MMA Fighting - The A-Side Live Chat w/ Shane Helms

Episode Date: July 1, 2020

For this episode, former WWE superstar Shane Helms joins José Youngs and E. Casey Leydon to break down some of the top stories in MMA. Some topics include fallout from UFC on ESPN 12, the epic war between Dustin Poirier and Dan Hooker, the lack of "characters" in mixed martial arts, fighters' promo skills, Fedor Emelianenko's aura from his Pride FC days, the bantamweight title fight between Petr Yan vs. Jose Aldo, and more. Follow José Youngs: @JoseYoungs Follow E. Casey Leydon: @ekc Follow Shane Helms: @ShaneHelmsCom Subscribe: http://goo.gl/dYpsgH Check out our full video catalog: http://goo.gl/u8VvLi Visit our playlists: http://goo.gl/eFhsvM Like MMAF on Facebook: http://goo.gl/uhdg7Z Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. Hey, we are live, pal, and this is Jose Young's, of course, at Enameflating.com here for another Wednesday edition of the A-side. I know a lot of you have been asking when we're going to have another professional resident personality on. We've had Sean Ross Sapp on recently. We've had Big E. And, of course, Brody Lee was on many a long time ago. And you guys have been wondering and asking when another person from that world is going to join us. And I am very excited personally to have this man join us because he is not only a fight fan and a professional wrestling fan.

He is one of the original celebrity comic book fans. And you all know my affinity for comic books. Andre Feely, I'm sure, of course, is tuning in to watch this too. But this man needs no introduction. But for those of you who don't know, this is Hurricane Shane Helms, long time professional wrestling, long time fight fan, long time comic book fan. Mr. Helms, how are you? And thank you for joining us this week. I'm doing great, man.

I'm glad you guys scraped the bottom of the barrel before you got to me. I got to say that about Sean Ross, Sav, just because he's in my fantasy football league, and I destroy him every year. Shots fired. Well, we did not. Right up to bat. We did not scrape the bottle of the barrel for you, sir.

I'm always looking out for people that. Maybe they're part of one world, and then we like to bring them in and maybe give him a break from talking about wrestling or anything else, and they just want to talk about fighting. And I saw you tweeting. about the fights last week and specifically the Dan Hooker and Dustin Porey War, which I'm sure we're going to get into. So I said, maybe he wants to talk fights for all of our fight fans.

I tweeted out and my God, people were excited for this one. I haven't had much of a, we've had a lot of great guests on, but people were very, very excited for this one. But before we get into the questions, I have to ask Casey, who's, of course, on the ones that's using the back. How are you doing up in Englewood? Just up to good. That's all. Up to lots of good in Englewood. but of course on the A side this is not our podcast this is the fans podcast you can ask any question you want to us we've gotten a few already about fighting about wrestling about comic books by anything you want so without further ado I know I've seen a lot of them already case what are our fans want to know all right here we go first question first question

this one's a big oh everything yeah there we go this one's an important one This is what I'd expect it. So not a fight question, but everyone asks this question. So we're going to get out of the way, Shane. This is going to be a, I guarantee you've never been asked this question before. I'm trying to think about how to wear this. In a world where we're trying to solve world hunger, you have, someone has attached a Mega Man type hand can into your arm.

Okay. And it can only shoot one flavor of ice cream. what flavor do you pick to save world hunger? And keep in mind in this scenario, it is not a constant stream like soft serve ice cream. It is one like, like one scoop at a time. So to save world hunger, what flavor do you go with? I guess I'm going to go with strawberry. Is there a wrong answer?

I don't know. The only wrong answer would be vanilla, in my opinion. I personally, you got to go with the flavor that's chunky because that types less to people up. And in this world, there are no lactose intolerant people in this hypothetical world. So they can all eat that flavor. Casey, what are your thoughts on strawberry? Are there like, are there like, is it artificially flavored? Are we going like high-end strawberry? Like there's like good chunks of it in there? Yeah, you got to have chunks. You got to have big chunks of strawberries in there.

So correct answer. The only wrong answer is vanilla because that's boring. But anyway, thank you. I knew that question was coming. As soon as night out, Shane Helves is going to be out of this show. I knew we were going to get that question. But thank you so much. Much. I had to get it out of the way here. All right. Next question. Here we go.

Ooh, a little cutoff for me. Gacy, can you make the question a little? Oh, you can't read it? Half of it's cut off. Let me see if I can fix that. Oh, I got it. Here we go. When Eddie Alvers beat Justin Gachie, it was for the title of most violent man in the

UFC, which Eddie Alvers won. Dustin Poria has stopped both of them and just beat Den Hooker in a fight-of-the-year candidate. Does Dustin Porre deserve the title with the most entertaining 155er given his resume? Now, we answered this between the links. So this is, of course, from our friend Average Joe Art on Twitter. Shane, I don't know if you know this man's work, but he is one of the best, I say, fan art artists out there in terms of like comic books and MMA and stuff.

So I'll give him a quick shout. He's a longtime listener. So Shane, I'll start with you. Is Dustin Porier, does he deserve the title of Most Entertaining Lightweight? given his past resume? He's definitely in the conversation. I mean, as far as entertaining and just, I mean, that has to include the microphone as well,

not just in the cage. So you know who the best promo guy is? He's in that division. He's the best promo guy in the game. That goes to Connor. In terms of his actual resume on paper, he's being Anthony Pettis, he's being Justin Gage,

he's being Eddie Alvarez, he's being Jim Miller, and now he's being Den Hooker. Pretty much the only one he's lost to is Habib. And, of course, he's lost. to Connor McGregor. So if we're talking violence, is he the most violent 155 in the game? Yeah, I'll give him that.

Him and Gaei, you know, the Gachie's highlight real, especially in the smaller promotions. Like what he's done in UFC, no doubt, is impressive. But like his earlier, his early career is just, I mean, it's a complete highlight real of him. Just yanking guys snatching them down. You know, he's had some really nasty knockouts. So they're both in the conversation. I mean, I guess you've got to give Dustin the nods since he had the win. So I wouldn't argue that.

And you touched upon it right at the beginning. You need the microphone. Is that what is lacking in mixed martial arts right now? Not enough, quote-unquote characters. I know we saw them a lot in the early 2000s where we had Rampage. We had Tito Ortiz, Huntington Beach, Bad Boy. We've had Brock Lesnar, of course, made the jump from your world and ours. We have these characters that people could gravitate towards and they were must listen and must watch.

And this climate of MMA is that missing outside of Connor McGregor? Yeah, yeah, it's a big miss. You know, the infancy of what became pro wrestling is very similar to what MMA is. You know, it started in the carnivals and, you know, basically a tough man contest. Like, let's see who's the toughest guy in this town is. Well, then what happened, you know, is that guys, some of the toughest guys just couldn't talk. They couldn't get on the radio and sell tickets. Now, keep in mind, this is radio days. They couldn't get on that radio and sell tickets to the next event. So promoters, they wanted,

you know, they wanted the guy that could talk and bring asses to the seats. And they don't want that guy to lose. That's one of the main reasons that pro wrestling even came into existence. You know, it's why a guy like gorgeous George back in the day became so immensely popular. Muhammad Ali is on record as crediting. He got his whole shit. He got his whole shit. stick from Gorgeous George, a pro wrestler. He knew it back then. And I think, too, when you talk about guys like Liddell and those guys, whenever they talked, it seemed natural.

It wasn't forced. Nowadays, if the promo isn't believable, I think the fans, they can tell. They can tell. Like, does this guy really believe what he's saying, or is he just saying shit to make noise? Like, when Connor said it, you believed that he believed it. It didn't matter if, you know, if he said he was the greatest in the world, that didn't matter. What matters is, does he believe? it. He really believes that shit. And then he goes out and gets, you know, becomes champ, champ,

and now he gets all of that behind him and makes it even more credible. But yeah, MMMA is definitely missing out on those personalities than just a guy with a hook, a hook to his name. If you look at, I mean, look at basketball, who's the most famous basketball players? It's Michael Air Jordan. It's LeBron King James. It's the Mamba Kobe Bryant. It's Shaq Diesel. You know, if your name is Bob Smith, no offense to any Bob Smith who may or may not be listening, you don't have a hook and you need. And that's a part of two of the UFC's problem. They're the promotion. They're the ones in charge of promoting and marketing.

They should be working with these guys. You know, when I came to WWU, it was F at the time, they wanted me to be Gregory Helms, just Gregory Helms. And I was like, that shit ain't going to work. You know, so I worked with him. I became Hurricane Helms and then later the hurricane. That's when the hook came in. That's when I start selling merch. That's when I start selling T-shirts and action figures.

And that's when the fans really just got interested in me. Was I that much more of a different wrestler than I was as Gregory Helms? No. I was just an entertainer with a hook then. So I'll ask you this. The two, what you brought up when fans can tell it's not real. I think two of the more outspoken personalities in terms of people talking about the personalities lately have been Triple C, Henry Sohudo, and then of course Colby Covington, they later went on

record saying like, this isn't really me guys, this is just a character. Like they're quote unquote breaking K-fabe in interviews. So when you hear that as a wrestler, are you just pulling your hair out saying like, what are you doing, man? Like people are tuning in to watch you for a reason and now you're saying this isn't you? Well, I think the reason Kobe did It was cause of the heat he was getting Sure

There's no reason to do that Like Suhudo, I never believed it anyway I never believed any of that shit he was saying He just didn't have the good delivery You know, promo, you have to be a good actor Like Kobe, if he's faking it He's an excellent actor And he needs to go into acting after this

Because he's really great And making people believe that You know, when you listen to Masvedal Cut a promo, you believe what he's saying. There's no doubt. Sohudo, I didn't really believe believe it that much. So, so I don't know, but yeah, I definitely understand

when guys, I hate that too. After fights, you know, when the guys said, oh, man, I would just say all that mess to hype the fight. Like, I don't see no purpose in that. So, you know, I think it was very underrated as a promo in UFC. It was Rhonda. Yeah.

Yeah, she stuck with it. She didn't care. If you thought she was being bitchy, she was fine with it. You know, there's been several examples. I'll even go back to when Tim Sylvia was the heavyweight champion. Wow. They were booing him.

You know, he didn't really have a flashy style, okay? Not everybody does. That's the name of the game. But like if when they were booing him after one of his wins, if he would have just got on their microphone and just told, instead of trying to get him to like him, he was just like hungry for their love and their respect or whatever,

that'll come. That'll come later. Don't worry about that now. If he would have just got on that microphone and said, I'm the heavyweight champion of the world. None of y'all could do anything about it. Y'all can't stop me. You want to stop me?

Then come stop me. If he would have did anything like that, his next fight ticket sales would have been through the roof because he would have took the Mayweather approach. People would have paid to see him lose. And Curtis Blades kind of did that a couple weeks ago. He said going into the fight, he goes, if you like exciting fights, don't watch this fight. That's exactly what you did. And he's like, I'm not like, I told you what was coming.

And you still mad at me. So, Chris Slade. I don't know if I would say that before a fight, though. I don't know if to hype up a fight is, hey, I'm going to bore your ass to death. I don't know if you say that before the fight. He didn't say, boy, he said, I'm just going to rag. I'm just going to throw him around. It's not going to be a slug fest.

I'm going to take this guy down. I'm going to break him. But don't even a rag doll. He didn't even rag doll. And ragdoll, when I think ragdoll, I think what Roy McDonald did to Nate Diaz, that was a ragdoll. He just kind of wrestling him, you know, And he out, he did out wrestling and he won, you know, so you can't fault him on that. But he too should have got up, you know, it's like he's on a path to the championship.

That's what he wants to do. He's going to win by any means necessary, you know, something more along those lines. Do you group fighters like the Diaz brothers and Horace, we all in a category of their own where they're not, they're not preparing anything. That's just who they are. Like what they say is on camera is exactly what they're going to say off camera. And that's why it's so believable. You know, you don't really like this. guy isn't reaching anything.

You know, it's like, you know, if you look at movies, like Christopher Walking don't even act anymore. He's just who he is. Like, if you put him in the movie, that's who you're going to get. There's no going to be no more range. Like, you know, you know what you get with the Diaz brothers. And Mazvedal, too. Like, I believe everything he says, and I believe that he believes it.

And that's more important. Best promo you've heard in M.A. I mean, McGregor, that whole, after he won that second bell, you know, when he was acting like he was going to apologize. And he said to absolutely nobody. That whole shit was great. The whole, who the fuck is that guy?

I mean, he turned Jeremy into a meme. And Jeremy is a great fighter, you know, and I really like him. But now when you think of Jeremy Stevens, that's all you think of. It's such a shame on his part. But I like those. Rampage was pretty decent. Tito was probably the first guy that got really good at it. He's not anymore.

He has really fell off on his promo. skills, unfortunately, they actually went for grape to absolutely rotten. But if you're talking about right now, guys that are, uh, Mazvedal is the best going right now, you know, just because he can back it up to as much as I like Nate, other than a kind of win, Nate hasn't done a lot significantly in the cage. And I know that one was a big one, uh, the kind of one, but other than that, not a lot, you know, so Mazvedal, he's been on a tear. So when you can talk that talk and then you can walk that walk. Man, that's when you can get the hype train behind you.

I mean, that's exactly what Connor did. Casey, what's been the best promo you've heard? You've been covering the sport for about 15 years. You know, I like the under the radar ones. When Henry Corallis knocked out, I was Aaron Pico, he's, I'm going to say it wrong, but basically the interview was in the cage. He said something like, I lived in the media of her life.

I was ready to die in this motherfucker. It just, and it just came out so just deadpan. It was just like, he was just like, yeah. You know, it was like. And speaking of two, when Nate beat Connor, when he goes, I ain't surprised motherfucker. Yeah. That too, that's got to be up there.

That's the promo that Corrales because when he goes, I went from, because he was talking about his like past like life of crime and all that stuff. He goes, I went from the dark arts to the martial arts. That was where that came from. I was a big fan of Nate Diaz calling Almond. Masudal after he beat Pettis when he called when he said, Mazurl ain't no West Coast gangster. I thought that in Mazurado was sitting about five feet away from him.

Used his platform right. And then he fought a massive square guard in like two months later. And they made up a championship. They have my men to have my man to rock there. Well, to me, the promo that kind of almost changed the game was actually Nate Diaz when he beat, I think Michael Johnson. Yeah, which is you're taking everything I work for. One.

And like, it was just, and that created the whole. And then once RDA fell out, then that created the RDA-Connor fight, then the mixed martial arts world changed. You know, but the original question is about the most entertaining fighter and talking about promos and things like that. I think people are like Mike Perry, you know, in a sense that he doesn't win all his fights. He probably wins like half his fights. But he just comes out.

So to me, honest in his promos, just what he says, that you don't care if you win or lose it. You just want to see him fight. And you want to see what he says. says win or lose. So I think Mike Perry is very underrated. I'm always interested, too, in Diego Sanchez. I never understand what he's saying most of the time. Like, I don't know what the fuck he's actually talking about, but I know it's going to be unique. So there's something to be said for uniqueness as well.

And what are you, not really a promo guy, but a fighter like Sugar Sean, who is one of the, he's yeah he's gonna be a big deal for a long time but when he gets on the mic he doesn't really cut promos but i kind of like his very nonchalant like just another day in the office type attitude yeah yeah that's a good character i mean that's a not everybody has to be brock lesnar out there screaming and rant and raven you need different ones that compliment each other so you know he has a swagger to him that that's pretty cool and that that plays into it well you know i mean he's supposed sugar i mean your name is sugar sean you know you got to be sweet you got to be smooth You know, he's not the animal, Sean, you know, so.

Yeah, there's not enough fighters anymore that you can go by just their nickname anymore, like Rampage or the Ice Man or so on and so forth. Sugar Sean's way up there. Stylebender's also just himself all of the time. And I think he has one of the best characters going right now. Yeah, for sure. What do you, Shane, what do you think about someone like Fador, who's almost anti-promo in a sense?

Or, I mean, his anti-promo was the promo, yeah. Yeah, that became the gimmick. Like, I wanted him to just say, I saw something with somebody, it was a picture that somebody made and it said, I am Fador. I wanted him. And I tried to get a, we had a Russian guy in WWE for a while. And I can't even remember his name. But I wanted to just totally jack the Fado gimmick with him.

You know, because I wanted Fado to be the answer to every question, just be, I am Fador. Like, no matter what the fuck they asked him, I wanted him to just go, I am Fadoor. And so I wanted to do, Kozlov, Vladimir Kozlov, was the guy in WWI. I wanted him to go, I am Kossloff. And I just want to end that to be the answer. And they didn't do it, of course. But, yeah, Fador's lack of talking just became, I was there when he beat Andre Alovsky, me and Undertaker at Front Row.

Oh, at the Honda Center in Anaheim. Yeah. And so, like, before, during, earlier in the night, they showed the, you know, on the big screen, they show. And you see, no, no, no, not Olofsky. I was there for the Sylvia fight. Sylvia fight, yeah. Affliction 1, yeah.

And so you look back there and Tim Sylvia's back there. And he's, you know, man, he's training. all that kind of shit warming up. And Fado was playing cards. And I was like, this dude, that's as chill as chill can be. So, yeah, that kind of became his gimmick. I'd be very disappointed if I met him in real life and he's all hyper like I am. I'd be like, oh, man.

I would either be disappointed or incredibly impressed. I've met Fado a few times. And that's what you see on camera is exactly what you're going to get. I think he's one of those fighters that knows a lot more English than he lets on. He just has his translator there because that's part of his aura. And Kurt Engel played Fadour-esque Fighter and Warrior. Remember that movie? I don't think I saw that.

The MMA movie with Tom Hardy where it was like... I'd forget Kurt Engel was in it. Yeah, Kurt Engel, so the premise is like there's this big million-dollar prize. It was like the tapout crew, like Mask and everyone were the ones running it. And they needed a Russian character. And Kurt Engel basically, they... Kurt Engel basically played Fador. and then the main character

tapped him out or something to fight Tom Hart at the end but yeah everyone needs a silent Russian killer in their movie yeah I remember too in WWE

I was having to do something with Kozlov and we weren't getting quite the reactions that I wanted and I was trying to talk to the agent of the match and he was an old school guy and he was just like

you know I mean the fans they're going to hate him you know he's Russian and I'm like do you watch MMA? I said the most popular fighter One of the most popular fighters in the world right now is this Russian.

Like nobody really cares anymore. This ain't the Cold War. This ain't Nikita Kohlov. If this was Nikita, I would understand. This is Kozlov, you know. But yeah, Fado came up quite a bit now that I think about it. Well, the anniversary of Verdun tapping him out,

his 10-year anniversary was, I think, this week. So it's been 10 years since Verdun tapped him out. That shit broke my heart. I was... You were there, right, Casey? I was there. I was... Actually, I was...

I was Esther, my wife's a photographer, and she was shooting cage side, so a lot of the photos you've probably seen were taking by her, but I was in the crowd, because I figured, at the time, it was, it wasn't even good...

People thought, like, this was gonna be a sure win for Fador. And then, so I'm shooting in the crowd, so I wanted to watch all the fans cheering. And when Fador lost, like in under a minute, I've never heard... There were at least 15,000 people there.

I've never heard just, it was just the weirdest sound. It was just like... Yeah. What is the absence of sound? Yeah, yeah. It was just like this. Like, we just, everyone was just like, we just paid $200 for these seats and like, it was just what happened. There was also, it also wasn't a knockout.

Like, if it was a flash knockout, it probably would have been insane. But Fador tapping is the last thing anyone expected. Yeah, it was just... And I remember I was watching that. I was at the Undertaker's House. We were watching. Undertakers are big MMA fan, too, by the way. We became friends because of boxing, not because of wrestling,

because everybody talks wrestling backstage. But now as that, I remember, like, we were talking about it, and I was one of the guys I would bet on a lot of fights, and I would take a lot of money from a lot of guys. And so, but, you know, kind of dissecting that fight. I was like, you know, I mean, Burdum's got good jujitsu, but literally I said it in passing. Didn't really say, but I had, there was no.

doubt in my mind that Fado was going to knock him out. You know, because keep in mind, too, that was after those... Dos Santos knocked out. Santos would uppercut him the damn death. And one of the best uppercuts, I think, in MMA history. And I just, yeah, I just knew 100% that Fado was going to win that fight. And I'd be talking shit, too, because we had a couple of them. We saw Dragan as a house full of people and people, and some of them didn't watch

MMA. So they're just listening to me thinking I know what I'm talking about. That was the Grand Prix, right, Casey? No, no, that was just a fight, yeah. Was it really? I thought that was because they wanted. No, no, no. He lost, Fadoe lost the Grand Prix to Bigfoot.

That was part of the Grand Prix. That was part of the Grand Prix, yeah. Because I think if Fador had beaten Verdun, they probably would have had over him, Fadour finally. Probably, yeah. Or Fador over him, and then after Fador lost, Overim kind of popped over to the UFC immediately after, because that fight was no more. But anyway, we've had one question we talked a lot about.

Thank you for the question, Jay Romero. Always happy to see him on. From Joey Jiu-Jitsu, MMA Triple J. Where does Porre and Hooker go from here? So matchmaking time. Shane, if you're booking their next fights, who would you like to see Dustin Porreier and who would you like to see Dan Hooker fight next?

Oh, man. Poria, you got to think, I mean, it depends on if Habib, is he done with his religious, the holiday thing? Yeah, so that's now, I think that's gone past. I think right now he's dealing with his father. His father's sake. Yeah.

Yeah. So the UFC is targeting Gaiji, Habib for September in Abu Dhabi. Okay. So, I mean, if I was poorer, I would sit on the back burner right now, not commit to anything. Because if Habib, Gachi falls through, you got to, I would push for that Gachi fight. I mean, because, I mean, unless Connor decides to pop back in and who knows what he's going to do. But Connor and Gachie is also, you know, I mean, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, There's a good story there.

Gachy's two losses or to guys that Connor knocked out. You know, but Gachie's on a tear right now. So, I mean, you got a good little story there as well. Hooker, you know, I mean, Hooker's got a good, he's coming off a loss. So he's going to have to figure out a fight for himself. But hooker and Gachie also, if for whatever reason something falls through, that's also another good fight. But I think Porre, I think he waits to see if Habib's going to come through with that fight or not.

I think a lot of fans want to see either one of these men fight. Tony Ferguson next. Tony Ferguson, I think it's seen one or two. If Porre wants to stay active, I'm never going to say no to Porre and Ferguson, but I also think Ferguson should probably not fight the rest of 2020. He did not look good. He did not look good in that last one. Someone in the comment says, Hooker versus Charles Oliva.

Charles Oliver, I think he's on a six, seven-fight win streak. Most submissions in UFC history, super young, one of the youngest fighters in the UFC. So I like that fight. It just depends on if you want to put on Hooker who's coming off a loss off someone along the wind streak. Someone says, Poy should get Tony or title shot. Dan maybe should get a rematch with Paul Feldar. That depends on if Paul Feldner wants to come out of time. I like all these fights, though.

Yeah, that's a stacked division right there. Maybe the most stacked. I think it's lightweight is the most stacked division in the history of the UFC. Like just going back to the BJ Pen era, like I think to this day, the most title defense in a row is three. and that's that's i think bj penn is still the record holder for that like since we've had frankie edgar benson henderson connor anthony pettis r d a like all these guys can't string together three title defenses because of how competitive that division is yeah and um and bj's only a couple bar fights away from coming back so you don't know where he's at well you have to win the bar fights but

yeah we got to get that streak back yeah that mean that's it's like that in a heavyweight though for a heavyweight nobody had defended the title. Yeah. Like for a long time, nobody had, nobody had had like two defenses or something like that. I think one did.

The record with, I think, three. Yeah. Because he defended it against Orem, JDS, and Inganu, and then lost this DC.

So Stipe is the record holder with three title defense. With just three. Yeah. And that's why I always thought Fador's running in pride was so amazing because he didn't fight

in a conservative style. I mean, he was throwing head. Hayes, you know, so like he's, a lot of those times he's fighting, like, almost 50-50 fights when you fight like that. And the fact that he was always coming out on top and for so long was incredible, you know. Basically a light heavy weight. Yeah, and light heavy.

It's like 230 pounds, like not chiseled. Like, there's no, he, yeah. There definitely needs to be a cruiserweight division. I wish. I wish or was. In MMA, yeah. That 60-pound differential between light heavy and heavy is just absurd. I think a lot of fighters want to see a 195.

too because 185 to 205 is kind of a big jump. It is, but I mean, if I was going to put one of those first, I would go with the Cruiserate Division first, you know. Or 165, which everyone wants, but you're 155 and 170. Yeah, I think first that the first one you need is the 60 pound difference. That's the one you need to just cut in half. You know what I mean? 230, 230, 235.

I mean, fatal at 230, 2.35 is going to, it would be great. I mean, that fight with Bigfoot was literally, he just couldn't get Bigfoot's big ass off of him. I mean, he shouldn't have been in there with him. He looked like, it looked like one of my kids hiding underneath the bed. You know, all I saw was them Fador's feet sticking out half the time. It's like, I think they had cruiser weight. I think that's another belt for John Jones personally. Yes, yes.

John, yeah, because John's, man, he's, well, he's packed on. If you look at his body from his first fight in UFC to now, man, he's, you know, he's really worked hard in strength and conditioning. And, you know, I mean, I know there's people lining up to say something about the weight game, but it doesn't come without immense hard work and all that type of shit. You know, you don't look like that just off of anything. Comes in at 204 a lot, too, so it's not like he's struggling to make 205. But if they had Cruzewear, I think that's another belt.

Yeah, and that, Cormiere. Cormiere could easily make that, you know, so. Sure. Yeah. But when you got a guy like Brock Lesnar that has to lose weight to make heavy weight, you know, and he's in there with God, I mean, when he beat Randy Coutour, Randy Couture, a tiny. And that was Randy kind of bulked up.

up a little bit. He looks so tiny in there compared to Brock. I'll tell you a Brock story real quick. I had an amateur background. I was about seven years. I was an amateur for about seven years. So I had a little bit of a background. Um, so I was in the ring playing with Brock one day. And I was like, I could get away from him. You know, I'd get away from him for a little bit. I had no illusions about what was going to happen once he grabbed me, you know, none whatsoever. But I was like, I could get away from him. His big ass shot in on me as fast as anybody ever had. He shot in on me, scooped me up. I was like, none. on his shoulder and I just kind of pat him on the back and said,

okay, we're good. The shit don't need to go. No fun. So when he made the jump over to the UFC, were you under the oppression of like it's only a matter of time for this man gets that gold belt? Yeah, the only thing I didn't know about is his chin, because you don't know that. You don't know anybody's chin until they're getting hit.

I've seen big guys, you know, I was a bit of a street fighter, bar fighter myself. So I've seen big guys get knocking the fuck out. And all those muscles don't really. do a lot. And those are gone. So that was the only question. I knew his athleticism.

I knew people were concerned about his cardio. I'm like, you guys don't understand. He'll go out there 45 minutes a night in pro wrestling. And he's bumping, bumping, bumping. And having your win get knocked out of you is so much different than on a treadmill. So that's why that pro wrestling cardio is way more impressive and intense than people really realize. So I wasn't concerned about that.

I wasn't concerned about his athleticism. Damn sure wasn't concerned about his strength. I was just worried could he take a punch, you know, so I wasn't surprised at his success at all. How do you think Kurt could have done in the UFC? That seems to be a lot of a big what-if between wrestling and MMA. I think he would have done good. You know, he does got that thick neck that looks like it's just ripe to be choked, though. Got to be honest with you, you know, he's shorter, so he probably would have been, he might have been middleweight or 205, you know. So I think Kurt would have done good. You'd have been successful.

There's always that story tells of how he wanted to be on the ultimate fighter with Kimbo. That would have destroyed ratings, but didn't pass the medical apparently. Yeah. Yeah, he had his neck and shit's been shot for years. It's amazing that he was able to extend his career as long as he did. Well, thank you for the question, Joey Jiu-Jitsu. I hope he answered it. I will go off on attention.

It wouldn't be the A side if we didn't have a tangent. We had Michael Keyeson here once, and we went on a 45-minute tangent on hunting Bigfoot after one question about fighting. So you're right on brand. Bigfoot silver or actually Bigfoot? Actual Bigfoot, because he lives up in the Pacific Northwest. From Mark Montonio, I hope I'm pronouncing that right, last weekend's car was the first one without Dana White Press conference since the pandemic shows begun. At the interviews he did promoting the fights in May and June, and you have a lot of the, of air time. Do you think this has been good or bad for him? So Shane, a lot of microphone time for

Dana White lately. His pre-fight scrums at the apex and post-fight press conferences in our site dwarf any other fighters interviews. It's just pretty much the Dana White show week to week, but you get some fighters like Sugar Sean and Mike Perry and those pushing in, but Dana White continually dominates our numbers. So has it been good or bad for all of the mic time we've had with Dana White? It's both. You know, you got to keep in mind. I mean, everybody knows he's the boss.

You know, they know that the UFC is a company. It's a little bit different than how boxing is viewed, where you got a lot of the fighters that seem to be called on the shots. Nobody calls the shots in UFC but Dana. You know, the only guy that even comes close is Connor that can kind of do what he wants, you know, but that kind of happened because Connor went outside of the UFC with the whole Floyd Mayweather thing. But it's so good and bad.

word he says, every sentence he says is going to be dissected and, you know, it's going to be 50-50. People either, nobody's going to universally like anything he says, much less everything. Every sentence he says there's going to have the people are going to hate it and half the people are going to like it. So he's in a really tough position. I think he navigates it generally, okay. You know, of course, there's going to be some things that I disagree with and probably you guys as well.

But I think he navigates them as well as anybody can. And it doesn't hurt that there's been a lot of questions specifically for Dana. White lately in terms of fighter pay, COVID testing, fight islands. So it's not like Dana White doesn't have anything to talk about. But Casey, are you over all Dana White videos? Yeah, I've been over it for a little bit. But hey, man, like I always said, if you had like a fan expo and you had all the UFC fighters lined up and a fan can line up to get one autograph or one photo with any of the fighters,

but then you had Dana White, I still feel like the Danes. Dana White line will be the longest. And we would. And that's, it's just, it's weird, but that's the reality. I mean, it's just, I mean, we look at our numbers, we look at our traffic, our interest, comments, and the Dana, Dana stuff kind of rules all. And then, you know, Connor is always kind of right there, too. But keep in mind how long Dana White's name has been out there. Like, if you put a field Jackson with the bulls that he won with, all right, there's going to be a lot of, you know,

There's going to be people in everybody's line. If you put him up with the boys right now, ain't nobody going to be caring about those guys. They're going to all go to field. You know what I mean? So Dana White is just a name that's been around people. You just recognize that name. If you pay attention to MMA at all, you know who Dana White is.

Most of it, there's a big chunk of the UFC roster when you would go, even us, like sometimes I'll hear a name and I'm going, now who is that? I have to be reminded of who it is. You don't got to be reminded who Dana White is. And that's by design, too. That is by design. 100%.

Yeah, well, he's a promoter. You know, you do have to, if he's a better marketing piece, if he's a better mouthpiece than his fighters, he's really just filling up a gap. I mean, like we talked about here, some of these guys can't talk. And when they say some shit, it's boring or it don't make sense, and they're not really marketing themselves.

So he kind of has to step in. He has to be the flavor of flavor of the UFC because nobody else is really doing it. Yeah, we've had a lot of people ask who you think the face of the UFC is, And I've, it's Dana White. Dana White is the face. He's bad.

Like, Conner's there. I think a lot of people, people always bring up Joe Rogan, but I think a lot more people know Rogan from outside of MMA than being tied to the UFC. But it's 100% Dana White. Yeah. Yeah. And too, that's where the UFC needs to look at himself. They need to look within yourself at their marketing strategies and they're promoting it and how they can define these fighters.

because, I mean, you've got Amanda Nunez, who's the most dominant female fighter. I mean, she's one of the most dominant fighters on the roster, period. But especially if you want to limit to just talking about the female, she's the most dominant female fighter of all time. It's like, how in the world is she not a household name? What do we do? How do we get her out of her? How do we get her own talk shows? How do we figure out a way to do this?

And they just, they're having trouble. And part of it is, you know, I mean, maybe she doesn't cut the best promo. Maybe she doesn't have a lot of charisma. I don't know what they think the problem is, but that is their problem to figure out, and they seem to struggle with figuring that out for guys. Like even, you know, Cormier, I love what Cormier's doing. Miochik, Miochik's got a great life story.

You know, he's a firefighter only. You know, he's outside, he's out there still doing that, and he's this dominant heavyweight champion. But you never hear anything about him. You never see him on any shows. You never see him in any commercials. Nobody's doing shit. They have to figure out how to get,

these guys in the mainstream public eyes. You need to be bringing in newer viewers at all time. Not just your casuals, not just your die-hearted. Every show you put on is an opportunity to bring in new viewers. What do you think of other promotions

outside of the UFC like Bellator or One or Rising? That pretty much bring out the bells and whistles for like fighter intros and music and they have fireworks and confetti. And Dana White is so staunch in that we do not do that. They walk out with their corners, and that's that.

They did the live music once. They've given Stylebender a few special intros, but Dana White absolutely does not want the pro wrestling style entrances. But what do you make of Bellator and One in Risen doing all of that? I mean, they put on a better show. It makes for a better atmosphere, better performance. I mean, you're there to put on a show. You know, it is funny because when the Ultimate Fighter season one happened,

it followed Monday Night Raw. Vince had to okay that. If Vince doesn't okay that, it doesn't happen. That's why Vince and Dana have a pretty close relationship. And so it's weird that he doesn't want to do that because there's so many things that obviously they copy from pro wrestling. I mean, when you saw people fighting in cages, that's old-school NWA.

Rick Flair was doing that shit for years when you saw people fighting in cages. So there's a lot of stuff that they can take from them. Why wouldn't they? It's not like it's going to make them look bad. You know, I think for the fighters, you got to be careful. You don't want to pull a Deontay Wilder and blow yourself up before the fight.

You know, you had to be careful about that. But, man, you want those entrances. They could be a really cool spectacle and part of the show. I mean, if you watch the Royal Rumble in one of WW's biggest paper views, the reason it's so popular is because you get more entrances

than you get on every other show. I mean, any other pro wrestling show. You know, you get all of those cool music. So, I mean, if I was them, I definitely would be trying to design, you know, stuff like that to make this guy stand out, you know. If you got the Iceman Chuck LaDale, I don't know if you get the lights all blue. You know, if you remember WCW, we had a guy named Glacier,

and they made it a little like it was snowed. You know, it's the million-dollar engines they always talk about. Yeah, it was fantastic. And then the NWO came to town and nobody gave a shit no more. Then everything became NWO. But stuff like that could be cool. And as a fan, you're going to buy that shirt, man. I want that shirt, you know.

Nobody's, I don't see. any, you know, and I'm out in the public or wherever I'm at, I never see, like, MMA shirts. And I bought a fade-o shirt, and you can't even tell what it was. Sure. You know, they just, nobody has that hook like I was talking about, that you want to put on the shirt and stuff like that. And that, you know, I mean, you see the action figures in Walmart. They basically all look the same because of the Reebok deal.

They all got the same-looking shorts on. It's like, they're just interchangeable, so kids aren't buying them. I was going to I'm going to bigger industry so I can assure you nobody's buying him things

but I was going to ask you how much you think Reebok plays into that because I remember when the Reebok deal came out everyone had pretty much the same fight kit

it was just their name on the back they even even Mirko Krocob didn't have Kro Kopp it was his actual last name or like Cub Swanson had his real name

so it wasn't like they were going with these characters that people have they were you like even without the spelling mistakes they were going. I didn't. What was your thought on it? Asinine. You took away individuality. You took away

autistic freedom from these guys. You know, if I see Chuck Liddell and he don't have on those blue tights with the little icicles at the bottom, that shit is going to look stupid to me. You know, you want, you wanted Tito with the fire trunks. You need Krocop with the Croatian flag of the red checker boards. You need that. You know, it just, it adds something to it. You don't need it, but it adds to it and adds markability. You know, I don't know who fucking Mercosillo-Povitch is. I know who Crow Cop is, you know. When Steve.

That's just, that should have been day one. That conversation should have never existed. You know, yeah, Reebok, we're going to, you know, Reebok can sponsor and Reebok can make them, but they should have easily got with these fighters. It's not like there's 10,000 of them. I mean, there's just, you know, 20 or 30 of them. I mean, that are going to fight on the next paper,

but you get with them and go, okay, what can we design for you? How can we make this to fit you and let's make it work? I mean, the more designs that they have, the more Reebok's going to sell too. You know, I'm not going to buy 15 of the same shirts that look exactly the same. They just have a different little name right here.

I ain't going to do that. I need something that tells me this is Mioche, this is Cormier, this is a style bender, something like that, and that is individualized. Yeah, I never understood how, like, I can go to a pro wrestling T's and see some indie wrestler who, you know, has only wrestled in front of, you know, 500 people. He's got six different shirts available, but yet, you know. And they look cool.

And they all look cool. Yeah. And like, but it's just, I don't understand why Reebok doesn't have, you know, 10 different Dan Hooker shirts that you can, I don't. I don't know. I just, I don't know. They're trying. Like, well, the Reebok deal is coming up. Supposedly it's between Nike Under Armour.

And Venom Coming out of the woodworks for that one So it's totally going to be venom 100%. But I think Bellator, I mean, when I watch Belator Just seeing everybody fighting in what they want to fight, I just like that. You know, just

Yeah, it felt weird. Yeah, I don't like that weird uniform look. I mean, if you watch, especially on Fight Island, because Fight Island is finally motor combat come to life. I want to see Scorpio, I mean, Scorpion and Sub-Zero. If they're wearing the exact same outfit, I'm not going to care. It's weird looking, but I rewatch Anderson Silva and Michael Bisving,

like recently, and Anderson Silva's just wearing the black and white, doesn't have the yellow, doesn't have nothing. It's very bizarre looking. They're starting to slowly come around because supposedly Bryce Mitchell is going to get his camo trunks after calling for him for so long. One fighter. Who's not even ranked in the top 15? No. Cowboy got his grandmother's patch on.

or someone's patch, Brian Keller, a lot of former co-host of this show wants his, what is it, a tie-dye trunk. So slowly but surely, but let's see what happens after the Reebok deal. I'm just curious why it's taken so long and what the conversation is. Well, we've had fighters on this show like Ben Rothwell.

He tried to come out with a robe and Reebok exonerated. They were like, no. Like, it's a Reebok thing. Or Roxanne Montefarre was on the show and she had a sports bra. That was Reebok branded and Reebok still shot it down because it wasn't the official sports bra of the UFC. So I don't know how much it's UFC, but I think Reebok has a lot to do it. I think one fight I can't remember off the top of my head wanted to walk out with his state's flag.

Not a U.S. flag, his state's flag, and that was shot down. You're only allowed to walk out of the Hawaiian flag, as far as states. For some reason, only Hawaii. But if you want to rep Texas or rep Michigan and just, nope, it just. That's bizarre. That's why you don't see the ATT flag, that famous one with all the bloodstains on it anymore. That's one thing I hated, too, because when they went to the Reebok deal, one part about MMA I loved was it was almost like Dojo versus Dojo. You know, ATT versus A.K.A.

And they will rep it wear their shirts all the time. You rep your team, rep your coaches, you know, but now it was just like when UFC releases like fight announcements, they'll have two fighters wearing the exact. same thing, like closing off. Like, you guys look at teammates. Yeah. That's why I liked about the Black Zions. I couldn't tell you who every member was, but I knew that team. The second I heard that name, I was like, that's a cool thing.

It's going back to the Lions Den. Who was the Lions Den? The Lions Den was like the first one, I think. Hammer House. Yeah, now you have to go to the region, like here in Arizona, back when they had the Power MMA and AZ Combat, like, there would have to be security guards between corners. Because like corners were trying to fight. Teammates are trying to fight in the crowd.

You don't get that in the M.A. Well, you know, Dan Lambert's got a bunch of championships. He's got a championship just ready to go whack somebody in the head. Yeah, honestly. Underrated promo guy, Dan Lambert. Yes. Yeah, yeah. I got to hang out with him a little bit.

I presented the fighter of the year to Amanda Nunez at the MMA Awards. Yeah, that's right. And so I got to hang out with Dan there. Yeah, he's a big pro wrestling fan. I like talking to him. You know who we started. talking about pro wrestling too much and then the guy, one of the guys got annoyed by it.

He was the guy he knocked out Uriah Faber in the WEC. You know what I mean? Mike Brown. My ground. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's not the biggest pro wrestling fan in the world. So if you start talking about it too much,

I noticed he kind of started to drift off and then he slowly just left the little group. Coach. You're Matt Brown. And so Dan told me, goes, yeah, he's not a big person fan. That's what I'm a guy. That happens.

I'm going to ask you a question, Shane, because this is something I've been working in MMA for 12 years now full time. And one thing I can never understand is the MMA, MMA fan, this generally, MMA's fans kind of, I don't know, like, they just, they always just shit talk pro wrestling, but I never see the other way. I don't see pro wrestling fans going, oh, MMA sucks. It's like, what is this insecurity that MMA fans have with? pro wrestling, even though we know

the histories are so linked together. Because it's more popular. It's the same. It's just what it is. And I understand it. You know, like I got into amateur wrestling because I loved pro wrestling. I went to my first live pro show in 1979.

So my love for pro wrestling runs deep. So when I first stepped on an amateur mat, I'm looking for a ring. You know what I'm saying? I'm like, what kind of shit is this? I got to land on this thing. And so like my amateur coach hated pro wrestling. Well, one of them. One loved it and one didn't. And the one that didn't, he was just

like, man, you know, and I never really got, he never really just came out and said it, but I remember having a conversation waiting one time. And I was like, well, I mean, there's no pay-per-view for the Olympics. Why do you think that is? And he just started seething. You get to tell he was just mad to shit. It's like, like, it's one of those things where amateur wrestling, like, especially in the higher levels, you know, it's so intricate. You have to be a fan of it to appreciate it. Casual fans they don't. And pro wrestling added all this kind of craziness to it. And that's why it became popular. But I think some of that just kind of translates over. But yeah, I never really see pro wrestlers like, and there are a lot of MMA guys too that like that love pro wrestling because I got

you know several friends in the in the business. So, uh, but yeah, you're definitely correct. I never hear like pro wrestling fans really trashing it. Um, I think the only time they do is if you have a real technical submission match and they want to see suplexes and they want to see suplexes and they want to knockouts. They want to see the spectacle. And sometimes if you have something as a Damien Maya, you know, who might not give you some of the flashy fights, you know, they might not, that's the only kind of bad things I ever hear from wrestling fans is they're called some of those fights more. And when they're not, you know, they're just really more intricate than the casual observer notices. I think we heard a lot of complaints of MMA fighters hopping over

to the squared circle in recent years. Like, oh, not another MMA guy trying to come quote, take our spot. Like when there's always that rumor of Connor making the jump over, when Rhonda made the jump over, even Matt Riddle, when he made the jump over, people just like, this is our world and you stay out of it. Yeah, which is odd because I'm saying, I mean, pro wrestling started out as MMA.

So it's odd that you wouldn't want anybody. And I'd rather have somebody with an athletic background than, you know, a grocery store clerk that comes in. You know, somebody that already has a background, there's already credibility and believability. But at the same time, I have seen something in the MMA guys come over in a pro wrestling and they think they're tough.

They think they're going to come and run shit. And they kind of get put in their place pretty quickly too. I've definitely told the guys like, man, if you were so successful in MMA, you'd still be doing it. You know. You're not wrong. That's a hilarious way of putting it. Oh, man.

I just want to mention a shout out to Shana Bazeler, though, and I'm very happy. Yeah, yeah, she's done fantastic. You know, I think, too, the Irish hand grenade, Marcus Davis, he dabbled in it a little bit. Yeah, yeah. He was one of those guys that really put over. I think Samoa Joe was telling me this and really put over how really difficult it is on your body,

how it beats your body to death. I mean, Rhonda, you know, she didn't want that schedule, not to travel and the getting beat to death. And that's a good thing about MMA. You get to stay home. When you're in your camp, you're there. Like when you're on a plane four days a week and those planes are just terrible. I don't know if anybody here knows that. this or not, but air travel, we're not meant for that shit. Air travel is terrible on your body.

And so you're doing all of this traveling, you get slammed 10, 15 times a night. It beats you absolutely the fucking death. Like, I think MMA, the cuts are worse. You know, the superficial cuts are worse. But in terms of what the damage it does that's done to your spine and your brain rattling around, pro wrestling is definitely worse for your body than MMA is. It's way more just, you know like I said it just tears your body to absolute pieces oh yeah I've had I've been on a few podcasts we're talking like because I always thought Daniel Cormay would make a really good commentator or manager in professional wrestling when Kane made the the jump over to wb I thought for sure DC was going to follow him and be his mouthpiece yeah I was amazed at how

many fight fans weren't aware of the schedule you guys had they thought it was just the one day a week one one pay-per-view a month I'm just like man they're on the road for like 300 days a year. Like, that's terrible for you. Yeah, it beats you absolutely to death. I remember King Moe-Law talk, because I think for a while he was trying to do both pro-restle and fight, and basically he said pro wrestling was just too tough on the body. It was just, you couldn't do both.

Yeah, he's just, nope, can't do it. Yeah, Bobby Lashley's like, man, Bobby Lashley's like, when he's not on the road and he's doing MMA training, he's like, he's fine. When you got to go on that road and you start bumping and you're getting sling. you're not getting slammed 15 times, you know, at night. You know, so that's why I think he really likes, well, the money, too. You know, the money of the WWB kind of helps out. From Jay's store on the site, most wins.

Five active fighters are in the top five for most wins of all time. Donald Soroni with 23, Damian Maya, 22, Jim Miller, 21, John Jones 20, and Diego Sanchez with 19. Which of these men were retired with the most wins? Will someone further down the road break the record such as Corey, RDA, both at 18, or Holloway or Oliver, both as 17. Very separate question, which female fighter, current, or former would you like to add to the English language broadcast? So I'll start with the first question.

Of those five men in the top, Soroni, Maya, Miller, John Jones, and Diego Sanchez, who ends their career with the most wins? What number is John Jones and Cowboy at? Cowboy is at 23. John Jones is at 20. Cowboy would probably end up He's going to keep going Diego I don't know how many more Diego has in him Jim Miller Did Jim Miller just fell a test?

He just won But did Was there something about him that he fell a test of some kind That wasn't him? I saw Miller something I don't know what it was So Ixneyed that one And he's what

30 He's up there He's like mid-30s late 30s? It's amazing how that's old. Jim Miller has the most fights or second or third most fights, and I think Soroni has the most total fights, but they're one and two, or one and three for wins. So they're always like, I remember for a while they would fight, like Soroni would fight one month and then he would have the most fights. And then Miller would fight the next month and he would tie him

immediately. So it's always been a two-man race between those two. I think they should get to a point where they had the equal amount of wins and then that's their final fight between them to they fight each other and that's what they should that's how i booked that i think it john jones should end with the most wins but who knows when he returns he said he's more than happy to sit out for as long as it takes to get paid what he's worth and in that time i would imagine donaldson he fights 12 more times until john jones returns uh for that second question which fighter do you know i think i think actually i think charles olivar is going to win that's what i was going to say i think he's going to have the most because and like just because because because

the financials. It's not because he just, he's not, he's, he doesn't charge a lot to fight. And, um, he can, he can kind of fill that card in all the time.

And so, yeah, like he, how many, he has, like, almost 20 wins. And I've seen all his fights and,

like, I really don't know anything by Charles Oliverer. I really don't know. And he's the, he's the youngest on that list, right? Yeah, he's only 30. So actually,

yeah, it was a, he'll sneak in there. He'll, like, whoa, you know, just,

but sorry you can go to the second part there was a point in time where I think he was one of the youngest fighters on the roster like he still wears glasses doesn't want to have LASIC eye surgery like it's all those interviews he's still wearing his glasses fought Frankie Edgar in the co-main event at USC 162 that was

the main event was Wyden & Anderson Silva won and like that's how that's how long he's been around and he has now the most submission wins ever in the history of the UFC I think he has a trilogy and it's Nick Lance I think he's one and one against Jim Miller so if I have to put money on who's going to have the most now, I think it's going to be Porre or Oliver because of age

and how much they fight and how much they win. Oliver takes a lot less damage too, right? He doesn't get too up. So I think he would be the guy to lean to here. Yeah, Oliver is coming up in August. He'll be a UFC fighter for a decade. That is insane to me. So, yeah.

So his first fight in UFC was when he was 20. yeah and he's still getting better to be honest that is insane to me they just had a female fighter that was 20 years old on this past card didn't they yeah yeah Hansen she's the second youngest fight I think the only one younger is Chase Hooper so she's the youngest female fighter and she won 50 and she won

her fight and she won the $50,000 performance bonus yeah and that's not a bad gig that third part of that question which female fighter do you think should be added to the English language broadcast. So we've talked a lot about male characters and on their mic skills. Are there any females that have good mic skills in the UFC?

I haven't, I mean, I don't think a lot have had opportunities. You know, I know Paige Van Zant seems to talk pretty well. She seems to do good. Karate-Hadi does pretty good, too. See, you notice how I remember her name? See, that's a gimmick. That's a hook. Angela Hill has a, is,

amazing. Oh, yeah, she's a great Twitter follow. She's good. She's pretty good. So, I mean, you'd have to actually hear them do commentary.

Can they dissect and be really good? You know, I'd have to hear it first. But those three right there are really good. I don't know how well. Holly Holmes does okay. She doesn't,

she's not a fantastic promo. She kind of really seems unsure of herself, which is strange, considering how decorated she is. There's not a lot that spring to mind, to be honest.

one after her fight in March compared Yowana to the rock where she has an aura of like win or lose she is so captivating to watch and all of her like if you watch her media days and stuff she always speaks in motivational phrases and then when she gets in the face of Wiley she's just talking the entire time so I think Yowna has to be up there for best mic mic workers and she she definitely works the gimmick well she did the whole I mean unfortunately she lost that fight boat. When she was doing the whole boogie woman thing with Rose Namagunius, like just, she made that

build up to that fight. She just made it, you know, and Rose, too, looking so timid half the times. Stoic, but also timid, like, if you didn't know Rose whatsoever and you look and you saw that face off in, it almost looked like Sigourney Weaver with the alien

eating her face off. You would just think Rose Namagunus is going to get murdered in here, and then she went out and won it. Like, that is such a really good pivotal moment for women's MMA. It was a really good fight too. But the buildup, the buildup was just all hype and Johanna's the one that

made that happen. I think without her that fight doesn't have nowhere near the level of interest. That's the great part. The clashes and personalities. That's why I love MMA because you have Rose just very quiet. Even I remember at the press conference, someone asked her like, Rose, are you doing okay? Because she was just sitting there and she's like

oh, I'm fine, why? She's like, she's like I'm ecstatic. Yeah. Yeah. Even Wei Lee, she doesn't speak any English, but the only English you hear to say is shut up. Shut up. Shut up.

That was it. That's all you needed. That's all you needed. Shut up. She was awesome. Like, too, they haven't really hyped up the Rose fight as much with, you know. I mean, this is the girl that took her championship, slammed on the head. We very unique way to win that fight.

And so, you don't want to. And, too, it's hard to work with somebody who doesn't talk, you know. Sure. But that's when your marketing team comes in. That's like what Bellator and companies did with Fatal, and they created the last emperor. I guarantee you Fado didn't come up with that idea. You know, they created and they create that entrance and all of that stuff.

You've got to do that for people like Rose, or else nobody or else we're going to be having this conversation forever. Why aren't they hype in this fight? What do you think of a fighter? And this is how it was described to me on Twitter, like Jessica I who has quote unquote Ex-Pock Heat

X-Pack Heat worked really well a lot of times to be, you know, you got to have those legit heels. So it can work because then,

I mean, Floyd Mayweather had Xbox Heat, you know? You know, it was until he became Money Mayweather that he got the hook,

you know what I'm saying? That was the real hook, money Mayweather. But even then, you wanted to see somebody be eat him. You know, you want to see somebody beat Xbox. You wanted to see somebody beat Jessica I, you know, but you can't talk that talk unless you're winning. You know what I'm saying? So if she could

have came out and won, if she would have won that last fight and then afterward, even up the promo. See, that's what happens. You know, if you got that kind of heat, once you win, you got to up it. You don't need to get too respectful. And I know there's a lot of old school guys that hate that there's the Pat Militich guys they hate you know all of that shit man but that's what sells tickets and this is still a business you got to have money coming in the door

you know you want to generate interest to the casual fan you want to see those headlines in the New York Times you know you don't see shit like that no more you know but and you don't got to be crazy you don't got to be Mike Tyson I'm going to eat your kids you don't got to be insane like that but if

Jessica I would have won that fight and then got on the microphone after him be like I told you I told you what I was going to do. Y'all can't stop me. Bring on the next one. Just anything like that. And, you know, keep that momentum rolling. You know, and then you want to see somebody whoop our ass.

So you got to have that. Someone in the comment section said, Megan Anderson and Elie Malay McFarlane would be, well, Megan Anderson already does in victim fights. I forgot about her. Oh, yeah. It's also a good interviewer. And LeMay, and she does the desk, I mean, you know, the desk for Bellator for the big events too. So she's done on camera.

Yeah. Yeah, there was another girl, too, Heather's something. She actually used to do the Adam Hunter show, you know, the MMA roasted podcast. Heather? There was a female that used to do his show a lot. I forget what her name was. But she was really good on his podcast.

So I feel like she would be good on the commentary, too. I always thought Misha Tate was a very good commentator. She's been around for so long. She does a lot with won championship now. Yeah. Didn't she do? I feel like she did something. She didn't do any commentary ever with anybody.

She was on the Fox desk for a few times with the U.S.C. Before she was it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought she was good, in that. I think she was great. Joseph Bose in the YouTube comments. August 22nd, fight night as Michelle Waterson versus number 8, Michelle Waterson versus number 13, Angela Hill booked.

Thoughts on Angie getting a full camp for Michelle. Casey, I'm going to start with you for this one because you've covered both of their careers from pretty much the beginning. Yeah. Angela Hill has pretty much become the talking about characters. Angela Hill described herself as the cowboy surrounding of the women's division. She wants to fight on every fight card against it. It doesn't care of the rankings.

Doesn't care if it's one day's notice or three months notice. So thoughts on Angela Hill getting a full camp. I mean, that's great for her. But this is one of those fights like where like. This fights never happened before. It's a super interesting fight because both Michelle and Angela Hill, they're coming off losses. But if you ask around, most people thought Michelle beat Carlos Sparza. Almost everyone thought Angela beat Claudia Gidella.

So it kind of, it sucks that one of them are going to have a two-fight losing streak after this. And that's what kind of, that's what bums, actually that's what bums me out. As much as I want to see him fight, the fact that one of them has to lose and lose half their paycheck and be in a two-fight losing streak. and just that kind of sucks, but just as a pure fan, hell yeah, super excited about this fight. And yeah,

I've known both these ladies for a long time, but I visited both their camps, shot them training and interviewed them and stuff. Did one of them go to your wedding? No, no, no. Michelle sold me on having my wedding

in Albuquerque, though. Oh, yeah, there's a, she was like, oh, you got to have an Albuquerque. Who you picking? Get to the tough question. Who you pick? Casey can't pay for these two. I know.

It's going to be an all-out war, 30-30 draw. 30. Every round is going to be so exciting and so close. The judges are like... A bunch of 10-10s. Just from the excitement. What do you think about that fight, Shane? I can tell you, I'm picking Angela Hill, you know, especially with a good camp.

I think so many of her losses, like there's more than a few should have went the other way. and they're the ones that weren't there were a lot that were just super super close so you look sometimes you look at that number of losses and you forget them and some of them are super super close she could easily won a big number of those so and I like I like waterson a lot I just feel like she really needs to figure out a way to get some power because she can touch you she can touch you a lot but it doesn't seem to do a lot of damage you know and this isn't point fighting you know And that's one thing that is traditionally. And, of course, I'm not a pro, so this is just kind of regurgitating information and just my observation.

A lot of people that come from that karate background, they do that point fighting thing. And they're not really landing those significant strikes that do damage and that wear you down and stuff like that. So I'm definitely taking Angela Hill. There you have it. I'm also taking Angela Hill. Any other questions, Casey? We went a little over time, but. Oh, actually got one more.

Good one right here. Can you read that? Is that too small? Oh, yes, I can. I'm very interested for this one. Trumbo on the site, one of our longest comment. That looks like the Dancy Scrolls right now. The Peter Yan hype.

Peter Yon may be a killer, but we don't really know that yet. He had a very close fight with Rivera, his best competition so far probably, and it looked great K.O. in favor, who was 40 and well past his prime. He's young and extremely talented, but largely unproved. as of yet. I see a lot of people basically counting Aldo out in a fight and given how Aldo's chin and cardio looked against Marlon combined with his skills and experience, I expect

this to be a very tough fight for Yan. Do you expect Yang to steamroll Aldo or people counting Aldo out because they don't like that he got the title fight? Thoughts. Don't tell Petey this question. His proud of probably spoke, Pete's former co-host, he is the biggest Peter Jan fan in the world. I am never going to think anyone's going to steamroll

over Jose Aldo to answer that last question. I still think Jose Alos is the greatest featherweight of all time. I think it goes, personally, I think it goes a lot with that second part where people are just upset he's getting into the title fight. But by no means do I think this is a gimmee fight for either man. But Shane, your thoughts on Peter Yon versus Jose Aldo at Fight Island? I agree with you 100%. I don't think he's going to steam roll Jose Aldo. I mean, but I think Yon is the real deal.

I think he's badass. And this is going to, I mean, there's no bigger test for him than Jose Aaldo here. So the question is, is Aldo pissed off because a lot of people feel that, you know, he was robbed of that last fight. So does he come, is he coming in? Because he looked like his athleticism and his speed and everything was there. Visually, he looked sunken in that last week. I remember being concerned when I saw him at the way in. And generally, when I bet fights, I try to watch the way.

And to me, that's just such a huge indicator of how the fighter is or how he's going to perform, how he visually looks. And he looked, man, he looked like Skeletor. But I thought he fought really well. I thought he fought excellent and just, you know, didn't get the decision there. But so now are we going to see an angry Aldo? And even though Aldo isn't that young, he's been in a lot of fights, a lot, a lot of fights. He's been doing this for a long time. And that gas tank, you know, that gas tank empties a lot faster when you're older.

You know, you look at Tyrone Woodley, you know, that wasn't the same guy. You know, I know Gilbert Burns was an incredible fighter, but Tyrone Woodley just looked to looked like he had nothing from an energy standpoint in the tank. So you got to wonder how Aldo is going to do in this. But I'm looking for Peter Yan to get the win. If Aldo wins, I would not be surprised. But Jan, Jan, that's who I'm picking in this one. Casey, who do you think wins this fight?

I know you're not a big fan of the fight actually happening, but who do you like in this fight? Yon. Yeah, I think, Jan. But, you know, I just, I'm, I hope Auto makes 135 because he, he looked like he barely made 136. And now he has to cut a whole other pound. And he has two more rounds because we always hear of Aldo losing his cardio in those fourth and fifth rounds. Cutting down one more pound and getting two more rounds is going to be a completely different.

I think a completely different Aldo. But I'm never going to count him out of a fight. I mean, of course, yeah, he's still in the fight. I just think it's this Yon's time. And I just, but like Shane said, like I'm just, I wish this fight wasn't happening. I wish it was Yon versus Aljo. But, but here we are. And, yeah, but like, like you said, if Otto, maybe that was this,

maybe his first cut to 35, well, his last fight against Marley, his first cut, maybe that was, we're going to get a better version of him now because he, now he has the experience. He's fought in that body now. So we might see a better auto, so we'll find out. You know what else he doesn't have to do? A lot of media. This is true.

Yeah, he definitely, he hates that. He's not good at that. We were at media. I interviewed him at Media Day, and he was sitting there in all of the layers you could imagine. Because that was also December in Vegas, so it's not overly hot. He had all the lights on him. He was sitting there with a leather jacket and a hoodie on, cutting weight while getting the same questions over and over and over for an hour. I think people are not taking that into account either.

Like not having to do as much media responsibilities is probably going to be a big factor for a lot of fighters. Yeah, sure. But anyway, last question. Let me ask you a question. What MMA fighter gave you the least in it? Because I had a couple, like on my podcast Highway to Helms, I've been doing it for 10 years. Now I do it just myself. I only have guests no more.

I just said to hell with it, these people on my nerves. But I used to it. I had some MMA fighters. And there was one in particular that stuck out that was pulling teeth trying to get an energy. entertaining conversation out of this guy. Why MMA fighter has given you the least and so that when you have to dig deep, and that's the true test of an interview.

You know, which one? Because I'll tell you mine, it will not be a surprise at all to you, but there's been a lot of prelim fighters. I can't think of them off the top of my head that are just scared. It's like their first ever interview they've ever done. So they're trying,

it's not that they didn't give me a lot. It was very cookie cutter. Like, I'm just really excited to be here. Thank you for the UFC. Like, you know, all of that. I know Casey and I have interviewed this fighter a million times, but Hannah Seifers. I love her interviews, though.

I love interviewing her. Only because, like, you're talking about, like, characters. That is her. Like, she is so scared of the cameras. I'll be like, so, like, what are you thoughts on this and that? She'll be like, good, I guess. And, like, that's her answer. But it's so timid.

And then after the interview, she'll come up to be like, I'm really sorry. I'm not used to the cameras. Like that is her character. And she gets so excited meeting. She got so excited to meet Daniel Cormier. She's like a 5'1, 150 pound woman. And it's just like giddy to meet Daniel Cormier.

So you're never going to get anything out of hand of Cifers, but I think that's, that makes her interview so fun. Mike Perry hates me. So that's probably another one. Oh, you get great stuff on Mike Perry. Yeah. I was going to say, like, I'm never going to get like a coach. hearing conversation out of him, but he's always going to give, he's always going to call me a name

or say something to me, and that would have to keep me on my toes. But Casey, what are your thoughts? Actually, talk about a great fighter that is almost anti-promo in the sense is, and I've interviewed many times. And off the record, like, we could talk, have fun conversations, but once I turn the mic on, it's just, is, um, Robbie Lawler. Oh, yeah, I forgot about him. Robbie is such a hard I'm such a hard interviewer. Yeah. You have to, he'll talk about fellow fighters for hours, but he hates talking about himself. Yeah.

And like, oh, and if you come in, like, if you ask Robbie a question that he just doesn't like or maybe like, hey, like talk about a previous loss or something. Like, he just gives you that look and he's like, oh, fuck. He's like, he like, he won't say that's a stupid question, but you can see it in his eyes. He's just disappointed in you. Right. Yeah, Robbie, Robbie, like, and I, and I, I'm such a fan.

Robbie Laude. Actually, like, I enjoy his bad interviews in that sense. So do I. So yeah. My only interview I've ever, actually, I've only thrown away one interview. I just like, you know what? I'm not putting this out there. And he's not a boring interview. I just, we just did hit it off, but I interviewed Phil Davis one time, Mr. Wonderful. And he's a quirky guy, but like, if you don't really set him up right, it just doesn't come off. And it was just one of it was when he was finding he was fighting Ryan Bader in Sweden and it was a fight no one wanted to

see anyway so I was just like so Ryan Bader he was like yeah Ryan Bader I'm fighting him Saturday I was just like it's gonna be a good fight he's like I hope so I was like shit I was like come on give me I was like I had nothing

and then I kind of froze up and I was just like okay delete so yeah people don't understand that when you're the interview and the person is giving you nothing how difficult that job can be. When I was doing Highway to Helms to begin with, I actually would have wrestlers and stuff come over. And so some of the younger ones that weren't used to it,

I would coach them before, like have something to talk about. Don't come on here without shit to talk about, you know, because there was in the early episodes I had a female on. I was like, you know, hey, so what's going on? She's like, not much. I was like, okay, you got anything big lined up? No, not really. Why are you on this show?

But as far as the MMA, I had the immortal Matt Brown on, and I was just like, man. And like how he came, how he came off in the ultimate fight is exactly kind of how he came off there. And it's kind of how he comes off. And everything I heard about him is he's a good guy. He just doesn't, you know, emote. He doesn't project, especially energy. So he's a guy when I was talking about earlier how pro wrestling morphed into what became pro wrestling. If you would have heard him talking on the radio, you're not going to go.

buy a ticket to see that guy. But then when you watch him fight, you're like, damn, that guy's a bad ass. We wanted the best elbow knockouts in history on Diego. But like, yeah, just talking to him, I was like, man, after it's over, I'm like, I'm not sure that guy even like me. Well, he himself has said that he's had to change. Like, I'm no longer that just agitated man all the time. So I think he's coming around a little bit. And on the inverse, Josh Barnett, if you guys ever get a chance to interview Josh.

Oh, yeah. He's a lot of fun. I had him, Stefan Bonner. Actually, I had Stefan Bonner on my show, and he had no fights coming up. And I said, hey, here's what I'm going to do for you. I'm going to put it out there. I'm going to use my Hurrah Powers. I'm going to put this out into the universe, and we're going to get you a fight.

The very next day, he got the call from Dana White for Anderson Silva, the very next day. That was the main event, too. Now, it didn't work out well for him, but he did get a fight, and he did get a payday. My God. There you go. I had nothing to do with you. It was just funny the way it worked out. Did any other questions, Kays or is that it?

I think we're good, sir. All right. Well, thank you so much. Thanks you so much, everyone, for tuning into this episode of the A-side. This is one of the best feedbacks we've had in a long time. But, of course, the mayor of the hour, Shane Helms, you've cut a promo once or two in your life. The floor is yours to plug, say whatever you want before we sign off.

Well, I'm at the twilight in my career. I really don't have to plug a lot of fights or anything. else coming up, but you can always check me out on social media. I'm at Shane Helmscom. That's cross-platform, Instagram, Twitter, Tumblr, even. I think my space is still up there somewhere. I'm not positive about that.

But Highway to Helms is my podcast I put out, I've been doing it for since 2010. So check that out on wherever you find your podcast, wherever they may be. And that's about it. That's how you plug. That's how you plug stuff. Take notes, young MMA fighters

who come on and say, thanks for having. that's pretty much all they say. Casey, anything you want to say before we sign off this week? No, thanks for having me. All right. Well, you might be back Friday. We might not. We'll let you know.

But thank you so much to the Hurricane Shane Helms. I hope, I assume you made a fan for life from Casey. He didn't know much about your wrestling for it at all. And you seem to have won him over. I appreciate it, man. Well, we'll see you back. We'll see you next Wednesday. Maybe Friday.

This will be on Apple Podcast, Stitcher, Spotify, Google, YouTube, you name it. But until then, we'll see you later.