MMA Fighting - What the Heck: Episode 34 | Ben Askren, Demetrious Johnson, Khaos Williams, Benson Henderson & Ashley Yoder

Episode Date: November 19, 2020

This week on What the Heck, MMA Fighting's Mike Heck chats with Demetrious Johnson (10:42) about the pandemic shutting down his 2020 fighting year, signing and competing with ONE Championship, the UFC 255 main event between Deiveson Figueiredo and Alex Perez, and Israel Adesanya. Khaos Williams (29:55) recaps his incredible 30-second knockout win in the main event of UFC Vegas 14 this past Saturday and reveals whether it was the scariest KO of his career. Ben Askren (53:28) discusses being a part of The Apprentice, ONE Championship Edition, having successful hip surgery, wanting to return to wrestling in 2021, and whether he may return to MMA. Benson Henderson (1:18:26) previews his Bellator 253 co-main event bout with Jason Jackson this Thursday, talks his recent loss to Michael Chandler and his move to the UFC, Patricio Pitbull's latest KO, and more. Finally, Ashley Yoder (1:41:12) discusses getting back in the win column following her decision win over Miranda Granger this past Saturday at UFC Vegas 14. Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Subscribe: http://goo.gl/dYpsgH Check out our full video catalog: http://goo.gl/u8VvLi Visit our playlists: http://goo.gl/eFhsvM Like MMAF on Facebook: http://goo.gl/uhdg7Z Follow on Twitter: http://goo.gl/nOATUI Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. This is What the Heck with Mike Heck on MMAfighting.com. Now, here is your host, Mike Heck. What the heck? Hello there, everybody, and welcome to a brand new edition of What the Heck here on MAPFiting.com. My name is Mike Hack. Thank you so much for watching and listening this week. As MMA just continues to be crazy, there is a lot going on in the world of mixed martial arts.

so many events that you guys and gals could check out this week and this weekend. A couple of offering from CFFC. We got Brave 45. We got Bellator 253 tonight. One championship has an event. Invicta FC 43 going down tomorrow night. Icon fighting Federation 3, I believe. I believe it's the third event.

LFA, UFC 255 on Saturday. Titan FC 65 on Sunday. Lexic Man, the CEO of Titan FCC. is fighting on Saturday night as well. I'm sure I'm missing others as well, but just so much face punching. To be watched and consumed. It's a good time to be an M.A.

It's a rough time to be people around the world during 2020. But if you're an M.A. fan, there's quite a bit to be thankful for us. A lot of action to consume. On top of all that, we had the final contender series event of 2020. We saw four more contracts get awarded. and we even saw a potential spot on the Ultimate Fighter. Offered to Nick Maximoff after his win over Oscar Coda.

It was just crazy to watch a man weigh 209 pounds, fight a guy who is 265 pounds. Nick Maxoff clearly the much better fighter, but just Cota's size was just way too much. And it was just a crazy fight to watch. So Maximoff was offered a spot on the upcoming Ultimate Fighter. I have talked to Maximoff's team. They're still weighing that option, whether or not they're going to accept it because they're going to be filming for that pretty quickly.

And, you know, Nick, as he said on when I chatted with him last week, it's a lot of, it's a lot. Most of his, I think all of his professional fights have been a 205. He feels like he's a natural 185er. But with filming starting pretty soon, he's going to have to fight three times potentially in a short amount of time, cutting a 185 when you haven't really done it before, or at least it's been a long time. It's going to be tough. see what happens there. But, uh, listen, I love the contender series. There may be five or six people on earth who enjoy the contender series as much as I do. I actually pay attention.

I don't just watch, you know, I don't just like look at topology pages when I think about the contender series. Like, I've interviewed a lot of these fighters when they were some were amateurs, some early on in their pro careers. So I know a lot about these guys and gals who compete. So I love it. I love it so much. I mean, and there have been people other reporters out there who have been tweeting about it, who, you know, they're like, they're like Patriots fans. Okay. I've been a Patriots fan since I was a little kid, right? I've been through the one in 15 season. I went through the years before Drew Bledso was drafted. None of you know what I'm talking about if you're not from the United States, but I went through a lot. And then they started winning. I'm not a bandwagon fan. There are a lot of Patriots fans who are bandwagon fans. There's some bandwagon contender series reporters out there. There's no doubt about it. I have been a day one contender series mark. I love it. I always will be, but good God, I will be honest. I am happy this season is over. Even with the fight island break in between to try to like separate things, 10 weeks is just too much. Maybe it's, I mean, maybe it's just the pandemic and there's been like a UFC event every Saturday for the last like

six or seven months. Maybe it's because a couple of the shows were just so insanely ridiculous and good with quick finish after quick finish after quick finish after finish, highlight real finishes. Maybe our expectations became somewhat unrealistic, but I don't know. I think the timing is perfect to sort of put a cap on the contender series for 2020. Let it simmer again. And by the time the summer of 2021 rolls around, hopefully the world is in a better place. We'll be fired up for it.

Hopefully regional shows are back up and running around the United States and around the world so we could see some more of these prospects that unfortunately haven't been given their opportunity because everything was shut down. but but listen if you're looking for that reality TV maybe get to the UFC type of stuff we get the ultimate fighter coming back who knows I'm not all that excited for it I'll be honest but uh you know hopefully it gets a massive facelift and um you know as far as what I'm hearing in regards to contender series contract winners making their UFC debuts I have spoken to some sources and that the UFC is planning on booking Jordan Leavitt I believe he's like one of the first people

to get a contract on this season. Looks like he's going to be fighting Matt Wyman on December 5th. Handsome Matt Wyman looking to get back on track, ticking on the surging undefeated debutante in Jordan Levitt in Las Vegas. We'll see what happens with that. That is the plan as of right now. We've got a big week for Bellator. Later on tonight, Bellator 253, like we alluded to earlier.

Main event is just unbelievable. Dary and Caldwell versus A.J. McKee. I know UFC 255 has the two title fights. some really intriguing matches, but if you want to make the argument that Darying Caldwell versus A.J. McKee is the most fascinating fight of the week. You will get absolutely no argument from me on that. I cannot wait to see how that one plays out, really outstanding matchup. Big test for A.J. McKee. People have been waiting for. When's he going to get that step up? And he's been getting him. But if he goes up there and beats Daring Caldwell, ooh, man, him versus Pippel would just be unbelievable.

Whatever this fight against Petrillo Pippel would be unbelievable. Really excited for this fight. Make sure you tune in. CBS Sports Network. We'll be talking a little bit more about that card a little bit later on. UFC 255, I have been singing the praise of this card for a while. It's really good. People are poo-pooing it. I'm going to keep saying it. I think it's a lot better than a lot of fans are giving it credit for.

I know we don't have the massive star power. You do have Davis of Figuedo. He's one of the most interesting people in the sport. If you haven't seen it, our own Guillermo has had an incredible conversation with Davis of Figuerreado after he beat Joseph Benavides to become the champion on Fight Island. It's unbelievable. You learn so much about the man in that conversation. I know the one thing that kind of holds him back is the fact that he doesn't speak English,

but the act man has the chance to be a big star in the UFC. It really does if things can just fall into place perfectly. You got Valentina Shiffchenko on the card. Interesting is probably the understatement of the century with her. She's like the female James Bond, like Jose Young said up between the links. she's one of the greatest fighters in the world right now, male or female. It's just, this card should be getting more luck, okay? Sure, the two title fights, the champions are massive favorites,

especially in the Shevchenko Maa fight. She's like almost a minus 2,000 favorite in that fight. I think Perez versus figure, I think Figuerado, excuse me, champion first, pal. I think Figuerre versus Perez is a really interesting fight. You got Brandon on Brandon, Moreno versus Roy Val. that's going to be bananas, just bananas, I tell you. I have a feeling that this card is going to be talked about in the same sentence as like a UFC 199,

like a UFC 206, these under the radar cards that steal some thunder away from some of the bigger events because it's just so good. That could happen on Saturday, and I'm looking forward to it. So if you're a fan of the sport, don't let this, you know, don't let the lack of star power slow you down when it comes to watching this event.

I think it's going to be really good. I think it's some really good matches. But let's get to the program. I've been rambling enough. Let's get to our guest. Rapping us up this week. We'll talk with Ashley Yoder. She returned to the wind calm.

Unanimous decision victory over Miranda Granger at UFC Vegas 14. Kind of a stalemate fight for a while, but then the flip switched for Ashley Yoder. She turns it on in the final round and gets a victory. First win in around two years or so. get her reaction to the win coming up to wrap up the show this week.

Former UFC lightweight champion Benson Henderson is going to join us. The second of two former UFC world champs that'll be on the program this week. He returns to action tonight. Co-main event, Bellator 253 takes on Jason Jackson first fight since the knockout loss to Michael Chandler in August. Going back up to 170, we'll check in with Benson Smooth Henderson, who just celebrated his 37th birthday this week a little bit later on. One guy I have wanted to interview for a long time now.

I don't really call these interviews. This is more like conversations. And Ben Ascran is one of those people that I've wanted to converse with for a while. So I've wanted to make this happen. Some of the fans who have followed my work for a long time, they have wanted to see it happen. And this week it finally does. It'll be part of the Apprentice one championship edition.

But we touched on that. We talked about, I mean, just a ton of stuff. All the things that you've been asking us, I basically asked Ben about. maybe we get an update on his his combat sports future following successful hip surgery is he thinking about maybe coming back the world of mixed martial arts

it's been about a year since he announced his retirement on Ariel Holani's MMA show so keep it locked in for that Ben Ascran makes his what the heck debut the biggest star the weekend at MMA this past weekend Chaos Williams will join us in around

25 minutes to recap his ferocious 30 second knockout of Abdul Razak al-Hassan in the co-main event of UFC Vegas 14. Now 2-0, two finishes, two performance bonuses in the UFC. Just 57 total seconds of Octagon time. He is a player at 170 right now, excited to have the Ox Fighter on the program in just a little bit. But first, big weekend for the flyweight's coming up, UFC 255. And who better to have on the show to talk fist fighting, fly weights, fighting careers, and more. Let us kick off this. week's episode of what the heck with the former long time reigning defending ufc flyweight champion the

current one championship flyweight grand prix champion one of the greatest to ever step foot in a cage ring any fighting surface you can think of the one the only demetrius johnson all right we're being joined by the one championship flyweight grand free world champ former long time ufc flyweight flyway champion, Demetrius, Mighty Mouse Johnson. A man, we unfortunately haven't seen compete in over a year because 2020 be 2020ing. And it's been a number of reasons. Most notably, we've got a global pandemic going on. But happy to have one of the greatest to ever do it.

Join us right now. You can also catch him soon on the new show, The Apprentice One Championship Edition. DJ, good to see you, man. How are you? What's going on, guys? Good for having me. Absolutely. So this has been quite a year for all of us.

You were coming off a very active 2019 campaign after the quote-unquote trade from the UFC to one championship. You went through the Grand Prix. You won it all. Have another shiny belt for the mantle. So before we get into the here and now, you know, after spending eight years with the WEC and the UFC, what was it like making that first walk in March of 2019 for one championship? It was definitely different. Obviously, you know, traveling, you know, traveling order to Singapore and then doing, you know, my 10-day, where did I fight first? I find Japan for us, that's right.

Wasn't Japan, I think 12 days ahead of schedule to give myself enough time to acclimate. And, you know, making a walk and not hearing, you know, the same music that I'm used to coming on to was a little bit different. You know, my own intro, which is pretty dope. And I loved it, man. You know, it's always good to experience different things. It's been a while since you and I have spoken. It's been around three or so years. So forgive me if I bounce around a little bit because there's a lot of questions that I do have.

I know that you've spoken about the trade and the loss to, to Hudo at UFC 227. But one thing I noticed about you from our last chat compared to other interviews I've seen over the years is that you just seem much more free and happy now. Like having that long title defense streak in the UFC, you had the close fight with Henry that a lot of people thought you won. It just seems like all those pressures, the constant talk about moving up to 35, the talk about Dillashah moving down to 25 in fighting you.

It just seemed, and correct me if I'm wrong, that loss and the subsequent move to one, it just seemed like it was just what the doctor ordered. Is that accurate? I would say so. I mean, there was a lot of stress and pressure. You know, obviously there was always going to be stress and pressure when you're a champion. And, you know, it's even more pressure, you know, when it comes to selling pay-per-view and try to hit a certain market pay for view so you make more money and et cetera, et cetera, all that stuff, you know, plays a factor.

And I did my best, you know, to, you know, put it behind me and not worry about it. Just go out there and fight and compete, which, you know, I did very well. I like to think. But once at all, you know, basically it lifts off my shoulders. It felt good, you know, especially when you go over, you know, to Asia, they respect, you know, the size that, you know, a 5-3 guy because they're not very big athletes as well. And when, you know, one championship, it's free on television. It's on VR Live.

It's also on TNT and Turner. So that's a huge relief. I mean, the last thing you want to hear after you, you know, defend a world championship and you pull off the Mighty Whiz Bar is that, oh, you're only so. with a 195,000 pay reviews. It's like, thanks. Still one of the most ridiculous submissions of all time. No, that's going to go down in history forever and ever.

I mean, at least you got that silver lining-wise, right? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, in a strange way, I feel like you're appreciated so much more now amongst the UFC fans. It seems like every couple months, like the goat talks come up in the UFC and the Mount Rushmore conversations come to light, and your name is always brought up. and you're doing that while still doing your own thing and another promotion. I mean, do you listen and pay attention to that chatter?

All the go talk, and if so, what have you made of it? Obviously, I pay attention to it because it's all over, you know, the feed on Twitter and Instagram and stuff. And I get tagged in it here and there. And I also get asked the question, you know, what are my thoughts? I think it's all about perspective on people, like on a person's opinion, right? Like my goat, my top five goats would be different from somebody else. or I had a buddy might call me the other day.

He goes, you can't say John Jones is the best in the world because, you know, it's all about character too. And I was like, well, you know, for me, I just want to know nobody's beat him. So if it tells him something they can beat him, then, you know, that's, that's, he's in my boat. They're like, but he popped for drugs. I'm like, he still beat your ass. And so that's just my personal opinion. And it's always going to change.

And that's what I was looking at. It's everybody's perspective. It's everyone's certain perspective on what they think is. the greatest fall time. And it's always going to be different. It might be different from, you know, GSP. It might be different from Daniel Cormey. It might be different from, you know, a thousand people.

But it's my own opinion. Israel Adasanya had his opinion. He was asked who the goat was, and he said you were. And I don't know if you saw that. And, you know, because that guy certainly wants to be in that conversation as the ears go by. And he believes that you're the guy he's chasing. What do you think about that?

I think it's awesome. You know, I've never had nothing about respect for it, is he. And I told him after when he did DePaula, I was like, dog, you're on your way. I was like, you keep putting on performance like that. You're going to be on your way. I mean, the way he dismantled him, I was like, you know, it's very rare that a fighter will do something in a fight that will make me think about certain things. And when he did DePaul, I was like, duh, I was like, simple footwork. That's the easy way to nullify Paula Costa's striking.

You know, how, you know, when he did to Uriah Hall, we did the Yer O'Ramero, he couldn't do it to Izzy Arasana because he used footwork. And I was like, good for you, Izzy. I was like, you know what? You impress me all the time. But now when he knocked out Paula, I was like, yep, he's on his way. If he keeps doing that and if he goes up to light heavyweight,

and then if he goes up to heavyweight to fight John Jones, I was like, you know, those are all the steps. And, you know, I feel that he's going to be, you know, he's going to be in a sport for a long time. Like, I feel he'll be a champion for a long time. As long as he keeps on evolving, which I feel like he has the mindset to do that because he watches anime. You know, anime always keeps you your mind fresh and keep you involving. There you go. True story.

I know my colleague Jose Youngs will agree with you on that. So let's talk about you in the here now because you were supposed to compete in April against Adriana Marias and then the event was canceled due to COVID-19, like many other events around the world. When this was all kicking off, like, I'll admit, like, I had an eye on it, but I guess I didn't take it as seriously as I should have, obviously, but, you know, you're trying to prepare for a fight, trying to prepare travel, et cetera. Did you think as you're getting ready for the fight that it would get as bad as it did, or did you see the cancellation coming? Nope. I thought if I was going to cancel, I had my flights booked. You know, we were ready

to go. I was training, you know, we were ready to go. And then it was supposed to be in Then he got switched to Jakarta. And obviously, you know, my coach, he knew, he saw the writing on the wall because, you know, he's just been through, you know, he has more wisdom. He has more years on me. So he was like, dude, this is, it ain't going to happen. They're going to shut down international travel, which they did. And, you know, the fight got postponed. And it is what it is.

You know, I've always been a type of athlete or the person where if it's something I can't control, then I just put in the back of my mind. I'm just like, screw it. You know, when you're like, when you're fighting again, I'm like, I don't know. I'm not worried about it until they send me a contract or this pandemic is over with. Then I'll start worry about, you know, when we're fight again. I mean, today is the last day. The gyms are open. We're going back down on lockdown quarantine for four weeks.

So, I mean, just like that, everything gets shut down again. So nothing else kind of came across your desk in terms of another fight. once one started getting events back on the books or just once April was done, you're kind of off the radar for the time being. Yeah, I was off the radar for the time being. Obviously, you know, all international traveling got shut down. So everything that I do in what championship is over in Asia,

Singapore, Manila, Japan, you name it, that's international traveler. So once I got shut down, your boy was put on ice. I know you don't like to focus on things you can't control. But is there like a part of you deep down that's, that's worried that it could be another year, maybe even longer before you get the chance to fight again? It's possible. Absolutely, it's possible. But, you know, I try to keep myself busy, you know, with homeschool the kids. I homeschool as much as I can. I mean, I'm basically relearning all types of stuff, learning about the

scientific method, the continents, you know, I'm basically living my role as a father. So every morning I wake up, I cook breakfast for the family, wash dishes, and then we start school at night, in the morning so that's been kind of you know taking my mind off of fighting and I've been enjoying and I love every bit of it what's been your favorite part of the homeschooling what's like the thing that you were so most excited to relearn again uh just honestly everything like acronyms and synonyms well my son is in first grade and then my middle son is in uh kindergarten but just going through all just going through all this stuff again and you know we're learning about, you know, words that sound exactly the same, words that sound exactly the same

by mean different things, like stool. It can mean poop. It can mean a chair. And my son's like, that doesn't make sense. And I'm like, I know it doesn't make sense, Tyrant, but it is what it is. And he goes, so, yeah, one thing, I have a first grader as well. And, you know, he's learning different things. One thing I'm worried about is, like, once he gets, like, third, fourth, fifth grade. I guess like math has completely changed and how you get from like the problem to the answer. It's completely different than it was when like you and I were in school. Have you seen this? And are you concerned about teaching a new whole new math? Yeah. My brothers came in town and they're in college and I was helping them with their homeschool. And the math that I saw and I told

I was like, dog, I'm going to tell you straight up. Only math you need in life, depending on what career path you go is plus addition, subtraction, multiplication. division and learning percentages, that's all you need. All this BS right here, you don't need a damn thing. So when I look at it, I'm like, go look at that dog. You need help with, you know, anything else to holl at your boy. But for me, don't come at the house with this. So if you had a guest, DJ, and I know it's like almost impossible to play the hypothetical

game, what's your gut telling you in regards to when you may fight again? Do you think it'll be 2021? Do you think it'll be longer? maybe not at all? Like has that thought creeped into your mind at all? I mean, I'm always, you know, I'm a black, I'm a black, I'm a white type of guy where it's like it's either, you know, I believe I'll fight in 2021.

I believe that I believe, you know, that COVID, the cases won't get out of control and things will be fine. But at the end of the day, it is in the back of our mind. All it has to do, you know, the president of the United States is like, hey, we're shutting down. We're going nationwide shut down, no international traveling. We get this under control. I mean, that can happen.

It's just the reality of life. It's happened before. Do I want it to happen? Absolutely not. I want to go out there and compete while I'm still young. I don't want to sit on the silence for another year. But if it happens, it is what it is. There's nothing I can do about it.

You seem like you have your finger on the pulse, despite what is going off, the pandemic in your career. I mean, the UFC has a big event on Saturday. Flyweight Division is featured in a big way. some really good matchups there. Figito and Perez, the main event, Brandon Moreno versus Brandon Roy Val on the card. And you've been in these spots before getting the chance to headline events, even though there are some folks out there, like you said,

they kind of dump on the smaller fighters. When you're in a spot like these fighters are in, is there a part of you that's like, all right, here's our chance to put a spotlight on this division that shouldn't necessarily need it because the fights are always good. But, you know, let's shine the spotlight on anyways. Is there like an extra pressure to do that? You know what? I wouldn't

I wouldn't say so I mean when I watch fights You know I don't think you know These guys are going there Make a statement to show the division is dope or whatever I always thought that way and that was always my mindset And it's like for me I like vanilla cake

You will never get me to like chocolate cake I don't care if we're on Mars, Venus, or Pluto I'm always going to enjoy vanilla cake Over than chocolate cake So that's just how it is with some people. They like heavyweight fighters more than small weight fighters. And I respect that. You can't, you know, you can try to persuade him and change them. But for me, you know, I know what type of weight classes I like to enjoy watching and nobody's going to change that perspective. There might

be a certain athlete that might make me change that, but at the end of the day, I know what I like. What have you made of a figurato's emergence as the champion as he prepares to fight a surging guy like Perez, who would love to go in there and potentially play spoiler on Saturday? I think Figurado is great. I think he's got all the tools to be a champion for a very, very, very long time. He can take a shot. He's got great cardio, he's got great jiu-jitsu. He hits hard.

Those are all the good things to have a long tidal rain. You know, as long as he stays healthy, drug tests come back clean, he keeps making weight. You know, I don't see why he couldn't, you know, be a champion for a long time. You know, I would love to see him and Henry Sehudo come back in. I would love to see Himmer Sehudo come back and fight him because I feel like Henry Sehudo is a, you know, complete package. He'll push the pace. He'll wrestle.

And he's, and he's, Henry's intelligent, right? So I feel like Henry could be able to go out there and oppose problems from not saying that Alex Perez can't. I just haven't seen enough Alex Perez compete in, you know, Henry, Henry, Hughu, me and I've shared, you know, we fought before. so I know that here we'll figure out a puzzle. Of course, next on the agenda for you is the Apprentice, the One Championship Edition. This is pretty interesting stuff. You're going to be a part of it.

Ben Ascran, George St. Pierre, Brennan Vera, Henzo Gracie, Sage Northcutt, Angeloid, and there are others that I'm missing. This is pretty cool stuff. For those who may not have seen it, what is your role going to be in the show? What are you going to be doing on The Apprentice One Championship Edition? I'm super excited about it. That's one thing things I love about one championship is that are always, they're not just a mixed martial arts company.

You know, we got one e-sports going on with Dota 2 and all that stuff. Obviously, that's been putting on pause with the, you know, global pandemic. But now, you know, stepping into, you know, the One Apprentice show. I know everybody else has kind of filmed their show or whatnot. And obviously, I'm being a judge on there, just sharing, you know, my life experience, working, full-time job and also competing as a full-time athlete. and basically just guiding, you know, guiding, you know, the contestants. Hopefully I can help share my insight and be able to be a great judge.

I know, like, in a way, it's going to give those competing in it, like, a chance to learn the business side of M.A., which is lost on a lot of people, especially me, because I have no idea how the business side works, how and why decisions are made behind the scenes. Has the business side of the sport, I mean, of course it relates to you with contracts, money, and all that stuff, but, you know, the back end, the behind the scenes, business aspect of such a crazy sport like this. Has that been something that you've been interested in on a wider scale? The only thing I'm interested in it is when it comes to certain things in the business aspect is how can you leverage your brand? Like how can you be able to expand your brand outside of mixed martial arts?

And that's what I've been doing by gaming. You know, we just, me, my team, and we just got back from California shooting some content that was, you know, video game related. and that's that's going to be broadcast on a certain channel on a certain game i can't really you know speak too much about it but right there you know one of my very first passion which is video game i've been able to leverage my name and build to do content in the video game space so for me i would always look at like an athlete you know my buddy who's oh no as a professional athlete um but undefeated as amateur i look at him on my okay well he's his

name's James James. He's Chinese. He speaks Mandarin. He also speaks, no, he speaks Cateaese, and he also speaks English. He does Wushu. He does all of the, you know, the staff, sword, numbeds. He does all that stuff that's performances every Chinese New Year's. I'm like, okay, how can we build your brand? You know, you're already a badass fighter. I'm sure you're going to do very well, but how can we separate you from everyone else? How can we make your walkout? Remember, role, you know, just like Izzy Adasana, like, he's, I feel like he separates himself from every other, you know, middleweight or, or champion is because he's very, he's very honest, you know, he's throwing up middle fingers, he's calling, you know, people to see word, and he's also,

you know, a nerd who watches anime, and that sticks out to me because that's, that's what type of characters I like to, you know, like follow or like, I guess you can say. Yeah, that's a good way to look at it. By the way, did you get a PS5 yet? Yes, I did. Are you having issues like everybody else? No thanks to Sony. No thanks to Sony.

Shout out to my man Robert Lopez. And shout out the Target for delivering the next damn day. But no problem with whatever with mine. Have you seen everybody having issues? Even Daniel Cormier said he's having big problems with it. Well, I'm sure Daniel Cormier's got his shit on Wi-Fi. You don't play console on Wi-Fi. You hardwire that bad boy.

So there you go, gamers. That's a little piece of advice from the man himself. DJ, it's great catching up with you, man. I know you're driving. I appreciate it giving me so much time. You can catch Demetris Johnson on the Apprentice One Championship Edition. You can find that on the one super app. And I believe that'll be dropping pretty soon.

But I always appreciate the time, man. It's been a few years. Hopefully you'll have a busy 20, 21 in and out of the cage. But you're handling it all like a true champion. No surprise here. Thank you as always, man. Great stuff right there from DJ. It has been a while since him and I have had the chance to chat,

and it's been a while since we've seen him compete. The timing is great. Hopefully once this pandemic dies down, we get to see Demetrius Johnson compete once again, but you can catch him on the Apprentice. One championship edition on the One Super app when that drops, which I believe is going to be pretty soon. So speaking of drops,

this man dropped his opponent in a very, very scary way on Saturday, a one-punch, K-O from hell that was delivered by, I won Chaos Williams this past Saturday night at UFC Vegas 14. So let us get the Oxfighters reaction to that big win right now. All right. Well, there was a lot of attention coming from the main events from this past Saturdays. The UFC Vegas 14 events. There's so many UFC events that throws me off sometimes.

The star of the night came from the co-main event. You saw this man, Chaos Williams, knockout Abdul Razak al-Hsan in just 30 seconds, a wicked right hand that put his opponent out cold. And with that, second UFC finish, second performance of the night bonus to boot. Happy to be joined by the Oxfighter himself. Chaos Williams. How are you, sir? Bless, man.

Bless, you know, having to, you know, the weather good, having a good day. You know, like you said, comrade and a pin went well, you know, just enjoying life. It's crazy because I went back and watched our first interview back when I was doing the freelance thing. And you were coming off the knocko, went over Alex Marano. and there were several things that stuck out to me from that conversation. One of the things that I thought about on Saturday night was the fact that one of your goals for your second UFC fight was to fight somebody that would last more than 60 seconds with you because you wanted to show a bit more over a longer period of time than you showed in the Morano fight,

then land the highlight rail. Instead, between your two UFC fights, you still haven't hit 60 seconds combined yet. This is absolutely incredible. How does it all feel a few days later? man you know it's still it's still uh you know it still it still feel it still feel good you know at the end of the day you know especially uh just seeing how far i've come you know seeing dana white reposted seeing some of the you know i mean some of the legends in the game speak my name uh you know just retweeting you know i'm just blessed you know at the end of the day but i never admire

my work you know got to stay hungry got to stay hungry um and i'm i'm gonna just keep grinding you know right now, like you said, you know, it ain't even been a week yet. So, of course, you know, I got to celebrate a little bit, but I'm going to be right back in the gym. I'm going to get right back to work. You know, the more you win, like, the hard you got to work, because at the end of the day, you got more people that's watching you, you got more haters.

You know, you got more people that want to fight you. You know, it's just so much. It's just so much. So right now, I'm just enjoying it, but I know, I know what I got to do. You know, I'm just getting started. You got more haters? No way. No, I mean, you never know, man.

You might have silent haters. know, people, people, you know, they can say what they want to say. You know, like, think about it. Like, at the end of the day, you know, it's a big world. You're not going to make everybody happy. After my first fight, some people was like, oh, I had, some people was like, that was sloppy or this or that. You know what I mean? Just this little, you know what I mean?

People that probably never fought before, just little stuff. But the thing about it is, like, when you get the job done, me, I get the job done. Like, right, my second fight, it was, I was going to be more technical. Whether we had to go 15 minutes, five minutes, you know, 30 seconds, how it was going to be. That's why I took my time. And, you know, I just had to show people like, you know, I'm just not no brawler. You know, I'm an all-around fight.

I'm a well-rounded fighter. And, you know, the people, they're going to see that. You know, I just continue to get better. And they're going to see that. When you knocked down Morano, I mean, you didn't have a lot of time to prepare for that fight, but you used the time that you had to your advantage because a lot of people didn't realize it. But when you finish Marano, you set it up with the kick to the bottom. And not a lot of people talked about that,

but it was something that you and your team felt would be sort of an opening there. Did you see something in tape watching Al-Hassan or did you coach to see something that you knew that that right hand would be there and that it would be an opening for you? Yes. See, the thing about it is, I probably watch only probably not even 30 seconds of this fight.

Me, I don't really tend. I don't even tend to watch people like that. I let my coaches do that and they just let me know. And my job is just to train. So I just train and they let me know like, okay, this guy, he liked this, he liked that, or this is what he do. And, you know, that's their job. And, you know, my job is just to stay ready and be the best of me I can be.

And they told me, like, they told me, you know, really, they just said, just keep it tight, you know, just keep it tight, you know, show the world that you're technical, you're a well-rounded fighter, and just be patient. And that's all I did. When Abdul was walking to the Octagon, at least where I was watching on ESPN plus here in Massachusetts, the camera was on you most of the time, especially when he walked in octagon because you were just mean mugging the crap out of him like you didn't even blink you're just staring a hole through his soul before and even after bruce buffer made his introduction for you what

is going through your mind at that moment is the fight's about to start your eyeball on him like that like what are you thinking about hey like it's a fight you know you you you sign that contract in my mind i'm looking at it like you know you sign that contract to uh to fight so you i believe that you believe you can beat me you coming in here to hurt me So it's cute to be killed. It's either you or it's either me, and it's not going to be me. And I'm going to lay it all out here on the line. I got 15 minutes.

It would be great. I got 15 minutes to lay it all on the line. And that's what it is. We're about to test that chin out. Is that something you do for every fight, or is that something you were just feeling in the moment on Saturday? No, that's every fight. You know, every fight, you know, I'm locked in.

I'm locked in. You know, one thing about me, you know, let me knock on some wood. But, you know, I don't know. I've never I've never been finished you know one thing about me like you know I'm here win lose a draw I'm here I'm fighting and nobody everybody that fight they got a day we we come in to win and they know they got to fight on their hands you know even through the losses like early on in my career you know it's just a lesson learned and I never even through those losses I've always beat them they they left to fight concussions and you know throwing up and

barely making it out the cage, you know, all beat up. They were just able to control me. That was it. It wasn't me losing the fight. You know what I mean? I just lost my point. They was able to just control me. Pride rules you won all your fights, right?

Right. For real. So it's interesting because, like, in your debut, you were on one of the last cards in front of a crowd in a big arena. So everyone got to react to it. And this one was in an empty arena. Yeah, there were a couple of people there, Dana White, obviously, but, you know, what did you like better?

The sound of the crowd reacting to the finish or the echo of the punch landing and his body hitting the mat like that? I mean, I'll definitely say that echo, just because at the end of the day, you know, we got Dana White right there, you know, and that right there itself was worth more than the crowd to me.

As end of that, we got people watching at home, and I feel like even though through the pandemic it's been a blessing and a curse, because it kind of, people are not doing anything, You know, we really don't got the entertainment like we had, like we had. So when you have UFC on and people not doing anything, they're tuning in, you know, especially me. Like me, you know, that's why I say I'm the people's champion because the thing about me, I got the whole, I got the whole Michigan behind me.

Really, I got the whole Midwest behind me. You know, I got no people all over, you know, I ain't look for, I'm everywhere, you know, Chicago, Indiana, all over Michigan, Detroit, Lansing, Jackson, me in Kalamazoo, just all over, like, Michigan and General Battle Creek. It's everywhere, you know, so people, people know me. And yeah, like I said, man, like I had people tuning in. Was that the scariest knockout of your career? Like, it was definitely scary to watch on TV, seeing him drop like that and seeing him out and stiff like that. How concerned were you for his well-being after the fight? Was that like one of the scarier knockouts of your career?

Definitely was. I'm not going to lie. Just off the strength because I know, that, you know, it's a sport, you know, and I'm a dangerous fighter. And I feel that at the end of the day, like, when I'm in there, it's kill or be killed. But outside of the cage, you know, I really don't, I know people have, I know people have lives. That's somebody's son. You know, that's, I don't know if he got kids or not, but that, that might be somebody dad, you know, or somebody husband or, you get on me?

So at the end of the day, like, I never want to hurt nobody, like, too bad. because, you know, at the end of the day, it's just a sport. But while I'm in there, you know, it's going to be killed. And after seeing them down so long, I, you know, I did get a little concerned. Like, you know, I just hope you all right. Because I know you were celebrating, obviously. I mean, that's just such a surreal moment to land a shot like that and get a big win and do it in front of Dana and such a weird time in the world.

You did the backflip and everything. Was it kind of hard to celebrate it or because he was so down? I mean, no, no, definitely. I mean, it wasn't hard. It wasn't hard. Like I said, man, you know, I'm always humble, though. I'm always humble. You know, I'm always humble.

You know, I'm always humble. But at the end of the day, you know, I still, I still, that's a, I put a lot of work in that, you know, there's a lot of pain and suffering, man, a lot of discipline going at. People don't see what's going on in the fights. You know, the fight is one outside of the gym. I mean, outside of the case, the fight is one getting prepared for the fight. You know, that's the behind the scenes.

That's what we're working. You know, me watching what I'm eating healthy, you know, I'm self-motivated. Nobody had to call me to get up, run miles. Nobody had to call me to go to the judicial gym, to go to the wrestling gym, to go to the boxing gym, you know, to cut the weight. Nobody had to do that. That was just me.

So, of course, like all that discipline and days and days leading up to it, you know, I had to celebrate. It wasn't hard. I know you spent some time at Jackson Wing in preparation for this fight. How long did you spend out there? Just a week, just a week.

But in that week, you know, I just got better. You know, I was able to get one-on-one with Greg. I was able to get one-on-one with Winkle John. And then, you know, the people there, there's a lot of talent as well. And it didn't even have everybody there. So, you know, I'm going definitely go back. You had some words with the big boss after the win.

Dana White, as you were walking to the back for your post-fight interview, he had that look in his eye, man. What did you guys say to each other? He was just like, you know, that's one of the most vicious knockouts he's seen in his life. And I'll just, you know, just thank you. I was just grateful to be there, you know, just had an opportunity. You know, like I said, when opportunity in preparation, me is nice. And that's one thing about me.

Like, I never wanted one of my previous interviews, I've always said, like, the thing about me, I'm a fight at heart. I love to fight. You know, it's just not about the money. Of course, if I'm fighting these when I get further in my career and I'm fighting guys who, like, top 10 or top 15, of course, like, they got to pay me what I'm worth. You know, I'm a businessman as well. you know, I'm not trying to make, I'm not trying to make X amount of dollars and they're making, you know, way up here, you know, because you got to give me what I'm worth.

But then the day, it's not about the money for me. It's about, you know, just to continue for school to growth, just the opportunity, just keep being great. And, you know, just my legacy. That line you dropped in the post-fight interview with Michael Bisbing, people going to keep sleeping on me and the doctor going to keep waking them up. man, that thing was awesome. That was very powerful stuff. Do you feel like people may be done sleeping on you now that now that you've given everyone your division, especially a bit of a reminder

since they haven't seen you in nine months or so? Man, you know, truthfully, I really don't care, but I think that, like I said, you know, when I feel like I can say what I want to say, and, you know, I'm a decent speaker, but the end of the day, I got to continue to just keep, I'm more of a doer. I mean, I like to talk with my hands. I like to speak. I like to speak on my actions.

So people could know what I'm saying with my hands. They can know what I'm seeing with my actions, just like Saturday. I feel like some people, they might sleep on me. They might still be sleeping, but it's going to take me to continue to just keep winning, maybe two, three more fights, and then, you know, put the division on, you know, for them to put some respect on my name. Any, any, any, I know you just fought on Saturday, but any movement on the, on the video game fronts, the Chaos Williams video game character? No, you know, I don't think, I said something about the video game. I guess that I didn't even know that, but I guess, you know, D.C. said no.

Somebody retweeted, told me, D.C. said no. But, hey, but I could have swore that the two people I just beat were on a video game. I'm not mistaken. But, hey, I don't know. Are you cool with that? I mean, you're okay waiting? I mean, after two knockouts like that, you should be in the freaking game at this point. I feel, I agree.

You know, but the end of the day, you know, it's guys timing. It's guys timing. denying me. I'm going to end up getting on there eventually. You know, my main thing is just, you know, keep winning. At the end of the day, just keep winning, keep getting better. And, you know, that's really it. You know, the game, that was something I just had to put out there because

I have people that, I got game for friends who ask me, and people always ask me, so, you know, I had to put it out there. And hopefully they do put me on there. You know, I'm making noise. You've, I mean, when I last spoke to you, your mentality's always been just line them up. I'll fight whoever the

UFC gives me, but right now, got a lot of momentum and I feel like you're in a place where if you want to, you could call your shot if you want because a lot of eyes are on you right now. What do you want next? Like who sticks out to you as a fight that you would like at 170? Well, I got people ask me this a lot. One thing about me, like, it's not really nobody that really stick out to me. It's not really nobody that stick out to me for real, for real. You know, like you said, man, all lies with me like pop. At the end of the day, you know, it's all, you know, I'm just playing it by ear. I'm just playing about ear. I'm just playing about

you're taking it day by day. And, you know, I let the matchmaker do their job. I let Dana White, you know, talk to the matchmaker. And, you know, we can make something happen. But, you know, I ain't giving nobody no extra clout. You know, I mean, I'm here. So, I mean, even deep down, there's no one that you're thinking about. I mean, you have to tell me, but is, you not thinking about anybody?

No, I ain't thinking about nobody. Do you want to try again another one in this year? Like, if they offered you, I mean, you're still in Vegas right now. if they offered you a fight on any of these upcoming November cards, maybe December. Are you all over that? Maybe, you know, like I said, you know, I'm just planning. I'm just playing about air taking a day by day. You know, I never want to put too much on my play.

But I definitely, if the opportunity to present itself and it's right, I will get back in there. Where did you get the suit, man? That, as impressive as impressive as the performance was, I think you got even more attention for that suit you were wearing. And you looked like, like five billion, man. Where did you get that thing? Oh man in Detroit, man. You know, I can't give up the sauce, though, man.

I can't give up the sauce. Can't get my plug up, man. You know what I mean? Can't get my plug up. You don't want to give the guy a shout? Nah. You know what I mean? He got to pay me a little extra for that.

Ah, tushay, tushay. But I mean, you... Give me a free suit or something. I mean, did you think the suit would blow up the way that it has? Because, I mean, the picture, your photo with that suit on, that thing was everywhere on Saturday night. Right, you know, I made the suit. You know, the suit didn't make me, but, you know,

hey, you feel me? But I think it was going to blow up like I did, but I did know, like, I've been doing this. You know, my first fight, my first pro fight, I had the suit, like, three years ago, three, four years ago. Like, before, like, everybody seen Connor doing it and something like that. I got my own swag, man. You know, I've been dripped up.

You know, I've been Gucci down. I've been wearing designer way. before the UFC, people just not catching up. I've been wearing louis batons and, you know, driving sports cars and, you know what I'm saying, just living good. You know, I've been doing this, you know, like I said, I'm always humble, but I've been doing this, you know, people just not catching up. Yeah, it's a professional thing, right?

Like, you're a professional athlete. You compete in the cage as a professional athlete, and then after the fact, celebrating the win, you dress like a professional after the fact. Yeah, exactly. I noticed, and you talked about it in the post-fight scrum, you were wearing, the autism awareness lapel and you mentioned there were family members that you're wearing that in honor of and that got a lot of positive buzz in social media how important is it for you as your stardom continues to rise to be able to use your platform to raise awareness for things like autism

and other things for for good like that you know I'm the people's champ man like I said man you know some people hate me some people love me you know but at the end of the day as long as they watch and that's all that matters and as far as doing that for for autism and just, just, just, this everything I stand on, man. You know, I've done a lot of negative stuff back in the day, and now I just turned all that negative and made it positive. So I just want to have a positive I'll look on things, you know, like I'm me. And, you know, like I said, I came from the mud.

So, you know, I just want to shed a little light for the ones that feel stuck. I just want to use the platform for things. It's like we were talking about as far as like autism and stuff like that. I just want to use my platform to be able to, you know what I mean, speak life and just be positive on certain things as well, man, because, you know, everybody loves negative,

everybody love negative shit. It's easy to, it's easy to attach yourself to negative stuff, you know? Like, example, example. And, you know what I mean? Not like anybody like speaking, but example.

Everybody love you when you look, like everybody, everybody, everybody talking about you when you're dead and gone. You get on me? Right now, I just had a knockout. Okay. great knockout second fight co-main and event

great opponent knockout artists people not getting in there people not rushing to get in there with a guy like that you know what I mean they're not rushing to get in there with a guy like me either but I always get credit where it's due and he was a dangerous opponent

I knew what I was up against but I was locked in now as far as the negative side I was talking about like boom example if I was a and I ain't going to say me. But you get what I'm saying like die tomorrow man. It's like people blow up. They go blow up.

They blow up overnight type stuff, you know. I feel like I'm amazed that way in general. Like, and you probably felt this like coming up on the regional scene too. Like when you're winning, everyone wants to go out and drink beers with you and hang out. And then when you lose, like you know who the real ones are. And now that you're like running them, running them off here in the UFC and running up knockouts, I'm sure like either some of those people are coming back or, you know, new people are trying to come into your life. Like, what has that been like for you? and have you, you know, have you experienced that in your career? Yeah, you know, to come up, I mean, it's never been at this level, obviously.

You know, this is the highest level I can be on, on ESPN, Sports Center, UFC. So, I mean, it's never been like how it is right now. But coming up, you know, is this definitely, the people definitely been on me like this before, you know, winning, you know, 1,000 people liking your stuff. and everybody's sharing your stuff. Like, I've already had, like, a large amount of people hitting me up as I was coming up. You know, some people seen this. But as far as, like, now me being on ESPN and doing it on ESPN plus and the UFC, like,

man, my phone blowing up, man. I couldn't even read it all. I read all the messages, man. Like, I can't even see everything. It's crazy, man. How's the real estate game right now with the pandemic going on? Like, I know, like, here in Western Massachusetts, it's booming right now. I know you do different things with development and stuff, but, you know, people from the big cities are trying to get the hell out of Dodge and they're buying everything out here.

How is the real estate biz in Michigan right now? It's still great. It's still great. You know, everything's still moving, you know? That's one thing about, uh, land, you know, like, shoot, you can't get enough of it. My thing is, uh, I've just been focused on the fighting and stuff, so I kind of put it on hold a little bit, you know, just to be able to be at my best because I was supposed to. to fight in March. And that kind of got on hold. And I kind of got a little laxed in April.

I got a little relaxed in April because I'm like, man, here I am. I'm grinding. April come. I'm grinding. They shut everything down. And instead of like working on the properties or anything like that, I'm thinking I might have a fight, you know. So I kind of put that on hold because it's not going on where.

I just got to, you know, just pay the taxes on that. That's not going on where. That's going to be there. You know, but as far as me getting an opportunity. to fight, I got to be at my best. And I kind of put that on hold to be able to be at my best. And then when they shut everything down, I got a little relaxed. And they called me for a fight. And I'm like, no, because I don't want to sell myself short. You know, I got to be in my best. Yeah. Do they offer you something else before this last fight?

Yeah, they did. It was in May. It was like a two-week notice fight. You weren't interested in that. What you say? You weren't interested in that. You wanted to. to make sure your second go around. Yeah, I was still in shape. I was still in shape, but like I said,

I just wasn't in my bets. And any time I get in, I want to give the fans my best. Because I got a lot of people that believe in me. You know, I got a lot of people that spend their hard-earned money betting on me. Not only that,

I owe it to myself to be at my best. When I lose to draw, I got to be at my best because I know at my best, I don't feel like nobody can really, really touch me. You know, I'm a, you know, it's a guy giving talent.

You know, I'm a great athlete. It's not just about a fight. I'm a great athlete. Everything about me is just, I'm just focused, man. My mind, my body, just spiritually. It's everything, man, you know. I spend the time to meditate. I do this.

People don't see what on behind the scenes. Did anyone win a lot of money on Saturday off of you? Yeah, I had a lot of people that won a lot of money, man. People were sending me bets. I got people that spent $5,000. It's $5,000. A couple of my homies, man. They were sending me dudes,

bet 2,000, one like 5,500, another one of my homies, bet like 5,000. Shoot, one over 10,000. I got people that bet like 2,300. You know, I had a lot of people that spend money that I don't know personally. It was a little irritating before the fight when I had everybody blowing me up. Like, man, what you're about to do, man, what you're about to knock a mile or you're going to win? I'm like, man, listen, man, don't ask me if I'm about to win. You know, I do this, man.

I believe in myself. If you're going to bet them, you're going to bet them, you know. Hopefully they're Venmoing you a couple of bucks there, buddy. Man, shit, they need to. Especially when you're talking five, you know, four or five figures like that. Yeah. 10%. That's nothing.

It's nothing. For real. No, no. Very interesting guy, Chaos Williams. What a start to his UFC career, really intrigued about where he will go from here. Alex Kaley and myself try to make sense of it on this past episode of On to the next one. Although my pick is no more since Bilal Muhammad is now fighting Diego Lima in December. I thought chaos sliding in there to replace Sean Brady on December 19th was a very, very interesting option.

But for now, Chaos Williams will enjoy the win. Enjoy some extra time in Las Vegas. And congratulations to him as we get ready to say hello to a bucket list guest that I have been trying to talk to for a long, long time, probably four or five years at this point. Funky Ben Ascran, their weight is over. That conversation happens right now on what the heck. All right. So for years, people have been asking me, when are you going to interview Ben Ascran? And for years, I've tried into no avail. But luckily, for the first time in my career,

Funky Ben is joining me on the other side of the camera, former Bellator champion, former One Champion, former UFC Welterweight. And now he's living that retired life. But still involved in the game. He'll be part of the Apprentice, one championship edition that's going to be dropping soon on the one app. But Ben Ascran, happy to have you here, sir. How are you? I'm doing pretty well. I was up early this morning. I was some of the side of the globe, getting some work done,

do some reading. Life's pretty good. So where are you right now? I'm in Singapore. Oh, no kidding. How are you enjoying the trip? You know what? They're very strict over here with the Corona thing,

way more than so in America. So when I got here, I had to get tested. I did a two-day quarantine. They're still very strict and regimented on what I can and can't do. So I would love to have a little more freedom, but I understand how they like to roll over here. So I get it. So I have a lot of work in my room. I'm getting stuff done while I have free time.

So what are you doing in Singapore, if you don't mind me asking, I'm sure. Is this one involved? Yeah, you mentioned it. Oh, you're filming, you're filming now. Yeah, I'm filming for The Apprentice to One Championship Edition. Yeah, I never been part of a TV production. So it's kind of an interesting. new thing. Obviously besides fighting, but like for a TV show. So I filmed with Brandon Berry yesterday. We had a good time.

We enjoyed ourselves. Yeah, it was good. There you go. So it has been right around a year. We're recording on a Monday night. So two days from right now, as we record, will be the one year anniversary of you going on Ariel Hawanis' M.M.A. show and announcing your retirement from the sport.

Isn't that crazy? It doesn't feel like that long ago, actually. it really doesn't. But that sounds to be, obviously, it was November of last year. Yeah, I mean, the whole last couple of years, it kind of seems like a blur to me, how fast everything went by from the unretirement to the fighting to the retirement again.

And then obviously this year with 2020 for everyone, it's been pretty wild with everything going on. So when it comes to the apprentice thing, I wanted to go back to this real quick. What is your role in the show? Like, I know that they're bringing, and there's a whole slew of you guys and gals that are going to be making special guest appearances.

But what is, I talked to DJ a little while ago. He said he's going to be a special guest judge of some sort. What is your role going to be? I don't even know what they would call my role, a special guest of some sort. I did some things. And I'm not really supposed to talk about what I did. So I'm going to have to leave it at that I'm a special guest.

But yeah, they got a pretty good group of athletes. You know, DJ was here, GSP, Penzo Gracie, Brandon Vera, myself, I think Angela Lee. I don't know who else. There might be a few more, but not too many more. One of the big reasons that you had to retire was due to you having problems with your hip, and I know it required a full replacement surgery, which you had a couple of months ago. You posted that it was like, it wasn't a full replacement?

It was called the Birmingham hip. You see, you want to see my skill is. I'll show you. Oh, geez. Yeah. I think it's massive. Yeah, so it's called the Birmingham hip. So what they do is they get it all cleaned up.

They cap the top of, right, the bone goes into the socket. So they cap the top of it. And then they clean up the inside and they put something on the inside. Yeah. So, man, I'm pain free. I was, you know, there's a whole bunch of other things. I knew a bunch of pain on my one side and range of motion was tied to my hip issue. but I had all kind of back problems.

And the day after the surgery, they were just gone. It was wild. I really, like, I wasn't anticipating that. I just thought I had a bad back because I'd wrestled my whole life. And then morning after surgery, I woke up and back pain was gone. And I'm like, yeah, maybe I'm on pain pills. Maybe that's it, you know? And then it just never came back.

Is this the best you felt in, like, years now? You know, it's one of those things where when you're in that, when you're in it, you just kind of, this is how it is, and you never really think about it all that much. And you just accept that that's the way it is. And so now, you know, even now that I feel good, it's like, well, I just accept that that's the way that I am. So I don't want to say, but yeah, I had relatively severe back pain to go along with everything else. And I had hip surgery and it's gone. It's tremendous.

And what a couple of months has been for you since the surgery? cryptocurrency is going crazy. Just today, dog, that's 20% boom on light coin I was watching. Let me make sure I'm not wrong. Yeah, right around 20%. We're going, we're in the bull market cycle. I'm having a lot of fun with that. Our wrestling academies are doing great despite the corona thing going on.

We've had absolutely zero transmission in our academies. So that's going really well. Yeah, having a lot of fun this year. Yeah, President of the United States called you a young superstar. Getting WWU. And the mail model. You're getting, you're getting W.W. Title belts.

I've got away with a lot of things in my life because of my looks. I feel you, man. I'm right there with you. It must be this facial hair thing we got rocking right now. One thing I did notice, you interviewed John Freaking Danahur. What was that like? I mean, you talked to him for about an hour. You know what else I interview?

I got the interview around Paul. And he's like one of my hebrose. this year. So that was, yeah, that was fun. Zandahar interview was awesome because, you know, they said like, hey, interview, interviewed John for 15 minutes or whatever. And, you know, we sat down and we just started talking and we kept talking and then all of a sudden it was like an hour. I'm like, oh, my gosh, it's been an hour, you know. So it was like a really organic conversation where I just had a lot of fun talking to another really, really great minding grappling.

How did you initially react to the Donald Trump thing right off the back? Because that was just great. I mean, most of the stuff is like, I'm not, you know, I know, people start tweeting me and I'm like, what are they talking about? You know, and then I have to go look it up. I'm like, oh, my God. It's, I don't know, it's equally terrible and it's equally terrible and great and funny at the same time. It's kind of a weird world where, you know, the president of the United States is referencing me multiple times. Probably not in all that.

He's saying positive things about me, but it's all circulating around an event that was very negative to me. But I think the ultimate turn is that George has become ultra right wing. I mean, he's going nuts on Twitter. It's pretty wild. It's just a crazy year for us all, Ben.

We're seeing all these things you never thought we would. Mm-hmm. And one thing we, I mean, maybe we were expected to see it at some point, but, you know, you're in Singapore filming for The Apprentice right now a little over two years after the trade is finalized because I think we just surpassed the two-year anniversary of that.

You're back teaming up with Chhatri and the promotion once again. How did this all happen to actually get you involved in the show? I don't even recall when he asked me for sure because obviously there was some hiccups this year with the pandemic. But he's someone I keep in touch with, I don't want to say, not on a weekly basis, but, you know, maybe a couple times a month, just touch base about something going on.

You know, we have a really friendly relationship. And, you know, we're both obviously interested in MMA, interested in the business of MMA. And, yeah, so I don't know. I talked to him kind of regularly, and he asked, and I said, sure. And that was that. Well, I'm glad you're here because I don't know when I'm going to get the chance to talk to you again. So I want to pick your brain about a few things if you don't mind. Ask all the toughest questions you got.

I'm ready for it. Well, this is all fun. This is all stuff you probably talk about day to day anyways. But, you know, obviously you're watching all these events. You're giving your takes on your various podcasts. But the popular topic in the sport right now, because it's late in the year, and it always seems to be this way, but it's a little more interesting now. It's the fighter of the year talk.

And normally it's either locked up or it sounded like two, maybe three fighters' tops. But this year, it is freaking wide open. And like, you know, most of the times it would go to a champion of some sort. But with COVID-19 going on, we're seeing fighters like Hamzat-Shamehameh. Maya, fighters like Kevin Holland. They're very opportunistic. They're making big strides and they have huge main events coming up with title implications this quick against Leon Edwards and Jackramancer respectively.

So with all this going on, how are you looking at the fighter of the year conversation right now? Yeah, that's a good one because I guess none of the champs have necessarily stuck out that far. And obviously, like you said, this year with the coronavirus situation, it's been really difficult for people to get regular bookings. And so it has been, a lot of people have been highly opportunistic, which is definitely the right move. Right. It's like if you're a fighter this year, especially if you're not like a main event fighter already, you need to just get your ass in shape and just tell the UFC like, listen, there's any quarantines, there's any positive tests.

I'm fucking ready. Like, you know what? Fly me to Vegas. I'll stay in Vegas for four weeks. And if any show, you know, opens up, I'm on it. I'll fly to Abu Dhabi. And if any fight opens up, I'm on it. Like, that's what the smart guys are doing right now.

I mean, that's literally what Chimae did. That first rode in Abu Dhabi is he fought, and he just stuck around. And I can't remember who fell out, but someone fell out. And he hopped in, like, what, 10 days later or something? So that's definitely the right move by those guys. Yeah, but you're right. No one really, like, sticks out that far and above anybody else. You know, Chimai if beats Lynn Edwards, I think it's probably

going to go to him. You know, of the champions, there's, I don't think there's any of them who even had, no one's going to have three fights, right, of the major champions. Saturday, Davis and Figuerreiro is fighting Alex Perez, both of their third fights. If Figuerre do wins, he won the title, beat Joe, be twice, he'll defend it. If Alex Perez wins, two finishes against top 10 guys, and then wins the title in a major upset, there's a, there's a possibility that the winner of that fight could be the frontrunner, at least for now, right?

Definitely a possibility, but for whatever reason, that flyway division isn't only generating too much attention. And whether it's fair or not fair, that has a lot to do with, you know, who's going to win the fighter of the year, 100%. What have you made? I mean, Shemaya, like you said, very opportunistic, stayed on the island, got to fight 10 days later.

But, I mean, I could have, I mean, we've seen fighters do the same, but I have not seen in a long time. Maybe like your impact in the UFC in that one year was just huge. Like you burst on the scene made a massive impact. Shamiath is kind of like the 2020 version of that. You made each fight around it bigger. And that's kind of what he's doing right now.

What have you made of like just his immediate surge? Like the level of opponents has not been tremendous. But if he goes out there and beats Leon Edwards, this is just outrageous. Is it not? Well, I don't, you know what? He's one of those things. And I've said this multiple times. but the formula for what makes a star is fascinating to me

because there is no formula. It doesn't, I mean, Chamaima doesn't really make a whole lot of sense. It's like he's like a little bit funny but not that funny. He's won fights in a handful of different ways. It's like, why did he catch on so fast when, you know, there's other fighters in UFC who, if you list at a level of criteria that you would say for a superstar, they probably would fit the criteria much better than Shemayev would.

And there's just something about the story where he fought at different weight classes, he turned around in 10 days. There's just something about that story that, for whatever reason, it has caught on like fire. And yes, if he beats Leon Edwards, especially decisively. If he doesn't win decisively, it will take a little bit steam off. But if he beats Leon Edwards decisively, he'll probably be a top five personality in UFC.

by the end of 2020. Just so crazy to see this rise. It's so unbelievable. It's just unbelievable to think about this year and this search. One thing I'm sure you've touched on many times over the years. A few weeks ago, we saw Habib Nirmaga Madoff submit Justin Gaiji, retains his title, subsequently retires. And then as you've seen, like when someone like Habib wins a fight,

especially the way he did it, it spurs up, you know, the goat chattered. I believe it was like in May when Connor made his list on Twitter. and then you revealed your list on Twitter. And you had GSP and Jones, D.C., Silva, Habibs. My list had the seven possibilities. Right. I think it's just so hard to pick one because I think there's a lot of other people

who have really, really, really good arguments for being the goat. And so, you know, with Khabib, you know, at 29 and 0, and they've all been relatively dominant. There haven't been really very many where you said, oh, shit, I don't know if he's going to win this one or going to the fifth round. And so given that fact, you'd think, okay, it's an obvious one,

but then you know when John Jones says, well, you can only defend your belt four times, like, or whatever it was, well, John Jones's got a point there, right? He really does. But then we don't know what John Jones. He's failed, like, three drug tests now. You know, that if someone wants to count that, it's like, it'd be like saying Lance Armstrong,

is the greatest biker of all time. Like, I'm sure there's some people who consider him that, but most people have just thrown him out of the discussion because of the extracurriculars that surround his career. And so when you're making that list, there's just, it's so subjective to what you think, what your personal opinion is on what matters. Yeah, I think the go topic is fascinating to everyone

because there's just not a clear cut, like, oh, yeah, it's obvious. this guy, duh. Like, there's no way anyone would say that. Yeah, and I think what throws people off sometimes is that they combine the goat in the pound for pound discussion because to me, like, goat is like all time, start to finish entire career. But pound for pound to me is like right this second, right now, who is the most dominant fighter in the world?

To me, John Jones, GSP, they're in the goat conversation, maybe one A, one B. And then right now, it's hard to argue the Habib is not the best pound. for pound fighter on earth. It's just so dominant. Jones has gone to decisions. Habib's just running through people. People just have a hard time separating the two. You know what I mean?

Yeah. Well, I didn't admit that would go to like, are we judging, when we talk about goat, are we judging a peak or are we judging a longevity, right? Because, you know, John Jones has held that longevity

for quite a while. He's been either the best in the world or questionably the best of the world with some asterisk because he's sitting out. because of whatever reason he's sitting out for at the current time. Yeah. And so I, you know, this again, where some people have that,

I don't want to say it's confused, but there is this, you know, is it the peak or is it the longevity? And then, you know, like, with an Anderson Silva, if he would have retired on top, like, whenever before, say he retired before the Weidman fight where he lost, people would have legitimately considered him a goat and for a very good reason. But, you know, so he was up here, on this plateau and then he drops off at the end.

And so a lot of people are then taking his name out of the discussion. But does that, you know, do those later fights? And this is, honestly, I don't have a great answer to this. Do those later fights really have that bad of an implication on what he did earlier? Or did what he did earlier? Can that stand on its own as a body of work? And then you don't detract from his later work. Yeah, because I found that interesting that you put Anderson on your list,

but you didn't put Fedor and BJ Penn on your list. because they didn't retire early enough, but Anderson was there. Man, BJ was, BJ is a tough argument. Fidor, Fero is easier, I think, is that you could,

there's a legitimate argument to be made that the best heavy weights in the world weren't actually in pride. You know, a lot of people thought that unequivocally, the best heavy weights in the world were in the pride organization while Fidor was there.

And, man, I think you could make an argument otherwise. At the time, no one was making the argument, but when we look back at it, the data, I think that's pretty unequivocal that there's a good argument who made the best heavyweets were not all there. Do you think Habib comes back? Hope not.

I always want, I love reading about great athletes, and I always wanted it for myself, I fucked it up, right? I always wanted an athlete to have like that picture of perfect ending because there's so few that actually have that ending where they're on top, they did everything they wanted to do, and they're right out into the sunset, and they said, I don't need this shit anymore. So I hope so.

But, you know, I don't know. What about you, man? I know you just had surgery. You're feeling good. The back pain has gone away. But, I mean, you're a pro wrestling fan as well. There's always that never say never mantra in the pro wrestling world, WW especially.

Like, can you say definitively that we have seen your final fight, Or do you think, you know, right place, right time, right opportunity, right money, maybe you'll scratch that itch? We would say, I would say never to say never. I think it's unlikely. I'm going to wrestle next year, not WWE wrestle, real wrestle. I mean, I need a reason to train and be in shape. I love eating freaking ice cream and everything else. So I'm like, I don't have a good reason.

I haven't got on a scale in a year. I haven't got on a scale since I fought Damia Maya over a year ago. If I have a good reason to get a scale, I'm not getting a scale. I'm not getting on the scale. I don't know that ain't great for my health. So I'm not super obese, but I'm definitely in great shape right now. And so I can't really train like, I can like ride a bike right now. That's about all I can do with my hip.

But give me a few more months and I'll be able to get on the mat and start lightly doing some stuff. I'm definitely going to try to do some wrestling matches next year. Just so I give myself a reason to stay in shape. And, you know, I'm at the wrestling academy five days a week anyways, but it's not like it's going to change my life all that much. just get in there and hop in and work out a few times. Wow, look at you. I mean, not many people come back from that surgery and get on the wrestling mat that quickly.

Well, so my doctor doesn't think there's been anyone who's had the surgery and then fought professionally afterwards. He's had, I think he's had maybe a few golfers or a few other. He's done like 950 these. He's like one of the preeminent guys in the United States out of it. And I want to say maybe he did like The Undertaker or something like that. Yeah, so I want to do something, right? I mean, one of the main reasons I was excited to get this specific surgery,

if you get the full hip replacement, you can't do shit. Like, you can't run, you can't wrestle, you can't grapple, you're out on everything. And with the surgery that I got, I should be able to be full go after a year. Were you originally supposed to get the full hip replacement? There's, within the medical community, there's like a debate on whether this surgery is the better, better than the full hip. Because I guess there's a slightly higher failure rate or something to that effect.

But, you know, given my age and the fact that I'm young and I'm healthy and that this will give me the opportunity to do things I want to continue to do in my life, I thought this is pretty much, you know, for me it was a no-brainer. So a week or two ago, I'm like to surf in the internet like I normally do. I see your name popping up. And Jake Paul continues to say your name. Like he's about to fight Neil Robinson. What is up with this, man?

What the hell? Like he says he wants to box you, Mazadol and McGregor to prove he's a legit boxer. Like, I feel like the two of you guys have had this thing for a while now. Like, what is the deal? I was going to wrestle. Logan Paul came at me last year. And I think that's his brother or cousin or some shit. I don't know what their deal is.

But I think he was actually a wrestler. And he wanted to wrestle somebody. and I said, well, yeah, we don't got to do a full match, but I'll pin you in under a minute. No problem, Bubba. And he obviously did not accept the challenge because he pretty much knows that that's how it would go down. Yeah, and Jake Paul wants to box me?

I don't know, I'm not a boxer, but I could beat up a bum YouTube celebrity. Oh, man, I would love that. That would sell a lot of paperbears. It would be something to do just because you could say, like, I did it, you know? It's like, I don't got to go box. fucking Roy Jones got my ass whooped or not,

that I can boxed some YouTube bum and get paid for it? Like, what a tremendous livelihood. Yeah, absolutely. By the way, your son, Chase Hooper is getting back in the cage on December 12th. Yeah. We might have some more stuff coming up, then.

You never know. Oh, yeah? I know you guys did some stuff earlier, right? Yeah. Early filmed some stuff? Never know. Wow, okay. Have you seen them as of late?

I know you guys prank Daryl, But have you seen him since then? Oh, yeah, yeah. I don't remember what it was. A couple weeks back, a month back, something like that. Do you guys keep in touch often? Not super, I just reach out once in a while. Yeah.

Last thing for me, true or false, Dave Portnoy will be on the funky crypto podcast sometime in 2021. Man, that dumb ass sold out at like, you know, in the crypto community, you call weak hands, right? Because the crypto price, I mean, it's like, like coin, went 20% in the last 24 hours. But then it could drop 12% tomorrow, right? And that happens. And so, you know, I think he got in and he went on a little ride, went up about 20% and it dropped 10%. And, you know, he acted like a wimp, and he got out.

He said, I'm done with it. I can't handle this. So he's got weak hands. Once you've been in the crypto space for a while, you realize it's highly volatile. and I enjoy it. I always love gambling. It kind of kicks my gambling urge. I don't need to gamble because I get to watch the crypto markets.

Yeah, I think he's going to be on. He's been retweeting us a few times. I think he's got some curiosity around the show that we do. Yeah, I'm going to say yes, true. That'd be a pretty big get for you, man. He's a... Yeah, absolutely. Well, I appreciate it.

I appreciate the time, man. I know you're halfway across the globe and doing a lot of different things. And it's been, this is one of those bucket list conversations for me. I'm glad we're able to make it happen. Big shout out to one for setting this all up. But anything else you want to get off your chest before you say goodbye. I know you get a million things going on. No, it's follow me on social media.

If I see all my stuff at Ben Ashgren, you guys have it at the Instagram, but the same thing on Twitter. I don't really post all that much on Facebook. I don't really have Instagram. I really enjoy Twitter, mostly. And then check me out. One Championship, The Apprentice I did. Apprentice One Championship edition.

And who knows where else will be seeing me coming up. That was just great. Ben Asker joining the show and look at that, keeping that door open for a possible return. I would say the door is seemingly closed, but may not be locked altogether like you just heard. And to think this man is thinking of getting back on the wrestling mats after getting a major hip surgery not very long ago,

that's just something else. So great stuff from the funky one. and look forward to seeing what happens with him and his quest to get back to wrestling. Who knows? Maybe back in the cage. As we move ahead to, we go from the funky one to the smooth one.

Benson Henderson returns to the Bellator cage tonight. Bellator 253. Co-mate event taken on Jason Jackson, spoke with Benson this past Friday, and I always enjoy chatting with the former UFC Lightweight Champion. Check it out. All right. We have Benson Henderson joining us right now.

He's back in action this Thursday in the co-made event of Bellator 253. He's going to take on Jason Jackson. Ben's good to talk to you again, man. How are you? I'm good, man. I'm good. Not too bad at all.

Thanks for having me on again. Absolutely. So this fight seemed to have come together quickly, but Bellator likes to wait to announce these fights until the date gets a little bit closer. When were you made aware of this fight with Jason? I was giving notice about Jason a little under two weeks, no, two weeks ahead of time.

But I did text Mike Cogan. I did text Belator. say, hey, I don't need if I to tell you, tell you guys this or not, I hope you guys know this already, but if you guys had anything short notice, you know, 170, 155 is 155, I need a little more notice. I need about three, four weeks notice, 5070, give me two days notice, you know. If you guys need anything, let me know, though. And about, you know, two, three days later, four days later, he texted me and you up and said, hey, you want something short notice?

How about, you know, Jason Jackson, November 19th? Let's do it. I'm a Huckleberry. there you go what was the last time you've had a fight in like two weeks notice or that kind of short notice has it been a while or is this somewhat typical for you no that's not it's not too typical normally nowadays a belt or they give me a good advance notice ahead of time right not for a while I think not for a while to have a short notice fight it's it feel different I mean you've you've experienced everything at this point you've had short notice fights before in your career but does it feel different little old school here

No, it feels good, especially being at 170. It's nice to be able to concentrate on your opponent, you know, Jason Jackson, worry about what he brings to the game and not have to obsess about how many calories I've eaten today, how many calories I ate at breakfast, how many grams of protein I had, how many, you know, milligrams of sodium I've intook throughout the day, how much my protein was. So it's nice just to worry about fighting. and not all the other, you down the weight.

How much should you weigh, if you don't mind me asking, when you said yes to the fight? I think I was like 178 pounds, like 178.2 that day. I remember they texted and asked. Oh, there you go. This is easy, peasy for you. You're probably close to the weight right by now, right? You probably just walk in a little heavier weight.

I'm working my conditioning coach on being stronger, heavier at 170. so it's only only two weeks notice, you know, so it's harder to do that. But, yeah, I'm trying to stay away from being too light. There you go. So your last fight was back in August against Michael Chandler, and you were looking pretty darn good early on in that fight. You're really beating up his body, and then he lands that left hand and he ends up putting you away.

Obviously, not the way you drew it up, especially considering how fired up you were to run that one back. But, you know, wins and losses, you can always take something away from these fights. what were you able to take away from that fight despite it not going your way? The thing I did away most in the champion fight was him making an adjustment in the middle of the fight, meaning me not be able to adjust to it. He switched to a south ball stance, whether they saw something,

scouted something ahead of time, he switched to self-ball stance. And when he switched to south ball, I did attack right away. I didn't notice that. And then normally someone would switch his chance, they're not obviously as good in their off stance as they are of their natural stance. But he switched to southball. and I fired off right away. I was aggressive. I went forward right away.

I think a good, hard and body shot when he went to Southpaw. But I didn't make the defensive adjustments, I guess. But he came through with that good left hand. He landed pretty clean from his South ball stance. So I did not adjust accordingly. I didn't adjust enough. I mean, of course, we saw it that led to. Chandler goes into free agency.

He's now at the UFC. And he's one of the Bellator OGs, one of the faces of the promotion for a long time. Were you surprised that he jumped to the UFC or did you think he might, there's a chance he might have come, come back and stayed? I didn't really know. I wasn't really sure. Didn't have much, uh, didn't hear much one way or the other about it, really. How do you think he's got a fair over there? Last question on this and then we'll move on to the fight, but, uh, no, I think he knew really well, actually. I think he has the, the,

wrestling ability, oh, could be retired, so, but I think he had the, the, the, the wrestling pedigree to not get held down. I think he was wise enough of MMA Iq, MMA wrestling and I think he was good enough to not get held down by Kibib and then had the power in his hands because Kib got hit a lot. I think he had the power in his hands to put Kibb down, but whatever we're going to find out now. But I think he's texted very well against most of all the other guy that 1-85. I think he'll do very well. They'll hold his own. You know, he's a he's a true champion. Yeah, because it looks like maybe Tony Ferguson, maybe Justin Gachie seems to be in his future. You like his chances in those

fights? I think he's texted pretty well against most of those guys. I'll be interesting in seeing because he's a shorter guy how he does against some of the longer, better guys. He's gone against long guys in his past. In some of the fights that he's had a tough matchup or some of the shorter guys actually. But I still be interesting seeing I don't against some of the longer guys, especially some of the guys are like 6 to 3 on 135. I'm not sure how tall Tony is or what his reach is or anything. But I'll be interested in seeing a channel romance, a longer, taller guy with a reach of like 78 inches, 79 inch or so

and seeing how he's able to overcome that. So let's talk about Thursday night, back to Welterweight to face a guy in Jason Jackson. I mean, he's been in there with some big names. He's had his opportunities along the way. Very talented guy, just beat Jordan Meen in his last fight. Did you know much about Jason when you got the matchup and how do you like it now from like an X's a nose perspective?

I didn't know very much about Jason beforehand. I think I did see his fight with Ed Ruth. So the name sounded familiar, and I was like, oh, hey, I didn't think I even like I even got him in front of Ed Ruth. So, yeah, I didn't really know much about him. I think I only saw one of his fights. I do like to match up, you know, I think hopefully allows me the opportunity to showcase a lot of things I've been working on.

You know, I use the analogy that fighters, good fighters, you guys who, you know, who've been a while, been around like painters, you know, someone who paints something, they want to show it to the world. Hey, look what I've been working on. I've spent, you know, two months painting this painting is beautiful. It's amazing. I want the world to see it. Check it out, you know. Byter as myself, I'm the same way. Like, hey, I got kicked in the head 17 times. I got punching the body 27 times working on this new spin move I have. It's really cool. Check it out. I want you guys to see it. So I want to showcase the world to the world stuff I've been working on. So I think that Jason Jackson gives me a great opportunity to really showcase some things that were working on, whether it was, you know, against Chandler, working on it against specifically or whether it was against Miles Jury or Asi and O'Iad, out in Picolotti.

A lot of those guys, I got my hand raised, so that's awesome. I'm thankful for that. But I wasn't able to showcase a lot of the stand-up, a lot of things that were working on. I'm a stand-up coach of Rob Emerson. We're working on a lot of really cool new technique with him, and I'm being able to showcase. to land it pretty more, much more consistently in practice. So I just want to showcase that. I want to show the world like, hey, check this out.

Like he's going to catch my leg and I'm going to jump. I'm going to spin the air. I'm going to kick him to the back, you know, a back kick. You know, it's like you get very rarely, you get opportunities to pull and move off. I'm hoping to have those opportunities against Jason Jackson and pull off some moves I've been working on. That's what we like to see.

It's funny because you mentioned the painting thing because Jason Jackson's painted some really good paintings along the way. But when it comes to, you know, being credited and being asked to paint that masterpiece. He just hasn't been able to do it yet. Like, by his own admittance, like when it comes to getting that big fighter, getting that chance towards taking that next step forward, he's come up just short every single time.

He knows it. It's something that he's spoken about. Is that going through and like studying up on him? Is that something you noticed or is that something you don't really pay attention to? No, I haven't paid that much attention to his career, so I haven't really noticed that about him. It's interesting. It is cool to hear him say that, to acknowledge that.

I think for anyone to overcome a problem, they first have to recognize. They first have to understand it. So for him to recognize that, to understand that, say that speaks a lot about him as a person to recognize that as an athlete. But no, it wasn't something I was aware of, but something I intend on to keep on going for him. Like we said earlier, I mean, you've been doing this for a long time and you've seen it all at this point. but momentum is a big thing in mixed martial arts, especially even in like a team saying like over at the lab, I mean, you guys have a ton of momentum right now.

You got guys like Batista, Kyler Phillips, Casey Kenney's been on this crazy run as of late. And I remember I was having this conversation with James Krause before his last fight. And he said that, you know, when it comes to preparation, the vibe in the gym, that momentum makes everybody better, like everybody around him better.

But then you get locked in the cage and none of that matters anymore. Is that how you look at it as well? and how is the vibe over at the lab these days without the success you guys have been having? The vibe of the lab has always been pretty strong, pretty good. We're always pretty consistent. We've learned from our coach, John Crouch, for myself, you know, from all our veterans we learn.

You can't really ride the roller coaster. You have some big wins. You can't be all right on top of the world because then you get a loss, and that loss brings you back down, you know. Yeah, just not ride the rollercoachers to say even keel. Always consistently have great practice, consistently, you know, practice like, you know, our matcher there is to be the hardest

worker in the room. We have, we have a room for the young killers out there, like, who don't have big names or, you know, 4-0 or 3-0 or the amateur, you know, 2-0 as an amateur, but they work their butts off. They try to work every single day. They want to be the hardest worker in the room, you know, that myself, Jerry Cannonier, like you said, David Mischad, Mario Batista, and all these guys, these youngsters are trying to outwork us. And like, oh, man, like, yeah, they're bringing it today. Let's go. We got working that much harder, you know.

So it's a good vibe in the room. We're always just trying to get better. We're all just trying to be the hardest worker in the room that day. That day, who's going to be the hardest worker? You or me, let's find out, you know? So that vibe, we have a thing going up the gym. It's a great vibe. It's nice to have people who honestly care about you,

care about your family, your kids, and not just, you know, be there to punch you in the face and get better at punch you in the face. and then I'm just trying to help you get better, help your career, help you, you know, live your dream. So it's really nice to have that. I couldn't be doing this if I didn't have, you know, my gym the way it is. I couldn't go to another gym and be, you know, a punching bag or just be some guy and not have people I really care about, people that care about me. I couldn't do that.

From like a coaching perspective and a trainer perspective, are you excited to continue to see this evolution of the sport? because now you're seeing kids like, you know, kids 12, 13 years old. They used to be like at our age, they used to play baseball, basketball, football. Now they're training. They're in jujitsu classes. Like I have a niece who started jujitsu when she was seven years old and she loves it. And she's like obsessed with it. So seeing these next wave of kids just coming through by the time they're like in high school,

they're like ready to go. That's just crazy, right? Like you've been part of this evolution for a while now. Yeah, I think it's awesome. You know, I've been seeing the way. I've been seeing the trend. I think it's great. It's about your love of athletes going into the sport.

So throughout America for the past, you know, 100, 200 years, the top tier athletes from a younger age, 7, 8, 9, 10, they would choose to play, you know, baseball or football or basketball. All the best athletes would go do those sports. And then the third, fourth, death athletes would do the next sports. They would choose baseball first. The best athletes would go to the football. And then they would choose baseball.

And then they would choose basketball. and they choose soccer or whatever, you know, it's going on. And then somewhere down the line, it would be, you know, guys left over or whatever. So now we're getting in actual martial arts, you're getting guys instead of playing basketball, like you said at a young age,

instead of playing football, you know, you get these kids that are a monster, just athletes at a young age. Like they're just, you can just tell, like, there are a difference of, you know, a natural athlete who plays football and picks up right away is amazing. Those guys, instead of playing football, instead of playing basketball, they're

dedicating that they're spending that same time, same hours. Instead of dedicating it towards basketball or football or soccer or whatever, they're dedicating it towards Judicial or Ressing or MMA, even itself, not even wrestling, usually, but MMA itself. And those guys are going to be scary when they get to be 18, 19, 20 years old and put it all together. Plus, like the character development that martial arts presents, they're getting that at a young age. You're not coming in at 19, 20 years old with all this crazy life experience. they're like it's almost like you're getting them from scratch. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yep.

So you're about to join me in the illustrious 37 club, Benson. We're recording this on Friday the 13th. So Monday, I believe, will be your birthday. So happy early birthday to you. Thank you, man. I was doing my research before. You performed pretty well on your birthday weeks. I think you're two and one. The loss was the close. Yeah. The loss was the first Chandler fight. That was such a ridiculous matchup. Do you make a big deal out of birthdays these? days like I'm sure you do a little bit because you're a dad now but it's just like another day for you or do you use it as day to like reflect a little bit how is that for you no yeah my birthday is that

haven't been a big deal for me since uh for a long time this is i was 20 or so I I realized early on like hey it's it's cool like yay awesome birthday but it's just another day man like it is the day hopefully you do have some time to reflect and hopefully you can do your spend your day doing stuff you love doing something fun and cool like I mean going a while and crazy but You enjoy you sit down on the couch and your family and hang it out and then you know do that. Have that be your celebration, you know. But now birthdays haven't been my mom wife hates it. She always does something big and crazy and have big, you know, big birthday party for me.

But now she realizes, oh, you're, you're boring. You're old. You were old at like 24. You didn't want to have a big old birthday party. You're boring. You're old. And like, yeah, I am. Like, I just don't know this earlier.

Yeah. And you get to spend it. and beautiful Uncasville, Connecticut. Yes, amazing, Unkisville. But we'll be there to go to work, get my hand raised, and then come home and hopefully have a nice chill celebration now. There you go. So how do you gift yourself this early birthday present?

How do we get this done? You know, you get some tricks up your sleeve. And is there a certain way you see this going down, or are we past that stage of your career? No, just get my hand raised, just doing whatever takes. You never know which way a fight is going to take place. You never know if you think you've been scouting the whole time, guys staying traditional, and they filmed out southball,

or vice versa, or whatever the case may be. So just go out there, get my hand raised, go do whatever it takes, you know. If he, you know, turn into a boxing match, turn to a boxing match, turn into a juicy match, just go out there and get the job done, go get your hand raised, go do whatever it takes. And that's, you know, pretty much me in a nutshell. Yeah, the last time we spoke, you know,

Bellator wasn't even running events. It was a while back and they were running some programming, reliving past fights. And they've made a lot of moves since then. Now with CBS Sports Network, some interesting opportunities, some moves being made and a lot of free agent and prospect signings along the way. Like what have you made of all these changes and the approach Bellator has been taken over the last several months? I think it's super awesome. I think it's great. I think it's smart.

I think, you know, Scott Coker, Mike Cogan, all those guys, I think they're doing it the right way. They're building talent from the ground up. They know how to build talent. They know how to build some of the best, you know, current day martial artists all came up under, you know, D.C. guys consider him to be the best martial artist ever, or, you know, right now currently walking around. And, you know, he came up under Scott Coker.

Scott Coker built him, groomed him to be the man that he is, to have the wins that he does. And he had certain matchups along the way. He didn't give him a hardcore, dynamite awesome striker when he was 2-0 and when he was 30-0 he said hey let's give you this guy this is a good match for you and they built daniel cormay into the into the fighter that he is so scott gore definitely knows what he's doing he knows how to get it done i think the cbs deal is huge

and i think it's amazing think it's awesome uh i think prime time television is is the way to go i think that um you know some some big huge things are have been whispered in the backgrounds of the belter guy so I'm waiting to hear, I can't wait to hear, all the rest of things unfold the next couple of months. Did you watch the card last night? No, I missed one last night. I saw some of the highlights.

I saw some of the highlights, but I missed the card. I could have watched the whole thing. I got a five-year-old, a three-year-old, a one-year-old, and a three-month-old, so I don't have a lot of time for any other than TV watch. As soon as I get home, my real job starts when I get home. Yes, I have a seven-year-old. who's sitting right in front of me nice and quiet, which is pretty...

Oh, nice, awesome. Yeah, normally he tries to sneak in here, but he's watching something, so that's good. But I'm sure you saw Patricia Pitbull's knockout, the highlight of that, not going to Patriot Cabario. I mean, you do have a victory over him, and since then this guy has been on a mission,

double champ, et cetera. What have you made of his surge, man? I think he's doing great. He's one of those guys who's a constant professional. You know, he's a true pro. He's not too much of a trash talker either. I love that. I'm not a big fan of trash talkers.

I can't stand trash talkers. So I have a lot of respect for Patricio because normally he doesn't talk to him or smack unless someone says to him first. He didn't really talk to much smack or anything. So I like that a lot. He's just a true pro. He always goes in, he busts his butt.

He works hard. Goes his fights. He shows up. I think he's a true professional. When I say true professional, I use that as a compliment to a younger guy. Like, oh, man, you're really becoming true. You show up to practice after a hard loss.

You show up to the gym on Monday. You lose on Saturday. You don't have any injuries. You go up to the gym on Monday, ready to get better, ready to work out, ready to improve. You have a huge win. As a true professional, as a true vet, you know, hey, I gotta get back in the gym,

I gotta get better. The youngsters already watching the film on that, and they're already dissecting the smart coaches. A lot of smart coaches in M.A. Those coaches are already breaking down that. My last performance is always looking for holes in my game, how to beat me. So a true professional, true vet, has a big huge win on Saturday.

And guess what? He's back in the gym on Monday. So I use that true pro as the biggest compliment as I can give. And I think Patricia was a true pro. And I think he's reaping a lot of rewards now from all the hard work. Well, I think it's fair to say that you are a true pro as well, Benson. I always appreciate the time, man. Big fight coming up on Thursday.

Again, happy birthday. All the best to you on Thursday night. And pleasure as always, sir. Benson Henderson back at it tonight. Bellator 253 co-main event matchup at 170 pounds with Jason Jackson. That is the co-mate event. And what an opportunity for Jason Jackson. He's gotten a lot of opportunities, very talented guy.

He knows that he's gotten opportunities. But for some reason, different varying reasons. He just hasn't been able to get over that hump. Maybe tonight is tonight. If he can get a win over Benson Henderson tonight, that'll be massive for him. So make sure you check out that event. main event is just sick. It's so good.

Dary and Caldwell versus Aegee McKee, CBS Sports Network. I know what I'm going to be doing tonight. I'm watching that. I cannot wait to see how that fight plays out. During this big week in the world of mixed martial arts, we get ready to wrap up what the heck this week. Some news and notes. Let's get to a couple things trying to get my brain working here.

Oh yes, Cambache, Brazilian news outlet Cambaché reported that the Walterweight title fight between Kamara Usman and Gilbert Burns has been agreed upon for UFC 258 on February 13th. I am told that is the plan. It is not done yet, but that is trending in the right direction. Same card also added Chris Wyden versus Uriah Hall. That is good to go for February 13th. And another on to the next one selection. I know AK just introduced a new segment called Check the Tapes on onto the next one,

where we kind of prove our theories that. our picks came true. I have to be up at least a touchdown right now on AK in terms of how many of my picks from on to the next one became reality compared to his. And how about January 16th? Max Holloway versus Calvin Cater in the main event. A plus plus matchmaking right there. Good fight for Max. It's been a while since we've seen him in a fight that didn't have any kind of title implications, kind of takes the pressure off of him without having a championship in play. And also, huge fight for Calvin Cater. Well deserved.

I love it. I cannot wait for January 60. That's a good one. Fabricio Verdoom signed with the Professional Fighters League after a brief stint into the free agency world after he defeated Alexander Gustafson. So good on him. She's going to try to win that million bucks.

Kayla Harrison, also from the PFL. She returns to action tomorrow night for Invicta in the co-made event. Invicto FC 43. So there you go. Like I said, a lot going on in the sport. One more interview to get to, but just wanted to give a big thank you

and shout out to all of you watching this or listening to the sound of my voice right now, 34 episodes in the books. And I feel like we're just getting started right now. So thank you, really appreciate. Of course, we have all your UFC 255 coverage throughout the rest of the week. And weekend, our friend Jose Youngs.

Out in Vegas right now, Wayne and preview show tomorrow, Friday, all the post-fight chats, post-fight show, et cetera, on Saturday. So keep it locked to MMAfighting.com. Big shout out to Casey Liden on the show. production, Jose Young's, Alex Savas on the graphics, bugging them every day. Appreciate them coming through, as always. So have a heck of a week, everybody.

Enjoy the fights. We'll leave you with my chat with the victorious Ashley Yoder from this past weekend's UFC Vegas 14 event. See you later. All right, we have Ashley Yoder joining us following her unanimous decision win over Miranda Granger this past Saturday night at UFC Vegas 14. Welcome back to the show and the win column, Ashley. How are you?

Hi. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, definitely a relief to be back in the wind column for sure. Yeah, I was going to say, because the last time we spoke was before the Lavinia Sousa fight, and obviously that fight didn't go your way. But, you know, coming into a fight, losing back-to-back appearances, how important was it for you to walk out of Las Vegas, come home with a victory under your belt?

I think it was underestimated to say that it was very important. It was super important to me. and, you know, I think it kind of reflected in the beginning performance of kind of playing a little too safe more than I'd like. Not my best performance to date, but I feel like it's just one of those things in the back of your head. You're trying to not lose position and sacrifice any points, you know, so, yeah, I'm definitely excited to be able to have that kind of relief off my shoulders for getting back into the wing column. So it's nice. Did you feel any extra pressure at all? Like, I know a fight is a fight and there's not pressure just going in there to fight, but did you have any?

Any sort of extra lying pressure on you that knowing that maybe your back was against the wall losing too straight? You know, I've just had a rough, you know, running so far. So I think on myself maybe. But, you know, every day we have to prove ourselves win or loss in the UFC. So I think it was just more for myself, kind of getting that wind back in my sales. Miranda came into the UFC, undefeated from the tri-state area. won her debut. She's lost her last two. Finish her for sure, but she seemed, you know,

you seemed to be ready for everything that she brought to the table, able to sort of stalemate everything she tried to bring forth to you. Did anything surprise you at all in the fight from Miranda? No, not at all. I think for my personal self and my performance, I was holding back a lot on like some of the scrambles. I think I was trying to get more of a solid position. it was kind of like not my style and I like to grapple I like to roll around like you know I mean I don't get called the spider monkey for nothing so but yeah no she was a super sweet very tough opponent you know she's as a first person I'm I fought in 115 that's bigger than me I'm like how are you bigger than me like you know she's very skinny I'm not talking big in that sense we're all small but like just her her shoulders were bigger you know she's just bigger than me so I was I was very um

surprised by that. You know, I thought we'd be, I mean, we're pretty close, but it was just weird because I'm usually the big one, like always towering people. So the switch seemed to flip in the third round. You became much more aggressive. You were very, very close to getting that first UFC finish that you've been looking for for so long. What was the, the conversation like in your corner between the second and third round? It was a little bit of like, you know, them's just saying it could be one in one, which I knew it was one in one. In my mind, And, you know, at that point, I was like, you know, I think a switch hit, like, you got to leave it out there. You have to show them you want to be here.

And it was more, I think, an internal, like, all right, we got to do this. You know, I really have to just, like, make a stamp on that third round. And I wish I would have done it earlier. You know, the capabilities were there to do it earlier. I just, you know, I got to get, I got my trust back, I think, after that fight, you know, feeling, like, good in those positions and being able to handle my and just kind of be present in the moment really helps. So yeah, that third round, I was just like, I'm leaving it all out here. Yeah, it's just sort of build upon that.

You know, you and I have spoken quite a bit over the years. And, you know, you've said many times that, you know, I mean, you're still, you're still relatively new to the sport. It's not like you were a lifelong martial artist. Like you're continuing to evolve. Like, you even said it after the fight. Like, you are the definition of MMA. Like, you're very technical.

You're implementing new tools to your game. And I'm curious about this because I'm not. a fighter, which is why I'm asking this question, because obviously the technique is there, the athleticism is obviously there. Do you feel like at certain points in these fights that you have a hard time? And there are fighters I've talked to over the years that have felt this way. Do you feel like you have difficulty tapping into that sort of dark side, that aggressive side, like from the outside looking? Yeah. I mean, we saw it in the third round, but you know, do you feel like that's a place that's a bit difficult to find once you're in there?

No, I think, you know, to start off it is, I mean, to answer your question in absolutes, I think coming into a fight the very first, the very first round is always rough just because you're trying to get the fill out process. You're trying to be on your game and understand if this person's going to do what you kind of game planned for or are they just going to throw something crazy out of nowhere. So it's a very unknown kind of area in that first round and the first exchanges, how hard is this person punch? What's their head movement like? you know those little things you have so many things going through your head um but at the same time uh i think like that third round like it's if it's capable in the third round it's definitely capable in the first so it's one of those things that like now i have that kind of all right we're not fighting for our lives at this point you know so i feel like i can go in there and be myself

and i feel newer in the fact that like going into this fight i felt uh my weight cut was perfect like everything I slept before the fight for the first time like my last fight I did not sleep the night before so it was such an amazing feeling to have those good things go by and going all the way up into the fight and even the last minute like they're like I thought there was an extra fight in between before I had to go out and I're like no you're going now so normally that would kind of throw me up but I was fine with it so just I feel like as you know like over the years that I've had a lot of fights in the UFC. I've had, you know, but I'm still learning. So it's, it's kind of weird to kind of talk to someone that doesn't understand that. They're like, what do you mean? You've had eight fights in

UFC now, two on the ultimate fighter, you know, so I'm, I'm experienced on that side of like having higher level, but I'm still trying to understand myself as an athlete, too, because I never did team sports. I never, well, I mean, I swam, I did track, but nothing like in collegiate level or even high school level that really required to understand yourself, you know, so. What was that like to just feel like that for on a Saturday night? Like nothing threw you off. You felt good. Weight cut was good.

You slept. I mean, sleeping the night before. That, a lot of fighters could say that. Dude, nine hours. Nine hours. I was, that is like a record for me. So compared to my last fight, it was, it's day and night difference. You don't have those.

Like, if you, I was doing everything that the UFC protocols for the Performance Institute has us when we rehydrate. I followed it this time to a T, and I felt so much better than I even, and I don't have rough weight cuts, but 10 pounds is 10 pounds. So, you know, you cut from, I walk around at like 125. I still have to cut down to 115. So it's never the easiest. It's more uncomfortable than anything, but everything just was like my stomach was feeling good, you know. So it was just a, it was a really good experience and it gave me like even more kind of fuel in my fire to be like, we can do that. You know, this is a possible of a feeling like you can feel good.

You just have to kind of have your right mindset about it and do the right. And just be smart about it. You were so close to that finish. You've wanted to get one in there so badly. Like every interview we've had, I want to get that first finish. I want to get that first finish. How bummed were you when you heard that horn sound when you had that choke locked in? Man, it was heartbreaking.

But, you know, the smart thing for me was in my last fight, I got overzealous of trying to get it to the ground and jumping on a backfall. going off, getting bad position. And even though my, there was a lot of things that I did wrong on my grappling in this fight, the thing that I was like most proud of my whole fight, seeing an arm bar multiple times, and I didn't, the last round especially, I felt like she was like, take my arm, but literally I was like, I don't want to lose position. So it made me feel good going out after the fact that like I didn't sacrifice a submission attempt at that

point for position, especially when the rounds were kind of close. So I know that sounds crazy, but I mean, I saw that I wanted this arm bar so bad. And it was like, just keep working, you know, it will open up itself. And it is true. So I think that it gives me confidence, too, to know what I get those positions all the time and practice. And then you go into the UFC. And, you know, I started my career with all finishes and not getting those.

It kind of also takes the energy and wind out of your sales. But I feel like after this fight, I have a new fire. And I really feel, I feel like it's going to change a lot of things in my future. So I'm excited. Yeah, I was, I was going to say, because, I mean, the Sayuri condo fight, I mean, you made women's straw weight history. You got 30-24s on the scorecards, first time that ever happened in that weight class. But I feel after talking to you after that fight, compared to talk to you after this fight,

I feel like you took more away from this one than you did the 3024 fight. You know, I did. You know, and I kept trying to bring myself back to what was my mindset? What was so good that I felt? And, you know, at the end of the day, it was going into the fight. The locker room vibes were just there, you know, I didn't. That's the only thing I can remember from that fight that was like beforehand that was like going smoothly. And I kept trying to like, oh, okay, so, like, you know, I can get there again.

But I feel like the Sierra Kondo fight was a huge peak on what I'm capable of. And I've only gotten better since then. And I'm just ready to really, like, get back in there and show the world that, like, I'm meant to be in the UFC, you know? So I'm excited. Not happy with my performance, but I'm excited. What would you grade your performance overall? Gosh, a C. Really?

Have you gone back and watched it? Yeah. How many times? Maybe even a C-minus. Only once, only once right now. trying to let my coaches get on to me because you know it is a huge thing I go through a lot I've had a lot of losses this year like really close friends passing and it's just I've had a lot on myself so I need to embrace this wind and for what it is you know it wasn't that it was a robbery it wasn't you know there's always things to be worked on so I do understand that it's just you want so I'm a perfectionist man I want to I want to get this finish I want to get these wins I want to show you know know I want to be the potential, Ashley, that I know I can be.

So I'm just striving for that every time. You were fired up after the fight. You were bleeped from ESPN Plus. You're dropping F-bombs in the post-fight scrub. I was like... I try to try not to. You know, the thing is, I'm around guys a lot. So even Dana in the back is like, you could cuss as much as you want.

And then they're like, dude, how many F-bombs were you saying? I was like, I think that only said, like, maybe two or three. But I don't know. They were just bleeping me out. Like, no other. I heard it was really funny. It was, I was shocked. I was shocked, Ashley.

I'm not going to lie. You're like, you're like, you're a nice girl. I'm mortified now. Yeah, I didn't meet, you know, I was, I was fired up. I had a lot of emotions going, you know, I was going into this fight. Like, we, I just, one of our really good, one of my teammates just passed this week on Wednesday. And it was a sudden thing that we weren't expecting. So it was, you know, another thing to add the list.

I've dealt with a lot of death in my life, unfortunately. And just trying to keep. that focus on the task at hand. But I think it was really important to me after the fight to acknowledge, you know, the loss of anyone that is going on right now and how important it is to seek help.

So, yeah, that's basically where I was at, plus trying to be not cussing, but it just didn't mind. Sometimes the emotion just come out. One thing you mentioned the Postalite scrum is that you, I didn't even know you had a mental coach. You talked about mental coaching

and how important that is. and I'm sure with a lot of things that you've dealt with in the past and, you know, just fighting and trying to get better and trying to, you can get in your own head. Like, how pivotal has that been for you to work with a mental coach to prepare you for a fight and other things that happen? Well, you know, better late than never. I probably should have got one a million years ago, but even just for the losses of my family members. But, you know, for me, it was a blessing. I did reach out for help actually before my, before, after my, after my, my Singapore fight and it didn't work out.

It was a bad situation. And then I just decided after this fight, like I literally hired Brian. I was probably not even home from Vegas at the time yet. I'm like, I'm serious about this. I know this is what's holding me back. I got to fix this. So it takes a lot to do that. You know, it's very humbling when someone, you have to tell someone that, you know,

like I try to put this facade up that I'm really tough in the, gym because I'm the only girl. You know, they don't see me cry. They don't see my, my, my, some of my coaches in me behind the doors, you know, see me break down. But I keep a lot of this stuff. I shut it out. And it's definitely not the healthiest way.

But, yeah, Brian's been a blessing. And he's, uh, someone that's worked with guys in the, you know, GSP, Rich Franklin, uh, Donald Seroni back in the day, you know, he's worked with these guys that have done amazing things in the UFC. So, uh, I'm very blessed to work with him. And he's treats me no less or no more. than anybody else. So I'm very grateful. That's great. Pretty, pretty smooth night in a lot of ways for you on Saturday. But one thing that was not so smooth was, uh, the judging and the scoring in particular

throughout the night. Bruce Buffer is reading up the scores 3026, 29, 27, 27. And then he says 27.26. I mean, you had to have felt that when you heard 3026 and 2927, that you probably had won the fight. But when you heard 27, 26, what the heck is going on in your mind? I was like, is that even a possible score? I wasn't even sure. I was like, what is going on? I did, you know, I knew that the, I went into that fight one. I knew going in third round as one in one.

And I feel like being in top position and pretty much almost getting, I'm not pretty much, attempting a submission at the end of the third, um, solidified that round for me. Um, so yeah, it was, that was really, I was like, a draw. what is going on here? Like trying to do math. And I'm not, I don't know. I'm not a math major, man. I just got punched in the face.

I was like, I can't think right now. But yeah, it was definitely, man, I can't. I'm just not the person to be really put any faith in any judge, which no one should. But I feel like I'm definitely not. One of the things you've wanted to do over the last couple years, you want to stay active. You know, three months between fights this time, that's a nice sort of change of pace for you. But I know, with all. all these conversations is like two paths that you like to take. One is, you know, staying in the

gym, improving, learning, the other is just getting back in there and getting as many fights as possible. What do you feel is sort of your next move? Do you want to try and get back in there quickly, maybe get another one in this year, early next year? What are you thinking in that front? You know, hopefully I want to go home. I get to go home once a year. If I, if it wasn't Christmas right now, heck yeah, call me next week, you know. I'd be so down. I'm not injured. I don't have, no, there aren't any stitches. So I'm blessed on that side of it. But I only get to go home and see my parents once a year.

So I keep that in December. So, yeah, hopefully I want to, I'm thinking like February, mid-February. My coach goes out into Brazil as well for the first time he has been home in a long time. So he's my main man. So as much as I do want a quick turnaround, if it was before. for December 17th, call me, but I want to go home and see my family. I need to do that, especially with the times that are going on right now. So as long as the travel restrictions don't tighten up anymore in the next couple weeks,

hopefully I'm going to go home for two weeks and then come back and early in the year get another fight. One thing I kind of realized, and I know it wasn't necessarily supposed to be this way, because there were so many switchups and cancellations heading into Saturday, first main card fight in the UFC. Yeah. You know, I just, I found that out probably the same time you did. Actually, they kept telling me, hey, your report times one, your report times 130. Your report times 3.30.

I was like, okay. So we get over there and he's like, you're like the third to last fight. I'm like, what? And I honestly thought in the back, I had two more fights before I had to go. So one of my corners is actually coaching another. fighter that was fighting. So it was a little bit chaotic in the back because it went from like zero to here like real fast. Like all right, you're going. I'm like, all right, let's go. So it was a little bit intense. Yeah, I'm definitely excited. You know, for me, I just want the most

exposure as possible. If that's undercard, ESPN, like I, man, I just want to fight. I want to, I want to be able to reach out and, you know, get new fans to be like, hey, you know, women's MMA is legit, you know, or, you know, just get that new fan base for the UFC and for female fighters. So wherever I can get the most exposure. There's a new teammate of yours in the UFC right now, right? Jared Vandera is one of your teammates, right? Yes, sir.

And he is a stud. We actually share my birthday that I celebrate and his birthday are in the same day. He is. And it was nice to see him get his shot because a lot of people felt like he should have got this call a little bit earlier than he did. What was that like for you to watch him go out there, get a finish and make it happen like that? Well, it made me really excited.

I have 100% behind you on that. I think it's been, needs to the opportunity to be in the UFC a long time ago, you know, especially heavy weights. This guy is an athlete, not just a heavyweight. So, and he likes to fight. So why not? And I had the opportunity to be able to connect him with my agency and things happen. And, you know, he did the work to get himself there.

You know, he performed and he got his contract rightfully so. So I was just really excited to be able to kind of connect those two together so he could make his magic happen. So I'm very excited for him. It's really, really, it's a great thing. He's got a little family he's starting and the gym he's picked up. So I'm grateful for that. I interviewed Jared once last year and it was like almost a 50. minute interview because the man likes to talk.

It's pretty funny. And on the contender series, I don't understand about his self-confidence. He called himself ugly in his interviews with Laura Sanko like 11 times. Like, does he do that in the gym too? Oh, we don't ever really talk about looks, but he is an interesting character,

but he's like a through and through, like, I think he's just a specimen for that weight class man. He's a big boy, but he can move. So he does paint his fingernail sometimes, which I've always wondered about that, but I've never really asked. Well, there you go. Well, we'll find out more about Jared Vandera on December 12th. Makes his UFC debut, gets the callout that he wanted.

Sergei Spivak, he's going to get that. But as far as you go, congratulations on the win, Ashley. You had to dig deep. You got it done so close to that first finish in the Octagon. But maybe in the next one, it'll happen for you. But thank you for the time, as always. And all the best to you. Happy holidays.

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