MMA Fighting - The MMA Hour with Ariel Helwani - Episode 293

Episode Date: August 4, 2015

Ariel Helwani speaks to Miesha Tate, Joanna Jedrzejczyk, Chad Mendes, Ray Sefo, Dustin Poirier, Gene LeBell, and Michael Lunardelli. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Logan, everyone, I'm Mario Hawani. Back in New York City in Brazil, which is where I was just a couple of days ago for UFC 190. Of course, Ronda Rousey, defeated Betchkohei had 34 seconds. You know about it by now. In Brazil, the internet there was horrendous. And I think I brought that bad mojo here to... studio in New York City because for some reason our player was acting a fool. We had to make some changes. I appreciate everyone in the back working very quickly to rectify these issues. That's the

reason why we're a little bit delayed this week. So I'm going to cut our intro very short. We have a lot to get to on this week. On this week's show, we have a ton of guests lined up and well you can read all about them on the live page right now. Hopefully you're able to watch this, listen to this, enjoy this and join us for what will be a very fun three and a half hour show. It's a special Tuesday edition of the show. Let's get right into it. First, let's go to the phone lines and welcome in our first guest of the day. His name is Ray Sefo. He is the president of World Series of Fighting. Had a very busy night on Saturday night in Las Vegas, Hussemaer, Paul Yaris, defeating Jake Shields, but it was not without controversy. We're going to talk to him about that and a whole lot more.

Ray, are you there? How you doing, brother? I'm doing great. Thank you very much for joining us, Ray. So like I said, a big night for you guys, in my opinion, it was one of, if not the best fight that you've ever put on in the short history of your promotion. But again, as is the case these days with Hussemaer Palliaris, not without controversy. So the world is very curious to know what are you going to do with Palliaris this time around? Is he going to face any kind of ramifications, punishments for his actions on Saturday night? Right, you know, after the fight, I mean, obviously viewing it live, there was, you know, there was a few times where I've seen Perhar's fingers, stick his fingers in Jake Shield's eyes.

And I didn't want to jump the gun, so I went straight home after the event. I logged on my computer and watched the whole fight. and 100% not only he did it once, twice or not, he did it numerous times, and he was worn by the referee on four different occasions. Now, the fact is that, you know,

he may say that he wasn't gouging his eyes, but the fact remains that your fingers are in Jake Scho's eyes, therefore it's illegal. And then the fact that he had that submission way too long, And after, I think, I count on the amount of times Jake Shields tapped was probably nine times. I count out of the amount of times that Steve Matagati tapped him on his back was like five, six times.

And so after sitting down with my team and reviewing it again, we've come, we've made a decision here that we're just a fighting that we're not only going to strip him off his title immediately. We are also suspending him indefinitely. Wow. And obviously, you know, the Nevada Commission is also doing their own investigation. So he is no longer the World Series of Fighting Welterweight Champion as of right now. Correct. How difficult of a decision was this for you or was it a no-brainer? Once you saw the tape, once you reviewed it, did you know right away that this is what you had to do?

Absolutely. You know, I'm always, I've been in conversation. for a long time. You know, I've been fighting for well over two decades. And I'm always going to be an advocate for fighters. And we need to look after our athletes and fighters. And, you know, this kind of behavior has to stop. And we've given, I was one of the people that came out on and also defending him on several occasions, as well as Ali. And I think we've given him more a fair chance. And also,

I'm not the only one that saw this. My team is not the only one that saw this. Thousands and thousands and thousands of years that tweeted saw this. So you can't deny the facts. And the facts are, you know, it was dirty, it wasn't right, and

this is the reason why which is a finding of standing by its decisions, by stripping off his title, and suspending him indefinitely. Ray, did you consider cutting him. We, you know, obviously right now, that's a part of that discussion, but, you know, we haven't really finalized that part of the year.

Okay, so is there a chance that you might cut him at the end of the day? I think right now, depending on what the Nevada Commission's decision is, I mean, the fact that he may never fight for us again. The fact that the Nevada Commission may suspend him for two, two, three, four years, you know what I mean, so I have no idea until such a time that the Athletic Commission has done with their investigation. We'll make another decision after that. Have you spoken to anyone in Nevada, in the Nevada Athletic Commission, Bob Bennett comes to mind about what they plan on doing to him? Do you have any idea at this point?

Not at this point. You know, I mean, we did speak to Bob, and right now, you know, the, you know, the, you know, the, The Nevada of the Commission is not going to make any statement until they view the tape and do some more research into the fight and then we will hear from them. Have you informed Husseemar of your decision? That has been, I mean, I spoke to Alex briefly yesterday. His manager, Alex Davis. Right.

Yeah. And I pretty much told him that that's, you know, that is that him getting stripped off his title and suspended and definitely is in the conversations of the team and that he would, you know, we would let him know today. Okay. And when you brought this up to him just out of curiosity, did he fight it? I mean, does he understand? I know Alex quite well at this point.

seems like a reasonable guy. Did he understand where you were coming from, or did he try to convince you to do otherwise? Well, he did try to convince me to do otherwise, but like I told Alex, if we're talking facts, facts are hundreds of thousands of people saw what,

what, who's in my barrage did in the cage. Hundreds of thousands of people saw him stick his fingers in the side. Now, you know, he can say that he wasn't, he can say that he didn't purposely gouging, trying to push his face.

But the fact is, his fingers were in his eyes, and that's illegal. You're not supposed to stick your fingers in someone's eyes. There's a photo of Jake who scratches around all his eyes. He had the referee wounded

four times about, I mean, twice he pulled him up. So, again, you know, he, and I like that I told Alex, I got nothing about,

you know, respect for Alex, but, um, and I had defended, Baharis from the beginning. And so, you know, after explaining to him, and he said that he kind of viewed the fight,

but he hadn't fully seen it yet. So, but yeah, he understood after the end of our conversation, he said, oh, he understands where I'm coming from, and he's going to go view the tape. Do you have any interest in having Steve Mazagati ref any of your fights ever again? Um, listen, I'd like him to see Masagardi, but, uh, you know, it's just, uh, sad that, um, he didn't do, well, in my opinion, and I'm sure a lot of other people and fans and out there, uh, should have taken a point or should have maybe even disqualified him, um, after being warned four times. Um, so, um, you know, uh, I think that's their, their commissioner.

decision to where Steve must have got to it goes from here on him. And is there going to be any monetary

fine involved? Will he be, you know, because I heard that Nevada withheld his his win bonus.

Do you know if they're going to That is true. Is that accurate and do you know if they're ever going to give it to him? That is correct.

He is his winning bonus. There's been without by the commission. And like I said, until the

investigation is done, I think then we will know exactly what's happening with that. Okay, and is World Series of Fighting going to fine him any amount? Not at this moment. Not at this moment. We're waiting for the Commission to make their final decision.

What are you going to do with the belt now? That's a good question. I mean, we have a strong 170 division. I mean, the economy is, usually economy is going down to 170, John Fitches in the loop, Jake Steers in the loop and there's a few others. And so I think we still have a strong 17-1-7, locked-away division.

So that Fitch Okami fight that was recently announced that will be happening later on this year, is that going to be for the vacant title? That hasn't been decided yet. That hasn't been decided yet. Well, no. Are you asking me if that fight itself is going to be the vacant final?

Well, since you have no champion now. No, that 100% will. not be. Right. That 100% that would not be a title fight. Okay. When you say suspended indefinitely, I mean, do you have a time frame in mind? Are we talking six months, a year? Because looking at his record, since he joined World Tourism Fighting, I mean, he fights every six to eight months. So, you know, in an MMA, a six-month suspension isn't really the biggest deal as opposed to, you know, baseball, basketball, et cetera. Right. Again, you know, this is a, Right now, he's suspended indefinitely until we hear what the Nevada Commission's decision is.

And again, you know, that investigation is still ongoing. I'm sure we will hear something from them by either the end of the street or sometime next week. Do you have any idea? Oh, go ahead. Sorry. For all we know, the Commission may suspend them for, from competition forever. We have no idea. Sure.

is there a chance that they overturn the the actual win and change it into a no contest no decision? Do you have any idea if they can do that or if they're planning on doing that? I don't know if they're planning on doing that, but I know that they can do that. They could overturn the decision, yes. Okay. Have you talked to Jake since this all went down? Do you know how he's feeling? Because as you mentioned, that picture of his eyes, pretty hard to look at.

I personally haven't spoken to Jake, but he has. And, you know, obviously he's disappointed, and Jake is going to go with what, you know, I believe he asked him how he was feeling and what he thought should be done. And he says that he's, he'll be happy with whatever we decide. So I know it's all very fresh, but perhaps he fights the winner of that Fitchokami fight for the vacant title. Are you a psychic hero? No, I'm just, it's not hard to put this together. man that you're fighting after them. Well, I'd like to fancy myself pretty smart at this stage.

No, you are very smart. You are a very smart man. Yeah, it's very possible. Very possible. Okay. I have to ask you about something else that happened that night because, you know, it was interesting. You guys went up against Ronda Rousey, who's a huge star,

yet a lot of people, for better or worse, we're talking about World Series of fighting after the fact because of Paul Harris and also because of this brawl that happened between teams, let's just call them Nate Diaz and team Chabibhna Maghamadov. Where were you when this all went down in the arena? Right in the middle of it. Wow. And who's

to blame, in your opinion? Um, I didn't actually see the beginning of this event, but I was told apparently Nate started something, uh, said something to Bajara's that he's walking out. Now, I'm hearing a lot of different, you know, conflicting stories.

stories, but the story that, the one part of that, of the story that's the same is that I heard the Diaz brothers started it. So I don't know exactly who started it, but what I did know is that I was in the middle of breaking it up and having to, you know, rush a few people up. Did anyone get seriously hurt? No, no, no. Okay. And is it true that the Diaz brothers have been banned from all WS.O. W.S. SOF events from here on out? That is correct.

Why? Because of what took place. I mean, that fight is our team wasn't quick enough to, to, because it did get out of hand. Yeah. And then, I mean, the security, the police had to come down. So, you know, there was something that, 100% we don't need that in our sport. And we don't need that kind of trouble. and especially when we're focusing on such a big show,

we don't need to be running because the actual main event started with me involved in this big fight trying to stop everything. I mean, you know, I don't want that. 100% I don't want to deal with that. Right. But are you 100% sure that they're solely responsible? Like, don't you think it's a little harsh to just outright ban them from your events? Well, I believe that Ali actually had told, I mean, I didn't talk to them, you know, because when they got ushered out by the security of the police, I didn't see them after that, but I believe Alis saw them afterwards, and Ali told them that they were banned from coming to our shows.

Okay. From your perspective, as president of this organization, was Saturday a good night for you guys or a bad night? You know, you received all this attention. You had some great performances. Marlon Marais, of course Nirmagamatov's brother fought, Polyaris, unfortunately, you know, his win now marred due to these controversies. How do you view Saturday night for you guys?

Because one can make the case that you receive more attention for this night than, you know, any of your previous events, but there was some bad stuff going on. Right, I mean, all in all, I think 99% was great. It was a great night. I mean, our first six fights

ended in the first of the second submissions, stoppages. So the night began really great. I think that just that last one the end of the evening changed the, you know, the cause of the night. But all in all, I think it was a great night. Do you feel like World Series needs to beef up security, do anything so that these kinds of brawls? Because, you know, it's, I know it's not 100% you know, on your shoulders, but it spilled outdoors into the, I guess, the corridor, the lobby. And that could be, I mean, that could be disastrous, people throwing things, right? Right. Right, right, exactly.

Yeah, we, the team have, we've actually discussed that in terms of having security, tightening up, and things like that. Absolutely. And so you look at this whole situation, you don't feel like it's a black, It's not a night that you're necessarily embarrassed about. You just feel like it was somewhat overshadowed. There were some great things, but unfortunately some negative things that are getting the attention here. Well, I think, like I said, all in all, I think it was a great night of fight. It was a great event.

Unfortunately, you know, a little bit of what happened towards the end. soon enough happened, but I think all on all it was a great lot of fights and the fans loved it. But, and also there was a lot of fans that, you know, went happy with what Baharas did. And hence the reason why the decision is the decision is now. I wonder if the office was divided at all there because of, you know, how egregious his were, were there people trying to get him cut from the organization? Were they making that case? Some were, yes.

But again, you know, that's, like I said, I think, depending on what the Nevada Commission does, and we'll see what we do, you know, what the final decision would be after that. So for now, you sit here, you say, okay, we're stripping him. he's suspended indefinitely we're going to wait for Nevada to rule on this and then we're going to act accordingly afterwards, right? Is that essentially where you stand right now? That's right. That is correct. Okay. And final thing, do you have any idea when, I know they have a hearing August 13th? Of course, I'm assuming you want to see this resolved as quickly as possible.

Do you know if you will be on that docket or you're going to have to wait the following month? I'm not sure. I couldn't answer that for you. we probably would hear from the commission at some stage, either this week or next year. Okay. But you probably do want to get this resolved as soon as possible, right? Yeah, absolutely. Yes, absolutely. Okay.

Well, Ray, I appreciate it. I know it's not the most fun subject to discuss, but I commend you guys for acting swiftly and for doing probably something. I mean, he's a dominant champion and, you know, sometimes in combat sports, right, controversy sells. and you probably stand to gain something by, you know, trotting him out there for his next fight sooner rather than later. But I guess from a fighter's perspective, which is where you're coming from, enough's enough, right?

Right, exactly. And, you know, I think the saddest part of this is that the guy is a great fighter. Yeah. It's just unfortunate that he doesn't, listen, when Jake Scheld is tapping you nine times, and the referee is tapping you six, seven times, and literally pulling you off. I mean, that's just, that's where people are going to get hurt.

We're in a sport. We're not in, you know, in a war that we have to eliminate people. And I've had 101 fights. No, one time have I ever, ever been, you know, disqualified or being told that or whether I was a very five. or not. So, you know, I think he really needs to maybe at some point talk to somebody. Yeah. Do you think that there's something going on up there? I mean, this is not his first defense. Do you think that there's, you know, an issue, a mental issue that he's dealing with?

Maybe perhaps he just should not be fighting. I don't know. I think that's, I think that's something that, you know, I'm not an expert in that field. So I think he, you know, he needs to speak to somebody. And then they'll be able to tell us exactly what the issue is. You know, when you talk to the guy outside of the case, he seems like a very polite, very nice guy. But when he's in there, something triggers, and I don't know what that is. And so, like I said, you know, I'm not interested at it, and so I think he needs to talk to someone. Yeah, well said.

Very unfortunate. We appreciate you coming on, Ray. all the best to you in the organization and thanks for the time today. Thank you. I appreciate it. There he is. Sugar Ray Sefo, the president of World Series of Fighting, having to make a very tough decision. I know a lot of people were hoping that they would act swiftly, that they would punish Hussemaer, Poliaris, once and for all for his actions.

They have done so. Let us know if you're happy with their decision. All right, let's move along now. And on Saturday night, UFC 190, of course, all eyes were on Rhonda Ravis. but a very important fight in the strawweight division took place. Claudia Gadellia defeated Jessica Aguilar to now become the number one contender in the strawweight division. So we had to call upon our good friend, Yohanna Janjachech, the strawweight champion, the budding superstar, the fighter's fighter, as Ronda Rousey put her, to get her thoughts on Saturday night's big win for Claudia Gidellia.

And she joins us right now via the phone. Yohanna, are you there? Hi, hi, hi. Hello, everyone. I'm here. Thank you so much once again for the time. And I understand you're on vacation right now, so I really appreciate you coming on the show today.

No problem. Did you watch the fight on Saturday? Yeah, I did. I did watch Rondal's fight and Claudia's fight. So yeah, it was pretty good show. All right, let me ask you about Claudia first. What did you make of her performance? Were you impressed?

Yeah, she did well. She's very strong. This is what I said before. And I say that she's like one of the best. in my division, but she didn't respect that because she was talking about this decision and other shit. So, but yeah, yeah, I'm happy for her that she win, you know, like I'm happy. Like she did great job and yeah, that's all. So Jessica Gila, she said that she's number one in the Strohye division.

She's one of, she told that she's one of the best, but she's not. So, yeah. Are you happy that Klaj is the one? Yeah, I want to fight with Gadela, you know, but I think she lost with me and she should have other fight before tighter shot. But, you know, it's Dana's choice and I'm very happy. I'm ready for her. So in a perfect world, you'd prefer her to fight one more time before facing you?

Sure. There are other girls who have two wins, you know. So, yeah. Anyone comes to my? But I don't care, really. I don't care. I'm the best. And, you know, I think we're going to give good fight with Godella, but I'm going to win. But she did very well. So, like, yeah. So a lot of people, you know, when talking about this rematch, bring up the fact that it was a very close fight when you fought in December. And I actually had a debate with someone about this saying that, you, you know,

have grown exponentially since that fight in December. Not only are you champion now, you've now won twice since then, your confidence is on a different level. Do you believe that you are the same fighter who fought her back in Phoenix in December? No, I'm different, you know. I did a few steps forward, and that's the most important thing, you know. I'm better fighter, you know. Do you think she's a better fighter?

Yes, and not. She had just one fight. And that's all, you know. She did well. She's very strong, but that's all, you know. I have more arguments. But I have lots of respect together, I and, yeah, that's all. So you have become very good on the microphone.

After your win over Jessica Penae and in interviews, you've also been able to gather a very large following because of, you know, how you present yourself in interviews and on the mic, what did you make of her call out, what she said to you, to the camera on the microphone, right after the win. You know, she was very respectful, so I like it so much, and this is what I want, you know. I'm like, I'm respecting, like, everyone, you know, and this is what I want from my opponents.

So you had no problem with her. You had no problem with her saying I'm the best and all that stuff. No, no, I'm going to prove that I'm the best. I'm really champion, you know. Where do you stand as far as your broken thumb is concerned? Tomorrow I will go back home because I still on vacation, but I will meet my doctor. I will make x-ray and we'll see. How do you feel right now?

How is it healing? I feel very good, you know. I feel like I could fight even tomorrow, you know. I'm ready for all of them, you know. You're anxious to get back in there? Yeah. Did they give you a timeline? Did they say, I know you say that you're...

No, they didn't. They didn't. It's up to me and my success. So what would you, what would you prefer in a perfect world? When would you like to fight again? I'd like to fight on the end of the year, like December or on the beginning of 2016. We will see. I don't know. Maybe, I don't know. Is it safe to assume that you want this next fight to be in the United States? You seem to really like fighting in the U.S. Yeah, I really like it.

So I'm really enjoying the U.S., so, yeah, could be nice. I really love the idea, and I know Dana White mentioned putting the Ronda Rousey fight on the undercard, the co-main event of Connor versus Aldo, but I love the idea of Ronda in the main event, and then you and the co-main event, the two women champions, dominant champions together on the same card. What do you make of that idea? I was super happy when I heard about, so, yeah. You like this? So, yeah, I like it so much.

Okay, so let's talk about Rhonda. What did you make of her performance? This is what I said. I said that she's going to win in first run, that she's going to finish Becky and she did it, you know. She's simply the best, you know. Does she inspire you? Like when you watch her dominate,

you say, I want to do the same. I want to finish my opponents in 30 seconds, blow through everyone like she's doing? Yeah, but we both. We're the same, you know. and like we're crazy in the octagon you know me and ronda we are really the same you know so that's all and i'm happy for her and i can see my head myself when she's fighting in the octagon you know so that's all so when we had you we had you in studio around a month ago and you were going to the rebuk press conference

the following day you got to meet ronda finally right yeah i was super happy you know i couldn't believe you know i even didn't know what to talk about But I was super happy, you know, and what I had, that she was super happy too. So, yeah. She told... Maybe we could train together. Yeah. Would you like that?

Would you want to go to Glendale, train with her? Yeah, why not? Why not? I would like to be back to U.S. September. So I would like to visit some gyms and train a little bit before I'm going to start my camp in Poland. Yeah. Why not? I could visit Toronto's gym and we could train together.

Wow, that would be something. That would be incredible. Are there other gyms that you're thinking about visiting as well? Yes, but I want to talk about right now. Okay, fair enough. I heard from her that she told Dana White that if there was one person she can meet at this press event, the Reebok one, last month, it was you. She really wanted to meet you. What did she say to you when she saw you?

She was super happy. She couldn't believe. And we both, like, we didn't know what to talk. about you know but we were super happy and that's all you know like pretty big deal you know even right now I can feel like really nice you know yeah it's amazing to get that kind of respect from a fellow champion right yeah that's true um okay so so here we are end of August hopefully you'll return to action December early January and and it feels to me like every time you fight now.

Maybe faster, we don't know. Maybe faster, even better. It feels to me... I'm gonna check my... Yeah. Go ahead. I'm gonna check my dump into days and we will see.

So it feels to me like even... Big things are coming. Oh. I like surprise, so yeah. Why not? That's actually what I was going to ask you about. It feels like even in the last month, your star has grown exponentially.

You've been in the US. You were there at International Fight Week. You went to, you know, you went to the events and all that stuff. Are you starting to feel like, wow, Things have really changed for me because just seeing the way the fans talk about you, but more importantly, the way your fellow fighters talk about you, they truly are in awe and really impressed with you.

Do you get that impression as well? Yeah, yeah, I like that, but I still focus on training and I want to be back and train more and learn more and be better fighter. And I promise to all of you that my next fight is going to be better than the last one. And yeah, I promise to you. That's all what I can say. Have you started to envision dream about the Klaugia rematch? And if so, how do you see it going down?

No, I'm going to do my best. I'm the best. I'm the champion. I'm going to do my best and I'm going to win this fight, that's all. You know, like I said, I'm better fighter than before. She did just one fight. I did two fights. And, yeah.

Do you feel like this proves that Jessica Aguilar, who some said was number one before this fight, does this prove that she was overrated? I knew it. I know that she's not ready for us, for the best fighters, for the best throwaway fighters. The best fighters are in the EFC. EFC is simply the best organization. So, you know, that's all. So do you believe that she was overrated?

Claudia, so, yeah, that's all. Do you believe she was overrated that people thought too highly of her because she wasn't fighting? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And now? That's true. Claudia has proven otherwise.

Have you started to look at the rest of the division? Do you feel like there are other people coming up? Are you, you know, Joanna, excuse me, Joanne Calderwood won recently. That was a pretty, you know, fun fight. You know, Tisha Torres. She's doing very well. They're talking about Rose, but she didn't fight for a long time. So we will see.

What was the best part of this last month for you, traveling the States, meeting people? Is there one moment that... Yeah, I really enjoyed the U.S. So it was amazing to meet all my fans. Friday was very nice. Is there one moment that sticks out? One special moment? Last month.

Yeah. I don't know. But I could meet my fans in the U.S. It was pretty amazing. Yeah. Did you find that you were surprised by how popular you were in the U.S. from the fans? Yeah, I was. I was.

Yeah. It's amazing. I'm super happy, you know. I'm happy person. and happy athlete, you know. That's all. More kicks? I've got so many supporters.

More kicks since we last saw you? What? Did you get more kicks? Yes, sure. I've got some from Dana, Lorenzo. So they deliver it to Poland. Wow. I'm very happy.

Yeah. So I cannot wait when I will get home and I'm going to open the boxes, you know. All right. Well, I'll let you go because again, I know you're on vacation. It really means a lot to us and we're greatly appreciative of the fact that you took some

time out from your vacation to join us. It was great to hear from you again. Enjoy the rest of your time off. All what I can say. So Claudia, you did well and I'm going to train hard. You train hard. We're going to give good fight. But I'm going to

see a champion and that's all what I can say. But, you know, I'm full of respect to everyone, so even to Claudia Gadela, you know. very well thank you yanna really appreciate it so much bye bye good luck to you there she is the ufc strawweight champion joanna young jacek joining us from her vacation very nice of her to do so really looking forward to that fight that is a huge huge fight in the strawweight division a great rematch of a great fight that took place in phoenix back in december okay before we get to our next guest let me read

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They fought once in Columbus. That was in Strike Force. March of 2012, they fought again at UFC 168 after the ultimate fighter. and now it seems like we're going to get a third fight. Of course, Misha Tate was just an action, so the timing works out perfectly for her. She defeated Jessica I in Chicago, UFC on Fox, number 16. And that was a fight that, of course, she started off a little slow,

as we talked about with her coach Robert Follis last week, was able to pick up the pace later in the first round and really put it on Jessica throughout the next two rounds. A great win for her. She's on a winning streak. She has by far defeated the best that the Bantamweight division right now in the UFC has to offer, other than, of course, Ronda Rousey, and that's why she is in this position, it's hard to argue that really anyone in the UFC right now,

so we're excluding Cyborg in the UFC deserves it more than her, defeating Liz Karmouche for a unanimous decision, UFC on Fox in April of 2014, defeated Rinn Nikai, defeated Sarah McMahon, and then most recently defeated Jessica I in Chicago, now she joins us on the line. Misha, are you there? Yes, I am.

Hey, Misha, how are you? Thanks for the time today. So I'll ask you the same question I just asked, Joanna, did you watch UFC 190 on Saturday? And if so, what did you make of Ronda's performance? I did watch it, of course. I had a little bit of a best interest as far as thinking that supposedly

I'm supposed to be the next-in-line. But, you know, I thought she looked really good. I thought she looked improved. And, you know, she, yeah, I mean, she's been working on her striking, and you can definitely tell that. There wasn't really much else to, you know, be able to go off of it. It was a pretty quick fight, which I kind of anticipated. I actually thought, though, that she might finish it at the end of the first round.

So, you know, she really wanted to punish Fetch, but, you know, Fetch ended up going down, like, a sack of stato before I think Ronda could really punish her. the way she wanted to, so I think she actually finished a fight quicker than she had hoped to. You know, it's not often. You just fought, Just Guy, you dropped her, but it wasn't, you know, a

knockout like that where you see someone face-planned. It's not often that we see that in the women's bantam weight division. Were you surprised that she finished her in that fashion? You know, I thought that Ronda could probably do that to bet. I, you know, I'm going to be

honest, because I really thought that that she's in over her head and I know that I said that, you know, and you always want to give everyone the benefit of doubt, but I really think, especially after seeing that, that, you know, she just didn't hold the candle through her on it, didn't stand a chance, you know, and it just showed in that performance, you know. So I thought, you know, I didn't expect to be so fast. I didn't, you know, I thought it was probably going to be more like a key tail.

I thought she'd take her down, mount her and just elbow her until the rest, you know, decided you want to pull her up. But I, no, I didn't, I didn't expect her to go out there, and finish it in that fashion, but I thought that that, she's capable of that, if that makes me sense, given the matchup,

and, you know, I feel like that's such a big difference of the skill set of, you know, either girl. And athleticism, just your athleticism. Of course.

I know there's no love loss between you two, but is this one of those strange cases where you were actually rooting for Rhonda to win so you can get your third crack at her? I actually kind of really did want Ronda to win. I just think it's a bigger fight,

a better, and like I said, I just, I didn't feel, you know, I knew that if I thought bench, I was like, you know, I'm going to beat her and, you know, that that's a fast track way to the title because she was undeceited, you know, but I ended up with Jessica I and, you know, she just goes to show you. I think that she wasn't on that level, like I said, like I had been saying. So, yeah, with that being said, you know, but I think that, I think Jessica was a really solid opponent and, you know, she was hard to finish. And I think now that maybe if those two fought, you know, I think that Jessica wins that fight. I think Jessica would have been a tougher fight for Ronda also. So just so I have it clear, you think if Jessica fights Ronda, Jessica beats her? No, I'm sorry. If Jessica fights Betch.

Okay, okay. Yeah, I think that Jessica wins. I think she's a better fighter. So it doesn't sound like you rate Betch Goha very high? No. I don't. I mean, I'm not trying to be rude. I'm just trying to be honest. You know, I really don't think that she is, you know, that good yet. I think she really was more full of herself than, you know, anything else.

And she was really trying to hype herself to. You know, I give her all the credit in the world for really trying to get her head in the game. You know, I think she had every intention of going out there and winning, and I think she really believed it. But I think, like I said, she was just treading in two deep of water and was just in over her head. you know that when fighting someone like ronda the mental side of the game is is a very important part of what goes into fighting her and you can't sometimes lose the fight before we ever actually throw a punch did you get the impression from her behavior at the way ins the yelling and all that

and then from her behavior walking to the cage and in the cage that she was you know like she was a little like there's two sides of the coin there are two extremes in my opinion there's bj pin at UFC 118 who was like stoic and couldn't move and just seemed in a different world. And then there was Batch on Saturday who just seemed too fidgety, too nervous, had a crazy amount of nervous energy. Did you get that impression as well? Yeah, actually. I think that she, you know, that's just a really hard person for me to read.

And I don't know if, you know, partially was because of the language barrier. But, you know, I didn't really understand her tactics of wanting to attack around her so much. And, you know, if there's a time that I felt actually kind of bad for Rhonda, like, kind of sympathized with her, it was in this fight because I really thought that Betch overstep, you know, some personal boundaries that she just shouldn't. You know, I mean, Ron and I are probably never going to get along, you know, or probably never going to, you know, be friends necessarily. But there's a certain amount of respect that I think one minute should have for each other, you know, as for fighters, if nothing more, you know what I mean? You have that amount of respect for each other. And then no matter how much you just like, oh, and there's certain personal lines you just don't cross. And I think that she did that.

And so I think she got what was coming to her. But as far as her nervous energy, like, I didn't know what to think of it, you know, but I just thought, you know, it's not going to really help her. I didn't think that screaming at Rhonda and acting like that, you know, acting kind of childish and, you know, a little bit arrogant, is what's going to help, you know. I was like, this girl's really, like, really asking for it. And, I mean, I was kind of like, oh, it's going to be a, you know. It's going to be a painful night for her.

You know, it's amazing seeing what Rhonda generates as far as media is concerned and the amount of people, celebrities and big-time mainstream outlets, you know, what they're saying about her, how they're covering her. Are you surprised at all of this? Dana White said afterwards that this event was training higher than 189. It seems like everyone under the sun, people who never talk about MMA, are talking about Ronda Rousey right now. Does this surprise you? Well, no, because she's been doing incredible things. She's been doing things that no one else has been able to do a man, you know, man or women yet.

So it's like if anybody deserves a lot of credit, you know, really, rightfully so, she deserves it. You know, she's worked her ass off and, you know, since she's all she has been doing phenomenal things, and she's amazing, and I think for enemy it's good, and I think for women, and women's in particular, it's really good, you know. Now, the problem is that, you know, it's been amazing to watch for, you know, take out girls so quickly and demolish. you know, the division so far, but people are going to soon, I feel like, start wondering, like, well, you know, if I really spent $60 to watch a 30-second site, or else, is there anyone out there that can give her a challenge? And I want to be, you know, that person is like, you know what, I will buy that because

I know that that's going to be one-hull-fine, and I know that you should be, like, she actually has a chance to be around the shelf. And I think that a lot of fans you see it that way, you know, so I know a lot of people think, oh, there's a way in the computer. A lot of people think, like, there's a chance they're a computer. I personally think I have a really good chance to be here. But, you know, we've got to get some competition here. We've got to get these girls to step up their game.

And, you know, that's exactly what I plan on doing. I'm, I'm already, I was already training, like, before, you know, even a week was out. You know, I've already been back to the gym. I'm at an all-time high with my confidence, and I've had an all-time high with my motivation. So, you know, this is it. And, you know, if that fight is to happen, you know, which my manager said, They have yet to get a call confirming that from the UFC, so I definitely don't want to get ahead of myself.

Yeah. You know, but it's that, you know, I know Dana says a lot of things, but sometimes those don't always come to fruition. So I don't want to get my help stuff too much, but, you know, that's what I'm hoping for, and if that's the case, then, you know, we've got to do it. We've got to do it big. But for the record, you like that idea, right?

If they did put that fight in a co-main event, Connor, Aldo, Cowboy Stadium, even if it's not Cowboy Stadium, that's a gigantic fight. would you would you be okay with that scenario? Absolutely. I think that would be great. I think that would be one of the biggest paper views ever in history. It's not, you know, pulling or the other ones out of the water.

So, you know, that's a win for me. You know, if I could fight Rhonda and it's, you know, an amazing card like bad to make it so much sweeter, you know, when I go out there and take the title. So let's say it happens in December at the earliest. That's in four months from now. You know, you have to be careful. You're already training, you said.

know you're not going, you know, full steam ahead, but, uh, and I know you're very motivated and you want that third crack at her, but is there a part of you that says, or maybe your coaches are telling you this, like you have to be careful with not over-exerting yourself because it is, you know, at the earliest, four months away. No, none of my coaches have told me, you know, um, that, you know, I have to be careful over-exerting myself. Uh, I feel like they know that I've been doing this long enough, you know, I've been fighting since I was 19, so my birthday's in two weeks, so I'll be 29, so.

Happy birthday. 10 years. Thank you. And so it's, you know, it's one of the things that I know, you know, I know what I'm doing. I'm working on the right things right now. I'm not working, you know, I'm not working to kill myself. I'm not working to peak too soon. I'm staying in good shape.

And, you know, working on developing a skill set that I would need to beat anyone, you know, not just not just drawn it because, like I said. And so something's written in paper or we get a call saying, hey, this is exactly what's happening. You know, it could be anyone that I'm fighting next. You never know around a, you know, maybe. have different plan. I don't know. So I'm just training now because I know that I'm one step closer to, you know, potentially becoming a world champion and I have to train like a world champion. I can have to train like I've never trained before and do things that I've never done. You know,

if I want a different outcome than I had before, and I've got to do something different. And that's exactly what I'm doing. As you know, there are always going to be two sides of the coin. People are going to say, well, we saw this fight twice already. She lost. Why does she deserve a third crack? Can you tell the world, why this Misha Tate, who, you know, hopefully gets that shot at Ronda Rousey in the near future is a different fighter than the one who fought her in the previous two fights? Yeah, well, for one

thing, I've been beating everyone else who could potentially deserve a shot, so you can't tell me that there's a single girl out there that deserves it more than I do right now. I'm confident saying that because I told everyone that I would work my way back to the title, and I would earn that, and I have. You know, I've done it, and if there's someone else that people are questioning, It's like, hey, you know, well, what about this girl?

She might deserve it more than, okay, I'll take her out too. You know, that's what I did. I beat all the, you know, the best girls, the four-fight win streak. And I also am I only one to, you know, even get Rhonda a fight so far. I think I've already proven that I have something that so far, none of the other girls in the division have been able to prove that they have or they possess. So taking Rhonda into the third round is, you know, there's no easy feat. But that gives me so much more confidence.

I think, and knowing what it feels like to be in there with her and knowing, you know, what I'm up against, giving me an insurmountable amount of confidence because I know exactly what I'm getting into, you know, and I know that I'm evolving. I know that Rhonda's evolving, but that feel when I'm in there with her, it's different than fighting anybody else. And I just know that I'm more prepared for that than I've ever been. I know that my striking is definitely evolving. I know that, you know, I've been becoming a better athlete. in training more strength, you know, strength training programs and things like that.

So I just, you know, I really feel like things happen for a reason. And I know this last camp, you know, I had a few injuries that I was working through, you know, as many of us do in our camps. And it didn't allow for pretty much any wrestling until it was very, very, like, the last week of camp. So, you know, the wrestling was a little bit rusty, but it forced me to work on other aspects of my game, like the striking. And I got really so really good and really confident in my striking.

And that's the necessary tool to have, you know, it's a matter of whom I'm fighting. So definitely feel like I'm better with that and able to deliver those tail punches. You know, I'm able to deliver a lot of power behind him, and I'm able to do that for a much longer period of time than I ever was before. So obviously you believe that you've gone better. Do you think she's gone better since you fought her the second time? I do. I think that Ronda's striking has gotten better also, you know, and that she's evolving.

But I think I'm catching up to her as far as, like, being a better athlete. You know, I think that that's one thing she had a huge advantage is that the type of training, you know, having the experience being in the Olympics and the Olympic training center and things like that, you know, and the kind of programs that they put those elite level afters on. I didn't have that before, and, you know, I thought I was doing it right, and, you know, I was doing a lot of circuit training, but there's a lot of other things that I didn't know, and now that I feel like I'm training at Phase 1 sports, they have, you know, elite football players coming through their boxers, I mean, all different kinds of athletes, and I feel like

that has made a huge difference. I think I possess a very high skill set, and, you know, it's just a matter of being able to do what I know that I'm capable of doing and not getting tired and not, you know, fading away and being able to push that much harder. And I think that's going to make a huge, huge difference. The biggest mystery in sports right now might be how do you beat Ronda Rousey. Can you answer that question for me? I think, well, I mean, I don't know how to answer the question because I haven't done it yet.

But do you know the formula? Nobody knows the formula. I mean, there's no formula to beat anybody, you know. no, I mean, there's no sure-safe answer. There's no, you know, hey, you can only do it this way. I mean, it's just one of those things, I guess that's a beautiful thing about fighting is you don't really know exactly how to do it. I mean, you could try to make a game plan.

You can try to do everything you can, but in an instant, it could all change. You know, I had a game plan for Sarah McMahon, but, you know, when she knocked me down, well, that certainly changed, you know what I mean? What I had to do at that moment of time to continue on to be able to finish the fight, And that's another strength that I have and that I know that I have is the ability to adapt in any situation and time my way through it, you know. And that's what got me into the third round of Geronorowsy is being able to make changes on a fly and have that experience to be able to do that and figure it out. So, you know, no, there's no, there's no, for sure, formula to beat anybody. But I think that I am definitely the closest so far.

and it motivates me and it makes me very, very confident. Your coach Robert Follis was on the show last week, and I was talking to him about the slow start against Jessica I, and he mentioned, you know, when does Misha not start slow? This has been something that has plagued you throughout your career. Do you know how to rectify this, or is that just going to be something that you're going to have to overcome each and every time you fight?

Well, I disagree with saying that I had a slow start with Jessica. I would say I had a slow start with Sarah McMahon. I had a slow start with Liz Carmouche. But I didn't have a slow start with Jessica. I had a rough start. I came at her and I was swinging. I was just swinging and missing. And she was, you know, counterstrike.

But, you know, we saw the same thing with Rhonda. It's just that, excuse me, that, you know, Rhonda came out. She swung with a big right hand and she completely missed and was, like, very sideways. And actually gave, oh, my gosh, I'm going to be a bet. the angle, but Batch just isn't as polished and as good, in my opinion, at striking as Jessica I is, Jessica capitalized on it.

And, you know, Betch kind of ran away like, oh, I don't want to get too close to Ronda. I said, I mean, it's just, we're going to get two different fighters, but really, you look at the way both Rana and I came out. It was almost identical. It came out and both through, like, blazing right hands and missed. So, you know,

I didn't start slow against Jessica. I really wanted to come out and have a, you know, a, a, you know, performance for all three rounds, but it was just kind of a rough start because I didn't quite find my distance, and so I landed that right hand that dropped her, so you know, I figured it out in the fight

that I was a little bit too far away, and then it needed to step in, and that I would hit her, and I didn't. It's amazing that here we are on the verge of a third fight between you two. I recall way back when, many moons ago, both you and Rhonda were on my show before that first fight was announced, and you were going back and forth

one of the great moments in the history of our program, and, you know, at the time you said, she just didn't have the resume to get a title shot, and there was certainly a case to be made for that as far as pro-MMA is concerned. Is it fair to say that she has exceeded your expectations, that she turned out to be a better fighter than you thought originally? Yeah, because it's hard to predict the future, you know, when her and I were fighting, I just, you know,

felt like there were, like, you know, I told you this many times, felt like there were other girls at the time, that, you know, like, Sarah Hoffman that had, like, this really great records and had proven themselves to be number one contenders at that time. And, you know, Rhonda was doing great things already, but, you know, she still wasn't, like, in my opinion, like, as proven as the other girls. But, you know, she got the title fight. She beat me.

So, you know, clearly, you know, she was on that level and she was ready. So there's, you know, there's nothing I can argue about that. You know, I was wrong at that time to make that assessment. But as far as what she's done, since then, you know, she's done, I don't think anyone could have predicted, you know, what she would be able to do in this division and what she would be able to do. and for M&A and how she would be able to change it. So, I mean, definitely surprising. But it's like one of those things that when I see her accomplishing those things, I feel more motivated for myself because I'm like, you know, if she could do it,

you know, she's amazing, yeah, but she's a woman, you know, she has two arms, two legs, and, you know what I mean? She's just another woman. Like, why can't I do that? Like, why can't I be capable of that? And why can't I work harder and become better and close that gap and test myself against one of the best in the world? You know, I think that I'm perfectly capable of it and I'm going to do everything. I'm going to work my ass off like never before.

And I'm going to bring everything that I have. And, you know, confidence is a huge, huge asset. And I think that's one of the biggest attributes that Rhonda also says that's amazing amount of confidence. But I feel finally that I'm on that level with my confidence. confident. And I was confident before. You know, I found like, yeah, you know, I could meet her. But it's like this time, it's just like I just feel in my soul. I feel it in my heart.

Like, I know that this is the time. It's right now. And I really believe that the third time's the charm is if that's what's the store for me next. And, you know, if it's someone else, then bring them on and I'll pick them out too. And I will work my way. I will get my, I will, I will get my title

shot and people will want to do that that side of care and care. Two last quick things, and we appreciate the time very much. Do you feel like you have to go out there and stump for this? I know you said you'd be ready to fight, you know, anyone else, but of course you want that shot because there's still that cyborg thing lingering. Is there a part of you that is afraid that she might jump over you in the line? Well, I don't think so at this point just because I know 135 is going to be a big challenge there,

and especially now that they're, I think they're going to be implementing that no-I-B thing in October. I mean, I don't know how she's going to make it to that. So I don't think so, but, you know, we'll see. You know, potentially a fight between her and I know I said that I would agree to that. I won't 40, so yeah, that would be interesting. So we'll see what happens. And, of course, leading up to the first fight, it was emotional for many different reasons, leading up to the second fight with the Ultimate Fighter and the World Tour and all that.

Again, a pretty emotional affair. You extended your hand. She didn't want to shake it. We know the story. are you anticipating the same kind of roller coaster of emotions? Do you want to try to avoid that? Are you going to try to get in their head? I mean, this is, I would imagine, a very draining process to fight someone who, you know, you consider a rival you have such a history with.

That's something that you have to prepare for mentally as well. How are you going to approach it this time around? It's always an emotional roller coaster because there's so much invested into it. You know, I mean, think about yourself when you're watching one of your favorite fighters or someone who makes you know, personal. you know, a friend of yours and you're set on the couch, you're invested in that fight and all that emotion that goes into it. You're cheering for your person and, you know, I mean, it's like that you get that many roller coaster of emotions during a fight that you're just watching that you're invested in. Just imagine if you are the athlete yourself and you've been emotionally invested in this for, you know, for us, it's not pulling on ears, you know. So, I mean, it's always, it's always a challenge emotionally.

That's another thing, figuring yourself out and how to strengthen yourself and find, you know, find the other person. weaknesses. So, you know, I don't have a plan for it. You know, I don't want to get, you know, too excited until I know for sure that that is what's going to happen, what's going on. But, no, I'm not planning it. I know that I, I know that I can deal with it. I know that I've been there a million times before with Ronda and plenty of times that we've had to interact or, you know, lack there of interacting. But, you know, it is, it is what it is. And I'm prepared for it your way. Appreciate the time very much, Misha.

Thank you so much for coming on and being so honest with your thoughts and feelings. Good luck getting the fight and, of course, good luck in training for it. I appreciate it. Thanks, Ariel. Okay, there she is. Misha Tate. Really appreciate her time. Thank you very much to her manager as well, Josh Jones, who is great to work with in securing

Misha Tate. We appreciate his efforts as well very much. That's a big fight. Even if you don't want to see it, it will make a lot of money. I can assure you of that. a lot of people do want to see it. And there's definitely an argument to be made, Misha versus Cyborg, but I don't think there's an argument to be made Misha versus anyone else in that division. She's beat them all. And Julianna Pena might be coming up. Holly Home might be coming up, but I don't

think they're there quite yet. So we'll see what happens. All right, let's move along. Let's go to our next guest now. I've been wanting to have him on the show for quite some time. We have finally secured him after a very long trip back home from Rio. He is joining us right now via the phone, we're talking to Michael Lunardelli, the head of combat for Reebok. Very excited about this. Michael, are you there? I'm here. Can you hear me? Finally. We finally got you, my friend. Thank you so much for the time. So you're back home from Rio, and I want to ask you something that I threw out there yesterday in the midst of this Ronda mania, rousy mania, if you want to call it that, just like I think it was worth it. Whatever that price tag was for the UFC when they bought Strike Force, when Zoufers,

of Bot Strike Force, just to have Rhonda. Forget about everyone else who's amazing in their own right and they're worth it as well, but just that one fighter made the deal worth it for them. I feel like the Reebok deal for you guys, from your perspective, whatever that price tag is, was worth it just to be associated with this trailblazer with this pioneer

named Ronda Rousey. Is that a crazy thought? Well, it's not. You know, it's funny you say that. We started talking Ronda about a year ago, and when we first started, you know, we were in contract negotiations. We hadn't signed the deal yet with the UFC that didn't happen until December 2nd.

We announced Rhonda right around that same time, but we had started negotiations, at least speaking, or well before that. And the thinking was at the time, remember, she wasn't the rocket star she is right now. I mean, she's just,

she's out of this planet. I mean, her fighting style is amazing. I mean, there's nothing she can't do out there. But at that time, and it's more than that. Obviously,

she's gotten into the entertainment side of the business, and there's so many things she's doing. She's getting out there, and that's great. But when we talked to her back then she was just a really good fighter. And we were really interested in her for a couple reasons. One was because she's got a great story. Rhonda's story, if you go through, like, everything she's been through to get to where she is,

it's incredibly compelling. It's really human, you know. And I had a chance to sit with her sisters in her mom the other night down in Rio and really chat with them and get to know them a lot better. And, you know, they're just regular people. And Rhonda, though, was pushed through all the things that have happened in her life, and she's made herself into this incredible fighter. and also a great person.

So we knew we liked Rhonda as a fighter, and we liked how hard she trained, and we knew all that about her. And then when we actually got her in here to talk to her, we realized that there was a lot more to Rhonda, just that. So she was the first, officially the first two of the first two of the first two of the deal with the UFC. We had two other fighters already under contact with Anthony Peders and Johnny Hendricks,

but she was the first one we signed as part of this new deal. And, you know, man, we couldn't have picked a better person, could we? So I know you're a very smart man. You didn't get to where you are today without being very smart. And you've done a lot for Reebok and the other brands that you have worked for and spearheaded. And I know you don't live under a rock. So can you tell us, can you characterize for us the state of the relationship now with the UFC? Of course, things have happened along the way that some fans have been very upset about.

Some fighters have been very upset. Are you happy with where things stand right now on this August 4th, 2015? Yeah, well, you know, I don't know how smart I am, but, you know, I've been involved in other businesses like this. I came from business with our sports license division as part of Adidas group. We were running the NFL product team, and I was running our NBA business. So I've been working with leagues for a long time in organization, so I'm used to doing that. Do you see a perfect fit for us, you know, and for a lot of different reasons? I mean, the first thing is, and I think I've told you this before, we're a fitness and training brand,

And we're already really good at doing that. We want to be the best in the world. And that's really the motorist operandi for why we're doing this and which way we're going here. We're looking at this thing. We're saying, wow, there's like 35 million plus people in the world that train like fighters, whether it's boxing classes or kickboxing or they're doing MMAs, partly for fitness. And 10 million of them are in the U.S., and that kind of aligns with our brand. So, you know, in order to be validated or authentic in this space, we're good at making training and fitness products.

We're great at that, but we needed to be specialists in combat, and that's different. As you know, the movement stuff that Fred just go through, the training they go through, it's a little bit different than all the sports. I think it's much more aggressive. It's much tougher. So when we're looking at that, we're saying, you know, to be specialists, we've got to get access to people that can kind of help us with this. You know, we've got to come in somewhat humble.

We've got to know that this thing's to learn. We've got to know that, yeah, we do certain things great in the fitness realm, but this is a little bit different, right? So we've got to work with coaches, we've got to work with trainers, and we've got to work with fighters. So the UFC was out, and they were pitching a deal. They wanted someone to come in and kind of help elevate the sport. And we all want the sport to be elevated.

I think, you know, everybody wants that. And so, you know, we started talking to them, and we started thinking about how this could help us as a brand, how this could help us get to those fitness enthusiasts that are training this way. And it was a perfect fit, you know. And just being down in Brazil, I found that out firsthand.

I mean, the people that I get exposed to and get to talk to me and my team, Rafael Cardero, you know, we talked to Shogun Hoor, and we had a little talk with Anson Silver. You know, you're coming across one athlete after another that among the greatest in the world, and how they train is amazing. We signed Jacques-Rae, we announced that down in Brazil, really excited about that partnership with him.

So there's things that we're going to learn from the fighters, and we're going to learn from the coaches and that trainers, that we could only get if we're involved in this all the way. We've got to be all the way in. We can't just be on the outside trying to work with one or two here or there. We've got to go all the way in. And I think the U.S. CF4 just that opportunity to do that.

You know, there's also a merchandising side of the business and there's a business piece of it, of course, is all that. But the day-to-day stuff we're working with fighters and we're learning how to build the best products out there. That's what our focus is on. That's it. And I think, again, we signed a deal in December. Yeah.

And it's, you know, August. It's, you know, call it eight, nine months later. our normal process to build products is like 18 months to two years. And we signed a deal. We want to talk about having a fast break this thing. I mean, we had to design, develop, you know, produce and deliver products in the shortest time frame we've ever tried to do for, again, some of the best athletes in the world.

You don't want to screw that up. So our focus to be quite honest with you. He's been just on just get the product right, get it to the fighters, get it on them in time for, you know, all these events that are happening from now to the end of the year. And that's it. I mean, there's not a lot outside of that that we've really been doing that allows me to sit there and read through every blog about what people are saying. But like you said, I don't live on the rock. We know that there's been some criticisms of this thing. And we expected it to some level.

And it's okay. The way I look at it is this, is that MMA in general and the USC specifically as an organization have fans that are incredibly passionate about this, super dedicated. and they feel like they're protectors of it. And they're going to defend it. We're going to defend its honor, if you will, and we're kind of the outsiders coming in right now. And that's okay. You know, we're going to have to win over, you know, people,

and we're going to have to do it by building great product and by showing that we're in hand. We're dedicated to it and we're focused on it. And that to some level we're listening. I can't listen to everything because when the criticism gets pretty hot, heavy, I mean, you know, sometimes you're just going to say, okay, we've got to move past that and focus on the good stuff that's happening. There's a lot of good things that are.

happening. So it's not that we have a deaf ear to it. It's not that we're not listening to some level. For sure we are and we're talking a lot of people, but it's, you know, you talk to one fighter at a time. You talk to one coach at a time. You talk to, you know, one UFC employee at a time. You talk to one fan at a time. And that's how you do it. And it's a process. And it's going to take us, it's going to take us, you know, a bit of a period here to get through all that. But, you know, the fighters are the ones at the end of the day. I just have to please them. I'm happy with what they're wearing, if they like the gear and it's working for them, then we're doing

what we're supposed to do. I mean, to be quite honestly, and so far, I see the vast, vast majority of the fighters feel great about what we're building, and we're building really good relationships with these folks very quickly. We've got a long way to go, though. We're at the starting line, so it's a six-year deal with

options for more. We're not going anywhere. We're going to be here. We're going to stand up and, you know, and do this thing the right way. And so far, so good. I mean, yeah, there's been criticisms, but You know, we expected that. It's okay. So you say six years, are you able to finally confirm the terms of the deal, the actual financial amount?

And I'll explain why I'm asking that question. After you've answered first. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We can't talk about the financial terms of the deal. It's not something I can speak into. Okay. I can tell you the length of the deal. And I think you've heard from the U.S.C.

about, you know, how the deal is structured and how, you know, the money that, you know, we're paying for the deal is going into the fighters. But I can't tell you how much that is. also just to be really clear, we don't determine fighter pay scales, how they're paid, where the sponsor monies go, any of that.

None of that has anything to do with us, no one of we want anything to do with that. We made a deal with the UFC, a long-term deal that was super excited about. It's going to be a great partnership. And then from there, it's on the UFC to decide how they can still that. We've never once had a conversation about any of that.

Okay. And that extends out to other things. Like, you know, and I'm sure eventually you're asking a question, but, you know, some of the people around the game and how they're paid and how that's structured. We don't have anything to do with who the U.S.C. hires, fires, any of that. That's on them and how they're paid. We don't get involved in that.

We did the deal with the U.S.C. And then there's a decision that they made how to pay that out. But the good news is that we're investing in the sport. So the way I look at it, we're investing heavily, heavily in the sport. Not only did we do it deal with the U.S.C., which is a multi-year deal for a lot of money, but we're signing U.S.C. fighters. We're making deals with gyms. We're outfitting fighters, not only for their fights,

but also, you know, a lot of times for a lot of the gear that they're wearing outside of Fight Week as well. So we're in this thing, man. We're investing heavy. We're 100% committed to dedication. So we're excited, man. I came back from Rio on a high, man. I'm feeling great about everything right now. So, as you know, because you're the new kid on the block, you're subjected to a lot of this criticism.

and I'm wondering if once this all came about you ever talked to the UFC like when they initially said that the breakdown would be you know as a result of rankings that was the initial plan the financial breakdown and then of course they changed that but did you ever sit and talk to them like hey

maybe you guys should do this maybe should do that because we're taking the heat here we're being blamed we're being criticized we're being viewed as the bad guy yeah no I think it was more it's not listen we've got a brand new partnership that's not our place to step in the day this is how you should do things. You know, would they be open to us making suggestions?

Probably because the UFC's been open to everything with us so far. They've been a great part of them, being honest. I mean, they really have. I did ask, and we did ask for a breakdown, and they provided it immediately when we said, listen, can you provide a breakdown of how, you know, this is going to get paid out, how to fighters get paid from this. And they did. They provided the breakdown, and we asked all the pertinent questions.

What we didn't know was how, you know, how fighters are paid. fight by fight or what other sponsor monies go into the fighter payment system or any of that. We didn't get into that. It was really just more about, hey, here's the deal we've made. How does this get doled out to the fighters? And we felt really good about the fact that every single dime is going to the fighters. So we were like, okay, this is a good thing, right? So again, we've made an investment, and yeah, people are going to criticize the fact that we're the new kids on the block.

And I think a lot of people are trying to put some pressure on us so we can turn around and put some pressure on the UFC. But that's just not how it works right now. We're a new partner. We've got a great thing going with these guys. We really believe in this organization what they're trying to do. But I do understand the criticisms, and I've been a fan. I think you and I have talked about this, too. I've been a fan of the U.S. East before Lorenzo and Dana had bought the organization.

I've come back in 1993, you know, the hoist Gracie days, I like to call them, and in the very beginning, and I followed it then. I was in Japan. I followed Pride. I went to some of the Pride fights, and I became a huge fan of MMA at that point in time. and I've stayed with this thing all the way through, so I know a lot of the fighters, I know the history of it,

I know how fighters are typically paid over time and all that, but at the same time, right now, you know, trying to just get products on the fighters and the right stuff and do our job, our piece of this, my focus and our team's focus has to be in just making the best product possible.

You know, again, we're at the beginning phase of this. So, you know, we're in the first two months of the deal as it rolls out here. So, you know, there's a lot more to come. put it that way. There's a lot more common. And I'm going to tell you, too, the UFC has been great with us. Like I said, they call to us all the time. They ask us our opinions on stuff.

We have great relationships. We meet often. We talk about a lot of things. And, you know, at the end of the day, we need the fighters to be healthy, too. Because you need the sport to be healthy. So we're in it long term. And long term means a healthy sport. It means fighters are making good money if she's making what they need to make to keep the business going.

Fans are getting what they want. They're getting a product. products to wear and they've seen great fights and it's all one big you know ecosystem if you will and I think hopefully hopefully as we go along here some good things are going to happen so I was talking to Bributio over doom down in Rio and you know he he did a deal with red dot and what a great deal for him I mean I don't I only read what the reports were I didn't ask him exactly what it was but it looks like it's a three-year deal and he's making a lot of money in that and that's a side sponsor they're not going to get any they're not going to get any

exposure during fight week on fight night and yet they still did a big deal with him. So that's encouraging to me. When stuff like that happens, that's good for everybody. That's good for everybody because there's plenty of room for all of us here. What's your take on the whole stitch situation? You alluded to it. He does an interview. He mentions, it wasn't very critical, I thought, but he mentions that the cut men were not making any money. They couldn't have any sponsors. And shortly thereafter, U.S. Severs ties with him. And this creates this whole big, you know, firestorm and a lot of backlash, et cetera. Again, directed at you.

UFC hasn't commented on it officially. You guys sent out a tweet. Are you disappointed with the way this all went down? Well, it's so disappointing. The whole thing's disappointing because, you know, again, I told you I have been a fan before I was actually working on the business. And I have known Stitch from way back. I didn't know him personally, but, you know, everybody who has ever watched a UFC fight

has seen Stitch and a lot of big boxing matches as well. But, you know, stitch a good guy. He's another guy, a great story. He's definitely in his own way, an icon of the sport. Everybody recognizes him. I met him down to Florida a few years ago at a hotel lobby and introduced myself. And I called him and spoke to him recently after everything went down and had a good, good chat for a while. I don't think he was being necessarily disparaging towards Reebok.

It wasn't what he was saying. I think basically what he was saying was that, hey, in this deal, I lost my sponsorships. It was a part of how I made my money, how I lived. And I think he was being open and honest about it. I think he felt like he had to stand up for other people in this. But again, and here's another thing, and this is what I told Stitch. I was like, we never once I've even had a conversation about, you know, what the Stitch meant are wearing, whether they were losing their sponsors. It wasn't that we forgot about them, but it was kind of like that was going to be phase two of this deal.

we didn't have enough time to think about the Octagon girls to be quite honest or the referees or the cut man or what Joe Rogan's wearing on stage at the way you know we we haven't had time to even talk about all that stuff we haven't gotten it yet because we spend our first seven months just desperately trying to get you know fight kids to fighters and training gear to fighters and all the products to get this deal kicked off because again we didn't have 18 months to two years we had seven months. So I told Stitchis, I said, you know, we probably were going to have a conversation with you somewhere down the road. But, you know, that may not happen now. You know, I, again, we don't make decisions that's actually U.S.C. hires and fires. He was an independent contractor. How he was

paid, it was between him and the U.S.C. I have no idea how that was structured or how that worked. We never want that conversation with the U.S.C. by a stitch man. Never once. We hadn't gotten there yet. And it may be something that we talk about now down the road. We've got some means coming up with that organization. It'll probably be a topic. But unfortunately, you know, this all happened with Stitch. And again, it's a matter for them. It's a matter. It's just between Stitch

and Dana and the U.S.C. not us. But did you reach out to them and say, hey, could we fix this? You know, we're getting the heat here. Can we try to figure this out? We'll do a deal with him. Because when you signed the deal, it was an exclusive deal, which, you know, of course, stopped the cut men from having their own sponsors and,

of course, the cornerman as well. So here you are left, you know, perhaps looking like the bad guy in this situation. Do you try to reach out? Did you do that to try to rectify the situation before it got out of hand? Yeah, well, to be honest, I heard about the same way everybody else did. I saw it blow up on the internet the night of. I was actually traveling at the time, and I started getting some text,

and everyone said, hey, what happened to this? We had a little bit of this. I'm like, what are you talking about. I read it on, you know, on Twitter and Instagram like everybody else did, and was kind of shocked. wasn't able to speak to the U.S.C. anytime. So I actually talked to Stitch before I even talked to anybody in my own organization. You reached out to him?

I did. I just called him man to man. I got his phone number and, you know, I just dialed him up myself. I was on the road and I said, I'm just going to call him and talk to him and see what's going on. And we had a great talk. We talked for about 40 minutes or so. And it was, again, just man to man. I was just between him and I. And it was a good discussion.

It was great. I wish none of this happened, but it did. And again, it's not something that's in our control. You asked if we talked to the UFC about it. Yeah, I had a very brief conversation with Dana. Dana was great about it, as he always is. He's like, yeah, you know, he goes, that's not for you guys to worry about. That's between us and him.

And, you know, you guys shouldn't be taking any heat for that. He goes, you know, basically that's our situation with our cut in. And, you know, we're handling that. That's basically what he said. And that was it. I mean, it's, again, you've got to find your place here. There's a place where you can speak up about things, and there's a place where you can't.

We're focused on what our job is. Our job is to make these guys the best products in the world so they can train and fight it, right? And then there's a business side of it. And those are the components that we're focused on right now. It's not about pressure in the UFC or telling them they did a bad job or something. I mean, they have a great organization.

I mean, they've unified MMA from way back, and they've done a great job building this thing. You know, again, I get the criticisms, and I understand it, But it's not our place right now. It really isn't. Our place is to focus on the things that we can control. And we have an open line with the UFC, and it's a great relationship.

And I'm super grateful that we have that because these guys do listen. But now I didn't call anybody in pressure him or ask them, you know, how do this work? And we need to do something. It wasn't the way it needed to go down. It was between them right now. And if something happens there and he comes back, then we're going to have a conversation with him. If he doesn't, then he doesn't. you know, we'll move on and start talking about the other couple of men that are here.

So, but, you know, like I said, we're at the starting line here, and there's some things we haven't gotten to yet, a lot of things we haven't gotten to yet. One of them is some of the people that are on, you know, some of the personnel that are part of the game that aren't the fighters themselves or the coaches or trainers, but they're part of it. And that'll probably be the next phase of what we talk about, how do we gear these folks up and, or do we or don't we, you know, we have to have these conversations for us. But when the, when the website went live, As you know, there were all the prototypes were out there, and there were some spelling mistakes and some names that were not used to, like, I guess they're legal names.

What happened there? Can you explain, you know, why some guys had, you know, like Leonardo Machita and Damian Maya and Jacer's name was, you know, backwards, and seen punk went as Philip Brooks, Gilbert Melendez's name was misspelled? Why did that happen? It's crazy. So the way this works is pretty simple. Now, go back to, I'll play how it works for other leagues, because it's the same situation. I mean, the UFC has somewhere between 580 and 600 rostered athletes.

It's the same for MLB and NFL and NHL, NBA, all of these sports have rostered athletes that the league takes care of. So the league's in charge of who they sign, who's on the contract, and who isn't. And that list fluctuates, by the way, very quickly. So the game plan for us very simply was we decided very relatively close to the launch date that we were going to try to go live with every fighter in the UFC so that we could offer, which is a good thing, so we could offer every single fighter's, you know, in Jersey.

So there was a fan out there that was a fan of, you know, Travis Brown, whoever, doesn't matter who, that wasn't part of our, you know, mates called top 15, top 20 fighters, they could still get that jersey for that fighter. So the U.S. came to us, asked us if we could do it, we said we could try. So we were moving very quickly to try to get to FPR launch. But the way it works is we get a list from the organization. The organization provides the list.

I don't know who the 560th fighter is in the UFC. How would I know that? How would my team know that? In fact, the entire list has to come because every fighter, obviously, to a long process, was saying what they wanted on their fight kit, what name they wanted, what country they want, to represent. So the list was vetted out by the organization, and then it was passed to us in a very short period of time, so they were moving quickly as well. So again, it's a partnership. You know,

we don't want to mess up anybody's name, nor does the U.S.C. The list in the transcribing or the rendering of the list over to us, the transmittal of that, there was an error made in the transmittal. We took that list, our team, and we put it up live, but no products were ever made that were incorrect. So it was really just a rendering thing on the website. Okay. Of course, everybody took that and went crazy and said, you know, oh, you know, Reebok's thumb.

You know, the name's wrong, and they don't understand the MAA or the fighters. Trust me, you understand the MAA and the fighters. A lot of people hear that. They've been around the game or been following it for a long time. But I think the issue is, you know, you take the list, you're moving fast, our fault for putting it up without going through it. But at the same time, very hard to go through a list. What's my reference point with 600 fighters?

Where am I supposed to check to see where you're going? it is. And how do I know what every fighter wants to have on their jersey? I mean, that has to come from them. The league gets that, the league puts the list together, gets it over to us when we put it up online. That's how it works. And there was some mistakes made in the transmittal of that to us. So, um, it's what

it is. We took it down really fast. Um, worked with the works with our partner and we worked on it together really closely and we got all the names back up there and everybody's correct now so far. And, you know, it's an ongoing process too because fighters come in and fighters go out. So there's

It's going to be an ongoing process of always changing lists. So I'm sure it won't be the last time there's ever a mistake made. But I can tell you this from my days early on, on the inside in the NFL, the indie and the NHL, in a three to six-month period all at the same time to do exclusive deals with all three major sports leagues and outfit the entire leagues back in 2001, 2002. I can tell you that there were so many more mistakes made during that

startup than we've made here, but you didn't hear about it back then because there wasn't social media that way rich today. So mistakes were made, kind of nobody who ever really knew about it. Some guys actually went out on the field with incorrect names in their jersey, and then we figured it out. And over time, we built the best, strongest, biggest businesses any of those leagues that ever had ever had with some of the best gear that had ever been made for those sports. And we're going to do the same thing here for the UFC.

We're going to do the same thing we hope for the sport of MMA where we get to elevate a little bit. And, but it's, we're at the starting line. So there's still a long way to go. And it probably won't be the last mistakes I've ever made. There'll be more. But you, you know, you work through them and you get better as you go. And again, I think one of the biggest things is you stay humble. You take the criticism and you make sure that it makes you better, not, you know, go the other way with it.

So I think we're excited, man. I think there's been way more good that's happened than that bad. And it's been a really good start for us. a lot of products are selling really well. We're hearing great things from the fighters. We're hearing great things from our partners at the UFC. And we're super excited about what's still to come. We still have more fighters to sign.

We're still on more announcements to make. We're still more products to build. And even the fight kits themselves, which are the first versions of them, we'll have more versions of those coming out in the future. And we're excited to release those and so on and so forth. So there's a lot of good things to come. Final quick thing, and we could go on for two hours here because it's such a complex deal.

It's so new. it's so fresh there are many different layers. I just want to ask you this quick two-parter. First, do you wish you had a little more time in hindsight? You know, you said that you rushed something that should take 18 months into, you know, eight or so months. In hindsight, you wish you slow down a little bit, A and B, much like in other sports, you know, the Toronto Raptors are unveiling a new uniform for this season and, you know,

the Dallas Mavericks did, et cetera, et cetera. Will this thing evolve? Like, do you think maybe every year new looks come out, A, so that you can get more people to buy, let's be honest, and B, because, you know, styles of all the things of that nature. So if you can just comment on that, do you wish you had a little more time? Do you wish that you slowed it down? And is this the look for the next six years, or will it evolve over some time? Yeah, good questions. I think, first off, yeah, of course, I wish we had more time. I'd probably said it from the first day. I'd probably said it 100 times. I wish we had more time. I wish you had more time. But you don't. Nick, you know, I can't be a revisionist here. I mean, what happened has happened, and we moved fast.

Honestly, I've told my team and everybody we've worked with or threw on this deal, how proud I am of what everybody's done at such a short period of time. I mean, we've created the first ever fight kit for U.S. and fighters for the entire lead. We did it in seven months. And we were able to actually get a lot of feedback from the fighters as part of us. Not all the fighters. You know, there's 600 fighters.

and it was a very small percentage of the fighters that we actually worked with on us. Some of the ones that we had signed, some of the ones that did some fit or wear testing with us. But very proud of what we did in a small period of time. We've got fan gear products out there. We've got headwear that's making its way out shortly here. So I actually think we've done a really good job of doing that. We've also got our own products on our combat training line for, you know, those people taking those boxing, kickboxing, and it's like selling like crazy right now.

So in a seven-month period to be able to do that, I actually feel pretty good about what we've been able to do. Now, that said, again, this is like phase one. And you talked about Toronto Raptors and Dallas Maver's. That was actually part of the conversations about changing their jerseys. And so I know a lot about some of the NBA teams out there and, you know, changes they've made to teams uniforms. Yeah, there's going to be more iterations of the fight kit. This is the first version. And, you know, some people, they either like.

or they don't like the U.S.C. logo on the front, you know, we can't please everybody. But the first ever fight kit should be playing up the U.S. logo in my mind, at least on one of the three pieces. But the piece that most of the fighters are wearing into the octagon is actually just the short. And the short plays up the fighter's name in a big way, which is, to me, the fighters are always kind of first in this thing.

We want to have one item that played up on the U.S. logo because it's just that first jersey, but that first kit. But the hood and the short, I think, played more up on the fighter. So we felt pretty good about that as a starting point for the first, say, two to three seasons. So I think by either season three or season four, we're going to come out with something new. We haven't designed it yet. We're in conversations about it. And then, of course, we have to work with the league with the EFC and our partner on, you know, what that will be.

And we'll kind of work together on that. But, yeah, there's a lot more to come. We're excited about it. We've got a whole team of people here that are just fired up for this business and, you know, in designing new products and, you know, change. changing it up and keeping this thing exciting. And we're going to work. We'll be working with more and more fighters as we go forward

as we get into this as we make more relationships and get to know more people in this business. So I think it's an evolving process. Definitely just to start and a lot more great stuff to come. Michael, appreciate your candor and your time here today. You know, again, it's a fascinating time for our sport and I think you guys have handled it with a lot of class and I expect, and I know based on your comments here today, that, you know, we can't judge a six, seven-year deal on a few months, perhaps little patience.

And, you know, just a deep breath here, there. And yes, there are things that we can criticize. And I have criticized and others have as well in the media. But I know from talking to you guys, your team behind the scenes, off the record, all that stuff, at the events. It's all coming from a very good place. I appreciate that very much. And I hope to have you on maybe, you know, down the line next few months, year or so, we can revisit all of this and see where we stand. Yeah, I'd love that, Ayer. You're one of the best in the business. We appreciate your time

and giving us a little bit of a chance to talk about it. So thank you. My pleasure. Thank you very much. We'll talk to you soon. All right, air. Take care of. There is.

Michael Lunardelli, the head of combat for Reebok. Of course, a lot going on with them, a lot on their plate. and I truly do believe, as I have said before, that it is coming from a good place. And you can criticize certain aspects, and they are worth criticizing, no doubt about it. Let's see where this thing stands in a year or two. Let's see how it all evolves, as these kinds of big deals usually do.

Let's see where we go from here. I appreciate him coming on. Didn't have to. And I thought that was an interesting talk. Okay, let's move along. Let's bring in our next guest. It was announced last week that he will be main eventing the UFC's return to Dublin in October against one of their own. Joseph Duffy will main event the UFC's return to Dublin,

against our guest right now. Dustin Porre, he joins us on the phone. Dustin, how are you? All right, man, what's going on? Thank you for the time. Thank you for your patience as well. What was your reaction when you were told that you were going to Dublin? Of course, you've had an interesting relationship with these fans over the past year.

so you were going to Dublin to main event that card against an Irishman. Wow, man, you know, I was excited about it. Fighting is what I do, and it's what excites me and gets me up in the morning. So when I found out we were going out there behind enemy lines and fighting another guy who's got a lot of eyes on him, it was exciting for me. This is a guy who has looked good in the UFC, Joseph Duffy, but he is not ranked. And you just cracked the rankings and you're moving up very quickly. Did you have any hesitation about, you know, fighting a guy who was below you in the rankings,

not even on the rankings right now? You know, of course, that Ken Byrne, especially when I didn't know when I first heard about the fight, it came together pretty quick, man, but when I first heard about it, I didn't know we were going to be main event, and I was like, ah, you know, I really would rather be on the Houston card. My hometown I grew up is four hours from Houston, and I got Daniel Carmreys on the card, and it would just been like another homecoming almost for me. It would have been nice.

Maybe I didn't get a ranked opponent on the Houston card, but then they told me it was going to be main event and, you know, big things happen after main event fights. And I feel like in the future I'm going to be fighting a lot of five-rounders. So it was just part of the growing process of my career. And I was super excited when I found out of the main event. I don't know what it is. And correct me if you feel otherwise, it feels like for some strange reason the Irish fans have actually rallied around you. They've taken a liking to you. And it's a strange phenomenon because you were, you know, involved in this, you know, heated war of words with one of their own, their beloved son, Conn McGregor.

But when this was announced, I got a lot of people from Ireland saying, A, we're excited to welcome you, we're excited to watch you, we're excited to pay tickets to see you, you know, in action in person. They were, it was not negative at all. Did you notice that as well? And why do you think that is? Definitely, man. Across social media, you know, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Irish fans have been reaching out to me and sending me positive stuff.

It's been pretty cool. Of course, you know, you have a few jerks. and guys talking crap, but for the most part, man, it's been a lot of positive stuff. People are excited to see me come to Dublin and throw down. So that gets me pumped up as well. I think the true fight fans out there in Ireland know true fighters and guys who are going to come out there and put everything on the line and they appreciate that.

And, of course, they know I'm one of those guys. You told me before this fight was announced at International Fight Week that you wanted to fight on this card. Was there something about Ireland or the fans or the venue? I don't know, that really attracted it. you? You know, I wasn't pushing for it, but I just, out of the upcoming cards, it sounds like one that would be fun to travel over there. You know, I know I have a little bit of a following there after fighting Connor. So I just thought it would be fun, you know? What do you think the reception will be like? Like, it's one thing to get positive comments on Facebook or Twitter. What do you think it's going to be like when you're fighting an Irishman in October? Oh, for sure they're going to be rooting for him, but no worries, man. I'm sure I'll get booed and stuff, but no worries, man. I'm coming out there to take care of business. Have you been impressed with him? Have you watched his fights in the UFC?

Yeah, man, he looks good. You know, of course, his boxing looks good, and his submission game looks good, too. For being a boxer, most of his wins on his MMA career have been submission. So it looks like he's pretty slick there. You know, obviously this isn't Connor McGregor, but everyone loves to say he's the last man to beat Connor McGregor. That's his big claim to fame.

In your mind, is this a chance to exercise some of those demons, like go to their home country, beat one of the wrong, beat the guy. Do you view it like that? It's cool, man, but to anybody who's been in the sport a long time, and I'm sure you know, man, MMA mathematics don't really make sense. So this guy could have beat Connor, and it doesn't matter to me. Connor might beat him now, you know. It's just match up styles and all that, where the guys were in their career and in their mindset going into that fight. Everything comes into play, so I don't really care that he beat Connor. It's a whole different fight. Why have you looked so good since moving back up to 155?

Because I'm a great fighter, man. I'm a warrior, and I've learned a lot through the ups and downs, you know. The highest of the highs and lowest of the lows in this sport, man. I've been in the UFC for a while now. I think I fought my first fight in Zufa in 2010, you know. So I'm 26 years old now. This will be my second main event. I've just been in a lot of big fights and been in some good spots and been in some bad spots.

And I'm the kind of guy who evolves and learns and grows. and that's what I do every day in the gym, work on new stuff and, you know, stay relevant. And I feel like I'm still young and I have a long time to really keep developing. So, man, you haven't seen what I have to offer yet. That's why. That's why.

Do you feel like you were doing a disservice yourself by cutting those extra 10 pounds? Like, do you feel like it actually affected your performance? Some even say by cutting too much weight, you know, you're not able to take punches as well. you're just not at 100%. Do you feel like that was what was going on when you were fighting at featherweight?

I was for sure I was draining my body and maybe not performing to the best of my ability at that weight. But, you know, I've only been knocked out once and I was against Connor. It's not like I've been getting busted up and knocked out every fight or something. You know, I just got caught by a good punch from a guy who can crack, you know,

that can happen to anybody. But it definitely wasn't helping me. I had some great performances at 45, and a couple bad ones. So I don't know about all that, man, but I just know how good I feel right now at 155 pounds. And still, the cut to 155 isn't a walk in the park. Right.

But I would imagine Fight Week a lot more enjoyable for you now, right? Yeah, man, I get to enjoy Fight Week. It's still a little bit stressful, cutting all the weight and stuff, but my training camp is the main thing. You know, I enjoy training again. I'm not starving every day and feeling the play. pleaded through training. I feel good. You know, I really don't start cutting hard until the week of the fight. I just, you know, diet, eat healthy and train hard, and my weight gets down to within striking range of 155. So the week of the fight is when I actually cut weight. So I feel great all through training camp. As before, when I was going 45, man, I felt horrible through training camp. So. Do you regret it? Do you regret moving down? No, no, you know, I took on some big opportunities coming from the WC that when I first made my cut down and fought number one contender who was supposed to fight Aldo when Aldo got hurt and I really made a name for myself.

So it was just part of the process, man. It's the journey to the world title. All of that plays in in my career. I'm going to be the world champion. Yeah, you actually told me to change your name in my phone to Lightweight Champion. You're that confident. Man, just call me champ from now on. Just champ.

Just champ. That's cool. That's all you got to say. And I did just that. So do you foresee a time? Like, you know, some fighters, they're very good at this stuff, visualizing stuff. Do you foresee by the end of this year, that year I will be the champion in the lightweight division? You know, I think this year we're going to close out, breaking into the top 10, I'm about to Ireland and beat Duffy. And win a few fights next year.

So maybe at the end of the next year it could happen. The tire shock can happen. But when it does, I'm going to take it, man. and I'm not going to give it back. Everything that I've been doing since I was 18 years old has been to make me a better fighter and to make this dream a reality, and I'm going to do it 100%, no doubt about it, man.

And anybody who says different, just sit back and watch. I can't wait to show you guys. It's great to see and hear the confidence. I recall talking to you after the Conner fight, and of course you were down, and it was great that you were able to come on and at least, you know, share your feelings. Was there a point where you ever doubted yourself?

Like now you seem like you can, jump off the Empire State Building and land on your two feet, you're that confident. But was there a moment where you had to almost mourn the loss a little bit and in doing so started to doubt your own abilities? You know, it's just when stuff like that happens, when you get close, you know, if I'd be Connor that night, I would probably fall for the weight championship of the world, I'm sure. And so sitting back and thinking about it like that, that really heard, I took a huge step back after that loss as far as title dreams were, you know.

But I was confident going into those fights as well, man. You know, when you get back to the locker room after a fight like that, you sit back and say, how is this happening to me? You know, the way I feel I'm the best in the world. How did this happen? But that's just part of growing, man, and becoming a wider fighter in person. You know, I've grown a lot in life and through fighting. So it's just part of the journey, man.

I'm enjoying it all. But right now I feel like I'm really getting in my groove, and it's just the beginning of it, you know. Did anyone help you? 27, 28 years old, I'm going to be the world. champion. Did anyone in particular help you get back on track here? You know, training alongside guys like Chavoves and Robbie Lawler every day and see the way they look at the game and the way they do things, you know. I mean, Robbie has had a lot

of ups and downs, you know, and he's the world champ and he's an amazing fighter. And that's because of the way he looks at the game and his consistency and his his growth and evolution as a fighter and not wanting to call it quits or not wanting to accept losses. He's always looking to get better. And so having those guys around me, you know, Robbie lives a couple of streets down from me. I see him every day. I just saw him this morning at the gym. He was lifting weights.

And, you know, the week after his fight with Rory, he was already back in the gym. He was, of course, not sparring and wrestling, but he was lifting weights and watching practices and helping guys out. So, you know, being around guys like Robbie Lawler has really opened my eyes. He also famously said that he cut down on his sparring, which he believes led to this career revitalization. Did you do the same? Yes, I have, man. After the kind of fight, I come from pretty rough and rugged MMA jumps back in Louisiana when I started.

So that was kind of taught to us at the beginning. The harder you train, the harder you're going to fight, it's just what we thought was right. And, you know, that's not true. you only got one brain and you got to protect it and I've been doing this a while and I got a lot of years left so I really have to protect it and that's what I'm doing now you know I don't don't uh shy away from buying the expensive head head gear and stuff like that I you know I have winning head gear and good equipment and I'm not out there banging with these guys every day trying to show him who's a real fighter you know before that's what we used to do you know who's tougher let's go yeah but you know that doesn't go on your record man and so now I look at it as training sessions to get better. I'm not sparring unless I have a fight coming up. And even right now, I'm not sparring. I won't start sparring maybe for another three or four weeks. But that comes along with, like I said, growing in the fight game. I understand now that I don't have to do that to be a better fighter. And taking days off is okay. You know, I used to be crazy, man. I used to

be a little bit mental and overtrain and overthrink things. But now I'm finding the right way to do it. How many times will you spar, you know, sitting here today before this fight on October October 24th. Do you have any idea? Maybe 16 times, maybe, 14 times. I don't know. We'll see how camp goes. A lot of things factor in with that, but probably I'll spar two times a week for eight weeks. Okay, so you're still sparring. You're not stopping. In the past, in the past, how often would you do it? Like at your height of sparring. Three, four times a week, year-round.

And you notice a difference? Definitely, man. Definitely. What about other forms of change? And now, you know, I have the right coaches in my corner helping me out and stuff. So before I would spar any guys, any weight class, of course not heavy weights, but well-to-weights, you know, get in there and throw punches with these guys that are huge and go five rounds just to do it and take a lot of shots. And, you know, that's wearing tearing your body. Now I'm going with guys who are around my weight or they, you know, resemble my opponent some way or something. You know, it's beneficial sparring.

Before I was just doing it to see who was tougher. When's the last time you watched the Fightville documentary? Ah, man, it's been a while. It's got to be at least a year and a half or two years, maybe. I don't know. Is it weird to watch it now because you've matured and changed so much since then? Yeah. Last time I saw it, I'm sure it'd be even different now watching it.

Yeah. After the last time I saw it. But last time I saw it was when it was playing on Showtime and stuff. And, you know, it's crazy. It's crazy to see myself back then. Man, I'm glad we captured those moments and I'll have them forever. But I'd like to do another documentary and me get that strap and put it out there and show the growth. Is that something being discussed?

That would be an amazing part two. Right. No, it's not, man, but... Come on. I mean, I haven't heard anything about it, but I'm totally down with it. Somebody shoot me a message. Let's shoot this name. Michael Tucker, wasn't that his name?

It's going to happen. You might want to get it on film because it's going to happen. Wasn't his name Michael Tucker, the director? Yeah, yeah. He's actually, I think, traveling a lot. I think he went to maybe Dubai or somewhere. He's doing a lot of, maybe some jih Tzu documentaries and stuff. I think he fell in love with combat sports through the documentary

because before shooting it, he had no idea what fight sports were. He wasn't a fan. Do you still get a lot of people come up to you and talk to you about, even though a lot has changed since then, do you feel like it's still resonating with the audience? Yeah, man, guys got to see who I am as a fighter and a person through that film. they see that I'm a hard worker. That's the messages I get most when people watch it. It's like, man, you know, recently I've had a few messages actually in the last week and a half, and guys have

been sending me stuff like, you keep me motivated, you made it happen, anything's possible. You know, that stuff makes me happy, man. That stuff makes me feel good. Why do you think you're getting it recently? I don't know. Maybe different markets and stuff might have got the film or something or played it. I'm not really sure, you know. Is a part of you, you know, as we stand here today, again, so confident and you're in the top 15, you're close to being the top 10 big fight coming up. Is a part of you thankful almost? You see the silver lining in the Connor thing because it seems

like it helped change you into the fighter you are now who is thriving and doing so well in the UFC's lightweight division. Can you see the positive out of what at that time felt like a really big negative for you? Yeah, of course now I can, man, sitting back and looking at it, you know? And like I said, I've learned a lot from it. Stuff like that. that sometimes has to happen. And this is a tough sport, man. There's no, sometimes it's not a question that if it's going to happen. It's a question of when it's going to happen, you know, punches like that when you get

caught and stuff. So we have four-ounce gloves and stuff happens, man. But looking back at it now, I learned a lot and I switched up a lot of stuff. And it's just part of the evolution. How do you beat Joseph on October 24th? I really feel like I can submit it more, knock him out. I think I'm a better wrestler than him. And for being a boxer, you know, it's not like he's not like he's been knocking guys out,

even in his boxing record, you know. I'm not the type to talk trash or anything about the guy, but, you know, his hands do look good, but it looks like he fought all bums when he was boxing. So that's not that impressive to me as a fighter. You know, as a fan of maybe people would say, wow, the guy's an undefeated boxer, but nobody he fought had a winning record, I don't think. And, you know, like I said, I'm not talking trash. I'm just in facts.

And so I would have beat all of those guys as well, man. And I've been working on my boxing a lot. So if he wants to box, we can box and I'll put on a show for the fans. Can't wait. Thank you very much for the time, Dustin. Best of luck to October 24th. Huge fight. Love it. And I love the fact that you of all people are going Ireland for this one. Going to be a lot of fun. It's on UFC Fight Pass. And it's in around two and a half months time. Looking forward to it.

Thanks for the time, man. Thanks, Darrell. All right, there he is. Dustin. Diamond Porier, big fight for him, October 24th in Dublin, Ireland. That is going to be a great atmosphere there. Slowly but surely adding to that card. I know Calpendred was recently added. One assumes Gunnar Nelson will be added as well. It'll have the typical Irish flavor that we have come to expect from those cards. But that, in my opinion, is a fine main event, especially when you consider the fact that this is a fight pass card. It is a card featuring

Duffy, who has a look very good to know in the UFC, just coming off a nice triangle choke, win and Poria has looked fantastic since going down, excuse me, going back up to 155. He has his connection with the Irish people, a lot to like from that main event, in my opinion. And I'm curious to see what else they add to it. Okay, in a minute we're going to be joined by Chad Mendez. But first, let me just tell you about audible.com. Do you love books, but find that you never have time to read them? Well, audible.com has the perfect solution.

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no worries, you can exchange any book you aren't happy with for another title anytime, no questions asked. How about that? That is good stuff. And just for listeners, audible.com is offering a free audio book of your choice and a free 30-day trial membership. Go to audible.com slash MMA today

to start your free trial. today. Again, show your support for the MMA hour and go to audio book, excuse me, audible.com slash MMA to get your free audio book and 30 day trial. Again, it's audible.com slash mMA. All right. Let us move along now. Go to our next guest. Been wanting to have him on the show for the last couple weeks. Very happy that he is, that he's down to come on around three weeks removed from the big fight of his career. What a spectacle it was, July 11th, UFC 189. Very interested in hearing

what he has to say about it all. We're talking to Chad Mendez right now. Chad, how are you? Good, man. How are you doing? I'm doing great. Thank you so much for the time. So we're a little less than a month removed, around three weeks or so. What's life after 189 like? I mean, life is pretty much the same, really. I mean, other than me being in a stupid cast, But, I mean, life's good, man. You know, it sucks when you get a loss on your record, and it sucks when you, you know, you're that close to being right there for the title

and not getting it. But, you know, other than that, I mean, this is a sport, this is a competition, and there's things in life that are much bigger than that. So I'm still living the dream, man. Do you feel like you're over it, or do you think that's going to take a little bit more time? It's definitely going to take some time.

I mean, it's, you know, that's something I still think about, you know, sometimes going to bed and still thinking about it, you know, and it's definitely going to take some time to get over it. But, you know, that's just part of the game. You know, you get in there sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. You know, this is something that still hurts me a bit, but, you know, we'll get after. I truly believe in my mind that there's going to be a time very soon that me and Connor meet up again. I will have a full training camp. and I will beat that guy. You were very gracious.

I mean, amazingly gracious in defeat. Very classy. Didn't make any excuses, didn't complain. And you really took it as well as anyone could have, especially given the circumstances. Did you surprise yourself in that sense? Not to say that we didn't see that in you. We didn't think that you could do that.

But it was pretty darn amazing to see how you handled it after the fact. Did you surprise yourself? No, I mean, not at all. I mean, that's how I've been raised as a person as an aspect. my entire life. You know, my dad started coaching me when I was five years old when I was wrestling. And, you know, my dad always fulfilled in me to, you know, win or lose, you know, be respectful.

And, you know, I feel like that's just how I've always been. You know, like I said, it sucks when you lose, but that's just part of any sport. That's part of life. And, you know, if you can't take it in stride and know that that's something that's possible, then, you know, these are the types of people that lose, and completely crumble and never come back from it, you know. For me, obviously, it's just motivation.

You know, there's things that happen like that, you lose. But, you know, if you can get back up and just keep training harder or working harder at whatever it is in the last week you're doing, you know, that's when you become a true champion or you become very successful. And, you know, that's what I'm pushing towards, and that's what I want to do. How many times have you watched it? I've actually only watched it one time. Wow.

And it hurt to watch. So I think I'm going to give a little bit more time before I watch it anymore. Do you firmly believe if you had a full training camp, you win that fight easily? 110%. No doubt in my mind. And, you know, I'm not making excuses, like you said. I'm not sitting here saying, you know, that's the reason why I lost. But, you know, I just feel that if I am completely prepared for that fight, I win that fight every single time.

Was he tougher than you thought he would be? No, I mean, not at all. I mean, that's exactly, in my mind, that was the only way he was going to be able to beat me. I mean, obviously, he's not going to outgrap. He's not going to out wrestling me. He's not going to be able to grind out a decision. You know, his only way of beating me was tagging the only way of beating me on the seat. And, you know, he does a really good job of being in your face.

He has that, like, D.S. style of punching. But, you know, anyone they can move around and stay light on their feet, and take this dude down wins that fight every single time, you know. You know, I just, after scrambling around and fighting for the amount of time that I did, just wasn't able to get back to my feet and be light on my feet. You know, I was stuck, and that's when he was able to key off, and that's why I lost. So, you know, I truly believe that if I was able to, you know, keep that bounce in my step and move my feet, keep that footwork going, that, you know, I wouldn't have been tagged,

and, you know, the round would have ended, and we would have left, and, you know, round three would have been just like round two. So, you know, it sucks. I think that's the hardest part because, you know, I know I can beat this guy, and I was just so close, but you know what? Like, you know, this is a fight that I took on short notice.

This is a fight that, in my opinion, I stepped up, and, you know, I wasn't a fishy, I wasn't scared, I wasn't trying to back out, you know. Someone got injured, and I got the offer to take it on two weeks notice against a tough guy. You know, a lot of guys would have just said, hell no, I'm not doing it.

But, you know, it's a huge opportunity, you know, and like I said, I know on my mind that I can beat this guy. And, you know, I didn't turn it down. So, you know, it's last. You win some, you lose some. Do you regret the decision to try to pass guard when you were in his guard effective in the second round? Yeah.

I mean, I think that's one of the things that, like, upsets you the most. Like, if I would have just stayed there and kept soft, solid position. I stayed in guard and just kept landing elbows. The round would have ended, I would have stayed on top. But, I mean, that's the sport. I mean, this is, we take risks. We get in there, we fight another human being. And, you know, that was a risk that I took. I tried to finish the fight. And, you know, we scrambled and he was able to get back to the seat. You know, I think that's what kind of upset me the most about that fight. But, you know, it is what it is.

Do you think you did that because you were getting tired? Like you tried to rush the finish when in the past, if you had a full training camp, you would have taken your time more? No, I mean, I remember in that situation, just feeling like, all right, I have complete control right here. Like, he didn't feel like he had anything off his back. He wasn't trying to stand up. He was keeping close guard.

You know, he didn't feel very strong or very controlling off the bottom. So I figured, you know, I'm going to pass guard. And I feel like I could probably say, submit this dude. You know, watching past by, you know, seeing his losses, we knew that that was something that was very possible. And, uh, you know, you're all sweaty at that point. You know, you got Vaseline from each other's faces rubbing all over each other, you know, shit gets slippery. And I went for the choke, slipped right out of what you got in a scramble and was able to get back to the seat. If I, you know, looking back on it now, I would have just stayed there, but, um,

I mean, you know, whatever. I mean, there's not much that I can do or say about it now other than, you know, learn from that. And next time, hopefully we get the chance to where I'm fully trained and I'm, you know, peak shape and I'm in there whooping ass, so we'll see. Do you have any idea at what point in the fight you broke your thumb?

Yeah, I remember it was in a first. One of the times I took him down on the first, I remember trying to throw a punch, and it might even have been when he was trying to get back to his feet, but I remember it was early and maybe like halfway through the first ground, and I couldn't tell if I just jammed it really bad. or maybe dislocated and it popped back in,

but I felt like I couldn't like squeeze 100% with my right hand. And, you know, like I said, I wasn't sure if it was just dislocated or not, but I just kept making a fist and trying to throw that as hard as I could. And again, I know this will, by some, and it's not even worth mentioning them, but, you know, people will take this. I'm the one asking you these questions, so to be clear, you're not bringing this up, but I did hear that you injured your foot early in training camp. Is that accurate?

I did, man. It just kind of sucks. I, um, so I had about two weeks, and that first Wednesday, um, the first week, you know, we MMA spar every Wednesday until, um, you know, that was the first time that I would, I had sparred since my last fight against lawmiston in April. Um, you know, jumping right into super hard training like that. Um, I mean, we talked about in past interviews. That's, that's, when guys get injured is when they jump into something crazy like that without preparing their body ahead of time, you know, and that's kind of that situation.

And, you know, so we were very cautious of it. I had, you know, two pairs of shingards on each foot. I had, you know, the thick normal shing guard. I'm going to have, like, a padded sleeve that goes up and over it. Purposely knowing that I was going to be throwing hard kicks and working with tall, lanky softball, so the knees a lot higher, obviously. And, you know, that was something we really focused on. I didn't want to bruise my shins.

I didn't want to, you know, hurt my foot. I was laying padded shorts with, like, just, like, really thick, like, football padding that goes up over your thigh and over your hips. So if someone throws a kick, it doesn't, like, bruise anything up in there. You know, obviously all the other headgear, six-ounce-clubs kind of stuff. But, you know, we were very, very cautious about it.

And, of course, the last round, you know, I'm going against the tall lanky southball guy, and I throw a kick. And he covers his head, and I happen to just, land the top of my foot right on his knee. Like, he didn't even check or anything, but it just happened to land right there.

You know, he's taller. I'm not used to throwing him on the taller guys and just tracked my foot. You know, basically, instantly, you know, felt it starts slowing up. We stopped scoring right then. That was the last round, and my foot just got, like,

the size of a baseball on top of it and couldn't stand on it for about, I don't know, four or five days. I was his ice in every day, kind of do, like, stem on it, stuff like that. And, I mean, obviously, I didn't want to go get an X-ray. I didn't want to know if anything was broken at that point. And, you know, you just, I was trying to do everything I could to keep from limping on the countdown show

and on the embedded the guy following me around with cameras and, you know, trying to tough it out and make it seem like everything's fine. You know, because that's the type of stuff your opponent, you know, feeds off of us. You know, if I know an opponent has an injury, You know, that's, I'm not saying I'm going to go off to try to re-injure it, but, you know, that's a weak spot on the body. So there's, you know, other things you can do to try to attack knowing that that side of the body is not strong. So, you know, if I'm limping around in my flits, I'm not, you know, I know Connor would have been all over that, you know. And so, of course, I'm trying to tough it out, not telling anybody anything.

I didn't want to know if it was broke or anything, but for about, I don't know, probably five or six days, the last, last bit I couldn't really do much. I was trying to swim, trying to do anything I could to try to get my weight down. And, you know, that's basically how it was. I went into that fight. I threw one kick. I remember throwing it during the fight, and I hit it again. I was like, dude, there's no way I'm throwing anymore. This thing is killing me.

You know, I mean, it didn't really matter at that point anyways, but, you know, it just sucks. I mean, there's always injuries. Every fighter goes into every fight with some kind of injury, you know, and we just try to push through it. You know, this is our livelihood, this is our jobs, is how we make our money. You know, and, you know, I don't think I've ever had a fight with it. It's some kind of injury. But, you know, that's just one of those ones that's super tough because it's already a super short camp.

And, you know, you don't have a lot of time to get your weight down. There's not a lot of things you can do to get your weight down because you can't stand on your foot. So it just made things a little tough. Do you know if it is in fact broken? Yes, I had a doctor to look at it. We didn't do x-rays, but he did one of those, like, vibrating tests where he bangs a little metal thing and touches it to your toe. And there's a lot of pain that shot up to his. He said most likely there's some fractures, but a lot of the little ones, he said there's not much we can do other than just rest it.

So that's just what I was polled. Like I said, at that point, I don't really want to know. Yeah. not something that I'll just let it hill until it feels better and then we'll go at it again I get this cast off soon anyways Last week we had

Bang Ludwig on the show and he said that he believes that if you do three things in training you're a world champion But he wouldn't tell us what those three things are He also said that if you were still working together He's going to be confident

He thinks that you'd be a champion Do you have any idea what he's talking about? I don't know what the hell Dwayne is talking about And I'm just, I'm tired of hearing about Dwayne and, and him ruling our team, you know. Like, Dwayne came here to team off the L for a short amount of time. And Dwayne, you know, did what he did. But I'd say 95% of our wins when he was here, we would have won anyways.

You know, Dwayne was the type of guy that brought a new style to our team, but we have such a unique team that everybody's such high-level athletes that, you know, anybody can come to this team with a new style, and we're going to pick it up, we're going to learn it, and we're going to use it in fight. So, you know, we made Dwayne. You know, we put Dwayne on the map.

Before that, Dwayne was a fighter that fought NEOC that, you know, most people didn't even know about, you know. And he came here as a coach. This was his first coaching experience, you know. And, you know, he even said it himself. Like, when he got the offer, you know, it's like, basically he basically said it's like coming to a garage full of

Ferraris and Lamborghini he's gonna fine-tune some things and those cars are gonna run like hell and you know that's basically that's basically how it was you know and Dwayne had a new system that we hadn't seen yet and that's why you know things were so fun and you know everyone thought that we got along and then some crazy weird shit happened between him in favor and then you know Dwayne started attacking all of us the media and you know it just sucks it's it's something that you know really bung me out because i like

duen a lot and uh you know i felt like him as a person you know him as a coach it was it was good until all this stuff started happening and then him taking digs at all of us and you know it's just something i'm i'm sick of you know i want out of my life you know dwayne's not part of team alpha you know this is a team that i'm going to be a part of so i'm completely done fighting and probably after the fact that I'm fighting. So, you know, this is where I've started. This is where I'm going to end. This is what made me, you know, who I am today as a fighter.

And, you know, I owe everything to Team Alpha-Mil. And Dwayne was a small, tiny little part of that. And, you know, I just hate that so many people are assuming that Dwayne completely made our team and just tired of hearing it. Fair enough. I respect that. Just curious, is it creating a problem within the team because you have Dillashaw training with him,

Castillo trained with him? are you starting to feel like there might be an issue going on here, like that you guys have to address before it gets, you know, to be out of control? No, because we've all kind of addressed it already. We've sat down and talked about it. You know what I mean? And that's one thing that favor and all of us are really good at. You know, when there is a problem within the team, you know, you have to address it.

If you let that cancer grow, it'll start taking over everything and that rules and just wipes things up, you know. And I think that's one of the things that's so unique about. out this team is that we have the ability to see things like that happening and people aren't afraid to say like, hey, this is a problem. We need to fix this. So, you know, I think that was something that was done. But, you know, I don't think it's getting weird. I mean, I know, you know, TJ's going to train with them probably forever. You know, there's guys like Danny that are going to train with them. There's certain guys that just like working out with them. You know, I'm not one of

those guys, you know, I like my system here. I like, you know, like I said, Team Alpha Mel, what we've done here is what's made me as a fighter, and Blaine's training was just a tiny little part of that. And, you know, for him to say that if I would have worked with him, I would be champion. It's like that, to me is a dig at me. Like, that's disrespectful, and I don't think that's true. You know, I did work with him. I'm not a champion, you know, and it.

it's for him his three things. I don't know what the hell he's talking about. And, you know, like I said, it's just, to me, it's disrespectful, you know, and I'm just tired of hearing about it. Do you have a timeline and a perfect scenario, a perfect opponent for your return? You know, I'm in the cast for four weeks.

I have one week left for that, and I got a splint for another four weeks in rehab, and then jumping right back into training. I'm trying to do as much as I can right now, you know, most of it's basically just trying to stay conditioned and doing any kind of strength training I can, but, you know, obviously, it can't be any type of contact or even grappling, you know, these cask gets stinky as hell really fast. You know, probably into the year, and there's even a good chance at the beginning of the year,

but as far as the opponent goes, you know, I don't know, I'm kind of in a tough situation, but, you know, I could see maybe, you know, there's probably a couple guys that the USC might be looking at, but like I said, I don't really know. I know Frankie Eggers is right there, but, you know, in my opinion, I feel like Frankie would be more beneficial just waiting to fight for the title, you know, willing to wait it out. You know, in my opinion, he deserves it next. So, you know, we'll just have to see what the USC wants to do, really. Fair enough. Last question for you, Chad.

the time very much. I always love talking to you. What's the most, what's the best thing to come out of this experience? It was such a world win, you know, from taking the fight when you didn't even have the fight. I remember you were on the show, you didn't even have the fight, but you took the fight. Then it happens. You get the fight. Chelle Sunnan tweets out your phone number a thousand times. You go through this whole process. You'd be around this guy that, you know, there's some bad blood. Your guy, Aaron Lewis, is singing your walkout song. It's the biggest show. I mean, there's so much involved? What was the best part? I mean, I'm sure there was some positives at all this.

It didn't go your way, but it seemed like you enjoyed the journey, which is always very important. What's the thing you'll look back on in years and say, wow, that was a lot of fun. Yeah, any fight, I fight, I feel like there's positives and the negatives, whether you win or you lose, you know, and this is a sport that, you know, I've loved to do since the beginning, and it's something that I got into because it was something to interest me, you know. And, you know, in my opinion, life's all about, you know, steps and, and progressing into your next phase of your life. You know, I started wrestling when I was young, you know, to be able to go to a good high school to wrestle be a state champion or, you know, be at the top of state.

You get to that point, you know, you're wrestling with your high school so that you can get a scholarship, you can go to college, you can wrestle and try to become an All-American or national champion. You know, you go through that phase. You work hard at that, and then my next phase in life was to get into fighting. And, you know, as of right now, I'm fighting. I'm doing what I love to do. You know, the outdoors, the hunting, fishing, working on my show, that's what's going to be the next phase after fighting for me.

So as of right now, I'm enjoying everything I'm doing. You know, I get to travel all over the world, hang out with my buddies all the time. You know, I get to be healthy. You know, I get to make my own hours. I get to choose my own training. You know, this is a dream job, you know. And to be able to do that and then transfer over and kind of phase. to fighting out when you retire into, you know, the next phase in life,

which for me is going to be my hunting show and, you know, the guide service and stuff like that. That's what I'm all about, you know, and I'm loving it. I feel very blessed and lucky to be able to do this for a living and be able to do the things that I want to do in life. You know, I have a great family, have a great support system, a great girlfriend that, you know, is there and takes care of me through all these crazy, you know, situations in life. And, you know, to be able to have that type of sport system and people that love you and care about you like that,

you know, there's not much more in life that means more than that. You know, I just feel very blessed and liked to have that. So, you know, like you said, I lost, I got the big L. It sucks, but it was two weeks of craziness. But I remember, you know, the whole Aaron Lewis thing just being able to walk out to him seeing my walkout, looking back at him, you know, as I'm walking out. just seeing them, you know, the crazy, crazy Irish fans that, you know, at the time, you know,

it's overwhelming. I had Irish guys talking crap to be in the hallways and stuff watching, doing from workout room back to my hotel, you know, just to see the amount of passion and support that you guys have for a fellow athlete, you know, is crazy, you know, a countryman that, you know, they just back them up so much. You know, I honestly wish that we had that more here in America. You know, it's something that is just crazy to see, you know. And same thing with Brazil.

I mean, when we went to Brazil and saw the Brazilian there, it's just like crazy how much the entire country has their athletes back. And, you know, that's something I'll never forget. You know, getting in there in short notice, you know, biggest fight of my career against the guy that, you know, was going to be in the sport for a long time. It's just something that I'll never forget. By the way, final quick follow-up,

where and when will your hunting show air and will you be on Tough 21 as well? So my, we're doing filming and stuff for it now. We started about, I don't know, three to four months ago. Okay. Filming and stuff, but our first, episode should air in January.

That's the timeframe we're pushing for. Okay. As of right now, we're looking for the hunt channel. And that's, that's probably where I was going to air first. And then once we start getting sponsors and building the show, we'll move it up to, some bigger channels hopefully

and just kind of go from there so this is all just a big learning process for me and my partners and stuff with the show so I'm pretty excited about it and as far as the guide service goes we'll be starting that this year we're calling it fins and feathers guide service

and you know being a buddy of mine here it'll be a hunting here and then fishing on the river on my boat so we're pretty excited about that as well it'll be a combination you can do the fishing hunting or fishing hunting in a two-day, like fish all one day,

hunt the next day, or you can do them both in one day, half-day fish, half-day hunt. Okay. And will you be on tough? You don't really seem. What was that? Will you be on tough as well with your eye? Oh, the touch fee.

Yeah. As of dates right now, I don't know. I know T.J. G.J. just got out there, but I'm trying to schedule all that around filming and traveling to the hunts and stuff like that, but I definitely want to make it out there. So it's always fun to get to Vegas and help coach these guys and, you know, just be with all my brothers wrecked in Vegas. So it's always a fun time. All right.

Thank you very much for the time, Chad. Really appreciate it. I know you probably didn't want to talk about this and relive it all, but the insight was fantastic. So get well soon. Looking forward to your return. And again, congratulations on how you handle the whole thing, especially afterwards. It was inspiring and very much the way we would like things to be, very professional, classy. To me, you were 100% a star that night for the way you handled the fight and the

outcome afterwards. It was truly remarkable. So kudos to that. And again, get well soon. Awesome. I really appreciate it, man. That all means a lot. So I'm sure we'll be talking soon. Yes, I look forward to it. There he is. Chad Mendez stopping by. Chad Money Mendez, great to hear from him, as always. Very interesting to hear from him right after Dustin Porier. Okay, let's go to our next guest. And, you know, after this weekend, there was one man that I made a point to reach out to. I wanted to have him on. I thought this show would be incomplete if we didn't have him on. And I'm talking about the legendary, the living legend himself. There are a few people who can be on this man's level. He is on a completely different level

from what he has accomplished, his stories, where he's been, what he's done, who he has influenced. We're talking about judo Jean LaBelle, who was a mentor for one, Rhonda Rousey, she calls him Uncle Gene, also a mentor for the late Roddy Piper, and countless others. A true living legend, and I don't use that term lightly. He is joining us right now via the phone. Judo Gene, are you there? Ariel, I am here. You are the best. And when you die of old age, I'll be the best. Well, thank you for that. I appreciate it. We appreciate the time as well. Of course, I would imagine a mix of emotions this weekend for you, right? A man that you have known for so many years that has spoken so highly of you, who you

mentored, who you trained, Roddy Piper dying suddenly on Friday, and then Ronda Rousey, who you care for so greatly, you've been in a corner for all but two, I believe, of her fights wins in dramatic fashion on Saturday. How can you put this weekend into words for you? Well, you have your high and your lows And very low with Roddy Because he was a very, very, very close friend of mine And he's, you know, born in Canada

Of course, my mother was born in Canada also But he was wrestling professionally at 16 when you're supposed to be 18. And he worked out with me for 30 years. He wanted to really be able to wrestle. And he was, in my opinion, not only a great showman, but one of the best real wrestlers that ever stepped into the squared circle.

This man could box, wrestle, finishing holes. He could do everything. I even got him into motorcycle racing, and he got it. Whatever he did, he was the best. Very, very great guy. When's the last time you spoke to him? I spoke to him Thursday, and he was coming to the gym Monday. And I said, how are you doing?

He says, boy, I've been so busy doing interviews all over the United States. He says, boy, I'm tired. I'm going to bed early. uh... uh... you know Thursday night I guess he

he was staying with his uh... daughter in LA where I live and um he he said to his daughter I think I'll go to the doctors tomorrow

and uh and then I guess Friday and maybe the time's off about noon uh she checked on him and he was gone

and, I mean, she called me, it's devastating. Here's a man that's from nothing he made himself, his self-made man, starting off with a kilt and everything in wrestling. And I got him his A-card, his Screen Actors Guild card, and the one and only with Henry Winkler, and I guess it was 1976, and then he became a star in the movies and a superstar in wrestling. He wrestled them all from Andy the Giant to Hulk Hogan, all the big names, you know,

and made a lot of money, had a lot of fun, and, you know, a great guy. In fact, a great family man, you know, he's got a son and three daughters. But, and he was on, I had a roast, and he was one of the roasters, and he was the funniest one, great sense of humor. And, I mean, I could talk about Roddy forever, and I'm doing a documentary with Tully Cunningham and about the Olympic Auditorium, which Roddy wrestled at many times. And we interviewed him, and he was hilarious. I had such a sense of humor. You know, nice to everybody, except if you got in the ring with him. And Rhonda says, I want to use the name of Rowdy.

And, of course, Roddy Piper had a trademark. So we got a hold of Roddy. And, of course, he says, you can use my name or anything else you want. And that's the kind of guy he was, you know. And Rhonda still uses the name Routy, Ronda, Rousey. And I tell you, tears came to my eyes when she announced after the fight, you know, that I'm dedicating it fight to her friend Roddy Piper. I mean, you know, that...

of course, and her father, too, was a great guy that have passed away. You know, saying thank you, you know, for giving me hours of enjoyment. That's what's all about, you know. Yeah, that was a very emotional, a beautiful moment. It was wonderful to hear her say that. And you can see the emotion on her face. And to be honest, I thought of you in that moment as well, because I know how close both of you

are to both of them. I noticed that you weren't in Rio. Of course, I asked her about this at the press conference. Is it not true that in her illustrious career this was just the second fight that you missed? That you weren't in her corner? Yeah, the thing is, you know, at 83 years old, going down to South America

and, you know, 13 hours from where I'm at on the plane, go through the passport, and passport and the airport and thing, and then turn around and come back. That's a whole day out of your life on a plane. And I says, well, if you fight December 5th in Dallas or wherever, I'll be in your corner because she's family, you know. I'm always been Uncle Jean, and, you know,

she's got so many qualities people don't even know about. She's good at anything she does. She puts her whole time and effort into anything. And that's why she's one of the ones. I always love seeing you at the events, at her fights, because you have the stopwatch, and you keep us honest. You let us know, in fact, how long it took for her to dismantle her opponent. Did you have the stopwatch with you on Saturday?

I was watching it on TV, and the stopwatch. and the stopwash, of course, Rhonda gave it to me, so I got to have it. And even on the TV, 34 seconds, the guy was right on the numbers. And the last time we talked, they said 14 seconds, and I had 12.83, which is 13 seconds. so there was just one second different, and I complained about it, and I said they're not giving her proper credit, but where I was is right there,

and I could see when the other gal gave up, and where we stopped the watch, and the timekeeper who didn't see the bodies was one second late, great timekeeper. But I don't think, seconds mean that much. It's just winning or losing that's important. She has become now this world-renowned superstar. I mean, she has transcended MMA. She is, you know, Rhonda. It's like all you have to do is say her first name. Everyone knows

who she is. They're talking about her on every single show, sports show or not. She's in all kinds of movies. Are you somewhat surprised at how big of a superstar she's become? She is arguably one of the biggest names in sports period right now. as far as the attention that she is generating for herself and for the sport of MMA. I am more than surprised because I know she always has the ability and the drive, but I am so pleased from four years ago not having hardly money to put in her car, and she's spent a little time living in her car. I mean, if you read her book,

she's been on both sides of the road. And nobody deserves the accolations, the hero worship as much as she does. She works at it. When you talk to her, she looks, you're right in the eyes and she listens. She's the most dedicated student A person that's ever got on the mat with me

There's no break, timeout, let's go take Get a sandwich or something, boy, it's all business And anything she does And I think she's a damn good movie star You know, I'm gonna I'm a fan of hers. In fact, I was a pretty good wrestler, and last time I lost, Rhonda, was eight years old.

She beat me when I was six, but I had a bad night. Then she got to be eight, and gosh, I weighed a couple hundred pounds. I don't know how she got lucky in armbard me, but she's continued and done that in a lot of her matches. Is it not true that you told her that you made way more money, in your R-E-E-L fights, your real fights, as opposed to your R-E-A-L fights. And if that's true, are you surprised at what she's doing now in the real fighting world? I am so proud, and a lot of people mock Dana White, but he's the best, the best, and you can

quote me, promoter that I have ever seen in my life at one of the nicest guys. and he made her. He said, hey, I'm not having women, but he talked to Rhonda. Ronda has so much charisma, and he started off, started off, started off, and look at her now. The biggest woman star in the United States right now,

without a doubt. Yeah. What did you make of her performance? Were you happy with it? I, I, you know, anything she wants, Rhonda does, you know. The only thing is, is I think she was a little disappointed because she wanted to beat this gal up, and she knocked her out, and she says, well, I wasn't through.

I wanted to break something, like an arm or a leg or a neck, and John McCarthy just broke it up because she was uncomfortable. conscious. But she says, well, I proved the point, you know. And so she's happy. I'm happy. Did you talk to her after the fight? And of course, there was a great house, a lot of people there. So everybody's happy. Did you talk to her afterwards? No, just to her people that are there and they told me she saw everybody's on her. Yeah. You know, I don't bother anybody when they're doing their stick.

And when she's available, she talks to Uncle Jean when she's busy or I'm busy. Hey, talk to you later, you know. And that's the way it should be, you know. Do you care at all to see her fight Misha Tate a third time, or are you like the rest of the world who appears to really want to see her fight side? A lot of people think that can make a lot of money. Well, I tell you, in my opinion, Cyborg is a great, great fighter,

probably the third best in the world, women fighters. Rounded, of course, is the best, and Misha Tate would be the second best. I'd like to see Misha Tate fight Cybor. Without steroids, without steroids. Cybor is a great fighter,

but she's not in Rhonda's class. How long do you think it would take for Rhonda to beat Cyborg? As long as it takes as long as she wants to. See, Cyborg is extremely strong, physically strong. She's a good fighter. Now, I might say,

sound prejudice, but if it took her a couple of three rounds, that's okay. I think she would dominate her entirely. But that isn't taking anything away from it. That's how long shot

race horses, they pay big prices because they're long shots and they win. Anything could happen. Do you agree with Dana White that it could do... I'd like to see the fight. Yeah. just to give her a good butt whipping, you know, give Cyberg a good butt whipping.

But that isn't to knock Cybor. I'm a fan of hers, but like I say, Misha Tate, I think is better than Cybor. So this is a good third fight, and I think Mishit Tate has corrected a lot of her mistakes, you know. And so I'm looking forward to being there, being in, uh, around his corner on that fight. If it takes place December 5th. And of course, the highlight of that is seeing you there, you know, because you're, you're my hero. Oh, stop it. Oh, yeah.

When I get to be your age, I want to be just like you. Do you agree with Dana White that it could do a. over two million buys, Cyborg versus Rondorowski? I think it might do better than that. Wow. I mean, that's the biggest fight in history. And although Cyborg is a great fighter, I don't think she's that smart,

because if you want to get down, you can get down. I don't care. She could get down to 135. She gets down to 145. she can get down to 135. She's afraid that she won't have the strength. Of course, a heavy weight has an advantage if you're 10 pounds heavier.

And so if she wants to prove herself and make a lot of money, thousands, I'm talking about Cybor. She better go to the table and get down to 135. according to Dana, he says, well, she has to get a couple wins at 135. And that's nice, but, you know, I don't know if she could win. She's good. We'll see what happens. Do you know when she's fighting again? Hopefully September, October.

Okay. I mean, I love to see her fight because she's an animal. But, you know, I'd like to see her fight Misha because I think Misha is getting better all the time. And I think Misha will give a better fight for Ronda this time, you know, because she knows her style. A lot of people don't know her style, and she has so many weapons Ronda does. I mean, Graco-Roman freestyle, boxing, muta, Moutai. Graco Roman, judo. I mean, she does it all, and she does it all well, you know. And so when you got fire apart like that, you know, it's all over with.

I'm waiting for her to toss her down and break an arm, and she hit him with a boxing and knocked her cold turkey. And that was the end. that happens, she's got to go back to the drawing board. Boy, she sure shut up, didn't she? Yeah, and you know what's so interesting about Rhonda and what I appreciate about her is she's such a great promoter.

She'll never put down her opponent. She never said that Betch wasn't on her level. She built her up, built her up, so that the win means more, and she's doing the same now again with Misha Tate. She really understands the art of promotion. Where did she learn that from? Probably, honestly, her,

I blame everything on Anna Marie, her mother. Okay. People ask me, how do you get involved? Everybody I meets a teacher for her. And, you know, she might go to a gym or workout, and she has a lot of teachers that take care of her. But I think her mother has an attitude. I love her mother. You know, she doesn't take any.

crap his expression from anybody and uh ronda's the same way and Ronda's got into the show business of uh knowing what to say and she says it

you know if she says it he means it do you mind sharing with us a favorite memory of Rottie Piper was at the time that he had a turkey drumstick and some blueberry pot you stuck your your toe in his mouth

and then he threw up all over you was that was that your favorite memory of Roddy Piper or was it something else? That was one of many and I tell you something you know not everybody's perfect and I you know with

the wrestlers it's who can play the biggest practical joke and so he had that turkey drumstick and blueberry pie I think he ate the whole thing and I guess we're wrestling a little bit and he got a little bit upset

and he stood up and threw all over me all over me and I boy I went right to the showers and I got sick and I says I owe you one you know that was his sense of humor he says but dad

you can see in some of the the books. He calls me Dad because he was an orphan. Although I was only well, let's see, I was 83 and he was, well at 61, he died. But

he called me dad because if he got bug did something, he says, give me a call, let's go down to the gym and wrestle. And he was going to come down Wednesday, Monday and Wednesday, and Wednesday, and wrestle a bit.

That's his way of relaxing, you know. You know, a lot of people have been passing away. As you get older, people passing away that are younger than me and a few older. A lot of my friends, but with Roddy, he was more than a friend. He was a family to me. I'm still upset. I'm always be upset. because he has so many things in the fire, and, you know, he worked hard for everything.

Wonderful guy. And blueberry pie, boy, I hate that story. But my favorite story with Roddy. Please. I took about motorcycle riding with a couple of wrestlers, the Guerrero brothers years ago, and we're all hill climbing. with these dirt bikes, and they couldn't make the hill. And I said, to Roddy, I says, you want to make the hill, you can't back off.

You put the throttle all the way on, pop the clutch, stand on the seat, lean forward, and go up the hill. And he was down there, waved his hand. I was at the top of the hill watching. he went up there so fast you couldn't believe it and there was a cliff a couple hundred yards down on the other side you're supposed to slow down

when you get the top of the hill he got caught in some bob wire rolled up and when he got the bob wire off he didn't go over the hill he was bleeding like a stuffed pig he didn't care he says I made the hill and I'm the champion

and I should get the buckle, which means he should get the championship belt. Great sense of humor, and a lot of guts, a lot of levels. He's a great guy. I mean, he will be missed not only by me and his family, but anybody that ever met him. And like I said before, Rhonda wanted his name, and he had a trademark, the rowdy, and he gave it to her. And now she's the rowdy one. You know, that makes you feel good, you know.

I grew up playing with his doll. I remember watching WrestleMania 1. I remember the coconut over Jimmy Snooka. I remember when he was half black, half white against Bad News Brown. I remember Morn Downey Jr. and the fire extinguisher. My favorite Routy Piper memory, though, is actually something he said to me on this show two years ago. When he was on this show two years ago, I was blown away by just his humility and how down to earth he was. And I asked him, my final question to him was, how do you want to be remembered? How do you want to be remembered as, you know,

the legend and great performer that you are? And he said, I just want to be remembered as a great father. That's it, that I was good to my kids. He was. He taught his son how to wrestle and do stunts, and his son's very handy. You know, that's a good father, you know, a good human being, and anybody wanted something he'd help him out. For example, I'm doing with Kelly Cunningham,

a documentary film on the Olympic Auditorium which he wrestled many times, many times, like under the giant and Hulk Holden and every superstar he wrestled. And she could many, many more. And so in the documentary, which will be out next year,

he comes down there and talks about, it's called the Olympic Auditorium Project, and I think that's the last time he was on film. But, you know, you don't get paid for documentaries, and he'd jump off a building, he says, anything I can do for you, Dad, you got it. Of course, I was on his program, and anything I could do for him or his family,

you know, you've got to do it. You know, you've got to be. You've got to be in trouble, Ariel. You've got to be in trouble to know who your friends are or family. And Roddy and Rhonda, they're both family to me. Beautiful stuff. Thank you so much, Gene. I truly appreciate your time.

I appreciate you coming on. It is really an honor to have you on the show. And I could think of no one better than to tie this all together and to give us some perspective on what I bet was a very emotional weekend for you. So thank you so much. All the best to you, and I look forward to seeing you

at Ronda's next fight. It wasn't the same without you, my friend. It just didn't feel the same. I'll be there, just look at you, Ariel, because you're the best, okay? Thank you so much. We'll talk to you soon. Thanks for calling.

I appreciate it. God bless, okay? There he is. The one and only. Judo Gene LaBelle. You could talk to that man for hours. hours. An encyclopedia of knowledge, a wealth of knowledge, a wealth of experiences. Amazing. Great

sense of humor. An amazing performer. He was on the Jimmy Kimball show not that long ago playing a great prank on Jimmy's aunt. Amazing. Even at his age, 83 as he said, still as sharp as ever. And, you know, the guy who really tied Roddy Piper to Ronda Rousey. And just 24 hours before fight for Piper to suddenly pass away. Very heartbreaking for that family, I know for a fact, and I appreciate him coming by because, you know, if you have a chance, go back into the archives and Roddy Piper has a podcast, and he actually interviewed Rhonda. It was posted around July 5th, I believe, but it's clear the interview was done around April or so right after her WrestleMania appearance. And it's a beautiful conversation between

another legend and someone who is clearly making her own history on her way to that status and someone who also looks up to the interviewer in this case. It's a great conversation between the two. And if you want to, you know, reminisce more and celebrate more of the life of Roddy Piper and especially the connection with Ronda Rousey, I definitely suggest checking it out. That was one of my favorite moments in the history of this show when you talked about being a dad. And it's truly unfortunate. It's, it's heartbreaking to see another legendary pro wrestler pass away. A guy who, when I was working at HBO Sports as an intern on that wrestler death story back in 2003, which I think I alluded to last week on this show, believe it or not,

he says in the clip, I'm not going to make 65. Let's just face facts. And he made it to 61. And I thought of that right away. I thought of what he said. on the show. By all accounts, from talking to a lot of people, including people who knew him very personally, just a wonderful man, and he will definitely be missed. So I want to thank Judo Gene for coming on to talk about him for a few minutes and for also talking about Ronda Rousey's big win. Okay, one last guest before we go. We added him late, wanted to have him on, thought it would only be right to have him on, because of course, you know, at the beginning of this show, Ray Sefo, the president of World Series of Fighting, came on if you missed it. He, uh, he suspended indefinitely

Mr. Husseymar Palliaris. He, uh, stripped him of the WSOF Walter Wade title. Um, now it appears to be in the hands of Nevada, Nevada Athletic Commission, all eyes on them once again. And, uh, I guess it's, it's, it's fitting in a way and it's probably best that the, uh, the most world-renowned commission is the one in charge of them. that's the way it should be in a way. They have built themselves up to reach that status, good or bad, and you want to know how the best handle these situations. And it's a dozy one.

It's definitely a dozy one. How are they going to react to this? How are they going to punish Husseh Mar Palliaris? Are they going to punish him? World Series of Fighting has put its foot down. They've suspended him indefinitely. They've stripped him of his belt. Okay.

Now they want to see what Nevada will do. I think it's a fair statement. It's a fair punishment at this point. And then if they act accordingly after Nevada, then I think that we can complete this story. You want to see if he'll be fine because a man will truly change his ways, in my opinion, especially an athlete of this caliber. he'll truly change his ways if he's hit in the pocket.

You know, again, if he's suspended for six months, eight months, what's he going to do? It's pretty commonplace for him not to fight for six months. It's not a big deal. Will they fine them? That is what remains to be seen. Will they suspend him? Two, three years.

Then he can't make money. So I'm trying to reach out to Alex Davis. He gave me a number, but apparently it's not working. I wanted to have him on just to talk about this for a couple minutes to give his perspective on the whole situation, to see where they go from here, what he thinks about the punishment World Series of Fighting has given Hussemao Mar Palliaris. Look, watch the fight. It is, it is, it is downright disgusting to watch. And I'm not even talking about the Camorra. I wanted to have Recephal on first before I weighed in on the situation because, you know, I wanted to see what the promotion will do. I wanted to see what they would say. And I wanted to have Alex Davis to round it out because I wanted to see what he would say. But in this period where we're trying to reach out to him, I have to weigh in. I have to say that that was disgusting to watch. Repeated eye gouges. Eye gouges. Eye gouges have never been legal,

ever since day one, since UFC won, since there were essentially like three rules. Eye gouges have never been legal. Repeatedly digging his hands into the eyes of Jake Shields. There is no excuse for that. And you know what else? There's no excuse for Steve Mazagati, who we've talked about at length on this show and many other shows. There's no excuse for him not doing anything. No excuse at all. No warnings. One eye gouges enough. Two, three, four, five, when does it warrant a penalty? When does it warrant a disqualification? Forget about a point being taken away, a disqualification. And then the Comorah clearly held on too long. Again, Azagadi, not in the right position, not forceful enough. Look, this is no surprise. It is clear at this

point that he's just not a good ref. Fine human being, nice guy. I've talked to him before, but when there's a big fight like that, and you feel for World Series of fighting, you feel for them because Herb Dean and John McCarthy, the two best in the business were not there. They were in Rio, so it's tough. But there are other good judges out there, excuse me, referees out there. There's guys like Jason Herzog. There are a few, I mean, you want a guy who can get in there and be physical, if need be when you have a fighter who refuses to let go of his submission holds. This time it wasn't a leg lock. This time it was a Camor, which is, you know, in some respects equally as dangerous.

You could break an arm. Look what happened to Bignog when he didn't tap. You need someone who's going to get in there and he was in the wrong spot. He wasn't forceful enough. He didn't stop it. And look, let's just take him out of the equation. Let's pretend that there wasn't even a referee there. Jake Shields tapped enough on Polyaris.

It wasn't like he was tapping on his own leg. He was tapping Polyaris himself. and he wouldn't let go. There's no place for that. And World Series of Fighting is in a tough spot because this guy has generated a ton of interest for them, a ton of buzz, a ton of dialogue. People were talking about them on the same night as Ronda Rousey,

when if this didn't happen, they would have been completely overshadowed, and yes, the brawl had something to do with it. People were talking about them. So, you know, he's the most vilified man in MMA right now. A lot of people want to see him lose. A lot of people. So you have to put them out there. You have to make money off them. You have to book them. I get that. But at some point, you have to say enough is enough. At some point, it reflects, it reflects poorly on you, your organization, your fans, your network, and the sport. You can't, you know, you can't keep, you can't keep doing this. You can't keep cheating. And it's not just cheating. It's injuring people. You can't do that. This is, this is martial arts. This is what, you know, the whole thing about this, this thing from the beginning was code and ethics and honesty and professionalism and sportsmanship.

That's what martial arts are rooted in. This guy completely blows it out every single time he fights. And now it's every single time. He clearly realizes that every time he does this, it's good for him. He gets attention, right? Because more people are talking about him than ever before. That's taking advantage of the situation. That's being reckless. That's being reckless. That's that's being unprofessional. There's no place for it. We got him? All right.

Alex, are you there? Hey, I'm here, Ariel. What's up, man? Hey, Alex. Thank you very much for the time. Oh, come on, man. I'm for you anytime. So it's, are you there?

Yeah, I'm here. Okay. So at the beginning of this show, we had Ray Cepo on, and he announced, as I'm sure you've heard, that Hussemao Palliaris has been stripped of his title,

his World Series of Fighting Welterweight title, and suspended indefinitely. to be as fair as possible, I wanted to get your comments on this. Do you think that this was fair? I've got all the comments. I mean, I have a very strong position. First of all, I'd like to thank Ray for his respect to me.

I get his position. Okay, can you just hold on one? For sure. For sure. Being joined by Alex Davis in Brazil right now. Victoria, you know, I mean, I want to give Ray, I really like, I've always been his fan, you know, as a fighter, and I want to show his respect.

But, you know, the situation with Rosamara, you know, I see people saying a bunch of things, and I think that people don't understand what they're seeing. The problem with Rosamar to me is that he cranks those submissions way past what he needs to be doing. You know, it's not so much the time that he holds on. It's as far as he takes them, you know. And it injures, and it's really not necessary, and I agree with everybody else on that one. Also, the eye gouges. I did watch the fight carefully afterwards, and I did see where his hands come in contact with Jake Shields' eyes.

But I cannot say that that was on purpose or accidental, but independent of why or what the purpose was, it's still illegal. Yeah. Okay. So, I mean, the M.M.A has rules, and we have to abide by them. At the same time, if we're going to punish Rosemar for holding him. on to submission or cranky it too far or touching Jake Schild's eyes more than once.

We also need to punish Jake Schild for punching him after the fight. You know, I mean, we've got to be fair. It's just it's not because, you know, Rosenberg as a Brazilian can't defend himself, that, you know, that's right, right, wrong, wrong. And, you know, so that's another thing. Another point, the point I need to put is that

Mazagadi was in the wrong position. And this is something that, uh, since, in the very few minutes after the fight, I showed, without wanting to mention any names, to very knowledgeable people in the Maine. Everybody said the same thing. Mazzagati was completely out of position. Had he been in a better position,

he would have been able to stop that fight faster. Not only that, with the eye pokes, what he should have done, he should have stopped the fight. He should have got Rosemar up there, and he should have deducted the point of whatever he had to do. He let it go on, you know, which is, I don't think it's, correct. I think that might have changed the outcome.

And the real pity of all this is that it was a great fight. Yeah. She'll put on a great fight. Rosemar put on a great fight. Rosemar surpassed a lot of difficulty in that fight and managed to overcome it, you know?

So that's the pity of the situation. You know, I mean, that's the most unfortunate. It was a great fight, and we have such a great fight marred by this situation, you know? And going on with this, now we see SSOF suspend Rosemar indefinitely, but I have an issue with that because

you know, if Ariel, if I murder somebody, I get to put into jail for life or for 20 years, correct? Yeah. But not indefinitely, correct? Right. Okay. The contract very, very clearly states MMAWC shall have the right.

upon notice to the fighter, we have not had a notice from double SLOF yet, okay, just to make that clear. To suspend the term for a reasonable period until the applicable issue is resolved, I can see no place in this contract where it says that a double SLOF has the right to indefinitely suspend a fighter. And I also doubt that you can legally,

even a commission can legally indefinitely suspend anybody. You know, if you have to, or it's for life, or it's for 20 years, it's for 10 years, this is, this is legally wrong. You know, so my attitude is, you know, I get it. I mean, the

AA SLOF came under a lot of pressure from their fans. They have to respect their fans. There are things that are wrong there. Well, okay, if they want, they don't want Rosemar as their champion, that's their right. If they don't want him fighting anymore, in their promotion. That's their right, too, just end the contract.

My understanding, Alex, is that the reason they suspended him indefinitely is because they want to see what Nevada will do. Nevada has already said that they're going to review it and address this issue at an upcoming hearing. And then, based on what they do, because Nevada could come out and say, all right, he's suspended for two years, well, then, you know, their suspension really means nothing at that point. The commission typically, you know, supersedes the, uh, the promotion in this case. So does that make sense to you if, if broken down that way, if he's going to have his day in court and, and have to, you know, defend himself in front of the commission, they'll hear him out and then they'll weigh in. Doesn't that kind of explain why it's indefinite as opposed to saying,

okay, here's a six-month, one-year suspension, et cetera? No, it does not, because then if that's their situation, they need to let the athletic commission come out and suspend him and then take action and not come out in the media and try to look good doing something that they legally cannot do. You get it? So, I mean, legally, they can't do this. Yeah, sure. If the Nevada Athletic Commission comes out and suspends him for whatever periods, that changes

situations, the Nevada Athletic has not come out and do it, but they have come out in the media and not as the contract states, upon notice to the fighter, they have come out in the media, and they've stated in the media, and they look great to the media, but legally they can't do this. Under contract, again, it says,

MMAWC shall have right upon notice to the fighter to suspend the term for a reasonable. Ariel, does indefinite sound reasonable? I'm going back and forth on this because I understand where they're coming from. I think that they want to let it play out for the commission. And that's why they're... I think the big hit is obviously getting the title taken away

because I would imagine that comes with certain perks. Well, that's their right. Sure. That is their right. It's their promotion. I want to ask you this. Ray Sefo said he reached out to you yesterday. Is that true?

And if so, what was that conversation like? What did he say to you? Well, my job is to send my... fighter. So I called him out and I called him actually and we had a long talk and I asked him why don't you wait until the athletic commission

comes out and positions himself and he said he couldn't do that because it was under a lot of pressure. I understand it. I get his position you know he's he's defending his promotion. I'm defending my fighter. Yeah. Okay. But the way it's being handled in my view is wrong.

We're putting the car in front of the horses here. I don't think that, you know, whatever, I mean, I'm kind of pampered. You know, I deal with the UFC. The UFC has something tell me about a fighter. They tell me first and then they go to the media with it. Okay, so that right there is something for discussion, you know. So the main thing is, you know, I'm not going to let double SOF spend Rosemar indefinitely

to where it to the point where he cannot go something. someplace else to make his living. Okay? And that's the point. Now, we will abide by whatever Nevada says. Okay, we're going to, you know, whatever their position is, we're going to abide by it. But the way this was put out was completely wrong. And I really don't appreciate the way it came out.

You know, I think that if Ray was going to do something, he should have called me first and then gone out in the media, as it states in the contract. Right. Forgetting the punishment and the aftermath, you've been around this sport, long time. And this isn't, you know, it would be one thing if this was the first offense. We've had you on the show to talk about this with him. It's multiple offense now.

It's more than three. And in America, you know, it's three strikes and you're out. It's multiple times now. And it's almost every fight in World Series of fighting alone. You can argue that the submissions are being held a little longer. Now you have that extra added insult injury with the eye gaugges. What is going on here? I mean, you're a straight shooter.

I know you. What is going on here? There's a problem here. It's clear, right? I can't explain it. I mean, you know, think about it. When we had the first problem, we handled it. And the second, we tried to handle it.

And it's one of the focuses on all his training is to not space out, you know, not go beyond where he has to go. And for some reason that I can't explain it, happens, you know. and it's just a fact of Rosamars the way he fights. You know, I mean, I'm not going to defend it. I mean, it's just, and we've tried to change it, and there's been instances when it's been inflated, and there's been instances when he's really done, held on too long, you know?

Yeah. Sometimes, I mean, anytime Rosamar gets out there in the ring and any submission he holds onto, it's always going to be too long, you know, because sometimes he didn't hold on too long, but still it was too long, you know. And some other times he actually went past where he needed to go. You know, from my perspective, he cranks him way farther than he really needs to get the submission. If you watch Joe Lozone's piece where he showed that, you can clearly stay.

He takes it to a certain point and then stops and waits, you know. I mean, but again, that's Joe LaZone and Rosemar's Rosemar. They're different fighters. And I need to point something else. out. You know, sure. There are other fighters

that do similar things. And because they're not Rosamar, the media doesn't get, doesn't pick up on it so much.

I think that, you know, this is the same thing as when guys get punched three or four times after the knocked out, which is really the

same thing. You agree? It has to be addressed. For sure, but, but you do, you do admit that this is multiple offenses,

the same thing happening over and over again, and the eye gouges. I mean, look, Mazagadi deserves a lot of blame here. Quite frankly, just to interject, I don't think he should be roughing high-level title fights. In this case, you know, Herb Dean and John McCarthy, the two best were in Rio as you saw

them. So, you know, you kind of have to give them a pass on that one. Fine. I still think that there are better people. He should have been a lot more forceful and done his job and told Huismar repeatedly and to the point where, you know, a point at least should be taken away. Absolutely. If not. If it was soccer and you have one soccer team starting to bang up the other soccer team, what happens? The refs starts kicking guys out of the game until I stop it, correct? Yes. So you can make a case for a DQ, but my question to you is because you know him, and you know how he is in person, you know how he becomes in the fights, is it time to take a serious look at the fact that this guy, Hussimar Paliaris, who by all accounts when you meet him,

you know, on the street before fight, a very soft-spoken, wonderful young man, should just not be fighting. He should just not be competing in a combat sport where serious, injury can occur because of his actions. He changes. He becomes a different person. He's doing things that are injuring his opponent. And we know that this is not what MMA and martial arts are all about. Is it time to have that discussion? I would, but let me point out that this happens in other situations too. And, you know, but let's not talk about them. Let's talk about him. People, just a sec, Ariel, listen, let me show you some. Okay. People talk about serious injury, correct? Yeah.

Okay. But let me point something out to you, okay. And it's not only in Rosemar, in any situation where somebody doesn't tap, okay, once the joint's gone, it's already done. You know, and it doesn't have to be Rosemar to say that injury was caused by going farther than where the joint can go. I mean, you have countless instances where people have their joints popped.

Okay, it's part of our sport. The sport is based on damage. Okay. Now, it's graphically impressive when you see Rosemar do it. And that has a lot. You see the whole situation is so complex because you involve public opinion, you involve the opponents, you involve a guy that can't speak English, looks like a monster, you know,

and you involve the fact that he does crank those things too far and holds on to him too long. So do I think that he should be banned from the sport? No, I don't. I don't. I think it should, you know, I think that if it's applicable, if the authorities that their job is to govern our sport want a punishment, I think they have to.

And I think that as in any other sport, if a guy did something wrong once or twice, he gets worse punishments. Now, do I think that, that this guy has to be banned from the sport? No, I don't. I think that we're not there yet, you know? Have you talked to him since?

And if so, what's he saying? Is he remorseful? Does he not understand what exactly happen? What's he saying to you if you talk to him? You know what? Ariel, he doesn't, I think that this guy really, really does not. He's on that moment when he's fighting.

Yeah. It's called fight rage. He just zones out. He gets that submission, and he goes after it and wants to finish it. You know, and in his heart, he doesn't think that he's doing anything wrong. But after the fact, does he recognize it? Huh?

After the fact, does he say, damn? Then after you show him, he said, yeah, I could have let go earlier. But still, I'm here to win the fight. Right. Was this one personal for him because of what Jake had said? Jake said he was dirty, that he's going to try to hurt him. Did you know if that bothered him? No, because other fighters, we had similar situations,

and other fighters weren't talking bad. about him and we had similar situations. So I don't think it's personal against Jake, you know. And, you know, I do think that Jake took the pre-fight promotion a little bit too far. I think he said a lot of unfortunate things. But guess what? Jake put out a beautiful fight. You know, he's a really good fighter. And the fact is, in that sense, is that Osmar beat him at his game, you know. Yeah, well, I mean, the reversal at the end was nothing short of amazing. clearly a very athletic and talented man. It's truly unfortunate that all this has to happen leading up to it.

And of course, after the fact. So as his manager, what do you do now? What's your next step here? What do you do now as a manager? You sit back. You let the dust settle. You let the cards fall in place. And you see what you do to have your client keep on managing to make a living.

Do you want him to? to be released? Yes, I definitely, I think that, I think that in that sense, I don't have a problem with SSOF, not wanting him as their champion, but I do not want them trying to hold on to him if they're not going to use him. And I know you talked to me some time ago about him talking to a psychologist, sports psychologist, just to figure things out. Will that be done?

Yes, we can, we've done that before. You know, I never give up. I don't give up my fighters. I don't give up my fighters when they lose, when they win. If they're in bad problems, have personal problems, and I'm not giving up on Rosamara. Fair enough. Alex, we really appreciate the time.

Thank you so much for jumping on. Thank you so much, Ariel, any time you want. Okay, we'll talk to you soon. There he is, Alex Davis, the manager for one, Husimara Palliaris. You know, strong words there at the end saying he's not going to ditch his guy now. But this is a very tough spot to be in. And Alex Davis is a guy who has been around this sport a very long time.

Unfortunately that he even has to come on this show to discuss something like this. And I do mean what I said. I mean, the end of that fight, the reversal into the Kimora was amazing, especially against Jake Shields. Jake Shields is one of the toughest human beings to ever put on MMA gloves. He is incredibly tough. Make no mistake about it. If you beat Jake Shields, it's a big deal.

But it's a bad deal. if you eye gouge him multiple times, if you hold on to the fence, which he did, if you hold on to the submission, which he did in the process. It's just not the way it should be. And yeah, you could bring up the punch afterwards. Sure, Jake Shields, fine him for that. Fine. Two wrongs don't make a right.

But let's not compare what Jake Shields did to what Hussehmer-Paharis did. It's not even on the same level. Not even close. That does it for today's interviews. We have around 20 minutes to go here and I wanted to bring in my colleague from MMA Fighting.com Mr. Mark Romandi who's joining us now

via the magic of Skype, there he is, playing the role of New York Rick today because we don't have New York Rick here. Quite frankly, it's been a very smooth show. I've enjoyed not having his presence. I believe that Mark Romondi could be the Lou Gehrick to New York Rick's Wally Pitt. There you go.

Who needs him? Wally Pip, Eric? Yes, who needs him? But there were some technical difficulties earlier in the show. What happened? You know what? We're not going to harp on those. I think like all things, there's a silver lining and it has led us to YouTube, which is a great

thing. And hopefully we can use it for every single show because it seems to be very well received. Now, we were supposed to get to a lot earlier. I apologize for that. Alex Davis, the late start, people going longer, et cetera, et cetera. It got a little delayed. So I appreciate your patience. By the way, what happened to your neck?

I saw something on Instagram. What's going on over there? Who's beating you up? Here? Yes. I had a little accident yesterday. I was doing hill sprints. Okay.

Now, I'm a city person. I'm definitely not. I don't do things like hiking. And I decided to do that yesterday with Esther Lynn and Casey lied in from our venerable photographer and videographer at M.AFighting.com. Yes. And going down the hill, I took a little bit of a tumble, and I fell gingerly. into some thorny, some thorny shrubbery, I suppose.

But I'm okay, I'm okay. I know there are, is this caught on camera? I actually wish it was on camera, but unfortunately, I'm sure you would have played it today if it had been. Oh, yes. No, there's no footage of this, unfortunately. Your throng of fans would have appreciated this footage. Yes, yes, fans, indeed.

Okay, so I understand you have some questions. I hope you feel better, by the way. I understand you have curated the best questions, as New York Rick typically does. Well, first, I have a question for you. Oh, yes. The preview show before UFC 190, you and Mr. Guillermo Cruz, what was that all about? You bring my name up in discussion? It would have been raining in Rio if I had been there.

I brought your name up in vain. What is the meaning of that? What does that mean? Well, you know, we've talked about this before. some people tend to believe that you're a little too negative when it comes to the pre-fight discussion. And, you know, it was such a beautiful day. I couldn't help but wonder if you were there, would it be raining in Rio? I think you're pushing this, this Mark Raimundi heel angle a little bit too hard. I don't need your help. People hate me enough as it is. I don't need you to stoke the fire anymore.

I will stop. I will stop. In fact, I think you're a bright mind, you're a positive guy. That's why I have you. I called upon you and you alone to close out the show with me here. So that has to mean something. I apologize if you were offended by that comment, but it just came to mine and I'm an open book. Look, you were the fact that you were thinking of me before the big fight with Ronda Rousey and Bettecohe, in Rio on the beautiful beach, thinking of me back in Los Angeles, that really means a lot.

That gets me right here. Yeah, and let's not forget the fact that you had no idea what one particular tweeter was talking about when he brought this up. hours after the clip was already public. You have no interest in watching our footage unless it involves you. I'm busy. I'm not hanging out of the beach in Rio. I'm sitting here with my laptop open writing about five stories per day.

You're hanging out on the beach in Rio. What's up with that? You are the American animal. We got the Brazilian beasts. We have the American animal. We're wasting a lot of time discussing this stuff. Let's get to the damn questions. All right, all right.

What do you got? I want to see what you got. And by the way, if they're long, just feel free to give the guy props and sum it up so we can get this thing moving. All right. First question is from Lamont 18. It's a comment on this lovely MMA hour article. Do you believe the UFC will indeed put Ronda versus Misha as the co-made event of the Connor Aldo card? If they do, how big do you imagine the event will be? Will it easily beat the PPV record of USC 100? Okay. Because we're switching this up, I want you to answer them first and I'm going to piggyback.

so you answer. Oh, okay. You know what? I wouldn't be surprised that they did that. I know that Ronda has expressed the desire to be on that same card. And look, I mean, it makes sense, right? You put yourself on the Conn-Riggregor-Alda card. You're going to make a ton of money. But, I mean, the UFC right now only has a finite amount of draws. So I would rather see them just kind of split them up. You know, I think that as much as the Rousie-Tate fight has been panned by people inside the MMA bubble, I think that it's still a fight that has a lot of appeal to the casual fans. And really any fight that Rhonda Rousey is in right now has appeal to the casual fans. So I think they should split it up.

If they did put it together, I think it would be obviously a really big event. I don't know if it would beat out. I guess it was $1.6 million that USC 100 got, but I think it would come very close if those two fights were together. But you can't do AT&T Stadium without Rousey, right? Well, if the fight is a cowboy stadium, that's a whole different story. You need to fill those seats. but I still don't think that's going to happen.

Why? I'm still very, very skeptical because so many, they know why I said it so many times. He said at Cowboy Stadium so many times, and I think that the more realistic option is still that it's going to be in Las Vegas, that MGM Grand. You think this is some posturing on their part?

A little bit of leverage, you know, a little bit of leverage against MGM, you know, to make sure the fight is there. All right, fair enough. Again, all speculation, no inside info there at all. Taking away AT&T, because I do think if you do AT&T, you have to have Connor and Rhonda on the same card. Taking that away, because I do feel like Las Vegas, to be honest, is the best spot for that, especially with all the international people coming in. I love the idea of Rhonda and Yuan on the same card.

Love that. Especially with this girl power thing going on, you know? We did that the other night? Did you steal my idea? I've been talking about this for like a year now. A year. But not only Yuana on the same card, but a very, very, very big fight between Yuana and Claudio Godelia, I think that is a premier fight in that division.

I think that the winner of that fight, especially if it's on the undercard of a Rousie Tate, you know, the homemade event of a Rousie Tate main event could become a huge star. I think that either one of those women could be a huge star if they get that kind of rub. What's so funny? We got a comment from someone, but I'll get to that in a second. Give me Wyden, Rockhold, Conoraldo, and the two female champs on the same card. That's what I'd like to see. Not all four of them, two and two.

Sure. Robert Whiteford just weighed in. He said, he wanted to ask you this question. He said, ask Ariel if he fancies a weekend hunting, the mighty Scottish haggis. You probably don't know what he's referring to because you were in a of that interview, but, uh, I absolutely do know what he's referring to. He, you definitely bought what he was saying. I was. I guess it's not an actual animal, Robert. I did. But thanks for watching, but I appreciate it. Okay. By the way, I think he posts the most F words per minute in the history

of the MMA hour by Robert Whiteford in that interview. That was phenomenal. I like the flying judoka. I also think we kind of put him on the map. I mean, who was talking about Robert Whiteford before this show? Oh, hold on, hold on. Hold on. He had a big knockout in front of his hometown town fans the Scotland. Let's go easy there, Hawani. Let's take it easy. What else? Okay, next question we got from Anthony Menin. Who owns more responsibility for disciplining Hussamar Paul Harris? Is it WSOF or the Nevada State Athletic Commission? What would you do? Go ahead. So you want me to answer this? Yes, yes. Well, I mean, WSOF signed Paul Harris with the knowledge that he had a history of doing this

previously. But, you know, in the interest of giving guys second chance, I don't necessarily blame them. They're a, you know, they're not the UFC. They're not the highest level. He's a very good fighter, and he's proven that he's probably a top 10 welterweight in the world right now. So I don't completely kill them for this, especially because, as, as Ray Seville told you earlier, they're taking actions against him. Nevada will surely step in, and I'd be surprised that they didn't levy some kind of punishment against Baharis as well. So, I mean, I don't know, I don't really, I won't say that anyone is at fault leading up into the fight, but there were a few people who were at fault during the fight, mostly Paharis himself, Steve

Mazagati. I mean, these are people that are culpable for that. I mean, I think that both of them are definitely at fault. I think that both of them should see some kind of discipline. Steve Mazagati wasn't the ideal guy to have in that fight. You kind of crushed him earlier before, but like you said, Herb Dean was in Brazil, John McCarthy was in Brazil, Jason Herzog was in San Diego doing a regional card. So there wasn't, I think it was, was Steve Mazagati, Kim Winslow, and Mark Smith were the three referees available for that fight. And they chose Steve Mazagati. He's probably the most experienced of that of those guys. But, I mean, we know what his reputation is. And we saw what happened. It was kind of a cruel

twist that someone who's been known to miss certain things in the cage got assigned that fight. When I was told by John McCarthy on the way to the arena on Saturday that Mazagati was reffting that fight, I truly thought he was joking. And that's why Nevada deserves to be blamed for putting him in that spot. Figure it out, get it done. Mazagadi should not be in that spot. Now, I will say Kim Winslow also should not be in that spot. But Mazagadi, definitely the wrong guy.

So they deserve some blame going into it. He also deserves some blame, of course, for the way he very poorly repped that fight. And Polyaris deserves some blame. Jake, if you want to slap his wrist for the punch, fine. But, I mean, really, honestly, who could blame the guy? I mean, I gouged multiple times. The Camaro was held on too long, et cetera, et cetera.

So here's the thing. There is there, though. He has to be also disciplined by the bottom. Absolutely. But I still don't blame him. But yes, you should be. Two wrongs, don't make a right. The only issue that I have with WSOF at this point is that, as Alex Davis just said, they didn't call him beforehand.

He deserves a call before coming to the media. I think he's right there. But otherwise, I'm fine with the decision. I think it's right to strip him. I'm fine with the decision to suspend him. This is where I disagree with Alex. Suspend him indefinitely. Wait until Nevada rules on this.

and then take action. If Nevada's going to come out and suspend them in this day and age, they've been known to be pretty harsh for a year or two, then what's your suspension mean? Nothing. Because their suspension

supersedes any promotion and it stops him from fighting in North America or any commission elsewhere that's going to respect their laws. So I'm really fine with how World Series of Fighting handled it. They're in a tough spot, as you said.

Paliaris has gotten them a ton of attention, a ton of attention. I wouldn't be surprised if the replay tonight gets a pretty good rating because of all this talk. And they need that attention.

It's a weird thing because they were on the same night as Ronda Rousey, and yet a lot of people were talking about World Series Fighting because of a brawl, which is bad, and because of this, which was bad. So they're in a very weird spot for a promotion that's trying to make a name for themselves, but they had to do what they had to do, and I think they handled it very well.

They did, and it bums me out because, like you said, this is probably the most attention that World Series Fighting has ever gotten, and it skews negatively, but Paul Harris is a lightning rod, And not only that, but he's really good, man. Like, that's the, that's the worst part of it all is that he is, I mean, Jake Shields is still, to me, a top 15 ranked fighter. You know, he has wins over Tyron Woodley and James and Maya. He got a win over Robbie Lawler.

It was a while ago, but he hasn't won over Robbie Lawler. Hal Harris, you know, submitted him. Submitted him at, you know, obviously Jake Shields is best known for his jitsu. He submitted him and he did it in very, very convincing fashion. and, you know, it's just sucks that a guy who is that good can be that bad in that context. You know what I mean? Yes. What else you got?

All right. So this is from James Glory. Oh, yes. From our site, should the UFC book a fight between Nate Diaz and Habib Nirmigamette Medov and capitalize on the WSOF event drama in the buildup? Or is it too contentious an issue to sell on? You know, I have a weird feeling about this whole thing. It's like a lot of people are asking my thoughts.

Like, gosh, I don't know how to say it properly. I don't have the energy to get into this story. You know what I mean? I just don't have the energy. He said, she said, who started first, who didn't start first? I know you're supposed to go first on this one. I apologize for usurping you. But I don't know.

I'll say no because I just don't feel like going through this whole thing. You know, I don't feel like this being a lingering storyline. I think that we don't know enough about what happened. I think that there were probably a million different variables, including which was probably alcohol on Saturday night. I do think that even before this, a fight between Nate Diaz and Khabib was pretty intriguing. But I don't know if it necessarily makes sense. I mean, Nirmigand Medov is a guy that is right there among the next possible title contenders, whereas Nate Diaz is coming off a loss to Javier Dosangos.

on the flip side, if you want to give Khabib a fight before a title fight, it's not the worst thing in the world to do against Nate Diaz. You have this built-in thing. I mean, stranger things have happened in MMA. There's obviously a beef there. It will do very well. That's a fight that could possibly be a co-main event somewhere, you know, a pay-per-view co-main event.

Or a main event for a fight night, for sure. Or a main event on Fox Sports on a fight night. I mean, it's interesting. I would have wanted to have seen it before all this stuff happened. Now it kind of makes it seem a little tawdry. But I'm still in if they want to do it. It'll still be fun, I guess. It'll still be a fun fight.

And it's a chance for also Khabib to get in front of a little bit more of a casual audience. He's kind of won the hearts of a lot of hardcore MMA fans. But Nate Diaz is a guy that a lot of people know and to fight him and maybe you get a win against him would be probably big for his career also. So there's that. No thanks. I will also say that, you know, I don't love the idea of banning them from the events, especially when you consider the fact that, you know, great guy and all, but Ali is is Havib's manager. So it looks like you're taking sides by just coming out on the night of, you know, let's wait and see what happens. I don't think it helps you in any way to suspend these guys. They were not there looking for a fight.

You know how these things go. There's two sides. every story. I'm not in favor of that. What else you got? Well, we actually just spoke about this. Maybe we can go a little bit more in-depth. Yon Jacek versus Gedelia, too. Where do you want to see this fight? I personally think that headlining UFC on Fox 17, Hilland-December 17, would make the perfect platform to showcase the skill of arguably the two best strawweights in the world and add some more prestige to the 115-pound title. That's from Tempelhof on M.m.a.fiting. Go ahead. Again, I think that

I would not mind at all than being the main event on Fox But I think that Putting them on a platform Where they can get a rub from a bigger fight Would be the biggest service to them Because having them in a main event You'll promote them fine

But getting as much eyes on Both of those women as possible Should be a priority Because I really think that they both can be stars As I said before I think that having them on As the co-mate event of Rousey versus Tate would just be massive because you have the audience that wants to watch Rousey and Tate.

You have a lot of women. I'm sure you noticed it in Rio too. There just seems to be more women at these events now with Rousey on the card. I noticed that when UFC 184 in Los Angeles, there was just more women around. There was more women at open workouts on Media Day. And I think that women are looking for more fighters to the root for, and you have two built-in possible stars in Yawanna and Claudia. I think that's a no-brainer, but I don't know what they'll do.

But I think that's what they should do. It proves to the casual audience, and it was very surreal going on Twitter after UFC 190's seeing the likes of Bill Simmons and Kobe Bryant and LeBron James, you know, big time media players, big time athletes, all talking about the UFC. It was amazing. I mean, it felt like, wow, on a Saturday night, you know, August or not, the UFC was on everyone's mind. And that was amazing.

And it will prove to everyone that this isn't just the Ronda Rousey show. She's by far, you know, the biggest star as far as women's having. maybe even MMA is concerned. But there are other fighters. Yes, different divisions, but there are other great fighters out there and the UFC isn't only invested in Ronda Rousey. So by linking them up,

plus they have this mutual admiration society, it would be a lot of fun to see them on the promo tours together and all that stuff. I love that idea. I really hope that they put them together in their next fight. I think that would be amazing. What else? We actually did not get a question about this,

but while we're talking a little bit about Rousey, what do you see happening now with Rousy and Chris Seibor you know it just seems like every every fight that rousey has that talk comes up again and there's a talk while she's she's ducking cyborg and she doesn't want to fight cyborg and then people are saying well why doesn't cyborg cut down what do you what do you think happens in the end with that fight i think it will happen i truly believe it will happen and uh i wouldn't be surprised if it looks like we're going to get the mischip fight and that's fine um i want to see the cyborg fight next to me i think you're always rolling the dice you're always taking a risk it's a big

fight and it's never been bigger than right now because now people aren't only talking about Rhonda. I hear a lot of people talking about Cyborg too. They're like, okay, who's the challenge out there and Cyborg's name comes up even, you know, in outlets that don't usually talk about MMA. It's, it's there. People will buy it. People will be into it. I get it. I don't know if it will make over 2.5 million, you know, pay-per-view buys. I don't know about that, but it's a big deal. To me, if it's got to be 140, let's make it 140. Really? Let's just make the fight. Are we, are we really going to blow this whole thing because of five pounds? Okay, fine, she wants to work with George Lockhart. They want to see her get down. Fine. Let's make the Misha fight happen.

It's a big deal. I get it. They'll make money off of that as well. It's a little exhausting to think that we're going to have to go through the whole Misha thing all over again in a sense, because it's so, you know, it's so emotional and there's so much being said back and forth and the stair downs and all that. In a perfect world, I would do the cyborg fight now and capitalize on it. But if they can't, this is a, this is an okay, you know, number two. This is an okay plan B. But I want to see the cybrook fight. I don't care if it's not at 135 at this point. Make it at 140. Go out there. Make your money. It's funny. I was just browsing the web on Sunday and I stumbled upon my old shop, the New York Post, NYPost.com.

And right there, the number third item on NYPost.com, the main page was an article about Ronda Rousey possibly fighting Chris Cyborg. Now, I was at the New York Post about, about two years ago at this point. I left for Fox about two years ago. And no one in the New York Post had any idea who Chris Seibor was, and very few people knew who Ronda Rousey was two years ago. It's amazing how much that fight has been built up over the last... I wouldn't even say the last two years, I would say over the last eight months.

I would say since Ranza fought Katzingano, I think the fight, that fight has just really increased. they have to do it. I had been saying for a while that it's one of the biggest fights the UFC can do. No, it's actually, it could be the biggest fight they could ever do, you know, in terms of how that, if they sell that fight, right, it's so easy to sell, it's so promotable. And I do understand why the UFC would be a little bit nervous about making that at a catchweight or making that at 145.

And it's got only to do with protecting Ronda Rousey. It's not that. It's the fact that what if Chris Seibor wins? What if Chris Cyborg wins and beats your biggest star, and then there's no division for her? There's no 145 pound division. If she can't make 135, where does she go from there? So pretty much the whole 135 pound division loses its credence because you don't really have, you have Rousey who lost already, so the best fighter in that division is not even the best fighter,

and then you have no division for Cyborg. So I understand why they wouldn't want to do it, but money. End of the day, the bottom line is what makes the most sense, and that fight will just make too much money. And if Cyborg wins, you can do the rematch, and I don't make even more money. So I think that I agree with you. I think the fight will eventually happen.

I've gone back and forth about it. I don't know. I don't think Cyborg can make 135. If she can, I don't think it'll be in a healthy way. Do it at 140. Do it to 145. Just make it happen. It's possible the biggest fight they could do.

The UFC has never been in the what-if business. I mean, they're booking Frank Meir versus Andrea Olavski, which doesn't really make a lot of sense right now just to fill a spot. They're not, they booked so caught. That's on a much smaller scale. I know, but they put KroKopp against Gonzaga when Kut, to where everyone wanted to see it. They didn't need to see the Gonzaga fight. They've never been in the what-of business.

They roll the dice all the time. They do. They roll the dice with McGregor versus Mendez. Yes, roll the dice. Let's see it. Okay, we have like two minutes left, so let's roll through these. Rapid Fire. All right.

Speaking of Arlowski and Mir, sudden resurgence of older M.M.A. heavyweights. What do you think the main reasons are for the success of the wave of resurging of emerging heavy weights appearing on the main stage? Crow Cop, Rolovsky, well, he mentions Kimbo's Likes and Ken Shiamrock. I don't know about that.

What the hell? Okay, get rid of the question. You mentioned those two guys and that question. Get out of here. Next. Wow. Next. Very disturbing.

Okay. How about this one? Okay. Dana White was heavily criticized by pro-wresting personas and fans for calling pro wrestling, quote, fake shit. Do you think they're overreacting? Did CM Punk get the same reaction when he called pro-wrestling fake

during an interview with Sports Illustrated? What do you think? I got to say, your question, are amazing. I don't know if it's just good questions today or you're picking better questions, but you are killing. I think it's just thinking. Yeah. Okay, go ahead. Our fans overreacting. I mean, yeah, a little bit, but fake is like a four-letter word to a pro wrestling fan. Everyone knows that the outcomes are predetermined, but when you say the word fake, it means that these injuries are not real. The toughness of the business is not real. Pro wrestling is one of the toughest

businesses in the world. It's incredibly grueling. You need to be in an incredible athlete. I have the utmost respect for everyone who competes in that in sports entertainment. But I don't think Dana White was being Dana White on Twitter. He said far worse things in the last week to fans on Twitter than calling pro wrestling fake.

So there's a little bit of overreaction, but I can understand a little bit. A lot of bit. I see all these wrestlers tweeting him. Yeah, yeah. We get what he was trying to say. He meant to say scripted. Dana has never been disparaging towards pro wrestling. No. He's been very complimentary. even to Vince, who has taken shots at the UFC.

So the question, remember, the question was, WWE Network is 999 and these pay-per-views are 60, and he's like, well, they're fake and we're not. Okay, fine, he's sticking up for his brand. I don't think he was trying to insult. He let Rhonda do WrestleMania. He wasn't trying to insult them. He's good friends with the Rock, punk, all that stuff,

Brock Lesnarre. Just take it down. I got people ranked to me at USC 190. What is your take on Dana White saying wrestling is fake? Are you kidding me? Are we really going to get? And while we're at it, I just need to address this. I got a lot of people, you know, I did this interview with Ronda Rousey, this post-fight interview,

and then I go on Twitter afterwards and I see all these people giving me grief, saying, that's disgusting, blah, blah, giving me all kinds of grief on Twitter. Because I said to her, because she said, you know, I hope that Roddy Piper was with my dad watching that performance, enjoyed that, you know, up above. And I said to her, that's good she believes in that kind of stuff. Are you the kind of person? And I think that, I'm guessing that people thought that I was. was mocking her and insulting her. And as I've said on this show before, I'm a religious person.

I pray every day. I don't flaunt it. I don't talk about it. I wanted to know if she, like, if she's on the same wavelength, I believe in that stuff. There are a lot of people who don't believe in an afterlife. There are a lot of people who think when you're dead, you're dead. They don't believe in heaven. They don't be, and I was like, this is a beautiful, it got me emotional. It got me choked up, that thought, that image. And I want to know, like, is this, is this something that, you know, you're telling yourself today, or are you the kind of person who actually believes that your dad is watching over you and I couldn't understand. Am I crazy? Maybe I shouldn't have worded it that. I don't know. But like I went on Twitter and I got all this hate. What's wrong

with people? Did they not understand where I was coming from? Am I wrong here? What's going on? Listen, tell me. Stop reading. Stop reading the comments. Okay. All right. Final thing. You know that we have to go. Favorite comments? That wouldn't be on right now. That's right. We love you. Final thing. Favorite Roddy Piper moment? I mean, I know it's the obvious one, but it has to be the coconut and Jimmy Snooker, right? I like that. And I think an underrated one is when he made his debut in WCW against the NWO where he came to the ring.

No, I'm telling you, that's a good one. Really? It was a good promo. He confronted Hogan when he was in the NWO. It was kind of like he hadn't been around for a little bit in wrestling. It was during a time where I was, well, it was during the Monday Night War, so it was probably a time when the most fans were watching. I just remember that that just sticks out of my mind.

but of course the coconut, Piper's Pit, Jimmy Snooka, that whole little thing, putting over Jimmy Snook also at the end of that, which is what he did incredibly well. There are a lot of moments. You know, he's one of the greatest. He's one of the guys who has shaped what pro wrestling is right now. It may not be exactly what it is right now, if not for a guy like Roddy Piper. 100%. For me, one of my favorites, great one.

March, 1984, Frank Williams, Piper's Pit. Just when they think they got the answers. Yes. I changed the questions. I mean, come on. It's brilliant. I wasn't even alive when that happened, but I- How old are you? I'm 30.

Jesus. Well, you did great, my friend. I'm sorry for... Two years older than me. Three, three. Well, maybe. When's your birthday? In three weeks.

Okay, wow. We'll have you back on to celebrate. Happy birthday, early birthday. Great job. You did a fantastic job replacing Rick. I honestly am going to consider just having you on at the end of the show. Who needs that guy? Yeah, Wally Pip, get out of here. I'm too busy this every week.

I got too many times. I'm sorry, yeah, you have to write like 9,000 posts. I'm sorry that we had to cut this short, but them's the breaks, kid. We'll get you on soon. I got some interviews I got to do anyway, so it's better. It's better all. Bye-bye. Later.

There he is. Mark Romandy, slash throat and all, thrash-knack-neck-all, I should say, joining us on the M. Our time, taking over for New York Rick's job. All right, we're out of time. you can hit my music. We have gone far too long. In fact, we didn't actually go far too long because we started this thing 10 minutes late. So in fact, we only really went five minutes over. If you ask me, all as well, that ends well. Thanks to the guys in the back for working on the fly

and figuring this out. I appreciate it greatly. And thanks to all of you for tuning in on a special Tuesday. Of course, we're back next Monday, same time and place. So nothing's changed. But these Tuesday shows are fun. I said this yesterday on a radio show. To me, what's most interesting about the rise, the meteoric rise of Ronda Rousey is that in pro sports, you can typically pinpoint a superstar long before they hit the big leagues. LeBron James, Sidney Crosby, Peyton Manning, the list goes on and on.

But Ronda Rousey's debut four years ago in MMA came with little or no fanfare. No one was talking about her. No one was covering her. And now four years later, she's the biggest. star in the sport, arguably the face of the UFC, the biggest draw, and a pioneer and a trailblazer and someone will be talking about in 50, 60 years from now. Pretty amazing. Thank you very much to Recefo for stopping by. Thank you very much to Yohanna, Yom Jacek. Best of luck to Misha Tate. Thank you very much to Michael Lunardelli. Appreciate Dustin Pori's time. Best of luck to him. Thank you very much

to Chad Mendez. Thank you very much to the legendary Judo Gene LaBelle. And of course, thank you very much to Alex Davis. rest in peace Roddy Piper that will never be another one Hot Rod, legend he will be missed

sorely see you next Monday until then I say peace I'm happy Support for this show comes from Odu running a business

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