MMA Fighting - HOAM | What Is the Most Compelling Non-Title Fight For UFC 296?

Episode Date: December 7, 2023

The UFC is ending 2023 with a loaded UFC 296 pay-per-view event that features two world title fights, and a slew of compelling storylines outside of the top-two bouts. Of all of the non-title fights, what is the most intriguing on the card? On an all-new edition of Heck of a Morning, MMA Fighting's Mike Heck discusses the UFC 296 card, the low-key storylines, and if Ian Machado Garry vs. Vicente Luque could be the big talking point outside of the championship bouts at night's end. Additionally, listener questions include the UFC Vegas 83 main event between Song Yadong and Chris Gutierrez and if the betting lines may be too wide, Anthony Smith's future following his co-main event bout with Khalil Rountree, if Tom Aspinall will ever get the chance to fight Jon Jones, the UFC anti-trust lawsuit, and much more. You can listen live to Heck of a Morning Tuesdays, Thursdays, and Fridays at 10 a.m. ET on the MMA Fighting Twitter Spaces. Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Subscribe to MMA Fighting Check out our full video catalog Like MMA Fighting on Facebook Follow on Twitter Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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And the rematch is happening, everybody. It's happening. Jed Mishu versus Luke Thomas on BTL at 1230. Luke Thomas back on the M.A. Fighting Network. It's going to be a good time. I have a feeling things are going to get a little bit spicy, and it's going to be a damn fun show. So join us live on the YouTube channel, 12.30 p.m. Eastern time, and it's going to be a doozy. But a lot has happened as it typically does.

Since we last spoke, it's been two days. And since then, we've had fights fall out. We've had replacement fighters announced. We've had other bouts announced. probably the most notable as of right now. We found out that earlier this week that Josh Emmett needs a new opponent, Giga Chikaze, suffered an injury and training. And the great CV who is in the room right now made the perfect suggestion.

And I was all in on this once he said it. He said, let's do Diego Lopez versus Josh Emmett. And I could not have loved that idea anymore. Now, seeing how this all played out, it probably wasn't like the number one choice, only because I wasn't really sure what the status of the actual replacement was, because he got a little bit dinged up in his most recent fight with Dan Igay. But Bryce Mitchell is stepping in. And it's a good one. This is a good fight.

I actually like this one better. than the Giga fight, if we're being honest. I still would have liked to have seen Diego Lopez get the shot, but from like a meritocratic perspective, from a ranking perspective, if you're Josh Emmett, obviously fighting Bryce Mitchell has a lot more significance than fighting Diego Lopez. I did speak to members of Diego's team.

They wanted that fight. They wanted it bad. They threw their name in the hat. They said, hey, you need somebody, please call us. We're in. And Bryce Mitchell has stepped up to the plate. from what I'm told, Diego Lopez, hoping to return in February on that Mexico City card. And we'll see if that comes to fruition.

I think it would make a lot of sense to put him on that card, possibly the winner of that fight. If they can turn around quickly, don't know if they can. But that'd be a pretty fun one for the first quarter of 2024. So Josh Emmett versus Bryce Mitchell at UFC 296 to add to that incredibly loaded card. We confirmed yesterday. I think I confirmed the second side right when I woke up super early this morning. Macy Barber versus Caitlin Chukagi it going down to UFC 299, which is being targeted for Miami in March. Nothing is like 100% official there, but it seems like that's the direction they're heading.

Something we talked about a few weeks ago on the show that Miami was in play for that card. And it looks like that's what we're going to get. But that's a really interesting fight. We found out Dan Egey. I confirmed yesterday the Danny Gay-Laureen Murphy fight that was first reported by Brett Okamoto. That is happening as well on Super Bowl weekend, February 10th in Las Vegas. That's a good fight. Featherweight's going to be super-duper fun.

And there's just a lot of other stuff going on. So Alexander Rackich tweet out that Janbovich may be out of his fight in January. That rematch, he called out Yuri Pajshka. Yuri Parashka has responded on Twitter. I'm down to fight you, but can't do it in January. You can do it in February and March. So we haven't fully confirmed that one yet, but that's where that is at right now. I don't think Rackett would just kind of throw that out there if there wasn't smoke to that fire.

So a lot going on in the news cycle. And if you guys stayed up for Dana White's big announcements and found out he's giving away a Tesla truck, I apologize. I was not waiting for that announcement because I had a feeling we weren't going to get a big announcement in terms of what we truly care. about. So there you go. Let's get into this thing. Let's hear what you all have to say. We will begin with the coffee drinking Matt Ravelli. Matt, hello. Pretty quick. So Aljo released a video today. He said he's not going to be fighting Max Holloway. However, he did call for Calvacator. So I was just going to see what you thought about that. He was looking at $299 or 300. And then also there's rumors. It has a

been announced by the greatest website in the world, MMA fighting, but Gilbert Verns versus JDM possibly in the works for 299 from what I was seeing. Do you think that that's a pretty big step up for JDM? I know that most people are pretty high, but I mean, I feel like

once you fight Gilbert, you're like right there for a title shot. So I just want to see what you think about that. Interesting. So Aljo said he's not fighting Max, so they must have something else for Max. Maybe he's the back. up for the title fight and he just wants to cut weight once. I'm not really sure maybe Max isn't

ready. Does he want to fight that soon? I don't really know. I have to go and listen to Al Jo's response. I like the, look, I like the cater fight. I think the cater fight makes a ton of sense. I think that's a really good test. I think Aljo actually handled this perfectly. I think going for Max was the way to go because the reward for fighting Max Holloway is far higher than fighting anybody else in this division, but the risk is all the same, whether you fight Max Holloway or Calvin Cater or Diego Lopez. They are all exactly the same. If he loses, he's probably never fighting for a belt again. So go for the gusto and see if you can get it. But if he goes out and loses to Calvin Cater, like he's never getting a title shot. But if you lose to Max,

you can at least chalk it up to, well, he just lost to the guy that beats everybody except for Alexander Volcanowski. And it kind of somewhat keeps him in play as long as he's as he's competitive. But I really like the cater fight. If it's not, if it's not max, cater is a really good entry to 1.45 because cater's a big 45er and he's tough as hell. He's got pretty good wrestling defense. Dude can crack. I think that's a really interesting style matchup. So we'll see if we can get that. 299, 300. I'm down if that's the fight they make. But kudos to Aljo for doing the right thing and calling for Max because that's exactly what I said after you lost the belt.

Just go all in on max, see if you can get the fight. You may not win it. Stylistically, it doesn't look great on paper. But again, the reward is much higher when the risk is all the same, no matter who you fight in that division right now. So there you go. To address the other thing, I did see that report, JADM versus Gilbert Burns, possibly at UFC 299.

basically we have been told that that is the fight that JDM certainly wants. That's the fight they're asking for, but that ain't done. It ain't done. So the golden rule, it's important to note. If it's on our website, it ain't a thing. Not saying that it could not be, maybe it could be a thing. maybe that's the fight that ends up happening. But, man, like, why would Gilbert take that fight?

I mean, Gilbert is a freaking savage, so he'll fight anybody. That's just how he's always been. But, like, you go out, you do the UFC a favor. You take a fight on short notice after you pick up a big win. You take a fight, a five-rounder on short notice, the fight that made absolutely no sense to put on that card. Gets injured, loses, then you have to come up. come back and fight Jack Delamette Elena?

I don't know. I think there's other interesting options there. Like if Ian Gary beats Vicente Lucay, I think him and Gilwood Burns is a much, like, more interesting fight. Because I feel like, I mean, look, JDM and Burns, if they make it, I'll watch it. But I feel like if Gary beats Lucke, one, there's more of a story there. You keep the whole Gary versus Kilcliff thing going. Luke A and Burns are like best buds, and Gary will have the better win on his resume.

You know, I think that's... I'm not saying JDM couldn't win that fight, but I kind of want to see him beat somebody else first. Like, honestly, him and Sean Brady makes a lot of sense. Like, I know Sean Brady called for Gary, you know, and I think it makes sense the winner of the Luke A Gary fight, but Gary versus Burns, if he comes out and cuts a fiery promo on Gilbert,

Like, you could make that fight. You could definitely make that fight. And then if that's the case, I mean, Jadem versus Sean Brady is a good one. We've seen, but either is fine. I think we would learn a lot from J.D.M. And either fight because we've seen kind of the hole in his game, the discrepancy he has in his style right now. But long story short, that's the fight JDM's team wants. But that's basically as far as it's gone is like, hey, we'll fight get away.

Burns, to report that now would be way too soon from what we're told. But again, it doesn't mean it's not going to happen, but it's not, it ain't happening as as of right now. So there you go. Tristan, yes. Mike, I want to talk about two things here. So with Wonderboy, I saw him on an interview and he talked about, I'm not staying like BJ Penn.

I'm not staying too long. We saw what happened with BJ Penn's career. And he said, you know, his legacy was kind of, you know, Taiton because he fought so long. And I don't know. From hearing from that, that tells me that if he gets finished by Shafka Rakhmanov, and it doesn't go his way, I think he got one more fight, and he's calling into career. Because this is kind of like the final run right here, the final stretch for Wonderboy, if he wants to get a title shot.

So if he loses the Shafcott, gets finished, I think he has one more fight to try to go out in the positive note, and then he calls it a career. I just want your thoughts about that if you're getting the sense of that. And then the second thing I want to talk about, I'm all in for the Ian Gary versus Sean Brady. Sean Brady, after that fight, he has doubled down on what he feels. You know, I message you that this man is talking greasy, and we'll see if Ian Gary gets through. his fight at MSG or not MSG I'm sorry

I believe the fight in December I think you have to make that fight I think those two I mean we'll see because I want to see if Ian Gary can really challenge and stuff Sean Brady's takedowns

because we just saw he put a clinic a clinic against Kevin Gasolam so I just I got to see it. I got to have that fight with Ian Gary and Sean Brady, Mike. Just your thoughts on everything I have to say. Thanks, Mike. Thanks, man. Yeah, I saw the Wonderboy interview. Obviously, I think it was from, I think it was from the MA hour. And yeah, he's right. Here's the thing, though.

Wonderboy has not taken really any, like a ton of damage in his fights. Like, he got knocked out by Anthony Pettis. There's just a one-shot, K-O. But, You know, even the fights he's losing. He's not getting beat up. Like, he's getting out, like, Gilbert Burns just wrestled him. Well, I'll wrestle him. Which I'm not knocking the game plan because that's what you have to do to beat Wonderboy. But it's not like he's getting out there and just getting busted up in every single fight.

Like, we're not seeing that. We saw that in like every BJ Penn fight, except the Ryan Hall one. Ryan Hall showed mercy on the man and just tapped him in 30 seconds as opposed to punching him in the face over and over again. And I think that's more of what he means. And here's the thing. And I've talked about this before because I've been talking to Wonder Boy forever. Like Wonder Boy doesn't have to do this. He just likes it.

And he's not the kind of guy. I don't think that is going to overstay his welcome. When he just stops liking fighting, he's just not going to fight anymore. When he just isn't into it, then he's done. Now, if Shavcott goes out and just obliterates him. And I'm not talking like, a tackle submission loss because a lot of people are kind of seeing that anyways. But if he gets like colded by Shofcott and just takes a ton of damage,

maybe that's something to think about. But if he has like a good fight and he like lands some good shots and Schofcott just kind of tackles him and taps him, I mean, I don't think that takes, I'm not, it's not that I would be concerned watching Wonderboy fight. We haven't gotten to that level with Wonderboy. Now when BJ Penn was fighting and he was on that streak, we're like, oh, God, please stop. Please stop fighting. This is tough to watch.

We're getting there with Tony Ferguson right now. We're getting there with Tony Ferguson where he's just taking a ton of damage, losing six in a row. Like, he's not even competitive. Wonderboy went out there. He beat the hell out of Kevin Holland. Like a fight, a lot of people were picking Kevin to win. He went out there and just busted up Kevin Holland. I know Kevin got dinged up a little bit in that fight as well.

but Wonderboy went out there, beat him. Wonderboy's done that to Vicente Lucke. He's done that to a lot of guys. Did it to Jeff Neal. Went out there in 50, 45 Jeff Neal. Like, Duke can still fight. Duke can still fight. Stylistically, it's a really tough fight this one.

But as long as he's not taking a ton of damage and he really hasn't, then fight on, brother. Fight on. I like the Gary Brady fight. that's what I picked for Otno if Gary beats Lucay and if Lucay wins I would probably pick the same but here's the thing I thought about this a little bit more

and the way I see it is if Lucay if Lucay wins on Saturday then I like the Sean Brady Vicente Lucay fight that makes sense to me if Ian Gary wins I've changed my tune on this and I'm going to stick with my Otno

pick. If they do make that fight, I'll take my fraction of a point. I want to see Sean Brady JDM. And I honestly, I think Ian Gary could kind of get whatever he wants outside of a title fight. I think they could book a Wonderboy fight. I think that's a bigger name, better stylistically for Ian. And two, if you compare the resumes, Ian beating Vicente Lucke, and I love, and I like Sean Brady a lot. And I was not, I was not a guy who jumped. off the Brady train at all. But Ian Gary beating Vicente Lucke is a better win than anything on Sean Brady's resume right now.

It just is. Plain and simple. So Ian kind of jumps ahead of Sean, at least with how I see the UFC viewing him. I assume he will be higher in the rankings. Now, if Ian wants that fight, he could certainly get it. But something tells me that there is going to be no, the line will not be very short. in terms of guys who want to fight Ian Gary. Even freaking Sean Strickland wants to fight Ian Gary right now.

So the options are a plenty for him. He could probably get a Gilbert Burn's fight. He could get a Wonderboy fight. He could get something with a name. He could. Hell, if Colby loses to Leon, he could get Colby. That is all in play. Whether you like Ian Gary or not,

the guy creates reaction. He creates at least conversation in some way. So we'll see what happens. I don't think Brady's going to get the fight if Gary wins, unless Gary calls for it. If Gary calls for it, he'll get it. But otherwise, I think Gary will be like, nah, dude, go and beat somebody like Luque and then come find me.

And some people are going to shit on him for that. I probably won't because he'll be ahead of Sean. He'll be ahead of Sean. He's got the better win. So we'll see. Sean can come back. And if he goes out and beats JDM, like, that's a pretty damn good win. It's a pretty damn good win.

So we'll see. I've softened on the Brady-Gerry fight a little bit in terms of what I think is actually going to happen. But, hey, if they make it, I'm intrigued by it. But I kind of feel like Gary's going to go elsewhere with this. And I think the UFC would be more inclined to give him what he wants, if we're being honest. But we'll see. It's a big $296 is a big.

Big night for Ian Gary. I'll tell you that right now. Support for this show comes from Chase. If you're a fan of women's sports, you're always looking for ways to get closer to the action. And your Chase card can get you exactly that. With a Chase card, you can experience more. That means access to presales, preferred seating, and more savings.

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Four Corner Sports. Go ahead. All right. So I really thought that the promotion was in a go with Josh Emmett versus Diego Lopez. I understand why, what's it called, Bryce Mitchell, from a rankings perspective, you know, was the matchup. I imagine they're going to have to have Diego Lopez on them. Mexico City card. But what I wanted to talk about was two different things. It was one with Chris Guideras versus Song Yidong.

Do you, Mike, do you feel like the lines are drastically, you know, what's it called? Too large for Song-Gi-Dong. I think last time I had checked, Song was like a minus 380 and Chris Guidierrez was a plus 300. I just feel like it's too competitive of a fight for it to be that far apart. I feel like one of the things that, you know, maybe people are not, I mean, people should look into is the fact that, you know, can song go all five rounds with Chris Gutierrez, you know, kicking him in the legs.

I mean, Jonathan Martinez and Chris Gutierrez are, you know, two of the best leg kickers in that division. And I just feel that that's something to look at. And has there been, the second thing I wanted to talk about is, has there been any news as for Zhang Wei Lee that you heard? of. I know that she, I know that I think the USC was trying to make Yao Janan versus Jean-Weili for the Shanghai card. I feel like the UFC didn't get the fights that they wanted. That's what they moved it to Vegas. Is there any rumors of her fighting in the

first quarter of 2024? I'm just very curious because she's not the most active champion. All right. Thanks, Mike. I've heard nothing about Zhang at this point. So, I don't really know. I don't really know. At the same token, you said it. She's not all that active. But at the same time, it's not like she fought in February. She fought in August. So she fought like less than four months ago. And she beat the living hell out of Amanda Lemo for 25 minutes. She didn't lay and pray. She beat the hell out of Amanda Lemo. So it's not like she just kind of did nothing. That was a hard fight. She tried their best to finish Amanda Lemos. She couldn't do it. So she worked a lot in that fight. So yeah, we'll see what happens. I don't know

if it's if they're going to do Janjanon. I don't know if they're going to do Tatiana Suarez. I'm not really sure. I kind of feel like with McKenzie Dern losing to Jessica Andraj, if I'm Tatiana Suarez, I ain't fighting anybody, uh, unless it's for the belt. So, you know, but she also doesn't want to make up for a last time. So I don't know. We'll see what happens. I kind of feel like if that didn't happen in. in Shanghai, then like, what's the point of doing it now? You know what I mean? Unless they did it in like Boston or something,

which doesn't seem like they're going to Boston anytime soon after just being there. So, yeah, I've heard nothing. It would be, I would like to see her back in the first quarter. I'd like to see her fight at least twice next year. And we'll see if that can happen. Yeah, Song Yidong, minus 380. The comeback on Chris Gutierrez plus 300.

I thought the Armand Sarukian Benil Darius line was too wide. And boys are I wrong about that? This is interesting, it's an interesting fight. Like, it really is. I think Song will win. But Chris is the guy who can accumulate damage over time with the leg kicks. And you know what he's going to do every time. Like, you know what this guy is going to do.

And unless you could fight fire with fire, like Pedro Munoz is able to do, who is an excellent leg kicker himself and a good defender of leg kicks, you're going to have a tough night. You can have a very long night. Chris is also very durable. He's never been knocked out in his entire,

he has not been knocked out in his career. He has been finished once. He got submitted. But honestly, I think if that fight was run back, Chris would win. He's in a much better place mentally now than he was back then. He was dealing with a lot of,

the things he's still kind of dealing with, but was dealing with them in a much worse way from a mental health perspective. So the Chris Gutierrez that is that you see now is a completely different guy. What Mark Montoya and the factory X guys have done to help him from a mental perspective is really, really incredible, honestly. Like Chris Gutierrez was a guy who was talking about killing himself to just end the pain that he was dealing with. mentally with this kid and everything that had happened with his ex, like all that stuff. And now he's just in a much better place. Still dealing with that, but he's able to handle that a lot better.

And Chris has shown him his performances. Here's the thing about Chris's durability, though, and he is durable. He has not fought a hitter like Song-Gedong yet. Like, Song is a hitter. Like, he's got the death touch. And we'll see if Chris could deal with it. So it's an interesting fight. It's an interesting fight.

Now, could Song go out there and just, song could wrestle him a bunch, and Chris isn't a bad grappler. Song's pretty damn good in that department. And Song is a hitter. And I think kind of the best way to slow Chris Goody is down is put him on his back. And song's pretty good at that.

So, yeah, I think the line is a little wide. Like, I can understand why people would take a dog shot on Chris at plus three. I don't hate the, honestly, from a betting perspective, I don't hate the plus five and a half for Chris here. Because I think he could win a round or two. I think you win a couple rounds. So I don't know. It's going to be interesting.

I think this fights a little bit closer than the people think. But I also thought Surukian's line was a little too wide and Sirukian only needed 64 seconds to win. So, yeah, look, this is a good fight. This is a This is more of a co-main event Than a main event But this is a fine It's a good fight

It's a good fight I like it But yeah Minus 380 seems like a Like a lot But we'll see I could be wrong And I often am wrong

So it's okay Good I'm sorry So I just have two questions First If Vicente Lucke wins What do you reckon What do you reckon? will be the best matchup for him going forward.

Does he get some of the top five, maybe the loser of Leon versus Kobe, or maybe a real matcher, Wonderboy? What do you think? And my second question is, just a little bit of revisionist history about making fast. If Al Jermaine Sterling had been short on Mali at USC 292, right, do you think the stars would have a line for him

to get his super fight with Alexander Volcanovsky, regardless whether the short notice fight against Islam happened in October or not. Because I'm just realizing, I don't think he would have actually technically got this fight, had Arnold Allen not lose to Max Holloway in April. And if Al Jemay had not lost to Sean in August, what's your thoughts on that? Yeah, I mean, I don't know. I don't know. Timing would have been everything there.

and who knows how much things would have changed. Honestly, probably with Volk stepping into fight Mokachev, if that still happened in this hypothetical world we're living in right now, it probably would have, like, did Al Joseph favors? Maybe the fight happens in March. Maybe it happens a little bit later, because it's a little bit bigger, because it's the champ versus champ kind of a thing.

So, yeah, I mean, Al Jow probably would have been the front runner you would think because the UFC loves putting these fights together. And here's the other thing, too. The relationship between Aljo and the UFC is not a great one. We've heard Dana and his quote-unquote promotion of Al Jemate Sterling since he was the battle by champion and it wasn't very good. So I think there's a part of the UFC that have been like, hey, this is the opportunity to kind of get Aljo away from us because honestly,

as good and is underrated as Aljo as been, I have a hard time thinking, and even he said it after the O'Malley fight, I have a hard time believing he was going to beat Alexander Volcanovsky, even if he went out and dusted shot O'Malley. It just, it's a really bad, it's a really tough fight for him. But at that point in his career, like, where else you get to do? So, yeah, I think in that weird world, Al Jo probably would have been the front runner. Ilya may have gotten the winner. Maybe he had to fight one more time. but with the way all of this worked out,

I just happened to be the dude, and it made a lot of sense. The Lou Gein question already kind of answered that. I think they do Luque versus Sean Brady. I think that makes sense. Do Luke A versus Brady. It's the fight that was being discussed before Brady Gasolam happened and all that.

So maybe they just go back to that well and it makes life just a little bit simpler. You know what I'm saying? Let's go to DA. I know we left something in the comments, But let's hear from him. DA, hello. Hey, how you doing, Mike?

Please talking to you. Good over you, man. I was going to ask you a question. What are you thinking about the upcoming card? Because they hasn't got, like, a lot of recognition. It's the most tag card we have seen, like, in the whole entire area. Because it's from the prelims up to the main band. It's fully stat.

We got Gary. We got Shafat. We got Thompson. We got like the flyweight. And then we got, of course, the main man, Leon Edwards against, like, College, Comington. What do you think about that? And the second one would be how you think the Tom Aspinel and the John situation is going to play out. Do you think they're probably going to fight it right now? Thank you for answering. Thanks, man. No, probably not. Tom is, yeah, I don't see it happening. Sorry.

I don't think we're going to get Jones versus Aspinall, at least not now. I mean, even Dana is, Dana is steadfast. Like he gets in these spots. He gets stubborn. And again, I don't blame him for that. His stubbornness has been very helpful at a lot of respects for how successful the UFC has been. And me being a Boston guy myself, I understand the stubbornness. I am stubborn as hell as well. But when people say like, nah, you should do something different than he doubles down on it. And he is steadfast that we're going to get Jones versus Depe. And that's the fight everybody wants, which is just not true. It's just not true. So I would love to see Aspinall Jones. I think that is the fight everybody truly wants to see right now. But I don't think we're going to get it. I think Aspinall is going to have to defend the interim belt. Maybe against Cyril Gnilat, maybe they do J-L-Talmeda.

Who the hell knows? Let's pull up. Let's pull up good old UFC 28, 296. I love this card, by the way. So let's take a look. I'm trying to think back at like cards I remember this year. Like I love UFC 290. I thought that was really good.

I loved UFC 287. I thought that was really good. And then when you look back at UFC 285, you're just like, holy crap, oh, what a card that was. And boy, to that deliver in a lot of respect. So let's take a look here. UFC 285. We had Rodzabov versus Rebovich. We had Fareed Basharat, up-and-coming contender beating Daman Blackshare, Tabitha Ritchie, Jessica Penne.

And then we got Cameron Simon versus Mata Martinez. We had Ian Gary versus Kahn-Song on the prelims. Mark Andre Barrio, Julian Marquez beat the shit out of each other. We had Amanda Hebas, Viviani Aurozio, on the prelims. Drickus Duplice. Maybe in the next middleweight champion. versus Derek Brunson, Cody Garbrant, Trevin Jones. The feature prelim, Not a Great Fight. And then the main card, we had Bo Nickel, UFC debut. We had Matush, Gamrot, Jalen Turner. We had Shafcott versus Jeff Neal.

We had Alexa Grasso versus Valentina Shepchenko, and we had the return of John Jones versus Cyril God. That card was insane. That card was insane. 287, not a ton of name value, but still really good card. I mean, main card we got Raul Roses Jr. losing. Kevin Gassum, Chris Curtis, great fight. Feature prelim, Kevin Holland, Santiago, Ponzi.

Rob Vaught, Adrian Yonazzo. Holy shit. Gilbert Burns, Jorge Mazadol wasn't all that thrilling. And then we had the Adasania knockout of the year. But boy, 296 is really good. This is a makeup card. This is a makeup card for last year's December card. Because that December card last year was trash.

And look, it's at the end of the day, injuries. Jed always says like the UFC's one injury away from doing the perfect card. That is the exception to the rule because that card was not good. It was real bad. But this one, Josh Emmett, Bryce Mitchell, Andre Feely, Lucas Almeida, Shemiel Gadsiav versus Martin Boudai, Cody Garbrand, Brian Kelleher, Alonzo Menafield, Dustin Jacoby, Randy Brown, Muslim Salikoff, Casey O'Neill, Ariadipski, Arrani, Karalhasa,

Tegar Ulambachov versus Cody Durdin. And then we get to the main card. Lucke, Gary, Ferguson Pimblet, Rachmanoff Wonderboy, Pantosia Royval. God, that fight is going to be incredible. And Leon Edwards, Colby Covington. It's real good.

It's real good. There have only been, there have been probably, four or five times this year. And look, there are certain fights, like certain main events that I was like really intrigued with. But when talking like looking at

an actual entire lineup and an entire pay-per-view main card, it's probably only happened like three or four times where I'm like, let's go. If this stays in place, I can't friggin wait for it. And this is one of those cards. It's just so good.

There's so many storylines. This could be an emotional roller coaster in a lot of respect. Starting with Ian Gary, everything he's dealt with heading into this fight with Luke Gay. He could win and just piss everybody off because that's just kind of how they feel about him. Then we're getting Ferguson versus Pimlet and either we're going to get Patty just dominating Tony Ferguson or Ferguson does the 20203 thing and beats Patty and we're just like, what the hell just happened? Shafcott Wonderboy could go a number of ways. A lot of people think Shafcott's going to win,

but what if Wonderboy wins? Holy shit. Pantosia Royvall is going to be a fight of the year contender. And then Leon Colby, like, I just need this fight to happen. Like, I don't even care who wins. I don't even know if I'm going to look into making a pick. This fight just has to happen

because this division needs it to happen. We need something. We need some movement. at 170. We're talking about 155 meeting movement. 170 has done nothing this year. There has been no movement. We got the title fight in March. We've had some other fights that have happened, but literally with like no significance at all.

Nothing has happened. Blah Mahamah went out there, Dusted Gilwood Burns for 25 minutes in May. Everyone's forgotten about that because the fight happening on that car made no sense at all. but we have nothing we've had nothing in 170 so this fight needs to happen so we at least get some semblance of direction here either we're going to live in a meritocratic world with leon as the champion or colby becomes the champion and then we're just going to get all sorts of crazy and we won't know until this fight actually happens so we'll see it's a great card it's really really good i can't I can't wait for it.

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CV, go ahead. Go, Mike. Heckel over morning. Damn it, we tried. We tried to make Diego. Lopez versus Josh haven't happened. But it's all good. It's all good. Anyways, I just want to talk about

the flyweight division. And like you said, Pantoja Royval, that's going to be a sick-ass fight. And no one's really talking about it. So, yeah, let's talk about that, as well as the Moreno versus Al-Bazi fine announcement. Do you think the winner of that gets the next title shot? So, yeah, thanks.

Thank you, CB. Do I think Marino-Albazi winner gets next title shot? Yeah. Yes, I do. Yes, I do. I don't met all cops fighting Mateus Nicolao. But look, if Albaozy beats Brandon Moreno, you have to give him a title shot. Like, if he goes to Mexico City, it beats Brandon Moreno.

He has to get it. He has to get it. You could make the case, you could have made the case that he should have got it before. And that's why I said, like, if the UFC wanted to ask him, add a second title fight to the Abu Dhabi card and wanted to throw Pantosia in there. I think they went to win with Albazi over Royval just because it's Abu Dhabi. But Royval is, it gets the spot. Amir needed one more.

I didn't think he, I didn't think Moreno would take it. Not because he was like afraid. I just didn't think like they'd go in that direction. I thought they would do something different with Moreno. But it's a damn good fight. Yeah, the win. And if Moreno wins, he'll probably. Tantosia Moreno from earlier this year was one of the best fights of the year.

It may be the fight of the year. It was so freaking good. So, yeah, I would love to see that one again. Moreno Royva would love to see that one again too, because that was one of those crazy ones where it was crazy. and then Moreno got him down. Royval got hurt, so we never really got... I don't know. I feel like we never really truly got that fight

to some degree. So, yeah, man. To answer your question, yes, I think the winner of that fight will get a title shot. Because it's damn good. And yes, we try to make Diego Lopez. I would have loved to have seen it, but fortunately it didn't happen.

Eric, go ahead. Do you think Colby is going to, retire i did this fight because i'm seeing rumors that colby might retire that's all done i mean if he wins why would he retire if he wins he could get he could get a conno maguire fight like he could get that fight so i if he wins he's i don't think he retires if he loses i still don't think he retires i mean it kind of depends on how it happens they have colby loses like a close decision i don't think he retires if he just gets if he gets kicked in the face and brutally knocked out maybe he takes a break i don't know there's still fights for him

that people would want to see colby is still a name they could do colby versus porre like there's there's fights we could make with colby and even and even then like if he loses to leon like is he truly out of the title picture? Because what if they do Leon versus Bola Muhammad after that and B'Lahal wins? With the story of those two guys, Colby could just get right back in there. Like, it's, he's got that swing,

that sway over Dana and the brass right now. The UFC, like, they set Gilbert Burns and Mazzadol up for Miami. And Dana was like, I don't care of Mazadol, basically essentially said, like, I don't care if Mazadol does a fly. flying flippity-dippity, somersault triangle choke to Gilbert Burns. Even though Leon versus Mazadol would do like a million pay-per-view buys,

we're still giving it to Colby, like just immediately. So I'll say no. If he wins, he's definitely not retiring. He loses, probably not. But if he gets dusted, which I don't think he's going to, that might be something different. So we'll see what happens. We'll go to Ani, then we'll go to Daniel.

Maybe we'll go to Ani. Oh, wait a minute. Ani, I think we have you. What's up? Hello. It's coming back. It's a free-for-all Friday. I hope it's not too noisy on my end.

I'm just walking back home. So very quickly, I would like to address the situation with Ian Gary as well. I really like Ian Gary's fighting style. And I sincerely hope that all his... out of the octagon antics don't, you know, sort of shadow how skillful he is. It's really nice to see him fight. I mean, I just hope that he tries to, you know, showcase his skills rather than the other stuff, just shadowing everything else. And another thing, I feel like Tom Aspinon, I mean, Tom Aspinon is my boy.

I met him. Like, I had like a 15-minute conversation with him. It was amazing. I don't think he is marketing his value to John Jones very well. You know, if he goes to John and he says, John, you want to fight Steepen-Nichich who got brutally knocked out, knocked out by Francis and Ganu. You want to fight him in Madison Square Garden.

Okay. Or do you want to fight me? A guy who knocked out Sergei Pavlovich devastatingly in Wembley. Do you want a headline, do you want to be one of the first two MMA fighters to headline a stadium show in the UK? I think that would be better for your legacy. And you could beat me and I'm from a different generation. So that's good for your legacy as well. I just think Askenal needs to, you know, market himself better.

But it's all right. So my before Friday question for you is, you know, we've had a lot of people on Haka for morning talk about their mental health. And you also just mentioned how Mark Montoya and Factory X helped Chris Gutierrez from a mental standpoint. So I want to ask you, and you do not have to answer this. In your career, who was that one person or like a couple of, people, friends or colleagues, whoever it is, who helped you, you know, mentally or who kept encouraging you, you know what I mean? Who was that person in your life for you, if that makes sense?

And yes, and I'm a research student, as has told you, many times. And just tuning into your show or just listening to you talk and sometimes go on your rant actually makes my day and takes my mind. daughter the stress that is a PhD. Thank you, Mike. Merry Christmas in advance. You too, buddy. Thank you very much. Lots to unpack there. The Ian Gary thing, look, this, he, outside of like probably, like, I don't know if Ian becomes a bigger story than Patty this week, but there's a chance that happens. I think Ian's talked about a lot this week because, you know, he's going to go to Media Day and say a bunch of stuff. Because that's just how he is and sometimes that rubs people the right way and sometimes that rubs people the wrong way

shot o'malley talked a bunch of grease in this too and when chito vera beat him everyone talked a whole bunch of shit about john o'malley everybody everyone fell off the train this guy sucks overrated all that took some time came back reevaluated still kind of talked about bunch greasiness, but did more so from a business perspective. And now he's one of the biggest stars in the sport. Just how this works sometimes. That's just how this works sometimes. But Ian's in a, obviously this is a little bit different than Sean. With everything going on, people just decided to like hate Ian, fighters, a lot of fans, etc. And look, there are, I don't dive into that other, the stuff with his, with his wife and stuff like that. It's not in my business.

I don't give a shit about any of that. I have talked about, you know, the gym etiquette, if you will, the showing up with cameras, all that stuff, him being asked to leave, renegade for those reasons. At least that's what Leon said. And if that's the case, totally agree with it. Totally agree with Kilcliffe doing the same. You just don't do that. Like, you just don't do that with the cameras and everything like that, especially if you're Leon Edwards and you're a champion, you might actually fucking fight this guy. So I understand that. But if he goes out there and melts Vicente Lucke on Saturday,

people are going to, not that they're going to forget about it, but they are going to be like, all right, man, got to give him props. Dude talks a lot of shit. We thought he would lose. And then he goes out wins in devastating fashion.

Like that is, winning changes everything, man. Like, look at Arm and Surukia right now. I mean, he's kind of said some things that have, kind of got him back into the heel persona, but he was like public enemy number one heading into UFC Austin after the whole Bobby Green run in. And now look at him. Dude goes out and just ice has been healed there. You should. Winning changes everything. Changes perception, changes all of it. Now, if he does be Vicente Lucay, how does he handle himself after that? Patty's dealing with that as

well. Patty's going to have a pretty interesting next couple of weeks because if he loses the Tony Ferguson, boy, is it going to get rough. And if he beats Tony Ferguson, it ain't going to get any better. He said it right. This is a lose, lose fight. So, yeah, it's, it's, Gary's in a tough spot. It's in a tough spot. The Aspedal think, look, Tom Aspinall can market himself however the hell he wants. And John Jones ain't fighting them. I know Jed wants to do this whole crusade and we should all call about John for being afraid of Tom Aspinall. Look, he ain't afraid of Tom Aspinall. For realties. But if I respect the crusade, I respect what Jeds try to do, I respect the gimmick. I love it. We all know that it's not true. At the end of the day, this is about prize fighting and making money.

And even though all of us in this room would prefer to see John Jones fight Tom Aspinall, the casual, we're going to watch John Jones fight Steepa. If that fight happens, let's say international fight week in July. What are we going to? Are we going to sit that one out? Are we going to sit out in international fight week because it's not Tom Aspinall? Of course not. We're going to watch it. And guess who else is going to watch it?

Casual viewers who know who these two guys are are going to watch that fight. More are going to buy that fight on pay-per-view, even though all of us would rather see Aspidal. More people are going to buy John Jones versus Steepa than they are going to buy John George v. Tom Aspel. Just the way that it is, and John is well aware of that. Now, is there a world where John and Tom could happen?

Yes, there is a world where that could happen. Tom Aspedal's next fight needs to be in Manchester, somewhere in the UK, defending that interim title, and he needs to have the performance of a freaking lifetime. And get that star pop. That's how you get John's attention. That's how you get his attention. Get a couple of wins. get over with the people, become headline material,

become a tiered star, that's how you get John's attention. Right now beating Sergey Pavlovich at MSG on short notice. It's a great win. And all of us want to see that, him fight John Jones, super compelling fight. But in the UFC's eyes, in John's eyes, he's just like, no, I can make like millions of dollars more to fight Steepay. Why would I fight Tom Aspinall right now? And John's kind of earned that right to do that.

love them or hate him but yeah he's going to go ahead and fight stepe's probably going to take some time off as if he wins his next fight maybe two will become the will become the champion he will graduate from interim to undisputed and then if he can go on a nice little run and get over john will could come back and do that that's pretty much what he said he wants to make money He wants huge fights. And as much as we would love to see John versus Tom Aspinall, John versus anybody is big, but John versus Depe is the bigger fight.

It just is. It's the bigger fight. It's the more attractive fight to the UFC because they bring in a casual audience that they just won't get with Tom Aspinall. They just won't. So I don't think it's going to happen. it's certainly not going to happen next.

Could it happen in a year, year and a half, two years, maybe? But Tom's going to have to win like three or four more fights before John Jones is like, all right, bet, I'll fight this guy, because we can make money together. And John certainly ain't going to, he's not going to do Tom Aspinall any favors, stadium show or not. He's not going to do Tom any favors.

It's not going to go to Tom's home country and fight him. no way. I could do that. Why would he? Daniel, go ahead. I do. Have a nice day. My question is, I personally never talk about Connor McCracker since a few years.

But you mentioned his name if Colby wins or whatever. It's for Colby or maybe for Connor if he's coming back. My question is, and maybe you can give me an answer question. and an honest question answer. If Connor, you feel that Connor is somehow competitive in the UFC anymore, in the welter world,

or if he's coming back to the lightweight and do one fight, or is he just this leftover paper view making money cash cow, or you see any possibility that Connor is ever able to come back in a in a in a in a in a supportive really competitive way

thanks mike i'm not going to rule it i won't rule it out i won't rule it out i don't know i mean it's all it's on him he's got the skills dude can still fight just i don't know if he can fight for more than like eight minutes anymore that's that's the thing could he beat michael chandler yes he could be Michael Chandler. But if that fight gets to like round three,

could Chandler win? Sure. I don't know. It all depends. Is Chandler going to like fight Connor? Not saying that if he like wrestles Connor, that's a bad strategy. I'm not like knocking him for it. But it's like Chandler going to say F it and just be UFC Chandler

and just get into a striking battle with Connor? If that's the case, Connor could win that fight. If Chandler's going to be more Bellator Chandler, and just go for the win and wrestle and take Connor down a bunch. I think that's a better option for him. But Connor, I think with that kind of fight is competitive with anybody right now. Like, him and Gachi would be ridiculous.

Like, Gachi's durability would probably get him the win. But he's going to hit Justin Gachi. There's no doubt about it. He's going to punch Justin Gachi in the face. So that is a super fun fight. And I think Gage's durability would be the difference. Like, could Connor go on an incredible run and win a title and then beat? Could Connor, like, win the lightweight title and then just go out and dust Armand Saruky it and Jalen Turner, all those guys?

I wouldn't bet on it. But could he go out and beat Chandler and maybe beat a Covington or something? I guess. I don't know. We haven't seen him in so long. So we don't, it's hard to even answer that question. Like, you look good in the first round of the first round of the first. first port of the second porre fight and then poor he started to turn it on

poorie kind of dusted him in the second fight or the third fight i don't know i got to see what he looks like first we got to kind of see how this chandler fight goes to to really answer he's been out for so long his body has changed everything about him seems to have changed so it's tough to answer i'll take two more good for it sniper I got you. I got you. And he's gone. We will go to Nicholas. Nicholas has been just crushed by the wheel of doom over and over again.

Maybe today is the day. Maybe it is. Maybe it isn't. It doesn't look like it is. The wheel of doom continues to spin. Yeah, it's not going through. All right. Well, we tried.

Oh, Cole wants to jump in for one last comment. Cole, go ahead. Morning, Mike. I just got one short one for you. Is this do or die for Anthony Smith this weekend? Do or die? Do or die? I mean, it's definitely do or die for title hopes.

And it seems like he could be so far away, but he really isn't. With this little ongoing beef with Pereira. I don't think it's, it's like do or stay you know what I mean like if he wins I think he's got a better chance to win than people are giving him credit for

I mean there is money coming in on Anthony Smith now I think Smith open is the favorite memory serves it correctly but Cleo got up to like minus 230 or something but now it's down to minus 200 or a little lower than that so the types of fights Anthony thrives in And as good as Khalil Roundtree's run has been,

this is certainly his toughest fight. Certainly. Even at this point, where Anthony is no longer throwing his fastball at 95 miles an hour. I thought Khalil lost the Dustin Jacoby fight, but Roundtree is a violent, vicious man. So look, if Anthony starts getting takedowns,

it's a different fight. So, yeah, I don't think it's die. I don't think it's due, or die, I think it's do or you just kind of stay where you're at. You can fight or not fight. You know what I mean? But if Anthony wins, you might find himself in a freaking title fight if the UFC wants to get Alex Pereira out there in the first quarter of the year.

So do or stay, not do or die. Yes. Yes. Okay. Thank you. Appreciate you having me. Heck of a morning. I just wanted to get your quick thoughts on what Chris Gutierrez needs to do.

do this weekend in order to get the win because I'm trying to think of a game plan of what he could do and I can't come up with anything because I think Song, uh, Song Yadong is just going to run him over. So just your thoughts on what he should do in this fight and how he can win. That's all. I mean, it ain't going to be easy. Um, I mean, there's paths. I think the longer this fight goes, the better it is for Chris. And Chris is a pretty durable guy. I mean, I'll make this real simple because I want to get one more in before we go, we get out of here. But don't get taken down and don't get knocked out. That's pretty much it.

If Gutierrez can defend takedowns and not get just absolutely blasted out of there in the first eight minutes of the fight, I think he's got a chance. I do. Those leg kicks are pretty nasty, man. Now, is there a world where song just goes out and obliterates Chris in a round and a half? Sure. Like I said, Chris has never been knocked out, but he's not fought a guy who can hit his heart as song can. This is a hitter.

This is a big time hitter. And Song could wrestle, and I think he's going to have an advantage there. But Chris starts landing those leg kicks and he could stay upright. I don't care if you're, I don't care who you are. It's going to take a toll over 25 minutes. So I think he's got a chance. I think he has a better than a plus 300 chance to win this fight. My pick will probably be Song Yadong,

but to say there's like no path to victory, and it's not an easy one. Just stay on your feet. Stay on your feet. Don't get knocked out and don't get wrestled. Don't take, don't get taken down. If this turns into like a range kickboxing match and Gutierrez could show that chin and show that durability

and he can start just accumulating damage over time, he's got a shot here I think he's got a I think he's got a shot Jamir take us all oh Mike why is it why it felt like every

MMA journalist it's like kind of praying on like the UFC's downfall with this UFC case it's like every single time information comes out about and it's like

kind of negative about the UFC is like they're like tweeting from a happy place about oh these emails have just been released it's like I feel like a lot of MMA fans as well

it's like these people watch UFC every weekend and they say they love UFC so much but it's like they hate them as well it's like which one is it makes sense yeah um I think celebrate is kind of

a tough word yeah it's a tough it's a tough word like I don't think like there are certain people who are like it seems like that they are not that they're celebrating it but it's just they're bringing it to life or bringing it to light and

I think and this is something that I've said pretty much from the beginning here because I honestly like I am not I am no John Nash I I'm familiar with this but I have not been ingrained in this like some of the other journalists have like John and who's done an incredible job the thing I've been saying is that for the for really the first time since this new boom of growth for the UFC which is the pandemic and we're getting all these newer fans. I think for the first time,

newer fans, some older fans, are seeing how dirty this business actually is. And I think those people who have been defending the UFC and defending Dana for literally everything are starting to see that this ain't all sunshine and roses and nothing is but one thing I could pretty much guarantee

that is if you really take a look at this stuff you're going to see that this business can be super dark and we just look at look at the shit that's just come out this week just look at the emails about Nate Diaz look at the payout structures proof that some of the big weeks in the UFC have used their business as a credit card to some extent. This is potentially the biggest story in the history of the sport. And I don't think anybody's like celebrating it, but this changes almost everything if this goes to the fighters or the past fighters. Like everything. And this includes PFL.

Like everything will change. Not just for the UFC and this whole, are they monopoly or not. This changes the sport. And at this point, I know just going, being a sports fan and seeing some of these big leagues dealing with this stuff over the years, the UFC is going to try to settle this. And they should. And they should try to settle for whatever it costs. Just settle this shit.

And that's it. but I'm here to tell you, I don't think it's going to get settled. I don't think there's any amount of money that is going to settle this. Because if the whole thing about this is changing the sport and changing business practices, if you settle, then you look like a moron. Like you just, you look bad. If this is, that it just shows like, yeah, we got back what's ours. That's great.

But your whole stance since the beginning, has been not only do we want to get back what's ours but we want to change the entire sport we want to change business practices we want to change how everything is and unless you go the full way with this thing you're not going to get it you're not going to get it jimier has more to say i'll bring them back in real quick what else you want to say man that makes sense i'm not saying the ufc hasn't done bad things like yeah that's obviously bad but my my whole point was just like people are celebrating. I know you said that you don't feel like it,

but maybe it's not the journalist or say, but I feel like when some tweet like this Aaron, I don't know it's last damn Aaron guy, but when he tweets, it's like he's happy to put that out, but he won't put the information about that, like, kind of, some good things that has came about the UFC

that they have done about payouts. When people say, I think it was like the champions payout or something like that. And he, he didn't say anything about that, but he was just kind of highlighting just all of the bass

stuff by the UFC to make them like a monopoly but I'm not saying I was I see what you're saying yeah like the UFC's done like fucked up stuff and it's like I understand with that um but I just I just see it a lot you know and then with the Dana

teutu which I got mad about the Dana comments about PFL and Bellator like the acquisition of Bellator it's like what he said was true two too shitty organizations who don't sell tickets who who television ratings are aren't the greatest I don't know the ESPN Plus for PFL, but they're not the greatest.

They buy each other. They're talking about their second. How are in a second note? Everything that he said, everything that he said about that was true. People got mad about that and we're getting pissed about it. But was that a lie? No, I get what you're saying. I saw some tweets about this.

And one person in particular I saw was like, look, I forget who was. I want to say it was maybe Eric, the compound lawyer. somebody said something the effect of like look you are in this like business changing lawsuit right now potentially and your entire defense here is you have to prove that you are not monopolizing the industry and for data to come out and be like essentially saying like they ain't a threat We own this bitch. You know what I mean? Like that's like some of those tweets.

But again, and I agree with you. Data is not wrong. Data is completely right about that. And we've been saying this from Jump Street about the PFL. We have done segments on BTL about how awful PFL is when it comes to the way they promote themselves. Don Davis putting out that graphic earlier this year. We spent like 40 minutes.

minutes on BTL shitting on that graphic because it was like the dumbest thing we've ever seen. And Don Davis is got to be a meme probably forever for the co-leader thing. It ain't going to happen. It ain't going to happen. You came out when you made this deal and you basically said like, we're head to head with the UFC now. Our roster is as good as the UFC's. We're the co-leader.

You see how quickly the narrative has changed a little bit? It's not that now we're the co-leader. Now it's like, hey, in five years we'll be the co-leader. Hey, if Dana fights back with us, that's one step closer to being the co-leader. We're quoting Gandhi now. It's just, it's all, like, they have a little bit of momentum right now. But like, if, honestly, if you think Dana White has lost a wink of sleep over the PFL, he hasn't he's slept as peaceful as he has all year with this whole deal 1,000% he is not worried about

this at all not at all and even if he was all he had to do is watch that fucking paperview a couple weeks ago and he was like all right good night everybody he probably used it to go to sleep that thing ended like an hour and a half ago still happening i think much work to do so much work it's not even funny and i'm look we have not been very kind to pfl since don went on the m m m m hour and this deal was announced in the way they have announced it and how don has just tried to respond to dana white um it hasn't been good and it's well does it's honestly well deserved too uh you got to be better you got to be better do i appreciate don as a character yes Do I agree with like anything he says?

Not particularly, especially when hashtag mathematics. This whole, well, now we have the same number, same percentage of ranked fighters across the board the UFC does. No, you don't. No, you don't. And here's the other thing. You have outside of Francis Ngano who is not even fighting for you, you have no stars. None. No stars.

You can't win without stars. You just can't. I don't care how good your roster is. And their roster is really good. Getting Patchy Mix and Johnny Eblen and Vadim Knavloff and Chris Seiborg, even though she's not in the prime of her career anymore. And some of these other fighting, getting the pit bulls and getting some of these, getting A.J. McKee.

Like, that's great. But you have no stars. None. You can't generate interest without stars. You need them. It has to happen. But you don't have any outside of Francis, who's not even a fucking MMA fighter right now.

He's a boxer. He's a boxer. His star ability was because he boxed. Tyson Fury had nothing to do with PFL. Nothing. He just happened to be on their roster. And even during the broadcast, all that was mentioned was the UFC,

the former UFC heavyweight champion. I don't think it was anything. he mentions a PFL in that broadcast. Despite saying all this, and this is, I feel the same way about this as I did about Bellator before they were sold. We were tough on Bellator. Always have been.

But because we mostly were tough on them because we know what they were capable of. We know they could have been better than they were. We know they could have promoted better. We knew they had the roster. We knew they could do cool things because they've done them. You remember the whole Featherweight Grand Prix thing where they had the drawing and they had people come up like that was fucking awesome. That was awesome. That was great stuff.

And they never did it again. And we were just like, come on, guys. Like you could do it. Just try. Just try. You could do this. And they never did. They never did it again.

And they just couldn't draw interest. And then they had people in their staff calling out media for not promoting them enough. What do you want us to promote? Tell me. Tell me what we're supposed to do. We talk to your guys. We talk to your gals. We broke news for you. We covered all the events. Post-fight stuff, et cetera. What else are we supposed to do? There's nothing we could do. We're not promoting your brand. We will talk to your fighters and get the word out. But that's like all we're supposed to do. That's all we're supposed to do. And now, PFL has to do the same thing.

Like you have a different kind of a product. You have a different kind of a product. And it's cool. I like the season format. But now you have to work on making this digestible to the people. You cannot do. If they come back next year and do one event for their world championship with six or seven title fights,

that is legitimately the dumbest thing you could do promotionally. This needs to be a two-night thing and it can't be on pay-per-view. It can't. 2024 is a huge year for the PFO. And it's a huge year for the UFC too because this lawsuit's going to be super crazy. And if this thing goes to trial,

we're going to learn a lot more. Not just about the UFC. We're going to get texts from managers. We're going to see a whole bunch of days. different stuff. And a lot of people are going to get potentially exposed with this whole thing. So yeah, are some people celebrating it? I don't know if you're celebrating it more than just telling the story and speaking kind of truth. I mean, at the end of the day, like, you could just see all this stuff for yourself and just be like, yeah, like, they're not wrong.

Exposing the business practices. Like, you could see it all. And this shit says it's just going to get worse. Like I feel like this is the tip of the iceberg. We're starting to see payouts. Like, like full payouts. Like not just the commission payouts. We're seeing like full on payouts. Like Connor McGregor, while you look at the numbers and you're like, wow, he did pretty good. He should have been making way more, way more money. All of them. Like just slow percentages. So look, at the end of the day, I ain't celebrating anything. We're going to follow this story. We're going to check it out.

This could be and has the potential to be the biggest story that has ever happened in the history of the sport. If this goes to trial, boy, oh boy, is 2024 going to be fascinating? It is going to be fascinating. But again, follow John Nash, doing an engagement. just the Lord's work with this stuff. I know it ain't positive, man. Like, I know. This ain't the prettiest shit to talk about.

We want to talk about dudes getting in there and fighting. I get it. I get it. As fans, like, you don't, a lot of fans don't care about this stuff. You just want to see guys get in there and punch each other in the face. And that's cool. And I get where you're coming from. And there's a part of me, too, feels the same way.

Sometimes it's wish you could sit back and be fans. That's just not how it works. That's not how it works. This business is cool and it's ugly. And I don't think you guys know the half of it. There's a lot of shit I've been told off the record that I'm just like, what the fuck is going on here? But that's how this works.

And I think you guys are going to learn a lot more over the next year or so. And then you guys can decide for yourselves. You can decide whether or not you want to celebrate. You could decide whether you don't give a fuck. And that's up to you. Completely up to you. And I ain't going to sway one way or the other. But I think it is imperative.

And I think this whole thing is super important for people to understand what actually happens here and what has been happening over the last 20 years. And maybe this will all invoke positive change in the future. Who the fuck knows? But it's up to you guys to decide for yourselves how you all feel. And you see what's out there now. You're getting just a taste of it. just a small taste, and I'll leave it at that.

But yeah, it's going to be a wild year. It's going to be, 2024 is going to be nuts. Everyone says like 2023 has been crazy and it has been. I think 2024 is going to be crazier than 2023. And this could, and this includes if Tony beats Patty and Colby wins the Welterweight title. 2024, I think, will go down as a crazier year than 2023. three. I feel it in my bones, my friends. I feel it in my bones. But we'll be here to talk about it. It will be on all the other shows to talk about it. But it's time to go. I have to leave.

Thank you all very much. I appreciate you. D.C. Betts, jump back on tomorrow. We'll cut you to the front of the line. We'll do that, Nicholas, you as well. Nicholas, we're going to get you some better connection, man. I'm trying to get you through, but it just ain't working. So we'll try again tomorrow. for the best. A little over, little under an hour from right now. Luke Thomas returns to MMA fighting for BTL, him and Jed. It's going to get saucy and it's going to rule. So we'll see you at 12.30 p.m. Eastern. We'll be back here tomorrow at 10 a.m. Eastern.

We've got a preview show tomorrow at 1 p.m. Eastern. We'll get through UFC Shang Vegas. And then it's onwards and upwards to UFC 296. It's going to be a busy week. I'll be doing some traveling. I'll be in New York, obviously, for the watch party, but I'll be doing some boots on the ground work in Orlando leading into UFC 296 as well.

So stay with us, MAPFutty.com. We got you. And we'll see you later on. Have a great rest of your Thursday. Have a heck of a morning, everybody. The Vox Media Podcast Network. Okay, only 10 more presents to wrap. You're almost at the finish line.

But first, there, the last one. Enjoy a Coca-Cola for a pause that refreshes. Hi, I'm Sophia Loper Carroll, host of the Before the Chorus podcast. We dive into the life experiences behind the music we love. Artists of all genres are welcome, and I've been joined by some pretty amazing folks, like glass animals. I guess that was the idea was to try something personal and see what happened. And Japanese breakfast.

I thought that the most surprising thing I could offer was an album about joy. You can listen wherever you get your podcasts. Oh, and remember, so much happens before the chorus.