Modern Wisdom - #125 - How To Become An Online Coach

Episode Date: December 9, 2019

Jonny and Yusef from PropaneFitness.com join me today as we talk about how to become an online coach. The opportunity to work from anywhere in the world, coaching clients into amazing shape, all whilst still only wearing your pants is a dream that many offline PTs and entrepreneurs want to achieve. Today we learn about Jonny & Yusef's journey to becoming successful online coaches, their best advice for wantrepreneurs who are just starting out and tactics which you can use as a consumer to protect yourself from giving your hard earned money to someone who doesn't deserve it. Extra Stuff: Get PropaneBusiness's Free 7 Step Plan - www.propanefitness.com/modernwisdom Check out everything I recommend from books to products and support Modern Wisdom at no extra cost to you by shopping through this link - https://www.amazon.co.uk/shop/modernwisdom - Get in touch. Join the discussion with me and other like minded listeners in the episode comments on the MW YouTube Channel or message me... Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chriswillx Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/chriswillx YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/ModernWisdomPodcast Email: https://www.chriswillx.com/contact Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Oh, hello friends. Welcome back to Modern Wisdom. Today I am joined by Joni and Yusif from propanefitness.com and today we are talking about how to become an online coach. Those of you who frequent the internet, especially Instagram, will have seen online coaches offering you transformations, diet and training advice. But how do you do it? How do you go from being an offline PT or perhaps someone who just has an interest in health and it? How do you go from being an offline PT or perhaps someone who just has an interest in health and fitness? How do you go from being a normal schmo who only exists in the real world to being the

king of online income? Well, Johnny News of New Business, which they've been working on for the last few years, coaches, coaches. They coach coaches to become online entrepreneurs and based on the results they're pretty good at it. Even if you have no interest in becoming an online coach, I highly advise that you enjoy this episode. Mostly because Joni and Yusuf are hilarious and their stories from over the last few years of how they've learned to become effective online coaches and some of the people that they've met are side-splitting. On top of that as well, it will protect you from

the spurious and nefarious tactics that some online coaches are using to get you to part from your hard earned money when they don't deserve it at all. So, let's get on the side of the good guys, listen to this episode and if you've got any questions, comments off feedback You know where I am at Chris Willx on all social media But for now, it's joining a new safe time also while this intro music is playing go and give us five stars We're ever you listening it would make me very happy indeed I'm Johnny from Esif. Johnny from Yousif. Johnny from Yousif. Johnny and Yousif for Proven Fitness. Did you mean to do that? No.

That's incredible. Johnny from Yousif, and Yousif who looks like Ned Flanders, to the people that are listening, Yousif is growing in a moustache for Moe Vemba, and he looks. I've been likened to every famous figure with a moustache over the month. Tom Salik. Have you had Tom Salik?

Captain Hook. Captain Hook. Very Captain Hook at the moment, actually. Did he have him? He had a like a red coat? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. If we get you a hat of red coat. Right.

Crash Bandicoot. You know, the character. Puprika. Puprika. Without googling it, did he have a chain on his jeans? Yes. Yes. He had blue denim shorts, red shoes and a Minnesota.

So Mike did this to me the other day and he doesn't have a chain but it just shows the power of sustainability. I was like, well, yeah, and then we looked at him up and he never has a chain He's like, ah, so that's why I'm thinking captain hook maybe didn't Really thought that was relevant It's not relevant because Chris has said you Chris has said you love to make a lot of money. Thank you. Okay, today we're going to talk about how to be an online coach. This is what Joni and Yusuf do. The new wing of propane is propane business.

You say you also have a new podcast. We do. The propane business podcast. I mean, it's not technically called that. What's it called? If you search propane business on iTunes, you'll get it. It's called,

or grow your online fitness business. The reason that it's not called the propane business podcast is, there are a group of people who make money from selling propane. Via a business. As a result, we don't, they do own the domain. And they wanted to sell it for 36,000 dollars to us.

And we said, Yeah, no, thank you. No, thank you. Propane business for people who want to get into the beauty in the industry business, yeah. You know Hank from King of the Hill. Yeah, that's what he does. He's in the propane business. And accessories for propane.

Okay. Propane and propane accessories. So there will be some people listening who think, I'm an in-gym PT, I'm fucking sick of this, sick of my clients, giving me the flu, I wanna work in my socks and my pants, I don't wanna do this anymore. I'm just gonna open the floor to you guys,

we have an hour for you to explain to people, should they go online? Should they do they need to have PT experience first? How do they do it and give us your best stories? So where do we start? You're doing an MRT, if someone who's about to go online, maybe to coach? Where do you start? You've got all the answers for this. So, this is where the hopper tater gets part of it to direct. So with this, I think that's an important observation of I want to work in my socks and pants at home. Like it sounds silly, but it is actually like you need to think how do you want your life to look day to day. And so a lot of people don't do this and they just go like, oh, I'm

interested in like lip biceps and stuff. So I'm going to go and do a personal training qualification. And they realize the reality of it is working in pure gyms, sort of slinking around and like sneezing on people to try and like gain new clients and working long hours, exchanging time for money and generally just having a bit of a rubbish time. Whereas if you set your goal on how do I want my life to look and then reverse engineer it, rather than I like this and so I'm going to do this and think about what the outcome ends up has. Some people might like the idea of being on the feet, talking, interacting one to one. Not good, but you're a great fit for a PT.

Quite a lot of people don't want to be exclusively online for that reason, because especially if you've gone from being an online coach, being an offline coach to fall online. Most ironically sedentary activity. You go from waking up at six in the morning and like non-stop till nine at night and to just wake up and go on. You top open, walled-end email. We've actually spoken to an online coach, we're not going to say his name, but at the end of an interview with him, he was like, so I've been coaching people online to get shredded for ages, but look at me and he stood up, lifted up his shirt and just went like, with his like fat balls.

And he was like, it doesn't matter, no one knows. That's fine. So we're a very well known guys, well. So, let's say that someone, the most common person, I think, that's going to be listening, or that's going to be interested, the most representative example for people who aren't coaches, is going to be an engine PT. Maybe we've been a PT for three years. Good clients, but they've realized, hang on,

unless I start putting my price up to 50, 60, 70 units per hour. The 50, 50 you ask? Newton minutes or something. Newton meters per hour. 50 kilowatt hours, yeah. And they're like, I want to earn some money. What do they do? Yeah, so the biggest mistake that people make in that transition is they think being an online coach is the same as being an offline coach. So when you are like impure gym with the words personal trainer written on your back, they don't realize it, but pure gym have done all of the work for you. They brought people to the door, they made them pay, which is a big deal, because all you're dealing with

is people who are paying for fitness, which is much just be there and not creep. And you've got words in your back that say, you're the expert, you can have a fucking clue, but it says, but it's not trading on your back. So everybody in pure gym thinks, oh, fuck it out, that's the guy I go speak to, yeah. And people still struggle.

So that person is struggling. They're like, oh, I've only got 20 clients, 30 couldn't have a bit shit, six in the morning, nine at night, don't see my friends at the weekend. I know I'll go online. What are people want a recipe book? That's what everyone wants the one a recipe book. So I'll make a recipe book, I'll make a logo, I'll spend five round on a website and I'll just try and do the same thing on the internet. And the analogy we use is you're like, you're the pivot of the family barbecue.

Because everyone's scrolling down, it's like cat food or cat food, a funny video, Brexit, Brexit, baby, baby. Someone trying to say something, I'm like, fuck off, like, ban, block, complained. And they're like, oh, but I've only got 10 spaces. So, you know, comment below, tag, tag, it's just not, it doesn't work. So, basically

in the current market, online market, or probably any industry, if you just shoot from the head and try and sell fat loss in the internet, like, because we were able to do that when we started, but the on 2008, it was because, like pre credit crisis. That's because... Did you cause the credit crisis? Basically, yeah. We posted on Facebook and that was it. Like that was in back in the day, it was beautiful. Where you could post on Facebook and get 200 likes for sharing like a daily mail article.

You could rank on the first page of Google for writing an article about domes or Ramadan or like, we're actually even about like much more basic stuff from that like hypertrophy. How do you hypertrophy? Yeah. Top hypertrophy. I want a hypertrophy. Google preferred. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. First page Google whereas now you just weren't much more sophisticated. Well, or just you know, there's a wider market. So the market's massive. And there are there are easily enough clients that go around.

But I'm not going to lock your iPhone first. Hey, Siri. Anyone? Anyone have any ideas? Are you leaning on your iPhone? Which home? Can we turn it off now? Moving on, the market's a lot more sophisticated.

The market's a lot more, well, the market's massive, but there are a lot more people trying to do it, because a lot more people are disillusioned with PT offline. So you just have to be more specific with who you try to reach. And that, go on. Yeah, well, that's interesting. Like, the bottleneck is sales when you're working in the pure gym, but they don't realize it because most of the front end

works been done. But then when they go online, the bottleneck is much harder and it still sales. But yeah, people think it's the recipe book or whatever. And I think part of the problem is thinking, identifying the wrong bottleneck with your whole process and then trying to fix it. And the most common one is like,

I'm a PT and I've done me level four, active IQ certification. Then I've got me nassum level one, and I'm gonna do me advanced nutritional counseling for women aged between 60 and 65 to help with food intolerances. And I've done me celiac certification and me pregnancy and you're like,

it's cat or battle level 10. It's like because they think it's like little feathers to the, what is it, feathers to their bow? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's wings to the cup. And it's wings to the cusses, skin off their nose, whatever. And whereas like, I would say any of that education is that should be off your own back for your own sense of internal pride

And really get out from a textbook don't pay like too grand for a kettle That's the same person who says like you know Joe Wicks is it you know Tosser and he doesn't know anything So no one cares if Joe Wicks has a kettlebell well look at the numbers. Yeah, look at a lot more people care about Joe Wicks He has no recipe book. He does have a recipe book. He's got a number of recipes. So he does. So back to why that's important.

And I'll get onto the recipe book in a second. What Pure Jim have done is brought a certain person in. They trust the environment they're in. They don't approach a PT and think, how am I going to get scammed here? Does it as an environment? You have to create all of that yourself online. Because you've got the institutional legit. Yeah, you're in a gym.

You're in a gym. It's a brand of run-over. So you are. But you trust the Tesco guy. You go to Tesco and you don't think, oh, you might be. Which I need to find out where the serial is. And he says, I'll Batman symbol key.

And you're like, hang on a second. I'm not sure if you know what you're talking about. And there's like a green button that says Attica, are you sure? Exactly. And then, so like your website, your persona online, everything has to create that. So you have to somehow be seen as trusted as an expert, as having the answers by someone. And the easiest way to do that is to pick a specific person who would naturally see you as that. Now, I realize I'm going around the houses here, but the point is, like, we... That was a weird noise. We started working with students,

because we just finished being students, and because we intimately understood students. So, to a student, us versus a coach who's 10 years older or whatever, we're much more likely to be seen as an expert because we know exactly what they're going through. We've had results in that environment. And our markets change as we've grown up. And we now mainly work with people who are where we were before we've used

in a propane, just finance and corporate busy. So it's far easier to create that pure gym feeling when you're seen as someone who's just, oh, they get me, they understand me. So they're saying things that are relevant. You need to be seen with some authority. You need to be trusted. And what was the third one? Well, no liking trust is like the thing that's no, like, no trust. You are, they trust you and they're like you. So you know,

if they make you laugh, if they're if it's engaging, they relate to what you're saying. It's super interesting that you talk about how the offline normal in gym PT environment has pre-selected for that. So Lewis Housemate who's upstairs at the moment, he was at the gym. And I don't know do you know the way that their PT structure is set up, but they have no rental costs for being in the gym. They just need to do, I think, it's six hours of reception per week. And I thought, wow, that's an amazing deal. When you actually scale up six hours by four over a month at 40 pounds per hour or whatever you're going to charge. Right, so I hang a second. I could maybe be working more, but then you think, well,

I can slot things around it. But the main thing, and this is why I was saying, hey, me, I was talking to I go into a private studio, should I go away? And how's that, bro? Like, if you've got slots left in your calendar or slots left in your weekly schedule, as I would just stand on reception, these people are the hottest leads in the world. They're coming to you and saying, hi, person with personal trainer on their t-shirt. I want a personal trainer. Exactly. No where else on the planet does that happen.

Apart from the yellow page is back in 1992. When you'd look down, it would be like Arthur Anderson, painter. Oh, well, he's for top of the pitch. Oh, he's paid for a friend as well. It's a white double A. Yeah, Aaron Aronson, yeah. Exactly. It's even better than that because the people in the gym

are like, they're by definition a series because they've paid to be there. So I know, it's an upsell. It's an upsell, not you know. Yeah, yeah, so like being a PT in like a David Lloyd, like you know one thing for sure about everybody in there and I was that they're paying a decent monthly rate. That is a good point. Like the quality is great because they're in the chip. Like they're not they're not just paid to offset their guilt and haven't gone in. They

actually turned up at the gym. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Massive. Okay. Yeah. They still have a sales problem. We're talking to people who are probably offline PT's or people are just interested in this industry overall, but Is there any analogous situations for this? I guess someone potentially who's like a a counselor who works one-to-one with people perhaps doing therapy or anyone else who's like that who's thinking about going online, you think that these universal rules are at least applicable to some other,

are you considered any other? Yeah, I mean, I think any freelance job, so yeah, Councillor Painter, Therapist, you can't even... An online painter. Well, so like anything where... Where's the worst example? I'll explain. So anything where there is a potential to be working with an institution or working on your own basic understood. So so either with PT if you choosing to be purely offline, then you're either yeah working with the institution of pure gym or you have your own personal brand that you've built and then you can bring people into that and then you are for whatever you want with that if you're a painter you can't do the lot online unless you go into like information products but we don't know how what the market is like for information products for painters how to be a painter how to be a painter feel like a handy man or something but what you can do is leverage your time and use that expertise to say right right, I'm going to build a team around me and

teach them how to be painters. Focus on BDM. Yeah, that's where you put born in BDM. Yes, that's where you have to. So if you're a handyman, the biggest market I see, I'm sure you'll have experienced this paint, right? We will experience experienced this paint horribly is there's a huge gap for PAs for handyman or for builders where they just tell them, right, you're here on Tuesday, you're there on Thursday, that's where you go. So effortful, the discussion back with some forward to anyone who's in that handyman plumber paint carving to fucking electrician thing. Like traits, ring the person, high mate, can you do this job? Are you available at this time?

He is the address, he is the phone number of the person who you need to speak to or it's me, oh hang on, I need to rearrange. Like, none of that has got anything to do with your expertise as a fucking handyman. The thing is though, is that that, so that will exist through bigger companies, but it'll be a lot more expensive. And like, would you pay double? Because you've got to pay for the PA and the plumber. That's it, so if you can charge like a 10, 20% premium or whatever it is to cover your

costs and then just operate that at scale. And if fuck it, what we talking about coaches for, like traditions, where the gap is, where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is.

Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is.

Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gap is. Where the gapcing of it. Check trade.com. Check trade.com.

Organizing of it. You watch a lot of TV, don't you? It's actually more of a radio thing like that. And I listen to a song. And I listen to a song of a radio. When we told an entire room of radio presenters, the only time we ever listened to radio was before our Bluetooth connection. I think it was the bosses of a big radio company.

Conglomerate. Yeah, it was technically. Yeah. Think of a big radio station that owners of them, we told them that radio was there. Shit. Immediately after someone told them that 93% of people in the UK listened to radio at least once a week and we looked at each other and went, no they don't. They thought you're not.

Okay, so I'm thinking about how a sales page works here. Where's your authority? Why should the people that we're speaking to listen to you? I'm thinking about how a sales page works here. Where's your authority? Why should the people that we're speaking to listen to you? What regulations have you got to talk to anyone about how to be an entrepreneur? You're really good question. And it's also what you should ask yourself

whenever you're offering a service is like, have I achieved the thing which I'm professing? Have I achieved the result that I'm professing that I'm gonna get for other people? And so the same way that you wouldn't trust a fat personal trainer, you wouldn't trust a car, a car driving instructor that has no license. Come drive cars. You have to...

And the great thing is, you don't need to be the world record holding authority on that thing. You just need to be a chapter ahead of whatever you're offering to someone. So how many chapters ahead do you think you guys are? Because I know the answer to this. So we probably look at the entire book, probably the encyclopedia. No, I'm joking. We market to people who are like us five years ago. I think us 10 years ago.

But you've done a lot in five years, you've done a lot more than most people would. So you've been online coaches for 10 years. So propane started about a decade ago, as a blog, gay interaction, got a few clients, slowly trickled along. We figured out, right, we need to figure out how to market this, bought a, bought like our first course to learn the basics. And then since then, I don't know how much money you've invested, it would probably make 60,000 grand as more than that.

I actually include all the software stuff as well. Some lots of money in learning how to market it. We've been doing it. It can't add spend as tuition fee as well, then. It's nauseated. It can't add spend as tuition fee as well, then. It's nauseating. I will be sick. Yeah, so we've been doing it full time. I mean, you've done a bit of other stuff

like you did a medical degree. I'm not just a black person. Black, yeah. But since 2016, full time. So we're not, like, I think our selling point as far as we see it, is there are two ways to succeed with this stuff really. One is you hit, so the big, the best example of the way that we don't do is James Smith and what's happened to him.

So he, let's talk about that in a second. Okay. All right. So we don't have any of that. If anyone follows us, like they'll know that we don't have 500,000 followers on Instagram or anything like that. That's not internet personalities. No, no. We run things very much from it.

We have systems that do the work for us. We figured it out. I suppose they're long for a trading way that, if you leverage sales and marketing properly, you can use advertising software systems to bring clients in in a fairly repeatable way. No, passive. Yeah, there's a lot more work to get it set up, but there's more predictability over it.

It's less like, will my video go viral? Yes, I know. Will the platform change and take likes, comments away? There's none of that, but there is other uncertainties and difficulties. It's probably the difference between setting my per an intricate set of pipes and stuff that spits out like a bowl of cereal at the end. And you just go, I'm just gonna pull that much milk into the top and it goes, it makes the bowl of cereal compared to just getting your hose pipe out and just being like

and hoping a bit goes in the bowl. Yeah, yeah. And sometimes the loads goes in. Yeah, and sometimes not. And those days are great. Yeah. Those days are the best. Okay, so you talked about some of the things that you guys have done. I want

the listeners, the ones who are still with us who are not perfectly interested in. What are you talking about? What about fucking online coaches? I want to hear a round robin for the next 10, 15 minutes of the funniest situations you've encountered whilst learning about being an online coach. So I want to hear the story about when you want to go see James Smith live and you thought he was going to give you the keys. I want to hear the story about... I want to hear the story about... I'm not being funny, right?

I want to hear the one about, I'm not being funny, right? I want to hear the one about the brain problem. Oh my god. You know what, these really like, looking and getting, you're getting fomored and you're not written them down. Yeah. My phone's too bloody big, I can't flex my hip, but... So, these actually come very much into

that what we were saying about getting, you're like, level three Kebble Bell certification and all this stuff stuff that you go to like some kind of, you sort of like an Eric Helms event, which... So for the people who aren't listening who's that? So he's... The people who aren't listening. For the people who aren't listening, you almost got away with that. I know, I know. It was started perfectly fine. You said from Johnny. For the people who don't know who Eric Helms is, or 3D muscle journey. Yeah, so like someone who he's a PhD researcher and body builder

talks about the mechanisms of physiology of muscle metabolism and hypertrophy. He's a big deal. He's a big deal. He's a big deal. But it's very, it's something that personal trainers love to nerd out on. And we did as well. We turned up and we were like, oh, you know, there's some stuff about this But the kind of questions that you have you have people asking so why were you there? Why would people so there's not like coach? Yeah, there's not like coaches listening to this and thinking I might go to James Smith's new training seminar I might go to Eric Helms is new this I might go to Hall's new, whatever. And why do people go? What do they want?

Well, so the answers. I think it's perfect for answers. But what answers? But yeah, they want the secret, the thing. And the questions that they're asking, if it's on behalf of clients, it's like you don't need to be asking that. It's just.

What else? So like, Eric, I have clients, she on her period, but normally she's got 72.5 kilogram. This week Tuesday she's got 70 kilogram for four reps. She cannot do more. Is this because can you stop creating an unperiod for it? You're getting so bogged down and like it's not going to help you get more clients. It's not going to help you be a better personal trainer or better anything.

And you see you can see because the obviously these people have been asked these questions a lot and you watch like someone asked the question period question. Well, it's a bit of an archetype of someone who goes, er, yes, I do have a question. But a training and as soon as someone says pertaining or like implementate yeah or anything like that red red fly warning the stuff the claxing goes off do you remember if someone opens up with a title that they have so like as a personal trainer of 15 years yeah yeah yeah yeah absolutely love that yeah do you remember the one there was one there's a bit where Eric was talking about I'm getting some over this point, just so...

I don't care. I just want to hear funny stories. Is it the patrol? So he was talking about, he was like, okay, so when you're setting up someone's diet and periodizing, you want to have, let's say for example, five low calorie days, where you have moderate protein, moderate carbohydrate, low fat, and then two days of refeed, where you have moderate protein, moderate carbohydrate, low fat, and then two days of refeed where you have higher carbohydrate, and you cycle that through and... Erick! Erick, I'm sorry to interrupt, but I've just got a question pertaining to the aforementioned status of diet, periodizing what you just mentioned there. How would one implement that along

with a cobscycling protocol? And he was like, well, I mean this kind of is cobscycling. So you need to be aware that when you go to these things that people might ask questions that are either too nuanced or ones that whether try and sound too clever. It's because of the lack it like they don't They're coming at it from like the you need to have some kind of goal of what am I going to this for like am I going for my own Education in which case just sit and listen if not if, if it's for like a question that interests you. Yeah, exactly.

And whereas if it's something to make you a better personal trainer, that is not that it's never going to be the bottleneck unless you're like terrible at what you do. Because most of the time, the limiting factor with your client's result is not protein synthesis or like how that period, their period or like how many grams of creatin they have post work hours. It's their compliance. It's their

tone, weekly volume. It's your roughness. Or being a human. Like treating someone like a human and being a human is like one of the biggest things. So why do you think this is fearing off? I want to get back to funny stories in a second. Us three here know that the secret to getting in good shape isn't really a secret and it's really quite basic. It's moved more than you eat, controlled the process foods that you have, tried to progress above or tried and left heavy three times a week, tried to get some sort of fresh air,

tried to get some day sleep well. That's it. Why is the fitness industry so abound with different approaches to achieving that? Is it because this is my theory, I'll see what you think. The route from input to output, the process that people go through to get there is so opaque and so difficult to see that it allows everyone to be like, what's in the magic box? My magic box is the faster, quicker, superior magic box. Well, it's the only way to get into this.

Like, why is it allowing? Because it's a fucking industry. You guys work in an industry of charlatans. Yeah. Why? It's just, it's money. It's profit. Like, whenever, in any, you can see this in anything

where the process is, the the answer the true answer is Like a few things done every day for two years Like saving money for example like becoming wealthy the answer is never Like this far extra on a course in a like in a for ex masterclass on this technical analysis Yeah, it's a system of triggers and at your points and It's the fundamentals done for a very long time. And that and people don't want to hear that. And that creates a gap for people who are really good at marketing to make a lot of money. Cool.

And what else we got? I want to hear what happened when you went to go see James Smith because you've identified the fact that you guys aren't, there's too broadly two categories I think of online touch. There's the James Smith and there's the broadly two categories I think of online touch. There's the James Smith and there's the prop in fitness. prop in fitness would be more analytical with regards to the way that they've got sales funnel setup. They're using ads cleverly, they're using spend online.

We see it as where the every man option, like not everyone can be James Smith. My definition, I think that's like everybody trying to be on Coronation Street or Holly Oaks, or you know, like you need to be a certain type of person for that to work. If you make it, great. Yeah, you sort it and it's easy to look back and go, oh yeah, you want to go to acting school and you can map out the path that you took to get there, but actually the reason is your charisma, the way you look, and James is obviously great

at that stuff. And that was, the elephant in the room for us in that entire seminar was half the people asking questions. They're quiet, they're shy, and James naturally is not that. And that's gonna be the biggest difference, but that's beside the point. So we teach people a way to's going to be the biggest difference. But that beside the point. So we we teach people a way to just not to be running Academy with thousands of people in it. Just how might you go about replacing what you in as an offline coach as an online coach? I mean, you could

just do the same income in a way that was a bit I allowed you not more flexibility. That's a table for everyone. It's not going to make you a millionaire, but it's achievable. And we do that with like marketing and sales, the basics of marketing. And there's nothing that stops you from doing what again, my housemate Lewis is looking at doing, which is augmenting is existing offline. Well, yeah, we've had many people that we've worked with that have, you know, doubled or tri one case, a couple of cases like six, seven times their income to like, 10, 10, 15 grand a month. But they still want to do some offline personal training stuff,

just to get out of it as well. Yeah, just to keep my foot in the thing. I'd have some clients that I'd be made sure. They just want to keep their foot in the thing. Just put in the thing. Yeah. Just put on the ground and like some level, because they get some level of satisfaction from it. And what's better is that they can then hand pick the best offline

clients that they have. Charge a higher rate and just sack off the pain in the ass ones and then just focus on cool and I work. Who else do you think you see? So you have this Eric Helms that what about what are some of the other things that people should be concerned about before they sign up to a seminar? Oh my god, I wear to begin with that. Like some of the things some of the situations I've been in with UCF like so it's hard to describe because you have to the more you know UCF the funnier the whole thing is but it UCF is you got to remember the sort of guy who went to Blythe. Is it Blythe?

To be in a cult. To be in a cult where he ended up lying down on the ground because everyone around him was dancing and he didn't get it, but he still went for 12 weeks. So like, if someone says, this is the way to do it, Yusef. He'll do it. The first business coach we hired told us to, basically, we did like a boosted post Facebook

ad which is not never you know. Do not. I mentioned boosted post. It's allergic. Yeah, it's an unaffulcated. It's a great way. You get a lot of exposure but it literally just anybody can come into your world. There's no targeting or or measurability to anything you do and that's what happened.

Loads of people booked one of these free coaching calls with us, which is what we're told to do and we're good students. So that's what we did. And we spent about, I mean, probably a hundred hours on the phone. So just to give you some context for this as well, like this is a man who was bragging about the fact that he puts makes people bring people to tears during the sales calls all the time, bragging that he got a single mum to remalcage a house so that she could sign up for his, yeah. It really is a stream.

It's a stream. And the sales script they give you is really manipulative and really like, just pain point. Yeah, you encourage to make people cry, and LP. And so we've been doing this for a while, we'd have mixed success with it. You set a lot of friend over there. I remember feeling like nauseous while doing these calls. It's just so not in line with who we are as people.

But we've got to follow the process because we've case-life ground for it. You said did a live on a call with this guy, a live roleplay, where you said was the client and this guy was trying to close Yusuf and Yusuf just kept. So they call it something. It's 5, 9, 9, 5 for my programme. Yusuf was like, okay, the guy was like, what do you think? He's like, I think it's too expensive. The guy's like, what do you mean by that? Well, it's beyond what I feel comfortable to pay. it's beyond what I feel comfortable paying. Oh, what do you mean by that? Well, it's, I'm unable to pay that today, so I won't be proceeding and they just continue. And we've been in so many, like, on the other end of sales calls,

the guy trying to sell us this program where he just kept saying, so what's next? So he would say something, I was like, so nextager term, because I was like, so you know, this is the program, and so what's next? And you just kept saying something. And it got to the end, and the guy went, so what? Guys, what's next? You used to have to have to meet and just went. Because I suppose like, it's just weird. These are on a sales call, like, both people have them playing the game, don't they? Yeah, you can't, if one person just isn't bought into the game, you can't be adversarial.

So I suppose the lesson is, like the world of people selling marketing advice to personal trainers is a really like there be dragons for sure, like there are people who have zero experience in what they're teaching, like have legitimately never run a fitness business, but see an opportunity. And it's the same way in the fitness world. Grant Cardon. People who... I've never bought anything from Grant Cardon.

So, it is Grant Cardon. Have you seen the contributor? I have, yeah. Yes. But not the interview, the actual is mentoring. Oh yeah, yeah. Is it supposed to be Grant Cardon? It is Grant Cardon. Right. Okay. I mean, the accent sort mentoring. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is it supposed to be a grant card? It is grant card, right?

OK. I mean, the accent sort of quite blatantly gives it a little bit. Yeah, it's amazing. He's got a week that says 11x on it. Right, yeah. I think you're right, OK. So I mean, in the same way that there are people selling weight loss powder, weight loss pills

in the fitness market, there's the same thing in this market. But it's more when people are like messing with their life savings or, you know, remorcaging things because they've been sold this dream gets a bit. It's true, like it's got to be really aware of, like, and I suppose in the industry, like once more people are making money from selling how to make money, then the thing itself, you've got to be really worried. You've got to be really worried. The principle from Mike Winnet from the Contrapraneter, the whole principle behind that is, why if someone had the secret would they turn their customers into competitors? That's what he asks. And yeah, it's not quite a zero-sum game, but like,

there's only, especially when you're talking UK audience, There's only 65 million people here. That's for you, I'm gonna guess. What's a good sized audience for you to target? Three mil, four mil for you. You mean on Facebook or? Yeah, I mean like 400,000 would be like a 1% of the UK audience. Minimum like bottom end.

Yeah, I mean the thing is, okay. So out of all of the people, you only have a hundred of them. You only have a hundred one percent. Yeah. Yeah. Like that's not that many. So the people ask us this question a lot, like if if you're doing fitness and it's going so well, why are you teaching personal trainers? And I definitely get where that question is coming from because it feels like, yeah, what the fuck are you doing? You're scamming me. Yeah. But the reality of the market is one, most people, most coaches couldn't handle even a hundred people online, like the vast majority. So when you consider the market, when you're in there, when you're in like Newcastle and you're a PT, you immediately think of it as, well, there's me, there's that gym down the road,

there's that CrossFit gym, and that's got all those new PT's, and you think in a very competitive sense. When you move into the internet, really anybody is a client, because most people, or in UCF's world, everybody has a bodybuilding goal, they just don't realize it. So you can legitimately work with anybody with internet connection. Seven billion people. Yeah, well. And when we talk about it, it's so big. It's huge. Because everyone has a bodybuilding.

Yeah. We talk about this idea of a freedom number of the point at which you've replaced your offline income with online coaching. And either double your income, or you can move into online coaching full time. To get that, you need like 20 people. So like, if all we do,

what's like typical charging you're charging like a hundred pounds a month. Yeah between a hundred and two hundred a month is like average online at the moment for a monthly rate. So if we help even a thousand people do that. It's not even putting like it's not even making the tiniest dent in the fitness industry. Even in like the North East England. It would affect us. And so when people say that, you're like, you should fuck off. Do you just sit and think about it for a second?

Do you think, say to question for you, are you a better online coach or an online coach? With the same, the material is different. Because, no, you ask for, do you have to, do you know our ability? Yeah. Are you more talented at coaching coaches or are you more talented at coaching clients?

They depend for us for me, especially well, I think for both of us it depends on the fitness client Because we'll have some fitness clients who are we work really well with people who are like analytically minded So we'll have some clients who come in Who like have listened to a podcast and you give them a little bit of information and you come they come back and they've devoured all of the members area, all the podcast, and they're shredded. It's a bit like, you leave someone in a kitchen with a pot of dry rice and a cookery book. A garlic clove and cookery book and whatever, and you come back and they've just made a feast with noodles and then you're like, oh, yeah. And then some other people.

That's what people are. So we, I mean, you probably get this. Like we aren't like promoting, like a juice fast diet, or like, you know what I mean? Like we were quite scientifically grounded, we're quite numerical, and broadly the unsexy stuff. It is exactly the unsexy stuff. Thank God, because we were too intolerant as people

to handle the type of person that would come to you if you promoted juice fasts, because there's a type of attitude and shortcut kind of mindset, but it's very hard to shake if you have someone that comes to you and wants that, and then to try and coach them just becomes impossible, because it's just like square-handedly. And that exists in business as well, but I think it's more, I think people think how you market it as well Of course it does yeah, but I think there are a few people there are that's another story as well There are a few people who think like well by tomorrow I'll have a big business online like I think there's sort of most people, big bister online, big, big, most people think it's going to take a year or whatever. And so the result is a more serious type of client than someone who's

like to like what I'm going to holiday in 10 days. So get me like if I'm not leaving. Just a little fella. I'm sticking out of the office, man. But yeah, it depends on the client, but because, probably because generally when a PT comes to us, like, guys, serious, yeah, I want this is going to take two years, but that's fine. Like, we're on the same page. If someone comes to us and they're like, you, you're a doctor mate, I want abs by, by next Monday, can you, can you sort that?

There's nothing we can do. But give us the right fitness client. Okay, you shredded the flying. Okay, that's, that Okay, that's a good politician's answer about coaching coaches. Also, my background is business and finance. Usus background is like, bombs and breasts and cells, hormones, glands, or megalenegrum. Okay, let's say we've talked about kind of like what the environment is and what

the industry's like. Let's say that someone's thinking, okay, offline PT, I'm ready to make a move online or someone who's got an interest in health and fitness and I think that I should do that. What's the first step to the biowebsite? No, they make a brand? No. Absolutely. For God's sake, no.

Can I remorge my house? You're gonna, and for like, this again, like, we are, what are the most common things that people think they should do? By a website? So, yes, that and build a program. Don't do that. So don't write a program. Don't build a program. Don't get a website. Don't make a logo. Don't definitely don't like pay someone to set up a trainer eyes or my PT, have anything like that because all that is doing is digging a trench in some way where you're not sure whether the trench is going to actually be there

long term, like you're building a house and you haven't checked the foundations. And so we see this all the time and we like use it in marketing a lot that you see someone post on Facebook on their personal profile like I'm proud to announce after six months of building it that I'm finally launching my eight week fat loss blaster program Zero comments zero likes tumbleweed six hours later and people wonder why so the first thing to do is really You want to build some sort of sales process to test this with, like, have an idea, have a concept, who do I want to work with and why? Why would that person listen

to me? What compelling stuff have I got to say to that person? What might the program look like, then build a way to sell it to them and sell first and build in some people, bring in some people to help. So pre-enroll over. Yeah. Or say if you were to post online and say, considering going online, is anyone looking for an online coach at the moment, why don't you give me a DM and we'll have a chat? And then you could say, you could talk to them, see the sort of people who respond. So you're talking about dipping your toe in the water. Yeah, you want to build a program that is designed for your clients, not what you think your clients need. And that means really, you need clients to help you build it. So should you start off just coaching a few people for free?

That's one option. Yeah, the downside of that is a lot of people don't take it seriously. So like someone we know actually has just tried to offer that all you've seen this, he's just tried to offer 12 weeks of coaching for free, no one's taking them up on it. And the reason is, like, people don't,

if I say to you, like, I'll make you a billionaire, but it's free, no one's taking them up on it. And the reason is, like, people don't, if I say to you, like, I'll make you a billionaire, but it's free, no problem. So it's vicious. Yeah, you just sound well-hut. Price is an indicator, of course. It is. Yeah, it was reassuring. It was really expensive.

Like, whenever we've paid a lot for something, we, like, if you pay us for a course, or an audio program, whatever, you'll go and do it because you like, well, I've sunk this amount of. But there's a book in the marketing world called Breakthrough Advertising that you can only get now for like 800 quid. And everybody gets really excited about the book because it's so expensive. It'll just have the same stuff in. It's the basics of marketing, but like when things are expensive, people value them more. So if something's free, people tell you, it's how do I find out who my audience is?

So that I would serve you a year ago, or you at the beginning of your journey. So I would have that as your client, because you are that person post transformation. Broadly should men, culture men, and women, culture women for effectiveness. Typically, that's the best way to do it. But it's difficult.

Like, if you have some reasonable expertise in that, then fine. But when we, like, I feel as weird when I see like a 25-year-old man say that he's going to do like middle-aged women posts, post-naked women. And you just say, what do you know about that? Yeah, about the struggles of a middle age woman like a baby like yeah just it seems CD and it seems like it is possible and some coaches are really good at coaching you know men coming yeah exactly and like some men have really I'm sure have really good postnatal programs but for the first, for your first online program, it's making it hard

of yourself, because you have to imagine what it's like to be that person. So you want to pick the goals that you had, sorry. So just the only exception to that is if, when you, if just naturally from your, your existing personal social media following, you get loads of questions and things from a specific demographic, and you can't figure out why, then fine. Perhaps you have selected for men, women, young people, young people. And it could be that James Smith is a very, is like a sexually desirable man. And so a lot of, like a lot of women like him. And so they go for, they message him, they see him as an authority and that's who he's

like, right, I'm just going to, I'm going down on him. You were saying that because James has got the mustache, you're doing the mustache case. This is exactly that. You're hoping that message is young. I've been he messages me. Yeah, and he can be it with him. So, a good example of this, a client last week launched his sales funnel for his program that was men only and more women bought them though. Like so, you know, he advertised it as a male program, but he had more female signups than male signups, which is like the market going, hi, this is the right thing to do. So you say to me like, do you think I should rebrand it or I was like, well, good instinct.

What would you say? So yeah, like, there are exceptions to that, definitely. But the first thing to do, build a sales funnel, like build a webinar, build a challenge in email series, something like that that positions you as an authority, gets you to show off a little bit about what you know and how you can help people and offer your program as a like a beta launch at the end of it. It's like I'm doing this program.

I want and pick a reasonable number of people like 20 or whatever is reasonable for half price and I just want some feedback. I want you to help me build it. I want ideally a testimonial. And then the program that you build is what they wanted rather than like what Eric Helms spoke to you about carps cycling and period management at a seminar because that's what everybody focuses on. No one gives a shit. Like someone will make an ebook about how Brian Shaniemy and I said to work and then wonder why their clients don't want it when their clients are

like middle-aged women. So the exact, like the fact that everyone there was a PT, and it wasn't made for PT's, it was Eric, I'm speaking out of that, but yeah, and that's who it is right. And you're like, well, if you look around in the room, you think, well, everyone here's a PT, no one's what my client would be.

And so they're not gonna care. If this room is full of people that are my ideal client, then okay, they're clearly interested in the mechanics of carbs cycling. So I'm going to use that. Talk about carbs cycling to get my clients. And the stuff that Johnny mentioned there, I think, applies for any result in any domain.

It doesn't have to be fitness. Like just anything that you have expertise in and you can get for other people that you can know is that you can pack and deliver and apply with someone keeping the countable to, that's... You know what I, the main issue I have with the Grand Cardone stuff, and like that, not just Grand Cardone, but like a lot of internet and marketing in general, you might be.

I'm actually, who wants to be called? Fuck off. Is that I think some of the time, people buy these courses because they're told, are you gonna become an internet millionaire? But you still need to have, like you can put a turbo onto anything,

but if it doesn't have like wheels, a chassis and an engine, it's never, it does not make go fast. What's the turbo you're referring to? The turbo is like all that. What these people are teaching is like a marketing mechanism, usually like a sales and marketing process for a the two. But what these people are teaching is like a marketing mechanism, usually, like a sales and marketing process for a business online.

Well, Mike, when it talks about that, he says that some woman bought this Grand Cardone's business kickstarter program for $3,000. Mm-hmm. Didn't have a business. Yeah. Like, you know, a product. I'm going to help me come up with one. I mean, that's shaky ground ground begin with, isn't it?

Like, you still need, it's still just demand and supply in the market. Just because you bought something doesn't make you instantly have a desirable thing. Whereas if someone's a PT, or it's the same, as you say, for trades, or if you're an architect, or a lawyer, or speaking to someone the other week who was a lawyer and now it's like seven times what she earned just working for herself getting clients online.

Lawyer. Yeah. So like there's an example of it had she bought Grand Cod or something like that, you know, like how to market yourself online when you have a skill that is in demand. It works. So you can't fabricate that by buying one of these courses. There's a really good article. You might have sent me or someone didn't, it was basically saying it was like one of the articles of the year or whatever and it was just saying your entire

worth is determined by what value you can try to put the people. The guy that wrote this book is full of spiders. So is the dying man on the ground and you were the guy that wrote this book is full of spiders. Society is the dying man on the ground and you were the one that's holding the pen knife. Cool, okay. So your entire worth is just what you can offer to people. And so that's how economics works, it's like demand and supply. But people think like, oh, dollar signs, I need to learn the marketing. Then you're like, what are you actually marketing? What's the thing that you're selling? What are you selling? Because there's this sense of like, I think what these things do is they

generate a sense of entitlement in people that like, well, if I put myself in front of the camera and then people will just buy my product because I'm worthy of this and it's like, well, no, like not unless you actually have something to... and then people will just buy my product because I'm worthy of this. And it's like, well, no, not unless you actually have something to... Well, if you look at, like, to offer all the legit businesses, like, look at Amazon, like Jeff Bezos didn't have, like, a quick marketing funnel. Did he?

Elon Musk didn't start Tesla. So you say focus on the product? I'm saying all those people focused on having a really solid product. They were focusing on the customers experience, rather than, and this is the thing about, like what Johnny said about, I'm launching my new program and it's going to be sick. It's going to be absolutely amazing. It's going to be the latest intermittent fasting.

And it's like people don't care. And you're not thinking of it from what do they want? They'll be watching you on video and thinking, well, who's this guy? How can, because they'll be watching you on video and thinking, well, who's this guy? How can they help me? I'm interested in them. I'm interested in my big belly and I wanna get rid of it.

It's true, isn't it? With regards to when you hear people, and I see this with myself as well, like thinking about, I'm so in the weeds with my own experience of life and my own life, my ability to have perspective on anything that I do is almost zero. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You will talk to someone about a project once that you've thought about a thousand times. You literally had a thousand versions of this thought and then when it comes to talking to them about it, you garble your words, you're like, because there's so much to say. Hang on a fucking second, yeah, and you're like, no, no, no. So how do people ensure that they're kind of still focusing on that? Is it focus customer first? So that's what, so people, people mistake great product and focus customer first with like, right, I need to go into the,

like, a cave and make the best thing I can. Like that might be the best thing for you, but it might not be the best thing for the person buying and that's why we're so big on, like, there needs to be both and needs to be a way to get these people to take you seriously and actually pay you money. Because if they don't pay you money, it's not a business anyway. But after that, build what they need. Like, what is, what is going to get them the best result possible? Because the testimonials that you get where someone like we have people like videos are people saying we've changed that life

That doesn't come because we Explained to them how protein synthesis works or like you know They're giving the latest intimate and fasting thing. We gave them the solution to their problem And I think that's what and they'll tell you yeah Like which is the problem I'm experiencing please help me it. And then you use the expertise about the praise synthesis. And I'm not sure it's intimate in fact. And just to solve it. But they don't want to know how it works.

They'll give a shit how it works. It's like a small subset of the ones that do. But then they usually want to go and then become pt's. Yeah, you know, details, details. Don't bore me with the details. That's it, isn't it? Laircake. Yeah. It is to be it, isn't it? Lair kick. Yeah, it is to be honest, it is all just Lair kick.

Your ball takes shit, get out in the world, take more shit. Got it. Welcome to the Lair kick. It's a real shit. Until one day you're up in the rear refined atmosphere. And you're an online coach. You're a writer. And you're at James Smith's PT with a blue techie.

Something else that just I just remembered was, this was a link that Johnny sent me about 42 minutes into a Tom Martin seminar. So, you know, Tom Martin, like for the listeners, this is a guy who is, like mental strong. Like he, he deadlifted 340 at 82 kilos. When up to 93s got stupid lifts. Everyone thought he was on drugs. Everyone was like, I was clearly on drugs, like look at his kilos. When up to 93's got stupid lifts, everyone thought he was on drugs. Everyone was like, I was clearly on drugs, like look at his lifts. One day he left the powerlifting

federation that was drug tested and became huge over six months and started adding like like 400 plus squatting 300 plus like really big lifts and just got looks like an absolute like Belgian blue ball Derber got Yeah, exactly with the yeah and full it's how you look very full and then it's like oh okay So he wasn't now He's Just moved to an untested federation and got very strong. So he's a really impressive athlete like absolutely mind blowing and he's sat there is a really impressive athlete, like absolutely mind blowing. And he's sat there.

I'm, I'm in a sling because he's torn his bicep dead lifting. Delivering a seminar on like basics of power lifting. And this guy goes, uh, Tom, Tom, just, uh, just, just stop you there, cause I've got your question. As a, as a intermediate power lifter who's, um, recovering from an ACL reconstruction in, if this was back in, on my left knee in 2014, my question really relates to the specifics of, and the mechanics of, doing reverse bound partial squats in as part of my volume building block. And so what's the

efficacy in implementing that within my program for improving my squad? Is there? Maybe you thought I was just doing full range squats for the barbell. Oh, okay, right. Right. Like, it's the basics is what and that's what people don't want to hear. What's the one about the guy who turned up to the internet marketing explanation seminar and didn't have an internet business?

Maybe I'm not being funny. Yeah, so we were at a thing in we were at it. I'll not say where we were at a event somewhere in the UK on the squares location and Someone came up to you, sir. And you said it is not the person to ask this question of because he doesn't like it It was like mate mate Can I ask you a couple of questions? Was that asking us like loads of questions? I'm not being funny. Well, I'm not being funny. Can I can I ask you a couple of questions. Was that asking? That's like loads of questions. I'm not being funny, but I'm not being funny. Can I ask you a couple of questions about that? You don't have to answer this for it,

but how much do you charge for you? And loads of really cloak and dagger. And you've got down to the brass tax. I don't mean to. I'm not the guy. How much do you charge for people for? Was it during cutin Kertel? Very similar.

You didn't have a website or anything. And that's like... At the time... And was it that they really advanced? Yeah. Like it was like top of a high end. Talking about like packaging intellectual rights and like it was like it was... It was the assumption was you had a website.

Well, it was the military precision Facebook spend. Yeah, yeah, super advanced target. It's like when you've been doing it like seven years and you sit in a thing like frantically taking notes and you know, really edge of your seat holding on for to your life. And the bloke in the back. Like it doesn't have a website is out like a community hall somewhere in like to do westland and to like gluten gluten harms or something twice a week for it's like a school sports hall on a Saturday but he's there

because he wants he wants the answers and that yeah the fit my favorite thing about the And that, you know, the fit, my favorite thing about the James Smith event was, so the two things about that that we had won was like, it's very similar to the Tom Martin thing. There's a guy on stage who's done very well and is doing very well in the internet fitness world. And the questions were like, James, Ray, I've got this woman who I charged £30 an hour for. Thinking about charging £35 an hour, what do you think? And you want to sign up and go like, right, everybody, sit the fuck down, right? This guy, thousands of clients online, and that is the best question.

You can come up with it. That's how we got to where he is by charging for extra five per hour. It's when people just start with a sprawling story. Yeah. The question. Sometimes there's not even a question at the end of it. You're like, you just put your hand up there to just like have your turn. What?

Yeah. Yeah. So it's a fucking meeting, right? It's a security name. Speaking of having your turn, so I'd ask a couple of questions and you could see it was getting towards the end of the day and I can, what Yusuf always feels like I need a participant. So James is talking about, is a guy he's called a fitness chef. Does like, you've probably seen some of this stuff, comparison and the graphics of like avocado on toast and sick as bar.

And James went, oh, this guy's got like 150,000 followers and you said, when made the 250,000 and James went, really? Yeah, he's like, I only check this morning. That is a classic example. As the crush bandicoot chain, you just invent something in your head. Oh, I just really got it.

James said, I check this morning. He was like, really good. And that was the one that I had to contribute. After I was like, ah, I then checked. Well, I was sat there, he was like, 50. Fuck you, I'm doing. So then I put my hand up and I was like, James, I charged 30 pounds. Everyone's like,

I was just thinking that I was gonna ask that as well. So it's the same. I went to go and see recently, Alain DeBotten in London and Douglas Murray. There are Q&A for them as well. Yes, at the end, yeah. So you can imagine, Alain DeBotten, this man's YouTube channel has had 500 million plays,

500 million, one of the most insightful channels on the internet. And like, he, even he, Alan is like the most compassionate, gentle, he's like the ultimate uncle. Do you know what I mean? And not the one. Not the barbecue. Not the tattoo. Not the weird one. And even he, caveated the beginning of his Q&A section by saying, please keep questions to no more than three sentences and please ensure that they are a question. That's a man who has experienced a lot. Douglas Murray said, he said two sentences

and make sure it's a question. There's still people that stand up and go, yes, Douglas, I wondered, I wondered first off, thank you, thank you for coming, I'm all for thank you, first off, obviously we are in Westminster tonight, so fuck me, what is this, is it the only night at the proms or something? We're on planet Earth and it's the current summer. Thanks for the framing, mate, I want to be this is your life. There was been a few hours listening to him and Lionel Shriver talk about the nuances of identity politics for you to remind me that I'm in Westminster.

Come on back. Oh, am I? Oh, I thought I'd throw something. It was just really strange. You should just have a bag of marble shimmy and you're not throw a marble every time. Have you ever seen this before? So you had this thing where there was people with numbers

in different areas of the room, and it was like number one, two, three, four, five, sit all the way around, and he would just pick a number, and then that person would go, it was like he'd delegated out the way, but it was like this one from this section, and one from this section, and one from that section. I'm like, mate, really this kind of vision of representiveness that you're giving out here. Just do everyone in that

row. Yeah. Just do. They're making more complicated than it needs to be. Okay, so you get Darren Brown in the podcast. That would be great. It'd be good. And that would be the most excited I'd ever be. I'll take you while it by the end of the eventually. Yeah. Okay. So we've given out some fucking cool info today. Let's do a recap. And also we need you need to tell people where they can go to to find out more from yourselves as well. So I okay. So I would say. If if if is either, so like, Jim owner, PT, nutritionist offline, or we help a few people who, like, there's a few people actually who have been

fitness clients for two years and are in such good shape that they're like, I want to help people do the same thing, which is really cool. But so those criteria, so you're off outside the industry but thinking about it, offline PT, Jim owner, anything like that. I would start an online presence regardless of whether or not you wanted to be a full-time thing, and I would do it sooner rather than later. What's that mean? Like, I would have something in place, I would have an online program out, have an online offering, because really the barrier to setting one up at the moment is pretty low frictionless. Yeah. And especially if you have clients already,

it bolsters the value of your offline service. It is a PDF enough, it's a weekly call enough. I'd say probably not, but if we're gonna get into that, I've got a link that can help people with that. Or rather than me go through the deals. But yeah, sooner rather than later, just because realistically, there's someone starting today. Now, now, now, now.

And you're just gonna be a year down the line if you wait. And there's no reason to wait. Because everyone's always like, ah, in January or next year, the magical land of when I have all the time and all the money. It's one of those things to do with us being in the weeds about our own experience again as well, isn't it? It's like you presume that everybody else is watching you and that you're going to

part our man, I've got it. Well, I'll just fucking sick program yet because honestly, if my third cousin sees that I've released this thing and there's a spelling error on the front page. Yeah. So doing, it's getting started today might mean in a year, it's doing all right, rather than, you know, this time next year, just beginning. So start sooner rather than later,

and don't get caught in the weeds with websites and stuff you don't need to focus on what I said earlier. And just if you are getting help, be very careful. So the question we encourage people to ask is like, can I see your version of this business please? Like can I see if you're teaching me to build a fitness business, I want to see this type of thing that I'm building because it might be like, you might see that business and think, that's weird, that's shit. And probably the most common reason people give for, I don't run my fitness business anymore, because I didn't suit my lifestyle. So, do you want to be taught by

someone who built the business that didn't suit their lifestyle? Just those sorts of things. I'm not trying to rubbish everyone else, because there are some really good coaches, but just ask for proof, just like you would ask to see someone's left if they're a part of the coach or whatever, right? And do you have anything else? No, that's... Make a muster. Make a muster. Make a muster, just stick it on.

Stick it on. So people are thinking, these two sound like they know what they're talking about. Where should they go? So propinifitness.com forward slash modern wisdom. Nice. Did it for you especially. Thank you. And that all that is is a, it's basically us as a case study. So it's propinifitness as a case study and I just take you through what we did. Because that's what people always ask. It's like, what did you guys do when you were starting? What were the steps you took? So we've broken it down into seven, like our seven key takeaways. And it's free.

Awesome. It's very now the best thing. That's fucking, I don't even know your name. Thank you. Well, for the listeners who are interested in more, or just wanna get something for free, link will be in the show notes below or pro-penfitness.com forward slash more on our wisdoms.

Obviously, follow pro-penfitness online, all that good stuff, gentlemen. It's me and S Sick, thank you.