MMA Fighting - HOAM | Joaquin Buckley Doubling Down On Conor McGregor Callout, Barber vs. Namajunas, More

Episode Date: May 14, 2024

Joaquin Buckley made headlines for his performance at UFC St. Louis, but more so for his post-fight callout of Conor McGregor that left the MMA community collectively scratching their heads. As the week has progressed, Buckley continues to get McGregor's attention, but to no avail. Is he doing the right thing? On an all-new edition of Heck of a Morning, MMA Fighting's Mike Heck reacts to the big moments from UFC St. Louis this past Saturday, the promotion being on a financial tear in terms of business, the negativity surrounding Buckley's callout, insinuating that he may have turned down a fight with Ian Machado Garry — which if he did, might be more surprising than the McGregor callout in general. Additionally, listener topics include the targeted Maycee Barber vs. Rose Namajunas headliner for the UFC's potential return to Denver in July, the flyweight shuffle up that led to Alex Perez vs. Tasturo Taira headlining the UFC event on June 15, and much more. You can listen live to Heck of a Morning Tuesdays and Thursdays at 10 a.m. ET on the MMA Fighting Twitter Spaces. Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Subscribe to MMA Fighting Check out our full video catalog Like MMA Fighting on Facebook Follow on Twitter Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Support for this show comes from the Audible Original, the downloaded two. Ghosts in the Machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudulian and the rest of the Phoenix Colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever. Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprise his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the Audible Original Blockbuster. The Downloaded, it's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking,

What are you willing to lose to save the ones you love? The Downloaded 2, Ghosts in the Machine. Available now, only from Audible. Support for this show comes from the Audible original, The Downloaded 2. Ghosts in the Machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudullian and the rest of the Phoenix colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever.

Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprised his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the Audible original blockbuster, the downloaded. It's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking, what are you willing to lose to save the ones you love?

The downloaded two, Ghosts in the Machine, available now, only from Audible. To the Vox Media Podcast Network. All right, it is Tuesday, May 14th, 2024. It is indeed a heck of a morning. We are live on the NBA fighting Twitter space. You can hear the show in its entirety

shortly thereafter. on the podcast network. What's going on, everybody? I am Mike Heck. Hope you're all having a great start to the week. Currently here in South Carolina, raining thunder, some lightning, just not what you want to see.

But it is what it is. We deal with the good, we deal with the bad, and that's kind of how we feel as MMA fans. We deal with the good, we deal with the bad, and there's obviously a lot going on in the space right now. We are coming off of, UFC St. Louis this past Saturday. And it's, I know Ariel talked about this yesterday and this is something that I've talked about

for the last few weeks as well on this show and other shows. It's just incredible. The business the UFC is doing right now. It's unbelievable. It truly is unbelievable. And when I first reacted to this made event announcement that Derek Lewis, was fighting Rodrigo Nassimento. I was telling San Luis, don't buy tickets.

Don't buy it. You deserve better than this. It's been so long since they've been back to your city. Demand better. And then like two days later I came on, I was like, you know what? Maybe do buy tickets because if this freaking thing sells out, then they can leave the apex forever.

Because you've got a Rodrigo Nassimito made event. And if you can sell that out, you'll sell anything out. And Jesus. They sold a ton of tickets. Biggest gate in fight night history for Derek Lewis versus Rodrigo and Asimento and Joaqu Buckley against a guy that outside of maybe people in this room and other hardcore fans had no idea who he was fighting. I mean, it's just unbelievable.

They're killing it. They can literally put on any of, they can do a contender series event on the road right now and sell 5,000 tickets. absolutely they're just on fire and the event was what it was there was some a lot of weirdness going on derrick lewis did derrick lewis things he keeps evolving with his celebration after he knocked out rodriga nascimento he took the pants off started fanning the near unconscious body of rodrigo nascimento the cup gets thrown in the crowd media member gets it gets it autographed by multiple people I didn't want to really go there. I'm sure we will at some point,

but we had Joaquin Buckley do, boy, oh boy, Joaquin Buckley things, wins his fight, then delivers maybe the worst callout in UFC history with Connor McGregor. Connor McGregor doesn't even know who this guy is. There are people in the Walter Wake Division

who don't even know who Joaquin Buckley is. Ian Gary literally just did an interview about it, fights that he was offered, and he didn't remember who Joaquin Buckley was. It took him a second to sort of figure that out. Buckley calls Alcona McGregor. I'm sure we're going to talk about that as well because I've thought a lot about that. I've obviously given my reaction on the post-fight show. We talked about the importance of the post-fight call-out, whether I overrate its importance, whether other people don't give it enough credence. But we can talk about

that. We got other fights that have been announced as well. Confirm last night that the main event, for July 13th. There's talks about different places. It looks like Denver is the target for July 13th, fight night event. And the targeted headliner is Rose Dombey Unis versus Macy Barber,

which is pretty fun. It's absolutely the fight to make. Makes all the sense in the world. So we could talk about that. There's a new main event for June 15th. A lot of flip-flop. been going on at 125. Tatsuro Tira no longer fighting Josh Van at UFC 302. Josh Van now fighting Tegir Ulaan Bekhov.

And now Alex Perez is going to headline at the world's most famous Apex June 15th against Tatsuro Tira. So Tatsuro Tira getting a big opportunity, getting a big main event. I'm curious why they flip-flopped everything, but it is what it is. We got Fury Ousick this week. There's just so much going on right now. So let's just turn it over to all of you. And let's get into it. And we'll discuss all these things and much more.

Left lane, M.A was first. So we will begin there. Left lane, are you there? What's on? Mike? Can you hear me?

Yes, sir. All right. Well, I guess I'll start there with those two fights, which I'm pretty interesting. And I think when Van Bess Tire was announced, I came on the show and I was like, I love the fight. It's going to be sick.

but I don't like that they're going to kill off a prospect. Well, not kill off, but one prospect is going to have a setback here. Now they got two fights, both fighting considerably up the rankings. Like, I'm pretty sure Perez is number five in the UFC rankings. Tire was like number 13, I think. And then Van is unranked and Tegu is like number 11. So both guys taking big jump-ups. I hope they can both win.

I think the UFC is hoping they can both win. I would assume that's why they did the switch up unless for some reason, One of the two just said, I need a bit more time, or maybe I got dinged up, I need two weeks, and they said, all right, sure, we'll switch it up. Maybe that's why. But I like the two fights better in terms of now there's not a guarantee that one of them loses, but there also is a possibility that now both of them lose. So I wanted to get your sort of early thoughts on that and what was the cause behind the switchup.

Also, I saw Ian Garry said that apparently he accepted a fight with MVP, but wasn't sure, but apparently MVP said he might not be able to make weight in time for International Fight Week. I don't know if there's any sort of validity to that. And also I saw somewhere, because I know for the last couple weeks you've been cautioning against the confirmation of Buck, not Buckley, Canineer versus Amavov saying, I don't know if you guys have officially reported that, but I saw somewhere, I don't know how likely it is, but apparently there might be a possibility that that might get switched up or that one of those two might be out. I don't know what's going on there.

Just someone mentioned something about it that has normally been pretty good with fight news. So yeah, Van versus Tegia, Tyra versus Perez, Gary versus MVP, maybe, and then also at Kenanir v. Mavov, all your thoughts on those fights and what's going on there. Thanks. Yeah, I don't, I mean, again, I don't really know what happened there. My guess is that maybe June 1st was too soon, and maybe they just felt like, hey, maybe June 15th they needed a bump. We'll just throw a bunch of flywates on there. Maybe they just looked at Alex Perez versus Takeda on Beck off and was like, eh, not fantastic.

And even if Tikir wins, like, is he a guy? They're just going to push up the rankings real fast to fight Pantosia and try to get him up there quick. Tyra, I can see, because I think they got something with him, and I think people are starting to catch on. So, you know, maybe they see something in Tyra. They feel like, you know, come the end of the year, if Tyra wins, he can be ready for some big opportunities. Maybe he gets a quick finish and wants to turn around. If something happens with Milo Kopp or Bahamukhaya, he could be ready to go against either of those two guys. It's a little risky booking Minal Kopp these days.

So that fight, if he goes out and beats Alex Perez, makes a ton of sense. sense. So yeah, I don't really know why they did it, but now both fights are happening June 15th. UFC 302 takes a hit, but at the end of the day, it doesn't really matter because 302 is pretty damn good. It's all about the main event and the co-main event. We just found out Kevin Hollins fighting on the card against Mikhail O'Ezek and his return to middleweight. So, yeah, you just kind of rob Peter to pay Paul, and that's pretty much what happened here. Yes, I saw Ian Gary say he said yes to MVP talking about possibly having to cut too much weight. I have no idea.

I have no insight to it whatsoever. But it just seems like Ian wants to fight on that card. And at this point, at this point, like the whole Joaquin Buckley thing just drives it crazy. Because even Joaquin Buckley sort of insiduated yesterday that in his own Buckleyish kind of way that he was offered a fight with Ian Garry and he turned it down. And I'm just like, why? why would you ever turn that down?

Just the decision making there, I'm sure we'll get into Buckley more so in a minute, but if he really got offered Ian Gary and turned it down on that card with freaking Conover Gregor on it, that would be one of the worst decisions I've ever seen. But that's just me. I'm sure we're going to get more in depth with Mr. Buckley later on in the program. Cannon Air and Emavovov. Again, we haven't officially reported that yet.

When the report first came out, I even said it was too premature to report that fight. Not everybody was in from what I was told. And then I think last week, I saw other sites sort of report it. And again, I was told it's not done yet. But it just seemed very likely it was going to happen. And now it's just, I don't know what's going on with it. So it's, I mean, that event's what? June 8th?

That's a week after 302? we're running out of time, man. We are running out of time, and we do not have a main event. So hopefully that gets figured out sooner rather than later. And there you go. I honestly have no idea what's going on with that. But the whole thing is just kind of weird. Maybe you just bump it back.

The UFC just nods are going to Paris. Like, just do it in Paris. Who cares? Push it back a few months. I mean, no one's, I don't think there is a single person who will be like, oh, man, we have to win. three more months for Jared Kandnear v. Nassardine-imov. I don't think anybody's saying that.

So, yeah, that's the latest on that. At this point, I'm probably just going to wait for the UFC to announce it before we actually put it on the website because it's not up here yet. Abs Wai, go ahead. So, Mark, heck of a morning. Firstly, I've got a few questions, so I'll start them off. Firstly, what's your favorite Duke Louis celebration of all time and why? Another two questions.

I want to just discuss briefly about Kobe Covington. I saw that he said he's interesting fighting Charles Olivera. I think I mentioned to you a few weeks back on this show about should Charles move up to 170. I personally would love to see that fight. I think it would be interesting, but I do want to say one thing with Kobe. I think he has no right to be choosing the kind of fights he wants. I know he has leverage on the side, but really, let's be real. this guy has zero fucking hype.

You know, the only fight I would say any person's really interesting seeing right now is him versus Ian Gary. But, you know, if anything he should have zero saying who should be fighting next. This guy lost every, I mean, you know, he's lost, ever since the Leon fight, he has lost every single hype, popularity. You know, no one gives a fuck about what he has to say. The only way he's trying to stay relevant is through silly political interviews or, you know, just join random podcast just to continue his little stick. So I don't really get what's up with him. I'm not sure why the UFC's not making that Ian, Gary and Kobe fight.

I really think there'll be a really perfect fight for the head co-main event at 303, even if they don't really need it. But it would be really nice just for the fans who want to tune in to watch that. One more question I have is just do with the upcoming Perth card. Do you possibly see that card in general just being another, you know, mid-tier card that just, you know, has won two big names and the rest is kind of relatively unknown or unranked opponents? Or could you see them trying to stack it up a little bit like Adakai Car of France, a Steve Erseg, maybe a Thai Tuivasa, maybe Carlos Orberg, who just won recently. What do you reckon? That's all I have a great day.

All right, let me go through all these. Derek Lewis, Best Celebration. It's Marcus Jury to Lima. That was the best. I don't know if I ever enjoyed, I don't know if I ever had more fun in a 90 second span watching the UFC than that moment on the watch party

when Derek Lewis flying knee, Mark, Ruggra, Delima, and then got the finish and then everything that happened after that, I was in tears laughing at it because they're so ridiculous. This one was good too, but just the whole thing with fight begins,

flying knee, lots of punches, throwing the lunchboxes, gets the finish, pants come off, DX crotch shop, like everything about it was hilarious. Enjoyed it very much.

So I'll go there. Colby stuff, look, Colby has not changed at all. Like, he's just, he's doing the prize fighting thing. He's picked and choose

his opponents pretty much nonstop for the last like four or five years. He typically gets what he wants. So why stop now? From all into, And I have not talked to Colby. I haven't talked to Colby in a while.

But from all the conversations I've had, he's still hurt. That foot is still banged up. So even if he wanted to fight Ian Gary at 303, it doesn't seem like he can. He's not going to be medically cleared to compete. So at this point, just throw Ian on 303. It doesn't matter who the opponent is. It doesn't. Just put him on there.

And, yeah, it doesn't really matter. throw him in there with whatever welterweight is available to go that he hasn't fought yet and that's totally fine and then for perth yeah i mean look i think you're gonna get and don't be like oh myx report and this blah blah blah it seems like uh it seems like ddp izzie is probably the direction here uh it's not done it's not even like to the point of you could say it's like in the works or anything, but I mean, this isn't really breaking news.

I mean, we've talked about this for a while. This is the fight everybody wants. The UFC wants it. DDP wants it. Izzy wants it. It's not done yet, though. So you throw that main event in there.

That's going to be the heavy load. And then, yeah, you'll have some Australian folks on there. Maybe you add a second fight. Maybe that's where you do. I know it's like a random place to have it. but like if you want to add a second title fight do Raquel Pennington Giuliana Payne on that card like so what and then do yeah Kai Carr France and Steve

Ersig like Kai wants that fight Steve wants to fight in Perth of course he does he lives there he's from there that's good one Taituivas to throw him on there and I still want him to fight rebellus to Spain because that's just fun as hell and neither of those two guys are going to be fighting for world titles so let's just do the fun thing and let two guys who hit very very hard fight another guy who hits very very hard we'll just do that and then yeah you can do carl sloberg him and bogdan it's a hell of a main card opener right there lots of action quick a pretty solid main card with good fights quick finishes and then a main event with a ton of heat on it i think we booked a pretty good uh pretty good birth card right there that's what

So sure. Let's go ahead and do that. Boarding for Flight 246 to Toronto is delayed 50 minutes. Ugh, what? Sounds like Ojo time. Play Ojo? Great idea. Feel the fun with all the latest slots in live casino games and with no wagering requirements.

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Let's go to Toke. What's that, bud? You know, perusing the old Big Marcel timeline of all the matches that have been made, and the One of, you know, what was one of the first ones on onto the next one to actually submit picks? And one of my very first picks has actually been made, Bill Elgio versus Doho Choi.

I remember I was talking about where the hell is he? Can we even match make for Doho Choi and all that stuff because it'd been out for such a while. And now the match is real. So I'm just celebrating my victory over here three years after or whatever. And other than that, yeah, so talk about that fight. And then the other The other thing is how in the world does Ribovich not get 50,000? That is crazy. I was just sitting there watching it like, okay, that's 50 Gs in the bag. And suddenly it's not getting a bonus, which is insane.

Can you talk about those two things? Yeah, I saw Doho Choi bill, your report. My man, Nolan King reported it. So to me, that's as good as gold. Good fight. Interesting matchup. Sure. I'm down for it.

I think it's on that July 20th card. if member serves you correctly. Sure. Good fight. What was the other question? Shit. Let me think. Oh, Rebaovich.

Yeah, I don't know, man. I honestly have no idea. Usually I don't like call robbery on bonuses that often, but that, I mean, come on. Come on. Like, shout out to Ulberg. You got a, what, 12-second knockout, and when you get to see in a headline,

12-second knockout, you want to see it. but I mean, dude, Alonzo Meadowfield just like sprinted at him and begged for that to happen. And one of these days, Olberg's got to fight somebody that the gameplay is, let's just charge of this dude and make him uncomfortable. Because they just all get knocked out. Like every single one of them gets knocked out. And Alonzo Meadowfield suffered that same fate as well. Arribovich, I mean, that is, if the year ended right now, that is on the knockout of the year list. is a top five knockout of the year.

And it's not even a knock. It's not even a performance of the night on that card. Come on. Hopefully he got taken care of. I assume like I don't know how you can't. Like he knocked Terrence McKinney into another planet. McKinney was sleep talking as he was slumped up against the fence. That was a brutal knockout.

brutal. So hopefully they took care of him. But that is like, that's a big miss. That's a big miss. That is, shout out to CDF, man. Like that, that was a great performance from him.

I would actually, no disrespect to Ulberg. I would have given Reivich it over Ulberg, and I still would have given it to CDF for what he did as a, what, plus 400 underdog. He beat that. soul out of that man and then got him out of there.

So yeah, I thought Reavich got the big fat hose job, but hopefully they took care of him. Let's go to four-ounce sniper. Go ahead, four-on-sniper. Hey, Mike, can you hear me? Yes, sir. Hey, heck of a morning. I just wanted to ask you real quick, your thoughts on Joaquin Buckley, outside his ability to make a good call-out, do you think the UFC might actually have

something with him? It seems like, you know, the crowd really got behind him in his hometown. You know, he got the win. made a terrible call out, but I think backstage went on and called out, was it Gilbert Burns? You think that is, you think that's a fight that the UFC might book. And if he wins that, you think, you know, he could be a guy that they want to push or, yeah, what are your thoughts on that? All right. I'm glad we're here.

I'm glad we're here. This has been what does Mike think about dot, dot, dot, dot. since Saturday. People were waiting on the result of this fight to see how I was going to react to all things Joaquin Buckley because I've been pretty public about this and it's not just Joaquin Buckley. It's literally anybody else who is put in these positions

that has dropped the ball that has bungled it. And ever since Joaquin Buckley beat Vicente Lucke, he's bungled a lot of things, in my personal opinion. Not having a name after beating Vicente Lucke was just not good. It was not good. I get you want to fight in St. Louis. I totally understand that.

And I guess by definition, he didn't quite get what he wanted because he wanted the main event. He wanted Derek Lewis out of the main event spot. Insert Joaquin Buckley to the main event spot and all that. But he did get to fight. He fought an unranked dude who has a very good resume,

who hadn't fought at Walterway in a long time. who was unranked, and he beat him. He beat him. And it was a good performance. He looked good. He just was running over, Nursaltin Runezabayev, over and over and over again. And it was just a great performance.

Almost finished him. I think if there's any other referee, besides Keith Peterson that night, Mr. No Nonsense, once in a while becomes Mr. 1 million percent nonsense. He let a lot of fights go a little bit longer than they needed to, gave Mr. Rundsabai.

buy a chance to survive and buckley won and this was a really good performance the crowd was super behind him i didn't realize like how much behind buckley they would be because i mean if you go back to the walking buckley glory m m mary remember that remember all that when buckley wanted to fight james krause before the whole crows thing happened and then it was was like, well, I'll just fight everybody in glory of me. I don't care. I'll fight all of them. And we started hearing things about Joachy Buckley's sort of reputation in that area, getting kicked out of gyms for sparring too hard and things of that nature. So I wasn't sure what the reaction would be. The UFC presented him in a tremendous way. They set him up to

succeed in a big way. They did the video at the Anheiser-Busch Brewery. They did all these things. They set him up to look like a star and Buckley delivers the performance and all that. And as I said throughout, the performance in the Octagon is is pivotal because he had the most to lose on that entire card in my eyes. He goes out and loses to Roots-A-F, he's done. Not done, done, but the push is over. Everything about it is over. He took a big risk and I respect the hell out of it. But now you've got to capitalize on that. Now you've got to come. through. And I even said, he could prove me wrong if he goes in there wins and then delivers a good callout. The one I kept clamoring for, and it doesn't matter if he said it or not, say MVP,

I'm coming to Manchester, let's go. That would have been an impactful, realistic callout, which I would have dug. And then as I was listening to the crowd, react to everything Joachim Buckley did, I said to myself, this man could literally call out. anybody besides Kamar Usman, Colby, Leon Edwards, and Connor McGregor, and he could probably get any of those fights. As long as guys aren't injured or whatever, and I know there's some examples of guys who are injured, JDM, Shafcott, etc. I don't think he would get the law, but if he called them out,

like, I think people would be like, maybe he could get that fight. He called out, then he calls. then he calls O'Connor McGregor and I just could not believe it I couldn't believe it I'm like God man why would you do that

and the thing that hurt me the most was how the crowd just groaned his home crowd 15,000 people on their feet chairing for this man and they groaned it was

it was the most deflating sound I've ever heard. And since I reacted to all of this, I would say 90% of the people have agreed with me that this is, this arguably was the worst call in UFC history. Conn McGregor's no idea of walking Buckley is.

That fight is like never going to happen unless it's just all luck. Something happens and like Buckley needs to fill in on 24 hours notice or something. thing like that's the only way that fight ever happens buckley just doesn't have that you don't look at buckling he's like he's the guy you know he's he's the next big star in the ufc like he i think he can get over and i think he can be very successful all that and he calls alconnor and i'm like what the fuck is wrong with you why would you do that why and just the other 10% of people are like

yeah i don't think that's big of a deal i'll say like 7% of those people and then there's 3% of people who are like it's always those people who are like how dare you tell a fighter how to conduct their business well let me let me say let me explain something i'm not a fighter i'm not it's just the truth i'm not telling walking buckley how to go in there and fight people i have no right to i don't train if i want to teach walking buckley not even teach him i would be like, hey, maybe you should do the CrossFit movement. Like, I can do that. That's basically the only athletic advice I can give to Joaquin Buckley. I'm not going to give him any fight advice.

However, I do feel like over the last 10 years of my life as someone who has gotten to a position, mostly because he's had a microphone in his face for all this time, who's found himself in big opportunities because he knows how to speak into a microphone, I feel like I am qualified to some extent to speak on this. I got into radio by accident because I could speak into a microphone. I didn't know how to do radio. I didn't go to broadcasting school.

I just knew how to entertain people. I knew how to get it on a microphone and be comfortable and be fun and read an audience. That led me to hear, to interviewing fighters, to doing shows like this, to being on camera for 95% of the stuff

that's on MMA fighting. I know how to talk microphone. I know how to get people talking. I know how to read people in terms of what do people want to hear. What do they not want to hear? So I feel like I am qualified to speak on this. Buckley's answer to all this was, well, I'm just trying to drum up some interest. You drummed up no interest. And the amount of people who I've heard say, oh, bad press is still good press. No, it isn't. No, it isn't. Bad press is bad press. And when you are the most over-dressed, dude on the card when everybody is screaming and chanting for you and then you leave them going

yay wakit yeah oh that's a sound nobody wants to hear that's like being on radio and telling a joke with five people in the studio and nobody laughs not only that nobody makes a sound the sound of silence the sound of groans and the sound of silence not good not how good in those situations. Joaquin Buckley could have called out Gilbert Burns and it's fine. Like it's a fine callout. I don't love it, but it's fine.

It's fine. He calls out MVP, that's a good one. That's the one. Going to Manchester, this guy's got all this hype. He beat Kevin Holland. I don't think Kevin Holland's very good. Yes, Kevin beat me on like a week's notice, but I'm going to show Kevin Holland how to fight this dude

and I'm going to go beat him. Like that's cool callout. Would have been fine. with that. Ian Gary would have been perfect. Honestly, that would have been perfect. Hey, Ian, you want a fight at UFC 303? Colby can't do it. How about you fight me? How about I fight you? And then if he wants Connor, he can go to the press conference start talking shit to Connor. He'll look like an idiot, but at least he didn't make a ridiculous call up before that. At least he could share the stage and get up there with Connor. And now to find out after the fact,

if we are what to believe Mr. Joaquin Buckley, if we are to believe what he is at least insinuating on Twitter, he was offered a fight with Ian Gary and declined it. What? You just called O'Connor McGregor. You're tweeting up a storm, tagging Connor in these tweets,

calling his ancestors hoes. Mick Hoes. This was your brilliant plan. And now you get the chance potentially, at least what you're insinuating, to fight on the same card as this impossible feat that everyone believes you can't get and you turn it down? The hell are you doing?

What are you doing? Like every movie he has made has been awful. Just not smart. Like he's just trolling at this point. And then you go to the press competition called Gilbert Burns. At that point, nobody cares. Nobody cares because you had the lights on you. You had 15,000 people screaming for you.

Everyone was saying, wow, great performance. Joaquin looks like a star right now. And then he called out Connor McGregor, and they were all just like, ugh, okay, good win. Where's Derek Lewis? And then Derek Lewis sent him home happy by doing Derek Lewis things. See, Derek Lewis didn't call out John Jones. Can you imagine if Derek Lewis got on the mic and called out John Jones? Like, that would have been ridiculous.

We still would have been, like, okay with it because it's Derek Lewis and it's like, in cheek. But if Derek Luce is like, hey, man, there's only one man that I deserve to fight, and it's John Jones. Would have been like, okay, funny joke, bro. But instead, Derek Lusch is like, nah, man, I don't even know if I want to fight again. That was a tough ass fight. I don't even know half these guys are. Just wasn't going to lose to a cab driver from Brazil, which is hilarious because Nassavento, all that. You see what I'm trying to say? I think it is important to have a name in mind. Charles Sondon

made a career out of calling people out. And I'm not saying, because New York Rick was like totally against us. Like, I don't think it really matters at all. It matters like very, very little. I don't think that's true. I don't think that's true.

Now, if, you know, let's go back and think about it. Like if Esteban Riemovich called out fucking Charles Oliva, would anybody have cared? No. Like, look, Sean Woodson, perfect example.

Look at Sean Woodson. Sean Woodson goes out, wins a fight that, let's be honest, I don't think he won that fight, but he won, got his hand raised, and what does Sean Woodson do? He didn't call it Max Holloway. He didn't call it Iliate Teporia. He didn't call it Alexander Volcanovsky. He didn't even call out Al Jermaine Sterling or Mobbzor of Loyas. He called out Bryce Mitchell.

Calls out Bryce Mitchell. Good call out. A realistic fight. It's got to be a ranked guy probably. Maybe he's just outside the top 15. Bryce just got brutally knocked out. But Bryce is also a name in the division. And what does Bryce Mitchell do?

30 seconds later, send the contract. You're trying to tell me that the UFC isn't going into their matchmaker meeting today and is going to discuss the possibility of putting this fight together? Because I think they are. There is value to the callout. There is value to it. Henry Sohudo bungled a million of us. him. Bala Muhammad's bungled a million of them. And I honestly, to this day, believe that had Bala

Muhammad chosen his callouts a little more wisely, I think he would have gotten to this position way faster. I honestly do. It's not everything. But beating Jeff Neal and then calling out Colby or Usman made no sense. Made no sense. And then he goes out and beat him. And then he goes out and beats Vicente Lucke. And I remember this day, like it was yesterday. I tweet out, do not call out Colby or Usman. And he called out both of them. And I'm just like, why?

Because I know what you're going to do. You're going to go do a bunch of media and you're going to call out Hamzat. And at that point, nobody cares. Nobody cares. Because all they're going to be talking about is the fact that you called out Usman and Colby and you have zero chance of getting either of those fights. And what does Belal Muhammad get? Sean Brady.

He gets Sean Brady. gets this big, huge win, exercises the demons, calls for, could have called out Hamzot, probably would have gotten it if we're being honest at that time. And he gets Sean Brady. And Sean Brady is a good fighter. But Sean is just a, he's a good fighter. He's not a star.

And it's a tough fight that doesn't gain him a ton if he wins. Now he opens some eyes with that performance because he went out, beat the hell out of Sean Brady and got a finish. So that's great. To me, I think Wauke and Buckley's going to fight John Brady. Like, I think that's what they're just going to give him at this point. And the fact, I just felt like if he said any name there, any realistic name, they would have gotten it.

Look at what Jack Della Madalina did after UFC 299. Look what Jack did. Kind of a higher-rank guy. He's losing the fight to Gilbert Burns. Seconds away from losing the fight in general. dude gets up knocks the hell out of Gilbert Burns finishes him sends him

unconscious to the land of wind and ghosts and what does he do he calls out the boogeyman he calls out Shafkat Rockmanoff says look I think Leon on Belaw are going to fight each other so Shafkod let's go you and me let's fight let's do the dance

and what was everybody's reaction to that it wasn't ooh that's a bad call even Miami who has no emotional connection to Jack Delamatta at all. In fact, they had more of an emotional connection with Gilbert Burns because he trains a Kilcliffe. They cheered him. All the media members are like, yeah, sign me up. Even though it might not make sense meritocratically, sign me up. That's the difference. He used his time wisely and made a call out that people were happy with. They loved it. They absolutely loved it. It made sense. He might not get it, but the, the taste on people's

mouths was, this guy just went out and beat Gilbert Burns, and then he called out the man that nobody wants to see in there. That's, and that's what you need to do. I think he nailed it. Buckley, doubling down on this, I think he understands at this point that nobody liked this call out, that it's nonsensical. Now he's just kind of trolling and doubling down on it. But if he and Gary said, he talked to Talk Sport, said that he said yes to MVP, said yes to Buckley. And if it turns out that they offered Joaquin Buckley, Ian Gary, and he said no to that fight, it would be one of the worst things I've ever seen in terms of like self-builded and promotion. Because had he, if he goes and fights in Gary at 303 on the same card as Connor,

like you have a chance to like shut people up you have a chance you might look silly but you might have a chance to get in there and like get Conner's attention and you would turn that down oh just everything about this has just been awful

so I think he's going to end up fighting Sean Brady that would be my guess because I don't think they're going to get much more than that if I'm Gilbert Burns I ain't touching that fight with the 10th foot pole I am acting like Joaquin Buckley doesn't exist I'm Gilbert Burns damn it I'm Doreenie

I don't play second fiddle to nobody, including Connor McGregor. You call Connor, even Dana White says it's a bad, oh, well, I'll go with something a little more realistic. I'll go with Gilbert Burns. If I'm Gilbert Burns, I'm like, hell no. No.

I'll fight somebody else. So that's my thought on it. It's just bad work, man. It's just bad work. And I guess, like, the last very question is, do they have something there? Yeah, I think they could. I think they could.

I think he's close, but man, I don't know who's guiding him on this. I don't know. It's wild. I'm still shocked by all of this. I really am. Like, oh, you got everybody back, man. Make a good callout. Do the thing.

Do it. You didn't do it. It's hockey season, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So no, you can't get a nice rank on Uber Eats. But iced tea, ice cream, or just plain old ice? Yes, we deliver those. Goaltenders, no.

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Yes, hi, Mike. how are you doing? I have two questions, similar questions, about future events, UFC Spain and UFC Africa. Will it happen in 2024, A, and B, will it ever happen? Because if you look at the venue, especially in Africa, it's looking not that good. And in Spain, you have true laws, if it comes to martial arts, it's very difficult, and the venues are overbooked. I like to hear your take. And good luck, Mike. Thank you. Ever?

Yes. Yes. Because, look, at this point, if you have, we talked about this sort of in a different way at the beginning of the show. If the UFC wants to do something, they're going to do it. They're just going to do it. End of discussion. They will find a way to do it.

And it'll be huge. They will definitely go to Spain. And I do think they will make it to Africa. Will it happen this year? Probably not. Could I see them maybe getting into Africa this year? I would say the chances of them getting into Africa is better than the chance of getting into Spain. I don't think Spain's happening this year.

For a lot of the reasons that you suggested, that there's different things you have to go over, different government things you have to go through. A lot of these venues are overbooked. And if they're going to go to Spain, they're going to go to a stadium to do it. They're not just going to go to like a 10,000 seat arena. They're going to do a big. They're going to do a big, especially if Iliot-Iporia is still the featherweight champion by the end of the year. Then they're certainly going to try to do that.

Whether he fights, Max Holloway or Volcanovsky, however they try to put that all together. If Ilya is still the champion, they're definitely going to go to Spain. One million percent. But it's not going to happen this year. There's just no way. And they've been talking about Africa for a while. I think I'd be pretty surprised if it happened this year. But if it was like, Mike, you have to put $20 on the UFC either going to Africa or Spain in 2024.

I would hope to just put the money in my pocket and not put it on anything. anything, but if it was like you have to choose or the money just disintegrates, I'm probably putting it out of Africa, but to me, I feel like that $20 should just be gone. But 2025, I can see it. Certainly Spain in 2025. Riley, go ahead. Sean Woodson and Alex Casares fight. I know that all three judges scored round three for Woodson. And I know you disagreed with that. I know you disagreed with that. I definitely disagreed with that. I was just wondering what you make of that. And do you think at all it has to do with like the fact, Sean Woodson is like the hometown guy, the crowd's rooting for him. And like in third round, he lands a shot or two. He raises his hands. Like he's taunting a little

bit. Like the optics are sort of like not looking in his favor. He's still moving back the entire time but like when he's taunting and stuff the crowd is obviously cheering for him like oh go for him because they're rooting for him uh do you think taunting at all could be the reason he won round three like uh i don't understand how they all three judges could give him the third round that's just uh wowed to me i know we see bad score cards um but i strongly disagree with that one thanks mike how go on so i have rewatched the fight um i watch it yesterday, as a matter of fact. And I still feel like

Ciceres won. I gave him the second and third rounds. And honestly, if their discussion, when I heard 3027, I was like, all right, Caceres won. Even though scoring the first round of Ciceroes seems a little ridiculous,

I think there's, honestly, there is a just as good of a case that Ciceris won the first round than Woodson won the second or third round. it's just one of those things having rewatched it i kind of feel a little bit differently about it where i feel that two was the more clear round for alex and that three was a little closer but i still feel like alex won that round i just i feel like he won the fight i feel like he took the first round to kind of figure sean out try to deal with the size and sort of the uniqueness of

Sean Woodson, and I think he figured it out pretty quickly in round two. I think he beat the hell out of Sean Woodson in round two. So actually going back and looking at those cards, I think scoring round two for Woodson is insane. It's absolutely insane. 3027 Woodson is one of the worst scorecards of the year. It's awful. It's a very bad card.

But, yeah, it's tough. I don't know if the crowd helped at all. Like, I don't know if you put that fight in the apex. Isn't scored any differently? maybe maybe but there were moments in that third round where if cassar's just kind of kept picking his spots and kept hitting him he probably runs away with it but i think sort of the last minute at that fight woodsin started gaining a little bit attraction back he started to land a little bit cassera started to get a little sloppy and then those final exchanges it seemed like

woods was getting the better of it and the aesthetics of it just seemed like woods had a little bit more momentum. I certainly didn't change my card at all. But close fight, close round, closer than I thought it was. I still feel Bruce Lee where I won. Woodson does, and Woodson does the thing. Makes a good callout. It's probably going to fight Bryce Mitchell next. And that's a good fight. So get on Sean. He's an interesting guy. Like talking to him. Nice dude. Huge for the division. And it's nice to see him get a win in St. Louis. Pretty cool, even though I don't. think you won the fight. Matt, go ahead.

I did not even get a chance to watch the fights this weekend. But whenever I was actually looking into it, all that I could see was Joaquin Buckley's horrible call-out. And I heard that he actually had a great performance. I still have yet to go back and watch it. But to me, that speaks so much if you are that fucking terrible on the mic, where I can't even read for updates to hear about how great your performance. was.

There's ESPN literally put something out on their YouTube. It was the worst call out of all time is what it had Walking Busley, Buckley, listed under. But on more of a positive note, I was on my Instagram, and I saw that Macy Barber versus Rose was announced for UFC Denver, I think, in July. And I just wanted to get your thoughts on that. I mean, I honestly kind of looking forward to the fight. And I'm not the biggest fan of either one of those women, to be perfectly honest.

So we confirmed that that's what they want. It seems like that's what we're getting. Seems like it's going to be in Denver. Hasn't been like officially announced by the promotion yet. But it seems like that's direction of they're going. Ariel first reported it. And pretty cool for Rose. We just gets to fight at home.

That's pretty awesome. Macy's got some ties to Colorado as well. I know she's trained to Factory X a little bit from time to time. Mostly she's at Team AlphaMail, but once in a while she'll venture into Colorado. I like the fight. I think it's a good main event for, especially if it's in Denver. And I think it's the fight to make it 125 right now. It's the one.

It's the one. Because we know we're getting Grasso Schochenko. Man in Fioro is kind of next in line. So let's just have these two fight each other. I love it. I love it. Let's see Macy get the big-time vet test, and she can go out there and thump rose up,

and she could do it. She could beat her. It's kind of hard to deny her, like a huge fight after that. So, yeah, I like the match of a lot. I like the match of a lot. So it's good stuff. And then, yeah, the, I think we talked to it,

the Buckley thing. It was a good performance. It was very, very good. He looked good. he looked good but yeah i i just i'd like to crawl around in his brain a little bit when he has a microphone in his hand just i'm just curious to see what is what is actually going on up there who's and i would like to know who's telling him like yeah that's a great idea you should definitely do that i i would just love to talk to those people but at the same token like

i think everybody has called this like one of the all-time worst call-outs so if you're going to double down on it would be kind of funny. That's cool. But if this Ian Gary thing is true, and they offered him Ian Gary on the Connor McGregor headlined card, and he said no to fight Gilbert Burns, this would be, I mean, all this is for nothing. All this is for nothing. I mean, talk about great fortune after everyone dumped on you for just this horrendous callout. If they offered him the opportunity to be on the Connor card and share a stage with him and share a fight week with him after all that and he says no, that might be more shocking than the callout itself. But we'll see. Maybe they convince him to do it. I don't even know. I have

no insight to it. But it seems like he was insinuating that he was offered that Ian Gary fight. He said no, which is stunning to me if that's actually true. Chiefs fan guy. up. Hey, how you doing, Mike? Good. You know, that Barber Rose fight, that has a potential to be a pretty good fight. I think Rose is a pretty good counterstriker and Barbara's got a lot of power, so she'll move forward into Rose and it won't be a boring fight, I don't think. As far as, you know, what you're saying about Woodson and Clacerus, I'm going to have to go back and watch that fight because I thought that Woodson did win, you know, thought he landed more cleaner strikes. But I wasn't watching too close, so I'm not going to, you know, say anything too much about that.

Buckley needs somebody to make his decisions for him. You know, like people have sports managers for a reason. And, you know, they have a team behind them for a reason. And that's to help them make choices when they're not the person who has, the most wherewithal in the room when it comes to, you know, your trajectory and where you're going to go. I just kind of think maybe his whole team dropped the ball there by not helping him plan ahead before he made that call out. If he planned ahead to make that call out, like you said, that's just trash. You know what? What do you think about Buckley and Mohammed and Covington?

And, I mean, they're probably going to give him Brady, but Brady is kind of a bad, I guess they're a bad fight for each other, right? Like, Brady's got a way better ground game and Buckley's got that striking. So I kind of think that's, I still think that's a bad fight for Buckley. I'd rather see him fight Muhammad or even Covington. Anyway, that's all I got. Have a nice weekend. Yeah, he's not fighting Ball, Muhammad. Ball is probably fighting for the belt, and he should fight for the belt.

it's probably going to go to Manchester and fight Leon at 5 o'clock in the morning and that's just about to happen Colby's definitely not going to fight him why would Colby even touch that out the 10 foot pole like he's you know right now he and Gary doesn't interest him if that doesn't interest him then

walking Buckley certainly isn't going to interest him so yeah I don't know I think it's I think it's Brady like I think that's the one honestly but it's just so weird that he could have he could have said any name for the most part like even if he called for belaw like i think that one wouldn't have gone over like tremendously but i still think it would have gone over okay but even if he called it like shopcott or jdm or gary or brady or

i mean even if he called burns out like write that in there like that's fine that's fine doesn't seem like Gilbert's fighting anytime soon, but it's still fine. But the two, like the two that were right there for him were MVP and Ian Gary. Those are the two. MVP seemed like the easiest one. Yo, I'm coming to Manchester. I'm going to show Kevin Holland how to fight you and actually beat you. Boom. Perfect callout. We were to go on the post-fight show and been like, yes, this is how you do it. Well done. I take back all the bad things I said. After Luke A win, you went through all of this. And one, and then you made the perfect call. You did the thing.

You just took a long-about way to get there. Respect. And then he didn't do it. Then he didn't do it. Or Ian Garry would have been perfect. Even if you wanted to mention Connor's name in the sentence. They're like, yo, there's only one name to call in this division right now. It's the big name.

It's Connor McGregor. But I'm not going to do that right now. Connor's booked. that's my goal, my dream to someday share the octagon with that man. But the next step in getting that Connor McGregor fight is to take out one of Ireland's own. A man who thinks he's got all the hype. A man who thinks he's the pound for pound best. A man who thinks he's the best fighter in this division.

A man that thinks he's the future. Talking about you, Ian Gary. And if you fight me, you won't be the future. You're just going to be the past. Like, I did that off the top of my head in 18 seconds. If he had just done that, still put Connor's name out there to plant a seed for the future potentially. But then you throw Ian Gary in there who's got all the type. Not only is it a well done and well thought out call out.

But it makes him more of a baby face because for some reason, everybody seems to hate Ian Gary. So that just makes it. Can you imagine what the crowd reaction would have been if he called out Ian Gary? he would have gotten a standing ovation, but still mentioned Connor's name, put Connor over, didn't call any of his ancestors McHose, because that was awful too. He plants the seed, puts Connor over as a superstar as a goal he would like to attain one of these days as a fighter. But the next step in getting there is take out Ireland's next hype train.

Ian Gary on that same card. I'm going to show you, Connor McGregor. Before you fight, I'm going to introduce myself to you by beating your guy. That is, like, that's fine. That is well done. Again, would have gone on the post-fight show. Would have praised him. But he didn't do that.

He didn't do that. And here we are. I did that in 10 seconds, CV. CV, I did that in 10 seconds. Yeah, perfect. Yeah, just a quick comment. It looks like John Anick just unofficially leaked that Belal is actually going to fight for the belt in Manchester. Because he did say flight book for Manchester, England.

See you there. And he did tag Belal in the tweet. So it looks like it's officially official. And just one more comment, man. Maybe you should start charging fighters to be like a callout consultant. Like you know how Fabiano he's on the ring when there's a Brazilian fighter. and he does the Portuguese interpretation. Maybe you should do like doing the thing interpretation, you know?

Dude, sometimes like you just need somebody to help you. Like look at what's going on in WW right now. I don't like to, you're talking about wrestling, whatever. Roman Raines can talk on the microphone as well as anybody in the business right now. He's got charisma. He's a star. Like you look at him, you just like, Dan, this guy's got something. And you can kind of look at Joaquin Buckley the same way.

But Roman Raines doesn't always do the talking. He's got somebody else doing the talking for him. It would be amazing if one of these fighters had a friggin manager. If there was a Paul Heyman of MMA who would just come out, acknowledge the tribal chief, acknowledge Joachim Buckley, this is what Joaquin Buckley wants. Let me lay it out for you. It would be incredible. It would be incredible.

But that's not what happens. And one more thing I wanted to bring up as well when it comes to this, the post-fight call-out, because, again, there are some people who feel like it's not that important. Well, if it's not that important, why is the UFC doing it? Why are we doing post-fight interviews to begin with? Unless it's a sponsorship thing. What's the point? If these don't matter, why do them?

And why have your producer tell DC or Rogan or Michael Bisbing or whoever's doing these post-fight interviews, make sure you ask them who they want to fight next? If it didn't matter, why would they do it? You think they cared about Waldo Cortez Acosta wanted after the rebellious and fight and fight? No, he didn't get a post-fight interview. But when they see good performances and they see something cool

and they want the fighters to kind of plant their flag, they give them the microphone, they give them the opportunity to get themselves over because that's how you make money in the sport. You set the tone. You put it out there. And yes, are you going to get every single fight you call for? No. but if you lay out a realistic plan on how you want to get to where you want to go,

more oftentimes and not, especially if you were in Joaquin Buckley's situation, who is so over after that performance, they probably give him most things. So I do think there's more value than some people think. It's not the end-all-be-all. And to the John Anick point, it's no secret. John hosts like he has Anakin Flore. And part of Anakin Florian is his twin brother, Jason, doing a show with Bala Muhammad. They are very close.

They are very tight. In fact, Colby Covington had jumped on an interview with me and basically threatened John Annick because John defended Colby or Bala, excuse me. So there's obviously a relationship there. Maybe, you know, he's just kind of hoping. Like, it would be stunning at this point. If it isn't Bala, it'd be stumbling. I don't know who else it could be.

Could they do Shafkat? It doesn't seem like it. It seems like Shafkot is still a little dinged up. But it's going to be the law, guys. It's going to be. So I don't think he like officially leaked it, but I think he put it out more of a good juju thing, if that makes sense.

But it seems like that's what we're getting. So I don't think anybody would be surprised if we get the old Dana White Instagram post today announcing that fight later on today. Column City, go ahead. My man, Mike, I finally don't have a question regarding a Dagestani. I got one kind of out of left field for you.

My favorite fighter, Michael Morales, I don't see any fight news on him. He's going on about over six months without anything. One, I want to know what do you think of his prospects. I'm real high on him. I thought he did well against Matthews, who, you know, can have a good grappling game. Um, who do you want to see him fight? And, uh, what do you think the, the future is for him? And I appreciate it.

Thanks. I match made for him. Did I give him Buckley? I think after Buckley beat Vicente Lucke and Buckley didn't call anybody out, I was like, all right, he's going to have to fight Michael Morales now. But I don't know if that's true. I have to go back and like listen to the episode. But yeah, the guy's super good.

He's very talented. It seems like he's the dude. You kind of look at him in that type of way that there's something there that they can capitalize on. He's rose up pretty quickly. I have Michael Morales 24th in my personal rankings right now, which at Walter Wade is pretty damn good. So I have him like right around the Kiesa Magni,

Gastilum, Nicholas Dalby, D.rod, Randy Brown, Ponziabio range, like right in that wheelhouse. So, honestly, I think, I kind of feel like Neil Magny would be like the right guy. Maybe do that fight in Denver. It'd be really fun. Lucay wouldn't be a bad one, but like, I don't know how Lucay's doing after all this. I know Randy Brown's fighting on June 1st. If he wins us on a bad one.

I mean, at this point, just trot him out there as much as possible. If he's ready to fight, put him out there. Let's just keep shining a light on him. Because that's how you get over, really, is you just go out there and you keep fighting. Go out there and you keep fighting. So it happened to Hamza. That's what got Kevin Holland really over, plus the personality as well. And that's how, you know, even last year when Shafcott was going to fight Jeff Neal in January,

and they pulled that fight. And I was like, I don't care who Shafcott fight. Just put him out there. Let him just absolutely annihilate some guy on the roster, some short-notice fighter, just let him out there and let him just style on him. And then he can fight Jeff Neal in March. Totally perfect. It's important to get him out there.

It's important to get him out there because there's so many events and there's so many fighters that there's a certain fighter that you have your eye on and that the fan base seems to have their eye on, it's important to get them out there. So I don't think it really matters who his opponent is right now. But if I had to choose, and I know Neil's coming off of a win over Mike Belot, this is kind of where Neil is right now. He's kind of that. He's in that spot where these up-and-comers are on their way up.

They're coming quick. They're incredibly talented. They're young and they're hungry. And if you have those questions about certain fighters, you throw them in there at Neil Bagney to see if you can get those answers. So don't hate that idea. Yeah, it's kind of where we're at right now. Everyone's just, Alex Morono's not a bad idea.

that's not a bad one someone yeah some sort of vet with the with the name magni would be my first choice but you want to do alex morono you want to do like a max griffin i can live with that but somebody somebody in that ilk of that ilk if you will uh so there you go we're done appreciate you guys are the best uh we'll be back on friday we'll do it again just before the return to the world's most famous apex UFC Vegas 92. Good main event. Looking forward to it. Edson Barbosa versus Lorone

Murphy. Lorone getting a ranked dude, getting a big opportunity. Looking forward to that card. And of course, we get Tyson Fury versus Alexander Usik. So there's a shitload of stuff happening in the combat sports world. And we'll talk all about it on the eve of both those events. On Friday,

of course, BTL on Thursday, to get you ready for those cards as well, plus to break down all the big news going on in the sport. And who knows? Maybe Dana will drop some announcements and we'll do some reaction pods. Who the hell knows, everybody?

So keep it locked to the MAFighting Podcasting Network at MAAFighting.com for all of that. So until Friday, have a great rest of your Tuesday and have a heck of a morning, everybody. To the Vox Media Podcast Network. With Instacard, you get groceries that over-deliver so you can over-share your preferences. Want russet potatoes with no brown spots?

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