MMA Fighting - UFC 273 Post-Fight Show | Did Khamzat Chimaev Live Up To The Hype? | Volkanovski, Sterling Pick Up Big Wins

Episode Date: April 10, 2022

Khamzat Chimaev's win over Gilbert Burns was one of the wildest fights of the year, but did it slow down the hype train? Should Alexander Volkanovski be a top-2 pound-for-pound fighter in the world? Did the judges get it right in the scoring of Aljamain Sterling vs. Petr Yan 2? Join MMA Fighting's Shaun Al-Shatti, Mike Heck, Alexander K. Lee, Jed Meshew, and E. Casey Leydon as they discuss the top storylines coming out of UFC 273. Follow Shaun Al-Shatti: @ShaunAlShatti Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Follow Jed Meshew: @JedKMeshew Follow Alexander K. Lee: @AlexanderKLee Subscribe: http://goo.gl/dYpsgH Check out our full video catalog: http://goo.gl/u8VvLi Visit our playlists: http://goo.gl/eFhsvM Like MMAF on Facebook: http://goo.gl/uhdg7Z Follow on Twitter: http://goo.gl/nOATUI Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Yeah. Let's go. Let's go. What is up, my friends. Oh, my gosh. Boom. What a night. What a night.

You already know. Welcome the UFC 273. Post-fight show. here on M.M.A. fighting. My name is Sean O'Shti, and I am joined by the crew. Let's meet them. Out there in Jacksonville. He is the host of Heck of a morning at several other shows. He is my man, Mike Heck. Also joining us, the Prince of Positivity. The King in the North, himself, Alexeda Kay Lee, and the Lord of the Hot Take. Duval. Jed K. Maymishu. The undefeated E. Casey Layton Man in the boards from the producer's desk and let us get

rolling, fellas, because it's late. We have a lot to get to you. And I know my man, Mike, they're kicking y'all out here soon. So we got to get to you for you, first. I think at some point tonight for UFC 273, our old pal, New York Rick, said in our MMA fighting Slack room that tonight's card was never meant to be a buffet. It was always meant to be a three-course meal. And that had rung true. I mean, those top three fights, I would say absolutely lived up to the hype. At the top of the card, you had just a sublime performance by the champ Alexander Volcanowski. He retains with what was pretty much a perfect performance against chance Sung-jong. Al Jermaine Sterling also retains his title with an extremely,

close competitive decision over Peter Jan. He's going to have himself a hell of a time over the next few months thrown in everyone's faces and he deserves it. But first, let us start where we started on the preview show. Because like it or not, UFC 273 was the Hamzat Shemaya show coming in and good Lord, what a special

fight we were all witnessed to tonight. One of the best of the year. Unbelievable display of heart from both Shemayev and Gilbert Burns. And ultimately he did it. He came in there and he won. Mike, I throw it to you first. Hamsat Shemayev. coming in tonight.

Did that meet your expectations? Was that below your expectations that exceed it? Where are you at with this? So it's one of those things where, you know, we talked about this on the preview show and throughout the week. It wasn't a matter of if it was a matter of when Hamzat would go in there and get a win.

And as cool as that would have been, if we're thinking about the long-term future of a guy like Hamzaa Chamaa, where he can go in this sport and in this division, yeah, it would have been cool for the short term, but the long-term, he needed this fight. he needed exactly what happened tonight. He needed a guy who's going to get in there and punch him in the face

and make that man bleed his own blood because it showed that Hamzaa Shamaev is human. It showed he was human because he's been coming off as like this Terminator robot. And even when he walked up to the press conference, like it just seemed like he was a little more vulnerable. Like he was like, all right, like almost like a big weight was lifted off his shoulders that he went through an experience like that. And it sort of hardened him up for the potential.

potential run that he's about to be on, maybe fighting the Colby Covingtons of the world, fighting the Kamar Usmans of the world. And it opens a lot of things up because if you're Colby Covington right now and you watch that performance, yeah, you understand that Hamzaa Chamaif is super tough, that he could get into the trenches, pull himself up by the bootstraps and get on the other side with a win. But at the same token, Colby, who may not have been as interested in a guy that's just trucking people, might be like, well, you know what? If I fight this guy right now, I might have a chance to beat him.

So it really, compared to where we were heading into this fight, Hamza has a lot more options that he had heading in. And that's not necessarily a bad thing. That's actually a really good thing. So I think the intrigue levels about this man have actually grown, despite him not running through Gilbert Burns, like a lot of people thought he did. But unbelievable fight. I was in the back. We were all on the edge of our seats. We all had goosebumps.

We were going crazy for every single punch and kick thrown. And, I mean, my hat goes off. I was where I went to both gentlemen. congratulations to Hamza at Shamaeef and Gilbert Burns keep that head up son an amazing fight yeah I mean Mike you give me the perspective of being out there in Jacksonville how this whole week I mean we've talked about it quite a bit it did feel like this was the big fight of the week even with the two title fights on fight night in that arena what was sort of the vibe around Hamzaa Shamaa Gilba Burns what was the vibe afterwards just set the scene for us so so we're in the back

in the way this arena is structured, like you could kind of see above me, it's almost like stairs are going up. Like it's crazy. When that fight was going on, it was literally felt like an earthquake in here. The place was shaking. That's how into the fight people were.

I could hear anytime the crowd made any noise, I could hear it. But with that fight was going on, it was like the whole room shook. That was the perspective I had. These people were all in on it. Gilbert Burns, Hansa Tchaimai F,

these guys got after it. The fans appreciated it. And it's always great when something is hyped up so much. It's built up so much. Not only does deliver to the expectations people had, this one delivered 20 times bigger than that. And this is going to go down as one of the all-time great fights. This is going to be a fight that maybe five, six years from now,

much like Cubswants and Du Ho Choi got the rub tonight, this could be a fight that ends up in the UFC Hall of Fame five or six years from now. So I think the people who are here to see it live witness something special. and they certainly felt like they did because the room back here was shaking what we were watching in the media room. Well, Mike, I wanted to stick with you here for a second because again, we're losing you in a second.

Seems like Colby Covington's next. I mean, we heard this earlier. We heard this, you know, coming into the fight that Colby was the fight they were sort of looking at next for Hamzat, especially now that with the way this plays out, it feels like we can slow things down a bit. As you said, there's no rush anymore now to rush him into the title shot,

and I think that's actually a good thing. is the Colby fight for you is that the way we go with this at first I was like I mean it's cool but I also thought like all roads were going to lead to Hamzat getting either an interim title fight or getting an actual title fight and it seems like all signs are pointing to Usen versus Leon Edwards sometime this summer

and when and where TBD but right now after that fight and after that performance I'm literally about this I don't know if I could be more fascinated about any other fight for Hamzat Shamiya for right now because I don't want him fighting Kamar Uson right now because I feel like as great as Hamzaa was and as great as that fight was, you have to think that Kamar Uson watched it and his confidence grew. So I think Colby's the right fight.

And I think Colby presents some really interesting challenges to Hamzaat Shamaif. As good as this guy is, as terrifying as this guy is, especially in a five-round fight, like, we were talking, we talked about betting lines and stuff like that. I would say like it would be like a minus 350 Hamzat heading into tonight. I would say right now, Hamzat's still the favorite, but it might be like minus 180, like minus 170. Maybe it's like even closer than that. I think it's super interesting,

especially when we get to rounds three, four, and five, if Colby can survive the devastation like Gilbert Burns did. But I'm super fascinated. Walter Waite just got a big boost and not just in the championship picture, but right below it too. Colby, Hamzat is huge. And this is an opportunity to even get Colby back into a trilogy you fight with Kamar Usman.

So the stakes are super high for this fight and they do it on ABC. What a giant platform to have it. Well, quickly, man, I want to get your perspective just on the rest of the night. Obviously, we had two other title fights. Big, big moves from Al Jemaine Sterling and Alexander Volcanowski both. Who was your standout from the two title fights? What was your big takeaway? I mean, it's got to be good for Al Jermaine Sterling, feel a good moment, come through and win the title and shut up everybody.

I mean, that's going to be a tremendous feeling for that guy, but it's got to be Alexander Volcanowski. The guy went out and was like David Wells, just chucking pitches right down the middle. Perfect game. Just was fantastic. I mean, he has looked so tremendous in his last several fights. That Brian Ortega fight outside of that third round,

I mean, he put a beating on that man, and I thought that was going to be one of those performances that was going to age so well that we'd always go back to that one. This was incredible. Nobody does what he did to the Koreans' zombie tonight. That fight could have been stopped easily at the end of the third round. He comes out in the fourth and vault just looked like he needed it. He was going to go out there and make a statement and he knew he was going to make it. Whatever Korean zombie

and his team had planned, it was like Alexander Volcanowski had a spy in the room and knew everything he was going to do. I was so impressed by this guy to the point where he might very well be the best fighter on the planet, pound for pound. He might have jumped Kamar Usen with this performance because he was that. good and he was that perfect. I mean, this is an A plus. This guy went out and had an A plus performance tonight over a legend and just a tremendous fighter guy

that everybody respects. He might be the number one guy in the world. I don't know if I'll be my, there's a chance. I will be having an internal discussion with myself whether or not Alexander Volcanovsky is the number one pound for pound fighter in the world. It's going to be a very tough discussion,

but I will say this. I have number four in my pound for pound rankings right now. not be number four next month. He will be three, two, or one for certain. Wow. Look at that. It's a hell of a night for the champ, for both champs. Actually, Al Jameen retains as well. Mike, you guys killed it. You and Jose both all week out there in Jacksonville. You absolutely crushed this coverage. We appreciate you so much, man. Thanks for staying late with us. Thanks for giving us a few minutes. Safe travel back, my man. I got one more thing to say. I got one more thing to say. I know, I know New York Rick had a great quote with the three course meal, and I get exactly where it's coming from.

But sometimes when you have a three course meal, you get a little thirsty. That glass of water tastes delicious. The Diet Coke, maybe you're into a frosty beverage. I think we got a little bit of everything tonight. We got finally, finally, Alexi Olinick, the 60 win graphic that Jose Young made like 14 years ago. We finally got to put it on social media. So congratulations to Alexi. Congratulations to Jose.

to finally get to show the world that graphic. Also, congratulations to Mike Milot, because that was a ferocious knockout. He had an A-plus post-fight interview, and then he had like an A-plus-plus post-fight scrum as well. He didn't get a bonus, but what he's trying to do, the more important thing about donating money

and helping out his coach and his family and his coach's daughter, who's going through a really hard time right now. Now Dana White's going to match his win-and-show money to donate to that cost, so that Mike Malak can keep his money. That guy deserved a bonus. And maybe this means more to him than that.

So, yeah, we had some good fights. We got a lot of decisions. But in the end, this is going to be one of those cards. We're going to be talking about the end of the air. But thank you guys for all the support back here in M.A. fighting. Appreciate you all. And Godspeed, we'll see you next week.

Mike, I'll see you. Oh, I'll see you tomorrow. I'll see you tomorrow. I'll see you in a few hours. Hold on. We have a live on the next one coming up Sunday morning. I'll see you in a few hours, buddy. It will not be live.

It will not be live. Oh, thank God. Oh, thank God. I don't know what's happening. Yeah, travel day, all that stuff. There will be on to the next one on the podcast network, the greatest podcast network ever. Good night, everybody. Okay.

Godspeed, my man. All right, fellas. We have a lot to dig into, so let's do it. Jumping back to Hamzatchamaya versus Gilbert Burns and then we will work through this card. Jen, I'm going to throw this to you, man. Same question I asked Mike at the start. Below expectations for you, did this meet your expectations to exceed them? Where did this land for you?

I mean, I think it's below expectations because the expectations are so sky high for me for what was going to happen. But that's not to say that he did poorly. I thought it was we learned a ton and we learned a lot of really good things about Hamzad Chamaio. I think he did. I rarely agree with Dana White, but I think what he said in his post-fight presser about Hamzad's pretty spot on, you know. This guy still is very unproven or untested. He doesn't have that many professional fights. And against, you know, one of the top five welterweights in the entire world,

he comes in and beats him with pretty limited experience up to this. Like, that's a, any way you cut it, that was a really good performance from him. He showed a ton of heart, honestly, a more varied striking game than I thought, frankly, and just looked overall good. So it's definitely less than what I thought, because I thought he was just going to absolutely dump truck him. but I thought it was a great performance so I can't take anything away from the man

and I'm just excited that everybody else is going to come with me you guys are going to take the journey, put him at number two on your well-to-weight rankings and I'm a visionary and a pioneer and you guys are all just finally catching up. Oh, this is gross. The victory lap that this man's going to take now is just gross. A.K., I can't handle this.

You step in here, okay. I mean, obviously, obviously, well, let me say, Obviously, Hamzat Shemayev now is one of the best welter weights in the world. But he is also human. And we saw that now. And I think everyone can see that it's fine. It's fine that he's human. I'm already seeing sort of this weird narrative developing of like, oh, he was exposed.

Now he's overrated, this and that. It's like, this is a man who fourth UFC fight, 11th fight as a professional total. And he just came in here and beat the number two guy in the world in an incredibly stacked division. And it was one of the best fights that we will see. in 2022. There's no way that this is a disappointment. Like this was an incredible performance, however you slice it. For you, tonight's action, the way this all played out,

does this make you more or less convinced that Hamzat Shemayev will hold UFC gold at some point? Oh, more, more. Not like a lot more. It would be closer to like steady. But I mean, I think my expectations for him were already pretty high. Because I was saying before the show that even a lot, that a lost scale of burns, I don't think that necessarily derails him.

And I think we would have learned a lot from that, too. And I think I also saw people saying that they thought Burns did win the fight. So in some people's minds, this was kind of an L, even though it's not official for Shamiya. But again, just judging the action itself, regardless of whether you think Shemaya clearly won a decision or if you got away with the decision, he showed you a lot. He showed you a lot. He showed you a lot of what you needed to see in a contender because you want to see resilience. I think resilience is a key. Now, look, there are some fighters who just.

just bulldoze their way to a title. I mean, Cody Garbant is probably an example. He had all those highlight real knockouts, and then he puts on the greatest performance of his life against Dominic Cruz. It was just this 90-degree angle trajectory, and then, of course, burnt up pretty quickly after that. But most champions aren't like that. Most champions aren't like that.

Our greatest champion, M.A's greatest champion, George St. Pierre, had a couple of hiccups before he finally became the George St. Pierre that we see and that we view as dominant. Habib would be on the other side, of course, another guy who I would say, you know, was pretty one-sided with his performances, though.

There was the, there was the Glysses T-Bel fight. There was the, that one moment, the Michael Johnson fight, people always point to. So these moments of adversity are, are become part of a champion story.

And one day, I never like to say when with these things, but strong if, one day, strong if Hamza Shemaya does become a UFC champion. We will look back on this guild. Burns fight as a positive as a great part of his mythology not as like oh he he got away with one there and and I didn't think it was at that moment you know I started to have doubts it's like

no no this this happens this happens to all great fighters and again the fact that he hey listen he is still undefeated you know what we're talking about it like he was tested and like he lost and no man the record is still is still unblemished he's still clearly one of the most exciting fighters in the UFC if there was any question of that I mean he's not just bulldozing through overmatch competition. He just put on one of the best fights of the year against me personally, my number two and my personal rankings, Gilbert Burns. And now he's going to take that spot.

So, yeah, definitely slight bump upwards as far as my expectations for him, which were already sky high. I mean, Jed, same thing to you, man, because I honestly, I come away from tonight so impressed by this guy, and I feel like some people aren't. So I wonder, you more or less convinced that he's a future champion now tonight than you were this morning. I am less, but again, it's a major caveat.

I think he's still going to win a UFC title. I was pretty convinced that he was going to win two UFC titles before tonight. I am a little less certain that he can go up and get the middleweight one. I think that's still in play. I'm not willing to throw the baby out with the bathwater because of one tough fight. But I think we saw some limitations. And so now, whereas there weren't any before he was. was unbounded in my imagination.

Now there are some real things that he can fix and can work on, but he's also 27. I know he's relatively young in fight years, but if he was 22 or 24, no questions at all. He's going to be a two-division champion. At 27, knowing that he has some clear limitations that he maybe didn't fight the, and he acknowledges, didn't fight the best fight for himself. He got drawn into a battle that he shouldn't have been. been drawn into. That raises questions, especially when his road to a title will go through

Kamau Usman, one of the greatest fighters of all time, and potential is Dissnya, also one of the greatest fighters of all time. So I still think he's going to hold the belt at some point. I'm just less confident he holds two, though I still think that's in play for him. It did feel too. I mean, maybe out, though. Yes. I was like, I was like, I was almost ready to be like, I think he's going to be the first three

division champion. and that one, I'm straight out on three now. I don't think he's getting the 205. Well, I think that that's one of the things that tonight did, right, is it grounded us more in reality with this, because this was getting really fanciful for a while because of just the historic nature of how this is sort of gone up until tonight. Like, we had never really seen anything like him until tonight.

Now it just feels like a much more realistic person, athlete, fighter. Like, however you want to frame it. AK, I mean, the Colby, fight, that feels like this has to be the way to go from now, right? Like, that, that's the fight. I don't feel like there's this urge now to push him to Usman or anything like that. Like, it has to be a Colby. The only downside to the Colby Covenant fight is that if Covington beats him, I shouldn't say it's a downside because then, yeah, you probably set up a third fight with Usman, but that's a fight that Usman is probably not interested in Teagan anytime soon. I know both their

fights were really competitive. I'm one of the people who says, hey, anytime you can throw the two best, you know in any division in there you should do it but i do think fans are a little bit burnt out because it's not just that they fought twice it's that like the feud is it was pretty intense like even even in between their two fights there was so much back and forth trash talk i just i don't know if that's a fight you can sell a third time so soon and if you beat shemaiah i i don't think they have any other direction to go so that's my one my one caveat i would pick shemaiah to beat covington but that's an assumption, but not anything close to a guarantee.

And I think of your Dana White in the match breakers, you have to consider that. Because again, perfect world, Shemaya runs through Kummington. You have this fresh challenge for Usman, and then Shemaya beats him, and then you have a fresh champion. It's great.

You start this whole cycle all over again, and people get intelligent, Yassana-da. But that's a dangerous game to play. It is a bit of a dangerous game to play. So I do like it. Dana White did say that would likely be next. He said that interview.

This is kind of a Dana said moment. You guys can take that with a grain of salt. I have to think what other options there could be. Like, I still want to see the Neil Magni fight, but it really just feels like he jumped over that by beating Burns. And if you're him, even if, let's say, Neil Magni, let's say he takes care of Shabakhanov and just destroys him, even if you're seeing that year, Shemaya,

you're probably just like, I don't really want the Neil Magny fight right now somewhere down the road. So if you're him, you want the Colby fight. I mean, that's the way to go. if not an interim title fight with Leon Edwards, if not an instant title shot with Usman, that's your best part, non-title option here.

Yeah, I agree. Let us now move on and talk about the champion. The man, the best featherweight in the world. I've been silly with this for the rankings, I think, at this point. Thank you. I've come around. I've come around. Tonight was his night, and what a night it was.

I mean, his first, Alexander Volcanovsky's first finish as UFC champion, and it was never really in doubt. I mean, in total control from pillar to pelons, It felt like he could do anything he wanted in there against Chan Song-Jung Korean zombie. Jed, what did you see tonight from the champ? You saw what I've been saying to y'all forever. That dude's the best 145 on the planet. He's there no bigger Jose Aldo Mark than I am, and Jose Aldo is still the goat because of all he's accomplished.

Well, Volk has a real chance to take the title because that dude's the best featherweight on the planet. And God love Max Holloway, but he doesn't. ain't it and he ain't going to ever beat that dude like he's just never they're going to have great fights and they might fight eight times and in each of them wogonovsky's just going to slightly beat him because he is so good at so many things and at putting all of those pieces together in a dominant and tremendous way maybe this is hyperbole maybe i'm just a little too caught up in the moment that might actually just be the best performance that might just be the best performance I've ever seen a fighter put together in the cage.

Like, from a pillar to post, consummate in, not a one-shot, K-O, he tuned up Korean zombie for however 16 minutes or whatever it was before. Herb Dean, thank you because zombies corner are assholes. Herb Dean, you did your job, but Volcanovsky did his job better than anyone else in the world tonight. I thank you for mentioning Herb team because that was one of the best stoppages that I've seen from a referee for a long long time perfect like Herb has has taken it on the chin for quite a few number of years at this point he's had some deservedly so yeah yeah like a lot of that wasn't unfair he's had some rough moments tonight was a brilliant brilliant moment like that needs to be submitted instantly into every video you know tutorial that they show these judges, teaching up-and-coming referees, things like that, like, that needs to be inserted into that

immediately because that was a boxing stoppage tonight. And it was merciful, and it saved Korean zombie whatever kind of extended damage that he was about to take. And this was not going to turn around. And we need to see more stoppages like that. And I hope tonight sort of sets a trend for that. But, AK, I mean, it does feel like, we mentioned it a bit on the preview show, but like Alexander Volcanovsky is really evolving into somebody very interesting in front of our eyes. He's coming to his own. He's very comfortable. He's very calm. confident in himself. And he's said, you know, a thousand different ways. He just doesn't care anymore about what everybody else is talking about. He's going to do him and he's going to have

fun doing it. And it feels like this was kind of the fight and the kind of win that he needed tonight of finish. It was decisive. What do you see there? Well, I mean, I love the I don't care persona because it was, it was believable. We see, we see fighters. We see athletes kind of say that sometimes. But you can tell they're putting it on. They're trying to convince themselves, like as much they're trying to convince us that, I don't care. I don't care what to be. says. I don't care what fans say. And sometimes it just doesn't come off. There's a good example. Sure. Aljo. But with Volcanovsky, you really, you really believe it. You really believe he's at this point of his career where he's so comfortable in his own skin. He's so confident about his accomplishments.

Again, I'm sure when the third Max Holloway fight gets booked, he didn't have deal with all this kind of talk again, like, oh, do you still feel like you're in Max's shadow and do you feel like You need to beat Max if you consider the best, blah, blah, and he'll deal with those conversations, you know, when they come. But in this situation where he was entering as the head, the headliner, John Anick says all the time about like two or three fights in the car, the man around whom the event was built. I mean, in this case, it might have been Shemayev,

but right, right behind that would have been Volcanowski. He was the ace side of the main event. He was against a, you know, a replacement challenger with all respect to their Korean zombie. Clearly, Volkanowski, you know, this was supposed to showcase, for him and it was. And he's acted that way in post-fight, but without seeming cocky too. You know, it wasn't like an I don't care as in,

I don't care because I don't like the media or I don't like the fans. It wasn't like that at all. It was like, if you're with me, great, I'm with you, let's ride together, come with me on this journey, let's have a good time. And if you're not with me, I don't need you. That's fine.

He's like, I care about my friends. I care of my family, my team. And that's what's important. And all of us should try to be better people. there was kind of that broader message there. He was like, he's like, I'm always trying to be a better fighter. But he's like, not just in that, like in everything. I feel like we can be better.

So as the Prince of Positivity, I'd tell you, I could not have said it better myself. I was so thrilled to see to see Volcanox ascension. Jed, I'm with you, you know me. I've had Volcanovsky number one. I have with respect to Holloway. I've had him at the top. And it will be very exciting in the rankings when pretty sure I think everyone will have. The wild ranking show.

That is. we have like again a month to stew on that I'll tell you because it's going to be it's going to be a busy one we're going to I have feeling I know it's like I said it's a month away but I have to make very few adjustments okay well you're a hero but we're going to have don't say that well I think we're not say believe me that was not you go like that come on come on that we all know that was said very sarcastically the the after effect of this will be felt for the next month so it'll be still be fresh in our minds a month from now and possibly you even more than a month from now. Like there was, there was some serious, some serious implications here. Let me just say, Shahim,

before we go to our next topic, I ran a poll. It's running right now. It's running right now. Very simple. Who was the biggest winner? Who was the biggest winner? And Aljo actually came out to our early lead.

Aljo was at like 40% for the first few minutes there. But now it has leveled. Aljo, Aljo 35, Hamza 36. So I'm not sure what that says about how impressed people were with Aljo. how much, again, they were, I wish there was a better word, disappointed that Shamiya didn't run through Burns.

Because I thought Shemayev would be like 50%. I thought just by default. But it's pretty close. 35, 36% fluctuating. They're kind of trading the number one spot, Volcanovsky, just a bit behind 24%. Well, let me just say candidly as, you know, one of the ringleaders on the ranking show. Let me just say that I am glad we're not doing the next ranking show this coming week because I would probably have to take a couple on the chin and I'm not ready to do that just quite yet.

But that is neither here or there. I have to say, man, watching the champ tonight, he is always brilliant, he is always just a joy to watch. But the decision making that this man makes in the octagon and the number of the quick trigger just in his own mind, like the mental chest that he's playing in there, is just otherworldly. It is unbelievable to watch. And tonight it felt like he had the script already of what zombie was going to do every

single second of the fight. Like he knew from pillar to post exactly what that man was about to do to him. and he had the perfect counter at every single moment. It was beautiful. Like, it was just straight up beautiful to watch. Jed, when Mike was still in here, he said, I might have to put Alex as a top two pound for pound fighter in the game, maybe the best pound for pound fighter in the game.

Maybe his eclipse, Usman. Do we need to start talking about Alexander Volcanowski as a top two pound for pound fighter in MMA? Depends on how you do pound for pound. I said this on either the pre-fright Q&A or something with Mike earlier this week. he he will be number four for me because i i just do a straight point system and vulcanovsky is great but he only has so many wins over currently relevant featherweights his last four wins basically are currently relevant feather weights and so he can't eclipse

usman and uh adis indisina and ingano just because of who they fought and where they're ranked now but if you're just going on skills again i've i feel like i've been saying this for well over over a year since the first max fight, he's, he's arguably the most skilled fighter in MMA. Like, it's him and Ustman and maybe Piora Yan, though Peoriaean took a big hit tonight. So for my money, it's him and Ustman. If you're just talking about composite skills. And so if that's the way you're approaching pound for pound, he should absolutely be in

your top two because I don't think there's a good argument for anybody over, over those two gentlemen, if those are your criteria. Yeah, man. I'm going to have to give some serious thought to this pound for pound list. I'm glad we have a couple of weeks to digest it because, man, tonight was just so impressive. But AK, last thing on this, and then we'll move on. What's next from here? Because, I mean, it does seem like Max Holloway feels like the next step, the obvious next step.

That was supposed to be the fight already. This was a replacement tonight, the zombie fight. Is Max next for you? And if so, did the way we saw this whole thing play out? Did that change anything tonight, how you feel about that potential? a trilogy fight with Max? Well, I do think that Volcanovsky, for the first time in their rivalry, will be favored. I don't know if that would have been the case without this performance tonight.

I think at most he might have been in like a minus 120. He would have been close to a pickup. I just think there's so much love for Max Holloway. I think the second fight was so close that I do think Hollywood would have favored. But this time off, there are these questions about, man, is there issues with this? health is he's just getting older what what is this mystery uh you know affliction malady injury whatever it is that kept him out of the third fight we don't know and i do think all that uncertainty combined with the certainty that we saw from volkinovsky's uh title defense tonight will make him

will finally make him the favorite so that that is something that will definitely be different for me like i said i've had volkinovsky as the number one further for a while i'm so impressed by his skills i thought he um he obviously clearly won the first fight with holloway i thought he did a enough to win the second fight. It was very, very close. And the Ortega fight that was phenomenal. And, of course, tonight just complete dominance. So I don't know how much changes for me.

Pound for pound, I'm definitely someone who already had them in the top five. And kind of play off of Jed's answer, if you're going by the criteria of like strength of resume, even then, even then he might climb up. I don't know if he's going to move in mind because I do have him behind the Usman and Ghanu, Adisina. effecta but there's a chance there's a chance like it's a shaheen it's good thing we don't have to make these changes this week i'm definitely going to think about a bit as well i i don't predict that he will rise up uh but it is certainly possible that he does so and as for his next opponent i like what he said the post-fight press conference he feels he's in a position to call his shots of course he wants to stay busy but he's not going to fight just anybody so you know he clearly he wants to holloway fight

next but if that's not possible i'm sure he more than happy to fight and arnold allen i don't know what josh Emmett, a Calvin Cater, depending how that, you know, some of these guys have upcoming fights. Yeah, your Rodriguez is out there. He could be one big win away. There are options. There are options and they're compelling fights for Alexander Okunovsky, money of which came up when they were looking for a replacement. So, Chan Song, John, remember, it wasn't even the number one choice. So he's got options, but Holloway should be next.

And if not, I don't think people will complain if one of these other guys gets picked. Yeah. Well, it's going to be fascinating to see how this plays out because I think finally we do feel, or at least it does feel like there's a sense admit that, like you said, I don't know if that was, I think Jed, maybe you said, or Al, AK, maybe it was you, that Volcanovsky's definitely going to be favored going into this trilogy fight probably for the first time in this whole series. It just feels like we finally have some degree of resolution on this, at least, I don't know. We'll see. Moving on, let's move to the man who should spend the next few months telling everyone he can in the world

to F off. Because after a year from hell, Al Jemaine Sterling goes in there and retains his belt against Peter Jan. It was a controversial scorecard, it seems, for some. He had Dana White out here saying he thought the judges botched it. I thought it was the right call. I could have also seen a draw. Jed, I'll go to you first. How did you have this one score?

Well, the MMA fighting official stance on this fight is that Al Jermaine Sterling won 48 to 46, which coincides with my stance on this fight because I was doing our live blog. If you want to call it a draw, I haven't rewatched the fight, obviously. would accept a draw as Jan winning that first round, which is, I think, the swing round. Round two is very clearly a 10-8. If you do not think so, I think that you are just stone wrong. And so at worst, Al Jermaine Sterling got a draw there. But I thought Sterling won the first round.

And I frankly thought he won the first round easily. Like I don't, there was no, I did not have a tough time making that pick. I was like, oh, Jan's, and the commentators even were on to it. It's like, yeah, Jan's swinging really hard and not landing and coming forward, but Sterling keeps kicking him in the body a bunch. So Sterling's going to win, and the numbers back it up. He outlanded him by like 10 strikes. I know numbers aren't everything, but I thought he landed better.

I thought he landed more. I thought he clearly won the first round, and he clearly won this fight. He faded down the stretch, and Jan made some great adjustments in the championship rounds. Full credit to the man, hell of a fighter. but Sterling talked a lot of crap all week and put all the pressure on him and came out and showed out.

Talk your trash, baby, because you earned it. Because if he'd lost, he'd have had to go away forever. And now he can rub everyone's nose in it and he damn well should. If Aljo had come out here and lost, and especially if he gotten finished,

knocked out, however it would have gone, he would have never heard the end of it. Like it would have just, it would have been the single thing that everyone remembered for the rest of his career. It would have been absolutely brutal. I said it on BTL. I was like, if he loses, he has to delete his social media because he just can't have it anymore. It won't. And I'm dead serious.

Like if he came out everything, because everything he said this week just turned it up to 11. Like, yeah, either I'm a dumbass and everyone's going to talk trash to me for the rest of my life or I'm going to make everybody e. crow. And when you come out with that type of energy, you better back it up. And he did. Damn proud of him. Hell of a performance. I thought he clearly won and good for that man.

A.K., coming to you, I mean, how did you score it? And also, I mean, if you're Al Jemais, Sterling, how hard is it right now to just not go on a world tour telling everybody to have a ball? Listen, I scored it the same way as Jed. I put out my tweeted out my scorecard after. I got some pretty classic Twitter. This is the worst score card ever. how could score the first round for Sterling.

And again, the first round was close. If you want to go by the stats, which by the way, do not tell the whole story. Al-Ain Sterling, 19 significant strikes to Peotor Yon, 13th, significant strikes. But again, not every significant strike is created equal. I think people are giving Yon credit for, as Jed said, he was throwing some power shots, right? And so, you know, you land two or three power shots, can change the whole complex number around. Sterling, a lot of those significant strikes were kicks, like kicks, kicks up. And which I think count, which should matter,

but I understand if people would favor the Peotryon sort of power shots more. So I totally get that. I did have for Sterling. I don't think a Yon first round scores indefensible. Just to elaborate on the 10-8 thing, again, Jed and I both gave it 10-8 in the second round.

Guys, that is pretty much the definition of a 10-8. He had dominance. He had the most dominant position you can get in MMA fight. He had back control, Al-M. Sterling. And he had it for almost the entire round. So he had duration. He was going for submission attempts, which on their own are not worth that much.

but it is effective grappling, which matters. And there was damage. There was damage. He did, there was some ground and pound in there. He landed some good shots. There was nasty ground and pound in there. Yeah, there was some, there was some serious. He got that belly down body lock.

He was lighten hammers into the man. I guess we wanted to see it for longer, but it's like, look, if you're, if you're saying round one was a clear yawn round because he landed like maybe three or four good punches, then you have to get, then you have to give, I was bringing sterling credit for the, however many, like, heavy ground shots he landed in round two. So, so for anyone who does not understand why round two was a 10-8. we're after dark here, so pardon my language, but read the fucking criteria. Read the fucking criteria.

I'm sorry, I'm sorry. If you don't, you don't know what a 10-8 is. Or am a-a-K, bringing the heat. You don't know what a 10-8 is. And I'm a little disappointed, frankly, that the judges didn't either. Because I think in the end, they got to the right decision. I do think Sterling 1, if you're going to pick a winner, I do think Sterling 1, draw also would have been very acceptable.

But guys, read the criteria. That's a 10-8. But it was a great fight. I'm sorry to call people out. and I'm sorry to have to be even a little bit negative because I thought the fight was really enjoyable. I think both guys are clearly the one and two. I think they are clearly the one and two bantam weights in the world.

We are probably going to run it back someday, and I'm fine with that. I don't think it needs to be next. Bantam weight is so deep. I think you could go probably two fights in between, depending who Yon fights next, who Sterling fights next, could happen sooner or later, but I'd like to see a bit of space. Another year, another year.

If it's another year between them fighting again, I think that's more than fair. but really enjoyable fight. Jed, I want to go to you for this because I'm actually really interested in your thoughts here. You have been the driver, pretty much, of the Peter Yan bandwagon, train, whatever you want to call it, for a while now.

Like, you have been number one on that bandwagon. Of the Beodorian? Yeah, just in general and like a couple of weeks ago, I hope I'm not betraying your trust here, but you even said, you know, like the more I look into this fight, like I just don't see really ways that Alja is going to win this fight.

Were you surprised with how all of this played up? I was super surprised because this is the way Aljo could win the fight, and I just didn't think he had it in him. Like, I talked about it on BTL this week with Mike. The way Aljo had two past a victory, he could try and go full Corey Sandhagen and just empty the tank in round one, and it's an all or nothing. It's an all-in bet, and it probably wouldn't work,

but that seemed a thing that he at least knows how to do. But the other way, it's not like Al Jermaine Sterling is deficient in tools or ability. He is an incredibly skilled fighter, but his issues, especially in that first fight, are largely mental. Like he is still not a very comfortable striker. He's not a bad striker,

but you can see the wheels turning when he is forced to engage on the feet, and it is always about being safe and then about activity. Like, oh, I need to do stuff because nothing's happening, so I'm going to jump with a big knee. And it's great, And in that first fight, he won the first round by just throwing everything,

but he also gassed himself out entirely. And that's a really bad thing to do against the guy like Peoria, who gets stronger as the fight goes on. So the way for him to win was to not do that to pick his spots, to get some takedowns and work the grappling, and to just use his range because it's longer than Peartyon. And he did all of those things. It was incredible.

He, like, fought really, really smartly and perfectly. and absolutely deserves the win. I just didn't think he could at all do it. I thought he was so mad about everything that happened. He was going to come in and kind of like Peter Yan did, try to put hands on him early, blow his gas tank, and then be screwed in the later rounds, and he didn't. So I'm shocked that he could do it,

but if he was going to do it, this was always the way I thought he could do it. So hats off to him, him and Ray Longo and that whole team. They were perfect. Dillashaw seems to be next. I mean, he got the call out from Aljo post-fight. He seems very into it. Kind of just makes a lot of sense with the way this division's form right now. Do you guys like that as the next one?

It's fine because it's the right thing to do because Dillishaw never lost his belt in the cage. And so you should close that book. How did he lose the belt, though? I'm trying to remember. I can't recall. By doing things that everybody does all the time. Oh, come on. Oh, okay.

You know, Sean, you, you and me, you and me, we know what should happen. It's, it's our man. It's Jose freaking Aldo. Put that man against Sterling. Tell me. Tell me. Sell him. I think Aldo beats or beats Al Jermaine Sterling and that man gets a second belt.

If there was any decency in the world, that is what would happen next. But instead, we're going to let T.J. Dillishaw probably lose. Oh my God, tears. I would, if Jose could get that shot and win that, I'd be sitting there crying. I'm not going to lie. I think. Amazing. That'll be amazing.

I think. AK, what do you think? I mean, Dillard makes the most sense. I don't like it because I, he's such an odd case because obviously I have a huge problem with him. You know, this is someone who we know cheated. He admitted it. And then just, you know, traips, just, just traipsing back into a television. Now, he did fight Corey Sanhagen, a fight that I know some people don't think he won.

I was kind of okay with the score, but very close fight. A lot of people call the robbery, and I don't know if I blame them. I have not watched the fight against since. That's probably a robbery review waiting to happen. That's already did it. Anyway, but either way, I, oh, I did do one. You know what, MAPFline.com. A digital shock.

It's four a year. It's four a. Robbery review. Robbery review. I've written so many of these now. I don't, I don't remember. But I think I said, I actually think I said not a robbery. So I have to stand by that.

But it was a really close fight, and I understand that the Corey's handing and support. But either way, technically, Dilloshaw won that fight, big, so that's a, you know, he came back. He got a win over a top five contender. He is a two-time champion. So he's got the long-term resume as well. He's a name. He's a name. He's not like a Connor McGregor-level name, but he certainly is one of the marquee stars of the division.

That's why Al Jermaine Sterling would want to fight him. So Dana White would want to make that fight happen. ESPN, you know, they'd be thrilled. They'd kind of sound as this weird, like, redemption story. which is also, I think, what they did on, like, FightPass. There's like a T.J. Dillashaw documentary, which I've not watched. I'll be honest, but I know that the trailers were like, T.J., you know, coming back from having his title taken away from him.

And I'm just kind of like... Really overcome an adversity that guy. We really need context for this, guys. We really need context. So it's... I don't know if it's right. I don't know if it's fair. Again, Bantamain has so many good fighters.

I love the Jose Aldo idea. I just don't think you would get it over T.G. Adela Shaw. And everyone else, again, as great as this division is, they're really all one fight away, except for Marab. And obviously, him and Aljo are not in any rush to fight each other. So that removes him from the equation. So we're close.

We're close to getting someone else. But right now, there just is no really great reason not to book Dilashah and Sterling. Man, Jed, you really opened something in me with this Josealdo idea. Like, can we put together a go fund me to make this happen? Like, I will throw in money right now, whatever. takes. Can we just please get this going, get this movement going? Because he could win that. He could win that fight. He could very much win that fight.

That's a great matchup for him. It's one of the better ones for him in the division. Like at the tip-ty-top. So it's also, I just want to say this because I think it needs to be said about T.J. Dillashaw. So we're clear. He lost his title because he took PEDs. He also never once failed the drug. test while he was at Bannam weight. He failed the drug test for his drop to fly weight.

He came out, admitted it and said, I did it because I was cutting to this weight class, yada, yada, yada, yada. The simplest explanation is usually correct. And the simplest explanation here is that he was clean for his whole Bannam weight run. And so you should just take that into account as he was the best Bannum weight in the world when he lost his belt. And he is still not lost a fish. though the Corey San Dagen fight was close.

So that is the fight you should do, but Jose Aldo makes me happy. You may have heard of the sex cult nexium and the famous actress who went to prison for her involvement, Alison Mack. But she's never told her side of the story until now. People assume that I'm like this pervert. My name is Natalie Robamed.

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Workday is the AI platform for HR and finance that frees you from the mundane so you can focus on more meaningful work. Workday, moving business forever forward. I totally agree with you. Well, we still have a lot to get to on this card. I mean, let's throw it to the peeps, though. It's getting late. while, Casey, I need you get in here. What's going on with the peeps?

What's going on? What are people thinking? They're angry, aren't they? I've even looked at these comments. They're pretty upset, like just in general. I don't know. We got a bunch of casuals talking here. Oh, I mean, that's fair.

That's more of fair. All right. You want to talk about the non-top-three fights or just whatever? Yeah, let's hit some new stuff. And also, anyone who's hanging with us at 4 a.m., respect to you all. You are not a casual. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Do do, do, do. Oh, yeah, let's talk about this. Also, there's a very weird blue versus black thing going on with the shirts in the order of the panel right here. It's making me uncomfortable. Are you wearing this? We really need to switch AK and Jed. Yeah, yeah. Are you rocking that made fighting?

Yeah, there we go. Double Zed, baby. Jeanne, are you wearing one of these? You know it. Okay, okay. Nice. All right, this one's coming from Joseph Boza, who says, In what universe did, this is aggressive already?

In what universe did McKinsey Dern beat Tisha Torres? I'm sorry, that was the perfect example of McKinsey needing the fans to help her beat Tisha? Tisha took one to three in his honest opinion. I'm guessing by needing the fans. I guess by needing the fans, he means like maybe the fans were swelling with crowd, like, ovations. I know what he means. I know what he means. I like influence swaying the judges.

I think so there was so much action going on tonight. So I think it was round one was the big, the swing around. Yeah. And I was pretty like, as soon as the fight was over, I was like, cool, Tisha Taurus won. Moving on. And I was like, what? So how did you guys score the fight? Do you remember there was so much action tonight?

Jack, go ahead. MMA fighting's official position is the Tisha Taurus won rounds one and three. I think that that's probably true. I also don't have a huge issue with Dern winning the first. I think Torres won it, but she didn't land. I thought Dern landed with more power when she did land, and she wasn't outstruck by that much. So I can see the argument.

I just think it's probably not correct. Yeah, that's the problem with Tisha's. A problem is a terrible phrase. No, it's a problem. That's why she keeps with it. Well, when it comes to judging, when it comes to judging, because judges are, again, I keep going to the criteria here, judges are supposed to reward immediate impact more. I believe that's the language in the criteria, immediate impact, you know, strikes that are more likely to lead to finish or more obviously damaging. Casey, you mentioned all the time damage is subjective, right?

So it's hard to tell. We might not see Tisha's shots as being particularly hurtful, but we don't know. We're not the ones getting hit by them. But for the judges, they are going to lean towards the more dramatic moments. I think Adirn had a big moment like at the end of the first round, right? Where she really kind of caught her with someone. It was being like a big light hand. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. And it sounds crappy. But that one like strike and however Torres reacted to it, that might have swayed that that round. It was the most meaning of the round. Yeah. And Tisha was landing, you know, anything significant.

I thought Tisha controlled that round for the most part. But, but this one of those things, when you're, when you're the fan favorite, which I'm pretty confident McKinsey was. even shots that are blocked. If the judge is at the wrong angle, to the judge, if they hear the crowd roar, they assume it lands. So when you're a fan favorite,

close rounds, and I'll go in and say it's a close round, I can see why the judges gave it to Dern, but. And for record for Joseph Boza, who asked the question, McKenzie also had the best sequence of the fight with her sick, frigging, so that's a cage to go for a dought-locked scissors camaraderie. So, I mean, if we're going by, like,

who had the coolest best moment? And then pride rules. This is like what. In Pride rules. When just like a power of course. Yeah. In Pride rules, Stern wins that fight.

Yeah. But also like I've said it, I've said it for a while now with McKenzie and like she's Arizona person. I saw her growing up like her coming up in the game. Like I followed her pretty closely. Like I was at some of her fights before the UFC. She has always just needed to be able to perfect like the one go to against the cage, clinch take down or something.

Just like something to get this fight to the ground because that is just the biggest escaping hole in her game right now is like her inability to drag the fight to the ground is consistently stifling her in these type of fights because you saw once you get once she got it there like that second round watching her like grapple with anybody and just the jaws of death that she puts these women to it's unreal like it's harrowing to watch that that second round it was unbelievable theater to watch and it's just I want more of that Rogan into that fight like five times. That's it.

That's it. That's it. Like, if she can just get that one Damien Maya take down that he perfected and was able to do to really well for pretty much the entirety of his career, like, that's it, man. That unlocks so much for her because as soon as she gets it there, no one in this division can stand with that. Like, no one can even come close to hanging with it.

And it's so much fun to watch. Like the different transitions and sweeps and just escapes and submissions she was going for. Like, it's just, again, jaws of debt style. Like, it's so crazy her compared to everybody else to this division. Is it a weird comparison? But I really think McKenzie Dern is a better version of Ronda Rousey,

but in a much better division. Hmm. I see where you're coming from. I don't know if I agree, but I kind of like understand. Well, I mean, like a simple striker can't throw really heavy. Rhonda could throw heavy just wasn't a good striker. But if it lands, it hurts. Dernkin throw really heavy, not necessarily a great striker.

Neither of them have, neither them are good wrestlers, but they do take you down. You're, you, it's trouble. But Rhonda had a, was really good at getting people down. Rhonda actually. Yeah, she has a judo. Ronda couldn't wrestle. Rhonda couldn't wrestle, but, well, but she could get people. And that's why she lost when she, when she, when they figure out how to fucking

set her. There's some cursing. Whoa. Okay. Jeez. All right. I took the lit off. When Ron.

The language thing. I'm going to have to notch the language thing when I. I know. When everyone figured I had how to stop her judo throws, kind of it stopped her game. And if you can basically keep Dern in a stand-up fight, you should win the fight. That's why I'm just,

but the division is so much. Straw weights is such a better division than Bantamweight. I think you're on to something, but I think Dern is not the same. Dern, Dern has no takedowns, like none. She got body locks and clenches, and then her take down was a starry pole bar.

Yeah, jump. She jumped guard. She doesn't like it. She doesn't like doing it. She's like, I don't like doing that, but I wasn't succeeding anywhere else, so I did it. I like that she was just kind of like, if I can't take this fight to the mat, I'm essentially going to take the mat to you. I'm going to make, I'm going to just use the cage as my mat and use your body and just fight, fight in the air. Which was super cool.

Like, it was extremely cool to watch. Like, she's pushing. She's in her feet to like push off the cage and try to create the momentum to like get them spill into the floor. Like all of that was so fascinating. And watch, I need more of that in her fights. All right. I just need a double-ass number. You had a moment against Marina, Marina Rodriguez.

But that's why I was talking about Rhonda. Rhonda had no doubles. Ronna had no wrestling. She had no shot, you know? Shoot a double. It's not that hard. All right. What's it?

What else? It hurts the knees. Let's like, let's talk about the other lady fight on the card. Well, there were two, but to talk about the, the, the more important one. The other. Stone, Stoned Zebras 666 is coming in here. What's next for a Kel Pennington? I don't know.

I mean, she had a really. nice win tonight over Aspen Ladd. What do you guys think? Didn't she call for Katzingano? No, Sarah Kaufman. Sarah McMahon. Zingano is a Bellator. Yeah.

That seems like a fine fight. Another former Bantamweight title challenger. Yeah. I like the McMahon fight. The only mistake she made was just going like Sarah by one name. Yeah. Yeah. Sarah, I have a lot of respect for Sarah Mann.

She's not quite on that level that you can drop a Sarah. Art of him is almost like Sarah Kaufman. Like, what did Sarah Kaufman do to warrant this callout on paperview? Did she hurt Rebecca? I mean, I'd love to see that fight. I just, I was surprised that she would know. And I was like, okay, wait, Sarah McMahon had recently won a fight. She's, okay, they're in the same kind of ranking.

That's fine. Also, Raquel, like, low-key throwing like 100 miles an hour in her post-fight scrum calling the corner of Aspen Ladd, a comedy show. What was that? I'm just sitting here listening to the comedy show. I don't know. She had several examples of things they were saying, And she was just like, what?

Like, none of that made any sense. I think Raquel and Tisha are kind of in a weird way, almost the same. We said this on the Q&A. Raquel is like the highest level gatekeeper. And I think Tisha Torres is kind of almost the same thing in the Strawby Division. 100%. I know it sounds negative, but people, two fighters, though, yeah, two fighters, I think are never going to win the belt. But you have to beat them if you want to fight for the belt.

They're elite. They're the gatekeepers to the elite, which to be that, you have to be elite. Like, I don't, I understand how it could be a slight, but it's not meant to be a similar. Look, Raquel's fought for the title. Tisha is one-in-one with Rose Namajunas. I'd still love to see a third fight someday, but obviously this result tonight's going to hurt the chance of that happening. So, yeah, that's weird. They are gatekeepers, but they're also gatekeepers with just, like, really, like, really strong credentials.

So, yeah, but I do, I do agree. There is some comparison there as far as their standings in their respective divisions. So it's follow up. It's better. It's sore clear. Oh, boy. I don't know about that. I don't know about that.

Next for Ashton Lad. I don't know. What do you guys think? She's in a tough spot at this point. Can I ask you guys? Are you going to rank her at 135? No. No.

Because I had her, I mean, Yana Kunitskaya is ranked. That's her last win, I think. It was over two years ago now. So I was just doing some preliminary. I actually was doing some preliminary ranking. I might rank her. And I did drop Lad down.

It's such a thin division. Yeah, maybe at the bottom of the top 15, but not in our top. But yeah, not in our top tens, right? Yeah, it's unfortunate. Her struggles with weight pretty much like just removed her from the equation for the last two years. She takes a very unnecessary fight with Nora Dumont. I know she just wanted to get back in there, 145, and then loses that.

It did just lose it. It was just a bad fight. It was supposed to fight at N. N.A. Aldana, loses that fight. That fight might have gone even worse for her, for being honest. I mean, she might have gotten hurt even more. I'm sure this fight wasn't fun either. But, and then loses this fight to Raquel Pennington,

where it just doesn't feel like we were seeing like the logical evolution of this fighter when she was, what, 23, 24. How old is she now? She's 27, right? Yeah, she should be hitting a prime right now, but she seems to be regressing as a fighter. It was really. I don't think it seems. I think it's clear she's regressing.

Boy, I mean, it's like, look. Casey, you fought. This is an easier said than done thing where it's like, I'm sure all of us were watching like, man, why isn't Ladd just going to try and take her down? Like, Ladd's ground and pound used to be, that was how she won a lot of her life. That was her thing.

That was her thing. Raquel, great, grappler, great, take down defense. So again, it's easy for me sitting on my couch with chip, you know, chip grease on my fingers saying, oh, just shoot in, just take her down. But it was a bit shocking. It was a bit shocking as the fight progressed. And then in the end of the third round,

she did kind of go to her grappling a bit. And we're like, oh, well, it's there. Like, it's clearly. there. And yeah, I don't know what's going on with her corner. Like Raquel said, they're giving her some sort of information that she didn't think was helpful and was not an accurate assessment of the fight. One of the things that Raquel said that they said was that Raquel was breaking. I did not see that at all. I don't know. I thought that would help Aspen Ladd's confidence. I can't imagine why it would. This is a case where I'm just, I'm only going to, this is the first time I'm ever

going to say this and only for only for Aspen lad's sake open scoring would have helped her a lot I think don't clip maybe she needs that fire maybe like if she looked up and like oh I'm down two rounds my corner is lying to me you're right my corner is so wrong yeah and again even if it did just it's just it's nice for her to know how would have it also the one time she did something good was in her round anyway I just I just want to see her reaction because because she was surprised the end of the fight. She was surprised at the end of the fight. When I read it, she was like, oh, I can't believe it. And we were like, yeah, I mean, you're surprised.

It's somewhat understandable, but it's also because your corner was giving me. There were a couple media members that gave her the first round. But like, like, I think I threw this on Twitter. Like, unless that's a clear, like, you know, I'm using a half point, but clear like 10, eight and a half round, you have to, as a corner, you have to assume that your corner, you lost that round. You know, you can't, if it's, there was no way that. The first round was clearly lads, that's all. And so that, I hate throwing this out there because it sounds so cheesy, but she needs to change camps.

Yeah, that's all. That's the, I mean, that's the answer that we're all beating around the bush. Yeah, she just needs. I mean, and I'm not going to get into that's personal relationship with her coaches, her coach and stuff. But she's still a really good talent, but something's wrong. For very obvious reasons, you should not date your coaches or have relationships with people in the business. business sense. Like that extends beyond fighting and many companies specifically don't want you to do that. And especially in sports, that creates this situation. She super needs to leave and she's not

going to. And so she's never going to be what she could have been. I think it's at something. Let's keep it going. What else we got? Also, AK, why are you like working with chip grease on your hands? Wash your hands, dude. You're on your computer. Like, what are you doing? That's really good. It makes my fingers glide over the keys faster. That's a little tip for you. That's super gross. Life hack. Life hack.

This one's coming from our pal, David Sandine. Are we watching Volk in the middle of a legendary career? Seems like he's on that path. I mean, it's kind of starting to feel like that, right? Guys, like I think I saw some stat tonight that he has started his UFC career now 11 and O and that the only other people who have done that are essentially like in the all-time goat conversation of like Habib and. Anderson, Camaro, and I think that's maybe the list.

Like, maybe I'm missing one. It is the list. Yeah, it is. That's incredible, man. Like, that's incredible. And also, if you look at the standard of competition, like, you'd have to go back to really, like, 2018 to find anybody that isn't up to that level of competition. Because at that point, it's Elkins, Mendez, Aldo, Holloway, Holloway, Ortega, zombie.

Like, that's impressive, bro. Like, that's, that's a lot. And I didn't realize folks only loss was that. Walter weight. I didn't even. Yeah, I interviewed that guy. If he if he didn't lose a welterweight think about what we would view his career at right now. You should look at the clip of that he's like twice that guy is literally like twice. Yeah, he's the man's enormous because he's not a welterweight. I mean at that point he's 24 and oh like he's doing all of this like it's very weird and stupid that that's how this sport is but that one loss like fundamentally changed

Alexander Volkanowski, like how he is viewed. Because, like, he would be, he would straight up be Habib right now. Like, he would be the exact same of where Habib was when he won the title. This dude's 24-0. He's starting to finish people. He might be the greatest fighter of all time. And because he lost the fight at Welterweight half a decade ago, he's not getting that same love and it's kind of insane.

You know what I don't want to go for you, Casey. I think it's going to really help Volkanowski in terms of getting that kind of status amongst fans of media is actually his press conference today where he kind of just said I don't care what people think anymore and I think because that's been the issue of Volkanowski not his in case performance but to me like just how we see him has like we want to see these guys as like kind of no gods and stuff and Volk just seems like a dude who just seems like every man yeah which is cool like he is a great which is cool but but Shemai doesn't seem like every man you know at a sign doesn't seem like an every man or auto isn't an every man there's there's something

i don't know something that's that vote doesn't have but i think it's coming i think it's coming and i think today's performance and even how we was talking to the press conference coming to the press conference of his own music just not giving a i know it's late guys but not giving a fuck and i think that's i think that's what volk needs third time we know i know we cannot monetize this we have to click no for no this is not suitable for kids. No, but I mean, we've said it a couple times. It feels like a switch is sort of flipped within him that he is just, he's carrying himself a little differently now.

I love it. I think it's really cool to see sort of this evolution of him. And man, like, I don't want to do a goat conversation because I kind of hate goat conversations. And he's not there for me. I think I'm still an old head who's going to have Jose Aldo there for like a while. Like you got to do a lot to get past Josealdo. But like he looks like he might be that guy who could eventually get there.

That's all I'll say. Look at this run he's on. This is, I mean, this isn't his whole, look at these last seven, seven opponents. Darren Elkins, who at the time, who at the time, was on a six-fight win streak and is currently, currently now tied with Max Holloway for the most wins in the UFC featherweight history. So a super tough out. That's the first win in this run. Chad Mendez, TKO win. Jose Aldo, clear-cut unanimous decision win over Jose Aldo.

Back-to-back decision wins over Max Holloway, Brian Ortega, and one of the great. greatest title fights we've ever seen. And one that he won very convincingly, by the way, outside of that one, you know, him, him getting in danger and almost getting choked to death, other than that, pretty clear win for him. And then a complete, just utter destruction of Chan Sung, Jung, again, one of the most respected featherweights of all time. That's an all-time run right there. So, and we are not, like that, he might fight Holloway again, and then we have all these

other great up-and-coming feather weights. This could be, I still think GSP has, like, the greatest championship run of any, of course, any fighter in MMA history. Volcanovsky, if he stays the chorus and just sticks with 145s and doesn't mess around with, oh, jumping up the lightweight or doing all those other stuff, he could have a title of run that compares that. And I'm Canadian. So when I say that, you know, I'm being serious.

I want to say, let him jump up because I really do now. I actually kind of don't. And that's what I guess I was about. I don't care about that. Last thing from this, for me, from me at least, is like, I actually really dig the mindset that he's sort of going through right now just like, give me these contenders. Like, let's just do this. Like, this is very Anderson Silva-esque right now and GSP-esque of just like, I don't care who it is. Give them to me. I want to fight.

I want to keep defending this title. I want to rack up these title defenses. That's really cool to me. Like that mindset of just like, hey, I know that two division champ and everyone wants to be two division and everything. Just give them to me and let me rack up the numbers. Like, I love that. That's very old school. Imagine if you add Arnold Arnold Allen, Bryce Mitchell someday, if God help us to beat Magumad's Sheriff how ever comes back, imagine if he adds those three names this run,

Like, that would be insane. That's an all-time great. That's a top five championship run in MMA history. Like, that's insane. I'm on the record. I'm on the record many times over saying that the hardest thing to do is defend your title and that this would be the best thing. But you guys are forgetting two very small facts.

One, I think Volcanovsky would whip the shit out of Charles Oliver or Justin Gachie. And you know me, Big Gachy Stan. I think he wins both of those fights Gachi maybe could be interesting just because of the pure power but I think Volk probably tunes him up

and two Arnold Allen is coming and I don't know if Volk wants that smoke from him because Arnold Allen is the future and you all need to get on board he is numerous Is there a shirt that like would explain how I feel about Arnold Allen

because it is he's numerous Uno and Volus, you know, he's been fighting a while. He's been fighting over 10 years, he's 34. You know, you don't want that smoke from Alon because he is Numero uno. So maybe go up, get a second belt. That's all I'm saying. Are you Jesse in the comments? Because Jesse in the comments saying double champ is meaningless, but I would pick Volcanowski to beat Oliver or Gae, which you just said. And then they also had, I would pick him to beat Islam for crying out loud. I don't think you're going that far yet. I don't think that's, I think you're trying the line there, but

that's, I mean, Alexander Volcanowski would be so much smaller than so many lightways. Like size matters at a certain degree. Like, he's a much smaller man than a lot of people. Look at Gil, look at what Gilbert Burns did tonight. He gave up 30 pounds. That's a great fight. And maybe if you'd have been equal size, he would have won.

All right. How many, let's see you one or two more. I'm going to get out of here. I still got a lot left to We'll work a lot to do. A couple more comments. I just wanted this guy mentioned tonight. Shavkat might beat Hamzat. Let's see how he does against Maggie. Yeah.

As much people were all about Hamzat, I'm all about Shavkat. And I'm super excited about what's next for him. I have Shafkat the highest ranked of any of us. I don't think he's beating Hamzat. Oh, all right. We'll see soon enough. Let's talk about the real star of the night. Right.

Heist Viking says Olinic should have retired with a question mark. Why? Let's keep this going. This old layers. Yeah, this old man, you could do this for another five, ten years. Nobody trains scarf holds. Nobody trains Ezekiel chokes. Like, no one knows how to stop these at all.

And you shouldn't. And you shouldn't. You shouldn't. You're not going to get better at them than him. Like, it doesn't matter. Casey gets in that spot. You're going to lose. As soon as this fight happened, I immediately texted my coach and I was like, I want to work on that.

I know this carpool but I haven't really really done it in a while like that looks so painful It's a strong man move Yeah it's a strong man move Yeah you were saying You were saying on Twitter case

It hurts like I mean Your recollection of any way That it hurts like hell And that hurts like afterwards You're saying like that's a cold That like after it's off You're still like it's ringing It's just everything

Yeah and it's one of those moves Like yeah It'll burn you out to put it on But if you get stuck in it Even if you get out of it you're still going to go like, oh, crap, I got to fight now. Like, it's just, it's a moot. But that's not what Jared Vendera did, though.

Jared Vendera. He saw, he personally vomited. Fantastic. Then he sought, he sought, uh, Alenic after backstage. I think everyone saw the clip. And he's like, hey, show me how you almost like broke my, my neck and like hollow bone, bro. Like, show me how you did that.

And sure enough, like, Olinic walks through, walks through it with him, walks through it with, they go, pull some other guy over. Like, oh, yeah, okay, here's it. So you can see how it looks like here. And I'll show you. It was amazing. amazing clip. Win number 60. Yes, Jose, finally gained to use a graphic that he made literally two years ago. This is even a show over two years ago. I've had it saved in my computer. We've had it

in the cloud. And finally, it was brought to life. 60 wins. 47 submissions. Was that right? His 47 submissions. 47. That's absurd. Real quick on this because let's end it with this, because it is getting late. I was looking at a couple things because I'm writing my Post-Fi column. And I was like, what's the world look like? What does the world look like when Alexi Olinic makes his MMA debut, which is all the way November 296? I wrote about this earlier. Dude, November 1996.

So here's what's going on, like, right around the week. Right around the week where Alexi Olinic makes his professional mixed martialist debut. Bill Clinton defeats Bob Dole to win his second term as U.S. president. Bob Dole. Hot new musical act, The Spice Girls, Girls, debut with their, you know, first album. all the rage. Tell me what you want. 18 year old Kobe Bryant

becomes the youngest player to ever play in an NBA game. And I'm like a seven-year-old me is like Conn kids to train me their Pokemon on the playground. Like that's it. Like it's absurd. The fact that this man is still doing this 26 years later

and like there are not going to be odes written and tributes written to you know guys like this, the unsung pioneers of this game. But respect, man. You're still going 26 years. years later, like, that's crazy. And wasn't there also like Kay Hanson and Ian Gary hadn't been born yet?

They haven't been born yet. They had not been born when this guy was fighting. It's unbelievable. And I shed on the UFC how they hand out performance bonuses, but I'm very happy they gave Mr. Olinick an extra 50K tonight for that. They rarely give submissions, not submissions. And apparently took care of Mike Malott. So apparently took care of Mike Malott, the one finisher of the car who didn't get a bonus,

but Dana White said he could keep your Mike Molot said he was going to donate his money to his coach's daughter who unfortunately has been diagnosed with cancer. Dana White said, don't worry with that. We'll pay for that. A lot of people were, Shaheen, you put the link out there of the GoFund Me. It blew past its goal. I think it was a $50,000 goal. Last time I checked it was at like, it was at like $75 grand.

And that was it exploded. It's probably blow as soon as 100K now. I'm not there. So a great story. Great to see the community come together like that. So that was one of the nice stories of the night. I just want to say I will close the poll now, guys. Al Jermaine Sterling, biggest winner, 36%.

Just ahead of Shemaya. 36, 33, but I wouldn't have guessed. I wouldn't have guessed that going in that people would think that I'll show. Where to go, fans. They're back on. Or they don't want to get blasted. I don't know. Because you're right, Shaheen.

He's going to have guns blazing on social media. As he should. I can't wait for him on the hour this week. It's going to be hot fire. There is no one who deserves it more right now than that man. video dance, son. I had a song. The music's on.

It's like 4.30 in the morning. It's that time. It's the end of the show. This has been the UFC 273 post-fight show. You're on M.MA fighting. My name is Sean Shottie. That man is Alexander K. Lee.

That man is Jed Mishu. That man is Casey. He's the best producer in the business. He's undefeated. Also, Mike Heck out there in Jacksonville, killing it all week. Jose Young's out there in Jacksonville, killing it all week.

We got on to the next one coming on Sunday. We got the MMA hour coming on Monday. Fighter versus Rider Tuesday, MMA hour coming again on Wednesday. All sorts of stuff coming. Keep it locked to MMA fighting. You already know. Best in the business.

We will see you later. Thanks for keeping with us. We love you guys. Stay safe out there. You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network.