MMA Fighting - Reaction | Larissa Pacheco Upsets Kayla Harrison In PFL World Championship Main Event

Episode Date: November 26, 2022

Following Larissa Pacheco's upset win over Kayla Harrison in the main event of the PFL World Championship, MMA Fighting's Mike Heck and Jed Meshew react to the shocking conclusion of the PFL's first pay-per-view event. Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Follow Jed Meshew: @JedKMeshew Subscribe: http://goo.gl/dYpsgH Check out our full video catalog: http://goo.gl/u8VvLi Visit our playlists: http://goo.gl/eFhsvM Like MMAF on Facebook: http://goo.gl/uhdg7Z Follow on Twitter: http://goo.gl/nOATUI Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Support for this show comes from the Audible Original, the downloaded two, ghosts in the machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudullian and the rest of the Phoenix colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever. Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprise his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the Audible Original Blockbuster. The Downloaded, it's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking, What are you willing to lose to save the ones you love?

The Downloaded 2, Ghosts in the Machine. Available now, only from Audible. Support for this show comes from the Audible original, The Downloaded 2. Ghosts in the Machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudullian and the rest of the Phoenix colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever.

Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprised his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the audible original blockbuster, the downloaded. It's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking, what are you willing to lose to save the ones you love?

The downloaded two, ghosts in the machine. Available now, only from Audible. The Vox Media Podcast Network. We are live, and I got to be honest with you, I didn't think we would be live. We said during the People's Pre-Fight Show for the PFL World Championship event, that the only way that you would see us after this card is if the unthinkable happened.

And it did, Mike. It did happen. 2020 is the year of the unthinkable. Another stunning loss for a massive favorite parley killer, Larissa Pacheco, gets it done. Unanimous decision, 4847s across the board. She is the PFL Women's Lightway Champion. She is a million dollars richer, and she handed Kayla Harrison her first ever professional loss. She exacted some revenge, Jed Mishu, over the woman that beat her twice in 2019. And now Larissa Pacheco is in a great city to party all night long.

Good old New York. She gets it done. I am Mike Heck. Mr. No Gray area, Jed Mishu joins me. And Jed, we are here. Did you think we'd be here? And now that we are here, how are you feeling? buddy i did not that obviously beforehand i didn't think we'd be here as that fight started to unfold

i started thinking we had a really good chance so i did the live blog i officially to get this out of the way up front i officially scored the fight a draw 47 47 i gave kela harrison a 108 in the first round um i'm sure some people in the comments will not like that but i'd have to rewatch it but i feel I feel okay with that score. I have no issues if you don't give her that. There is, I do not believe you can score that fight for Kayla Harrison, like, justly.

It, to me, it is either a draw or it's a Pacheco win. I gave a draw, but I got no issues with what happened. Pride rules Pachaco won the fight. Like, that's just how it goes. And it started looking like that was really an option after the third round. I did not have any, I still had a lot of faith in Kayla after round two, even though Pacheco won the second round, I think pretty convincingly. But in that third round, you can see Harrison starting to get gas.

Like, you can see the wind kind of coming out of her sails. And she recovered well in between rounds and looked, you know, had Pappen her step at the kick of every rounds. But her shots started to be more desperate. Like, like, I need to get this instead of just letting it come around. And Pachaco just hung around, man. she she good defense on the ground and I sometimes think that it's like it's simplistic to say this but in this instance I actually think it's true like straight up I think Pachaco just wanted it more because that fifth round like they are they are both tired like you it is you cannot watch

that fight and be like well one of them has a better gas tank they are both just spent and it just comes down to who wants it more what's there And, you know, maybe it is that Harrison has made millions of dollars and has won this thing twice. And Pacheco has lost to this woman twice. And this is life-changing money for her. But that fifth round was a gut check round of who wants it more. It was far less about the skill and the talent involved. And just because at that point, they are both clearly so tired.

They're diminished versions of themselves. And it is just put your heart on your sleeve and who wants this. And Pachaco wanted it. Because when Harrison was getting to her spots, Pachaco was doing her best to fire off and just throwing, just constantly working. And Harrison was forced to survive portions of it. Like Pachaco clearly won that fifth round.

And honestly, like I said, maybe it's simplistic. Maybe I'm an asshole. But to me, it was just a straight-up. She wanted that more. And when it counted, she put it out there and she took it. Good for her. The scrambles in the fight were crazy. Awesome.

Like it was a really, it was a really fun fight. Like it was a really fun fight. It was the most fun fight Kayla Harrison's ever had by a mile. 100%. And I guess here's the real question because Larissa Pacheco, this is a life-changing moment for her, like you said. She has tons of momentum right now heading into the next season. And Kayla is probably not even going to compete in the next season, at least as of right now. But maybe this loss will change things.

But there's when you're someone like Kayla Harrison and you've been putting. these spots and you lose. There's two directions fighters typically go. There's no middle ground here. You either just continue the fall from grace and just strap in and not really enjoy the ride. You're just there. Or you use this as motivation and hunger and you get right back and become better

than ever. So I don't know, man. Some of the things Kayla was saying heading into the fight, I'm not saying she was like overlooking Pacheco at all. maybe there was a part of her that was because she beat her twice already. And I know a lot of us are like, we've seen this dance before. We know what's going to happen.

I just don't know how Kayla, like what Kayla's going to do next with two fights left because pretty much all of the mystique about her, it's like gone right now. It's like when you're dating a woman and you bring her around your friends and they notice something that you don't, and then they bring it to your attention, it's like that glass shatters. And you're like, oh, I didn't notice that. but now that I've noticed it and you've told me about it, I can't forget about it.

So how do you think she bounces back from this? With everything she's got going on, only two fights left in her deal, how does she bounce back from this? That's a great question. And I don't know. Like, we're going to have to find out. She is,

Kayla Harrison is so much more interesting now than she has been in forever because of this. Like, because she is fighting Pacheco next. Like, if she does not retire, and I don't think she will, there is no other fight that they make. Like, I don't care that Aspen Lad won,

and you do Ladd versus like that is the stupidest idea possible, which I guess means maybe it's in play for them. But she is fighting Pacheco next. And I saw on Twitter people firing out, well, you do Pacheco Harrison Ford to headline the next pay-per-view. I think that's an awful idea. Because I'm still, I don't, I just really don't think that sells pay-per-view numbers.

That's not really what you need to be looking at. I think you do Harrison Pacheco for on ESPN. Not ESPN plus ESPN. You talk to ESPN, you get them say, hey, like you got, here is a real card to put on real ESPN. Find a weekend. This is what we'll top it. And let's get ourselves out there in a really, really substantive way to increase our brand and stuff. And I think that's exactly what I would do if I was them.

And I think it's the fight you have to. Because you just can't do anything else. that gets really interesting though because like straight up Pacheco won this fight Pacheco is younger I think it is fair to say that she has improved more

in the duration between their last fight to now than Harrison did in that same period of time now that doesn't mean that the same will move forward and again part of the thing I genuinely enjoy the PFL in concept at least because it is a very different way to approach fighting. And that, I think, will get missed here in this.

It is so very, very different to fight four times in six months. We talked about it on the pre-show. We talked about BTL. It is so different and so difficult. And we truly have no idea what was going on with Harrison or Procheco coming into this. Like, I have no idea what their physical shapes were, et cetera. It is entirely possible that they run this back not after having, fought three times, you know, in the prior, and that Harrison looks a lot better or projector

looks a lot better, frankly, like anything's in play. So, honestly, it's hard to draw too many thoughts about, like, too many sureties and be like, well, this is definitely what happens in the next one, because that fight was very competitive. Maybe Harrison comes back and, you know, maybe she was injured, or she was clearly dealing with something she alluded to ethereal, but we don't know. Or maybe she, it's hard for me not to believe that she overlooked Pacheco to some extent. Just because she won very dominantly twice and it is, it, that's human nature to have that. So it is a fascinating third matchup or fourth matchup, but it's, it's super risky now. Because if Harrison loses that, like, I mean, I guess you can do five at some point, but then that's, that, that puts us in a real weird way.

So, like, it's fascinating. I'm genuinely like, kind of interested in what PFL's got cooked. now with this and with Brendan Lata and like there's some stuff's happening over there in the PFL baby let's go well that kind of leads me to my next question I know Joseph Boza kind of brought it up a little bit

is this a good thing for the PFL like is this because Kayla's the face of your organization for sure no like this is this is a loss for them right for sure absolutely I mean it's for for the sake of like if this isn't a real sport and we talk about all the time like

This is an entertainment industry, and frankly, the only way that stars are built in this sport is long runs of wins. And sprinkled in, you can have the comebacks, et cetera, but mostly it is always better for the stars to win. And God love Lus Pracheco, tremendous story. You should feel great for her for this win. Everything she said after, like, very easy to appreciate her as a fighter and what she has accomplished here. She is never going to be a star. That's just it. She might be, you know, have the potential to be some level of a star in Brazil.

She's never going to be a broader-based star. She doesn't speak English, which is, it's shitty, but like that is legitimately a huge limiting factor to start up in this sport. And there's no way, there are no two ways around it. And she's just not, it's, I think Kayla Harrison was uniquely positioned to be the only lightweight woman star that this sport could ever offer because she had two gold medals. and that's enough to bring in a different crowd or give you instant credibility that Pacheco is just never going to get. So it's clearly worse for them to have this happen.

Again, it's not death now. And if Harrison can come back and win the fourth fight and reclaim the title of Queen of MMA or Top Dog or whatever, then it's a net good because they will have gotten a fourth event out of this that will be a marquee headlining event and none the worst for where. I think Harrison can suffer a loss, certainly in the PFL context. Now, her broader legacy and what that means, a loss is much, much more damaging to that.

But from a promotional standpoint, if Harrison rebounds with the win over Pacheco again, I think that will then be a net good for PFL. But at this moment, it's for sure negative. When A.J. McKee lost to Patricia Pitbull, it was like, oh, my gosh, the student's value has dropped tremendously. The UFC's not going to touch him. he's going to be a Bellator fighter for life. So if you're Dana White, if you're Scott Coker right now,

what are you thinking? Like, what are you thinking right now? Do you feel like her stock is still where it is? Or are you thinking, you know what? If she comes back and wins these next two fights and does it in devastating fashion, she could still be a star for us, but maybe we're getting there a little bit of a discount

than we thought we might at the beginning of this year? Like, what are they thinking? I mean, you can't put yourself in. in their shoes. But what do you think they're thinking right now? Do you think Dana's going to come out at the next press conference to be like, so you try to tell you, you know,

she wasn't one of the best of the world. We only have the best in the world here. Like, how do you think he handles the questions? He's got to get him. He's for sure going to get him. And yeah, he's going to do exactly that.

So you know, well, you're not the best in the world if you're not fighting here. So that's, you know, we gave her an offer and she decided to go fight cans. And then she couldn't even beat the cans. Pacheco lost to whoever the hell.

lost you in the UFC. She lost somebody that's like not very good. I'm trying to remember. It was years ago, but he's going to do the same thing. And Coker will never disparage her publicly, probably. But, man, can't wait to see the cyborg tweets. I don't know if those have come out yet, but heads up because that one is coming. Hard and fast, maybe.

Right down the middle. She's going to fire off as soon as she sees this. But yeah, Bellator and the UFC are both privately, certainly thinking. still interested, certainly still interested in the business aspect of it, but this is a discount for them. Like there is, and maybe it's not,

because ultimately I don't think Harrison is going to think that she's discounted. I think that woman believes what her value is intrinsically, and she is going to go after and get it, because sure, she got Nettle, she also got two gold medals, and ain't nobody else in combat sports can say that. So, you know, that's the truth.

And she's going to take what, And the PFL won't pay her less. Like they still love her. She is still the focal point in the centerpiece. So I'm not sure it ultimately affects her bargaining power. It may just affect the likelihood that she goes somewhere else when her two fights are up with the PFL. We have cyborg tweets. By the way, she blocked me.

And I have no idea why. Oh, I got blocked by Cyborg a while ago. Why the hell is she? I have no idea why she blocked me. But luckily, I just think it's funny because I have no. I've never once tweeted at her. Yeah. So she blocked me because she was searching her name

and saw me mocking her about the... I assume it had to be me taking shots of her over her handling of the Harrison situation and her handling of pay-per-view demands of 80-20. Like she's some massive pay-per-view drop. So 26 minutes ago as we speak, Cyborg tweets out. Tonight will only make

judo Kayla a better fighter. One thing I learned after going 14 years undefeated is that sometimes you need to lose to come your best. Kayla will be back and she will grow

from this experience. Congrats, Larissa Pacheco, you are a real world champion. Four minutes later. Backhanded tweet. Got it. Four minutes later.

14 years undefeated, by the way. Four minutes later, she quote tweets an August 10th tweet from Don Davis. Don Davis tweet, Fans want the fight.

Fighters want the fight. I have watched and listens. PFL MMA will provide all money and handle all matters. Kayla versus Cyborg, million dollars each fighter, plus a $2 million winner bonus, pay-per-view superfight, no more talk, decide the best inside the cage.

She quote tweets saying, I think Don Davis owes Larissa Pacheco a backroom bonus. She just saved the PFL $3 million. So humbleness went out the door within four minutes. That wasn't humble at all. And look, like straight up, I want to be clear, I am not here to bag on Cyborg. Do your petty dance, girl, like that, for real.

I am absolutely in support of you taking that shot right now. It may not be earned, but I am never going to knock somebody for being petty as hell because it's always fun. But like, the structure of that tweet is very clearly fake humble. When I went 14 years undefeated, I learned that is a very clear. you know, compliment with the sting in the tail on. She is making a statement while also preserving an aura. And then that aura goes out the window. And again, do you dance, girl.

I will say the other side of that, though, to, you know, to play devil's advocate, you could have been the one. You could have been the one. You talk all about your legacy, all about this. You could have made that $3 million. You could have been the one to make that. You could have been the one to take the O. It would have been huge monumental news.

This is big news. We are doing a post show for Larissa Pacheco for pulling off the thing and doing the damn thing and doing great. That is not going to do the traction. There's not going to be the interest. This is not going to matter as much as if Cyborg had been the one to do it in four months. And we don't know if she could have. Straight up. She has a better chance than I thought prior, given how that fight broke down.

But Cyborg A. game Pacheco. Like they are not the same fighter and who can say that she would have won it. So she can go on this victory lap for a fight. She didn't win. But she could have just won this fight and she would be much better for it if she was here and doing this instead of the boxing thing. Very, very interesting.

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Let's talk about, let me just pull it up. Let's talk about the rest of this card because Brennan-Wins the title, great fight with Bubba Jenkins. What a story he has become. Look, DeLijah. That was a great fight too. Honestly, they finished really strong. They did.

Antid Elijah did what we all thought he was going to do. Aspen Ladd wins a split against Julia Bud. Could have gone either way. A lot of people thought Bud won that fight. Olivia Aubin-Mersier, what a moment for him. Big knockout, gets it done. Sadabousai, not a great fight, but he won. And Rob Wilkinson just beat the hell out of a Mariah

man off. and the doctor kind of saved Akhmana from being too tough for his own good. Then we saw Marlon Marias get knocked out. We saw Jeremy Stevens get submitted. We saw Muhammad Ali's grandson get a vicious knockout in 45 seconds to kick off this entire card. What'd you think, Jed? Top to bottom. Did you enjoy yourself tonight?

That is tough. I will say, we talked on the pre-show saying that is this worth 50 bucks. And my contention was in the dark, I think it probably is. But that is really heavily dependent on what happens. Even taking out the main event upset and how monumental that is, if Kayla had just won that fight, I will still say that this was worth 50 bucks. This went, frankly, about as well as the PFL could have hoped for, given what they were doing and how it was structured.

And again, they didn't set this up in the best way possible, but a lot of the fights delivered, you know, there was six championship fights. We got four finishes, which is, if we had talked over under on finishes, I probably would not have thought four. I would have thought three was incoming for us.

So OAM getting just a tremendous knockout, great, great for them. There were some down spots. I think that that's probably unavoidable when you have a seven-fight main card and stuff like this. Sadabousai fight was just horrifically bad.

but you can't judge the card on its low points and it hit some good highs and it finished very strong like this was the best pfl card they've had this year by a lot and a pretty solid effort overall it it really waned in the middle it was really tough in in some of that middle section but we worked through it and i think if you paid 50 bucks you got value for money i thought the pacing was much better on the main card after like the second fight at first i was like oh god this is going to be a tough tough tough tough night yeah but it did get better once we got past the oh the undercard pacing was horrific oh so awful really bad like just start the frigging card at six yeah but yeah that's the problem with starting at five or five 30 or

whatever when you have three undercard fights like if you get finishes we're just going to hang forever yeah that was that was tough i was like off this main card is like this this is got to be this is going to be really bad the sadbu side was the fight was the one that probably got the most of the fighters agreed with a lot of the media members like and you even tweeted out this might be your only chance to ever fight for a million dollars that you certainly don't they know might about it neither those dudes ever fighting for a million good for sye for you know winning but if if the judges had come back and given that to taylor side could not have been mad like it was not like a dominant clear win and there

There was a real world where he could have lost that strictly because he just backed up a bunch. And sometimes judges are stupid. And they think that the guy coming forward is winning. And it's just like, yeah, man, I don't know. I've never fought for a million dollars. So maybe I'm very, like I wouldn't be this way. I like to think that if I was fighting for a million dollars, I would act like I wanted it. As far as the title winners go and as far as the MA fighting global rankings go, the only rankings that matter.

There are other rankings? Is there going to be some movement here for you based on? happened tonight? Oh, for sure. Well, there are three big changes coming. The first one is Harrison is dropping precipitously in the pound for pound rankings. And Pacheco, who already had ranked, is going to take a little bump up for sure in my women's pound for pound. Because like I said before, I like Pacheco. I think she's improved a lot and is a very good fighter. Like, this would have been a quality win if Harrison could have pulled it off that she would have gotten zero credit for because she already has two wins and nobody respects her as Pacheco.

but that one's going to happen I it would be really hard not to not to rank Brandon Lonnie after that like that was just a great performance and Bubba Jenkins is maybe not a top you know 40 feather not not a top 20 featherweight but he's a top 30 featherweight like he's a very consummate quality fighter and Brendan just tuned him up

like Lonnie's good man he's gonna make I don't think I have him in my top 15 right now he is for sure cracking the top 15 from that and I'm probably going to throw OAM a bone and give him one. I think that one's the one that he probably won't actually make the rankings broadly. I suspect Brendan certainly will make the actual featherweight rankings. I think O.A.M. will end up being a far for us because I will throw him a shot. But how do you not?

This is the best performance of his career. Like, Stevie Ray, again, not a world beater, but we talked about it beforehand. If you told me that Stevie Ray fought Michael Chandler tomorrow and beat Michael Chandler, It would not shock me. I would pick Michael Chandler to win. But like lightweight is in Shark Tank, man. And anybody in there is a quality fighter when they're in the top 30 or 40. And those two dudes are undeniably top 35, 40-ish lightweights in the world.

It's a great win. He's been on a good run. His losses in the UFC are like Gilbert Burns and Armand Saruky. And like, we're going to knock that man for losing the dudes that would everyone loses to those men. So no, he's he's going to crack my top 15. I don't think everyone will get him there, but he certainly will make my 15. We'll be done in a couple minutes here.

Someone asked if there's going to be press conferences for the fighters that won tonight. Yes, there will be. We're not going to stream or anything. I think we'll probably put a couple of videos up, especially, you know, if we hear from Kayla, we'll certainly put that up. Pacheco will probably hear from a few of the fighters for sure. Yeah, Brennan. We do have a poll up.

Did you enjoy the PFL's first paper you event? 61% yes, 39% no. So probably better than we expected. But I do have to bring up one more thing before we wrap up. And I think you know where we're going with this. You're going to do it. We had, we actually had like an internal conversation in our Slack channel during the Shaman Marius, Marl Marailles fight.

And Marius was winning the first two rounds. and we're both saying, like I think I put in our Slack channel, thank God Marlin's not fighting Shane Burkos because this would have been a really bad night for him. And then we were kind of joking around. Yeah, but there's still a very good chance like he could get knocked out in the third round.

Just kind of playing around. And then all of a sudden, New York Rick chimes in. He goes, oh, my God. And he was obviously there. So he's a little bit ahead of us. And then we see it happen. And we're like, I can't believe this just frigging happen. I cannot believe this just happened.

Marlon Mariah. Oh, I could. I called it like three minutes beforehand. I was like, it's so crazy. It's entirely possible that Marlon Mara's gets knocked out. And I was like, actually, it might even be probable that he just gets knocked out in this third round. And then a minute later, it happened. I mean, we have to.

I hate being that guy, but we have, someone has to talk this man. Like, he's just, if he goes through this season again, and he has to fight Burgos and then he has to fight Brennan Locknain or like a lot of these guys at 145 we're just going to see the same thing man like I just I like Marlon a lot I've interviewed him a few times

can't really interview him anymore but I like the man I like him he's a great guy he's a dad he's a husband he's a good family man and you just want to see him do well especially you know you watch the MA hour interview and you're like all right he seems like he's in a good he's in good spirits much better than he was last couple

UFC fights when he had to cut all the way down and then just to see him get knocked out again like this it just hurt my heart it just hurt my heart j ed yeah i if you were to ask if if i were the man who got to dictate these things to him i would say he should retire because he retired and that was the right instinct and coming back it's not i won't ever begrudge a man for making money in a way that only jeopardizes his own life and no it doesn't hurt anybody else else. I, if not being said, if I was his teammate, his coach, I think that you can certainly talk to that man and say, hey, if you want to keep doing this, I understand you have to make money for your family. How am I going to tell you how to put food on the table? I will not be

a part of this because I wouldn't want to be a part of that. If I was, if I have loving my heart for that man and work with him, I won't want to be a part of it. Same way that Bigfoot just continues to fight people and whoever is is working with him should not because you're not doing him any favors. I know if Marlon wants to keep

doing it, okay. I will probably end up watching. I won't watch with happiness, but like he's going to keep being on PFL cards. I'll keep tuning in so I guess I'll continue to see this fall, but it's the worst part of this sport. It's undeniably the worst part of the sport.

Fighters can't. They can't walk away for be it financial reasons or ego or whatever it is and he thinks he has something left and maybe he does you know maybe he's going to turn it all around and this this was all you know pearl clutching and hand ring for no reason he's lost five in a row and they have all been by knockout and that that doesn't get better that that that only goes one way it just is what it is and sometimes it is the hardest thing to reckon with yourself and say, I don't have a fastball anymore, and this is too dangerous,

and I was never the best fighter in the world, and that sucks ass. But for his long-term health, I super hope somebody sits him down, or he is just able to recognize. Man, I was having a good fight, and then it all fell apart, and it's,

and, you know, because maybe, and maybe this is the one, right? Because Shaman Marius is not any of the other ones. Like, you catch an L to Marabweil, that's one of best fighters in the world. Corey Sanhagen is one of the best fighters of the world. Henry Sehuto is one of the best fighters in the world.

Like, okay, maybe I just need to lower my expectations, fight some lighter comp for a million dollars. And maybe this is one who's like, I beat this dude handily seven years ago. And now he's just glassing me like this. Maybe I should step out. And I hope that's the case because I want that for him. I would like him to have a long and happy life.

Yeah, a lot of people are saying, take a year off you can't like if you're going to be in the season you got to be ready to come back in like april because that's when the season restarts like right around springtime so you got you got to think about what you're doing here and man five knock out loss in a row six out of seven fights he's been finished the only the only one he wasn't finished it was the jos a alda fight which he's got technically a win but yeah man it's just it's just it's incredible to see where he was It was such a crazy falloff. Yeah.

The wins he racked up to get to the title fight were incredible. Like he deaded the current champion. Killing him. Yeah. Knocked him stiff. And now, man, the Shaman one, that's a tough one. That's definitely a tough one. It's, and that's it, man.

When you look at these kind of runs, shaman is the one because they all, they are all structured like this. Guy ascending. guys great takes an L takes another L takes another L but because he was so high Chuck L L he's fighting top tier competition BJ PIN he's fighting top tier competition

you can sell that you can tell yourself okay I got knocked out by one of the best guys in the world and I was competitive at parts of it but as you keep falling down then you're losing to the Dennis Sever of the world or whatever like you were dropping off and Shaman is a very clear here where my loss

is here is my loss and if he can sell himself to come back, then that is, then we're in for a really bad ride, frankly. This is not the one that drives the point home. It might be a tough next year or two for that man and for us. Joseph Bose is asked if Jeremy Stevens in the same situation, and he probably should be, but he ain't stopping. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. So Jeremy Stevens is definitely in the same-ish situation, only there is a zero percent chance that man is retiring. So it may be unfortunate, but I am. am certain that he is not going to have to come to Jesus moment. Last question. Even though it didn't seem like it at the time, was the biggest winner of the night,

Aspen Ladd. And I asked this question because she's not fighting Kayla now, at least not next. She's not fighting Larissa Pacheco, at least not next, because they're probably going to run that one back. She's going to enter the season probably is the favorite here. Like her toughest test,

It depends on who they bring on to fill this division up and what they're going to do if it's going to be 45 or 55. But Aspen's got a road right now to the Millie, much better than I thought she did when she got the sputty over Julia Butt a few hours back. Can you make a compelling case that even though the performance wasn't great, she might have won bigger than anybody tonight. You can make a case.

I don't think it's compelling because she didn't. win a million dollars and six other people did which is just a start line point there um and i mean for like for future for future yeah well and I was about I was about to get to the other point of that though I think Pachaco

is still ahead of her because I don't know what's in store for her either she is going to tetralogy Kayla for a big bag of money or she is going to tell the PFL I mean I don't really care if

you don't pay me this big bag of money to fight her this one time, I still just want to go to this tournament because I will win a million dollars again, and I would like to go win a million dollars again. That's a very good business model for me because now Kayla's not even in this damn thing next year. So I'm feeling great about my chances to win a million dollars. So she's going to get paid coming or going, either which way she's going to get a big bag of money, and either it's going to be to fight Kayla or.

or it's going to be to fight Aspen Ladd or whatever. And I feel Pacheco, I feel pretty good about Pachico's chance against Aspen Lad, given what we just witnessed right now. So I think she's clearly the biggest winner. But I do get what you're saying. Lad now doesn't have to lose to Kayla, which is a win. And if the BFL does just say, Pachico, we're going to pull you out of this tournament. Here's a million dollars to fight Kayla.

We're going to do this fight. Then, yeah, Aspen Lad has the inside track to winning their first. featherweight tournament in 2023 is the next year yeah so it it certainly was a good night for performance was whatever um but you know she got the dub and that is all that matters at the end of the day yeah someone that says uh i look pretty baked to this evening trust me i'm not i'm just a little tired turkey day got me a little bit it was a long day and uh a lot of fights i will also A lot of fights tonight. And I played golf with my son, which is a lot.

Yeah, that's a lot of things. That's draining. I didn't say this in any of our pre-stuff. I didn't think about this at all until yesterday. My mom always raised me that when somebody does something right, you should tell them about it. And I also just tell people when the stupid do things wrong. I've done a lot of that this past week for PFL. I will say to them, outside of this being a good event that I think succeeded in many remarks,

shouts to this being on Fridays we had the debate on whether this should be on Friday or Saturday and I think there's a lot of problems with that in general but I didn't realize until yesterday that by doing it on Friday meant way-ins or Thursday so all those people could weigh in and then the Americans could still eat Thanksgiving dinner and then fight the next day

and that's actually probably like really nice for them instead of being like hey I have to sit here on Thanksgiving. Thanksgiving and cut weight because that would I can't imagine something sucking as hard as cut like doing the hardest part of my weight cut during Thanksgiving. That seems miserable. So we'll see where this all goes. We'll see what happens with Kayla Harrison when she wants to come back. Maybe she'll take some time off.

Who knows? She's got two fights left. Apparently there's some sort of deadline on it. But who knows. But you have to think they're just going to go. right back to this Pacheco fight. You think you have to at this point because that's what's what's Kail's going to want. I don't know.

What's Pacheco's? What's her contract looking like? I don't know what that is. You got to pay her. If they offer like 500 and 500 to fight Kayla, I think she's got to take that. She should. She's super should.

And Larissa. Getting that anywhere else. Yeah. And Larissa, sit down, sit down with the PFL brass and just get a new deal done before you get back in that cage. And put this woman. in front of cameras.

Just do it. Like promote for once in your life. Promote somebody actually. This is a thing. She beat Kayla Harrison. Maybe that's not like as big in the mainstream culture as we would like it to be in our little MMA bubble.

Just get her in front. Whoever will put a camera in front of her. Just put her in front of her and try and make something happen out of this. Like you should be damn sure doing that with Brendan because that dude is great. Like that guy could, be a star if you give him a push and you just just do it with all these people give them a push and

see what happens you're not in thackerville right now you're in friggin new york city you can bring him to every show around the corner today show you could bring them i mean they should both be in studio with aerial on monday that was a hundred percent they should be on every show the breakfast club anything in new york anyone who will take them anyone who will take them i don't I don't know if TRL is still a thing. Get them on TRL. I don't even know if that thing is still a real thing. Hey, Brennan, I know you want to take this road trip cross-country Route 66.

We're going to have to hold that one up because you and Larissa and, I mean, I guess you could do Auntie, but that doesn't seem necessary. I'm trying to think who else. Get Rob. Get Rob in there. You do you, Larissa, Rob, and OAM. We're putting the four of you in front of cameras. And you guys are just going to talk to people and say, we want a million dollars doing this. and drum up interest in our brand and yourselves,

and we're going to see what we can cook with this. All right. Well, we'll see what the PFL does. Hopefully they do better than Bellator did with AJ McKee after he won the Grand Prix. It would be hard to do worse. Yeah, that's true. All right, we are done. We went a lot longer than I thought we were going to go,

but I felt like we needed to touch on the rest of the card. So that's it. We'll talk more about it this week for sure. The queen is dead. The queen is dead. Long live the queen. Yes. Congratulations to Laris Pacheco to all the million dollar winners, all the new champions.

It was an interesting Friday night of fights. You guys did it. You made a pay-per-view that was not that bad. And I thought it was going to be. So really, really good work from everybody involved. Yes. Except for commercials. Don't put commercials on a paper-view product, you asses.

Put Wiz Khalifa on the end of the prelims before kick up the main car. We didn't need that to start. commercials than a long package but we're not going to go down that road we can go down that road on btl on thursday we can get a little more lucy-goosey with the whole thing but we're done back to mayfutting.com great website post-fight coverage still to come we'll see what we what happens stay tuned to this page for post-fight interviews new york rick is in the house so he'll be reporting those bad boys and uh we'll go from there so for jem to shoot i am mike heck thank you for watching. Hope you guys at least enjoy it a Friday night of fights because that's pretty much it.

Now enjoy your football watching the rest of the weekend and we'll see you later. Have a good night, everybody. Love you guys.