Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin - Kat Von D on Good Business and Bad Contracts

Episode Date: October 14, 2024

You may know Kat Von D from Miami Ink and LA Ink, but she is so much more than what you saw on TV. As a kid, Kat felt like an outsider— but through her music, tattoos and business, she created community for others who grew up feeling the same way. On MNN's Money Maker, Kat tells host Nely Galán the story of her meteoric rise; from mohawks in church, to opening up her first tattoo shop, to regrettable contracts, to peace and sobriety. Her story is for anyone looking for the tools to turn their passion into a career. $ Take control of your finances by using a Chime checking account with features like no maintenance fees, fee-free overdraft up to $200, or getting paid up to two days early with direct deposit. Visit: http://chime.com/MNN  $ Looking for the perfect holiday gift for your coworkers, friends, and everyone in between? Choose Nicole’s favorite wine, Justin. Get 20 percent off your order for a limited time with the code “MONEY20” at http://justinwine.com/  $ Ready to find a financial advisor that’s right for your financial goals? Get matched with a trusted, vetted financial advisor at: http://moneypickle.com/MNN  All investment strategies involve risk of loss. The information shared in this podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only. Listeners should do their own research and consult a financial advisor before making any investment decisions. See terms for additional details: https://moneynewsnetwork.com/terms/ 

One of the most stressful periods of my life was when I was in credit card debt. I got to a point where I just knew that I had to get it under control for my financial future and also for my mental health. We've all hit a point where we've realized it was time to make some serious money moves. So take control of your finances by using a Chime checking account with features like no maintenance fees, fee-free overdraft up to $200, or getting paid up to two days early with direct deposit. Learn more at Chime.com slash MNN. When you check out Chime, you'll see that you can overdraft up to $200 with no fees. If you're an OG listener, you know about my infamous $35 overdraft fee that

I got from buying a $7 latte and how I am still very fired up about it. If I had Chime back then, that wouldn't even be a story. Make your fall finances a little greener by working toward your financial goals with Chime. Open your account in just two minutes at Chime.com slash MNN. That's Chime.com slash MNN. Chime. Feels like progress. Banking services and debit card provided by the Bancorp Bank N.A. or Stride Bank N.A. Members FDIC. SpotMe eligibility requirements and overdraft limits apply. Boosts are available to eligible Chime members enrolled in SpotMe and are subject to monthly limits. Terms and conditions apply. Go to Chime.com slash disclosures for details.

I love hosting on Airbnb. It's a great way to bring in some extra cash, but I totally get it that it might sound overwhelming to start or even too complicated if, say, you want to put your summer home in Maine on Airbnb, but you live full time in San Francisco and you can't go to Maine every time you need to change sheets for your guests or something like that. If thoughts like these have been holding you back, I have great news for you. Airbnb has launched a co-host network, which is a network of high quality local co-hosts with Airbnb experience that can take care of your home and your guests. Co-hosts can do what you don't have time for, like managing your

reservations, messaging your guests, giving support at the property, or even create your listing for you. I always want to line up a reservation for my house when I'm traveling for work, but sometimes I just don't get around to it because getting ready to travel always feels like a scramble, so I don't end up making time to make my house look guest-friendly. I guess that's the best way to put it. But I'm matching with a co-host so I can still make that extra cash while also making it easy on myself. Find a co-host at Airbnb.com slash host. I'm Nicole Lappin, the only financial expert you don't need a dictionary to understand. It's time for some money rehab. If your dream job lands in front of you, you'd take it, right? You might even take it no questions asked without reading the fine print. That's exactly what happened to Kat Von D, tattoo

artist and entrepreneur. Kat recently sat down with Nellie Galan on her MNN podcast Moneymaker, Mi Mundo Rico, to talk about the dreamy contract she signed that turned into a complete and utter nightmare and how she got out of it. If you know Kat from Miami Inc. and LA Inc., you are in for a surprise because she is so much more than what you saw on TV. And for anyone interested in turning their hobby into a jobby, Kat is the master and has lessons for days. Welcome to Moneymaker, the podcast that gives you the tools to enrich your life in every sense of the word. I'm your host, Nelly Galan. Let's get started. So Kat Mundy, I'm so, I can't even believe I'm here with you. You have, I mean, you're Latina. I'm Latina. So you can imagine that Latinos follow other Latinos. And I've just loved everything you've done. Now you're a singer. You're a goat tattoo.

You're the goat in tattoo. And you also have had my favorite makeup line. I'm obsessed. And you've just done so many businesses. So I'm just so happy to have you here. What comes up for me with you, because we're both Latinas and we're very American, is, you know, that saying, follow your bliss and the money will come, which is very Joseph Campbell. And I think that as Latinas, we also know that that's a little bit entitled and true, but not true because, you know, you follow your bliss. There are many blisses of your life. Some make money and some don't. You have followed all your blisses and, and also you've done parallel lives where you made money in different ways. So super excited to get the whole scoop from you. So, you know, you were born in Mexico,

which I don't know if a lot of people know that about you. I don't think a lot of people know that I'm Latina. That you're Latina, man. You're so Latina. And your parents were like Argentinos. And then they moved to Mexico. And then you came from Mexico here. I have to ask you because I left school when I was 15. And you left school very young.

You're like my parallel life sister. Yes, parallel life. And so my parents lost it. And so I know that the Latino parents must have freaking lost it. Yeah. So can you tell us what happened? Yeah. So I was born in Mexico.

I was born in a little pueblito que se llama Montemorelos. Yes, of course. It's right next to Monterrey. So, you know, it's like. Norteña. Yeah. From the northern part of Mexico. Yeah.

But my family is from Argentina. So we're all kind of mixed up. But my parents were missionaries for the church. So my dad was building hospitals in these little towns where there was no access to hospitals, just, you know, doing amazing work. And I'm so grateful for that because to me, like my heart is in Mexico. That's like my motherland. So and I love Argentina, too.

I'm not, you know, a disvisive. But, you know, the way that I speak Spanish is a lot more Mexican. I mean, it's mixed, but, you know, so many people don't, they think Latinos are all the same and we all have different accents. It's like America where you have a Southern accent and whatever. And so it is a little different. And then we moved to America in the eighties. I was like, you know, five or six. And then we moved to a little town called Loma Linda, which is two hours, two hours, uh, you know, east of LA and, you know, my parents, they weren't Americanized at all, you know, and, and I, which I loved, you know, and my siblings and I, we, we led a pretty humble, like modest life with church, you know,

on the Sabbath, we were sent the evidence. So when I, when I started, you know, falling into the tattoo world, I don't think people realize Latinos are not into tattoos. No. Now it's a lot more accepted. But back then, oh no. I mean, no. It's like almost like that. The only two people that get tattoos are like bandilleros or prostitutes.

Yeah, it's prostitutes or these gang members, right? So they really see it as... And by the way, I got into the entertainment business, which to them is, you know, in Latin America, if you're in the entertainment, it's prostitution. So Latinos don't get it. So I can't imagine your parents during this period. What happened is I got into punk rock music. And so I think that to me spoke on a very like profound level, like just this feeling of being an outsider. And I've always felt that I felt that within my own family unit, I never really felt like I fit into a lot of places. And, and I don't know if part of that is that like, I am

mixed. So it's kind of like, I don't fit in here. I don't fit in there. Like where do I belong? And then this kind of revolutionary music to me was like embraced all that. And I love that it wasn't anything having to do with rebelling. It was more about embracing that, like we're outsiders and it's okay. And so I shaved my head into a Mohawk and I think my parents just, that was worse than the tattoos, you know? And because for them, it's like, how are we going to explain it to the church, you know?

And I get it. It was very in your face. And at that time there wasn't, you know, people weren't dying their hair. Like this was not considered acceptable. I gave them probably a lot of white hairs, but now they've seen, you know, what I've done with my life and they're very proud of me, but you know, I've apologized for the hell that I put them through and stuff, but that's part of having kids. Yeah. When you have kids, you realize it, but I think you're talking about something

also very important that when you come from another place and you come into this country and then you're a little bit of Americana, whatever that version of Americana is, you do feel like weird. But in a weird way, it's a building block toward a business because you also know, you understand differences in people

and you understand desires in people and you can code switch between a Latino culture and a this and the punk culture. Yeah. Yeah. So I look at that in your trajectory. Yeah. Yeah. No, I love that. Yeah. I love that. Yeah, that is true. I mean, I've always, you know, when it comes to building a brand or any kind of project that I, you know, pour myself into, I really come at it from the perspective of being a fan. I know that things can become corporate and they can become big and mainstream, but at the end of the day, I'm a fan of music. I'm the person that will stand in line

and buy a ticket. You know, I will buy the artwork. And so if I don't want it, why would I make it? You know? And even though what I like might not be what everybody likes, I know that I'm not alone. There's other people that are outsiders that can relate. So how did you go from loving punk and loving tattoos for yourself to turning tattoos into a business for you? So I was 14 when I did my first tattoo and I know I'm cringing for your parents already. Well, it's crazy because I have a son now and he's four and I can't imagine him doing half of the things that I was doing, you know, just like, like living on my own at such an early age and running away and moving across the country on a Greyhound bus and smoking. You and our twins.

Yeah. I just grew up too fast. So, you know, again, I don't think I would necessarily change a lot of things about, you know, my path, but it's interesting. I'm like, man, at 14, I already knew what I wanted to do. And basically my neighborhood punk rock friend had this like homemade tattoo machine. He said, Hey, you know, I was, I was painting on, on like punk rock jackets at the time. And he's like, you're really good. You know, you draw really well. Yeah. I mean, I've always been drawing since I was a kid. My mom said, since I could hold a pencil. So he said, Hey, you should tattoo me. And I said, okay. And I didn't know anything about the tattoo industry. I didn't have a point of reference.

And I think that that was kind of a good thing. Most people go through traditional apprenticeship where somebody that's more experienced shows them how to tattoo. And for me, I had no idea what was bad or what was good. I was just doing it. It's kind of liberating in that sense. But I tracked down the first tattoo I ever did to photograph it when I came out with my first book and oh my god it was like the art was there the heart was there but the the skill and technique the equipment was not there you know so poor person that got that tattoo yeah but it also too I mean you know he's that now he has a cat run yeah the original yeah so yeah so then I got into my first tattoo shop when I was 16 and that's kind of when I had unlearned a lot of ghetto habits that I picked up along the way. And it was, you know, kind of refreshing to be around like bikers

who it wasn't about a business. It was like, we lived for this art. It's like, yes, it's a profession. Yes, it's a job. It means to the end, but that's not why we do it. You know, we don't do it because we have to, we do it because we, we, we need to, you know, we don't do it because we have to do it because we need to, you know, it's like in you. And I think that's like such an exciting thing. And I don't like to use the word blessing because it's like so contrived sometime. But I really feel blessed that I got to know at an early age what I wanted to do. So then I went to school, I was going to, I went to junior high, and then I went to my first two weeks of high school, my freshman year, and then I already knew I wanted to do this

for the rest of my life. So I just dropped out much to my parents' dismay and then dedicated myself to tattooing. And so in that period that you dedicate yourself, because there's one thing of, you know, loving something and then mastering it. Yeah. So how long did it take you to really feel like

grounded in that mastery? A little bit less than 10 years. See, I've been hearing that a lot from people. I mean, for me, I didn't make money for 10 years and then it all, I made money. I remember the point where I was like, Oh, um, this is becoming second nature. Right. In the beginning I would do tattoos and I'm like, I'm doing a good job, but I could do better. And you can always do better, but there's a point where you're like, okay, I'm doing a portrait tattoo and it really resembles the original or, you know, and it's, it's, I feel satisfied. I feel comfortable in your skin. Like I don't feel afraid in any way. And so I think that took a little longer,

but along the way I was making money. I was providing for my family. I was taking on a lot of responsibilities that teenagers shouldn't have to, you know, just growing up way too fast. So you're, you're learning all this and then how does the first TV show come up? Yeah. So the TV show was interesting at that point. I was already doing portraits and I was already booked out for almost like two years in advance. It was just, uh, I was really doing great. People in the tattoo world become obsessed with a specific artist. Well, yeah. Um, I mean, I wouldn't call it obsessed. I think that there's an artist for everybody. You know, I have weaknesses. There's things that I don't do because I'm not good at them. And you should go to those people who mastered that, you know,

genre of tattooing. But yeah, a lot of people become very loyal to their artists or to a certain style, you know, like I personally always loved black and gray and realism. So that's kind of what I gravitated towards. So I was tattooing, I was in my twenties at that point. And I was tattooing at a shop in Hollywood. You know, I was drinking a lot at the time and partying as 20 year olds do. And I was, I think I was in Finland actually, like at a metal concert, there was like a festival and I was tattooing a bunch of metal bands. And I got the call saying that they wanted me to come out to do this tattoo show. And I was like, who's going to watch that? That's so stupid. Like so boring.

Cause we just sit there and we just do this. And that's like the world's most boring show. But then there was a part of me that was like, at the time there was not a lot of female tattooers. You know, I could probably name all of them on two hands. I felt like a certain sense of responsibility because I know how networks are and like, they're going to hire people based on looks versus like what they're capable of doing. There was a little bit of gatekeeping, I guess, in that sense. And so I said, okay, I'm going to give it a try. And I

showed up and, you know, I wasn't familiar with the other artists. Like we didn't know each other and I don't think we had a great chemistry at all. So it was not fun. You know, it was like, I didn't connect with the people in Miami because it's, it's very, it's different. It's different. Like, you know, I really stuck out like a sore thumb, not in a good way, you know? And so I felt, I felt, I felt very isolated and alone, to be honest, I didn't have any friends. And I started just really like diving deeper into my addiction, you know, as a form of coping. And so I was, I started doing a lot of drugs at that time. And at one point I just had enough, I just had to get out of it. So I got offered my own TV show.

They want to do a spinoff show in LA, LA Inc. I agreed to it mainly because it nullified my first contract, which I signed completely drunk. And it just had a lot of things where I was like signing rights away that, you know, I should have had a lawyer present. I didn't know because I was a young kid. And so I said, okay, well now I've grown up and I've got a lawyer and I know what I'm going to do. And so I built this shop. And shortly after that is when I got sober. And that is really when my life turned around. And that's like, I won't be too preachy about it, but it is a big part of my story. It's like when I first started tattooing, I made an agreement with myself where I said, if anything ever gets in the way of my passion, that gets cut out. During that time, I broke up

with boyfriends. Like if they, you know, they felt I worked too much or whatever it was. And then when I realized that like drinking and drugs was getting in the way, that's when I was like, I got to break up with drinking and drugs. And overnight I just stopped. I like cut out all of my friends that I drank with and deleted all my drug dealers. Like I stopped going to the places where I used to go. And it was again, this kind of lonely place to be in because I was like figuring out I didn't have any real friends, you know, even like when I look back at like certain production when I was filming and I'm like, Oh, they liked me better when I was drunk or when I was wild.

Well, because that's good TV, right? That's good ratings. Yeah. And now I like, you know, when people are like, Oh, I watched L.A. and I'm like, Oh, they liked me better when I was drunk or when I was wild. Well, because that's good TV, right? That's good ratings. Yeah. And now I like, you know, when people are like, Oh, I watched L.A. and I'm like, like, I get like a little bit cringy because you know, I've grown up a lot. I'm 40 now. So it's like, I was in my twenties and thirties during that time. So I like myself a lot better now than I was then. But I was really grateful for the opportunity to be on TV because, A, I'm not afraid of documenting things. I think documenting things is amazing. I'm like a really crazy, obsessive archiver. So I archive everything.

Like I own the first five of everything I've ever made. And we have everything like neatly archived. And I have every line drawing for every tattoo I've ever done. So to me, documenting my life for that decade was amazing. I think that's a really interesting point. You know, I've spent a lot of time at the Library of Congress, and I noticed the common denominator between successful people is they keep their archives. Yeah.

You know, it's so interesting. You know, George Washington and Lincoln kept everything in their life. And I think that's just something interesting to hear from you. Yeah, it's true. It's almost like, you know, yeah, that you're gonna need it. Yeah, or I don't know why it's like, I think I think at the time, I you know, I was like, I'm never gonna have kids. I'm married to my job and all that stuff. And I thought, like, I'm not passing this down to anybody. But is this like a legacy? Is this like my mark, you know, and to a certain degree. And also I get emotionally attached to like, you know, nostalgia. Yeah. So it's like, I like seeing the growth.

Like I have like the first drawings from when I was a child up until now. And it's like, wow, like I got better. And that's like something to be proud of. Of course. But it's interesting because you do a TV show and what, no matter what we say, let's be honest, a TV show is a commercial for your brand. Yeah, of course. And it does create a whole other parallel track for you business-wise that you could never have scaled to the degree that you scaled it. So can we talk a little bit about that? I will say that times have changed since I've been on TV.

I don't think people watch TV the same way they did as back then. So back then, I mean, we were competing with shows like Sopranos. TV the same way they did as back then. So back then, I mean, we were competing with like shows like Sopranos and then my heart really just kind of broke up with television once it turned into reality because we were like a docu-series at first. It was like more documenting the tattoos and the stories behind them. And then it turned into like, okay, now we're competing with Jersey Shore and there's something for everybody, you know, like there's, I'm not knocking that at all. I just think like, that's not what I do. And like, I don't have that within me to like make that kind of television. So I saw myself kind of growing

out of it at that time. I think like whatever you put out into the world is what you're going to get. So whatever it is that you want to do, put more of that out there, you know? So I don't understand people like on Instagram or on social media now, like putting garbage out or just things that are fleeting because I'm like, that's what you put out. It's what you're going to be demanded of, you know? So like, to me, I like to put out what I like to create. So I love reading. I love writing. So I started writing books and then I learned how to photograph. And then I started, I photographed my second book and then I was actually approached for my makeup line. That was never something that I was like, I want to have a makeup line but actually but when you know what when i saw it i was like what a cool kind of brand

extension in a weird way because look you have great makeup yourself but also you i don't know i thought your makeup line was very tied like the way you even named yeah like tattoo eyeliner and it was just very appropriate yeah it's a form of self-expression and that's what i was selling i wasn't selling like a beauty standard because i'm like you know fuck a beauty standard you know but to me it's more just but it was vegan so that's something that was important to you yeah i mean i later like formulated things to be vegan but to me originally like the purpose of my makeup line was just to show like an artistic expression in a world where like beauty is more defined by like personal aesthetics or something like that, you know? And so I think it was fun, like the first five years. And then after the five years, I feel like it got so big

that I just lost control of it. And then I saw the mutation of YouTube happen. And that to me was like, I'm just not anything I want to be a part of. Again, I'm not criticizing anybody's approach to stuff because there's a lot of great entrepreneur YouTubers and influencers, but is that what I want to contribute to? I knew in my heart, that's not what I wanted to do anymore. The last half of owning my makeup line, I was quite miserable to be honest. You know, it was like kind of just, okay, let's see what we could do, you know? Like, where's the compromise here, you know? And that's okay.

I feel like I got out kind of at the perfect time before the piece of the pie was getting very divided. I have to ask you because, you know, when you put your name on something and then you sell it, you know, so many times they own your name. I know that they've taken your name and now they've turned it into,

like it means something else, right many times they own your name. I know that they've taken your name and now they've turned it into something else. We basically agreed that like I would take my name back. And at the time I thought, oh, well, it's just my initials. It'll be fine. And now I regret it, you know, because I feel like people still think I own it and I hate it. Like I have nothing to do with it. I don't know who they're hiring. I don't look at like I don't follow them. I don't know what products they're making. And it is hard

because people think like, oh, you know, Kat made that. And it's like, I have no idea what the creative direction is. Like, you know, I kind of wish they would change their name. Yeah. So it is. So that's a cautionary tale. Yeah. Totally. If I could go back in time, that's one thing I would change. I'd be like, just change it to like something else, you know? Right. But it's hard because they're buying a brand, right? Yeah, yeah.

So a lot of business information here because you do a show. Yeah. The show is a commercial for a brand that sometimes you can brand extend, but people then come to you. Yeah. And how many people do licenses and do all kinds of stuff? You do them and it sounds great, but they don't always work out. Yeah.

And then you have to figure out, you know, did I put my name? Should I have called it something else? And maybe when we're the first time you do it, you don't think of that. Sure. I mean, that it may be a divorce. Yeah. And then somebody else has your name. Right. So like when I did Miami Inc, for example, they owned the rights to my name, my likeness, all my artwork. I mean, that, that was what I was fighting for because I was like, Oh, this is, I can't even believe that that's legal. Like, you know, how can somebody own while you're alive, your name and likeness, you know? So like, meaning that I couldn't do anything with my name without their permission. That's terrible. So then when I did

LA Inc at that point, I got a good lawyer and he was like, Oh no, we got to, we got to get rid of this deal. And this is all very cautionary because when you are the brand you're selling versus you come up with a line of which, you know, you now are doing a lot of other business deals. So we'll talk about that. So when you're selling yourself, then it's very connected to you. And if something goes wrong and it's a divorce in business, they own you. And that's happened to a lot of designers, a lot of people. And then the other part of it that like, to me, the, the, maybe the more

emotionally important part is that when something fails, nobody knows the wizard of Oz that's behind, that's actually running things. You have to deal with that. Like if, if the makeup line were to fail now, people would think it's me and it's not. But at the same time, I think like you pick your battles. Well, you know, entrepreneurs, I mean, you think of yourself, I see as an artist, but you're really an artist and an entrepreneur. And I think the entrepreneur part of you has to make mistakes. I've made a million mistakes. I have failed. I tell everybody I have failed more than I succeeded.

You only have to succeed two or three times. That's all people remember. But you have to fail to learn to go to the next level. So I also love it because you've talked a lot about your entrepreneurial life and also buying homes and all kinds of stuff. Where did you go after this whole makeup thing? Because I know you're doing your own businesses. The makeup stuff started just consuming my whole life. We were based out of San Francisco. So I was flying out there sometimes twice a week. I mean, it was like just, I didn't really have a life outside of it.

Were you still tattooing at that point? Yeah, I was balancing it whenever I was in town, but I haven't done tattoos for money. And like, it's been over a decade now. Like I only tattoo my friends and it's more of a gift that I do. I don't really depend on that. And my first and foremost passion in life has always been music. I was started playing piano when I was five years old. I was a classically trained pianist and

music influences everything I've ever done. I had been working on an album for about 10 years prior to releasing it two years ago or a year ago. So when I sold my makeup line, I said, Hey, like, I really want to tour. I want to make this my next focus. And the only way I'm going to do that is going to be compartmentalizing and choosing like, you know, you cannot do it all. Like you can, it just won't be good. Well, that's why I said, follow your bliss, maybe in Spanish saying in epochas, right? In periods of your life. Yeah. They've run other courses, you know? Right. And then this was a perfect time for me. So I did that. And then I have a shoe line too, that I learned so much from the makeup. Yeah. Just from production. And it's interesting

because now we're at a little bit of a tipping point where it's like, okay, we were a baby brand and now we're starting to grow. And I'm like, like, you know, I still want to keep you small because it's, it's nice to be in control of all of that. And I, you know, I still want to keep you small because it's, it's nice to be in control of all of that. And I, you know, and I'm a little traumatized with, you know, other experiences. So it's like, but it's a good thing. It's a good thing to be able to do that and grow things that they do stand up on their own. And, you know, we'll see how that goes as well. Hold on. Moneymaker will be right back. One of the most stressful periods of my life was when I was in credit card debt.

I got to a point where I just knew that I had to get it under control for my financial future and also for my mental health. We've all hit a point where we've realized it was time to make some serious money moves. So take control of your finances by using a time checking account with features like no maintenance fees, fee-free overdraft up to $200, or getting paid up to two days early with direct deposit. Learn more at Chime.com slash MNN. When you check out Chime, you'll see that you can overdraft up to $200 with no fees. If you're an OG listener, you know about my infamous $35 overdraft fee that I got from buying a $7 latte and how I am still very fired up about it. If I had Chime back then, that wouldn't even be a story. Make your fall finances a little greener

by working toward your financial goals with Chime. Open your account in just two minutes at Chime.com slash MNN. That's Chime.com slash MNN. Chime. Feels like progress. Banking services and debit card provided by the Bank Corp. Bank N.A. or Stride Bank N.A. Members FDIC. SpotMe eligibility requirements and overdraft limits apply. Boosts are available to eligible Chime members enrolled in SpotMe and are subject to monthly limits. Terms and conditions apply.

Go to Chime.com slash disclosures for details. I love hosting on Airbnb. It's a great way to bring in some extra cash, but I totally get it that it might sound overwhelming to start or even too complicated if, say, you want to put your summer home in Maine on Airbnb, but you live full time in San Francisco and you can't go to Maine every time you need to change sheets for your guests or something like that. If thoughts like these have been holding you back, I have great news for you. Airbnb has launched a co-host network, which is a network of high-quality local co-hosts with Airbnb experience that can take care of your

home and your guests. Co-hosts can do what you don't have time for, like managing your reservations, messaging your guests, giving support at the property, or even create your listing for you. I always want to line up a reservation for my house when I'm traveling for work, but sometimes I just don't get around to it because getting ready to travel always feels like a scramble, so I don't end up making time to make my house look guest-friendly. I guess that's the best way to put it. But I'm matching with a co-host so I can still make that extra cash while also making it easy on myself. Find a co-host at Airbnb.com slash host.

Me again. If you are loving this conversation, and I know you are, duh, don't forget to subscribe to Moneymaker. The link is right there in the episode description. Okay, back to Nellie and Kat. Let's get back to the show. So you're doing the music, which you love, this next fashion, but you do have an entrepreneurial life. Cause you know, I always say to, to, especially to women, you know, life is about mission and money. And we forget that money has to be in a part of the equation because you can't do your mission without money. So can you talk a little bit about that? Yeah. And I will say, you know, I have like changed a little bit of my perspective. I used to be a workhorse. Like I used to be one of

the workaholic. Yeah. Yeah. I just hate the term bus, but I used to be like workhorse. Like I used to be one of the workaholic. Yeah. Yeah. I just hate the term bus, but I used to be like, Oh, that's so cool. You know? And now after I got married and had a kid, I realized that stay at home moms, uh, you know, I have a little bit of an envy to that. The idea of making your empire be your family is like a really enticing thing for me. It doesn't mean that I have to like let go of what I do. Cause I do think you can do both. Well, I think also coming from our background as immigrant kids, I think when you spend so much time also taking care of your family, which I don't think people realize and you are so motivated to succeed and maybe you don't even know why,

but it's because your parents have gone through so much. And then it kind of catches up with you where you go, I am the moneymaker. You know, that's why the show is called moneymaker because I was the moneymaker of my family, right? That you are the moneymaker and that maybe you also need to take a break and give yourself some space. Right. I think so. I mean, I have no problem admitting that I've gotten something wrong, you know, and there's been many times in my life that I've gotten things very wrong, but I think in this case, I used to like make fun of domestication and like, maybe because it wasn't cool to you. And now it's very cool. My mom was a stay at home mom and my dad was away working most of the time.

I don't know. It's, it's, it's not what I want for my family. And my husband's so on board with the same thing. You know, he's a musician as well. And he's an artist. And we, we do feel like lucky that we're able to stay at home as much as we do with our son. But like, you know, I want to homeschool my son. Like I want to like live on a homestead. Like, so, you know, I know earlier today we were talking about moving and everything. And I've lived in Hollywood a majority of my life. And I love, I love California. You know, I love the weather. I love the dirt. I love my friends here. Yeah. What happened that you decided to pick up and leave? I think I want to give my son similar upbringing that I had when I lived in Mexico,

even though I was only there up until I was six, there was a feeling of simplicity, modesty, and nature. There wasn't all these complications of life. And now in this day and age is even more. I fear that it's going to be a lot of work to go against the grain of what is normal now. Like, I think what we have as normal is not good. There's great things about social media, but I think there's terrible things about it, especially like with children. And this is obviously my own perspective. You know, some people are like, I love giving my baby an iPad.

That's fine. We don't do that. It's funny. You're almost becoming more traditional. Yeah. So basically, I found a similar house as the one we're in right now, because I like a lot of Victorian architecture. And it's in the middle of nowhere in Indiana. Like Like even my friends in Indiana have never heard of this place. And it's a town with

a population of 10,000 people. It's right on the Ohio river and the house is on 14 acres of land. You know, we're going to build a lake and have, you know, and you probably bought it for a lot less money than in LA. Oh yeah. Yeah. But I'll tell you really quick. What was the most appealing thing to me when we went there? Because I remember seeing this house that I loved for the longest time. It was on like the historical homes of America listing. And while it was a bed and breakfast for 10 or 20 years, but now it's on the market, let's just go and see it. You know, and you were just looking. Yeah. We weren't even looking for a house. I just said, this house is on the market. I don't know anything about this place. Let's just go to my husband. And we bought a plane ticket, went there and we drove up to this

majestic house on a Hill and we loved it. And at nighttime, we walked around the little town and what I loved was that in every little house, there was a light on in the dining room and families were seated at the dining table. And I was like, this is my childhood. Like, you know, we sat down, we prayed before we ate and we unwrapped our day together as a family, whether we liked it or not. That was what we did. I live in Hancock Park right now.

And it's like, you walk around and I don't see that here. And it's like over there, it's just very working class people, very simple. And I love that. Like, they don't give a shit who I am. It's awesome. Like the first time we went there, we went to like AJ's diner. It was like this little, like, you know, kind of David Lynch-y looking like greasy spoon place. And the lady was just like, oh, are you the lady that bought the house? I'm like, yeah. I'm like, how'd you know? And she's like, I don't know. You have black hair. Like, you know, they don't care about you, you know? And I love that. They care about you as a And she's like, I don't know. You have black hair. Like, you know, she's like, they don't care about you. You know, and I love that.

They care about you as a neighbor. You know, they'll bring you over a loaf of bread and then leave it at your doorstep. But do you think it's also that we're craving home? Yes. That feeling of home. Yes. And I think as- I lived in Hancock Park for seven years and I don't know my neighbors.

That's right. Well, it's because you come from a country where there's a sense of home. And when we, sometimes when we come here, we feel like we don't fit anywhere no right so you're trying to recreate that but also i think going back to young people and talking about money yeah everybody wants to go to new york la all the you don't realize like there's many places to go live yeah that are still small towns that you can actually buy a house for cheap and actually own it for 20 years and retire off of that house or whatever. And we're forgetting to talk about that. And we, everybody just wants to go to LA and be famous and be on, be an influencer or be

on social media. And there's so many other places, especially in today's world where you can work from home that we can populate and create small town communities that are... Yeah. I mean, I will say this, look, if you're young and you want to move to LA or New York and pursue, you should do that. Like, you know, like there's certain opportunities here that you will not get elsewhere. Like there's pros and cons to everything. So what would be like for young people, what would be the three things that you would say to them that you've learned in this mission and money life and, and really following your bliss and also evolving? It sounds like your bliss has changed, right? And what you focused on has changed. And how do you,

how do you kind of track that trajectory? You know, I think the whole follow your bliss thing, like I was reading something the other day about like how to choose wisely what your dream is you know because a lot of times some stuff is like not realistic and like do you really want to waste your time like just being realistic or getting the feedback of what you're really good at yeah yeah or or what people are responding to and you know it's like sometimes you can be good at stuff it just doesn't work you know like i'm doing this music thing and like i'm to keep trying and we'll see how it goes. And hopefully like people like it, you know, but I don't know. I'm just doing things because I believe in it and I love it. And we're going to try this out, you know, but I think sometimes it's okay to say, Hey, maybe this isn't working out.

Sometimes there's other practical things that are equally important. You know, like I was telling my husband, I'm like, man, I don't, I'm useless if I'm not creating art, but that's like scary. Like, because, you know, it might not have as long of a lifeline as like somebody who has an actual trade, you know, like, I don't know how to frame a house. I don't know how to, you know, and that's why I think like lately people knock like stay at home moms. And I think that is an amazing job to have. Like, if you can do that, that's so cool. And if you find the right partner to do that and have a little nuclear family, that is such a beautiful balance too. For me, I need to have both worlds. Like I can't just be a

stay at home mom. I have to create, like, even my husband says, like, you'd be so miserable if that's all you did. You know? I'm like, yeah, it's true. But I think what you're saying too, miserable if that's all you did you know i'm like yeah it's true i need but i think what you're saying too is that the things that you do that that succeed or make you money are not always forever like if you're a professional athlete yeah that's not going to be forever right like influencers like i wonder what does that look like in in 10 years that's right so you have to cultivate other things friends who are strippers Like there's a very like short life. Yeah. You don't see in your 50s. 60 year old stripper.

No. No. You do have to kind of cultivate both sides. Sure. Yeah. On the other hand, we can all evolve and switch gears. Totally. But do we switch gears in what we're good at versus something we may love, but isn't really

where our gifts lie. lie. And that's the question. And also you're very lucky that you love something and you've known it early. Yeah, totally. And that also you had that platform that scaled it for you, be good or bad. Totally. One thing that it's very clear to me to hear from you is life is also about timing, right? If you land in the right place at the right time, and then maybe the media changes and we don't like, or we don't want to

do it or whatever. And today that world is based on TikTok and sort of short form media and people do even quicker, faster stuff, but they're monetizing it. So it's a business now. Will it be a business in 10 years? We don't know. No. Yeah. I mean, now that you say, I think like, what would I be doing if I, let's say, didn't have a TV show, I would be, I think a successful tattooer, you know, at the end of the day, like I was still doing, regardless of what came my way, I was still doing what I love and making great money at it, you know, consistent, you know, it was booked out, you know, two years prior to be on the show. That's how like, and it was like, you know, five to six tattoos a day averaging, you know, anywhere from a thousand to 2000.

So your mastery in a focused area is what brings you to everything else. And then you have to decide. Yeah. I mean, for me, at least it worked. But I think it's true. Yeah. I think, you know, that's true of an athlete. It's true of anybody that does something and masters it, like sticks to it for a period of time. Sometimes I think it's so much better to be that kind of famous that you're famous for a specific thing that people respect you for. Totally. Because then it's very grounded in something you really know how to do. Yeah. You're not a fraud. You didn't just show up and become famous because you happen to be in. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. You do have a skill. Yeah. That no one else has and that you've mastered. Yeah. No, I agree with that for sure. But it's the finding that for people that's not so easy.

Yeah. Finding that passion that's not so easy. Yeah. I want to talk about being a moneymaker and being a woman that's made money. Yeah. And how has that changed your life compared to other women? Like, how are you empowered in a way that most women aren't? Because somehow what you've done for a living has brought you some level of wealth, right? Of course. So how does that feel? And what do you think about that? It's interesting because I was having a conversation with my friend, Alex. She has like a jewelry line that's that does really well. And she was saying, you know, when you sold your makeup line, you made a bunch of money like you're all set. Like, what do you what more do you want? And I'm like, yeah, what more do I want? I think mainly because I still feel young and there's so much that I want to do. I think the hardest

failure that I will ever face is like not being able to do all the things that I want to do before I die. Right. But I'm going to die trying. But I think now that I have a kid, it's changed certain things that I'd like in life. It's a weird balance. Like I want my son to not, I want him to have a clear understanding that the luxuries we have are not given. You can't be entitled to this. You have to work hard for it. But then I also want to have the means to be able to have him in whatever classes and extracurricular he wants to do. I want to have like tutors. We want to do homeschool. Like there's certain things that require money. I want and so you're saying not not necessarily grandiose things but that money has given you choices yeah i want the the ability to be able to stay at home and like to a certain degree and

and enjoy my life with my son and you can't do that if i don't make money you know what i will say is that something that you said earlier today that I loved was that like about about the means you know means for the mission like I think that's the important part is that like what is it that you love to do and figure out a way to make money doing that it's not that simple but it's like that's the that's the dream the dream is to be able to do what you love and make money but as a woman that has interviewed a lot of women entrepreneurs, I think there's another piece we're missing, which is very important, which is we just went through the whole me too thing and women kind of coming out and saying they put up with a lot of shit, not just in relationships, in bosses and this and that. And I think what I've gathered

from so many women I've talked to is this idea of becoming self-made and everyone becomes self-made in a different way. Right. And does give you this empowerment to not put up when you have F you money, you don't put up with a lot from a bad relationship or a boss that's horrible or whatever. And the empowerment that being self-reliant economically brings to a woman is very powerful. I want to know if you feel that way. I don't know if I agree with that. I mean, I guess I know what you're saying, but I feel like it shouldn't take money for you to be able to tell somebody to fuck off. But there are a lot of women that are economically attached to a man or attached to a woman, whoever they're with.

like economically attached to a man or attached to a woman, whoever they're with. Yeah. But that's, I mean, don't do that. I mean, it's like, I know a lot of people don't like Jordan Peterson, but he, you know, he talks about like how women are just so agreeable sometimes. And I, and I look back at my life and I go, I was not agreeable. And maybe that's why I pushed forward because I didn't make my gender an issue. You know, I just was like, I'm going to be better than I can possibly be. And most likely be better than you, you know? And it's like that way, by the time that I like went to Miami ink and these like fucking just insecure men would like give me the hardest time.

I was like, at the end of the day, I'd come home and I'm like, I tattoo circles around you. So what, what are you holding over my head? Like at the end of the day, like I know my power because I've worked for this, you know? So it wasn't about money. They were probably making more money than I was, but I mean, I definitely wasn't making money off of the contract, you know? So it's like, it was just more about like, you know, your self-worth. you know? So it's like, it was just more about like, you know, your self-worth. So why, why would you put up with it? Like, I don't need a guy or money or what the world thinks of me to, to know my value. Well, you certainly are an incredible, well, you're an incredible artist and an incredible moneymaker, which doesn't always go together. I love that. I'm so happy.

Moneymaker is a production of Money News Network. Moneymaker is written and hosted by me, Nelly Galan. Our executive producer is Morgan Lavoie. Thanks for listening. See you next time you