MMA Fighting - The MMA Hour - Episode 283

Episode Date: May 27, 2015

Featuring Chris Weidman, Daniel Cormier, Benson Henderson, Joanne Calderwood, Bobby Green, Sara McMann, and Dave Meltzer. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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The mixed martial arts hour back in your life on this Tuesday, May 26, 2015. Logan, everyone. I'm Ariel Hawani inside our New York City studio. Great to be here with you on a Tuesday. Hope you had a beautiful long weekend if you're joining us from the United States. If you're abroad, well, I'm sorry for leaving you hanging after an unbelievable weekend. for the UFC. I know you're expecting to hear from us and see us on a Monday, but we had to honor our troops. I had to celebrate them. So we took off for Memorial Day, but here we are on this

special Tuesday edition of the MAA hour. Of course, we'll be back next week on our normal Monday slot, and, of course, we couldn't miss a show. So much to discuss. UFC 187 has come and gone, and I said last week that it was the best fight card on paper. Well, you know how these things go. Sometimes they don't live up to that hype. This one did and then some. What a fantastic card.

What a fantastic night for the UFC. Great performances. Great moments in the cage, out of the cage. We have a new UFC light heavyweight champion. His name is Daniel Cormier. Some are disputing that. I say they're crazy. The man holding the belt

is the UFC light heavyweight champion and that man's name is Daniel Cormier. Chris Wyman successfully defended his UFC middleweight title. He defeated Vitor Belfort in a fun fight, a fight that at one point it looked like, a little tricky for Mr. Chris Wyman, but he pulled it out. He defeated him in the first round.

Also, one of the greatest rounds you'll ever see, one of the greatest first round finishes you'll ever see, Travis Brown, Andre Arlofsky, Andrei Alofsky wins an unbelievable embrace afterwards. That, in my opinion, is everything we love and respect and admire about mixed martial arts and its fighters. A beautiful moment inside the cage. And what an unbelievable moment for Andrea Alovsky. The guy has finally returned. I mean, he's had some big wins. Not that long ago, we were saying, this is a guy who had no chin, glass jar, Alovsky, and look what he's doing now. taking massive shots from Travis Brown, unbelievable.

And then, of course, Donald Soroni picking up the big win over John McDessie on Saturday night as well, eight in a row for him, Cowboys on a roll, he deserves a title shot. Anyone who says otherwise is crazy. So like I said, a lot to digest, a lot to discuss. Let's get into today's show. 3.30, we will answer your questions and comments. Hit us up. Hashtag the MMA hour.

You know the drill. question or comment in the comment section below. At 3025, we're going to go inside the vault. We have a clip this week that is very relevant. It pertains to the aforementioned light heavyweight division. I'm looking forward to sharing that one. Somewhat of a historic clip. At 305, we're going to talk to Sarah McMahon.

She's got a lot in her mind. She's coming off a loss to Misha Tate. A close fight. Couldn't pull it out. We'll see what's next for her. 245. We're going to talk to Bobby Green. He's got a big fight coming up July 15th against Ally Quinta.

225. We're going to talk to Benson Henderson. Why isn't he fighting Michael Johnson in July? We'll find out. Smooth stops by at 225. 205. We're going to talk to Joanne Calderwood. Straight out of Scotland.

She returns to action July 18th against Beck Rawlings. That fight was announced late last week. We've been trying to have her on the show since her lost to Marina Morose. And finally, she has obliged. I'm looking forward to talking to her very much. 145 Chris Wyman stops by. Can't wait for that. He'll talk about the big win. What's next? 125, the new UFC light heavyweight champion, Daniel Cormier, stops by. I cannot wait for that. Before we get to our first guest of the day, let me remind you that the MMA hour is presented by NOS.

Do something epic. Go make your mark on the world. Hashtag with this NOS, I will. Follow them on Twitter. At NOS Energy Drink. So like I said, we have a lot to discuss as it pertains to. to UFC 187. So much to happen. I mean, really one of the best cards of the year. One of the best cards in a long time. So to help us break it all down, let us go to the Skype machine and welcome in our first guest of the day. He is our very own Dave Meltzer of MMAFighting.com and the wrestling observer newsletter. Dave, how are you? I'm doing great. How you doing, Ariel? I'm doing great as well. Like I said, honestly, still buzzing after Saturday night. Do you agree right now, best show of the year for the UFC? I think best main card.

There have been some really good shows this year that have been, I would say, more balanced where you get the whole great show. But as far as top five matches with two, like, two of the best one-round fights you'll ever see, best main card. I mean, I was thinking best main card on a pay-per-view since maybe UFC 139. Wow. Going that far back, huh? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

The Shogun-Hu. Yeah, right. But you're biased because you're a San Jose guy and that took place at the Shark Tank, right? Didn't you go to that show with your son? I was reporting, but my son was. That's actually the only MMA show my son's ever seen live, is that show, yeah. Why just that one? There have been so many.

He's not a fan of MMA. But it was like, you know, when Frank Shamrock was fighting, we would always think about taking him. And then it was kind of like, because he kind of grew up around Frank Shamrock. And then we always thought, well, what if Frank gets beat up, he's going to be traumatized because he was so little, you know, he was so young. So finally, this was a show that was a big show and there was no Frank Shamrock on. the show and he went and uh you know afterwards i talked to him and i go like so so what did you think and he said that uh it was pretty good and i go well i have to tell you that you're never going to see a fight as good as that main event so this is this is not as good as it's going to get

and he's never been to any show since no that's the only show he's been to what about pro wrestling um he's been to a triple a show and i think he i don't think he's ever been to a wbwee show and i've actually talked to him usually when w w w comes down to him um usually when w comes you want to go and it's always nah. Wow, that is fascinating stuff. Okay, let's get back to Saturday night in Las Vegas. I said at the top of the show that the big winner on Saturday night was the UFC. Of course, we're talking about it being a great night, so that's obvious.

But I thought all the people that they needed to win won. Do you agree? It was fortunate, I mean, in the sense that if Travis Brown would have won, I thought that that would have worked out fine. If you're picking with the benefit of hindsight, yeah, I think that, that all the key people that you would want to win one. And, you know, just fantastic fights, fantastic atmosphere. You know, going in, it was a show where there were a lot of championship, you know, high contender championship shots at stake.

And so when you came out, I mean, I can't think of a show where you came out of the show with more of a clear direction for the rest of the year because it's just like, you know, a bunch of championship or potential championship fights came right out. of almost every winner. Great point. I actually said that on the Way-in show. I thought it was the best card of the year on paper because you had two title fights and also you had title shots at stake potentially in the heavyweight, lightweight, lightweight, and flyweight division. I think Arlofsky winning is great for the UFC because everyone remembers Arlofsky. He's a former champion. He's a guy that if you stopped watching

MMA, you remember him as well. He has a great story now with this rejuvenation at Jackson's. Personally, I think it's Greg Jackson's best piece of work in a very long time. But we'll get to him in a second. Let's start at the top. Let's talk. Start with Daniel Cormier. He won. It was a dominant performance. He took a big shot and he kept on coming and then he ended up submitting Rumble Johnson. Now, this has been debated and it's a fascinating debate and I want to get your take on it. Is Daniel Cormier the real light heavyweight champion? Do you consider him that? Yes, I consider him the real light heavyweight champion. But it's a weird thing because the light heavyweight champion should signify the great.

greatest light heavyweight fighter in the world right now. And I think that he is not the greatest light heavyweight fighter in the world right now because John Jones beat him. And John Jones is still, even though he's suspended, he is, you know, he is an active fighter. But the reasons that John Jones lost the championship are valid reasons. And Daniel Cormier beat the number one contender. I mean, it wasn't like they threw him in with like Ryan Bader. No knock on Ryan Bader. But they threw him in with Anthony Johnson, who was the number one contender. I mean, it was the number one contender. I mean, they threw him in with Anthony Johnson, who was the number one contender, he beat the guy. You know, it's in a sense like, I think I compared it to an Olympics, you know, where,

you know, the Russians didn't come. And that's probably not even a fair one. But it was one of those things where if you have a big world championship or a big meet and for whatever reason, the favorite, the number one guy gets suspended, gets injured, the guy who wins is still the world champion, the guy who wins that meat. And that's how I view it. I view Daniel Cormier, yeah, as the world champion. champion with questions. And there's that big question that has to be resolved. And that's fine.

That's what sports are all about. Fans are so passionate about this. And you look at Daniel Cormier's mentions on Twitter, everyone's calling him, or a lot of people are calling him a paper champion. And I think it's because of what he said in the cage and also his history with John. But the thing that I feel like people are having a hard time separating is there's a difference between being the best in the world and being the champion. Sometimes the best in the world isn't the champion. And as Daniel Kormier has said, John Jones disqualified himself. So he is the champion. He is the lineal champion. When you look at the history books, whether or not you agree with the decision or not, the UFC has

every right to do what they want with their title, it goes from Shogunha to John Jones to Daniel Corme. This is not an interim belt. This is not Big Nog over Sylvia. This is not, you know, Shane Karwin over Frank Meir. So he is the lineal champion. And if you're the lineal champion, you deserve to be called champion. And no one should take that away from you. And yes, John Jones right now, if you ask me, is the best in the world. There's no doubt about it, he fought Daniel Cormier a few months ago. But if you remove yourself from the equation, if you do something that is, you know, you're being charged with a felony and being charged with what he's being, I mean, yeah,

how is that Daniel Cormier's fault? He stepped up to the plate and won the belt. So I don't understand this, this passion when people are trying to take that away from him. He's the champion, live with it. Yeah, I mean, it'd be like, you know, in any sport, in any sport, if something like this would happen. I mean, the guy who wins Wimbledon, you know, at the end of Wimbledon, you know, at the end of Wimbledon, if, let's say, you know, the number one guy is arrested, let's say, and he can't go,

and there's a meet, whoever wins, they won Wimbledon. It's not like, oh, well, you know, but like I said, you know, we've got an open-ended question. We do not know who the best in the world is, or if we do, it's John Jones. But Daniel Cormay is absolutely the legitimate world champion because he won a championship match. It reminds me of, to a degree, It's hard to make the clean comparison, but, you know, a few years back, the New England Patriots were undefeated up until the Super Bowl and they lost to the Giants. A lot of people would still say they were the best team that year, but they didn't end up being the champion. They weren't the best team that night. Now, of course, they lost in a match and a game to not get that title, but sometimes the best in the world, which John Jones clearly is, no one's taking that title away from him, is not the champion.

Even back in the day, you know, Fador wasn't the UFC champion. He was still considered by many the best in the world. Chuck Ladell, you could say, was the UFC champion. champion, but not the best in the world because he wasn't fighting in pride. So this isn't unprecedented. I think people feel weird about it because it's Cormier who just lost to Jones and because of what he said in the cage afterwards in particular. What did you make of that promo? I thought, just off the bat, A plus, it was a money-making promo, it was everything he needed to say, and that's it. What'd you make of it? I thought that, you know, what's funny is I thought he would

do essentially what he said at the press conference in the ring about his journey and everything like that, which we made a great speech at the press conference. That's, I mean, so what he did, the way he did and he walked out and everything, it was completely not what I expected, but it was far more dramatic and it made a statement and it made it far more memorable than what I thought he was going to do. When you're talking about A-plus, it's like, that is the sound bite. Everyone who watch, see, that's the thing. When the show is over, my idea of a great show is both great fights, which we got, but also

when the show is over, you and me and every, you know, we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll We'll go around and talk, and it's like, we can't wait for, blah, blah, blah. And this made, like, when that's over, everyone in the building is like, we can't wait for this fight. And, I mean, it is a controversy. And that controversy is good for the sport. And it's not an illegitimate made-up controversy. I mean, there's a reason. Daniel Kormnade didn't get this championship for a bad reason.

But, you know, things fall into place. And I think that, you know, Daniel is very smart on his feet. And he did something that, you know, shocked people. you know, we'll remember that like when George St. Pierre, you know, said, I'm not impressed with your performance. You know, those type of lines that just you remember for a long time. And then when the fight comes, it makes the fight bigger. What I like about Daniel these days, two things. He's polarizing to a degree. There are some people who find him maybe a little too much. Some people find him very honest. But I think they all start to care about him now. I mean, everyone wants to

either see him win or get his ass kicked. Also, and Chale did a fantastic job of doing this. He's always setting himself up for future fights. So right now, he has that Jones fight in his back pocket, and we don't want to sweep his legal troubles under the rug, because, you know, honestly, you know, we could talk to Dana White about this all we want. I mean, no one really knows how long he'll be gone or if he'll ever fight again. So we don't want to dismiss that. But once the last time people were legitimately interested in a Ryan Bader fight, and Ryan Bader fighting for the belt, Daniel Cormier being champion now, puts a whole new fresh coat of pain on this division, all these new matchups. He has,

hasn't fought at Light Heavyweight for a long time. So there's all these fresh matchups that you couldn't do with John. Now people are really into the Bader thing. What did you make of that? Because I thought his brilliance wasn't so much what he did in the cage was that in the post-fight press conference, he had the presence of mind to then set up the Bader fight, which now all of a sudden I think everyone wants to see. Well, it made it a viable fight that people were talking about. And yeah, I think Daniel was really smart when it comes to this thing. And whenever I say I'm USC tonight, you know, I think that, you know, it comes out very personable, but he's always, whether it's his own fights or his teammates' fights, he talks in a way, you know, like Chale,

that gets you interested in wanting to see these upcoming fights. And him is champion, he's a good champion because he will say the right, you know, he'll understand how to promote his fights. He's not, you know, everybody's different. I don't think the people look at him as this unbelievable John Jones fighter. I think that people think that he's a guy who's really, really good, Perhaps he can get beat, you know, the Johnson. You know, if you put him with Johnson again, you know, and Johnson does tons of wrestling training, people will go, well, you know what? Daniel's a little older. Johnson nearly knocked him out in that first fight.

You know what I mean? There's questions. And so we have, instead of the dominant champion, we have the situation where you've got a very good champion, 16 and one record, I believe. And, you know, but every fight is interesting. Now, Bader's going to be a tough sell for me because. Because Bader's strength, you know, Bader does have knockout power. But Bader's strength is his wrestling, and I think Daniels is a class above as a wrestler. So it's going to be a tough stylistic matchup for Bader.

You know, I can't help but wonder what Phil Davis is thinking, because now, I mean, you'd have to think he'd be very close to a title shot. If he didn't lose that Bader fight, you know, he had been knocking on that door for so long, but no one really believed that he would beat John Jones. And he, you know, he has the same issues that Bader will have, probably, you know, highly regarded, more highly regarded as a wrestler. or as a straight wrestler, but now he's in Bellator and he's not going to get that title shot. He never even sniffed the title shot. So that's obviously a different problem

for a different day. So you have DC now as the real champion. That's what I consider him to me. He's not the interim champion. And then you have Chris Wyman, who by the way, I still think should have probably been the main event because he was the real champion.

He was the only one going in, right? A great performance. I felt like this was a turn-the-corner performance for him. Like, finally people are starting to realize this guy is really good and not just a fluke. And speaking of promos, wow. I mean, that was perfect. Much like DC's was perfect. His was perfectly in a different way. It was passionate. It was real. And it was just, it was, it was so perfect. It was exactly what he needed to say. Do you agree with everything I just said? Well, I think that Chris Wyden, to me,

really, turned the corner as a champion. I mean, as a fighter, as a fighter, really the Machita fight, but, you know, then he got injured, so it kind of slowed some momentum. But where I really saw Chris Wideman as a really good champion was on the April Fox show after the Luke Rockhold fight when him and Luke Rockhold and DC were sitting there and they were, they made me want to see Luke Rockhold against Chris Weidman so bad to the point where it was just like, I really hope Vitor doesn't upset this Apple Carp because I think we've got this great fight. We've got this great fight set up between these two guys who from the dynamic, they did not feel like that they hated each other, but they absolutely had both had great confidence, and they both

looked, you know, have looked, like killers on the ground. I mean, that's the thing is was when they were doing the talking, and they were going like, and Chris goes, you know, I'll smoke you on the ground, and I was thinking, like, that's not Chris Wyden from before who would say a statement like that, right, to a guy who just looked great on the ground, and now it's like this thing,

who's going to smoke who on the ground, because you know, Rockhold smoked Leoto, who's great on the ground, and beat, you know, you know, Lioto's a great fighter, and Chris just as soon as he got Vitor on the ground, he destroyed him. So, I mean, it's another one where I'm coming out of this thing, really looking forward to a big fight.

And, you know, again, the New York thing, who knows how that's going to go? But, you know, what a perfect, you know, maybe not the sole main event, but what a perfect fight Chris Widman and Luke Rockhold for the first show in Madison Square Garden. If there's, I would think you would want two title fights on it just because of that, but that's one of the two, you know, the Long Island guy going, you know, against the California. This doesn't necessarily the California, but the Long Island guy defending the championship. It's a beautiful fight because they're both in their primes. They're both looking like absolute killers as of late.

Like I could see, I could see if you polled the arena that night, it would be 50-50, if it's in a neutral site, not in New York or something. You know, like you can make a legitimate case for either guy at this point. I know they haven't announced it. And I want to ask you about that in a second. But if I put you on the spot right now, who do you link towards? I find that fight to be damn near impossible to predict. Yeah, boy, putting me on the spot. Gun to your head. I guess, gun to my head, Chris Wydenman. But, you know, boy, oh, boy, that's a hard one.

It is so hard. I love it. I find it weird that they haven't come out and said that Rockhold is the number one guy. In interviews, he's kind of winking and saying, yeah, yeah, yeah, trust me, I am. But why do you think they haven't come out and said it? Is there any chance they don't do it? it's only been you know a couple it's only been a couple of days

since the fight but he could have been the more to tender off of Machita yeah yeah I think maybe yeah I don't know but maybe maybe it's just

they're waiting for the big announcement for when the you know the thing clears and they can announce Madison Square Garden and they all announce it you know even though we we know it's the right fight to make maybe they're just holding off

on trying to absolutely say it until you know that they can announce the garden show I don't know Well, you know, not to rain on anyone's parade, but the legislative calendar in the state in New York ends in June, late June. So they have to do this rather quickly. I mean, the time, the clock is definitely, the clock is definitely ticking. The time is now, as they like to say. Speaking of number one contenders, is there any doubt that Donald Seroni is the number one contender now in the lightweight division?

No, because Khabir Magamato is hurt. Yeah. And, yeah, yeah, there's – and you know what? even if he was healthy in time for a championship fight, you know, Ceronry's won eight in a row, and, you know, he won this one clean, and it's his time. And, yeah, it's just time to get a championship fight.

Honestly, he's infinitely more popular than anyone in the division right now, including the champion. He has this amazing connection with the fans. They love him. And this story coming out that he had a serious rib injury, and Greg Jackson was pleading with him to pull out of the fight, and he said, no way. even when Nirmagamatov pulled out, that was his out right there.

Look, at times you wonder, like, is this guy for real? Is this all an act? The guy really does practice what he preaches. And I think a Donald's Rondi title fight at this point can be sold to the public very well in 2015. Oh, I think it's the best opponent for Dosanias. I think, you know, it's a better opponent than Khabib as far as selling to the public. Because people, they've watched this guy rise. I mean, he's been in the spotlight, you know, going back to the WEC days, but certainly since day

in UFC and he's always come close to getting the championship fight. It's his first championship fight. You know, and he's a, I think that there's a thing about him that people like in the sense that he's won a lot of fights, but he's lost a few. You can kind of empathize with his up and down and up and down. Similar

to Arlobski, there's like, and then Kormier to an extent too. I think there's something to these guys that, and what's great about the sport is one loss doesn't kill you and people understand that. And there's a rooting thing. I mean, I think Johnson, honestly, I think Anthony Johnson made himself a bigger star in this fight just because of how he handled the loss. I couldn't agree more. He did everything that he needed to do in particular because he came off as humble.

And I think that, again, some people may have questioned, is this for real? Is he really this humble now? Because there was a time where he was really cocky and he had gone through all this stuff. And you're wondering, all right, is he just trying hard to get people to like him? But in your lowest moment, when you lose a title fight and those colors come out, those are your true colors, I think. It's hard to fake it. Those were the colors that came out. I spoke to him in the locker room. The interview never aired. The guy had a smile on his face. And you could say, oh, well, why aren't you more upset? but he was like, look, life is good. I was never supposed to be here to begin with. I lost everything, and he was really handling it very well, so I give him a lot of props.

Before we let you go, I want to ask you, do you think that Arlofsky should get the title shot or should it go to, let's just pretend that Kane wins. There's no immediate rematch or whatever, even if Redoom wins, and they're not going to go, because they could very well do an immediate rematch if Kane wins or is controversial. But let's pretend that that's not the case.

Do you go with Arlofski or do you go with Miyochic? That's a real tough one, because I think that Miotis is a better fighter, but I think that I would go, right now, I would go with Arlovsky because I just feel it's a little bit more momentum, a little bit stronger to the public, and also, Miochik can wait one. I think the longer Arlovsky waits one, the more you're hurting him. You know what I mean? So there's just a little thing. I mean, so yeah, I would go with Arlovsky.

I think you need to strike while the iron is hot here. You know, I mean, this is lightning in a bottle stuff. No one expected this. 2015, to have Andre Arlofsky in the UFC period on a three-fight winning streak, Coming off, arguably, you know, the round of the year, fight of the year, whatever you want to call it, is special stuff. They need to capitalize on that. You wrote an article for MMAFighting.com before the event saying that Pachial-Mayweather might hurt this show as far as pay-per-view buys, which is not a crazy concept. I know we're just a few days removed.

It was a holiday yesterday. But do you have any indication how this did on pay-per-view? I have no indication at all. So it's funny because Kevin Ioli and I usually talk about how the pay-per-view is going to do before the fight or the day before or the day of. And we're usually pretty darn close, and we were very far apart. He was much lower than me. I mean, I was thinking five, maybe even six, and he was thinking maybe three and a quarter.

And the thing is he thought more of an effect of the Mayweather-Packiel fight than I did. I mean, I think it has an effect, and whatever the number is, I think it would have done better. But I think, you know, my gut is still the day of the show. This was a big fight, and it's kind of like the dynamic of guys buying a paper, view is like that day of the fight, do you really want to see it? The money is always a secondary issue. It's an issue, but it's, you know, and I think this one was strong enough to where it's like, you know what, I mean, you watch the, the Weidman-Belfort Way and stuff, and Daniel

Cormier and Anthony Johnson and Serroney's on the card. It's the deepest, you know, it really is the deepest card of the year. I think that if you're a UFC fan, you're going to go, you know what, I did just pay for that bad pay-per-view three weeks ago or that bad fight, but this is really one I want to see. So I don't think it's going to kill it. But Kevin thought, hey, people just spend $100. They're just not ready yet. It will hurt a little bit. I mean, and one of the things that is when Mayweather fought Canello, which a couple of years ago, it took three months before the wrestling and the UFC pay-per-view numbers went back.

Every show for three months did lower than I expected. And so there is, I mean, and this was a much bigger fight than the Canlo fight. So the idea that that is a factor is for sure. One word before we let you go. Saturday, the UFC is back. It's unbelievable. We have to turn our attention to Carlos Condit versus Tiago Alves. Very good, very interesting fight at 170.

Your pick? I guess I'm going to go with Carlos Condit, but again, reservations when you're talking about a guy coming off major surgery in a year layoff. You know, did he lose anything? You know, and I don't know. But I think that the Carlos Condit that I saw, the way they match up, and it's actually a pretty damn good matchup, I think that you, he beats Tiago Alves, but yeah, we're going to learn how fully recovered.

He's had enough time to where the time is right, but you know, you never know about guys coming off of surgery and long layoffs. All right. Great stuff as always. Thank you very much for the time, Dave. Okay, thank you. There he is. Dave Meltzer of MMAFighting.com and the Wrestling Observer Newsletter.

A lot of great insight. You know, I said it was... A win for the UFC, it absolutely was the one that was kind of unresolved, was the flyweight division. Dotson didn't really go out there and wow. He was very honest with his performance, no doubt about it. He said that, you know, he was rusty. He's coming off, as Dave mentioned with Carlos Condit.

He was rusty, felt a little off. And Benavides is honest. I mean, he could have come out and said, hey, you know, I'm the number one guy. Look, there's an opening for me. but I think the opening now is for Henry Sohudo, even though I don't love that because I still feel like he needs a couple more fights at 125. Henry Sehudo is fighting in, what, three weeks in Mexico. So, you know, let's see what he does there. Of course, he has to win the fight.

He's fighting Chico Camus. But I still feel like I'd love to see him get a few more fights before he fights for the belt. Right? It's too soon. It was for Dotson, and honestly, I would take the Dotson fight now. There's very much a real animosity between Dotson and D.J. You can feel it when you talk to them. It's there.

There's this rivalry. They do not like each other. And the facts are that Dotson gave D.J. His toughest fight as champion. He didn't win, and that's definitely a feather in Demetrius's cap. but there's no one, there's no one else that makes sense. And you can tell every time he has to talk about Dotson and somehow have to explain or defend or validate his presence,

his status in the division, it just bugs D.J. I think it's great. I love this tweet. It may have been true. There's definitely a case to be made for Makovsky winning the fight, but I love his tweet about, you know, I had it two to one for Mikovsky. I love that. I think that was perfect.

The timing of it, it was just, it was great. So all in all, a great night for the Ultimate Fighting Championship. It was as good in the cage as it was out of the cage. I mean, when can you remember a night with that many great promos? And you can't roll your eyes at that part of the game because it's a very important part of the game. We replay them over and over again in the countdown shows and the car. commercials. This is how you sell the next fight. Arlofsky and Brown was just, I mean, it almost made me want to cry. Arlofsky apologizing to Brown for having to beat him. And then them catching on

camera, them catching, what is going on here? Them catch, maybe I screwed up, them catching on camera that Brown was saying, you know, you don't have to apologize, go out there, get the belt. I mean, that was an amazing moment from two teammates. You saw, you saw Arlofsky talk about their relationship on this show last week. And then, you know, Seroni is just always great and just how humble he was and talking about the injury and not wanting to pull out all that stuff. That was fantastic. And then, of course, what Widman said, man, Wyman's was so great. Stop doubting me. Join the team. Perfect. Just perfect. And then the DC thing, dropping the mic. If you missed it, he essentially said, Joe Rogan, you can catch it online. Joe Rogan,

with all due respect to you and the 16,000 in attendance, I need to talk to one man and one man only. John Jones. I love how he says John Jones. Get your shh together. I'm waiting. Walk off. Lorenzo didn't look like he was very happy with that. And then setting up the Bader thing. Amazing. Can't beat that. What a night. We'll have Daniel Cormier in a second on the show. I believe we're trying to locate him. him as we speak, but he'd see that belt. He was great. If you felt like, you know, the promo and the cage and all that was, was too much. He told a great story in the Post-Fight press conference about, you know, climbing through the ranks with his fiance, Selena, and them having nothing, having absolutely nothing to their name. His parents and his siblings having to pool together like

500 bucks just so that he can, you know, live for the next month. And now look at him. A second chance. It's a guy who has stumbled in the past, who, you know, failed twice in the Olympics, who, yes, he won the Strike Force Grand Prix, but, you know, got that big UFC title shot and was unable to capitalize people saying that he was better off fighting as a heavyweight, as opposed to light heavyweight that he was doing a disservice to himself. And who knows what's going to happen if or when John Jones returns. Who knows? But right now, there's no doubt of my mind. And it's not because I work with him. I mean, it's just, that's the fact. The guy is the champion. Now, do you believe he's the best in the world? Do you think their first fight proves otherwise?

That's a whole different discussion. But he is the champion. And for anyone to say otherwise is actually inaccurate. It's false. It's not the interim belt. It's not a fake belt. It's not a paper champion. real lineal champion. That is undisputable. Speaking of which, let us introduce the real UFC light heavyweight champion, the lineal champion of the world. The one and only Daniel Cormier, let's clap it up for the man. There he is. Shirtless. How about that, my friend? Congratulations. I'm just waiting right now. Salinas digging through the bag trying to get me a sponsor sure before I get into trouble. Oh, okay. Well, I like this Sherlock. I thought, man, living the

dream over there. Sponsor. Yeah. Who needs a sponsor? Look at that. Mmm. Hmm. Stop. Where's the belt? Oh, you want to see? It's, it's was right on, it's on my, on my, uh, island in the kitchen

next to the rest of my, my, uh, belt, because I was trying to, I was trying to do a picture this morning. I don't know if you saw it on Instagram. It's fantastic. It's an unbelievable picture, man. Like I literally was sitting there and I sent it to my manager, Bob and Dwayne, and I said, guys, we've done pretty good for five and a half years, you know, and they said that needs to go out to the public.

I said, yeah, I'm amazed. Unbelievable, very happy for you. Congratulations. I'm wondering right off the bat, what, you know, this has been a very, very, look at the smile on your face. I love it. This is really. I can't stop it. I'm trying to be serious, but I cannot stop it right now.

I'm seriously trying. This has been a very intense debate. Is Daniel Cormier the real champion paper? Are you hearing this a lot, or is it other people talking, you know, away from you? Are you getting this from people? I hear it, man, but you know what, man, I've got some great fans and friends because they defend me, you know? I've said it time and time again that John disqualified himself from the competition.

He took his name out of the hat. He's not an option anymore right now until he gets everything right outside of the octagon. You get to choose who you want to be your champion. You cannot pick John Jones. He's disqualified himself in competition. And there's nothing we can do about that. There's nothing I can do about it.

There's nothing Anthony could have done about it. We can only compete to the best of our ability for what's available. and that's the UFC championship. Ariel, I am proud of what I accomplished the other day. I mean, not many people ever get the chance to stand inside of the Akron and wear the UFC title. I'm proud of that.

Let me ask you this. I know you're an intense competitor and your heart of hearts. Will you only truly consider yourself a champion until you beat John? You know what, man? I would love to fight John again and hopefully beat John. But when they put that belt around my waist, I'm the UFC champion. They don't do that. They don't just give away those titles, man.

And they didn't say, here, Daniel, here's your interim title. They said, Daniel, you are the lineal UFC champion across the board. When we go through the books, as I said in the interview, I said, Ariel Hawani, when you look in the record books, there will be no asterisk next to my name as I'm the UFC champion. There will be no asterisk. There will not be a pause. There will not be a space in between John Jones and me as the champion. We will flow, just like John flowed from Shogunhua,

as Shogunhuah flowed from Leodda. Machita, Machita went from Rashad Evans. There will be nothing different. So in history, it will go down. You know, back in 95, 95 when the Houston Rockets won the championship, at the time, everyone said, well, the Rockets aren't the champions because Michael Jordan was playing baseball. so they would have never won if Michael Jordan was still there to play.

When we look back at the Rockets now, nobody says, well, that's only because Michael Jordan wasn't playing. They said the Houston Rockets were the back-to-back NBA world champions. Thanks in part to the great John Starks shooting zero. Come on, man. Come on, I'm trying to. It was one for 18, by the way. It was one. He made one.

He made one. Zero for 18, John Starks. Thank you for shooting the Knicks. out of the championship series. Okay, I'm going to ignore. I'm going to try to be happy for you here, so I'll ignore that. You told me before the fight,

you kind of shocked me, he said, I don't really need this. I want it, but I don't need it. I don't need to complete my life. I have a great fan, all that stuff. Now that you want it, do you still feel the same way, or do you think things would have been incomplete without it?

I feel the same way, man. Like, I mean, I think that's what actually allowed me to win that fight. I was able to just let go and just go and compete. I'm glad that I talked to John, when I did because I was starting to do it again to myself

I was starting to put that pressure of I have to get this one I have got to get it done this time I cannot not win this fight and I do it to myself over and over and over again and this time I was actually able to

to let it go and it allowed me to just do what I do and that's just compete is that dipyourcar.com I can't find my dipycar.com teacher man I'm screaming Well, we'll give them a shout out right here at dipyourcar.com. I see them on everyone. Dipyourcar.com. How are you guys doing? I cannot wait to dip my car.

Okay. So you reach the mountaintop. You've been waiting for this moment your entire MMA career, and the mic is put in front of you for the first time Joe Rogan. The first thing you think about is John Jones. You don't say anything to anyone else. You drop the mic. It's the promo of all promos. One of the greatest, top three greatest promos in the history of this sport, post-fight. Why in that moment, though, are you thinking about John Jones? Because he beat you. Like, John just, John beat me, and I just beat the guy that a lot of people thought was going to beat him. So I'm like, you know what, man, I still want to fight him.

You know, I want to challenge myself against the best guy. You know, he's good. You know, I think more than anything with Saturday Night showed is how special the kid really is, if he can get himself and everything else in order to have beaten me. and then for me to do what I did to Anthony Romwell Johnson. That's crazy, man. So, yeah, I want to compete against him. I hope that he does get it together so that we can fight again.

Have you heard through the grapevine at all that he was watching? I hope he was. Could you imagine him sitting there watching me, of all people, get the belt? Do you know how much that? I mean, if the rolls were reversed, I would be going insane if I had to watch him do that if I was in his situation. I mean, he doesn't want to see me win. He doesn't want to see me carrying what he probably feels is still his title, which it isn't.

It's mine. But he doesn't want to see that. And I don't know. Maybe John's in so much of a better place now after going through the issues that he has had that he's let everything go. But we'll see, I guess. A lot of people thought Lorenzo Furtita was mad at you. He gave you the stare down to death as you walked out. Is that the case?

I think maybe I cussed. So maybe that's what it was. But no, Lorenzo was fine. talked after the fight, texted, and he was very happy. I talked to him on Saturday night after the fight, and I talked to Dana on Sunday, and those guys are extremely happy with my performance, and they're happy that I'm the champion of the UFC. I believe that I can actually, I will represent this sport in the best light possible. I won't mess it up. I won't get myself in any trouble. I'm going to live my life the correct way and I'm going to be a champion the kids

can look up to it and hopefully aspire to be like. When you spoke to them, did you get any insight into what they want to do with John or what they know about John or what's next for you? Did you talk at all about that? You know, man, once I got out of the octagon and I was able to kind of just get back in my environment and start to kind of think about what I had just accomplished, it wasn't really about John anymore. You know, I didn't think about John anymore. So Lauren, Renzo and I, we talk none of nothing about John. Dana and I talked nothing about John. They allowed me to have my moment, which was great, you know, because when a guy,

when a guy does something that he's been chasing for so long, you know, you owe it to him to, to give him his moment, you know, let him bask in it for a second. Let him, let him, let him, let him, you know, kind of basking what he had just accomplished. and those guys actually did that for me. You know, these two guys, you know, Dana and Lorenzo are great guys, and they gave me an opportunity and I took advantage of, and they told me that they were very happy and proud that I did. I love the Rogan interview. I love the Bader thing.

We'll talk about that in a second. But really, my favorite thing, my favorite thing that you said was the story about you and your fiance, Selena, and your parents and siblings pulling together around $500 just to help you survive. So I want to ask you, when was the first time that you thought, wow, UFC champion, that's something I want. That's something I want to be called. Was it before the Olympics? Was it as a youngster in Louisiana? When's the first time you thought that, wow, this is something I want?

When did that dream start for you? How long ago? It wasn't UFC champion. It was to fight in the UFC. I watched Brock Lesnar and Frank Meir, UFC 100. I was like, man, this is crazy. if I ever got to compete in something like that, how that would be great.

When I talk about my parents, you know, it was just tough, you know, because Celine and I were just starting off. You know, we were just starting off. We moved to California, to San Jose, which is very expensive. Excuse me. Excuse me. Bussey. Bussey.

Sorry. We wanted to live on our own. You know, we were expecting our first kid. And I would get my cage Friday's, sponsorship and our rent was 1,300 bucks a month and my KHPri sponsor was $1,500 a month. But I also taught private wrestling lessons so that I would raise my income to apply about $2,000 a month, and that's how we would live, you know? So it was tough, man, and a couple times we didn't know what to do.

Now, when I say welfare, like, I mean, you know, we weren't getting like any government checks or anything. We were getting like WIC and stuff, like to help buy formula for our kids and everything. and I just want to maybe kind of explain that a little bit better, but we just didn't have. And we were fighting in the best way that we could to try and make our lives together, and now it's kind of working out. I want to ask you the same question. I asked Chris before his fight, was there ever a point where you were sleeping next to your fiancé,

your future fiancé, maybe your kid is now in the world, and you're thinking, like, man, I'm just not making enough here. Like, I'm the provider for this family, and this is a great dream and all. But how much longer can I do this? Is there a light at the end of this tunnel? Did you ever doubt that this day would come? You know what? I never did because she would never allow me to.

She knew that it was something I wanted to do. And when I would start saying stuff, like, I've just got, Salina, I've got to get a job. And she's like, no, you don't. You need to train. Continue to get better and improve. And one day it's going to work out. You know, so.

And plus my manager, man, like my managers, like, if we ever were needed, like we're dying dire need, they would always come to our aid, you know? I mean, at one point, we've had guys that have owed our management team $10, $15, $20,000 because the Wayne and Bob will just take out of their own pocket to give to you. You know, so now that we're making money, I have no issue writing those guys' checks

because when we had nothing, they would actually just pay it. When my sponsorship checks were late sometimes, didn't come on the first of the month and my rent was due by the third. Duane and Bob would write me my sponsorship check at the beginning of the month to make sure my rent was paid and then they would just wait for the check

to come in to get paid whatever time it came in that month. They just made sure that we were always okay. Wow. What was it? There's no company like Zinkin and MMA. You know, these guys, Dwayne and them, Dwayne doesn't need mixed martial arts. They don't need,

mixed martial arts to live. Bob's a great businessman. He's done great for himself. They don't need this. They do this because they love their guys. They want to help. And it shows. That's why we're also fiercely committed to our management team. And you see them having some of the biggest name fighters in the world. Maybe the highlight of my weekend was meeting your mother, Mrs. Cormier. What a moment that was at the Wayans. A lovely lady. What was it like when you showed her the belt? And I also saw, I want to get your take on what was it like in this moment. I saw your fiance holding the belt right after. Like she was clutching onto that thing.

Like it was the most prized possession in her life. What was it like when you got to finally look at them and share this with them? You know, Salino was just like, I can't believe this. I can't believe this. I can't believe this. Because reality is all we've known in terms of UFC champions came. And we've seen what it's done for his life. So she was just like, I can't believe it.

And my mom is 73 years old and she's quiet. And the story of her actually walking up to you was surprising because it's not something that I would have expected to do. But then I think about it, I'm like, that's exactly what she would do because all she watches is Fox Sports One and Fox Sports 2 with the hope of seeing me on TV at some point. I'm going to watch the weather channel for 10 hours and she's all, boy, there's some bad. weather in Russia. Like, what do you care with the weather in Russia, Mom?

And she's like, watching the Weather Channel. Then it was CNN. And now all she watches is UFC. She loves Fox Sports, too. And she goes, well, that area of Hwani, he's a pretty nice guy. And he works with you on the UFC tonight. So she saw you, and she went up there.

And it was great. Like, my dad, my dad was probably the proudest. He was just standing there smiling. And my dad's a big old guy that's worked 25 years for the city of Lafayette, doing the baseball fields and cleaning bathrooms and doing all that. And that's a big, burly, hardworking man that doesn't smile very often. But this dude has a smile across his face that it just warmed me inside, man.

So showing them and giving that back to them, I admit the world of me. Did Schwarzenegger make fun of your belly? He did. He goes, I think I might have saw a two-pack. I go, well, you'll never see a two-pack right here. I go, it's fine, though. I said, don't worry about that belly, swore. Schwarzenegger, governor.

Did he show you love? He's a great guy, man. Crazy thing is Arnold Schwarzenegger's very good friends with my manager, with Dwayne Zinken and his family. So yesterday I get a call during my travels back from Las Vegas, and it was Duane going, dude, I just got a message from Arnold, and he played it, and it was Arnold left a voicemail on Duane's house phone, because Duane still has a house phone for some reason I can't explain.

And Arnold was like, great job guys. You have the best management team and awesome for Cormier. What a great guy. Way to really get after it. Arnold's a great guy. So there are plans for us to all get together for dinner. And how about this? You're the champ of the world.

You reached the mountaintop, a great moment. And yet you had to drive from Las Vegas to San Jose nine hours because you missed your flight. Is that true? Ariel, I didn't miss my flight. Selena, be quiet. Don't talk. Selena, don't talk during my interview. One of the hours yesterday it took us to get back from Vegas with two

sipped with two toddlers, a three-year-old, or four-year-old, because Daniel can't read the date when he's booking airline travel. So I booked my family's travel for Sunday, thinking it was Monday in the UFC, move mine to Monday. But because we're four, there were no flights coming in from Las Vegas to San Jose one way, San Francisco are Oakland. So we ended up having the pile into a minivan

which by the way Selena refuses to drive anyways because she doesn't want to be the mom with the minivan. But we drove 12 hours yesterday from Vegas to Gilroy and we got home at 12 o'clock in the morning last night.

How much would that drive have sucked if you didn't have the belt with you, right? If I didn't have the belt, I probably would have just stayed in Vegas. Like there was no way. We were going to wait. probably, actually we would have still drove because I wouldn't want to piss

to lean off any more than she's already mad at me. Okay, so what about this Ryan Bader thing? Holy moly. Where did that come from? Where's the animosity? Where's this coming from? Who, Ryan? Ryan's learning from the Connemogregor playbook of building a fight.

Like, what is up with Bader? Like, I don't mind Ryan Bader thinking he deserves a title shot. I understand, Ryan, due to the process of elimination, you're pretty safe buddy you don't have to come and interrupt a press conference i mean you're the number five guy in the world rankings are going to shake up on monday because i just beat the number one guy things are going to happen just wait ryan it will happen for you but bader i don't know if i made bader mad in new orleans by just messing with him the whole time trying to sell the fight or what but somehow something switched in ryan bader and he turned into an angry guy and just kind of attack me

at the press conference. I'm just an innocent bystander. I'm just trying to hang out. I have, I played no part in that deal. I don't know what Charlott and Bader. This is my press conference. Get the F out of here. The thing is with Bader, though, he started since the beginning of the middle of the week, you know, like he's like sending me messages on Twitter for some reason. I don't even understand. I'm like, well, Ryan, I've got a fight to get, I've got a fight to get to. So the crazy thing is, I think after I beat Ryan Bader,

he should have to go get beat up by Anthony Johnson for being so disrespect for the Anthony Johnson because he was acting as if he was acting as if I beat Anthony before we even fought. He's calling me out for a title shot. I'm like, hey, I've got to worry about Anthony Johnson. I'm over here worried about Anthony and you're trying to call me out.

That right hand that Anthony Johnson about knocked me out of the octagon with Ryan Bader would not have gotten up from and I think that's his punishment for disrespecting Anthony Johnson. He gets to get beat up by me and then he gets to go and fight Anthony Johnson and Anthony will beat him up too.

Deep down, are you just like... Are you just licking your lips? Are you just saying like, oh man, if my first title defense is against Ryan Bader, you called him the easiest fight. Is this a perfect scenario for you? Well, I don't understand. I don't understand like if Ryan has fought

all these guys, the top guys, and he's lost to him, how all of a sudden does he just think, miraculously, he's going to match up so well against me? What's he going to do? Like, what's he going to do? I understand.

Brian Bader wants to fight for a time. great for Ryan. I could respect you, Ryan, Bader, because you're a wrestler, I'm a wrestler. I could respect you. But now there's no respect because of the way you handled the situation. Bader talked about he wants to kick my ass if Rumble doesn't do it on Saturday. But, I mean, who's assing, I mean, who's asses he? The thing is, Ryan Bader has done something so phenomenally spectacular.

He's got everyone to talk about him. It's unbelievable that Ryan Bader. name is coming off of someone's tongue. Ryan Bader doesn't get in... I saw somewhere today. Ryan Bader's actually going on a radio show. I don't think that's ever happened. And all this time that Ryan Bader's been fighting

and he did it by interrupting my moment. I mean, good for you, Ryan Bader, I guess. He hats off for Ryan Bader. I don't know. He must be talking to McGregor or something. McGregor's got him. He's the teacher. So do you think that's next, if it's not, John?

Has to be, right? Again, process of elimination. Yeah. If you look at the new rankings that came out today, I'm one, Anthony's two, Gussopson's three. The guy, Bader's right behind him. Anthony and Gustafsson are coming off of losses. Ryan Bader, you're next, but you're going to get exactly what you wanted, exactly what you asked for. I hope you make a good fight of it because if you don't, you're going to get embarrassed.

And by the way, you know, so now we have this situation where it's probably better. I mean, do you feel like this is almost a good thing for the UFC? now you have all these matchups. You've never fought Gustafin. You never fought Bader. You know, all these guys that Jones already beat, it is actually kind of a fresh coat of pain on the division. Do you feel like you're almost a good thing for them?

Man, I'm telling you, man, because John beat everybody. Yeah, it's weird. Yeah. What do you, he messed up the division. He beat everybody. Like, there's like eight guys. You go, when a guy, a guy defends his title eight times against eight different people,

it really throws a division in a tailspin. But now, like you said, you know, I've never fought Gustafson, never fought the Shara. All these guys are in play now, you know, so we'll see how long John's situation takes. And even if he does come back, you know, I win the fight against John. I win the rematch and I can still fight all these new guys. Last thing, was that the hardest you were ever hitting a fight when he rocked you early? You know, man, I've been in a fight, yes. But Ariel, I tell you one thing, this was not a right hand.

This was a right missile. It was the fastest thing. It was the fastest punch. I mean, I literally was on my feet from the next. I'm like laying on the ground. I saw a picture in a fight. I'm like, oh, I took a nap like Nick Diaz in the middle of the aisle. I was just kind of laying there like, what am I doing from my feet to the ground so fast?

So I try to pop up and I look behind me. I'm like, oh, my goodness, he's coming back. And then I look behind me and Anthony Rumbull's chasing me trying to finish me. But my whole deal was don't allow him to get the follow-up shot. The follow-up shot is what's going to put you out of this fight. He got so excited that I was able to actually take his back. And once I got my hands clasped, I was okay. I wasn't necessarily like dizzy, though, Ariel.

Like, I fell down, but I wasn't fuzzy. It wasn't like I was seeing two of them or any of that. I just got knocked down. So you then submit him, and then he goes on the mic and says, don't quit, which some people kind of laughed. And then he puts the belt on you. What did you make of him afterwards? You know, man, I don't know exactly, I don't know exactly what to make of it.

He's a nice guy and I think maybe he showed exactly how nice he is after behaving in the way that he did, you know? A lot of times it's tough. Losing a fight is tough, man. And in your darkest hour, I guess your true color show. And Anthony Johnson is made of gold if you ask me for the way that he handled that. What he did for me on Saturday, Ariel, was he. he made my experience different. By putting on the belt, he made my experience of being crowned a champion different than

anyone else in the UFC's history. Nobody's done that. So thank you, Anthony Johnson, for making my experience different. I appreciate it, and I appreciate you. Well done, my man. Everything was perfect. I thought the walkout music was perfect, the fight, the post-fight interview, the everything. So, well done.

What do you want to say, yes? I was very close to using y'all must have forgotten. Don't say that. I was very close to doing it, and guess why? Because going into the fight, it was just weird how much people thought I was going to lose. Yeah. Being that I had only lost one time. And I know it's about, a lot of times it's like your last memory of a person is what sticks in people's mind.

But I was like, man, let's not forget I had won 15 straight fights. So more than anything, the reason I used that L.O. Koujee, song was because if you listen to the very beginning of this song, he says, don't call it a comeback. I've been here for years, which is exactly how I feel. This wasn't a comeback fight for me. I felt like I was going to win this fight, and we have to be a little broader in our opinions and in our perspectives when it comes to fighting. The last memory of Anthony Johnson on Saturday, don't let that change what you feel for Anthony as a fighter. This guy's a phenomenal fighter, and going into his next fight, he shouldn't be considered the underdog

or people believe he's going to lose just because of what he did last time. It's all matchups, and I knew that I matched up well against Rumble Johnson. Great stuff, D.C., so happy for you and your family. Congratulations, my friend, an amazing performance. You are the champion of the UFC's Light Heavyweight Division, and you certainly deserve it. Thank you so much, man. I really appreciate you coming on. Thank you so much, Ariel.

Guys, do yourself in favor. Go to YouTube. watch UFC 166 practice walkouts with Adam Geller. It's the funniest video you will ever see in your entire life. Hey, Ann, the Seth Rawlin celebration from WrestleMania coming. I am waiting for Ariel Hawani's email. I gave it to. The moment in the email, I will send you guys to Seth Rallin's celebration, just like I promise.

You're the man, D.C. Thank you. Thank you. There he is. A man of his word. Daniel Cormier, the new light heavyweight champion. and now we go from one champion to the next, the man who successfully defended his title on Saturday night, the man who I made cry on Wednesday night,

just days before the fight, Chris Weidman, the middleweight champion of the world. Chris, are you there? Yes, what's up, buddy? How are you? Well, congratulations, maybe tears of joy now, but what a night for you, because I want to ask you this right off the top.

It really truly feels like you turn the corner on Saturday. I know the Anderson fights, were big, the other was big, but it feels like people now view you in a whole different light. Like,

we can't talk about the respect thing anymore. Do you feel the same way? It's too, it's too early to make that statement. I don't know. Well, see, right now,

right now, I feel what you're feeling. But let's give it them, let's give it a month or two. So you're, you're, you're not ready yet to concede the fact

that you have received the respect or that you will receive the respect that you deserve. Yeah, I'm not ready, I'm not ready to jump on that bandwagon yet.

Let me, let me give it a couple days or, you know, weeks or a month, and then we'll decide if I'm going to jump on that band leg or not. But it has been amazing amount of support I've got it. I think

it's probably been more than some of my other fights and I feel like it's more consensual. It's more people. Not as many haters at all. Why do you think that is? Like, you suck, you still suck, you're going to die,

so now it's kind of, now it's a little different. I won't know how long that last, but it's nice. I don't know if it's usually because you've got another Brazilian legend waiting for me that they think is going to kill me. So I don't know if that's it

or they're a special performance and they probably recognize. But either way, it's nice. You know, I have no problem saying. I mean, we've talked a lot about, you know, your interviews and your appearance and all that stuff. The promo, I mean, I got to admit, I was kind of sitting back like a proud father

when you unleashed that thing afterwards. Stop doubting me. Join the team. Where did that come from? Did you practice that or was that off the cuff? That was off the cuff. I don't know. You know, I do, like, before fights,

I do imagine the whole fight. I even imagine getting the mic, my face, and remember in the state a couple things. Kind of like thanking my wife and family and coaches and stuff like that. And then, but that just took over. and it just happens. So, you know, it was the cuffs.

That might have been your finest hour. Forget about the fight itself. That was passionate. And then you ended it with an I love you. It was so great. Join the team. I feel like that. That could be your new slogan.

Like, you need to make t-shirts of that thing. Have you thought of that yet? Join the team or I love you. No, I love you is kind of taken, but join the team is perfect. Maybe I love you in the back. I think you're right. I think you're right. I think it was trending on Twitter.

So I think I'm sticking with that. Perfect. Okay. Let me ask you about this. I'm watching the fight. You're coming out. You're making that walk to the music. And it kind of strikes me.

And be honest with me here. You looked a little off. It looked like you were sick or something. Like you were very pale. Your eyes were dark. Was something wrong? I'll be honest with you. Please.

It was my first time ever. I had to go to the bat for bed. and I'm like, I cannot believe this is going to happen. I'm going to trap myself in the middle of this cage. I was like, I didn't know if I was going to write, like as soon as Vitor's walkout movie that came on, I was constantly all I could think about was like, I don't know if I should run to the bat now or can I hold it.

I don't know what's going to happen. That's really what was going to my mind the whole time walking out. I'm like, I don't know. I might see the first person to have to run, run away from the fight to go to the bathroom. I don't want to, like, hold the fight for me. But I don't want to, like, tell anybody because, you know, when you say it out loud, it becomes worse.

So I remember, I just, like, when we were getting ready to do the walk, I gave right my flag. You know, I usually hold the flag. I gave right a flag to hold because I was just trying to focus on not crapping myself pretty much. Wow. Yeah, you were right. There was definitely something not normal. This coming from a guy, this coming from a guy who you crapped yourself when you sparred Valenti, right? Yeah, I'm going.

My wife, I have to go to, yeah. I've had issues. I had to go to a gastro and whatever they're called, gastro gastro back there. Coming up, I keep putting it up on the phone it off. That was kind of crazy. Yes, you also crapped in your wife's garbage can on your first date,

so clearly there's something going on. You joke that you might be an honorary Jew, but you know, Jews have IBS. Maybe that's what you have. Maybe deep down, why, man, I mean, it does sound Jewish. Maybe that's what you got. Exactly. It might be Jewish now, officially.

At what point did it hit you, though, like while you were standing there? Or in the... Well, because if I was in the locker, I was good, but what they do is they take, you know, you're walking your locker room and then they go like, all right, we got two minutes, we got a minute, then all of a sudden they bring you out. And then you wait. So Vitor has to, they bring it to a point, they got the camera set up, there's a million people, you know, kind of look at you.

And then at that point, you know, the security guard is set up. At that point, Vitor makes his walk first. So as Vito was getting ready to make his waf, the whole time, I was just contemplating to the batten. But it's a pretty far run. And everybody's eyes are on me, so they'd be wondering

like, if the guy running away from a fight, so I didn't feel like having all this drama because I'd go to the bathroom. So I just kind of like dealing with it, like, struggling, man. You know what that's like when you,

it's just a terrible situation, especially when you're about to go out and fighting for millions of people, you know, with the people and everything. And it was just a very, it was a struggling time. Was this an indication

of you being nervous before the fight? No, usually like I go to the bathroom before I fight. This is such a weird conversation. It's not like anything on normal, but the thing that was on normal was that it was happening on my walkout. I'm usually good to go at that point. I have no wish it was happening way too close to my fight, which was kind of scary. Yeah. Okay, last thing about this.

At what point you forget about it? Is it bothering you throughout? Yeah. Like, I still wasn't, I still was, like, consciously thinking about it, like, holding myself together only up until, like, I was in that case. Wow. So the whole walkout, you know, all these people are going nuts. The only thing I'm thinking about is keeping together.

It's unbelievable. It wasn't, I think, it wasn't my normal thought process. I was sitting with someone backstage in my little cave, and I said, man, he doesn't look right. Something seems off. And then he rocks you. And I was thinking, wow, I mean, something is clearly off here, and I asked your teammates, I didn't get to see you

after the fight, and everyone said, no, no, no, you were fine, but man, I feel like I know you better than them. They didn't know about that either. I didn't even, they still don't know. I didn't tell him. Maybe I told them afterwards, but, uh, yeah, that's kind of what was going to my mind. How close were you to being out there? I mean, how much did he hurt you? when it seemed like he did, but how much was it? You know, it was kind of, it was kind of weird. So we got to that weird exchange where, like, I fell, then he fell, I run after him.

Yeah. And as I run out, I, like, throw the knee out of him. Because in my head, the whole fight, like, I wanted to keep him at him because I feel like the more I did, the more he would do. And it was all about breaking him. I was all about getting him tired. That was a goal.

I knew he was going to have spurts. of spirit especially in the beginning so I just wanted to stay in his face and make them work make them work so that's why I was

like running after the cage after him because I just wanted as much drama as possible much much much activity out of him

you know he sees me running after and that brings a little like an dorfins or whatever to the brain

and he's starting to you know to start getting more tired and more tired or whatever the drama and I don't so I was just trying to run after him and when I ran after him

at some point I think he was like a headbutt or something. I came out and I felt the drip on my eye. I wiped my eye and there was blood. So Vitor saw that. And now Vitor's thinking I'm hurt, which I was completely fine.

It was just like a, just felt like I had a little cut. So now he's coming at me like a madman thinking like I'm hurt because if you watch his other fight, he's a great finisher. When he sees blood, when he sees someone's hurt, he comes at you like an animal. So here he comes after me when I'm completely clear-headed.

And so I'm back up to the cage, and I'm just, all right, let him see you off. Let them throw some hard punches. I don't care because I'm just going to cover, cover. But, you know, I'm used to doing that with fishing out of the gloves on and letting guys kind of tie themselves out. If they want to go crazy, I don't go crazy. You know, I do believe in my chin and everything,

even though I don't want to get punched in a fight. Like, I do, it is a good thing to have, you know, kind of on the back burner. So I was covering, cover, cover, and then he hit me with a nice uppercut, and just hit me on my lift at my nose. And I was just like, all right, you know what? I probably shouldn't just be getting standing here. But there was no point where I was actually like hurt to where I was like, oh my God, I'm going to fall down, I'm busy or not knocked out.

There was no point of that. It was just like, his meter is dropping. He's throwing all these crazy punches and I'm still here. I'm still fine. And as soon as he stopped throwing the punches, I just threw a jab. And he threw something and it was way slower. And I'm just like, oh, he's breaking. And at that point I could just probably stand with him and knock him out.

And I'm like, you know, that's what he's expecting. And so then he always did the unexpected. I just took him down from there. I just didn't give him a break to recover from his barrage of punches. That was the goal. He probably wanted to take a couple second break, and I just can't give him. Were you surprised at how ineffective he was on the ground? I mean, you come to my sparring sessions.

You come to me and Jiu-Jitsu. Things kind of look similar sometimes as what it looks like. So I'm not taking anything away from him. I go back. You know, I go to some top guys. When I go on the ground, my ground, my, I don't feel look different than people that they've ever felt before. So I might not look it. It might look simple, but it's different.

I'm a different animal when I, when I grab you. You know, you? I knew we hit the ground. I'm going to, this issue is a coming out part of me on the ground in my mind. I said if I'm taking this guy to the ground, would be letting the world know that I'm on another, no, no, no. other level. It would have been, if he would have kept on going, you guys might have seen him more. But I feel like I didn't give him a chance to recover from all of his punches.

And that's why he couldn't defend the thing clearly because he was exhausted. And then he's got this guy on top of him that he probably feels, you know, I feel like a ton of bricks. I'm not moving and I'm just going to keep on, I mean, I'm not going to be in his face the whole time. It's fire. It was definitely tough on mentally. And that was a goal. I'm just going out there to break.

these guys little, mentally and physically, and that's exactly what I did. I said I was going to finish in the first or second, that's what I do. You made headlines on Friday when, you know,

it got heated and you said that you felt like he was still cheating, and then after the fight, you showed a lot of emotion, more so than in your other fights. I mean, you were yelling, it seemed like you were really letting, you were really letting out

this aggression and this buildup from, I know it had been going on for a year, you know, you guys back and forth, but I never quite seen you like that. Where was this? all coming from, especially in the 24 hours before the fight? Well, you know, the juicing thing,

I left them all long old camp about it, you know, the cheating thing. I don't want to bring it up anymore. I said it was just too long ago, and I don't really want to put my own, I didn't want to even wrap my head around worrying about if he's juicing or not throughout camp. I didn't care. I was like, I don't care. I'm going out there, but I'm going out there, but there's not much control I have.

So I just said I stopped off and about it. But then just happened to be the media show, I guess. On Wednesday or Thursday? Thursday, yeah. I guess Thursday. Yeah. On Thursday, one of the reporters came up to me, Akamoto, and just said, while I was getting the scrum was just saying that, oh, I contacted Nevada,

and I got scores back. It was interesting because your scores were both like 370 and then 370, which is low, but during a short time. training can, that's what it kind of should be. You should be to do up yourself. I've got tested before. This was like two years ago, and mine was even lower than that during a training camp. So I expected my, I just know that I might score a low,

but that doesn't, like, I feel fine down my training camp, but that's why I know, like, I don't need to take anything. Like, I'm completely fine, and that's why I never made sense to me with these TRT guys, you know, when they were doing it back of the day. But anyway, so then he tells me, your scores are 370, 3-7? And you've got to realize that I am almost 10 years younger than him,

and he has been on PRT for so long because he said he couldn't live without being on it. So he said that, you know, like basically his testosterone is lower than everybody else. So I figured that's way a lot lower than he's mine. They said that his was 500 than 1,200. And I'm like, well, I don't know that much about testosterone. But 1200 doesn't seem like it should be illegal to hear. That's crazy. And especially during a training camp, but we're killing ourselves.

How the hell is this testosterone from 1,200? That just doesn't make sense. but he passed because the ratios from epitostostrom to testosterone was normal. So I'm like, all right, so there's something that he could take to make that ratio normal? And yeah, there's stuff. So that's what my head was. All right, well, he's 100% she has no way in my mind. His could be four times of the amount of mine during a training camp when I'm 10 years younger.

And he's had testosterone problems his whole life or whatever for so many years. So I'm like, all right, he's cheating. And now at the time, I'm like, you know, I don't care. I was going to talk to him about that. I was like, either way, have to give them up. But they kind of, like, overnight, and it just kind of start bothering me because this guy has the bulls to keep cheating

and, like, talk about, like, he's doing all the right things. I'm like, I just had enough. So when I went, I was like, you know what? I'm going to have a word with him about it. That was it. And I just, my off to him, I said, I can't believe they're still cheating. I was like, that's messed up.

I was like, $1,200 testosterone score. He was like, that wasn't this kind of. no, three weeks ago, his son's going to go to $1,200. And he was just so completely put up guard. I'm like, you know, I was like, you know, see the Christian

started acting like it. I was like, I'm going to make you pay for this. He was like, I was like, I was like, how dare you keep cheating? And that was it. I just kind of put him on blast. I think he was just so confused and mentally depleted from me.

He just wanted to get off stage. So I think it was probably a good mental wear for more there to be used. But, yeah, I think it definitely made the fight more exciting as well. So it was, it was different than my usual way and as we've ever had. You know, we've always just shook hands and stared at it down, a strict hand to stand in a

so definitely calm off guard and what everybody else would start to. Do you feel relieved that you can move on with your life now? Like no more Vitor Belford the past year has been about him and all this drug talk. I mean, you can really move on. You proved your point and that's it. Does that feel like a relief? Does it feel like a, you know, something's been lifted off your shoulders? Yeah, yep, it definitely is a relief, but at the same time, I'm just, you know, I'm ready for the next guy. I'm just ready to go out there and dominate again. Well, that is a good segue, because it appears as though the next guy should be Luke Rockhold,

yet they haven't come out and said it. Do you believe it's Luke Rockhold? You know, yeah, prior to the point I would say, you know, just by going by their last foot, so he'd be commosia, no disrespect to Comosie, but he's not a macheteer. and he already beat him once in the first. I don't know if that's a fight that usually, you know, merits a title shot for Jackar. So, but then you go and then you look at the other side.

Rocko was knocked down the U.S. secret pet by the B4 guy who was just, you know, beat up. So I understand whether they're looking at that side of it. So I did, I was on board. I don't know what, I don't know what's going to happen. I've been waiting to get on the cold for UFC. I was supposed to meet with them yesterday, but then I had to lead, so I didn't get to meet with them.

But I figure I'm probably going to get on the cold of the right zone, Jane. I try to go through the whole thing coming up. Do you think Rockhold right now is tougher than Machita when you fought him, tougher than Belford, tougher than Anderson? He seems to be fighting at a whole other level right now. I would expect a definitely a tough guy,

a tough fighter. But I feel like I'm running right through any of these guys. Nothing he does worries you. He's well-rounded. He's well-rounded, but he's not great anywhere. He's not the best striker ever fought. He's not the best basketball ever fought. He's not the best good guy ever fought.

Jack right brings different element. He's really good on the ground, and he's probably more dangerous on the feet than Rocco. Rockwell is kind of just well-rounded and keeps a good, solid pace going through that whole fight. Doesn't make too many mistakes. They're just two completely different fighters. If I had to say it was more dangerous, it would be Jacaree,

but there's five more holes in his game than their obstacle. So they both drink different elements of the game that I have to figure out and expose. Would you prefer Jacqueray next? No, I don't know what. I don't know. I don't really have a preference. Okay. Either way I'm going to see,

either way I'm going to have to fight these guys at some point, and I'm going to have to kind of let them know that they have no chance for me. Because I love the fact, like, I just love their attitude. And I'm excited to, as a competitor, to kind of just show them, show them the truth. But as far as which order, it doesn't really matter. I just want a big fight. Both of them know that.

I want big fights. They want big fights. The Madison Square Garden throws a little bit of a curb bowl in there. I want to know what's going on with that. Yeah. Yeah.

Do you know anything more about it? No, I know. I know nothing. So, hopefully the next couple days I'll find out more about it. Well, that would have... That changes in, too. Yeah, that would have to be in December

and the legislative calendar for New York ends in June. So we'll know pretty soon if the sport is legalized, at least this year. let's just say it's not. Let's just be pessimist. When do you want to return? I want to return by as soon as possible.

I mean, listen, I haven't had a summer. I haven't had a summer with the family that you enjoy. And this fighting in May is a great time. End of May. So now I have June, July. Yeah. In August, I would love to enjoy. You know, if you're from the East Coast,

you understand the feel I'm talking about. Or at least the Northeast. But I'd love to. enjoy the summer a little bit for once with my family. Other than that, I want to just keep on going. I want to keep on showing the world, you know, where I'm at. I kind of just separate myself from the rest of these guys. You know, every time you get done with a fight, there's always another guy.

Oh, this guy can do this, which guy is better than him than there. And that excites me just to let all these guys know the truth. Okay, last thing before I let you go, you tweeted a picture of you hanging out with Floyd Mayweather rocking a Louis Vuitton towel at some kind of pool party, it's a great picture he looks thrilled to be there.

The smile on his face is just gigantic. What was that all about? I don't know. He retweeted it too. Oh, I guess he was at. I think that's that's the thing. The no smiling, I don't know. But, yeah, it was fun. We were both

on the same pool party, so we ended up again together, hang out, I talked to him. He gave me some advice. What do you say? And I just talked to him about, you know, business stuff and told me how much money. He just went right into the money. He's paid with it for sure. I'm like, hey, how you doing, man?

I respect you. He's like, ah, you know, I made, so far, they gave me $125 million, but he's going to be a $0.75 million. I'm like, oh, I didn't even ask you about that. That's awesome. He's like, I own a private line of planes. I own everything. I own everything.

I'm like, oh, that's awesome, man. I didn't even ask you. But that's great to hear. I'm proud of you. I wish I had all that stuff. No, but it was cool. It was cool talking to him. He's actually a pretty down-the-earth guy.

Obviously, loves his money, and he's successful as he could possibly be as an athlete. And he kind of told me the way he got the Pachiel fight, the way he put it together. Wow. It was the whole process, the time off, the time in between game people, I did it was all part of his plan. Yeah, so we had a big conversation. He was cool. He, uh, you know, he knew all about me.

Oh, really? I was going to ask you about that. He knew who you were right off the bat. Yeah, he actually, I mean, he sent, I don't know if you know Chuck Dito. Of course. Yeah, well, he said Chuck Dito come get me to come hang out. Oh, wow. So that's the way it went down.

And then, yeah, so it was cool, man. It was a good experience. he's definitely a good guy to know yeah that's it I mean he yeah that's it well like I said it feels like you've turned the corner my friend

something has changed I don't know if it was you crying on camera you know you don't mention it that one's on the house what you think of that it seems like people actually really like that interview it's weird not gonna lie after we got done with that

I was so close to telling you is that what we could be doing it was just terrible no it wasn't even because it wasn't because of me, like, hearing up and I had again choked up and all the stuff. It was because after I choked up,

the amount of rambling I went into that made no sense. I wanted to circles, because all I could think about the whole time was really, like, I stopped me but just pride. I got out of it. So I just couldn't make sense after that. I just kind of talking and talking, I don't know, I thought it was terrible. And somehow

people loved it, so I thought you did a great job. As far as me, I thought it was terrible. No, it was fun to watch you fight the tears. like the champion that you are, and that's what, you know, made you go all over the place. But people want to see that emotion. They want to have that connection to you. They want to know about the trials and tribulations.

They want to live vicariously through you, and you open yourself up finally. And then you call everyone out in the post-fight interview. Wow. You couldn't have scripted it any better. From Wednesday all the way to Saturday night, a virtuoso performance. Congratulations on that. You are the reigning and defending champion. You're doing a great job, still undefeated.

Can't wait for the rock hold fight. I feel like that's the one that it has to be. and I think it's a fantastic fight. Two guys in their prime. Two Americans, finally for you, get to fight a non-Brazilian, presents something new. A lot of fun to watch you grow as champion.

Thank you so much for the time, Chris. I know you're very busy. They're probably going to do another day for you over there in Long Island because they have so many open slots. So I know you're busy talking to people rubbing elbows. We appreciate the time very much on this Tuesday.

Thank you, buddy. I appreciate it. Take care, guys. Thank you, everybody, for all the support. I appreciate it. Join the team. I love you all. You join the team.

You understand. It's your last invitation. I love it. Great. Thank you, Chris. All right. Go-bye. There he is.

Chris Wyman, UFC middleweight champion, stopping by. Great stuff from him, as always. All right. So, let's move along to our next guest.

It was announced Friday. Yeah, Friday, that, of course, we know that the UFC is returning to Scotland on July 18th. And when they announced this card, we all knew that one fighter in particular would have to be on this card.

Scotland's own Joanne Calderwood, who we've wanted to have on the show for quite some time. She can attest to this. I have been bothering her for quite some time about this. And finally, after a lot of you have asked for her to be on the show, she has obliged. She is joining us right now via the magic of Skype. There she is, the one and only Joanne Caldwood.

Wow, this Skype connection is fantastic. It looks like you're actually sitting here in the studio. Well done. Really? Yes. Thank you. I'm actually in my friend's house, stealing his Wi-Fi. Well, your friend deserves a lot of credit.

This is crystal clear. That's good. It's on high definition. Okay. By the way, is your hair pink over there? What's going on? Yeah, it's been pink for a while. Oh, it has, okay.

It's just the end of it. It's just the end of it. It's not all pink. I'm a little colorblind, so I notice things at the weirdest times. I like it. No problem with it. I just didn't notice it before. Okay, a lot to discuss with you, of course.

Let's kind of move backwards. You got the fight in Scotland against Beck Rawlings. You guys know each other. You're on the ultimate fighter together. Do you like this fight? Yeah, I really like it. We were scheduled to fight before in Invicta, and the fight didn't happen,

so I was ready then, and I'm even more ready now. Obviously, I spent some time after in the house, so, I mean, any of the girls in the house with me, I was like, I'd be quite willing to, as long as I wasn't sharing the house with them again, I'd be willing to share a cage with them. So, yeah, looking forward to it. How do you feel about her? You sent out a tweet, you know, apologizing in advance for perhaps some comments she may throw your way.

Do you not like her? Do you guys have a history in that sense? It's not that I don't like her. It's just I don't really, like I respect every fighter, but I just don't like the way she conducts herself. but that's her personality and that's the way she promotes herself and I didn't like the way she was in the house you know the first week I thought

actually she's maybe not as bad as I thought and then obviously I thought that about most of the girls in there but after a week I was like oh then the kind of true people came out and I was like actually I can't see myself like doing anything other than punching her in the feet face. Was there any chance that you wouldn't fight on this card considering what happened last month in

Poland? No. Like, Sean Shelby messaged me the Monday after my last fight and, you know, I was in a bad place at that time and I didn't get back to him and he was kind of like you, like, texting me every second day. And eventually I just told him, look, no matter what, I'm going to be fighting on the Scotland card. And he's like, right, cool, that's all I need to know.

And obviously I had a few weeks to sort myself out after that last fight and some personal reasons I had. And now I'm back and happy feet again and ready to go. Just about to start my camp. That is very good to hear. It was a strange thing to watch because without seeing what you wrote afterwards and all that, just watching the fight against Marina in Poland, you did not look like yourself.

You seemed off. You didn't seem like you were there. Your body was there, but you didn't actually seem there. And then, of course, the fight didn't last very long. What was bothering you? Yeah, like a lot of people, even people that didn't know me, they said that it didn't look like me. And I think I was the last person to know that.

You know, I was going into that fight. And I did have a lot of, I'm not making excuses or that, but I did have a lot of things on my mind. and but I always I'm a fighter that just kind of gets lost in a fight camp that's why I always want to fight because I feel like when I go to the gym

I don't know like any athlete you know they love training because I think well personally because I go in and I like forget about all the problems and you forget about the stuff in the world and you just get on with training so that's what I was doing

and obviously I was in Sweden and I was just concentrating on the fight and physically I felt great and then but there's like signs there that obviously when everyone's seen me walking out to the cage that the signs were there that I wasn't right but at the same time I was quite stubborn and I was like no I'm just going to do this

and no matter what like the physical I was physically ready and I had the best fight camp ever but I found out firsthand in there that there was stuff on my mind and I was in a whole lot of shit. But a lot of things happened before the fight. Obviously, you know, I wasn't at my home team.

I went away to Sweden, which it was great and I got on up with a lot of the guys over there and the training was perfect. Just the night before my fight, you know there was a situation that happened and it just put me back into it kind of was the kind of breaking point for me I think I had there was so many other things that I had just put the back in my head and I think that was just someone close to me in my fight camp that should I knew better kind of fucked me over and yeah it wasn't a good night the night before I didn't get a lot of

sleep and worrying and it was not nice and I'm thinking about it now I'm like oh god but these everyone's got their problems and you know it's just going to make me stronger so I'm just going to take it out and a lovely person in Scotland do you mind elaborating what exactly happened because it's it's a little unclear the night before what are you what are you referring to yeah just a situation that I found myself in with someone and that was in my fight camp at the time and it was just not a nice

I mean you know the night before you're any fight you know but this fight was a really big fight for me and the person that knew me they should a new first hand that I was already worried about stuff going into

this fight being not right but yeah they it just something happened and I couldn't, I didn't sleep the whole night and I was worried. And I don't really want to mention names because it's, I don't want to be that person that's putting out. I understand.

You mentioned that you weren't with your normal team. You're in Sweden. What was the reason for that switch? Because of another problem. But I was, I was engaged to my partner, my coach, my training partner, and we had had problems for a while. And six weeks before this camp,

we decided that we kind of needed time away from each other. So the opportunity was there to go to Sweden. First of all, I wanted to go to Iceland, but that kind of backfired and I had to go to Sweden. It was kind of like last-minute thing. and just got up and went and done my camp there but although the camp was really good and stuff but now being back home and things have settled down

and me and my ex-partners working together and everything's better and this is where I want to be. I want to be around my team and I've got a really, really close connection with them and I felt that especially with Stevie fighting on the last show I met my two of my teammates and Stevie

obviously the week of the fight and that's when I knew I was like really missing home and it was put me even more homesick so but for this fight I'm here yeah you're back with the team everything's good

yeah your uh you're uh you're I guess your ex is he still a part of the team is that strange for you no it's just hard because Like, we never actually fell out. We just, like, kind of grew apart.

So it's really hard because we got on so well. So, you know, when you have, I don't know, if you've had ex-girlfriends or ex-boyfriends, you know, you think, oh, she's a right bitch. I don't want to see her again. But we didn't have that. We didn't fall out. We just kind of just went our separate ways.

And we worked well together and we got on well together. And we just had to put that separation in. The timing wasn't perfect. But at the same time, it never is. Right. I've actually never had a relationship. So I don't know. I wish I knew what it was like to have.

I'm kidding. I'm married. But I know what you mean. It was just funny, you know, to lighten up the mood, I guess. You feel though that you're okay now. You feel like you're ready? Yeah, I'm ready. Okay.

Just like even after my last fight, being around people that know me and stuff and I've been more open with people that's the thing like with me I'm very secretive and I don't like people know my business and not that I don't like people know my business I don't like talking about myself and I don't like talking about my problems

I would rather be the person to help other people so after that fight I was like shit I need to start opening up and talking to people and the past after that, I was like, I got a lot off in my chest and yeah, it's good to talk. It is good to talk. Yeah, you know, I felt like I was bothering you. I was, you put out that post and it was very mysterious. You know, you gave us some clues here and there, but it just seemed like if no one knows and how would we know about your situation, it's like, what is going on here? And especially the way you looked in the fight. So I can't lie. it piqued my interest very much, and that's why I was trying to get you on the show.

So I'm very happy that you have agreed to come on. I'm wondering if you ever thought about pulling out of the fight. I mean, just the team thing alone, like having to move and let alone what happened 24 hours before, I mean, that's a lot to handle for someone before a fight, and especially a very big one. Did you think about maybe saying, you know what, let me take a break, figure this out, and then I'll fight in July? No. Wow.

Wow. I just, I don't like letting the fans down. and obviously I like fighting and that's what I was saying earlier the thing with me is I just throw myself into a fight camp thinking everything will be all right because this has happened

there's been stuff on my mind for the past maybe two or three fights now and especially I had a lot of stuff going on in the tough house as well so it's just a way for me to deal with things but now I know that I can can't deal with things like that that way.

You know, I have to, like, face them. And I do feel a lot happier with that solution. Now I finally knew, but I had to go through a loss for it, but at least it will not happen again. Did you only realize after the fight that you were dealing with all of this? Or were you able to recognize that you weren't the same person going into that fight at any point in the locker room? a minute before the fight as you were walking down.

Was there any point where you recognized that or only after the loss? No, like before it and stuff, like you always have doubts anyway, though. That's the thing that I didn't really see. I was like, God, just put it to the back of my head and said everything will be fine. You know, you're just going in there and you're doing what you do every day. And like my training had been perfect. There was no issues there. But just when I got, actually when I was warming up, I was like,

I just can't wait to get it. in there and just fight you know and i think that's not a good thing that you should be thinking and yeah so and obviously after the fight you've got nothing really you're thinking about your loss and you're thinking what can i do differently than that's when i found that that i need to sort it all these stuff and in six weeks before the fight when i went to sweden maybe i should should have been like, right, wait, I'm in a, I can't just get up and go to a different camp. I need to sort out these issues, but at the end of the day, I'm just, like, so stubborn and selfish that I wanted to do the fight, you know. And how did you digest the loss?

Like, did you go anywhere? Did you do anything? Did you, you know, just disappear from MMA? What did you do? Pretty much I can't have sat in my house for. two days cried and ate a lot of ice cream. What flavor? Cookies and cream.

My favorite flavor, wow. Really? I love anything with Oreos in it. Me too. That's unbelievable. Really? High five. High five, there it is.

My son's birthday cake a month ago, I got him an Oreo cake, not because he liked it because I liked it. Oh, that's a bit harsh. But as long as he liked it. He likes anything. He's only three. But yes, tell us more. So you were in your house just eating ice cream for two days and crying. Yeah.

And then I was like, this is terrible. I need to go up to the gym. And then I went up to the gym. And then I went to Iceland the next week. And that was good. I trained a little bit. And yeah, just kind of caught up with a lot of people and ate a lot of food. and yeah, just caught up with everyone and kind of was more open with people and had fun and thought, right, I need to have more fun because it's quite fun.

So here's the thing. We're talking now about this and you have the fight coming up, but this didn't happen all that long ago. Like usually I feel like we have, when I have a conversation like this with a fighter, it's like six months ago. This is literally a month and a half ago. You truly feel like everything's okay. the right spot mentally and physically and that you can focus and be your best on July 18th. Yeah, like, it may not feel like that long ago for you, but it feels like ages ago. Okay. I've done a lot of stuff and a lot of things have happened since then. So, yeah, it's all good and, you know, like the negative stuff that was there before I've

managed to deal with and it's not going to be part of my camp anymore. so yeah we'll soon find it anyway sure it's a beautiful thing also that wow what are the chances it's the first show in Scotland i feel like that's what what great medicine that is for you can be home you you could get the love you're such a popular fighter the fans really have this connection with you the the timing i mean coming off if you have to suffer your first loss this couldn't come at a better time right or is it too much pressure how do you feel about it uh yeah i always believe like things happen for a reason but I wouldn't

want to be like yes I've lost and I'm this is that's been the perfect outcome and all that I hated losing you know especially like the fans don't deserve to see me not at my best especially how hard I try

and how hard I train you know I put I dedicate everything to this and to lose is just heartbreaking but yeah I'm really excited for Glasgow and it'll be good to to let everyone know

to forget about my last fight and finally anything you want to say I mean like I said these fans of yours they truly love you and you have a great connection as many MMA fighters do and I know when you posted that stuff on Facebook, social media, whatever you received a lot of positive feedback

and maybe at the time it meant nothing but that stuff I think deep down does help. Anything you'd like to say to those people? You can't say it meant nothing that meant the world to me. You know, I was in a dark place at that time. And the support I get is unbelievable. And, you know, all these other girls in the category, I remember in the house,

they were saying that they get all this negative feedback and negative posts and stuff. I don't see, you maybe see like one. or two, but I have the most amazing support team out there, like the fans are amazing. And even them not knowing me personally, they knew that that wasn't me fighting. And that's kind of special that people know, can see that. And just every message, I read them all, and I try and reply to them all, but it was so much. and just really appreciate all their support, and they're amazing.

Well, I am reminded of the great saying it is always the darkest before the dawn, and I think that applies. Even with this great Skype connection, it's so bright, it looks fantastic, it is crystal clear. So I really am happy to see and hear that you are in a good spot, that you have a smile on your face, that you're able to focus on July 18th, you've turned the corner, and I really appreciate you coming on to talk about this stuff, because I know it's probably not the happiest subject and the subject that you want to see.

Yeah, I'm sorry. Yeah, I'm sorry. Like, I can't really, I just don't, there's stuff I don't want to say, and obviously, because it's just personal, and as I was saying earlier, I'm really secretive and stuff, but, I mean, things are better now, and maybe when I retire, I can tell more. All right.

for now sell my story yes absolutely for now we won't worry about that best of luck to you again thank you so much for the time I know this was a sparring night for you and you had to rearrange your schedule

so I truly truly sincerely appreciate that good luck again looking forward to the fight and I promise I will not bother you between now and the fight yeah I've got to get a restraining order against you

oh come on now that's a lie I only ask you like twice you and Shelby now do not do not ever put me in the same category as Sean Shelby. That is a real problem. Thank you so much, Joanne. I really appreciate you to your friend as well for the Wi-Fi connection and good luck in training. Thank you. Have a good day. You too. There she is. Joanne Calderwood, stopping by from Scotland. Great stuff from her. As always, great to have her on the show. It was really good to hear from her

once again. Okay, let's move along. As I mentioned at the top of the show, we were hoping in July that we'd see a great fight between Benson Henderson and Michael Johnson. Unfortunately, when they announced that they were moving the tough finale from Florida to Las Vegas, that fight just kind of disappeared. No real reason given. So we had to find out why. I wanted to have our good friend Benson Henderson on the show. It has been a while. Benson, how are you? Hey, I'm good, Ariel. How are you doing, buddy? I'm doing great. Thank you so much for joining us. So this is the question a lot of people have been asking me since they came out with that news. why aren't you fighting Michael Johnson in July?

I had an injury. I won't be cleared for a little while, so I had to respectfully bow out of that one. I was kind of disappointed in myself, but you got to do the doc's sake because ultimately they have the piece of paper they got to sign off, you'll sign off for you, and my doc wouldn't do that.

So I'm not cleared, but I'll be ready for, I'm hoping they'll put me on the, card in Korea. I think I said in November sometimes, so I'm definitely willing to wait to be on that card. So what exactly happened? Ah, you're training, man. It's a rough sport. It's, uh,

you know, we get punched and kick and choked and your buddies train every day. They know your, your weak spots, and you know what you're good at, what you're not good at. So it was just training. It wasn't even a hard sparring session. It was a nice, easy, you know, training sessions, sparring session.

and, you know, you get injured. The nature of the beach, I suppose. And you said you're still not cleared, right? Yeah, actually, still not cleared. Oh, wow. So when did you suffer the injury? A while ago. I had it, and I kept getting Joe Riggs and Brad Scott,

is ready for their fights, and so they need training partners for sparring. So I kept, you know, partying with those guys for two weekends afterwards, and it definitely didn't help the situation at all. But, you know, you got to be that for your boys. Sure. They're there for you.

They go out of their way to help you out. So you got returned to the area. That's what our gym's all about. So it didn't help the situation at all. Are you able now to discuss what exactly happened? I probably won't ever say exactly what it is, you know. I will say it was by far, by far the, like, it was some of the, like, it was some of the,

those injuries, you're hurt, you know, like you are injured, but the rest of your body feels perfectly fine. So it is, in that sense, it was like the hardest thing I ever had to deal with. Like, I felt just fine. I wanted to go do, you know, whatever, but not being allowed to, even though the rest of your body feels just fine. But that kind of sucked. I was kind of sad about that, but yeah, I probably would ever actually fully disclose what it is, maybe like later on sometime, but, you know, whatever. Wow. That, uh, that makes me really wonder because you don't know.

I mean, usually when you get an injury, your body hurts and, and even if it's in one spot of the body, it's still going to, it's just the way you describe it is very mysterious. You get what I'm saying? No, I'm not having mysterious or anything. I just, uh, I guess that's right, though. You're right. It's like if your elbow hurts. No, I had, I had her elbow before.

There's not a body felt fine. when I shot box when I did, you know, practice, I would just keep my hand up my chin and not use my right arm at all, not use my right elbow at all, but I would do the rest of practice. Oh yeah, kind of sort of, I just kind of just trying to get it

out of you. Oh, I know, I know. Is this a fight that you wanted? Did you like this fight? Because you were coming off the 170-pound, you know, that fight of the year, performance of a lifetime, all that stuff against Brandon Thatch, and then you're going back to 155,

so you couldn't really build off of that. How did you feel about the fight? I felt the fight was a great matchup. At 55, I really don't care who it is. I'll fight anybody tomorrow. Like, I can't make weight class, but at 55, you know, like two us 55-fathers, I'll fight anybody, like, whenever.

I'm very confident at 155. I'll beat D'Otano, give me a rematch against him, you know? Anthony Pettis, I'll take him out, too. You know, it doesn't matter at 55, about as confident as you can possibly be in an weight class. So I don't know the matchup against Johnson was good, you know, definitely on the upper encumber. Remind me of a bit of like a Rousseau McAvolov, like a lot of hype, you know, on a good little wind streak and that sort of stuff. So it would have been a good fight, you know, it would have been entertaining for the fans.

Johnson brings a good pace. He's a South Falls. He would have had two South Falls going at it. You know, he changed at a tough gym, tough camp. I think it would have been a fun affair But at 70 That's gonna be a little more like I have to be a little more selective

Like oh well I can't take I can't fight this guy On two weeks ago I can't fight this guy You know Just whatever like I'm like okay Give me a full like you know Five weeks six weeks prepare for

Maybe for this guy Because he's kind of big kind of strong So So you know This show is live People can watch it Listen to it You know right now right

And as a result of that, people are telling me about an interview that Michael Johnson just did on MMA junkie radio discussing you and also discussing, I guess he knows your injury, but I don't want to put you on the spot here. So if you're uncomfortable talking about it, I won't ask about it. But apparently on the radio, as people are tweeting me right now, he was talking about you and the reason you had to pull out of the fight. Are you uncomfortable with me asking you about it? Would you rather me get off the topic? I'm fine.

whatever you want, Ariel. I'll dance around a little bit more. Y'all, I'll have been elusive in my answers to you if it broaches the subject too closely. But I would imagine they wouldn't tell Michael Johnson the reason. I'm not sure if they did or they didn't. I don't know. So he might know. I'm not sure if he knows or not.

Well, yeah, I mean, it's a weird thing to play out over a live interview, but on MMA junkie radio, just like 10 minutes ago, I'm being told via Twitter, he said that you suffered an eye injury. Is that accurate? It was in that area. It was in that area. Okay. Fair enough.

I'll take a hint. Yeah. I imagine that they told him pretty close to what the situation was, you know? Does that bother you? Maybe. I can't be mad at him now. He's a grown-ass man. He can make his own decision.

Maybe he didn't know that I wasn't disclosing it or something like that. It's fine. He's a grown man. He can make you know, my team and person, we'll talk it up. Well, you know, it'll be just fine. I ain't mad at him, no. When do you expect to be cleared? Oh.

I hope to be cleared by November 28th. Oh. Whenever the, whenever the, whatever the dock, you know, take a look at me and gives me the green light. But the time table is one of the most weird ones. There's no, like, that time table exactly. he was being as elusive as I have been with you. He was elusive as well as giving me a set time kid on when I'll be good to go and this and that and blah, blah, blah.

And, you know, most doctors, you know, guys cover their butts for insurance reasons. They can't over promise you something. And then, you know, they don't deliver because they overpromise you. And then they, you know, get exactly what you were. What he told you initially, but that was a very optimistic guess. So I think he's being very pessimistic. I could be in my life in general in my career and everything. I could be as optimistic as possible.

So I'm looking at the best case scenario. I think he's looking at the worst case scenario. So I guess a doctor always has to be careful and not so much pessimistic, but I get what you're saying. He just doesn't want to give you false hope. Yeah. So let me ask you this. Was this potentially career-threatening at all?

I mean, because of how up in the air, it seems like, I mean, usually you get a knee injury years like six to eight weeks, you're good arm injury, you know. I mean, because of this unknown nature, was it? at all career-threatening? I never once considered it. Me personally, I never once considered it career-threatening. It doesn't matter what it is I got to do or how much prayer it takes. You know, I'm a very optimistic individual, so I never once approached it or thought about it as a

current engineering injury. Okay. You know, if I ever have a secret, I'm coming to you, my friend. Thanks. You are a vault. That is good stuff. And you are 100% confident, Korea. you'll be ready for that, right?

Absolutely. I'll do whatever it is. I physically possibly can do, but yes, I will be ready for that career card. And you're going to see a whole new beat. We decided we're flip-flopping back and forth, the idea, 55 or 70. And DeSano's being the belt holder now, like, you know, maybe getting another two or three wins, you're going to get another shot of him because my loss against him was, you know, it is what it is.

He beat me. You got his hand-raised. but it was, you know, not a technical decision the way it ended. So, you know, we think about getting one or two more, you know, exciting Ws under my belt and then getting a title trial against him. I would love to get my hands on him again. But, you know, I think we decided my coach and I, Don Crouch, to go up to 70 and, you know,

or to take this time off to rebuild my body. It's going to be a whole new unveiling for 170. I'm trying to walk around at 82 to 80, 85, you know, walk around maybe like 6, 5% body fat and just, you know, be explosive, just, you know, really opens my eyes up. I'm going to make a fight at 170. Wow. And anyone in particular, you have in mind? I hope it was a little bit harder to get fights at 55, you know, like not all the guys

want to find me for too long or so. And a few guys actually called me out Roostom and Michael Johnson. You know, there was like only two guys in the last, like, three years who, you know, actually said they wanted to fight me. But it seems that 70s, I don't have a whole lot of takers either. I'm down to find anybody.

I asked Aaron Woodley over Twitter, social media, and I said, as long as you don't hope smash me, you know, if you get it on, you know, do it.

But, you know, everyone's trying to get a higher-up fight. At 170, I'm a small fish, I suppose, you know, like I'm not in any serious contention at 1170.

So you don't have a whole lot of guys who want to fight you because there's no real big, reward for winning and there's a lot to lose if you do lose against me. But 70, I don't think all that's what I got going to find me. Anyway, that's what I was told by some of the guys in the UFC who worked there. You know, that's what I was told by them. But we'll see if they can, you know, find somebody to match me up, you know, I'll take whoever, you know,

whoever the number two guy, number one guy, number three guy, number four guy, whoever it is. You know, that's enough time I can be prepared, I can be ready for him. It's funny because I have mixed emotions about this. on the one hand, I feel like, yeah, let's build off of what we did against Brandon Thatch. It's a new chapter in your career. It was inspiring all that good stuff. On the other hand, now that Pettus isn't the champion and your fight against Dosangos was controversial, I feel like you have a nice little path right there to the belt. Of course, if he keeps it, you know, after a fight against Seroni and who knows when Habib comes back. You really think,

though, that 170 right now is best for you, though? cutting weight really sucks i like eating i'm a facet i'm a facet of heart you know like i'm a real facie-to-heart so that always sucks i mean doing it for such a long time but like you're right though you know at 1.55 if you think about it like to be able to hurt right uh um her to knee again or something like that yeah a cowboy just picked up another not easy win but you picked up another you know good solid win uh everyone knew he was the win going into the fight so you know like and then i have my I have my loss to the cowboy,

you know, nothing but love Donald. You know, he beat me in our last affair. We all know how that played out. So I don't know. You know, like,

what do you do? What do I do? Where to go? But if 55, if they want to make the match in Korea at 55, I could be talking to that if it's the right matchup. You know, a top contender like Khabib or Cowboy or somebody like that,

doing that in Korea, I'd be down for that. you know, when he gets a towel shot. It's just all up in the air, man. I don't know. That's why I don't like playing this game. I don't like playing the what it's game. I hate doing it.

I really, really do hate doing it. I just like being told, hey, you're probably in this guy. I say yes, and I go get ready. Or you're probably even that guy. I say yes, and I go get ready. It doesn't matter to me. But playing the what it's game, man. It can drive you crazy.

That's why I try not to do it. You know, when you fought RDA last August, no one really thought, I mean, going into the fight, I think a lot of people were kind of looking past him and didn't really think that he'd be a threat at 155 pounds. Now here he is, his champion,

he dismantled. I mean, that was a dominating performance against Anthony Pettus. What were you thinking when you watched the Pettus fight? Were you as shocked

as everyone else? That was a good word, dismantled. That's a good word choice about you. It was surprising. You know, I thought,

I didn't know who's going to win. I stopped thinking fights that who's going to win. I just hope let the best man get his hand raised. You know, let the judges not screw it up, let no one get a freak injury,

let nothing, you know, weird happen, but let's, let two guys go in there and let him lay it all in the line, and who's ever the better man that night, let him get his hand-rays. So that's what I was looking for for the Pettis in the D'Sanos fight. And then, yeah, like you said, D'Otanos dismantled Pettis, like he said, you know.

I was a little bit surprised. I'd say that. I will say, though, against D'Othanos, my coach, John Crouch, thought that was a pretty good match-up for us. And I thought so, too. I think I can get my hand-rays against anybody. But I did think going into the D'Ossanos fight when they first announced that he would be a tougher fight for me than Khabib.

I thought Kibb was just a wrestler, you know, like, I can wrestle all day long, no problem. You know, as hard as you want to go. I place myself against anybody wrestling-wise, you know. But we had a chance to, you know, lean in which way, DeSanos or Khabi or against Kib, you have to wait a little while because of knee injuries. Like, sure, you know, you want to give it to Sassanos? We don't want to wait for Kib or whatever. so sure, let's do it, no problem.

But I did think that the beat would be a little bit of an easier fight against Stano's. I bet Osama would be a tough fight for me. And he ended up getting a good quick stoppage from John, what's the name, the referee. McCarthy. John McCarthy, yeah. He had a good quick stoppage from him, so, you know, ends up being a tough fight for me, like I thought. But, you know, it is what it is. Who do you think wins?

RDA or Serooney in their rematch, we expect that to be the next title fight. Uh, do they announce that? Is that official? No, no, it's not. I just, I mean, he's won eight in a row. There doesn't appear to be anyone else, so I'm just, I'm just guessing if they did make that. I want to put an asterisk by the eight in a row, though. Okay. I don't put an aster by the eight in a row. Fair enough.

No, no, I'm joking. I'm joking because I think my longest winter in the UFC was seven, I think, something like that. I'm around there anyways. And Galvoy, it's like a beat me, you know, on the winter you can doofs. I was like, oh, you sucker, like, you shouldn't be there, you know it, but, you know, just messing around with him. But I think Cowboy and Dolanos, DeLanos won that first fight, right? He cracked him pretty good. Yeah. I think Cowboy has reached a point where he's doing a better job coming out stronger early in the first round.

Against DeLanos, that was when he was starting pretty slow. He wasn't really getting into his groove and Joel the second round after he's been hit a few times and he's into it. Then he starts getting in his groove. Then he's a dangerous, dangerous man. I think he's addressed that problem. I think he's addressed that he's a lot better at coming out quicker, stronger in the first round. I think because of that, I think it'll be a lot of cover fight between the two. And again, I'd say, you know, let them go at it, let them put the belt on the line

and who have the best man in, let him get their hand raised, you know? And again, if Saroni wins, I mean, who wouldn't want to see that fight again between you? So, I don't know. I'm conflicted now. you asked me in February, I said, stay away from 155. It's a new venture at 170 now. I don't know. I guess you have options.

That's a good thing. And who knows? You know? Cowboy, again, this is the what-it-game. I hate playing a what-ish game. But if Cowboy does face off against Elthano, say Cowboy does win, I think he could be however long he's out for if he wants to wait until November, and if he's fully healthy and he's going in November, I'll take him in November.

And then after I beat him, you know, the, the, you know, the, you know, the, you know, the, Cowboy mood number four for the towel shot I'll be down for that but that's a very that's a very

far-reaching you know guess of what's going to happen so I'm down for whatever you know yeah number four wow that would be

somewhat unprecedented all right last chance before you go you want to you want to share the injury or no it was it was hard to deal with man it was a true test

of my you know I I lean on on God a lot for that one. Wow. I'm not going to lie about that. I definitely had to lean on him to stay positive, to stay in the right mind frame,

not just going McDonald's for the sweet tea and a big Mac and then head over the Burger King for the Whopper and then for their sitting in bites and they got ahead of it to Dairy Queen for the dessert and just not to be too sad about it, man. I really had to lean on him. It was good, though, you know? Like you need to go through trials and tribulations.

sharpest knife in the world a real sharp knife if it is constantly being used just to use butter just to use some butter it's going to get dull after a while you need to have a sharpener you need to put that knife against the sharpener

to grind it up to make it tough to keep it sharp so the same thing I think for myself for everybody we need those trials and tribulations we need those hard times to make us a stronger better person and that was definitely a hard time for myself

but I was able to rely on him. But you're feeling better. You're turning the corner? Yeah. I'd say, again, I'd like to be mixed about it. I'd say I'm pretty close to there. I have another appointment scheduled next week, so we'll find out next week exactly what he thinks

or how close I am and that sort of stuff. What kind of doctor is it that you're meeting with? I'm good. What kind of doctor is it that you're meeting with? I don't know. He has like six letters behind his name. I'm not sure what he is. He has like a B-M-A-F-J-K or something like that behind his last name.

I'm not sure he's like what kind of doctor. That's a good question. You are good. I don't think I've ever done an interview where I have more questions after the interview than I did going into the interview. No, you're pretty good, man. You're pretty good. We know that.

But you have said enough. I respect your privacy. I respect that you don't want to, you know, lay all your cards out on the table. Most importantly, I hope that you make a speedy recovery. I hope you feel well sooner rather than, later. I respect the fact that you want to fight in Korea. I know how much that means to you, but hopefully you'll get cleared sooner rather than later. Thanks for coming on the show, Benson. Always a pleasure. And when you do get cleared and you're 100%, I'd love to have you back on

to talk about this thing that you overcame, whatever this injury is, this mysterious injury. Sounds good, man. I appreciate the kind of words, there you. Thank you, Benson. There he is. Benson. Wish him the best. Hope he recover soon. A mysterious injury, I guess, in the vicinity. of his eye, he said. That fight is not happening and it seems like it was pretty serious and pretty taxing. Hopefully he gets better sooner rather than later and is

able to realize that dream of fighting in Korea later on this year. We appreciate his time very much. All right, let's move along now. Let's welcome in another guest who calls lightweight division his home. Fans love when he's on the show. We love when he's on the show. We've also

tried to get him on the show for quite some time. He meets Ally Quinta, July 15th, San Diego on Fox Sports One. He is King Bobby Green. Whoa. And he's brought backup. Where is he? Oh, there he is.

What he do? What he do? There he is. Let's get to take first. It's Bobby King Green. Okay, my man. Bobby Green. Like, that's some cocky stuff.

Like, I'm not trying to be anybody's king or anything like that. I'm just like a Martin Luther King. I'm here to do this walk of truth. I'm the truth, and that's all we're doing. So I brought my whole squad. And we all here to let you know just in case you get foul. I got my whole squad We'll run over there

We'll come all the way to New York That you and Al-Aquinta at the same time Whoa, all right And I'm a little intimidated now I can't even see you I see all these guys You know giving me the mean mug And I wasn't expecting it

So it's a five on one here That's how you do, huh? You jump me five on one We don't play around here You know what I'm saying They don't get a fair face From where I'm from We don't get fair face

We don't even get the fight We don't even fight We don't even fight guys We don't even trip but I don't even need them I'll get it on myself You know how to go But let's get back to business

So let's get to business What is business is Yes Aliquita Yes Or how do I say that guy's name Al Ayahuinta Aiquinta

Quinta Okay Yes So this is an issue What I felt What my last fight Is that These guys

Tend to Just want to Win You know And I did not realize that In my last fight I come

to fight. I do this for all the guys that come here to fight. I don't know about those guys, if they're dancers, or if they're runners, I'm not in the chasing business. I didn't get in that. I came to fight, you know, so you make sure you tell Al if he wants to go here with me that he comes to fight. Don't get out here and waste my people's fan, especially because we're going to be in my backyard, in my backyard, where I run, CA,

Scali, all day, A1, all day. Okay, are you referring to his fight against Mazurana? We will get you out of here. So come out to fight. Do not waste our time. We don't play that.

We come out here and we throw them things. We come out here and we throw shells. So no, none of that running stuff. Don't come out here and do what nobody wants to see. Everybody came to see a fight. So I want to make sure we're clear about that. Sure. I'll come to fight.

Every time, watch everyone in my fight, Ariel. Who stands in the center and cage? And who's on the outside? All these guys that I'm supposed to be the little guy. And I'm running. And I'm the, who's the barbosos supposed to be the demystifier striker? And I got this guy running like a marathon. I didn't know we were track stars.

I didn't know this was track. I thought this was the art of fighting. I'm not coming to chase, guys. If you don't want to fight, then get out of here. Get out. Because we ain't have time for that. We got real fighters like these guys that get out. You know, we come here to fight.

By the way, tell us who we have here. We didn't introduce them. I feel very rude that I didn't do that. So tell us who we got out here. Right here, we got my duo right here from New Jersey, D.C., the wolf. What's up, baby? Hello. Mr. Daryng.

What? Then we got over here on the left, my dude Jamal, aka Pretty Boy. What's up, pretty boy? We got the hottest dude in Cali, RJ in the back. RJ, respect. And we got the ringleader, my head coach and dad, Jake Benny. J.B., hello? Pleasure.

You still got them Them little magnet Magnet What are they They're like What are they call right here The cup links Yeah cufflings

Oh yeah You know You know Of course I do I do I do But you know I can't go

I can't go to a fight Yeah okay You want to bet I'll bring them on the show Next week Okay I'll show them to the world We'll be watching

We'll see if you're a man of your word Don't call me a liar Bobby Well, because this is the problem, Arrow. Listen, you mentioned something before you got me on. You said this. You said, he has not been in an interview or been mad at you or you know exactly what I'm talking about. You know exactly what I'm talking about. We had some words.

Oh, yes. And I felt some type of way. And I haven't done no interview since, really, because why? Because the media and the way you guys play are stuck. I want you to understand this. We're the leaders and you are the follower. You are the follower. Every time we do something, you bust a net.

You get happy and you get excited because why? That's the headline for you. So make sure that we're clear. Secondly, we're cool, right? So trust and know that I understand that the game. I understand it's your job to create these things to have ratings for your show, the MMA hour. We are on the MMA hour.

Trust me, I know where we are. So when I give you something hot, like when I say, what I share a story with you about how Dona Taroni's treated me, this kid who I've done nothing to nobody, and I'm just a happy-go-lucky kid the first time in the UFC, and this guy comes to shit to my dream, and not only gets on me one day, but two days in a row just of like what I like to call bullying. Okay, well, we stand up against bullying, and we don't stand for that. So now this is my retaliation, and I just spoke a story, and I shared it with you on your story. I know it's hot.

I know it's this big thing, but I didn't need you to go in there and put it in headlines. Body throws racist allegations. Come on now, bro. Are you trying to kill me? This is my life. And I want you guys to understand. I'm not just talking to you because you told me that it was not just you, that it was one of your guys. So it's your editor or it's your producer or your writer, whoever it is, they need to get their ass handed to them.

So let them know I'm mad. Let them know that I'm on the head. Can I clear something up? What? I believe what I'm. And by the way, I miss. you. It's great to see you again. This is great. I'm back. I'm back. I'm back. I haven't been able to watch since my last little fight.

I know. I want to get to that. I want to get to that. But first, let's clear this up. You came on the show. I believe it was in August. You talked about this story. People listened to it. People reacted to it. And I never, for the record, I never threw anyone under the bus. I said how it works. You know, on this website, people listen to the show. We have a writer, an interview and a writer will then write a recap of said interviews. So I said that that was the headline and I stand by because you did call him a racist, right? You may not like it. No, no, no, no, C, C. Let's go back there. Okay. You find it. I said he said racist shit, bro. Isn't that a racist? No, that's not. That's like, so if you say some dumb shit, I'm going to say

right now, you are saying some dumb shit. Then I'm done. You just got out of your mouth right now and you just say it's a dumb shit. Then I'm done. Because why? Because that does not mean, that makes you not, that doesn't make you dumb forever. That doesn't make you a retard. That makes that you just said something dumb, that you just stuck your foot in your mouth, which you did. So, therefore, that's something might make you permanently dumb. Just so if I said something like, hey, you, hey, you white boy, you said something racist at that time, but that does not mean that I'm a racist. I got white friends. Here's my dad right here, who's white. So don't try to make it seem that I'm racist. But I said some racist stuff, even though I do have family members who are

of the other race. So don't try to make it seem that way. So put your foot out of your mouth again and speak. Okay, well, I don't think anyone was, you know, trying to hate on you or reprimand you. I think they were just kind of recapping what you said. I don't think anyone was trying to get you in trouble or call you out. You know what I mean? That's not the way I took it. The interview was heated.

It was already intense. Trust me, it was already hot. So that's what I'm saying. But you have the power, again, to choose what you chose to put out there. You could have said Bobby Green goes on the rant and that had been fine. Body Green goes crazy. You could put the... Oh, yeah, right.

You would have hated that. Purple suicide. You didn't find them. But you have to go, Black Green goes racist, Alleyation. Why? Because that would get me just like,

oh, I've been on a pitch for a sense, bro. And I said, thanks to you. No. Thanks, buddy. Thanks, friend. No. How are you?

Thanks, and I appreciate that. This is my life. I know this is your job, and that's cool, and you just enjoy what you do. You're great at what you do, Ariel. You pick guys,

and you pick these questions, and you pick and pride and you get what you get for your ratings. This is the MMA hour. This is the show to do it on. Trust me, I know where I'm mad. Don't think you got me fooled.

You've been fooled because I brought you here to bust your butt. Because you are the guy at the end of the day that are in and up looking like the jet because you end up taking our lives and opening them up. And you don't even realize what you do at the end of the day. You don't realize that there's people that actually take offense to what these things and how you put these things. Even though we are responsible for what we put out, don't get me wrong. We are responsible for what we say.

I'm happy you said that. If I, for instance, if someone came and it said their side of story, and then you turn the story and changed this just that much to say that they're now these different allegations versus me just saying an experience. Oh, yeah, it's just an experience. But it's just all in our words. Our words can kill. Our words can kill in the simplest, slightest ways.

So I'm saying, is you got these fighters lies in your jeopardy in your hands. be careful of what you put out there bro because you know what low key i wanted to come all the way down to new york i wanted you to see the white my eyes when i said it so that you know that's the truth you know it's like it's nothing bro i'm gonna come down there into your into your little boop and said this you know but be honest with you i'm afraid of heights you know so i hate you fly so i'm only flying when i got a fight you know i'm only fly when i got to fight well you always have a home here i will correct you on a few things i take that power and that responsibility very serious you may not think so. And by the way, you don't think this is my life. You don't think this is

what I live and breathe? This is how I provide for my kids and my family. You think this is a game for me? You think this is a fun little thing? So you coming on my show and feeling down about an interview that I conducted bothers me and you can let the world know that I texted you after and said that if you felt like I put you in a rough spot, I apologize for that, even though I really didn't have to apologize. You know, I didn't know about that story. You came out and told us that story. So the way people interpreted, at the end of the day, look, I don't think anyone was calling you a racist. And no one was saying anything bad about you. You were sharing a story that made you feel bad.

I'm shocked that you're still fired up about it, but I'm happy we're having this conversation now because it's good to clear the air. I haven't really do interviews since. I have the interview. Why people think that I get this for some type of some type of ploy or something to get publicity. You know? And I'm just explaining to them that I'm real. And this is the real life of these fighters that it's territorial. It's not just peaches and cream.

And we're all just sitting here having fun. It fits everywhere you go. And so I just shared a small story with you to let you know how real this is really is. And you turn into something evil, you know? I didn't do anything. I'm just saying like so I just feel like you use these things to feed your family. I understand you need to feed your family. Do what you need to do.

But that's why I brought you the story. Two feet your family. Trust me. I want you to eat. I want you to eat just like me. I brought it for you. But you think my intentions are bad. Why do you think?

What do you think the gift and you're going to go paraded around and say, ah, ha, look what I got. I did not do that. No, you got the gift. I didn't tweet about it after. We don't have a May out right now. More? We don't know what's up. Brett Butler's in the building.

What's good, man. Your favorite journalist, favorite journalist, favorite journalist, Red Bullers in the building. Salute you, baby. That's my dude. I'm always here, baby. How many more do you go in there? Why do you, girls go?

Here's the thing. I got a question for you. Yes. What's your feeling on the Donald Seroni-Bobby Green fight? The fight that never was? Do you think that's a fight for the family? How's that possible? Don't you wrong.

I love my company, but how's it possible that where you take a guy off a car where there's no reason for us to be taken off? Like, he's agreed and I've agreed, or the fight is already going on and then somehow I just disappear, you know? So I love my company, but at the same time, I felt like that was already a done deal, and now it just sucks to it. He got away. But at the end, the truth shall prevail, and I guarantee you I'm going to see him. I guarantee you the truth shall prevail.

I will see him. My talent will show. I will see him sooner or later. You can run, you can hide, but I will get you. I look forward to that. What's your opinion on the fight? You know, here's the thing. I don't think that I'm in the position to defend Donald Seroni.

or speak on his behalf. But I will say this. I have a lot of respect for him because what we learned this past weekend, this is a guy who had seriously injured ribs, and his whole team asked him to pull out of that fight against John McDessi.

After Habibna Maghamedov pulled out, he had the out to pull out, and he said, no way, I agreed to fight, I'm fighting. And I really believe that he's one of those guys who lives up to the moniker case. I'm about to cut you off

with all the suck him up right now. You know what? That's great. So this is the thing. This is the thing. I love the guy in terms of who he is inside the cage. Sure. The fighter, he is, hey, I salute you.

You go out there and fight. That's why I wanted to fight him as guys that come out to fight. He didn't come out here to waste nobody's time. So I give that to him. He is a fighter in that terms. But as in terms of a man to a man, you're a liar. You sit here in a lie in public and tell me something to happen. But I don't even want to get into that.

Let's get back to what I'm saying. We know it's hilarious, Ariel. Yes. Is that John? What's John's the last name that for? Oh, McDessie. John was there that day of the whole situation. Oh, really?

He was there. He was one of the signers. Yes. And Isaac Valley Flag was there. And what's his name? I can't believe we're going over. Why are we going over this again? Isn't this old news?

Aren't even in the industry or they're on their way out of the industry. They're all, why the truth is happening. God does what he does. Like, you guys had your time to speak up and speak the truth, and none of those guys want to open their mouth. You know what happens? They're getting kicked up. because their talent is not that well and it's not getting the truth comes and I'm sorry this is what happens you didn't say nothing so they're getting their self shootout karma it's karma it just happens I'm not saying it happened but all of a sudden these guys careers are not blowing up they're not having things not having any success but I believe they wanted to book that Eddie Alvarez fight for him but it was looking like strike force was taking excuse me Bellator was taking too long to release him then when he became available that's when they changed things but I don't

believe and you know he can... Whatever I got to prove it, after I'm done with Kinta, I'll fight Eddie Albrez to get to him or whatever way you want me to do it. I'll fight Pettis to get to get to him. I'll say whatever way I got to get to him. Well, let me ask you this. How are you feeling? You posted a picture and we're going to show right now of your quad. Pretty gruesome picture that you showed. You had a really serious injury. What happened

there and how are you feeling now? War. You know, I came out to fight. I don't come, I'll come to go out on my shield, bro. If you're going to beat me, send me out of my shield, you know. I'd rather lose that way in an honorable way than to go to decisions, you know? And I went out there trying to, as soon as you're going to stand, Suburabosa, supposed to be known as the most feared striker in our division at this point in time. So what I was to do is to show that I am not scared and I'm no girl.

I beat every man where he's best at. If you think you're a better strike, give me, show me. show me. And so what I did was I put my hands down to get this guy to fight because he's running so much. I put my hands down to provoke him. And I showed that I can walk to you with my hands down and prove that I can still hang out with you. And you're the best striker in our division. I'm disrespecting you. My hands are down. I thought I have to fight hands down. So it happened to cost me in the second round I got caught with this spitting back kick, which I actually blocked. But it actually comes around and knocks me down still. but I'm not even rocked or I jump back up and I'm like, hey, finish your fight. Like, normally that's the way it works is when you knock a guy down or you rock him.

The guy's the rest of in and finishes him. But for some reason, he's not doing that with me. I'm back to chasing him. What's the fight? And it's funny, it's like these judges, I took Barbosa down in the first 10, 20 seconds of the fight. I showed that my wrestling is better than you were. I took him down and then I let him up. Get up.

I'm here to fight. I'm not here to wrestle or to, I just showed you I'm better there. I didn't get a take down. So I felt that the takedown for the first round, and the strike was pretty even, that I run. I won first round. Second round, he gets to knock down. Third round, I chase him around.

I cut his eye, and I'm chasing him out all the round around the ring. I went third round. I felt like it was a close fight, no doubt about it, but I won it by a close fight. But it was one of the most terrible performance. He says, why? You're throwing these guys who don't come to fight. They come to score points and to try to get...

He was trying to survive. He was just trying to get by. Why? Some guys got to come here to fight. So you're on a fight. You were referring to, I think you were referring to Al's fight against Masvedal, right, when you were saying don't run, right? No, I'm referring to Barbosa. No, no, no, but at the beginning, what I want to know is, are you worried that Al is going to do the same thing? Yes, yes, yes.

These guys all, hey, these guys all think they're going to get in there and do what they're going to do. And once they start realizing what I'm doing in there and what the games and what I brought into her, they go, holy moly, I'm out of here. I'm going to go and take a step back, you know. Look at Josh. Josh ran, Josh Thompson ran, Barbosa ran. It's these constant guys where I'm chasing these guys around. I'm like, I'm not hearing us these marathons, you know?

What the heck? Did you come? Did you make me wait three, four months to do this? We came to do this. Are you healthy? No. They're paying that hard for money. That maybe somebody has me sick,

that they're going to pay that much money to watch two guys have a sparring dancing session. You're like, I don't know what the heck happened, but to pay that that type of money is ridiculous. I'm going to give these people their hard-durn money. They came to see a fight. Here I come. I promise you, I'm not going to it.

I'm staying in the middle of the cage. Here's my words. I'm standing in the middle of the cage and I'm not going nowhere. You move me if you can. Move me if you can. So when that fight starts on July 15th, you're going to walk to the center.

I will stand in the center to cage, and I'm not moving to Alecinta. Come on. Fight if you can. I came to fight. Does he do anything that? I promise you that. I promise you won't be chasing me.

Does he do anything? I promise you won't be chasing me. I promise you he won't be pushing a fight on me. I promise. He hasn't pushed the fight on Mazel. That's what got him to win, even though he didn't win against Maselov. He didn't not win.

Maslow is a better fighter. But I promise you he won't do that to me. I'm going to be pushing that fight. I don't get tired. I don't get tired. Does he do anything that concerns you? No. No.

Nothing. But run, but run. Run. That's what they're concerned me. These guys are not here to fight. What are we? Are we dancers? Are we crossfit guys? Are we track stars? You know, are we break dancers? You know? I thought we were called fighters, but I understand that this is not rock'em, sock them robots

where guys are going to stand up, beat each other up. But there is some type of technique to movement, you know? There's a movement to set up something. There's a movement to something. And then there's just guys are just moving from left to right to left to right to just left to right until the time ends. He's on working on the clock. What is this? What is your intention of fighting?

What are you here for? These fans pay to see a show. That's not a show. So don't give me these guys that don't come to fight. So if you come to fight, come fight me, come call me. And I come find you. All you guys are just called my name, Tony Ferguson. Anybody call my name?

I heard you. Anybody call my name. I'm listening. Here I come. Call my name. Let me ask you this. Let me ask you this. What has the last six months been like for you?

Because you haven't been able to fight. It's been crazy. It's been a tornado. Why? Nothing been the same since my brother being killed. Ain't nothing been the same. But all I can do is do the best I can. God is my leader and my guide here and God in my pathway.

And I'm doing the best I can. That's all I can do. Okay. So you feel like you're in a good spot? Doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. I'm ready to go. I'm ready to fight. Are you healthy? That's all you need to know is I'm ready to fight. Hold on. Let me ask this question because you ask the good question. Okay.

Is he an good spot? Yes. Do you think Pinnacle's a good spot for him to be at? I think it's a perfect spot for me. Do you think Pinnacle is a good spot for him to be at? Of course. That's why I moved down here. How about you? It's an excellent spot. How about you? Where are you from again? I'm from Jersey.

You come all the way from New Jersey to be here. Why is this a good spot? Do you know who this is? Well, his face is Yes, go ahead This is how you feed your family, right? Yes Who's this man right here? You know, he actually looks familiar, but I can't

Why don't you tell me? This is Darien Codwell. Oh, of course, of course. D.C. Okay, is there a better wrestler? Is there a better wrestler? No. Yeah.

No. Hell no. Okay, you think Al, you think Al's going to bring anything to the table with this boy can't right here? Well, I don't know. I mean, that remains to be seen. What's your prediction I'm a fight?

Hot seat. What's your prediction I'm going to fight? You know, I don't like to make predictions because then people get very offended. You know, people take these things to heart. They get very sensitive. Yeah, because, be honest, because you're in the world. And I'm sure you got to understand me. I keep trying to tell you, this is not somebody's just, this is not just a business. This is life, bro. People will take what you say. Seriously, you got to watch what you say or what you do. You don't think I take that seriously. I just told you I take it.

gang, it's almost like a territory thing. So when you say certain things, I'm going to invite you. What do I say? Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, get a twist in my man. Don't get a twist in, don't get a twist in, don't paint us all with the same brush. Don't do what you don't want people to do to you. I didn't say anything to you.

I didn't do any. I just gave you the form. I'm the one who tries to get you on my show to talk. So don't get a twist to my man. Understandable. I think you guys are best when you're, you're face-to-face. No, I love this. You guys have been fantastic.

We have been great, you know. The thing is I did not expect that when I gave you the goal. I don't do interviews. And the only reason I did interview because why I liked you? And I'm saying, why past tense? Why past tense? No, it's only because you actually try to be cool with me and you try to be a homie. I really don't give too about any of this.

Like, low-key, I don't have to do interviews and none of that stuff, bro. This don't make my day. You actually take it on my time. I was actually punching on something when you took me out of it. So what's up? Like, why are you taking up too much of my time? Let me ask you this before I let you go. Why have you stopped?

You haven't tweeted in like a month and a half. Are you done with Twitter? That's what I'm explaining. I'm like, I went underground. I don't even have about Facebook. Like, people think that I do this for y'all. Like, I'm, like, I'm usually doing this for people. Now I'm like, hey, I'll shut off.

And I'll just do me to the point where it's just coming out of me. Now it's about artists about how I'm feeling. If I want to do Facebook or if I want to share people with my mind, like, I've been so open with people. I tell everybody the truth. I tell exactly what's going on. Like, I've been going through the worst. And everybody knows it.

to my true fans. But I'm real, because I'm real. But at the end of the day, like, I don't have to be open. I don't have to connect with people and let people know that, hey, you can make it past that hard block that you want. Sure. You know, it is bright around that next little corner. But right now, I'm just doing me.

So I'm just really just worried about me, bro. It's just like, I just kind of like shut down to everybody. I don't have to do this for publicity. No more enemies. I don't need Facebook or any of that. I'm just a normal-ass person. Just like everybody else. That's what I'm saying.

It's king stuff. It's not about King like that. King is about being like a Martin Luther King. I did a peace walk for people against violence. You know what I'm saying? I'm here to stand against something against negativity. I am a soldier of God, bro. Understand that I am not here to bring negativity.

I'm only yelling. I'm only angry because why things are wrong. And I don't stand for wrong. And it's negative and it's wrong. Then it's got to be corrected. And right now we're in that time where I had to get at you this way. So we understand, and you have my understanding, hey, well, Bobby, here my show, I better check myself.

I better check myself. I better make sure that I'm incorrect because why? This dude going to get his feelings. He won't get into his feelings, and he's going to say something. So I better make sure I'm correct. And I should make sure do the same if I ever say something about you that's false. You say, hey, no, check yourself. I feed my family with this and blah, blah, blah.

Sure, sure. Just the same thing as you did. So that's all it is. It's a check is, man, checking you and letting you know. Watch you do these people, you can make or break somebody's career. If you got on there start hollowing, water greens are great. If you started sucking me up, bro, I get my whole Twitter fans, everything will go through the roof just because you're sucking me up that much.

But no, you're over there on somebody else's balls, you know, or something like that. So therefore, it happens that way. That's all I'm saying. How are you going to win? You give me the prediction. How are you going to win? How am I going to win? Yeah.

This is what I'm saying? I don't ever like to predict that. No, what you ask me for prediction. I just tell you what I'm going to do. Okay, fine. I'm going to stand the middle stage. Yeah. And then I'm going to go after Aliquita.

Now, I'm not going to stop until he stops or I stop. It's not going to be a stop. There is no, there is no stop. I'm going and I'm going and I'm going to one of our hearts fall out. Somebody better fucking have a heart attack or knock out one or two. That's what I'm looking for. You got your team there. His team is rolling.

And then I'm going to show you that I'm not a liar. I'm going to show you that I'm not a liar. I'm going to show you that I'm not a liar. when you see me walk over there and start going crazy on that man, I'm not going to tell you what I'm doing because there is no predictions of what I'm doing. I don't fight off of what he gives me. If he wants to stand, he wants to wrestle, we can wrestle. I'm prepared.

I am prepared for wherever he wants to go. So you understand this, that my prediction is it's fireworks. And that's all what I like to predict is that I'm coming to fight, that you can guarantee bets for money if Bobby Green will fight. Yes. That's what you can do, and that he's coming forward. He's coming to fight. I can't say for the other guys.

Can I speak for the other guys? But I can bet on my end that I will be coming forward and I will be pushing the fight and he won't beat. But we've been working a lot of wrist locks, so watch out. Bobby, I agree with my wrist lock. Hey, you got your team there. His team is rolling. I got to say they got the champ there.

You know, Quinta's doing good. Al Jermaine sir. You guys. We care about his team. Bro, me ain't tripping? I'm just saying. Wait, hold that. Who?

Who? Chris Widman, the middleweight champion of the world. Ray Longo, Coach of the Year, Al Jermaine Sterling. You've heard of these names, right? John Valante? No, not really. Did you say Belonte? Yeah.

I did say Valente. I did say Valente. Yeah. I know of him. I know of him. He got slept by my homie. Lorenz Larkin. Got slept by him.

Sure. You know, put it on him. Controversial. But hey, I don't disrespect to their team. They do what they do. They do what they do. We do what we do. We don't worry about them.

We have the losers worry about losing. That's what we do. And that's all we do. Here's the thing. Final word. We respect to everybody that we get into the cage with. Their teams, their coaches, they're at that level for a reason. I think they've been in the game a lot longer than I have.

I was a student of Matt Serra's as he was moving through his jihitsu career early in his career. We competed a lot of the same tournaments. He just happened to be a division ahead of me every time. You know, he had his purple bell and I had my blue. and then he got his brown and I got my purple. And I just chased him through the whole grappling scene. I never really had that opportunity to meet with him. But we know a lot about their camp.

We know a lot about their coaches. They've been in the game a long time and they've given out great knowledge with some of the guys that they've trained and the guys that they've developed. But who have they really developed from the get-go? That's what I want to know. Who have they developed from the get-go?

This is not a serious question, is it? No, I want to know. like who they groomed from the beginning. Who did they groom from the beginning of their career? Who didn't come into the camp? Chris Wyman. Who didn't come into the camp already grew? Chris Wyman came in as a zero and zero fighter.

Al Jermaine Sterling, Chris Wyatman, All right? Those are all grassroots. Where did you wrestle? Well, what does that have to do with anything? Everyone comes from somewhere. Well, that's what I'm saying. What do you mean? Our program has been under the radar for so long

because we're grooming our own athletes here. I've had my program for nine years now. But with all due respect, you just said these guys are coming from New Jersey and other places. You're not getting them from high school. Hold on. Let me back up.

I said my core guys, these guys came to me over the last year. Sure. And it's because of the success that Bobby's had and some of my other students, Ruben Duran, a handful of other kids that I've groomed. Now we're bringing in that talent that they have at that talent pool in their gym now.

We have great wrestlers. We have great strikers. We have great jiu-suiters. I think that this is a fight that's going to put our program on the map because we are fighting a school that's so established and have such great coaches in their program. I think it will show what we can do from this side of things. And I think it will only give us great exposure and bring in more athletes like they have in their program now. Sure, sure. No, no, I see where you're coming from.

I disagree with your statement that they haven't groomed. I think them in particular have done a tremendous job of grooming talent because all those guys came in as nobody's. I mean, who knew of Chris Wybman? Who knew of Matt Sarah before he met Ray Longo? Who knew of Chris Wyman, Aligh, Quinta, Algebra, Stirling. But anyway, that's a different discussion. We could disagree on that. I had a lot of fun here doing this.

We understand what you're saying. We understand what you're saying in terms of they come from Ground Zero. But what my coach was saying is like he was already established as a wrestler that came in with this. Fair enough. Fair enough. I think that Bobby Green as a high school wrestler. I got you. I got you.

No, no disrespect. I think this was a lot of fun. This is one of my most memorable interview. on this show. This is a lot of fun. I appreciate you coming, you coming five, six deep. But by the way, I give you that real, bro. Next time you come, the time you can recognize this, the better you'll be off is that give you that real. As soon as you recognize that we'll be better off. Next time, hey, but I know you, you like a fair fight. So next time you come five, six deep, let me know and I'll bring my boys too, all right? That's how we do. That's how we do over here. That's how you West Coasters do?

I'm from like games in New York so we need to like establish what kind of guns or we're gonna have a knife fight or we're gonna have go on no no I don't do any of that

I do verbal I do verbal warfare you don't know how we got to get you hey or is it like we're gonna have something established we'll meet up

down the alley and meet up with knives and bats or whatever you're choosing you don't know how we do in the 514

Montreal Quebec Canada the mean streets of Montreal verbal warfare verbal warfare my friend I come from the Jewish streets of Montreal. That is a dangerous, dark place, my man.

So you don't know. You don't know who you're dealing with over here. But for now we have to say goodbye. Much love, Bobby. I hope we cleared the air. Much love to the team. The guy in the back with the San Francisco 49ers has been staring at me the entire time giving me the mean mug over there.

He hasn't even looked away from me for a second. I won't even address Miami Marlins guy over here on the right. I mean, what's going on with that hat on the west coast? And Darren, I love you, but that hair, I don't know about that hair, my man. I don't know. You know what I'm saying? It calls out of tension, right? Yeah, yeah, it's good. It's good. It's good. Bobby, I love you, my man. Thank you so much for the time. All the best. It's great to have you on the show. Thank you for having us on, man. We do greatly appreciate it.

Thank you guys. All the best to you. There they are. Team Bobby Green. Holy moly. That was memorable stuff. We have kept her waiting long enough. We'll address the Bobby Green stuff later on the show. But let's go to our next guest. Sarah McMahon patiently waiting. Sarah, are you there? Yeah, I'm here. I'm sorry about that, Sarah. Did you get a glimpse of what I was dealing? with over here? Yeah, it sounded pretty funny. Wow, you know, they tried to jump me. By the way, you could have jumped in to, I mean, I could use a silver medalist from the Olympics to have my back. Where were you when they were attacking me? I'm sorry, I didn't know enough about the history of Rangelo and the people he's coached to be able to legitimately back you up. But I could have said

that just because you have a wrestling pedigree does not mean that you don't come completely fresh whenever you start fighting. And it's a completely different sport. So when someone has you from the beginning, they really are teaching you how to fight. I mean, look, they could say whatever they want. We won't get into this too much. But you know, as well as I do,

Chris Wyman, Sarah, all those guys came from the ground. I mean, they didn't go anywhere first. So I was feeling them for a second there, but once he brought that out, I had to check him there because that's 100% false. Anyway, we'll move on from there. Let's talk about you.

You know, I had heard and I had reported on UFC tonight not that long ago that there was some talk, some interest of booking you versus Katzengano. Is there anything more to that that you can share with us? Well, I was really interested in that fight. I knew that that is a high-profile fight, and I knew that would, you know, put me right there in the title contention again. And I got, I waited for like a few days, and then I checked my manager, and he said that she had to go to the doctor to see if she, she was going to get cleared. And, you know, from past the experience, that's never really a good sign.

And usually if you are going to fight with an injury, you're kind of trying to hide it rather than letting everybody know that you have something going on. So I was like, ah, she's probably out. And then she had a different follow-up visit with the doctor. I waited a few more days and a week later they said she's out. And then they said they were going to ask Sarah Kaufman. And I was like, I don't really know why because of the three other times that they offered it to her.

she clearly showed that she didn't want to take the fight, but okay. And then, you know, basically they've been waiting. It's been a couple weeks now that they text her manager offered the fight to with no response. I believe even Sarah Kaufman has stopped responding to Sean Shelby about it. So I told them I was like, just find somebody else. You know, like, but that's the problem is that I'm in the same position with a lot of the other girls. I'm really getting really tired of it. I experienced it in the beginning of my career,

but I thought once I got to the UFC, I'd find more girls that were willing to step up in fight, and I'm finding a shortage of contenders. Do you feel like you're in a tough spot from the UFC's perspective because not that long ago you had that loss to Ronda Rousey, and it's like they don't want to put you against someone who, like a Betch go ahead, because if you beat Betch, then they have to give you a title shot right off the bat.

So they don't want to have you like kill off, because you're super tough and one of the very best in the world, but you just had a title shot. So do you feel like that's what's going on here? You only have a limited amount of opponents that you could fight? Yeah, that they probably want to put me against. But I think that if other girls don't want to fight me because I'm good, then I deserve another title shot. I mean, isn't that the person that you want to put against your title holder is the people

that other people are avoiding? That's true. It's a good point. Fair point. Do you think that, I mean, you are coming off the loss to Misha Tate, so it's hard to get it right away. I know you want to get back on track, but do you think that you should be in that discussion, like one or two wins away? Yes, absolutely. What happened in that fight?

You were so closely, it was looking very good for you early. Where did things go wrong for you against Misha? Against Misha? Yeah. Okay. I should have kept it on the seat. Yeah. The takedown.

I didn't need the takedown. I could have stayed standing, and that would have definitely been better. And I had a rougher camp that made different things a little bit harder for me to do. And it reflected in my fighting. I was able to do a lot more of the stand-up in my camp, and I was able to do less of the ground stuff. And, you know, my performance reflected that, that I was, I focused heavily on one area. What happened in the camp? But, you know, I don't really want to talk about that.

Oh, man. No one wants to tell me anything today. It's a weird thing. I'm sorry. I had an injury that forced me to be very selective. And, you know, truthfully, if I wasn't in a different position in my life, I would have actually backed out of the fight. I just wasn't in that position to back out of the fight.

So I trained the best that I could, given the circumstances. Wow. And are you okay now? Yes. Yes. I'm doing it a lot better. I had to take a little bit of time off afterwards and, you know, go and do the appropriate things for injury maintenance.

But no, I'm, I even after like a month, I was like, okay, when's my next fight? Have you watched the fight again? Yes, I have watched the fight. Is it hard to watch? Because it seemed like you had her early. Yeah, yeah. It's definitely hard to watch the fight. And knowing, you know, some of the reasons why I did poorly in the third round.

But, you know, like, I don't normally face that, but I think by the judging criteria of the stand-up, I probably should have won the second round. By how it's supposed to be judged. I understand that, you know, if you finish around, you know, on the ground, that, you know, that is probably fresher in the judge's mind and that it'll typically go that way. but the exact judging criteria is if 51% of the fight, or that round is on the feet, you first decide to judge it by the feet. Right. You know, I spoke to your coach,

crew fill nurse before the fight, and he told me that you actually did some Skype sessions with him as far as like training. He would sit there on his computer or iPad, whatever, and watch you train. He was in New York, I believe you were in South Carolina. Is that the first time you've ever done something like that with a coach? Yes, it is.

Typically, my coaches are around where I'm at, or I can fly up there and train with them. But, you know, like, he trains a lot of high-level fighters, and I want, like, he'll watch different sessions. He'll watch sparring sessions. He'll watch drilling sessions with people. He'll watch, you know, me doing stuff on the bag just to make sure that I'm doing the technique correct. And besides actually going with him, it very much so much, what I would get in a practice with him. You know, being able to watch what I'm doing and make adjustments right then.

So you didn't feel like you were missing out. No, no. I mean, there is something different when you actually go and work out directly with Phil. Like that's something that you definitely cannot recreate. But, you know, a lot of times that coaches are watching your technique, watching you spa with other people. And so that's a very valuable tool to be able to make, you know, mid-practice adjustments. and correct things as you're doing them, you know,

so you can get those repetitions in for whenever you bring that to the fight. And you kind of worry at this point in your career. I mean, you've competed for a long time. I don't think anyone would call you old or anything, but, you know, you've had a long athletic career. Are you worried that you're going to have to, you know, I feel like a lot of the female fighters, especially the ones who have fought for a belt,

have these extended layoffs because, you know, the divisions, aren't as deep and they have to find the right opponent. Are you getting worried that you're going to have this extended layoff that you didn't ask for? No, Sean Shelby's been actually really good at trying like every six months to get me a fight. I would love it to be more frequently, but I understand that nobody else, you know, is getting that either, so I'm not quite so, you know, I don't feel like it's, you know, directly angled at me. Okay.

So who have you set your sights on now? Are you still hoping for Kat? No, because if she's injured, there's really nothing that you can do about that. But, you know, really, like, I would love for every single girl in my weight class that's in the UFC, if they could, you know, publicly say that they would like to fight me. Like, if they could just say, yay, hey, I would, I'll fight you. I have no problem. Maybe it won't be my next fight.

Maybe it'll fight after that. But then I'll know which girls actually are game. You know, like, I don't want this to be, you know, unexposed anymore. If you're not willing to fight, and that's your job, you are a fighter, then I think that you should have to, you know, you should say, I would like to fight all these people because there is not one person in my weight class that I would say no to fight, not one. The strongest contender right now would have been Kat, and I already said yes to that.

Yeah. The only other, I mean, the only other higher contender would be Rhonda, and I absolutely would say yes to that. everybody else is a no-brainer. You know, I'm looking at the rank. Go ahead, sorry. Oh, go ahead. No, no.

I just need other girls that are willing to, you know, step in. I understand that I would be a hard person to fight, having wrestling credentials and then, you know, improving on my striking. It doesn't matter. That's what you're supposed to do. It's your job. You can't just dodge the people who are working hard and getting better. You know, I'm looking at the rankings right now,

and the fight that really jumps out if it can't be cat is Alexis Davis. I know she's going through... I would love that fight. Yeah, although I know she's going through some personal issues that have been well documented with her niece being sick, so perhaps, you know, I'm sure you wouldn't blame her for taking some time off, but... Absolutely not, because I really think Alexis Davis is one of the girls that would step in and definitely be game, you know, and I think that if everything were, like, if she were

injury-free and, you know, everything was going right in her... you know, personal life, I think that she is a warrior and she would step in and do it. That's a tough one. This is an interesting dilemma that you have found yourself in. What about Amanda Nunes? Yeah, all of them. Anyone. Yes.

Yes. That's the answer to all of them. When do you think that this will be resolved? When do you think you'll get your next fight? Do you have any idea? They're telling me that they want me to fight on the July 15th card. So that's eight weeks out. That's why I'm so adamant right now of saying somebody step up so you can have a full camp, you know, and there's no problem.

There's no stepping in short notice. There's nothing unfair to you. You know, if you want to fight me and you want to be on the July 15th guard, let the UFC know. So this is the message. It doesn't matter if you're ranked, unranked, number one contender, 15th contender. If you want to fight Sarah McMahon, this is your opportunity. Yeah, I'm down with it. I mean, I don't know what they'll say.

I don't know what they want to match up, but the answer for me is yes. Even if the fight doesn't make sense from a ranking standpoint. It's better than no fight at all. I mean, experience in there. You know, like if I go out there and if they're not as good and I have a really good performance, it still puts me closer. It puts me closer rather than just sitting around doing nothing. By the way, side note, what was it like for you to see your fellow Olympian Daniel Cormier win the belt?

Oh, that was unbelievable. I was so excited for him. I was really, really happy. He's worked so hard. Does that inspire you? And Anthony Rumble? Yes, absolutely. It's my turn.

Yeah. What were you going to say about Anthony? Oh, he was, he's an unbelievably tough fighter, too. You know, like, that was an excellent fight. I was, there were times I was so worried for Daniel just because the power that Anthony has. And, you know, he just stayed in there and made it his fight. And that's great.

I'm really happy for Daniel. You know, speaking of Misha. recently, she was somewhat critical of the Reebok deal, and I know this is a very hot topic. How do you feel about it? I feel like this is a really touchy subject, just because of if you look at the numbers and you look at the facts, there could be a strong case for gender inequity in the way this deal is presented. I think that, you know, the UFC and Reebok would never want to be perceived as somebody who is treating an entire gender, you know, poorly. But really, if you look at the females, like I've looked at the numbers, 86% of the girls are in the first year, which is 2,500.

The entire straw weight division, except the champion, and I believe Paige Van Thant has a, a personal deal, which I don't even know what that is, so I can't even tell you what her numbers would be. But the entire straw weight division by that criteria is making $2,500, regardless of how long they've been fighting, regardless of their rankings. And the majority of the women at the family division are in the same boat. The only exceptions are the champion who's making the highest tier. And then Misha Tate is the only one. There's one girl who has above 10 fights. there are five girls who have above five fights.

The other 29 girls in the division are the other 20 girls. There's 57 women total, and only 14% are getting that. Yeah, it's now it looks like, if you look on paper, it looks like the rebuck deal is unbiased. Number of fights, if you come from strike force of WEC, but that's not the case when it plays out because the women never had an opportunity to fight in the WEC. and they never had, there was only one week class in the strike force

that they fought and that was 135. So all of the straw weight division is out of luck. They also had 145 by the way. They had 145, remember cyborg? Oh, yes, that's right. But they don't have that in the UFC so it doesn't apply.

Right, right, right. So, yeah, and that only applies to the champion. She's the only person that's fought at 145 that dropped down, I believe. Oh, no, Amanda Nunes did too. but um so that i doubt if you look at the percentages of the men that it's even remotely close to that wow you really came with the uh the facts and figures there well i wasn't i wasn't going to make a statement without looking and examining whether i could back it up i mean like that that that really is the case like it would be the equivalent if this were like the civil rights movement

and you decided to hire minorities and then you instill a policy that said um the only way that you can be applicable for a raise as if you've been in this company for five years. Well, automatically, every single minority would be out of that running, you know, and the women are just recently added, but that doesn't mean that these girls haven't been fighting for years

or doing other sports for years, and their rankings that they don't deserve to be compensated for that. They deserve $2,500. And, I mean, if you even look at other sports, they allow you to have one personal sponsor, the majority of professional sports. So we're not even able to, like, I mean,

someone who could have a huge, you know, contention with this deal would be police Harrog because she made a lot of money off of sponsorship. She can't even bring one personal sponsor, and she doesn't qualify for the, for anything but the $2,500. She hasn't fought five times in the UFC. I mean, this is something that they really need to think about,

because it does look discriminatory against the entire gender. And so I think that they should probably, I think they probably will do, the right thing and contact people and make personal deals. And they've already done that with other people. So I don't understand why they couldn't do that with the women. So, you know, who are getting, go ahead.

Well, I just wanted to know if, you know, you or management or whatever have voiced these, these issues that you may have with the deal to Sean Shelby or anyone else in the UFC. Well, I have now with you. Okay. Are you planning on? And I'm, yeah, yeah, I'm going to follow up and actually make sure I have a legitimate claim. You know, I'm speaking with a lawyer soon that does a lot of work with Title IX. So, I mean, gender equity is a very big deal.

I'm just because I'm not going to come and say and make statements if I don't really actually have backing. If I don't, if I'm not in the right, you know, I'm not going to be like, you know, I'm not going to pitch a fit and throw a tantrum. I'm going to come intelligently and say, that really is not fair. For those that, you know, that don't know about Title IX, I know that's something you know very well about because it affected a lot of college athletes. Can you briefly tell them what it is? Title IX is, it basically was saying that women were underrepresented in collegiate sports. And so what it originally was designed to do was you would,

for all the male that was getting scholarship and had different teams, they wanted to add women's sports, so women had equal opportunities to be a college athlete. What unfortunately ended up happening is because of budget or whatever, they ended up cutting meal programs to make it equal. And that's not what I'm suggesting. I'm not saying start giving all the men less money and funnel it into the women. I'm just saying that there are so many more men who have fought in the WEC fought in strike force and have a ton of UFC fight that they are getting the majority of, have that chunk and we're just left high and dry because we were just recently added. That doesn't mean we haven't had full careers, you know, and that these women don't deserve it.

It's that we're not the same as, you know, just a younger guy who's just made it in the UFC. And we shouldn't be treated that way. Wow, this is a, this is a fascinating, fascinating case study. It's a fascinating argument that you have. I think it's, I mean, your experience, what has it been? like when you've voiced things to the UFC or have you ever had to voice anything? I mean, do you think they're going to be open to this?

Do you think that they purposely did this? Is this an oversight? I mean, I think they would agree that... Go ahead, go ahead. Oh, I don't know. I don't think that it was like purposely because if you look at it on paper, it appears fair. You know, I don't think that they're out

to like screw over the women or if they were, then they wouldn't have even out of them to begin with. Right. I really think that when they examine it from that perspective and see, you know, 86% are on the first year, you know, like that, they'll see that that's not fair. And I really hope that Reebok also would try to, you know, make amends and try to fix that problem.

Something I've suggested on... I was going to say something that I've suggested on this show, and I know you watch the show every week, so this is old news for you. But I think that there should be a formula of ranking times tenure, times position on the card. So I feel like that accounts for everything. I agree with that. There are a lot of people, you know,

who's to say Paige Van Zant won't main event her next show? I mean, she's certainly popular, but she's only been, you know, in the UFC for two official fights, right? So... Yeah, and should Connard for Gregor be on the $2,500 pay scale? No, he got a personal deal.

But if you look at just the number of fights he's had in the UFC, that's where he would qualify, you know? But no, he shouldn't be there, because he draws a lot of attention, and, you know, he's fighting in a title fight. Oh, like, it's a criteria different if you have a type of fight. Say that he isn't a title holder.

Then he has three fights in the UFC. No, he's worth more than that, you know, and to Reebok and the UFC, and they should be compensated appropriately. Yeah, and if you're in a main event, I think that should mean something. I think a guy like Todd Duffy will only be like 25 or 5,000 max, and he's fighting against Frank Meere in the main event.

and there are a lot of other cases. So what do you make of my equation? Do you like that? No, I absolutely do. It seems very fair. And it also makes it on a more case-by-case basis. Right. And I like the ranking in there, too, because I don't really like mean to offend the people

who've been around for a long time, but some people have fought a lot of fights, and they are now past their prime, and maybe they don't generate the same attention as a young, up-and-coming person like a Connemer Greger. And so really, like, it should be that. if you do have a higher ranking, you know, it isn't just time put in. It's the amount of attention that you would generate and how skilled you are as a fighter still.

So how would we describe Sarah McMahon right now? Are you a frustrated, you know, considering this and your inability to get a fight? Is the state of your career a frustrating one? No, I just, so I'm not like solely monetarily driven, but I am driven by fairness. So the fact that even if it did keep me in the 2,500, I wouldn't be excited about it because I'm taking a huge pay cut.

But if it were fair, if it were truly fair, I would just accept that, okay, well, you haven't had that many fights in the UFC, and that's what you have to do and you just have to get more fights. And I would accept that. But the part of not having opponents, especially coming from my wrestling background, where I don't even care if it was a timid little college girl and that were her first match wrestling freestyle,

she at least would show up and do her best. And I can respect that. And the people who aren't going out there and fighting, I don't respect that. Even if it's someone coming off a loss, you don't care? No, no, I don't care. Because I just came off of a loss but I don't feel like I should have had, so yeah, I don't care.

They're a good fighter that are just coming off a loss. No problem. I'll take it. All right. What's the next step here as far as getting the fight and the Reebok thing? You're going to talk to a lawyer and then you're going to talk to the UFC. Is that what you're going to do? Yeah.

Okay. Just to make sure that I have my, you know, I'm not coming to them unrealistic. Right. And then you're preparing at least right now for July 15th. Yes. For who the hell knows. But it's not going to be Katzenegano. Or is there a coffin, I'm betting.

All right. Well, it remains to be seen. I appreciate anything else you want to get off your chest. I feel like you came with a lot. No, no. I'm pretty good. Thank you. Okay.

Always a pleasure to talk to you, Sarah. I'm sorry that you're dealing with this stuff, but hopefully it gets resolved sooner or rather than later. Good luck getting the fight. Good luck with the Reebok stuff. And we'll talk to you soon. All the best. Thank you.

All right, there she is. Sarah McMahon, Silver medalist, Olympic Games, Ressler, of course, coming off that fight against Misha Tate. Tough one. Look like she had her there for a second, but unfortunately, as she discussed at length, couldn't get it done. Looking for a fight now.

If anyone's listening, anyone in the 135-pound division, you're looking for a fight too? You got someone who wants to fight you. Tough fighter, but hey, she's ready. All right, that does it for today's interviews. We went almost an hour longer than we should have with the interviews. Let's quickly reset because last week we didn't get to do it, I really want to share this interview.

Let's go inside the vault here. We're talking about the light heavyweight division. We're talking about the belt. I have to talk about this with New York, Rick, on the back end of Inside the Vault. But I wanted to go back to March 19, 2011. That is the date that John Jones became the new UFC light heavyweight champion. That's the last time we crowned a new champion in the UFC's 205-pound division.

It was in Newark, New Jersey. He defeated Shogun Huah that night. Of course, UFC 1-28. after the fight, I caught up with Rashad Evans in the crowd. In the crowd. Great stuff. Remember, when Jones won, they brought Rashad into the cage. They faced off. It was a pretty intense moment. The former friends, training partners, all that stuff. And it was just weird. A lot of tension. I caught up with Rashad in the crowd. And that's where he dropped the bombshell to the world that he was no longer with Jackson Winklejohn. In that interview, first time. It was pretty shocking stuff.

I mean, we all kind of thought something would have to happen, but we didn't know what. He dropped it in this interview right after the UFC 128 main event. Here it is, Inside the Vault, March 19, 2011. Post-fighter UFC 128 where John Jones just defeated Shogun, whoever shot. You were just in the cage. What was that experience like for you? What was that moment like?

You know, I thought about it was going to happen before it even happened, so it's whatever. Was it awkward considering your friendship with John? This whole situation is awkward, you know? But it is what it is. You seem to be experiencing some mixed emotions right now. Yeah, I'm happy for the duty. He went out there and he fought well. You know, I'm happy for him that, you know, he looked phenomenal.

But at the same time, you got that strap, so now I got to go and get it. Were you pulling for Shogun so that you wouldn't be in this situation? No, I know I was going to fight him. No matter if he lost tonight or not, I was going to fight him. What do you think of his performance? Phenomenal. Great performance. Did you expect him to dominate the fight that easily? Yes, I did.

From the minute they called that he was going to fight him, I knew he was going to destroy him. And when you're watching that, are you thinking of how you will fight him now, or you haven't really been... I already know how to fight him. I train with him. Right. What do you think you're going to do? Will you train with Jackson's or stay at Grudge, do you know? I'm done with Jackson's. You're done?

How come? I'm done. You feel as though they betrayed you? I'm done. I'm done with Jackson. Last question. When do you think the fight will happen? happen? Whenever John's ready to do it. Are you ready? Always. Thanks, Rashad. I'm done. That's what he said. He has not been back. Of course, he is a leader over at the

Black Zillions, but that was pretty shocking stuff, pretty powerful stuff. March 19th, 2011. All right. New York, Rick. I am here. I mean, can I just ask you, oh, by the way, I have to, you reminded me with your hat over there. This episode of the M.A. Hour is presented by NOS. No looking back, no holding back, and absolutely no regrets. Find a Noss near you at find Noss.com. So, Bobby Green shows up. Five deep.

Yep. I mean, I got three over there. Where were you guys? Well, first of all, if you're going to rep the 514, then you don't get the 718. Why not? No. Come on. All right.

F that. I'll rep the 514 till I die, mother. You can't call for backup from the 718 when you're talking about Montreal, all this and that. Well, I feel like I can. I mean, I'm an adopted member. I just went on. I talked about America at the beginning of the show about how I feel like. No one sticks up for me.

That was. By the way, my mom was texting me in the middle. She would have my back. Oh, that was. She did not like it. Well, I thought that was great. It was incredible. Well, this, I mean, this is my mother.

She gets a little, she gets a little anxious. when Rampage gets too close, you know? That was fun. I mean, from back here, that was a lot of fun. You know, I got to admit, I know a lot of people I would say, you know, I'll give you a pass. But I know I acquint a listens to the show.

I was thinking he was going to call in, but, you know, maybe we'll get him on in the near future. That was intense. I couldn't tell if he was, like, really mad at me or just having a go as the, Ritz say it was very intense. I know you're a big Bobby Green guy. I love Bobby Green, and I thought he brought it today.

But he was off, by the way, can we just say something? Dad, you know, dad, coach, dad. The comment about Longo, Sarah Longo, I felt like they completely, they completely ruined their entire argument with that comment. Yeah. I mean, Sarah Longo is the camp that is known for developing talent from the ground up.

Like, that's the camp. They don't have a lot of guys, but all of their guys pretty much are grassroots guys. Are guys that they took from the start. They're all New York, Long Island guys. I mean, like, you don't even have anyone from Brooklyn. You know what I mean? They're all Long Island guys. I agree with you there.

Yeah. Wild. All right. Well, that's Bobby Green. Intense. But we like him. That's fun. That was fun.

It's fun to have interviews like that. People that keep you on your toes that bring it, that are passionate. it. We appreciate his time. We appreciate his candor. I thought it was fun. And by the way, holy moly, I know July is a great month. I am now infinitely more excited for that fight than I was, you know, an hour and a half ago. Bobby Green ally Quinta, don't boo me versus what's Bobby Green's line? We have to come up with a line for him. He must have said something a bunch of stuff. I'm real something. He said something. He doesn't need a line. He'll just do the thing where he shakes his head. You didn't hit me? This one? Do you think, Bobby Green? Do you think he was feeling my heat, though?

I mean, I feel like at one point he was like, oh, damn, I didn't know this. guy brought it like this. I don't know if I'd go that far, but I think you stood your ground. I did stood my. I mean, I always get a little annoying when guys are like, oh, this is a game too. This is not a game. This is my actual job. Like, if this goes away, I don't have a job.

I don't have money. They think, like, because I have maybe toys on the desk or something, it's a game. It's not a game. Trust me. Trust me. I work very hard to put the show together, and everyone does it. It's not a game. It's not a game.

It's not a game. Okay. Should we get, I know I want to talk to you about the belt thing. Is that going to come up here? in some capacity. Okay. I mean, just jump into it

whenever you feel is appropriate. Please comment on DC's post-fight antics. Does this guy get it or what love DC playing up the heel role? Well, I said it a little bit at the top. I thought it was absolutely brilliant because

the best characters are the gray characters, not the white ones, the black ones, the gray ones. You get what I'm saying? Like Stone Cold Steve Austin was a gray character. The Rock was a great character.

If we're going to try to compare this to pro wrestling, That was a tremendous promo. It was an A-plus promo. It sets up the Jones fight. And then, once he was done with that, he set up the Bader fight. And he continued to do so on the show. He dropped the mic. It was fantastic.

I mean, there's nothing bad you could say about it. And then, you know, if you could say, oh, you know, he wasn't respectful. He didn't give a shout out to his family. He did that all in the post-fight press conference. This was the moment that will be played over and over and over again, leading up to the Jones rematch if it ever happens. He's a great character. He doesn't care.

He doesn't mind ruffling feathers. and then, you know, being the good guy, like you saw him here today. So I think that's the best. At the end of the day, they just have to care about you, and he does a good job of getting people to care about him. That in-cage interview is not the time to do that. And, you know, save for like a Mark Munoz situation, yeah.

That's your time to cut the promo, call out who you want to call out, get your point across. Then in the post-fight, you know, when you're digging a little deeper like you did, that's when you get out the heartfelt stuff. Yes. It was fantastic. Speaking of the post-fight, was it real? Or were there prearraged theatrics involved?

What was your take on the timely confrontation between Cormiere and Bader? Was it completely Bader's idea? So his name is clearly there in line just in case, or is there any remote possibility that it could have been slightly worked? I don't mind either way, the excitable mark that I am. I bought into the confrontation anyway. James Glory. James Glory.

Very smart guy. All we have to address is the end. I don't mind either way, the excitable mark that I am. I bought into the confrontation anyway. Then who cares? If you bought it, then run with it. Who cares? At the end of the day, guys, we have to remember this is just sports.

And if something like that, look at the views on that thing. Wait a minute. Wait, way. Say in a game. You can't say it's sports. No, but it's sports. And as fans, if we can get excited, and especially something that can, I mean, again,

with all due respect, who's ever felt this way about a Ryan Bader fight? And now all of a sudden, I will pay good money to see this fight. Everyone loves a good rivalry. And I, look, I saw Bader. I'll tell you this. I saw Bader after the fight. We interviewed him quickly. The guy was like shaking.

He was fired up. Who knows what goes on behind the scenes? I mean, at the end of the day, I don't want to look behind that curtain. If you believed it, if you liked it, if you bought into it, then who cares? Cormier needed about the length of a vine to get me interested in him versus Ryan Bader. It took about six seconds or less. No one's been able to do that, right? I'm all in on Bader Cormier.

When that fight was announced for New Orleans, it was an overall. It was like a nothing fight, yeah. It was like whatever, but I'm all in. I don't care if it's fake, real, whatever. It felt like a rebound fight, you know, when it was first announced. Now it feels like, ooh, we got a grudge match. And to be honest, there's not much else out there. Exactly.

And also, could you imagine, can you imagine if John Jones beat Rumble on Saturday, what would they do with John Jones? He'd literally have cleaned out the division. Yeah, how many times do we say that about it? No, no, no, but honestly, we're right now. If John Jones beat Rumble, which was very possible, I'd still like to see a gustafs infight again. I mean, coming off a loss?

Look, I'm not about to, I think by the end of the show, people know how I feel about John Jones and his status as champion. But what would you do, honestly? What would you do if he beat Rumble on Saturday? Whatever John Jones wants to do. If he wants to fight some guy in a rematch, good. If he wants to fight the heavyweight champion, good.

Oh, that's a, I'm talking about light heavyweight division. There weren't any options. Now, all of a sudden you have Ryan Bader in a legit. What options do we have for Ronda Rousey? Betch-Koh-Hia. She's fighting. So you can find a Bech-Koh-Hia in light-heavyweight. Honestly, there isn't one.

Look. You can find one. There's nothing going on. Anyway. We say this about every champion. No, but that's when we say, like, oh, in two-fights, three fights. I'm saying if he just fought three days ago, there would literally be nothing for him. This is me trying to turn a negative into a positive.

I'm saying, what I'm trying to say is, D.C. being champion. It's almost like the DJ thing that I said a few weeks ago. If DJ just kind of like took a break for a second, it's not going to happen. I don't want it to happen. The division would evolve. Jones being away and hopefully everything works out for him and he could come back at some point in the future. It's not the end of his career. Might end up being a positive thing for all involved because the division will evolve in his absence. The division is never cleared out. There's always somebody. It may be somebody further down the line, but there's always somebody. Speaking of John Jones, if John Jones comes back and gets his title shot versus Daniel Cormier,

let's assume he still champion then, and he loses, does he deserve to get more than one title shot because of who he is? Anderson got knocked out and got an immediate rematch. And if you remember at the UFC 182 post-fight press conference, when asked if he felt bad for D.C. John said he doesn't feel bad because of D.C. 1, he would have been talking all type of trash, like he did after he won the title on Saturday. and as more time passes and John Jones doesn't fight I think how much of his think of how much of his skills will lose

like Vitor this weekend after not fighting for a year Wait so the question is if Jones comes back If he comes back and loses to Cormier Does he get another one? Silly question There's a lot of ifs there If he comes back if he loses If he gets another one next Wow

Dismissed We've got time for this we're running out of time You got a plane to catch I got a plane to catch Do you want to quickly talk title belts before we move on to Belfort and Wyden. So you strong, I've had my say, you strongly believe that your guy... Well, first let's address the fact that you're calling it

the lineal championship. It's not the lineal championship. What? John Jones is the lineal champion. You have to get in the cage and beat the the lineal champion to become the lineal champion. That's how it's passed on. The actual belt. But that's not a lineal championship. If you look at the history books, it goes from one guy to the next, right? Yes, it goes from one guy to the next. But the person who is not a title holder can still pass on the lineal championship when they are defeated in the cage.

That's how it works. You're talking fantasy world. I'm talking real world. I'm talking about the real world. The lineal championship is passed on by defeating somebody in the cage. It's not always the person who is the belt holder. Again, that's fantasy world. No, that's how lineal championships were.

disqualified himself. You're not talking about lineal championships. It's not like he went and signed somewhere else. It's not like he got injured or something. He did something to get stripped. I'm not telling you that John Jones is the reigning UFC champion. I'm telling you that the lineal championship is passed on by fighting in the cage and whoever is holding that championship, again, not always the belt holder, then passes it on to the next guy.

So he is not the lineal champion. Disagree. It's not a fact. There's nothing to be. disagree with. Go ahead. Having said that, I think that... I think we can both say that John Jones is still the best light heavyweight in the world,

correct, or incorrect? Absolutely correct. The belt is supposed to represent the best light heavyweight in the world. Correct or incorrect? Sometimes not. So what is it supposed to represent? Well, no, no, no. Okay, say the question again.

I thought you said something else. The belt? Yes. The belt that Daniel Cormi is where... It should represent. sometimes it doesn't. In this case, it doesn't. In the past, it has not. Sometimes. For example. And now, okay, let's look at it from this perspective. You're Daniel Cormié. Yes. You're UFC champion. Yes.

Are you thinking, I'm UFC champion? I'm UFC champion. I really looked out that John Jones had personal problems. Or are you saying, whatever, I'm USC champion. I'm not thinking about that. I'm probably going with a bit of both, to be honest. I don't know if there's a right answer here. I'll tell you why. A lot of people forget this. At any of the day, as we were talking about with Bobby Green, the point of this whole thing is to make money, right?

Yeah. Championships are nice and all. But until you are a champion, you don't get certain perks, right? Daniel Cormey now gets those perks. That's absolutely correct. So all these people who call him a paper champ, like he'll take that paper champ and wipe his butt with it. He's the champion.

and in his contract that states as champion you get certain perks. That contract's written on paper just as much as the belt is. Oh, that is bullshit. That is such bull. You're going to say that Daniel Cormié is not the real UFC light heavyweight champion right now. It's paper. John Jones, until there's, now there's an expiration on this. I said some people have asked me on Twitter, you asked me this, about George St. Pierre.

In my opinion, I think GSP could come back now and beat both Robbie Law. and Johnny Hendricks. And I think that he, for all intents and purposes, is still the champion. Now, there's an expiration on this. There's a certain time where he's given up the... Yeah, so Anthony Pettis hadn't fought in how God knows how long every time he's defended his belt. But I think that's wrong. I think a year and you're done.

Now, the Pettist thing is a very rare situation. Kane Velasquez. I think you should have been stripped. I said it on UFC tonight. But my point is... Wait, let me just say. Petis thing weird because of the ultimate fighter. was ready to come back and they delayed it. So they kind of did it to him. That's why it's a bit of

unique one. Regardless of how it happens. I think 365, if you don't have a title fight book, you know I've said this. You're done. Regardless of how it happens. Right. I think the belt is supposed to represent the best fighter in that way class. And I think that John Jones is that in this case. And listen, I've predicted for three years in a row that Daniel Cormeier would win the championship. This is not how I first saw it happen. I predicted that for three years. The problem that you and all these other haters are having right now, is you can't distinguish between the best in the world and the champion. That's the problem you're having. I can distinguish it. The best in the world. But what I'm saying is that champion is meaningless now. No, it's not.

That's BS. It means, it means this guy who's 16 and 1. Look, yeah, he's 16 and 1. You know who has that one? You know who owns that one? Absolutely. He is the best in the world. No one's taking that title away from him.

That's a real thing. But the UFC light heavyweight champion. So basically, let's, let's ask you. this, when is this expiration date that you speak up? That I don't know. Oh, you have to have a date. Why? Well, because when I buy milk, it says a date on it. I need to know when it's done.

I can't just be like this number that's going to hang in the air, and then one day you're going to wake up and say, okay, now he's the champion. It's a very real thing. When it's without a shadow of a doubt that John Jones will not return, that's when it's real. And if John Jones returns, then you can't even make the case. He's the guy.

You need to move on. he did something that was allegedly very serious. They can't just hold up the division. I was talking to someone very close to John Jones this weekend, and I said, man, could you imagine? D.C. Jones, New Year's Eve, Vegas? They were like, New Year's Eve? No, no, no, that's too soon.

That's too soon. Okay, so let's just say that's too soon, right? It's not happening. That's what they said. Who knows? This is before the D.C. fight, so who knows? He may have seen. Tell me this.

Wait, wait, New Year's Eve. Too soon, that means he'll be gone for more than a year. Tell me this. You relinquish the belt. Tell me this. Tell me this. Whenever that fight happens, let's assume that it happens. Let's assume John Jones comes back in a year and a half.

Yes. Whatever the time frame is. And he absolutely demolishes Daniel Corrieu. Yes. What did that belt mean? Tell me what it meant. But these things happen all the time. It's like, okay, again, it's very...

Tell me what it's signified. It's signified exactly what it's signified, that the guy got in trouble. He came. back, the division moved on, other people held the belt. That physical belt was taken off his waist. He cannot walk around with that belt and say, I am the owner of this belt. And he let them borrow it while he was gone. He didn't do anything. He let them into his house, stretch your feet out, have a good time. Per his contract. Once the master comes back to the house, he's his. His contract states that there are certain things you can't do. And in his meeting with the UFC, they determined that he did certain things. Maybe you can say multiple times.

So he's on timeout. That he, yeah, and in timeout, privileges are taken away from you. When I put my son in time out, you can't play with his toys. Well, guess what? John Jones had his toy taken away. So why should everyone else suffer? So, so, Dan... I'm not trying to make the case that everyone else should suffer.

But then they're trying to make the case that they're just playing with his toys. But that's not fair. That's his toy that they're playing with. So forever, forever and ever, John Jones, you know, because he's been so... Well, John Jones never comes back for his toy. Then it's, then it wasn't his anymore. But if he does, still is. These guys have legacies and careers and families to feed.

He's able to sit on that belt and do all this other stuff, and they're not able, you know, like, Daniel Cormey's not able to cash those chips in, you know, those perks as champion. Rumble wasn't able to do that. This is from outside perspective. From Daniel Cormier's perspective, run with it as far as you can. As I just said, I want to see Bader Cormier.

I'm interested in Daniel Cormier as the reigning USC Light Heavy Wood champion. Anyone who calls it a paper champion, or a paper belt doesn't understand the game. You don't understand the game. These guys, at the end of the day, at the end of the day, they are trying to make as much money as possible. It's prize fighting.

And that belt is their ticket to making more money, to getting more prizes. You think Daniel Cormier is sitting up at night saying, oh, this belt, if only I could beat John Jones. Sure, he wants to beat him. But that just cashed in a hell of a lot of chips.

No, he's not mad. He's not upset about winning the belt. It's so juvenile to say, oh, he's not the real champion. He's the paper champion and all this stuff. That's not the point. They don't give, you think if Ryan Bader wins, he's going to be upset about it? No, this thing moves along.

Life goes on. If, if Fighter X... Why would he be upset if he won anyway? If he won a fight, why would he be upset? Because I see the responses to people on Twitter or social media. They're saying, like, oh, you should be ashamed of yourself. It's a paper belt. Like, what do you want him to do with it?

No, he's going to be happy when he wins just as he would be any other time. But it comes with an asterisk. It comes with a caveat. John Jones looms. Of course he looms. best in the world. He's undefeated. 100%. But sometimes the best in the world isn't the champion. It's just like back in the day, Fader was the best in the world. He wasn't the UFC champion. The belt, the title of champion, all that stuff. What does it mean? You're saying they have it.

I'm not arguing whether they have it or not. I'm arguing what it means. This is an organization that has given title shots, the guys coming off of losses, you know, guys have changed weight classes and never proven themselves in a weight class. And they thought like all of a sudden we're going to be all, you know, high and mighty here and be like, oh, you know, come on. Like, it wasn't like they just decided because they hated John Jones to take away the belt. And by the way, back in the day, like BJ Penn left and they took the belt off him. No one said, you know, things to those guys. No one said that paper belt.

It's a, it's a ridiculous statement. John Jones got himself, you know, in some hot water. He has to figure out his life. And they've already said that when he comes back, he could get a shot at the belt. But I think it's disrespectful to tell all these other guys who are fighting for this paper belt that it means crap. It's completely disrespectful. I think we've both made our point there.

Let's leave it on this, though. But that thing that you said about BJ Penn... No, I'm just... What you just said encapsulated it nicely. But the thing about BJ Penn, you know, when he went to the other organization left to UFC, that's how like a lineal championship

is passed without being the belt holder. If he left, that championship goes with BJ Penn the next person to be BJ Penn. I get your point. Anyway... I get your point about that. No, no. I'll concede that the word lineal, fine. But you get what I'm saying also about the history books, right? Oh, yes.

But we just disagree on this, but I don't think that any – Daniel Cormier should be very proud of himself. He is the UFC's light heavyweight champion. I win. All right. Vitor Belfort. Vitor waited a year and a half to fight for almost three minutes. Was it worth it? And should other fighters consider this when sitting out for a title shot?

Okay, okay, okay. Wait, say it one more time? Sorry, sorry, sorry. Vitor sat out for three years to wait for the title shot. Is this something that other fighters should think? think about. No, no. What? He looked like, you know, he looked very bad. So you're saying take some fights between the title shop? Oh, oh. That's what they're saying. Um, well, I mean, at his age, let's not forget also that, you know, he was out for quite some, he was only eligible to come back in

December. Don't forget about that. So he only really had to wait five months. You get what I'm saying? Yeah. Because of the drug test. So, uh, I think sometimes, but, you know, once you reach a certain point in your life, uh, again, as I was saying, the belt allows you to cash in a lot. lot of chips and people forget that this again like well bobby green my main man bobby green this isn't a game this isn't a game and if you're on the cusp of you know of of of uh being able to check off that little box champion a lot of other things come your way and and i think fans forget that sometimes on board with chris wyedman question mark is chris's status confirmed or is there still a debate to be had this person says the naysayers will still have some ammo his big wins have

all have some mitigating factors munoz at the end of his time as an elite fighter the off-discussed Silva wins, 38-year-old Belfort off the TRT. Okay, okay, okay, I've weighed in on this. You weigh in. Do you feel like he's turned the corner? There's nothing for Chris Wydman to prove anymore. But don't you feel like after Saturday something's changed in the way people view him? I, for me, remember, I was very confident that Machita would not only give him a tough fight, but I thought Machita would win.

After the Machita fight, I felt completely different about Chris Widman. He showed, you know, that he could handle adversity and he could last for five rounds. He can finish fights. There's nothing left for Chris Wyman to prove it in the Octagon. He's been in every type of fight, and he's looked incredible doing it. This one was just another one. He took Vitor's best shot in the first round, and then completely dominated him. Okay, yeah.

If you're not a believer in Chris Wyatman at this point, I don't know what to tell you. Yeah, there's nothing else he could do, but there is more for him to prove. Let's not get a twist. As in, like, Luke Rockhold and Jacaray coming up. Certainly. There are good opponents out there for him. But if you're questioning whether Chris Wybman belongs at the top and has proven himself, you know, the Silva wins, whether they're tainted or not tainted or whatever the case may be by the injury and by the fact that he was playing around, it doesn't matter at this point.

He's gotten in there and beaten the other top guys as well. Vitor earned his title shot, as did Machita, and he took them both out. Definitely one of the very best in the world pound for pound. the way, I wanted to say one more thing. Is it time that DC gets some pound for pound love as well? I think he did. I think he got moved on to it. Double check. Oh yeah, he's now ninth. I mean, I think he should be higher. This is a guy who was undefeated as a heavyweight. Probably could have won the belt there. And now he's the UFC champion. I like heavyweight. I like that he's getting it. Yeah. Brown versus Arlovsky. Do you think that surpasses Diaz versus Dias versus Daly is the greatest one round fight of all time? And if not, why? Why does it have to surpass? Why can't they both be great? Well, I mean, for me, it doesn't come close. Which is better? Diaz Daly is the Holy Grail. This one was damn good.

This was pretty damn good. But Diaz versus Daly is the Holy Grail. Only because it looked like at various times, both guys were going to win that fight. And it wasn't like when Brown, you know, landed that shot against Orlovsky. But for 99% of it, it was Arlofski teeing off. Diaz versus Daly had a much more defined and clear back and forth.

And it's going to be near. impossible to top that one, but this one was damn good. Damn good. I have to go back and watch it, but, you know, Bigfoot Mark Hunt was pretty damn. I mean, there were some rounds in there that were tremendous stuff. This is one-round fight, though. One-round fight. Oh, he's asking one-round fight?

Okay, okay, okay, I see. Yeah, they're up there. Because typically a one-round fight means somebody got beat pretty badly, so it's hard to have a great one-round fight where it's a back-and-forth. This is one-of-those examples. The best part about it, for me, it was so much fun to watch, but the best part was that it involved Andrei Arlowski. I recall being in New Jersey when he was knocked out by Sergey Jairitanoff,

and we're like, this guy's done, he's got no chin, it's done. Brett Rogers, all these fights, he is finished. And for him to be in a fight like that and take those shots and keep on going, again, I truly believe it's Jackson Winkle-John's, maybe their best work and certainly their best reclamation project. And they've had a few. And by the way, I would give him the title shot. I think you need to strike while the iron's hot.

And unless something crazy happens in Mexico, I think you got to go with him. It's a great story. You just answered the next question already. Yeah. It was about his comeback. Is it the comeback, is it the story, the sleeper of the year? I'm sorry, is the comeback a sleeper of the year? A sleeper for story of the year.

Wow, that was terrible. Okay, but here's the thing about that. Two of those fights happened last year. Remember, Shab, which was, you know, let's not forget, somewhat controversial. Well, let's say, no, but if he fights for the title, maybe wins it. Oh, my God, if he wins it.

It's like he's a fighter of the year for that takes. And you gave the credit to his camp, Jackson Winklejohn. I saw Greg Jackson after the fight, and he was crying. And I don't recall Greg Jackson crying. When's the last time you cried, I asked him? He said, it has been a while, but Andre has meant so much to him. He's traveled all over the world with this guy. He took on this project when everyone was kind of, you know, laughing at them and saying,

this is a waste of your time. He's done. And look what they've done. It's truly remarkable. Did we have to skip over a bunch? No, we're going to Twitter now. But did we get through all of them? Yep.

Okay, wonderful. Should Luke Rockhold take another fight at the UFC gives Jokuree the next title shot? Everyone's saying Jokre, let's not forget. You people must not watch UFC tonight. He just had surgery. They say he'll be back in September, but come on. It's got to be Luke Rockhold. You agree with this, right?

Luke Rockhold deserves a title shot. And I say that as somebody who wants to see Jokore fight for the title. It sucks that we can't get the Jacques Re-Romero fight. I don't love the Romero Machita fight, to be honest. I think it's a little soon for Machita, but honestly, if I'm them, if the MSG thing doesn't happen, I book Rockhold and Wyman, and I just give Jacques Ray the winner. Just let him wait. At this point, he's coming off surgery. Just let the guy wait. He's done enough. I am mad at that. Why not? I am mad at that. Is there any doubt about the efficacy of TRT after Vitor's non-performance in the middleweight title fight?

There were many variations of this. Well, I don't really think that we needed that performance to tell us about TRT and it being an advantage. And I'm very happy that they have done away with it. He definitely looked different. And, you know, credit, obviously, you got to credit Chris Wyman. I mean, Chris Wyman makes older guys look really old. He had his moments. And one has to wonder if he was on TRT, would things have been a little different?

But he had his moments. Again, I'll say this about Vitor, like I said about Rumble. You know, Chris said a lot. and, you know, at the end of the day, he did pass those tests. He handled that loss like a pro. You really got to give another interview I did for Fox that didn't air for some reason, and I don't know why it wasn't posted, but he really handled it like a pro, so I tip my cap to him.

Taloslades is a terrifying proposition for Bisbing, but does a win get Bisbing any closer to the title shot? At this point, Michael Bisping just needs to win. You know, he just needs to, I could see one or two more, and then all of a sudden start chirping for that final shot at glory. So, hey. How many times have we called it Bisbing's final shot of glory? No, no, no, but he still has to win.

He's just, what he has to do is just win. It doesn't matter against who. Like, part of Bisping's problem, look at his record in the last, you know, his resume. He's really fought a who's who. He's always taking those tough fights. Regardless of what you think of the guy, you could really say that. Just win at this point. I was on, again, UFC tonight with him.

And he said, who do you want me to fight next? Who would you pick? And I said, Lytis. And he said, I want someone who's a little higher rank. I think this fight makes total sense. It's perfect. It's great that he's in Scotland. He's in the UK.

Lytis is looking great. I don't think this is a game-y fight at all, by the way. I think this is a very tough fight for Bisman. He's saying the opposite. He's saying it's a hard fight for Bisman. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I agree. I agree with this individual.

It's a tough fight, but it's not, it's not Jacaree, which I think some people were calling for. Oh, boy. It's not Musasi, right? It's the next step before those guys. I think the fight makes a lot of sense for both. I think Michael Bisping will, as long as he's an active fighter, will always be in the title conversation because he's interesting,

and it won't take much to get him back there. And I've said that many, many times. We've always talked about Michael Bisbing's last shot at the title. He's had like 50 last shots at the title. He will always be in that conversation. That is credit to him. He is one of the most relevant guys in MMA history and just keeping his name out there.

Do you think the UFC made the right choices for this year's Hall of Fame? If not, which wings should change the air? inductees? Well, I will say that, of course, you can pick a different guy for every, I mean, there are obviously an infinite amount of choices. I think they nailed it, though. I mean, BJ coming in, I know you like that. That's perfect. I mean, who doesn't think BJ Penn? And it's a big name, and it's a great way to reintroduce the Hall of Fame. Perfect. Jeff Blatnick, perfect. I mean, that's perfect for the pioneer. Again, I keep saying that word, but they nailed it on that one. fight is a tremendous fight.

I had the chance to interview both of them. I hope that will air on Wednesday on UFC tonight. And fascinating stuff, by the way. And you could really feel the tension. Ten years later, there's still tension between those two. It's unbelievable. So that's Frank Trigg versus Matt Hughes 2, April of 2005. Great fight, great comeback.

That's the fight where Hughes took him across the cage after getting the low blow and almost submitting to a rear naked choke. And then he ended up finishing him. And then you have pioneer, Basruden. Now, Basruden, maybe you could say, oh, Frank Shamrock deserves it, but he didn't have as many fights in the UFC. But who thinks Basrude? I hope at some point this will become, like the WW Hall fame,

where guys who didn't have a long run in the organization may not have even fought in the organization, still get that kind of love. It really feels like they're going in that direction. They're going to make this into a big deal, broadcast it, and really give it the attention it deserves. Yes, do I hope to see Frank Shamrock? I hope to see Fado or Sakharab, all these guys. Absolutely.

But for their first effort in reintroducing this thing, they went the right, safe route. Perfect. I loved everything about it. I loved the way they announced it. They went on Inside MMA with Boss. They announced it to the crowd, BJ Penn on Saturday. Just great stuff. Aunt Evans at the UFC, does there a lot of credit for that.

Yeah, shout out to Aunt Evans. What a great first UFC class. Fantastic, right? I don't think it could have been done better. They did it fantastic. just as you said, they nailed it, and I look forward to visiting it. Well, hopefully we get to see an actual Hall of Fame at some point, a physical Hall of Fame. But for now, this is a good first step.

This is something that's been missing. The UFC has done a rather poor job of honoring its pass, and I think this is a big step. Blattnick is great. I think a lot of fans don't know who he is, and what a legend. In the Olympic Games, a guy who coined the phrase mixed martial arts, who gave this sport credibility when a lot of people wouldn't. Unfortunately, he will not be there to accept the award. He passed away not that long ago, but he definitely deserves it.

And now you have a place for a guy like a Charles Masked Lewis. You have a place for a guy like Stefan Bonner who had the fight with Forrest Griffin. It all makes sense now. They broke it up in a wonderful way. And I'm really excited. I love that kind of stuff. Hall of Fame history. That's something I always loved as a kid.

And I'm happy that they're finally getting behind it. Is that it? We out. That is it. You can hit my music. Well, a fun show. I hope everyone knew that the show is actually happening because if you didn't know that this show is happening and you're catching it late for whatever reason because it's on a Tuesday, you missed a hell of a show.

Holy moly. A lot happened today. It still feels like Monday. That's the weird thing. It may be back this week, by the way. Wow. Two champions. A former champion.

Bobby Green. And by the way, it's Bobby King Green. not King Bobby Green. It's Bobby King Green. I will never make that mistake again. There is a new UFC light heavyweight champion, my friends. His name, Daniel Cormier. Is he the best in the world? No, he lost to John Jones. But you know what? That doesn't matter right now. John Jones had his physical title taken away from him.

In the UFC's eyes, he broke the rules. They have to move on. And so now someone else is that title holder. Does it take anything away from John? Does it devalue what he's done in the past? Absolutely not. He is the best in the world, but without a belt. He's the uncrown champion right now.

Hopefully, he's able to settle that score. For now we say goodbye. We will see you next Monday. I want to thank Dave Meltzer for stopping by. I want to thank Daniel Corme. Congratulations to him. Thank you very much to Chris Wyman. Congratulations to him.

Thank you very much to Joanne Calderwood. Good luck to her. Benson, all the best. Bobby Green. Good luck to him, July 15th. Thank you so much, Sarah McMahon. Great stuff from her, as always as well. If you missed anything, SoundCloud, Stitcher, iTunes, all the good stuff.

We'll see you Monday. Peace. I'm out of here. I'm Neilie Patel, editor-in-chief The Verge, and Decoder is my show about big ideas and other problems. We've talked a lot about generative AI on the show lately, which is a very big idea that is causing quite a few problems. And one thing we keep hearing about over and over again is that generative AI is causing a lot of problems in schools. There are a lot of people out there, including many of people. of the listeners of the show who email us, who are worried about the obvious problem, students

using chat GPT to cheat on assignments. But when our team went and poked at the story, they found that the issues in education with AI go a lot deeper, to the very philosophy of education itself. If this technology becomes more ubiquitous, we'll have courses created by AI, graded by AI, with submissions from students, absolutely generated by AI. So it begs the question, what are we even doing here in higher ed. This episode is presented by Salesforce. Defenders in cybersecurity are always there when we need them. They should get a parade every time they block a novel threat and have streets, sandwiches,

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