MMA Fighting - UFC Vegas 5 Post-Fight Show

Episode Date: August 2, 2020

MMA Fighting’s Mike Heck, Alex K. Lee and E. Casey Leydon break down the top storylines following UFC Vegas 5 Saturday night at the UFC APEX, including Derek Brunson’s third-round finish of Edmen Shahbazyan in the middleweight headliner. Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Follow Alexander K. Lee: @AlexanderKLee Follow E. Casey Leydon: @ekc Subscribe: http://goo.gl/dYpsgH Check out our full video catalog: http://goo.gl/u8VvLi Visit our playlists: http://goo.gl/eFhsvM Like MMAF on Facebook: http://goo.gl/uhdg7Z Follow on Twitter: http://goo.gl/nOATUI Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Welcome to the UFC Vegas 5 live post-fight show here on the MMA fighting YouTube channel. Hope you guys enjoyed the card. It was absolutely chaotic. We had 12 shuffles overall between cancellations and weight misses and fights being called last minute. We had eight fights total. We had 10 low blows. we had a couple of eye gouges and pokes, a couple of fence grabs. We had a little bit of everything today, two feints as well.

I don't know if we ever had two faints on a card. And I'm not trying to make light of that. I'm just trying to add up all the crazy numbers. So on a chaos scale, this is like a 25 for UFC Vegas 5. But in the end, Derek Brunson gets a huge finish of Edmund Chabazian. We're going to talk all about that with all of you guys. This is your show. It's the People's Post Fight Show.

So if you guys have questions, thoughts, concerns, anything you want to talk about, matchmaking ideas for me and AK for on to the next one, leave them in the comments. We just want to talk to all of you guys. But introducing my co-hosts and cohorts here, we have Alexander K. Lee. We have E.K.C. Liden. Alex, you know what the first question is going to be. It's always the first question.

What are we grading this thing from start to finish? Because this is a little more interesting to talk about because we had so many changes and so many crazy things happen in the buildup and then during the fight night itself. I think this is the first time that we have to give a card. an eye. I don't know if I remember people getting those in school, an eye, an eye for incomplete, because this card fell apart. It would be almost unfair to judge the quality of the fights and the fighters that competed on it and the UFC staff who scrambled to put all this stuff together because they lost fights last, what we thought was the last second on Friday, but that was not

the last second. The last second turned out tonight literally minutes before the first fight of the main card where they lost Trevin Giles and Kevin Hollins. So I'm going to go incomplete. It was really hard to even think about like afterwards the things that actually happened because I was thinking a lot about the stuff that didn't happen. So we're going with the very first I on our post fight show. I might have to give it an N because Spike DeVito just said this fight card was quote unquote nuts. Well, well done. That means multiple things. Well played.

Double on tonne. You're going with the I. I'm going with like an S plus. So like when I was in elementary school, we would get grades for subjects, but then you'd get like grades for, you know, your effort and your conduct and all this stuff. And S was like satisfactory. S minus was like not so satisfactory. S plus, I'll give it an S plus. I'm not going to give it a letter grade, but I think considering all the chaos that ensued, I think the UFC handled themselves very well and was able to put on a nice card. And it's 1222 a.m. Eastern time and we're past the post fight press conferences and on the post fight show.

that deserves the plus in my book. E. Casey Liden, what do you think all things considered? This is 2020 entirely. This card got a participation ribbon. Just a nice ribbon sticking on there. Have your parents take a photo, you know? And yeah, that's what this card was. This card was not a good card for the UFC matchmakers as far as building up the bigger

bigger fights. Obviously, they wanted, there were, Edmund as far as the, as far as the promotion, they definitely wanted Edmund to win. I mean, I didn't see one promo talking about Derek Brunson and whatever his story to get here. It was always about Edmund. So they put a lot of promotional time into Edmund. So I'm sure they were, they were not happy of the results. And Jojo losing, I don't think as far as like moving the needle, I don't know if Maya moves the needle more than Jojo. So participation ribbon. Okay, fair it up. So let's talk about the main event, AK, Derek Brunson gets it done. And we talked about this a lot during the buildup and throughout the week. And on between the lengths, the Derek Brunson has all has been a hype derailer. That's

what he does. Like he gets put in these positions when he gets to the upper echelon, has really been able to get over that hump. But tonight, he kind of had a combination of the two. He could derail a hype train and kind of get over the hump in a main event and in a big spot. And he accomplished both of those things. So your thoughts on Derek Brunson's performance and, you know, how much his stock may have rose tonight. I think it's, I think it should rise more than, than some people would think at first glance. Because no, this does not break the other, you know, Derek Brunson narrative that he can't beat like a top name like Anderson Silva, which I did a robbery review. I think he did beat him. But either way, does not have went over to Anderson Silva,

Yoval Romero, Jacques de Sousa, twice in his career. He's fought him and lost him, Robert Whitaker. So Israel Adasagna, the current champion. So we didn't get to see that yet. Instead, this was another, can he hold off another prospect? Which he did, which he did. And he did that to Ian Hinesh.

He did that to Elias Diodoro. He's done that to other people in the past. But you have to watch the fight. And we talked about a little bit about this during the post-fight press conference. You have to watch the fight to really see that he is a better fighter, even than the guy who got first round finishes of like Uriah Hall and Sam Malveen, guys like that. He just looks so mature and so poised and looks so perfectly equipped to deal with this specific opponent. His game planning looked perfect. His approach was perfect from the start after a competitive first round.

It looked like he warshe-abazzing down and took control. So, no, it doesn't change a lot of the major storylines around Derek Brunson's career. but I hope people will actually watch the fight and see like, man, this guy looks, this is as as legit as he's looked as a contender. Yeah, I think you really started to see him turn the corner in the Ian Hinesh fight because obviously this wasn't as big of a fight, not on, like the lights weren't as bright as tonight was on him, but you really got to see how much more improved he's got. Like he wasn't a crazy knockout guy.

He wasn't going to meet in the middle and just throw wild hands like he did in the Robert Whittaker fight. This is a composed guy who had a game plan and stuck to it in one. And we've seen that ever since that. And then tonight he really put it all together. Casey, was this the best Derek Brunson you've ever seen at this point? I can't hear. Casey, I think you're muted.

All right, mute it, mute it, muted, rookie mistake. That's okay. Ben there. What are you? What are you? What are you? What did Alex move? He got dunked on.

Sorry, sorry. I don't know if this is the best Derek Brunson, but this is who Derek Brunson is. He's a very good top 10 middleweight. And I know Derek Brunson thinks otherwise, but I just never see Derek Brunson fighting for the title. I just don't. But I see him up there. And I see him, like I said, when he faced those top guys, the Jacqueray's will never pop up our title.

But, you know, the guys who are just pretty old top five guys, Derek Brunson just can't beat those guys. And Edmund Chabazzian, at this point in time, isn't a top five fighter. He's a very good prospect who beat the crap out of some other decent middleweights. But he just ran to a better fighter tonight and Derek Brunson showed up. And I think he is learning from all those reckless performances he's had in his past. I think he'd match him up with Hermanson and see where he goes. Winner of that. I mean, we got some big fights coming up at 85.

We got the title fight. And then we got Canada versus Whitaker. So there's still some things that need to happen before. the Hermansons or the Brunson's or any of those guys can even sniff a title shot. But I think that's what we do. Next few months, October maybe, we do Brunson versus Hermanson. And if Brunson can have a similar performance and finish Hermanson, then we know, like, okay, we got something here. We're cooking with fire a little bit.

But until then we got to wait and see. But it was a great performance from him tonight. And then Edmund Shabazzian is an interesting place. We're going to talk more about him on onto the next one, which will drop Monday morning on what could be next for him. But we'll touch briefly on admin AK, your thoughts on his performance. And, you know, sometimes it's just like college football. Sometimes if you're like in Alabama and you're winning 63 to nothing every week, sometimes you get to run into an LSU and lose on a last second field goal.

And this may have happened here. You got to you need the loss to refuel you. And maybe that's what happened tonight. So what did you think of Shabazzian and, you know, kind of what his mentality might be. Look, he's obviously a great talent. Okay. I think maybe the marketing was a little over the top. But it's also understandable given how many good hooks he has, 22 years old,

four and O in the UFC, unbeaten in his career, three straight first round finishes, the Ronda Rousey connection, the coach Edmund connection, of course. So there was a lot of good hooks, and I totally understand. And I think he looked good, but for some of the first round. But he really just ran to a guy who knew exactly how to make him uncomfortable. You know, he just got right in his face. He didn't let, he didn't let Shabazenkin into any sort of rhythm. And that frustrated him.

And I think so mentally and physically, when the second round came along, it was really Brunson with a major advantage. So I don't think, I hate to use the word exposes. I hate people say, oh, this guy who's exposed. Brunson's a very good fighter. He has three times the amount of UFC experience as Edmund Chabasian. He's 14 years older than him, which is in this case, I think, is a benefit and not a bad thing. So I don't think this should derail the Shabazzian hype train that much. I think we could easily see him go on another run.

And, you know, as cliche as it sounds, this is one of those situations where a fighter like him will benefit more from this loss and it happening now in the long run. I would agree with that 100%. Some news to share with everybody from Odin Hodak, the manager of Trevin Giles on Twitter, said Trevin Giles will remain at the hospital overnight for further medical evaluation. Thank you to everyone for the thoughts and concerns. So Trevin Giles is going to stick around in the hospital tonight after fainting prior to his scheduled matchup with Kevin Holland, which obviously did not happen tonight. Dana White said it. I confirmed that earlier on the post-fight press conference. Kevin Holland is going to fight next Saturday.

Who he's fighting? We don't know yet. There is no opponent yet for Kevin Holland, but expect to see him compete next Saturday against whom? I don't know. But that's where right right now. So all the best of Trevin Giles, all the best of Joanne Calderwood. We found out that she fainted as well, following her loss to Jennifer Maya. Let me see if I can pull that up real quick, just so I can kind of give you guys the skinny on the Joian Calderwood situation, because that came up really suddenly at the press conference.

But Ariel Hawande from ESPN, quote from her manager, Daniel Rubinstein, she was getting checked out in the medical room and fainted while sitting down. John Wood, her coach and her fiance caught her. They laid her down and carted her out on a stretcher. Her heart rate dropped on the way there, but stabilized now. She's awake now at the hospital. They don't know what caused it yet. So just a crazy, crazy set of circumstances in multiple different ways tonight, especially that.

And we wish all the best two Trevon Giles and Joyne Calderwood. But let's talk about Jennifer Maya and what she did tonight, Alex Keeley, because, wow, comes out of nowhere. Joanne Calderwood is next in line to fight Valentina Shepchenko whenever she's healthy and ready to go. and said, nope, I'm not waiting. I'm going to fight Jennifer Maya instead. And Jennifer Maya made weight, which is huge. And then she went out there and looked fantastic, look great on the feet.

Once that fight hit the ground, Joe, Joe couldn't get anything going. And she ends up submitting Joanne Calderwood via Arm Bar in the first round. And Dana White said at the post-fight press conference, she is going to fight Valentina Shavchenko ASAP, according to Dana. What did you think of Jennifer Meyer's performance? And her chances against someone who many believe is unbeatable at 125 pounds. right now. It's almost unfortunate for Maya that this was a little bit like the main event in which I think Chouinand Calderwood was clearly perceived, I think, by most of the fans and some of us in the media

as well, as the A side, because we've known her for longer. I think she's very much a fan favorite. She was, she is the number one contender. I mean, she was in talk. I don't remember if it was actually scheduled, but she was supposed to fight Shefchenko. That title shot was hers. Ben Chifchenko had an injury. And then, you know, Calderwood said, well, I'm not going to wait around. I'm going to take a fight. So now there was a story going to this fight with should Jojo have done this. And not a lot of talk about like, you know, how good is Maya? Because her results have been a little bit mixed in the UFC. She's missed weight her last two fights.

That's not something people ever like. But Maya is very skilled. She's a former and Vicks champion. And she showed the best version of herself tonight with some very, very sharp boxing. She has legitimate power at 125 pounds. And that ground game was no joke. And she was just consistently beating Calderwood to the punch. You know, save what she wanted.

If Jojo was off, she shouldn't have taken this fight. That doesn't matter because Maya came fully prepared and she looked outstanding in this performance. So she was winning the striking. She won in the ground. She finished in the ground. She's worthy of a title shot. Again, does anyone seem like a worthy challenger to Shepchenko? Probably not right now.

So Maya is as good a name as any, I think. Casey, are you surprised that Dana White pulled the trigger on saying yes for Jennifer Maya? She deserves it. She had a great performance tonight. But like Alex said, she has missed weight a couple of times. missing her last two fights. So when someone says like she has exercised the demons on the scales because she made it once, I'm not necessarily buying that completely. Do it once. Okay, great, good job. Do it twice. All right, we're getting there. Do it three times in a row. All right,

now we're, now we're good to go. You got Cynthia Calvillo who had that win over Jessica I, and we were discussing this right after that win. If they gave Cynthia Calvio the title shot, we'd be like, we wouldn't be that shocked about it. But to immediately commit to Jennifer from Maya. When Dana White normally doesn't do that, it's always like, we're going to get to the meeting on Tuesday, then we'll talk about it. Are you surprised by that? Not at all, because I think usually when we hear about these, when people, like, when the consensus that this person should get a title shot and Dana is kind of like iffy about it, usually it revolves around money. But I don't think Jennifer Meyer is necessarily a very expensive fighter. So I think,

I think her asking price is going to be reasonable to take that championship fight against. and Shefchenko. And yeah, not surprised. And she deserves it. And as far as the weight cut thing, take note. She didn't make just weight. She made a championship weight. And she came in under championship weight.

And I do think that was on purpose. And I've seen Jennifer Mai fight many times in Invicta. And as far as I recall, I don't, I never recall her missing weight in Invicta. So I just think, you know, these things happen. You know, she wanted missing weight. And but even in her losses. in the UFC. Like, I don't know, like, when she lost against Chikagian and Karmouche, it wasn't like she was

blown out of the water. And those are two women who fought for the title, too. So Maya absolutely deserves a title shot. And just poor Jojo, man. She rolled the dice and, um, sucks. And then you run Calvillo versus Lauren Murphy and there you go. Yeah, that sounds great. There you go.

We got one, we got one 25 match made for you. Yeah. All right. We're good to go. Hey, Dana. Why can't Dana, uh, give Al Jermaine Sterling the same courtesy that he gave Jennifer. Though I think Casey,

though I think Casey may have already answered that question. So if anyone wants to answer to that, maybe just go back and review what he said about the reasons why sometimes people don't get named the number one contender right away. Yes, but if you actually watched the post-fight press conference with Dana White after UFC 250, he did say Al Jermaine Sterling was next. What?

He said it. Yes. He said, why is he waffling on it now? Yes, the tune has changed. He has changed not only the tune, but the whole CD, the whole radio station, the presets and everything on this whole situation at 135. It's absolutely bananas. Absolutely bananas. Now we got Garbrad.

They get a drop in at 25. Manel Cape wants to fight Cody Garbage. I love it. So we got a lot of good stuff going on all over. Wow. Cody Garbage. Yes. Hashtag what the heck.

Vicente Lucke got a bonus tonight. Derek Brunson did not get a bonus, by the way. But Vicente Lucay got a bonus. Jennifer May got a bonus and the fight at night went to Bobby Green versus Lando Bonata, aka I know you were very impressed by Vicente Leuke and his finish tonight. Share it with us. Share your enthusiasm for Vicente. Yeah, I mean, I didn't even realize what had happened at first.

I knew it was a clean knee. That was not in question, I think. So people who saw he had or who didn't see, I just say, or just don't recall the finish, he had Randy Brown up against the fence. Randy Brown was kind of punched over almost in that four point, you know, kind of four point position, but not quite. And Lucay recognized that he was somewhat vulnerable to a knee. And before Randy Brown could drop all the way down, Luca kind of got his hands.

I don't know if on his face or kind of on his upper body and his shoulder to keep him from touching the mat, leaving him just a very small window to land a knee. Lucay shot it right in there, right right to the chin. And that was it. And then just a few follow-up shots. It was over. So you don't see that kind of wherewithal, that kind of forethought. I just say, I'm sorry, that kind of forethought very often, especially in a moment like that,

where you get it wrong, you're getting a point taken or disqualified. But Luque is the elite of the elite when it comes to finishing fights. And only guys with that kind of ability can find a finish in that situation. So that was, I don't know if it was more deserving of a bonus than Brunson, but it was a very, very good finish. Yeah, I think with especially with all the fight cancellations, they all should have got a bonus. All of them. Bronson, Maya, Luque, then the fight of the night. And if Jonathan Martinez had made weight, he should have got a bonus as well. Yeah, what are they doing with this money that they're saving exactly?

So can I just jump to this, Michael? I'm a little disgruntled. Sure. I would love to. Me too. So our own Stephen Morocco tweeted this out and there were other reports, but our own Steve Morocco wrote that he just heard Dana White personally called Ed Herman. Oh, sorry, this is the wrong thing.

This is another topic. But Stephen Morocco also mentioned that from the press conference that the fighters got, who didn't fight tonight because of various reasons, got some. money, but not all of their money. Now, first I'll say, obviously, the plan I imagine would be to reschedule these fighters as quickly as possible. That's usually the justification that Dana White and the UFC gives for why they might not pay someone their full pay. Like, oh, we'll get them another fight in a couple of weeks. But I just don't understand they did their job. They did with everything they were required to do, like Kevin Holland. He did everything he was required to do

for his fight tonight. Pay the man his show money. That's what I would say if I was Kevin Holland. F you, pay me a mother effort, and book me another fight next weekend and pay me again. You can afford it. The UFC can afford it people. I'm sorry. I know, I know that we live in this world where people say, oh, you should have to, you got to earn, you know, you got to earn your pay. But these people, you're right, you got to earn your win money.

But your show money, most of these fighters did that. Kevin Holland showed up and weighed in. Ed Herman showed up and weighed in. Pay these people. This is ridiculous. Okay. Casey, I know you forgot some things to say, but I'm going to play devil's advocate here before we go to you because the question that was asked to Dana Way of the press conference

was will Kevin Holland get his win money? And Dana said he's going to get, no, he's going to get some money and then we're going to turn him around. So I don't think the word show money came out. He did say show money. He said, he said they won't be. He says it's not their show money. Oh, he did say that. Okay. Because I know the question was win money. I heard some money. I didn't hear whether or not it were show money. Yeah. In the very end, he did say show money. So I'm that they won't get show money. They were not. Oh, wow.

I'm pretty confident. So devil's advocate, gone. But either way, I just, I just think it's, like even the guys who, like Mirchart, guys who made weight that everything you're supposed to do, these, they can't. We're living in, we're living in a pandemic era. Like, can you imagine, like, if these NBA players or MLB players, like, they, if they get the virus, they still get paid. You know, I just, I just feel bad for these guys because this is completely out of their control.

Like, Mirchart probably got it in the bubble because he, because when they arrive to Vegas, they get tested, then they get tested way in day, then they get tested on the fight day. So in between then and then, somehow he got it. So does that mean he got it in the bubble? You know, in the little UFC fight week bubble. So, I mean, it's, guys, you need to freaking get some sort of, you know, unionize or something and figure out like, because this is going to be a big issue for until this pandemic is done with, which I feel like we're going to have another year of this maybe.

I don't know, who knows, but that's another issue. But these guys need to get paid. And I just think it's really unfair that a lot of these guys aren't getting paid. And you know what? In the UFC, by contract or whatever, yeah, they don't have to pay them. That's on them. But not having to and what you should do is something different. Yeah, I mean, I would agree with,

with both of you guys. I just don't know. We don't really know. Like, really. Like what he said, like we don't know if like maybe Dana offer them be like, like maybe Mirschott's probably like a different story altogether because he's not

going to be fighting anytime soon. But maybe he like went to Holland and maybe went to Herman and Perez and said, listen, we'll give you the choice. I'll give you some money now and you can fight next Saturday and get a chance to get your win money too and you'll get this. Or you can just take your show money and go home and you can fight later. But they should,

but they shouldn't have to choose though. That thing is it. I agree with you. I agree with you. Yeah. This is the pandemic world we're in. I'll read the other thing I was reading up before back to that Steve that Morocco said, just because we're talking to the whole time when these fights were canceled,

that Ed Herman was supposedly, was supposedly they want to see if they could make, because Ed Herman lost his opponent. He lost Gerald Mirr's shirt as an opponent. And Kevin Holland lost Trevin Giles. So apparently Dana White did call Ed Herman and asked him if you could take the fight. And Herman, as Steve Morocco already had drinks in hand. and was out of the bubble, so to speak, so no dice. So that would be, that was kind of weird.

Again, weird really sums up everything that's happened in the last 48 hours. Yeah, because that's what? Like, once we found out, because Holland and Giles was supposed to be the first, first fight on the main card. So by the time we found out that Mirchard was out, that was what, at like 5.30 Eastern time, that's like three and a half hours. And no fighter on earth could be like, oh, maybe someone will faint and I'll have the opportunity to fight. So Ed Herman was probably like, get me a beer, give me an ice cold Herman Weiser.

I'm going to suck that thing down and give me another one. There is one guy, Hamzat Shemayev. It's the kind of guy who would just immediately go back to the locker room, I feel like, and just sit down and watch the monitors and be like, just wait, just tell me. Just let me know. Just let me know. Yeah, just let me know. Because he definitely, that's crazy.

What's crazy is I feel like if he was, if this is something that has happened last week, I don't think the commission would have allowed it, but he would have been jumping at the chance to fight Kevin Holland or something like that. So it's crazy. That'd be a fun fight. Hey, yeah, but I want to give the UFC, Dana, some credit, though. The fact that they did try to get Herman that fight, and, like, can you imagine the UFC booked a high-level UFC fight

in, like, in 15 minutes or something like that? It was like, I'd be all for it. I'd be all for it. I'd be all for. That would be taken to the next level from our expectations of UFC filling in fights. But unfortunately, yeah, Ed Herman, decided a part oh, you know, you said the story. I texted, I texted Holland's manager and I said, I said, all I have to say to you is

this, please make this happen. Please make this happen. And then he goes, no, Herman's already had beers, I'm told. So he won't be fighting tonight. I'm like, oh, man, that would have been amazing. Oh my God, that's Ed Herman's music. Where did this come from? And that's Kevin Holland's music.

Holy shit. Unreal. And look, Gilbert Burns was in the building. He's probably around 185 right now. You can throw them in there. I was waiting for James Krause's music to head. Because I know he threw his name out there. He goes, hmm, I think somebody needs a middleweight.

You know what? If the world goes even more wacky as it are than it already is, I can see in a couple months where the UFC just calls about 30 fighters. Hey, guys, stay in shape. And in the night of the fight, we just find out who's fighting by the music, you know? Yeah. It'd be so exciting. Like Battle Bowl, like Starkey Battle Bowl.

You're just sitting in the back and they pull names. They wheel the thing up and they start pulling names up and then he came down and fight. I love that idea. And you definitely throw Habib and Tony's name in there just in case. Because maybe that's the only way that fight happens, you know? I mean, I'm being quarter serious in the sense that,

I mean, this whole card, how many of these fights actually the fighters had a traditional fight camp? You know, give it like three weeks, four weeks. I mean, I'm not even, you know what I mean? Like, both sides, A side and the B side, both had a traditional, both sides. Yeah.

A traditional, you know, four-week fight camp. And it's probably just the main event. And look, this was as close as you guys were talking about to literally just having guys just jump in.

I mean, again, we had Vincent Gacero, essentially one day's notice. Johnny Munoz, essentially one day's notice. Charles Antevaros was going to jump in and fight Marcus Perez, but for whatever reason was not cleared by the commission.

I think probably couldn't make, probably couldn't make the wait safely. So that was three people who were about to fight. on one day's notice. So this whole random draw idea is not that crazy, actually, given what we just saw. I love it. I mean, you're shaking things up.

Even Sarah Kaufman, when in our interview of her on A side, she said, well, part of the reason why I'm in Vegas helping up Jojo's camp is because I'm on weight right now. So I can fill in for any 45 or 35 fight. So, I mean, like, so fighters are obviously, this is out there. They're thinking this, you know, so managers are, Like, if you're just a fighter sitting around looking for a contract, try to be within, you know, yeah, just start hitting the treadmill right now. Gerald Harris said he's going out to Vegas next week and he's going to be ready. The Terry Funk of MMA?

By the way, Sarah Kaufman also said that she does not drink milk and that she hates milk. So we should take things that Sarah Kaufman says with a grain of salt, okay? Shout out. YouTube comments. Shout out all my milk lovers out. All right, just leave a comment if you like milk or if you can find the milk emoji. Throw that one in there. Milk rules.

Kurt Angle of MMA fighting. Alex, yeah, 100%. Drink your milk, everyone. Can I just say that I think the MVP of the night was Bobby Green? He was awesome. Performance was great. The Triple H spit out the water after his name was announced. Like he knew it was coming and it's spent it out in a COVID thing.

Yeah, mid-COVID, by the way. The cameraman got 90% of that water. Toast. And the post-fight interview was tremendous, too. Bobby Green is slowly becoming one of my, like, favorite fighters to keep an eye on after these last two performances and everything that happened. That fight with Landau was great.

But Bobby Green, my MVP, second place, Gilbert Burns, gets a corner victory. It gets a, A-plus translation tonight for Jennifer Maya. Did great. I had a third one, too. I forgot who my third one was. Maybe Brandon Fitzgerald for his amazing different statements every time there was a low blow tonight. Oh.

And there were so many. There were so many. Ten low blows. How did eight fights? The UFC has changed so much over the years. Like, we had 10 low blows tonight. And I didn't hear one mention of Diamond Cup. No, one mention.

We actually had a point taken away for a low blow. What was the last time you've seen that? One point out of 10 low blows. Think about that. 10 low blows and there was one time it was penalized. So fighters, I hate to keep saying it. But Jen Michoud and I always preach this. But fighters out there take note of what you can get away with.

Okay, there was 10 low blows in this card and only one point got taken away. So we're just saying. Yep. I pokes, fence grabs, only one point. Use the holy trinity of fouls, okay? Yes. I say we go to the peeps now. I mean, there's some other great performances.

Well, I want to shout out Sandy Fam first fall who said milk, yay, even though she's lactose intolerance. So that's how dope milk is, all right? That's how sick milk is. Let's see what the Bates have to say. I'm sure there's tons of milk questions. There we go. There you go. You're on the screen, Sandy.

Three cups, three glasses of milk. Respect, respect. All right, let me queue up. We had lots of questions before. We're all over the place. A people's post fight, shall, ladies and gentlemen. There we go.

What about Jessica I versus Jessica Androge at 125 and Holly versus Arrini Aldana from Joseph Boza? So if you hadn't heard, Jessica I versus Jessica Androge is going to happen.

This fight is happening. They're going to give Jessica another shot of 25. Hopefully she can make the wait. And, you know, welcome back. You get to fight Jessica and Drudge, Jessica I.

What do you think of this fight, AK? I mean, I love it. Like, I think it was always kind of, well, not weird because it was her only option at the time. Jessica Andraves going from 135 down to 115 because there was no 125. So even though she was, you know, she was so, so good at 1 15, you know, a world title winner, there was always that kind of thought like, man, could you do 125 too? Because she won fights at 135. She won fights at 115, obviously.

So why not? Why not in between? And she's perfect for Jessica, I, because I has had some uneventful fights. to put it nicely. She's not always a fight of the night contender. And And Andraj, kind of on the other side, I don't know if Andraj has been in a boring fight maybe early in her career, I'm forgetting, but

she's always, always an exciting fight. So I think you put her in there with I think it's a good mix of styles and I think you'll get the best out of both of them. So yeah, I really like that matchup. Casey, Holly versus Arina Aldana. I think that's the fight that needs to happen at this point. Maybe October. I think that's being targeted. this point? Are you happy with this fight? Or should the UFC shuffle the deck like tonight's

theme? I do not like that fight. I'm like with Jose Young, so he's saying a lot. It just hate that, a Holly Arena fight because I think Arena has already earned that title shot. But unfortunately, due with Amanda Nunes, or her wife having a child very soon, is she taking a break? As Manonan Nunes kind of even publicly said, is she just taking a break right now? Do we know? she's talked about maybe retiring she hasn't like actually said i'm definitely out but i could retire i've done everything i need to do in the sport so i mean i would say if a fight excites her she'll come back yeah so um maybe uh yeah because i don't i mean to me like arena would have to just steam roll holly to i guess to excite am an an anuna's to come back so um i mean it's a fight

i don't i'm i'm excited about the actual fight itself but as far as the title implications I just think it's unnecessary. But Jessica I versus Jessica Androge, freaking rules. I love that fight. And I want to see Jessica and Drodge not doing the big wake at the 115. Let's see, maybe it was, because remember, she went from 135 straight to 115. She's, I think at the time. 20 pounds.

I think at the time, there was no flyweight division, right, when she did the drop. Yeah. So that was insane. And remember at 35, she was still like a decent top 10, borderline top 10, 35er. So I'm very excited by that. Um, good luck, Jessica I. Yeah, I'm down. I'm down for both at this point.

Let's just, let's just see him play out. And then we'll go from there. What else we got? Do, do, do, do, do. No, this fight, uh, Bobby Green versus Bryce Mitchell. Sorry, that doesn't make any sense. Bob Green's 55 or anyways. Yeah, yeah.

You know what this is about? I don't even know what this question is. What about the fight that the bell, went off three seconds before the time ran out. Yeah, I don't remember that. I didn't see that. No, I wonder. I don't know where Gerardo Granados was watching this fight from.

He could have been watching a different channel, maybe not ESPN Plus, maybe I didn't know the country. Because sometimes the on-screen timer, I wonder if they use a different one sometimes. And it's different from what we're necessarily seeing, what's the fighters, I'm sorry, are necessarily seeing and hearing in the, you know, in the actual venue. So I did not, I know I watched up in Canada on TSN and you guys were watching ESPN Plus. I don't recall seeing this happen. So Gerardo, if you want to clarify in the YouTube comments, please do.

But we didn't see, no, we didn't see that. I think the weirdest one of those that I've ever seen was I was covering a Bellator card. And Lindsay Van Zant was fighting somebody. And the horn went off with like 90 seconds left and around, like during the Bellator card. And like both women like stopped and the referee was like, what are you doing? Like the freaking horn went off. No, no, no, no. Keep going.

Keep going. Keep going. So that was a crazy one. Bronson versus Gastilum from Michael Panza. I will start with this one. Don't hate the idea. If they booked it, I would be okay with it. But I think Bronson deserves somebody a little higher on the pole right now if we're, if we're being honest.

I think the Hermanson fight makes, makes all the sense of the world. I thought most people thought if Shabazzian won, it would be. be the Hermanson fight, especially after the Whitaker Canada or fight got booked. So I think Brunson deserves the same thing after that performance. And I think you get a top five, top six matchup and see where he is. Is he the guy that can get over the hump? Can he get that one step closer to a title shot? You put him in those kinds of matchups.

And I think him and Hermantz would be a really good fight. So that's what I think. Your thoughts. Casey, we'll start with you. Brunson versus Gasolam. I don't love this one. I think Gasolam. No, Brenton's, if Brunson defeats Gasol him, it really doesn't do anything for Derek Brunton to me.

So, obviously, Kelvin probably won that fight because that will put him back up there. But for Derek, I think, I just don't think it's a smart fight career-wise for him. Okay. Yeah, I mean, look, I was, I wasn't sure what to do with Brunson if he won, you know, heading into this. But as we learned recently that, that's right, Whitaker will is now occupied. And I thought that the winner of the Whitaker-Till fight was the logical matchup for Hermanson. But now that's off the table, I guess we do have to kind of go with Brunson and Hermanson. But I like to know Hermanson's elaborate plan to have cannoneer not fight Whitaker, but instead get the title fight against the Coast Adisina winner.

But that's not on the card. So yeah, either Brunson, Hermanson or Brunson rematches the winner of Uriah Hall, U.L. Romero. More so if Romero wins. I don't know if him rematching Uriah Hall makes sense. If Romero beats Uriah Hall, I wouldn't mind seeing Brunson run that back and kind of get another shot. Because he actually did very well in that first fight before classic third round Romero showed up. No, no, no, but what happened?

It wasn't third round Romero. Do you remember it was all the nutshots? Remember he got, he got... Dude, what... I should have remembered. Rewatch Brunson Romero. That fight completely changed when Brunson, you know, got hay-hade, you know, so

So actually, you know what? Yeah, Romero does win. I would absolutely love to see Brunson-Romero rematch. I think that would be awesome. He deserves him to the crack out of him. No. Oh, whoa, get out of here. We already talked about this.

Darren Till versus the winner, you're O'O. Romero versus your eye-all. That's the fight to make. And then, Calvin, I'll tell you what, if Omariag-Metoff beats Chris Wyden next week, that's the fight for Calvin Gasolum. You're welcome, world. Uh, Jermaine King, what does Shabazi need to work on after this loss?

Everything. Okay, I'll start with you. Everything. And that's not in a harsh way. He's 22 years old. Yeah. He's 22 years old. I think you take a 22 year old fighter and like try to find one thing like, oh, he

needs to work on take down defense or cardio or striking defense or just, you know, defense in general. He's 22. He needs to work on everything because the tools are there. Like we said, the kind of, the kind of accuracy he has with the strikes, his grappling skills, he's already very advanced in that. But, I mean, I think we saw it tonight. Again, you run into someone who's just a little more poised than you, a little bit more experienced with certain situations.

And this is what happens. You're going to lose fights. So Brunson is the better fighter at this stage of their career. This was no fluke. And that's fine. Again, like I mentioned before, he has three times as much UFC experience. He's 14 years older than Edmond Shabazian. So really, he's got to work on everything.

I know that's kind of a boring answer. But it's true. There's really no one aspect. no one weakness I thought he showed tonight. He just got he just met a better fighter. Casey, how much blame is the MMA space going to give to Tarverdian after this fight? Because you know, after the whole Ronda thing, he was getting crapped on for a while, even when Shabazzian kept winning fights. And there was always like a scapegoat needed. Tarverting just always seemed to be the easiest target. And it seems like he was starting to get a little more aspect, as they

say these days. But how much blame do you think he's got to get for this? And he shouldn't get any by the way it's just like Alex said he's a 22 year old kid that he's still getting he's not even near his athletic prime yet the blame he gets will be unfair it would just be basically just trolls being trolls that's that's it I mean at what what Tervarian did do he found this kid who came into his gym when he was 12 or 13 or something and by in 10 years he made him an A-level elite middleweight fighter fighting in the UFC main eventing a card that is an incredible incredible accomplishment for a coach. So, no, everything, the treatment he gets is unfair.

Now, what happens after this, though, that might be a different story. Let's see how he handles this loss. Because, of course, I mean, if you ask, I mean, we're now just going back a little bit. But, you know, after Rhonda, of course, lost to Holly, we were, as far as we know, when we talked to other coaches and things like that, nothing really changed with Holly's camp or anything when she when she kind of took the break to fight manna nunes was there any chance that she had now how good we know mananunas was i don't know if ronda couldn't have done anything better for that fight but um it's i think uh for shabasian let's see how his next two

fights are um before really judge um his coaches but so far they've done an amazing job yeah give him a give him a decent name at 85 someone I'm not going to say beatable because there's, I mean, there's only tough fights at 85 at this point. So don't be throwing him in there with Hasmat Shamaev or anybody like that. Give him a fun fight at 85 against, you know, a decent name, you know, a mere shard or something like that. Like, I'm fine with that. Yeah. Yeah.

It is what it is. Yeah, I think Shabazi, I think he has a, the UFC isn't going to have a tough time trying to find the right fight for him. But I'm really, I'm really curious, though, is how much the UFC. promotional machine is now going to be with them because I mean because right now they were really just like with um oh what's the young uh the young lady that lost uh Roxanne but Macy Barber just like Macy Barber they were selling the whole youngest champ ever youngest champ ever as soon as they start putting those graphics on the screen they lose their next fight you know so that's out the window now so I mean I it's very very unlikely that Shabasian will have an opportunity to become the youngest champ now so uh yeah that's

A lot of question marks, though, how his future is going to be. Yeah, bouncing back from your first loss, that tells the story for sure. What else we got? We got lots of stuff. Casey, did you see that question from Nick Bergen? Oh, I just had it. I just had it. Okay.

Well, all right, Nick. I know Nick has been waiting, loyally waiting to have his question answered. Not sure if you guys saw this, I'd like your take. Borg has now missed weight four times and plod out of nine fights. What does the UFC do with him? Interesting question. I don't, there have been rumors swirling, and I cannot confirm this, but this is, you guys may have heard this rumor as well, that Ray Borg may have been released from the UFC. Now, I'm not saying this is fact.

I'm saying these are rumors that are swirling around right now. And listen, Ray Borg has gone through a lot. And as a father myself, I cannot imagine what this man has gone through over the last few years with his son. everything that has happened. I don't even know how he even focuses on fighting with everything going on. So something happens with his kid and there's a phone call that, listen, you know, he's sick. He's going back to the hospital or something's not right. My ass is getting back on a plane and I'm going home to check on my son.

So we don't know why he pulled out of this fight. We don't know what happened. But I know that's what happened the last time. It was a family emergency you needed to go home. Family comes first. And I totally understand where he's coming from. However, we're in a situation where it's like, you know, you got to fight, bro. Like, you just got to find a way to get in there and fight.

So I understand both sides. So, AK, what does the UFC do with Ray Borg now? Yeah, again, I'm not sure about the veracity of the rumors that he's already been released. And I won't say that I think it's like the, I won't vilify the UFC for doing that. This is a business, right? Again, and I don't think if they did it, I don't think it's any indictment on, again, and how he sort of handled his personal life. He's got to do what he's got to do.

But at the same time, the company has to do what they've got to do. But for me, I think it'd be, I just don't, I wouldn't release him if it were up to me. Man, it just might be bad luck. You know, for people who don't know, of course, you mentioned issues with his son. His son is a brain condition. And he revealed his last fight, which he withdrew from against Marabbaas, really. He revealed pretty sure, I think within two days or within a day, he kind of updated people on social media saying he did have to go home to sort of address something that going on with the sun.

Thankfully, it turned out to be nothing serious. So that was great news. This time, again, we're sort of still waiting to hear from Ray. And again, he is under no obligation to let us know what the situation is, especially if it is something to do with his son's health. But again, I understand why people would be more frustrated now, given that again, the second fight this year that he has withdrawn. And if you look at just at his schedule, you can go to Tapology and they keep a nice record

of it, there's a long list of canceled votes. if you go back to 2018, he's had way more canceled fights than he has had actual fights. So for the UFC, again, I don't think it's, it's, I wouldn't release him, but I don't blame them for doing so. I just don't think they should. I think he's still a talented fighter. And I, and we really just don't know how many of these things are out of his control. You know, we really don't. But again, I'm the same person that keeps saying that they should, they should book Habib versus Ferguson as many times as they can't until it happens.

because, you know, again, there's circumstances outside of people's control. It sounds like that's what's happening to Ray Borg a lot. So I say keep them around. But, yeah, it's in the eyes of the fans, he unfortunately is getting a reputation as someone who just doesn't fight, which is why, which for fair or not is one of the worst things you can be labeled in MMA. Real quick, and I'll let Casey respond to this. Edmund Shabazzian has released his first comments since the loss to Derek Brunson. Said, I'm okay, everyone. Just need some stitches.

Thank you for all your messages. Love you all. Congrats to Derek Brunson tonight. Did a great job. No excuses. It's the fight game. And I'll be back. Bless to have the support I have from everyone.

That was from like a minute ago on Instagram from Edmund Shabazzian. So Casey, Ray Borg, your thoughts? What can the UFC do at this point? This is hard to comment on because there's just a lot of unknowns, to be honest. True. Just a little too many unknowns. I think anyone to give a real solid opinion on it. But I'm assuming.

the UFC has had they've sat down with him and like hey like what's going on you know is it is it is simply your child's health because if it's about that I mean this is you need to fight you got to that's how you make your money you know so it's a it's not a good situation and um I hope the UFC handles it with maturity and um I just hope it gets um because Ray Borg he he's an excellent fighter he's he really is an excellent fighter and um it's just um It's just, everything's just unfortunate for whoever's booked against Ray Borg. But if you are booked against Ray Borg, chances are you're not finding Ray Borg. That's all I got, that's all I know right now.

You got hosed out of a bonus with that Ricky Simone fight. That was the fight of the night. Yeah. Jacksonville cart, by the way. It's probably still bad about that. Yeah, but it sounds like there's something else going on behind the scenes between the UFC and Borg that we just don't know about. because things don't make sense. So it's just to me, just to me,

to me missing, too much missing information. Got, okay. Credit, credit to the matchmakers for being able to find Johnny Munoz to replace Ray Borg and fight Nate Maness, I'm sorry. And Manus did get his first UFC wins. So like Casey said, is unfortunate that Manus, you know, maybe should have known that he would not end up fighting Ray Borg, but at least he did get a fight and got his first U.S.

win and win bonus. So somewhat of a happy ending for Manus, but yeah, the Raybivor situation is so murky. And whatever is going on with him, you know, of course, obviously, I wish him the best and hope it is nothing, no more issues with his son. But yeah, he's whatever's going on has put the UFs in a tough spot. Yeah, how about Johnny Munoz still in the third round on a day's notice, still hoisting Nathan Manus up in the sky and slamming him to the ground in the third round. That guy is a legit prospect at 35.

Manus is two. So very excited to see what happens for both those guys. Manus, that's a tough fight to look good on. Because when you look back of this card, you're like, oh, yeah, Nathan Manus won. But you're not going to remember much from it just because of how Munoz is and his style. And he's just all over you. It's hard to look good against him.

So thank you, Dick, for the question. What else we got? What's next for Bobby Green? Ooh. Casey, I'm going to give you this question. Because me and AK can't really answer this right now. We have to ponder this. I'll throw something out there in a minute.

But I'll do a little onto the next one tease. I can do a lot of the next one tease. A little tease. Oh, I was going to let Casey go first still. Yeah, man, I'm trying. You know what? Yeah, I feel like I need a list. I don't know.

I wasn't ready for this. I'll throw some names out there. I'll throw some names out there. All right, here's what I got for you guys. And this is, by the way, I think most of these guys don't have fights booked. If they do, then I, obviously, I, I retract these suggestions, but Scott Holtzman.

Scott Holtzman is fighting Benal Daryoush. Is he? Next weekend. That's a good, that's a good fight. That's a good fight. Wait, you just went from Bobby Greenger by Scott Holtzman. They're like, hey, Scott Holtzman, that's pretty good fight.

If you, I could not name, what's, what's next week's headliner? Derek Lewis. That's Lewis and Olinnic. That's next week? Yes. I swear that's got... In that tiny cage.

In that tiny cage. Didn't that not just get like finalized like officially announced like four days ago? Am I crazy? Yeah, but we knew it was happening. Yeah, I know. But man, this is wild how fights are coming now. Okay, well, that's great. I should be more excited now because I've been wanting,

I've been wanting that fight since Olinic last fight. So I don't know why I forgot. But again, that kind of shows you how rapidly the cards are coming, how quickly they're coming together. How about Drew Doe. Because Drew Dober is obviously That's a good pick

But what happened To Gregor Gillespie? Did he ever wake up? Did he ask I mean where is he? Like he was on such a role And And I

And I The way Bobby Green Looked against Clay Gwita I'm interested to see Bobby Green go against Gregor Gillespie And even a higher level wrestler So by it

Top 10 guy Top 10 guy for Bobby Green Why not? man, come on. He's been around. Well, Dober's, well, okay, never mind. I'm looking at a,

I'm looking at a different ranking. Does Gillespie have, does he have a fight? Like, what happened to him? No idea. Still recovering, I guess. You know, just taking his to fishing. He's gone fishing.

Literally, literally gone fishing. You know, we say that about people sometimes like, oh, they've just been away for a while. He's probably literally just enjoying fishing. How about Green versus Fizve? Oh. There'd be so much. There'd be so much fainting and dodging and shit-talking.

Be like a, like a kung fu-foo movie. I think, I almost feel like we, we have a lot. I think that's, I mean, for these against any striker, it's going to be incredible. But I think Bobby Green, especially, their personalities and different, and Bobby Green is unorthodox striking. Yeah, I like that fight. I mean, like, I mean, the really only things that make sense, like, I would say, like, him and your car closer, probably like right around the same ranking. And they've already fought.

And they're like buddies now. And they train together. So that can't happen again. Surukian? No. You already know how I feel about Surukian. I love Sweden. I want Jim Miller.

I want Zerukin versus Jeter. Yeah. Yeah. That makes that makes, if you're going to have him fight a veteran, I think that makes. That's like a Brad Reddell. Brad Riddell. I don't know. Hernandez.

Dan Hooker? No, that's too far. That's too far. Bobby Green's in that weird spot where like he's been around for so long. This was his 37th pro fight tonight. And I think his 14th UFC fight. And you really feel like 13th, I'm sorry. And you really feel like he'd be competitive against almost anyone.

You know, he just has that kind of game. And he's just been around so long. I'm not saying I would pick him to beat anyone in the top 10. And he's fought something. He fought what, Porre already. But I feel like, again, you throw him in there with, I think he's like a Gillespie, a guy like Paul Felder, who I know is not going to take that fight now. He only wants a big, big name, bigger.

name fights, but I absolutely think that Bobby Green could put on a competitive, like, three or five-round fight against Paul Feldor. He definitely could. So he is a little bit difficult to matchmake for at this point. O'Higin's son, Alexander Hernandez versus Bobby Green. I think Hernandez is, oh, he lost his last one, but he is still, he is still ranked, I would think, ranked higher than Bobby Green. I haven't ranked higher than Bobby Green personally. So it's not much. Yeah, it's not, it's like kind of a cluster of the outside the top of Dean from like 16 to like 30 this kind of a cluster they're all interchangeable

a little bit a little bit it's really hard to separate them at that point if you're going to give bobby a top 15 guy i think gillespie's probably the only one that makes sense right now i'd like to see green against anybody especially the way he's looked in his last couple of fights he looked awesome tonight he looked fantastic he's got a story that i want to hear more of no doubt about that he's always got a story

if anyone's ever interviewed bobby green or listened to a bobby green he's got a lot of stories i am working on that for what the heck already. Try. There's a little tease, but Alex Hernandez versus Lando, though. I kind of like that too.

Yeah. I like Lando versus Comma worthy. I think that's a great fight. That's a good fight also. Lightweight is so good. Lightweight is so good. I can talk out random names. Like, awesome fight.

You're great. That's genius. Bobby Green has been fighting for 12 years. 37 fights and 12 years. This man has really seen it all. Yeah. I forget. I have an awesome Bobby Green story.

When he fought an affliction, I cannot remember who he fought. I'm looking now. He fought Dan, Dan LaZan. That's what, it's Dan Lazon. Yes. And I think that fight ended in nutshots, too. Or, like, it was like, it was incredible about nutshots. But what happened was Bobby Green got so excited waiting in the tunnel.

He just ran, like, you know, they kind of, they get the guys ready, and then they play the music and they go. But I think they played some, like, just kind of generic DJ music, and he kind of assumed. do it was his music. So he just runs out to the ring and just like high-fiving everybody, you know, and all the camera guys and directors like, no, we're like, we're in commercial break. We're not even like doing, like, he's like by the ring, like taking his shirt off. Like, so he had to walk back to the tunnel. And they do it all again. He did, and he came out and did the same exact thing even bigger. I was like, I didn't know who he was at the time. I was like, that man's amazing. That is great. And then he heard that black,

you heard that black hole sun remix. He said to get out there. So, yeah, I've always been a big, big fan of Bobby Green. That was a crazy man. Bobby Green versus Kevin Lee would be a lot of fun, too. Is Kevin Lee? Oh, look right. Yeah, someone. Fizzie versus Bobby Green.

John G knows what's up. He knows. Yeah. That's, okay, let me find another question. I missed this tonight, but I saw people talking about it. Was this on the promo? Do you think Derek Lewis was calling? Alexei Olinic, Alexis on purpose, or he just didn't know how to pronounce his name,

L.O.L. Definitely didn't know. I'm going with that. If you ever listen to like Derek Lewis's interviews and stuff, like he knows the bare minimum about the UFC in general, not just like the guys he's fighting. Like especially like a guy like Olinic, he just knows like, yeah, he's good at submissions. But that's probably like the only thing he knows about him. He doesn't watch fights.

He doesn't watch fights. When Rampage called Fabio Malzanoi, Mababobo or something. And it's like, he just doesn't know. He just, I don't know. I don't think it's some sort of like sly trash talk. It's like, no, I just don't, I don't really don't know who the service is. I've always, yeah, sorry.

He fought Shamil Abdurrahimov in his, in his first main event in Albany, New York. That was the first UFC event I ever covered. And when you asked Derek Lewis about his opponent, he goes, I have no idea who he is. Like, I don't know, I can't pronounce his name. I'm not even going to try to pronounce his name. I don't even know who I'm fighting. I won't know who he is until I don't know who I'm fighting. until I actually stare like look at him after the way and Samar that'll be the first time I've

seen anything or know anything about him and that's what I knew Derek Lewis is my guy he literally watches no fights he is just the only thing he cares about an MAA is training and fighting other than that he's not sitting at home watching all these cards like what have you last seen Derek Lewis tweet about a UFC card I can't remember do you want to read that no please go ahead I'm not a reader. From adamant movies on YouTube. I'll read this with an accent to class it up a little bit. Derek just honestly cannot pronounce Alexi's name, L.O.L.

He is not selling. But I guess he'll just vol with his. Like the balls was hot moment. That was Alex Lee reads a classy tweet. There you go. Well done. M.A fighting. Was that a preview of a new podcast?

It's a new character I'm working on. All right. I'm just workshopping. I like to use these shows to workshop things. You know, but like Derek Lewis, though, I really, I enjoy it. I love his, no, he, you know, he messes with the media. He just, just for his own laughs. But like what Mike said, he actually, he isn't a fan of MMA.

He doesn't watch the sport. It's just, it's, and he's very upfront about this. This is literally a job for him. Like, he doesn't care about the fans. In that sense, you know, I do it for the fans. And he likes fans and stuff, but this is strictly a job for him. This is a paycheck. This is how he pays his bills.

It's how he feeds his kids. And he doesn't care about that stuff. So he absolutely has no idea who his opponent is other than this guy that chokes people. And he's like one of the best guys to interview. His interviews are so funny. But I think out of all fighters, he might hate doing media more than any other one. Like he hates doing media. He's not doing any media for this fight, by the last.

And I think he's fairly savvy about his image as well. Like I think he's genuine. But I also think he's very aware of sort of the, the persona that he that he projects and he doesn't care you know he doesn't care he doesn't care people think like oh oh he's a bit like again he just he's not pronounced people's names right you know he doesn't care he's he's he's uh very upfront about how he is and i would say i would the only thing i would add is i think he does also enjoy fighting i bet he actually enjoys the in cage part of it the fighting but yeah all the all the all the bs surrounding it all the all the stuff the crap that we

that we bring into the sport uh he has no i don't think he has any interest in that and that's fine again that's kind of what's so cool about him my fans like him so much yeah he is as real as it gets. Like, he is who he is and that's it. He's not like Colby calling Tyrone Woodley Tyrone. Tyrone Woodley. Yeah. Like Colby's obviously doing it on purpose.

Yes. Cente Lucke. See, here's Vicente Luque should he get a top 10? I think if there's, I think the guy we're going to have the hardest time matchmaking AK on onto the next one is Vicente Luque. Yeah, because look, if you love watching Vicente Luque fight, you kind of don't care who he fights. You just want to see Vicente Lucay do his thing. Now, at some point, of course, a guy has to go from being a highlight generator to a, well, I don't think they do, but I think for a lot

of fans, that's the case, you know, like a Donald Seroni, you know, and Donald Seroni, that guy could have just could have exciting fights forever, but every, what, two, three, or four fights, they say, oh, let's throw him soron with a top 10 guy and see what happens. And, you know, he usually doesn't make it over that hump, but people still want to see it. I personally don't care. Lucay is, what, 27? So he's kind of right approaching that sweet spot of his athletic prime. Is he 27, 27, 28, something like that. I know he's actually younger than Randy Brown. And I will like to just see him taking care of business against almost anyone in the top 20.

But again, given how good he is, and if you're a fan, I totally understand the urge to see him tested against the top 10 again. So he had the one fight with Wonderboy, which was competitive, but didn't go his way. So should he get a top 10? I actually am in agreement with Joseph Boza. Yes, I need to think of a name, but I do think if someone is free, I do think he should get a top 10 upon. honestly like it's damia maya if there's anybody in the top 10 but i think dami maya already like knows where he wants to go with this he wants deigo sanchise i think the only thing that makes sense is he gets the winner of jeff neal versus neal magni i think that's like that's all you

can do really i'm sorry which fight i was like which fight what are we calling this fight go ahead no no no kneel on neal neal on neal neal on neal i'm sorry i was like which fight i'm not i i'm Neil, all right, the upcoming Neil on Neal on Neal fight. The upcoming Neil on Neal, who wins the Neil on Neal fight. That's who we said to the gay fights next. Thank you. What's Michael Kiesa up to? Is he injured?

Surgery. So he's out for a while? He'll be out for a little bit. What about a man who's on a three-fight losing streak? One, Mr. Robbie Lawler. Is that too much violence? Is that, will the commission not sanctioned that fight? The question is, I think, is Robby Lawler and that kind of Damien Mayer?

era in his career where he's just going to be taking fights that are really big fights in a sense or fights he really wants because I don't necessarily Loller wants to fight Luka. He probably would if it was a different point of his career. But yeah, just

if we can make it happen, that would be freaking awesome. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, that's kind of, I don't know. I mean, that's a good one too. But yeah. Shemaiah. time fight.

Shamiyev. No. Look, people are telling me Shemaya's the number one contender at Welterweight right now, right? I'm not,

I'm not against that. I'm not against it. I'm not against it. Man, that'd be tough for, if I'm Lucia, I feel like it's the kind of guy who wouldn't say no to anyone. But I mean, if that's a fight,

I'd be like, why? If I'm Lucia, it's like, why would I take that fight? But I mean, Chameh has a lot, but he does have a lot of buzz around him, though. Oh, no. You want to kill that buzz?

If you're looking to kill that buzz, You go like, yeah, give me Chima. Chima is one of those unique fighters where even though he's way behind you in the rankings, you beat him, you somehow go higher up on the rankings, you know? He's all the talk. He's all the talk of the town right now. But you would not- If he was, if they put him in the top 15, if they put him in the top 15 last week,

I think that would be more appealing to Vicente-Luke. But that's the problem with a guy like Chama have. Is that like there's no upside for a top 15 guy right now? Yeah, he's got hype. But like, when you don't have that number next year name, you lose a lot of that appeal. That's why I think it's going to be a Saroni or somebody like that. I slightly disagree because I feel like there are certain fighters

and Shemaya right now is one of them where like you beat them the matter what the rankings are, you go up. Even though you beat McKinsey Dern. It's a even though McKinsey Dern has never been highly ranked, your name gets bigger. You beat page Vinclair and your name gets bigger even though they weren't ranked. So I think Shemaya right now is that kind of that unique spot in his career where despite his no number beside his name, you know.

But, uh, Miguel Baezza. I know you guys don't care about that matchup. I'm making, I'm going to make Miguel Baezza Shemayev happen. Just like I made Neal on, hashtag Neal on Neal happen. Okay, I'm a, I'm a taste maker. Okay, I will get people behind this Baezza Shama. When this matchup is announced, I will be front and center saying, Miguel Baezza, Shemaya is a worthy fight for both men at the stage of their careers.

We do not need to rush Shemayev. Miguel Bayez is a good fire. Shemayev is probably ranked, like, if we only get to the top 15, Let's just say, like, we have the rankings on, like, Dana's whiteboard. Shemayev has probably ranked 25 spots higher than Miguel Baez right now. That's absurd. That's not absurd. He just beat Matt Brown.

He beat... How can he be ranked lower than Shemaya? Shemayev beat a someone who... A good fighter, but I think in Reese McKee, who wasn't even in the UFC as of like two weeks ago. How can he be ranked higher than a guy who just beat Matt Brown? I will guarantee you that there are voters who voted for Kasbet Shemad Shama to be in the... I'm sure they did. I'm sure they did.

But I feel like... But if we're looking at... I would say Miguel Baezza is probably like number 40 to 45 and Shemai's probably like 20. I still had Matt Brown probably ranked way too high. So, so I'll be honest. My rankings are very are not great because Matt Brown probably. You're good. You can stop there.

Your rank isn't on. So I had, no, I had Baezza. I have Baezza at 24 because I have Matt Brown still in the top 30. So he just took Matt Brown's spot. But Matt Brown should probably be much lower. So realistically, like, what did you say? Like 40? 40 or something? I'd say he's like 40 to 45.

Yeah, I think that's probably closer than where I have him now. I've been wanting to change that. But I do not have Shemaya have ranked anywhere. I have him like outside the top 50. Oh, that's ridiculous. That's. He has one win at 170. What are we doing?

What are we doing? No, no, no. It's the way he won. And that's great. I agree. There's winning and there's freaking domination. And that was freaking domination. You have to beat someone ranked in the top 50, I feel like,

to make. into the top 50. That's crazy. No, you don't. Now you know, bro. This is absurd. You're making that up. Rees McKee is a very legit win. He's solid. Very legit win.

He has zero. He is nowhere near the level of wrestling needed to even challenge Shamiya. Look, I keep on record saying, I think Shamiya is a future champion. But he's not top 50. Guys. He's not top 50. Future meaning 2022. Okay.

He has no, he has not fought one guy in the UFC with any take down defense. That is a fact. This is not a theory. So if I went through all of his previous opponents, previous opponents fights, none of those guys have ever stopped to take down. You will have to do that first before I can answer that question. You're right. I actually cannot speak up this pre-you-se guys.

I'm just saying, but neither of us know, right? If we're just talking about UFC ranking, if we're going based on what most people are talking, the majority of people are just talking about the two fights they saw in the UFC, correct? These are two guys who have no takedown defense. That is a fact. No, that is not a fact. John Phillips? Are you serious?

I'm going to tweet him right now. Hey, do you have any take down offense at all? Just wondering. John Phillips, the first person will tell you. Hell no, I have no teardle. I don't want to go to the crowd. I've never learned any of that stuff. His nickname is Mike Tyson, I think.

I think he literally only wants to box the way. Well, I didn't say it, but yes. I don't see the world to that lens, Mike. But it's just an actual nickname. I know. I'm just saying. Shemayev is great, but the hype is crazy. It's crazy for people to say he's like,

should automatically be thrown to the top 10. Let him fight one person with decent take down the fence. You know why he should get a big fight, Alex? Do you know why? Because every show we have done for the last week, we have spent more time talking about Kamzad Shemaya than anybody else. Anybody else. I know, but look, we're a bunch of no-nothing pencil neck,

soy milk drinking clickbait artists, okay? It's shut me down. Shut me down if you want. No one even asked us about Shemaiah. I'm sorry. We've been talking more by Shamiya than I think like Derek Brunzen. Our editor is going to cut off my mic any minute now, but I cannot lie to America. I cannot lie to Canada.

Okay. We obviously are trying to drum up this prospect for our own headlines, okay? And just, you know, just get that sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, internet, those sweet, sweet, internet dollars, okay? I like Shemayo, but I want to see more. I want to see more. I want to throw the Vicente Lucke. I think he'd beat him.

I hate you so much. So crazy. All right, what else do we got? This is great. All you have to do is say Shabaya for 12 minutes about this guy. I could talk about Shamiya. I could talk about Shamiya for three hours. Yes.

And how he's so overranked, but yet he will be the greatest fighter ever tomorrow. What he should have? Most talked about. Jesus Christ. King of Fight Island, the King of Fight Island. All right. We're at an hour. We're at an hour.

Okay. guys let's one more we'll do one more uh we're getting lots of shami is it about shamiya yeah seroni needs shibaya and shibaii yeah you're right mohagan son this is mike hegg's um burner account he's saying man mohkegans son man this mike hegg is very handsome bald bald for life all one more one more question okay non shamiya You have to scroll all the way back up. Yeah. Shemaya versus Ousman, who wins?

Just getting. I'm so. Yeah, we're thinking about it. This won't be our last question, but I want to touch upon this because I was going to start talking about it on the presser show about Mike Perry, because someone just said as Shemaya Pairer, which I would love because I would love to see Shemaya beat Mike Perry's head in. Whoa. Look, so Mike Perry did issue an apology on Twitter today. I don't know if we have it handy, sorry, I should read it out in his own words. I don't want to misquote the man.

I'll fine. Let me pop it up. Yeah, yeah. Sorry, we had it. Someone had it out there. For people who don't know, of course, Mike Perry was involved in a recent sort of public altercation. There's a lot of, you know, there's a lot of coverage by us and other outlets and video of him getting into this sort of unfortunate altercation at a bar. Sorry, do we have that?

Yeah, one second. Here we go. So, okay, there it is. So this is here with Mike Perry. I want to be a better role model for my family, for my unborn son, for my queen, Latori Gonzalez, and for myself so I can earn the respect I deserve. To my sponsors, my boss of the UFC, I want to apologize for how my actions have impacted our relationships. I will be better all around. O'S, classic martial arts, sign off.

Okay, look, Mike Perry is not a good dude. Sorry, Casey, can we have that up at the bottom? You can cover my name or something, but. Okay, one second. Yeah, yeah. It's a very, so of course, speaking in a perfect world, someone like Mike Perry gets the help they need. Because, yeah, obviously there's something's going on with this guy. He needs help.

And it is good to see him saying things like, I want to be a better role model, of course, for his family. And of course, for a lot of fans who look up to him. Though I think most of them like him for his fighting ability and not necessarily his being a role model. Yeah, just put it over my mouth. People don't want to hear me talk anyway. There we go. Perfect. Perfect.

That's perfect. That's forever. That's very parasity. So I like he also said he needs to earn respect. I think it's important that a young athlete understands that because I think, you know, I think fighters and athletes can get their head inflated, especially when they reach the UFC and feel entitled to a lot of things. So him recognizing that is a good sign as well. I don't like him saying to my sponsors and bosses, I apologize for how my actions have effect at our relationships. That's like, that's the least, I feel like that's the least things that he should be concerned about. That sounds like almost like, please, you know, don't make me lose my job and I don't want to lose my sponsorships, which, again, I'm not, that's me putting words in his mouth, by the way. That is not what Mike Perry said. That's an inference. So, yeah, he does need to be better all around. But, you know, action speak louder than words. It's fine. The apology is okay. I don't think it's the best kind of apology. He doesn't, he didn't apologize to anyone specifically other than, again, sort of sponsors in the UFC, but not necessarily the people involved in the incident, which you might not want to talk about, though, because that is still. in litigation. So I'm very critical of Mike Perry. I'll say that if anyone hears my comments and you'd sense, of course, some bias against

the man. He should get help. Yes, I don't think it necessarily needs to be in the public eye. I don't think he needs to keep getting UFC fights during this period. If he's honest about getting help, he needs to step back, I think, from this fighting career and really have an honest go at it because I don't think publicity and the glory of fighting is going to benefit him in any way. I will say this.

if there's one thing that can change this man, it is becoming a dad. Like, if that doesn't do it, what else can be done? Like, how does that, like, that should motivate you in every way. Like, to be the best person possible, to be a champion, to be the best in your sport, like, whatever it is that you want to be better at, like, that alone should be enough fire to, to make those changes. So hopefully, finding out that Latori is pregnant. will help facilitate those changes.

Because, you know, Mike has said some pretty awful things. He's done some pretty terrible things. But he's also kind of like must watch TV when he fights. Like the buildup to his fight with Mickey Gall was like bigger than the main event. And then when that event was over, what were we talking about? We were talking about Mike Perry in the way he was at this post-fight press conference. The way he was in this post-fight interview with John Anick. Like, that was great stuff.

That was great stuff. And then just when everything seems to be turning the corner, the whole incident happens. And it's just like he cannot get out of his own way. So hopefully with all this happening in his life, you have to be responsible. You can't just take being a parent for granted. Maybe this will be the thing that sparks that change. But like AK said, action speak louder than words. And hopefully this can be the beginning of the help that he needs.

And I want to see him come back. I love a comeback story. I like when, you know, when people can get their heads together and do good. And I still want to see some of that old Mike Perry. There's some choice language I would hope he avoids from now on. But at this point, you know, I want to see Mike Perry fight and do his thing, not right now. Let him get the help he needs and like to see a new and improve Mike Perry back in the Octagon. But that's my piece on it.

Yeah. I just actually, I think Mike Perry is actually a very, just a very talented athlete and a very good fighter. And it just, I. I hope he gets the shit together. That's all. And I hope the UFC, I hope people behind the scenes can help him with that and getting the proper therapy and things like that.

And still, yeah, I just, right now, yeah, he is, he's, he has, he has, they're creating a new person for this world. So I, I need Mike Perry to be a good person to help raise that extra person. They are bringing into this world. For sure. Yeah, and that things work out for him in Latori because, you know, he did raise one good point after he won his last fight saying, man, it was really unfortunate that Latori got dragged. This girl got dragged into, you know, so much of the negativity that comes his way on social media. I mean, yes, she's become a public figure now because she's associated with him. But, I mean, there's what I can only imagine sort of heinous things that she was getting on social media. Again, and for no reason. You know, for nothing. She has, as far as, you know, has not done anything wrong as far as just other than being.

Mike Perry's girlfriend. So for her sake, for the sake of the child, and for his own sake, and fans of his, you know, yeah, he needs to get it together. And if that means, look, if that means not, fight, never fighting again, maybe that's what it takes. You know, maybe he needs to be removed from this environment and find another way. But at the end, that's the extreme end to this, you know, scenario. I like to see him off of social media.

Yes. That would be a good way to help. Yeah. But we'll get ready to wrap things up. One last question. Let's go out. Let's do it, sure. Shemayev, how many titles can you win?

What sex for Jojo? That was a bad loss. They basically pulled the Frankie Edgar. Euse. I just got a text message from someone close to Jojo, and she said, she. That Jojo is doing fine right now, and she's back home. And, yeah, it's no concerns, but I think it was just basically just, it was just, it was just stress from the loss and just kind of everything kind of so that's all we don't know

nothing's real official but jojo right now is fine and at home i would i'm gonna i'm gonna i'm gonna throw a name out here okay do it because i don't want to like after what happened in the fainting and stuff i'd like see jojo take some time off you know maybe come back november december and that would line up for the return of another 125 or that people have been excited about that is looking to come back from a loss. How about Jojo Calderwood versus Macy Barber? Oh. Oh, I like it.

I like it. I have not, I don't have anything bad to say about that. I like it. I like it. It's a good fight. There you go. I'm not,

I don't, yeah, I'm like, it's one of those fights. I was like, ooh, that's very risky for both fighters, which I like. Both,

but both, you know, Macy doesn't want to have back-to-back losses. and Jojo's are losing obviously doesn't want to lose back to back too but losing to someone that's so far behind her in the rankings is a big risk too

but I think that fight yeah Macy's one of those people too even though she doesn't have a number beside her name or does she? Or a number is that a ranking is she ranked in top 10 right now I don't think she is but um she's probably like 12 yeah yeah she's right yeah somewhere for 11 to 15 probably outside of top 10

and considering Jojo's top five it's a risky fight for Macy, sorry, risky fight for Jojo. But yeah, but I like that fight. I like that fight. I got a name. First, I'm gonna say I'm a Jojo fan. Since I've already shown how biased I am,

I'm talking about fighters anyway, I'll go to the other side of it. I'm a fan of Joanne Collier. I think a lot of people are. She has a very memorable personality, good and entertaining fighting style. And man, just had to sympathize so much with her for taking that, that was tough to watch.

Taking such a high risk, low reward fight and getting the absolute worst outcome out of it. So it's kind of a word one, but a fight that I think would keep her in the Valentina Shepchenko's sweepstakes, why doesn't she just fight Antonina instead, maybe? Antenna was certainly below her in the rankings, but style-wise, a good matchup for her.

If she beats Antonina, then you have that storyline, again, sort of like, oh, she'd be Wonshipchenko, now you throw her back in the title fight, which, again, she should have gotten anyway, but she had to stay busy. She had to stay busy, and she got a good opponent,

and things happened. So I'll throw Antonina's name. out there. I don't want to see Antonina Shepchenko anywhere near Joanne Calderwood. I just don't want to see it. I, I, she needs to, she needs to take like five steps back. She needs to fight like the Justine Kishas of the world. That's what she needs to fight. Jojo. No, Antonina. Oh, okay. I was I was like, I was like, what did. No, no, no, no, no. She needs. Oh, you're saying for Anthonyina's sake. Yeah, Anthony needs to like go back. Yeah, I can understand the Luana Carolinas of the world. That's.

that's who she needs to be fighting. Get a couple of wins. And then, I mean, look at the murder, like, Roxanne, Pudilova, Chukagian. Like, that's, that's a party. I mean, that's, like, you're 8 and 2. Just coming out the contenders series. You didn't fight, like, really anybody. And you get Roxanne in your first fight.

Lucy, Kaylon Chukagan, like, they threw her, like, a murderer's row almost for her first three fights. Like, take her back. Take her back. That's what I think. I don't care with that. But yeah. Yeah, but I see where you're getting at. Yeah, but yes, that was one of the sadder stories to come out of tonight's card.

But again, good for Jennifer Maya. Yeah, sad story for Joe. It's that story for Jojo. Great story for Maya. She looked great. From November of last year to now, what a turnaround for Jennifer Maya. That was awesome. What a time of your first UFC finish, right?

And that was awesome. Yeah, Dana was impressed and said the right thing. So next week, We're back again. And we'll get Tuesday night. We get the contender series. Bellator is back on Friday with a big card. Chandler versus Henderson, too.

And then we got the UFC on Saturday. We got Lewis versus Olenik, Widman versus Akhmadavado, Darren Stewart versus Maki Patolo, Yanukutzkaya versus Julius Stoli, Bernice versus Scott Holtsman, Tim Means, versus Lariano Starrapoli, Nazareth-Hakpras is back against Alex Munoz. Sanchez versus Wellington Turman. Justin James is back. It's Gavin Tucker.

Yusuf Salal, the loudest cornerman in UFC history, is going to welcome New England's Peter Barrett to the UFC. And then Irwin Rivera is back welcoming Ali al-Kasai to the UFC. That's going to open things up in 135 pounds. So we get some fun fights on the horizon. And that belliger card rules, too. Don't, don't. That's a real good belliger card.

It's a nice bellator card also. So Friday and Saturday is like, luckily we have no social lives. So, so yeah, yeah, I was going to be, yeah, I mean, I had turned down all these party invites because I, there's such great fights, guys, so. Yeah. We got so, it's just so much going on. I'm so excited the contender series is back. I know that's like another night of covering fights, but I love, love, love the contender series.

That's a pleasure to cover. Absolutely. So that's coming. As are, ours are eight fight cards, by the way. Yes, eight fight cards are great, but contenders, five fights, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, in and out two hours to you later i love it so that's it we have talked enough about uh ufc Vegas five is almost 2 a m eastern time but uh appreciate all the questions and the comments and uh we're just going to have to do a shemaiah hour every week on m a may fighting live and

we'll answer all your uh comes at shimai have questions so for e kaysie lydin for alexander kelly i am like milk drink milk it does a body good it does a body good i hope too unless your lack doesn't tolerant oat milk is great guys try oat milk I'm just saying. Rice milk or almond milk. All the milks. Yeah. See you later.

Expanding horizons, bro. You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network.