MMA Fighting - The MMA Hour - Episode 278

Episode Date: April 20, 2015

Featuring Phil Davis, Hector Lombard, Max Holloway, Gian Villante, Jessica Rakoczy, Sarah Kaufman, Stephane Patry, and Shaun Al-Shatti. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Support for this show comes from the Audible Original, the downloaded two, ghosts in the machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudullian and the rest of the Phoenix colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever. Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprised his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the Audible Original Blockbuster. The Downloaded, it's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking, What are you willing to lose to save the ones you love?

The Downloaded 2. Ghosts in the Machine. Available now, only from Audible. Support for the show comes from Odu. Running a business is hard enough, so why make it harder with a dozen different apps that don't talk to talk to each other. Introducing O-DU. It's the only business software you'll ever need. It's an all-in-one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier,

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Hi, Mario Hawani, inside our New York City studio. Great to be inside. It is pouring outside here in New York. Pour it. Everyone who came to this area to watch UFC on Fox 15 over the weekend. They were lucky. They had tremendous weather. It was like all those people from the West Coast brought this amazing weather here.

but now it is pouring outside, so it's a great day to be inside and talk some MMA. I got to tell you, I am still, there are some performances that hours and days later you're left kind of, you're still in awe. You're still thinking, like, how the hell did that happen? You know, T.J. Dillishaw, Hennon Burrell last year, U.S.C. 173, that was a performance where I was left in awe of the winner, T.J. Dillishaw. I feel the same way about what Luke Rockhold did to Liro Machita on Saturday. I view Luke Rockhold in a whole different light now. He is on a whole other level. You just don't do that kind of thing to Liota Machita.

You don't beat up Liota Machita like that. All of a sudden, Leona Machita feels very, very old. An amazing performance. We're going to talk about that. Of course, later on in the show. Some big wins on Saturday in Newark. It felt like a changing of the guards, so to speak. Al Jermaine Sterling with a huge win.

Max Holloway with a huge win. Benil Dariush with a huge win. Paige Van Zant with a huge win and of course Luke Rockhold with a huge win all youngsters

over veterans if you will I like that sort of thing so we'll talk about that and of course it's UFC 186 fight week

Montreal now in everyone's mind and I know I know I know I know I know I know the card has been hit I know it's not what we thought

it was going to be but the UFC is back in Montreal for the first time in a very long time and I think I have a feeling about this card

I don't know what it is is I have a feeling something is going to happen. Hopefully something good. We'll talk about that as well. We have a few guests who will be competing on that car. We have some VIPs in the house. Esther and Casey, the creative duo, the first family, the first couple of mixed martial arts there in the house,

and the Forrest Gump of MMA, Andrew Mayer, also in the house. How about that? VIP's here today, watching the MMA hour in studio. Okay, who's joining us on today's show? Well, we have a packed show, as always, at around 350, we're going to hear from you. So hit us up using the hashtag the MMA hour.

Leave a question or comment in the comment section below. We have a lot to discuss. Another very busy week in the world of mixed martial arts. So hit us up right now. A lot of you have done so already. 345, we'll go inside the ball. A very fun one. A very fun one from four years ago that actually happened on this very show.

So stay tuned for that. 325. We're going to talk to Sarah Kaufman. A lot of people forget Sarah Kaufman has actually defeated Alexis Davis twice. This is a trilogy fight. It's not a rematch. A trilogy fight. They fought way back when, early in their careers, and then, of course, in Strike Force a few years ago, they're fighting again this Saturday.

And one of the most important fights on the card, two ranked fighters. It's on the prelims, but it's an important fight, and it's always great to talk to the fellow Canadian, Sarah Kaufman. She'll join us at 325. 305. We're going to talk to Max Holloway. Respect to Max Holloway. A huge win over Cub Swanson. A lot of people thought he wasn't ready for it, but wow, did he prove the doubters wrong?

What a win for him, his sixth in a row. He is on a role and has reached that contender status, in my opinion. I'm curious to see where the great UFC rankers rank him later on today. 245, we'll talk to Hector Lombard. This is his first interview since he failed his UFC 182 drug test, and, of course, received that pretty lengthy and hefty suspension from the Nevada Athletic Commission. 225, we're going to talk to Stefan Patri. If you don't know him, he was the first manager for one GSP, George St. Pierre,

also longtime MMA promoter. He manages Steve Bosset, who faces Fabio Maldonado this weekend. He knows a thing or two about the MMA scene in Quebec, so we'll talk to him about that, and UFC 186 and his business and all that stuff. 205, we're going to talk to Jessica Rikosi, who returns after a very, very long layoff. She returns this Saturday at UFC 186, the Canadian Strawweight. She was in the finals of Tough 20 against Julianna Pena, but she has dropped down from Bantamweight to Strawway.

145, we're going to talk to John Volante about his big win, thrilling win over Corey Anderson. He is now $50,000 richer. And at 125, we're going to talk to Sean Alshaddy of MMAfighting.com about the week that was in mixed martial arts and of course the week ahead as well. It's great to be back hosting. I was just hosting this past weekend, the weigh-in show and the pre-fight show and the post-fight show. It felt great, but it's good to be back here among my people, the comforts of the MMA hour studio doing what I love. to do every single Monday. For now, though let us go to

the first guest of the day. Let's go to the phone lines. He is the newest member of the Beltor MMA team. He just signed last week, last Wednesday to be exact, one of the very best 205 pounds in the world, and now he is switching teams. His name, Phil Davis,

Mr. Wonderful, he joins us right now on the phone. Phil, how are you? Hey, what's going on, Ariel? How are you? I'm doing great. Congratulations on the New Deal. My first question is, why did you sign with Bellator? It seems to be the question everyone likes to ask. To me, I think it's one of the most obvious, but it's like anything, you know?

It's fighting is a job for me. I love it, but at the same time, it is for pays the bills, you know. I'm sure you love your job at the MMA hour, and you would cry if you had to leave. But if there were a reason why you would leave, it might be a job opportunity somewhere else, correct? Sure. Everyone knows it's a business. But there would have to be more in it, right?

What's that? Say it again? But there would have to be more in it. There would have to be something, you know, the reason. Yeah, reason, right? Yeah, exactly. So, it's like anything. So, correct me if I'm wrong here.

You were offered, or at least there were talks. of you signing a new deal before the Ryan Bader fight, and the UFC typically, especially when you're dealing with big-name fighters, rank fighters, they don't like you to go into a fight with just one fight left. They try to have you sign a deal before going into that last fight for obvious reasons, but you decided that you're going to roll the dice and test the water, so to speak. Is that accurate? That is accurate.

And then you go into that fight against Ryan Bader, and of course it doesn't go your way. Did you feel as though the gamble didn't pay off? Because, I mean, no secret if you win, you have more leverage. Absolutely. In some ways, I felt like the gamble didn't pay off. I'm like, ah, crap, I might have ruined everything. On the other hand, man, I just kind of lived by faith.

And, you know, God puts me exactly really wanting to be. And I try not to worry about the details of life. uh, too much either way. If it's, if it's good, you know, I try,

you know, I try to claim that victory for myself because I really didn't do it. And if it happens to not go my way, I try not to get too bummed about it because, you know,

there's a bigger picture. What was the thought process behind not trying to sign a deal before that beta fight and testing the waters? Because I think there are a lot of fighters who like the security of saying, okay,

I'm not going into a fight with none left after this one. You see a lot of guys signing that deal beforehand. Why did you say, you know what, I'm going to roll the dice here? Well, that's just it.

Security is a myth. Security is a mirage. There is no security in the fight game. There is no security. You have a bad performance. You can be cut. It's as simple as that.

You know, it doesn't matter if you're, you know, older guy, newer guy, half of the ninth. You know, you can be cut

based on your performance. performance then. Security just does not exist. So it's best to go with what is on the table. You know, don't go with, there could be more security if I stay here. Well, that doesn't really exist. Was a part of the thought process, you know, maybe the deal wasn't what you wanted? Like, if they would have offered you a tremendous amount of money, a tremendous deal,

would you have taken it or no matter what you were going to go into that fight and afterwards as a free agent. You weren't going to sign anything. Oh, 100%. Um, 100%, you know, there, it wasn't like I wanted to get away from the UFC. Not at all. I absolutely love everybody at the UFC and, and I thank Dana Lorenzo for giving me my, uh, my big break in, and MMA and giving me a chance to fight on the big stage.

And, you know, I have nothing but gratitude to express to those guys. and I would have liked to sign a big contract and stay with the UFC. Sure, that was my first option. But as more options became available, I went with other options. You know, this is, it's hard to look at it emotionally. I'm entirely looking at it as a business move. There's probably no one out there when offered a better opportunity. No, I'll speak with what I'm used to, you know?

And just to be clear, did they actually offer you something before the Ryan Bader fight? Oh, absolutely. And how does that compare it to what you ended up signing? It was comparable, but not what I wanted. Okay. And then after the Bater fight was the same deal on the table, or did they change it, or not even offer you anything? No, after the beta fight, the same deal was on the table. you know, like I said, everybody at the U.S.C.

This is not a parting of ways where, you know, I hate you, you hate me, where I'm out of here, you know. I quit kind of deal. No, not at all. You know, the guys at the U.S.C., they're the businessman, and they're one of the organization. And, you know, same thing. I'm a businessman. I run my own business. And so this offer that you signed with Bellator, is it better than the deal that they offered you?

I'm sorry? The offer that you signed with Beltor, the contract that you signed with Beltor, is it better than the UFC's deal? You know, I definitely preferred it better than the deal with the UFC, yes. Was it all about money, or were there other sort of flexibilities that were offered, you know, because we sometimes hear when Viacom offers a deal, there's TV stuff, there's this or that, there are other things that they throw in there because of Viacom and the networks that are under that umbrella. was that involved as well or was it was it something else um there were other things other than money but then again you know the fight game is simple i i i fight for money you know it's like

anything you know um that's that's what i do did other organizations come after you did you get offers from the world series of fightings the one-fc's etc um you know what honestly uh i do believe so. I do believe so, but I completely take the backseat and all this stuff, allow my management to do all the hard work. They go out and talk to whomever and filled all the options, and the options they presented me with were just that of UFC and Bellator. And I'm pretty sure there were other offers.

I just don't know from whom and for, or what? what the details of those deals were. You know, one detail that I think has flown under the radar here is that your management team, Zinken Entertainment, Zincolm, management, they have a great relationship with Scott Coker. You know, back when Scott Coker was the president of, you know, Strike Force, CEO of Strikeforce, he signed a lot of the Zinken guys, right? Kane Velasquez, Luke Rockhold, Josh Thompson, et cetera, et cetera. And now you kind of feel like the first big free agent from Zinken.

who was made available once Coker took over Bellator. How much of an influence did your management team have in this decision in the sense that if they didn't have that relationship with Coker, would you have possibly gone somewhere else? What do you think? That's asking me to put my, what if, you know, a guess upon the relationship that my management has with Scott Coker. simply put, you know, my management team is one of the best, arguably the best, I should say.

They are arguably the best. Definitely have some of the best fighters in the world, some champions of all sort. I heard you talking about Luke Rockhold, one of my buddies on the way in. So, you know, we have good fighters, and obviously good promotions like good fighters. I mean, that's an obvious relationship right there. I mean, there's no, I can't, yeah, there's a little bit of a, a relationship there, but anybody could have that relationship with Scott Coker, given a multitude of good fighters.

Have you ever met Scott? Yeah, I met Scott briefly when the Vellator came to San Diego. last year. And what do you make of him? Some might say that he's not your typical promoter. You know, I just, you know, I shook his hand, say hello. And, you know, that was it. We didn't even have a hot-good conversation at this time.

I was, you know, busy worried about my boy, Michael, Michael Chandler. Okay. I just wanted to shake his hand, say hello. What do you, what do you, go ahead, sorry, I thought you were going to say something else. Are you disappointed? ultimately that the UFC didn't match this offer, like deep down, would you have preferred to stay there? No, no, no, no, no.

It's not moving to Belletore is not an opportunity where you say, I'm disappointed in anything. Okay. You know, if I was working for FedEx and UPS offered me a better job, can you go to UPS? The only thing that brings up hurt feelings is that I have a lot of friends and family that work for the UFC, the people of the organizations that I won't be able to see on a regular basis. That's simply it. There's no hurt feelings any other way.

And, you know, it's just one of those things that happens in life, you know? Do you feel like something like this is important in MMA because we don't often see, you know, of course there's that lawsuit out there and there are people who have said that there aren't a lot of options for fighters for a big name, ranked fighter, who's in the top 10, who's had huge wins in the UFC against some of the biggest, you know, names. of all time. Do you think it's important for things like this to happen to show people that, look, in this day and age in 2015, there are options. You don't have to just, you know, settle on the deal that is offered to you. You can go out there and test the waters. Do you view

yourself as someone who's taken a big step for, for fighters' rights and things of that nature? Well, I certainly, I certainly hope so. I will never want anyone in any job to feel confined to working on that job, you know? That, I mean, if you are, if you're in sports, you know, especially in the fight game, you know, definitely, definitely go after the best offer, shoot, you know, shoot for the stars, you know. As fighters, you definitely want to,

especially when you perform well, you want to get compensated well. at the end of your career, you don't want to say, man, you know, I should have done this, it should have done that. You know, as a whole, like fighters are a group of risk takers. But when it comes to that category of, you know, shopping out the best deal for the contract, they become not that big of risk takers for most part. You know, around this time last year, that's when you're, if you want to call it a rival

with John Jones really started to ramp up when you were fighting on the same card as him, UFC 172. And, you know, he's commented on your departure. I'll ask you about that in a second. But does a part of you leave a little disappointed that you never got that shot against him to test yourself against the champion

in that organization, the UFC? Well, simply put, I don't fight to beat people. I fight to be the best. John Jones is the best guy in the UFC. and I definitely want to be the best and that meant fighting him and slightly bummed I didn't get a chance to fight him but at the same time, not really.

Why not? Because it really felt like you wanted to test yourself against him. Oh, I do. Oh, I 100% do. But like I said, my goal in M.A. It's not to fight a particular person. It's to be the best.

And if he's the best at that time, sure, yes, I would like to fight you. If he's not the best at that time, I want to fight whoever it is. He was on Ander Alovsky's live chat, and he referred to you as Mr. JV, and he said, Good luck crumbling me like a cookie from all the way over there. What do you make of him taking a couple shots at you on the way out? He refers to me as Mr. JV. He called you, yes. Oh, he said, quote,

Oh, my goodness, Mr. JV himself. To be honest, I'm happy for him. If he's going to make more money over there, ultimately it's about providing for our families. It's a job at the end of the day. If he's going to be treated better over there, good for him. I do believe the competition is not as stiff, not as stiff at Beltaire as the UFC,

so I think he'll definitely be a top three guy in the world now. Good for him. Maybe he'll even win it. To be a world champion and to make a little more money, that's a win-win, but good luck crumbling me like a cookie from all the way over there. Also on his Twitter, he said maybe now you'll be able to live up to your Mr. Wonderful moniker. Ooh.

It sounds like I got under his skin more than a little bit. It sounds like I'm living rent-free right in the right in the top of John Bill's his head, you know? Yeah. It's interesting. It's interesting. He has all that to say as I exit. Right. But, you know, he's a little bit of a rivalry, but more or less of like, you know, he's like your little brother or somebody, you know what I mean?

You want to give him a nougie? There's a part of John Jones who really wants to beat me, you know? Yeah. What's your take on the Bell Tour Light Heavyweight Division? How much do you know about it? I know the top couple guys. The common thought right now seems to be that maybe this time next year you will be champion, that there's no one in there.

In fact, I even brought up on our show the MMA beat last week that you can make a very strong case that right now Phil Davis is the very best fighter in Bellator, regardless of division, given your resume and your skills and all that stuff. Would you agree with that? Both of those sentiments you'd be championed this time next year and that you're the best fighter in Belator? I will agree with the first sentiment that I should be champion by this time next year. And that, you know, I will say I definitely make a case for one of the best fighters from Belator, but Belator has some great fighters.

And I'm not going to just say I'm the best out of all of them. No, I'll be added to a roster of already great guys. Have they told you when you will debut? No, I haven't heard yet about exactly when or who or when that might be. When do you want to debut? Man, I'm just sitting around in the lab working hard. That's it. You know?

Have they given you a sort of blueprint? Like, you'll have to fight once before you get a title shot. You'll get a title shot right away. I mean, the champion, Liam McGeeery doesn't have a title shot just yet. In fact, I saw him at UFC on Fox 15 this weekend. and he was very excited about the possibility of fighting you sometime in the future. Have they told you at all

what your path will have to be to get that title? No, they haven't told me too much of anything. Really, all I've really heard is just, you know, the same thing you've heard. I'm signed, I'm in, and I'm added in with a bunch of already tough guys. Given your resume...

Go ahead. Go ahead. I was just wondering, given your resume and your experience and all that, you think you deserve a title shot right off the bat? Oh, I kind of want a title shot right off the bat. But, you know, I wouldn't say deserve. Deserves a strong word.

I'm not going to tell somebody what I deserve. I would say that I would want a title shot right off the bat. But I'm happy to do whatever you want me to do. I'm a team player always has been. But, you know, there are some interesting names in that division. There's the legends like Ortiz and Poplar. Possibly Rampage, if he comes back. There are some, you know, guys who are coming up like Linton Vassell,

and, of course, McGeery is in the mix, Emmanuel Newton. Do you prefer to go the sort of legend route, or do you want to test yourself against some of these other guys who are coming up and who have kind of helped build that division before the legends came around? Honestly, I want to go straight for the top. Okay.

Me and McGarry, I like him in his last fight, so he looked pretty solid. And, yeah, yeah, I want to, I want to go. Well, I guess this guy. I would not. You know, it's weird. I very seldom say that. And it's not like that.

That's something I say, I don't have to be in their weight class. But when I watch some guys fail, man, I kind of like to fight that guy. And you said that about him. I said that about him as he was playing. Just because, you know, I thought he had a great skill set. And I would never say that about a guy who I felt like, oh, this guy sucks. I can sure beat him. A lot of people think that way.

I don't. If I thought that way, it's because you are good. You are really good, and I respect you as a fight. So on your way out, tell me what was your favorite moment in the UFC? You had some big ones. You had some great performances. Is there one that sticks out? This was my favorite moment inside the Octagon.

You know, I've got so many favorites inside the Octagon. probably, you know, probably my favorite would be just my trip to Abu Dhabi. The whole trip was just, yeah, the whole trip was just, it was just too much. I was over at Abu Dhabi, which I didn't think it was a place I'd never imagined that I would go. And, but kind of always wanted to, you know. and, you know, the culture there is just, I was almost distracted by the culture because I wanted to just be out and about and just experience that side of the world. And at the same time, I had this fight going on. It was just so much mental stimulus.

And, man, the whole trip was dope. went on Safari. That was dope. I had a fight. Alexander Augustine. Made a friend. Almost got the bonus. That's another story.

That's a story for another day. What do you mean? What do you mean? What happened? Well, the story, the story as it goes. The story as it goes, Kat. George, not George,

Joe Silva. George, Joe Silva, I'm pretty, uh, George, Joe Silva comes up to me after when he goes, Hey, Ken, you probably got fight of the knife. Okay. Or the submission of the night. Okay. Like, what?

This is a night. Oh, don't, what? You know what I mean? And I was especially Jack, because it was, I think it was like 70 grand. Okay. And at this point, I'm fresh out of college. I still got three loans, you know? So I was like, oh, great.

Great. I'm going to pay off all my loans. This is perfect. You know, so I'm in the bat. Like, crunch your numbers. I first will pay off a fish. I don't pay off some car. You know?

I'm like seriously like crunching numbers of the bat, right? Okay. And then, you know, Mark Munoz goes out and almost gets submitted by Kendall Grove. And I'm like, Mark, come on. No, Mark, don't go out like this. Mark, he's going to take my body, please, no. And then Mark doesn't get submitted. And right before the co-main, Javier Dosanos pulls off an arm bar.

Now I'm like, I don't know. I don't know if that arm bar did it. And so as the night goes on, no more submissions, and the night comes. I'm still confident I got the submission of the night. And then they tell me that I didn't get it. And they told them the story, I was going to get it. And Dana Lorenzo were split between who should get it between myself and Raphael. And George St. Pierre happened to be Cagetide that night.

And they're like, ah, George, who do you think? But George goes, you know, I kind of like the armbar. What? Yep. Well, boy, George. GSP, he screwed you. Yeah. He didn't screw me.

He liked the arm bar. I give it to him. It was a nice arm bar. It was a nice arm bar. Wow. Did you ever approach him about that? No, what I'm a say? What I'm a say?

Hey. You know my end of condo was better than now, and I want me to say to that. Come on, man. Well, I think it was better. It was still a great night. It was a great weekend. Afterwards, we went and had a party at some rooftop club inside the Yaz Island Marina.

It was sick, man. Everything, the whole trip was just crazy. The whole trip was just crazy. I remember our post-fight interview afterwards. We were outside that little trailer over there, and it was very humid. You were sweating a lot. We were talking about your friend.

Shondella, you remember that? Good times. I do remember that. It's so funny you say that because right before the interview, I was walking back to your trip to the trailers and, you know, hey, we got an interview. I was like, okay, cool. And before we started, one of the workers there was saying, can I have your shirt? I was like, I can't even breathe. The shirt is completely soaked. I was just about to take it off after we got done. But they were like, they were, ladies I was like, can't you have it? So I gave her my shirt, and then you and I looked like I was just all sweaty in the interview with you.

Do you remember that? Of course. You were glistening. Glistening. I'll never forget it. Good times. Phil? Good times.

Very happy for you. Congratulations. Mazeltov, as my people say. I look forward to your debut. I look forward to your run in Bellator. It was great watching you and covering you in UFC, and I think this is an interesting. new chapter for you. So all the best. And we will be, we will be following you closely over there in Bellator. So all the best again. And thank you very much for coming on.

I know you're about to go to practice. We appreciate the time very much. Yeah, thank you. All right, there he is. Phil, Mr. Wonderful Davis, the newest member of the Bellator-MMA light heavyweight division. It's going to be interesting to see how quickly he moves up the ladder over there. Again, you can make a very strong case that he is right now the best fighter in that entire company, given his resume and his skill set. Let's talk more about Phil Davis. Let's bring in our colleague from MMAfighting.com. The one and only Sean Al-Shadi joins us via the magic of Skype.

Sean, how are you, my friend? I'm doing pretty well, Ariel. How are you doing? Great to have you on. Let me ask you two questions. A, do you agree with the statement that Phil Davis right now is the best fighter in Belator? Not light heavyweight division, Belator, period. And B, if you were the Bellator matchmakers,

how quickly would you put him in a title shot? That's an interesting statement. I think he's definitely one of the top three. I mean, I think it's hard to distinguish between him and a guy who's still unproven like a guy like Will Brooks or some of their lower-ranked fighters or lower-weight fighters. But I'd give him the title shot right away.

Why not? So you don't mind that he's coming off a loss in the UFC? You don't mind that he's never won in that organization. and you don't feel like he has to prove himself. I think some would say that. I mean, Phil Davis doesn't need to prove himself. He has a better resume than anyone else in that entire division, Belator, at least. Were you surprised that he signed with the UFC?

Excuse me with Belator. So I wouldn't say surprise. I think Chuck really hit the nail on the head with his article where the whole Phil Davis journey with the UFC was very strange in a way. Like it was a strange in a way that you couldn't really put your finger on it, but it was overall just disappointing in a way. So I think it really feels like that move benefits all of them. The benefits Phil.

Benefits Belator, it gets him out of the UFC, and I think the UFC is all right with that. So I wasn't surprised, but I think it is going to be interesting to see moving forward how this really affects the landscape in regards to guys really being able to leverage or being aware of that idea that you can leverage one against the other if there is interesting in it. I do agree that it's one of those rare signings,

at least it feels that way, that everyone comes away a winner. The UFC comes away a winner because in this day and age where you have people claiming in their monopoly and all this stuff, look, one of the best fighters in the world, top 10, I think he was sixth

when he signed, I don't know if he's ranked anymore while you shouldn't be. No, taken out. Yeah, so look, he just went and signed with Beltor. Beltor gets a known fighter, a solid fighter, and Phil gets a contract and he seems pretty happy about it. Do you think also this time next year

he's champion? I don't know. It's interesting, right? Like, those are actually pretty interesting fights. When you think about him, you think about him against McGarry or Neil Newton. I think he might be able to beat Liam McGarry just because of the stylistic matchups. I think Newton is a much harder fight for him just because of the awkwardness and style. I don't know.

I could see him being champion, but I could also see him not being champion. So I don't want to fence it, but I don't think it's going to happen for some reason. I think it's going to continue this idea disappointing. Phil Davis narrative. Whoa, he's always going to be the bridesmaid. Maybe, yeah. Like I said, it's those two guys. I mean, Rampage and Tito, those aren't really, yeah.

So it's those two guys. I feel like Newton more than McGarry is going to be the harder challenge for. Bigger fight for Belator right now. Liam McGeeery versus Phil Davis next or Liam McGee versus Tito Ortiz next? It's bigger in terms of ratings, like getting people to watch it?

Yeah, Buzz. I'd say Tito. Yeah, I'd say, agree. Yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, old, early 2000 era name that's hanging around the Kimbo slices and the Ken Shamrock's Hey, hey, let's give him credit. He's enjoyed a bit of a career rejuvenation. I mean, who would have thought he'd be, you know, a relevant player? I don't care what

organization. The fact that he's still fighting is relevant, I think, and, and, and somewhat surprising. Yeah, I mean, we thought he was done what, like two or three years ago. He had that Hall of Fame induction ceremony. Yeah. Like, this is all just, this is all just, this is all this is all just gravy for him at this point. Let's talk about Newark Saturday night. It felt really to me like a changing of the guard. It felt like a lot of guys, young guys, were matched up against veterans. Sterling, Mizugaki, Darius, Schmiller, Van Zent, Herig,

Rockhold, Machita, you know, a lot of guys, Max Holloway, Cub Swanson, and all the young studs won in those fights. Did you get that? It felt like one of those events were like, wow, the UFC has walked away with some new faces, some new contenders here, and that doesn't happen often. Yeah, it felt genuinely special in a way that I feel like a lot of events don't. And you're right, it was crazy that as the night progressed, each individual, because there were so many passing the torch fights,

each individual won, the torch was passed. And it was most of the time in a very violent and lopsided way that was almost surprising. You take Sterling's head and arm from the bottom, like that's just nuts. I can't remember the last time I've seen that. And then Max Holloway just goes out and just blows the doors off of Cupswast I can't say enough of how impressive that performance was. That was just a ridiculous fight.

I've been buzzing about it since. Right. And since Paige Van Zan, I mean, I feel like a lot of people weren't sold on the page Van Zan hype, and that at least vindicated that a little bit. You know, really, there's a reason why people should be excited for it. Right, just up and down the card. It was all these performances. And then Luke Rockwell, I mean...

Oh, sorry, go ahead. No, no, go ahead. Please, please. Yeah, no, and Luke Rockhold, like, we've seen Machita lose, but nobody has ever beaten Machita in that way. Like, he beat Machita in a way that we didn't even know existed, of just this idea of dominating Machita from bell to bell and just, like, smothering him on the ground.

Like, Machita's get-ups are usually fantastic. He's usually very tricky and elusive on the bottom if he gets there. And he was just stifled. Rockhold was just all over him. It was crazy. It was nuts to see. Yeah, I am honestly telling the truth here. I'm blown away by that performance.

Again, it reminds me of the T.J. Dillishaw fight where two days later, I view him in a whole, different light. I mean, he is oozing confidence. He feels like he feels, you know, like he's, he's exuding this confidence that like he can beat any fighter in the world, seeing him and Weidman on the set together. It actually reminded me a lot of Chris Weidman when he beat Mark Munoz and then felt like he was on top of the world. And, you know, some people might not be a believer, but this guy, in his own mind, is a world beater. And now there's this debate because Dan White didn't come out and say it. And that was somewhat surprising, but I can understand, given the fact

that both the guys are right there. There's this debate. Should Luke Rockhold get the next title shot after the Belford-Widman fight on May 23rd? Or should he fight Rock... Excuse me, Jacre. Or should Jacre get it because he's undefeated in the UFC?

I have a very strong take on this, but I want to hear yours first. What do you do with Luke Rockhold next? Well, Daniel Cormier certainly seemed to think that you should get that title shot. I mean, he's not biased, but yes. Daniel Corbyn being his flame of flame to Chug-D. That almost got uncomfortable to watch

after a certain point. Well, hey, a lot of credit to Weidman. I think he took it like a champ. Absolutely. But yeah, I mean, you have to go with Rockhold, right? Like, this is a, that, first of all, that fight in and of itself, Rockhold versus Weidman is just so, like, that fight seems so crazy when you just think about it. Like, there are so many different variables in that fight.

But that, it, again, it sucks for Jacques-Raeb because this really was out of his hands. Like, he did anything he could have. Like, that was a flawless victory performance. But just the way Rockhold beat Machita was so unbelievably impressive. Like, there's no argument against it at this point, in my head at least. Like, that's the fight that we want to see coming out. It's a no-brainer. There's no, there's no debate here.

There's really no debate. Even if Jacques-Rae would have defeated Romero in the exact same time and fashion, exact same, what Rockhold did to Machita was next-level stuff. It doesn't happen. So it doesn't even matter at this point that Comozy didn't. fight. And people bringing up that, you know, Rockhold lost the bell for it. I mean, his path in the UFC, Rockhold, compared to Jacerais, a lot tougher. If you just look at who they fought. And also, let's not forget the fact that Rockhold has a win over Jacques Reyes. I know it was in

Strike Force and all that stuff. If you beat Machita like that and you go on the streak that Rockhold has been on, it is a no-brainer. And I also think it would be a mistake, which I've seen some people suggest, to book Rockhold versus Jacer. Don't cancel them out. Either let Jacerai say, on the sidelines, have him fight Romero, have him fight someone else, and wait, or, you know, or just wait, just like not to have him fight. And I don't know if that's an option for him. He wants to make money, and I get that. But Rockhold should 100% without a doubt be the number one contender, be the next man

for the winner of Wyden Belford. There's no debate. Yeah, I agree. I agree with you. Just coming out of that, again, the buzz for Rockhold and Wyman is unbelievable right now. Like, that's such a great fight on, on, on, on, on levels that we usually don't get. And you're right, I just, I feel like there isn't really that much of an argument at this point, especially because people bring up the Belfort thing and you look back, come on, like that,

if we're just being honest ourselves, like that Vitor exists in some kind of murky level of like alternate universe. Yes. Yeah. I don't know. And also, by the way, it's a win-win for the UFC. Wyman Rockhold is special two guys in their prime who are, you know, world beaters right now. And I think everyone would be excited about that.

And then you get on the other side, you know, on another side of the thing, you get the rematch. And you see the way Rockhold talks about Belford where he says, when he says, I wish nothing good for that man. I mean, that's on a whole different level of hate. Like, you could tell deep down in his stomach, he despises Vitor Belford. Like he wants to, you know, he would walk on him if he was on the ground hurt. You know, he has a deep, deep hatred for this man. So I think it's a win-win either way. But Luke Rockhold, if I were him, I would stay in shape.

You never know what's going to happen between now. on May 23rd. Yeah, because if either one of Weidman or Belfort dropped out, that's a fight. Rockhold would take in a second. Even if that Belfort fight wasn't a title fight, Rockhold would jump on that right now. If you said today, you can fight Vitor. Yeah. It's not for Tyler.

I think Rockhold takes that without even thinking about it. Okay, let me put you on the spot. Let's say it's Wyatman who beats Vitor on May 23rd. Who wins? Wideman or Rockhold? Oh, man. That is, I have no idea. It's a tough one, right?

I think it would depend on how Blybman looked at in the Belfort fight. I honestly have no idea. Who do you favor? Who do you favor? Gut feeling right now. Gun to your head. Who do you favor? Rockles.

Wow. I don't think, man. Any reason why? This Machita thing is just like you said, I can't get over how he made Machita look old. Yeah, he did. Like that's, that's very odd. Like, that's incredible in a different. different way of that. Like, Wyden's fight with Machito was remarkable and it was a show of heart and it

was just so good. But Rockhole just made it look easy, man. Like, that's, you can't, there are not enough superlatives to put on that. Like, that's so impressive. How do you feel about PVZ, page Van Zend? Do you feel like, okay, it's, it's, it's, it's all worth it now, all the buzz, all the hype, she's vindicated. If you didn't believe, now you should believe? Or do you feel like, you know what, that was dominant, but it was somewhat sloppy, and Felice Herrick isn't a top 10 fighter. You know, she's been around. She's a veteran, but, you know, let's slow our role. How do you feel about her? I think, I mean, I think, like I said before, that vindicated a little bit.

Yeah. At that point, she was still totally untested, and let's be honest, she didn't really deserve, like, a Reebok sponsorship and everything like this. At least now there's some, momentum to justify it. But, yeah, I would slow the role on that. I mean, she's, she can barely drink legally. Like, we don't need to rush it. I'd like to see her get someone probably lower top 10, if that. I mean, I think we can really she's someone who you can take the

Connor path of really picking people out to really, you know, build some kind of momentum and height behind, as opposed to really rushing her. I think now we're going to see, I think Sean Shelby arguably is the best matchmaker in MMA. With all due respect to Joe Silva, I mean, 1A, 1B, of course, they're the

most well-known ones. But I think now we're really going to see his brilliance as a matchmaker because what does one through 10, one through 15 in the strawweight division really mean. We don't really know what it means. We saw that with the Marina Moro's Joanne Calderwood fight and we continue to see that. Look at Yohanna Yom Jacek. So it's going to be very interesting to see because you can't really look at those numbers right now. I think they're all very unproven. It's going to be interesting to see how he matches her up and what he does because there's a science to that. You know, you want to build this person up to a degree, but also at the same time test them. Yeah, I mean, it's just different.

it's just if you even look at like a video game it's just in different incremental or incremental steps of challenging like okay here's someone who's a little bit better wrestler here's someone who's a little bit striker better striker. Let's just see how you keep dealing with these challenges moving forward. It's a very interesting process and you're right

I'm actually really curious to see where this goes because they do have someone in PVZ who can really become a big star in that division and a division that's a brand new division that would just be basically found money because I mean they just started that division a year ago. Like it or not, she, to a degree, opens up the same kind of doors that Ronda Rousey has been opening up for the UFC. Now, speaking of the rankings, some breaking

news today, sports business journal breaking the news that the new Reebok deal that comes into play in July will not be based off of the rankings anymore, which was highly scrutinized. A lot of people criticized the UFC for this because we all know the rankings have many flaws and a lot of people that we don't even know, and these media rankings, we don't even know, are determining where these fighters are being ranked. So now they're going with your experience level.

It's a tiered system, you know, one through five as far as fights in the UFC, then six through ten, things like that. So the more fights, like if you're like a Glycin T-Bowl, you're killing it because you've got 20 plus fights in the UFC. How do you feel about this decision? What do you think about it? I mean, it's definitely improvement, right?

Like, just because we don't have anything that makes the rankings less important, I feel as an improvement. because those are just the most garbage things. Like, we don't even need to beat around the bush. But it's definitely a big improvement. And I feel like there's still a lot of questions because it's a few, like, we're in April already. And that thing starts in July.

And we still still so much vagueness regarding how much and just like all the intricacies and the nuances of it. But that was my initial question when this whole thing was announced was to take a guy like a Joe Lozahn who's just who's unranked. But, I mean, fans know him. People tune in to see him fight. He's been around forever. There's no way that guy should be making as much as Joe Schmoe, who just comes in for, you know, his first UFC fight.

That just doesn't make sense on a very basic level. So, I mean, at least this is an improvement because, you know, there's some form of the experienced guys should be making more than the newbies. And, I mean, that's just basic common sense. Yeah. They still have around two and a half months to really figure this out, which I don't know if that's enough time, to be honest. I mean, you have those big questions. You have questions like Demetrius Johnson, who has this great deal with Xbox, even as a champion, will he be compensated?

Will he get the same amount if not more than what he was making? I don't believe that he'll have Xbox representing him in the cage this time for this fight. You know, it might not behoove them to be in that kind of relationship with him anymore. So that to me is the big question. But yeah, it's nice to see that they're going away from the ranking thing. And the next step, in my opinion, would be to fix the rankings because they're still very valuable. they're mentioning them in the cage. Bruce Buffer is saying it now.

I don't know if you notice on Saturday. He's saying the number three and all that stuff. So you'd like to see the right people involved. And I'm not saying it has to be the media. It just needs to be the right people. And if it's going to be the media, I don't know. I don't know what the answer is. That's a whole different discussion for a different day.

Let me ask you one more thing before I let you go. When I say UFC 186, what do you think? What comes to mind? That's what comes to mind. Yeah. I mean, are you even remotely amped for this? well I'm biased because I get to go back to Montreal my hometown I get to sleep in my old bed get my mom's cooking be around my parents so I'm very excited about that I'm very sad to see what's

happened to the card honestly I don't think that the right card was put in place from the beginning yeah it's it's going to be I know you I know some of you and I know you included don't like this question but I'm going to ask it anyways does it break 100,000 buys oh man it's going to test that yeah it's going to really going to really set a baseline of how a UFC paper you can sell just based on the UFC and maybe like the fleeting image of Michael Bisping. It's a tough sell. I feel bad for Demetrius because again,

I feel like this is a referendum on his star power, and it shouldn't be that. He should be positioned the right way. It's on his fault that he's fighting, essentially another faceless contender. He's one of the very best, and I think he deserves better. But honestly, I think the biggest factor

that will go against UFC 186 is what's happening next weekend. Paci Out Mayweather, any combat sports fan is saving their money for that. That's a $100 pay-per-view. The fact that this card, and as weak as it is, is happening the week before, people are like, look, I'm going to save my money

and put that into Pac-Out Mayweather, I think, if you're on the fence about this, right? I think if this was September, October or something like that, it might be a different story. But the fact that it's happening the week before, the biggest fight, arguably of all time in boxing history, that just kills it.

DJ just can't catch a break, man. Because you're right. Every fight, it's this referendum on, you can't draw, he can't draw. Even his last fight, I think it was 178 when we were in Vegas. Everyone was asking him, you're not the, are you the real main event? Are you the real main event? It always comes back to this idea that he's just not good enough to sell these when he's not putting, for the most part of these. He's not put in position to succeed.

And you're right, it was, it's just sad what it's really to come to. Because it seems like the UFC's left this one for dead. Like the marketing for this one is non-existent virtually. And I feel like they just kind of acknowledge, okay, this just needs to be done with so we can move on with. To the big ones. Yeah, the big ones like 187, 188, 189. It is important to note, though, that they were dealt a bad hand. You know, the rampage thing, T.J. getting injured.

Hector failing his drug test, they were dealt a bad hand. And so it is what it is, as Dana White likes to say. Montreal will show up, have no fear. They may not be as big as the 124 crowd or UFC 83. but my people will show up. I have no doubt about that. Sean, thank you so much for the time. Great to have you on, as always, and we'll talk to you soon. Sounds great. I appreciate it. There he is. The one and only, Sean Alshaddy of MMAfighting.com stopping by talking a little UFC 186.

It is five days away. And if you are attending UFC 186 in Montreal, I remind you that I'm hosting a panel discussion Friday morning just 24 hours before the event, before the Wands, 8 a.m. 10 a.m. It will involve me, Forrest Griffin, Tom Wright, and David Lozzo talking the business of MMA, MMA in Canada. It's a $30 entry fee, although if you're media, you can come in for free and cover it, and it's taking place downtown at the Plaza Hotel in Montreal. I've tweeted the link out a few times. It should be a lot of fun hosting a live panel discussion. And by the way, breakfast is included. So if you're hungry, you get that bonus as well. That's Friday morning, April 24th.

Just a couple days away from now. I'm looking forward to that very much. For now, let us go back to the Skype machine and welcome in a man who is now $50,000 richer. He won the Fight of the Night bonus. Great win over Corey Anderson, the second latest win in the UFC's light heavyweight division in history. The one and only John Volante joining us via the magic of Skype.

John, how are you? Good. Thank you for having me. Can't get a fight at night by yourself. You got to give it up for Corey, man. That was a great performance by him and showed a lot of toughness, man. It was an awesome night, awesome fight. Where are you right now? At Wyman's Jim, he's inside sparring, actually.

So I'm going to go check that out after this and get back to watching you. So, yeah, I'm just in your hanging. And by the way, I'm hoping you're not sparring him today, right? you're going to take a little break? Yeah, probably just this week. I'm probably not allowed to take much longer than that or he'd be yelling at me nonstop. Yeah, just this week off.

Actually, I thought my leg was going to be a little bit more sore than it is. I mean, after the fight it was pretty sore from all those kicks. But today, it's way better, no swelling, no nothing. And just two black eyes, which is where I'm wearing glasses. I'm embarrassed by them. Why embarrassed?

Those are badges of honor. It looks like you're in the witness protection program here with your black outfit. Yeah, I don't, I mean, I've never had a black guy before, I tell you the truth. Really? Really? I've never had a black eye before. I've had scratches here and there, but yeah, two of them and I'm so embarrassed.

I hate it. Wow, that's shocking to me. If I had a black guy from a fight, I'd be sticking my face out everywhere, telling you one, look at me. Maybe that's a difference between me and you, a beta male, and an alpha male. That is embarrassing. I mean, I was out, I was out after my fight, went into the city, had a good night going out, and I let them hang out a little bit there.

and, you know, it was pretty cool. Got to, you know, see a lot of my buddies on the jets and a couple guys in the Giants and stuff. It was pretty cool hanging out with a bunch of NFL dudes and Waller and Rockwood came out. So it was a good night, but, yeah, I showed them off a little bit that night, but nothing too crazy.

Can we see them now, or am I crossing the line by asking you that question? Oh, kidding. Of course, man. Come on, let's see them. Let's see those baby blues. Oh, my. I can't really see myself.

Yeah, you know, I got my right eyes pretty bad. I mean, you know what? I was willing to get punched to land those kicks, you know what I'm saying? And probably landed a little bit too much. And, you know, he was good. He was a tough guy. Like I said, at the point when it got later in the fight, I was willing to get punched because I thought it was worth it. I thought he might get stopped due to the way kicks since I was landed him so frequently and in a pretty good spot. I loved, you know, what happened at the end when you finished him. You know, you're kind of known as like this, you know, rough and tough ex-ex football.

player, Long Island guy and all that. And we saw some legitimate emotion out of you. You put your head down, you're on your knees. I don't recall seeing you that emotional after a fight. Is that accurate? Yeah, I mean, for sure. Just the last time I was in that ring in that same place

couldn't have won any worse, you know, getting poked in the eye and losing a fight. Thought of that going into the ring. Thought of fighting in front of all my friends, family for that, you know, so close to home. It's a little bit of impression with that many people there that you know fighting a guy where you know I thought I

was better than and he showed he showed me he was a lot tougher than I gave him credit for it not that I didn't think he was tough I just it was just a tough fight so many things went into and so many people there ruined for me and you know having good people on my team and great coaches they you know push you through things like that was just just an amazing amazing feeling is it true you had like around 500 people there supporting you I'd say at least I mean we had three other guys fighting but say you know between everyone because we're all the same team i'd say at least 500 people 600 maybe more wow of people i know that were there you know i had my assistant principal in middle school you know i mean i had middle school coaches come i had all my high

school wrestling coaches and college teammates and this and that as a family i mean i'm italian i come from a same family so uh it just so many so many people there was awesome My nephew for the first time saw me fight, so it was pretty cool. Do you prefer a scenario like that where everyone's coming and watch you have hundreds of people in attendance, or do you prefer a situation like when you're fighting in New Zealand, and you probably know no one in the arena? They both have their pluses. I mean, New Zealand way less pressure. You just go out there fighting.

But when you win, it's not as great because you don't get to go celebrate and embrace everyone after. So, yeah, before the fight, I would say I'd rather fight in New Zealand, but after the fight I'd say I'd rather fight in Newark or New York or wherever. I can close to home so it was just great to see everyone after and have fun and be able to just enjoy my victory with them because they enjoyed it just as much as I did. You mentioned the OSP fight, but you kind of feel like to a degree you exercise the Chad Griggs' demons a little bit as well because I feel like that was your big, your first big East Coast fight. and it didn't go your way, and you've been kind of working to get back to that point.

Yeah, I mean, those are the two past two times of the 40 with those two fights, both just as bad as they could go for me. Those are probably my two worst fights, you know. Just not, the OSP fight being more that it was a boring fight, and if you know if you see me fight, I don't really put on boring fights, but the OSP fight was a boring fight for me, and it wasn't really that exciting. And then I get put in the eye and it stopped,

And then the Chad Griggs fight was, I thought like I was in second grade just trying to kill a guy. And then I would get a big shot landed on me. And so only time I've ever been down. I mean, you can hit me with a bat and I won't go down that time I did. So it's just this feeling that out there was just amazing to do that in front of a homework. That's why, you know, like those things go into your head when you're fighting at home. And the last time I've done it was, you know, those two times. So it kind of was a little bit nerve-wracking.

But getting in there and getting that done. Like I said, it was all worth it. You mentioned the kicks and you were okay to take some shots to keep lining the kicks, but honestly, do you feel like you need to change that strategy a little bit and move your head a little more so that you don't end up with these black guys? Yeah, I read somewhere that I have a record now in the UFC, which is pretty awesome. I have three consecutive fights getting 100 punches landed on me. Wow.

I don't know. Yeah, so maybe I should move a little bit. Like I said, I mean, you can hit me with anything. It doesn't matter. And I'll take punches to land those kicks. I don't care. But earlier around, I should have just been more active. I should have threw more in combination.

I mean, any fighter who comes on here and tells you that they were happy with their performance is probably lying or isn't, doesn't have much room for improvement. I know I have a lot of room for improvement. Every fight I'm growing and getting better. I just know that I can't keep taking shots like that. It's just stupid. But, I mean, hopefully I still sound okay and make decent sentences, but I know I can't get hit like that anymore. It's just stupid. No reason.

But, hey, I got us fight at night. I want to make an entertaining fight. It's my biggest thing. And number one thing I do while I'm in there is I want people to want to watch me fight. I mean, I'm not going to be the guy talking all the trash, this and that, or to get fans, this and that. I want to go in there and make my fans in the ring and they like the way I fight. That's it. You said afterwards that you noticed all his bottom teeth came out from a, I think it was a knee.

Was it a knee that knocked him out? How did you feel? Did you feel that? Yeah, and I heard he broke his jaw too. So, I mean, he's a tough, tough kid. Yeah, he went to shoot him, which I thought he was going to do more. But I guess after that, he didn't do it anymore. I would have liked him to shoot more because it would have got him more tired because I have

good wrestling defense. I go with the best wrestler in the UFC every day, you know. and I have good deal So that's what I thought he was going to go in there to do Was try to wrestle me more and just make it a boring fight He went in there and slugged it out with me I mean he went to shoot on me And I went to throw a kick kind of at the same time

It was kind of like a kick And I saw him coming So it kind of turned into a knee And all his bottom teeth out He said he was holding them forward with his tongue What? Yeah he's a tough kid man I mean you got to I don't know

Dana heard those stories or whatever the signs on Put it a knife but, I mean, that just gives you, shows you why we won fight at night and why we deserve it is because, I mean, that's as tough as you get right there. Look at my face and he's got his teeth. I mean, we went to, we had a battle. What did you say to him afterwards? I saw you guys took a selfie together.

That was cool, man. It was just like, dude, what a battle, awesome way. I told him, I thought you were going to wrestle more. And it was probably a mean thing to say at that time. But, you know, I just thought that would be his game plan. and he went in there and slugged out. I'm like, I just give you credit for being that tough. I'm like, and you're so active, bro.

I, you know, I knew it hurt, but I'm the kicks hurt. But he didn't really show too much. He moved around, okay. I mean, his punches started to have left zing on him because I took that lead leg out. But he showed toughness by, I'm telling you, getting kicked by those things. I'm not saying I'm the toughest guy or throw the hardest kicks, but those things hurt, man. And I landed like over 30 kicks, and he was fine with it. He didn't show him.

any, he didn't limp. He didn't, I mean, after the fight, he wasn't walking, but he didn't show me anything like, we good here, stuff? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, he didn't show me anything that he was, during the fight that he was hurt from him. I was just looking because my inside sources at Fight Metric

confirmed what you said, my good friend Michael Carroll, telling me that you are, in fact, the first UFC fighter to absorb 100 plus significant strikes in three different fights. So congratulations. Maybe not the, the record that you want later in life, but it's a nice feather in your cap.

By the way, let's clear something. Go ahead. My sense to start. Can you tell me, though, if I'm like, I want to be able to sound okay, still? It's sound like the first time I've been on your show. Yeah, it's pretty good. It's pretty good, though. Well, I mean, you're 48 hours removed, so we need to get you, because the first time you're

on the show, you were going into a fight. Of course, actually, we're going to look at that clip later on in the show when we introduced the world to Chris Wyman when you were in studio before. for your Strike Force debut. But I want to clear something up here because I talk to a lot of people about this, but I want to talk to you about it. You're one of the few guys.

You know, everyone talks about Long Island, MMA, MMA, Long, and Sarah. But you're a Belmore kickboxing guy, and you kind of, you kind of, you dip in, you know, with both teams, you do some Belmore kickboxing, and then you're over there, you know, Longo Weidman and Sarah as well. But, you know, when you fight, you have Wyman in your corner, but you also have Keith Trimble.

And I kind of feel bad sometimes because I feel like he doesn't get a lot of credit. for your success and stuff. And it's just like everyone kind of is geared towards Longosurka's because of the more well-known guys. How do you deal with that? Because I feel like of the big-name fighters in the UFC, you're the only one that goes to both.

How do you balance that? It's cool that they let me do it. I mean, Chris is my best friend, and we've been training since we started. We went together every day, so I was already at that school. And it just shows you how cool of a guy, Keith, is to be okay with that. because a lot of times when they announce me in the corner or this and that, they're saying, you know, Serro Longo trained and this and, hey, those guys are great to me. Everyone, it's just awesome. I mean, I have a great situation. I have the best of both worlds. I could come in here, get great advice from Ray. Any type of, if I'm ever feeling down, this and that, Ray will pick me up, make me feel great. Great coach, awesome guy. Matt Serra, best jihitsu coach in the game, my opinion, period. Go there at least three times a week. And I have Keith Trimble, who's, make sure that I'm, you know, always straight, never lets me get too high, too low,

make sure I'm, you know, doing the right thing. And he knows my technique the best. I mean, everything I've ever learned punching and kicking wise is from him. I've never learned it from anyone else. I came into the sport as a wrestler and a football player. I never knew how to do anything else, and now I'm pretty much just a striker. So, I mean, I'm very fortunate to have those guys and then be okay with me doing that the way I do it. I'm lucky. I'm very far. I'm the only one that is able to do it because it does kind of ruffle feathers or it is kind of like not that they love each other. Not that you know, maybe feelings get hurt.

Yeah. It's just it is an awkward situation because it is two different gyms. But, you know, obviously I want to see this gym succeed, you know, that it's my best friend gym and I also want to see my other gym succeed. So it's hard to say where I give all the credit to. have you ever thought about just sticking with one to make it easier on yourself? No, I couldn't. I wouldn't be able to fight if I had to. Okay. You know what I mean? I wouldn't be able to do it. I'd probably stop fighting before that happened.

Wow. By the way, are you also, because I had heard this, and I wanted to confirm with you, also happy that, you know, like your friend, Al-I-Quinta, that Doug Crosby wasn't judging your fight? Oh, God. I mean, I don't know who was judging my fight. It wasn't, in my opinion, great judging. yeah definitely happy he wasn't because that that is a huge confidence interest right there that's just

crazy to me that's doesn't make sense and if he was to judge my fight I feel the same way just because he knows I'm affiliated with right these guys oh it just wouldn't to me it wouldn't be fair have you ever had dealings with him yeah yeah yeah I'm yeah I used to bodyguard um like actors and stuff and uh I was on movie sets a couple times I met him I mean, he seemed like an okay guy at the time, and then I got to know him a little bit more and see some of the stuff that was going on with some of my friends, and, you know, I obviously got my own opinion about it, and I took a side, and that's that, you know, it was just, I'd take side with my family over here, and that's what I have to do, and it was just some odd things went on

with the guy, and I can't explain a lot of it. It was very, very strange, strange stuff. So you wouldn't... Go ahead. He does that fight. Crazy. You wouldn't feel comfortable with him judging your fight now as well, right? A million percent, no, no way.

I mean, I hope he never does now, because I'm saying it is, but I really, really hope that he'd be in trouble. I mean, but... You think he would judge it against you? Really? I mean, I stated more than once a million times

I'm with Longo, you know? Yes, my dude. 100%, go to back to the, you know, for that guy, a million percent, and anything he wanted, not just with this guy, with anything. The other guy's family to me. So, yeah, I mean, that would be against him.

So I have to. I would be, it would be terrible if he did. How are we spending that 50K? Or maybe not spend it. I don't get to spend it yet. I want to, you know, first, I feel like I can't really celebrate yet until after Chris's Kris Pizza Vitor puts him to sleep. So maybe go celebrate a little bit in Vegas after that.

Sunday pool party sounds fun for me. Don't spend it all at the pool party, by the way. That wouldn't be a good idea. I hope, man. Well, we'll make Chris pay for that. He gets paid more than I, I do it. We'll have Chris pay for that, and I'll just do a suprichot event.

It would be fun. And by the way, final thing, you know, again, you, I'll always remember you being on the show and you kind of bringing Chris, you guys are inseparable, great friends, but, you know, it's no secret, he's champion, you're not right now. Is that ever hard for you?

Because I think originally people were thinking that you'd be champion first. Oh, I mean, that'd be great. But, anyway, God. you know, I don't know, whatever. God, you know, set a plan for us, and this is what it is. And, you know, hopefully one day I will be, and that's in my plan. But, I mean, never had I had one feeling of, I don't know, if it called jealousy or anything.

I wish that was me. It's nothing but pure happiness for the guy and what he's done because I know what he deserves. I mean, that's where you see him jumping up going crazy in the corner because he knows what I go through and what I deserve. And that's why we're so happy for each other. It's more just happiness for each other. And you don't see that too much in the sport with guys because everyone wants what the other guy has, especially if it's a belt, you know.

And with us, it's just more happiness than anything else that he has that thing and he deserves it. And he's able to provide great for his family. And it's just his family is my family. So it's just an awesome feeling that I was able to do that. Look forward to him crushing Vitor. And then, you know, him and Rockhold there. I mean, but he's a rockold too.

Yeah. It's going to be an interesting thing. but, you know, it's my family, Chris. Well, that is a beautiful thing. I was on the set with him, and we had to go live, like, two minutes after Eddie Gordon lost, and you could just see how disappointed he was, and then you could see how nervous he was all day for you,

and then just how relieved when he came back after cornering you and how happy he was. It's one of the most beautiful parts about MMA, the friendships and the teammates. It's something that you don't see, and when you say that you don't have any jealousy towards him, I truly believe it. Sometimes, I think, in other sports,

when one guy gets the MVP or stuff, you kind of feel like they're, you know, they're not really telling you the truth because they were just put in this situation together. They were two guys who came from different colleges and they're put on this team and now they're friends. You guys are lifelong friends and it's a little different. So I'm not surprised to hear you say that. I congratulate you on a huge win. It was a lot of fun to watch. Enjoy the victory.

Enjoy the black eyes. Enjoy the bonus. And we will see you in Vegas for UFC 187. Oh, yeah. Thank you. And I appreciate it. And like I said, I'm going to keep putting on those shows, man. It'll be fun.

Hopefully I won't get hit as much. So. Thanks, John. Appreciate it. I appreciate it. There he is. John Volante, big win over Corey Anderson. Like I said, the second latest win in the UFC's light heavyweight division history.

How about that? A lot of fun to watch and deservedly so. It was granted the fight of the night bonus, $50,000 each to both Corey Anderson and John Volante. And Corey Anderson I saw on his Instagram. He wrote this amazing post, John Valade. like thanking him and was so excited about the fight afterwards. This guy's broken, broken teeth, potentially a broken jaw, all these injuries. And he was just like, thank you so much.

That was so much fun. Only in MMA would you see something like that. Unbelievable stuff. All right. Thank you very much to Valante. We move along now. As we mentioned earlier, UFC 186 is this weekend in Montreal at the Bell Center, home of the Montreal Canadians, who are, by the way, three up on the Ottawa senators

and the NHL playoffs. That's very exciting. One of the most intriguing fights on that card, in my opinion, is, one that takes place relatively early in the card. It's a strawweight affair between Quebec's own Valerie Le Tourneau and Jessica Rikose. Jessica Rikosi, we have not heard from her in quite some time. We finally get to see her in action once again, and she joins us on the phone right now here on the MA hour. Jessica, how are you? I'm great. How are you? Wow, what a pleasure this is. You know, this has been one of those questions that I receive, you know, every couple of days, it seems.

What happened to Jessica Rikose? We last saw you in action at the tough finale, November 30th, 2013. Of course, it didn't go your way that night against Julianna Pena. And then you essentially disappeared. You're not active on social media. We don't see you anywhere. Where did you go? You know, I actually

moved back to Canada after that fight. So it was a big adjustment for me. I had to try and find a new gym. And then, you know, it's like starting all over again with coaches. But it was really hard. And, you know, I found a great

place and my coach Dewey Cooper is, you know, he came out just to help me with my mix and I feel so great right now. This is a great feeling to be in Canada and have like a team that I have, but it feels like

no other. I'm so happy. Which part of Canada? The East Coast. Nice and cold. Which part of, you know, I'm Canadian as well, so I know Canada, I'm just curious, which part in particular? I'm coast of Hamilton, Ontario.

Okay. And was that always part of the plan to go back to Canada after the tough finale? It wasn't planned to go right after, but it was always my plan to come back home. And my son was starting school, so I needed to, you know, I needed to start that process for him. And it was just, it was the timing was, it was good, you know. I needed to be home with my family. And then was it always part of the plan to take this? extended break. I mean, that's a long, amazingly,

Giuliana Pena suffered these knee injuries and she returned before you. I know, yeah. Well, I've had a couple of fights lined up, but then they just didn't happen. And I was on that card in September, 29th in Toronto, and that didn't happen. So I've had, you know, fights set up, but nothing has gone through. Were you waiting to fight in Canada? Is that why? No, no, they just, I'm here, so they were setting something up for me, you know, closer. Did you miss it? Absolutely, but I, you know, I knew I needed to work on the ground,

and I needed to, you know, obviously perfect that because I was having a lot of problems there. So it was something that I've been drilling, like, crazy, and I feel so much more confident now on the ground. As before I was, you know, obviously like a push out of water there. Yeah. you would compare your ground skills today to your skills when you fought Pena, what's the difference? Like scale of 1 to 10, how much have you improved? Well, I'm not sure of that. I just know I'm a totally different fighter now. Oh, really?

I feel like, yeah, I've just been drilling ground, ground, ground, everything ground, and then, you know, sharpening up with Dewey all with my hands and, you know, it's, I feel like a totally different fighter now. So we'll see on Saturday. You know, I mentioned a lot of people would ask me what happened to you. Did you get that a lot along the way? Were people coming up? Because you were very well known.

You were on the show and all that. You got a lot of exposure. Would people in the last year and a half or so always come up to you and ask you the same question? Yeah, definitely. But it was, there's only a few people in the gym. I don't go out or anything. I'm not home with my son or I'm at the gym.

And then, you know, grocery shopping and here and there. But I'm not really out enough for people to say that. And so, you know, at the gym they knew what was going on. And, you know, we were waiting for fights. And then when the fights are falling through, so not too many people really, you know, it's just the ones at the gym already knew. So it wasn't too much. How much did life change for you after the show?

You know what's crazy is I've been boxing for such a long time. and the exposure that I got on that show from the Ultimate Fighter, it was, like, it was just incredible. That show really did change my life, and I'm so thankful for it, and I loved it. I loved every minute of it. I would do it again in a heartbeat.

I enjoyed it so much, and it just crazy how much the exposure that you get from a show, and I've been boxing for almost soon, 15 years and to have that from one show, more than what I've ever done in boxing and everything I've accomplished in boxing, to have this, you know, all this exposure from the ultimate fighter, it's pretty unbelievable. Maybe it's a little surprising to hear you say that, because some people come off the show and say that they hated the experience, that it scarred them, that they would never in a million years do it again. And, you know, you're a mother, and, you know, I know, I remember watching the show that you missed your son very much. So I guess it's surprising to hear you say you would do it again. I would do it again in a heartbeat.

It was the most amazing thing I've ever done. I loved it. I loved it. It was amazing. I'm actually quite shocked to hear you say that, but that's great. How old is your son now? It was unbelievable. He's six.

He's six. Does he understand what you do? You know, he didn't really understand it. And now he totally understands it now, and it's really cute. He brags, and it is just, it's so funny how mature he's gotten in the past year. So he really understands it now, and he's so excited for the fight. Will he be going to the fight? Oh, yes, definitely, yeah.

He'll be in attendance. Oh, yeah, definitely. He comes to all my fight. Wow. You have no reservations about that? crazy. Yeah. No, I know.

People kind of think weird of it, but he has honestly been to every single one in my fight. So, like, you know, so he's been born, obviously. Sure. But he's been to everything, and he didn't really get it before. So, you know, maybe this time he's going to understand a little bit. But he's up in gym with me every single day. He sees me get punched. He sees me roll.

He wants to do it now. And he, like, so he. He sees it. It's like it's natural for him, whereas just some other random kid wouldn't get it, but Jesse's there every single day. So he knows what I do for a living, and he understands it, and he knows that I have to work hard. He knows, like, he's so encouraging to me.

I'm training, and he's like, you're doing a good job, Mom. Like, it's hilarious. He really gets it, and I'm really proud of him. He's very supportive. How old was he? Yeah, that's amazing. How old was he when he went to your first fight? He was six months.

Oh, my gosh. Yeah, praise. He didn't obviously get it. He came in the ring and he was crying. Sure, of course. And my coach is holding one. And we have a couple of things of it. But, you know, he's been to every fight.

Yeah, he didn't get it, but he'll get it this time. Yeah, I would imagine this would be the first time that he actually truly understands what's going on. Yes, exactly, yeah Wow, that's going to be an interesting experience for him Now, will you push for him to get into the fight game? No, no, no, no, not at all Will you try to make him not go into the fight game? I don't think I'm going to push him towards really anything

He's playing baseball right now and he's doing really well But I'm not sure if I really want to see him get punched I mean, I'm not really sure if I can handle that. But just because I know what I've been through and the things that have happened, but, you know, I've played sports all my life, and he seems like he's going to just be a natural athlete. He's very athletic and flexible. And so whatever he chooses, I will support him 100%. Why did you decide to go down to 115?

Well, Dana, offered it to me. He said, you know, he thinks I would be a beast at that weight. and I just can't make 135. I can't even hardly make 130. Oh. So it just didn't make sense to keep fighting at 35. But I didn't really have a choice, right? So when he offered that to me, I was so thankful, and I couldn't even believe it.

I was like, absolutely. Would you have preferred there, if there would have been a 125 division? Is that better for you, or are you okay with making 115? Well, I've never made 115, but I have made 115, but I have made. I made 120 for MMA. I got the lease. And I made that like four days notice. So, you know, I don't see it being a problem.

I'm already late now. So it's just, you know, I've never really had to do the water loading and all that. I've never had to do that my whole career. So that'll be something different for me. But I feel really strong at this weight. I feel crazy strong. By the way, happy birthday. I know you just celebrated your birthday.

And I feel like... What's that? I said 44. No, I'm just kidding. Well, you know, I feel like in normal life, it's not proper to talk about a woman's age, but in the sports world, you're allowed to talk about it. It's a whole... It's different.

It's publicized. I'll let people figure it out for themselves. How about that? But given your age, how many more years do you want to fight? I think if I just... keep fighting smart and keep training smart. And, you know, I think as you get older, you figure things out. I've been doing this for a long time, and I know what my body can handle.

And, you know, I know when you're younger, you just kind of go for it and you don't care. But as you get older, you have to be smarter about it, right? So I want to do this forever, but, you know, however long my body will handle it. Did you watch Holly Holmes' UFC debut? I think a lot of people might compare you to her. You have similar backgrounds, of course, coming from boxing. You've won belt, she's won belts. I think maybe when you were at 135, that was a fight.

Some people were thinking would make sense for both of you. Did you watch her debut at UFC 184, and if so? How do you think she did? I didn't actually see it. Oh. It was late for my son. So, you know, we went to bed. I talked actually, Raquel, and before the fight, the day of the fight,

and I'm not really sure everyone just kind of gave me a little feedback after. So I still, I'm going to watch it. I just, I'm going to wait until after, you know, my fight is over, and, you know, I have a little more time on my hand. So you're friendly with Raquel. You, of course, were on the show with her, but you beat her while you were on the show. You're friendly with her now? Yeah, no, we were friends even there in the house, too.

I think I pretty much got along with everyone, and I, but I really did just kind of stick to myself, you know, with the other team. We were in our room and with the girls that I trained with. I mean, we're on my team. We just kind of talked and we were, you know, just kind of stuck ourselves. But Raquel would come in our room and, you know, even Roxanne was in our room, like stayed in our room.

it was fine. There was no hostility whatsoever. What do you make of the champion at 115? Because she's a great striker as well, Ioanni, I'm Jacek. She dominated Carlos Sparza. When you watch her fight, I don't know if you've seen her fight,

but how do you think you match up with her? Oh, I think that would be a great fight. And that's true. I definitely want to fight. As long as Dana, you know, set everything up, and I win all my fights, and, you know, I'm impressive,

and that's the fight. I want. Have you been impressed with what's happened to Ronda Rousey since she was a coach on your show? She's, her star has just exploded. It's unbelievable. Did you foresee this? I didn't, but I'm really happy for her. That is just awesome.

I, like, she is a super superstar. It seems like Juliana Pena is, you know, very eager to fight her at some point. Do you think she has a chance against her? I think everybody wants to fight Rhonda, right? She's got the target and that's so you have to beat to be on top. So, of course, everybody says they want to fire, but it's going to be a different story when she gets in there with her. And so before we let you go,

what do you know about your opponent, Valerie Latruno, also dropping down to 115. One expects her to be the hometown favorite because she's from there. What do you know about her? What are you expecting from her? I'm expecting a lot of kicks, and, you know, she's thinking I'm a boxer. She's going to hit that lead leg, and, you know, I just expect a lot of kicks, a lot of punches. She's really tough, and she keeps coming forward, and that's the perfect fight.

So I think our styles are going to do well together. So you like this matchup. You were excited when they offered it to you. Oh, absolutely, yeah. And we're both coming down to 1.15, so it's a fair fight, you know? Yeah. Well, I think a lot of people are looking forward to seeing you back. Finally, they can stop asking where you have gone,

and they can just watch you of C-186 on Saturday. And I'm assuming it will be fun for you to be in the octagon under the bright lights. It has been quite some time. Oh, yes, I'm very eager. I can't wait. I'm so excited. All the best to you. Thank you so much for the time.

Looking forward to your return on Saturday. Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it. There she is. Jessica Rikosey. Yes, we will. talk to you very soon, Jessica. Thank you so much for the time. She is back in the UFC after making the finals of the Ultimate Fighter season 18, November 30th, 2013, her last fight. You know, her

MMA record, when you look at it, 1-4 and 1-0 contest, not obviously the most impressive one. She does have an impressive boxing resume. But she did beat some notables on the ultimate fighter. She defeated Roxanne Monteferey, defeated Raquel Pennington via decision, and then of course lost to Julianna Pena. Haven't seen her fight since then, and she says she is a different fighter, so looking forward to that. I will correct something. I'm pretty sure I read this, unless they gave me the false information earlier.

The Valante finishes, in fact, the third latest in a three-round light-heavyweight fight. I said second-latest. It is the third-latest in a three-round light-heavy-weight fight. weight fight. Still notable, and I'm sure he doesn't care. He's $50,000 richer. John Volante, two black eyes. Those are pretty significant black eyes, I must say. Maybe my reaction wasn't the best. But he looks like a fighter. Anyway, there are two strawweight fights. All of a sudden, the strawweight division feels like the bantam weight division of a couple of years ago, the women's bantam weight division, where you never really know what to expect,

and the fights are pretty darn fun. There are two of them on the fight-pass prelims on Saturday. Opening the card, which I'm a little surprised about, opening the card is Ashting Daly versus Randa Marcos, and then it's Jessica Rikosi versus Valerie Léternon. Nordin Tel Av versus Chris Clements, the third fight-past fight, and then you got four Fox Sports One fights.

Patrick Cote versus Joe Riggs is the headliner for the prelims, and then, of course, five pay-per-view fights. And one of the interesting fights on the main card involves Fabio Maldonado. He, of course, was supposed to fight Quentin Rampage Jackson. That fight not happening. Instead, he's fighting Steve Bosse, who Quebec fans know a whole lot about. A former minor league hockey player made it all the way to the UFC not that long ago, but then he retired after having to pull out of a fight last year prior to their show in Quebec City.

he has been called upon to step up on short notice to replace rampage against Fabio Maldonado. And now we have his manager, and a man who, if you have followed Canadian MMA, you have certainly heard of his name, you've seen him inside the Octagon, you've seen his shows, a very important figure in the history of Canadian MMA. I've wanted to have this man on the show for quite some time. Happy that he is on this week, prior to UFC 186 in Montreal, I'm talking about Stefan Patri, who joins us right now on the phone. Stefan, how are you? I'm very good. What I want yourself, Ariel.

I'm doing great. Thank you very much for joining us. How did Steve Bosse get this fight? Because last I heard, he had retired from MMA. Well, he had retired from MMA. He was actually training for a boxing fight in May, so he was in training camp. And then when the old story about the injunction with Clinton Jackson came out publicly, Steve called me.

Because, I mean, I was handling, I was going to handle himself stuff for boxing and kickboxing, stuff like that. He didn't want to do M.M.A. anymore because he was getting injured quite a lot doing wrestling and jiu-too. So anyways, when the news broke, he called me, he goes, I want to fight Maldonado. So I immediately called the UFC. At first, they were not interested at all in putting Steve on the card because of what happened. last year where he retired before doing one fight on his deal with the UFC. So anyways, I insisted a little bit, and we ended up making a new deal for him. And there he is, fighting Maldonado Saturday. Wow. So do you think if this opportunity doesn't come up, he never fights again in MMA?

It wasn't the plan at all. I'm being honest with you. I signed with Steve in March, and M.A. wasn't part of the... equation at all. And after the UFC agreed to give him that fight with Maldonado, he went back to the gym, you know, to do MMA, Maita, and all the other stuff. And the first thing he told me was, Jesus Christ, it's a good thing I took that. I'm in love with the sport again. So he's back in MMA full time now. But, you know, Steve's a warrior. He just needs a bit of fire in himself, and now he has the fire and people will see a dangerous guy on the ring Saturday.

I remember when he announced his retirement that he said the injuries were catching up to him. He was just banged up. I mean, how does he feel physically now? He feels good. I mean, actually, what happened was when he was training for the – he signed a deal with the UFC back then. I wasn't involved in that deal. And then he started training.

He was going to go to a training camp in Thailand. And the week before he was supposed to leave for Thailand, he got hurt again. He had numerous shoulder injuries, elbow, knee. I mean, he got banged up pretty bad, and all the injuries were from training. Never in a fight, always from training. So after the last injury, he decided not to go to Thailand and just retire. He was fed up of all the injuries. But then he started working with a physiotherapist.

He played hockey last year in the North American Hockey League. So they worked on his shoulders. They worked on his elbows, everything. And now he's 100% healthy. He did some very, very hard sparing last week. And he's like a brand new one. So it's a big coincidence. But this coincidence.

ends up like the biggest news in his career because his dream was to fight in the UFC and there he is. Yeah, and he gets to do it in Quebec. You mentioned that he played hockey as recently as last year. I know he used to be a hockey player, but he went back last year? Yeah, he played for the Laval Predators. He played, I think he played 16 games with Laval. And so, you know, and he was doing boxing training and things were getting going better, no injuries. so that's how he ended up

wanted to do a boxing fight and then this UFC opportunity came and you know if honestly if if if

if Maldonado was the guy with the injunction with Bellator I don't think Steve would be fighting Jackson because Jackson's a wrestler but the

fact that Maldonado is a striker he's a boxer it's the perfect opportunity for Steve to get back in the U.S. and then after that, concentrate on wrestling and jiu-setsu and all the other things that he hasn't been doing for the last couple more. So you know the Quebec MMA scene better than anyone.

You've been promoting shows there for many, many years, over a decade, of course, TKO. You were the one who really helped, you know, make MMA into a very popular sport over there. And I'm wondering, and we're going to talk about that in a second, but given your expertise and given your history of promoting shows in MMA, your take on UFC 186? You know, as you know, fans have complained that it's not a great card, that it doesn't have, you know, a lot of, you know, roots in

the Quebec scene, doesn't have connections to Montreal gyms and things of that nature. What's your take on this card that the UFC has brought to Montreal after not promoting a show in Canada for quite some time? Well, I was surprised when they announced a show

in April, because I thought they would do a show in Montreal with McDonald's fighting for the title. but they decided to put that on the July 11th card with McGregor and Aldo. So obviously this kind of hurts the Montreal card because there's not really a marquee fighter fighting on the card that's from here. Obviously with GSP on the sideline, that hurts them here in Montreal. But, you know, it's very complicated because, you know, they didn't really add the time to build the guys like Obain-Mersier,

uh, Coet is, uh, you know, he's, he's at the end of his career. So it's, it's a complicated situation to come and do a big show like that in

Montreal without a marque fighter, but, you know, they, they, they decided to do it anyways, but, uh,

and also I noticed in the, in the, there's a lot of people ever since we signed Bosse to fight on the card that are like, they're, they're, they're freaking out. What? There's a USC this weekend in Montreal.

I didn't know. Wow. So the local promotion, right now is not very good here. I don't know what that's all about, but a lot of people now are buying tickets because there are no state of fighting. How many tickets do you think he has sold

or will sell by Saturday? Oh, Steve Bossley, without Steve Bosset, K.O was selling about 5,000 to 6,000 tickets. With Steve Bossley, we were selling between 8,000 and 9,000. Wow. The guy sells 2,000 to 3,000 tickets on a card, guaranteed. So, and that's another thing.

People that know that Steve is fighting is because we're telling them. There's, I mean, there's no advertising that bus is fighting. So it's, I don't know what the strategy is or what they're doing with that, but honestly, the local promotion that's going on in town right now is not as good as it used to be. And what's your take on, because you don't promote anymore, right? Not for now. Not for now. Okay, we'll get to that.

what's your take on the Canadian MMA scene right now? Because I've said on this show that it feels like a quiet time. You know, we have Rory fighting for the belt, but with GSP leaving and with not as many shows here and the crowd's not as big and honestly, not as many, you know,

I'm not talking about UFC shows. I'm talking about, you know, the promotions that were cultivating this talent like TKO, like MFC. It just doesn't feel like there's a lot of, there's a lot of action going on in Canada these days. And I don't know why. And I Now, I want to ask you, given your expertise, why do you think things have changed over the last few years?

Because at one point, it felt like so many guys were coming out of Canada. Even non-Canadians had to come through Canada to eventually make it in the UFC, if you know what I mean? Well, honestly, it's very complicated. You know, when I, at the end of TKO, the last, I think it was the last 11 shows were at the Bell Center. And we had amazing crowds from 5,000 to 9,000 people. It was good. And then when I stopped with TKO and came back two years later with Instinct, the first show was pretty good. We had like 5,000 people, but I spent a lot of money on advertising, on marketing, because, you know, it was a comeback show.

It was the first instinct event. So I wanted to really put a lot of money in advertising, and the result was 5,000 people. But then, after that, when we did Instinct 2, 3, and 4, I went back. to a normal advertising budget, and I had a hard time getting 2,000 people. I had to, I mean, and that brought me back to 2001. When I first started in 2000, I mean, when I first started in MMA, where we were struggling to build a fan base, we ended up doing it, but, I mean, I wasn't, I mean, in 2012, you don't want to do again everything that you did back in 2000.

Right. So I realized that the problem right now is, in the past, in the history, in the, the TKO era, going to an MMA event was an happening. It was something special. It was something, you know. But now you have MMA three times a week on TV. You have the Ultimate Fighter. You have UFC on Fox.

You have Bellator on Spike. I mean, you, and then you have UFC on RDS. You have World Series of Fighting on TSN. I mean, it's all over the place. So it's not the same thing anymore, where back then, UFC wasn't on TV here. It was only on pay-per-view. the only show you had on TV here was TKO, and that was once a week. And I was using those once a week weekly shows to promote the event the next month.

So we had a pretty good gig going on, but right now it's hard to take a guy out of his living room with his home theater in the living room and bring him to the bell center or to the arena because, I mean, he sees MMA on TV every day. So the market is different. We have, I mean, to bring back the TKO days here in Quebec is going to be very complicated. I tried it with instinct, and I, you know, I'll be honest, I failed. So, you know, it's the same thing as it used to be. And there's also the fact that the people here in Quebec are still not, and you're going to kill me for saying this, but it's the truth.

They're still not too excited by the ground game. of M&A. That's interesting. You know, because I think a lot of people would think that the Quebec fans are some of the most knowledgeable fans out there because they've seen so much. And people like myself who grew up in Quebec, you know, I've been watching TKO. I remember watching, I have memories about TKO, maybe even before, you know, really the boom of the UFC after the Ultimate Fighter. So you hinted that you might be coming back. What were you trying to say there?

Well, I'm actually working, I've been working under the radar for, the last three years with the Quebec government to get full contact kickboxing and Muay-I legalizing Quebec, I actually have a big meeting tomorrow with the government, and I'm on the verge of making it happen, and once I do, I'll start a promotion here. It can be a bit like glory, but with elbows. Oh, interesting, and that's illegal in Quebec. It is illegal. Right now it's illegal in Quebec, yeah.

And what's it like dealing with that commission? because, you know, they have received criticism as well. Well, the thing is, it's not even the commission. I mean, I met with the commissioner a few times about it. He wants to do it, but the thing is the way the structured combat sports in Quebec, and it's not only MMA, it's also boxing. The way it structured it, combat sports in Quebec are not a rule. There's no rules.

It's a law. So just to change one word in the law is very complicated. It has to go to the prime minister. It's a big, big, big edict. So, you know, I'm on, I mean, I kind of found some holes in the game, and that's what I'm working on right now to get its sanctioned. And you feel like that will be bigger than trying to bring back a new TKO or something like that? Oh, yeah, guaranteed.

Really? Wow, that is interesting. Now, you also work for RDS as a punded as an analyst, and not too long ago, you went out on the record and said that GSP is coming back. and Dana White said recently that they offered him a fight on this card, he turned it down, and right now it seems like as time passes, Dana White is less confident that he will ever fight again. Do you still feel like he will come back?

Do you still stick to your guns on that one? Yeah, Dana should be confident because George is going to come back for one fight. And this thing is going to come back and go on the title run and do 10 fights, but I know for sure he's going to come back for one fight. Really? And do you have any idea when this will happen? I have no idea. If I knew, if I had the answer, I'm pretty sure Dana Lorenzo would have the answer as well.

But, you know, it's one of those things where, you know, George got injured, which is something that wasn't expected, is other knee injury, then Anderson Silva got caught with steroids. So, I mean, there's a lot of things that have happened. in the past few months that can change the scenario a little bit but I know that George has the will and he wants to do one more fight he doesn't want to leave the sport

with that fight with Hendricks I know that for a fact because he's done something so rare he left his champion and now with the time's changing and he keeps talking about the drug testing I kind of feel like he's gonna sit it out that

I mean there's no point in doing it all over again but you still feel 100% that he will come back at least one more time I still feel 100% that he's going to come back for at least one fight. To me, it's obvious. Why? Why obvious? It's obvious because, I mean, you have to know the guy. You know, George is a special guy.

And there's something in himself. I mean, he has to come back for one fight. And it's not the fan saying that. It's the way I see it. But I'm assuming people are telling you this, right? This is not your guess. No, it's not a guess. I'm telling you he's going to come back for one fight.

But the thing is, if George would ask me, what's your opinion? Should I come back for one fight? I would say absolutely not. You know, you've done so much for the sport. You've done so much for the UFC. I mean, you've done everything. I mean, there's no – there might be nobody else that will do what you did. So, you know, just enjoy life.

And, you know, there's so many opportunities for him outside of fighting right now. But I know he's going to come back for one fight. Even though I tell him that, is that tells him that. Is that your manager tell him that? It's not going to change. He's going to come back for one fight. He's stubborn, and he's going to come back for one fight. Are you surprised that he didn't accept the fight on this card?

Because it was in Montreal, and, you know, it would have been a huge deal. Well, when I say George is coming back for one fight, it means he's going to come back for that one fight everybody wants to see. And obviously, when I say that, everybody points out to Anderson Silva. And, you know, if you was going to fight on that card in Montreal Saturday, obviously the opponent that Dana would have offered is not Anderson Silva. So he just doesn't want to come back for one fight that's not going to mean much in the history of mixed martial arts. He wants to make history with that one fight.

obviously like I said before with what happened with Anderson in his last fight and his problems with the commission I don't know what the big plan will be now but obviously the possibility of doing Anderson might be

a bit more tricky right now what's your relationship if any with GSP now do you do you still have any kind of relationship with him I talked to once in a while obviously we don't have the same relationship we used to have I mean we were I mean, for years, for seven years, we were the best friends.

We were together every day. So the relation has changed, but I still caught them. And so, correct me from wrong, did you kind of end your business relationship on bad terms, and have you had to work to repair that relationship? How would you describe how it ended? It didn't end good. Obviously, after he lost to Matt Serra, George wanted to fire one of his coaches the day after, and I didn't agree with it

because I knew that George didn't train for that fight. George was partying all the time for that fight with Sarah. He didn't do a real training camp for that fight. So basically I was selling George, you can fire him. I mean, you can fire him. If you're not comfortable with him anymore, yes, you do fire him, but you can't do it now. Because if you do it now, people will say,

oh, you lost because of this guy. You see, he just fired him. So, you know, to be honest with Victor, the name of the trainer was Victor. you know, wait a little bit before you, you take your decision or announce your decision, you know. So that, that was our first disagreement ever in our professional life and our friendship. We, we, there was a big fight around this all Victor thing. So anyways, you know, things got worse and worse and worse.

And then he ended up telling me he didn't want me to manage him anymore. So, which, you know, it's his decision. and even though we had a contract, you know, it was called, so we went that way. But the problem was, George Ab just signed a new six-fight deal with the UFC that I negotiated. So there was no way the new manager, Sherry Spencer, was going to get her commission on fights. I negotiated, right? We ended up, I had to sue him.

We were going to go to court. It took like a year and a half before we got a court date, and the day before the court date, his lawyer called my lawyer said, let's settle out of court. So we ended up settling out of court. I was very angry at George for that all two years. I didn't talk to him for that period of time between 2007 and 2009. I didn't talk to him once. Wow. And then in 2009, end of 2009, beginning of 2010, we talked to him.

to each other. We went to dinner and, you know, we kind of put everything behind us. But obviously, the relation will never be the same. But, I mean, you know, it's part of life. Was it hard for you to see him become this megastar afterwards and really become one of the greatest of all time when you kind of helped him, you know, get to where he was in the UFC? I mean, you got him to that title fight and defending that belt that one time. Was that hard for you? No, I was very happy. Honestly, I was very happy for him. But at the same time, I know all George is very, he listens to people a lot.

Actually, he listens to people way too much. I remember, I'll give you a stupid example, I think it was when he fought Frank Trigg. When he fought Frank Trigg, we were in Vegas at the restaurant a couple of days before the like maybe four days before the fight. And there was me, George, and one of us trainers. And then all of a sudden, the waitress comes up to take our order. And she goes, oh, you're George Champierre. Oh, you're fighting Frank Craig.

I know him very well. My brother used to wrestle in high school. And she starts giving George advice on his game plan. She's a waitress. And then she leaves. And George is all thinking about what she said. He's actually thinking about what the waitress just said. Wow.

And we had to work very hard to get all the stupid things. Exactly. It was actually thinking she might be right, but she wasn't. You know, it was just whatever she was saying didn't make any sense. But it made him think that's the way George is. It doesn't make him, you know. But that's the way here. But he's still like this.

He's still this way today with everything. if you put something in his ad, he's going to think about it for days. That's the way he is. Fascinating insight. So back to your question, I wasn't mad at him, but, you know,

because, you know, I knew that so many people put so many things in his ad that, you know, the kid that I discovered back in 2001 is still the same thing. When he's in the ring, he's that same kid all the time. So I wasn't, you know.

Well, Stefan, a great pleasure to have you on the show. was a lot of fun. I wish you and Steve the best on Saturday. I know, as I've said before, the card isn't what a lot of Montrealers wanted, but for me personally, it's always great to come back home, and there are some great Canadian

stories on the card, and Steve is definitely one of them. And there's two fights that, I mean, for me, the fight of the night will be either Maldonado against Steve or Campbell against Nikesy. So you have two huge fights on that main card, and then

obviously the world title. But Bosse and Maldonado and Magdesi Campbell, those two sides, those are worth the price of the ticket alone. We look forward to it. Thank you so much for the time, and good luck in that meeting tomorrow with the Quebec government. Thank you, Alia. All right, there he is. Stefan Patri.

If you're in the Quebec area, he is an analyst for RDS, Resort de Sport, the Sports Network, which is the French equivalent, the sister channel for TSN, the ESPN, the ESPN, end of Canada. He does a lot of great analyst work for that network and of course still very much tied to the world of mixed martial arts in Quebec. Great insight from him. We appreciate the time very much. All right, let's move along to our next guest. We have not heard from this man in quite some time. It has been a, I guess you can say, a tumultuous couple of months for him. Very happy that he has agreed to come on the show. I've wanted to talk to him for quite some time and so happy that he is

here right now, ready to speak to us. I'm talking about Hector Lombard, who joins us on the phone, right here and now. Hector, how are you? Hey, Ariya, how are I, Mike? I'm doing great. Great to have you on the show. So, Hector, of course, no beating around the bush. Everyone knows what's happened over the last few months. Can you describe what the last few months have been like for you? How difficult has it been since the news came out

that you had failed your post-fight drug test? Yeah, it was quite difficult, but I always believe that everything happened for a reason. And, like you say, I don't want to go on the bush and stuff like that. You know, a lot of people think that I wasn't getting me, you know, with some roads and stuff like that. They don't even know the true story. What I really happened was I trusted a person that I shouldn't trust. She was an Olympic competitor, and I'm paying for that. She told me like, oh, you know, I take this pill.

You know, I felt sick before my Olympics and stuff like that. You know, I know you're sick. You know, take the pill. And you got to feel better. Trust me. So I went ahead and I took the pill and actually the pill. Screw me up. I've sent you all the text messages that me and hey went back and forth, UCA.

I know a lot of people don't got to believe me anyway, but you had to prove and show you. And I was, you know, I was pretty, I've served with the whole situation, but, you know, I'm okay now. How many days before the fight did this happen that she gave you these pills? She actually gave me the pill and my mistake didn't ask anyone about the pill. I thought it was not true. I mean, like, I wasn't expecting that a pill would have such a strong effect. Right. You know.

And what was it for? Like, what was wrong with you that you needed this? I was sick, man. I mean, you saw me before the fight. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, like, you know, I had the flu and I was hard to cut the way and it was terrible. I couldn't even barely talk.

I talked to you just a couple days after God there in Vegas because, you know, the first few days, I couldn't even talk. And even in an interview that I did to you. Yeah, I remember. You can see that I was like really, really sick. and, you know, and I always believe, like, what's meant to happen, because, you know, I mean, like, if I would be, if I would have felt good, I wouldn't be experimenting something new or experimenting, experimenting, experimenting things that I don't take. And, say, okay, you know, she says, it was, in the back of my mind, it was like, oh, you know, I need to feel better, I need to be better. because at some points when I was training, I was, you know, about to pass out a few times.

And now I'm paying for the experiment, you know, something new. And what kind of relationship? And do you mind saying who this person was? Yeah, I mean, she's a friend or a friend. Her name is Julie. And I can't even pronounce her last name. Okay. Try. Can you try?

She, melafone, melafon, something like that. Okay. And how did you know her? I met her for a friend of my. Okay. And she came across, she came across like, you know, as very knowledgeable about the whole, the whole Olympic, you know, trials and knowledgeable about all the drug testing and all that. thing.

And, you know, I kind of like, I trust her. But did you know her for many years? Maybe I know her for a year or something like that. Okay. And did you tell any of your coaches or anything that she had given you this? Did you tell anyone beforehand? Like I say, it was one of the things that was meant to happen. I thought, like, I never expected that appeal would, you know, would have as soon as strong.

I felt like, you know, when you, you got to get caught, you know, when you injecting yourself something or whatever. But she's like, oh, you know, this pill, like, you know, you can take it over the corner and stuff like that. But obviously, that was wrong. And how many days before the fight did you take the pill? I just took it before the fight. I should stop to the wings.

Oh, on Friday. Yeah. How much pain were you in at the Wands? Like, how sick did you feel? I feel she's dizzy and, you know, you know, when you had the flu. Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. Just, you know, like, the adrenaline, it was the thing that was keeping me going. But if I wouldn't have that pressure and the adrenaline going, I'm pretty sure that I would be in bed the whole time.

but um you know how it is you have to uh you have to go over there and and do it no matter what are in a way are you disappointed in yourself because you've been around the sport a long time you know that you can't take certain things even like certain you know aspirins and things of that nature right before a fight are you disappointed that you made that judgment um very disappointed about my stability you know me I mean even like the Esteroid Park

when I When that thing came up I'm like okay you know I have to be It must be the esteroid pack that I was taking for the flu And they said No no no

There's no There's no asteroid pack It's like And then I mentioned the name Of these They whatever the name is And You know

Joe Rowan and all these people So it was saying like, man, that thing is being around forever. I mean, like that thing doesn't even do it. Thank you. You won't perform without seeing that much. I mean, like, what that thing is going to do to you? It's an older thing that it's being around forever. You know, the name of that whatever was, I mean,

didn't try to avoid the system or anything like that. otherwise, I would be do something different, but you know, I just, I thought it was, you know, just a normal opinion.

It would make me feel better, you know, because my, my conditions, and, uh, it didn't happen that way. And after the fight,

they booked you against Roy McDonald, um, but then there was some confusion over when the UFC found out about your positive test and when you found out about the positive test. And when you found out about the positive. test. Do you remember when they told you about it?

And what was your reaction when you found out that you had failed the test? I mean, to be honest, that thing is weird because, I mean, you know, like, once you get, once you get tested by the Philadelphia Commission, you would take maybe like two weeks to that thing come up, right? No longer than that. Mm-hmm. And that was like a couple of few months. It was like a month and change, right?

Yeah. It was after, though, it was after your fight against McDonald was booked. Yeah. I didn't quite understand that part, but, yeah, my reaction was like, fuck, the fuck is this. You know? Yeah. I competed in the Olympic level so many years, and I had a second. level and I just, you know, now I'm paying, you know, like you have to get back to my roots

and I don't even, don't even take you in freaking supplements, you know, because you never know in these days. Do you feel, do you feel like publicly by fellow fighters and fans and media you have been treated unfairly because, you know, I don't know how much you paid attention to it, but a lot of people were like, yeah, of course, of course Hector Lombard failed. We knew that all the time. I mean, it seemed like a lot of people were piling on you. Did you pay attention to any of that, and do you think that that was unfair?

Did it, you know, honestly, did it hurt your feelings? Well, it doesn't have my feelings because it's always been that way when the things come to me. Either in that situation or, you know, if you are fine, if you have fight, and, you know, we go to a scoring decision, like, you know, there's no referee's going to give me a fight. There's no referee's going to even be a fair with, you know, with, you know, they, I always, I have to win convincingly a fight to get, to win the fight. I, for J. Shields, and it was a referee they gave me a route to J. Shield. When I'm, for real, you know, you see what happened with, you know,

You know, Team Bush. You know, it's always being like, always John Sherman taught about me. But something that I'm used to it. I mean, and as well, like, you know, you know, it's so much farther that I look this way. I mean, there's a lot of people that are, and I'm going to mention names,

but they look like they're fat, and they're using it all their career. But because the way I look, you know, obviously they're going to be making, you know, they're going to be a lot of criticism behind. Yeah, you've actually been outspoken about PED use in the sport, which, again, that led to some people saying, like, oh, come on. And then when this happened, a lot of people were saying, I told you so. Can you go on the record here and say you've never taken any kind of performance and have, drug prior to any fight?

I haven't. You know, I mean, there is no secret. I mean, like every every fire before I got tested enough. And it's the one thing that's going to keep me going now. It's going to be this

this, this what, uh, what, uh, this whole situation. This is the one that's got to keep me going. I'm going. I'm going to, uh, I'm going to, you know, stick around for a few more years to prove that I don't need that of that, you know.

And then in March, Nevada suspended you for a year, took away your win bonus and 33% of your show money, which equals almost $70,500. Were you surprised by the amount of money they find you and also the length? usually the first offense in the past has been nine months and around like a $2,500 fine. Yours was much heftier than that. What did you make of that all? It's always, you know, it's sector. You know, whatever I had to do, you know, they capitalize on it.

Mm-hmm. You know. Did you think that was unfair? Of course it was unfair. But have they done it before? No. You know, put in a sample. me. I mean, come out. But what can I do? It's always that way, you know, when the time comes

to Hector, it's always a way that, you know, looking to, look into a sample. So what are you going to do for the next year? Because this is how you make your living. You're in the prime of your career and you can't fight and you're healthy and, you know, you would be ready to fight, you'd be fighting this weekend if this didn't happen. What are you going to do now? Yeah. Obviously, they don't really care about it. I mean, I do believe that if it would be somebody else, it would be different.

But obviously, it's me. And it's good to happen, though. It's good to see, like, you know, when you're on the bottom, see who is the one that's going to kick you up, because I'm going to stand up again. And what I have in plans right now is just kind of like do a little grabbing competitions and stuff like that. Obviously, I'm going to stop, and I'm going to keep going.

And next year, I will be blocked. Yeah, so your suspension is up January 3rd of next year. So I guess you're three months in a little bit into it. But I'm wondering before I let you go, will you do anything towards this woman who gave you these pills? Will you try to sue her? Are you going to look for any kind of compensation? I don't know. This isn't the talk.

I'm just thinking. But, you know, she gave me, she didn't force me. And that was my stability to just believe in her. sort of like I tell you I come up to you and say like

Hey Ariel she's jump out of the bridge and there is there is a person down there that is gonna catch you

you know you won't jump but you know if you jump is your fault um no

I mean I just gonna keep positive uh gonna be uh but um It's always been that way. Like, you know, I can put samples to you.

Like, I remember back in the days in Australia when I stopped fighting. I remember that this is just like a small history of what I've been through. I fought a guy that he was like a free time Olympian for the Nabudavis. He beat the graysies and stuff like that. He was kind of like very popular. His name is Chris Brown. So I went and knocked the guy out quick. They gave me the fight.

I won the fight. And it's just the very next day. The very next day, the promoter came. He says, hey, man, we got to put the fight in no contest because you're hurt by the guy. And I'm like, how the hell I help by the guy? Are you serious? you guys gave me the fight everything was okay

now the guy goes back and makes some compliment some arguments because he can you know lose and et cetera et cetera la da and

now you guys got to rig my fight and they actually did they put the final contest but if you watch it on YouTube uh hecta versus uh Chris Brown

you can see like can knife the guy or cling. And the very next day, they just put the final conference. You know, and all the fights like, you know, I have with James Tehuna, you see the referee, stop the stop the fight, and then restart the fight again. So I actually have to fight the guy twice in one fight because the referee, he just didn't like me to win the fight. Oh, you know, when I fought Takasi, you know, I,

I was fighting the guy and then you see the referee stopping the fight when I was gone upon the guy and said to him, hey, careful, this guy's going to knock you off. So, I mean, it's always been like this with me. I mean, I don't got to just complain about it. It's just part of my journey. Why do you think that is? Why do you think people have targeted you? I don't know.

I don't know. Maybe she just doesn't look easy. on their eyes. I don't know. Well, Hector, I'm sorry that this has happened. It was unfortunate news. I know a lot of people were looking forward to that fight against Royne McDonald. I appreciate you coming on and talking about this.

I know it's probably not the most fun topic to discuss, so it is very much appreciated on this side of the table. And we hope everything turns out well for you and that you can return to the UFC in the new year and resume your career. Yeah, and I promised you Tolia that I was that I was, you was going to be the first person to interview me.

And I appreciate it. You kept your word. I'll be my promise. You kept your word. I gotta keep, I gotta keep positive and, you know, they slow me coming. So, no stopping here. All right, all the best to you, Hector.

Thank you so much for the time. Thank you. All right, there he is. Hector Lombard, stopping by attempting to clear the air on his failed drug test from a couple of months ago. All right, let's move along now. One of the big winners, as we mentioned earlier, on Saturday in Newark, was Max Holloway. What a performance over Cups Swanson.

A career-defining win extends his winning streak to six in a row, and now he is very much in that contender status. So right now, we need to go to the Skype machine and go all the way to Wainai, Hawaii, where Max Holloway is standing by. Max, how are you? Are you back home? I'm back home, man. Back home and chilling. How good does it feel? How long was that journey from Newark? I think it was like 12 hours total time, 13 hours.

We flew to Phoenix and we had a little short layover and then we came back all the way to Hawaii. But it feels good when you have to fly back home after a win like that. I guess you're kind of still on that high, right? Oh, yeah, of course, you know. It's great. It just feels good. Just winning period. any fight. Any fight in the UFC is huge. Winning a fight in the UFC is huge. So, you know, going home, being on the plane

and being a winner, is just a great feeling. Did they have a parade for you over there, a barbecue, something? What kind of reception did you get when you came back home? You know, I just went to my Anteim's house that was on the road to Octagon. They had a barbecue for me when we came back down. So it was just a bunch of close family,

family venerers, and we just had some. With Mantis's birthday on Saturday, they had some leftover ice cream and cake for me, so I had a bunch of that, and we had some barbecue. They cooked me lamb and steak, so it was great. So the same kind of barbecue scene. How many people are at these barbecues? You know, it's just, like most of the time, probably like 20 of us, you know, it's not too big. Maybe a little bit more, but we just all like to get together, you know, and just like kind of, kind of, I just want to kind of forget about fighting a little while, you know. I love spending time with them.

I love playing. That game we was playing is called Portagee Horseshoe, you know, so practice that. We've got some tournaments coming up, so I got to get better at that game. Tournaments. Is there money on the line? Yeah, it's more money, man. It's like a $25 buy-in and like 20 teams, so it should be good. All right, well, you are on a role as of late, so I'm picking you to win that thing.

I know nothing about the game. You're just on fire. What a performance that was. Wow. Deep down inside, did you think you would dominate him like that? You know, that's how I felt. You know, I, I, I, I, uh, I feel confidence with my tools, you know. And it's the confidence that I said.

That's the confidence you need, you know. If you don't, if you're not confident in this sport, you're not going to get very, very far, you know. And it was crazy, you know, I had a dream about that finish. I had a dream that I was going to, I was going to submit Cub, you know, with a guillotine. I had a dream. And I, and I came, uh, I told my, I told my, uh, my coach, I told my coach, I told my coach, Ryan Lazars, my jiu-jitsu coach. I said, I had a dream, man, I'm going to sub-cub.

I'm going to sub-cub with a guillotine. I called it and he was like, yeah, I don't know, man. Just stick to the game plan, go punch people in the face, do it max how it does best. And if it happens, it happens. And then, you know, I stick to a game plan. I land some good clean punches on Cub and I had them hurt and got to sink in that sub. How far in advance did you have that dream? I was like maybe like four weeks out of the fight.

Wow. Yeah, I was four weeks out of the fight. And I came to the gym. It was on a Thursday. It was before wrestling practice. And then I saw my coach in the morning and I told him, I had a dream. I'm going to submit Cubs Johnson. And he was like, he's like, don't change nothing, man.

Just go in there and just go punch him in the face. They stick to our game plan. I was like, I'm going to. I'm going to. But I know the sub is going to come. At what point in the fight did you realize, all right, and speaking of confidence, like, I got this guy. I have broken him. I'm better than him.

I'm going to win this fight. was there a certain moment where you had that epiphany? You know, I think was in the middle of the second round. You know, I kind of felt like the first round I felt I got to rewatch it. But in there, I thought the first one was much more closer than what I watched. Like I always remember what the guy does to me a lot of times. So the first round, I thought it was closer than what it was, you know. And then the second round came, and like in the middle, I just started having fun.

I don't know what it was, man. Something just went through me, you know, and this was having fun. I was landing strikes, and it was just great. You know, I just saw him kind of, he was moving forward, you know. That's how I know that he stood in the game. He moved forward. But once I started, I was able to walk him down and I was pressing him and he was taking step backwards, I kind of feel like, oh, gosh, this is uncouristic from him, you know.

He likes to support it a lot. So when I got him stepping back, I was like, I think I'm getting him, you know. Did he seriously hurt you at any point in the fight? Not too much, you know. He hits hard, though. He does hit hard, you know. His kicks is pretty hard, but I felt good, you know. It didn't get hit with anything that made me be like, oh, man, I got to watch out for it, you know.

But it felt he hits hard. I felt some of his punches, but nothing that really hurt me. When you found out that he didn't speak. spend any time in Albuquerque to prepare for this fight. Did you think anything of that? Did you think, oh, that's interesting. He's switching things up. He's been so good as of late.

Sometimes when guys switch things up, you know, different results happen. I mean, did you put any stock into that? You know, not really. You know, I was, you know, he still did some elevation training, you know, so running at that 8,000 feet thing on top of the show and on top of the show. And I didn't think too much. You know, I was just kind of like, oh wow, you know, I was kind of tripping out that, you know,

he was at boxing where, you know, Victor Ortiz then box, you know, and he knows Tim Bradley and all that kind of cool stuff. And then he just is at home, you know, sometimes you got to do that. You know, I take nothing away from him. You know, I love training. Everybody, when I first got the Cub fight, everybody was telling me, oh, Max, where are you going to go for train for this fight? I was like, I was like, I'm not going nowhere.

I'm staying home, man. This is where my heart is. And, you know, I got one of the best teams in the world. just people don't know yet. Do you feel like now finally you're going to get some respect? I mean, I'm looking at the rankings, and I don't think they've been updated, so you're nine going into this fight,

do you feel like you're going to crack that top five, do you feel like you're in that contender status? You just beat the fifth-ranked guy, and you beat Cubs Swanson. I mean, he was on the verge of getting a title shot. Yeah, you know, I don't care too much about the rankings. I don't believe into the rankings. You know, you see guys fighting non-ranked guys getting ranked.

You see guys winning, and fighting non-gang ranks and moving up, you know, it's ridiculous, you know. And at the end of the day, I'm a firm believer of, we're all second place. They should just put two to everybody's name, you know, because there's only one guy out there, and that's the champion. You know, if you don't have the gold belt around your waist, your second place right now. So I don't really care, you know, I don't care wherever they put me. It's great, you know, and, you know, it was awesome because I was happy I was moving up

because of the fighter pay for the Reebok thing, but I guess they just, They just came out with stuff saying that they changed it to how many fights you got now. So I'm good on that side too. So it is what it is. You know, I just want to fight the best. You know, a lot of people just fight, they were saying I was going to get annihilated on the feet. I was my best chances on the ground and this and that. I was tripping out.

I was like, I'm not even a ground fighter, you know. And I strike all my fights. And it's just, now it's just crazy because all the same guys is like going on and telling me, oh my gosh, you're not going to beat the next guy. They're saying Chad Mendes or Ricardo Lammis or Frankie Eggers, like, there's always somebody else, you know? There's always somebody else that's going to annihilate me. You know, I just, I fought the fight of my life and, you know, people is not happy with that, I guess.

Still. So I was going to ask you about the kind of feedback you've received. Like now that it's one thing to fight on pay-per-view, it's another thing to fight on a, you know, on a fight night on FS1, but you were on Big Fox. Millions of people were watching. Do you feel them coming out of the woodwork giving you love or not? I mean, it sounds like maybe not. Yeah, you know, I got some love, you know, I got love, man.

I got, I got, actually, I got a lot of love from people, but a lot of people just, like, you know, like telling me, like, with the whole McGregor situation, they're trying to tell me Mendez or Frankie, they're all saying, like, oh, you're going to get annihilated from them now, you know, but before this fight, they were saying there's no way in a chance in hell or in God, whatever, that I was going to beat Cub, you know, the way I did. And, you know, it's just, it's never good enough for people. You know, they're always trying to look for the next and better thing. You know, they're like, okay, he got past Cub, whatever.

That was a fluke. But he's going to lose to this guy. That's not a lot of guys is doing to me right now. So it's just funny, you know, it's funny to see. What a bunch of a-holes, huh? Coming to you, you're trying to bask in your glory, enjoy your win, and they have to try to put you down. People these days, unbelievable.

No, it happens, man. It is what it is. You know, some people are not happy with their life, so it's going to try bringing it down. They ain't bringing me down. I know what I did. I know how big what I just did is big, you know. So I just can't wait.

You know, I just can't wait for the call from my management over at Suckpunch, you know. You know, hopefully we can see what happens, see who's next, and just take one step at a time, you know. Dana White was super happy with my performance. I got to talk to Sean Shelby and Joe there, but was happy. So I think not to my great things in the near future. Do you have a preference who you fight next? Is there someone in mind?

I don't care, man, whoever, you know. I'd fight whoever, you know. I'd love to get that McGregor fight, you know. Everybody's like, oh, you know, McGregor beat you with an ACL. He just destroyed you, this and that. I was like, yeah, okay, cool, you know. But not too much people knew I was injured, you know. And when I came out with it, then people was like, oh, you know,

you're just making an excuse now. Why you come out two years later, you know? Because I didn't want to cry about it, you know. It's something that I didn't want, I'm not that person, but it just gets to a point where these guys just get under your seat. skin, keep saying you got annihilated with a guy would have blown ATL, blah, blah, it's just frustrating, you know? What was wrong with you?

I got a high ankle sprain in the first 30 seconds of that fight. Oh. I kicked him in his knee and then I kicked him in his elbow and right in the first 30 seconds and I just couldn't, could not move. And I tell everyone, I tell, go watch any Max Holloway fight. When do I ever move straight back? You tell me, go

point out any fight. If you got me, if you go watch my fight you know that wasn't me you know and a lot of people like oh oh this and that like oh no you were uh that was the best you or this and dad he had a stuff my girl got hurt at the ending of a second round you know at the ending a second round and he got hurt on the ground so he took me down so so i was thinking like that's that's my point exactly like all these guys say that he's gonna knock me out this next time he had two rounds to knock me out before he got injured you know so where where's uh where was it i don't know i don't see it by the by the way back to the the sponsorship thing. So you're happy that it's not based off the rankings, right? Is that accurate?

Yeah, you know, I was, actually, I'm not really happy, but I just was stoked because I was like, oh, maybe I break top five and I can be in the fighter's pay of one to five or one to six now, you know, so that's, that was great. But then I just saw in the interview, I just saw on the thing say, now you got fights per fight, like how much fights a fighter have now? So I was like tripping out. I was like, oh, I'm kind of good there. I got 12 fights. So it should be kind of nice. checks. Crazy. I can't believe you have

12 fights in the UFC. I feel like you debuted yesterday. That's unbelievable. 12 fights and you're 23 years old. That just blew my mind. Yeah, it's a blessing,

man. I don't know, man. We only make this money once, so you gotta go fight as much as you can. Did you, at what point? I mean, because you talk very proudly

of where you're from, but it's, you know, I'm assuming a lot of big stars don't come from Wai Nahuay, right? I mean, like, did you, did you,

did you dream of this or is this beyond your dreams? This is way beyond my dreams, man. I just wanted to put Winey in a positive way, you know. And I kind of feel like I did, you know. I'm getting so much support here now. It's so crazy, you know. It's just awesome.

Down here, one of my sponsors, Paradise Drive, the shoe sponsor, they made me shirts for this last fight, you know. And they sold it at a farmer's market in Wainai here at my hometown. They had a farmer market on Saturday before a fight. And I don't know how much they made, but they sold out the shirts in like 10 minutes. Wow. And they had this big banner of me and like everybody who bought signed their name on it. And I got to get one of my friends.

He's holding the banner for me. So it's just stoke, you know, to see all this support and see all this people just backing me up. That's major. Yeah, that is major. How about that? You like that one, huh? I got a little pigeon in me. You didn't know that.

Yeah. I know. I know. You always been talking to me in Pigeon. Respect, brother. Yeah, respect, brother. I love it. How, how, like, pigeon, and excuse me for being not too well versed on this. I mean, is it its own language or is it just certain terms here and there? It's just, it's, it's kind of like its own language. Like, people can really speak, like, speak hard pigeon. Like, before when I first came into UFC, I could speak, I speak, I speak pigeon a lot. watch all my post-fight interviews, it was funny. I was just a pigeon machine. But now, you know, I kind of have to clean up my eye because people would be like, what are you saying back?

So what are you saying? Or I'm like mixing up words, so it's funny. When you were growing up and we're talking about like your dreams of becoming a star, you said this is beyond your dreams. Did you look up to BJ Penn? Because, of course, when people say Hawaiian MMA, that's the first person that they think of. Yeah, you know, of course.

You know, he's the one that set the plateau. He's the guy that when I, when you watch, it's like, I want to be better in this guy. That's the way BJ pushed me. I want to be better. Like to see all these great things. No, BJ, I don't think that much that much people know that, you know, there's a BJ Penn Day in Hilo over in Hilo on the Big Island. Or on the Big Island, not in Hilo. The whole Big Island thing, they did a BJ Penn Day for him, you know, and I thought that was cool.

I was like, oh man, maybe I want to, you know, like BJ Penn can get a day and maybe I can get a month after me. here in Oahu but you know he just push you to be great you know but it's it's what he did was is crazy you know two different weight class champs

and he did it he's the man and he he was a big inspiration did you ever meet him yeah you know I met him I met him a couple times you know but I never did see him ever since I was in the UFC I met him after that

you never tried to train with him or anything like that um actually when he was getting ready for his Frankie fight you know A couple of my teammates went up there, and I was going to go with them too, but I had one of my fights booked. I forget who I was. I forget where I was, but I was getting ready for a fight, and I was already gone.

So the week that my teammates went, they went, I was up for a fight week. I think I was when I was in Oklahoma. Okay. And I know you have a good relationship with the UFC and Dana White. Are you going to try to convince him to finally bring the UFC to Hawaii? Oh, yeah, you need to convince him. Just every time you see him to say, hey, Max is texting me. He wants one in Hawaii.

You know, every time you see him, just irritate him, man. Please, just please do it. I'm going to irritate him until he tells me stop. And I'm just going to keep going. Is that the dream? Oh, yeah. Yes, that is the dream, you know. You know, right now they can say they only had BJ Penn, you know,

when BJ Penn was in it, you know, they didn't have too much Hawaii guys. But now we got like seven guys, you know. Three of all, the other two, three of us is on the same team. and a bunch of us all trained together. You know, I used to train with Brad, I used to train with Brian, used to train with Kylean. So, you know, I got Russell Donne, Louis Smoka. We got KJ Noon, you know.

So it's like, we got a bunch of these Hawaii fighters just come down. We can make a whole car with Hawaii fighters, you know, come on down. And then they're like, oh, you know, they're scared of the rain, this and that at a little stadium. You know, I don't have to be a big show at the low stadium. We got this thing called the Stan Sheriff. Uh-huh. We can think there's a lot of parking because I guess the big issue is people say like where to broadcast the fight.

Like they need their big buses and trucks to park. Okay. But the stand sheriff is made for that. So they have a lot of parking at the stand sheriff and I think it sits like 12,000 people or something or 10,000. So we can make a fight night, I think, you know. Give me whoever, give me whoever. Give me whoever. Let's make a fight night.

Let's bring one to a white. That would be ultimate, you know. That'd be major. Yeah, that would be made. That would be super major. By the way, did you know that Chris Wyman's wife is also from Wynai? I did know. I did know.

One time he was training in Macaugh. I was my dad. My father-in-law, he was helping this jiu-jitsu school with the strength and conditioning. And, you know, this lady came in and she was like, she was like, oh, is blah, blah, blah here. I forget who she said. But I was like, oh, no, he's not. And then she was like, oh, I have tickets to was Chris Wyman versus Anderson Silver. one. And then, no, she said, oh, I had tickets to my, my son-in-law's fight. I was like,

oh, who's your son-in-law? Oh, no, like, what did his son-in-law fight in? And she's like, in the UFC? I was like, in the UFC. I was like, who's your son-in-law? And she's like, Chris Wyman. I was like, we got to be lying. She has to be lying. And then later on, I found out one of my uncles told me that, yeah, that he was friends with one of the, with one of the guys that know the girl and said that yeah Chris Myman's wife is from Weiner I was tripping out I was like oh man that's pretty crazy did she go to the same school as you or something like that I have no idea I have no I don't know who she is I got to find her in a name yeah by the way my friends over at fight metric are telling me this you have 11 UFC fights at featherweight

that's tied with Dustin Porreier for the most in the division you also have 12 UFC fights overall. Of course, you had that one at $150. Oh, actually, it was a catch weight. And you rank in the top five in the following UFC and WC featherweight categories. Wins, finishes, knockdown, significant strikes landed, landing rate, and takedown defense.

How about that? Killing it. Max Hollow. It feels awesome, man. It feels awesome, you know? It feels great, you know. I keep forgetting that that one fight is at $150. They keep telling me about, oh, you had this much fights.

Like, 11 fights at 45. I was like, all my fights weight for one time, 150. I always catch, like, even like the most,

something came up and it was like the most finishes at featherweight, and I was like, bro, they're jipping me one. And I was like,

oh, okay, one was at 150, so I'm like, oh, it makes sense. Hey, one last thing before I let you go,

what was your son's reaction when he saw you after this big win? Oh, you know, he was, he was just kind of, like,

he was kind of waking up, so he was kind of whatever, but when he saw my wife, he was going crazy. My wife was up there with me, this one. Oh, nice. He woke up, and he was like, he was like, oh, mommy, mommy. And then I was like, hi, baby.

And he's like, hi, dad. And then he was like, whatever, you know. And he was like, I was telling him something. And he started crying. I was like, why are you crying? And I told him, I wanted to surprise him. I bought him some shoes up there. Okay.

And I just told him, I got your shoes. Stop crying. He's like, shoes? Okay, I always me. He doesn't carry it, right? He has no idea what's going on. No, he has no idea what's going on. But it's funny because when I got the shoes on and I put the shoes on him,

I was like, oh, look, you don't have to train in these shoes. He's like, no. He's like, no, I want to train. And then he does a one, two, three, and then he does a high kick. I was like, where are you learning this from? Yeah, I was like, where are you learning this from? It's funny. I'll try to record him.

I'll post a video. You laugh. I would love to see that. He's learning it from his old man who just picked up the biggest win of his career on Fox in front of millions of people. One day you will tell him about that fight, and he's going to be very proud of you. Congratulations on the win, Max. Thank you so much for coming on.

I know it's early in the morning over there. Really appreciate it and looking forward to the next one. You are in contender status, my friend. It's going to be a lot of fun watching what they do with you next. Thank you, man. Thank you so much for having me. Oh, the pleasure is mine to be on the show. I'm excited and just can't wait for the future.

All right. All right, all the best to you. We'll talk to you soon, Max. Thank you. There he is. Max Holloway. Huge win for him. Appreciate him coming on.

What a great performance that was against Cups. All right. One guest to go. She has a huge fight coming up. this Saturday at UFC 186, it's a trilogy fight. Don't let them tell you differently. They fought three times of four, and in fact, our guest is two and oh against her opponent. She's fighting Alexis Davis.

She is Canada's own Sarah Kaufman, and she joins us right now. Sarah, how are you? I'm doing great, thanks, Ariel. How are you? I apologize for the delay. Thank you very much for your patience. I'm wondering when they called you and said that you're going to have to fight Alexis Davis again for the third time after being two and oh against her. What was your reaction?

Initially, I mean, it wasn't, it was pretty shocking because I just wasn't expecting it. You know, you beat someone twice, you know, there's no question about it. You know, great fights. You know, Alexis is tough, and they've been very exciting fights. But, you know, Alexis is probably the one person in the entire UFC band-o-wight division that wasn't on my radar for being my potential next opponent. And, you know, I was a bit surprised and didn't really understand it. you know, I don't know, maybe they just want to make an exciting fight, but a trilogy

without a title or without being a rubber match, you know, again, just wasn't on my radar and wasn't something that I was really that excited about. At this point, being a week out, I almost don't feel like we have fought twice before, but I do feel like, you know, I'm going to be crushing Alexis for the third and final time and then can move on with the rest of my career. Yeah, you're kind of tired of thinking about her, I would imagine. Yeah, you know, it's old news at this point. You know, as I say, it's a third time coming through, and I need to beat her that much better and make sure that there's no chance that

the Lexus Davis comes up in my future again. Initially, was it hard to get up for the fight? Because, like we've said, you beat her twice, and, you know, you almost have to outdo yourself here. It is a lose-lose for me initially when I first got the news. You know, I did feel like, what do I have to gain in this fight? There's a lot of pressure, you know, to, as they say, fight better than you have in the first two. So the first couple weeks were not unmotivated, but it was definitely, you know, a little bit confused

and kind of different emotions going on as to why this fight and what was happening and where am I in the division. And as the camp's gone on, it doesn't matter who it is. You know, it's been a great camp. I've worked with great people, and, you know, I'm ready to literally just go in there and throw down and try and get this to be a bloody fight that ends fast in my favor. I kind of feel like we're about to see a year's worth of frustrations come out on Saturday. I mean, would you describe the past year as a little frustrating?

You had that win over Leslie Smith, but you haven't fought since then. It's been a year and four days since your last fight. You had that car accident that delayed things a little bit. You've been campaigning for fights that, for whatever reason, didn't materialize. Are you walking into this fight as a frustrated fighter? You know, I definitely am. I'd say I'm walking as a frustrated fighter, but also a very confident fighter. Over the last year, sitting on the sidelines and watching as things have happened,

and as I've been injured and then waiting for fights and seeing other people get opportunities, you know, none of that matters at this point, but it has led to kind of this penultimate moment for me on the same thing. Saturday when I get to step in that cage and show what I'm about and remind the fans, remind the division, remind Misha Tate, remind Jessica I, remind Bette Correa, remind Ronda Rousey, who I am and what I am

as a fighter, as a person, and that I'm coming for everybody. You really went to great lengths to try to get Misha to take that fight. Did you ever have any serious discussions with the UFC or your management team, anyone about trying to get that Misha Tate fight? I mean, you put out a video of you smashing a cupcake. That is that is original stuff.

That means that you really wanted the fight, and it didn't seem like it was on the radar at all. Did you ever have any talks about trying to get it, and why did you want it so much? You know, I've been trying to get that fight. I mean, since I last fought Leslie Smith, I wanted the winner of Liz Karmouche, Misha Tate, knowing that it would put me in a great spot.

And then I had the car extent, and Misha Tate after the fight, said, okay, I want to fight, Gina Carrano, Sarah Kaufman, or Holly Holme, two of whom at the time, were not ready to be fighting and she just never responded

and Misha doesn't want that fight I know she doesn't want that fight and I had my manager pushing you know the UFC I had the fans I had you know as many people as I possibly could any kind of media pushing I mean it was hilarious that video

and it's a fight that makes sense it's a fight that people want to see and it's a fight that Misha should want I mean I beat her before who wouldn't want that rematch back You know, it was years ago. There's a big story there. And again, it's going to be an exciting fight.

So all I'm going to do is I'm going to stay in shape after I beat Alexis and get ready for the fact that maybe Jessica I pops for weed before the fight in a random test. Maybe someone gets hurt. Either way, I'm going to be ready to step in and fight Misha or Jessica if that happened. Why do you think she doesn't want it? Because of the first fight? I mean, something recent. Why do you think that deep down she doesn't want this?

She knows she's going to lose. And a lot of people, I think, don't mind losing to a grappler or a wrestler or someone when, you know, they're going to get held down. It's going to kind of be a back-and-forth fight. But I think when you know that you're going to get hit and you're going to get hit with power, it doesn't matter where it is on the feet or on the ground, you know, that fight is not alluring for a lot of people. And I think that that's the case with Misha. She wants to keep her face intact. deep down inside were you worried that they might cancel this card after all the cancellations,

the injuries, the lawsuits, blah, blah, what were you thinking? This is such a long road for you this past year, and then you're like, oh, my gosh, this might not happen. What was going through your mind? You know, when TJ initially got injured and pulled out of the fight, it was something that I thought weakened the card for sure. You know, that was a big fight. I was excited to be on the card and get to witness that live because I didn't get to see their first sight. And so I was disappointed as a fighter and a fan, and I'm sure a lot of other people who were going to the Montreal card felt the same.

And then to lose Rampage, you know, that was really unfortunate as well. And there was kind of a momentary thought of what if they cancel this card. What then? You know, I've already been waiting a year. I've already been waiting way longer than I wanted to. And, you know, that that rage probably would have come out in some form or another, whether it's on Twitter into a pillow, making sure that I need to fight.

And I'm just glad that the card is going through and going forward. And, you know, I leave tomorrow morning, so hopefully nothing happens between then and now. And I'm looking forward to not getting a phone call from my manager for this fight, saying that my opponent's out. And let's not forget also about Roy McDonald's Hector Lombar, which was also on this card that isn't happening. So three very big blows,

but thankfully for the fighters involved, the fight is happening. Does it bother you? I know you're somewhat in tune. You're on social media. Does it bother you when you hear people bagging on the card and saying it's not worth the money and all that stuff? Does that piss you off? I think people have a right to their opinion and they have a right to feel how they're going to feel about how they want to spend their money. You know, the UFC puts on so many great cards.

And the card itself is actually a pretty good card. I mean, it's not Chris Wyden Vitor Belfort, which has all the hype. It's not Connor McGregor, Jose, you know, or Jose Aldo. It's not that card, but Demetrius Johnson is an amazing fighter. He always puts on good fights. Whether you find them as exciting as you want to,

I'm always entertained. You know, he's an amazing practitioner of all sorts. And from the bottom of the card, right to the top, as a whole card, there aren't very many weak fights on it. And I think fans should be excited to maybe be surprised by what they get. You know, oftentimes the cards that have the biggest names and the biggest hype don't always turn out to be, to live up to that standard. And the cards that you're not expecting as much out of could blow you away.

And I hope 186 is just that. Well, the good news for you is that you're not on pay-per-view. You're on the FS1 prelims. And I think initially some people are like, what's up with that? I mean, they're two top-ranked fighters, but we've seen this before. What do you make of now being on the prelims when perhaps this could be one of those cards where the fans just check out the prelims? And I think, as I mentioned earlier on the show, the fact that it's right before Pachiao-Mayweather,

I think is a tough blow because that's such an expensive pay-per-for-you. It's like $100. There might be some people who want to save their money because I think any combat sports fan, even if you're a casual boxing fan, you're going to want to watch that fight next week. But that doesn't come into play with you because you're on the prelim. So is the part of you kind of happy that you're on the prelims where the most amount of people, I think a lot of people, I think I would guess, I would definitely guess. I would definitely go out on a limb here and say the prelims will be watched by more people than the pay-per-view. Do you take some solace in that?

I'm happy to have people watch me fight. And, you know, another good thing about being earlier on the card is I'm done earlier, I get to enjoy the fights after. And being on FS1, being on TFN2 in Canada, and every other network that it's broadcast on, there really are so many people. that I know who wouldn't buy the pay-per-view, but they want to watch me fight. And so those people get to watch the fight, and then the people who maybe don't know me or don't know Alexis as well or are excited for our fight but might not have paid for that pay-per-view, get that option of seeing an incredible world-class fight between, you know, two of the top ranked in the phantomweight division. It's kind of a win-win at this point. You made some headlines last week

when you talked about the Reebok deal and losing sponsorship money, so I want to get your take on today's news. Did you hear about the new system that's going to be in place where it's not going to be based on where you're ranked, it's going to be based on how many fights you've had

in WC, Strike Force, and UFC combined. Are you in favor of this? I actually just read it probably two minutes before we went on the air here while I was waiting. And, you know,

I think, again, that's interesting. I think it does have a little bit more stature in that it makes more sense. But at the same time, you know, I've been in the UFC for two years, and this is only my third fight, and that's not always by choice. You know, I've been trying to push for fights, and then injury did happen from our car accident, but I would like to have 30 fights if possible. But it does make sense rather than kind of an arbitrary ranking system.

It'll just be interesting to see it might change again before July comes about. And by the way, the good news is it includes your strike force fights. So this, if I'm not mistaken, this is your 11th, you know, Zufa fight now because they put that umbrella off over all those fights. So that puts you pretty high up there. It does, especially. It's nice that they would really compensate for those fights you've been with the company over the years. And, I mean, I'm reading here that it says title fights count for more. So again, with me having fought for the title four times,

in that period of time, you know, who knows what that does. I really am interested to see how everything pans out. I understand companies right now, knowing that Reebok is coming into takeover, are just not as willing to, you know, throw their dollars out there. And that's understandable because the return they're going to get on it for longevity isn't going to be there as well. Can you guess in maybe like ballpark terms,

how much money you think you lost in sponsorship for this fight? with this looming? You know, I probably lost at least about 10 to 15 grand from what I've had in the past. And what are people saying? They don't want, like, what does what's happening in July have anything to do with what's happening this Saturday? Yeah, I think a lot of the companies at this point, knowing that Reebok is coming in, or just maybe choosing not to pay the UFC tax, knowing that, well, Reebok's coming in,

we're going to maybe spend our dollars in other organizations, or they're just offering, you know, less or, you know, different companies are doing different things, but I definitely think you're starting to see a lot more of the companies that you are used to seeing in the UFC, starting to pull back and not sponsoring as the quarters get closer to July. Well, that is definitely unfortunate. Hopefully in the end it all works out for everyone.

But I think the main thing is, at least for me right now, there are more questions than there are still our answers. Would you agree with that? I feel like we still have a lot of questions. Absolutely. I mean, we're learning new things every day. You know, this is a new thing based on fights coming up. And I do applaud the UFC and Rebop for trying to look at different options and putting something out there to see the reaction and see how people feel about it, trying to be as fair as possible. I think is great. You know, it's not as much just being told, well, here, this is how it is. It seems like there is some listening and response that's coming out of it.

And I hope that more of that comes out and more answers come out as we get closer to that date because as a fighter, it would be great to know who we're working for and what we're working with and how we can represent them the best we can. And, you know, so far, Reebok as a company, you know, I think that they do some great things with great athletes and so it'll be great to see how this as I say pans out and and works for the athletes who will be representing the Reebok brand. Did you spend any time in Albuquerque in preparation for this fight? For this fight on Saturday, I spent time in Albuquerque helping Holly Home get ready for her

UFC debut in February. And then once I came back after being at Holly's fight there, I really brought people out to me. So I brought a wrestler down from Up Island, who's a Canadian wrestler and Ashley Cross. I was lucky enough to be able to bring Sheila Bird, who's a world-decorated Brazilian Jit-Situ Black Belt. I brought her out from Calgary and got to do kind of a week of training with Sheila. And then I was lucky enough to, again, bring Holly home up as well to do some training. So I was able to stay my local base in Victoria with my coach Adam Zujek and the Zuma team,

work with my training partners and bring other people in. and then, of course, confer with Greg and Michael Winklejohn and the team down in Albuquerque. So it's been a really, really positive camp. Do you think that will be what, you know, I saw Cubs Swanson did the same thing. He stayed home. He still had Greg in his corner.

And, you know, I've heard from some fighters that these super camps, as they get more popular, it's just harder to get one-on-one time with the coaches. Do you think that's going to be what you're going to do from here on now? For most of my fights, I've actually spent the majority of my time in Victoria, when I've gone down to Albuquerque, it's amazing, and I always get lots of attention. But I do think that it's hard to manage 40, 50, 60 fighters, you know, and some people don't ask for the attention, and you can't give attention to 70 people.

You know, you have to give attention to people who have fights coming up. And I love going down there, and I usually go down for, you know, five days at a time, and then come back up and do my camp in Victoria. I teach so much. I work with our little bulldogs class and my kids' class and then our women's kickboxing as well as our jih Tzu programs. So I'm already running the Zuma Gym. And for me to be away, it is hard in the middle of a camp.

It's almost more stressful. And so I prefer if I can to bring people up to me and then go down in between when I have a little bit of downtime. Will Holly be in your corner? Holly won't be coming up, unfortunately, to Montreal. But I know she'll be behind me. in the fight. And what do you expect from Alexis?

I mean, it's amazing. We haven't seen her in quite some time. She had that very short fight against Ronda Rousey, and, you know, that's a fight that hurts physically, but I'm sure it, you know, it hurts emotionally as well. Your ego takes a blow when you lose like that to the champion after working so hard to, you know, fight for the belt. What do you expect from her in this first fight back since the Ronda Rousey fight? I expect Alexis to be just as durable and gritty and dribb.

as ever. I expect her to come in and fight hard and kind of in the same boat as me. It had a long layoff. I mean, I was quite happy with my last performance and clearly Alexis wasn't. You know, I'm sure she feels like she didn't perform at all to her capabilities. And Rhonda had a great fight and Alexis's chin, you know, it's potentially wavering at this point. So I think that also coming into this fight knowing that she's lost twice to me, you know, I think I'm going to be able to mentally break her as the fight goes on, just having that in my pocket, knowing that she just is coming off a loss as well as the fact that she's already lost twice to me.

I can't see that she was that excited when she got the phone call, but regardless of that, she's going to come in game, and I'm not looking at this as an easy fight. I'm looking at this as literally the toughest. fight because Alexis always brings it when she fights me. I actually feel like, and I don't know if you know this for a fact, I feel like she would be excited to try to avenge those losses. I feel like you'd be the one who's not excited, but she'd be the one who is excited.

I'm sure she's excited at the opportunity to, but I think in your mind, in the back of your head, knowing that you've already lost twice, it's a pretty big hill to be climbing up. Yeah. You know, she has a lot to prove coming off of the Ronda loss and definitely coming off of two losses to me that she's going to come in blazing, I'm sure. I've no doubt about it. And as I say, I want to crush that spirit, kind of take her soul and move on with Alexis Davis in my past. Hopefully not actually blazing, because then, of course, the commission would have a problem with that and it would be a whole blessing.

Well, you know, and then her and Jessica I could be friends. By the way, who do you pick in that Jessica-I-Misha Tate fight? You know, it's hard because I don't, I'm not really a fan of either of them as people. So I can't really say one way or another that I hope one person wins. But I would like Misha to win just so I can punch her in the face and she can't run away again. You know, if she loses, she could say, oh, well, I don't want to fight Sarah. But on a win, maybe she has the title shot, but if not, I'd love to be able to step in there. But subjectively, I mean, just given their skill said, you fought them both, who do you think is the better fighter?

Hmm. You know, I think that Jessica I is the better fighter in game plan, staying on the outside, probably trying to use her length and kind of tie Misha up a bit. But I think that Misha Tate is crafty enough and kind of unorthodox enough in her striking that she might be able to get Jessica I off of her game. If Jessica I fight smart, she could win this fight just by kind of pot-shotting and staying away and not letting Misha get a hold of her and grappler, but I think that Misha will probably tap her out. Does Betch Cahaya have a shot against Ronda Rousey? Absolutely not.

Not even close. Not even close. Will it be less than 14 seconds? I don't think they'll be less than 14 seconds. I'd say under two minutes, so. Wow. Are you surprised she got the title shot? Are you in disagreement with that, or do you understand why?

I understand from a business side of things. The fact that Betch Correa is 10 and 0. The record looks great. She has a great storyline with the four horsewoman, having beaten two of them, and only three of them are in the UFC. So I understand the storyline. I do think that it has died a little bit since that she's been off for so long since last August. But I understand why they did that, but I don't necessarily agree with that in terms of

if you were talking about fairness and people deserving and having fought their way up the ladder. And by the way, did you watch the first two Davis fights in preparation for this one, or do you feel like you know her like the back of your hand at this point? You know, I went back and watched a little bit. I try not to overanalyze because I'm already someone who really overanalyzes everything. And so, you know, I've felt her in the cage twice. You know, things change. People improve.

I've improved. She's improved. But ultimately, you know, their entire movement structure isn't going to change. and I just don't want to get too focused in on it. So I feel confident that I've watched enough but not overwatched anything. Is that first fight available anywhere? Like, can I find it on YouTube? I have the first fight.

You do? Where? On my computer. Oh. But. But no one else has the first fight. Not even her? I don't think so.

Officially it was a third round. I haven't watched that fight in a long time, but I do have it. It was in 2007 in a promotion called UWC and Winnipeg, right? round T-T-A. Yeah, it's actually run by Christoph Shasinski. Oh, wow. She said his last name. And, yeah, it was a fun card. It was the first women's fight in Manitoba.

And she came out to, I think down with the sickness is what she came out to, something really angry. And the best part, I thought the best part was one of the guys at the gym had chose my walkout song. And I didn't really know what it sounded like. So it came on. I was like, oh, it's my song. And Adam, my coach was like, no, that's her song.

Oh. So it was pretty funny because I had no idea what my song was, but I think hers was down with the sickness. And I don't know why I remember that part about it, but I just remember thinking that was pretty funny. And by the way, it was UCW, excuse me, I said UWC. Can you name the other famous UFC fighter that was on that card? Oh, nope.

Teammate of yours? Uh, um. The magician? I don't know. John Dodson? No, he wasn't. According to Sherdog, he was. Against Bill Boland.

He lost. Crazy. You don't remember that. No, not at all. I don't remember who anyone was on the card. No, it was so long ago, but that's crazy if that's true. Yeah, UCW7. He lost to Bill Boland for unanimous decision.

Same card. Wow. How about that, huh? Huh, things you learn. The main event was Graydon Tenass versus Aaron Trigar. Tree gear, Tregear. I mean, maybe. Big names.

As I say, I only remember being on the card, and I remember that there was a playoff. I think we've always fought in April, Alexis and I. I'm pretty sure there was a playoff game going on. I remember them, I think it was a Montreal game, and they were announcing it, like, in between the fights. Wow. It was a smaller crowd because there was a game actually happening during the fights, and so in between fights, they were updating the score of what was happening in the game at the time.

It was pretty good. And by the way, your second fight actually happened in March. So around the same time. Oh, it did March 3rd. Yeah. The infamous Misha Tate Ronda Rousey card in Columbus. Great fight though. Fight of the night, I believe.

I'm not mistaken. Yes, except that there was no fight of the night. Oh, that's right. This is airst fight for a four. Unfortunately, I didn't get an extra bonus. Well, you've just been wronged your entire career. Hopefully you can write the ship beginning on Saturday in Montreal. UFC 186 to anyone listening who's on the fence about

watching this card. What does Sarah Kaufman, one of the very best fighters in the world, who's fighting on Saturday, say to them? What do you say to those people, the naysayers? You know, I don't know if there's anything to say. Watch, you know, enjoy and look forward to a bloody battle that I'm going to come out ahead of. All right. Good enough for me. It's on Fox Sports 1 here in the United States. TSN2 in Canada for the third time Sarah Kaufman versus Alexis Davis. Great to have you on the show, as always, Sarah. We'll see you in Montreal, and best of luck to you. Thanks so much, Ariel. See you. Montreal. There she is. Sarah Kaufman's stopping by. Big fight for her. Amazing when you look at her record.

17 and 2, 1-no contest. Truly one of the best fighters in the world. Perhaps doesn't get the attention and respect that she deserves. She's been out of action for quite some time. Her last fight, a late replacement fight. Remember Leslie Smith taking a fight on very short notice. She defeated her of a unanimous decision. Also a rematch for her. But she has not been very active since her fight against Ronda Rousey. This is just her fourth fight. She beat Leslie Smith and Invicta, then lost to Jessica I in a somewhat controversial fight, and then, of course, the Leslie Smith fight once again last April. Hopefully Saturday, the beginning of a more active streak for her. We look forward to the fight. One of the best fights on the card, no doubt about it. Regardless of what you think of the card,

that definitely is a fight worth paying attention to. Their second fight was great. I can't lie, I've never seen the first one, but it sounds like a fun fight as well. All right, we have around 35 minutes left in the show. Let's go inside the vault now. And this is a quick one. No bathroom breaks allowed during this one. I was talking about it earlier with Mr. John Volante. Back in February of 2011, just days before his Strike Force debut against Chad Griggs,

we had John Volante in studio, and there was a lot of hype around him. He was ring a combat champion, all that stuff. And people on the East Coast were very excited about his Strike Force debut. he was an alternate in the Strike Force Heavyweight Grand Prix, and he came with a guy named Mark Mastondrea, who was the owner of Cage Hero, which I don't think is still around, and he also brought a friend of his. He brought a friend of his name Chris Widman,

who I had heard of, but was only, I believe, 4-0 at the time, and still in ring of combat, had yet to receive his fight in the UFC, his late replacement fight against Alessio Sakara in Louisville, Kentucky. And at the end of the show, they were like, can you just bring them on, give him some publicity, some attention. I was like, yeah, sure, why not? Never met him before, didn't book him on the show, didn't know that he was coming. And literally, days later, he got the fight against Sakara and

the rest of course is history. Very hard for me to find the actual full video version of this interview. I actually, on a whim, just went on YouTube and typed in their names, and someone, thank you very much to them, uploaded a very short clip of it. And it's the intro. It's the most fun part. I thought it would be fun to look back at that with the Wyden fight coming up, just worked with him this weekend. He did great on the desk and Valante's big win. So this is February 2011, the M. May Hour in our old studio, back in the AOL days near Union Square, Valenti and studio.

And we introduced Chris Weidman to our great audience. Here it is. This is Chris Weidman, right? pronouncing that correctly. You are a big prospect as well, my friend. Four and O, Ring of Combat, right? Middleweight champ? Yep.

You beat Ryan Bader in college? Yep. Man. Who's the other guy? Who's the other guy? Oh, man. Come on. We've got to call people out.

It's so much fun. Come on, come on. Phil Davis. You beat Phil Davis in college. Wow. He's the man, though. He won nationals. I didn't.

And you fight at 185? Yeah. Those are big boys. Yeah, I cut a lot of way for 85. Wow. You know, when I decided to get in MMA, I wanted to take it very serious. Obviously, you know, making it my career. And when I was wrestling, I always felt like if I had a disadvantage, it might have been

size. I was facing, you know, guys like Ryan Bader and Phil Davis, and, you know, I felt like my body type might have been a little small in there. So, uh, down to 85 I go, you know. How about that? Amazing stuff, right? High-pitched voice, young Chris Wyman, young John Volante, introducing him to our audience. A great moment in the history of our show. Up there with the Connor McGregor interview, I think, maybe even cooler, just the way it all happened. And maybe one of these days I can actually find the entire clip. I think the problem was when we switched over from AOL to SB Nation, something's got lost in the move. It would be nice to retrieve that stuff at some point. But I thank the individual who uploaded it to YouTube. I don't know how they did it,

how they found it. Maybe they downloaded it or something. Pretty cool. Chris Widman debuting on the M.A.R. February 2011. All right, that's inside the vault, a quick one, because we don't have a lot of time. We do have a phone caller, though. That's very exciting. and I believe I met this man on Thursday. I even tweeted about him. Is this Chow from Newfoundland? Hey, Ariel, how are you doing, man? There he is.

Wow. On the phone, I recognize your voice. It is you. Let me set the scene here. It's Media Day, New York City, Thursday afternoon, Times Square, Best Buy Theater, and I meet a young man who claims to be friends with my good pal, Dave Knowsworthy,

who I've talked about on this show before, also from Newfoundland, who came all the way to Syracurricular, to listen to my chat that I have with the students there in November, who I think is a tremendous guy. I hold him near and dear to my heart because of what he did. It was very nice of him. And Young Chow, who tells me later that wasn't his real name

or that isn't his real name, and we'll get to that maybe in a second. But this man claims to be Liotto Machita's biggest fan. He travels to all his fights since UFC 79, and he came from Newfoundland. Actually, now he lives in, I believe, Timmins, Ontario, right? Close to it. It was a small place called Englehart, so it's about two hours away from there. And you came all the way from there to Newark to watch Machita fight Luke Rockhold. Wow, you must have been the saddest person in that arena on Saturday.

What the heck happened? Oh, man, I'm still sad. Man, I'm still trying to figure out what happened. I never actually had a chance to watch the whole fight ever since because I just been too sad. Like I was flying back and I'm back to work now. I'm actually at my desk at work currently. and I just haven't had a chance to download it and watch what happened. But I've been seeing clips of what happened of it being posted,

and people are saying, oh, you spike this head, this and that. But, like, I mean, like, I'm not trying to give excuses for why he lost or anything. Like, it is what it is. It looked like to me that he tripped over or something, but it could have been, like, Rockhole hit him and it knocked him off on him, because he did get hit at the same time, so I really don't know what happened. and I was hoping that it didn't go on the ground because I felt that if there was any disavile, well, the major disadvantage for Liotto was probably on the ground because as

when we're talking on Friday, my main concern was his size. You remember that? I asked you. I was like, oh, man, I'm kind of worried. I've seen him at the open workouts the day before. And I actually didn't realize how big rockhold was and just comparing them like one-in-one, like within, you know, 10 minutes of seeing each of the day before. I was pretty intimidated, I must say.

Yeah, he's a big guy, so I did not want him to be on top of Liotto that night, and that's exactly what happened. It was like after a minute and 15 seconds, and it wasn't even because Rockhold tried to take him down. It just happened to be that way, and, you know, like, it is what it is. Yeah, it did seem like a trip that led to the end for Machita, but man, did he capitalize on that? I've never seen, I mean, we've seen him lose before, of course, but the John Jones fight,

he was winning the first round, in my opinion. He won that first round. The Shogun fight, a little bit different because it all happened very quickly. It wasn't like a dominating loss. The Phil Davis fight, I thought he won. You know, it's just like we've seen him lose before, but never like that. The Wyman fight he had his moments as well. This was, wow, I'm still, I don't even know how you digested it.

How sad were you on the way back home to Ontario? I mean, to come, it's not a long trip. It's not like you went all the way to Brazil, but, you know, you take time out, you pay, I know you paid a lot of money for your tickets. That's kind of a bummer, right? You must have been pretty depressed. I'm not trying to pour it on, but I'm actually generally curious. Yeah, no, I still, I'll get over it after a few months, probably.

That's usually about how long it takes. I've been through this before. And it's just the way it is, man. You start, like, like in one fighter and you feel emotional feelings towards them, not in like that kind of weird way, but, I mean, like, you know, you want, like someone you look up to, you want them to win all the time, you know, when they fall off the radar, it's like,

it makes you lose motivation of what you believe in sometimes, you know, like, because you believe, like he believes that he could win, but you believe in this guy that he can win,

but then he loses, and it's just like, crap, man, like, all of a sudden, by the way, are you, are you with me on this?

Like, all of a sudden, it feels like he's really old. Are you worried about that? Do you think that he, he has now reached a point where he can't hang with these younger guys?

I don't know if it was just Luke Rockwood looking that good, or he's about to be 37? I mean, it just felt like he was really old on Saturday. Like my opinion, like, I really don't think he looked that old. Like, the first minute there, I don't know if you remember it much, but I felt he was tagging Luke, not like hard punches, not

anything that would, like, drop him and end the fight or anything, but he was hitting him, and it didn't seem like Luke was able to find him, to be honest, but, like, it was only a minute and 15 seconds or so, So it's hard to judge by that. Like if he didn't fall and the fight went on, past that, staying on the feet,

who knows who would have won that. But it was just a huge disadvantage for Luke to be on top of him. And like, it's just unfortunate that that happened. Yeah. Well, I'm sorry, man. I appreciate you calling in. It was great. You know, it's great to meet fans like you

who support a particular fighter. You've traveled all the way to Baruri and all over the place to watch your guy fight. Al-Agua. Yeah, crazy. Yeah, crazy. Yeah, it was nice, too. How much money do you think you've invested in Machita trips thus far?

Man, enough to buy a brand new BMW off the lot, sure. Do you regret it? Yeah, I've invested a lot. No, not at all. I actually regret not going to Morphus. Oh, my gosh. It's fun. Not even just his fights.

I like watching a lot of fights. I'm actually going to the one of Montreal there next week. Oh. Yeah, I'll be at that, too. but it's better for me this time because like I'm going in there watching the fight just to enjoy the fight. It's more stressful for me to go in there and watch a guy that you enjoy watching and wondering if he's going to win or lose. Like, I mean, I always believe that like Machita could win, but I know realistically like there's chances that he doesn't win and I know where his disadvantages may be or where his advantages may be. And, you know, if I knew he was going to win every fight for sure, like I would never.

be stressed out when I'm watching the fight, right? So this time going to Monterey is going to be pretty nice just watching the fight for the people watching the fights. Well, you deserve that break. Enjoy the fights. Thanks for calling in, man. I really appreciate it. It was great to meet you on Thursday and I was thinking about you on Saturday. I was thinking, man,

my man Chow is probably really sad right now. But I'm glad to hear you're okay back at work. Did you cry? Honestly, did you cry? That is an understatement. Wow. Did you cry? Yeah. Oh, I didn't cry. I think I almost did one time, but, like, I don't know.

It's just, I got to get over it. I got to go see my girlfriend or something. I don't know. I don't know. We'll figure it out. Well, I, I appreciate your fandom, and I wonder who you're going to root for if Luke Rockhold fights Chris Widman, right? Because both those guys beat your guy.

Widman. Widman? You hate Luke Rockhold now, right? I don't know. No, no, not at all. Man, like, don't get me wrong. Sure, sure, sure. wrong. Like, like, I love, like, seeing Machita win, but for example, when I was in, like,

Bariari, and, like, I saw him, like, beat, like, well, he kicked it all the way right in the ribs, and it only took one shot, and he was down and out, right? Like, I, by no means wanted anything bad to happen. Like, this is the sport it is, you know, one guy wins, one guy loses, but at the end of the day, like, they're all there to do their job. And I just respect the fact that, you know, all these guys get in there and fight Machito, a win or lose that, you know, that they get in there and actually fight and instead of just just like trash talking and stuff all the time, right? So it's nice to see them perform. And like, at the end of the day, one guy's going to lose. But you don't look down on him because he loses

and because the other guy's better. It's just, you know, you know, like I hope, I was hoping Dulloy was going to be fine and that he got up and, you know, train harder and maybe win the next time, you know? And like, and I'm a huge Machita fan. I want him to win. But I by no means wanted to see like Dahlaway be injured like the way he was because I saw him kind of get up and he was like still in pain like walking in the cage so I felt kind of you know sympathetic for him and you don't want to see that on anybody right like I know this is a fight game and I know like I'm a huge like machita fan I don't know if I'm the biggest one or not like a lot of people say I am but there might be bigger ones who knows I just know that I'm a big fan of his so um but from here on like I'm definitely going to be

I'd say all his fights until he retires, so yeah. Good man. Thank you for the call, and I look forward to seeing you at the next Machita fight. Okay, thank you very much, eh? Hi. Spoken like a true Canadian at the end there. Thank you very much, eh. And good call.

I appreciate the call very much, Chow. And good call by New York Rick saying that he actually sounds a little bit like Ed Soros, Leotto's longtime manager. How about that? All right, well, we've got to get some questions here before we go. are you still alive back there in New York, Craig? I'm alive. Are our guests still here?

Our guests are here, yeah. Where are they? They're in studio edit suite three. Come on. Okay. You know, they got the full setup watching the show. They're definitely sleeping. No, they're not sleeping.

Speaking of our guests. Are they coming in? No, I'll give a little love to... Oh, you got a shirt. All elbows shirt. All elbows. Casey and Esther, thank you. Best in the business.

Well, hopefully we can run through these and then have a little chat with them. Yeah, bring them in. Yes. By the way, I just want to say something about the sponsorship deal. I just got an anonymous text from someone who is in the Indyno, who is listening to our interview with Sarah Kaufman, and they informed me that they received the official release for the outfitting policy, and it only counts strike force bouts from April 2011 to January 2013,

and WC fights from January 2007 to December 2010, which off the top of my head makes me think that it's the fights under the Zufa umbrella. So pre-ZUFA strike force doesn't count. And that's interesting to note. It's not your entire Zufa run. So what I told Sarah Kaufman was, in fact, wrong, because a lot of her fights were pre-ZUFA strike force. Well, no, it is your entire ZUFA run, but only your ZUFA run. Yeah, but not, yeah, exactly, not the entire strike force run. Yep. All right. That is interesting. Okay. Let's run through the stacked middleweight division. Clearly the middleweight division is loaded with contenders right now. That said, they all can't wait for a title shot, assuming USC gives Rockhold the next title fight.

Do you think the USC should match Jacare up with Romero for a third time, or should they give him a lower-ranked fighter? This person suggests Bisbing, Dalloway winner, and match Romero up with a guy with a similar ranking, and this person suggests Gagar Musassi versus Costa-Philippu winner in hopes of keeping both guys as top contenders. Well, I don't know if I want to see the Musassi fight again. The Bisbing one is interesting if he wins.

You know, I think that's a very tough fight for Bisping. I would, in a perfect world, Romero fight makes all the sense in the world, but let's not forget he has a knee injury, meniscus. He could be out for quite some time. What I know for sure, 100%, 100%, 1,000% do not make Jacerai Rockhold, and Jacerai should not get the title shot. That's what I'm 100% certain of. Did you say it to hurt me? No, but you come on. You're the biggest Jacarai guy.

You have to agree with this, right? You beat Leonardo Machita like that. By no fault of his own, does Jacare not get a title shot? But Luke Rockhold took it by the horns, and he deserves it, clearly. If Jacare could just get a fight with a guy that could put him into that next level, I'm sure he'll be fighting for a title very soon. But, no, Luke Rockhold is the guy. He deserves it very much.

Again, do you agree with this? Even if he would have defeated Romero in the first round? Well, it depends. I mean, you know, if he subbed Romero the way he subbed Camozzi, I think there's a conversation to be had. Man, Machita is no Romero. I'd say... Machita's no Romero. To do that to Machita.

I'd go on to say that Romero is... Has less miles on him and is a pretty solid win right now, comparable to a Machita. And you know how much... Listen, I was picking Machita against Widman. I really respect Lyoto Machita. lot, but I think he's a little bit shop-worn. And what do you make of Talis Ladies versus Jacques Gray?

Great fight, but I don't know if that's the one that gets you a title shot. At this point, I think he just needs to be active and he needs a very good. He needs a damn title shot. He needs a... So wait, so wait, the guy wants to get paid, too. Let's not forget. Like, for us, it's all well and good about title shots, but are you really going to

wait? Think about this. Let's say Rocco gets it. So the winner of Machita, excuse me, of Belfore. Widman faces Rockhold. Yeah, so, I mean, we're not talking about, if you're waiting, we're not talking about a fight until 2016. Take a fight that, I mean, I don't know. I don't know what to do.

That would be a fun fight, though, given their ground skills. Sure. But I think Jockeurik could just keep it standing. Yeah, but he's in one of those weird spots, like, almost in like a Cubs Swanson spot where it's like you're either going to wait a really long time or you have to take a tricky fight. This is a damn shame. But, yeah.

I mean, you've got to do what you got to do. I think it's unfortunate that. he's getting up there in age. It's not like Jacari is a young guy, even though it feels like his career is very fresh right now, like, and he's rejuvenated, he's not that young. And at a certain point, like, he's going to hit a decline, and it's going to be a shame that he didn't get that title shot.

I'm voting for Tiles Ladies. I like the fight. Don't get me wrong, but I don't think if he wins that, everybody's going to be clamoring for him to get a title shot. I think so. I think they know what's at stake here. Hey, nobody would be happier than me. Yeah.

So, yeah, that's great. Max Holloway, is this, now Holloway himself has been talking about this a lot lately. Is this Connor McGregor's biggest win? Considering how impressive Max Holloway has been recently, is it fair to say that the victory over him is Conor McGregor's biggest accomplishment, especially considering he was injured for most of the fight, or would you still regard Porrier as tough as test to date? Well, I don't know. I think that's six in one, half dozen, and the other. But I think the point is, what I'm happy about here is, finally we're starting to realize that Connor McGregor did not have an easy path to this fight.

And, of course, you know, there could be revisionist history at play and all that stuff, and guys get a lot better. And I truly think Max Holloway has improved immensely since that fight. In particular, his confidence. I mean, you see the guy at the Media Day on Thursday. He's a different guy. He's a lot more confident. He believes in himself.

He oozes confidence. But, I mean, let's not forget. Look at the guys who he has fought. Marcus Brimidge, still in the UFC, still very much relevant. Max Holloway, Diego Brandau, Dustin Porier, Dennis Siever. there's no guy in there who's out of the UFC, who's a bomb, who doesn't have big wins in the UFC. Yeah, he didn't fight the Mendezes and the Edgars, but those are legit. I mean, maybe he's one huge name that you could say, oh, he didn't fight one of those guys,

but they're all very legit. They're all very tough fighters. And look at Holloway now. Look what he's doing. So I don't know if it's Porier. I don't know if it's Holloway, whatever. It doesn't really make a difference. But hopefully now people will recognize that that was a very big win.

Remember that fight? It was supposed to be Andy Ogle. Hallway replaced Andy Ogle. And look how far, you know, Halloway's come since then. He hasn't lost huge wins over some very big names and some tough guys like, you know, Swanson, Cole Miller, etc. Andre Feely, don't forget about that one as well. So, yeah, hopefully in a weird way, Connor gets a little more respect, but I'm guessing that's not going to happen. I honestly think, I think it's a non-story at this point.

I mean, we're kind of past that chapter in the Connor McGregor saga. Like what's his biggest win? You don't look at my Twitter. Well, people don't ask about what's his biggest win. It's that he didn't do enough to deserve this and blah, blah, blah. There's still people. Oh, yeah, yeah. Anyway, big win.

Max Holloway is legit. The more interesting thing, in my opinion, is where does he go from here? Holloway? Yeah. It's a good question. Maybe that rematch with Connor McGregor is on the horizon. Hmm. I don't know if that happens.

Why not? Well, here's the thing. I want Chad Mendez to fight Frankie Edgar next, almost regardless of what happens in the Faber fight. Of course, he's not going to fight Faber. So I feel like those two are matched up. There's no, there's no, you know, is it a Clay Guida, who's number 10? It sounded like he wanted to go back up to 155.

Yeah, Lentz's book. Definitely sounded that way. Bermuda's coming off a loss. There's no, you know, Lama's coming off loss. There's no. So why not, Connor McGregor? If he loses or if he wins? I was thinking either one, to be honest.

Title shot. Why not? Yeah. He just beat Cubs Swanson. No, I know. Let's not, let's not. I know, I know, but I don't know. We're talking about how great Connor McGregor's wins are for beating Max Holloway.

Well, he just beat Cubs Watson. Yeah, I know. I just kind of feel like we saw it. Like if Frankie Edgar wins, I think that would be a really cool fight. Frankie Edgar versus Connor or, you know, I don't know. Not going to argue with you there, but I think he needs one more. I feel like he needs one more to get that title shot. And if he, and if he loses, then Connor versus Holloway makes all the sense in the world.

Yeah. But again, I kind of feel like I want to see some fresh matchups for Connor. but I wouldn't be against it. I mean, like I said, I said it on Saturday. I would pay a lot of money to see that because I think he's gone a lot better and you can tell the loss bothers him. I'd love to see that.

Okay, featherweight division. We just talked about it a little bit. This person is proposing the fights that make the most sense are Mendes versus Holloway, Swanson versus Bermuda's. So you like Mendes Edgar. Yeah, I like Mendes Edgar.

How do you feel about Swanson versus Bermuda? I don't mind that. Although I feel like Bermuda's just got a fight. And I don't know, I'm not too quick to book him in another one. I think he needs some time off. I'm looking it up here. Yeah, Bermuda's just got Jeremy Stevens. So, yeah.

All right. Your idea sucks. Okay. Page Vanceant title shot. Right time, right place. Hell no. Oh, come on. You're not even going to let me get through this.

So that's it. Done. No. What? Title shot. Are we crazy? No way. Do you agree with this?

No. What? How about, how about? Come on. Builder up. Yeah. It's a shallow. division. But there are people, I mean, Godella, that's the natural one, in my opinion. I just,

she's too young to get the title. Why, why, why rush it? Build her up, get her some big wins, book her the right way, three, four fights, the Connor route. She's a huge deal. And she will, if she wins three four fights, she will definitely get, there's a shorter path to the title in that division and some of the younger divisions than in, you know, middleweight, lightweight, Walterway, you know, you've got to win like six, seven in a row just to get a sniff at the belt. So she'll get there soon. But a win over Felice Herrick, I just don't think. And quite frankly, I don't feel like she has scratched the surface.

I mean, it was dominant. There were two 30 to 26es. But it was a little sloppy at times, and I feel like she could do a lot better than that. I want to see a couple of more training camps under her belt with Team Alpha Male and really getting comfortable in there. I think it would be too soon for a title shot. Let's stay on the same track with the same division. Yeah. Since the Ultimate Fighter 20 finale, the alums of that show are now 0-N-3, Asparza, Calderwood, and Herrick.

How much of a toll did it take on the ladies coming off the show? Should they wait longer than four months before fighting again? Well, I guess you're not counting. I don't know if that's fair. I guess that wouldn't count the finale fights, right? Yeah, which is not fair, and they had a lot of time to prepare for that, so it seems a little skewed in. Are those the only ones? Let's see how Ashley Daly and Rand and Marcos, I mean, they're fighting each other, so someone's going to get a win there.

I don't know. Do you think there was any effect of the show taking a toll on that. I thought of that for Carla. I thought Carla came back too soon, and she alluded to that. I think when you fight for the belt and all the emotional stress and the pressure and all that, and to come back three months later to defend the title for the first time after going through that tournament, I thought that was too soon. I don't think that was at play with Joanne Calderwood, to be honest.

It sounds like she was dealing with a lot, as she has alluded to. And I don't know if that was at play with Felicia. think she ran into a better fighter. Okay. Tim Means Business. Oh, yeah. Shout out to Naitron Means. What did you make of the Dirty Bird shots at MMA Media?

Specifically, he called out Bleacher Report, if anybody's unaware. Yeah, what was up with that? Do you think he has a point? Will he be a guest soon? Maybe I will call him on the show to talk about M.A. Media. So I believe essentially what happened is there might have been on Bleacher Report a fight breakdown where they said he was a striker, which I don't know if that's necessarily far from the truth.

and he seemed to take offense to that. Well, you know, I don't want to get into the whole MMMA media thing because I did that a couple of weeks ago and it opened the floodgates for the loser patrol. How do you feel about a fighter calling out MMA media? Oh, I'm fine with it. What I wanted to say was, as we all know, sometimes on Bleacher Report, I have a lot of respect

for some of the guys over there, but there are some, you know, younger writers there who are trying to make a name for themselves. So who wrote this story? I'm happy at least that he named the site that he was mad at because I often hear a lot about like MMA media shows and stuff and they're referring to

as something they saw on Joe's MMA site.com. So at least he named the site but who wrote it, what's behind? Hey, you know what? That is James is a good idea. Maybe we'll have them on the suit to talk about this. I like a good MMA media debate. Yeah.

Good for him. He called him out. Why not? I think, you know, the ideal situation... But sometimes take it with a grain of salt. The ideal situation is calling out a specific person. Sure, why not? because, you know, Bleacher Report, who wrote it, like what article you were referring to specifically, call out the dude who wrote it and tell him shove it. But, yeah, I really, I don't know, prognestication is kind of difficult, so I don't know, you know, I don't know if he should have been too offended.

Phil Davis to Belator. Were you at all surprised the UFC chose not to match Belator's offer to Phil Davis? What sort of impact do you think you can have on Belator's light heavyweight division? Also, what impact, if any, do you think the signing has on the current monopoly lawsuit against the UFC? Well, I don't know about that. I mean, I don't know if that one signing will change the course of the lawsuit. But I do think that it's not a surprise for multiple reasons. In this landscape, yeah, it's not bad to say, hey, look, a top 10 fighter went and signed elsewhere.

There was a home for him elsewhere. Also, just being honest, Phil Davis got a lot of fights, and he wants some big ones, but can never really get over the hump. And we saw that in the Anthony Johnson fight. So do you want a guy who's going to kill out? It's the Yushinokami, John Fitch dilemma all over again. And of course, I think Phil Davis has a lot more fight in him than both of those guys. And I think he's going to have a strong run in Bel-Tor. And quite frankly, I wouldn't be surprised if this time, this next year, he is the champion over there.

But if he wasn't going to get to that title fight and he was going to stunt the groat of others, then it is worth saying goodbye to him. Now, I don't necessarily agree with your comparison to those two because I feel like those guys were on the tail end of their career. whereas Phil Davis, I think, is still relatively in the prime of his career. Yes, but I feel like that's a little revisionist history because going into the... Remember when John Fitch got released? Yeah. This is different.

This is a release as opposed to not signing him, but, you know, essentially the same thing. People were outraged, way more outrage over the idea that the UFC didn't sign him. And going into that Josh Berkman fight, people were still viewing John Fitch as a legit guy. Now, once he lost to Berkman, I think the thoughts on him changed a little bit. possibly, but I still, if I'm remembering correctly, I don't feel like John Fitch was at the point. He was a lot older and he had been through a lot more fights. And his career that Phil Davis is at the moment.

And the other thing I'd say is the division matters. This division is not that strong. Well, then, and not that young. Then you'd keep Phil Davis around, right? I would think that they would have wanted to keep Phil Davis. But I understand your point on style. You know, nobody's going to argue that Phil Davis was going out there and, you know, knock it fools out.

must-see TV had to be the guy that you tuned in for. But, yeah, I mean, you know, welterweight wasn't going to be hurting without John Fitch. Middleweight has contenders, you know, without Yush and Okami. But light heavyweight's not in a great spot right now. You know, it was somewhat similar. He beat Eric Silva, who was a star on the rise, remember, and then he loses to Damien Maya. And then at that point, you're like, all right, well, what's the point? And, you know, I definitely think there's something to this.

They offered him a contract before the beta fight. He said, no, rolled the dice, lost. Yeah. It wasn't a great fight, and then it's like, all right, well, you didn't take our contract? See you later. I mean, it's, you know, the, the, the show will go on. The UFC will be fine. Their division will be fine.

And Bellator got a great fighter. So I think, you know, it's a great situation for everybody. He lost leverage by doing that. He rolled the dice. And, you know, now he's in a good position. And sometimes when you're a bigger fish in a small pond, you'll get a lot more attention. They'll still push you. It'll still be seen by a lot of people.

Their ratings are pretty solid. Yeah. So I really think this is a win-win for everyone. I agree. And you know how things go. You win a few fights in another organization and all of a sudden. I mean, it's true. I do think we place subconsciously more value in that and guys get a lot of buzz.

And then they come over and we see what happens. Yeah, I mean, Rumble, you know, went to WSOF, you know, completely, you know, change his career around and now he's back. Okay, breaking news, Reebok sponsorship pay is now tied to the time and tenure with the U.S. and not rankings. And you, you know, detailed a little more info about that. Yeah. Do you like the idea of that?

I like it better than the ranking one. I like the ranking one. There were faults all over that thing, and that wasn't a good idea, and I'm happy they came to their senses. But again, I still feel like there are a lot more questions than there are answers.

We don't know what cut they're going to get, what percentage, how much. We don't know what the champions are going to get. I really still feel like, you know, two and a half months away, we don't know a lot about this. And from my discussions with top fighters, they echo the same sentiment.

So now we're starting to find out more, and it's good that they switch this, you know, was still some time to spare. But if you're asking me strictly, do I like this idea more so than the ranking one? Yes. I still find some holes in this. I mean,

I feel like some guys who are, newer to the game, but a lot more popular and better fighters, well, then you compare them to someone who's been around for 20 fights. Is it fair that he's making less? I think at this point, someone's going to be disappointed.

Yeah, now this is putting you on the spot, but do you have a better, have you had time to think about like a better, because I can't think of a perfect system, but I like this one better. Yeah, I like it better. But I don't know what the answer is. I don't know what the answer is.

After doing the show, come on. I've been talking for three and a half hours. I don't even know my name. No. Uh-oh. Our next question. Yes. Douglas Crosby, Ariel,

what did you make of Douglas Crosby's appearance on the Chale Sondin podcast? I listened to that bizarre interview if you want to call it that. This is what I'll say about it because I don't want to get too into this for multiple reasons. Hopefully now you understand

why I and many others believe he shouldn't be judging fights, period. I just don't think someone who conducts himself that way. Joke or not, work or not, should be judging fights. And at this point, I don't think you should be judging fights,

whether there are Sera Longo fighters in there or, you know, alpha male fighters in there. It's just, that's just, that was just bizarre. It wasn't funny. It wasn't entertaining. I listened to it just for my own reconnaissance, but now you have a little insight. I've been trying to interview Doug Crosby for over a year.

Now you have a little bit of insight, a little, like a smidge of insight into the kind of text messages you receive when you interact with them. It's a bizarre trip, and that was pretty bizarre. From what I understand, important people listen to that interview, and hopefully all the commissions come on the same page and just say, someone who conducts himself like this should not be judging, judging, and having fighters lives in their hands, their livelihood, their future, their records in their hands. It's just, if it's a joke to you, if you're going to do interviews like that,

conduct yourself like that, you have no business in this sport. Hopefully, hopefully that was the final nail on that coffin. Okay, moving on to Twitter questions. Do you think Bisbing, Michael Bisbing, should have campaigned for the jockey fight knowing that a win may have earned him a title shot? No, I don't blame him at all.

He was preparing for Dalloway. you don't just jump on a week's notice to fight someone like Jacaree. You don't. It's easy for us to say, you know, this isn't rockem-sockham robots, this isn't fantasy MMA, this isn't video games. You don't do it. He's preparing for Dollyway. He's coming off a tough loss.

He needs a win. Get that win and then move on if you're interested in fighting Jacques-Rae. Then set your sights on him. But get this fight out of the way. I don't blame him for one second. Now, would I have loved to see him in Montreal? Absolutely. But look, that's his career, his livelihood, his family, all that.

I don't blame him at all. Where do you rank Luke Rockhold's walkout song from Saturday night? I didn't mind it. I mean, I got the joke or the poke that he was trying to take at the karate kid. It was fun. You know, Rockhold's been known to do that. He had a fun one prior to the Bissping fight. I wouldn't say it's my favorite one.

It was fun. I don't know. Where do I rank it? I'll give it a 6.5. Out of 10? on the ultimate walkout? I'm more personally at the end of the day, I'm more into like the intense emotional songs.

And I'm also a fan. I go back and forth. I'm a fan of guys sticking to one, but if you don't have one that you've stuck with, I'm a fan of switching it and putting out some kind of message. But I'm still always a sucker for like, you know, oh, that's Ronda's music, or that's Wyden's music,

or that's Chuck's music, or that's Anderson's music. I'm a sucker for those because I like the tradition and the history and all that. but if we're going to go with like a jokey one and sending a message, yeah, that's pretty damn good. Yeah, it's great. I like that one. And our final question, what was more impressive?

Jocqueray's performance over Komosi or his English at the post-fight press conference. Was I really not impressed with you? I mean, it was not bad. Look, I spoke to Machita about it. Machita's come a long way with his English, and we spoke about Aldo and whether he's doing a disservice to himself by not trying to speak to the public in English. nice to see Jacques Ray do it.

And also, what was really nice about Jaceray this week was that he was actually, you know, being very assertive with his comments and saying, I deserve a title shot.

Luke Rocco lost in the UFC. I'm undefeated in the UFC. It's not my fault that Romero's out. And I think that's important. You have to act like you believe if you want to get people behind you. I think Jacques, Ray said and did all the right things.

And honestly, he was in a lose-lose situation and he performed the way he should have. I mean, if he went into the second round in the third round. People would have been knocking him last time you beat the guy in a round. He pretty much finished him the exact same way. And in the same amount of time, what was it? I never looked this up. How much

time was it? It was somewhere in the three minute range. It's a crummy situation for him because he was dealt a bad hand but he did exactly what he had to do. The first time was 337. The second time was 233. So he topped himself.

There's nothing more that he could have done. But unfortunately, when you beat Liotto Machita the way Luke Rockhold did, and you have the kind of performances over the kind of guys that he's been as of late, there's no question about it, Luke Rockhold, number one contender. He should be in Vegas on May 23rd sitting there. And wow, if it's Rockhold versus Widman, holy moly, what a fight that is. Two guys in their prime, wow, that's special stuff. That, to me, is, it's tough to top that as far as high-level MMA. I agree. I mean, Any permutation of the top guys at middleweight, I really enjoy those fights.

But that to me is the ultimate. I know you disagree. You know how I feel. No, I do agree. Rockhold versus Weidman is something special. And, you know, obviously Vitor's in the equation here. This is, you know. Yeah, I kind of felt bad for Vitor.

I felt like we were forgetting about him on the post-fight show. By the way, did you watch the post-fight show? What do you think of my hosting debut? I thought you were fantastic. Thanks. I mean. Was it cool for you? Was it like, did you have any prize?

Wow, there's my guy. If they don't bring you back, I mean, they're making a mistake. I was like, wow. What was your favorite part of the whole thing? What part did you like the best? I mean, you really shined when you were... Doing the hosting? No, when you were reading the sponsor plugs?

Get out of here. I thought you were... I thought you nailed it. You didn't watch. Shit. I was like, you know what? This guy's something. I mean, you would think...

No one back there watched it. You would think your guy is stepping up, big moment. No one wants. watched it. No support. Where's the love? I think Mark was shaking his head. I think he did watch it. Get out of here. He's a liar. Bold-faced liar. I mean, it would be nice if someone said, there's my guy from the

MMA hour to Fox Sports 2. Hosting in front of the world. America. Not quite the world. America. There's our guy. You know, we see him every day. We see him every week.

Sometimes twice a week. Let's go out of our way to at least DVR. Maybe not watch live, but DVR. No love. Yeah. It hurts. I'm not going to lie. It hurts.

But we did it. I know some other loyal fans were watching and supporting and rooting me on. And it was a lot of fun. I hope to do more of it. It was a blast. Now, where are our guests? Are they around? Can we give them a quick shout-out?

You talk for a little bit. I'll bring them into the studio. How about that? Yes. UFC 186. Oh, this studio? Yeah, yeah. Well, that's going to be weird.

Bring them into your studio. All right. So I could talk to them. UFC 186 is this weekend. We have just a seconds left, but I just want to say a quick shout out to our guests who are here. We have Ashton D'Ali versus Random Marcos, Jessica Ricozzi versus Valéry Le Tournaud,

Nordine Teleb versus Chris Clements. Olivier Obamersier versus David Michaud, who is a fellow journalist. That's exciting. That's Fox Sports 1, by the way. Chad LaPriez versus Brian Barbarina. Sarah Kaufman versus Alexis Davis, Number three, Patrick Cote versus Joe Riggs.

Eve Jabwein versus Thomas Almeida kicks off the pay-per-view. Shane Campbell versus John McDessie, which you heard earlier, Stefan Patrice, is a contender for a fight of the night. Fabio Maldonado versus Steve Bosse, former hockey player, minor league hockey player, not an NHLer, but definitely a draw in Quebec. So I'm curious to actually see if we can monitor this somehow, how many tickets he's sold. And then Michael Bisping versus C.B. Dalloway,

and finally main event, Demetrius Johnson versus Kioji Horaguchi for the flyway title. Did you get our guess? Hey, look at these guys.

Wow. You're not going to let us in your studio, man? Nah. Well, how can I talk to you? I have one mic here. I don't know. It would not... Only one person has ever walked in

to my set, my house, during the show, and that was my mother. And we need to keep it that way. way. It's hard to move the mic around. Wow, I'm shocked that you guys are still here. We have... It was a long show.

Yeah, it was. It's first time watching, right? I didn't know you had a show. Is this the first time? This is my first podcast, yeah. Oh, wow. I knew you had a blog and stuff, but this is cool. So we've got Casey, who's infamous on Twitter. Wow, is this guy? EKC on Twitter. If you want some hot takes, some real

positive takes on the world of MMA, all positive all the time. Go to Twitter.com slash EKC. We have the legendary photography royalty, not just in MMA, but in combat sports period, the one who took these lovely shots over here, Jason Maham Miller, Frankie Edgar, Eric didn't showcase them for some reason on this side of the table. We have Esther Lynn at all elbows. Oh, is she not there? Where is she? Oh, I don't see her. Who will be shooting the Pakeau Mayweather fight? No?

Camera shy, right? Yes. Oh, yes. You will be shooting the Pachamayway. Are we shooting it ringside? Oh, you're not hearing. Oh, you can't hear me. I don't know what he's saying. Pacial Mayweather, you'll be shooting it, right? Yes, I will. Ringside or in the back or what? Ring side. Whoa, that is a big deal. It is a big deal. How about that? Do you have a prediction? Are you allowed to predict? No. You'd prefer not to. Yeah, I prefer. Okay, fair enough. But I called you Combat Sports Photography Royalty. That is all elbows, as you may know her on Twitter. one of the very best, if not the very best in the entire game.

And then in back of her, we have the one and only, Andrew Mayer. Longtime, hardcore fan. He can't hear me either. He has no idea that I'm talking about him. See, this is why it's tough to pull off this sort of thing. The Forrest Gump of mixed martial arts, who I believe wants to send out a special shout-out. Call him out. Is that accurate?

Yes. Andy Mayor? Holla. There he is. Aloha. Oh, yes. Mahala, my brother. Mahalo.

I didn't hear a word you said, Ariel. I was saying that you are the forest Gump of MM. you are a hardcore fan of this show. In fact, this man right here, ladies and gentlemen, he is my, or he was, my wife's first boyfriend when they were eight years old. Is that accurate? That is accurate.

She was my second girlfriend, and I am friends with her husband to this day. Well, it's a very funny story. I'll tell very quickly. I went to camp with Andy Mayer, and we parted ways, and then I was in Orlando, and I believe 2006,

working on a show for Spike TV for T&A Impact, and I'm at a restaurant, and all of a sudden I hear that familiar voice. And our waiter was that man, Andy Mayer. How about that? So we reconnected, and he has since become a huge MMA fan to the point where he actually travels to all the events, like our friend Chow. He was at UFC on Fox. He went from San Diego to Newark for UFC on Fox.

And what other events have you been to recently? You went to 183, 182, you went to 180, you went to 180? You went to 170? 185 was the first event I missed pay-per-view this year since 178. Hardcore fan. But I am looking very, very forward to June 6 at the smoothie center. Smoothie King Center. Smoothie King Center in New Orleans where something very special is going to happen.

What's happening? Well, Ryan Bader is facing Daniel Kormier, and Ryan's going to find out something that night. What's he going to find out? He's going to find out that jumping on is a lot easier than jumping off. Jumping on and off what? Daniel Kormier. Oh, okay. Wow.

How about that? D.C. This man, Andy Mayer, an unabashed, hardcore DC supporter. In fact, I introduced both men together, and they went to WrestleMania as an ensemble just a couple of weeks ago. That's how close they are now, right? Is that accurate? Best Buds.

He has a bunch of tag team partners, but definitely my tag team partner at some point. Wow. How about that? All right. Well, it's great to have all of you in studio. I appreciate the sport. I appreciate you actually staying awake. and we will see you at UFC 186 in Montreal.

Much love, mahalo, respect. Keep on keeping on. Aloha. Aloha. All right, there they are. There's the live studio audience for all of you. Some MMA royalty in the house. They're all on Twitter.

You can interact with them. At EKC. At all elbows. And at Forrest Gump, MMA. By the way, our good friend on Twitter, Layla S, telling me that episode 122 is the first time the words New York Rick were uttered on this show. How about that? History. You can go back. I mean, might be the best show. Might be the best thing that ever happened.

I wonder who's on that show. This person, Layla S, is actually going through the entire catalog of MMA hour episodes. I appreciate her. It's amazing. All right. We have run out of time. That's it. How about that, though? A nice visit. A nice visit. From the whole crew. From the whole crew who stuck around, I would have paid a lot of money towards the odds that they were not going to stick around. But here they are, still around. I think they were digging the Max Holloway interview specifically.

Respect, brother. Major. Shoot, brother. All right. Let's get out of here. All right. Take care, everyone. You can hit my music.

Yeah. Another fun show in the books. I'm excited for UFC 186, my friends. I'm not going to lie. It's good to go home, regardless of the card. but I feel something's going to happen. You know, let's not forget. These are prideful individuals, professional athletes.

And they've heard your complaints. They've heard your jokes, your remarks, your comments. And I think they're going to step up. I think we're going to see some special performances on Saturday. If I'm wrong, I'll be back here in seven days to eat my words. Now, I can't go out on a limb and say it's worth your money I understand. Times are tough. There are a lot of people trying to get your money.

I get it. But I think UFC 186 will be a special night. Why? I have no idea. But I do know one of the very best fighters in the world is fighting in the main event. His name, Demetrius Johnson. He's fighting Kiyoji Horaguchi. Fun little factoid about that fight, but you'll have to wait until later on in the week to find out.

For now, we say goodbye. We thank Phil Davis for stopping by. We wish him the best in his new venture, new career, Belvoir MMA. Looking forward to that run. Thank you very much to Sean Al-Shadi. Thank you very much to John Volante. Get well soon.

Congratulations on your big win. Thank you very much for Jessica Rikosie. Good luck to her this Saturday. UFC 186 in Montreal. Thank you very much to Stefan. Patri. Great stuff from him. All the best to Hector Lombard.

Thank you very much to him. Thank you very much to Max Holloway. Congratulations. And thank you very much and good luck to Sarah Kaufman as she faces Alexis Davis for the third time this Saturday. That does it for us. Back next week, same time and place. Until then, I say,

Pah. I'm Nilai Patel, editor-in-chief The Verge, and Decoder is my show about big ideas and other problems. We've talked a lot about generative AI on the show lately, which is a very big idea that is causing quite a few problems. And one thing we keep hearing about over and over again is that generative AI is causing a lot of problems in schools. There are a lot of people out there, including many of the listeners of the show who email us, who are worried about the obvious problem, students using chat GPT to cheat on assignments. But when our team went and poked at the story, they found that the issues in education with AI go a lot deeper, to the very philosophy of education itself. If this technology becomes more ubiquitous, we'll have courses created by AI, graded by AI,

with submissions from students absolutely generated by AI. So it begs the question, what are we even doing here in higher ed? This episode is presented by Salesforce. Support for this show comes from Odu. Running a business is hard enough, so why make it harder with a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other? Introducing Odu. It's the only business software you'll ever need. It's an all-in-one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier, CRM, accounting, inventory, e-commerce, and more. And the best part, Odo replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost. That's why over thousands of businesses have made the switch. So why not you? O-D-O-D-4-4 at O-D-O-O-O-com.