. Pierre fight Nick Diaz, and Johnny Hendricks was the real number one contender. Everyone was up in arms about that. Everyone kind of moved on because Nick. and GSP was such a big fight, but then Johnny did get his shot. Like, they didn't make Johnny, you know, the problem here is like, Armand's going to end up waiting even longer. Like, unless Ilya does end up staying out longer,

which he says, I'm going to believe what he's saying, April and June, then he's going to fight the winner this fight. And if it's like June, July, July, July, or August, they're not going to fight again in 2026. It's just not how title fights work. They generally don't rush people back in there, unless you're Marabdowalishvili. Then you're looking at Armin potentially not fighting until 2027 for a time. Like that's the really hard part about this because now you're making a bullshit interim title without the number one guy.

If they put Armin in here, I have no problem with the interim title because we still don't know for sure what I'llie is coming back. But now you're not even giving us the number one guy. You're giving us the number four guy, number five guy against the number seven guy, which by the way, I like Patty. I'm picking him to win, but I'm saying like realistically he's not really a number. He hasn't beaten anyone the top ten. Like, you know what I mean? So like, what are we really doing here? Yeah, we're giving entertainment to the people, right?

And look, 90% of, I don't know, whatever percent of people aren't going to know the difference or care, right? They're going to turn on Paramount Plus, and they're going to enjoy the fight and not give a shit one way or another. And whoever wins this fight is going to be the baddest dude, and, you know, especially if it's Patty, right? They're going to be like, God, Patty's undefeated. He's going to be invincible and blah, blah, blah. And then they'll get really excited for him to be fighting Ilya. and Armis just over there, like, dude, can I just beat all you guys and be done with this?

Yeah, I mean, at this point, we should be able to all agree that Armands getting screwed. I mean, there's just no way around. Like, he's getting screwed here. Yeah, it's tragic, man. I feel bad for the guy, you know? I mean, I mean, apparently he came from a good upbringing

and has money, so I guess, you know, he's not so worried about all that shit. But, you know, he shouldn't be getting screwed like this, man. I feel kind of bad for him. It sucks. You know, put in all that work, put in time. do all the right things. And then, you know, again, you know, I don't even know why they're so mad that he pulled

out of that fight. I mean, you know, he got injured. Like, it happens all the time. Guys get injured. I know he got injured at a stupid time as probably something silly. And, you know, I'd love to hear the actual story, you know, of what he said, what happened there. I haven't never heard that story.

But, like, I don't know how much he, why you punish the guy so much for getting injured. you know, he's probably training because he wants to win. Yeah, it's not like he was fucking around and got arrested for DUI or hit and run like certain UFC champions have done in the past.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, and to your point like I know the whole like he comes from, he does, he comes from money, his dad's like a construction magner or something, he's got money, but guess what? You still go to go in there and fight dudes. I don't care how rich you are. If you're not a good fight,

you're going to get your ass beat in a fight, and he's not. He's a very, very good fighter. He deserves it, and he's getting passed over for a dumb reason. It's not even a real reason. It's just dumb. You know, how long do you have to be punished for being injured to fight?

Like I said, they didn't punish Jose Aldo, so, you know, Josiah dropped out of a massive fight with Connor McGregor 10 days before whatever. I mean, I understand his fight week, and it sucks, but basically the same kind of thing. And Jose didn't, they didn't hold it against Jose for the rest of his career. Yeah, I mean, what was the one with the, was it where they had to cancel the whole card? Oh, with John Jones when he dropped out when Dan Henderson got injured? Yeah, yeah. That was like a week before, too, wasn't it? Yeah, Dan got injured and they wanted to replace him with Chale,

and he didn't want to fight Chale in short notice. They had to scrap the whole event. And Dana still brings that up to this day. He still brings that up to, like, when he's talking about why John won't be at the White House. He's like, I can't trust him. I'm like, you can't trust. You can't, I understand not trusting John Jones outside the case, the dumb shit he does, but like he got a different opponent on 10 days notice and he didn't take it.

I mean, what are we doing here? He didn't get injured. Dan Henderson got injured. It's just so dumb. Some of the reasons it gives him. make my head spin. Yeah, yeah. And that's,

you know, my only response is, you know, I go back to rehashing the same shit, I've said over and over again, you know, this shit can only be fixed by third party, legislation,

you know, the UFC keeps doing it the way they're doing it. It's not like this is going to get any better. You know, it's not going to be, there, it's clear the trajectory is not going to be, hey, guys,

let's, you know, we should make this more of a sport. you know and we should you know we should set some rules here and some standards and you know it doesn't matter what our feelings are about things and it's obviously this is not going to happen yeah so again that's the only response I can ever even have to that because I actually understand a little bit of things and and I'm like I'm like man I just I would love to see this just be a standardized proper sport, man.

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This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Real quick, Matt, I've got to ask you, the rest of the car, the main car. We got Sean O'Malley, Sonia Dong, Waldo, Cortez, Acosta, Derek Lewis, Natalia Silva, Natalia, Rosano, Meunas, and Arnold Allen, John Silver. Then on the undercard, of course, we got Umarmer and Magamato against Devis and Figurato. I'm not going to go through the whole car, but those are like the top six fights. What fight are you most excited about? I'm curious.

If you're not as excited about Gaichi and Patty, what fight are you most excited about? the song and shot O'Malley for sure. I think that's a really good fight for one. You know, I like to see where Sean's at. Even if he's at 100%. I mean, that's not an easy fight,

but, you know, I think he is a level above song, most likely. But just to kind of see where he's at. And, you know, the Humar-Davidson fight

would be the other one. Yeah. Where, you know, these are four guys here that are all potential, title fighters next, right? You know, whoever wins these fights. And so I think I guess maybe those two fights, four guys, two fights combined is to me

is the most exciting thing, kind of how that whole drama show plays out. And the most likely scenario, Sean Amali wins and he gets the title shot. This is, you know, the highest chance, I think, right? or, you know, after, I guess, if Yad and Marab fight again, which I don't know if they've actually announced anything on this division. They have not. Yeah, they have not. But either way, yeah, just kind of that whole story there, you know,

with all those different fighters, I think it's an exciting division, and a lot of different things could happen. So I'm pretty interested to see all that. And O'Malley, you know, like, this was an interesting fight regardless, but O'Malley now has kind of new life in the division. because he was kind of stuck in no man's land, losing a marab twice. Now he has a winner of repeater yon. Controversial or not, close fight or not, he does have a winner of repeater yon as the current champion.

He's got new life now. If he goes out beat song yodong, which in my opinion, he should beat song yodong. Song you don't. He's a fantastic fighter. But if you look at Song you dong's record, every single fight he's lost has been to the guys in the top five. He's just never been able to quite get over that hump. So I think Sean O'Malley should win this fight, but there's even more motivation, in my opinion, because now he's got the opportunity to win here.

And if he does it spectacularly, he can get a knockout or a really cool win. win. I'm not saying they wouldn't put him in there. Peter Yon next. Look what we're dealing with it lightweight. Like, are you going to sit here and tell you. I know Marab deserves that he should get it, but are we going to sit here and kid ourselves

that they wouldn't put O'Malley against Yon again in the main event? Come on now. Like, what are we living there? And also on the UFC side, if, you know, Sean goes in there and wins, whether it's Marab, Yon rematch,

or, you know, Yon trilogy, I guess it would be at that point. Umar. Like, the next fight's a big fight no matter what, right? Like getting shot in there, and particularly if he wins, but getting him in there for the title fight. And he wins the title, you know, those are all ginormous fights now, right? And he becomes, he really elevates as a star. And I do like the Umar Devison fight, though I'll be honest.

I don't like Devinson's chances in this fight. I don't really like his chances. But Umar's another one. He can go out there and really put it on Deveson, put him away, finish him. like Umar should be getting right there in title contention as well. So like you got some good fights of Bantamway coming up in this year. And by the way, unlike lightweight, umar wins and Marab is out there. Like I would not complain about Umar getting a title shot.

I wouldn't complain about Marab getting his trilogy, which I think that's the most deserving thing because he is a long-reigning champion. He does have a winner of Peter Yon. But even O'Malley, as weird as it sounds, two losses to Marab and a row. He goes out there and absolutely destroy Song Yadong. He does have a win over the current champion. It's not like the Cheeto Vera thing where he had an injury and all. kind of weird shit.

He has a, and it was a great fight too, by the way. It was a three-rounder. It was a great fight for three rounds. I don't even think I would be like, oh, man, that's bullshit. Like, come on. Like, Sean and Yon put on a great fight the first time, and Sean does have a win over the current champ. So I'm not saying he would be my first choice.

I'm just saying, like, it wouldn't be as egregious as what's happened in Armin. Yeah, I wouldn't totally hate it. But, again, when you kind of step back and look at the bigger picture, you know, my issue would be, you know, Marab has. a win over Yon, obviously, but also a loss. And no matter whether it's Sean or Umar that fights Yon for the title, you got two guys fighting for the title that Marab has beat. Yeah.

You know what I hate it, you know, that big picture when I look at it like that, it's like, Marab feels to me like he's getting fucked, right? Because there are now two guys fighting for the title that he's certainly better than one. and, you know, we need a trilogy to see if he's better than the other. And the whole idea of the title is to see who's the best. It should be. It should be Marab and Yon 3 and Umar versus O'Malley. That would be like the...

Yeah, assuming all this plays out where everybody wins the way we think, right? And Umar and O'Malley is a big fight, too. That's a great fight. That's a really good fight. I'd love that fight. I would love to see that. I think that could be an amazing fight, man. I couldn't agree more.

I think that should be the way it all plays out. You know, unless song wins, you know. I think Davidson has probably a bigger uphill battle with Umar than, you know, song has a good shot with Sean. I think the length is probably the biggest issue. You know, I think Sean's so good at staying long and he's kind of a sniper at their range. And I think that, but the song's quick, man, you know, and he covers distance as fast. So that's why I'm really interested in that fight.

And I think song could certainly give him some problems. and, you know, we'll just see if it's enough problems to be able to take Sean out. And, yeah, so, yeah, to end it all, like, those are the ones I'm excited for. And the entire division is exciting. And it's going to be a cool little story to follow. Let me ask this real quick. Before we get out of here, I got to ask this question. People get sick of us talking about Connor McGregor.

But Connor is obviously Adam about fighting the White House. Now there's a rumor. Maybe he's going to fight George Maswoodall. and if he saw that rumor floating around to like Madswell's coming back. I'm not going to get into Connor stuff. I guess technically Connor is involved in this question. I'm about to ask you, but I have to ask this question before we get out of here, Matt. Dana White this week said, no, he's not interested in rebooking.

Connor and Chandler again. Do you feel, is there any part of you that feels a little bit bad for Chandler after all this time that he might not get Connor? Or do we go back to the argument we made like two years ago? I'm like, dude, you just can't sit and wait for any one guy. And it feels like I know technically he didn't because he fought Charles and lost. and he fought Patty-in-law, so he didn't eventually sit around and wait, but he did waste, you know, almost two years of his crew waiting for that Conner fight that never ended up happening.

Is there any party that feels bad if he doesn't get it, or is that just a sport? Or the entertainment, I should say, the entertainment. No, no, I don't feel bad, law, man. You know, he had the option to fight, and he could have fought. You know, it's a different situation than like George Mosvital, if somehow this fight happens, which I'm still untrained that Conner is never fighting. but you say he fights George Mosswoodall, you know, George was retired.

You know, and like he's not out there, like, talking about fights or talking about comeback and fight. And then, you know, however it worked out, he gets the call. And, you know, then they say, fight Connor. And he's like, okay, right? Whereas Chandler, on the other hand, is, like, talking about fighting and talking about how he's the best and he's going to do this and that. And it's like, that's not the path.

the path is fight. And obviously you can talk up the fight and talk about the fights and all that. But if you're not fighting, then don't talk about it. If you are fighting, talk all you want. But if you're going to talk, you have to be fighting. Yeah, I mean, there's like a part of me. It's like, man, this poor guy, man, he wasted so much time on the Connor fight. His last fight was in April last year when he lost to Patty.

And pretty clearly he was gunning once again for this counter fight. And having to rug pulled out from under him, I'm like, man, like talk about like the all-time like just suck fest to like have that entire like three years you occur four years your curve centered around one fight and it never ever happens I'm just like man like when Dana said that I was just like and you know Dana I don't know data seems kind of disinterested when he talks these days it doesn't seem all that interested in talking about UFC but when he said he's like no that was two years ago I'm like oh you're Michael Chandler man he's got gut punch right year you got dick kicked one to two no I mean I said he You got to be out there fighting if you love fighting. If you're just about, you know, trying to get a big fight and you just want to make money or whatever. Like, yeah, I don't feel bad for it. You know what I mean? But like fighters fight.

Period. Yeah. So if you're a fighter, go fight. If you're not fighting or don't get the big fight, don't complain about it. Go fight someone else. There's always someone to fight. Go fight. Yeah.

And Madsulal going back. That's the one that happens. It is fun. I do like that fight. It's an interesting one. You know, I mean? If you had asked me like three years ago, it says it's a terrible fight for Connor. Now, you know, Mazvedal's been retired for a couple of years. He had a couple boxing matches in there. But it's interesting. Mazvedal's an interesting dude. He's going to talk shit and he's going to get into it with Connor in a way that Chandler wouldn't. We know Chandler's not going to trade trash talk with Connor. And Donald Trump clearly loves George Mazadol. He's a big Trump. You'd be down there stumping for him in Florida. So, I'm not saying it's the one that needs to happen, but if it does happen, it kind of makes sense, you know. Guy's been retired for a couple years, guys have been basically retired for four years. Yeah, sure, why not? Yeah, and I kind of figured, you know, when Miles Vidal kind of teased whatever he's teasing,

my first assumption was Connor and George probably going to go to boxing. They're going to be headlining a Zufa boxing card. I mean, who knows, like I said, but I think the White House, maybe they box on the White House card. there are Zufa Boxing. It's all wonder companies. So maybe they do it there. Who knows? Yeah.

Who knows? Who knows? Who knows? Who knows? I was watching that news. I was like, oh, you're Michael Chandler, man. You just got kicked right in the nuts.

Like, just you got actually kicked in the nuts with that one. I mean, he'll be all right. I should have been fighting anyway, you know, so. Yeah, it is what it is. Matt, obviously this week we got 324.

We roll right into 325 next week. Now, our podcast, I'm sure we're going to be reacting more to 324 because I'll be honest. UFC 325 isn't the strongest card? A couple good fights, obviously, Volcanoz and Lopez, Dan, Dan, Don't know, Benoit, St. Denis.

That's a really good fight. But it's not the strongest card in the world, but we don't have pay-per-views anymore. We're all on one thing. We just watch the fights now. We'd have to worry about the paper. I'd be really pissed off if I had to pay $80 for one and pay for another $80 next week,

but we don't have to do that anymore. So we'll do some 325 talk next week, and of course, we'll give our reaction to everything happening at U.S. 324 this weekend. Matt, people want to check out what you've got going on, where you're at. Where can they find you? I'm sorry. I am the immortal

Instagram and Twitter, the immortal Matt Brown on Facebook. Awesome. And obviously we appreciate it when it tunes in the show. Make sure check us out on all your favorite podcast platforms, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and of course over on the best website in the world, MMA fighting.com for Matt Brown. I am Damon Martin. We will see you guys next week

for another edition of the Fighter versus the Rider. Thanks for tuning in. We'll see you then.