MMA Fighting - The MMA Hour - Episode 259

Episode Date: December 8, 2014

Featuring Jon Fitch in studio, Matt Hughes, Frank Mir, K.J. Noons, Tom Wright, and John Pollock. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Support for this show comes from the Audible Original, the downloaded two, ghosts in the machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudullian and the rest of the Phoenix colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever. Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprised his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the Audible Original Blockbuster. The Downloaded, it's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking, What are you willing to lose to save the ones you love?

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I am Ariel Halwani inside our New York City studio. I have so much to discuss with you today. I cannot wait for this show coming off one of the most interesting and exciting weekends of the year, especially as far as the UFC is concerned. Holy moly, holy crap, what the hell happened on Saturday night? I'll tell you what happened. It was a great show. Forget about all the other news. UFC 181 delivered.

It was one of the best cards of the year. The main card was supremely exciting, and you got two great title fights. Anthony Pettis returning from a very long layoff. He hadn't fought in over a year. And he's the first man to finish Gilbert Melendez. Did so with a guillotine in the second round. A fantastic performance.

He has not missed a beat. He's one of the very best. I don't know if he's the number one pound for pound fighter in the world, basically because he hasn't been as active as others, but holy moly, is he great? And he's certainly in that discussion now. And I just hope he remains healthy, and I just hope we get to see him three, four times in the next 12 months or so.

A great performance. And then talk about great performances. The main event, it delivered. It wasn't quite the flight of the year that we saw back in March, but it was just as interesting, just as captivating, and perhaps just as controversial. It came down to the first round once again. And in the end, Robbie Lawler,

after all of that, after everything he's been through, coming to the UFC as a 19-year-old in 2002, ups and downs, Elite X's strike force, falling asleep at a press conference next to the great Fyodor O'Millianenko, returning to the UFC last year as a welterweight, defeating Josh Kosteck and many others.

Afterwards, Robbie Loller, finally, after all these years, as a young adult now is the UFC Walterway champion. How about that? A great moment, especially when you saw Matt Hughes in the cage, Pat Miltage in the cage, Matt Hughes putting the belt around Lawler's waist, just historic stuff. And then, on top of all of that, on top of all of that, right after the first fight on the pay-per-view,

right after Tony Ferguson defeated Abel Trujillo, Joe Rogan is standing cage side with the best in the world. Phil Brooks, C. M. Punk, doing an interview, announcing that C. M. Punk has signed a deal with the UFC. He will make his debut probably in 2015. He is no longer in WWE. He's no longer doing that professional wrestling stuff. C.M. Punk is coming to the UFC. And of course, afterwards, I'm sure you have seen it by now. If you haven't, check it out. We spoke to him 20 minutes, so gracious with his time. This guy is unlike others. I've met as far as celebrities are concerned. Stuck around, made me a promise, stuck around after

I was done with all my stuff. He was done for several minutes. Stuck around, did the interview, stood there, answered everything, cannot thank him enough. So gracious, so down to earth, so humble, and I have no doubt that he's going to take this very seriously. He has already taken it very seriously. A lot of people don't know that he's been thinking and preparing for this for a long time. He's already been taking it seriously. I have no doubt of that. We will get into what that means. We will get into whether this is good or bad for all parties involved on this show. Do not worry about that as well.

And of course, on Friday, Invicta had another fun show. There was one FCRFA, a very busy weekend in MMA. Guess what? It's busy this weekend as well. Tough finale. UFC on Fox. The fun never stops. All right, what's happening on this show?

Okay. As always, we'll take your questions and comments at the end of the show. You know, I've been told by management that I can no longer go past 430 here. Never again, they said. Last week when I was done and we went past 5 o'clock, the stink eyes that I got were very pleasant, very much appreciated. So then I got this email, I cannot go past 430. All right, we're not going past 430. Your wishes have been granted.

No longer are we going past 3 hours and 30 minutes. So that means perhaps less questions, sometimes less interviews. Who knows? but this time around it'll probably be less questions because we have a lot to discuss beforehand and a lot of guests to get to

it'll be fine we'll make it work don't worry this show used to be only 30 minutes long so we'll make it work we'll get your questions and comments in there

around 345 at around 3.30 we're going to be talking to Matt Hughes he was in the cage he gave Loller his belt very emotional stuff he's known Lala for a long time

looking forward to talking to him 325 will go inside the vault this is a good one a timely one looking forward to that at 225 We're going to be joined in studio by John Fitch.

This Saturday, John Fitch faces Hussimar Paul Harris for the WSOF Walterway title. That's a big fight, WSOF 16 in Sacramento. John Fitch joining us in studio. How about that? That's going to be fun. 205, we'll talk to Frank Mear. Remember Frank Meir back in February.

He's fighting Bigfoot Silva, but also he was the first man to welcome another pro wrestler who tried to make the transition from WW to UFC way back when. UFC 81, right? Brock Lesner. Talk to him about all that. right, the managing director for UFC operations in Canada, Australia, and New Zealand will stop by at 145. A lot to discuss as far as those markets are concerned. And at 125, we are going to be joined by KJ Noons, who returns to action this Friday against Darren Crookshank at the tough 20 finale.

But first, let us go to the phone lines and welcome in my good friend, joining us from Toronto, Ontario, Canada. Of course, you know him from the Fight Network. You know him from the Law Live audio wrestling, a man who knows a whole lot about the worlds of mixed martial arts and pro wrestling. So I thought he'd be a great guy to talk to about CM Punk and UFC 181. Talking about John Pollack, who joins us right now on the phone. John, how are you? Ariel, how's it going? Good to be here.

Yeah, sorry we couldn't do the Skype thing, some issues with our Skype machine, but great to talk to you nonetheless. So when I say to you, John, CM Punk, Phil Brooks, as we are calling him, as it is hip to call him these days, has signed with the U.S. UFC, what is your reaction? I think I'm kind of right in the middle, Ariel. I think there's people who are on one extreme thinking this is going to be a rejuvenation of the UFC on pay-per-view. This is going to be much to the success Brock Lesnar found. And there's others that believe this is going to destroy the sacred sport of mixed martial arts.

And I think my knee-jerk reaction is that this is something needed for the UFC. I really think they need this kind of jumpstart to attract a lot of their lapsed audience. But at the same time, I do have a lot of reservations about this guy and his health that has been very well documented and starting, I mean, at pretty well a beginner level. And it's going to be quite an undertaking for this guy to go through this and compete at this level. So when you were sitting, I guess were you at home on Saturday night? Where were you? Well, amazingly, Ariel. Like I, I, don't tell me you weren't watching. You were not watching? Listen, the jiu-jitsu school that I train at was having their Christmas party, and I did not want to miss this. So I timed it out. I watched all the prelims, and I was going to go out for an hour, and then come home.

I would go, have a beer, come home. Of course, I was at this party, and my phone exploded at about 10.30 p.m., and I quickly made my way out of this Christmas party to get back home. So, yeah, I was about the open-mat Christmas party here in Toronto. Wow. You must have felt like such an asshole, right? I mean, this is your world's colliding in front of every... I mean, this couldn't be more in your wheelhouse. That must have made you feel pretty bad.

The guilt. I don't think anyone had guilt at a Christmas party like I did. I'm sorry. I'm sorry to hear that, but I'm sure you're all caught up now. You guys did the show yesterday, live audio wrestling, and you had great takes, and I appreciate the plugs for our interview. You know, the thing that... I have a few takes, which I will share with you,

and I want to hear your response. My first initial reaction to it is, look, next year there's going to be, what, 50 events? Let's just say 50, right? And let's just say over 500 fights. Exactly. Let's just say on average, you know, there'll be 500, plus or minus 10 each event. So we're going to get caught up. We're going to get so upset, offended, we're going to get offended over a guy who will probably

only fight once next year. I mean, when all it's done, he may fight more. I'm not just saying it's going to be a one-fight career, but by the time he's ready, it's probably going to be around this time next year. He's not going to get in two fights. We're going to get that offended. And guess what? That one fight will probably be talked about more than any other fight next year.

As far as mainstream is concerned, as far as trying to reach other audiences, what's the big deal? And don't tell me that he's taking someone's spot. You can't tell me that the UFC has watered down their product, that the events don't feel special, that there's too many of them. and then when they actually try to make an effort to rectify this in a different era, right? Five years ago, I agree, and I don't mean to go on this kind of rant here when you're my guest, but five years ago, Dana White wouldn't entertain this, but times have changed. And there are a lot more events. You got to do this, right?

You need to ebb and flow with how the industry moves. And five years ago, I'm with you. I don't think UFC's making this deal. But today, if Phil Brooks is adamant that he is going to fight and he approaches the UFC and says, listen, if it's not here, it's going to be somewhere else, and you're going to hand off this guy to Bellator to go fight, and let's be honest, Ariel, outside of, you know, the potential money he could make on the back end of a pay-per-view,

look at what he's turning away from Bellator, where this would have probably been much better received by most, where he could go out and get sponsors, unlike most MMA fighters, I would say, 98% of fighters can attract, and a significant money offer, and probably get a much easy, your opponent on the way in. It's up in the air who he's going to fight. But this guy, he's doing a lot by deciding to do this. It was obviously going to come to criticism.

And yes, there's going to be 45 events next year. But how many events have we watched this year that feel like big time events? I'm sure you have many friends. I can tell you with my friends that I would watch mixed martial arts with, it's not the majority. It's all of them that have just moved off from this. And it's always the same thing that it's not the quality of the fights that have gone down. It is just so much to keep up with and not those can't miss events. And that's the landscape in 2015, he's trying to attract these fans that have moved on that are not watching all of these shows. And this is a tool to bring back an audience that is not watching every single month. This is the most definitive thing that we can say about CM Punk going to the UFC.

And by the way, could we stop with the Phil Brooks nonsense? I mean, no one called him Kevin Ferguson, right? He was Kimbo-slice. Why do we have to go by, like, why do we have to feel better about ourselves by calling him his real name? He's Seampunk. He's been known as... New York, Rick rule. Yeah, he's been known as CM Punk longer than Phil Brooks. Just stop it with all that. Here's the thing. People either care about it a lot or hate it a lot. No one feels indifferent. And I can guarantee you, the Howard Stern rule, right? The haters usually watch more or listen more than the fans. I can guarantee you all those people who are holier than now, who are acting like, you know, their mother was just slapped across the face.

I can guarantee you all of them will be talking about it. All of them will be having their hot takes on it. All of them will be going around and doing interviews and doing it. I'm talking about the media here. All of them will be watching. All of them will be covering it. And the fans, don't even get me started on the fans, they will all be tuning in. No one is going to boycott UFC 196 because CMPUG is on there.

And going back to my earlier point, people saying that he's going to take someone's spot? What spot? I mean, do you remember UFC 175? there were guys that people were all up in arms, like, this guy doesn't deserve to be on pay-per-view. CM Punk making his debut is an attraction. And by the way, it takes me back to why we started watching this thing to begin with, right? When I watched UFC 1 and 2, I didn't know who these people were. I didn't know who Kent Shamrock was.

He was a guy coming in there, essentially being billed as a wrestler, by the way. And the end of the day, the thing that attracted me to all of it was like, can this guy actually go in there and fight? Can he actually go in there and beat the other guy with a different discipline? That's what this is about. Now, does it change things? Does it make it seem a little different from, you know, a couple years ago when they would never do it? Yes, absolutely. But you can't be grudged seam punk, right?

I mean, can we agree on that? Like, this is a guy who if the UFC said no, would have went elsewhere. The UFC said yes. So you can't hate on him, right? I mean, we can at least agree on that. And, I mean, look, there's a lot of ex-professional wrestlers that don't have a whole lot of avenues. This is not one of them. This is a guy that could make a lot of money doing things that are a lot less taxing

on his body. He's going to essentially potentially uproot himself. This is going to completely change his life for the next six plus months in order to get ready for a fight, whether he moves to find a camp. And yeah, this guy could have gone somewhere else. He could have done

many, many other things. So, I mean, I'm not going to begrudge the guy for doing this. The concern for me comes with somebody that I mean, two years ago this guy's knees were absolutely thrashed and you have to think about what impact, you know, working with high-level wrestlers at a beginning level is going to have in that

regard, training with world-class kickboxers when you have a history of concussions, how susceptible he is going to be to the next concussion. I mean, there's just general concerns I have for the actual human being here if his body can withstand a fight camp. I mean, this is not going to be a walk in the park, and I don't care who you put him up against with. This guy is going to go through a huge, huge undertaking to get ready for this. So, you know, people who listen to this show who watch it on a weekly basis know that typically I don't get this fired up about things, and I don't take away from the guesses. I feel like I'm doing two now, but I feel like we're going to have a two-way conversation here. You know, it's a weird one for me, to be honest, because, you know, I have a relationship with the guy. I know him, and I was a fan openly of him. I never thought he was going to go into UFC when I first met him. So, you know, when you could be a fan of anything you want outside of MMA. But now he's in the UFC. So I have to try to separate that. I am human. So we, you know, do have our biases. I'm not going to deny that. But I'm wondering if people have come up to you and said, I'm offended by this. You know, I know you're tapped into that world as well,

and I'm guessing most of the people in that world, the world of pro wrestling, would be somewhat interested in it. I've heard from a lot of people, but have you heard from any fans, any friends who said, there is no way I'm going to watch this because I don't want to support a guy who's, oh, no, with no martial arts background fighting inside the octagon. It makes me think of the sport and the organization in particular completely different. Has that happened? Not to that extent, but reaction has certainly been mixed. I think we got that, you know, on the lawns. Which is fine, by the way, right?

Mix is fine. It doesn't have to be all positive. I think that the common parallel, though, is that there is curiosity in this, whether you think that this guy is going to succeed or not. I think that's one of the great elements of an attraction is you're curious to find out the answer. And in the best case scenario, you'll pay money to see that. I think that was a lot of the intrigue with Brock Lesner, was.

just how could this guy really hold up here against the former heavyweight champion, no less, in Frank Mir. Different set of circumstances this time now, now with CM Punk going in, we're not going to see him against a former world champion in his first U.S. Sure. You know, I think that that curiosity is there, and that's a good thing, because UFC, they've presented so many cards, but they're not presenting a plethora of those events where you feel that the, the MMA world stops to really take focus, the sports world, notice and it feels like the big can't miss event. And I think that Sam Punk fighting is going to create that. And I think that is unapologetic from Bellator of what their goal is in 2015 to go after

this audience that's not watching cards every week and present these names that bring curiosity. And that's going to be a big balancing act, Ariel, in 2015 is how far do we go with this before there's pushback? But when that Bellator number came out after November 15th, I mean, everyone, their conclusion, was the lesson that Bellator takes from this, and my big takeaway was, is UFC take a lesson out of this? And on Saturday night, I watched a very invigorated UFC that Beyond CM Punk Ariel, let's talk about that incredible commercial they had for John Jones and Daniel Cormier.

For everybody that wants to get on the altar of sport, that commercial had nothing to do with the actual fight and, you know, two top-plate heavyweights. But that commercial encompassed everything that that fight is and why people want to see that fight, and they were right to do so. And that is a can't-ness fight. And that was as much playing on the entertainment side and turning the sport you will get on January 3rd. But the build-up, the sizzle, that was encapsulated perfectly on that commercial. And it was Dana White's words right after that, whether it was innocuous or meant to mean more, he said, we're back. Yeah.

And whatever that means, I think they understand that maybe they were a bit off the ball in 2014 and having those priorities in 2015 that brought in the outside audience. And you're trying to satisfy your base as well. You bring up a great point about the promo. You know, I think that promo was two and a half minutes long. And off top my head, I don't recall any actual fight footage other than the brawl at the MDM. So you bring up a great point about that. You know, I thought it was interesting that Dana said to me afterwards that he is skeptical of CM Punk.

He doesn't know what to expect of the guy. So you've got to give him at least some kind of props for being, you know, honest. I mean, he did go out and sign him, so he's obviously confident to some degree, but he did say, I am skeptical. Let's see what happens. Now, it's not all positive, in my opinion. I think they could have announced this a little better. I mean, first of all, to do it on a pay-per-view, when you probably have your smallest audience

of the night, you consider what's going on in the prelims on Fox Sports One and even maybe the post-fight show. But let's just say there's 300, 350,000 people watching this. pay-per-view. That's a pretty small audience when you also consider the fact that this coming Saturday, you're on Big Fox. At least two and a half million people, I would imagine, are going to be watching. So to do it on the pay-per-view and not really promoted all that much, they mentioned it a couple times on the pre-fight and the prelims, but no one really got a sense that this was some kind of big announcement. To me, felt like it should have been done in a different way. I would have done it

personally on Thursday, maybe, at a press conference, and then anyone who writes a story and discusses this. We'll talk about UFC 181 coming up in just a couple of days. So it gives you that one last push to get people to buy that pay-per-view. It felt like it was a bit overshadowed, even though we're really talking about this as opposed to the two title fights a couple of days later. But it felt like, you know, once Hendricks and Pettus won their, or fought and defended their titles, it was somewhat overshadowed. I thought they did a pretty good job bringing him out there alone afterwards. They shouldn't have brought him out there with the other fighters. But it didn't seem like that was the best way to roll this out there. Do you agree with me? And on top

of that, it's really all about how do you capitalize on this from now until the end. Like, I think there should be a camera on him from the second he signed that contract until the second he actually steps into the octagon. Let us see how he picks the team. How difficult this is, if they don't go

out and actually document this, put it on fight pass, put it on Fox, then it is a botched job. Do you agree? Well, I think the story of him getting to fight number one, it's an extremely compelling one that people want to see, and it all comes down to, I think very much like the debate about prime time right now is what resources

you are going to put into this versus the return you're going to get on Fox Sports 1. And to those that are making the ultimate fighter analogy with Kimbo Slicse, yeah, that made sense for Kimbo Slice back in 2009 when you had the Spike platform and his taped fight did millions of viewers to put punk on Ultimate Fighter today in the Fox Sports 1 environment. It just doesn't make sense to me, but that's a separate point. Going back to, I think certainly you want to do a lot of shoulder programming behind Punk's debut. It's a great story. In terms of rolling them out, I think that I didn't have a big issue with how it was done. I think you could have pushed it much more during the prelims that there is a major signing that we are going to announce to drive people to the pay-per-view.

And I think afterwards, to the point that you have Fox on Saturday, that would have been a golden opportunity to do his first interview on Fox. be sitting down with you or anybody. And so you have a whole week of all of this debate back and forth, and then we're going to hear CM Punk on Fox, and really giving that biggest audience possible a commercial of here's our new signing. It's going to get a lot of attention, a lot of discussion all week, and he talks on Saturday night between one of the fights in the studio,

however you want to do it, and capitalize on Fox. That's what it's there for. Yeah, that's a great point as well. I'm wondering from the other perspective, from WWE's perspective, did they mess up royally here? Did they kind of shoot themselves in the foot by not making sure that he can't go to UFC this quickly? I mean, look at the timing in all of this. He comes out with that podcast, the entire world is talking about him. Vince McMahon is talking about him on WWE Network just a couple days before with Stone Cold.

So he's very much in the news. His cue rating couldn't be higher right now. And then bam, he shows up on UFC TV and he's now a member of the UFC. The timing couldn't be better for seeing punky is more relevant today than he has been all year since he left WWE. Did WWE screw up? And could they have done anything to stop this? Well, that's it, Ariel.

I don't know how much the WWE could have done beyond what they attempted, which was to have that no-compete clause thrown in there. And that was one of the notes that he mentioned on the second interview with Colt Cabana that wasn't discussed as much, but he just flat out said that you cannot put a no-competal. Compete clause on an independent contractor, which is what pro wrestlers are labeled as in the WWE. And that's a really interesting point. It's always one that comes up every number of years. And I think that's for future performers that are leaving the WWE and a no compete comes up.

You might have, I mean, that was my takeaway that this settlement, the WWE agreed on this and had to agree to this. So I think the WWE, CM Punk did a masterful job the last couple of weeks of being top of mind. for both pro wrestling and MMA fans. I mean, they were very much flocking to that podcast and talking about the comments that Vincent McMahon made about the UFC. And I don't think the WWE could have done anything because they attempted to, and it was thrown out,

and they realized the case wasn't there, and they had to settle. You know, I must say, again, I'm being as impartial as possible. This does muddy the waters. There's no doubt about it. Once again, I don't think Dana White of four or five years ago entertains this. But I do know from talking to him personally and privately, he's taking this very seriously. He is not going to embarrass himself. You know him. This guy has a lot of pride, and he's not going to go out there to make a fool out of himself, the sport, everyone involved.

He just won't allow that to happen. You know how much Chicago means to see him punk. The fact that he's even considering leaving and changing everything after just getting married says a lot about how motivated he is to do all this. Let's see. Some guys have it in him. Some guys don't. But he's giving it the old college try and I am certain of the fact that he is not going in there until he feels ready to go in there. He's not going to rush this. There's no date. There's no time that he has to enter the octagon by. So I feel pretty confident about that. In my opinion, I think it will work out for the UFC. I think they'll get what they want out of it. And I think he gets what he wants out of it because he gets that fight and he doesn't want to

live with regret. But you mentioned Bellator earlier. I don't believe that this had anything to do with that November 15th rating because this already was in motion. But do you believe that Bellator's, I don't want to call it resurgence, because I don't know if we're quite there yet, but Belator's momentum as of late and just them being on spike and having a pretty good year ratings-wise, do you believe that's the sole reason why they're doing it? Or do you think it's a bunch of factors, especially after you consider what happened to the UFC this year? Oh, I look at it as a number of factors. I think, you know, pay-per-view took a big step back this year in terms of what the expectations were versus the results.

And I think that there is a conscious look at the product this year. I mean, this year really, if you are a fan of just sports presentation, this year really was that for the UFC. And the UFC has thrived when it is catering to both. And I think that it's gotten into, there's so many shows to produce that it's inevitable, that you fall into a bit of a pattern when it comes to your presentation, when it comes to isolating potential brain. break out stars. And suddenly, you know, you just watch under your nose, someone like a

Page Van Zant who just pops up out of nowhere. She's here on Fight Pass. And I think, you know, just the fact she was showing on the pay-per-view tells me that the UFC is fully aware of this woman's potential popularity that could come in 2015. I think it's just an entire look at their industry and their business of how they are presenting these cards. How are they presenting these performers and understanding that this is very much star-driven and that there are less fans watching the UFC today than there were a number of years ago and how are we going to attract them back? And it revolves around being creative and being able to have that wiggle room to change philosophies. I think that is one of the keys to staying relevant.

Look at Bellet's where their philosophy has drastically changed at this point. And they've got Viacom behind them. I mean, they seem like everyone is on the same page now with Viator. Viacom and Bellator promoting this brand of mixed martial arts. And the UFC pretty much told you on Saturday night that they are aware of this, and they are going to be gearing things like this in 2015. Final complaint, before I let you go, stop trying to compare this to something else. This is not Brock Lesnar. We know why. This is not Kimbo-Sleis. We know why.

This is not anything that we've seen before. It's very unique. The one that I can compare to maybe the most in my mind, it reminds me of when Michael Jordan tried to become a baseball player. He had no business being in AAA. He was not a AAA player. He was Michael Jordan trying to come over to the world of baseball. And his most experience that he had in baseball was being a little leaguer. He had no business being there.

But because of who he is, they gave a shot. It didn't work out. Now, AAA is not the UFC. The UFC is not AAA. But the UFC is not a league. And sometimes they try to act like a league, but it's not a league. It's a couple of owners together. And that's why Ben Ascgren is not in the U.S.

You can't bring up the Ben Ascran thing too. Dana White and Lorenzo Furtina have every right to say no to anyone that they want. They're owners. They're no different than Jerry Jones and Mark Cuban. They can sign and fire anyone they want because they own that promotion. It's not a league with a bunch of owners and a commissioner. It's not that, as much as we want to think it is. So stop trying to compare it to something.

It's very unique. It's 2014 CM Punk, a pro wrestler who really wants to do this, was able to convince the UFC to get into the UFC, and because of a myriad of factors, they oblige. it fail? Who knows? Will it be a home run? Who knows? Right now, I think it's a good thing for all parties involved, because look what we're talking about, and look what everyone else is talking about. Yeah, and I think just to that point, I mean, it's clear that this guy is taking this extremely seriously, and, you know, from talking to, whether it be top guys in mixed martial arts and pro wrestling, the common threads, and just turn off if you are discussed it at this

comparison, is that to succeed in both, you have to have to have to have. this obsession of not failing. And it's inherent in both sides. And I think that is something that you have with punk. I'm not saying this guy is going to necessarily be a gigantic success in mixed martial arts, but he's going to take this seriously. And in a UFC environment where tough China exists, the barrier for entry into the UFC is much, much wider than it was five years ago. And that's just the realistic point. And the fact is, CM Punk is bringing an audience. Everyone knows this.

And CM Punk understands this business pretty damn well. And I think he knows the positives and the negatives of whether people are praising this or criticizing it. I think he understands it exactly well. And there's curiosity at the end of it. And I think this is a risk 100% worth taken for the UFC. And I don't really know if risk is an appropriate word because the worst case. scenario is we probably get a pretty healthy number on a pay-per-view with this guy. And that's the worst-case scenario out of all of this. It's S.M. Bunk, the person that's going to be going through the

most here. It's going to be fascinating to watch a monitor over the next year. Certainly sets up another interesting story to watch for the UFC in 2015. I'm sure we'll be talking about it a lot. Great stuff, John. As always, check him out on Twitter. I am John Pollock. Check him out on the Fight Network. Check him out doing his MMA report every week. Great podcast. Does Tremend This work over there, of course, also live audio wrestling. The man is one with many hats, and he does a great job wearing all of them. Thank you, John. We'll talk to you soon. Appreciate it, Ariel. Thanks for having me on.

There he is. John Pollock, joining us from Toronto, Ontario, Canada. Okay, let's move along now. Let's talk about this Friday, the Ultimate Fighter 20 finale. Of course, two women will be fighting to become the first ever UFC Strawway champion, but there are some very interesting fights not related to the ultimate fighter on that card. One of them involves Darren Crookshank versus our guest at this time. KJ Noons. KJ., how are you? What's going on?

Great to have you on the show, KJ. Appreciate the time. I got to ask you, since it's very much in the news, what do you think about the UFC signing CM Punk? As someone who's been in combat sports for a while, you have a great resume. Is this good or bad for the sport? I mean, look, I'm fighting on the all-women's card.

I mean, who would have thought that happened? Sure. Hey, give him a shot. He's an athlete. I just got the last end of that conversation. I mean, Daniel White, and Brenda the boss. What are the boss is? You know I mean?

Yeah. So you don't feel like this ruins the sport. You don't feel like he's taking your spot? None of that goes through your mind? Let me say it again. I'm on an all-woman's card. Who would have thought that would ever happen? Yes.

I mean, for world titles. And I mean, the whole thing, which is great. They're great athletes. And there's a market for it. So, I don't know. I mean, isn't the guy a black belt and you did too? He's not a black belt. No, he has trained with the gray season and whatnot, but he's not a black belt.

I mean, from all, you know, signs, he doesn't have a strong base in any kind of martial art. He's trained in Kempo. He's training jiu-jitsu, but he's not coming in there with, you know, a black belt under his belt or anything like that, to be honest. Does that make you change your opinion? No. I mean, I don't really, uh... No, not really. You know, I mean, if a guy's a good athlete and, I mean, he's going to draw eyeballs, you know, and that's the game, you know what I mean?

So, I don't know, he's going to drop your favorite numbers and it's going to be good for the company, you know, not necessarily maybe good for me or whatever, but if they like them, then cool, I'll pour it, you know. And final thing, just curious, because you are in that world, have you had people come up to you in the last 48 hours and ask you what you think of it? I'm wondering if a lot of people are trying to get, you know, your temperature on all of this and if you've noticed sort of a renewed sense of interest in the product. No, not too much, you know, not really, not at all, you know. It might be a fad. You know, we'll see how he does, and we'll just see how it plays it out, really, to tell you.

Okay. I think I don't think I want people forgetting, you know, and you guys kind of like know it out a lot. This is the entertainment business. Right. You know what I mean? Even though it's the fight there, you said a fight, but the guys that pulled big numbers

are the guys that are really good fighters and know how to entertain. Very well said. Okay. Let's talk about you. You're fighting this Friday against Darren Crockshank. you've won your last two in a row. And I remember around this time last year, after you beat George Soderopoulos,

you were quite frank. You said if you lost that fight, you were going to retire. Has the retirement stuff officially left your mind after winning the last two in a row? Yeah, I think, you know, I contend with a lot of top people. I think one, well, let's see it.

It's since the Josh Thompson, so I thought Josh Thompson lost that. He was ranked pretty high. I feel like I won the Couture fight, lost a Donald fight. then those guys are ranked at one point probably top five top ten and then I won my last two fights I can still I can still get in 10 I think it's more about if I'm just motivated

to get in the gym and do it you know I feel like I have the skill set and you know can hang with these guys it's just more as far when I get in the gym and do it it's tough you know yeah waking up every morning 530 I got my kids hitting on my head I do all kinds of stuff you know and I got other priorities so that's what it comes down to for myself so do you still have that motivation Yeah, I do. I do have the motivation. It depends on what time of the year. What do you mean?

I mean, it's just like, you know, sometimes you feel like getting up against the gym. Sometimes you don't. You know, I mean, it's tough after you do a lot of injuries and stuff. I mean, I think this is definitely over my 50s. It's pro fight and boxing, kickboxing, and MMA. So when you're at this point, it gets tough sometimes at the mornings, you know. But you change things around, you get around some positive people. It can be fun. You know, it doesn't have to be the same. Like Groundhog. they're like runoff day. Sure.

Did something in particular happen that got that motivation back? Because, you know, when I hear you say in Houston last year that you were thinking about retirement, I mean, I believed you. If you would have lost that fight, you said you were going to walk away.

So did anything happen, or was it just getting back on the winning track? I think he's getting the right track. At that time, a lot of things was going on in my life. You know, I was just turned 30. What am I doing the rest of my life? You know, a couple of kids just got married. a lot of things are going through my head, you know, like,

where's the, I'm really as good as your last, by your last couple of fights, you know, really in your performance. And sometime this is going to end, so I've got to kind of prepare myself, you know. So I was kind of looking at that moment, but now I got a good game plan and stuff after fighting. I feel like this is more fun for me. It's like, I have to win, you know.

My whole life is depending on this, you know, so everything for my kids and my family, you know, I have a backup plan. and I'm going to have something going for myself after fighting in the career, and, you know, so that it makes it more fun for me. And where can you go, especially if I fight like myself and make, you know, $50,000 bonus on top of what you can pay. That's really good money. What's the backup plan?

I'm going to school right now. I've got a couple things in the work. So I'll tell you in person. I'm just working on it. Okay. It's going good for me. Fair enough. You know, the last time we saw you in action was in April.

You look great, even though we didn't get to see you for, for that long, but it was a great performance. You knocked out, Sam Stout. Very hard thing to do, obviously. It just took 30 seconds to do it. You haven't fought since April. Is there a particular reason why? Yeah, my wife, I wanted to take some time off.

We had my second son. Okay, yes, congratulations on that. Thanks, man. It's been a lot of fun. I wanted to help, you know, be around for the baby, help her out. And actually, I went back to school, too, over the summer. Went to summer school. That's more school coming up.

just being busy, you know? There's the little guy. Yeah. Little guy. Yeah, so that was, I just want to have the baby, and then, yeah, now I'm back,

I got back in the gym if the baby was born and ready to hit this before the new year. Father of two, do you feel like you fight differently? Like your mindset is different. When you were a youngster, perhaps you're just, you know, the selfish kid, you think you're on top of the world,

there are no real repercussions for what you do in there other than what happens to you. Have you noticed now that you're a father of two, which is a big difference than one, as you know, that you just think about things differently and you go into your fights differently. Yeah, I'd say so. I mean, there's one time, especially on some, like, the second Dias fight and some, you know,

grudge matches like, I would never have given up. I would have literally died in the ring. There's no way I'd do something like that. That's not like the stupid thing in the world. I'm going to train, fight smart, get in there, and put on a good show. But, you know, I mean, there's dangerous in there. You know, I think a lot of people forget that at times. Like, you're getting hit in the head and things can happen.

So let's just say I'm still going to put on a exciting fight, and I'm going to be at, I'm a lot of that extreme at one point. So, yeah, definitely different. I've never been able to clear this up. Your fight in April against Samstout, it was a Walter White bout, but that was changed at the 11th hour. Why is that? You know, we were actually on track.

Did I actually talk to you and tell you what happened? Not really, no. Honestly, not even, you know. off the record or anything. Well, I was walking, I think it was the day before you have to cut weight before the wands, so you know, you're still cutting weight, and I was walking in the lobby, and I saw him. I'd never met him. You know, we'd know each other. And I heard one of his quartermen say, you think he'll do it. And I turned and I said, you know, what did you say?

Is you talking to me? I thought it was talking to me. And he said, no, no, we're just joking around and saying, you know, we're on wait. Would you want to just fight a catch weight? I go, hell yeah, let's fight at 170. Because are you serious? I go, yeah, I mean, what's your weight right now? said, you know, he was right on track of the same way as me. And we called Joe. And I think we caught him off guard real quick. And he said, yeah, I guess. And we jumped on the contract and signed it for a good change his mind.

And actually the commission, they were, you know, saying that. Because what we looked at it was, you know, we weren't fighting for a number one title or, you know, not even a title or not even the contendership, you know, was a fight to move up and against an opponent, each other and we're like, let's do a catchway. And so we wanted to put on a really good fight. You know, he wanted to have all the energy. And so let's put a war out. I said, yeah, let's do it.

So was that? He agreed on the weight, didn't cut weight. Wow. Me and Sam agreed that we just not cut weights. We'd have as much energy to really put on a really good fight and try to create like a fire of the night or five of the year. And obviously, you felt like the bang. Yeah.

Yeah, it turned out better for me. But he's a really nice guy, man. We had a good time. We had some drinks, and we got the chat, and I really enjoy it, Sam. I enjoy this company. It's fun. Honestly, I'm surprised more fighters don't do that who were in your spot back in April. How hard was it to get Joe Silva to sign off on this?

Well, I think they had never done it. I think they said they're not going to do it again. I think Joe, I just got off the plane from Brazil, and he was a little jet lag. I think we caught him off guard. Wow. Well, good for you. Yeah. You got it, and you didn't have to cut weight,

and the whole thing lasted 30 seconds, but you've dabbled with the idea of going up to 170. Are you still thinking about that? I mean, I've kind of always fought, you know, at, you know, obviously I wanted to tie that at 160, so 155 is really tough for me. And, you know, obviously I'm getting older. I'm 32 now yesterday. Happy birthday.

Thanks, man. It's tough to cut this weight. So, I don't know. You know, 155 is such a tough division, too. I would love to move up. We'll just kind of see you. Every division is tough, you know. I'd like to play around with it. We'll see.

What do you make of Crookshank? Is this the kind of fight that gets you excited? I mean, we know about his striking. He's coming off a nice win over in Joe Kuani. He's very dynamic on his feet, the kicks and all of that. Do you like this matchup? Yeah, you know, I like the matchup. Actually, I was matched up for Joe Lauson first.

Oh, really? Yeah, I was really excited for that. and he agreed and we're on set for, you know, January, then he took the Diego fight, then Diego fell out, then Diego fell out, then Diego fell out, I won that fight, and then, you know, a lot of fires injured, and Darren was, he won the fight,

and I think it's an exciting matchup, so I'm excited to get in there and mix it up, especially for the holidays. Did the Luzon fight interest you more or excite you more? That's the fight I wanted, you know, But, I mean, I tried to get a deagle fight, and there really wasn't, and I wanted to have able to fight. Trulio, then he, you know, Ferguson took that. But, you know, everybody's staying busy.

It's not like calling people out or people don't want to fight me. It's just, you know, people are trying to stay busy and injuries. And, you know, it's a lot more than what people think. You don't just agree on one fight and it happens. You know, things change up with injuries and scheduling and suspensions for the cuts. You know what I mean? Mm-hmm. So in the last 12 months, you know, from that,

Sartaroplas fight until this point, you've just fought that one fight against Samstown in just 30 seconds. Next year, and after this, if all goes well, do you want to be more active? Yeah, I think with all the shows coming up, I can really see like a trend. It's like a little bit different sign.

It used to be where you're getting, you know, three fights. You can fight five, six times if you're healthy. So after this fight, I'm healthy, you know, take a couple months off and I want to fight a lot next year. Because there's so many shows, and if you're healthy, why not?

Did you watch UFC 181? I did not. I recorded it. I haven't had a chance to go over to my dad. He got it. He's the one that tapes it. But I read about it, and my buddy told me all about it. Well, I'm just curious, because it's your division. I mean, when you hear that Anthony Pettis submitted Gilbert Melendez,

and you know, you know, Gilbert, you guys were in Strike Force together and whatnot, I mean, what's your take on Anthony Pettis coming back from 15 months on the sidelines and to do that to Gilbert's never been done before, he's never been stopped, let alone submitted. Pretty darn impressive, right? Very impressive. Isn't he, isn't Anthony like a blue belt, too? He's certainly not a black belt.

Yeah, props to that guy. Man, that guy's explosive, and I think it's great for the sport. I'm not a hate on anybody. I think it's great, and I think he's doing good. That's exciting. Your son is not a fan of his Yeah

All right, hey, yeah What do you want? Hey, what's up? What's up, buddy? Okay, get out here. What's his name? His name's Carl James. Wow.

I think I've heard of that name. That's your name, right? Yeah, he's the fourth. Carl James the fourth? Wow, your dad, is he the third? The second? Yeah, and my great grandpa was the first. Oh, wow.

And what's the youngster's name, the younger brother? Oliver. Oliver Edward. Wait a second. Do you know what my firstborn son's name is? What? Oliver. Is it really nice? Yeah, I love that name. I knew I liked you, KJ. I knew you were a good guy. That's great. Do you call him Ollie? No, no, he's called Oliver.

Wow. Look at that. That just warmed my heart, just hearing you say that name. That's great. Will they go to the fight on Friday? I'm guessing not. No, no, my wife's My wife's going to come up And watch a fight They're going to stay at Grandma and Grandpa And yeah, they're going to chill

My son's been to the past A couple fights though Wow, okay He'll see the UFC on TV and everybody Daddy Daddy That's amazing That's funny Let me

I'll let you go I want to ask you one last question And I'll let you go You know Nick Diaz very well He's coming back He's fighting Anderson Silva Do you think he has a shot Yeah, I think he has a shot

You know I think I mean, I don't know. It just depends on Anderson. You know, there's that time. Now, if Anderson's healthy and he's still on top of it, Nick does not have a shot. But if Anderson has met that time, you know, an athlete just kind of, you know, and he's kind of, he's not no spring chicken, Anderson.

You know, you know, and athletes, especially fighters, it's like they hit a wall at a certain page, and they just never the same. So I don't think we really know if Anderson hit that yet. If he has, then, you know, Nick has a chance if not, then if it's old than Anderson, then Nick doesn't have a... I think Nick has a shot. Interesting. Okay. KJ., best of luck to you. Looking forward to the fight.

Always great to watch you in action. KJ. Noons versus Darren Crookshank this Friday night on Fox Sports One. All the best, KJ. Hey, thanks for having me. Have a good day. There he is. Carl James himself. Former Elitexie champion. Remember that fight against Nick Diaz.

He did have a rivalry with Nick Diaz. Defeated him once via that cut, and then they came back and fought once again for the welterweight title of KJ Noon's. Went up to 170 in that fight back in October of 2010. Holy moly, over four years ago that fight was. That is unbelievable. That is really amazing that that was over four years ago.

Wow. I would have guessed that was two years ago. In any event, he lost that fight via unanimous decision, probably because of the hair. Remember the hair? He was pushing it aside. It was bothering him. It was in his eyes. Never again for KJ Noons.

But he returns after winning his last two in a row in Quebec City in April. April, he knocked out Sam Stout in a 170-pound bout after defeating George Sauteroplas in Houston at UFC 166, and slowly but surely now climbing up that ladder. A nice fight against Darren Crookshank this Friday on Fox Sports One. All right, let's move along now. Someone who, of course, knows a lot about Quebec City. He was front and center in Quebec City back in April is the UFC's managing director for operations in Canada, Australia, and New Zealand. I'm talking about Tom Wright, who joins us right now, not from Canada, from Las Vegas, I believe.

Tom, how are you? Hey, Ariel, I'm terrific, and you are absolutely correct. I am in Sin City. What's going on over there? Well, we had this thing called the UFC 181 on Saturday night, which was a great event over at Mandalay, and I'm presenting business plans this week. The international heads are in town, so that's what's all about. So business plans for 2015, I'd imagine, for your territories?

Business plans for 2015 for Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and my counterparts from around the world will be doing similar things. Wow, that sounds exciting. Any chance we can get involved in those meetings, just to be a fly on the wall? Do you want me to just send you the PowerPoint? That would be fantastic. It's Ariel Hawani. All right, well, I have a lot of questions pertaining to those markets. Let's talk about Australia first.

As you know, a big victory for the labor. Party in the state of Victoria. The ban appears to be on its way to being lifted, right? The cage ban, you've been fighting this fight for a very long time, front and center. You've been trying to get this done. It appears as though it is going to happen, right? That they will allow cage fighting to happen in state of Victoria, of course, in particular Melbourne. Is that correct? You know what, Ariel, we feel it's imminent. The Labor Party, as you know, campaigned on one of their platforms was to lift the ban

of the fenced enclosure. ostensibly the Octagon, for all the reasons that you know quite well. And the good news for us is that the shadow minister, John Aaron, who is the shadow minister for not only sport but major events and volunteerism, he's been, the new government has been sworn in. He's been appointed as the new sport minister, the minister for sport and major events. And the other good thing about this whole situation is that it's not a legislative requirement.

So they don't have to go to the legislature to change the law. All that is required is a letter needs to be written from the sport minister to the Combative Sport Commission for Victoria, advising them that the position has changed and that the Ottegon ban, fencing and closure ban should be lifted. So we feel that's imminent. I have, I mean, there's lots of things on the government's agenda, as you can imagine. It's a brand-new government. There's lots of things to do. but we're feeling very confident that the many, many years of hard work by a lot of individuals,

not only myself, but certainly, you know, people like Mike Mersh, who's, you know, runs our regulatory work, Mark Ratner, Marshall's Lasnik, all these guys have spent a lot of time working on doing what's right. And that's the kind of, I think it's the kind of leadership that we try to provide for our sport because, you know, if we didn't push this agenda, I can tell you nobody else would have. And it's the right thing because it's all about health and safety and making sure that the environment's fair for our athletes. And that's what it's all about. And just for the record, when this letter is written, does there need to be some sort of process where someone approves it?

Kind of like what we see here in New York, or is it just the formality of the letter being written and then it's all systems to go? I believe it's the latter area, but, you know, I'm not a, I'm not a constitutional. Well, you certainly know a thing or two about getting these things done. You did a great job in Ontario. Now we see what happened in Melbourne. And then once this news came out, I mean, just minutes later, I remember waking up. It was last week. And I had all these fans in Australia running to me on Twitter. This means that the UFC is going to Melbourne. There's going to be a 55,000 seat event, and it's going to be a huge pay-per-view. And I was like, what are you guys talking about? I didn't really heard much of this. So clearly they're on the inside over there. Is that the case? Is there going to be event next November? I believe the date that it's even been talked about, a specific date, November 15th, at the Eddie Had Stadium in Melbourne, a big pay-per-view, big stars. Is this actually going to happen if that letter and all that transpires? Well, Ariel, if anybody knows this as well as you do, I mean, it's, you know how it works. You know, I'll be making that recommendation, but in the end, you know, our schedule is

in Lorenzo and the rest of the team we all agree upon. clearly our intention has been to when we have a chance to lift this octagon ban that we wanted to bring a large event and we do have Eddie had stadium held in November and you know you've got one chance to make that first impression as you well know we did that

certainly in Ontario we held event in Toronto and so I mean that is the kind of thing that's on the books it's planned for but you know until until you see the Dana-Lorenzo confirm it, then that's how we manage things. And so, you know, I'll be having those conversations this week while I'm here in Las Vegas. And I think it's a lot of really good, compelling reasons

to look at it and have this opportunity to really make an entry into Victoria. It's the second largest state in Australia after New South Wales. Melbourne is the second city, largest city after Sydney. You know, Melbourne is a self-proclaimed ultimate sports city. These, their fans, you know, people who live in Victoria are just rabid sports fans. And we're very confident that people have been waiting for this for a long time. There's a lot of pent-up demand.

You know, we see this when we take an event to Brisbane and to the Gold Coast and the city. A lot of fans come to those events from Victoria, from Melbourne. And we know this has been a big issue that's been talked about a lot. So we're very confident that we can do a big event. But, you know, in the end, we may decide, okay, we're going to go on another date. We may go to another part. There's tons of really good venues in Melbourne. But right now, that's been the thinking.

And that's where we're going to have those discussions later on this week and hopefully be able to make a formal announcement sometime in 2015. Can you tell us why you're even thinking 55,000 plus? You've been to Australia, you've been to New Zealand, you've been to that corner of the world, and those were all pretty well-attended events. What makes you think that you can get that kind of crowd? Because you were there in Toronto, you were a big part of that. That's the biggest ever.

55,000 and change, it was 724, I believe it was, officially. That's the biggest event in North American UFC history. That's the biggest event for the UFC. So why do you think that Melbourne, of all places, can rival that? Well, I don't know if you've ever been down there. I have not. But it's a city that actually is very similar to Toronto.

The whole Australian culture, their sport culture, their love of big events is very similar to here. And you have to remember that when went to Toronto, it's not like Toronto was the first ever time we'd ever come to Canada. I think Toronto was the fifth or sixth time we'd been. And we saw that when we held those previous events in my first. Montreal, that a lot of the fans that went to Montreal actually, you know, bought tickets that had Ontario 416 area codes. And so, so we anticipate a similar situation. And you know what, you know, we plan to go to, we plan to go to, hang on a second. Sure. We plan to go to, to Eddie had, but, you know, and we may not, somebody may scale it for 30,000, we may scale

it for 40,000. We haven't made those decisions. You know, you might, you might. recall when we went to Toronto, we originally scaled that event to be $40,000. And after day one, I think we had sold all $40,000 of those tickets, and that's when we opened up the upper deck and started to add more seats. So we're not going there with this anticipation or this expectation or even this objective to set the all-time record. We're going there to make sure that it's an incredible first-time experience for our Australian and New Zealand and frankly fans from around the world to see. what is like to witness a UFC live event and not have to tell you what that experience is like.

And so we'll focus on the experience. And if we end up selling a bunch of tickets and selling out Eddie had like we did the Rogers Center, most terrific. But ultimately that's not the goal. The goal is to make sure it's an incredible experience. And it's something that, you know, when you live up to that mantra, you've got one chance to make a first impression. And we want to make sure it's a meaningful one. Two more quick questions on this topic. If it does actually happen the way you wanted to happen, would that be a primetime pay-per-view here in North America? Yes, it would be. Okay.

And are you confident— If you think about it, Ariel, the first two—we had two numbered events that went into Sydney. Yep. I forget the exact numbers. 110 and 127? 110 and 127. You're better than I. And those would have been Sunday mornings in—

in Sydney. And, you know, the Aussies are familiar and used to those kinds of things. And, you know, I think they'll probably just go to church and then come to the church. That's a pretty good Sunday. And then the other thing is, you know, you went to Toronto with GSP. There's rumors of Conne McGregor in Ireland. In other words, are you confident that you can go to a place like this without an Australian headlining? Yeah, I really do. I believe so. You know, I think that our Australian and our New Zealand fans are very knowledgeable. They're engaged. They know our sports.

And I mean, I think that clearly, if you're going to go to a city like Melbourne and take a large pay-per-view in a stadium, you're going to have to have one or maybe even two championships. I mean, you recall in Toronto, we had two. Not only George fighting, but I think Josealdo fought Mark Harmonic.

So, I mean, I think we'll probably have something similar to that. But again, you know, this is all subject to the team here in Las Vegas sitting down and making sure that the plan works and making sure that we can put on a compelling card. One of the challenges that we have, and you know that as well as anybody, Ariel, we haven't figured out a card yet for our international fight week because we don't know that far out. And so we're talking November, that's 13 months from now.

But I think that it's recognizing that there is this important opportunity to, you know, to really ignite the market and build momentum across the entire South Pacific, and that's what we hope you'd be able to do. And by the way, for the record, it's actually 11 months from now, so I'm expecting an announcement tomorrow, okay? Oh, it's 11 months tomorrow. Okay, you're right. Let's move along to a topic that is near and dear to my heart,

the Canadian TV topic, right? All reports, and we want to talk to you because you are the source behind it. All reports seem to indicate that the contract was supposed. Sports Night is coming to an end this year. I get a lot of questions about this, and fans in Canada are concerned about where they will be able to watch the UFC come next year on Canadian TV. What's the state of the Canadian TV deal? Well, I can guarantee you, Ariel, and all our fans, and our fans,

that they will be able to watch it. I can't tell you exactly where at this stage, but chances are if you invite me on your show either next week or the week after, I can tell you. Really? It's that close. it is that close yeah and are you happy with the way things have transpired absolutely I mean it's it's I am

but you know I think it's it's better that when when the final agreement is in place and we know exactly what we can talk about then we can have a really meaningful discussion about where we are with Canadian broadcasting can I ask you just one follow up on that did it did it take longer than you expected

yeah I guess the quick answer is, yeah, it did. But, you know, it's all, I think it's all going to be terrific when we, when we finalize all these details. And, you know, these kinds of things do take time, because you want to make sure you're doing right for, for not only ourselves, but obviously for our broadcast partners and for our fans and making sure that our content is as readily available to as many people as possible. So, you know, they're not easy discussions, they're not easy negotiations, but they're important, and that's why they take time.

And just one more for good luck. Will it be a new home for the UFC on Canadian TV? Can you tell us that? I'd have to kill you if I told you that. No one's listening anyway. Don't worry about it. Like I said, Ariel, have me on in a couple of weeks, and we can have a really good conversation about it.

Okay, let's talk about Canadian events for next year. As you know, some of the fans are not very happy because Toronto and Montreal were taken away after it was announced at the beginning of last year. Can you tell us definitively, How many Canadian events are scheduled for 2015 as of right now? I can't tell you definitively. I can tell you it's going to be anywhere from three to as many as five. And once again, those are the kinds of things that we're discussing this week.

Because as you know what, you know how it works, I'm looking for three to five events here, and I'm looking for a number of events in Australia. Then my Brazilian counterpart is looking for this number of events. and the same for Amaya, and then we've got broadcast commitments that we have to take care of around the world. And so the quick answer is that it would be somewhere between three and five, and I hope to be in a position.

And you recall last year in January, in Quebec City, I announced the entire rough schedule, which I'm hopeful to be able to do again. I'm a really, really strong believer in announcing what our plans are and allowing our fans and our business partners and our broadcast partners and everybody to properly plan. And I hope to be able to do that again next year. But sometimes things happen and certain events end up having to be moved and, you know,

the reasons behind those things. So I can think the best I can tell you is that I expect to know definitively in early January what the entire schedule is going to be. What have you heard from the people in those markets about if any damage was done by taking away those events? Are they down on the product? Are they upset with the UFC? Has there been any brushback because Toronto and Montreal were canceled? I think to be fair, I think there has been because you understand how it works.

And our live event experiences is a real key driver to the business. It's a real key driver to our fans and ensuring that. consistent engagement and all those kinds of things. And we've talked about wanting to go back to Calgary. And so, you know, we're looking forward to hopefully doing that in 2015. You know, we want to go back to Toronto, Montreal, for the obvious reasons. And I tell you that, you know, our fans are, you know, we're disappointed. But, you know, it's funny.

You know, this event on Saturday was supposed to be in Montreal. That was originally planned for the bell setter. and interestingly enough, I was flying down here on Thursday and on an air Canada flight, and I'd say that at least half of them, we're coming down to here. So our hardcore fans find a way to make it work, but in the end, I think it's important to have a consistent live event schedule in your region, and those are the kinds of things that I'll fight for. After the event, and we'll let you go in just a couple of minutes, I appreciate the time very much,

Tom. after the event in Halifax, which was a great event, it was attended. You know, it was a tremendous attendance. It seemed like everyone in Halifax was very excited and Atlantic Canada as well. Dana White announced that Rory McDonald will be getting a title shot in Canada. But after the close nature of the fight on Saturday between Robbie Lawler and Johnny Hendricks, he didn't want to put in stone anymore. And we know that things can change.

How confident are you that that title fight will take place in Canada? Because, you know, personally speaking, I think that would be very important for the market. it. Yeah, listen, I'd love to see it happen, but, you know, I watched that fight. I was in in Madelaide Bay on Saturday night as well as you, and, you know, it's interesting, I've actually scored it for Johnny. But in the end, you know, it happens, and we always say this, don't leave in the hands of the judges. So it was a close fight. You know, Laller really came on strongly, as you know. So, you know, the quick answer to your question, is in the end, I'm not the matchmaker, and I think at some juncture, we'll have to decide

whether or not there's a rematch or a trilogy and, you know, when Rory will get his opportunity. But I guess the other side of it to directly answer your question, I mean, I think that when the time comes for Rory to have a shot at that title, if he has to wait for a rematch or the trilogy fight to happen, and so be it. But, you know, when the time comes for that title shot, you know, I'd love to see it in Canada and, you know, the places where it might be, it could be in Calgary, it could be in Toronto, it could be in Montreal. How confident are you that GSP returns next year? Well, I don't have any insight information, but I'm pretty confident that he will. I'm really hopefully he does for a bunch of reasons, not for himself, first and foremost, because I think

he wants to be able to perhaps, you know, finish some or get, you know, accomplish some unfinished business. I think that, you know, when you're an elite, a world class championship athlete like he is, it's tough to walk away from the sport. So he's a competitor and he loves our sport and he loves to compete.

So, you know, I think that first and foremost for him, I think it would be great for him to come back. Obviously, I think a bunch of our fans would love it. I'd love to see it because I'm a big GSP fan. But in the end, it's going to be his call. But I'm really hopeful that it happens. Final question for you, Tom. And again, appreciate the time.

You joined the company in 2010. It's amazing how time flies, right? I mean, we're approaching it. It's coming up to five years there. Unbelievable. It really is unbelievable. What's it been like? What has this experience been like for you?

Has it been what you thought? I mean, it was no secret. You weren't an MMA guy when you came in. We know by your great background in sports, in particular commissioner of the CFL. has it been what you expected? Has it been tougher to break down some of those barriers? What's this four and a half of your journey been like for you?

Well, you know what? It's been terrific. I've really enjoyed it. You know, when you have a chance in life to not only learn new businesses as I've had, but to learn a new sport, but for me to learn new markets, having given Australian New Zealand now under my responsibility, It's been a great time.

It's been a great learning experience. I think I've tremendously enjoyed it. I would tell you that when I came in, I probably didn't know enough to appreciate the level of education and change that was going to be required. I mean, I've done my homework, but you can only do so much homework when you come in. But the encouragement, but the encouraging you.

The other thing is, and I think of what happens, what's happened in Canada, and what's happened in Australia and now in New Zealand, and how a lot of these, you know, the barriers to our sport have been broken down. And, you know, when we open up the Toronto office, and our sport had only been really in one province. And now we've been in six. And with a little bit of luck, you know, we've got our sport now in Saskatchewan, so that'll be the seventh province.

And so, you know, I was surprised with the level of, of education and change that was required. But even that is, I tell you, is improving, you know, markedly. It, you know, now it's less about trying to explain what our sport is about and, you know, dispelling the myths and sort of informing the perspectives of a lot of people. And it's, you can talk about how we can grow the business and grow the sport and take it into new places as opposed to, I mean, to justify the sport. And, you know, I've always had confidence that if you argue with fact and if you argue objectively and you try to take emotion out of things, that eventually it is a matter of when, not if.

And I think we've proven that to be the case. Like, look in Australia, Ariel, we're over the goal line in Victoria, but we still have Western Australia with Purpose and they still have the Octagon ban in place. So we still have a lot of work to do, but I've got a lot of energy, and I'm looking forward to continuing to contribute to a great sport and a great brand and a great league. Well, keep up the great work. Good luck with those meetings in Vegas. And when you want to break that news about the TV deal,

come to your old Canadian friend, Ariel Hawani. We'd love to break it here. Looking forward to that announcement very much, and appreciate the time, Tom. Thank you. My pleasure, Ariel. You take care. Bye-bye. All right, there he is.

Tom Wright. Stopping by a lot of good information about Australia. New Zealand and Canada. Let's move along now. Let's talk about the former UFC heavyweight champion who's about to join us. He is fighting Bigfoot Silva in February. That was announced a couple of weeks ago. We've got a lot to talk to him about, so let's get right to it. I'm talking about Frank Mear, who joins us right now. Frank, how are you? Thank you for joining us. So, you know, when I booked you on the show, we didn't know about this CM Punk news, but since you were the guy to introduce Brock Lester to the UFC, since you had that rivalry with him and there is that connection

between them, what do you think about this? It's a lot different than Brock, but I'm curious what you think about it. I'm all for a Ziam Punk, become a part of the organization. I think that his background and training in martial arts, he should be capable of handling himself and doing well. And bottom line is people are going to tune in to watch, and that's pretty much the bar of getting to the UFC, if you can sell tickets to this, you know,

an entertainment sport to make money. So people are definitely going to tune in. I feel, you know, it is risky for him going, oh, and no, just jumping into the fight just because the UFC trying to pull out. an opponent that as you go see level, that also can help the guy out with his first fight, give him a little bit of a leeway from a learning experience, where it's not going to be the easiest thing, whereas he didn't get any experience at all.

Even Brock had at least one MMA fight prior to the WOC in the UFC. And by the way, speaking of Brock, have you heard about these rumors that he's considering coming back, and does this excite you? They've been going on for a while now. It's one of those things now that, you know, if I hear it, it's kind of shrug it through it. Okay, I'll believe when I see it. Do you think he comes back in your heart of hearts? I really don't know.

Is that something that you tell Dana from now you'd like to be the guy who welcomes him back? Oh, obviously. I would enjoy it. But, I mean, I really don't gun for certain individuals, really. I'm just looking for to fight and do well and perform all on my part. So as far as if it's Brock, I would be excited to fight anybody. Okay, so let's talk about you. As I mentioned, they announced that you're coming back in February. you haven't fought since this past February.

Why did you have such a long layoff? I take time off to you, have a proper off season, reevaluate attorney programs and look at things and just try to revamp. And what did you do in the time? Like when you say revamp, did you do anything different? Did you change anything in your life? I mean, that's a long time to be out of action. Yeah, no, lots of things.

Not enough time to go through the whole list here, but basically just got a proper off season instead of always just resting. Sometimes you take time off to rest, then you have to take time to peek for a fight. I now just time off to rest and recover, and then slowly build back into and having a base level of fitness. So that way when the camp starts,

I'm not just jumping into it. As you know, after you're fighting against Overe, there was some talk. Will Frank Mear fight again? Did you consider retiring? I did. If I wasn't able to have a proper off-season and see what I could get my body's level of fitness up to, then I would have considered it

just because at that point I don't want to go in there and have a bad performance and it keeps getting worse and worse it wastes people's money and then at the same time it was a waste time from my family and if you can't perform at a high level

or at least an optimal level then it's time you have to call it. What was the thought process like to come back? Was it just something you and your wife discussed? Did you have to talk to coaches? How did you actually come to the conclusion that yes, you are going to continue fighting? Basically you take as much output

from everybody around you, but I don't know if the decision you have to make on the inside. And so I told everybody that I wasn't going to make any decisions and just train without any going left or right, just train and be in shape, and then see how I felt. And then when the time felt right, look around the people around me, and say what they can look at the merits of my work and think of, you know, what do you guys feel? And so the consensus was to go ahead and, you know, keep it going. Do you have a theory as to why the last four fights haven't gone your way? Well, I haven't fought the easiest opponent.

That's true. That's true. That is very true. You fought the best of the best. There's no doubt about it. But other than that, I mean, you just think it's, you know, those weren't your knights. Were you doing something that you shouldn't be doing in preparation? Do you have any kind of theory?

Yeah, there's a few things. I've gone back and tried to adjust and train. But I think the strongest factor is that fight for, you know, Duna dos Santos and and Cormier and fighting fight after fight against top-level guys, you can show up at your best and still not come out on top. What do you make of the Bigfoot fight? Do you like that fight for you? No, I think it's a very good fight.

I think that Bigfoot is a solid black belt in jih Tzu. I think that he has great overall skill set. He's very good at all the basics in every area. There's not really an area of his game where you point at and you sit there and go, okay, well, you know, so he's very well-rounded. I think it's a very an accomplished victory. If you beat him, you mean? Right.

Where will you be training for this fight? Right now, I'm still in Vegas. I haven't really made that final decision. I'm still not going to make that until I'm nine weeks out. Are you leaning towards Jackson? Is that on the table, or would you rather stay closer to home? It just kind of depends on, as far as, you know, Jackson sometimes, especially in the heavyweight division, you have to kind of coincide with other people's fights on who's going to be there for sparring,

partners and so that's kind of the stronger trial you know one of the biggest fighting factors so I just kind of way out who's going to be moving around with we saw you know and embedded this past week you were you were helping Travis Brown get ready for his fight is there any chance you go to California and Glendale in particular to train with his new team for the advantage of training with Travis yeah very much so I mean this far with them but as far as coaching wise not particular I think it's approach is great I'm not going to get but his coach is also Ricky Lundell

who drives up for him, so I already have him here. So I probably be more keen to see if I can get Travis from out there and help. That's true. And has this time off started to get you? I know you're still fighting and you're still very much motivated, but have you set yourself up for life after fighting? At some point that's going to come. Do you have any idea what you'll do when you're done fighting?

Well, hopefully I entered in the broadcasting range and get back into commentary. You'd like to do more of that? Oh, absolutely. I very much enjoy during color for these fights. I feel that I'm decent at it and enjoy very much. Why haven't we seen you do more of it? Is it just because you're focusing on the fighting now, or is there another reason?

No, no. I don't get asked to. I'm going to talk to Fox about that. Yeah. Okay, so, and final question, how do you see this fight against Bigfoot playing out? How do you actually envision it going down? I think Bigfoot has a great solid skill set everywhere. But, no, I always feel very strong about my submissions.

I feel that the way I'm able to move when I'm in shape and do things well as far as on the ground, I think it's part for a lot of people to even train to defend them, because if you train with someone who moves to similar to how I move, typically it's the guy closer to 200 pounds, but they still don't have the same torquing power that I have. So if you train with somebody who has strength or wrench something the way I can, they don't move the way I do either, so they have a little more size on it.

So I think I'm kind of fit in one of those, you know, spots where I think it's hard to prepare for the missions on the ground against me. Is this fight? Go ahead. Sorry. Oh, no, I was just saying. And I also think that, you know, Bigfoot is, you know, and rightfully, so I think he's very confident with his ability to be on the ground, which usually is one of my best weapons. When people are wary of fighting on the ground, I have a more difficult time. So the fact that Bigfoot feels that he has a shield set could work there, I think that plays will under my schedule.

Is this fight do or die for you? I think they all are. So, yeah, we think that, you know, I have to come out with a very convincing performance. All right, looking forward to it. Thank you very much for the time, Frank, and best of luck to you. All right, thank you. There he is. Frank Mir, the former UFC heavyweight champion.

He meets Antonio Bigfoot Silva on February the 28th, 2015 next year, Staples Center, Los Angeles, to UFC 184, turning out to be a really fun card. Swyman versus Vitor Belfort with the UFC middleweight title, Ronda Rousey versus Katsingano, the UFC women's bantamweight title, the aforementioned Frank Mier versus Bigfoot Silver fight, and also announced recently Jaceret Souza, aka Jacerre Soza versus Yoel Romero. It was weird with Jaceray. It was like later on his, in his career, we figured out that we were all pronouncing

his name wrong. Reminds me of Jose Aldo versus Joseo, Hafeldosanos versus Hafelde dosainos versus Hafelde Sanjos. Sometimes these things happen, in particular with the Brazilians. But hey, look, it can happen to anyone. Yes, Eric, we are. Is that okay? Okay. All right, there's Frank Mear. We're going to take a quick break here. In a minute, we are going to reconfigure this little studio. And by the way, big news, and I think the person that will be most excited about this news, is John Fitch, because we got a new chair for our guests. How about that? They took away some of my time, but they got me a new chair. Not for me, but for my guess, which I think will be met with a lot of enthusiasm. He never experienced the old crappy chair, but he knows that now we have a top-notch chair waiting for him, and I think

that's great news. So no one will be uncomfortable anymore. I'm very excited about that. We're going to be joined by John Fitch in studio. As I mentioned on Saturday, he meets Hussimar Paul Harris for the WSOF welterweight title. It's WSOF 16. It's taking place in second. Sacramento, California, a very busy night for MMA fans. You've got UFC on Fox, you've got WSOF on Friday, you've got the tough finale. So there's a lot going on. I'm really looking forward to having John in studio, one of the great veterans of the sports. Still, one of the very best at 170 pounds. Don't get it twisted, even though he's not in the UFC these days. Still very much a player at 170, in my opinion. He has a big fight coming up, and he's going to be joining us in a second right here in this very spot.

For now, as we reconfigure things, if you haven't seen him, it. I talked about it earlier, but it's, it's very apropos on this Monday afternoon. Here is my exclusive interview with CM Punk. It took place after his press conference, after everything was said and done. We talked to him about why he left, why he signed, what he's expected to do, what he is thinking after all of this. It was, it was pretty much, it was pretty much, what? I didn't, what? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. That's not what I get. Come on the mic. Can you come on the mic? Yep.

What do you mean I didn't give you that? Okay, I got that. Say again? I had to put on the cans. So look what I did. Look what I did. I'm an idiot. So I gave you a bunch of clips.

I gave you a clip for before and after, right? I copy-paced the same clip twice. See that? Yeah, because it's a long clip. No, it was my mistake. It was my mistake. I meant to give you the CM Punk clip. Okay, if you didn't see the CM punk clip,

it's on an MMAFinding.com. Instead, here's Road to the Octon. On UFC on Fox, we mentioned it, JDS, Miyocic, and a whole bunch of others. We'll be back in a minute right here on the MMA hour. Fighting is life. Are you a person who gives up or are you a person who's going to fight? I really believe I can knock out anyone in the world. I'm a knockout guy.

These guys can tell what they want. I'm the real deal as far as number one contenders. I put in a lot more work and everybody in the top 10 and in the UFC. I am the number of contender right now. I'm gonna hit him hard, and gonna share his mouth. People question if you still have it. This fight is one step to getting back to where I was at. The opportunity to show that I'm still one of the best heavyweights in the world.

My thing is I want to win. I want to knock him on in the first 30 seconds. I'm trying to get to the tell shot. I'm gonna get the W no matter what. I'm better than him. I'm better than anyone. than anyone in my division. I'm going to beat him and get my title shot again.

On December 13th, the octagon will rise in Phoenix, Arizona, for a blockbuster UFC fight night on Fox. In a spectacular five-round main event with major title implications, Junior Dos Santos, one of the greatest UFC heavyweights at all time, looks to once again wield his staggering one-punch knockout power against Stipe Miochich, a surging contender with devastating skill. Good combination by Stipe O. Who was harnessed Division I caliber wrestling and potent finishing instincts

to seize victory in 12 of his 13 professional fights. The co-main event features the much-anticipated return of standout boxer and world-class submission artist Nate Diaz. Nate Diaz, so confident. To take on top Brazilian contender, Rafael Dos Anjos, winner of seven of his last eight, including back-to-back, impressive knockouts. And in a third exceptional matchup,

massive 6'4-Allister Overing. Oh, big shot. Whose menacing power made him into one of the most legendary heavyweights of his generation. One of the most dangerous men on the planet. Squares off with nearly seven-foot-tall, Stefan the skyscraper, a strew, who has leveraged his immense height for some of the most impressive finishes in UFC history.

For each man, the road to glory inside the UFC octagon begins with the grueling, lonely work of training camp. In the rural woods of the Buckeye State trains one of the UFC's most thrilling rising contenders, Croatian-American Stipe Miyochich. I'm trying to get through Tel-Shach. That's what I signed up for. I'll fight whoever you know.

I say J. Diaz, it's so okay. With a 13-1 record, Miocchish will arrive in Arizona carrying three straight victories. Dipe is going off here. Daving his way with dominant showings against rival contenders. Who I got rocked! Including the latest show-stopping 35-second TKO in Sao Paulo, Brazil, against hometown hero Fabio Maldonado.

Now, Miochich turns his attention to the biggest challenge to date. And former UFC heavyweight champion, Junior Dos Santos, and the opportunity to step even closer to a title shot. I think, you know, I've gotten nothing more matured in the last year or two. Any fight, it doesn't matter, like I said, every fight's the biggest fight you have. You know, because you don't want to lose, you know, so you got to go out there. You got to do what you do to win. I feel like I'm coming in my stride, and I'm just ready.

It's my time. I tell you, it all right in time. It's always my time. Let's it. Get a nice combination on that break. and then leave at an angle and leave low. That's it. Get a little damage done.

Chop. Chop with the free hand, knees, everything. Nice, nice. Work to it. Punch on that brake, baby. Punch on that break. Halfway done. 2.30.

Steepa's evolved, not in one particular way. I think he's grown in all fastest of the game. Deep enough for you, long enough for you. No return from him. People see a lot of steep staying up and striking because that's where everything starts. We're two feet on the ground, you know, walking out to the middle and fighting. But his whole game's awesome.

Get a combination off. Get a combination off. Good. So I think he's always had the physical skills. Now he really believes in himself and he's really ready. 15 seconds. Finish strong. Finish like you need it. Let's go. Behind your hands.

Come on. Just like a knockout in the bag. Keep working. Keep working. Keep your hands free. Oh, keep going. Time! Good work. I think what makes a good fighter is someone that I'm inside and outside of the kid.

You know, someone that works hard and, you know, takes their talent, even though they're good at something, and makes it even better and works hard at it. That's why I love the city of Cleveland, you know? We're all blue-collar, man. Everyone works hard. We take proud of what we do. It does get cold and stuff, and it does suck,

but I have automatic start on my car, so it's okay. Full-time mixed martial artist, part-time firemen. From Yoachich, there will always be room for both. Of course, fights first, you know. I mean, that's what I do. That's what pays my bills, you know. But six, seven years. years now and I love every day. Every day I go to work there. Like, dude, we were messing people

out. At first day, they said the same thing I said. They both are intense situations. They both are intense. Both, yes, I thought I'd be calm and cool and collective with the whole situation. Saving people, helping people is just something I always wanted to do. When I become champion, you know, I'll never stop being a firefighter. The early morning hours in one of the world's most famous cities signals a new day for one of the world's most feared fighters. I grew up in Casador, Santa Catarina, is a small city. When I decided to move up from Salvador to another city, it was because I couldn't see a good future for me there.

This whole time I'm here in Rio was training. I had amazing things happening to me, amazing opportunities, and then I had my chance to fight in the UFC. And after seven years, I become champion of the world. become champion of there. All right, back on the mixed martial arts hour. If you want to see more of that, we have it up on M-AFunding.com. When we take our break, after this in-studio interview,

we'll watch a little more about it. The UFC always does a great job with those Road to the Octagon specials, so I thought it was noteworthy to watch. I screwed that up with the copy-pacian punk interview. You can check that out right now on the site as well. But very excited, really excited to have this guest in studio right now. He's one of the very best in the sport today. He's one of the very best at 170 pounds, as I mentioned.

Don't get it twisted. Just because you don't see this man in the Octagon anymore, at least for now, he's still, in my opinion, one of the very best at 170 pounds. He's the man who will be facing Husseymar, Paul Harris. This Saturday, it's on NBCSN, World Series of Fighting 16. They'll be fighting for the World Series of Fighting Welterweight title. He is the one and only John Fitch. John, how are you?

I'm good. I'm great. Great to have you here. Yeah. I don't usually see you on the East Coast. Well, I mean, I lived in Syracuse for about five, six months. But yeah, I don't get out here that often. But, you know, got to do the PR stuff.

Got to big fight this weekend. I'm fighting for a championship belt. Got to act like a champion, unlike some people. Yes. And do you mind just talking into the mic? Yeah, sorry. Yeah, there you go. Is it comfortable for you?

Yeah, this is fine. It's a little weird having, you know, phallus-shaped object in my face. Oh, come on. We got a new chair. How's the new chair? Oh, it's comfortable, yeah. It's good, right? Because you used to have a horribly uncomfortable chair.

Yeah, it's good. my back. Yes, great. You took a little shot at Hussimar there. He was supposed to come as well and said no, no way. Does that annoy you? No, it just lets me know where he is mentally. He's worried about something. He would have been thrown off by this, so he's mentally weak, and I plan on exploiting that. Worth noting as well, you currently live in Las Vegas. Yes. This fight is taking place in Sacramento. Yep. New York is not near those places. No, nowhere. Very quick flight. He's coming from Brazil, you have to go through New York to get to the West Coast. Yeah.

I think that's worth knowing. Yeah, you know, I'm, you know, acting like professional. It's my job, so I do my job. You know, when they sign Husseymar two World Series of fighting, and you were already there, you were one of the guys who you weren't that keen on fighting him because of his past. Was it a tough sell to get this fight to happen? No, because he had the belt, but I think, you know, they maneuvered it to make sure that that would happen, I think, a little bit.

But yeah, I mean, if there wasn't a belt involved, I wouldn't do it. Why take a risk if he's known for, you know, kind of cheating? I don't know how else to put it, but like in a way that hurts people and could possibly end careers or at least make it walk with a limp for a while. I think that's just crazy. I don't know. It's really unprofessional. You know, if somebody wants to turn into a street fight, we can have a street fight if you really want to.

But we're professionals. It's behave as professionals. So do you have reservations going into the same? fight other than the typical I'm getting into a fight stuff. No, I mean, I have no fears, but you know, there's no reason to take unneeded risks, but he's got a belt, he's got something I want, so I'm going to go take it. So let's talk about where you're at right now. You live in Las Vegas. It was announced recently that Daniel Cormier is the new captain of A.K., which signaled the fact that you're no longer the captain. You had been the captain for a very long time, what, like four or five

years? For a while, since the fight with GSP, I think right after that, you know, it was. it was decided that they would, you know, kind of make an official leadership role out of the position I kind of unofficially, you know, took. I wanted to, I wanted to make more than just a bunch of guys who trained together. Right. So I, you know, did my best to do more than just show up and train. So are you no longer a member of A.k.a. I'll always be, you know, I'll always bleed black and red for A.K.A. But, you know, you've got to grow in life, and I needed to do some different things and they were in a position where I didn't feel like they needed me there to support them. I'd been thinking about going to different places and trying new things for a while,

but that got put in the back seat when we had problems with Kosteck and Camarillo leaving. I felt like, you know, the guys still needed me. They really needed me around to have some kind of rock and stability around. And they don't need that. They got, they got Coriiani, they got cane, they got rock hold, all the other guys have stepped up and they're fine on their own. They don't need me there. So I felt like it was a good time to explore, explore. Has A.K. The A.K. that you were talking about with those old faces, has it changed? It's in a different location. Mendez is still there, but a lot of those names that you mentioned aren't there anymore. I mean, it's important to know to know that everything is always changing. Sure. Nothing's ever the same twice.

The old, I don't know, the Indian proverb, the guy who stets his foot in the river, you know, can't do it twice because the river changes and so the guy. So, I mean, everything's always changing but I'm like there's no negative reasons for the the law the move there's no anger like oh I got what I screwed over this wasn't there no it's just I felt I need to explore and see what else is out there and I feel like there's some things that I needed more specifically that I couldn't get necessarily at the time because financially it's really expensive to live in in California in the Bay Area okay and I couldn't afford to pay the people I needed to have around me full time

They have to have over the jobs. So then it's kind of like part-time with a lot of the stuff. So, you know, in Vegas, I can afford and people can give me the attention that I think I need in the areas that I need. How difficult was it to come to that decision that you were going to leave this place that had been home for so long? It was very difficult, but I had an amazing job offer in Syracuse. So it made it easier to leave. And then once I left, I saw, hey, I can do it. I can be away from basically of my family.

and be successful because I still fought away. I trained away and I fought when I fought. I only had two weeks at AKA for that fight. So, yeah, I gave me confidence to be like, yeah, I can do it. I'm okay leaving that comfort zone. So you were on this show talking about the move to Syracuse. You're not there anymore. You had a job there.

You were going to work at a gym. Why didn't it work out? You know, it's just, I think initially, the owner was very set on creating a fight team. But I think the reality of the money flow of things kind of got him to want me to focus more on teaching regular classes. And that just wasn't what I wanted to do. So we respectfully dissolve the contract

because we both wanted different things, I think. And, you know, I was still wanting to fight. I wasn't ready to just teach, you know, full-time. So it was time to go back and find something else. Now, were you alone in Syracuse or did you move your family? Yeah, my family came with me. And in Vegas, are you alone? No, I'm with my family.

So it has been tough moving them around now three different places? It's made my wife harder. She's a harder person. Harder in what sense? Harder. She was born in California. Okay. And no offense to Californians, but they're a little bit soft sometimes.

Okay. They're not boilermakers. Yeah, well, when we moved to like the first. first like a couple days we were in Syracuse we had to go to the grocery store and it's already snowing so we're driving to the supermarket and my wife's looking out the window like he's sure this is okay this is safe right and then and then I'm like yeah babe this is okay this is normal and then she's people walking like she's oh my god there's people on the street there are people walking on the sidewalk are they homeless what's I was like they're probably going to work

that doesn't happen in California no really well not not unless you're in the mountain areas okay okay so she's uh you know if it sprinkles a little bit people pull over and put their flashers on on the road sometimes in Cali. So she got a more hardened understanding and respect for what people go through for daily life and other places. You know, I think the building across from our apartment, they were building up to turn into rentals and it's snowing and there's guys on the roof doing their job and it's, you know, foot of snow and it's 20 degrees out and, you know, she's just looking at, she's pregnant, you know,

at the time and she's just looking out the window like I can't believe they're out there I can't believe they have the work in this I was like they got to make their money they got to do their job so it definitely I think made her tougher just experiencing that I'm guessing she likes Vegas better she loves Vegas surprisingly we both really love Vegas oh wow it's not what you expect it's a lot cheaper so you got a lot more money to do stuff

and then if you're off the strip like the strip is a different planet sure it really is like Times Square here yeah probably right and then I was only a third time here so I don't have a full now life. Yeah. Wow. You fought in New Jersey. Yeah, and then I got to come up and then visit for a week. That was a great week. But yeah, I haven't got to spend enough time here. Um, I also feel compelled to tell you, I don't know if you notice right there. There's the Syracuse orange. Oh, yeah, that's right. You know, when you were on my show the last time, I was kind of down on Syracuse. I won't go into all that now. I'm not in love with Syracuse. So I just want to let you know that in case you're worried. Oh, it's a miserable place. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no. I love it now. So I just wanted to point that out.

Yeah, I enjoyed it. Like, the people there were awesome. They're really good people there. And I worked with some great people. Darren Carroll was an amazing boxing coach. And Jim Andrello was a really great kickboxing instructor. We did a lot of footwork, a lot of drills. Like, my footwork is on another level right now compared to, yeah, I finished out my career

with what I should have started with, you know, the footwork and the basics. Do you feel in the back of your mind like, gosh, if I would have known or done this? Yeah, if I would have done it the right way, which is going to, to be very useful in my future coaching endeavors. Yeah. You want to be a coach? Most likely. My passion is teaching. I'm coaching right now. The deal I have with Nick Blumgram from One Kakes Nick is, you know, I've taken over the MMA head coaching position. Oh wow. So I was going to ask you, where's your home? That's your home? Yeah. Okay. So you're the head coach? Basically of the MMA, yeah. He's the head coach. I'm kind of like assistant coach, but I'm running the MMA. And you're okay with that balance because

you said you didn't, you still wanted to focus on your fighting. Your coaching. Just the fighters. Yeah, because basically I'm doing what I did at AKA, but I'm going to get paid for it. Gotcha. Okay. Yeah. Just being a captain. Yeah.

Who's under your stable? Right now, Chidi and Jiguani, Anthony and Jiguani. I didn't get to really work with him much before his last fight. Bonner is there. Stuff in Bonner is there. I only got to work with him a very little bit before his last fight. And then he's got a bunch of younger guys you might not have heard of. Okay.

But you feel like this... I'm still learning some of their names and their last names. Really? Jeff the bullet. I don't know Jeff's last name. The bullet is a cool name. You just call that. Mark Dickman, Tricy Dick.

That's what you call? I think a nickname him Tricky Mark, Tricy Dickerman. Yeah. And there's some guys that I've been working with. But, like, you know, it'll take at least six months before we really see whether or not I suck as a coach or they start beating people up real bad. Have you been in corners yet? Have you? Not yet.

Okay. Of course you have a big fight coming up. I just wanted to ask you one last. Phil Baroni also is there too. And that's one of the big reasons I came out. I feel convinced me about Nick and how much of a great coach and great person he is. Former AKA members. Well, when I said Cormier's name, you said rightfully so.

Why is he the right guy to take over? Man, he is hands down one of the best coaches I've ever been around in the period. Just his knowledge, his coaching ability, and just the way he can motivate people. Like, you want to do well for him. Wow. He's that good. He is. He really is.

Wow. Yeah. And, you know, like, you can see that. secondhand light. John Smith is probably a pretty damn good coach too. And you can see coming coming through him. Oklahoma State. Yeah. Try to be as objective as possible as a coach. Does he beat John Jones? I think he does. I think he beats John Jones because he's got a lot of tools that he can use and he can always result to that wrestling. I think he out-wrestles John Jones. Let's talk about where you're at just in your career because when you left the UFC,

when you were released from the UFC, what it's about to be two years since you've been gone. It was right. Keep track. I'll remember that kind of stuff. You know, there was a lot of outrage. A lot of people were upset. It was one of the first big sort of breaking news stories involving a top-rank guy,

you know, getting cut from the UFC. And then, you know, you spoke up about a lot of things. And I feel like you've kind of been, and correct me if I'm wrong, you've kind of been labeled or branded as this sort of disgruntled fighter now. because it comes up in a lot of interviews, and people ask you about this stuff. Are you happy with that? Do you want to be viewed that way?

I'm just speaking honestly. You ask me honest question. I'm going to give you an honest answer. I've always kind of been that way, and that's one of the reasons why I think I was treated the way I was for a long time. I wasn't a yes man. I wasn't, oh, I'm so grateful.

No, I think things could be done better. I think people should be treated better, not just in fighting in this organization, but workers throughout the country and the world, I think are disproportionately paid and treated. So do you look back on your time in the UFC? It was a very long run, a successful run. Do you look back with sort of like a sour taste in your mouth?

Was it all bad? No, it was all. I mean, I loved what I was doing, but things can be done, could have, and should have been done better. How do you feel right now about the way you're treated, the way World Series of fighting? Of course, they're in their infancy, so they make, you know, infancy mistakes, infant mistakes.

Like what? Like I didn't know I was coming to New York until Thursday. Okay. Were you pissed off? No, but it was just like, come on, I got kids, give me two weeks notice. Sure, sure, sure. But whatever. I mean, I'm professional.

You got to get the job done. You know, I'll be in Sacramento on Tuesday. That's when I wanted to be there anyways. Right. So whatever. Yeah, so they're doing the best they can. And what I really love is the effort. I can see the effort out of everybody.

Everybody, even if it's not their job necessarily, they're putting themselves in a position to get things done that need to get done to make the fights happen. You made a comment about Baharis getting that title shot and maybe them sort of going in that direction to try to make the fight between you two happen. Were you disappointed when that was his first fight, a title shot right off the bat? I was irritated because I've been waiting forever for another title shot. Sure. And I've been working hard and I believe that I'm the best in the weight class and I should have

had multiple title shots in my career. So to get shunned again, I was like, oh, am I going through this again? But, you know, I don't know if they thought that if I won the title first, I would have said no to fighting him, but it's one of those things, too. You got the belt. You have to take the fights that they give you. That's another part of the job. So, you know, I don't think they should have been in a fearful position.

I don't know if that's why they did that. It could have been that they didn't have the money to pay me for the fight at the time. That could have been possible, too, which is fine. Like, I'm open. I want these organizations to know. They talk to me. I'm a human being. Like, if you're honest with me, I'm going to be honest back.

I understand it. Even if I don't like it or I'm not happy with it, I will appreciate your honesty. You feel like people are afraid to be up front with you? I think, well, in the industry all around, I think, yeah, they're afraid to tell people. Because fighters are. We're pretty bad on us. Really? I never heard a fighter admit to that.

I think a lot of us are. I'm probably the least of that bracket, but we are. Have you changed? Were you more so in your early days as opposed to now? Have you become more of one? No, I'm still pretty straightforward with, you know, just be straight to war with me. I'm going to be straightforward with you. Do you still enjoy fighting?

Oh, I love it. I'll let you drink your coffee. I kept interrupting you with the hard-hitting questions. But you still feel the same way about it today as you did a couple years ago. I love doing it. I love fighting. I love training. I love being in it.

I don't watch fights anymore, though. You don't? Anymore. You used to. Used to. Why don't you? I don't like the way they're marketed and put out there. I don't like the matchups.

Is there too much of it? No, I just don't think it's sport-related. I think it's too much entertainment-based. I want to know who's the best. I don't care about popularity. I don't care this guy said this about this guy's mama or this guy did this. I just want to know whose techniques. And I think that's what it is.

I'm more excited about the techniques and abilities that people are using. And I think a lot of the way people are fighting today is just the same. It's over repetitious. It's all the same. Everybody's fighting the same way. I like the contrast. I like the video, not video, but the animal. M.A. type thing. I love this matchup with Plarez, actually, because it's like my grinding style

versus this guy who's this leglock master. It's one of the best ever at what he does. Him and Aoki, probably the best professionals that have competed at a high level and focused mostly on leg locks. So you say that you don't like that other stuff, the talking all that, but there still exists some of these intriguing mac. I mean, Jones DC, I think, would be one of those, right? Those fights still exist. So you don't pick and choose. You just kind of have barred yourself from watching? Well, some of it is just so fake. What do you mean?

They're not really genuinely, you know, hateful or emotional towards each other. It's just, you know, fabricated to try to sell something. And I feel like when somebody tries to sell me something, I know right away and I don't want to buy it. But like when you see like a Robbie Lawler, Johnny Hendrix, that's your weight class. There's no real bad blood there.

There was a great first fight. That doesn't interest you at all to watch. Not really Do you think it's because maybe you just have other things going on in your life? A lot of it is, yeah. A lot of it is It's kind of like I swallowed the blue pill I follow a lot of politics and a lot of stuff that's happening around the world

And you're seeing all these like protests and demonstrations that are going on It's like who cares about this So this fight that might not even be the two best guys Sure Do you feel like what happened to you and the UFC made you into this kind of person, have this stance? Did it kind of sour you to the point where you felt like, okay, at the time, you know, screw this stuff?

And then once you got out there and started to live a life without MMA, you were like, you know what? This is more interesting to me. This is what I want to focus on. Maybe a little bit. Maybe it felt like I was trying to swim upstream a lot when I was with the UFC. And then it was just tiring. And then once I was out, I was swimming with the stream.

And it was crazy, like night and day difference between just press relations from being in the UFC and being out of the UFC. I feel like a lot of the press corps has to tow a certain line and ask certain questions and do certain things in order to keep getting invited or keep getting their passes from the UFC because they own so much of the market. They own a whole market. So if you want to make money as a MMA journalist, you have to tow the line of the power. Do you feel like that people are doing that to you? Like they're doing something? I feel like I didn't even think about it until I was released.

But like after that, nothing was nothing. but positive press. Nothing but positive press towards me. And I was like, why was it such a huge shift? And then you start realizing, well, it's a different press score. It's the guys who aren't in the UFC. They have a different, they don't have to tow that line because they're not, you know, they don't have an overlord that looks down at them. Like, why did you ask those questions? Why did you support him in this thing? So do you feel like it was the same media or different media now covering you because now that you're out, they didn't have to pay attention to you anymore? Some of it's different. What about me? I mean, you're talking about media, so I'm included.

feel like I'm in that category? Possibly. You can be honest with me, you know, I won't be offended. I think maybe there are some things that maybe you couldn't. I always thought you did a pretty good job because you stayed a lot truer to journalism than a lot of others. But I feel like you, you probably have your hands tied in a lot of situations too. I think it would be very difficult for you to break a investigative journalist story

that was anti-UFC and then you continue to have a job. Right, right. Yeah, I mean, there are certain, there's always, I guess you could say conflicts and whatnot. I mean, I don't really consider myself an investigative journalist per se, but I try to be as unbiased as possible and cover the other organizations Hence the fact that you're here and I would have had Paul Harris here too who left the UFC on sort of unfavorable terms, right? He was ousted pretty quickly, but you know totally respect that It must be a little more enjoyable then since you're dealing with more positive press, right? Yeah, I mean, that was the thing.

I was, that was the biggest surprise after I was released from the UFC was the attitude. And even the fan base, like, all the, like the hateful, boring stuff kind of stopped. I was like, why did this stop all of a sudden? Like, it's weird that just because I left the organization, like, it's just like a nine-hapet. You feel like they were perpetuating that message? Kind of, yeah. I mean, it seems like it. After the fact, looking back, it seems like it.

You really are a conspiracy theory. I mean. You're feeling it, though. Yeah, you felt it. It wasn't before. I didn't think that before. It wasn't until afterwards that I felt like they were controlling some of that. Wow.

And it's no joke, especially with like the Edwards Stone leaks. There's no secret that governments pay online people to... Do you think that happens in M.A? I believe it does. I believe all corporations. Anybody who has multi-million dollar or a billion-dollar organization has a budget for people who are online who are trying to focus shifts in a public opinion. What's it like for you?

And that's a proven fact. Like these big companies do that. Sure. I don't know as a proven fact that the UFC or any of the other organizations do, but I feel like why wouldn't they? If they're a multi-million dollar or a billion-dollar company, why wouldn't they do the same thing that Google or Apple or the government does? Do you feel like your recognizable name?

Because you were fighting in sort of the height of the UFC on Spike TV and all that stuff, and you have a recognizable face. I mean, I think a lot of people would recognize you if they watched a few years ago and they don't watch now. Do you get a lot of people come up to you and say like, Hey, where are you fighting these days? Like, are you, is WSWF still on their radar as far as if they were fans of you? Yeah, that's one of the things, yeah, I did an interview this morning, and I made a statement that sounds good.

It's like people, people who get bored of brands, you know, they want heroes. So that's what you're seeing. You're seeing it with Bellator also. When these named fighters leave the organization, the fans go with them. And I think that's one of the reasons why a lot of people feel like UFC. is stale. They don't know any of the fighters. They've done a horrible job. And I've always said they've done a horrible job of building the next generation of guys because it's always been about the brand, just the brand.

We want to sell people, you know, come to the circus. You know, they don't care about, you know, the elephant's name. They just want to go to the circus. That doesn't work for fighting. They want heroes. They want a name. They want to go follow people and watch people. Did you hear about this CM Punk News? I did, I did hear it on my Twitter feed. I'm curious what you think of it. You can go back to interviews in the past that we've done probably together. Yeah.

And I predicted it. I predicted it. In what sense? That I talked about them, you know, we got to keep it true to a sport. If they just start, you know, if they paid, I think I said it, like, if they paid Brad Pitt to fight George Clooney, it would do more pay-per-view sales than any fight ever. But those guys are not a fighter. Right. It's not a part of the sport.

It's a spectacle. It's a side show. Right. But it would sell more tickets. So like I said that that's the direction we're going. and lo and behold, we have an actor, that's what he is, he's an actor, he doesn't have any amateur experience in anything, combat related especially. Now he's going to be on their main card.

Yeah. Would it have annoyed you, bothered you if World Series of Fighting signed him? Because I know they were interested. How would you have felt about it? Because that's your company. I mean, you know, yeah, but it is my company, but the UFC controls so much of the market. They dictate how everyone else behaves.

Right? So when you monopolize the market, like, everybody else is going to follow suit just to try to compete. That's a big word they use, the M word, right? You still feel like that's the case with what Viacom is doing, NBC now with you. You still feel like that? Yeah, it's still difficult for people to compete in the next year. I was saying this earlier today, too, that 2015 is going to do. be very telling about the future of MMA.

What do you mean? Because, well, I think the UFC has to pay off a huge loan, I think, sometime next year. So that's going to affect how they operate as a business. And then how World Series and Bellator do in this next year is going to be very telling about how things are going to be. Things could open up. If Bellator grows up and goes huge, it could change everything. Did you have a relationship?

I know Scott was very close, Scott Koker with the A.K. We're friends. We have a relationship. Scott Koker's a good person. I know he does good work for promotion. And he understands the idea of you got to have names. You got to have stars in order to sell self-fights. How do you feel about the Walter Wight Division and World Series of funding? Because I thought they did a really great job of building that. Like that was sort of their showcase. I think it still is good. You know, I'm going to be. Things have changed, right? No Birkman anymore, no Carl anymore. Well, I'm going to beat up Polaris on Saturday, and I still have Jake Shields to fight after that.

That's a huge fight, and then we'll see what they have to offer after that. I think they have plenty of time to grab plenty of names and make it just as thick and heavy of a weight class as possible. While we're talking about Jake Shields, I got some breaking news for you. You want it? What's that? January 17th, Planet Hollywood in Las Vegas, so you could be their friend's center, hopefully with the belt. Jake Shields is going to fight Brian Foster. for the number one contender spot.

The winner of that fight on NBCSN, World Series of Fighting 17, will then fight the winner of you versus Hussein Mal Power Hires. This is according to World Series of Fighting. They just told me moments ago. Oh, that's awesome to hear. You like that?

Yeah, I love it. Are you hoping Jake wins? Is that the fight you want? That would be the biggest fight, I think. I think the fans would want to see that the most. What did you think of his performance against Ryan Ford? I didn't see it.

I saw pictures. You weren't even interested in that. It affects you. I knew how it was going to go. I knew exactly what he does. I know exactly what he does. You didn't think he had any kind of, you know, worries. There's always the one-punch possibility, but I know Jake, he wasn't going to lose that

fight. But it didn't even cross your mind. Like, this is a fight that could very much... You could have asked me to predict it. Sure. It just wasn't of interest. Yeah, because I knew how it was going to go. I knew exactly what was going to happen.

What about, let's say you win the belt. You know, you're going to win the belt on Saturday night, and you know that this fight's coming up on January 17? I'll probably be there. You'll go to it. But is that almost like a chore to you to watch live? No, because that's, no, live MMA I really like. You enjoy that?

I enjoy. Even if it's these kind of fights that you're talking about. No, that's one of the cool things about Vegas is I can go watch, your kickboxing with Thai. Do you do that a lot? If I can, if there's a fight that pops up or whatever, yeah, I'll go. How long have you been there for? Since August.

Okay, so it hasn't been that long. Not that long. Not that long. I'm sure you're very busy with the kids. I got to watch that, gosh, it was a, I can't remember his name, but a Thai from Thailand came over. fought somebody. It was amazing. It was at the hard rock.

So you just go and show up the fights? Yeah. I'll be like Phil will call me and say, hey, this fight's going on and show up. I'm trying to get in with all the promoters and people and get some numbers so I can probably get my free tickets. And to get your fighter's fights, I'm assuming, right? Yeah, well, Nick handles most of that stuff.

I'm more on the technical side. You just want the free tickets. Yeah, free tickets and a beer, I'll be good. Were you disappointed they didn't get Ascran? Um, no, but I haven't my contract that I may be able to go over there. Oh, really? Yeah. What are the terms? Well, if it's not going to impede on a fight that they have planned for me,

and it's not a competitive local U.S. show, I could possibly go fight over there. So it's essentially like a North American exclusive? Yeah. And, I mean, I would imagine, correct me from wrong, if you're a champion, though, could things change? Like, they don't want to have their champion go over there. I'm, you know, I still have two fights in the contract. So like under this contract, if I'm not planning on it, they're not planning on having me fight again until July, why not go March and try to fight somewhere?

We haven't done it yet, but we did a grappling match with my vow. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, there's supposed to be some leeway in there. Wiggle room. Yeah. Has it been frustrating that you haven't been as active this year? I would have preferred to have been more active, but I'm so happy that I got a title shot. Sure.

This is supposed to happen in July, though. Yeah, but at least this is happening now. It doesn't do me any good to think backwards and be upset about it. But you'd like to fight preferably even at your age. With the belt, I would like to have the belt and twice a year is fine with the belt. Because, man, three-month training camp for the five rounds, it's trying. It's difficult. And to stay healthy at my age for three months is a lot of work.

Does there any kind of like champions clause or anything in your contract? Like, in other words, if you win the belt on Saturday, does your contract change? I just have to defend it. Just once? Yeah. So you have two fights left including this one? Yeah. So that would cover it.

Yeah. Do you want to stick around? We'll see. We'll talk. Well, we'll win the belt and we'll talk and we may... You'll have some leverage then. Yeah, we'll see. What is your heart telling you now?

So far, has it been a positive experience? It's been a positive experience. I can't really complain. Everything that I would complain about is all, you know, bumps in the road because of, you know, it's only 16 shows. Sure. They weren't planning on doing that many shows in the beginning, and then NBC. Sports Network. I think they wanted more shows. So they, you know, they're understaffed. They're on a tight budget. Like, I get it. I get it. But I'm positive about it because I see everybody

working so hard. Like I show up on site and everybody's, everybody's doing their job plus, plus more. That Ascrant thing is very interesting because I think a lot of people thought it was a foregone conclusion that he would go there didn't happen for a myriad of reasons. Is that a fight that interests you? Like, is this something that you were thinking, oh, this would get me excited. I mean, fights in general get me excited. Against anyone? I like staying active.

Anytime I get to test my abilities, yeah, I think at this point in my career. I fought so many people. I feel like I'm the best, so, like, you know, I'm not looking down on anybody, but I feel like they're all kind of the same fight. I just throw people at me, give me somebody. When you hear Robbie Lawler is the UFC champion, what do you think of that? I think George St. Pierre is the same. the UFC champion.

You still consider him. You think he beats Loller or... Until he's not so many beats him, he's a champ. Even if he never comes back. Life's got to go on, right? Well, you know, in five years, when some young guy we don't know who's coming out of college

or coming out of whatever and starts beating people up and I'll, you know, pat them, I'll mentally pass the torch to that guy. Okay. But, you know, as long as George is in fighting shape and fighting age, he's a champ.

Do you think he comes back? I don't know, George, we have a score to settle. I'm waiting for you. Yeah. Come to me, George. Is that the one that's still? Wow, look at you. Yeah.

I'll just break you on two. I know. I speak French. I'm from Montreal. Yes, of course. I know. I know the French. How'd you pick up the French?

This is the one. This is the one. Yeah. It's the one saying I know. And then I started, I started to learn a song, ukulele that has a couple verses. You're still doing that? Yeah. The ukulele.

Well, I want my children to have a wide variety of influences in their life, you know. So I want them to, you know, have music. I didn't have that much of music growing up, I think. My grandma and mom played a little bit of piano, but it was like, you know, church music. So I didn't like it, so I stayed away from it. Okay. So I want them just to, you know, be exposed to as much as possible. Do you have it here?

It's in my apartment. Gosh. In your hotel? In your hotel room. I would have loved to have you play. I love those videos. I'm not an idea to do a backguard music. It's amazing.

It's great. You're really good. Were you self-taught? I want to give a shout-out to this website. Euculele underground. Okay. thing enough times I can I can usually pick it up because I'll practice it over and over and over again. But yeah, it made it really easy to learn. Why that instrument? It's not your

It's only four strings. Okay. It's the easiest. It's a very intimate instrument. You can, guys who are really good, like Jake Shimbuku, I don't know if I'm pronouncing his name right, I'm probably butchering it. But the stuff that those guys do on it is just ridiculous. But it's so simple that I can make it sound pretty good. One song that comes to mind that I know the ukulele is being played in is Is it somewhere over the rainbow? Yeah Yeah, Israel.

Yeah. I don't even know. Kalawa, yeah. He's good, right? He's considered like a legend as far as ukulele. Yeah, I'm pretty sure. Yeah, he's legendary. He's one of your influences?

And that dude, he's so big. Gigantic. I don't know how he gets those fingers. Is he still with us? I think he passed away. Oh, he did. Okay. Tremendous voice, too.

Yeah. Voice as well. So is that what you listen to? too is like it will you listen to that on fight night as well to get you pumped up i listen to uh i call my on my phone i have pandora i call it beach music but there's a lot of uh a lot of people from from hawai who play different songs and some of them use a lot of ukulele in it but is that what my favorite song right now is this guy you can find it on youtube it's called uh no regrets by mike love and he's playing on ukule mike love okay it's amazing it's my favorite song right now

i want to try to learn it but it's kind of difficult are there vocals in it too yeah um So is this what you'll listen to to to get pumped up for the fight or is there a different John Fitch when you're getting ready for the fight? No, I listen to, I listened to a lot of reggae. Oh, really? I listened to a lot of reggae. Eke mouse. Eke mouse is my guy. Eke mouse.

Yep. Is this a guy who's alive? I believe he's still alive. How do you pronounce that? How do you spell that? Eke a mouse. Eke a mouse. He was named after, nicknamed after a horse he used to bet on and lose lost money on all the time.

Wow. That's great. I love that story. Yeah. It's funny. I said recently on the show that my walkout song, if I ever have a fight, which I'm not planning on having a fight,

but maybe you'll be in my corner. Maybe you could be my coach. Do you think I have what it takes? You probably wouldn't support this idea of me fighting based on reviews. Well, the system that I've come up with, I think I've dumbed it down enough to where I could teach anybody

to be confident in a self-defense fight situation. So if CM Punk reached out to you, do you say thanks but no thanks? I don't want to support this, or are you open to it? I'll take the money. Okay. That's it though Well I mean like

I don't know the guy personally Sure sure But if somebody comes to me And they want instruction Like I'm not gonna turn you away For any reason Right If you're lazy or you don't listen to me

I'll kick you out Right Yeah well I'm not lazy And I'm a pretty good listener That's the biggest thing for me Because if you're lazy then I'm teaching I'm teaching you and giving you gold And you're wasting it

So I'm not gonna waste So my walkout song I think would be Three Little Birds by Bob Marley That's one of my favorite songs Right? Reggae. Yeah. You're respected?

Or are you one of those guys like, oh, Bob Marley's too. No, no, no. I like, no. Bob Marley, I really like. Some of the songs are played out because they're used so much. Pop, yeah.

If you, if you, there's a lot of deep, deep album stuff that Bob's done. Sure. Amazing that you've never heard of. You ever see his documentary? The one that came out like a couple years ago. There's a few of them. The big one, Marley, the one that was like won all the awards and everything.

I think I want. I can't remember. I might have. Is it on Netflix? It might be. I don't have Netflix. I want to go back to GSP. Does that still eat at you?

Because you say you have some unfinished business. Do you still think about it a lot? Yeah, that's the one fight that I crave more than anything. Really? I think everything else is an appetizer. You have flashbacks? Do you think about it? Like, does it eat at you?

Yeah, well, it doesn't eat at me because of that fight. It eats at me because I feel like I should have gotten one more chance. A rematch? Yeah. I feel like I deserved. That's what bothers you more. That bothers me. I did so much work and I improved so much.

I didn't get to tested. Did you ever get a reason why you didn't? get another shot. That was boring. That was the reason. I'm not entertaining enough. No, that wasn't given, nobody ever personally told me. That was told through me through whatever, media.

Right. Tweets, whatever. Management? Like, did they relay that message to you? No. Are you still with Zinkin Entertainment? Yes. Even though you're not at A.K.A. Yeah. For life. Or at least right now. Yeah, still still with them right now. So, when you

say that that would... They do, they, I mean, they do great, but again, the Monopoly. of the UFC and the way they do business has made management companies almost irrelevant. What do you mean by that? Even outside of the UFC, though? Well, even now with the new Reebok deal, like, what deals are managers going to make for their fighters sponsor-wise? None. So that's a huge pay cut for those management guys. The contracts are so cemented already. There's no real wiggle or negotiation room. They're almost made management completely irrelevant. So what about though if you're a World Series of Fighter fighter or a Wiltier's a

fighting fighter or a Beltor fighter? It helps, but again like I said, like when you have such a powerful monopoly, it dictates how everyone else does business. Have you ever thought, you know, just thinking about your stance and whatnot, have you ever thought that getting involved in some kind of fighters association or anything like that? Does that interest you? Have you thought about this? I've thought about it, but man, it would just be too difficult right now, especially for to do it. As a fighter, you'd have to take it on full-time as a full-time job. Do you think maybe when you're done, you'll want to look into it more? Maybe, but my passion is teaching and coaching.

Do you feel like it's needed? Something needs to be done. Something needs to be broken up. I don't like the, you know, long-term contracts. I think you should have one-fight deals in a matching period for every fight. Sort of like boxing? A little bit. But there are longer contracts in boxing, too, HBO, Showtime, and things like that. Yeah. But you want more freedom. More freedom.

So no more promotions. Because there needs to be, there needs to be negotiation room. You need to be able to negotiate for more money if you're worth more money. Right. So it basically comes down to not having like these promotions where they have a roster and multi-fight contracts just long term. And then they have the opinion.

Then they have the ability to, yeah, they don't like you. So we're just not going to fight you for a while. Okay. I want to talk about the fight before. obviously, you know, we're here to promote this fight. Like I said, he's a dangerous guy. You know what he wants to do. Does that make it easier on you?

You know that that's what he wants to do. That's where he's going. I mean, I've learned a long time ago. It's not about what that guy's going to do. It's about what I'm doing. Okay. And that's made fighting easier for me a long time ago when I finally decided that, I think it was before the Diego Sanchez fight,

where I really flipped a switch and be like, who cares what that guy's going to try to do? it's about what I'm going to do to him. And my training needs to revolve around what I'm going to do to him. So I didn't even have a left-handed fighter or sparring partner when I fought Diego. But I made myself fight the guys who are right-handed. And I was sparring against like they were left-handed. So I had to circle the same way.

So I'm circling into their power regardless. But I had to have that mentality of that. It's not about sitting around waiting to block what they're doing or defend against them. It's about me imposing my way. on them. Wow. So did you even watch tape on this guy? I haven't watched tape on anybody in a long time. Really? But you know what he does, right? You know about him because you compared him to Aoki and you know that he likes the leg lock. And I've seen leg locks. He didn't invent a new different kind of leg lock. Sure. There's still, I still have two legs, two ankles. Did you bring

anyone to mimic his style or at least to, you know, work on leglock the fence? Any of the specific? I've had, yeah. I mean, I've been doing this for more than 12 years. Sure. I've been wound leg-lock defense for a long time. I fought, you know, got a lot of guys from Japan who do leg locks up. So it's not like it's, oh, now I have to, like, do it now. I've been doing it for more than a decade. But, yeah, I had some extra people going after legs. I put myself in situations to drill and get comfortable with the situations.

But I didn't go overboard with, you know, worrying that much about just the leg lock. Do you want to take him into the championship rounds? Would you like to it? Because he doesn't often go there. That's one of the things I like to do with people is I like, I like beating people up. I enjoy it. You want to make it less alone. I like beating you up for 15 minutes.

I could maybe could finish you in the first round, but it's funner for me to beat you up for 15 minutes. Have you actually done that in a fight where you knew that? It's more demoralizing and more dominating. I'm dominating you and beating the crap out of you for 15 minutes. I like that. Have you done that in a fight where you knew that you could finish it and you're like, you know what, I'm going on? I think with the, I think with Hallman, I think I could have, you know,

chose to stand and finished it, but I was fine with elbow and I've been punching the face. I mean, I have deformities on my forearms from beating people up with my forearms and elbows and stuff. That's amazing. I mean, that's permanent, I think. Is this new? This, I got after the fight in Brazil with Eric Silva. Okay.

And it's pretty self-explanatory for the love of my family. That way, when I'm elbowing you in the face, you know why. Wow. Is that the reason? Holy moly. That kind of scared me right there. It's the way you said that. You shave your arms.

When I, you know, everything's strategic with me. When you're fighting a heavily grappling-oriented person who wants to be in the clinch and wants to grapple, I'll remove the body hair. Wow. A little slicker. Legs too? But if I'm fighting a striker, I'm hairy.

Hairy as can be. I was super hairy. You notice the second Tiago office fight? I was so hairy. Really? I have to go back. Chest hair, everything. And not this time.

Yeah. What about legs? Clean as a whistle. Clean as a whistle. Look at you. Well, I don't razor shade because that opens you up to infection. Yes. So what did you do?

Wax? No, no, no. I use the buzzer. How many times? I just did it the other day. Will you do before the fight again? No, this is enough. By the way, before I let you go, we were talking about your kids and their birthdays

and your birthdays and your kids' birthdays. We shared the same week birthdays. It's unbelievable. 22nd, 24th, 27th. But you say you don't celebrate birthdays. I don't believe in time. I don't believe in time. What does that mean?

time doesn't exist time is a measurement of objects passing through space those objects that are passing through space are different different different distances all the time so how dates do you believe in that because that's that that that is uh on par with time right like if i say this fight is happening on December 13 well when you think about dates like the future the future doesn't exist it hasn't happened the past it's just something in your mind you can't go to the past you can't go to the future it's just right now all there is is right now all there is right the past and future. They do exist in some form.

In your mind, but that's an illusion. You can't touch it. So when I talked to you about UFC 87, when did that take place? Or did it not take place? It took place because as moments pass, you take pieces of those moments with you. They shape who you are at that current moment. The moment, you know, an hour ago, I took pieces of it with me as they move forward. You know, a good example of something I try to explain this to people with this is like,

When you're a kid and you touch something hot for the first time and you burn your hand. Yeah. You don't have to take the memory of you burning your hand. Oh, I remember that on this date, I touched this hot thing and it hurt. No, you remember that sometimes things are hot. You know, something on the stove is hot. Yes, yes, yes. You take it with you.

You don't have to think back to the past. That doesn't exist anymore. You took a piece of that with you. And moment by moment, it's still with you. When you go to Sacramento? That's a question. Oh, when I'm finished with my arm now, I'm doing PR stuff. So my PR stuff will end and then...

But there's a little. It'll be time for dinner. The flight is time. There it is. Right? It does exist, though. Do you look at our minds? Only in our minds.

Like, do you look at the time? Do you ever say, oh, I need to know what time it is? Not really unless, you know, the outside world makes me. Gotcha. Hence a flight, right? For example, you have to make it to a certain time. And that's one of the reasons why we have time was travel. Sure.

Was the trains and why we have, you know, different time zones. Wow. Is fat, were you always like this? Or it's a new thing? Oh, no. I've, I've been reading a lot. lot and studying things and I'm a, I think a lot differently. I'm still a lot of the same person, but I think a lot differently than I did when I was. So what about your kids? Like, will you celebrate

their birthday? Um, yeah, see, this is one of the things is, uh, I don't like the idea of canning celebrations. Like, we have to celebrate on this time. I think you should have a celebration every moment. Sure. Every moment should be celebrated. Yeah. Why should you suffer through one moment because you're trying to get to some other moment? I get it. You know, it's just like with like, like, Valentine's Day, though, the not trade, not certain, you know, like, why do you need that one special day to, like, treat someone nice rather than you should be treating them nice every moment all the time? She must be the best husband.

My wife thinks so. Yeah. But what about your kid? Like, will you have a party for them? Probably because my wife will want to have one. Okay. And sometimes those parties are really for the adults anyways. That's true.

Especially at that age. Yeah. Especially, like, Christmas. Like, I'm going to, you know, it's a hard choice. But, yeah, what about that? I'm not going to, I'm going to give them the real. story of Santa Claus. It was a pagan tradition. Right now though? They're like too how old's your oldest son? I think it's I think it's wrong to lie to your children so no tree nothing no we do

trees but I wanted them to understand why okay oh yeah we do this because a long time ago pagans celebrated their whatever you know give them a Wikipedia definition of why it's still fun to do I don't think you have to lie about it oh there's a magic guy who comes around no it's oh it's a please it's a fun thing so no tooth fairy no And, like, when I was a kid, I never, I never had a memory of believing in Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy. Okay. I always knew. I always have memories of knowing that it was my parents.

I always have memories of finding presents before, like in closets or the attic or whatever. So, like, I was kind of offended as a kid when adults lied to me. I'd get really mad. And then I went to Catholic school, too. So, like, yeah, they're lying to me about Tooth Fairy in Easter Bunny and Santa Claus. What else are you lying to me about? And that's what opened this all up for you. I've always been really skeptical about this.

I question things a lot. You don't take things at face value. Never. Wow. That's interesting. Which gets me in trouble sometimes because... Yeah, I can imagine. Yeah.

And your wife probably doesn't share these sentiments, but maybe that's what makes you guys a good pair. Well, she, not necessarily, but then... She's starting to come around. She comes around because I'm very logical and I'm very good at explaining things. Yes. And she's like, well, now that you explain it like that, I kind of get it. What about your dog?

diet, by the way? I lost too much weight as a vegan. Okay. I was about 182, 183 pounds when I fought Vijay, and then I started doing a weekend vegan thing, and then I was about 187, and then now I'm just full meat, and I'm lifting full-time for the first time. Well, it's been about two years. I started lifting a little bit before Eric Silva, but now it's like full-time, full-on. Mostly it keeps my body healthy. Okay, but you're eating meat now? And I'm eating meat regularly, and now, like, you know, by about 195, mostly can't. Okay. And what are you right now? 188 this morning. Is that good for you? Is that normal?

Yeah, perfect. All right. I wish we could talk more about this time thing. I mean, it's fascinating stuff, but I've run out of time. How about that? Yeah, see, now we've run out of time. See, see, they're the ones. Not really, we haven't run out of time. The moment's just passed. Good point, but I could have gone on forever. They're the ones that told me I had to end at a certain time. There you go. So we have to blame. We have all these ancient ideas and rules that really enslave us. And if we just just could break free of them. We could have a

much better society, I think. What's the number one one that you want to see you go away? Oh, man. That's hard. I think the false belief that the state or government cares about us and wants us to do well. Gosh. That's a heavy one to end on. It's very heavy.

You don't vote, I'd imagine. What's the point? There are two parties that represent the exact same thing. Sure. They talk about these little subjects that they talk about very passionately about, but they don't really affect us. Things like gay marriage, like on the day-to-day that doesn't really affect us. But, you know, multi-billion dollar corporations or people like Rupert Murdoch, they avoid hundreds of million dollars of taxes every year that could be a huge

benefit to people. But that's not a topic they're willing to discuss. Right, right, right. Wow. All right. Well, next time you come on, we'll talk about that stuff. I appreciate it very much, John. Really thank you a lot. You know, great to have you. I got to say maybe you've changed your views on me as a journalist or journalism in general, but I remember way back when you were one of the first guys to even recognize. Yeah, you're still my favorite. Really? I still think you do one of the best jobs. Thank you. That means a lot to me. Of being unbiased and asking tough questions in a good way. Thank you. That means a lot. And I remember when you first said that to me. So thank I. I'm glad that it's still the case many years later. You're not afraid to ruffle some feathers with questions that. I think that's good. Cool. I wish you the best.

It takes place this Saturday on NBCSN. It's World Series of Fighting 16. It's John Fitch versus Hussimar Paul Harris for the WSOF Welterweight title. And once again, I'll mention January 17th just broke right here on this show. Jake Shields versus Brian Foster, the number one contender fight.

That will take place at Planet Hollywood in Las Vegas. The winner of that fight will fight the winner of this fight on Saturday. So very interesting stuff. Paul Harris versus Fitch is a fascinating matchup. I look forward to it very much. I wish you the best of luck. And once again, I appreciate you stopping by John Fitch.net. At johnfitch.com.net is his Twitter.

If you want to talk to him more about time or lack of time and how all this stuff is affecting us. We're going to take a break. We'll say goodbye to John. Right now, we're going to go inside the vault. This Saturday also, Nate Diaz is fighting. He's fighting Hafeld dosangos. And I spoke to him at UFC 11 in March of 2010.

Who did you fight at UFC 111? Do you remember? Tiago? Ben Saunders. Ben Saunders. We're supposed to fight. There you go. You won that fight.

And I spoke to Nate Diaz. after that fight that he had on that card, and it was a very interesting ending. I'll leave it at that. Actually, in the middle, we had a very interesting moment. He's fighting this weekend against Dosangos. I thought we'd look back. March of 2010, we'll go inside the vault.

Here's me and Nate Diaz from four and a half years ago. Ariel Halwani post-fight at UFC 11 with Nate Diaz, who looked great tonight in defeating Rory Markham. First off, Nate, congratulations on the win. Were you happy with your performance? Yeah, I guess it was good because I got in and out. Got in and out. How was your first time at 170? How did you feel?

I had a lot of energy. Just building up to the way and was... Coming up to the way and wasn't as miserable as usual. That's pretty much it. There were a lot of questions about why he came in so overweight. Did you get an official reason? No, he came in more overweight than it said to. I think he was like 10 or 12 pounds over because we heard his manager was calling and stuff,

saying he was heavier than whatever the hell they said he was. and I don't know. I wish he would have made the weight, but it was like whatever, though, you know. I think it was a little unprofessional, that he came in that much over? Whatever, you know, you know, you got to make weight, you know.

I'm not going to dog the guy out, whatever. Sometimes making weight sucks, and you just want to say, I'm not even going to do it. But you got to do it. You got to make the weight. That's what you agreed to. Otherwise, go up.

But, you know, right on, I don't care. It wasn't good for me, so. and I'm sure he'll make the weight next time. Did you consider not taking the fight because it was such a huge discrepancy in weight? No, no. I figured that. I figured he would either have to, I don't like that guy. That was Kurt Pellegrino.

Why don't you like him? You have some history, right? Yeah, he's, I don't like guys you clown around. He used to be on Hendel Gracie's team too, and he jumped ship, so he's a traitor. Nothing huge, but, you know. Well, now you are swimming with the 170-pound sharks. He's at 155. I'm guessing you're going to stick around on 170 now.

This is not just testing the water. I'm going back. Really? Yeah, I'm going to 55. Why? I'll go, you know, I'll fight. I don't care. I'll fight both.

I don't got to, why do you got to be in one? So you think your next one will actually be at 155? Probably. Probably 70. I don't know. My team, my coach, and what they want to, you know, my manager. My manager is, my coach. so he's a shot caller if he tells me whatever to do.

You know, he's got my back, so I got his. He's going to let me know what I got to do. A lot of people thought you deserved to win the fight against Gray Maynard in January. Did you feel as though you had something to prove tonight and finish the fight decisively to show that, you know what, you are a top contender and you did deserve to win that fight? No, yeah, I did win that fight. Only people who thought I lost that fight were the judges,

but who's that? Who were the judges? You know what I'm saying? Like, I thought I did. I didn't get one person saying that he did. And I didn't feel like if I lost the fight, you know, how did he win the fight? That's more of the question. Maybe I didn't do enough, but he didn't do shit.

So. All right, so. A lot of guys there, you can't, I can't complain. What can I say? You're going to get, you're going to get in this game. You've got to win if you're going to win, I guess. All right. I think someone's trying to get the court.

under us there they will step back yeah how much they really wanted all right so you're saying a 155's next anyone in particular that you would like to fight uh no not not at the moment i don't i don't care whatever like i said whatever my manager and these guys here say i don't care all right nay well thank you very much for the time congrats on the big win amazing things happening to me amazing opportunities and then i had my chance to fight in the ufc and after seven years i become champion of the With unrivaled tenacity in his unique brand of precision power punching, Junior Dos Santos' remarkable UFC ascent began with a devastating knockout of fellow Brazilian Fabricio Verdun in 2008.

It's an uppercut! And continued with seven straight victories to seize heavyweight gold from Kane Velazquez. It is all over! The Brazilian striker then successfully defended his title against Frank Meir, before two hard-for-tidal bouts against Keen. Kane Velasquez cost him both the belt and his status as number one contender. A status he is determined to regain. When I lost my fights, my last fights, was a little bit confused.

Everything was happening. It was maybe it was too much. To be the champion, it's simply amazing, the number one of the world. Junior Dos Santos is the new UFC. heavyweight champion of the world I want to have everything I was having when I was champion I'm gonna have to work a lot to reach the position of the champion again that's what I want and I really believe I can achieve that I can get there for dos Santos getting back to the top means training at Brazil's most famous gym

under the guidance of one of the country's most legendary coaches right now my old Training camp is coordinated by Andrepidinez. When Sigano me procurro, he was trying to move, because here's more facilitation to have more training for him. All right, back on the mixed martial arts hour. I really want to thank, oh, he left his coffee here. I knew I smelled coffee. I want to thank John Fitch for stopping by.

Interesting stuff. In particular, the stuff at the end. I love when fighters throw you a curveball like that. You don't get a chance to talk about that stuff often on a show like this. So I appreciate him, an OG, if you will. I was there. I remember when he had that issue with the video game. I was there when he was getting ready.

I remember being at the gym when he was getting ready to fight GSP at UFC 87, way back when. And I was there at the Prudential Center in March of 2010. That was the Inside the Vault clip that we just took a look at. Nate Diaz had just defeated Rory Markham, defeated him via TKO. and that was a catchweight fight at 177 pounds. And then you saw that little moment there with Kurt Pellegrino. That was a lot of fun. I actually got in a bit of trouble afterwards

when I showed that clip to Pellegrino and Goddard's response and blah, blah, blah. But I'm in a great place with the Diaz brothers now. And I look forward to seeing Nate return on Saturday. I will be in Phoenix for UFC on Fox doing my usual stuff. I'll be there beginning Wednesday night. So back-to-back shows. East Coast, West Coast, East Coast, West Coast.

I'm looking forward to this card. The main card is tremendous. JDS versus Steve Miochich, you just saw a bit of the Road to the Octagon special, which is always very well done by Zufa. You also have Alistair Overeign versus Stefan Strove, Matt Matrion versus Gabriel Gonzaga, and Nate Diaz versus Hafelde de Sanjos, what I like about this card very much is that, you know,

there seems to be a theme these days with the UFC. Like we're getting a lot of activity in, certain weight classes at around the same time, which, you know, goes back to my point that you need to sort of align yourself with the best when you're fighting. So I really like the fact that the heavyweights just fought for the belt. They just fought in November. That was Verdum and Mark Hunt. And then the lightweight title was just defended this past weekend. So Dos Santos versus Nate Diaz makes a lot of sense. And of course, you have three heavyweight fights on this card. You just had two on Saturday at UFC 181. So it really feels like this time of year,

we're thinking a lot about heavyweights and lightweights, and I like that. The Dosangos situation is perhaps most interesting right now, as far as I'm concerned, because Pettis doesn't have a clear-cut number one contender. But man, what are they going to do if Dosangos wins, all right? If Dosangos wins, unless I forget, Dosangos beat Donald Trone last year, last August. So he will have a win over Donald. He'll have a win. He'll have a win. a win over Nate Diaz. He's looked very good as of late. He had a stumble, though, last, you know, it was in April against Khabib Nurmaghamedov.

But he's injured. And I feel like the UFC wants to try to get Anthony Pettis to fight sooner rather than later. Now, that being said, they're pretty much booked up until March. So can he return against Nirmagamadov in April? Yes, but will Nirmagamato be ready to fight in April? That's the big question. He's coming back from ACL surgery that happened in July. I remember we were in Ireland when this happened.

That's a very quick return. He seems confident, but I don't know. So then you look at Dosanjos. But you got Donald Soroni fighting, and he's fighting Miles Jury. And let's be honest, he's the more popular fighter right now. Do they go with Soroni over Dosanjos? I think Dosangos really needs to make a statement. And I think if he can make that statement on Saturday,

he might have the inside track. He really could. And then maybe you do Narragamato Soroni, but Seroni's not going to want to wait a long time. So it's a very interesting time at lightweight. The good news is Anthony Pettis, who's the champion, he is back. And that just opens the door for everyone else. But I'm really curious to see what they do.

Also, I'm curious to see what they do with the next contender at Heavyweight. We know that it's going to be for Doom versus Kane. But what about who's next? I get the sense that, or this is what I would do, if Miotich beats JDS, and that's no easy task. Remember, we haven't seen JDS fight since October of last year, since UFC 166. If he wins, if Miocchich wins, I would do Miocchich versus Travis Brown. I think that's a lot of sense. I think that's a lot of fun.

I mean, the styles matchup is a lot of fun. That's the fight I would do for the number one contender spot. Do you do JDS versus Travis Brown? I think you could do that, even though you kind of fall into that tricky spot with JDS because he has two losses under his belt to Kane Velasquez. So you don't want to put him in that spot where you eliminate a contender, kind of the same spot that Chad Mendes is in right now and Joseph Benavides as well.

And then you have Todd Duffy coming up. Perhaps he gets the winner of Mitriung Gonzaga, or maybe even the winner of Stefan Struve versus Alastor Overeign. Of course, he lost Alstereo. Way back when in Dream, very quick fight. Great to see Stefan Struv back. Hopefully all goes well. So a lot of interesting storylines,

and of course we can't forget about the Ultimate Fighter. Season 20 coming to an end this Friday. There's one more episode. There's the semifinals. Up the top of my head, it's Jessica Penne versus Carlos Sparza, Rhonda Marcos versus Rose Nomanus, and they're going to fight on Wednesday, and then the finals are on Friday. So not a lot of time to promote that, which I kind of feel like they should have done the finals, or at least the semifinals, this past Wednesday, so you can at least have 10 days or so to promote the finals.

Here you only have two days, and you don't have that much time. Because remember, the wayans, because this show is taking place on a Friday night, the wanes are going to happen on a Thursday. So you really have hours to promote it. If that, how much media can they do? It's a tough spot. And I know they had to delay things because of the World Series, but, you know, if I were in charge and I'm not,

so no one has to listen to me. But I would have done it last Wednesday, so you have at least 10 days to promote that. Still, it's fun times. There's two shows back to back, and I think the fans are, as long as the fights are interesting, and as long as the fight cards are good,

which both of these are, I think the fans are receptive to that to a degree. Of course, on Saturday, we saw Anthony Pettus defeat Gilbert Melendez, as I said. He is the first man to ever finish. Gilbert Melendez in a fight. He did so via second round guillotine. And then in the main event, we had Robbie Lawler versus Johnny Hendricks. I didn't have a lot of time to talk about this just yet.

We will. After our last interview, we're going to be joined by Matt Hughes. And he second, of course, Hughes was in the cage. He was the one that put the belt around Robbie Lawler's, waste. It was a split decision. 4847 for Hendricks, 4847 for Loller, 4946 for Loller. Now, I don't have an issue with 4847 for Hendricks. I do have an issue with 4946 for Loller. I scored it 48, 47 for Loller. I think it all came down to the first round, which isn't it interesting? What's with these first rounds? It all came down to the first round between GSP and Hendricks, in my opinion. It all came down to the

first round between Loller and Hendricks, the first time they fought in March, and it came down to the first round this time around. I thought that was the toughest round to call, and really, the first round this time around was a tale of two rounds. The first round had Robbie Lawler come out very aggressive, landed some big shots. It was clear he was going for the body, knees to the body. Look like it affected Johnny Hendricks very much so. And, and that, and he was, and he, and And then in the second half, Hendricks was able to control him, had him up against the cage, and then got the big takedown. To me, though, and I know that word isn't in there, I know they don't like to focus on the D word damage.

To me, though, what Lawler did in the first half of the round was more impactful than what Johnny Hendricks did in the second half of the first round, and that's why I gave it to Robbie Lawler. 48, 47, I gave him the first round, I gave him the fourth round, I gave him the fifth round, I gave him the fifth round, it was interesting to watch the third round because it seemed like he was slowing down. He took his foot off the gas. But then the way he came back in the fourth and fifth, in particular the fifth, to really try to seal the deal, it was very interesting to watch. Because if you recall, the last time they fought in March, it came down to the first, it came down to the final minute of the fifth round. And that's when Johnny Hendricks scored the takedown.

I really think that's what sealed the deal. and it was almost like Robbie Lawler said to himself, I'm not going to let this happen again. I'm not going to say what if. This might be my last shot. That's what he told us. He needed to go for it. And he did.

And I really think it comes down to, you know, what he did in that first round. The first 90 seconds of that first round, really sealed the deal for him. First round, fourth round, fifth round, Robbie Lawler, second and third, Johnny Hendricks. Super close. And now the big question is,

Do they go for a third fight or do they give Rory the shot? And remember, Rory recently lost to Robby Loller. If I were in charge, I go with Rory. I switch it up. It was promised. I think this was a super close fight. I don't think it was a controversial fight. It's one of those weird ones where I feel like it could have gone either way,

but it wasn't controversial because it was that close. But still, I think Rory deserves it. and you have Hendricks fight someone else, maybe GSP, and he's very close. If he wins his next fight, I think it's much like Gilbert Melendez and Benson Henderson. He just needs to win one more fight and then get back in there. You got a feel for Johnny Hendrix.

He just won the belt, super close fight against GSP, lost that fight, super close fight against Robbie Lawler, wins the belt, out for what, nine months, torn bicep. And I think he said it. The video wasn't posted online. But he said it to me afterwards. He needs to reconsider how he treats his body in between fights.

He said, look, maybe I can't go up to 215 anymore. Maybe I just have to do things a little differently. And from what I understand, the weight cut was a tough one. It's always a tough one with Johnny Hendricks, but it was tough. And you saw how Robbie Lawler looked at the weigh-ins, energized, didn't seem too sunken in. You know, I spoke to him before. he was fine. And then you saw how Johnny Hendricks looked.

Now, he was out for a long time, but one wonders what kind of a toll that had on his body. So congratulations to Robbie Lawler. And speaking of Robbie Lawler, we want to talk to a man who knows a thing or two about the ruthless one, a man who's been with him for so many years, and he had the honor of putting the belt around his waist

in the middle of that cage on Saturday night. One of the great moments of the year, of course I'm talking about one of the greatest welterweight champions of all time, Matt Hughes. Matt, how are you? Good, Ariel. How are you doing, buddy? I'm doing great. Congratulations on this moment for both you and Robbie, and of course, Pat Militich.

A tremendous picture was posted online on Saturday of the three of you. That trio is a really impressive one. I know how much it meant to you. What was it like just being there and watching Robbie after all these years, after all those fights, the ups and downs, finally get that UFC title? It's rough to be outside the Octagon and watch your buddies. I'm not the best judge for scoring because a lot of times I watch the fight, but probably a third or a quarter of the round, every round, I've got my head down praying. So I had your eye at favor sitting right next to me and was with a bunch of fighters. So they would tell me what was going on, and they would always judge the rounds while I

wasn't had my head up. But it's tough being outside the octagon, not being able to help your buddy who's inside the aftergown. So it's very stressful for me. But like I said in one of my tweets, one of my proudest moments of ever being in the octagon was putting the belt around Robbie's ways. Wow. And that is certainly saying a lot. Did you know that they would give you that honor? I went up to Dana before the main event started, before the paper you started and said, hey, do you mind if I put the belt on Robbie if he wins? And he goes, if you want to put the belt on, put the belt on.

Wow. So I did know that. And were you that confident, or was that just, you know, you trying to put the good vibes out in the air? I, you know what? I thought the fight was going to be close with the judges. And I had Robbie winning the first round up until that takedown. And, you know, these judges nowadays, some of them really, what I would say, overscore a takedown.

And I thought, well, shoot, they probably gave that, you know, Johnny because he took him down. You know, I've got some facts. Johnny tried 17 takedowns and took him down five times and had one strike on the ground. So, you know, with that being said, you know, Robbie was always busy on the ground and just did a good job. But I had Robbie winning round, possibly winning round one. And then four or five, I had two and three for Hendricks. And the last round, the fifth round, could have been, could have been a 10-8.

It was so really one-sided, but the judges don't like to give 10-8 rounds. So I didn't know. So when I was – Dana's holding the belt. I'm in the octagon. The first round goes – the first judge goes for Robbie. The second judge goes for Johnny. And so now I'm waiting for Bruce to say the new or – and still. Right.

So if he says the end from the word new – I reach over, I grabbed the belt from Satan, and I didn't ask for it, and I start making my way to, to Robbie, who's now on somebody's shoulders, getting toes around the ring. And I just stand in my spot, stare at Robbie. We make eye contact. He tells the guy to let it down. He comes over, and I get to strap the belt on him. So one of my favorite memories in the Octagon bar. That is great.

And I love the fact that you come with stats. How about that? I wasn't expecting that. Good for you for backing up what you were saying. could we agree, though, that 49-46 may be a little off? Well, you know, those two rounds were pretty close, you know. So, you know, Robbie didn't do much in the third. And two, round two, was somewhat close, and round four was somewhat close.

You know, the fifth was very obvious to me. So, you know, I don't know. I think it was a, I think it was a 49, 48 for somebody. So I think that would have been the best. I don't think it's so off-based that, you know, that judge should be fired because of that. It's just maybe he, that's why there's three judges. Maybe his view of the fight was different than the other two and the rest of us. It's great to hear you talk about wrestling and to also hear you say that sometimes

judges put too much stock in the takedown. Do you feel like this is the fight that really shows that maybe there's a shift in judging? Because we don't see this often. As you know, those takedowns usually seal the deal for the guy. And I would have been surprised if they, and by the way, I scored it for Robbie Lawler, 48, 47, first, fourth, and fifth round. But I wouldn't have been surprised based on how fights are usually scored if they would have given it to Hendricks, given the fact that he was doing a lot of that.

But do you feel like maybe times are changing a little bit now? Well, I don't think Johnny was as effective on his takedowns as he was planning on being. So I think that really hurt him. I think that the crowd actually hurt Johnny because they were booing so much on his takedown. The judges hear that. So when the crowd is yelling, that that's a, you know, not good for the judges. And also, you know, I believe Johnny got this from GSP. GSP is not a guy to go out and win fight.

GSP wants to win three of the five rounds. He wants to win a round and then win another round and then win another round. And I think Johnny really tried to do the same thing, not go out there and win the fight, but go out there and win rounds. And, you know, that's not the most exciting thing to watch, is watch a guy go out and try and win rounds. you know, people want to see people go out and try and finish the fight. So, but I think Johnny got, I'm sorry, I think Johnny got cut up in the whole aspect of trying to win rounds based on takedown.

And, you know, you never saw Johnny really go out there and try and finish the fight, even a couple times when he had maybe Robbie stumbling a little bit, you know, where he could have capitalized on it. So, you know, I think, I think Johnny will go back. I think Johnny definitely had a hard weight cut. I think that would be corrected in his next fight. And I think he'll go in with a game plan of, if I've got an opportunity to finish this fight, let's not let go to the judges. And more to that point, according to Fight Metric,

Hendricks's clinching in takedowns got him outstruck in those positions, 62 to 14 in significant strikes. So one could say it may have backfired on him. Objectively speaking, you feel like he fought not to lose as opposed to just go out there and try to win the fight? Yes, yes. I would say that, yes.

Were you surprised? You know, yeah, because Johnny's a finisher. I mean, he really is. But, you know, I think that first fight with Robbie, he got hit a couple times, and he didn't want, you know, to get hit by Robbie again, you know, like that, and to take the blows. So I'm not saying it's not a smart thing to do, you know,

I know how Robbie hits. I've parted with him many times. And, you know, I'm not saying that wouldn't have saved his career to where he's not getting, taking those big hits down the road. But that's just not the way to go about doing things. And that's not a champion in the UFC once. You know, and I'm kind of, maybe I'm speaking out of turning. But they don't want a champion out there to go out and tie somebody up,

put them against the fence and try and just win single rounds and not try and close the fight. Do you recall the first time you met Robbie Luller? Yeah, he was in high school. I was training at Pat, and Pat said, hey, let's go to the high school. They've got a good kid here that needs some training partners. So I went to the high school. Matt Robbie Lawler didn't think he was ever going to really meet him again,

and wrestled with him while he was in high school. How old was he? He was, I guess, 18, 17 or 18. You know, he was a senior in high school, and I was actually coaching college wrestling at Eastern Illinois and was just down on a training trip to MFS there. So were you in the UFC yet? Yes, I'd fought in UFC.

Okay, and had he had won MMA fight yet? No, right? No, I don't think so. He was in high school. Right. I think it was Taekwondo. It was either karate or two. I think it was Taekwondo.

He'd probably done some sparring and some tournaments in Taekwondo, but nothing, no MMA. So when you met him, did it ever cross your mind that this guy had potential, that he could be, you know, a great fighter? Did any of that cross your mind? Well, I knew he was going to be, he was a good wrestler. Okay. From being on the mat with him, but I had no idea that he was going to cross over into the MMA at all.

So, you know, I was a very good wrestler, you know, back to my hundred days. And I was coaching college wrestling, so I know I helped him out a lot on the mat as much as I could. And he was tough. You know, he's a big, strong kid, very athletic. And he, I don't know if I'd say he gave me fifth in that high school wrestling room. but I knew he was a good kid. He was good. I said before you came on the show,

I said him winning the belt cements one of the greatest comeback stories in UFC history because let's be honest, MMA history as well, let's be honest, I mean, there was a time he was out of the UFC,

he was losing some fights, he probably should have won. I don't think many people would have predicted that he'd be UFC champion and have this tremendous run upon coming back. What did you think?

What were you thinking when he was out of the UFC fighting in the elite X's strike force? I mean, he's falling asleep at press conferences. he didn't feel, he didn't seem like he was motivated, and he was, he was kind of putting that out there. What did you think about what had become of Robbie Lawler? Well, this whole time Robbie was away from the UFC, I was trying to put a small bug in his ear about going back to 170, you know, and I think that was a motivating factor, getting back to 170, and now he said back at his, where the way class he should be, back in the UFC is definitely a motivating factor.

I also got to say two other things. I think he grew up a little bit. You know, his age helped him out, and then going down to ATT helped him out a bit, you know, and really getting on a schedule and the right coaching. And this and that really, really helped him out. So, you know, with all that put together, that made the fire that's not wearing the Welk-A-Welt-Wilite belt.

Did you think, though, that he'd be able to do this, actually mature, put it back together, get on the winning, track and make a run at the belt? Well, you know, I've spard Robbie a lot, and I've worked with him a lot on the ground, standing, you know, in pads or running in this. So, yes, yes, I knew that this was in Robbie. That's why I, he was never, I never took Robb, you know, a good coach will always know his pupils.

So, so, so you can't treat everybody the same. No teacher can treat every student the same. No coach can each can teach every pupil. the same. Everybody is motivated differently and everybody learns differently. And Robbie was only the guy that I never said, hey, you need to go down to 170. I was always a guy to say, hey, you know, look at this 170 division. I think, I think you compete well in there. You know, so that's how I always tried to put the bug in his ear. And I'm not saying that's what made his mind to go to 170. It was probably something else. But I just, I was glad to see him come back

down and be one of the top five guys in welterweight and not one of the top 15 guys at middle weight. Speaking of sparring, he told MMAJunkey.com last week that he didn't spar for six years. Do you think that that may have added some years to his career that maybe if he would have sparred more during that stretch, we wouldn't see this Robbie Lawler now? Very good, you know, that very well could be possible. Robbie's very smart, and a lot of people out there don't give him the credit. for his brains that he really should have.

Robbie is one of those types of guys. If he's got something to say, they'll say it. And if he doesn't have anything to say, he keeps his mouth shut. So when Robbie talks, when Robbie talks in the room, everybody listens because they know that there's something being said worth listening to. And so did you feel like, okay, like were you supportive of this? Did you feel at the time that this was the right thing for him? What's that? About not sparring.

Oh, yeah, yeah. I was fine with that. You know, he's just very smart and always hitting pads, always keeping his timing right. And, you know, if that's what Robbie wants to do, that's fine. That's a little different than me. I train super, super hard, and I just always, always trained, always in shape. My last week of a fight, I trained twice a day, both practices being very tough. And, you know, most other people train once a day with a mediocre practice. So I trained probably twice as hard. other people did during fight week. But, you know, everybody's different. So everybody's got their thing, and Robbie knew what his was, and now he's ripping the rewards of doing what he needed to do. Would you say Robbie's in his prime right now? This is the best Robbie we've ever seen?

What's Robbie? 32 right now? Yeah. He's 32, so I think I was in my prime from 31 to 33 or something, what I would consider my prime. So I think Robbie would be right in the same boat, you know, right there. You know, he's now, he's got some tendon strength. He's got some old man strength, maybe, we'll say.

And he's had plenty of technique and training before this. So, you know, he could very well be stepping into his prime. So let me ask you, Matt Hughes, age 32, Robbie Lawler, age 32, who wins? You know, it all depends on, you know, styles make fights. And if I can get Robbie to the ground, I could be effective on the ground. if I cannot get Robbie on the ground, then he's going to have a good day. So I'm not the type of guy

that's sitting and stand with Robbie and expect to be there for long. That sounds like a non-answer to me. You didn't really pick a winner, to be honest. Well, I told you, I told you, you know, if my wrestling is good on a good day. Are you confident you could take him to the ground? No, no, I'm not confident.

I'm not confident. You're not confident. You're not confident. You're asking the same question, and he might not be confident. He could knock me out. I don't know. Wow, that would be fun.

Let me ask you, you know, just your opinion. What would you like to see next for him? Third fight against Hendricks or what was promised before the fight? It would be Roy McDonald fighting for the belt. Do you think they should go that route, which is also a rematch? Well, you know, I heard you talk about this before I got on your broadcast, and I think I got to disagree with you. Okay.

How long ago was the McDonald's fight? Nine months? Ten months? It was actually, it was in November of last year, so third. 13 months ago. 13 months ago. Yeah. You know, that's not an old fight.

Yeah. And Robbie won that pretty decisively, right? It was not a decision, was it? No, no, no. It was not close. I mean, it wasn't close, but no one thought it was a controversy. Yes, yes. So, I mean, you've got a guy that Robbie's already beat pretty decisively.

And now you've got, you know, a great rematch set up where the first fight was close. The second fight was maybe even a little bit closer. and now you've got, you know, that's making me score a third fight. If I was Hendricks, I would want a direct rematch. And I would say that they're going for that, and I don't blame them. You know, now you've got a storyline for a really big third fight. And if you go with McDonald's, you've got a guy that Robbie's beat a year ago. So, I mean, what do you do?

So I think you've really got to go for the Hendricks fight, but it doesn't matter me. And by the way, I should say, officially it was a split decision, but I didn't think there was a controversy there, and you know how sometimes that goes in MMA split decisions, don't always tell the story. So I should at least correct myself. Would you like to see Robbie take some time off because he has been very active as of late?

Yeah, I think we talk about this. To me, Robbie is, after this win, he's five of the year in my eyes, just because, you know, he did have a loss, but he's come back fought two other tough guys, and here he is wearing the wealth rate belt, you know, at the end of the year. So that's the way I see it. I would like to see the guy who have a couple months where he can let his kid know who his dad is and spend some time with his family.

And even between all this, he's moved from Iowa, between all the fights, he's moved from Iowa to Florida. So he's moved into a new house, and he just, the guy just needs some time home. But, you know what? Everybody can say that this champion needs some time off, but they've also got a champion that's willing to fight anybody out there at the drop of a dime. So, I mean, I think everybody's happy that there's a Worldaway champion that there's not going to back down from the fight. He's going to fight anybody, and he's going to go out there and try and win the fight with every punch zone.

And as far as you know, no serious injuries or anything like that coming out of the fight, right? Nope, nope. I should have asked about his leg if he did absorb some kicks on his leg, but no complaints whatsoever with Robbie. I was with him for most of the night afterwards until he left

at 4 o'clock in the morning for the airport. So, no, no complaints whatsoever. And in his press, post-flight press conference, he said he needed a couple weeks off. I think I'd like to see more than, you know, two weeks off and go back in the training camp. You know, he had him, you know, two months off.

You know, it wouldn't bother me. Let his body heal a little bit and enjoy his family. How did you guys celebrate? Back to his room. I always buy Robbie and Joyce cupcakes. So I had several fresh cupcakes, two dozen fresh cupcakes there. And usually what happens, we make kind of a little train out of it. Robbie takes a bite out of a cupcake, and he passes the right to me.

I take a bite out of it, and I pass it to somebody else. and we like to try many and not just eat a few. Okay, I like that. Does a part of you want to see GSP come back to see Robbie beat him? Yeah, I would love to see GSP come back just because, you know, he stepped out, you know, kind of as a champion, and I think he's got every right to come back in and face the champion. So, yeah, I'd like to see GSP come back. I do think it's a good match for Robbie.

but yeah, I love to see him come back. Do you think he comes back? No, no, I don't. You don't? Why? Well, because he's made a lot of money. He's not fighting for money anymore, which is a great motivator for somebody. And, you know, he's busy with movies and this and that.

And the third reason I really say is because he took a beating from Johnny Hendricks last time. He's just, you know, everybody gets old. And I'm not debating on if GSP is champion. championship material. I'm not, I'm just, in his last fight, he didn't look like the young GSP. And I went through the same thing, and every other champion has went through the same thing where you just get older.

He's got nothing to prove, and why come back and take those beatings when you don't have to. Do you think Robbie beats him? Are you confident he beats him? I don't know. I don't know. I think Robbie would, I would confident Robbie could win you know, three out of the five rounds. Okay. But you don't want him to fight like that, right? Because you say that's the way GSP fights. Yeah, GSP's a hard guy to finish, though.

Yeah, that's true. He's been finished twice that I know of. Yes. So he just doesn't get finished. But I would also say that GSP does not want to absorb any punches from Robbie. So you're probably going to see a ground game out of GSP. And, of course, Robbie's going to want to try and take his head off. Like Matt, Sarah, had a good time, had that opportunity.

Right. Two last things, and then we'll let you go. Really appreciate the time. Thank you so much, Matt, for coming on the show. So, you know, you had, I mentioned that picture. It was really one of the best pictures I've seen recently of you, Robbie, Pat Militich, you're holding the belt, you know, three of the greatest of all time. Just what was it like not only experiencing this with Robbie,

but to have Pat there as well. What was that like for you? You know, Pat and I get along so well. we don't see each other very often. So before the fight, we talked a lot. After the fight, we talked a lot. And I think it's great. You know, it was definitely a torch passing ceremony, we'll say,

because, you know, I kind of got the belt from Pat, and then Robbie kind of got the belt from me, you know. So we loved it. We loved it. Even though there's no, there's champions between Carlos Newton and GSP and Johnny, you know, there's three of us right there. that have had the gold, the majority of the wealthy champions were right there in the ring. It was just, to me, it was kind of big.

Yeah, it was really special. I'm sorry. Mattler, Mattler held it out as well, so I'm sorry about that. Is it out of your system yet? Yeah, yeah, it is, because, you know, I loved competing in there, but, you know, I'm just not, I'm just, you know what to say, the old gray mirror just ain't what it used to be. I guess, I guess, I guess, I fit that little thing as well. So it's not, I'm 41 and I'm not in my prime. And, you know, if I don't think I can win doing something, I won't do it.

So I just, against the right opponent, I would. But they're not out there anymore. And we know that you work for the UFC now. What are you working on? What's on your plate? I worked a lot with the Reebok deal and the fighter uniforms and this and that. Okay. That's been somewhat.

What was your involvement with that? I had a lot of input on about everything. Oh, wow. Are you happy with it? Are you happy with the deal? I am happy with it because these fighters have less stress. That was one of the more stressful things was where all my patches on my shorts. Yes.

What was they getting paid for this and that? So now these fighters have nothing to worry about stress-wise with their stuff. They're getting some decent money. And I mean that. And I don't mean decent in a low way. I think it's good money. And, you know, now the only people who aren't going to be happy with the managers because they're going to have less to do now.

Yeah. But that does not mean that these managers can't go out and find sponsorship outside of the Octagon, because now there's going to be other people trying to get some fighters doing this and that, you know, outside the octagon. So the money is still going to be there in sponsorship outside of the cage, but they just can't wear it on the inside. Is it safe to save? that you were looking out for the fighter's best interest

because you know, some fighters have brought up there. I feel like we can't on the outside have a take on this because we don't know the numbers. It hasn't gone into effect just yet, but since you are a fighter and you come from that background, were you looking out for their best interest when you talk about the pay and all that? That guaranteed

I was. That's my whole... My title might read BPFF Development and Government Relations, but my role in the UFC to me is, hey, what did these fighters need first? And what do they want second? So, you know, I'm always, that's my whole role, is to look out for the fighters.

So that's what I do. So that's what was going on. You know, and I was wanting them, some of my input was, we'll put one of the, you know, the three different options for the outfits. And I put one of them on Johnny. You know, they've outs at the second. Johnny fights on the sixth. have one of them on Johnny, but they couldn't get one made in time to show it.

But I'm happy with what they look like, too. Pretty good-looking stuff. I was, at the first, I thought it was one was going to be blue and the other one was going to be red, and it was going to be very generic. It's not good-looking stuff. I'm happy. Okay. And finally, are you happy with this role as Zufa?

Do you feel like this is something you're going to do for the foreseeable future, or are you itching to try other things as well? I like my role. And like I said, my role I feel is to look out for the fighters. Yeah. I love it, you know, but some fighters are going to get talked to by their managers, and they're not going to like this or that, and they're going to be mad at me for this. But in the end, I think that nobody likes change.

It's human nature to reject change. But in the end, five years from now, they're going to look back and say, you know, it was a good thing. We promoted our sport. We elevated our sport, and now we're in a better place. It is always one of my highlights seeing you at the events, highlights of my night. I truly mean that. I thank you so much for the time, Matt. Great catching up with you.

And congratulations to you and the team on what was one of the great stories of the year and great stories in recent memory. Robbie Lawler, UFC Welterweight champion. Pretty amazing stuff. And it was really awesome to see you put the belt on him. Congrats and thanks for the time. Hey, thank you, buddy. And I got one more poll.

I'd like for you to do a poll for me and say, who wants to see Ariel in his old clown shoes and not his dressed-up shoes. I think that should be a poll, your next poll. Okay. And have pictures of both. Yes. Clown shoes? Wow, that doesn't sound very good.

Well, you phrase it for me. Okay. Ferran, I know this is a big issue for you, so I'll ask the people what they think. I am a people's man. Talk you later, buddy. There he is. Matt Hughes. Arguably the greatest of all time, as far as the welterweight

Division is concerned. He obviously put that title on the map, so to speak, and he was there front and center on Saturday alongside Pat Meltage. Pretty cool. Pat Melitch sitting alongside UFC President Dana White. Pat Melitch recently inducted into the UFC Hall of Fame. They patched up their issues. Matt Hughes inducted him into the hall. Or actually, he kind of just was there. I mean, I guess you could say that. It's not the traditional sort of set up there. but you get my point. They were all there. And everyone, you know, if you've ever read the book, Blood in the Cage by John Wertheim, great book about Militich and, you know, that Robbie was one of those guys coming in there as a teenager and had his run in the UFC, left the UFC, went to Elitexie, went to Strike Force, among other places. And now finally, after coming back, has gone on an amazing run. Defeated Josh Kosteck, Bobby Volker, Rory McDonald, lost to Hendricks, but has come back since. he defeated Jake Ellenberger, Matt Brown, and now Johnny Hendricks on Saturday night. So Matt Hughes discussed his take on the Fighter of the Year topic, which is a very interesting one this year because there's no clear-cut winner.

And that's a great plug for me, because next week's show, December the 15th, will be our final show of the year. I hope it didn't scare you. Final show of all time. No, that's not the case. Final show of the year. We're off for the next two weeks, and then we're back after UFC 182. So if you recall last year, we had awards, right? We gave out our year-end awards. Now, I hate doing this before one more UFC. Of course, C.B. Daluay, Leot Machita is the final UFC event of the year, but we'll be doing this just a few days before that. But we're not going to come out.

I don't want to do it in January because then it seems a little too late. I mean, I guess it's not technically too late, but everyone will be talking about Jones Cormey, and there'll be a bunch of stuff coming up in January. So I want to put 2014 to bed on our final episode. So I just want to run down the awards that are at stake for next week's show. Both New York Rick and I will be weighing in on this. This is in no particular order. Story of the year.

Story to watch in 2015. Fighter of the year, Fighter of the Year, Fight of the Year, Women's MMA Fighter of the Year, Coach of the Year, Jim of the Year, Fighter of the Year for 2015, our prediction. Knockout, Submission of the Year, Prospect of the Year, comeback, fighter of the year, most improved fighter, feel good story of the year, surprise of the year, event of the year, round of the year, and what's the guest, or who's the guest, do you want to hear from the most come 2015? So those are some of the awards we'll be weighing in on. We'll have our

typical show as well, our usual show, but I wanted to mention that it's going to be tough, right, New York, Rick? I mean, last year, it was pretty easy, in my opinion, to pick a lot of these. This year, I feel like it's going to be tough. Are you there? I'm here. Do you share that sentiment? No, I mean, I'll figure something out. I don't think. it'll be too tough. Admite, though, that it's a little tougher. There aren't the same clear-cut choices or options as there were last year. I agree with that.

Yeah. I feel like last year, like for a fight of the year, for fight of the year, you had like three, four great answers. But that also makes it tough sometimes. True. Because there's so many people who are worthy. Mm-hmm. Yeah, so that's to come next week. Okay.

So we have 25 minutes to go now that we have this new credo. that we must be out by 430, so no time for small talk. But is any, I mean, so today we're picking our five best questions. Is that accurate? We got a little more. I picked a few more, but let's do them, let's hit them quickly. Because I want to ask you before, are we getting CN Punk? Are we getting the main event?

So I want you to weigh in on this as well. Yes, yes, okay, go ahead. You touched upon this, but quickly reiterate, Robbie's next fight, which would you prefer to see the trilogy with Hendricks or the rematch with McDonald? I personally would rather see Rory get his title shot because I'm tired of immediate rematches. Also, I don't think Hendricks would have a problem getting back to the top. Now, when you say I personally, this is the person who asked the question. I wait in.

I think it should be McDonald. What do you think? I think it should be the rematch. Do you mean the trilogy? Correct. McDonald does a rematch as well? It should be the trilogy. Why?

It should be the trilogy. Because, you know, how many times have we seen somebody promised a title shot and then not given it? So I don't think that that is necessarily... It doesn't make it right. No, no, no. I'm just saying that if anybody's making the case that that's why that should be the fight that happens. I'm sorry, tough luck. But the reason is because Robbie Lawler just decisively beat Roy McDonald. And I think that it's a great fight.

I'd love to see it down the line, but you have to catch lightning in a bottle while you have it. And these two fights have proven to be incredibly close, incredibly well-matched. And each time it came down to essentially one round, 49.4.4.4.4.4.5. 46 aside. So let's see it one more time, see who wins the rubber match, and then give Rory his shot, which he has earned. So I think that... So you put Rory on the sidelines? Yeah, just until, you know, just until they resolve this third fight.

But, you know, when you hear Matt Hughes talk about Robbie Luller, and I think he deserves time off, that's kind of the problem as well. I feel like some of these guys, and I'm not begrudging him. I mean, he has been so active and he's been great. He's been the company guy. But you get the belt, and now you can relax a little bit. and you deserve it. I mean, it's like you win the Super Bowl. You don't want to defend it three weeks later, right?

Two months later, you don't want to do that. You want to be at your best now that you're a champion. Rory fought in October. That was two months ago. Tough spot for him. Yeah. I mean, I would not be disappointed to see that rematch. I would not be disappointed to see Robbie Luller versus Rory McDonald again.

But I think that you have to make the third fight. Hmm. You know, Johnny wasn't banging his chest, so it's going to be interesting. Our next question. There's a few in the same category. So let's just address exactly what it says. Ariel, do you think it would have been smarter for the UFC to have CM Punk compete on Tuff rather than go straight into the UFC with no fight experience? Everyone seems to agree tough is getting a bit stale. And this could have been the kind of gimmick that could pump some life into it and gain the attention of some new viewers. It would also allow Punk to gain some experience fighting and prove himself against lower caliber fighters before entering the UFC. First of all, they've never actually ruled out that. But I will say that.

No, they should not put him on the Ultimate Fighter. I think that would be a very big mistake. Why? Because it is stale. Now, what do I think they should do is they should do some kind of multi-part series. They should be following him as we speak. There should be a camera on the guy right now as he decides where he's going to train, what weight class, when he's going to fight, all this stuff. I mean, is he going to move?

This is all so fascinating. I mean, this is a real fascinating story, and I want to see it from beginning to end. I want a camera on the guy or I wanted a camera on the guy from the moment he signed that contract. even before he signed the contract if they knew it was going to get done. But the ultimate fighter will make the CM Punk story stale. To me, it just doesn't work in 2014 the way we have it now. And I don't want to see him in a house, watered down with 15 other guys, all gunning for him for 13 straight weeks. I just don't want to see it.

It's a big enough story where he should be the focus by himself. And the key in all of this, by the way, is, you know, I know people are concerned about his opponent, and you have every right to be concerned because you don't want some. a-and-o guy who doesn't deserve to be in the UFC. Now you have, you know, in your opinion, two guys who don't deserve to be in the UFC. The key in all of this is to not bring in someone who can then not take the ball and run with it

if he beats CM Punk. Don't make the same mistake that other promotions have made where they just want to give, you know, a big name a cupcake. And then if the big name loses, the cupcake is standing there with his, you know, his hand in his pants thinking like, okay, well, what do we do with this guy now?

You need to at least bring someone who you think can then become a star if he beats this guy, not just some no-nameer. Our next question. Isn't CM Punk being a bit of a hypocrite here? His career blew up by cutting a shoot promo where he bemoan the success and airtime of guys who he perceived to be lesser talents than himself. Now he's perfectly happy to insert himself into a role that he has no chance to perform competently in. I don't know if that's fair, all while taking a spot from a greater talent with better credentials.

See, this whole taking a spot thing makes no sense to me. I mean, again, we've been talking about and Pollock, you know, nailed it. And you know, tough China. You know, are those guys taking people spots? In this day and age, the UFC is not the UFC of four or five years ago. It's a completely different promotion. And we were saying this before this story ever came out. What it means to be UFC caliber fighter does not mean the same thing.

So I don't think he's taking anyone's spot. That fight just wouldn't be made. You know, it's not like someone was supposed to be on that card in December of next year, UFC 190, whatever, and he's going to take that spot. It's just not the case. But those guys from Tough China aren't going to be on a pay-per-view. Yeah, but, okay, that's just being smart. They're on a big show in China.

They're on a flight pass show. People are buying that. I mean, that's just being smart because you know that that can sell pay-per-views here in the United States. The point is, there wasn't someone earmarked for that position that he's now usurping and taking his spot and making his money. That's just not the way it works. No, that's fair enough. It's not like a roster, and there's X amount of guys that need to be on that roster, and now he took that guy's spot. I think you're setting the threshold at...

on the roster or off the roster, but I think the real threshold is on pay-per-view or off-paper-view. But look at some of the guys who have been on paper views with all due respect this year. I mean, yes, they have backgrounds, they have experience, without a doubt. But, I mean, we've complained many times and many more people have complained a lot more than us that these aren't pay-per-view caliber fighters. Now, one thing we do know for sure is that CM Punk is a pay-per-view caliber name. Now, does he deserve to be there in the UFC? In this day and age, I think all bets are off.

It's a different UFC. Four or five years ago, I guarantee you this doesn't get done because times were different. Perhaps business was better. Perhaps they had less shows, less fights. They didn't want to open the door to this. But I don't think that this means that Shaquille O'Neal is coming in or George Clooney or anything like that. CM Punk is a very convincing man. And I truly believe that if the UFC would have said, go out there and fight a couple fights, he would have done it.

He really wants to be a fighter. He loves MMA. He wants to be a fighter. He would have done it. Now, it was up to Dana and Lorenzo to say to themselves, sorry, well, the money is in that first fight. We need to be a part of that first fight, and that's why they're going for it. This is a bit lengthy, but this is, Ariel, I know you're a fan of pro wrestling

and actually a really big fan of CM Punk in particular. I know that while a lot of diehard MMA fans such as myself are sort of laughing at the signing of CM Punk from a standpoint of mediocrity, that you are probably marking out all over the place. But I am really curious as to your thoughts about what you believe. you've seen on Punk's rationalization is for why he thinks that the fans, the UFC brass, and the fighters will have to respect him for entering their domain while he was very vocal about being upset that, quote unquote, some actor could come share the stage with him on his turf. Can we stop right there? Yeah. So I don't forget. Okay. I thought, and you tell me what you

thought about this, I thought he handled Saturday night perfectly. He said all the right things. I thought he came across as humble. I thought he came across as respectful. I know it was important to him to not be on the. same stage as everyone, and he addressed that, that he didn't want to be, you know, on the dais with Pettus and Hendricks and all those guys, because they had just fought, it was their moment. He didn't want to take away their shine, so to speak. So when he says, we'll have to respect him or we'll have to respect me, what he means by that is the proof is going to be in the pudding. You may not respect me now, but by the time this is all said and done, by the time my

MMA career is over, you will have to respect me because I will have shown you that I did put in the work, that I am serious, that I can be a good fighter. That's what he's saying. there. So it, to me, it has nothing to do with, like, you know, his rationalization for why he thinks that the fans and everyone should, you know, watch him right now. He is definitely of the mindset that by the time this is all said and done, like, he knows that right now, you probably don't want to watch him. Or at least there's a big group of people who think he doesn't deserve to be there. But what he's saying is, when this is all said and done, then you will learn that he took this seriously that he deserved to be there. Completely agree there. But I think the second part

of this is where it gets more interesting. Go ahead. Why do you suppose? that punk thinks it's okay for him to jump into the sports grandest stage, the UFC Octagon, without having a fighting background, but that it was taboo for the rock, Dwayne Johnson, to leave his rightful place, quote unquote, in Hollywood, to come play wrestler with him in a WWE ring, a place where Johnson, unlike Punk in a Cage, had actually built a reputation and brand on pay-per-view. Okay, so I don't want to be like Punk's defender here.

But again, this is just my take on this whole situation. And to some degree it has nothing to do with the fact that I know the guy, but I don't want to lie about the fact that, you know, we've done interviews and I've been to his house, and you've seen this all on paper. I mean, he's not my best friend. We don't send each other Christmas cards or Hanukkah cards, but I just want to throw that out there. Okay, it's sort of a lot to digest, but in a sense, I don't understand the idea of begrudging him and putting him down for taking this opportunity. Don't we all want the best? Don't we all want to shoot for the stars? If that spot is open, why not take it? Now, if you have a problem with Dana White and Lorenzo,

or for Tita and the UFC open their doors to him, I get that. But if you're going to get the opportunity to fight in the UFC to get the most amount of attention to be a part of the largest organization, why wouldn't you take that spot? I truly believe him once again that if they would have said no, he would have went elsewhere. So this is a guy who shot for the moon, who said he wanted to be a part of it. They said yes. He took that spot. What did you want it to say?

No. Now, the other thing is you talk about this rock situation and other people taking spots. again, he's not fighting Johnny Hendricks or Robbie Loller for the belt. He's not going to challenge Chris Wyman. I think his issue was, and you have to understand the world of pro wrestling, the rock was coming in there as a part-timer as someone who didn't stick around on Monday. And it gets a little weird comparing both, but I'll play along. He was taking the top spot.

He was taking the main event of International Fight Week. You know, he was taking the top spot of the biggest event of the year. He's not taking that spot. No one is saying that he's going to be the main event at the best. July 4th card. No one is saying that he's going to be the main event of, you know, it's not happening. And he's not taking Roy McDonald's spot. They didn't sign him to fight for the belt. So I don't feel like it's the same at all. He wanted to fight MMA and to go back to the first point, this is a guy, as he said to me, he doesn't live with regrets. And it would have ate him up

inside if he didn't do it. He wanted to do it from the moment I met him. He talked about it. He's a huge fan. He watches everything. He is a bigger fan of M.A. these days than pro wrestling. He watches the Wayans shows UFC tonight. He consumes it. He consumes it. all. He loves it. And he always wanted to know what it would be like. And to me, this reminds me of why we all got into this. At least I did. When I sat down and watched UFC 1, I didn't know who these people were, but I just wanted to know if this guy could beat that guy. And this is a guy who wants to know that for himself. So I have no problem with it. Our next question, do you wait until April or May to put Habib Narmaga made of against Anthony Pettis, or do you book Soroni before

then if he's healthy after the jury fight since Cowboy loves fighting back to back? with the idea of Anthony Pettis fighting in April, but I don't, or I have my doubts that Habib and Ramagamatov makes it to April, or at least is ready for April. Because again, he had ACL surgery in July. I don't know if April is enough time. You know, if you look at the schedule, they like to have a title fight on the pay-per-views. So we already know what's happening in January, February. March, it sounds like they want to do Dominic versus T.J. And they haven't fought quite some time, so that would make sense. All right. So now it's time for April. I'd love to see Pettis fight in April because that means he can maybe fight in August

and maybe December if all goes well. So I'm down with that, but I don't know if Habib is ready. And then you have the problem that, okay, if Chabib is not ready, let's say Dosangos wins. Where is he in this question? He gets no respect. He beats Saroni. So what do you do? I think if they're all, if they're all equal, they're all on winning streaks, they're all healthy. I give it to Chabib first. I think he's done a good job of selling himself and getting the word out there and generating interest. And he has a win over Doseon. Sanjos, who beats Saroni, I think if he's out of the question, we have to see what happens in those two fights. They're fighting, you know, in the next month or so, both of them. So we should find out

pretty soon. Uriah Fabor's win. I'm a big fan of Uriah, and I'm sure that it was an accident, but do you believe that Rivera deserves a rematch or should that fight be turned into a no-contest? I think historically they don't go that route, the no-contest route. I have no problem with the rematch because I think the first round was close. And if you look at the Bantamweight Division right now, no real obvious answer for your i he's kind of stuck in limbo especially with tj and dominic supposed you know they're supposed to fight around april or so i mean he could get he could be on that card so i have no problem with that idea and i think it's kind of the fair thing to do here i think it would make a lot of sense so yeah i'm down okay this is this is a big one but try and quickly

distill it hey ariel i know this seems like a lifetime ago now but what are your thoughts on the uc slash rebuck deal long term do you think it benefits the sport and the fighters also if the deal is to launch in July 2015, how do you think the fighters will be affected between now and then? Is it not possible a lot of companies will be hesitant to sponsor fighters if they're not going to get any long-term return for it? Could this not lead to a lot of fighters struggling for sponsors and therefore income over the next seven months? Absolutely. I mean, this makes the next six or so months a very lame duck period for sponsorship. Now, I was just talking to John Fitch about this prior to him leaving. The sponsorship game in MMA has changed drastically. Some might say it's

because of the sports popularity going down. Some might say it's because of the sponsorship tax. There's no real answer. I mean, no one knows definitively why, but the fact of the matter is, it has gone down. So I suspect that it will go down even more by the time this happens, perhaps making the Reebok deal that much more welcome to the fighters. Now, as for the actual deal itself, I really have a hard time, and it's not me sitting on the fence or trying to, you know, be as kind as possible. I really have a hard to. time weighing in on it because of two reasons. A, we don't know the facts. I mean, we really don't know what the breakdown is. We don't know what percentage the champion gets. We don't know what percentage

1 through 5 gets, 6 through 10, 11 through 15, et cetera. We just don't know that. We don't know percentage, you know, how much money is involved for the fighters. We really don't know those numbers. And the second reason why I have a hard time weighing in on it is the fighters don't know. I mean, I'll be honest, I've talked to a lot of top-named fighters. Believe it or not, I can talk to these people. They do pick up the phone sometimes when I reach out to them. And they don't know. Very big names don't know. They don't know yet. It's all very fresh. They kind of found out like the rest of us. Now, is that a problem? Yeah. I mean, Dana White called some of them and that is true. I know that for a fact. But they haven't seen it and digested it and figured out if it all makes sense for them.

So if they don't know, and if they don't have a take and if they're reserving judgment, I say let's weigh in on this come July or May or whenever it actually happens. One thing that hasn't been brought up about the uniform deal. I met this woman on Tuesday in New York City when they were here to announce it. They hired two people from the NFL who were in charge of uniforms, just that whole business. Now, I'm not saying that this makes it good or bad for the fighters, but I thought that was really interesting that they poached two executives from the NFL, who unfortunately their names escape me right now, so I apologize for that,

but really to focus on this for quite some time. And I think it's interesting to hear Matt Hughes talk about that he was looking out for the fighters' best interest and all this stuff. So I feel like with time coming, you know, with more and more time as we approach July, I think we'll have a better sense as to whether or not this is good or bad for the fighters. The one thing I will say about it, though, is I would have loved to see a situation where in this case there is some kind of players association or fighters' association, I should say, who when it all came down to the fact, okay, they want to make this happen, they look at it, they get to see the facts and figures and say, okay, is this better for us

as fighters. I think that was an important point that was brought up, and that's something that I think would have been in their best interest. It could have been good. I mean, they could have decided that, but I would have felt a lot more comfortable with it if that happened. End of the day,

we'll see what happens, but that's kind of my take on the uniform right now. And I love, man, Twitter. How was Twitter? Twitter, last Tuesday, the hot takes on the uniforms from the media were just, I mean, it was nauseating. I mean, my, and you know what happened?

That was on my six-year, anniversary with Twitter. And it just, I had never been so tempted to delete Twitter because all these people talking out of their ass that knew nothing about the deal, five minutes before, that know nothing about the deal now, just going on and on and on with their takes

on the uniform deal. And now we see the same thing. Gross. Ugh, the worst. Our next one, good title. Ask Grin for trouble. Is there anything? I love the Phil Brooks thing, by the way.

I hate to harp on this. But like, the same people who call him Kimball Slice, they can't call him CM Punk. They can't resort to calling him CM Punk. Amazing. Yeah, that's a little weird. Come on. You've seen it too, right?

Maybe. It's been all over the boys. Phil Brooks, Phil Brooks, Phil Brooks. Guy's CM Punk. You called him Kimbo Slice. I mean... Well, every fighter, like Showtime or whatever nickname. A lot of people call them by their nickname.

I think... Great point. I think it's almost disrespectful. It's almost disrespectful. Like, this is what he wants to be called. And why? Just because it's pro wrestling. You can't call. I mean, Hafeel Feijal. Who calls him Hafeel Cavalcante, right?

Exactly. Exactly. In Brazil, that's part of the culture. I'm not saying it's the culture here, but it's just because it's pro wrestling. Don't forget that. Is there anything more childish than Ben Ascran, constantly bitching about the UFC and Dana White in particular, telling anyone within an earshot he doesn't care about being there only to then pick fights with their fighters? He's a dominant fighter that seems clueless to multiple media reasons CM Punk was signed, and he was not. my take on the Ascran thing is this. I don't understand why people still bring him up as like, what they signed, but they said that Ben Ascran didn't have enough experience. Did you really think that that was the reason why they didn't sign Ben Ascran?

Honestly, did you really think that? Now, I know they said that, but since when do all the people who are questioning this decision always believe what the UFC says at face value, that they take this at face value? They don't. But they keep bringing this up over and over again. Now, if I'm Ben Ascran, yeah, of course.

course I'm pissed. I wanted to be in the UFC. I wanted to fight the best. I was available. I was a free agent and they told me I didn't have enough experience. Of course, but do we know what happened behind the scenes? We don't know, but that's what was said publicly. So it's a great thing to put out there. Of course, we know the reason why he wasn't signed to the UFC. They didn't like him. And again, I go back to that. It's the same thing with the Hall of Fame. They put the people that they like in there. They don't put the people that they don't like. They put the people that they don't like on TV. That's their thing. That's their prerogative. They're the only. They're the people that they're the owners. They're not a league. They're owners of a company. Owners of an organization, they can do whatever

they want. If a day comes where things change in this sport and the dynamic is different, then we can seriously point fingers, but they're the owners. Now, you can disagree with their way of handling it, the fact that they told us something that probably wasn't the truth, the fact that they didn't bring in the best, when they want to be considered the best. I mean, they're all legitimate issues. I think Ben Asker should be in the UFC. I wish he had a title shot already. I have no problem with that. And I have, and I have. And I, and, and, wish it happened. Saw him on Thursday. I genuinely, sincerely wish it happened. Unfortunately, it's not happening now. I do believe, though, at the end of the day, it will happen. When it's all

said and done, I really do think it's going to happen. But all that being said, I don't understand why people keep bringing this up. Are we going to keep doing this until we're blue until he actually gets signed? The reason they didn't sign Ben Ascreen is because they didn't like him. And they got off to a rough start, and he said some things, and they said some things. And that's their prerogative. So I don't think Sienpunk has anything to do with Ascran. I don't think he's taking Ascran's spot. The only one who has a legitimate gripe in all of this is Ascran because he didn't get the deal that he wanted. But I think it's going to happen. How about John Fitch saying he could, his contract allows for him to fight Ben Ascran

internationally? That'd be a hell of a fight. How about John Fitch, period? Oh, great interview. Yes. He's super interesting, dude. He's just an interesting guy. Okay. And I feel like I have a very similar take on, you know, promotion in MMA. I think that he's a man after my heart. Oh, yes, you're right. That is true. Good call. Okay. So, Twitter. What's your take on how the UFC media and fans will react to John Jones' new heel persona in the UFC commercial for that fight? By the way, how much fun is this week? I mean, there's just so much to talk about here. So this 182 promo, you saw it? Yes, of course.

I know you were hobnobbing with celebrities on Saturday, so I don't know. Shout out to Skyler. Yeah, look at you. Look at you. Two weekends in a row? No. Yeah, I saw Skyler a bit. Ground floor, TBS, tomorrow.

Look at you. A real star effort, huh? So. Mr. CM Punk over here is giving me shit. I mean, it's relevant. I'm not going around flaunting it in people's faces. Who's flunting it? Okay. This promo that aired on Saturday, 182.

Maybe the, I think it's the longest pay-per-view promo in UFC history, A, B, I think it's one of the best, if not the best ever. And by the way, also a shout out to the one with Anderson Silva. And I think it was also one air too. Those were unbelievable. I mean, they really stepped up their game. Yeah. This one was fascinating because there was no fight footage. It's all about the brawl and the quote unquote leaked footage and all that. And especially the end, when John finds out that this is actually going some. and it can be grabbed is is is pretty hilarious stuff and and it's uh captivating uh i love it as a fan i think it's great and i watched it a few times however if i'm john jones i don't know how i feel about this thing i feel like he had a reaction on twitter well he forget what exactly he said he said

something like well he said please tell me if this was actually good or bad for the sport this bra right right right right but i was expecting his i was expecting his reaction to be like wait a second they're painting me out to be the bad guy they're painting me out to be the two-faced, you know, I'll stab you in the back, I'm fake, all this stuff. You know, they're showing him shaking people's hands, and yet he's doing, you know, he's, he's doing an interview this, this way with this tone, and then he's talking this way behind the scenes. I mean, if I'm Daniel Cormier, I love that promo. That was a gift from God. That's the greatest thing ever. If I'm Jones, I'm like, wait a second. First, they say Pettis is the pound for pound best before he

actually fought, and now they're putting this out. I feel like these guys don't really like me. Let's rewind for a second. You said, quote-unquote leaked footage. Are you implying something? Well, no, I mean, no, I actually kind of know the story behind the leaked footage thing, and I don't think the UFC had anything to do with it. 100% I believe that, and I know that. But I think that now that it's out there, once it's out, run with it. Run with it, man. And that's the smart thing to do. Yeah, why wouldn't you use it? Why wouldn't you? Well, there is a reason why you wouldn't. It's because you pretended to make it like it was a big deal that you're disciplining. Well, oh, they were disciplining about the brawl,

but they didn't discipline about the back and forth. Oh, no, but I mean, the brawl is the centerpiece for this entire thing. Sure. Obviously, the most interesting one was when they thought they were, you know, off mic and they were, you know, trading barbs. But the brawl is the centerpiece for this entire commercial and promotion. And if, you know, that's the one that they're supposed to be being punished for, promoting it seems like a bit of a...

Yeah, if I'm, if I'm Jones in D.C., I'm like, can I get that money back? Exactly. Yeah. Or at least pay for it for me. Take that it. Pay for it. Maybe they did. Next question, or I believe final question.

Do you guys like the Wheaties box? You have it on your desk right there. Why does Showtime look like Irwin R. Scheister? By the way, you totally botched the spelling of IRS's name. Sure. But even I know that one. Yes. Even I know that one. Yes, IRS. What was his real name? Gosh, I forget now. Okay, so here's the Wheaties box. You see it right here. This is Anthony Pettis on the cover. They unveiled this on Thursday. Move it back a little bit because it's very hazy. How's that? Yeah, it's much better. which I thought was quite ballsy because they unveiled

this on Thursday. Picture of him with the belt right there. It says UFC champion there. Picture with him with the belt right there. I thought that was balsy because in 48 hours this could have been very, very outdated. But crisis averted, as

Sean Alshaddy wrote on Twitter after he won. First of all, I think this is the first time I ever have a Wheaties box in my possession. They gave these out afterwards. I've looked at the ingredients. I don't know how healthy this. thing is, but that's besides the point. Listen, that's the breakfast of champions right there. I would have, like, personally, if I was in charge, an action shot.

I don't think that this tells me who showtime peddice is. You know what I mean? This doesn't feel like show... I want to see him jumping up the cage. I want to see him doing some crazy kick in the air. That's MMA. This to me feels like we're trying to be corporate America. You know what I'm saying?

Is that necessarily so bad? And also black and white? Are they always black and white on Wheaties? That, I don't know. But is it necessarily so bad to depict a UFC fighter in that kind of If we're going to go UFC fighter, let's go UFC fighter. And, you know, I don't know if I've ever said this on the show. I'm not a huge fan of the whole, like, tie undone look.

But now I'm just nitpicking. I mean, he looks great. He's a very good-looking guy. Tremendous hair. That is definitely nitpicking. He looks great. But I'm just saying, if we're going to go with the suit, let's go with the suit. So if it was up, it was up to me, I would go with him doing something athletic, like, you know, active.

I mean, maybe he was, you know, maybe he was out of training camp or coming back. I don't know. It's pretty cool in the back. They say what he, his belts that he has. I mean, this is... Oh, I didn't even see that picture on the back. Yeah. This is a big deal for the sport.

Make no mistake about it. But, you know, if I'm nitpicking, if you're asking me the question, I go with a different picture. What a performance. Yes. Incredible. That's it? That's it for the questions, yeah. Okay, we're done.

Well, it's 430. It's actually 431. Boom. And I'm afraid to get you out like that. To feel the wrath. But you know what? I'm going to go just two more minutes, if you don't mind. I just want to get your, your odds picks for this weekend.

UFC? JDS Miotich. Are they? Yes, go ahead. Oh, just that one fight? That's the fight? I'll go to Friday. It's just the fight.

It's just that one fight. Oh, of course, JDS is the favorite. Yes, minus 385. Actually, minus 350 plus 289. Seems as well, right, yeah. Hill Kagan, Angela Hill. Yeah, I know. She trains out of New York.

Oh. I think she actually trains in North Carolina, but she's from New York. Well, she was at a square circle for a while. But I'll go Angela Hill. Correct. 175 plus 135, Daily chambers.

Daily. Yep. Minus 250 plus 210. Rawlings Clark. Rowdy Beck. Minus 203 plus 209. Calderwood Ham. Jojo.

Minus 500 plus 385. Magania Torres. Or should I say? your majesty. Or should I say Miss Ex-Poc? I think Tisha has got that one.

You think? She's probably the biggest favorite. Yeah, minus 570 plus 450. Herrig Ellis. Felice. Minus 300 plus two.

Is that an eight or a six? I think it's an eight. Yes, you're right. Proctor Mederos. Proctor looked good, but I'm going to go Yancey on this one. plus 212 for Proctor

minus 205 for Madero's interesting so Nate Diaz won't be in his corner because he's fighting on Saturday KJ Noons versus Cruikshank Crookshank Wow yeah I'm surprised with that one No no minus 203 plus 175 No interesting

And then Charles Orlavera versus Jeremy Stevens This is a tough one Stevens just lost Dubrox has been looking good I'll say Dublovera Do Bronx very, very slight. Wrong.

Stevens is the favorite. Plus 111 versus minus 130. Interesting. Yeah. I don't know where to go on that one. I would stay away from that betting-wise. It's tough, I mean, tough fight to call. All right.

So another fun weekend coming up. This week's show is finally in the books. Great show, and we almost made it. Four minutes over. We're getting better. Yeah. You can hit my music. So not only...

are there two UFCs this weekend? Friday night, Fox Sports 1, the entire card. Well, there's five past prelims, but you get the point, main card, prelims, all that stuff. And then Saturday, it's Fox 13 from Phoenix, looking forward to being in Phoenix. Last time I was in Arizona was for the final WEC event. WC 53. Of course, that's when Pett has hit the Showtime kick.

And this is the first ever trip for the UFC in Phoenix. So that's pretty cool. I know those fans have been asking for that for quite some time. And also Saturday NBCSN World Series of Fighting 16, Husseymar Paul Harris versus John Fitch, and also the featherweight title on the line. Rick Land, defending for the first time against Lance Palmer. You know him from Team Alpha Mail. All right.

I want to thank everyone who tuned in, everyone who stopped by. Also, the fans that I met in Las Vegas, as always great. One chap in particular, I believe he was named James. Met him on Friday, big fan of the show. fan and Mr. New York Rick. So thank you very much to James for all his support and to everyone I met for all their kind words.

Enjoyed my time in Las Vegas. Thank you very much to John Pollock for stopping by. Great stuff on CM Punk. Check him out on the Fight Network and live audio wrestling. Thank you very much to KJ Noons. Best of luck to him this Friday. It's Darren Cruikshank. Thank you very much to Tom Wright. Good luck with that TV deal and all the other

stuff he's working on. Thank you very much to Frank Mir. Good luck to him. John Fitch, good luck to him. And thank you very much to Matt Hughes for his time as well. Next week, final show the year awards time. Can't wait. If you missed anything, iTunes, Stitcher SoundCloud, tell you. So, Maria. Support for this show comes from Odu. Running a business is hard enough. So why make it harder with a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other? Introducing Odu. It's the only business software you'll ever need. It's an all-in-one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier. CRM, accounting, inventory,

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