MMA Fighting - UFC Vegas 108 Post-Fight Show | Reaction To Taira's Dominance, Lightweight Bangers Stealing the Show

Episode Date: August 3, 2025

UFC Vegas 108 delivered a lot of action — especially on the main card, but it was the final three bouts of the UFC's return to the APEX that will steal headlines for the next few days. In the main event, Tatsuro Taira destroyed Hyun Sung Park with relative ease via second-round submission to bounce back from his lone career loss. Following the event, MMA Fighting's Mike Heck and Jed Meshew react to the card, Taira's spectacular performance, his post-fight interview getting awkward with Michael Bisping, and if he could get a title shot next. Additionally, they discuss the two Fight of the Year contending lightweight bouts between Chris Duncan and Mateusz Rebecki, and Esteban Ribovics and Elves Brener, other standout performances from the Fight Night event, and much more. Follow Mike Heck: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@m_heckjr⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow Alexander K. Lee: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@AlexanderKLee⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Subscribe:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ http://goo.gl/dYpsgH⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Check out our full video catalog: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://goo.gl/u8VvLi⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Visit our playlists:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ http://goo.gl/eFhsvM⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Like MMAF on Facebook: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://goo.gl/uhdg7Z⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow on Twitter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://goo.gl/nOATUI⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Read More: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When I got a great deal on a great gift at Winners, I started wondering, could I get fabulous gifts for everyone on my list? Like this designer fragrance for my daughter. At just $39.99, how could I resist? This luxurious will throw for my sister. This gold watch for my partner? A wooden puzzle for my niece? Leather gloves for my boss?

Ooh, European chocolate for the crossing guard? At these prices, could I find something for everyone at Winners? Stop wondering. Start gifting. Winners, find fabulous for less. You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. All right, everybody. The victory horns have sounded. And they sound for Tatsuro Taira bounces back.

There are people questioning Testerotira a little bit after his loss to Brandon Royval. It took almost a year away, 10 months to be exact, and he bounces back and just decimates. dominates and destroys Jansung Park in the main event. And Tetsu, Tira, is back. He's calling for title fights. He has Michael Bisbon questioning his call on abilities. The man just making waves all over the price. He's welcome you to the UFC Vegas 101A post-fight show.

I am Mike Heck and joining me to discuss the epic return to the UFC Apex for the first time since May 31st, when the main event of that card was canceled. at the last second. What a triumphant return, Jed Mishu. Was it not back at the Apex? We did the thing. How are you?

Good. We did the thing. You know, I hadn't missed the Apex, and I still don't. I'm sad we're coming back next week because a lot of really fun stuff happened tonight, Mike. I'm not here to tell anybody. This was the best card ever, but all the fights we thought would be Rippers or Rippers. A couple of fight of the year candidates. and it all just went over a little less fun because it was in the apex.

But still, free night of fights, assuming you have the SPM plus. Not a bad way to spend an evening if you had nothing else to do. And I'm excited to be here and talk with you about, I don't know, 40 minutes. The figures, figure that's probably we're going for tonight. But let's find out. Yeah, it was funny because I had literally tweeted out before the Riebovich fight. that I feel like this card had been on for eight hours. It just, and I don't even blame like the fights,

because I don't think the fights were all that bad. And obviously there are some good performances, but the pacing of this card was brutal. Like this is PFL 2022 pacing. Like we got to the desk like four times during the prelims. Like that should not be happening. This card just kind of took forever. But once Rievovich and Brenner started getting after it,

business picked up and picked up real quick. It was, the last three fights were, were pretty damn good, especially the two lightweight fights, which we'll talk about. But it all was capped up by Tatsuro Tire, Jedmishu. Guy goes in there, he's a pretty sizable favorite, taking on Yonsung Park and compared to some of the opponents he had faced in the past. Pretty significant step back, but Park was a pretty, he was kind of a favorite underdog, I guess.

Like a lot of people were picking Park to go out there and shock some folks because he is a finisher and he has looked good and he was 10 and O and entering his physical peak. But Jed Tatsura, Tyra said, nope, not tonight. I got something to prove and the man did it. Did he not? Oh, 100%. I do not pick Park to win. I still thought Tyra was going to win. But I didn't bet Tyra in the climb this week because I was like, I don't know, man.

he's coming off his first loss fight that I know he got a card in that split decision but well I'll be honest he did not deserve a card even though that you know and you guys talked about it in the previous show I was listening to it this morning actually you know about how that's one of those losses that you can feel good about right like you can you take some things away he certainly did coming in here but Junson Park's a pretty good fighter on his own right Road to EOC champ has looked really good. Statistically was very good at defending takedowns. He only really had one takedown attempted on him tonight,

and it promptly led to him getting submitted. We talk about that a little bit. But he could have produced some interesting things. Maybe, you know, just the change of opponents, because he was supposed to be fighting, you know, Vincenzo next week, and there's a pretty big delta between the, styles of Steve Irseg and Tutsu or Tira.

And, you know, maybe just the moment got to him. It's his first main event. All this thing sort of happened quickly. But he was frozen almost from the get-go. I scored the first round of 10-8 for Taira, and then he promptly finished. He finished him like a minute and 20 seconds into round two. Tatsura-Tira, like, he did as good as he possibly could have tonight. And in the men's flyweight division right now, that's.

sort of performance maybe gets you a title fight probably shouldn't but that is within the realm of possibility and even if it doesn't everybody is leaving this card thinking yeah that dude's going to fight for a belt one day and they should because he's going to I'm looking at scorecards uh no one scored it a 108 I was with you I scored it a 108 I knocked down and you're not scoring around a 108 then there's what like what are we doing like what what are we doing you believe that that round would be the same as pick any round. No, I was actually going to, I'm trying to think of any round in the Hadofa-Vierre-Tresangor fight. You think that round was the same as anything that happened.

That's ludicrous. And now it's not just, like, it's not just ridiculous. It's a very stupid way to score a fight. Like, it is very dumb to think, I'll give that a 10-9 when, like, you could conceive pretty obviously of a way that, the following round might just be like pretty close and then you're going to call those the same insane absolutely ridiculous. Dyer's just a host man like he's put on a little bit more size during the layoff.

Dude just looks super strong. Striking getting better. He's got a little more pop to his strikes, knocking down Park in the first round, which kind of led to dominance. And then the hoist take down takes the back, spushes his face, gets the big win. the puzzling thing to me was the post-fight interview. It was very awkward because Tyra had basically said he told me this and has been saying it all along.

Look, I lost to Royval. It was a tough fight. But look at this division right now. Pantosia has essentially fought everybody already. We've seen Steve Ursaid get a title shot. We saw Caius Akura get a title shot. Josh Van has come out of nowhere and he's getting a title shot. If I go out there and just mush this man,

why can't I get a title shot? And that's what he called for. He goes, whoever wins seen Pantosian, Van, I want the winner. I don't think it's like a far-fetched callout, especially in this division. And then Michael Bisbing's like essentially saying like, no, how about a real call-out? Give us a real name. And then Michael Bisbing was, I don't know if he's mad, but he goes back to the broadcast movie. He's like, he should have called out Brandon Moreno.

That's the fight that should have, which I like the thing. After that he left, I did not realize that that was a thing that happened. happened, okay. Yeah, but he could get a title fight after this, after this win. If he's available and pants fights fan in relatively short order and they want him to return in December or something, who else is there right now? He shouldn't fight Moreno because Moreno should fight Kioji. That's what should be happening is those two do a chafist fight. And the winner of that gets a title fight.

And that's just the most obvious thing in the world. I think So I think Bisping has all the subtlety of a sledgehammer, right? And like that's really the problem. He just has no craft to basically any aspect of his game. Frankly, like his actual fighting career. Like the man was not like a scalpel in there, you know?

He was a hammer and he hit you a bunch and then eventually you would break. And he does like he could have done that better because I kind of agree. Right. Like, to your point, and I do agree with you, I don't think it is outside the realm of comprehension that Tyra gets a title shot just based on how things are operating at flyway at the moment. Also, I don't think it's like super likely, you know, like we're talking 10% outcome here. And so in that circumstance, being like, hey, shoot for the moon, okay. But like, give us something else. If that doesn't happen, give us something else and then maybe set the.

table for something. Maybe the table is, and it could have just been as easy a layup as, look, I was supposed to fight Amir al-Bazi. I don't know what happened there. Let's do it. You know, like I, whatever, let's settle up at the end of the year. And that can be for a title fight. I think the principle of what Bisping was trying to get to, I don't actually have a

huge issue with. The manner in which he does it is, is bad because he's not very good at this. and I'll make no apologies he was him and Cruz on the call tonight they were they were tough scenes for me man that it's just not my cup of tea yeah Damon Martin's favorite pairing with the color work

here's the thing like as Bayer notes in the comments Bispings commentary goes hard on mute sure does yeah and maybe perhaps there's a producer in his ear telling him to ask ask him? And that's very possible. And I'm certain that that's true. Right. But there's still a better

way you can handle it. Yeah. Now if you now now if the producers of the program are like, I want you to set up a fight with Brandon Moreno. And I think the biggest reason why they did that is because Brandon Moreno was in the effing building. He was right there. He's 15 feet away doing the Spanish desk work. You could have just put him on the screen. Like they could just they could have just put him on camera and be like oh there's brandon morano right there what about what do you think of a fight with him and then you nail it and then it's not like it's not disrespectful or anything like that and that would have been a way better way to set it up but if they do right no fine but yeah and that would be fine and that's the thing like you if you're trying to get him to an outcome get him to that outcome like

you lead the witness tell him what you want to get to it's like that's the point as opposed to like well, you're not going to get what you asked for, so let's try again, dummy. Like, that's functionally what Bissing said. Like, the dummy was silent,

but it was like, well, that's not going to happen, you dumbass. So why don't you shoot again? Take two. And it's just like, it's infuriating.

I'm also, I'm certain there was a producer and Azir telling him this. And it, I cannot, but like, I have been watching, there's like,

if there's one piece of content, I, like, have discovered that I love. It is Netflix sports docs. Like, I've watched every one of them on every subject, and they are deeply fascinating about subjects I've never cared about, and suddenly I deeply invested. And this week, I've been watching the WWE one, which I think just came out or whatever,

and everybody watching this. I was like, I'm not a big pro wrestling guy. I've learned a lot more, certainly in the past, like 12 months about it. But that show is fascinating to watch how the sausage is made and like how intricate everything is going on there. And like one of the big parts that is like that I like maybe would have guessed if you like sat me down and told me to think about it. But I didn't really know is like how much communication is between the production booth and like what's physically happening on TV to like there's a, the ref has a mic or as a earpiece. is being told, like, feed things, keep things on time, etc. And these people are all professionals, and so they can do it and make it seem fairly seamless.

But you get a blunt instrument like Bisping and you've got somebody in his ear being like, hey, that's not that like, yeah, he's not going to get like, we want to try and set this up. And he's just like, well, that's not going to happen, you moron. What you try to do? Get a real goddamn professional in there. Like, you're owned by the same people now. Like it genuinely, it is shocking to me to watch that WWB show and like the high end production that is going into every aspect of like a million moving parts. And then just like the total bozo shit that happens on a daily basis in the UFC.

So like get get those people in a room together to have a conference call and just have one dude. Whatever the fat dude's name is, Bruce something that sits next to Triple H. get that dude sure get that dude to watch one UFC event backstage and just be like all of this is bananas I can't believe this this guy's interviewing people he can't like I could just feed him line like it you could button this up in a way that would be so much better and they don't and it's just like I don't I don't know what we're doing here because the end of the night was not a celebration of Tatsu or Tzu or the two fight of the year contenders it was here's Michael Bisping kind of being kind of being kind of being in a little silly. Yeah. And that's how we remember the show. And the UFC is very good at setting these things up.

When they want to do it, they just do it. Josh Van fights Brandon Royvall at a fight of the year contender. And then they sit him cage-eyed for Pants' fight to set that up. Giuliana Pena wins the women's Bannamweight title. They go to a split screen of Kayla Harrison in the locker room watching Pena win after she beat Kettlin Vieira. Like, they can do it and they have done it. So if you want to set up Brandon Moran,

know, he's literally in the building. Sit him cage side. Pull him off the Spanish desk. Do it. Who cares? Like, if that's the desired outcome, just sit him down. It's fine. It all, like, you just have to start getting rid of these commentators.

Like, the more I go, the more I think my greatest take is just that commentators have a shelf life of three years. This thing was never like good, but he was like fine or whatever. but you have 600 people on roster. Let literally any other human being try and do it and see if you can find, like, because you'll never convince me that Michael Bisping is the best option that they have

or the Dominic Cruz is the best option. It's just they're the guys who got in first and basically the history of this company is just like, all right, you're here, you'll stay forever because you're kind of like if you just say yes a bunch. And it's like, there's just, no way. Dustin Pore is retired. He just tweeted about being on the desk. Put that dude in the booth. Let's see if he can do it. If he can't keep firing until you find somebody like Paul Felder. Who can ask good questions? He's great. And like just be a mouthpiece to a producer in his ear, but not one who just like Ron Burgundy's his way through it. Yeah. Kiasse is great. He'll be on the Contender Series. So we'll get to see a little bit of him. Anthony Smith would be a good. a good one. He's done a lot of color work as well,

but that's something. Jed, we have bonuses. We have bonuses. Care to take a guess? They should do two fight of the nights. I don't think they're going to. I believe Duncan Rebekchi is going to get fight of the night. I think I mean, Rania's going to get performance and

give it a Tyra for the other one. Fight of the night Chris Duncan versus Batush Rebetschke. Other bonus other bonus goes to the other

fight of the night. Esteban Rebaugh. Oh, hell yeah. They did two fight of the nights. And that's it. That's the correct answer. 100%. So let's go to the two fight of the nights.

And in my opinion, we'll start with, in my opinion, if the year ended now, and I don't know exactly where I would put, this because I'd rewatch all these fights and I would have a great time doing it. I think Chris Duncan versus Matuchuch-Rubeschi's top three fight of the year. That fight was absolute bonkers, absolute bananas from second one. These two dudes went out and chucked them as hard as they could.

They were both bloody messes. Chris Duncan's thrown these insane step-in elbows. Rebetsky's just kind of walking through them and just throwing hammers. it seems like he broke his left hand, but he still thrown it out there. He's just a bloody, disgusting mess, like within 90 seconds of the fight. It's just this way for 15 minutes. That third round was such a battle of attrition, and both guys were landing heavy, heavy shots, and both guys just kept coming after each other.

Absolutely insane fight. Chris Duncan gets the win. There wasn't 3027 in there, but who gives a shot? I didn't agree with that. Yeah, I thought Rebetsky won the first round at that Duncan won two and three. I thought that was pretty clear cut. But at the end of the day, it doesn't matter.

The right guy won. Holy shit, Jed. What a fight that was. It was really fun fight. I'm fine with you won the first round of Robechki. I didn't score 20 and 28. I got a little bit of flack on Twitter for that because I said like probably should be.

Because like I, like in by per the rules, like arguably Duncan did win that because he put, a friggin softball in Robechke's head and cut a four-inch gash on his eyebrow. And like, you are supposed to weight damage more than anything else. And like, there were two very visible signs of major damage on one fighter and not the other. So, like, if you want, I think 3027 is defensible. Not how I scored it.

I went 29, 28. Totally fine with that. I don't know. This certainly be a top five five of the year. It's insane because we're going to talk about it immediately before this. I was like the Rieva Vitch-Brenner fight was probably certainly had it had overtaken the Vallejo-Dandes Silva fight, which is a rocker to be fight of the night. And it was, you know, it was going to have fight of the year consideration. But that fight feels a little more like, you know, maybe that's a far of at the end of the year, not like going to be in the top five.

This one feels like it's got a good chance to be in the top five. I don't know the top three. because it kind of depends, right? Because the way fight of the year always breaks down. Occasionally there is the perfect combination, the perfect symbiotic relationship between a fight that is super high level and a fight that is just bad shit crazy.

And this was not like the most high-level fist fight you've ever seen, but it was a rugged blood and guts war of attrition. And there hasn't really been like one of those there hasn't been like a Izzy Gasolum Poiré Holloway 2 this year but there have been some

really high level good fights that you know like if we go Roy Valvan like that's a better fight than this is it a more fun fight than this I don't know I frankly don't know and so I don't know how I feel that I will say in just the fun

fight category and I think my fight of the year frontrunner at this point in time is Holland Rodriguez because it's just the funniest goddamn fight that fight's fucking hilarious and

like that I think that fight was more fun than this fight still certainly it not winning fight of the night is absolutely hilarious but like there's just there's some it's going to be an interesting year unless somebody comes through and just like blows the doors off everybody

in this regard it's going to be a little bit of a pickier flavor of it and this absolutely could be a lot of people's flavor. It's going to be hurt into the year by it being three-round fights are always hurt in the fight of the year considerations. Five rounds is just a huge advantage in that regard. And it being in the apex. This fight probably would have rocked way more if there was a crowd just lose because the crowd of the apex was losing its mind all six of them.

You know, like they were all yelling and being as loud as they can. But like it's like me causing a ruckus in this office right now. There's just not enough bodies to come through the screen and grab your attention, like if this was at Team Oval Arena or something. But hell of a fight. I'm glad they got the bonus. Glad the next fight we'll talk about guys as well. Yeah.

And the thing is, Rebetsky and Rievich were both in fight of the top seven fights of the year last year. And then they're immediately. You knew this is going to be a year. It really shifts back to the apex. Immediately. Reberich said two fights in a row. with a frigate apex since that incredible war with Daniel Zellieuber.

Like, what are we doing here? These two dudes, Rebetsky should never be at the apex. Revan should absolutely never be at the apex. There should probably not be any lightweight fights at the apex unless they're newcomers. Yeah, just to be honest. Like, what are we doing? That's 100% correct. So I would, I would like to take a stand right here right now.

I think it's important. that I get this on on air at this moment in time. My Ateno selection is Wildcard and it's Matushabeski versus Ells Brunner because that would just be fun of shit. That would just be fun of shit, man. Let them both rest up for like six months, but on January, just run those two dudes into each other. Oh, that'll kick ass. So is it fair to say, and I'm kind of cheating based on pre- previous slacks that you sent out.

This is essentially like a four-man tournament where a winner's bracket and a loser's bracket? So I kind of want to say that, but I also sort of actually think that, I mean, I guess no, Riebevich lost to Nazrae-Hakpros, even though I thought he won that fight. I was going to say like kind of feels like Rievich deserves like a real crack up and Duncan would not be that. But I guess since he did technically lose to Nasrott, you could run it. Sure.

Just swap. Put both fights on the same card again. Back to back. Just to see if we can catch lighting in a bottle twice. And that fight week, everybody can be like, is, you guys think this is kind of weird? They're like, nah, it makes sense. It was a heater. Dude, Chris Duncan's won three in a row.

He's five and one in the UFC. I mean, it's a nice little run right now. Who did he? He lost to Manuel Torres. Also, let me make sure I'm not totally making this up, but I think I'm not. Because I thought I didn't realize it until too late to do it. And I should have done it because we're big dumb bozo. Yes.

So the UFC botched it because they're assholes. And outside of putting this fight in the apex, which is stupid and shitty, they should have put it next week when Christian Leroy Duncan is also fighting. And the two Chris Duncan's are both undefeated when fighting. fighting on cards together. And so I could have done a week over week parlay and didn't do it because I didn't realize it until like literally tonight the Christian that were talking is fighting next week. Yeah. I have cashed that parlay twice.

It has happened twice. I have cashed it twice. That had been a great call if you had remembered to do that. Great fight. Chris Duncan on a roll. I think he's a guy. I mean, he might be the most, at least in my eyes. And Casey and I were talking about this on the Q&A.

Chris Duncan might be the most overlooked fighter in this division because in our MA fighting picks, just to pat myself on the back, I went 11 and 1. The one I got wrong was picking against Chris Duncan, which I have done his last three fights. I just can't seem to pick him. And even after the previous win, I was like, I'm not picking against him again. And then they match him up with Batusha Betchke, I'm like, damn it, now I have to pick against him again. And now I really, I don't know what to do with Chris Duncan. He just keeps proving me wrong.

So maybe for the benefit of his career, I'll just keep picking against him. And maybe he'll just keep winning until he's UFC champion. So great win for Chris Duncan, incredible fight. Very interested to see like a post-fight hospital photo between the two of those gentlemen. That'll be very fun and some electric stuff. And then the Rievovich-Brenner fight was just awesome, man. Like just a banger. It was very, very good.

I thought Reavich was just going to kill him. And it looked like we might be jude. I kind of did. I kind of felt like. I was certain that this was the fight we were getting because it's every Elvesbrun fight. He refuses to defend himself and he's tougher than a $2 steak. And like there are just always moments in the fight where it's like,

holy shit, I've hit this guy a lot. And then he cracks you and like, God damn. What's that? Next, the first round, he heard him bad. And I was like, oh, all right, things would be over in the first round. And then Brenner just got tougher. And his chin got better as the fight went on. He got hit a billion times of that fight.

It was one of those. And Brenner's just got so much heart, man. And he's fun as hell. And he should be employed forever. That was one of those. They should give that man a step back. God damn. You know the run he's on right now?

Yeah, he's fighting a whole bunch of, heavy heavy hitters i mean jesus joel he's warren by alvarez and rivenovitch like that is a fucking rola hitters dude that's all before that he i mean he beat kate on he got the the grombe upset got him got people of and about it

i mean dude just fight in really tough conditions i was just going to make he's just get a step back except for now he's getting her two shribecki necks So enjoy the brain damn selves. Oh, man.

It was just a very compelling asswopin, but a very fun one. And Brenner, like, gained a lot of fans, uh, despite getting beat up in that fight. Dude's just so tough, man. And Reavitch is just so fun. This guy's just, he's so electric, Jed. He's one of your boys.

Guys, lightweight fucking rocks. The best edition of the sport. I don't want to hear any more arguments against it. It's just so. good and like I the top of it's going to be like a little bit of flux to get a bunch of old guys who are finally going to give up the ghost here a little bit but dude like you just pick any lightweight in the top 50 and way more often than not like they're just they're just going to be doing silly cool shit to each other it's it's awesome I love this like like lightweight's you're right light weights just shouldn't fight the apex basically like we could remove lightweights and bannam weights from the apex and that'd be okay in my personal rankings

I don't have any of those four fighters that competed tonight inside the top 35 that just tells you how I almost certainly would have Rebovich in there I don't do rankings that high

he's close he's close right now he's very very close Rebovich would have been the one who was in and I suspect that have him in the top 35 but I don't do He's that high. Yeah, I might.

But I also just. I had Rebetsky at 36, but I might, does he jump? Does he jump chase hooper? Probably. You know, that's kind of. Chase super's real good though, man. Yeah. My weight's good.

That's a really good weight class. It's the best damn division in the sport, one of the toughest divisions in all of sports. And it just rocks. Carol Hosa gets a win back on track. She's just the flip-flopper. Lose win, lose, win. lose, win.

Boo. I bet that did not go well to you. No, my fantasy team. Oh, the fantasy team. You don't remember? I literally was like, I don't know who to pick between Norco and Carol Hosa,

and I believe I asked the magic eight ball, and it told me to go with Norfolk or Yole. Because I just had to get a woman's bandway. It was one of the two of them. So I turned Norfolk or Noel as a loss. Yeah. It was a tough one. That's tough zippy.

It's tough zero to take. That's for sure. First round, I felt pretty good. I was like, okay, she might actually, she's an underdog,

but she might win this. She's kind of tuning her up. And then she can't stop, but she looked atrocious. That was outside of like my personal investment, she could not stop a double leg and looked genuinely lost on the ground. And I know that Carol hosts as a black belt, but like,

Grona was not doing anything. Like just doing that. She was just getting beat. It was tough scenes. We did get a couple of 10-8s in that fight. So there you go. Neil Magny. Neil Magny avoids a three-fight losing streak right back at it, Jed.

What a birthday. What a birthday present for Neil Magny. Shout out to AK, who slacked me yesterday. And was like, is Neil Magny a lock? I was like, honestly, I think he's a really live dog. And the only reason I didn't bet him is because he's gotten. pretty badly knocked out in two straight fights and his chin might just be all the way gone and granted he got beat by good fighters but and like zDS is a clear step down was like historically this is

exactly the fight neil magni wins but he's old he's fought a lot and his chin seems to be cracked and if zDS can still do something it's he can hit people pretty hard so it's like i'm just staying away aka was like but it's his birthday sunday and he was right and he was right right, Neil Magny, classic vintage performance. Good for him. Yeah, Neil Bagneyed all over him and got the finish. I mean, just the most classic Magni performance. Yep.

Kevin Vallejo's, great fight with Danny Silva, gets it done. Honestly, I thought that would be the fight we talk about all night because, one, that fight ripped, and two, Kevin Vallejo is going to fight for title, and I need you guys to understand that. I really like Danny Silva too. I was very hard on him coming off contingent shares and I think everybody got to see why. He's just a violent like tougher than $2 steak, super fun. Like he's got that. Like he's like Ells Brenner of Ells Brunner had talent. And so like he rips. But Kevin Valleos is the best way I can put this and have been using this as my example. Kevin Vallejo's very nearly being.

John Sova on Contender Series the first time around when he was 21. He is by far Jean-Sovva's most difficult test. John Silva may be fighting for a belt by the end of next year. And when this kid was 21, he went hammer and tongs John Silva. He is awesome. He's so talented. He's very good. Rennie Nakamura.

Argentina got some hitters on him right now. Yeah, Reni Nakamura got hoax. got hoised by the lightweight. Also got hoised by the lightweights. Probably the most, if we're talking locks, Renni Nakamura was the lock of locks against Nathan.

Declim, step two, baby. Very smart. Easy. Just an unbelievable. He was only like minus 420. I think he's minus 425. Which I was like, I was like, guys,

I know he just lost, but like surely he will just use his wrestling. And then he, you know, didn't. I was like, Nathan Fletcher can't wrestle. Like, what are we doing here? I think Reni Nakamura might be the most underrated fighter in a very specific way on the entire roster. Because people don't recognize that he's like one of the absolute

like full stop best prospects in the sport. Like people are tripping over themselves to anoint Bo Nicol as like, like, and we were all doing. I was certainly doing. I still think Bo Bo Nicol probably has a bright future in the sport. but like Renni Nakamura is as accomplished as Bo Nicol. He is also a U-23 world champion wrestler

who missed out on the Olympic trials or whatever. But, you know, like it's the same sort of thing. He is just as talented as Bo Nickel and actually has kind of looked a little bit better, I would say, in his fights. Granted, has lost not as good as losing to RDR future champion. But like this is a dude who

he's going to fight for the belt like he's just going to do it great performance uh we got a bunch we got we had some middle weights and boy it got middleweighty with delfeira and trachon gore yowser that was that was tough scenes

uh wasn't a very good fight no Andre Pulaev and Nick Klein was pretty fun because Nick Klein just comes at you 5,000 miles an hour and then he just dies heading into route to he's the

Macuanamirconi. He's the whole first round. So I didn't see. I just saw the finish. Yeah. Nick just, he just sprints at you, runs you over,

tackles you, and just beats the piss out of you. For like the entirety of the round. And then he's just cooked. He is the middle-weight Machuanamir-Mir-a-Kani. It is official. That is who he is. And pli-

Not really the comp you ever want to have. Very fun first-round fighter. Might get you out of there. If he doesn't get you out of there in the first round, you'll live bet against him. You could probably make a ton of money that way. Austin Boschi, great bounceback performance. He's got a...

I mean, maybe we should walk before we run a little bit. Yeah, he's going to fight for a belt one day. He's 23. If he could just keep fighting the John Janus's of the world, he will certainly... He's 23. He... I feel very comfortable saying that he will fight for a belt one day.

Do you feel comfortable saying... That's why I liked a lot of this card. They're like future titles. I'm not saying they'll win them, but they're future title challengers up and down this card. We shall see. I think Bosch is good. I need to see a little bit more before I am on the same pathway with you.

And I watch a lot of his regional stuff when he got on Contender series. I was like, all right, good. This guy's a very good young man. He's one of the more talented guys. Let's just see if once he gets the higher level. He's incredibly talented. He mostly fought like decent dudes in the regional scene.

And like, I'm sorry. Christian Rodriguez's whole thing is blowing up. prospects. I'm not holding that against him. That's what C.R does, you know? Hafiel Estevam, a workman-like decision win over Felipe Bunes after missing weight by a massive amount. And that's how you do it. I had no idea about this until Danny Rubinstein tweeted this out yesterday. And then I hit him up yesterday and asked him about him. Like, I had no idea this is true. It doesn't matter how much you misweight by.

The cap on a on a weight miss penalty in Nevada now is 25%. 20. Oh, 25, okay. You can't go any higher. You can't go 30. You can't even ask for it. You cannot go higher than 25%. That's insane.

Actually, I think that makes sense. I don't. I think that's ridiculous. I mean, I think it just, no, but I think it's, well, that you just shouldn't have the fight. Like, I think it should be capped because like if you miss by more than like five is the max probably we should allow. So it's just like it's it should just be a if you miss your find 25% of your purse. And if you miss by five, you don't get to fight.

That's it. Yeah. I actually, I actually, you should be able to go to 30 or higher if you want to negotiate that. I think it should be up to the managers and to figure that out. and then if the commission allows the fighters to fight like it's a fuck i really hate finding fighters though um for that like i get it and i'm not entirely sure it's wrong but like it's just like i feel like it incentivized one we're taking money from fighters who don't get paid shit anyway which i never feel like great about and two it's just like what's the old adage like if

if you're rich a a fine is just the price to break the law So it's just like you're just incentivizing people to miss weight and take five grand, you know, 10, 15 grand less or whatever to just come in five pounds over. So it's just like, if you're happy all this of them, it doesn't matter. Like, yeah, I, I, I'm missing weight. I'm missing weight. Yeah, I'm missing weight. I'm missing weight.

I'm missing weight too. Why not? This is a deeply unpopular opinion. I don't think fights should happen if the fighters miss weight. I, I, I know that there are not many people on this island. I think the UFC should have a standard policy. If you miss weight, you don't get to fight. Other fighter gets their show money,

and we'll book them two weeks now, whatever it is, at their earliest convenience. But make the wait. You agreed to do the goddamn thing? Do the goddamn thing. Pierre Rodriguez did the goddamn thing. Gets a nice trip to Splitty City and gets out on the right end of the street.

Picks up the win over Ketland Soza. and that is UFC Vegas 108. And we'll never talk about that fight again. Yes. There are a few things we will remember, and there's a lot of stuff we won't. But the things we will remember were eaters. Casey, come on in.

It was the night before the gathering and all through the house. The host rapid cozy cashmere throw from Homense for their spouse, kids' toys for $699 under the tree, and crystal glasses for just $14.99 for their brother Lee, A baking dish made in Portugal for Tom and Sue and a nice 599 candle perfectly priced just for you. Happy holidays to all

and to all a good price. Homeless presents perfectly priced. A couple of real heaters. Three really good fights tonight. Yeah. The card was laid out pretty well. I was like... And again, honestly, like all of these outcomes

are pretty... expected. Like, we all expected the main event to be fun, maybe a little more competitive, but like still fun. And certainly given the circumstances, the coming event, everyone thought would be a heater. It was better than we thought, but it was still, like, you would have thought that fight would be great. Rinovich Brenner, you would think that fight would be great. Again, I think that, that fight felt like, it actually felt exactly right on what I thought, whereas, you know, Reveschi Duncan was exceeded my expectations. And I was really certain that Vallejo-Standi-Solvo would be awesome, and it was.

It was just like, all the main card was really lined up pretty well. Yeah, I said that's on the main preview show, but this card to me had a WEC fill, especially of all the highlights of the lower weight classes. And guys are just no names, no names, but just we know they're going to be good. And I agree with what you said, Jed. a lot of maybe not future champions but guys who will be

right in that top five in five six years you know they're gonna be we're gonna see their names I believe four people on this car will fight for belts yeah this is one of those cards

you look back like six years from now you're like man that was one crazy talented card yeah so uh I um but one of those cards honestly I said four it's probably five because women's ban and weight

like Carol Hosa might just find her way into one you know. Oh man. Yeah. Yeah. Caritas Hosa Cornhole fight, Cornhole fight was actually the most, I can't believe that was the most, that was the ranked fight on the card.

That was like just the weirdest thing. Like, just the one fight between two ranked folk. Yeah, it's just a weird thing. Questions. Here we go. Let's get our super chat first from Miguel 49 super chat

Thank you sir Jed how do we feel about Nora Cornoli's Trevor Peak impression with the standing hammer fist Standing hammer fists are hilarious They're not intended to be But I always find them deeply funny I look

Cornoli was doing fine before Hose had just tackled her And then Cornoli was lost And I was like all right well we know how like the third we didn't need to have the third round of that fight because i would have bet everything i owned or ever will own that well carolosa is just going to come out and shoot a double in at most 15 seconds because it went so easy for her like she would have to be the stupidest i was literally in my house being like maybe carolos or just get real stupid maybe she'll get

stupid and I'll have a chance to get some fantasy points here because the only possible result is her being a total moron and just trying to strike for the next five minutes and that's not what she did and the fight went exactly how you knew it was going to uh thank you Miguel all right what else we got here oh this is I want this is for Jed I want I want him to rant a little more against him Who cares about a 10A when there's a finish? I mean, do you just not care about the process to anything, Martin?

Like, is it just whatever the outcome is that's the only thing that matters? I don't think that that's a productive way to get it through life, but you got to do what you got to do, man. I care about the sport being better. I think, honestly, like, the through line to any time I am yelling about something, I'm either yelling positively about something because it's very silly and that makes me happy, aka Drickus Duplessi, Snyder de Ritter, that sort of thing, or I'm yelling about something that is like tangibly making the sport worse.

And I like it's, it is hard to be a sports fan. I honestly think that just like a lot of fight fans aren't sports fans and that that's what is happening here because like as like a sports fan, I watch. a lot of all sorts of sports. And like, by far, MMA is the most clown show of it. Not just like it's kind of conceived as a clown show thing because it's physical violence,

which is, you know, on the periphery of polite society, but just like every aspect of it is not remotely to the level that, like, sports that make way less money have, like, this ability, like this is not a, Midwest Smoker Show. If we were covering like Wild Bill's fight nights, I have a lot more latitude on random shit happening because like, yeah, in the same way I would about a Pop Warner football game.

But this is a multi-billion dollar industry that is still run functionally like it's managed by children's or potheads from the 1990s. Like there's so many stupid things that could be cleaned up to just make it a better sport that would take very little lift, frankly. But so they will just always be frustrated. The UFC just parted ways with a seven and one fighter from their division who was coming off of a win in a fight that I thought was electric compared to what it was on paper. I had a fun time watching Martin Boudai fight Marcus Buccecha. It was exactly what I hoped it would be in more.

And then they just, they were just like, nah, you're good. that's like that's like if the it's like if the Patriots go to their buy week it's seven and one but they they won all seven of their games

just by kicking field goals are just like you know what we don't want you back for the second half of the year we're just going to dump you because you weren't that thrilling to the majority of the fan base like

that doesn't happen in other sports it's crazy it's absolutely insane so it's all and like to this specific point even Martin like to go to another football analogy here, right? Like in a regular season game that's meaningless, right?

Like the game has already been decided, but a referee just stone blows the most obvious call of all time. Like, I'm trying to think like just some dude punches a guy in the face in front of him and he's just like, no whistle. Okay, well, it was a 50-10 blowout. It doesn't matter. Does that ref then go ref the Super Bowl?

when it might matter when that shit is like this shit matters because it all matters like life is not a random series of occurrences every part of it is a piece of the whole and if you like there's no if

if the design of your scoring is such that you could ever score the first round of Tyra Park the same as as I said any round any round in the Adolfo

Trashon Gore then that is raw like there is a fundamental break in your system it is not working for those two things to be treated equally and maybe it didn't matter now

but at some point it will and so we should just fix it because it's not hard to fix these things just look at the refereeing so look at the refereeing in the sport right now how many the Pierre Rodriguez fight there were three egregious fence grabs

that none of them were called, none of them. And like, that does, again, this, any sort of penalty is called in every other sport, except this sport, unless it is just, and even like the egregious ones. You need like six eye pokes before a point is taken away. You need like four kicks to the ding ding, before we even talk about a hard warning before we take a point away.

Like, it's not like that in other sports. Like, you hold the guy's jersey, accidental or not, it's a 10-yard penalty every single time 100% of the time so yeah it's silly and this is the sport we we follow and that's why the shelf life of an m-ma fan is at most five years really like i genuinely believe that it is a contributing factor into the turnover rate of the sport it's just like okay it's there's just because it's not the then the the the The participants of it, the people running it only barely treat it like a sport. And if you don't believe in your own product in that way, then why should other people believe in your product? Like, it's just a fundamental thing.

So like, yeah, this should be fixed. I at least look forward to, I do think the rules update that's coming at some point. I mean, it has to be voted on at that, which is happening like next week, maybe. Very soon, yeah. Yeah, it's this month, probably like fairly certain. And I think that rules update is, it doesn't do enough. But I do think that that's like an improvement. And, you know, hopefully that will get us going in a better direction.

But like, these should not be things we have to talk about. Like, it is ludicrous for anyone to be like, who like that wasn't a 10-8 round. Like, okay, the sport's broken if you think that that's not a 10-8. back. Our sport has a scoring system that was based on another sport. Yeah. I always go back to that. Stephen Wynne knocked a fighter down six times and around and only got a 10-8.

Like that's funny. Here's the thing about that. Like that's not a like that would work except for they fundamentally got rid of the single biggest aspect of that other scoring system, i.e. mandatory point deductions. because in box, like this is what drives me fucking insane. In boxing, like, it's a mandatory point deduction for getting dropped, like if you get dropped because it is like intrinsically understanding that that is a significant moment and it is more

significant than the general round that happens in a boxing match. And so like that scores. And they, that is not part of MMA. and in fact they then spent a full decade actively dissuading 108 rounds in general, which is ludicrous when it straight up the sport would be better if it was a mandatory point. If every drop got a man, it would genuinely like be a more accurate representation of a fist fight. It may not be perfect.

It be better than what we currently do if you just gave 108s every time a fighter got dropped. It is, but they got like that is the straw that stirs the boxing. 10-8 10-point must system and they just threw it the fuck out to leave us with this shit yeah i don't 100% agree with the automatic point deduction for getting dropped but i hunt but i do see a point there needs to be way more yeah that's me being hyperbolic yeah because i do i actually just think it would be better than currently but literally the the point of it in boxing is to differentiate between rounds and it is

looking at a pot that's not a particularly high bar to clear in boxing you got to drop a dude like in MMA they we are setting the standard where people are like three judges were like I Honsung Park literally had zero zero zero offense for five

minutes got dropped and had his back held for four full minutes 10 nine that's insane it's insane that like the scoring is not like that that is the outcome people think we want? I don't know. It's ludicrous.

All right. We could go on forever about this, but thank you, Martin. Hey, we've got another apex card next week. I'm sure we'll have things score cards and yeah. Fence scraps to discuss next week.

Yeah. So happy that it two fights of the night. They did it right. They did it right. I always complain about this. Like 90% of time, I'm like, what, what, but got it. Do you guys recall another card with two fighting the nights? I'm sure there had to be one. Somebody asked that earlier and there must be, but actually, hold on.

You know what? Hold on. Let me look one up. Let me look this up. Oh, nailed it. Hell yeah. You know what it was, Casey? Atlanta.

USC 236, Atlanta, baby. They gave fight of the night to borrow. For a Holloway and Gaslimizzy. I just was like there's no way they didn't. Just like this. Yeah. I was just like there's no way they didn't do that because we were at that car. I was like who, what like what else could they have possibly?

Like there's no chance. That was literally the one and two that year for five of the year. Yeah. And yeah. So at least that I would bet that it's happened a couple of other times. Honestly, maybe just in instances where they didn't have finishes because that used to be a thing. Yeah. So like, but it's definitely not common.

And I think it was right. I do believe it was very cold. Yeah. But because of that, we got to talk about this just because this man was robbed, but it's just how I had to go. Still feeling the front kick from Macomor to the body of Fletcher. There was brutal. We had multiple body kicks. Justin, it was not a front kick by the way.

I understand it was a cuckuno kick. The classic cacuna kick. Google it. Those toes right into the liver, baby. Do those feel brutal. Have your friend do it. Have your friend give you a light kick, have you curl your toes up and give it right under the rib, right?

Oh, it's, uh, it feels, yeah, it's, yeah. It's not quite, it's not a liver. It's not a liver shot. I think in the call, the original car they thought it was a liver shot. It's, it's different, but, uh, very similar. But I want to shout out to Nakamura for that. Yeah. What are you going to say, sir?

No, just that was dope. It was dope. I do, I love that we're no longer in the timeline where people pretend that the UFC is going to take care of him backstage. Because that used to always be the line. Like, well, Dana's going to take care of it. It's like, Dana's not there. Mick Maynard's not going to cut that.

McMainer might have a 20 out of his wallet. Just be like, all right, get yourself a soda pop kid. Yeah. And then get the hell out of here. You can't stay back in the green room while other fights are happening. get out of this get out of here right now yeah we'll order you an uber black to the airport that's about it you'll get the nice uber i don't know yeah definitely uh but yeah awesome but you think knocker is that good though back to knocker more you think he's that good as an overall

prospect my i mean i'm not against that i mean he's a little older um is he is i think he's 30 or 20 30 um but like again he's this is a u 23 world champion wrestler he is a physical specimen. Like he should just be like treated exactly the same as Bo Nicholas, frankly. And I believe most people, I certainly was like, Bo Nichols

is one of the best prospects in the little sport. I, you know, he had a setback against Moing Gaffroff. I think that he probably learned to be a little bit smarter there, hopefully. But like if, like I love Malcolm Wellmaker. I, I, he's on a fantasy.

team, been a huge supporter of Malcolm Wellmaker. I have to assume Rania Nakamura is a better pick to like have like high, high in success in the weight class because he's got a better pedigree and they're both old. All right. Thank you much. Oh, um, we got a friend. Oh, Dave.

Just want to talk about Bisbing just a bit. Give my bizbing's already like seven hours at the work at that point. Yeah. I will sell. But Paul Feller's not in there. And that's a, that is, I will say this about the UFC. Those guys should not be doing commentary for that freaking long. That should be split into two crews.

That's all. Just, I mean, because, or like, let Bisman go, then you let Feltter go. It's just, it's just too, it's just too much to be just on to me. I wouldn't hate that. I think, and again, I'm going to come back to just put like one human being who does other high level production into a room and be like, what the fuck are you guys doing here? You ever notice how you go to boxing, you go to any other sport? Like the K, like the in-ring announcer, the sideline reporters, not the same person who's on the analyst desk or in the commentary booth.

They're just all different fucking jobs because they are. You are a multi-billion dollar company. You can have Megan O'Levy step in the cage to do the post fights. You don't have, like, again, the company is run as if it is, you know, on the verge of bankruptcy. And we got to get Bisping to do this and this and then go through the booth. I know, like you have a commentary team. You have an analyst booth. You have a sideline reporter.

You have an in cage interviewer. You have a ring announcer. Bruce Buffer isn't out there holding up the ring cards between them. Like, get a person for this fucking job and preferably one who knows how to do it. Here's what they should do. And I say this, I've said this many times, and I'll say it again. The best, the best night Dominic Cruz has ever had on commentary, or the best, the best overall night he had when it was just him and Anick. Anick knows Cruz so well.

And he set Cruz up all night. He had nobody to battle with. He didn't have D.C. trying to like yell at him and Bisming trying to yell at him. Cruz is great with Felder because Felder isn't like an A personality when he's got what he's got the headsets on. Put Bisbing in the Dean Thomas role during those events.

And then if he wants to still do the post-fight interviews, fine. He's not yabbering for seven hours then doing post-fight interviews. You go to him after the occasional round for a quick drop in, hey, this is what I saw. This is what he needs to do differently. Back to you guys.

And then at the end of the fight, if he wants to do, if there's a post-fight interview you had, Chuck Bisbig in there to do it. Like, that's fine. You don't need three people in the frigging booth for an apex card. You don't. Don't put Bisping into do interviews ever again. But no, you also just shouldn't.

Like, three men, again, and I find it really, I know that these aren't the same sports. I think that if you spend most of your, you know, sports business career being like, I'm going to try and do what the NFL does. You're probably going to largely be really successful. And there aren't three men commentary booths going on on NFL broadcasts because you don't need them. The third person never fits in, especially the way the UFC does it where it's two fighters and an actual broadcaster.

Because then Annick's doing his job. And to your point, Mike, the two fighters are then bickering or arguing or podcasting over it as opposed to broadcasting a fight, a sporting event. you know, it's Joe Buck and Troy Aikman. It's not Joe, Troy, and we threw Tom Britt. They throw him, like they may bring a third person into the booth for a minute to give a separate perspective. But then that is always a circumstance where the broadcaster and the other person are like, so Tom, you know, thanks for stopping by.

What are you seeing out there? And it is a very interpersonal one to be about option C. Not the three of us are going and trying to figure out how we all fit in. It's not natural. It's a bad dynamic. You should only be doing two minutes in general. And Michael Bisping should never be a post-fight interview. He's bad at it.

He's just not good at it. And so hire a person who that's their job. Like, Ariel does those at boxing because he is good at that sort of interview. There are people who do this for a living. Let them do it and stop being like Bisping. let's have you do all these things that you're not particularly good at. Yeah. You know what's crazy is for so many years,

everyone was like, well, UFC has nothing to do with WWE. WWU went into a three-person broadcast booth. And then what happened like a year later? UFC did the exact same thing. And then boxing did it after the UFC. Does WWE have a three-person broadcast booth?

Not anymore. They switched to a two. Maybe like two years ago. They did. I watched, you could maybe make it work for them. because it's scripted. Like, so you could, like, there's a little more leeway.

But still, it's just like, it's too many voices. Yeah. I just watched frigate SummerSlam tonight, like in the background, two-person booth for like an event with 50,000 people in a stadium. They just had two people in the broadcast booth. And it went fine. Like, I, I would, like, if somebody can, if somebody from the UFC is watching this, I like, we don't, this doesn't have to be on air.

I would just honestly like to talk to you and explain to me why. you think it is necessary to have a third. Like what is having dominant Cruz and Michael Bisping? How is that elevating the product to have them on the same thing? Is it, you know, well, we owe them X contractual dates?

I can't imagine that's it. They're not, one of them is better because then it's a conversation between a fighter and not a fighter. And not, here's Annick trying to do play by play while Bisping and Cruz take shots at each other about what do you know about pistols

you're from the UK her her her actually I said piston you deaf motherfucker like it's just like why why is this happening oh is that the conference

I didn't understand what was going I heard him like that happened tonight Casey I heard him talking about I'm just like I'm not going to rewind it I'm just gonna be confused and move on Michael Bistling was like he hits like a piston

and Cruz was like, what do you know about guns you from the UK? Hur, dur, dur. And Bissing was like, I said, I said Piston. And then to his credit,

look, this wasn't like clever, but to his credit, he did at least kind of put a bow on Dominic Cruz being a dumbass by being like, but he throws straight as a bullet. And so like,

credit to you, Bisping, fair play because Dominicruz sucks too. Like, it's just you don't need the third person. You don't. Yep. PFL Africa, great broadcast. Sean O'Connell, Jimmy Smith, beautiful. I'm sure the play-by-play guy would love a two-person booth. I'm sure for the play-by-play, the three-person booth is probably heavy for them.

When they moved to a three-person booth, like, Anik was bad for like three months because he just had to figure out how to do it because they were talking over him constantly. And then, but he's a professional broadcaster and he got there. He's still incredibly talented. all of the professional broadcasters are good they should not get rid of any of them they should try some new blood all right uh thank you old dave uh two super chats before we get out of here for this very short post fight show we're going to do that we're now over an hour so it's please it never it never works it never work next week we're like guys we're post showing for three hours and maybe we'll get out of here yeah we're going to do a five we're going to do a five five-hour post show.

Yeah. We'll see you. The post show will be longer than the card, we promise. At least it's a 4-7 next week and not a 6-9. Oh, that is nice. Big fan of that. Yeah. All right.

Two more super chats before we get out. Steven, boys, everyone talks about PFL, one not making profit. How is Japan, MMA going, Risen, et cetera? You never hear too much negative coming out of there. Verizon continues to put on dope shows. I have no idea how they do financially. I don't know anyone that does. I have teammates that fight in Japan.

When she's came back and fought, he just fought in Pancras and won his shot and won a belt over there. And from all accounts, they're doing good. But Japan, Japan's like, they just kind of care about Japan. and that market out there they don't they don't try to they're not like the UFC like we're the biggest sport ever

you know they're just like they just do their thing focus on their fans and they don't really care too much about the American fans they're just they just do their thing I get I mean Hank Craig's gotta be like almost 40 years old now yeah still just trucking along

yeah and apparently for no he's like a no like a 9-1-92 lightweight and he says you know he's getting paid you know UFC money. So, and for a smaller promotion. I have no concept for the financials. Like my sort of default statement or belief is that Verizon will eventually go bankrupt or get into legal trouble because the history of Japanese MMA promotions that have ascended to a certain tier, that's just kind of happened.

But every time they put on a show, the arena seems packed. people it seems rocking and again like you that there's you don't have to pursue global domination you know like kSW is awesome and they're concerned with kids they're concerned with poland and putting on the best show they can and you know operating within their means and to the best of my understanding horizon is doing that so yeah good all ksw and the part of the world that they cater towards they are bigger than the u. in that part of the world. Like, they just are.

That's why they're selling out 60,000 plus people. Octagon's like similar. Octagon's doing great too. You can own a little niche of the world. And you want to know what? You want to know, like, I don't know, Rises Financials. I don't know KSW's financials. But you can normally tell kind of the perception within the community by just conversations

you have with people. and you know I talked to like regional promoters and I talk to everybody like banditiers and stuff of that nature you could tell one was going down the shitter for a few years now yeah uh just based on way longer than i thought they were yeah it's crazy somehow i genuinely thought they were filing bankruptcy last year and they managed to avoid that but you never you never hear a promoter that at least i've i haven't heard one in a long time say like you know what i'd love to work with and do like a a collab event with one championship. You don't hear that.

You want to know who everyone wants to work with? Risen and KSW. They all want to work and do something with those guys. That's what they, that's value. Like if there's, and these are people like who are very knowledgeable of the M.A. space and they know about like the areas that they,

that they host shows in and all this stuff. Like they're very researched on this. And they're just like, yeah, dude, it would be frigging cool to like do a, event versus Risen or do an event with. KSW, like a little co-promotion type thing. Like they want to work with these guys. And these guys are open to any sort of like fun thing.

That could happen. So there's like a very basic but general rule. If you're like interested in the topic like this, I found to hold true, pretty simple. If a promotion is promoting fights when they say they're doing it, they're not shifting locations. you know, there's no hinky business going on with their schedule, and they are promoting fights in arenas that are filled with people. They're probably doing okay. You know, it's not like a 300-person gym or thing.

And okay, they're selling a lot of tickets. And they say they're doing this fight at this location. They go there. Probably doing all right. Hey. Thank you. much Stephen. Oh, I've said this a million times, but if you're an MMA fan, save up a couple thousand bucks. Go to Japan. Go see a-Ry card.

One year I'm doing New Year's, uh, a rising card. Gotcha. It's really like the last thing on my MMA bucket list at this point. Well, that and attending trick is two plus C versus Ryan. I'm not kidding. I'm going to that fight whenever it's book. I will be in attendance to that one. And our last super chat before we. call it a night? I just want to say Paco Porter. Thank you, Stephen.

Which Parker Porter going to get into dirty boxing? Dude, he's about to become BKFC heavyweight champion of the world. Yes. He could just be the dirty boxing champion. Like, that's some two not great humans. I mean, the goat is fighting for it, but who's Androluski fighting for it? For what? The BKFC one?

No, the DBX one, isn't it? Oh, Olofki's a BGF2. Oh, he's fighting? Oh, God. No, the dirty boxing inaugural heavyweight title will be decided later this month. It is Jarziniur Rosenstrike. Yeah, I don't know. Fighting the wolf, Rod Perez.

That's Garzini. That's who it is. I got it backwards. Because Olovsky did fight in DBX. And he won. And he won because he's the goat. His is the goat. And then he won his BKFC fight.

And then Ben Rockwell wanted to fight him. Steve is not picking up dubs and BCHC just saying. Your story. True story. Well, guys, it's on to UFC Vegas 109, but we got on to the next one coming up tomorrow and then guys. What's the co-made event next week, Mike? All the top of your head.

Oh, son of a bitch. I know there's more ranked fighters on this card. There are. Yeah. is Yasmin Lucinda Angel Hill. Yes. That's the co-made event?

Yeah. Well, that's number two. Oh, maybe it's DeVersay-Ode-Osborn. I don't know. Oh, it's number two on the Wikipedia.

Number one in our girls. We'll see you next week at the apex, everybody. Love y'all. You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network.