MMA Fighting - The MMA Hour - Episode 207

Episode Date: August 26, 2014

Featuring Rashad Evans, Todd Duffee, Sergio Pettis, Nick 'The Tooth,' and Bob Meyrowitz. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Apologies if you're watching this live for the slight delay at the top, technical issues. I think our guests in the back were messing up with our computers and our system and everything, but we are good to go. Happy to be here. It is the 20th anniversary of the UFC, and they have a huge show coming up on Saturday night. It's UFC 167, headlined by GSI. P versus Johnny Hendricks, of course. We'll be talking about that.

You can see if you're watching the show live. Who will be joining us later? But no time to waste. Let us get to our guest in studio. He'll be co-made eventing UFC 167 against Chal Sunnan, his good buddy, or at least I think they're good buddies. My good buddy, Rashad Evans. What's up, man?

How are you? I'm good, man. Thanks for coming. Man, thanks for having me. I told you off camera, the last guy who visited us in studio was Chris Wybeman before he knocked out Anderson Silva. I think the UFC should bring more guys in the studio. Sam, but then everybody had that luck. That's true.

You want to space it out to on the guys you really like. You know, it's interesting. This is a very big fight, and it's a very big show, and it's the 20th anniversary and all that. But it feels a little bit like the fight is kind of flying under the radar. It is flying under the radar. I definitely agree with that sentiment, you know. And one of the reasons why I feel it's been so is because, you know, Chale is he's already booked for another fight.

You know, and there's another fight already more exciting as far as the fans concerned looming in a process with the event. under the silver fight, you know, and he's already scheduled to fight. I mean, do the ultimate fight of reality show. So this is a fight that's kind of, you know, not getting the burn. And also another reason why is the fact that, you know, the UFC has a primetime show on. And whenever they have the primetime show, they're building up Johnny Hendrickson showing why he's a worthy competitive fight GSP.

So they have that much invested into that show. So they're going to put their money around and their advertising around building that fight. It was very interesting when Dana announced it, With Chale, when he announced in an interview on Fox Sports Live, sitting right next to him, before the fight, did you feel kind of like, like, man, why don't just wait until after the fight so you don't steal the spotlight here? Yeah, I kind of felt like that, you know, because, you know, we have the one element that we are friends and stuff like that, and it wasn't going to be that kind of trash talking. But, you know, I was hoping for a little bit more sporty banter, just something to make it a little bit fun for the fans and stuff like that. But, you know, the whole situation that happened in Vegas with, you know, Van der Leyen and in Chale, it kind of, you know, kind of took a life of its own, I guess. So you mentioned that your friends, of course, you work together on Fox Sports, you do the Wayan shows, the Pre-Fight shows, all that stuff.

But, you know, I was actually watching a video of your favorite UFC moment. And you said that it was Anderson Silva Chale Suna. Correct? And in the video, you said that Chale and I weren't on the best terms. And this is kind of an older video. What's that all about? When were you not on good terms? You know, I don't really know, to be honest.

Let me see. I got to see this video because I got to see my mindset. Right. I don't really think I had really knew Chale back then, you know, when I made that video. Chale is somebody that when you, when you, like, you don't know him, you kind of assume things about him and you assume kind of his mindset. And, you know, Anderson Silva, I love Anderson Silva. He's like one of my favorite fighters. So, you know, I'm all automatically in on Anderson-Silwa's team.

But, yeah, chairless somebody, it took some time to get to know. He rubbed you the wrong way at first? Yeah, at first, because I didn't really know how to read into that whole, like, that whole, you know, the talking trash, you know what I'm saying? I mean, he just did it at another level, you know what I'm saying? And it kind of took me by surprise as far as being able to discern if he was, you know, genuinely like that or he's just putting on the show. So now mentally, though, have you put a site? Like I said, I've worked with you guys. I was in the car with you guys.

And all this happened in Indianapolis, which makes this fight somewhat personal and very surreal for me, that you're actually going to fight each other. But have you separated the colleague from the fighter? Like, do you want to go in there? Do you have that killer instinct to go in there and actually beat this guy up? I definitely separate, you know,

the colleague from the person I'm going to fight on Saturday. And I did it, you know, just, you know, systematically through the last 10 weeks, you know, mentally getting my mind around just fighting them and just fighting somebody that I know. And, you know, I have talked to them a couple times in the 10 weeks, but, you know, for the most part, I want to make it just a fight where I go in. I will have to go in there and make the decisions that I have to make in a fight. You know, if I got an opportunity to end the fight with an elbow on the face,

I can't be worrying about, well, you know, this is my friend Chale. I got to be able to do what I need to do to win the fight. You know, we're both competitors and we're both in the same way class. And although we're friends, this is the fight business. And, you know, when you're in a fight business, you got to fight anybody. And you say you've talked, I've seen you talk on shows before, but have you talked privately? Yeah, you know, I text him a couple times. Really? Yeah, we text. He texted me my birthday and I text him, you know.

Wow. Yeah, so I mean, it's just not. What do you guys talk? What else do you say to each other? You know, I don't know. Like, what was it? Oh, I was going to the W.W.E. They had one in Miami. Okay. And he's good friends of CM Punk, so I had him hook me up with CM Punk and stuff like that. Yeah. So you're still on good terms? Yeah, we're still on good terms, you know. On Saturday, it's going to be very competitive.

We don't want to lose to each other. And, you know, I was telling you before the show, three weeks later, we're going to work together on Fox. So I don't want to be the guy sitting on the other end, like, dang, you know, this guy beat me. You know what I'm saying? So I'm going to go out there and do my best to try to end the fight. People say I'm an instigator. Those Fox guys are instigators. Whoever books those shows.

That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying, right? Come on. Three weeks later, you're working with the guy? Yeah, and then the thing about it was, they're like, hey, so you want to work on, you know, December 5th? And I'm like, yeah, sure. Oh, yeah, it's going to be with Chale. And I'm just like, ah, okay, it's cool.

What do you make of the fact that Chale's still doing those shows, pretty much leading up to it? Does that tell you that he is in focus, that he's able to juggle things? When you see that, how do you react to it? Initially, I definitely think that he's not really focused on where he needs to be. I mean, you know, and I'm just going from my point of view. My point of view, I couldn't do anything. No, I couldn't, you know, besides the fact that I travel across country.

But I couldn't do it just for the mindset of, You know, when you do those shows, and I know he's a natural and he's really good at it, there's a lot of prep work that goes into it. You know, you got to know the names of the fighters. You got to know a lot of things about the fighters just to be able to have a casual conversation to know what the heck you're talking about when it's time to. So for him to be still doing it, it doesn't seem as that like he's putting that kind of focus you need to be training at a high level, you know, I mean, maybe something to stay in shape

or casually train, but to train for a fight. And also you've got to keep in mind that, you know, Chale is, um, changing up camps. You know, he's changed up camps. He's now left Oregon. Now he's in L.A. area training in L.A. area is already hard anyways because everything is so pieced up. You know, it's different, you know, you got rain gym out, Mark Munoz and those guys have really good facility out there. But, you know, for the most part, you really have to travel to go and get different things which you need. And it's not all encompassed in one area. Do you think that the whole Vandrelay thing, the fact that he's going to coach against him,

They really don't like each other. Do you think that has taken some of his focus away from you? Do you think that will play, work against him come Saturday? It could. It could definitely work against him. I don't want to right now sit here and say, you know, write the script of what his mindset is going to be like because you really never know anybody's mindset

and what goes into having them compete. So I can say for me and myself, if it was me, it would definitely take a little bit off, you know, because it's hard, you know. I mean, he would have to be one seriously talented individual to go in there and juggle all those things in his plates, you know, and still come out and really fight the way he wants to fight. And, you know, we'll see you on Saturday.

But if it was me, it'd be, that would be a very tall order. And it seemed like he's stacking the order against himself. Is it fair to say that there's more pressure on you going into this fight? Because he already has his next gig. And it's not just the next fight. He's got a whole reality show waiting for. Yeah, exactly. You don't have that luxury.

No, yeah. And that's exactly it. You know, I try not to even think about it like that. You know what I'm saying? You know, I've made it this far in my mind. I'm very particularly about the way I think when I have to get ready for a fight and ready for a fight on fight week. I try to think about anything after, you know, that fight.

The only thing I think about is just that fight because when you start to think about everything else that encompasses it and what this could mean, you find yourself in a situation worrying about things that really have no relevance, you know, and you worry your mind and worry is the seeded disaster. You know, and the less things you can worry your mind with the things you can't change, then the better you'd be and the better you'd be able to go out there

and just compete the way you're able to compete. I was talking to my colleague here, New York, Rick, and we were talking about this fight before the show, and he's like, there's no way, there's no place in this fight. Any aspect of this fight where Chale can beat Rashad, what's he going to do out-wrestle Rashad?

What's going to do, outstrike Rashad? Where's he going to beat him? Do you agree with that sentiment? I do. I definitely agree with it, and I definitely trained. You should give my high-five on your way out as well. That's what I'm going to do.

But, you know, it's a fight, though. You know what I'm saying? And that's the thing about it is that in MMA, the math sometimes really doesn't make sense. You know, and I can be like, yeah, I can't out wrestle them. Yeah, I can't strike them all day. But that does not necessarily mean on fight that's what's going to happen. So I prepare for the worst. You know, I prepared to be on bottom.

I prepared for him to be on the mountain. I prepare for him to have my back and be in all kinds of tough positions. I prepare for the absolute worst chale sunning, nightmare chale sonning there can be. So I'm ready for anything. And I'm ready to take this fight wherever I need to take the fight. And I know he's going to be aggressive and I'm going to be aggressive. So this is going to be a fun fight. You know, it's interesting.

When you were on our show a couple months ago, you were on your way to New York. Yeah. You never actually stopped by back then. I won't hold you to it. But you're here now, so you made up for it. And you were here for like a week or so. We were seeing the pictures out there. And, you know, I will admit, I started to think, what's going on here?

See, the mindset. See, that's Ariel, man. He's always got to get the story. Always asking the hard questions. I was wondering, are you jumping ship? What's going on with the Blacksilians? Well, why did you do that? You know, I did that because it's been something I've been meaning to do for a long time.

You know, Mark Henry is one of those guys who is probably one of the best stand-up coaches that I've ever, ever had a chance to train with. He's one of the best coaches I've had a chance to train with. His mindset for getting you ready for a competition is second to none, you know. And I had a chance to work with them a while back, but I never really made the time to do it. I always let myself, you gave an excuse. Ah, man, I do it next time.

I'll do it next time. Well, the next time was this time. And I said, you know what? I'm going to make sure I start my camp early enough and I'm going to go and train with those guys out there. And just get a different look. Because, Ariel, sometimes when you're in a sport for so long and you're used to be in the same situation, you kind of tend to stagnate a little bit, you know? And maybe just stepping out the box just a little bit and maybe just relearning something

or learning something new or just being able to get a new energy, kind of revitalize you a little. little bit and kind of get your mindset in a different place and get you in a trajectory that you wouldn't normally get if you stayed in the same place. So coming out here in New Jersey was, I think, you know, a big part of my camp and Keating my camp and working with the guys in New Jersey, Ricardo Almeda and those guys and Frankie Edgar and Edson Barbosa and Marlon, those guys, it was amazing. So it helped you. You feel like it helped you. Yes, it helped out a lot. And you were here for a week, right? I was here for two weeks. Wow. Even more interesting than I thought. Two weeks. Two weeks.

weeks I was here. Will you do this now for all your camps to start here? I think so. I think so. I think I will like, you know, get a winner, winter code and come no matter when, you know, and just make sure I stay in this area and make sure I work with the guys up here, you know, because I'm affiliated with the Hansa Gracie team and it's good to be able to come out here and work with these guys. And, you know, they got some guys good in Jersey too that are my size that I can work with. So it's good training. It's funny how things can change so quickly because part of the reason why I thought that just a couple months ago was, you know, there was a time when the black civilians were on a bit of a losing streak, a lot of changes with the coaches and whatnot. Now look at you guys.

Yeah. Avres, Vitor Belfort on Saturday. What changed? What happened? How have you guys become unbeatable all of a sudden? You know, it's like, you know, it's, it's a mindset more than anything, you know. One thing that I would say, you know, the coaches work tremendously hard, you know, and Henry Hooft is, is amazing. You see the head coach now? No, George Santiago is technically the head coach. Really? That's interesting. Yeah, George Santiago is the head coach technically. Has he retired? He might still fight, you know, but he's definitely, you know, the head coach.

Really? Yeah. He's a really good coach, too, extremely good coach, good leader. But Henry is amazing at really being able to gather the troops and making you listen. And, you know, one thing he told us and one thing he was preachers constantly is just like, listen, let's stop looking for ways to reinvent the wheel let's stop making excuses for ourselves let's stop getting out of what really needs to be done and that's to train hard and when you go and you show up don't show up late respect your trainer partners and go in there and train hard give it

everything you have because when you do that it just becomes the way you are and he's very big and he always says train how you plan a fight you know and if you want to fight you want to fight aggressive you got to go out there and you got to train aggressive it's got to be hard you know you're going to get a little lumps up you're going to get beat up a little bit but if you want to fight that way don't expect it to come magically on fight night you got to train that way and he's been really good at just really putting that mindset and getting to uh get on that page is it possible that the team expanded a little too quickly that you brought in some guys that maybe you didn't weed out the guys who wouldn't fit with the team for sure for sure you know and um the whole black zillion

movement kind of all took us by surprise you know and it was just something that just, you know, we started off in a small gym in Imperial, and it was just a handful of guys, and we had our guys that we needed to train with and get ready for fights. But then once we got into the new gym, it just so many people came. So many people came, and the growing pains of that was just, it was very difficult, and it was a lot of change because, you know, everybody's trying to find their way in. Everybody's trying to get used to the coaching, get used to this, get used to, that. And, you know, people had a different kind of mindset, you know, as far as when it came to the

gym. You know, we were kind of like, you know, we started to believe the hype a little, almost too much. You know what I'm saying? And it got away from those roots of going in there and just, you know, that small gym that was pretty much inadequate for us to really get the good training we needed, but it was just good enough. You know, we trained in an old garage and it was exhaustingly hot all the time because it really wasn't air-conditioned right. So our, I, I training practices were just just downright brutal you know we had one shower for like 12 guys and stuff like that so it was just how but that's that's where that's where that's where we were given edge that edge yeah and we kind of got away from that when we expanded too fast and we started buying our

help and to our hype but then we had to get stripped back down you know and that whole falling apart movement where you know we were you know the black zillion curse and all the stuff that was really good for us as a team because it helped to see the other side of what all the the whole the whole the whole hype and everything is because one thing one one aspect is you can be loved or you can be hated but once you've been both you have a better perspective on what it truly means to be either you know so then when you're moving forward and you're doing good in your life or you're doing good and everybody wants to congratulate you you know where to let that go you know where to say okay that's good you can pat me my back but i know not to let me get mentally thinking that i'm better than anything because of that

because i know the other side of that the love hate thing reminds me of you're about for it because he is so, um, he's performing so well these days. Yeah. I mean, he knocked out Dan Henderson. Dan Henderson's never been finished like that. Finished him in like a little over a minute. Um, he's won big fights leading up to that point. He looks to be in great shape, but he is still very much criticized. He gets, after every fight, like, it's just an explosion on social media and people trying to take away, um, what he's doing inside the octagon. Is this fair? Do you think it's fair how people, the media, the fans are reacting to Vitor? I don't think it's fair at all.

You know, I think that, you know, no matter what anybody wants to say about, you know, him using TRT or whatever the case may be, that does not mean, you know, that doesn't make you fight better. You know what I'm saying? And that's one thing. Doesn't give you an edge at all?

In training, doesn't the bumps and bruises heal quicker, nothing? You know, when they get the TRT, you know, there just is like how all the other fighters who don't need the TRT, You know what I'm saying? Even playing field. It'd be even playing field.

Okay. And here's the thing about it. It's like this. If it was only something that only a few people can get, then I'm like, you know, that's bull crap. The system needs to be adjusted. But if I can go see a doctor and I can say, listen, my levels are low and feeling like this at practice and a doctor can say, okay, and subscribe me, some TRT and I do it, then that could be,

you know, everybody has the opportunity to do it. That's what I'm saying here, you know. If we all then have the opportunity to do it and make sure. that we're on that level, then it would be a different situation. But if we all have the means and the access to do it, then why complain about it, you know? Does he ever say to you, Rashad, you should do it too? Look what I'm doing to Dan Henderson. He never says anything.

You know, he never says anything to me about anything that he takes, you know, the supplement that he takes. He never said anything about it. He just, you know, I look at more than anything is the fact that it's not so much, because there's a lot of people who take many things, you know, people who have, you know, people have, you know, take this and take that, but it doesn't make them fight better. You know, what has made the biggest Vitor, the biggest difference in Vitor's career is his mindset, where he's at mentally speaking. And Dana touched on it on Saturday night.

He said mentally, you know, he's known Vitor since he came into the league. You know, he's seen Vitor and he's seen his mindset. He knows him, his whole story, and he sees that the only thing that's different is just his mindset, you know, and that has nothing to do with any TRT. Is he a good teammate? He's an excellent teammate. He's probably one of the best teammates I've ever had. Really?

Yeah. Why? Well, because he makes sure that he takes the time to help you. Really? You know, and he makes sure that he works, we work really good together. You know, we grind, you know, every single time. You're like, let's smash some grapes together, brother. We get it.

We go hard. You know, it's him. Cesar Ferreira, Anthony Johnson. You know, those guys are like, you know, Tiago Silva. What about Tyrone? Yeah, of course, Tyrone. But he does like a lot of, you know, he, like, more or less like coaches me more than anything, you know? Oh, really?

Yeah, he does more like coaching. Will he be in your corner on Saturday? Yeah, he will be. Who will be in your corner? It would be, you know, Kenny Monday, Henry Hoof, Tyrone, and also Mark Henry. Oh, yeah. That's interesting. You're bringing him out.

Yeah. Is he there for anyone else? Well, he's already there anyways in Vegas doing the reality show. That's great. You know, I have a theory now that Tyrone should just stick to kickboxing. Well, I mean, you know, I mean, you know, he's already. You know, Tyrone's one of special athletes. Doing a little too much, it might not be smart.

Well, he's such a special athlete. I think that he could do all three effortlessly. Well, the MMA, he has to definitely, you know, work a little bit more of that because it's just so different than all the other one because of the ground aspect. But I feel like he is one of those special athletes who can do it all. But, you know, when you're talking about longevity and when you talk about what you really want to be serious in, I definitely agree with that sentiment, you know.

But in Tyrone with too, you know, but he's focused on, you know, doing the boxing and doing the kickboxing. You know, for kickboxing, kickboxing isn't really too hard for him, meaning not to be disrespectful to anybody he fights, but it's, um, he's been doing it for so long. It's like second nature to him. And, um, I think a lot of people are really going to be surprised at his, how good he is in boxing. Boxing, I think, is where he's going to take a lot of people by surprise because I'm telling you, when you see this guy with his hands, absolutely. amazing. Absolutely amazing. Like, he's going to

be somebody exciting to watch in boxing. How many more years you want to do this for? You know, I ask myself that all the time, and I was in a place in my career where it just wasn't fun for me anymore. Yeah. And I've made it through that rough patch. You know, I made through a rough patch because, you know, after you see

everything, you know, you see behind, you know, the curtain of Oz, it kind of changes the way you feel about it. And by that, I mean, you know, you see how the whole system works. You see the politics in it and to not be bogged down by the politics of the sport by not and still keeping your competitive nature. It was hard for me at first, you know, but now I got a different mindset when it comes to competing. I got a different mindset when it comes to just dealing with the

politics of the sport and everything else like that. So it's helped me get a different appreciation for it. And, you know, I'm going to keep on fighting as long as my body allows me to, as long as God gives me the ability to keep on fighting. So you don't have like, you know, two years, three years, you don't have a set timetable. No, I don't have a set timetable. You know, you never know what can happen in your career. You know, you know, Vitor could have never imagined that. Sure.

You know, he's on a, you know, second leg of excitement and probably the best Vitor ever at 36 years old. And it's just something that, you know, I want to be able to, to be able to quit when I need to, like, I want to be able to retire before the sport retires me, no doubt about it. But at the same time, I don't want to leave the sport before competitively. unsatisfied. So this is the big 20th anniversary show, and there's a lot of reflection going on. What's your first

memory of the UFC? When did you first watch it, hear about it? The first time, I watched it on the first UFC. Yeah. Yeah, and I read about it. Live? Not live, not live, just on paper view. You remember this old scrambler box? So me and my buddy, we had no scrambling box, and we were watching these, we were babysitting these kids.

And me and him at the time, my boy, Craig Waldek, we were into karate. We went to karate. And we would always have these debates about who it went between Bruce Lee and Mike Tyson and just make up all these different disciplines fighting and see who will win. And we read about it in this magazine, this karate magazine, things like Black Belt Magazine or something. And we knew it was coming on.

So we made sure we watched it. And it was amazing. It was amazing. Like all our questions were like answered. You know what I'm saying? And even after the results with them, we still were debated about it. And then the next day we went and we trained and we kicked each other. But we tried to emulate what we've seen.

But it was something that I'd never seen before. And it was just like, what an amazing sport. You know, it would be something if I can do something like that. So right then you said to yourself, this is something I want to try to do? Yes. Because you were what was 1993? How old were you? I was like 14.

14. Yeah, was 14 years old. Were you wrestling at the time? Yeah, I just started wrestling. Okay. I just started wrestling. But karate was what I was really into. Okay.

You know, I was into Tang Suddo. I had a great karate instructor. show Carl Carl Brasino and you know he he was really tough on us we got to train with the adults because we were too too too much for the kids are really aggressive so yeah we're really aggressive so yeah just training with the adults and you watch that and remember saying to yourself one day this would be yeah we we went I remember telling my crowd instructor really yeah we want to we want to fight we want to fight in the UFC that's why and here you are 20 that's mind-blowing right when you take a step back you know it's this whole sport this so this my whole journey I

guess, has been kind of mind-blowing in a sense because, like, you never really get a chance to have the perspective, you know, and see where you are. You know, every once in a while, somebody say, wow, you're a legend of sport. And then I'm like, then I think about some things. I'm like, wow, I have made it pretty far. But this is one of those moments where you actually get perspective. And I'm privileged and honored to be fighting on this car because I remember where I was when the first time it came on. And I'm just like, man, now here I am fighting on the 20th anniversary. And I just feel, I just feel honored and happy. And, and I just feel, and And, you know, a lot of people, you know, like we were talking about earlier, like, you know, nobody's talking about this fight.

And, you know, I don't even give it damn. You know, it doesn't matter to me because this is for me. I'm just happy that I'm fighting on his card, you know? Where's your friend, the one that you watched it with back then? He's still, he's still back in Niagara Falls. Yeah. He still talked to him every day. That must be wild for him.

Yeah. The guy he watched it with is. Yeah. You know what I mean? It is, man. And just like, it's something else, man. It really is something else. And, you know, I talked to my old karate instructor every once in a while.

And it's something that that's. crazy that, you know, I'm doing what I'm doing right now because, you know, I've always wanted to fight. What's your favorite personal moment? Because when I think of you, obviously, you won the show, Sean Salmon Kick. Yeah. It was wild that they still show today. When you knocked out Chuck, you know, the shot to the heart.

Come to join you. Elizabeth, come to join you. That was, you know, when you won the title, it was amazing. You've had so many moments. Is there one that sticks out? The obvious one would probably be the belt, but. Yeah, that's the obvious one. But, you know, I always say to Chuck one, and I say, yeah, because, like, that one for me was, it was the first time, like, there's times where you show up and there's times where you just, like, arrive, like, you are just there, you know?

And that was a moment where I was just there. Like, I was just ready. I remember getting ready in the dressing room and an overwhelming feeling of just an exciting calm came over me. And that sounds even crazy to even say. But it was like an exciting calm. I was so excited, but I had like a stillness and a readiness in me that in my mind, nothing was going to stop me. And I just had like this uber confidence like this dude is making a mistake to compete against me.

You know, and I just felt ready. And I remember hitting the mids in the back room. And Coach Winklejohn was amazing. He was telling me, man, this is what you're going to catch him with. This is what you're going to catch him with. And the funny thing about it is Mr. Winklejohn, Coach Winklejohn, he was, the night before the fight, I was nervous, and I'm talking to him. And he says, listen, here's this going to happen.

You're going to catch him with the overhand right. And they're not going to let me in a cage to congratulate you. Really? And that's exactly what happened. And when I did it, I looked at him, and he was like, I told you. Yeah. That's wild. It's crazy.

You're still on good terms of them, right? Yeah, I still love Winks, man. You think you'll ever work with him again? You know, I would love to be able to do something with him these days. You know, he's such a good guy, and he's such a really, he's a really good coach. She is. He doesn't get enough credit at all. And he's like one of those guys who, you know, you see, you see his work. You see his work. When I watch one of the Jackson fighters, I can tell who works a week and who does not work a wink. You know, he has a very unorthodox style, but, you know, he's a very good coach. What about Greg? I like Greg. Yeah, me and Greg. Better terms?

Yeah, a lot better terms. You know, once we work past that whole situation, you know, I can never stay mad at Greg for too long. You know, we got a good relationship. We got a friendship. We got a friendship. I'll side of all the fighting things. The relationship is not what it was, but I mean, you know, when I see them, I always talk to him and chavoured up with him. What was that thing you were saying? You were saying, I'm coming with you. I'm coming to join you. What is that?

That's what you were doing? That's what you were doing? That's a little bit, I'm coming to join you. This is the big one. That's, oh, was it the Jeffersons? No, Sanford and Son. Sanford and sons. I'm coming to join you.

Really? That's what you were doing. Yeah, because I couldn't believe it. It was a hard stopping moment. I'm coming to join you. That's amazing. that you would have the mindset to do something like that after that. That was my favorite show.

I used to watch Sanford's Sun all day. Okay. One more thing before I let you go, and we appreciate this very much. No problem. Do you have your next plan? Like, Chale has his next date set, right? Yeah. And right now in the light heavyweight division, John is fighting Glover,

Gustafsson's fighting Manoa. Things seem set up top. What does that leave for Rashad? You know, I don't know, to be honest. You know, I told myself this area. I said, I'm going to go out there and I'm going to compete. and I'm going to go out there and I'm going to fight hard and I'm going to go out there and do what I know I can do

and let the result speak for itself. When I find myself in a position where I'm trying to make plans and I need to do this and need to do that and need to do this to get in the title picture, I never really make it to where I want to be, you know? So to be honest, I don't care how they stack them up. I don't care who I got to fight. I'll fight who they put in front of me.

And my goal is to be, the best. If John Jones is the best at the time, then I want to fight him. If that's Guffs is in it, then I want to fight him. But anybody in the way, I'm going to fight them and I'm going to beat them. And I want to do it in a present fashion where it would be no choice, but for them to say he needs to fight for the belt. Like they're saying about Vitor. Right. 205, right? You're going to stick a 205? Stick a 205. You know, I thought about dropping the 185, but, you know, it just didn't really make too much sense for me. You know, drop down to 185 to just have to fight back to be in a position

that I am in right now at, at 205, you know, and that's like a 20-pound weight cut from, you know, where I am. And I'm already, you know, I don't look big, but I got really dense bones, and it's really hard for me to lose that kind of weight. And, you know, I go down to 185, what am I going to gain? I'm still not going to be the biggest. Right. I'm not going to be the strongest, you know, And I won't be the fastest. So then, like, what did I really gain? You know, at least at 2 or 5, I can maybe be one of the quickest, you know, maybe be one, you know, so I can use, I can have another attribute that goes along with being small, you know. And I just got to, you know, fight where I'm at.

I feel like I sit here for hours talking to you. You're so sincere. I appreciate it, man. It really means a lot that you'd come by the studio and talk to us. I know it's a big week for you. Thank you so much. Good luck. No problem.

I will see you out there. My man. UFC 167. It goes down Saturday night in Las Vegas, Nevada. Rashad Evans versus Chal Sun and of course we'll talk about it as this show go on. Don't worry, we'll take a break, Rashad. You don't have to run away. No, no, there is. Hey, we're going to take a quick break. We'll be joined by Todd Duffy after the break for now. Here's my interview with Hoyce Gracie from last year. On the 20th, actually it was the 19th anniversary of the UFC, November 12th of

2012. We spoke to Hoyce Gracie, fitting to hear from him now. So here's Hoyce and then we'll join you right here in just a couple of minutes with Todd Duffy. As I mentioned at the top of the show, you cannot talk about the ultimate fighting championship, the success of the UFC, without talking about this man. We've mentioned him several times. He is arguably one of, if not the most famous MMA fighter of all time. Even still today, everyone knows who he is, everyone knows his last name, everyone knows his first name. It is a huge honor to be joined by the legend himself. Hoyce Gracie right now on the MMA hour.

Hoyce, how are you? Good, man. I'm a Disneyland. You know what? That's amazing. that you are at Disneyland. Do we have that clip? Brendan, do we have that clip?

I want to play this clip. Before we get to it, you're actually in Disneyland right now, right, Hoyce? I am. I'm trying to find a quiet spot, man. I'm checking back to you. You sound great right now. Do we have this clip?

Isaac, give me a thumbs up. Brendan? Anyone? Okay, we'll get to... Yeah, we do have it. Okay. We're going to play this clip before we get to the interview

because I find it fascinating. You told me earlier today, Hoyce, that you are going to maybe in Disneyland. And at the end of the first ever UFC, back on November 12, 1993, you had won the tournament, you won all your fights, you did so in very impressive fashion. They gave you this massive check of $50,000, and they asked you, we have it, Isaac, and they asked you, what are you going, where are you going, and this is what you said. If you get in a clinch, if they don't know what to do, it's great jujouzs all the way.

There's no chance. What are you going to do with the money? I'm going to go to Disneyland. You go to Disneyland? Unbelievable. You're still in Disneyland. Are you, do you go to Disneyland every year to celebrate the birth of the UFC? Man, I have four kids.

I come over here at least about six, three times a year. Do you remember saying that in the cage? Of course. My mother was in town, and I didn't spend any time with her before the fight. So I had to bring her to Disneyland to peace out a little bit. That is unbelievable. And in some ways you haven't left. So I want to ask you this, Hoison, thank you so much for joining us.

This being the 19th anniversary of the UFC, it's a huge honor for us, a real true honor for us to have you on the show. We had earlier Art Davy, who was one of the co-founders with your brother Horian, and he was talking to us about how it all came about. And he said he figured that Horian was going to ask Hickson to be a part of the first ever UFC. But at the end of the day, he went with you. Why did he go with you over Hickson? I think because Higgs was a little too big, or I wouldn't be as impressive.

200 pounds beating up a 220. So me being 178, beating up a 220, being up a 220, it was much more impressive. Do you remember when you first found out that they were going to put on this show? Yes. Take us back to that moment. Autumn just came up to me. I called me heads off. And said, I mean, I knew he was setting up the show.

I knew he was doing that. He was organizing the whole thing. And then he called me in his office and said, hey, I'm going to put you to do it. I was like, good. I can't wait. Having such a big family. Sometimes, I mean, I was wondering when is it going to be my turn. So there's always a brother that's older or younger, bigger, stronger, faster.

So it's like, hey, give me a chance. guys. So did you feel a bit at the time like you were kind of overlooked in the family? A little bit, a little bit. I mean, again, my family is very big. Right. So everybody's doing the same thing. Sometimes you get a little overlooked. So that being said, were you surprised that he came to you? I wasn't surprised. I was just, let's say, I was with him, I was teaching a lot of the classes of the Grace Academy. He knew me very well by then, how I think,

because I'm not an aggressive person, I'm not a violent person, but I get the job done. And he tasked me before with people that came into the Grace Academy. So he thought that my character would have been perfect for the show.

And why didn't Horian do it? Why didn't he compete in the first show? He was a promoter. Can't do everything. Well, you know, the Graces, I think they think that they could do everything. So was that even considered? Sometimes we do it. So that was never even a consideration, right, that he would fight in the first show representing the family? No, no.

It was any of that situation. Because I was the only shot, he came up to me, and, hey, you want to do it? I'm going to put you to do it. I was like, perfect. Back to training. Yeah, exactly. That's actually my next question. The first show was November 12th of 93.

How many months or weeks did you have to prepare for the event? There was about three months, four months I haven't. Three to four months notice. It was the same as everybody else. As he was asking people, and he asked the number one boxer at the time, and he declined up number two until he got, I think, Jimison was number six of the rank at the time, and he accepted. And then he was going to kickboxing champions

and survive champions and kung fu champions he was going for number one guys. So I saw he was making the list and then he asked me. And what did you do to prepare for this? Because nowadays, I mean, this guy fights this guy, they know who they're fighting, they prepare. You're going in there to not only fight more than one guy,

but you don't really know what to expect. What did you do in training to prepare for this event? Well, on the first one, We had a sumo wrestler and it was a random draw and that was done at night before

the fighting. So we didn't know who were going to fight them. So you got to be prepared for everybody, for a grappler, for a sumo wrestler, for a kickboxer. You got to be ready for everybody. So did you bring in, like a sumo wrestler or a boxer or a kickboxer? Did you bring these guys in to train

with you in the weeks leading up to the fight? Not a sumo wrestler, but I had enough students that I could choose from kickboxing, boxing, from very heavy, not exactly the sumo-rests, but very heavy students that would help me out so I can get used to body weight. The main thing is strategy for me is not just come in and duke it out and fight. Okay, if he's a grappler, good for me. I know what to do. If he's a kick-boxer, I got to get in a clinch. he moves such a way. If he's a karate man, he moves a different way, but I'm still going to have to get nothing change.

So I'll assume a rat, but eventually I've got to get nothing. Back on the mixed martial arts hour, that was our old studio back in the day, and now here we are with our new studio, much better, much improved. How about that? It was a blast from the past, and if you recall, last year,

our show fell on November 12th, 2012, and that was the 19th birthday of the UFC. Tomorrow is the official 20th birthday of the UFC. So I thought everyone's going to come out and do their anniversary shows and they're going to pay homage to the UFC weeks, days, months leading up to November 12, 2013, even tomorrow, I'm assuming there'll be a lot of stuff. But we're going to be first. We're going to celebrate the 20th anniversary of the UFC on the 19th anniversary of the UFC.

And guess what? If you missed that episode, if you're a newer fan of the MMA hour, we are going to repost that interview because it kind of disappeared, weirdly enough. We're going to repost that interview tomorrow on the 20th anniversary of the UFC. We have some other fun things planned for tomorrow as well. So stick around for that if you're watching this live. That whole entire show, including the full hoist Gracie interview, was a great show. Horri and Gracie was on. Art Davy was on. Campbell McLaren. You may know some of these names now after watching that great 20th anniversary. documentary that aired last week. I did not lie to you about that. It was, it seems critically acclaimed. The entire show, I believe that was episode 117, if memory serves me correct, it will be reposted tomorrow on MMAFighting.com, Tuesday on MMAFighting.com. All right. Thank you so much to Rashad Evans for stopping by. I love that. I told him afterwards.

I think that was my favorite interview with him that we've ever done. We've done many. It was just so great to have him in studio. We need to do that more often. Let us move along now. joining us on the line is a man who we were thinking we might see towards the end of the year but maybe not we haven't heard from him in a very long time and finally finally after much begging

pleading he has decided to grace us with his presence once again he is Todd Duffy Todd are you there What's up here? How are you doing? Hey Todd how are you? You made me sound like a prima donna on that

why? Grace me with your presence Well, it's been a while. I've been, you know, let's be honest. I've tried to get you on the show. I've been wondering where have you been. Oh, yeah. It's been all over the place.

How are you been? I've been great. You know, I was going to ask you where have you been, all these questions. But boy, oh, boy, did you do the media rounds last week? Yeah, I sure did. Got out of the way. I'm leaving for, I'll tell you tomorrow,

so I need to get it done. So finally, you've decided to break your silence. You were silent for a very long time. Why all of a sudden do you feel like you need to talk to people? It wasn't a break up my silence. I just like, why come out with information when you don't have the full, the full gamut of what's really going on and the full understanding, like why come out and alarm people or, you know, cause a big hub up until I really have the facts.

You know what I mean? That's all. Okay. It took a very long time to diagnose and it's kind of a complex issue. I'm still actually seeing doctors over it now, just to kind of double check and make sure that we've got the proper diagnosis. also. All right. So for those that may have, you know, missed some of the updates on you or, you know, just listen to our show because let's be honest, it is a one-stop shop for all things mixed martial arts,

and it's great that you're here. We haven't seen you since UFC 155. That was back on December 29, 2012, a great return to the UFC. You haven't fought in so long. Why haven't you fought in that long? I had a surgery immediately following the December 29th fight, and then as I was, preparing to move back in. I just called the UFC to schedule me within like November, like late October, November time.

I've been in the, I've been trained for about three or four weeks and then that's when she's kind of popped up on me. So what's the issue? It's called Parsonage Turner Syndrome. Parsonage Turner Syndrome? Mm-hmm. What's that?

Yeah, I don't know, man. Um, it's, it's a, uh, it's kind of a gray area in the neurology world. It's, uh, it's kind of rare. Um, basically the best way I can describe is like a neuritis of your nerves. Like the nerve gets, uh, super inflamed. Um, and it tends to be like the brachioplexus nerves and, um, so, like, coming out of your thoracic, it's fine. Um, what it, and what it causes, it, basically, like, the nerve gets so inflamed that it causes nerve image once the inflammation kind of calmed down and stuff like that.

So in a sense, you could just call it nerve. damage, I guess, due to neuritis, which neuritis is like swelling of the nerve or inflammation of the nerve. But, yeah, that's kind of what it is, I guess. So, like, where does that put me, though, is basically decreased arm function and hand function and definitely loss of strength and dexterity. So did you get this because you're a fighter, or is this a genetic thing? How, what have they told you about how you actually develop this?

They talked about it could be an immune system issue. It's about the only way that I can equate to like how are my response to this. Because, of course, you're like, well, what did I do? You know, you want to go back and kind of figure out what you did so you don't do it again and that kind of stuff. And it's just, it's a, they don't have any explanation for it whatsoever. And that, you know, adding to my frustration, obviously, it's just a rare thing. And it happens. They don't really, they don't know a lot about it.

and yeah. Who's calling you in the middle of our interview? I got like 15 texts going on. It's unbelievable. See what happens when you come on the show? People start blowing up your phone. They get excited. I know.

It's the thing alive. That's probably what's happening because I did get about two or three questionable text messages. Yes, it is live. So you're not sure how you actually got this? It just came out of nowhere. No, man.

Yeah, well, I mean, it really came out of nowhere. It came out of a dead sleep. You know, I was about 4.35 o'clock in the morning. I woke up. and riding pain and there I was, you know. Wow, what kind of pain? Like, how are you feeling? I initially thought I had pinched a nerve

or somebody had stabbed me in my sleep. What? It's about the best way I could describe it. I had no idea what was going on. You know, I woke up in the dark room and I'm having trouble moving, and just, you know, so it's about 20 minutes of me, like, kind of panicked, trying to get to my feet and kind of sit up

and kind of figure out it was going on. So you just woke up, like, the pain actually woke you up. Oh, yeah, definitely. Is this something that people, is something that people, like at your age, your physical condition, is this common thing? No, it's rare. It's rare to happen to anybody. And I have read of it happening to athletes, and it definitely happens, you know. But, like, I've seen a few therapists, and some of them have never treated it, and some of them have treated four or five people with this disorder.

It's just, again, it's a gray area in the neurology world, much like most of the neurology world is to begin with. but is an even grayer area. And does it maybe have anything to do the surgery that you had? No, they think they, that is something that, uh, that kind of comes out is that, uh, this, this does happen a lot after surgeries. Uh, but I was so far removed from my surgery. I was like six, seven months before we rehab. I mean, I was training full goes, um, at that point in time.

And so then you think, well, it has something to do with training, but, um, all my, all my MRI scans, I had about three or four of them total. They all came back and said no. It was just my luck of the draw, really, more than anything. Does the UFC pay for all of this? No, I have my own insurance. Okay. So right now, are they telling you that there's a chance you might not fight again?

That was initially. Really? You know, when they were first diagnosed in that first week of, like, really trying to figure out there, You know, every doctor's like, you know, you need to look at moving on. You need to look at a new career. And, I mean, any doctor you see, anytime you have an injury tells you that, though. You know, they don't exactly respect what you're doing to your body. Who could, you know?

Sure. It's kind of hard for them to treat you when you're just going to go out there and wreck it all over again. So that was a heavy consideration very initially, initially especially. My recovery has gone so well thus far that every doctor that I speak, you now and they see how well I'm advanced. They definitely think I'll have a full recovery, and they definitely think I'll be able to return. What kind of timetable are they giving you?

Initially, they were talking like two years to full recovery. Wow. Now they're looking at like, yeah, now they're looking like a year. And then, like, I've had therapists who have treated this, but say it's reasonable to believe that I could be back six to eight months. But that doesn't start with December 29, 2012, right? I mean, when are we talking, is your starting point? About three months ago now, I guess.

Oh, wow, okay. You know for a while. So it went from two years to six to eight months? It went from two years to six to eight months? Well, when they were initially diagnosed and it was a little more serious and they didn't know. I've recovered so quickly already that they are, it's reasonable to believe that. And that's not, they can't give you a real exact type of. You know, everybody's different and every, you know, every syndrome is a little different to the,

person. But there's what my therapists are saying, it's reasonable to believe that you can do that. You know, you can set that as a goal and that's an attainable goal for you. Is it a reality, we have no idea? It's nerves, you know? There's nerves that sometimes don't ever, ever come back. That does happen to people. Not usually, you know, I haven't much.

The odds of that are pretty slim with me, I would think, with my, like, you know, my age, my health and things like that. So are you in pain right now? Do you feel any kind of pain? Yeah, it comes and goes. It's more, now I just feel like numbness and tingling and things like that and this weakness. But I still do have some inflammation going on. That just takes time to move out, you know.

There's nothing I can really, it's just time with this thing. That's the most frustrating thing. There's no like, okay, well, if I just do this, it's going to come back. There's no. So that's the most difficult part for me is just be patient. And I'm not good at that, Ariel. Oh, oh, God. Can you even work out?

I do stuff. Yeah, I've run. You know, I'm doing stuff with my legs. I'm doing stuff on my other arm. I'm doing stuff. You know, I'm able to do some stuff. I have to be careful not to aggravate that nerve early on. I definitely aggravated it worse just because, you know, as an athlete,

you just kind of think, okay, this will come back in a couple days. It'll be fine. No big deal. But, you know, it took me about five, six, seven weeks to really kind of accept that, all right, this is here. This is my reality. You know, I need to kind of move on like I'm not going to be able to fight for the next year too. So with that hanging over your head, I mean, how do you support yourself? How do you make a living

without making a living? Right. Right now I'm actually opening a fitness gym in Boker, at home, Florida with a good friend of mine. And so that's my new outlook right now. Oh, so you're no longer in the Bay Area? No, no, I had to move down here for this opportunity. It was too good not to try. So someone reached out to you and convinced you to come move there? No, I didn't convince me. I mean, we talked about it many times before, and it was just a great opportunity.

We've been great friends for a long time, and something we both want to do, so we're excited about it. And this establishment, is this for, you know, general, you know, Joe Schmo's like myself, or is it for fighters or athletes? No, no, it's more for, it's for everyone. You know, the workouts are, you know, results-based, so it's for anybody.

But, you know, we'll have athletes in there, I'm sure. Myself included, I do these workouts myself, so it's not, you know, it's not just for Joe Schmo. But at the same time, it's tailored for Joe Schmo, for sure. And these workouts that you're saying, like, what makes them special? Huh? Like, what you're saying these workouts? Is it like a special kind of workout that you can't do anywhere else? They're designed by me?

Oh, they are? Oh, they are? Wow. Yeah. Do you have, like, a fancy name, like, you know, the Duffman workout or something like that? No, I'm going to come up with one, though. A comic book character name? Sure.

Do that. Don't know. Can you give me a taste of it? Like, what are we talking about here when we talk about the Todd? Take it out of here. I'll get all the taste you can want. All right, you will. It's heart rate training groupist, heart rate interval training group fitness, basically.

The workouts will be designed by me, tailored by me. you'll be doing anything from treadmill workouts suspension training kettle bells sandbells we got to kickboxing bosovo balls mat drills

we're going to incorporate everything and when does it launch when does it open to the public we're looking to open hopefully January 15th oh wow that's pretty soon and if you do resume your MMA career does that mean you'll train out of Florida now there's a lot of good gyms there

um yeah and is the UFC being patient with you? Yeah, I haven't actually gotten hold of, you know, Bob Cook has talked to them for me as far as I know everything's okay. There's not a lot I can really do. It's not, it's out of my hand, so to see, I guess. Oh, I'm so sad. Why are we talking about this? How's your day going?

It's okay. Thanks. I read actually that you used to cry in the shower. It really, obviously, I mean, I could imagine this was a major burden. You thought your career was over, right? Are you in a better place now? I'm in a better place. You know, initially I just didn't accept it.

So, like, the times that I would would be those, you know, those private moments where you're like, oh, God, this is real. You know, but initially, like, everybody's talking about how well I'm handling and stuff like that, and I kind of was, but I wasn't really accepting what was happening, you know. So I'd have my occasional breakdowns of my privacy of my shower and pacing to my apartment. If your career ends today, if it's done, if you never fight again, would you, would you be okay with that? I mean, do you feel like you've accomplished?

No. Not even the least. I've had this. This is the biggest thing about this is that I've put in nine solid years of a legitimate MMA training would be some of the best trainers, training partners in the world. Most people can't even touch the experience I've had in MMA. But I haven't got to go out and use those skills that I've acquired to use to get that, to just let that hard work pay off that I've put in. So no, I wouldn't be okay with all.

It'd be a hard pill to swallow, and it's thought of it makes me pretty sick. What I think for your fans, and you have a lot of them, a lot of people were asking me constantly, are there any updates on Todd Duffy? I think what is the toughest, and I'm assuming for yourself as well, you came back, you finally came back to the UFC, and you look so good in that comeback, so we got the taste of who Todd Duffy is, and, you know, there's been enough separation between your first and now your second, second stint where it was, I guess, you know, for lack of a better word, it was just a big tease.

You know, we wanted to see more. People were talking about who you're going to fight next, who you're going to fight next. Does it almost make it worse that you came back to the UFC and looked so good and now, at least for this moment, can't continue? No, it's been really helpful. The fans have really kind of helped me through a lot of this, to be honest. A guy that definitely shuns away from that kind of stuff. It's been very helpful. And you said, you know, you got to see who I really am. That's the big, it's the most frustrating thing about my career. I've not had that fight yet.

You know, nobody's really seen my full skill set at all. I'm kind of still an unknown. You know, I'm in and out quick typically. And, I mean, that is the heavyweight division, but I haven't had that fight that's pushed me. And that's the most frustrating part of it all, actually, is that I haven't got to rattle off my three fights in a row and I haven't got to really show my full true skill set.

And that is the most frustrating aspect of it all. But coming back, no, it's been great. There's not a complaint in the world. The fans have really helped me. The support has been unbelievable. My inbox is constantly full with guys, you know, asking how I'm doing, you know, sending their good wishes. It's been good.

So I don't think that doesn't make it worse at all. It makes it a little more frustrating, I guess, because, like, I'm just right there. I'm so close. But it doesn't make it worse. Do you know of any, like, real famous athletes or people that, you know, just came back and had the same kind of career in athletics that they had prior to suffering from this? Any known cases out there?

No. And I talked to Dr. about that, like, well, you know, what am I looking at? And they're like, you'll be fine. If you get, you know, if you get back, you get everything back, which I expect, it's not going to be any different. The big thing I'm losing is I'm losing time. And anytime you have an injury, you don't come back to be the same exact person. Sometimes you come back better. I think in this case I will because of the time I'll be able to, kind of,

to develop my body a little better and get even more healthier. And I think I think I'll end up being better for it, to be honest. It's just losing that time and those opportunities. You know, there's some of these guys that, you know, they're going to retire. I'm not going to get a chance to fight some of these guys by the time I get back. That's frustrating in just the time. Like, this is my prime athletic point right now in my life. I'm the most athletic.

I'm the most mature I've ever been. My confidence is at an all-time high. I actually have an understanding of who I am and what I'm capable of. When I was 23, 22, I had no idea how good I could be or how good I was. I was just like, man, it's a lot of fun and I love doing this. But that confidence wasn't truly there like it is now. So, you know, a lot of frustration. By the way, when you were back in the UFC late last year,

did you have a chance to talk to Dana? Because obviously he said a lot about you on your way out. Yeah, I spoke with him briefly at the way end. and I asked him, you know, how everything was, and is there anything I needed to know? And he's like, no, you're good, man. We're glad to have you back. That was the basis of the conversation.

That's great. That must have felt good. More times, but, you know, he's a busy guy. Right. Yeah, no, it was good. You know, I got a little tear out when I talked to him because I was just so happy. I was getting ready to walk out of the way in.

So it was kind of a, it was like a double special moment, you know. Right. To hear that everything was good, and then, you know, I'm getting ready to go back out there, you know. It was, yeah. If you do, you know, obviously continue training in Florida, which team do you think you'll join? You have Black Zillions, ATT, who are you thinking?

ATT, no, I've already been over there. Some of my friends out, and that's where I started my career. You know, those are my best friends are there. Great group of guys. You know, I'm going over here in a little bit to help out my buddy Steve Montgomery with some stand-up stuff in about an hour or two. I'm still going to try to think that actively evolved in the MAA as I can.

It's just a matter of getting things done. I talk a lot, sorry. And just a couple of minutes left with Todd, and we'll let you go. So do you go to rehab as well? I mean, what is your life like dealing with this now? Yeah, I'm doing rehab, and then I'm doing some rehab on my own. And, you know, it's just taking care of real body and giving a time to heal. Okay, and on the record, go on the record right now.

When will we see you fight again in the UFC? Sooner than later. That's very ambiguous. I can't give you a date, Ariel. You know that? No, I know. I'm trying to give you bulletin board material here. I know.

You're just making me sad of all your deal. It's all you ever do, Ariel. Can we have a happy conversation? When's that? Well, you know, I'd like to... Give a date on that. You date on our happy conversation. I want to know.

Our happy conversation, me and you. This isn't happy because this is mixed emotions right now because I'm happy to hear from you. I'm happy to hear your voice, but it's not on the turn. terms that I was hoping for. You know what I'm saying? Although...

Although I must admit, when you contacted me to come back on, I was so excited, then I had to do the little song and dance for a couple weeks to actually get you on, and if you would have come on the show, without me knowing how you're feeling beforehand, it would have felt like a knife to the stomach, but I was able to mentally get prepared after the media rounds that you went on last week. I'm glad to hear you care about me. I do. I think that was a bit of a jab at there, too, though.

Oh, come on. You know I've always cared about it. You can be first every time. It's just not realistic. You do your show on Monday. Right. You do it live, which makes it a little more special, but you can't be first at your time. Well, but you could strive.

No, I appreciate that about you. Well, keep us posted. And I wish you the best. In all seriousness, I wish you the best. It was great having you back in the UFC. I remember that post-fight interview. I remember seeing you there. It felt like a special moment.

I remember how happy you were. And I know a lot of people just based on the questions that we get. about you. I know a lot of people miss you and wish you the best as well. So I know it's something very serious that you're dealing with right now. Good luck with that new project, but we want to see you back in the octagon. We want to see you back healthy. So good luck with that. And please keep us posted.

Even if we're 10th on the list, I want to know how you're feeling I want to hear from you. Maybe you might have moved it there today. You've been pretty nice to me. Wow. Let me plug this real quick. I'm going to be in Australia next week. I got about six seminars playing guys. The first one in Sydney. If you would, check out

my Instagram or Twitter. I got the schedule posted up there. Come on and check it out. What are your Instagram and Twitter names in case people don't know? Todd Duffy. Pretty simple, I think. Just straight across. There you go.

Three D's in a row. Two D's in Todd, one in Duffy. That's correct. Todd Triple Duffy. We might be onto something here with the workout. The triple D 3D, maybe. The 3D?

I like that. That could be fun. Listen, don't mention it. That one was on the house. That's the lift your spirits. Thank you so much. for stuff. I'm already taking his head right now, I do.

Thank you very much, Todd. Best of luck to you, and keep us posted. All right, thank you, but I appreciate him. There he is. Todd Duffy, the Duffman, 3D. Todd Duffy stopping by. We wish him the best. Great to hear from him in all seriousness,

and hope to see him back in the Octagon sooner rather than later. All right, as we talked about with Richard Evans, as I mentioned, top of the show, this is the UFC's 20th anniversary week. Big celebration. It's UFC 167. this Saturday, headlined by one of their biggest stars, George St. Pierre, against Johnny Hendricks, and they've aired the documentary last week on Fox Sports One. We've got these great pictures here from our good friend,

and we will, good friend Scott, and we will promote them later on in the show. But we're in the mood. We're nostalgic right now. We are celebrating 20 years of the UFC, and there is no better person, in my opinion, to do that with, than our guest at this time. He is the original co-founder of the UFC, original owner of the UFC. He is Bob Meyerowitz, a man who's been a bit tough for me to nail down, but we finally got him.

And what better time than now on the 20th anniversary, the eve of the 20th anniversary of UFC 1. Bob, how are you? Very well, Ariel. Thank you. It's great to have you on the show. Really appreciate it. When I say to you 20 years

since UFC 1, November 12th, 1993, Denver, Colorado. What comes to mind? What kind of emotions? You were there. Front row seat. You launched this whole damn thing. What comes to mind? To tell you, the truth, it is amazing that it's 20 years.

It seems so recent. It seems like it was yesterday. And just to correct you, the UFC 1, which wasn't called the USC1, but just USC. Sure. is the only show that I didn't attend. Oh, that's interesting. So I actually was, I watched it at home so I could see what it looked like on television. We were making this up.

So we didn't know what it would be. I stayed home. I watched it on television. I watched it with my college roommate and his, I think, 13-year-old son, and was able to really get the whole thing. and understand the whole thing, so much better by watching it on television and appreciating what we were seeing

and seeing a 13-year-old's reaction to it. This is fascinating because Semaphore Entertainment Group, which was, in a sense, the parent company of the UFC, you were the head of that. Why? I mean, you could watch it on TV from the truck.

You can watch it from the venue. You're about to launch something on pay-per-view. You're in the pay-per-view business. Wouldn't you want to be there on site with everyone just to make sure everything goes off as plan? You have to understand that nobody knew what it was we were doing, including ourselves. I came out of the music business, and when I mixed a band, I would always listen to it on a small,

crappy radio, and they'd say, why not have you have the best speakers, you have the best studios, why not listen that way? Because I wanted to hear it the way the worst way you could hear it. I wanted to see this on television because this was a television show. What would it look like? How would it feel? What would people think? And really, what happens?

Nobody knew. And as you might remember in that first show, a lot of things happened. Yes. Including some of our announcers that we certainly didn't anticipate happening. And in that first show, Orion's sons came out to wipe the blood off the mat. in between matches. And my friend's son said, I want to be a blood boy in the next show.

Did you give him that opportunity? No. We made sure there were no more kids and they're wiping up blood. Yes. But it was, I mean, when I say didn't know, we really did not know. And by being at home, being able to watch it,

you got to see really what it is where instead of being able to say, cut to this or do this, you just had to sit there and watch it. is a great way to learn what we were doing. And what we could do better. Sure. I mean, we knew that we had to improve and how do we make it better.

The launch of the UFC, you know, has been much talked about at this point. The Playboy article, Horian Gracie and his tapes, Gracie in action, meeting up with Art Davy coming to Semaphore Entertainment Group, SEG, and presenting this idea and your team being interested in it, and then off we go. When did you first hear about this idea? Because from what I understand, it wasn't originally called the UFC, I guess the group that they were calling themselves, wow, war of worlds, and then together you guys came up with UFC.

But this idea to put on a pay-per-view with all these different styles, put it live on television, see who's the last man standing, one-night-only tournament. When did you first hear about this? Let me just tell you that everyone has, I've now heard many versions of how it came about. I will tell you my version and how I remember it. I was doing all these pay-per-views, basically with music,

with Band Fight the Who, New Kids on the Block, two-pack, all these different pay-per-views. Wow. And we were looking at what could we do that would actually be something we could own. If I'm doing Two-Pack, I can't promote New Kids on a Block after two-pack. back. So what could we do? I looked at boxing. I looked at wrestling. And we were looking to come up with something somewhere in the middle, something that would be real. But the brilliance of Vince

McMahon is that he owned it. And one of the guys who I knew having to be a Supreme Court judge also happened to be the head of the New York State Taekwondo Association. And he would always say to me, why don't you put Taekwondo on A preview? And I would say not enough people want to watch Taekwondo. One day I asked him, could Taekwondo beat up karate? And he said, what kind of question is that beat up? Nobody, it's not about beating up. And they couldn't even fight each other, of course, they have different rules.

So at my company, semaphore entertainment, every Tuesday we have a creative meeting. And Tuesday I said, I want to have a show where we'll have karate fight Taekwondo. There are so many people who do karate, so many people who do taekwondo, they'll want to know what would win. Campbell McLaren, who worked for me, came back a week later and said, well, what about if we put judo-jitsu? I said, that's fine. They can all fight.

Then Campbell, and I really don't know how he did it, but he came back with the graces. And just as you said, Orion had a partnership with Art Davy for something called, Wow. and the graces certainly knew far more about martial arts than I did. And Horon was the perfect partner. He didn't know anything about television, didn't know anything about pay-per-view, but he knew the martial arts.

And so almost all of the rules came from Horon. And it was really just a great partnership and a great idea. I was concerned about safety. we were able to do it. It's interesting, as I'm sure you know, all of the problems we had. But it was never, ever won serious injury, ever. And the entire time I owned it. How long did it take to actually launch it?

I mean, from the time that you're sitting around on this Tuesday meeting to actual, you know, the event taking place November 12, 1993, what kind of timeline are we looking at? Honestly, Ariel, I don't remember, and I'd have to go back and look. But I would say it was six months. We had all these meetings. We had all these things. We had to do a business arrangement between myself, Oriane.

We had to figure out how we would do it, what we would do it in. There was no octagon. We were looking for a surface that we could create that would allow the different styles to fight. And the original theory, this was really a discipline against discipline. So we wanted each discipline to be able to fit in, but no discipline to have its own surface. So we created the octagon, which a circle could fit in, a triaddle could fit in, a square could fit in, but wasn't to anybody's. We made it a certain height so people couldn't get thrown out.

We made it out of certain things so that people couldn't be hurt and wouldn't fall through. It was all really well-fought out, well-worked out. quite frankly with the second show when Art, when John McCarthy came on board, that was a very big addition, a very big help, and I think he played an incredibly important role in where it winds up. Is it true that the first show on pay-per-view did roughly 80,000 buys? It is true. And given your background in pay-per-view, the kind of shows that you were putting on,

in your mind, was that a success? that was phenomenal there were only at that point I'm going to say 13 or 14 million homes that had pay-per-view that was a huge

huge number and relatively speaking compared to doing a show with a band like the hoop it was much less expensive and it was a huge success so given what we saw given the numbers we knew we had something

very big on our hands and we had to do it really right really work at this. And so, you know, you get $80,000, what was it, like, was it $14.95 or was it more than that? I believe it was 1990. $195. The amount of money that you put in, as far as advertising, to put on the event and all that, did you make a profit on the first show?

We definitely did. Wow. Let me say that we had been doing music before. So when we had been doing the music, what we found is that we could at that point in time, because they were then so many different cable systems, we could take demographically equal places and charge different prices. So we could charge 1495, 995, 2495, and 495. And we found statistically there was virtually no difference in the buy rate pending on the price.

Either people wanted it or they didn't. So by the time we got to ultimate fighting, we were fairly comfortable with having the one price from knowing that people would buy it. And honestly, and I know you knew Horian, and by then, if you followed this stuff, the Gracie's had a reputation. But when you saw Hoyce, when you saw the other competitors,

honestly, did you think he would dominate and then eventually win the whole thing? Not for a minute. Who did you think would have won? Well, you know, you had, first of all, almost no one, and I'm sure there were some people, but virtually nobody in the,

United States really appreciated that you could fight from your back the way the Gracies did. And what amazed me is to watch Hoyce being under some huge guy, hounding away at him, and I would see Hoyce turn his head and look to his father. His father would give him instruction. He was that calm under that sort of condition that he could turn his head, his father gave him instructions, he turned to sit back and do just what his father had said. It was really, really remarkable. And I think a lot of it is that most of us in the United States really didn't appreciate what jujitsu was, what they could do, how they could fight from their back, what the guard was, all these things which now are so familiar to anyone who follows the sport.

given the success at that point where you all in like did you put all those other projects to the side and 24 hours a day seven days a week you were thinking about how to grow the ufc yes you took over we had something huge we had something big we had something really exciting i really saw in the athletes real stars there's no question that hoist gracie 175 and if you saw him with that as Gian relatively skinny-looking guy, that he could beat all these other people and do it in such a way that none of us, or many of us, didn't understand was remarkable. I remember him beating Dan Seven with a,

a sciss choke with his legs. That was just an amazing move. He was unbelievable. We were fortunate enough to have, in Ken Shamrock, someone who was the exact opposite of hoist. And so Hoyce versus Shamrock. Shamrock is all muscular. Shamrock is, you know, so Superman-looking.

Perfect. You guys took over, SCG took over the UFC from Davy and Horian at around UFC 5, right? Let me say that we were partners. Sure. We bought them out. Yes. Why?

It had really reached a point where there was a lot of money being invested all by me. And I think we had all reached a point where we could do what we could do, they could do what they could do, and the partnership was no longer a workable business partnership. How much should you pay to buy them out? I don't remember. Was it a pretty penny? I don't remember. Really? No recollection.

No recollection. Over the stretch of time that you own the UFC, how much money do you think you invested in it? Well, there's two parts to that, because in the beginning I did and at the end I did. In the middle, I was making a lot of money, but in the end, we were just losing money on every show, and so every show I did,

I would put in another $250,000. to $500,000. By the time everything was said and done, did you lose money on the UFC? Not that I have ever bothered to add it up, but no, I would say I made money on the UFC. When did things start to get just too much? I mean, you know, we can sit here and talk about the whole history and every show and the court cases and things like that, but when did things start to just get unbearable for you? Like, too many court cases, too many court appearances, too many, uh,

headaches, moving shows from New York to Alabama, when did things just start to wear on you, where you started to think that, you know what, I don't know if I want to do this for the rest of my life? Well, it had gotten and without having it in front of me, I can't tell you the order of things.

I was in court for quite a long time in Puerto Rico where we won. I was in court in Rhode Island, where they said we could do it if we followed the rules of professional wrestling, which is that a lot.

I was in court in Detroit, where right up to the time of the fight, the judge finally ruled we could do it, but we could not have closed-hand strikes. And when I went in and told Ken Shamrock that, he went absolutely

ballistic as well he should. There's a man, all of them, who have trained, who've worked, and now the night of the fight, they're told that something they planned on using they couldn't use it. It was ridiculous. But that was how it had to be done. We, of course, had the fight in New York, which theoretically we won, because actually people think it was banned in New York.

No, it wasn't. They gave us rules that we could fight under in New York, but those rules really wouldn't work for ultimate fighting, so we couldn't use their rules. We had, I guess it was really when we went to, and we were approved in New Jersey. But when we weren't approved in Nevada, that was just it for me. We had worked so hard, I had spent so much, it hired all these people in Nevada.

I flew all these people to Nevada. That was just that really was it for me. And some have hypothesized that at the time. Lorenzo Fertita, who is obviously one of the owners of the UFC now, was a commissioner for the Nevada State Athletic Commission, and then surely thereafter, of course, he bought it. Do you believe that he had a part in not putting up the sport of mixed martial arts up for a vote to see if it gets sanctioned in Nevada so that he could then come in and buy it maybe at a cheaper price? I would have no idea.

Did you ever think of that? It must have crossed your mind, right? After the fact? You know, honestly, I got a nice amount of money. I was happy to be out. The people who bought it really have great. really, really great passion for it. And they had the very deep pockets that the sport really needed.

So good for me and good for them. Why didn't you just stick to one city, one arena until the sport grew so that you didn't have to go through all these problems? Like, why don't you just find one place that you knew you'd be okay in, not travel the country, draw some good crowds, and then cross those bridges when you're ready to, you know, really expand? Why put yourself through those headaches, state-to-state all those court cases? Well, we had, it was an interesting time.

First of all, we also were increasingly being taken off table. So our source of revenue was being cut out from under us. And we were looking more and more to work with casinos so that we could get money from them. But our source of revenue is being taken out from us. underneath us. When we got the New Jersey State Athletic Commission to approve us, I thought we had resolved that issue.

But we didn't, and they wanted Nevada. And as I say Nevada, we never came to a vote in Nevada, so they never turned us down, but we were told that they would, so we didn't do it. And, you know, you just reach a point where you say, I have done, I believe in these

athletes. I really, really do. I really think that Dan Severin fighting for a couple hundred bucks a night is ridiculous. I know what Dr. Tahr off, all of these guys who are really great athletes. Mark Coleman,

I mean, great, great athletes, and they were getting no money for doing what they were doing. We were able to provide them with, A, some of the recognition they deserve, be some decent money that they deserve, and with, you know,

With one or two exceptions, I found them to be fairly extraordinary men. So when you passed this off, when you sold this to what then became Zoufa, in your mind, was this, this was like a gift from Guy? Like, did you think that at a time you just have to close this thing up and not make any money off of it when they came in with a two million? Absolutely. So you were thrilled? Yeah. Did you think back your head, bottom of your heart, did you think, well, this is going to, just die in a year anyway and I'm going to walk away with two million dollars. Did you think

that these guys could actually make something out of this? Lorenzo said to me, do you think it can ever be mainstream? And I said, no, it's not mainstream. And I still think it's not. They've done a brilliant job. And listen, they put a great, great deal of money into it. I mean, it wasn't just luck. It wasn't just hard work. They put a lot, a lot of money into it. It takes a lot of courage and a lot of belief to put that kind of money into something. They put a great deal of money into it, and they deserve a lot of credit for all the success it has had. Has it become mainstream? No, it is an interesting time for the sport, because I think they have taken it. They now are looking at globalization and have done a good job

with that, but within its own time find, it doesn't get beyond the very basic fans. Is there ever a point where you're sitting back and you're like, gosh, look at this thing, it's on Fox and the TV deal, the amount that's been reported that they get, and you regret that you say, if I just stuck around, if I put in a little more money, does it ever, you know, bug you that you had this thing in the palm of your hand and then had to sell it? Not for a minute. Really? You never have any kind of regret. No.

How come? The only thing that amuses me is when I see all of the dojoes now with the MMA out front when I was doing it, if you were a judo dojo, you know, you were judo and you were jiu-jitsu and you were taekwondo. And they objected to our mixing the ball. And now they're all advertising as MMA. That gives me some amusement. What they have done, I honestly could not have done. You know, it wasn't a matter of a little.

more money. $40 or $50 million is not a little more money. And if I could have put another million or two, I think I only would have lost another million or two. A million or two is not what it needed.

Are you shocked? Are you shocked that it is where it is today? No. I think it is... Where it goes from here is really going to be the interesting part. now what do you do

I think if you could somehow take it back to where it was that would be more interesting and more excited you need some really good people in it you need stars you don't think they have that I would ask you I'd ask your audience

you know is Kane is he the toughest man in the whole world people believe Toics Gracie 175 was People believed that

Mark Coleman was People believed Tank was one of the toughest People believed These men Really could do it You know

Right now I think they need Somebody GSP He's great Um John Jones I think has

you know, a lot of star appeal. But, you know, I think overall they need more. Dana White told the media that they were going to bring in some, you know, figures of the UFC's past to this event in Las Vegas to help celebrate it. Did you get that call and will you be attending the event? I definitely got the call. Dana could not have been more gracious or warm about inviting me. I am sorry to say in terms of the event that I can't.

So I do have a fact. family obligation. I don't want to say I'm sorry because it is a wonderful family thing that I'm going to, so I'm happy. I'm going to that, but I am very much sorry that I will miss, you know, a real milestone. If you didn't have this obligation, you would have gone? Oh, sure. What was that conversation like with Dana? When was the last time you talked to him prior to that conversation? Prior to that, it would be years and years. It was, as I say, a very warm conversation. I think Dana has done a remarkable job, I think, in getting Dana. Besides putting up all the money that the fatigatives did, getting Dana was a major, major factor in the success

and the place that ultimate fighting now is. And do you know if any of your former colleagues at SECG will they be attending? I believe David Isaacs is going. I think Campbell McLaren is going. What's your relationship like with them today? David and I speak all the time. Campbell and I speak infrequently,

but, you know, Campbell has, everyone has moved on. David is living in California. But we speak a great deal. What happened to SEG? What happened to SEG? I guess we closed it down.

After, right after the sale? Yeah. That was it. You didn't go back into, you know, promoting. I know you've done other things. I'll get to that. second, but you didn't go back to, you know, doing new kids on the block or whatever the hot band was at the time? No, actually what had happened is I had raised money and was doing a new company called Iata,

which was streaming media company. And so all my efforts went into that. And did you sell that or did that close down? Because I remember that. I remember Dave Meltzer had a radio show on that. You are correct. Dave Meltzer had one. I think Eddie Goldman had.

Sure. but we had many great people on there and it was, I think, a terrific thing. We eventually, I was able to sell it and then it was closed down. Yeah, some might say you were before your time with that. And in 2008, you came back to mixed martial arts with Yama, Yama pit fighting, and it had a bit of a throwback feel to it, of course, because you were involved in some of the characters.

Only one show, though. What happened? We did one show. It was an interesting thing. Yama, which I started out with, and I have some great t-shirts. It was Y-A-A-A-A-A-A-A- Actually, it was two M-A, right? But originally it was Y-A-A-A-A-A. Oh, okay.

I quite a T-shirts are great because those are the original. Okay. And what happened is I was with these Russians having dinner, and I was trying to explain the idea of, of having a fighting surface where the around the surface against the fencing, it would be slightly lifted, so fighters couldn't sort of get stuck in there. And I couldn't get this across to them. And I went into the kitchen of the restaurant, took out a frying pan,

and I showed them, you know, that surface. They go, yama, yama, yama. So I thought yama meant frying pan. So I thought this is perfect. The frying pan, the yama. So I called it yama. Then I was having dinner with Oleg Taktarov, and I said that I'm doing this new thing, and I call it yama.

He goes, Yama? I said, yeah, frying pan. He said, it doesn't mean frying pan. I said, yes, it does. You said, you don't speak Russian. I said, okay, then what does it mean? He said, when you bury someone, you build a pit in the ground, it's called a yama. Oh.

Right. Then what happened is I teamed up with Live Nation, and their advertising department changed it to MMA. Clever Y-A-M-M-A, changed to that. And we did that first show, and I actually had some very good fights. The Yama itself, the ring itself, didn't work out as well as I would have liked, because a lot of fighters figured out that they could just lie there. Sure. but I think we had some very good fights.

We had some good personalities. We had an interesting fight with Oleg and Mark Kerr, I think. But our partner was Live Nation, and Live Nation chose not to continue. Actually, Live Nation split in half at the end of that. Do you think you'll ever get back at the M.A.? Are you done? I think I'm done. Yeah.

Do you still watch it? I do. You know, I still am amazed at the athleticism and the ability to, when I was in the school, I used to box, and when there's a certain amount of attack you can be under, these fighters are able to so much keep their heads about them, when they're under such incredible attack. It's just marvelous to watch all the things they can do and do do. When you look back at your time as owner, what was your favorite memory?

What's the one that sticks out? We're trying to be nostalgic here. We're remembering the great 20 years so far of the UFC, the roller coaster ride that it has been. What's the one moment if there is one that sticks out above the rest? And don't tell me being at UFC one because I know you weren't there. Well, watching UFC. you know, being amazed at what it was and having my roommate say, you created it?

But actually when I think that there's a bunch of moments. I think of the Hoyt's Gracie Dan Severn fight. I think of Hoyce Gracie, and I'm sorry, now I can't remember his name. He was from Hawaii. He came in carrying the cross. Kima. Pimo. I think of Tito Ortiz and Frank Shamrock.

Oleg Toc Taroff and Tank Abbott, one of the great fights. I mean, there were just these great moments. I think of some of the fun things. I remember Hoyce after he won, and I brought him to New York, and I'm walking down the streets of New York City thinking, I'm the toughest guy in the world. I wish somebody would start a fight with us. And I say to Hoyt, I'm going to show you Central Park.

And Hoyt says, Central Park? Is that safe to go into? I'm with you. I know, but they have guns. You know, there were these great moments, whether it was, and I think the world of the graces, I think that they really truly had this incredible family tradition. I think they are, you know, they come from a very, tough, different upbringing than we do, but within their confine, real gentleman.

I thank Abbott, one of the smartest people I've met. Dan Severin, a fine, fine guy, Randy Couture, a fine, an incredible athlete. Peter Belford, incredible athlete. Just I tell you another funny moment is every year at the cable convention, we would have a big party and a big dinner, and I'd have the heads of all the cable companies. And one year I have all the cable company heads. We're having this big dinner at this very fancy restaurant. I have Mark Coleman there, and I have Dan Severin there.

And one of the guys from one of the cable companies said, I always wanted to know what it felt like to be choked out. And Mark Coleman gets up. And I said, no, no. Trying to stop Coleman, and he just walks over and chokes us. for me. He stopped before the guy went out cold, and this guy said, you know, I was really religious, and I just found myself really great.

So there were great moments. I also remember, you know, being in court in Rhode Island hearing this judge, and mostly, let me say I found the courts and the judges to be very good, but you're hearing this judge say that we have to do it under the rules of professional wrestling. Somebody. Would someone explain to this man what he just said? Not one memory, a bunch of them. It was a wonderful time.

It really, really was. We knew we were doing something unique. We knew we were special. We knew we had these great athletes. We knew this was all happening around us. We would like the traveling circus. What a time it was. And you're a very important part of UFC history, of mixed martial arts history.

And it was a real treat to have you on the show today to look back. I'm sorry to hear that you won't be attending the show, but totally understand, given your family obligations. But thank you so much for coming on, Bob, and wish you the best of luck. And thank you for doing all of this. If it wasn't for people like you, we wouldn't be here doing shows like this. So thank you so much for your contributions to the sport. Mostly we have to thank the athletes. Absolutely.

Thank you, Bob. you. All the best. Be will. There he is. Bob Meyerwitz. He does in fact have a Twitter account, but he's never used it. He is the former owner, co-founder of the UFC. He told the story right there. An amazing part of mixed martial arts history. Great to have him on the show to reflect. Now, you know what's interesting, the UFC launched 20 years ago, 20 years ago tomorrow, November 12th, 1993. on August 18th, 1993, just essentially three months before that, our next guest was born 20 years ago.

He is 20 years old, and he's making his UFC debut on the 20th anniversary of the UFC this Saturday night against Will Campuzano. He is Sergio Pettus, and he joins us right now on the phone. Sergio, how are you? That's pretty nuts, right? Have you thought of that? You're 20 years old, 20th anniversary. You're essentially three months older than UFC,

and here you are about to make your debut on the 20th anniversary show. That's pretty nuts. Yeah, man, I feel, it makes me feel really young. Did you think of that? Did you put that all together? Not. I mean, I never thought of that. That's crazy.

Shows, well, when did you first hear about the UFC, and when did you first think that this is something I want to be a part of someday? You know, I would always see the fights. I mean, like, I would watch them back then when I was a kid. I just never really thought nothing about it. At first, I was, you know, into Taekwanda. at the time. And the first fight, I honestly remember seeing it,

the GSP Matt Hughes fight, or GSP lost the first time. I was the first fight I remember seen. And then after that, I thought, wow, it was pretty interesting. I think I could try it out or some. Now, of course, I must say, you are the younger brother of UFC lightweight champion Anthony Pettis. And of course, he's had a great career.

And we'll get to him a little more deeply in a second. But he's 26. He's your older brother. If he never got into this before you, if he never kind of blazed this trail for you, do you think you would have gotten into it? Honestly, man, I don't think so. You know, watching him come up with his career and watching him fight is what inspired me to try it out. And, you know, he made the first transition at Duke's.

I would never knew about Duke if Anthony didn't make that. And then, yeah, he pretty much paid my way for him, man. And maybe even if he wasn't successful, like, even if he got into MMA but wasn't successful, good chance you probably don't try it out, right? I mean, no, I was going to try it out, you know, because I wanted to feel like I could defend myself. you know, that's the first time I looked at it. You know, I didn't think I was going to be competing in it. I was a man, you know, if I were in a real life situation,

I could use kickboxing or jit-suituituit, to protect myself on the street. So that's what I saw it at first, and then they just got good at it. You made your debut. You were relatively young. I believe you were just over 18 years old. But, you know, you were fairly active over the last, you know,

two-plus years. And one of those guys, these days, it's hard to really pinpoint prospects because so many guys are either signed UFC Bellator right off the bat but you took your time and you worked up you fought in organizations like RFA was that part of the plan? Was that the plan that you

and your team came up with? Don't rush into things because for the last year or so we've been wondering when you're going to finally come to the UFC it seemed like a no-brainer but it seemed like you were taking your time was that part of the plan? Yeah man I was really taking my time Duke wanted me to grow as a fighter and as an

individual and just get that confidence competing and I didn't have much of an airman career. I went straight to the pros. So it took our time, and when we thought the time was right, we decided to take our chances now. Did you want it to be a little quicker? Was there a time when you were thinking when you'd get the call, or

did it work out exactly how you planned? I mean, yeah, I mean, my goal was to get in the UFC before the age of 21, so, I mean, I got that goal. You know, I wanted to be, of course, I wanted to be quicker, you know, get to shine, get to fight in front of everybody.

But, you know, I think it played out pretty well. and I feel a lot more confident at this point of my career. So you didn't even go to school. Did you finish high school? Yeah, I finished high school, and then I went to the University of Rufusport. So you took classes in, what is it, the Hard Knock Life or something like that, that's what they say?

Yeah, the Hard Knock Life, man. Is it true that when your brother made, your brother Anthony made his WC debut, your mom didn't let you go to the event because you were too young, she didn't want you to miss school? Yeah, yeah, she didn't. Oh, not that one. Actually, I made his debut, but like the second, third, fourth fight, I couldn't go because I was in high school, and my mom's really strict.

And she was like, you know, education is key. This is what's going to help you in the future. And I ended up not using it. Yeah. Yeah, she was really strict about it. So how does she feel about two of her sons doing this for a living? Is she okay with it? I mean, she has her doubts about it, you know, like she doesn't like the fact that we get hit. And, I mean, I can understand that we're her kids. but I mean she likes it too

because she sees that we enjoy ourselves but this is our passion and this is something that we want to do and that we love this lifestyle does she go to your fights yeah she's gonna be for she'll be in Vegas for this fight but she'll most likely be in the bathroom

when I fight she doesn't like to stay in the arena at all so she won't listen to anything she won't know what happened she'll just come out when it's done yeah that's all she does she says she'll hear the cheering from the bathroom and then she'll come out and see what happens And what's the point of going? Yeah, I know, right?

That's what I thought. Well, you just made me waste a ticket. Does she typically do that for all your fights, or just the UFC debut? No, she does that for every single fight. She never stays there. She'll come in after, give us a big hug, and then she'll be happy after. But, yeah, she doesn't like to stay and watch. And, okay, so for a good stretch of your career thus far,

you've been doing great things at 125 as a flyweight. This fight in the UFC is going to be able. 135. Why? You know, I competed at 125, and, you know, it's a hard weight cut for me, man. I walk around like 158, and so, I mean, that's a big weight drop. And, I mean, I just feel a lot more comfortable at 135 right now. I feel a lot more explosive. I feel a lot more natural. I'm only 20 years old, man.

There's a chance that I could grow, hopefully. I hope that I grow, but, I mean, there's a chance that might grow into the 135 division, I feel, which is more compatible for me. So this is your first fight at 135? I think this is like my fifth fight at 135. Okay, but recently with RFA, you were fighting at 125, right? Yeah, I thought my last fight for the RFA at 125 before that was 35. And just very recently, you were, you know, up until recently you were supposed to fight Von Lee on this card.

And then, of course, he got injured, and they finally brought in Cabuzano. Were you worried that you weren't going to get a chance to fight on this card? Yeah, man, I was really depressed when I got that news. I thought I was going to be on the card. and, you know, this is a huge car, a lot of great fighters, people that I look up to you. And I was pretty upset, and they pulled it off somehow, so I'm really thankful for that. Which opponent you like better, given, you know, the fact that you're going to actually fight this guy,

which style do you like competing against better? I like Will style better, man. He's going to make it interesting. I feel, Vaughn, you know, Von, he's kind of passive in there. Will, he's aggressive. He's going to come forward. He's going to try to hurt me. Will has really kind of reinvented himself since leaving the UFC.

He hasn't lost since leaving the UFC. He hasn't lost since leaving. He left in January of 2011, since then, undefeated won five in a row. Is this a guy that has been on your radar? Because you were both kind of fighting on the regional scene, was he someone that you were thinking about? Yeah, I mean, I never thought I'd fight Will, honestly. I remember watching the W.C.

He's competing around the same time my brother was. I thought he was an awesome fighter, really smart, really technical. And now that I get a chance to fight him, I'm really excited about it. Someone I used to look up to you. What was it like being there in Milwaukee, when your brother won the belt. Oh, man, it was crazy. You know, we're in the corner, too.

First time I had to work his corner was for his title fight. Wow. Yeah, yeah, it's crazy. He got the arm bar, and the crowd was silent. You know, nobody knew what happened. I mean, I happened, and then jumps on the cage and this went crazy. So, man, it was ridiculous energy there. It was just so changing.

You, I guess you were discussed and correct me from wrong, when he fought for the WC title a few years back against Benson, but you were too young to be in his corner, right? Yeah, I was only 17 at the time I was off to the side So why, you know, he's been doing well Like, why this fight did he choose for you to be in his corner Oh, I don't know, man

He just, you know, I asked me if I wanted to be in the corner I think it's because I was of age now And, yeah, so he wanted me be in his corner And I'm in, I was in his corner I saw everything he did and just I'm glad he let me, man It's definitely a experience that I'll never forget And it probably gives you some motivation, right?

It inspires you Yeah, he inspires me, man He's a excellent fighter And he's my brother It's crazy A lot of people, you know They come up to him Oh my God, you're Anthony Curtis

It's like, man I've been knowing this guy My whole life And I live with the guy Is he a good older brother Yeah, he's good I mean when we're younger I didn't like each other

But really Now that we're older Yeah, we had like bad blood When we were younger But I think the sport Probably a lot closer to the other Wow so you guys actually didn't get along Yeah not at all man

When did that start to change Um, so yeah, I mean, I was the younger brother, so of course I was, you know, the annoying younger brother, the one that always got him in trouble or wanted to hang out with him and his friends, but, you know, they're older than me. But let's see, I think around when I was 13, that's when I started training that made with Anthony, and that's when we got really close. And there's another brother, right, Ray, right? Yeah, Ray is the oldest brother. What does he do? We never hear about him. Yeah, he runs our martial arts gym. He teaches cyclone. He competed and kicked by, right? a couple of times, wasn't really into the mixed martial arts scene,

and he just runs the Jim's victory martial arts, is what it's called. And you currently live with Anthony, right? Yep. Has he changed it at all since he became champion? I mean, not really, man. He's the same person. I mean, besides that, he doesn't do the dishes as much. Other than that, now he's the same happy guy.

Well, once you become champion, you shouldn't do the dishes, in my opinion. Yeah. Yeah, no. that's why I got to do them. Is it a blessing or a curse? Because we can't talk about you without talking about your brother. Your famous last name in this sport. Do you like the fact that you are the younger brother of a UFC champion making your debut?

Does that put more pressure on you? I mean, yeah, there is more pressure. You know, there's people who are expecting me to do all the stuff he's doing jumping off cages. And, you know, I have all that stuff from our arsenal. It's just a matter of time before I show it. And, yeah, I mean, I like the fact that they talk about my brother and when they talk about me, you know, this is a, we came up to, together, we're a family, and that's how it should be.

So, so, like, for those that haven't seen you, you're that kind of guy, you're the guy who jumps off cages, you do the same kind of thing, you have the same skill set as Anthony? I would say, I don't take as much as much as you as Anthony does. I'm more like, you know, the technical guy, but when I do have the opportunities, I do throw the crazy stuff. Is there a chance to do this in your Octagon debut? Do you have something special in store for us? Yeah, I'm going to have a couple of things that I'm going to go out there and grow, yeah, so it's It's going to be interested. Okay, and I got to ask you, you know, just late last night,

they announced that Anthony won't be fighting on December 14th. He hurt his knee. How is he feeling? How serious is this? You know, from what I'm hearing, you know, I live with the guy. He's really upset, man. He wanted to make this fight. Would have been a big year for him.

You know, I guess it's a serious injury. Every time we're in the gym, he can't do wrestling. He can't do jigs. You can barely check ticks right now. So, you know, definitely not ready for a flight in six weeks. I'm not sure exactly what the real injury is, but I mean, there might be a chance of surgery from what I'm hearing. So, you know, I want to release much information. I'll leave that for him. Right.

But, you know, it's a little more serious than what people are thinking, and I think he's just not, you know, wanting to play. Wow, that's very unfortunate. He's been a bit banged up. I mean, are you learning from some of the things he did in training to not get in those scenarios, to not push yourself? Maybe, you know, he told us he was banged up, you know, not too long ago, and maybe he, might have overcompensated. Are you learning from some of the things that he's doing mistakes and good things? Yeah, yeah, I mean, for sure. I mean, he always tells me, man, like, you don't, don't fight

if you're not ready, you know, if your body's not feeling correct. And, you know, he's done that a couple of times, and, you know, like, against the Bar-Palchowski fight in the WC, he had a hurt shoulder going on that fight. He could barely jab. So, I mean, he lost that fight, too, which was, you know, sucks. But I'm learning from a man. He's teaching me to in and out of the sport, whether it's business, whether it's the mental side of the fighting, the physical side of the fighting. So he's definitely helping me out a lot. So you don't know how long he'll be away for?

Yeah, I'm not exactly sure at all. Will he be in your corner on Saturday? Yeah, he'll be with me Saturday. Has he told you about what it's like to make, you know, UFC debut? Because if you recall, his didn't go as planned, right? He was supposed to fight for the belt. Obviously it didn't happen. Fawke-Guita, and it was, I believe, off top.

Yeah, it's the last time he lost. Has he told you about just what it's like being under those lights, big event, and tried to tell you not to maybe get overwhelmed by it, et cetera? Yeah, for sure. You know, I just said, you know, this is just another day. This is another fight for, you know.

I mean, the crowd can be bigger. There's going to be a lot more people watch and just go in there and do what we do best. Awesome. Well, I look forward to it very much. A lot of us have been patiently waiting for you to make your UFC debut. It's great that it happens on a card like this,

coinciding with the UFC's 20th anniversary. A best of luck to you, Sergio. looking forward to seeing your fight. And also, if you talk to him, wish the best your brother. Hopefully he comes back soon rather than later and everything's okay. For sure. Thank you for having me out. There he is.

Sergio Pettis, the younger brother of UFC lightweight champion Anthony Pettis. Late last night, news broke on Fox Sports Live that Anthony Pettis will no longer be able to fight Josh Thompson on December 14th in Sacramento, a UFC on Fox 9. so the UFC decided to move the Joseph Benavides versus UFC flyway champion Demetrius Johnson fight that was supposed to happen on November 30th at the top finale. They moved that fight to the main event of the December 14th card, and it makes a whole lot of sense, of course, because Benavides is from that area, Sacramento, Team Alpha Male, now they got Benavidez, Chad Mendez,

Yerai Fabra, all fighting on the main card. And now the new main event of the November 3rd, 30th show is Gray Maynard versus Nathan Diaz number three. Very unfortunate news, there was a lot of, um, there was a lot of, uh, buzz rumors, getting a lot of stuff about, uh, Anthony's knee. No one really wanted to talk about it. I, I did hear some confirmation that he had banged up his knee, but that it wasn't going to have to, um, uh, make him pull out of the fight. And then we hear late last night that it is serious. And as Sergio just said, sounds. actually a lot more serious than maybe we all thought, as of last night, that he might need surgery.

That would be really bad news. If you remember, he injured his knee against Benson Henderson, and it came out that it wasn't all that serious. Also told us that he had a shoulder injury, and here we are almost a month before the fight, and he's not going to be fighting. And he's talked about this, you know, learning from mistakes and training, getting banged up, doing things the right way. Unfortunately, his great year ends on somewhat of a sour note, but looking forward to having him back sooner rather than later, and hopefully no surgery for him. We'll definitely monitor that situation.

All right, let us move along and go to our last guest of the day. He's a guy who, for a very long time, he's been dangling this carrot in front of me. He's been telling me that he's going to come on the show. He's been telling me that he's going to do an interview with us, potentially first. He's really going to pull back the curtain as to who he is, what he's all about because there have been a lot of questions about him.

finally he steps up to the plate and answers the bell two cliches back to back right there and he finally joins us right now via the magic of Skype he is the infamous the infamous look at that what Skype connection as well the infamous Nick the 2 nice huh wow broadband 2013 man look at you well done you're here you're finally here you finally decided to come on the show I did I can't believe it I've been waiting three hours just watching you talk I bet it's very interesting though. You know what? This might sound very weird. This might sound very rude right off the bat to ask someone a question like this. But I'm going to ask you this question because it's one that I've not going to answer the question. It's one that I've wanted to ask you for a long time and it's one that

a lot of fans have asked me about you. Who are you and why should we care about you? Where the heck did you come from? You absolutely should not care about me. Who the heck are you? Where did you come from? All of a sudden one day you're showing up on every Dana White video blog. You're showing up to the events, and as quick as you arrived, you left. Now you're not seen as often. Who are you, Nick the Tooth? Oh, man. That's a good question. Nick the Tooth or who am I really? Niccolo Guilo, right? That's your real name. Yeah. Yeah, I'm so silly, Nicola Gulo. First off, I want to say the interview with Bob was amazing. Oh, thank you. I couldn't, yeah, I thought that was great. What did you think about that? Don't change the subject on me. I know you like to do this.

I'm not changing the subject. Before I forget about it, I wanted to talk. This is not a time to reflect on Bob Meyerwitz. This is a time to talk about you. I've actually come on the show, Ariel, as you know, because I've got a book coming out, and I'm here to plug the book. If I wasn't here to plug the book, then I wouldn't be doing interviews. But random house is making me do promotional things, and you're the first. Well, I appreciate that.

Yeah, yeah. You have been positioned, the little information, because even Dana White wouldn't talk all that much about you, positioned as, and of course we'll get to the book, don't worry, but I want to set the scene here. You've been positioned as Dana White's longtime friend. Is that accurate? Yes. How long have you known him for? I've known Dana. We've known each other for, I don't know, a quarter of a century, 25 years since we were 16, 15, 16. How'd you know him? We grew up together in Vegas. I grew up, when we grew up in Vegas, it was such a small town.

that there was really like one side of the strip and there was the other side of the strip. There was like the west side of the strip and there was the other side. And where I think when we were growing up, I would have to say there might have been like on our side of town, there might have been like two gyms, two or three gyms. Nautilus opened a gym. Remember Nautilus machines? They opened a gym. I mean, and this goes back when we were like 12, 13 years old.

And a gym called Camelots. And so I knew Lorenzo from, you know, Fritito from when we were like 12, 13 years old just from the gems because we both played football. And then I met Dana, I think it was a few years after that. And so just running, you know, running the same crowd. It was impossible to not run in the same crowds if you grew up in Vegas at that point. And were you friends with him, you know, from the time you met and then up until this point? Or when he bounced around, he tells the story of obviously going to. Boston and working at the hotel and we you know the story's been talking about you know when

dina and i met and we were it was one of those things where we were instantly close because he's i'm an idiot and he's an idiot and so you know especially as teenagers i mean we just immediately were like hey we could probably get in a lot of trouble together this will be fun and so um so after after high school i went to unlb and he I don't know. He said he would take a class at UNOV. I don't know if he ever even did. But I think he left after like a year or two years. And once he left, I graduated like a year after that. And I went to New Orleans. He was in Boston. And so I really didn't come back to Vegas much at all. And so I didn't, I ran into him. I think it was. He gave me a call.

You know, we'd stay in touch. But he gave me a call, I think it was in like 98. And I came down to the office and he was training boxing at what is now, the private Zupa gem. And so I came in there and did like that boxed with him. And he was there with John Lewis. And they were just starting to get into grappling at that point. And I had never, outside of hoist and watching, you know, the first UFC, I had never seen jujitsu. I was like, yeah, it's cool. But, you know, it's not like there were, especially in New Orleans.

I wasn't in Vegas and I wasn't in California. so there wasn't any MMA and when I I rolled with Dana that was the first time I ever rolled I think it was like 1998 and I remember John Lossie and I loved it even then because I was a wrestler but we kind of hooked up then and he was talking about I think he just started managing Tito and he was talking about MMA and I talk about this in the book and I was just like this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard of in my life and he was telling me how big it was going to be. And I just, there was no way at that point.

Even in 1998, 1999, people don't remember just how fringe it was, you know. Had you ever heard of it? Did you know what the UFC was? Well, I watched the, I watched the first, you know, five UFCs. I mean, who didn't? Right. There was no way at that point, if you were a fan of sports or boxing that you didn't watch the first UFC.

Everybody, I was in New Orleans. And everybody knew about it. You know, I remember crowding around the TV. just going, you know, this big dude, the last guy we ever expected to win it was Hoist. Right. And just watching these, sumo wrestler, it was like, dude, this dude is going to kill somebody. And, you know, it was kind of amazing that, you know, that even then that Hoyce won it. It didn't even make sense, I guess, is the best way to put it.

Do you recall Lorenzo, Dana, your friends, your longtime friends telling you that they had purchased this thing and that they're not going to run it? Well, see, now what happened was, is at that time, I was coming back, I was doing some consulting after school. And so I was, I would come into Vegas every once in a while, and I would see Dana. And this was before, I was living in California, and this was before I went back to New Orleans, or went back to Florida. And I think Lorenzo had just left the commission, the boxing commission, and Dana was managing these fighters and kind of flipping things. through a magazine and tell me, you know, how, like I said, how this was the next thing. And they hadn't bought it at that point. And so after he bought it, I was, I had moved to, um, to Florida.

And we were in a beach town in Florida, really small. And, um, and so, you know, I was kind of out of touch with everybody. And so he would email me. We would email each other back and forth. He kept telling me to come see a fight. And I was just like, you know, it's, it's far. I just, and I had a young daughter. my wife and I did.

And, you know, I had a business that was just killing me as far as time. And I just didn't get a chance to come out. And he kept telling me to come out. And a friend of mine finally told me, he goes, dude, you got to watch this reality show. And he told me about the reality show. And he goes, yeah, and there's this dude on it called Dana White. I was like, what the fuck? Can we curse on here?

Sure. Go ahead. Okay. So I was just like, what are you? It was maybe one of the most surreal moments of my life when someone told me that they were a fan of this show with Dane on it. I had not heard that, you know. So instantly I went back and I emailed Dane.

I'm like, dude, what the hell? And he's like, I got you a room. I got you this, this, and this, come on out. I was going to come out. I don't even remember what fight it was. It had to be like, dude, it had, what fight would that have been? 50-something?

Like, right when the first... I believe it was 53 off the top of my head. Yeah, like right when the first season was going on. And it was, yeah, and I just couldn't, and I had to email him back. I'm like, dude, I can't make it. I'm just too busy. I had a big construction company.

And I couldn't, I just, you know, I was always swamped with something. And he was like, you are such a pussy. And so, you know, I wish I would have come out then. But I didn't. My wife and daughter and I eventually made it back west. And as soon as I did, that's when I came to a fight. And even then, coming to a fight, you know, I talk about this in the book, too. I didn't have television, man.

I still don't have TV. What? I haven't had TV. Yeah, I haven't had cable TV. We haven't had cable TV in my house for 20 years. Why? Because my daughter is a crackhead for TV. And so we were like, you know what? We got one chance of raising this kid. We're not going to friggin have a TV in the house. We're going to make a read. Wow. So, yeah, it's actually been a good call. So we were one of the first, like, I guess they call them cord cutters for TV.

But, so yeah, I still. What's that? You don't miss the TV? Dude, I haven't had, I haven't had cable television in, like I said, like 20 years. And when I watch it and I see all those commercials, it literally makes me nauseous. So, no, I don't miss it at all. I watch it. I'm like, how the hell do people watch this?

But it doesn't, you know, now things are a little different because now we have Apple TV and we have Hulu. I mean, I just don't have cable. You know, now things have changed the last few years. But before then, I mean, we didn't have, there was no Apple TV. We'd have DVDs. we'd stick a DVD in and watch that. So anyways, that's why I was so, you know, and living in Florida in this rural, you know, beach town in Florida,

I mean, we were so disconnected from everything that until I went to that fight, I had no idea what the hell he was doing or how big it was. You know, because remember the first, remember how cheesy. Everybody, you know, of course we want to celebrate the first UFC, but the first UFC, in my opinion, especially going back and watching it, in a way, it was so campy and cheesy. And that's what's cool about it. But I was associating that, okay, he's putting on these fights. It's the same thing.

I had no idea. I was going to walk into an arena and there'd be 13,000 screaming people there, you know? So you mentioned the construction company. So you have a law degree and an MBA from Tulane University, right? Which might blow people's minds because the way you've been positioned to us or presented to us is, you know, this guy who licks gum off walls in Seattle. What was your living? How did you make a living?

How did you provide for your family? Well, I mean, I had a massive construction company. That's what I did. I was told you were a surfer, a pro surfer. Is that not true? That's part of the smokescreen. Oh, have you ever surfed? I surf.

You know, what's funny is that this is really interesting. I'm going to bring it back to the book, not because I'm trying to push the book. No, no, no, but trust me. I'm all getting to the book here. This is all part of the process. No, no, I'm just bringing up the book. Sure, sure.

Like, when we left, we left, the personal story is that we left Florida because of Hurricane Katrina. When we were living out there, I think that summer there were like five. And you guys just went through it with Sandy. But we went through it five or six times. And I remember after Katrina, Katrina was just the last of many. And I remember just telling my wife, I'm like, that's it. I'm done, man. It's so disruptive.

Did you experience any of that? So all that I experienced was this power outage things of that, nothing compared to, you know, the people who truly suffer. So I don't want to say that I experienced anything, to be honest. I got lucky. Well, what we experienced, and hopefully you guys don't, it's not a reoccurring occurrence. But what we would experience in, you know, in New Orleans or in Florida was, okay, you get the warning. you've got, you know, five, four, five days. You're glued, everyone is glued to the monitor.

So you're sitting there on your computer, you're going, okay, it's up to 90 miles an hour. It's up to, the models are saying it's going to get to 140, but right now it's up to 110. And I'm talking about miles per hour of the hurricane. And so you're just sitting there and you're watching this thing, and the days go by. And it's all of a sudden a day is gone by and you haven't gotten any more done. The next day goes by and it's coming closer and you're realizing this thing is going to hit us. And so then you start boarding everything, you know, multiple houses, condominium projects, everything. We would spend days just boarding everything up and then we would leave town.

And then if it didn't hit, then we would come back and it would take two, three days just to unboard everything. So you're talking about a solid week of losing your life. if it hit even if it hit peripherally where you weren't you know in the eye of the storm you had damage to clean up for months if you got hit like they got hit with Sandy

or New Orleans got hit with Katrina it's years and years and so you know at that point it was like man there this is going to be an ongoing occurrence that I just didn't want to deal with so that was that was why we left and why we came back out of west

and so I was a surfer in Florida we lived right on the beach and so we moved to Newport Beach and I surf all the time here. But I was going to say because of the book when I started writing the book and I started taking photos for the book, I said, you know what, man, I have to understand some form of martial arts really well to get in, you know, to write about it. I need to experience this.

And so I got into jiu-jitsu and now I would say in the past, you know, two years, year and a half, I do jiu-jitsu now probably five days a week, maybe six days a week, yeah. with who? I train with Mendez Brothers at the Yard of Jiu-Jitsu Academy. So they're both, you know, top of the game between them, probably, you know, 12 role titles, Hoffa just took silver at ADCC. So they're the top of the game. It's his new school sport jiu-jitsu as you can get.

But even yesterday, Carlos Connick gave me a call and asked me, you know, if I had a gym to train out. So I rolled with Carlos. And so that's the great thing about, you know, how this is I get to train with so many UFC fighters, you know, and roll with them. So this is the story that I was told. You were a pro surfer. Clearly, you're not. And you made a killing on the tour and retired at a very young age. Your board hit you in the mouth and that's how you lost your tooth.

So we've already... That's a great. That is awesome. I swear that's the story that the UFC has told me. So we've already a step... I don't know what the killing on the tour came from, but that's great. I would love if I was a pro-surfer. I remember talking to someone who, I was like, who is this guy?

What was he doing? He's like, oh, man, he made a killing on the tour. He's just retired now, loving life. I was like, wow, this guy is all 10. It's okay, so you're not the pro-surfer. Did you lose your tooth in a surfing accident? I can't, Dana won't let me talk about. Oh, stop that.

Yeah, he won't. Are you kidding? I would love the story. I swear. I won't stand for that. We'll get him on the phone right now. Give him a piece of my mind. Are you serious?

You won't tell us how you lost your tooth. No. Really? You gotta keep slim in the mystery now. How old were you? Hey, see some, is that, you know what? Did you have Chris Rini on today? Wow, look at you.

No, but we are, we are featuring his stuff. Like Chris is art. Yeah. I love MMR. A fan just sent me this one right here. Look at that. Oh, look at that. That's great.

And look, your name is Nick the Tooth. In that painting, your tooth is missing. You have to tell us how you lost your tooth. I can't do that, man. I don't want to. Leave me. I want to. It's like asking Dana how he lost his hair.

He'll tell us. No, you won't tell us, really? How old are you? What's that? How old were you? Quite a few years ago, man. So is the story so unbelievable that he doesn't want you to share it? Or is it so mundane?

No, if I told the story you wouldn't believe this, because it's so crazy, you would not believe it. Why wouldn't, this is, we're trying to sell books here. I know. We are trying to sell books here. No doubt about it. Some people said that I lost it. When I tried to ride a bull, man in Mexico.

No, I'm serious. We went to a bull fighting thing. And they were like, dude, you want to ride this bull? And I was like, I'll try it. That's one story. Okay. But did you actually write the ball? The other story, which is surfing.

Right. And by the end of the show, I'll tell you the third story. Okay. Are you retired? You can pick A, B, or C. Okay, fair enough. Are you retired? Yeah.

What's that? Are you retired? I'm retired from working construction in the South. Okay. Yes. Okay. So when does the idea come about to do a book like this? Now, this book, now let's do the reveal.

And we have a picture of the cover. We're actually showing it right now. It is called Into the Cage, The Rise of UFC Nation. It is written by you. There's a great picture of you in the back smoking a pipe. The forward is by one Dana White and a mix of great... I've got my part here. Oh, there it is.

There you go. A mix of great stories, text, and, of course, photos that we'll be showing as we're talking here. This is the book, and I want to know when the idea came about to actually do something like this, because this is a major project. I had a chance to actually look through it. I mean, this is a major – this is not just like, you know, six months. This is many years put into something like this. Years. Yeah.

Years. When did this happen? When did the idea come? Years. It was one of the – you know, I will say this. A lot of people talk about writing a book. And the first thing I say is, are you, and most writers will say, are you fucking crazy? Because it will take you years and years of your life, years.

And most books do. And there's probably very little payoff, you know, as far as the amount, as far as, you know, cost effectiveness of your time. But, you know, I had been writing for a long time. I had told you that. I had taken MFA classes and literature classes at UCLA and Tulane when I was there and even undergrad. And so it's always been something that I'm, that it's my first love is reading and writing. And I, and I love photography too. When we were in New Orleans, when I first met my wife, she had a dark room in the house.

And that's how I got into taking photos. And so I just remember going backstage with Dana. And, you know, as you know, no one's really allowed backstage. They've got a few, like, Getty photographers and the cameraman. But I remember being backstage and being like, you know what, this moment is, it's, I was so struck by how insane it was. This is my best friend who, you know, again, remember, when you're 16 years old and you're your friends with someone, there's no, I don't care who they are. You're never going to look at that person and say, wow, this person is going to conquer this end. or, you know, I'm sure even at 16 years old, Bill Gates' best friend didn't say,

wow, this guy is going to take over the tech world, or even Steve Jobs, for that matter. And so, you know, to be backstage and see Dana in his element at that point and see just the mayhem and the madness and the energy backstage and then in the arena, I immediately was struck with the fact that, you know, in 10, 20 years, people are going to look back and they're going to say, what was this really like? And so I immediately said, dude, I'm going to start taking photos. And he was like, okay, go ahead. And at that point, I didn't think I was going to write a book.

I just thought, you know, I'm into photography. I'm into very different photography. I'm into really artistic photography. And I just started shooting. At that point, I thought it would be a crime for me to have this kind of access and be backstage, not shoot every photo that I can shoot. You know, so the text really wasn't the first thing. The photos were the first thing.

And after a few fights, I started looking at the photos, and I said, wow, there could be a really cool project. And I remember when I was a kid, my dad had on the bookshelf back in the 70s, and he had it signed, like on almost every page, he was into bodybuilding. And he had pumping iron. And it was all black and white photography. was really artistic. And I remember looking at that, and I still have that book signed by Schwarzenegger in like 77. And I remember looking at that book throughout the years

and just being like, this is one of the coolest things ever. And film didn't really capture it, and no other media really captured it. And so at that point when I was looking at the photos, and I like black and white photos, I was like, man, this would be a good idea to do like a pumping iron type. book because that pumping iron type book it doesn't mean that's like a time capsule it's not necessarily

you know the sport from the start all the way till now it's that period of time which is kind of like the golden era of body building um and i thought this would be an opportunity i hadn't seen i researched i didn't see a book that really captured that and i thought this would be an opportunity to do that and so you you start out with the photos and all that and then you're just just kind of just fan, you're flying the wall. But when you present Dana White with this idea, is he on board? Because let's be honest, he's somewhat guarded about, you know,

the UFC. I mean, he has no book on him, and it's been talked about, never happened. There's just that one kind of Octagon book that came out a few years back, the coffee table book. Was he okay with you doing this? Yeah, you mean the UFC Encyclopedia. No, there was U.S. Encyclopedia. There was another one, though,

where I think it was called Octagon, the big, big book. Yeah, yeah. But that's it. No, no, no. Dana was, Dana's always been like Nick, Nick's going to be Nick, he's going to let me, you know,

and I mean, he and I have a relationship just because we've been friends for so long that it's like, you know, I don't think he really understood. I showed him the pumping iron book. I don't think he really understood

what I was going to do, what I was trying to do as far as more of an artistic, um, bent on it. But, you know, at the same time,

he would, like a great friend who was like, you know, I trust you. You know, you're not an idiot. I'm going to let you, you know,

do your thing. And let's see what, what comes about. And how many years are poured into this book? When did this start? I would have to say, I would have to say two and a half years. Two years, two and a half years. So this is the interesting thing.

Like around this time, sort of last year, you start to appear more. You start to appear on the video. You and I knew each other. It's not like the blog thing really came about because of the book or anything. I was already working on the book for a year and a half at that point. but um and i was already at the fights you know backstage shooting the fights and um and so the blog thing came about because just as you know there is it was so fascinating you know and i bring this up because you did talk to i i love that interview with bob and where he's talking

about you know the pay-per-view and how important pay-per-view was but really pay-per-view is an evolution from black and white, you know, first radio broadcast, black and white TV, then we have national TV, now you have cable, now you have pay-per-view, now we have, we're on freaking the internet. There is this thing where everyone's trying to figure out what's happened, what is the new thing, what is going to be the future, and the blogs are kind of an outsourcing, or kind of were born by that because UFC started working closely with YouTube.

And so YouTube, at that point, really wasn't a, I think they just got a UFC channel and it was like, hey, this would be fucking fun. You know, he had just met with YouTube, why don't we do some blogs? And before he, this is a great story, before he even talked to me about it,

we were in Seattle for the Lozone fight. And we're coming out of the bar. I remember I flew up there and I met those guys and and they were like, what are we going to do? Where are we going to go? We're always trying to figure out where we're going to go when we're in a new town. And I was like, hey, I got here a day

before you guys, I found this bar, let's go to this bar. So we went to this bar, and it was outside of that gum wall. So we are... So we hadn't even talking about the blogs. Dana just wanders off somewhere, and it's Elliot and I. Elliot's Dana's videographer, and we're walking out of the bar, and Elliot's always got his camera. He's like, dude, how much would it cost for you?

How much would I have to give you for you to lick that for a freaking gum wall? And I'm like, you don't have to give me shit. I'll lick it right now. And that's kind of how it was boring. I mean, I looked the gum all of a sudden, the blogs just fucking blew up. And what's interesting, I wasn't even going to go to that fight up in Seattle. And that was where I looked at Gamaul, and I had the infamous match with Joe Lozanne. So I thought, looking back, that they kind of presented you in this ambiguous, kind of fun, loving way,

and then you'd come out with the book, and it all makes sense, because let's not forget, You were on, I remember watching the event, I believe it was in London. In February, you were sitting right next to the Octagon girl, Carly Baker, right? So now you're showing up on the Brock. You did? I got a lot of trouble. I thought it was all part of a master plan. This is brilliant marketing right here, guerrilla marketing.

You know what? One of my favorite books is a book called, and as Bob was talking today, I was thinking about it. But one of my favorite books is a book called Accidental Empires. And it's just, if you look at the, the founding. of the UFC and just how those guys kind of were stumbling through everything. And even after Dana and Lorenzo bought it, you know, just kind of stumbling through, you know, the ultimate fighter, which kind of saved it. It was like, that was like a last ditch effort. And so I would have to say that the blogs were kind of an accidental empire for Nick the Tooth. Because we didn't

have any grand conspiracy. It'd have been cool if we did. But we really did. It was really just a thought that, you know what, the blogs are getting kind of stale. It's the same thing. You watch medicals, you watch backstage, you know what I mean? Yeah. And so at that point, and at that point I was traveling a lot with them for the book, with Dana for the book. What kind of trouble did you get in by peering on the broadcast? I don't ever get any trouble. It's like, dude, don't fucking sit next to the dog.

I'm going to crawl starting the podcast. That was wild because I thought, wow, they are really pushing this thing now. Like, the blogs are one thing, but you're showing up on the broadcast next to the audience. There's something going on here. I thought maybe they'll debut you as some kind of character on a TV show, some kind of fight. I didn't know because we had seen you against Joe. And that leads me to the Joe question. Your real introduction was in Seattle, you have this grappling match where there's money on the line.

And he smokes you. He smokes you, man. That was bullshit. Why was it bullshit? Because I was about as hungover as you could get. I was so weird. That came about because the night before, um, The night before the grappling match, it might have been the night of the gum wall, man.

We were tanked. But that night we were at dinner and Steve Mays showed up. Joe's trainer. Yeah, Steve Mays is Joe's trainer. His role there is very questionable. But they call him the trainer. And so Steve Mays shows up. Now, as far as we're concerned, we're eating dinner.

Dana and I and Marty Cordova or Elliott, if we're eating dinner, that is neutral territory, man. Fighters are not allowed. Camps are not allowed. This is neutral territory. We're there. And he shows up wearing a team aggression shirt.

So I told him, and immediately started it in on him. But that was probably after about 10 shots of Jack. And I told them straight out, I am going to smoke anybody from your care if you shall keep wearing that shirt. So then I didn't even, I swear to you, man. I did not remember the next morning I woke up.

And when I say woke up, like my eyes got, I heard my phone going off. And I staggered across the hotel room floor. And I grabbed my phone and I must have 10 Twitter notifications and 10 text saying, are you really going to fight Joe Lozone? And I was like, oh, shit, what happened now? And so I had to, that's, and you see that in the blog when I go into Craig Brasari's, who's the head of production for USC. When I go into his office and I'm in his room and I'm like, bro, what the hell happened last night?

So you actually do this. You actually do this. He smoked you, but you think it was BS. You think that he got you in a vulnerable state. And at the end of that, they kind of- Vulnerable, completely vulnerable. You knew. Didn't you have a rematch signed for a year later, which we are approaching a year later right now?

We're approaching that. Yeah, I mean, I'm a little bummed that he's got this December 14th fight. I want to figure out how we can do it. And I might fly up to Boston. I don't know. Like I told you, we might do some kind of like closed door, Rocky versus Apollo session. But it's a year later, man. You can ask Carlos.

We can call Carlos right now. It's a whole different tooth, man, stepping in that. Are you still a white belt? No. No. What are you now? What's funny is that I rolled in a tournament. What precipitated all that is that I rolled in a tournament, I think it was the No Gee World.

I think it was like late October. And I was a white belt. And I entered as a blue belt and I won. And so I won, I'm world champion blue belt, no-gey worlds for my division. Wow. And so I was like, Steve, your boy is not a frigging world champion.

Can he step into the ring with the octagon with the world champion? So would you say at this? Obviously he could. Would you say at this point that he's kind of ducking you? I think he is, yeah. Really? Yeah. Why don't we ask him?

Joe? Go on. Joe, are you there? What's up? I'm there. How's it going? Oh, I love it. Joe.

Joe, where is Steve Mays right now? Steve Mays is probably eating a sandwich somewhere. Yes. I don't know. He's either sleeping or eating, but he's doing one of the two somewhere. Joe, you've been on for a couple of minutes now. He said you're ducking him, that it was BS. You got him in a vulnerable state.

He was hungover. That wasn't the real him. He's won some kind of award since then. maybe a blue belt, we're not sure. What do you make of all this? You know, I love when people toss around the world champion part. That's the part that I love, because

Nick won the over 40, half blind, been training two months of World Championship at his weight, which, realistically, he's probably the only got to register for that division. So he won by default. So, you know, but I'm training hard for Nick.

You know, like people think I'm trained for fights. I'm getting ready for Nick. Get ready for Nick the tooth. I'm jumping. I'm wrestling. You know, I'm doing all kinds of stuff. I'm going to take away every minute. You know what?

I think that Joe took this fight on December 14th to the Belkney because you knew that the year anniversary was coming up. I don't mean to talk to you yet, but that's how I feel about it. Let's do it after the main event. Let's do it in the office. I'll fight. We'll see how that goes. And then after the event goes off.

I'll have a little time and relax a little bit. and then we'll finish it up. What do you say, Nick? I'm up. I'm up. I was wrong with Carlos yesterday, you know. Look at you. We don't know.

Joe doesn't know who Carlos is. Who's Carlos? Who's Carlos? Carlos Kondit. Carlos Kondit. He claims to have been training with Carlos Kondit. And Carlos Kahnit. These guys are all preparing.

Is Carlos teaching you? Will you be teaching all kinds of often? I don't think Marcel Garcia. I don't think BJ Pan. I don't think any of these great grapplers could help. you, Nick. Oh, man. Let's say you would train a five times a day.

That's cool. I'll give you credit for that. We'll train five times a day. Something crazy like that. You've been doing this for like ten years, right? No heel hooks, terrible. We need to set up the rules right now. You know, a couple times a day.

Even at your five times, you still did you a couple years. Okay, let me ask you this, Joe. Was that the, of all your athletic, you know, endeavors, competition, Was that the easiest match of your... Was that easy money, as they say? I would retire from fighting

if I could do that every week. I wouldn't have to train. I would just show up. I would, you know, tap on Nick half a dozen times. Collect my money. You know what's... I'll be done fighting. And, you know, I've got a lot of bonuses to the UFC.

So I would still give up on a little bit more than I would beat up on Nick every weekend. What were you going to say, Nick? Yeah, you know what sucked about this whole thing is that my wife and daughter run around the house in Lozone MMA T-shirts. All sweatshirts, T-shirts, Joe sent them everything that they have. I mean, I'm like barricaded in there. I mean, my wife's in the other room laughing right now. She thinks this is the greatest thing. They don't have faith in you.

Your wife and teeth don't have faith in you. Wow, that's personal right there. That is personal. Okay, so let's set it up right now. First off, you want $6,000. last time, right? You know who's going to train me next week in Lendell? Ricky, he's coming over to the dark side, man.

Wow. He's going to get me ready for you. Yeah? Okay. You keep Steve Mays. You keep Steve Mays in your corner. I got Ricky and Michael. Okay.

So, Joe, you're fighting... See, Ariel? That shut down the whole conversation. Well, let's see. Let's see. You're fighting December 14th in Sacramento. Nick, will you be there? Yes.

You will be there. You'll be at the fight? You froze up on me here. He didn't sound very confident. Yeah, what's going on? All of a sudden, hey, this is weird, Joe. All of a sudden, I just asked him the biggest question of the ball and his Skype, which was in impeccable form.

It was unbelievable. It froze all of a sudden. How about that? Coincidence, I'm sure. So you'd be willing to do this right after your fight on December 14th? Oh, man. I'm taking the fight seriously. MacDandig is super tough, you know, provided I'm not in the hospital or something like that.

Make it happen. You know, we can do it in the warm-up room. It doesn't have to be in the octagon. I came in a wall up for a room closet, you know, whatever. Doesn't matter. Okay, Nick is back, finally. Nick. Yeah, I'm back.

And, you know, we're going to have rules this time where it's not going to be ruled by someone from Lozong Camp at all. How much money is at stake here? Joe, are you still there? Yeah, I'm here. Who's putting up the money? That's what I want to know. Yeah, who is putting up the money, Nick? I mean, I'm going to be a big chance.

So I feel like Nick should have to come up with the money somehow. Are you crazy? He's not if he was going to try to. ring with me. It's very weird all of a sudden that is Skype connection. I've got to say, Skype connection. Let's try recalling Nick, because the Skype connection looks horrendous now. So we'll keep Joe on the phone for a second,

and then we'll recall him, because I just want to get this in writing. Who put up the money last time, Joe? Was it Dana? The boss was the boss man, Dana. He did. And you walked away with $6,000? Can you hear me, I can hear you, but it's not great. We're going to call your phone right now.

Okay. We're calling your phone right away. So you want $6,000? How much do you think is fair for a rematch? Because you're a busy guy. Yeah, I'm a busy man. I am a busy man. I don't know.

I mean, you know, I don't even care about getting the money. You know, we can do it for some kind of charity. They can pick a charity. You'll pick a charity. You'll get in and put up some money. Yeah. Whoever, it doesn't matter. You know, I just had a lot of fun last time, honestly.

How many times did you tap him out? I think I got six. I got $1,000 for you submission. I wanted 10. I wanted to go after 10. I really, I should have, I would let him go, I was, you know, I kept in a situation, I would let him go starting up again. I should have just, you know, switch to the next thing.

Should go, like, armlock triangle, armlock triangle. He's racked it up, but I was a good sport about it. I let him go all the way. Oh, you actually felt bad for him. A little bit, yeah, a little bit. I mean, he's a special boy. Yeah, I mean, that is somewhat embarrassing to get tap. I mean, you are a professional fighter and all, but to get tap that many times,

I don't even think I'd get, well, probably I would get tapped way more than that. Okay, he's back on. Nick, are you there? I'm here, man. Okay, we want to do it. We've decided we want to do it for charity. We're going to do it if he's okay on December 14th. Are you okay with these terms? We're just worried about who's going to put up this money because, you know, last time Dana put it up, is he willing and able to do so? I don't think he's willing. I think he was so disgusted by the last, by how much he had to pay out last time.

But, hey, that was his fault, man. He's a promoter. You know, he's a promoter. He should have known, hey, I'm putting my drunk buddy in against Joe, who was what? Come on, let's be fair here. Four weeks into a camp. I was four weeks out of my camp. I was four weeks out of my camp for the world of the Jiu Jiu Jit tournament. So I was a little on the downside.

I was so worried about that. My knee was so banged up. Like I didn't train like an entire week before. My knee was so banged up. I'm like, this is the stupidest thing ever. I should not be doing this. And I was like, I was like, I was like, And she made you're doing it for Dana.

You get hurt. Danes got you back. I guess there's no one better to do this for it. I'm injured. You know, so I get to do this healthy. You can do it healthy this time. It'll be awesome. Wow.

I love it. All right. I love it. So it's set. I look for it. This has been one of the best, you know, the best promoted feuds of the past year. I mean, this has to culminate. This is like an old school pro wrestling feud right here.

A year-long promotion. I don't let, man. I have enough time right now. I'm going on TRT. I haven't yet, but I'm doing mine now. After watching Vitor, I am going on TRT right now. In fact, I'm going on detour, guys. Well, are you okay with that, by the way, Joe,

because TRT is very controversial these days? I don't really care. Yeah. You know, TNT's bad, okay, we're a little protein. What about this? What about that? It's very slippery slope. Oh, wow, that's interesting.

All right. So December 14th, are you guys going to... I think you should talk about, like, UFC.TV 599, something like that, make the people pay for something like this. But I'll leave that up to you. I'm happy we got Joe on. Anything, Joe, you want to say to Nick

before we let you go here? No. You know, I do my talking to the Octagon. I don't have to jump on these radio shows and talk about how people are ducking me. Wow. There he is. Best of luck to you on December 14th.

I appreciate it. Can't wait, Joe. Thank you. Thank you for coming on. Nick, how about that? Wow. Did you expect that? Oh, I'm ready for it, bro.

You're ready. I expect all things at all times now. Are you going? Are you going to be there on December 14th? Yes, absolutely. All right. I was pretty bummed about Pettett, huh? Yeah, that does suck.

That does. Yeah, that was a shocker, man. I mean, I wonder, I wonder if this is something to be worried about. I wonder if, you know, he's been banged up. He's so talented, but what's going on? Is he pushing himself too quickly? What's going on behind the? the scenes, you know what I mean?

I don't know. Okay, let's... I don't know. He's one of the cool... I liken him to, to, like, Anderson's solo because they're, they're like these kind of different

types of fighters, these archetypal fighters that are almost, like, magical. And to see him get hurt, like, I expect that in, like, more of a plotting, you know, methodical fighter, but to see him get hurt, it's like, man, that sucks, you know? I hope that's not a ton of things to come.

So do I, and I think everyone does as well. We showed some pictures, some great ones. I think the one of BJ Penn and Ronda Rousey, because the white backdrop and everything and what they're wearing is just stunning. Is there one picture, one moment that you were privy to that sticks out above the rest that really means something to you, that we might not be able to decipher from just looking at it? God, let me see what I sent you. You know, that picture of Ronda and B. DJ Rowling was probably my favorite picture because it was a closed-door session.

It was a question that everyone has had, you know, forever, which is how can women fare? First of all, can they fight in the octagon? We now know that's true. And secondly, how would it, how would she fare, you know, even if it's just grappling against a guy? And I could tell you, I saw her, I watched her role. We closed off the gym. and she rolled with DJ and she rolled with Germo Mendez

and both of them were just shaking their head going she might be one of the strongest people at that weight they've ever encountered and guy or girl and so for me I mean that kind of solidified watching her role and I know wrong I've hung out with wrong

she's cool as shit and but seeing her role like that where it's not octagon like you know, and it's not MMA, it will just confirm to me that I just don't see her getting beat. I don't see it. And the reason I say that is because if you look at most, you know, you never look at the exception. You always look at the rule. But if you look at the rule, the guys who excel in the, in MMA have been trained since they were like eight to ten years old and usually from wrestling.

And so they have this hardcore. I started wrestling when I was eight years old, and I wrestled for 10 years all the way through high school. And it's just a culture. You do it every day. You go to tournaments. You go to matches. You know, it changes who you are. And I got men have that that path that they can go through through wrestling.

But for the most part, women today at this age, at least right now, don't have that. She has this like eight-year. lead on any other you know for the most part women fighters because of her judo which prepared her mentally for tournaments and fights et cetera et cetera

it's very interesting you know what I mean to see her role against these guys it confirmed that she's not a novice I mean Guillermo Mendes is one of the greatest judo guys here also not just one of the best and he just and BJ were just like

she is otherworldly how good she is. It's an interesting time for her with the show. And the pitcher, like I said, is stunning. It's an interesting time, though, because, you know, she's on this show and some are getting exposed to her fully for the first time. There was just this EA sports cover vote, and she actually lost Amisha Tate, a fan vote in this tournament

to see who would be alongside John Jones. So it'll be interesting to see how the fans react her come December 28th. The book, as I mentioned, is called Into the Cage, The Rise of UFC Nation. It's by Nick Gullo, forward by UFC President Dana White. It's out right now, right now. On Amazon.com, you can purchase it right now.

Yeah, it's out right now. We're doing a, I'm doing a book signing at Las Vegas Fight Shop for this Saturday for the 20th year anniversary, and so we'll have advanced copies in there. There aren't going to be many there because the books aren't on shelves. You can get them from Amazon,

but as far as being on bookshel, if they won't be in stores, I don't think until the 26th. So they've only got like 50 that are going to be at the fight shop. They'll all be signed by me. Hoyce will be there, and Hoyst is featured in the book. Oh, wow. And, yeah, and so Hoyce and I'll be doing a signing, and so it should be really cool. But like I said, I'm kind of bummed because they couldn't get them enough books.

What time at the fight shop? 12 o'clock. 12 o'clock on Saturday, which is just before UFC 167. and we hope that this grappling match that we have been talking about for the last 20 minutes or so actually happens between you and Joe Lozahn. Now, my last question for you before you go is, how did you lose your tooth? I'm not going to answer that question. You said you were going to give me a third...

I want to answer that question. I want to answer that question, but I can't. You said you were going to give me a third option than I could pick. Okay, what was the first one? The first one we had was the surfing. The surfing? The bull. I was a pro surplers.

Yeah, but you already laughed that one off, so I'm not even counting that one. The next one was the bull. Yeah. It was the bull fight. And the third one, I'd love to tell you that I had like an MMA story, but I will never let anybody punch me inside the doctor.

I'm not that tough, man. And the third one is that I was racing. I got into a BMX bike race that was for kids, and I got in, someone dared me. It was like 13-year-old kids, and I was racing around the track, BMX race, and I freaking went over the handlebars to knock my teeth out.

I'm going to go with the Bull Story. You're going to go with the Bull Story, right? That's a good one. I like that one. It kind of has blown my mind because I went into this thinking that you were this surfer who retired and you got to fall around your friend and take some photos. Now you've kind of flipped everything upside down, but I'm happy that you finally decided to come on the show.

The book is stunning. Congratulations on doing something like this. I know much time and effort and just patience. takes to do something like this. It must be unbelievable. So it has to be just in itself a great thrill to just complete the book and now share it with the world. Really appreciate you coming on. Good

luck at the signing. Hopefully more than two or three people show up. And good luck with the book because I think it's great and it comes out at a perfect time. I don't know if you thought of this or someone else, but to have this come out 20th anniversary of the UFC is a special thing. I appreciate it, man. Thanks. I'll see you at the fight, only.

All right. There he is. Nick, quote unquote, the tooth gulo. You can follow him on Twitter. It's Nick the Tooth. That's his Twitter handle. He has a website, nick thetooth.com. A great guy. He's been around the sport for a very long time. And it's great to finally learn about who he is, what he does. And he has this book that's called Into the Cage. And it's beautiful. It really is. The photos are great. It's a great behind-the-scenes look at what goes on at a UFC event. Not just that. I mean, the photo that we're talking about wasn't at a UFC event. It was Rhonda B. B.J. training, which I actually never knew they did something like that. I mean, I know it was

closed door, but I never knew they kind of. cross pass. So pretty cool. Check it out. It's on Amazon right now. You can order it. Not that expensive. So perhaps a great present for a UFC fan, MMA fan in the holiday season. Now, how about this? Speaking of which, holiday season, we got a lot to get to on the desk here. Of course, you know we have the Johnny Hendrix t-shirt, which I think you can see on the wide shot. But we do have this. This right here, we have one of these last year. This is pretty incredible. I believe Mr. Nehruy Rick, let me hold this up. I believe Mr. New York Rick has information on today's prize for the best Twitter question. Is that correct? I do. A little bit. As you can see right on the cover, UFC Ultimate Fight Collection, 2013 edition. By the way, could I just say something? What's up? Whoever did your camera did not put it in focus. Unless there's something going on with my TV here, but you're completely out of focus. Usually you're crystal clear. No, that's your camera. Is it my camera? What do you mean my camera? You mean my monitor?

Is that what he says? All right, let me see. Let me see how it looks on this stream because it's very bizarre. Anyway, keep going. Oh, there you go. It's great. So I was right. Yeah, Will took care of it.

Okay, well done. That's my guy. UFC Ultimate Fight Collection 2013 edition. Suggested retail price, $135. Holy moly. 20 discs featuring over 200 fights and 50 hours of action from June 2012 to June 2013. It's available now. in stores.

And we have two of these, but we're only giving out one this week. We're giving out one for right now. Right. Wow. Look at this. So July of 2012, that is U.C. 148. That was... June of 2012.

Oh, June? No, it says July in the back right here. It says July 12, June 13. I've been sent the wrong info. Unbelievable. Anyway, there's a lot of great fights here. I would say, and I wonder if anyone asked me this question, because I know some did on Saturday night. This has been the best year

in UFC history. Now, I know it's on a full 2013. It's kind of, you know, it's July. Save it. All right. All right, all right, all right. Let's talk about what's on the desk right here. Because we, we, uh, we change things up a little bit because tomorrow is the 20th anniversary of UFC 1.

We have these wonderful pieces of art, which you can tell me about. They're from our friend who we've seen his work before. Yes. Chris Rini. That little, uh, wood thing in the back over with my face on it was done by him. He was a friend of the show.

So for UFC 1 to commemorate it, he created all these burnt wood sketch it. Etchings. Hold on one second. Okay. Do you have a phone call? Oh, all right. Okay.

I was getting my own voice back in my headphones and I completely spaz out on a delay. Anyway, so our friend Chris, Rini. He created these for UFC 1. If you're interested in any of his art, which you obviously should be, check out how awesome it is. You can check him out

he does writing and blogging for Fightland, where he displays some of his other art, but you can also check him out on Twitter at Rini MMA. Rini-M-M-A. And on Instagram, Chris underscore R-I-N-I. He also has a website

with all the M-M-M-A art up at This Day in M-M-M-A-R-A. Now, the pieces of art that we have up here are all moments from UFC 1, which happened on November 12th. In my opinion, in my opinion, the best one, this, this, this, this, uh, hoist-gracy one right over here that I'm pointing at is fantastic. But to think that this guy actually does this from, but he just burns it, right? And then he colors it in. Is that essentially it? He, uh, he burns it in and then he wood stains it. Gosh, that is unbelievable. We have great moments. One of these here. I'm seeing them from the back, but Gerard Gordo against Taylor Tully.

Those are up above you. Oh, okay. Oh, yes. They're great. Foot stomps, all that stuff. It's fantastic. We appreciate him giving this. He's donating this to the studio, right? No. No. All right. They're on loan. They're for our show today. Okay. Well, fitting because tomorrow is the 20th anniversary. In fact, Mr. New York Rick is going to be a part of our 20th anniversary coverage tomorrow. but I'm not going to fully explain that right now. We'll save that for later on via Twitter, social media and whatnot, but he will be. So for those that are fans of Mr. Rick, he will be a part of it. Now, let us talk about what happened over the past week.

I was in Fort Campbell, and let me just tell you, today being Veterans Day, today being Remembrance Day in Canada, I was talking to Will about this. I always kind of feel a little strange saying happy Veterans Day to people, but I wanted to say this at the top of the show, but we got delayed a bit with the technical issues. just wanting to thank all the veterans, everyone who served, not just this country, but all over the world, wanted to thank them for their service.

And someone actually, Troy Noons, who's the former quarterback of the Syracuse Orangeman and is a big MMA fan, he had a great Instagram post today. He said, Land of the Free because of the Brave. And I thought that was great. It was very well said.

So we want to thank them. And obviously, thoughts and prayers with everyone who has served and who passed because of their time serving their countries and want to also send out our best to everyone in the Philippines who not is it might be in an American news kind of flying under the radar way of a horrific tragedy going on over there as a result of the typhoon and it's just one of the worst natural disasters we've seen in recent which says a lot so just want to send our best to everyone who has been affected by that as well so kind of a somber day today, I think, in the world.

And because, as I was saying, it's today's Veterans Day, I was in Fort Campbell last week for the Fight for the Troops Show. And I have to say this is top five most memorable events that I've ever covered. The crowd was unbelievable, just seeing those men and women. It was just them in the audience. There were no other fans. It was men and women in uniform and family members of theirs. And they were so happy to be there,

so respectful, so thankful. They're thanking us for coming. I'm thanking them for doing what they do and being who they are. It was a great show, and of course it was culminated by the amazing finish, which was, you know, out of a WWD storyline with Tim Kennedy knocking out Sopo Natal. So that was great. And then, of course, Vitor Belfort winning on Saturday against Dan Henderson, knocking him out in a manner of seconds, finishing Dan Henderson earlier than he's ever been finished, finishing via strikes as well. Very, very impressive stuff out of Vitor Bellows. Now, I get to this because I want to say that my mother, Mama Nose, went four in one on Wednesday and five in one on Saturday. So she has an amazing street going on right here of just losing one, making one mistake on all these cards.

Did you put any money on the line for yourself? I did. I actually bet on a Vitor Belfort finish. Well done. Within a certain amount of time? No, no, no, no, no, just via knockout. Okay. How much money do you make?

Can you say that? Is that legal? Can't disclose that. Oh, wow. But it wasn't, it wasn't a lot. Because I wasn't that confident of what happened. I was just, I just had a gut feeling that this might be the time Dan Henderson gets cracked, just because of how great Vitor has looked lately, and Dan just hasn't. So I thought that this might be the first time he gets cracked, and fortunately,

for me it was. You nailed it. So that's in the books. Busy weekend in the UFC for the UFC. As I mentioned, Saturday night is UFC 167 and this whole thing, Mama Nose versus New York Rick, which might be even more anticipated, more talked about, more promoted than Joe Lozahn versus Nick the Tooth. It will all culminate with UFC 167 because at UFC 167, Mr. Rick to my left and my dear mother will make predictions for the entire card.

Now, we're not doing Moneyline. Money line is not going to be involved, but you're going to make predictions for the entire card. And then the person who gets the most right, naturally, is the one. Is the last man standing? Is the king of the mountain? Is the one with bragging rights for life? The entire card at stake, first prelim,

all the way to the main event between George St. Pierre and Johnny Hendricks, New York Rick versus Mama Knows. I think this is just perfect for the 20th anniversary of the UFC just makes that show all that much bigger. Cool. Your thoughts. Can't wait.

You sound even more nervous than Mr. Nick the Tooth. There you go. There it is. Now, because she is my mother, she has put special stipulations on the way these picks are released. She may or may not question

your ethics. She has requested that you make your picks first. She just want you to copy her picks. She's worried about that. So let's run through the card. Today we're not doing, today we're not doing, we're not doing money line. Today we're doing just straight up picks. People like to pick up straight up. We want to know your picks. Favorite? Who's winning? You want to start from the bottom? From the bottom. John Valante. John Valante is my pick. Okay, but say who's fighting. Set this up a little bit. Cody Donovan. Okay, let me set it up. John Valante, friend of the show, Long Island's

He returns. He's fighting Cody Donovan on short notice. You are picking Chris Wyman's friend? John Valenti. Really? Okay. Fellow New Yorker. Fellow New Yorker, of course. Now, this is interesting. What I'm dubbing as the people's co-main event, Sergio Pettis versus Will Campuzano. Sergio Pettis. Dona Pettis.

Okay. Of course, this is, I mean, this is fascinating right here. This, talk about full circle. Talk about full circle. Anthony Lapsley versus Jason High. Jason High. Wow. You're still going to them.

Why not? Why not? Someone knocking at the door. Okay, here's another one. Edwin Figueroa. Now we're moving on to the preliminary card on Fox Sports 1. Edwin Figueroa versus Eric Perez. Gojito.

Gojito. Going to rebound. Didn't look great in his last fight. I mean, Figueroa. hasn't looked great just overall. Fair enough. I'm picking Perez. Brian Ebersol, we haven't seen in ages since June and July of last year,

against Rick Horror Story, who has been training with GSP for this fight. Let's not forget. Brian Ebersol. Wow. Is he the favorite in that fight? There's no betting lines out. Oh, for those? For the undercard.

Okay. Excuse me. Ed Herman versus Talis Lites, who, let's not forget, My mother was one of the few people to pick Todd's Lydides in his UFC return against Tom Kong Watson. Ed Herman was supposed to fight on this card against Tim, no, against Hafele Natal, but that all got switched up after Machita moved and Bisping's injury. Anyway, Herman Lytes. Ed Herman.

Wow. Donald Cowboy Soroni, perhaps his last fight at 155 pounds will headline the Fox Sports One main card, which kicks off at 8 p.m. Eastern against Evan Dunham. Very interesting fight at Lightweight. got. Who's calling you right now? Busy man. There were two fights on this card that I was iffy about and just unsure of. This is one of them, but I'm going with Evan Dunham. All right. Fascinating. I say fascinating because I know what the other picks are. Anyway, let's move to the pay-per-view card. Ali Bagatinov kicking off the 20th anniversary show against Timothy Elliott,

who's coming off a huge win back in August. Who are you picking? Elliot. All right. This one is an interesting one. This is actually the fight that I thought Tyrone Woodley should have had in his UFC debut earlier this year. Tyrone Woodley coming off a loss to Jake Shields at UFC 161 going up against Josh Koshchek. This is the other one I was unsure of. I feel like it's a coin flip, but I'm going to ride with Kosteck on this one.

Oh, very interesting. He hasn't had a win in a while. Most recently knocked out by Robbie Lawler. If I have a minute to break it down, it basically comes down to, I think that Woodley is just a little more raw and Kosteck's being underrated just in general lately. Arguably defeated Johnny Hendricks

in a split decision, if I recall, right? Was that a split in Jersey? That was, it was very, very close. Some people even today think he still won the fight. So regardless, I think Kosteck is just being underrated right now. I am actually, you know, a supporter of Tyrone Woodley. I think that he's really good

and has a future at the top of this sport, but I think that Kostchak is the pick for this one. Last time Kostchek Wanda fight was UFC 143 back on February 4th, 2012. There you have it. Going to win on Saturday, according to Rick. Okay, moving along, Robbie Lawler, who was the last person to beat Kosteck, faces Rory McDonald. Rory McDonald?

How big of a favorite is he? Pretty large. Last time I checked, I think it was around 3 to 1. That's not so bad. I was expecting. He's minus 335. Lawler is plus 275. And then this is interesting one.

I kind of gave away your pick a little bit in our interview. Rashad Evans versus Chelsan, but I was giving you props. I wasn't throwing you under the bus. No, you weren't. It was nice. Did he give you a high five on his way out? No. He didn't.

What a guy. Rashad Evans versus Chal Sun. You think this is a no-brainer. I wouldn't say that. You overplayed my hand a little bit. Okay. But I do think that Rashad is going to win. Ultimately, I think that Chale is able to manhandle most of the people he faces, but when he's not able to, it becomes a tough fight for him.

For example, against Bisbing, against Anderson Solvin, the second fight, although he did get him down. But just if Chale doesn't get the takedown, it's going to be a tough night for him against Rashad. If Chale is able to get him down much easier than I expect him to, then I think that Chale's going to be able to control the fight. but I just think that Rashad's take-down defense is going to be good enough that he's going to be able to keep Chale off him and on the feet I think he's just a better striker than Chale. And then George St. Pierre versus Johnny Hendricks for the UFC welterweight title. What do you think? GSP. GSP. No doubt about it?

No doubt in my mind. What's the lion for that fight? Less than Rory. GSP is minus 240. Hendrix is plus 200. So you can get Hendricks at 2 to 1. I wonder if this is the closest it's been for a GSP fight in a while and I wonder what it's going to be around like Friday night, Saturday morning, how things will... Usually what happens is the favorite becomes more of a favorite.

That's just a general trend. I'm not saying that that's going to happen for this fight, but I wouldn't be surprised if GSP becomes a bigger favorite. And what, by the way, what's the line for Sun against Evans? The line is Rashad is minus 175, Chale is plus 155. Very close. Yeah. So the odds makers don't agree with your assessment that this is a gimme.

Again, that's your assessment of my assessment. Right. So I actually, I picked chalk on this one. I've got Elliot, he's a favorite. Costcheck is a very, very slight favorite. Rory, Rashad, and GSP, all favorites. Well, isn't it funny that you say that because that is not the case when it comes to to Mama Nose, he are her picks?

So she picked John Valante over Cody Donovan, Sergio Pettis over Will Camposano, Jason High over Anthony Lapsley. So far that's three for three. We're same. prelims, 645 Eastern Time, exact same. Eric Perez over Edwin Figueroa, the same. Now things get interesting.

She's very much affected by Rick Story training with the TriStar team in Montreal, maybe perhaps pulling for the Montreal team. She picks him over Brian Ebersoll, long layout for Ebersaw. Also interesting. Talus Ladies, you can't jump off that bandwagon now. She's going to ride that thing to a rematch against Anderson Silva.

Talas Ladies, she says, is going to defeat Ed Herman. And then Donald Seroni is going to defeat Evan Dunham. So, correct me from wrong. That's three. Three things are going to get interesting here. It starts off the same, but we got some action. All right. Moving along to the pay-per-view card, Tim Elliott over Ali Bagatinov.

You picked that, right? I picked Elliot. She disagrees, though, with your pick of Josh Kostach going with T. Wood, Tyron Woodley. So that's interesting. Fair. You agree on Rory McDonald defeating Robbie Lawler. You do not agree, however, on the layup that is Rashad Evans versus Chale Sunnan, she goes with the American gangster.

Also fair. And I will say that she was contemplating a massive upset in the form of Johnny Hendricks defeating George St. Pierre, or is it a massive upset, according to the odds makers, It is not. She was contemplating it, but at the 11th hour, she stuck with Montreal's own George Rush, St. Pierre,

so you agree on that. So according to my sheet here, Chale Sonnen, Tyrone, Woodley, Sironi, Towslides, Rick Story. That's five fights. That is the true main card, in my opinion, of UFC 167. There it is.

There it is. Huge. Cannot wait. It all goes down, and I will be there on Wednesday for all the pre-fight coverage. Okay, let's get to the questions. Let's do it.

We will start with the website, as usual. Happy Veterans Day to my dad while I have a second. Oh, your dad served? He did. He was in the Air Force. You didn't tell me that. That's amazing. I just told you. Well, I mean, you could have told me before.

When I was doing my whole little spiel there, I would have mentioned it, of course. When did he serve? I don't even know the years. But way back when? When he was a youngster. Oh yeah, it was a handsome young buck. Wow. I've seen the pictures.

Where? Where did he serve? I don't know that either. Geez. We'll have, I'll call him up. All right. And we'll, uh, let us know. Um, okay, first question from the website. What do you think of Andy Silva saying Vitor deserves to fight for the title?

Also, TRT aside and all that, why do you guys think he has become this good at the later stage of his fighting career? Just how long do you see Vitor fighting for? Will he outdo, say, the likes of Ram? Randy, longevity-wise. You know, it's weird. Randy Couture began his MMA career at around this time. You know, Vitor is 36, a little younger, but it's amazing when you think about it. He got into it very late. Let's go one at a time.

I mean, Anderson Silva, Dana White loves to say that he likes to mess with the media. He knew that a quote like that, given their history, would get a lot of attention. And it has, and, you know, that's just maybe Anderson being Anderson. Now, I do agree. forget about how you feel about T or T steroids, all that stuff. Right now, he is playing by the rules. He is. He's playing by the rules.

The same way, by the way, you know, other fighters are playing by the rules. The same way that guys using steroids back in the day, or not steroids, I should say, PDs of any kind back in the day in baseball were playing by the rules, breaking records, they were playing by the rules at the time. Given what he has done, given his body of work, and who knows what else, anyone is on, but just given his body of work, knocking out Michael Bisping, knocking out Luke Rockhold, knocking out Dan Henderson, in the fashion that he knocked them out, it is impossible for me to say he doesn't deserve a title shot. Now, some people were saying, oh, how does he get a title

shot after winning a 205 pound fight? Guess what? If Anderson Silva would have defeated Chris Weidman back in July, he would have done enough to get a title shot, in my opinion. Both those guys, Michael Bisping and Luke Rockhold, were going to get a title shot if they beat him. So, my opinion, the same should be for him. He moved up to 205 because he said he didn't want to fight at 185, blah. He was essentially fighting a 185er in there who was, you know, eating right before the wands and finished him. Beating Dan Henderson like that warrants Tasha, I don't care what weight class it's in. So he is the top contender at 185 in my opinion. Now, why do I think he's become so good at this stage in his career? Well, look, I mean, you can, you can speculate all

you want. I've always said that it is telling when you look at the history of baseball and statistics in baseball guys who are hitting 50 home runs after hitting 10 home runs. All those guys after some time, most of them, they were exposed. Right? I mean, it just, it, it, you don't typically get better as you get older. It doesn't, it doesn't work that way, especially in a sport like this. He's doing it. What's his secret? Who knows? Is he on TRT? Yes. Do they believe he can can get sanctioned in the U.S.? Yes. I believe he can get sanctioned as well.

Let's not forget other guys have done things in the past. They've gone sanctioned. No problem. He will get sanctioned in the U.S. Does this bring up larger questions about TRT, about what guys are doing in the gym? Absolutely. But right now, I can't call him everything.

He's, what he's telling us, he's putting it out there. He says, I'm on TRT, I need it, and look at the results. And you can make any kind of, you know, decision, conclusion based off of the results. But yes, he is better than he's ever been. Yes, he's finishing guys more impressively than he ever finished guys. He looks to be an amazing shape, and he's on TRT. And this wasn't asked here, but do I think guys should be using TRT? No. I don't. If your levels are low, if you're not in the right physical shape to fight, then don't fight. But I don't think you should be using it.

Here's our next question. Is Vitor Belfort's Renaissance the greatest in MMA history? It is some kind of renaissance. I'll tell you that. I mean, remember when he came into affliction, just kind of flying into the radar fighting the likes of Terry Martin? And, I mean, look where he is now. Look what he's doing. Look who he's doing it to. It's unbelievable. Is it the greatest? I mean, I like to think that Chal Sondon's Renaissance is pretty damn good as well. But he never had a great start like Vitor did. Vitor had a great start kind of flew under the radar for a little bit and now is almost on top of the world

it's definitely up there Chales is great because of how he kind of reinvented himself but as far as Renaissance is concerned it's you can make the case definitely do any other Renaissance fighters come to mind well Randy's was pretty great because he retired and then he came back and won the belt

so that one has been pretty great that would rival something like this. I mean, like I said, most of the times when you hit the twilight of your career, you hit a roadblock, you don't often rebound. Sure. And, you know, it's one of those things where I'm so tired of the criticism. I'm so tired of like the flood of tweets and everything that you hear about it when it happens. But it's all very valid.

And, you know, Dan Henderson was on it, but Dan Henderson doesn't have the history that Vitor has. It's all there. It's all very easy to make conclusions about. Dan Henderson never had his issues with PEDs. Vitor Velford did when he fought Dan Henderson back in pride. It's all there. But right now, he's playing by the rules. He's being tested.

They tell us he's being tested out of competition. He's being tested before the fights. They're telling us he's not messing around, that he needs this. He's playing by the rules right now. So you can't deny that. At the end of the day, the question is, does you deserve a title shot based on what he's doing? You cannot deny him a shot at the title if he's doing everything supposedly by the books and winning these fights in impressive fashion. You can't deny it just because you believe he is cheating.

Unless you have concrete facts that he is cheating, concrete information, you can't deny him, unfortunately. It's a tough spot. It reminds me in a way, and it's a bad, it's somewhat of a bad example, but it's like when Bud Sealy was at Barry Bonds, his game when he broke the record, the home run record. He had to applaud. He had to acknowledge him. It turns out later that all the evidence pointed to him abusing PEDs. But right now you have to applaud and acknowledge what he's doing. Hopefully at some point it turns out he's all good and he wasn't cheating. Right now you have to applaud him.

Our next question. Do you think Vitor Belfort takes too much heat for TRT use? I feel like the TRT discussion is overshadowing what is otherwise one of the biggest stories in the UFC, the legacy and progression of Vitor's career. If he was taking too much heat, if he felt like he was taking too much heat, then he should get off it. That's the easiest solution.

Because him being on TRT coincides with this amazing run. It actually coincides with it. So it's hard to ignore it. Is it annoying? Is it kind of a black cloud? Absolutely. But other guys are on it. Other guys use it.

other guys have perhaps abused it, but not many have done it. Some have, and they've heard about it. Not many have done it with, you know, a flag on their record. And Vitor is one of those guys, but it actually coincide. So while it may not be fun, it may not be a pleasure to read, it may not be a nice, you know, aftermath of what he's doing, it comes with the territory. And either he has to deal with it or get off it to truly prove that he doesn't need it.

Our next question, what's next for Brandon Thethe? He just made a UFC veteran tap out to a knee to the body. Josh Koshchek and Diego Sanchez couldn't put him away that quickly. Yeah, I mean, obviously, it's been some time since he fought those guys. But Brandon Thatch is incredibly impressive. He has a great look. I mean, he's part of this new breed of fighters coming into the UFC with a lot of buzz behind them, a la O'A. O'Connor McGregor, different kind of personality, of course.

But he is super impressive. And some people were saying online a fight against Stephen Wonderboy Thompson, would be fun, which I think would be fantastic, given their striking, or Adelaan Amagov would be great as well, given what he can do on his feet. But Thatch is close. He is definitely a true rising star in the sport, and that was super impressive to finish a guy like that via, you know, essentially tap out due to strikes, knee to the body, needed the liver. I thought initially there was need of the ribs, but apparently it was need of the liver. I'll take their word for it. It looked brutal, and he is the real deal.

So one of those guys comes to mind as a fun fight for him. Dan Henderson, with Hendo being out of a contract after the Belfort fight, should Bellator make a play to sign him, at least make him a reasonable within their pay scale offer? Sure. Why not? I think he's still respected. I don't think people view him the way they view some of the other,

quote-unquote, UFC castoffs that Belator sign. So absolutely, I wouldn't break the bank. Unfortunately, he's on a three-fight losing streak. and he's lost against, you know, some very, very tough competition. Theota Machita, Rashad Evans, and now most recently Vitor Belfort. So he's, you know, he's 0 and 2 against the Blacksillions as of late, but he has, he's fought some tough guys. And he could probably do some damage in Belator, and there are some fights for him,

you know, a fight against King Moe. That's interesting, right? I mean, that was a fight that I think Strike Force was trying to make before Fézhael derailed those plans. So there are fights for him to happen. I don't want him to stick around longer. I don't want to see five straight losses on his record like others, but it sounds to me like he wants to stick around to the UFC.

Now, will the UFC try to resign him at this point? Do they see value in him? That's the real question. And I don't know. I don't think it's a given that they're going to resign him. I really don't. I don't think it's a layup. Given their past with him, given where he's at right now,

given his age, given how they're trying to shed some excess fat from the roster. I don't think that is a layup. Now, when that happens, if they don't try to resign him, will he go over there? Yes, but I don't think his, or will he try to sign with other organizations? Sure, but I don't think that's his first choice. I think he wants to finish his career in the UFC. So it's going to be interesting to see. Maybe the UFC calls the shots on this one.

Our next question, what did you make of the ending in the Green versus Krause fight? Do you think John McCarthy dealt with the situation the right way? It appeared to me that he just lost patience with Krause's complaints and stopped the contest. It was a very bizarre situation. If you missed it, two low blows. and then a third one, which at the time we thought he was de-kewing Bobby Green, which I billed as the people's main event, which did not exactly live up to the hype because of these unfortunate blows.

But in fact, Big John was standing there, essentially calling a knockout, saying that he was done. Now, I think definitely, whether or not you believe the third shot below the belt was legal or illegal, the first two had to have affected James Krause's state. And I don't believe that Krause was flopping or trying to get another point taken away or whatnot. It's awfully close. And it does appear as though a portion of Bobby Green's foot hits him below the belt. It also appears that a portion hits him kind of in the midsection there.

Super duper close. if I had to say right now, I'd say I don't have a huge problem with Big John's call. Watching it live, I was very confused because I thought that he was getting decued. Watching it a few times after the fact, it was so close that I think that the way he reacted and how damaging it looked. And what I liked most about what Big John did was that he was so sure of himself. He had the confidence he stood there, you know, like a statue. you. He was not, you know, he wasn't maybe thinking about it, you know, wavering at all,

like some other referees do. He was certain and he made his call. So I do think it was, I do think it was a fair call. I don't, it was so close that I don't know if it was 100% correct, but I think that it wasn't the, the, the, it wasn't blasphemy as some people positioned it. Did you see it? I did. What did you think of it? No, I have no problem with the call because, I wouldn't know what to do in that situation. Well, you're not a referee, so that's not a fair thing to say. Well, watching it, I don't know what the proper call is for that.

It was funny that we talked to Mark Goddard about it. That exact scenario. You're right. Yeah, we did. Three low blows. He said three low blows and he wouldn't stop the fight. But also kind of weird, he said like, oh, if it's Brian Stan, I mean, it's kind of buys. Right.

Sure. I remember that. Yeah, I have no problem with it. I think they're going to rebook it regardless. So I think it's going to be a moot point. You think they're going to do it again? Why not? Yeah, yeah. I've done that in the past with fights like that.

Yeah, they're doing it very recently with Abel Trujillo and Roger Bowling. I think it was so ugly, though, that there isn't a clamoring for it, in my opinion. I still want to see that fight. But you're okay with it? No problem with it. Yeah. Because, I mean, what's the alternative? I don't think Bobby Green should be decued because the blow was legal most likely.

I'm not even sure. So, I mean, the alternative is what? I think that there's really no right case in this situation. situation and I think John McCarthy made his call and I can live with that. Fair. Our next question. Recently, Cole Miller was decked out in ATT year for his fight in Manchester. Saturday night, Dustin Ortiz wore Rufusport trunks in Brazil.

Could these just be isolated incidents? Oh, I'm sorry, these could just be isolated incidents, but do you think these rare examples of fighters promoting team over sponsors is a growing trend attributed to the sponsor problems many fighters are facing? Or could it be a new thing that MMA teams are doing to brand themselves? Well, you bring up Cole Miller. He's been one of, if not the most vocal, about the lack of sponsorships in the sport. And I think it's no coincidence that he was doing that. I don't think they're doing it because they want to. I think they would rather make money and profit off of their fights via sponsorships. I think that they are doing it because they don't have anything else to cover the real estate. I think that's why they're doing it. And I can't speak for Ortiz. In fact, I didn't actually notice that. But I don't want to speak for Cole. but if there's nothing to put there, might as well rep your team

as opposed to just having black shorts. So that's definitely a direct result. And you've seen that with other guys. I've seen guys like James Kraus, Jason High, his team was just wearing UFC gear for his last fight in Indianapolis because they had nothing else. But it could also be a case of like Komosi

where if he feels like the sponsor is not there for the long haul, he might be refusing them. I don't know. The scenarios are, are plenty. There are many different scenarios, but it is a direct result of the, maybe the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the MMA slash UFC sponsorship game right now. For sure. Next question. Who would you like, who would you like V.C.? Who would you like 2C matched up for the vacant title? Condit versus McDonald's two for the title,

if they win their next fights or any other contenders out there. I'm sorry. This is pending George St. Pierre's retirement. Oh. Well, I don't know. Honestly, I don't think that he's going to retire. I really don't. There was a report yesterday in LaPresse, where his longtime mentor and trainer and friend and someone that he's actually very close with right now, his name is Christoph Mido. Mdu. Khristov Mido, the French hurricane. He spoke to the press in French. It's a French-Coubec newspaper. and said that he believes after this fight in the cage, George St. Pierre should retire. He should pass the torch to Roy McDonald. He's 32 years old. He has aspirations of growing a family, starting his own martial arts school, all these other dreams, aspirations he should do it right now, top of his game, nothing left to accomplish. I spoke to some people close to GSP after reading that.

They don't believe that this is going to happen. I think there's too much money to be made for GSP. I still think there are some interesting fights for him to be happy. I'm starting to really believe that they don't want to fight each other, Rory, and GSP, but I'm going to hold out hope that that's going to happen. And I think it would be a fascinating, you know, teacher versus mentor type of thing. Teacher versus student, I should say. But so I don't, I think it's a, it's a moot point at this point. Assume they do.

I assume he does. Just imagine it. Okay, play along. In the world. Well, and he has to win the fight, right, to make it vacant. Because obviously then Johnny Hendricks. well I mean okay so this guy is assuming also that Roy McDonald wins

which isn't a gimmie and then that Condit beats Matt Brown it could be the opposite it could be Matt Brown versus Robbie Lawler that could definitely happen so oh man right that'd be nuts that fight just got me excited yeah so I mean there are a lot of possibilities out there

and there are the young guns I don't think the Brandon the statues of the world are ready to fight for for belt but you know there are young guns. Jake Shields is kind of climbing the ranks. Who knows? Maybe that will entice Nick Diaz to finally come out of retirement. Possibilities are endless, but I don't think he's retiring. Win or lose. All right, here's your turn now. Evans is now a firm favorite against Sunnan. Do you think this is justified? So when they say firm favorite, what does that mean? I don't think that's like a, that's not an objective measure of anything. He's just saying that it's not a like coin flip right now.

Is it justified? Yeah, I think it's justified. I think given their skill set, it's justified. given that Rashad is a great wrestler and that's obviously Chelle Sondon's his strength and also given the fact that he's a great striker and so where is Chelle going to beat him?

So are you asking if him being the Benning favorite is justified? Absolutely and I think it's not surprising. Now do I think he's going to win? Well that is a different question. Well, you should put some money on it if that's well. Maybe I will.

Okay. We're coming to we're coming close to the end of 2013. Is this the best year of fights in MMA history? Then he listed some notable fights. Yep. Silva Stan, Sanchez-Melendez, Jones Gustafs, Alvarez Chandler, and many others. I think we kind of touched on this last week. And now I'm certain of it.

After the week the UFC just had and what's still to come, still five or so events to come. And it's very unfortunate that Anthony is injured. And hopefully that's not a sign of things to come to close out 2013. It is without a doubt, in my opinion, the best, year in MMA history. It's been a great year as far as news is concerned. There's been a lot to cover, but the actual action inside the cage has been out of this world. And unlike 2012, when we were teased with a lot of big fights, but they didn't come to fruition. Twenty-13, a lot of the big fights came to fruition. Some of the fights that, you know, 2013 benefited in many ways from the lack of

big fights in 2012. And a lot of those fights, which we predicted. At some point, it was going to have to happen. So I do agree. It is without a doubt. I mean, you listed five. There are plenty others that you can list that have been great. And I think it has been by far the best year for mixed martial arts. And fitting that it happens on the 20th anniversary of the show, of the sport. 20th anniversary of the show. I see that coming around the corner. That'd be nice. What have we got? We got 16, I believe. Well, if 2014 is next year, So we're approaching our, are we approaching our 50-year anniversary? Yeah, we are.

Does that mean I'm going to have to do a whole other crazy show all over again? I can't do that. Okay, good. Will says no, we don't have to. He gives you permission not to. Thank you. All right, let's hit this one quick. Do you agree, by the way, because your name was on that?

I do agree. The fights have been fantastic this year. Everything that went wrong in 2012 has gone right in 2013. My voice just cracked there. Sure, you're so excited. I'm pumped. All right, next question. Let's hit this one quick.

Will these following fighters ever fight? for the title. First, John Lineker. I'll read him off. You just say yes or no. Okay. John Lineker. Yes.

Cubs Swanson. Yes. Hafeel Dos Anjos. No. Hector Lombard. And does he mean UFC title? Yes. Let's just say yes for the case of...

Hector Lombard? No. Tim Kennedy? No. Michael Bisbing. Yes. Habib Narmaga Madov. Yes.

Gayard Musassi. Yes. Travis Brown. Yes. There it is. Interesting question. Yeah, it's nice. Some of those guys at the top, I believe, because the divisions are more shallow.

I mean, if Lenerkika may wait, he would have been fighting for a title probably already. Question for both of us. In the EA Sports UFC game cover art competition, Misha Tate beat Ronda Rousey in round one. Was Dana wrong when he said that Ronda was overreacting about how she will be perceived on Tuff? Many people I talk to, particularly women who have been watching Tuff, really dislike her from what they've seen on the show. I suggest you watch Dana's post-fight scrum, which was recorded by our own Guillermo Cruz in Brazil, where they ask him about this, about the backlash toward Rhonda. And he says he couldn't care less. He really sticks to this.

And I believe him. I believe he's sincere. He doesn't care. He knows that people want to see her fight. At this point, you're not indifferent to Ronda Rousey. So who cares if she lost on a vote like this? You're not indifferent. You either want to see her get her ass whoop or you want to see her win.

You're not indifferent, though. You don't just, you know, find her to be a channel changer, so to speak. Is she going from a good guy to a bad guy, a face to a heel? you know, she's certainly not coming across as, you know, as this perfect angel. She's not doing, she's not cheating or anything like that, but she, you know, she's rough around their edges. And if you knew her, she, that's, that's been her appeal, flipping the bird, you know, talking smack.

That's how she got to this point in the first place. Let's not forget, calling out the veterans of the sport and all that. And Misha has a very different demeanor. Is that constructed, you know, with a certain plan in mind? is it a lot more, what's the word? I'm not deliberate, but is she more methodical as how she, you know, presents herself, perhaps, and Rhonda has called her out on that. But at the end of the day, it does prove that maybe, maybe, I mean, who knows?

It's a crazy vote. I mean, who knows this thing is rigged or whatever? But you definitely hear it from fans that some are turning, but they're still very interested, if not more interested in the fight. This presents a whole new layer to the fight. I think Rhonda was the fan favorite going into the first one, back in Strike Force and people were against Misha and her boyfriend Brian Carraway. But now it's a whole new layer on top of the fight.

And I think that makes things even more interesting. This is one of the few times in recent history that Tuff is actually helping the fight, in my opinion. That it's making me more interested in the fight, and the fight is not fizzling on the way to the fight. So it's actually giving it a whole new layer, and I love that. So we'll see. We'll see how people react to her, but you still care about her, and that's most important. moving on to the Twitter questions. Again,

UFC fight collection 2013. First question, is Vitor Belfort 2013's fighter of the year? Three head kick finishes, three KOs of the night, got to be up there. It's very interesting.

Anthony Pettis has two wins. There's a lot of guys who have fought three times, but those are three pretty, three pretty damn impressive victories. I'm trying to think It's worth noting that a lot of people ask this exact question, so I mean, he has to be the frontrunner.

I'm thinking like Demetius Johnson won twice. Hennon Burrell has obviously looked good. Chris Wyden, if he beat Anderson Silva, I think he would certainly have a case. If Chris Wyden beats Anderson Silva again, I think he has to be fighter to the year, right? Beating Anderson twice is pretty... Perhaps the impact that Vitor has made has been the greatest right now, but... Come on. And there's always John Jones.

John Jones. So he beat Chale and he beat Gustafsson. Close. I don't know if he wins it. George St. Pierre will have fought twice. I think it has to come down to Wyden if he wins or Vitor. Right? Off the top of my head, I'm kind of caught off guard here,

so I don't want to actually crown someone. But off the top of my head, I'd have to say that. Okay, our next question. With Pettus Hurt, how would you? you feel about T.J. Grant getting his title shot back while Thompson takes another fight. Now it gets really weird. It really does. And I thought of that. It gets really weird. What are you going to do? I don't know what the UFC is going to do. I think the most fair thing to do would have let's just say he's out for a while and we hope not. But if he does have to have surgery,

Thompson versus Grant makes all the sense and that buys them time. And then you have a number one contender. That's the thing that makes the most sense and is the most fair in my opinion. I agree with that. I didn't even consider that as a possibility. But I think, I agree that that's very fair. They both got promised a title shot, not promised, but delivered a title shot, then they lost it, now fight for it. I like that.

But if he isn't out for a long time, then it gets really weird. Then it gets weird. What do you do? If Grant is ready, I think it has to go to the guy who was last promised the shot, and that would be Josh Thompson.

But, yeah, then it gets tricky. But if he's out for a while, it's a no-brainer, in my opinion, Grant versus Thompson, because last I spoke to Grant, he'll be ready around January or so, so maybe you can make that fight on the Fox Chicago card or New Jersey. There are tons of shows coming up.

It does suck for Thompson to have to fight someone, wait, get off a card. It would be best if Thompson could just fight Grant on December 14th. But if that could happen, then we would have had, you know, Grant versus Pettus this whole time. Would it have been crazy if Grant would have came back and then Pettus pulls out through an injury? A very weird situation at the top. Hopefully it gets figured out.

Hopefully both them get a title shot in 2014. but that's what I would do if Pettis is out for a bit. Our next question, would it be unsportsmanlike of Borough to go after Cruz's bad knee or is a fair game? Would he be looked down on? Well, that's a very good question. I mean, I think it's part of the territory, right? This is a fight.

You're trying to win the fight. You were going to say something? I was going to say, if he's in the cage with you, then it's a fair game. And by the way, Cruz would say the same, I think. Oh, undoubtedly, Dominic would say the same thing. If he feels like he's ready to get back in that cage, then that's it. It's all fair game.

Doing anything legal within the means of a fight is perfectly fair game. I don't think anybody will look down upon him. I'm trying to think of a scenario where they would, and I can't. Yeah, I mean, some might complain. Some fans will complain. But remember, I mean, when Jose Aldo realized that the Korean zombie was heard, he kind of hit him in his shoulder, right? With the kick?

if I know how to finish you, I'm going to finish you that way. It's no different than if you have somebody rocked. Are you supposed to, oh, no, his head is rocked and now I can't punch him in the head? It's insane. I don't think that there's any justifiable way that you can make an argument that he shouldn't go after it. In fact, that would be the first thing I'd be testing out, is kicking him straight in the knee and seeing how it feels. Yeah. I mean, you're going in there, you're fighting.

It's part of the gig. By the way, our good friends at FightMetrick tell me that there are nine fighters with three wins in 2013. Uriah Fabor, Joseph Benavides, Glover Tashara, John Lineker, Vitor Belfort, Gabriel Gonzaga, Habib, Nirmagamadov, Dennis Bermudez, and Sapu Natal. Now, Uriah Faber and Benavides have pretty big fights book for the end of the year as of right now. Benavides could become the flyway champion. but of those guys, I still think Vitor or Wyman, if he wins a second fight on December 28th,

would be the fight of the year, a fighter of the year, in my opinion. Joey B is a good one, though. Joey B is a great one. He's had a great year, but did he have the impact of these wins? I think Vitor and Wydenman are the ones. Next question. Should there be a rule on hitting opponents when they are out? Is it the same as holding a sub too long? I don't think so.

I know people were talking about this after the Jeremy Stevens-Honey-Jason fight, And it's one of those situations where you've got to give them a pass. It's ugly. And you know it could be done because we've seen Lita Machita, Brian Stan, and many others do it, stop short. But in the flow of the fight, momentum, you know, emotions running wild and testosterone flowing all over the place. You know what I'm trying to say. It's hard to stop yourself. I don't think that's the best argument for this.

I mean, there's a clear delineation. of when a fight is stopped. The ref, and that's what I'm getting to. If the referee gets in there, there's no such thing as holding a sub too long until the ref steps in. You're taught to hold that until the ref steps in.

Absolutely. Same for a knockout. If the ref is not there to stop you, you can choose to not punch the guy. You can be a nice guy. You can do what Machita did and not follow up the shot, but you're putting yourself

at risk of losing a fight. Whereas if you seal the deal, you're securing yourself a victory. I don't see anything wrong with holding a sub until the ref pulls you off or taking the follow-up shot. Now, you'll probably get lauded for not doing it like Machita did, but you're also leaving the door open for a comeback and for a loss. And that's what I was getting at.

I mean, you can't stop yourself because look at someone like Luke Barnard. I mean, he was celebrating tons, and he wasn't finishing his opponent against Andrew Craig a couple weeks ago. So you have to stop when the referee actually steps in. That's what they tell you. Stop when I stop you, right? And then people were saying, well, look at Paul Harris. He got released. Paul Harris, Mike Pierce, was tapping the referee.

He was on top of them trying to break them up. That's why he got released. Very different. Does it look bad? Does it make you uneasy? Do you wish that guys would stop? Yes, but I can't fault them because it's the flow of the fight. And they're told not to stop until the ref stopped them.

So refs get in there quicker. But it's very hard. This stuff happens in the blink of an eye. Next question. With the success of UFC on Fox and its affiliates, in your opinion, how long until the UFC stops doing pay-per-views and all fights are free? You know, it's interesting. At UFC 155, I did a pre-fight interview with Dana White at the Zufa offices, and I asked

them about the future of pay-per-view. And I remember him kind of looking at me like this is somewhat of a crazy question. But was he just kind of playing possum? Because I do believe that in five years, pay-per-view is going to be a moot point. Paperview is going to be obsolete. If you think about it, pro wrestling, boxing, and MMA are essentially the only sports at this point that use pay-per-view. I think the Vancouver Canucks put some games on pay-per-view, but that's pretty much it, where a huge portion of their revenue comes via pay-per-view. Pro wrestling's pay-per-view numbers very low, and they've oversaturated that market, in my opinion.

Boxing, if you notice, I mean, it's three, four fights, maybe five a year on pay-per-view. most of them are on HBO or Showtime, and you do have to pay for those. They are cable networks, premium cable networks have to pay. The UFC, if they keep getting great TV deals all around the world, different times, and they're trying to expand internationally, I wouldn't be surprised if come 2019, 2020, there are maybe four pay-per-views a year, a la the old pro wrestling days when there are the big four and the rest was free on TV, maybe zero pay-per-views in the calendar year. I wouldn't be surprised.

I think that we're going in that direction. I think it's about time. If the UFC can make that kind of money, it's about time. The pay-per-view as a model, in my opinion, hopefully will no longer exist come 2020 because we want to be able to watch everything for free. We're subjected to commercials, ads, all these kind of things. I mean, no more pay-per-view.

That's it. I think it also matters how you define pay-per-view because, you know, there's online subscriptions and being able to pay for things that you can stream versus going through the broadcaster and having it on your TV and things like that. So I think we're in an interesting time right now to see kind of where that goes.

Yeah, but there's definitely an interesting shift going on. They still put on their pay-per-view events and their biggest shows are going to be on pay-per-view. But what happens if Fox says, we want the biggest shows on Fox? And we're going to pay you for it. Then what happens? Yeah.

Here's our last question. What are yours and mine? What are the best UFC memories looking back 20 years of, UFC history. Well, on the MMA beat, I said that my favorite UFC moment came. If you missed it, it came on November 18th of 2006. It was UFC 65, Arco Arena, George St. Pierre, getting a rematch against Matt Hughes. And at the time, I was just a fan of the sport. I mean, back then, I hosted my own radio show in college for three years, where we talked about MMA, and I was working

in production, and I had done some stuff in mixed martial arts, worked. on the tough three finale, worked on tough five as a blogger for SpikeTV.com, but still, I wasn't doing this as my living. And I remember being in Montreal, my hometown, and knowing that GSP was going to fight, and knowing that he lost and he begged for the title shot and all that stuff. And I told some friends who still to this day, don't really care all that much about the sport, maybe a little more today than they did back in 2006 when no one cared about it. But I told them there was a big fight going down between one of our own George St. Pierre against Matt Hughes, the greatest welterweight champion of all time. And I remember, I think one, only one friend came with me,

my friend Moe, and I believe his brother as well, Mo Leibman. And we went to this sports bar called Champ Sports Bar, which is a very, very famous sports bar in Montreal. And I remember getting there thinking that it's going to be kind of depressing, no one's really going to be there, but we're going to enjoy this moment. And hopefully, you know, George wins for the city and all that. And I remember getting there, and there was a huge line around the block of people waiting to get into this bar to watch their own guy, George St. Pierre, fight for the belt. And I remember thinking to myself, holy moly, there are people here who actually care about this sport. There are actual fans, living and breathing fans that care about this sport like I do. And we watched it. It was a great time.

George St. Pierre wins, of course. He's very emotional. I actually watched the moment last night. And the place erupted like the Canadians had just won the Stanley Cup. The place went berserk. place went nuts. And I remember at that point thinking, this is such a special sport that it could bring people like this together. And it's still so under the radar, it's still so young, I need to be a part of this. I need to cover this sport. I want it to be a journalist. I need to drop what I'm doing. I need to be a part of this. I want to be a part of moments like this. That was in November of 2006. I started my website, jerrypark.com, in October of 2007. So it took a bit of time to get there. But that's when the wheels really started to get in motion that I decided I need to go back to my roots, go what I went to school to be a journalist, and I want to cover the sport. I want to be a part of it. I'll never forget how the place erupted, the emotion involved, the emotion in that room, in that bar, when he won. It was a great moment. And people were saying, oh, of course, it's GSP Montreal. Back then, it meant a lot because he was one of our own. He was our guy. He had just won the title, and he did it against a rival of his. Today, I don't have the same emotions attached.

to him because I'd like to think I'm as unbiased as possible. Of course, you're not a machine, so you have emotions about certain guys, but it's not the same. I will definitely admit that. But back then, that fight is the reason why I finally decided to do this, and I'll never forget it. There are many, many more, but that's the one that sticks out. It's a great moment. It is a fun moment. It's good. It's good when you have a personal moment. What is yours? Mine is very similar. I've been a UFC fan for quite a while, an MMA fan for quite a while, but my first live event I went to was UFC 101 in Philly

and the undercard and the bottom of the main card weren't so exciting but then came Anderson Silva versus Forrest Griffin and everybody knows how that fight went and just being in the building for that fight was incredible I was there with my friend Victor and when when Anderson did what he did when I don't even have to describe it everybody already knows that moment. The place erupted, like, nothing I've ever felt before that since then. Probably will never feel again.

I've never felt an arena kind of shake like that. And I've possibly seen better fights in person. I've possibly seen bigger moments, but I've never felt an arena shake like that. And it was my first UFC show, so I was pretty excited about that. And then to follow that up, to put the cherry on the case, BJ Penn defended his title against Kenny Florey and my favorite fighter, got to see him fight live on the first card I ever went to, and he looked dominant, and I'll never forget that experience. It was incredible. And I don't think it'll ever be matched. He was your favorite back then? He's always been my favorite. It still is, although he needs to get a win here. But was and always will be my favorite fighter, BJ Penn. Incredible moment. I thought you were going to say when you sent me that, he's a win here. But was and always will be my favorite fighter, BJ Penn. Incredible moment. I thought you were going to say when you sent me that. email to join the team. That was your favorite moment.

Maybe number two? No, really? You laugh. It's not a UFC memory. Sure, sure. I kid, I kid. I mean, did that change my life? Did that, I mean, we were, were we doing the show back then?

Actually, yeah, I just started. It started around UFC 99. I mean, it was very, very, very young back then. But did you say to yourself, I want to be a part of a show like the MAA are sitting? I was not tuning in at that point. You weren't. Wow, I thought you were a fan. from day one. Day one, no. Definitely not. Early, but

not back then. I'd say, hmm, I don't even know. I'll look it up because I remember yeah, that'd be something to see. I'll look it up. I actually looked at, I went back and downloaded the first episode that you were on and there wasn't, what number is it? I looked at it because it was January of two years ago, so that would be 2011 and I looked at it because I want, it's very clear because it was a big gap. We disappeared for a little bit. So it's very clear what episode. Maybe it's like,

I don't know. I really don't know. I don't want to say the wrong number. But it's January of 2011, and there's a big gap before it. And there's not much of acknowledgement. You know, I'm saying how happy I am to be back and I save the new team. And I didn't listen to the whole thing. But I thought I actually integrated you in the show earlier. But apparently I didn't. Apparently it was a slow build because there's not much acknowledgement of who's in the back. I mean, I acknowledge them, but there was no interaction, I should say. Yeah, that was a mistake. That was a mistake.

I came to my senses. But this is a great time. And as I mentioned on the MMA beat, I want to hear from you guys. I tweeted this. This is a fun time for the sport. It's a fun time in the history of the UFC and the history of MMA. And it's a fun time to reflect on why you are a fan,

why we love the sport so much. And it's surreal to me that, I do a show like this, where guys like Rashad Evans stop by and talked to us on the way to a huge fight, 20th anniversary. It's crazy to think that this can actually happen. To people like myself who have been fans of the sport, to people like New York Great, to people like you guys watching who get to go to events. I mean, the sport has come so far to think where it was in 1993 and what kind of a fringe idea it was and this spectacle. And to think that, you know, we get to do this for a living is pretty surreal.

And I think it is somewhat amazing that, and by the way, let's just say that the first question, the one about Vitor, should be the winner. Okay. UFC Ultimate Fight Collection, 2013. Ultimate Fight Collection, you win the Vitor Belfort question. Yep. So this is pretty amazing. To end the show, and the cameras are all flashing at me, but to end the show, we have a very special guess, and it's fitting. because without this person, I couldn't be doing what I'm doing today. I couldn't have gone to journalism school and followed my dreams of being an MMA journalist.

I couldn't do my radio show because the radio show at Syracuse University didn't make outgoing calls. So I couldn't get guests. So people like Bruce Buffer, people like Dan Severin, she actually called them on conference. she being my mother. Mama knows in the studio. Come in. Here she is. Hi.

Here she is. Say hello. Hello. All the people have been wondering if you actually exist. And here you are. I do. Look at her. Mama knows.

I was saying, without you, you were the one who called my guests on the phone. On the radio, remember that? Yes, I did. In Syracuse, she would wake up at 7 a.m. to call Bruce Buffer,

to call Dan Severin, to call Bobby the Brain, Heenan. act as my call screener, her and my sister, I should say. She give props as well to my sister, Amanda. And without her and her support, as well as my father and my family members, I couldn't do shows like this. And she is our number one fan.

She listens to every single show from beginning to end, watches it, and she just so happened to be here on the 20th anniversary, this big show, you made the picks. It's great to have you. And you're the best. Thank you so much. There she is. Mama knows.

Mua. Anything you want to say to the people about your picks, about your long simmering beef with New York Rick, how he puts you down for your picking of the favorites, anything you want to say. No, I wish him good luck. Oh, wow. Thank you.

And good luck to GSA. She says good luck. You're rooting for GSP? Of course. Of course. There she is. She's very shy. She doesn't have perhaps the camera presence that I do or the comfort in front of the camera.

Is that accurate? Yes, very. Yes. So she's not to join this. I wanted to come today and just say hi to everybody and then tell you that you're the best. Thank you. Amazing.

Well, thank you for everything. We're going to say goodbye to everyone and then we'll join you in the back. But thank you for this sport because without you, without this person who, by the way, when I was born, I was in grave shape. Is that too personal? No, it's okay. When I was born, I was in grave shape and she was in bed rest. I mean, all this stuff.

I believe it is a blessing to be here and it's all because of this woman and her support and you've never met a better mother than her right here. I love you. You've never met a better. She watches the entire show four hours a day on a Monday. No one can bother her about a sport. She knew nothing about now. She's a biggest fan, watches Facebook preempts.

It's amazing. So thank you. There she is. Mama knows in the house. How about that? What a way to end today's episode. Alfred, you can hear my music. Beautiful.

What a pleasure. For this to happen, something like that to happen on the week of the 20th anniversary of the UFC, is a sign to me that there is someone up there. It's great. I love things like that. And again, thank you to my mother and father. Without them, who knows?

Because there were times when I wanted to leave Syracuse, there were times that I didn't want to follow these dreams because of good moments, bad moments. And I'm not trying to sit here and say that I've made it or anything like that. But trust me, if someone like myself who went to a small Jewish school in Montreal, grew up in Montreal, can be sitting in New York City.

City doing a show like this for the last four hours talking to the greatest fighters in the world, talking about the greatest sport in the world, to the greatest fans in the world. Trust me, anything can happen. Trust me. You have my word. I want to thank Rashad Evans for stopping by on his way to Las Vegas, Nevada. It all goes down Saturday night. UFC 167.

What a great way to kick this week off. And we wish him the best of luck against Chale Sunnan on Saturday night. Todd Duffy, best of luck to him as he gets back on track. on route to the octagon. We wish him nothing but the best. We want Todd Duffy back inside the octagon. Bob Meyerwitz, without him, we wouldn't be doing shows like this. Thank you for your contributions to the sport.

Thank you for helping to launch the UFC. And thank you for coming on the show today. It's great to have him on. Sergio Pettis, best to his brother. Best luck to him as he makes his octagon debut on Saturday night against Will Camposano. And Nick the Tooth, Gulo. Great stuff out of him.

New book, Into the Cage. Check it out. We will be back same time in place next week. until then we say peace. Somebody here. Support for this show comes from Volkswagen. As the U.S. gets ready to host soccer's biggest moment on a worldwide stage, Volkswagen is helping people discover new turfs and new ways to play the beautiful game right here in the U.S.

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