MMA Fighting - HOAM | Will Jon Jones Retire After Potential Stipe Miocic Rebooking?

Episode Date: November 3, 2023

Jon Jones was supposed to headline UFC 295 next Saturday before tearing his pectoral muscle, thus delaying his matchup with decorated former heavyweight champion Stipe Miocic until sometime in 2024. While it seemed like the Miocic matchup could be the final one for Jones, does the delay change things at all? On an all-new edition of Heck of a Morning, MMA Fighting's Mike Heck discusses Jones' future, and makes the case that "Bones" could stick around after the Miocic fight. Additionally, listener questions include favorite fights of all-time, why a Jones vs. Francis Ngannou fight will never happen, the UFC's monster financials for the first half of 2024, leaked payouts for the likes of Conor McGregor, Ronda Rousey, and more due to the ongoing anti-trust lawsuit, and much more. You can listen live to Heck of a Morning Tuesdays, Thursdays, and Fridays at 10 a.m. ET on the MMA Fighting Twitter Spaces. Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Subscribe to MMA Fighting Check out our full video catalog Like MMA Fighting on Facebook Follow on Twitter Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Support for this show comes from the Audible Original, the downloaded two, ghosts in the machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudullian and the rest of the Phoenix colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever. Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprise his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the Audible Original Blockbuster. The Downloaded, it's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking, What are you willing to lose to save the ones you love?

The Downloaded 2, Ghosts in the Machine. Available now, only from Audible. Support for this show comes from the Audible original, The Downloaded 2. Ghosts in the Machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudulian and the rest of the Phoenix colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever.

Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprised his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the audible original blockbuster, the downloaded. It's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking, what are you willing to lose

to save the ones you love? The downloaded two, Ghosts in the Machine, available now, only from Audible. To the Vox Media Podcast Network. In November 3rd, 2023, and it is indeed a heck of a morning. We are live on the M.A. Fighting Twitter spaces

you can hear the show in its entirety, short and thereafter on the M.A. Fighting Podcasting Network. What's going on, everybody? I am Mike Hack. Hope you're all having a wonderful week. It is Friday. Which means we get to have a little more fun on this show.

It's a free-for-all Friday. Which means we can talk about MMA. We can talk about boxing. We can talk about whatever the hell you want. We can talk about the media space. All sorts of fun stuff. We are also on the eve of UFC Sao Paulo. That is going down tomorrow, beginning at 6 p.m. Eastern.

card at 9 p.m. Eastern. The weigh-ins for the most part are done. And there is a lot of drama today, my friends. A lot of drama on the scale. Not in the main event. Both Jailton, Almeida and Derek Lewis made weight. Derek Lewis is a 29 pound advantage over Jailton Almeida. Lewis hit 265 on the nose. Jailton Almeada was 236. Co-made event between Gabriel Bonfim and Nicholas Dalby's ago, Rodrigo Nassimto, Dantel Maze's ago. Kyle Brazzes. Alio, Abbas Maghavadoff as a go, Hidalfa Vietta, Armin Petrosian as a go. Ishmael Bonfee missed weight by three and a half pounds.

He fights Vince Pichel, who also missed weight. He missed weight by a pound as of right now. I believe Pichel is an extra hour. So I think he gets another crack at it, but there's no way Bonfim's going to make weight. So that's a tough one. But again, if you're Bonfeme, like why? not so what you're gonna lose 20% of your purse maybe 30 get all the advantages you can you're

making like 12 and 12 I mean this is this is what I'm talking about this is what I'm talking about why put yourself through the pain of cutting those extra poundage for nothing if you can get the wind bonus on the back end it's just so silly that you can get away with this Brenner and Khrushuski is a go that That's a catchweight of 165 with Khrushchewski stepping in on short notice. We're not Fakritinov versus Eliza Zlesquito Santos. That is a go. I'm really looking forward to that fight.

Daniel Marco successfully made weight. Victor Hugo, his opponent did not. He waited at 138 and a half. Another big miss. Vitor Petrino Medesda McCoscus ago. Angel Hill, Denisi Gomez is a go. Montserrat Ruiz, 114 and a half, taking on Eduardo Mara, Mara, who missed.

weight by three and a half pounds. If I must her at Ruiz, I might well take it. She didn't take that one. Maybe just take the show money and call it a day. I don't know. I don't know how that's going to work out. And then Kaui Fernandez and Mark Jekasey, good to go.

So four fighters, missed weights. That might go down to three if Pichel makes it, but all the misses were pretty significant outside of Pichel missing by a pound so we'll see what happens there if we get any updates i will let you guys know but like i said it's a free for all friday let's party let's do this yeah yeah kick us off what's going on big mike how you doing happy friday how are you i'm good i'm good um i recently i just had one question for you i recently read um henry serudo was just talking about um kind of like the qualifications of a u sce champion i guess in terms how it's being diluted in a sense of how uh

fighters are getting championship fights and he was talking about specific to aspinol and pavlovich and how he thinks it's more of a number one's contenders match than it is a championship fight for the interim title so i just wanted to get your take on that thank you half friday i mean he's not wrong but who care but like at the end of the day like look i'm not saying he's wrong because these go these two guys don't deserve to fight for an interim title he's right because the titles are props now. It's not a meritocracy in the UFC. It's just like either a main event falls out and we just create an interim title out of the thin blue sky, which is technically what they're doing here, even though you can make a compelling case that

these two guys could fight for the actual belt right now. Because think about what happened last year. Think about what happened last year. Yuri Praschka gets hurt. Now he's not the champion. John Jones gets hurt. Going to be out eight months or so. Doesn't get stripped of the belt. I know they, look, and I understand this. I get in this discussion all the time. Well, Yuri said he relinquished the title.

I don't believe that for a second. I think Yuri kind of accepted it and understood what the plan was. Sure. Do I think Yuri walked into UFC headquarters and just threw the title on Dana White's desk and said, I'm no longer the champion. I don't want to hold this division? No, I don't believe that for seconds. And he's basically said the same.

So what's the difference here? What's the difference? Yuri, first fight back, it's a tile shot. Why can't John do the same? I don't understand. But I understand that John's a big star or whatnot. But he's not wrong. We can just create title fights.

We can just create them. We did it with Cyril Gunn and Derek Lewis. We've done this a million times. We have to stop treating these. And there are certain cases like there are big time title fights and it's like to crown the best fighter in the world in that division. But it's not always like that. Just look at what's happening in middle way right now.

Sean Strickland should be fighting Drick's Duplice in his next fight. Unequivocally, that should be the fight that's going to be made. But Hamzaa Chimayev could find his way into that title shot. after winning a majority decision against Kamara Usman. And Drick's Duplacy annihilated Robert Whitaker. Which win means more? Which win is more impressive? No disrespect to Hamza Atchimaev.

He got the job done. But it's a popularity contest in a lot of respects. You could have just made this fight without the interim title. And it would have been awesome. We add a little bit of stakes to it. And the good news is the guys get more money. So I appreciate that aspect of it. But I can't believe I'm saying this.

Henry Sehudo is not 100% wrong here. It's not 100% wrong. The titles are being diluted. It does happen a lot. And it's been happening for so long. We have to create belts for certain events. Remember UFC 208? They created the featherweight title just because they didn't have a main event.

They canceled the January pay-per-view. So out of nowhere, they just created the featherway title. Because they had to. they created a BMF title just so they can have a title fight at Madison Square Guard at UFC 244 did the same at UFC 291 got to have a title fight let's just create belts but UFC is just crushing it right now currently now this anti-trust lawsuit could change some things but I don't know if you guys saw what happened yesterday uh bloody elbow first reported it we got our hands on some numbers too.

I'm telling you, when this thing goes to trial, we're going to see a lot more. Now we're seeing actual paydays. We're seeing actual paydays. Look at Connor McGregor. UFC 189. Made anywhere between $2.64 million and $3.3 million, rounding it up. Flat pay was $500,000.

Full payout included a $2.1 million. discretionary bonus. You have C-194, the Jose-A-aldo fight. Connor McGregor made right around $4.5 million to the Jose-A-aldo fight. Disclose pay $500,000, got everything all in. You have C-196. Connor made almost $6 million, $5.5.5 mil. Disclosed pay was a million. That's everything on top of it. 202 right around the same. Nate made $4.3 million for that fight with pay-per-view, and Connor made $7 million for the Eddie Avers fight, which seems like a lot of money. But if you actually look at the gate and the pay-per-view numbers, which were revealed back then, that's a small piece of the pie, considering what McGregor meant to that company in 2016.

We got, like, you could see Ronda Rousey's pay on M.A.fighting.com. Liz Carmouche fight. She made between 262,000, 574,000. Her biggest payday was the Amanda, excuse me, the Amanda Nunes fight. made close to $5.5 million. Disclosed pay was $3 million, while Nunes' disclosed pay was $200,000. John Jones more of the same.

Making anywhere between a million and the first D.C. fight, close to $4 million. Again, these seem like big numbers, but compared to Gates and pay-per-view buys, it's just a small fraction of what they probably should be making. like most people thought Connor was making way more money than that. BJ Penn during his unbelievable run, the most he made was $475,000 for the Nick Diaz fight at UFC 137. That's it.

CM Punk made a one over a million dollars for the Mickey Gall fight, made 500,000 plus bonuses over a million dollars, over a million dollars while micky gall made $30,000 for that fight see this is just a taste of what this antitrust lawsuit could bring to the table my friends this is just a taste let's go to thomas what's up thomas thomas bounce out and bounce back in it's not going through for some reason uh let's try four on sniper yep i got you hey heck of a morning mike i just wanted to ask real quick um of the fighters that missed the wait have they confirmed if they have canceled the fights or not, or are we still waiting on their announcement for that?

Thanks. I think we're still waiting. As if right now, let me just check. I would, they're probably going to wait for Pichel. Let me just check the OFC's site. I assume the Pichel fight will move forward because I believe, okay, so one fight is official. The Mara, Montserrat Ruiz, go, 30% goes to Montserrat Ruiz.

Bonfim, Hugo, those fights aren't official as of yet. But I believe Bonfim and Pichel have the same manager, so I think the negotiations will be pretty easy. I think Pichel is probably going to wait to see if you can make 156 before starting that negotiation, because then he doesn't get anything from Bonfim if he doesn't make weight, but if he makes the weight, then he can get a percentage of the purse, which isn't going to be a whole hell of a lot for being honest. But I would guess all these fights are going to happen. But I'll let you guys know.

But yes, we just found out via the promotion, Mara Conejo Ruiz, Will Boo Ford, 30% of the purse goes to Conejo. But tough scenes. Tough scenes in Sao Paulo this morning. J-MAC, go ahead. Just curious. I know that they have the UFC Chinese card coming up, and I just want to know if I'm hoping that White Waili-Zang versus Jan is on that card.

I just want to know if you have heard anything about that. And also, who would you like to see Paul Felder, the Irish Dragon, have for its first fight back? All right, thanks, Mike. Jim Miller is the answer to the second question. Just do it at UFC 300. I think that makes all the sense in the world. I think that makes all the sense in the world.

I had someone DM me and said, I have the, basically said like they had the perfect fight for Paul Feldar, and it's Patty Pimbledt after the Tony Ferguson fight. Why would Patty take that fight? If him and his team are treating this like Tony's the dude and he's the most dangerous guy he's ever fought and all this, and he becomes like a top 15 dude, why would he fight Paul Felder in his comeback fight?

That doesn't make any sense to me. So Jim Miller's the correct answer. 100% Jim Miller's the correct answer. Love that idea. Love that. It's been a day, my friends. I don't know why I don't know that remember this. Oh, now I remember.

The first question is, will Zhang Wei, Yan Shanan, headline Shanghai. I would be stunned if it does. I don't know what's going to headline. I'm hearing rumblings that it's either going to,

it could be like a middleweight fight of some sort, but I don't know. It appears like maybe Roman DeLizze is going to be involved in one half of this fight. I don't know what's going on. I know Ali tweeted about it.

I know Roman kind of teased, possibly fighting it. in Shanghai. And then Ali sort of tweeted that Deleidze is a gangster and takes tough fights no matter what. So I don't know. Maybe they do like Deleadze versus Whitaker on that card or something. I don't know.

I really don't know. But I would assume that's going to be announced. That'll probably be announced tomorrow. Or maybe we can confirm it today. We'll see. Thomas, go ahead. Hey, Mike. Hack of a morning to you guys.

Heck of a morning for me in the UK. Just wanted to ask you. I don't know if you would have seen or would have been around the news of the death of Adam Johnson, who plays for the Nottingham Panthers in the Elite League in the UK. So it's ice hockey. I just wanted to see what, if you know anything about your kind of laws around neck guards. Basically, it was a stray tackle. The blade cut the guy's throat and he died pretty much within a few minutes of bleeding out.

It was awful. Yeah, that was tough, man. That was tough. I tried to like avoid it But like this This new Twitter like you just couldn't It looks I don't know

It looked pretty It looks pretty suss If we're being honest I don't want to go on and like Start accusing people of anything But it didn't look The aesthetics aren't great So I'm not sure what's going to happen

With that whole situation It just it sucks It sucks. It sucks It really sucks It's really all I can say. I don't really know what else is going to happen with it. But super unfortunate. I hate when that shit happens, man.

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For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region. See app for details. Serb, go ahead. Hey Mike, heck of a morning to you. Been in and out. I wasn't sure if you had heard this.

Your thoughts on the socks signing Craig Breslo to be the new head of ops there. Thank you. Heck of a morning. I don't know. I don't know. It's just a weird one. Like no one wants, like no one wanted to interview for the GM spot or like any of those positions like internally or externally. Like it's so weird.

And then Craig Breslow comes in out of nowhere and takes the head of Opshub. I don't know. I saw the pieces of the presser yesterday and like he said the right things. Oh, we got to do this. We have to have this new mentality and blah, blah, blah, blah. Well, then go on and spend some fucking money then. Go make a move. Have some balls.

What is going? Like, this is the Boston Red Sox. This isn't the Tampa Bay raise. This is the fucking Red Sox. Spend some money. Make a play. Make a move. Go get Otisox.

Otani. Otani wants to play in Boston. He wants to come there. Pay that man his money. Have some balls and sign them. And until that happens, or they make a significant move that impacts the future of this ball club, it's just going to be the same shit. It's just going to be the same stuff from the Red Sox that we've gotten for the last seven years, six years, five years. Since they won the title in 2018, they're like, you know what? going to trade the core of our team for nothing. Ugh. Fucking team. Sorry. Let's go to Crying Belly. Go ahead, Crying Belly. What's up, Mike?

Good morning. Nobody knows, obviously, but Derek Lewis is my favorite heavyweight. He always was since I started watching combat sports. So my question to you is, Does Derek Lewis have abs? And I didn't see the way in show.

They didn't have one. So I was wondering if you knew. And also, do you think Derek Lewis is going to win? Thank you. There were some abbeys there. I mean, Lewis looked good, man. He looks good, even at 265. Like, you can see it in his face.

He's all thin in the face. He's in really good shape. It doesn't have like a full six-pack, but. See, you can see some abspoken out of there. He didn't like let himself go or anything. Looks good. He looks good. He's in good shape.

The other question is, do I think he's going to win? I don't think he's going to win. I think it's a terrible matchup for him. However, Derek Lewis brings some things to the table that are very interesting. Like, his anti-Jiu-Jitsu is just not believing at it. So the big question in this fight is, because, look, Derek Lewis is getting taken down and he's going to get taken down within the first

minute of this fight. It's going to happen. My biggest question is can Derek Lewis stand back up? Because if he can't, this fight is not getting to round two. If he can, that's when things get very interesting. From a betting perspective, I think there's value on Derek Lewis

at plus 370. I do. I do. If it was like plus 290, probably not. But plus 370, I think there's a little bit of value there. I really do. but my pick is going to be Jelton Alameda. I think he's like straight pick, 50-50 money line odds.

Like everything's even. I'm picking Jeltsin Al-Mada. I don't think this fight gets to round three. Either Amada is just going to, let me see what I'm like, we could get like an Al-Mada T-KO here. But I just think, if Derek gets back up after that first take down,

the next 30. seconds are going to be interesting but if almeida gets him down again the fight's over so my pick is almeda i do think there's a little value at plus 370 louis is the bigger more experienced fighter for sure jeltsin has been in there with big dudes as well shemniel durahimov is not a small guy and jeltz had tossed that dude around like you there's nothing so we'll see my pick is almeida but if like I said a couple times this week already if the magic MMA betting money fairy dropped the 20 on me and said the only thing you can use this money for is to bet

money line Almeader or Lewis I'm picking Derek Lewis I would put it on Derek Lewis probably throwing the money away but I would definitely take a shot at plus 370 Ephron go ahead you're muted Ephron my bad all good um Hey, Mike, this from Oregon. Just had a quick question. I've been seeing posts about Tyson Fury flirting with retirement.

He's 35 years old and Ghana was 37. So I'm just, you know, kind of asking about that. And then also I have a question about John Jones retiring. Do you think it's a good idea? Because, you know, he's, I think he's 30, about the same age as in Ghanu. but you know he's kind of on his way out but yeah that's it um Jones is interesting because he's he still seems to have it he's 36 by the time he fights steep A like if that fight happens I'm guessing what happened international flight

week he'll be knocking like literally on the doorstep of 37 but at heavyweight he could fight another two or three years easily. So I don't think he's going to retire. I think he'll do the steep A fight. I don't think he fights either Aspinall or Pavilich. Maybe Aspinall in the future if like Aspinall wins the interim title and becomes the undisputed champ. Like if Jones does take a sabbatical, which I don't think he's going to, by the way.

I don't think he's going to. I'll explain in a moment. But no, I don't think John's going to retire. I don't think John's got to like flat out retire. Even if like, I'll explain myself in a second. But Tyson Fury thing, look, I've seen some tweets about it. There's reports he's contemplating it. This would be like the 337th time Tyson Fury

announced his retirement. So I don't believe it for a second. I don't believe it for a second. There's too much money to be made. And Tyson Fury has said many times, if he doesn't have anything going for him, if there isn't a fight to prepare for, he kind of loses his shit a little bit.

kind of like what Volkanowski said after he lost Islamakshed ballwing UFC 294 where it's like I don't have anything to prepare for or take you know have a goal set in mind from a career standpoint kind of throws me off a little bit if you guys recall Tyson retired before him and Francis like had that face off in the ring remember that that was going to be his final fight he was going to do maybe an exhibition with Francis remember that and then he came right back you think he's going to retire before this Usik fight, that Usik fight is so much more interesting now than it was

before this past Saturday. It is so much more interesting now. So I don't, and then a rematch with Francis is huge right now. It's gigantic. It's so big. I don't think he's going to retire. I don't buy it for a second. I don't buy it for a second. The John Jones thing, and I've been on record, on this show many, many times that I said, saying that John Jones, Steepay, if it happens at UFC 295, it's going to be Steepa's final fight, and then John will say I'm taking a break. I don't think John would actually say, like, I'm full on retiring. But I think he would just be like, all right, I'm going to go away for a minute, vacates, maybe the UFC vacates the title or whatever, and then they do the Pavlovich-Assadol fight anyways.

And then I was basically saying that if Aspinol won the title, it ran off a couple of defenses and his star power basically got to the point where it's like just about over the hump, that I think John would come back and fight him. Or the Ngano fight, obviously, if they could somehow, the egos could be set aside and we can make that happen. Which, by the way, again, there's literally nothing stopping that fight from being made other than the egos of the UFC, stopping it from happening because they don't want to co-promote with anybody instead of putting on the biggest fight they could make right now. And that is by far the biggest fight that they could be a part of right now.

Having said that, my opinion has changed a little bit. My opinion has changed. I'll give you a little spoiler. There is going to be a little roundtable coming out. And I was thinking about this a lot. And one of the questions that's on it is, will the winner of the UFC 295 co-main event be the UFC heavyweight champion at the end of the year? And I said no.

I said no because if John I'm playing sort of crystal ball here Jones Stepe probably happens

in July Jones beats Stepe that room what at least five months left for the year I don't know

if John actually retires at that point I think after the injury and the recovery and everything that he's gone through I think he's going to

stick around now if Tom Aspinall wins I think Jones is just going to go ahead and fight Tom Aspinall. I think that fight happens in 2025. I could see it happening. I could also see Tommy Aspinall defending the interim title at least once before we get to that point if he wins.

Pavlovich, I'm not really sure, but if Pavlovich just lunchboxes Tom Aspinall without a single takedown attempt defended, I still think Jones might consider that. I think Jones will milk this thing. I really do. I think he's going to milk it a little bit. Had this fight happened next Saturday, I didn't feel that way, but now we're getting extended here. Jones fights in March, doesn't fight again for over a year. Steep A.O. almost over three years by the time he fights.

I think John's going to milk this thing a little bit. So the heavyweight division is just going to be super weird next year. It's basically how I'll leave it. But now I don't think Jones is going to retire if he beat Stepe. I do think this will be Stepe's final fight win or lose. because I mean Steve B doesn't need to do this he'll do it for John

and that's it but I kind of feeling like John's not going to retire anymore I think he's going to stick around and fight one of these guys I do I kind of feel it we'll see

J-Stat glad did go through oh wait a minute Ebswaya hang tight J-Stat do we have you yeah can you hear me yep

Avzalai, just hang tight. As well, you'll mute yourself. I'll get back to you in a second. Jay Stack out there. Sure. Go ahead, Jay Stapp. What fight besides the Tom Aspenov, Pavlovich, are you looking forward to next Saturday?

Me personally, it's the Benoit St. Denis and Matt Provolta fight. That'll be all. I mean, that fight frigging rules. I can't wait for that one. That was one of my best Otno picks ever, and it came to fruition. And I said, I think I nailed everything about it.

I said main card opener, MSG, that should be what opens the show on pay-per-view. And we got it done. That might be the best out no pick I've ever had. Obviously, the main events is awesome. That's like, if there's one, if someone came to me and said, you can only watch one UFC fight the rest of the year,

what are you picking? It's Yuri versus Pereira. It's not even close. It's not even close. I like the Pat Sabatini-Dio-Lopez fight. fight. Matusharbekki and Nerulo Aliev is going to be an absolute wild affair. That fight is going to be absolutely nuts. The Satikov-Slaval's fight is interesting.

I really wanted to see the Steve Versag match Chanel fight but we get Alessandra Costa, so that should be fine. Ritchie Godinez, I think is going to be interesting. It's a fine card. This is just a lot of heavy lifting up the top. Like, Jessica and George, McKenzie Dern is, like, a fine fight. But I just feel like, I feel like Jessica Androge is just taking the worst fights you can possibly take. But, yeah, for Volosantini is the correct answer outside of the top, too. I got out of the while, yeah.

Hey, how are you doing, man? Heck of a morning. Hope you having great day. Just have, yeah, just have two, three questions. I'll make you quick. I wanted to add to the John Jones Convo you're talking about I'm definitely curious to see if he ends up fighting the winner of Tom versus Sergei I think he might have a little bit of interest now

because he knows that both of them are really pushing themselves out there as interesting opponents and I'm sure some part of Jones as a competitor would love to prove that you know hey I can beat one of these newer generation guys because I like Cyril Gahn, but Cyril Gahn is, I wouldn't say it counts exactly because he's more closer to Jones' age than not.

You know, whereas Tom, Aspin, and Sergey, they're, like, much more young and fresh, so I definitely love to see that. And I don't know if I CERDA Play, but imagine Cota Play were to possibly get this Cilgarn match up, to get one last shot at number one contenders match. And if he would have to win that, I'm sure Jones would definitely sign up with that

because they have a little bit of a history you know, based on Twitter. And if Francis ever gets that opportunity, Dana's down for it, then I really hope that happens because Arnold Jones will be down. He will definitely persuade Dana as much as can. Now, the other question I just have, it's an NBA-related question. I'm sure you saw the James Harden trade. I would definitely like to get your thoughts on it.

Also just any, you know, any predictions, now. How do you see this whole thing playing out? And, you know, what are things at stake for the team? From my point of view, I'm really worried for Russell Westbrook. This guy's getting the short end of the stick ever since he's left. OKC. He's done very well on the Clippers. He was the perfect player that the Clippers needed in terms of the facilitating playmaking. And now James Harden joining.

And my opinion just makes no sense. Yeah, sure, he'll pry at scoring. And he's a very good playmaker himself. but I just feel that the guy's delusional. He actually believes that he's still in his Houston Rockets and early Brooklyn, next days, where he was that guy when he's no longer there. And he has a really bad team record of, you know, staying loyal.

So I'm definitely curiously how this whole thing plays, but if I was Russ, if I was Tilu, I would really be putting some boundaries and restrictions on Harvey. Simple as that. That's all I have. Have a great day. Can't put Hardin in a corner, though. He's just going to sit there and fight out of it.

Yeah, look, Hardin's going to put up numbers, but when the going gets tough, he ain't it. When you need somebody to have the ball with five seconds left in game seven, James Hardin's going to demand it, but he doesn't have the balls to put the ball in the hoop. So, dude, just not a winner. He's a good player, and he puts up good numbers. He's not a winner.

I'm a little more bummed because, like, the Celtics, playing the Sixers in the playoffs with Hardin on the team was like, I was so excited for that. Now we may not even see the Sixers in the playoffs. Who knows? They might sneak in there. But with Hardin, it was like a guaranteed series win because the pressure is just going to get to him and he's going to fall apart.

The Southwark's played horrible against the Sixers in that series and still found a way to win. The one game they played well is Game 7, and they blew the doors off of them because Hardin and Embed and all of them, just don't have that killer instinct to close out a game in a big spot. So, yeah, good luck to him. But Clippers, I think, honestly, got a little bit worse when it comes playoff time. They'll have a guy who could score, but he's the A-Rod of the NBA.

Like, Harder will put up 50 in a game where, like, the team wins by 30, but in a game where they lose by three, he'll shoot like four of 21. That's just who he is. So kind of a bummer you left the conference, but it is what it is. Yeah, I think John's going to stick around. I think John's going to stick around. I really do. I don't know if the Pavlovich fight.

Like the Pavvich fight, if Pavich goes out, let's just say Aspenol attempts four takedowns and like Pavlovich stops all four and then he knocks out Aspinall, I don't know if that's going to be enough for Jones. But if like Pavlovich just lands a big shot, knocks about like a minute, I think John might be interested in that fight. if Aspenol wins, I think there's something there. I really do. I mean, Aspinall is really the only guy that John has responded to in all of this.

So, yeah, heavyweight's going to be a, everyone's in a really decent spot, but it's just going to be messy with this whole situation with the belts. Because we're going to have to wait for John Steepay. John's going to win. He's going to milk this for all its worth. We're going to have interim titles defended. and then we have other guys like Cyril Ghan and Jelton Almeida and Volkov and some of these up-and-comers

and we don't know what the hell they're going to do. So, yeah, it's going to be a messy, messy, messy year in the heavyweight division. By the way, a little bit of update. Vince Pichel re-weighed 155 and a half. He's good to go. Still no update on the purses for the other two fights. like I mentioned earlier, Mara, forfeiting 30% of her purse to Conejo. And that fight would move forward.

The Bonfim-Cichel fight and the Victor Hugo fight versus Daniel Marco. Still up in the air, but I would venture, I guess, that all those fights will happen. I mean, we could lose one, if we're being honest. Eric, go ahead. What's up? I think Tom off, I think John Jones will be a good fight, but it says that John Jones won't fight,

I wanted to see that fight. And, uh, Derek Lewis is going to take a loss, but he's going to come back from this. Thanks, care. Yeah, I mean, look, a Derek Lewis win would be absolutely insane. It would be absolutely insane, especially in the non-meritocratic world of the ultimate fighting championship

because Derek is over. He's a company guy. He just signed a new eight-fight deal. He could have tested free agency and made a hell of a lot more money with the PFL than he's making with the UFC. But he was a, I don't even think from like conversations I've had with people in the know, I don't even think Derek actually hit free agency at all. Because I think there's certain like periods of, you know, exclusive rights and then matching powers and all that.

And I think Derek Lewis, like, re-signed like three days later. So I don't think Derek actually like actually entered the market and talked to anybody. I think his mind was basically made up after the fight. He did mention it. And then in the post-fight presser after UFC 291, he basically said, I want to stay here. Hopefully they treat me well. And apparently they did. They gave him an eight-fight deal.

and for pretty good money. He would have made more of PFL. That's for damn short. Can you imagine where he'd be at right now? And you know what? You can make a weird case and he actually, I don't know, maybe he made the right choice.

Because if he had, think about it this way. If he had signed with PFL to fight Francis in March, he ain't fighting Francis in March. He ain't getting that $2 million payday in March because France is about to go box somebody and make a whole hell of a lot more money. So I don't know. It's weird, but a win would be really strange.

I'm really interested to see what happened if Derek Lewis wins. You mentioned Joan Steepa. It's bummed we're not getting it. I still think we're going to get it. It's just, we're just going to wait for it. That's all. I think we're going to get it. Seems to be the only fight John wants.

The only fight Stepe is going to take. So I do think this fight happens. And yeah, Derek Lewis is probably going to lose, but good thing about Derek Lewis is nobody cares about wins and losses when it comes to Derek Lewis. Rankings don't mean shit. None of that matters. People are just want to see Derek Lewis fight. You can just throw Derek Lewis in squash matches for the rest of time and people will be thrilled. So obviously he crotch shops, takes his pants off, and throws his cup into the crowd.

Doesn't matter who he fights. Derek Lewis is just going to be Derek Lewis and people love that. people love Derek Lewis but if he wins then we have a whole different conversation Cole go ahead morning Mike I mean just thinking about Francis man like you remember that fight against Derek Lewis like you think after that fight you'd go on to beat a top 10 all-time heavyweight but uh my free pro friday question for you today is what's your favorite favorite musical group of all time to listen to? And is there a band or an artist that's past their prime that you wish you could have

had the chance to see live? Oh, yeah. Jeez. Favorite musical group? I don't know. There's a bunch. Pearl Jam is probably the first one that comes to my head. They're like really the first band that I liked.

They're the first band that I saw live. I've seen them live a million times. And Pearl Jam is like, you can listen to Pearl Jam at any time. The band that I've probably seen second most is Dave Matthews. But Dave Matthews is not like a group I listen to in the car or like, you know what I mean? Like I'm aware of them and I would like hear songs in the radio, but it's the experience of seeing them live, which was like a big thing for us where I went to high school. It was like a guaranteed thing. We knew we were doing New Year's Eve.

Dave Matthews always played the Boston Garden or the TD Garden at the time. they did it basically my entire high school run. And then in the summer, they would play a show at, they eventually moved it to Foxborough Stadium. And we'd all go to that. It was like, we knew what we were doing on those two times of the year. We're all going, like, there's like a hundred of us from like all different classes from my high school would go see Dave Matthews.

But Dave Matthews is in a band like I listened to in the car or anything like that. OIR is another band that I've seen a lot. Their band I've listened to more in the car. I really like them. Band that's past their prime that I wish I had seen. I've seen a lot. I mean, I've seen so many bands. I'm trying to think of somebody I haven't seen yet that I kind of want.

Like, Incubis would be a good one. Like, I've never seen Incubis. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I've seen pretty much everybody. Even like Tenacious D, I've got to see them play a set before, which is friggin' awesome. Yeah, it's a good question. I don't know. I don't know if there's anybody that I'm like, oh, damn it. I wish I got the chance to see them. But I mean, I've seen drowning pool back in the day before everything happened with dime bag.

So, yeah, I've seen anybody that really kind of wanted to see, I've seen. I like that question, though. AKGM, you're up. Not going through. All right, bounce out, bounce back in. Efforts got another question. Go ahead. Oh, yeah. So I wanted to ask, what was your favorite fight in the UFC? Mine, personally, has been Tony Ferguson versus Pettis, just because of how crazy it got and that one round. But it ended kind of, it kind of sucked at the end.

But it was still a great fight for me. That's it. That's a good one. It's a good one. It's Carlos Condor versus Robbie Lawler. That's my jam. That's the one. UFC 195.

Almost the perfect fight. Had it all. The ups, the downs. Robbie Lawler, we got fifth round Robbie Lawler at his best. Like, high-level stuff. We got kind of psychopathic tendencies. We had a razor-close fight. We had a controversial scorecard that could have

either way. It kind of felt like the one drawback from Condit Lawler is that Carlos Condit should have won the wealth away title that night. I've watched that fight probably more than any fight in the history of the UFC. And I feel like Carlos Condit should be, should have, should have won the Welterweight title that night. And the tough, the other, like, really interesting part of, there's a couple of interesting parts of that fight. One is that

Waller and Conda were never the same again. They were never, ever the same again. That was it. They took, they took each other's primes that night. They took a piece of each other in such a visceral way

that neither was ever the same again. I mean, it's just such a good fight. And also, that we talk about 2016 and 2023. That was the main event.

That set the tone for the rest of 2016, which is the craziest year in the history of the sport. And that fight is often forgotten about. And I believe it was the fight of the year.

It should have been the fight of the year. And it happened the first pay-per-view. That absolutely should have been the fight of the year. I don't know if it was.

Let me go back into the archives, but it better be that one. It was. See, M.A. Fighting. Great website. They get it. They get it. Fight of the year. Even above Connor McGregor, Nate DS2, which is also a great fight. Cubs wants a duo Choi, which is in the friggin' hall of fame, was the third best fight of 2016, according to M.A.fighting.com.

Misha T. Hollyholm, Home, number four, Dominic Cruz, T. T.J. Dillishaw, number five. Honorable mentions. Marco Polo Reyes, Dung Hong Kim, UFC 199. Great fight. UFC 1-199 is ridiculous card. Diazvigregor 1, Bisbing Henderson 2, Jake Matthews, Johnny Case, Neil Magny, Hector, Lombard. You want to, for all the people out there who feel like Neil Magny is a boring fighter,

go watch Neil Magny, Hector, Lombard. Angel Lee, Mae Yamaguchi, Yonah, Claudia, 2, great fight. Bisbing, Anderson, Silva, Silla, crazy fight. and maybe the most underappreciated fight in UFC history, Tired Woodley versus Stephen Thompson, honorable mention. The second fight between these two guys was awful. It was so, so bad. And the second fight was so awful that it makes people forget about the first fight,

which is at MSG, the first UFC event ever at Madison Square Garden, and it was the fight of the night. and everyone forgets about it because of how awful the second fight was. But yes, Condo Loller. If that's the fight, whatever the fight of the year of 2016 is

should be a top five fight of all time. To me, that's number one. And that should be a Hall of Fame fight. J. Mack, what do you got? Like, so I have a prediction, and I want a not know point if I think it comes true. So I think John Jones retiring after the Sipay fight,

but I don't think he's going to fight Tom Askenal, and I don't think he's going to fight Sergey Palovich. I think he's going to fight Francis in Ghanu in 2012, and they're going to do it at Alliance Stadium in Las Vegas, Nevada. 2004, John Jones v. Francis, baddest man on the planet. Biggest fight of the year. Thanks, Mike. I mean, I appreciate your positivity.

I mean, AK, who is in this room, might be getting a run for your money here. But it's not going to happen. It's just not. The UFC will never do it. They will never do it. And it's unfortunate. And it's all ego.

Again, it's all ego. Dana White has basically said like, no, he ain't coming back here. Francis will never be back here. But here's the thing. As big as that fight would be, and it would be the biggest fight you can make in mixed martial arts right now. There's nothing you can make.

That would be a bigger fight than that one. The UFC doesn't need it. The UFC does not need that fight. Let me just pull something up real quick. And I will explain to you why. Our own David Meyer wrote about this. It's on NBA fighting. First major UFC financials reveal staggering revenue

following WWE merger. All right. So listen to this. This is why this fight's not going to happen. The UFC sole financial information has been revealed with a deeper dive in revenue through the second quarter of 2023. Listen to this. Listen to this.

During the first two quarters of 2023, the UFC, and I'm reading this verbatim, my friends, produced $611.9 million in revenue across media rights and content, live events, sponsorship, and consumer product licensing. again through the first two quarters that's half a year half a year they produce 611.9 million dollars of revenue meteor now this is largely based on the ESPN deal listen to this ESPN quarter one paid out 224.1 million in the first quarter and two quarter one in the first quarter and two $211.7 million in the second quarter. The ESPN deal through the first two quarters of 2023 almost produced a half a billion dollars. They don't need this fight.

The landscapers are here and they have it all here. So, yes. Well, I would love to see it. And while it's the biggest fight that can be made, the UFC is not going to make it. And they don't need to. And that's why they're printing money. They're printed money.

That's why they can put on these crappy, Apex cards. That's why they could charge a trillion dollars for tickets. Who cares? They don't need to sell paper views. They don't need to sell tickets. I mean, they make a ton of money on the ticket sales too, but they don't need it. They don't need it. What do they make a ticket sales? I know that's up there too. $63.8 million from tickets through the first two quarters for half a year, 63.8 million in live events, 54.2 million in sponsorships. Product licensing, 18.1 million.

It's insane. They're making so much money. And that's why we're not going to see John Jonesers, France and Ghana. Because they don't need to make it. They're going to make like a billion dollars this year just from ESPN. It's crazy.

It's absolutely insane. All right, landscapers are here. They're about to make a ton of noise, so I'm going to get out of here. So thank you all very much. We will have a UFC Sao Paulo preview show coming up at 1 p.m. Eastern. Stay tuned for that.

I wrapped up an interview about an hour and 20 minutes ago with a guy you might know. His name is Dustin Porre. That'll be coming to M.A. fighting soon. I talk to Wonderboy Thompson. I talked to the great John Anik. You'll hear both of those conversations

coming up later on this month. Anik will probably drop early next week. Wonderboy, maybe a little bit later on in the month. But lots coming. This show returns on Tuesday at 10 a.m. Easter. We'll do it again. Landscapers take us home.

Have a heck of a morning, everybody. Listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network.