Moore Style - How to Become a Better Lover with Andre Lazarus

Episode Date: April 22, 2024

Certified Intimacy, Sex, and Relationship Guide Andre Lazarus joins us this week for a conversation around building deeper intimacy within our relationships. This conversation highlights the nuances within intimacy and why it takes a willingness to explore what it means to each one of us. Andre also shares his definition of sex, erotic desire, and what it means to be multisexual. Celeste and Andre even get into how BDSM goes beyond pain & pleasure and why we need to have open communication around our boundaries and limits.  This episode is a reminder of the importance of enjoying experiences with the people who mean the most to us. If you’re looking to become a better lover, develop deeper intimacy within your life, and tap into your unique desires - make sure to tune in! In this week’s episode, we discuss: [01:25] About Andre Lazarus [03:53] How Andre became an intimacy and sex coach [07:25] What is a multisexual? [10:52] Andre’s definition of sex [12:51] Intimacy is more than just physical connection [20:18] What is erotic desire? [26:44] Ways to explore BDSM  [31:48] Communication, boundaries, and hard limits [35:12] How can men become better lovers? [40:01] Both people’s pleasure matters in a relationship [42:36] It’s never too late to be happy or to try something new [46:45] “Sometimes people just want to be heard” [48:26] Andre’s favorite date   Connect with Andre: Website Instagram  “Talented Lover” Course

Welcome to the down and dirty podcast, the ultimate guide to modern midlife dating. I'm your host Celeste Moore and I'm here to help you navigate the challenges of today's dating world. Think of me as your female version of hitch but better with over 16 years of experience as a certified image consultant and dating coach. I've got the inside scoop on what women want. In this podcast, we're diving deep into the world of healthy masculinity and modern dating. It's a fast changing industry. And here you'll find personal stories, expert insights

and candid conversations that will empower you to take control of your dating life. There's never been a better time to achieve your desired outcome, whether it's marriage, finding a significant other, securing a life partner or simply regaining your dating confidence. We're here with you twice a week to explore the viewpoints and challenges in today's dating arena that resonate with every man seeking dating success and love. So let's dive into today's episode. We've got an exciting discussion lined up for you. Get ready for the double D's of dating where dating dilemmas turn into dating triumph. welcome everybody to another episode of the down and dirty podcast i cannot wait to dive

into today's episode but first i want to introduce you to my exciting wonderful guest today his name is andre lazarus and he's a certified intimacy sex and relationship guy trained surrogate partner as well as Sacred Intimate, with 10 years of experience helping individuals and couples discover their intimate and erotic power. As a multisexual being experiencing consensual non-monogamous dynamics, Andre's unique approach to sexuality, sensuality, and the bond people share make him a thought leader and knowledgeable practitioner, speaking on multiple podcasts and running retreats, workshops around the world. Andre specializes in erotic desire, sexless Relationship, Sexual Trauma Healing, Erectile Concerns, Rapid Ejaculation, BDSM, Consensual

Non-Monogamy, and more. Well, thank you for being on today's talk. You know, hearing you say that, that's such a mouthful. I feel like I need to like condense that. I don't know. Well, you have many topics to discuss, and I think that's a bonus, right? Yeah, yeah, that doesn't hurt. Well, I'm glad to be here. Thank you, Chalice. yeah I appreciate it always a pleasure you know to learn from expert and we really really truly like learn from here and that's the platform I have is really to educate and to help people that maybe are feeling alone or struggling with certain situations that they just don't have another outlet and hearing a podcast like this and hearing your story is just you know makes it

feel a little bit more you know i've been less alone in the world so thank you yeah yeah and i guess the the biggest feedback i get on my show is people love to learn and hear about sex that is what a shocker so i was like really that's that one did that with you know was such a huge hit and you know yeah of course i think it's such a deal in today's society it's a little taboo Yeah, I would agree. And I really am not shocked, but at the same time, it's such a new age of sexual exploration,

sexual desires, all these things that we have in, especially at the fingertips, right? We have the internet, so we can explore more. We didn't have these resources, you know, even 10 years ago. So anyhow, I would love to hear a little bit more about

the space, the journey that you have chosen to become a coach around intimacy and sex? Yeah. Well, first, how much time do we have? And then secondly, yeah, my journey has unfolded, you know, over many years. I've gone through many different iterations of change and shift in my life. So where I am today is different than where I was five years ago and five years before that. But really how I came into this work, it was really from the individuals in my life, my community, lovers, partners who reflected back the experiences they were having with me in an intimate space and how I should be doing this work for a living. So I can't say that I knew I was going to be doing this work. The little boy, the younger version of me would

have probably laughed at that idea, but I really credit the influences around me who encouraged me to step into this because I really do feel like this is my purpose or my current purpose. And like you said, you know, sexuality, even like intimate connection is still something that isn't like at the forefront of everyone's mind. And as you also said, you know, with more access to information. We're learning more about this, but it's still, I feel at its infancy. So yeah, my journey has been quite interesting rather than going too deep into it. It's on my website. So if people have questions, they can also reach out. But I was in the military for eight years and nowhere in my life that I think I would be stepping away from that world and then stepping

into a world that's more focused on love and connection. Yeah. And how old were you when you joined the military? 25. So I had finished college. I was in a rock band in college. And that is what I thought was going to be my life, my pursuit. I was going to be this amazing rock star.

And, you know, that shifted like many bands do. And I just had my degree concluded and I was interviewing for jobs. And I realized this is not what I'm meant to be doing right now. And I didn't know what I wanted to do. So what does one do when they are looking for something? Sometimes I joined the military and then I did that for eight years, got out of the military. I became a bodyguard and did executive protection work. And then I moved into the tech space.

But I've really been doing this work for 10, 15 years. but more like you know in a way that I felt was also like healing and like work for myself as well along my journey so as you mentioned like not feeling alone even the most skilled professional in this field is also working on themselves as well yeah agreed I'm a coach and a consultant and I'm always working on myself and I feel like the journey never stopped even in any type of relationship there's no stagnancy you know there's no there's no point where okay this work everybody is evolving everybody's changing all the time and i feel that the more you look inward and work on yourself it's just gonna have you're gonna you know project more of who you are and what you

want in your life so yeah i have a question for you what would you say for the audience here what is a multisexual yeah I know that I get that question all right yeah I would say at first just a little backstory for myself it's been hard for me to like label myself or put myself into like a particular box so when we talk about you know gender orientation or sexual orientation I feel because I'm an ever-changing being what I am desiring in connection is also changing and shifting. So I was looking at my history and understanding my sexuality. I never felt like I was a heterosexual being. I knew that I wasn't gay. And there were certain orientations that, as I was researching, that also didn't feel like it fully embodied me, such as bisexuality. So

I have a strong romantic and physical desire for women. And I also have a desire for exploration and intimacy with men as well. And other non-binary folk as well within my experience. So I was trying to find a particular word or way to describe myself that really fit. And I looked up multisexuality and it really similar to maybe what people might see as like pansexual is just a broad stroke of you find intimate desire connection with multiple beings and multiple ways and that can shift and that can move so it's how I like describe myself in the best way possible but again you know it's a term that not everyone knows about yeah it's more fluid yeah i like that thank you i know we all like to put label on our gender and

sexuality only because it works in society right it's easier it's easier to like pinpoint something rather than say i don't know i'm just kind of everywhere yeah right right well thank you for sharing and describing that a little bit more because i was like oh i don't that's a new one i'm always learning and i love it i am always you know taking bits and pieces in from every show and that's why i absolutely love doing this and having having everybody on here yeah i mean it's like yeah i think so many people even in the space that i'm in i'm still learning about i feel like there's a new term every week there's a new gender term there's a new sexuality term god it feels so stupid, but it's just, we're all learning and we're growing. And also like what we know is

like the dictionary and the words that we first, all words are created. We created them. The fact that, you know, what's the word that like fleek, the word like the term on fleek is now actually in a dictionary. So yeah. I remember someone saying, wow, your eyebrows are on fleek. And I I was like, it was a woman that was a year younger than me. And I was like, okay, I should definitely know this. It wasn't like my teenage daughter. Yes, exactly. So there's a new dictionary for all of these words.

Question for you. What is your definition of that? Oh, man, you're throwing some good ones out there. So this is my definition. There's like the textbook dictionary definition. People will have their own. But for me, I see sex as any experience that provides you some form of feeling, stimulation, enjoyment that has the potential to bring you to a heightened orgasmic state. That sounds like a mouthful, but we usually think about sex as this physical, you know, one person touching another experience.

But that doesn't have to be sex. Like sex can be, you're reading a really delicious novel and you're getting so turned on that all of a sudden you're now like in a heightened orgasmic state. Why is that not sex? Or the idea of like receiving a body massage and that brings you to a heightened orgasmic state. Why can that not be sex as well? So that's how I see it. And I feel it's helped me and as well as my clients to reframe because sometimes the idea of what is the traditional, more penetrative experience with sex can either can be hard to either achieve for them or maybe seem unachievable depending on where they're at in their life. And we're also talking about so many different ways that people identify, you know, gender-wise or sexual orientation-wise, that if you look at like a textbook definition, excludes quite a number of people. So that's my definition. Yeah, because I often wonder, I know there's relationships with asexual people, and I always wondered what sexless relationships, and that's pretty much, I always wondered about that. I know that you can have emotional connections with people, it doesn't have to be physical, but there's all different levels of connection. And intimacy as well. And again, when you see the word intimacy, like talked about in a book or perhaps maybe even like an article, then we go again to the physical. We think, oh, the physical aspect of what intimacy is. But like you said, it can be emotional, intellectual, spiritual and ways that people like to connect. You know, when we talk about like energetic sex, a lot of times energetic sex might not even involve the physical interaction of two people, but just being in the same space, different ways of breathing with one another and like tapping into something else that's more unique than the way that we, again, think about penetration. So my definition of sex, my definition of intimacy, again, is very broad stroke because we all desire something, but it can be very unique in the way that we desire it.

Yeah. Thank you for explaining that. It's something that I really talk about. Intimacy with others is not just physical. And I don't know if you find this with clients that you meet, particularly men, when they hear the word intimacy, oh, it's physical, right? Well, I'm really about educating them what the other forms are, because with a typical heteronorm relationship with a man and a woman, women desire and I'm not saying men don't desire, but the connection piece is so much stronger in a woman to be emotionally connected and spiritually and not just the physical portion. So it's really about educate like holding hands or there's all these different ways to express intimacy or not just yeah or even even a man being intimate with another man where they might not be sexually desiring or attracted to like you can still achieve that you can stick that's still possible. You can still have an intimate moment embracing another man as a man in a hug, sharing something vulnerable, and it not have to now mean you are gay, which is, again, there's nothing wrong with being gay. That's a beautiful way of presenting, but there's a fear in men that I've seen, and maybe I even had that at a younger age, not knowing myself, is that, oh, if I give this man a hug or a kiss, or I'd say that I love them, that means we are now something else, or now I am no longer the identity that I thought I was. And that's simply not the case. You can share intimate moments with someone and it not be romantic, it not be physical. And that's how we connect. I feel like we're all generalizing in some way, desiring some form of human connection. And it doesn't have to be sexual.

It doesn't have to be erotic. But why do we do podcasts? Why do we go out in the world and dress up or, you know, go to events, it's not just for us, but we want to share these experiences with other people. So yeah, I would say, especially with men, what I've seen just in my personal life and with my clients is the tapping into that intimacy or hearing that word intimacy can be a little bit scary because they don't know what that means or what's on the other side of that that's so beautifully said because we are we literally as a whole are lacking so much intimacy and connecting for years and years and as we do everything zoom right we're not connecting in the physical space you and I but I think prior to COVID started happening it's just the way

that we've shifted in society and so yes to find those moments it's almost like this gem these rare moments that we get to give the one thing that i missed during covid the biggest thing was hugging people it was the most beautiful embracing is hugging someone and really feeling them i'm such a hugger and my family's a hugger at huggers um may i send you an air hug right now Yes, yes, yes, yes. I just like, it's such a way to express genuine connection. Yes, I couldn't agree more. I feel for myself, while I enjoy exploring all the different realms of intimate connection, touch is very important to me. It's something I enjoy giving. It's something I also enjoy receiving from so many people. And like you said, during a time like when we're talking about COVID or just maybe in a world where we don't always think about the importance of touch connection, how vital it is. Some people are like having an emotional experience or might be having like the worst day possible.

and if there's someone you know or you see them going through something asking them would they like a hug and just doing that even for like five or ten seconds can dramatically shift that person's day potentially their light and also talking about hugs how frequently we like do quick hugs because maybe we're nervous or we're not used to that connection but even for you Celeste or anyone listening, you know, a challenge for you is the next time you hug someone rather than it being for a couple seconds, try hugging for 15, 20 seconds, like counting your head and see how different that experience is to your nervous system. Yeah, no, I love that. I follow this guy on Instagram and he's a doctor and he talks about, well, one of his posts was that we

need 12 hugs a day to function as normal individuals like to have a healthy normal life and so i told my daughter this one day and she's like okay how many do we have down now like we're counting and i was just like you know i mean could be with other people but it just for to have a normal healthy life 12 is the magic number and i was like interesting i don't even know if i get two bucks a day but it could be from an animal too you know will you send me that will you send me that i will i'll find it for you i'm thinking about that like i feel like 12 is yeah if i can get 12 in before in like the afternoon i feel like i'm at a good sweet spot but like you said maybe even like you said animals or just being able to touch another

living being obviously with consent with within the boundaries is again it's a way for us to feel the energy the warmth of that other person that other being that can help us like you know bring some new vitality to our day so yeah i'm gonna try that okay well when we're done i'll send that over to you yes please so i would love to speak on erotic desire now i did google erotic desire. There's no definition in the typical Webster dictionary. It's interesting. Could you explain kind of what this means and how you specialize in this field? Yeah. So the way that I look at erotic desire, and I'll speak for myself, is I think about the moments in my life where I feel the most turned on, the most elated, you know, I'll use the word happy,

but like a feeling of joy, a feeling of, you know, again, like life vitality. And that is where I see people being able to find what it is that they're desiring. It doesn't have, again, and I might repeat myself, it doesn't have to be sexual. If your erotic desire is taking a bath and having the warm water in the bubbles, you know, draping across your body, and that just makes you feel alive and powerful. Boom, you've nailed it. Holding hands. I really believe that erotic desire comes from something within us that maybe doesn't always get a chance to come out. So when we can come into that, that power of our erotic desire, then that's when almost like we think about nothing in this world can stop us. But I see the difference between what is like a

desire and the need. For me, I need water in my life. I cannot survive without water, but I might desire to have a lemon in my water and something else that gives it a little bit more fun or more flavor. So when we think about desire, it's what is it in our life that we're wanting something that can make us feel again like our big itself and then the eroticism i really do also see as this untapped area within us that again turns us on in the more you know sexual intimate space and what is that for you actually i don't know if you're open to sharing so that's but like what is something you desire like when it comes to connection you know i i wouldn't say i'm just gonna have to throw this term out there the first time i heard it i was like

what is that sapiosexual sexual is when you're stimulated through the intelligence of your brain having conversation that's a turn-on to me in a and it can be in any type of conversation i cannot connect with someone in a physical intimate space or sexual space if i'm not connecting on some wave of the brain so sure it's not the only thing it's just part of the thing yeah i appreciate yeah i appreciate you sharing about that yeah and that's the thing is that the stimulation and i'm i'm not a doctor and i don't want to go into like all of the things that happen within internally but the endorphins they're like when we're like working out or we're going for a run or you know we just saw you know amazing like concert that like lit us up inside

and we're our pulse is like pounding and you might be like feeling all warm these are like experiences that help us to feel and when we talk about tantra when we talk about bdsm when we talk about all these varying ways that people are trying to pull out or discover that erotic desire, in my opinion, it's all for one purpose, is we want to feel something. Sometimes that feeling can be uncomfortable. Sometimes it can be surprising. Sometimes it can be painful. But we want to feel.

We want to feel alive. And when we talk about erotic desire, erotic connection, those are all ways, gateways for us to feel. When we talk about psychedelics or plant medicine, I mean, those are tools for us to be able to tap into our feelings, our desire. they're not necessarily things we need but we enjoy them because it's an easier gateway people who meditate people who have been doing like forms of breath work all of holotropic breath work all of these are ways for us to tap into sensation into our body so that's that's kind of a longer answer to your question yeah but no it's okay it's good to explain in more of a general fence too so people can understand there's different dynamics to erotic desire and everybody has their own feelings and desires that come out and there's no right or wrong for this this is

what i love it's just tapping into what you like and that sometimes takes exploration oh yeah you don't know until you practice until you've tried some of these things and thank you for naming that I think about people like wanting to define things like with words and I enjoy bringing in examples because it's easier connected to because when I think about how do we teach children we don't just read them like the you know recipe or an instruction booklet we show them you know we maybe like help them to like tangibly touch or learn whatever it that they're doing. And I consider myself a big kid. I see us all as big children that just had to like become adults at some point in our growth. But I feel that is the best way that we can really

like learn about what it is that we want or the things that we enjoy. Also the things that we don't i mean i enjoy the practice of bdsm both professionally as well as in my personal life and there's so many ways that you can explore that dynamic but until you've actually you know had shibari rope on your body or practice sensory deprivation you don't know what that's going to elicit you can have the idea that it might be like scary or you might have hesitancy because you haven't done it you're like oh that's not for me which is perfectly fine but that you might try you'd be like oh wow there's actually something here that i really do enjoy and how would i have known if i didn't try yeah definitely on that subject we have never discussed that on the show

and that is a very broad spectrum of physical and psychological control and pain and pleasure and i don't think you have to explore all of them is that correct to absolutely not no you don't yeah right okay yeah i have a good friend of mine she was dominant a dominatrix but she had to be submissive first to understand is that correct or maybe that's not always correct i mean it's a great question i i can't say in my or something in that you have to do that or have to do anything okay there are schools of thought and and i might practice this myself i am more of a dominant or top role so there's there's d types and s types this can again be an entire another podcast but um yeah it's really around power exchange and also being able to talk about

varying forms of power dynamics so your friend that you're talking about who is a dominatrix who might be more particularly in their dominant or top role in the way that they play personally or professionally that what they're saying is maybe in the training they received is they also went into a submissive or bottom role to learn about what it's like to be on the receiving end of being in your dominant state. And this is something that I personally practice. I am, again, more of when I'm playing with lovers, partners in my work, I'm more in my dominant role. But occasionally I like to be in the submissive state to, again, see what it's like. but I also I have some comfort level in doing that you don't have to do that you can if you

so choose but it's not it's not a necessity and I want to go back to where you're talking about pleasure and pain and in the world of BDSM I feel sometimes there is some misconceptions that you have to feel pain that you have to have an entire toy chest or dungeon or room to be able to really explore this space and while all of that can be part of it literally using your hands on another person's body in a soft gentle way can be within the realm of bdsn like i talked about before it's all about what do you want to feel it doesn't matter around the what role play or what experience you have with like certain toys it's important to have experience depending on what you're incorporating in like a scene or your play but you don't have to have all of those

things i could literally in in this moment you know we won't do it today but we could have a negotiated scene where we're playing a role and you're in another part of the world than i am And this can be a BDSM scene by us just looking into each other's eyes or using particular words or me commanding you to stand up, sit down, all of these other elements. So it doesn't have to involve pain. And I feel once you do some research and get to know more about yourself, what you want, there's a whole nother world that might open up to you in the realm of like intimacy and play and sexuality. yeah and i i love that you said that because there are so many ways to find out more information about it you can read more you can read books you can go to the toy store and try some things with a lover partner um there's and i like that you said that too that you don't have to go to a dungeon space right you don't have to do the extreme version if it's something you're still

exploring um and yeah there is such a there is a lot of stigma around what it needs to look like so yes i'm glad that you were able to break that down and i would say from that piece and as well as everything we've talked about in this conversation the cornerstone to all of this intimate connection erotic connection understanding your own intimacy bdsm communication like talking about this with friends with lovers with partners but really feeling safe to share openly and honestly about things that feel good to you and what you would like to explore things that do not and where are like hard limits and boundaries but talking communicating before you go into an intimate experience during it afterwards that's the the real meat and potatoes

so to speak, of anything in the realm of connection. Because again, there is a lot of stigma around sexuality. There's a ton of stigma around BDSM. And when you have a chance to talk about it, it can really maybe help quell something like the nervousness or the fear around a space that can be really beautiful and really healing as well. Yeah. Well, I'm going to share a little story it's not going to be a long one but I feel like it's the space I don't know if I've even shared this with anybody before so it's not like it's such a secret it's just never the right time I had momentarily dated somebody and was preparing to be intimate and a very like you know what I thought was going to just be a very you know very just casual vanilla loving kind of way

all of a sudden he says he wanted me to put out cigarettes on him and kick him in the stomach with a high heel and literally andre when i tell you it went from very like nothing i had ever expected that that would come out of his mouth because like you said the communication right and i was like oh my god i felt so uncomfortable because i was like where did this come from don't surprise people I guess it's not even that great of a story but I'm just saying that how it is how true that communicating if he would have talked to me prior I may have chosen to go down that road or I may have not but to surprise a partner in that sense was just was it was like okay I think I'm going to leave because I just don't know what level this could could turn into so it's really

about everybody being comfortable too. Yeah. And I very much appreciate you sharing about that experience. And I've been surprised in similar ways. And maybe at times like a younger, more immature version of me also was the one to surprise. And like you said, if you had that conversation before, it wouldn't have felt as daunting or even if it was shared and you realized that that wasn't for you at least it wasn't something that you were caught in the moment and was able to like express where you were at and whether or not that would be something you'd be interested in actually doing so yeah thank you very much i think that was an important lesson for all the listeners to know about don't surprise yeah yes definitely how can you you know

for all of my men listening and women i mean i feel like it's about 50 50 but i definitely have more and more men listening and they love to learn from everybody here how can men become better lovers this is like very important audrey it's very it's very important it's funny you say that because i i literally just finished the creation and i'm now just finishing my first cohort of my course my program that I call talented lover so it's a program geared for men on how to be better intimate lovers and partners so well maybe just like the tip of it yeah it's almost like we set this up yeah how do men be better lovers well we talked about the communication piece I think that's that's vitally important and when I say communication not just how to communicate

with a partner or a potential lover but also communicating with yourself like actually asking yourself what is it that you are desiring in connection what is it that feels good for you as well not just what you have to do to show up for someone else because if we're only focused on the external we're only focused on holding space for someone else and this is challenging especially for people who are givers, to think about themselves a little bit, maybe be a little bit selfish. But if we're always focusing on outwardly, then we might not actually be getting what we need to feel connected, to feel good and experienced. And we might assume that just by giving and giving that eventually someone will give back to us, but that's not always the case.

So I'd say to really like lean into the being the best lover possible is also figuring out what it is that feels good for you and how you can co-create experiences with a lover, with a partner through communication, through understanding how you both enjoy, you know, giving and receiving intimacy. so one person might be more physically drawn to someone someone might be more intellectually like sapio more intellectually drawn and while they don't have to match in order for those two individuals to be able to speak the same language in the bedroom in other forms of intimate connection you have to talk about it because i can't read your mind celeste i have no idea what it is that turns you on or what you desire in partnership and you don't know the same for me but when we talk about it when we get to know each other and really get to know each other not just the surface level questions of where are you from and and what do you like to do for a living it's what are you

afraid of what are the things that are you know you're desiring you know before before you die like what are the things that bring you to the brink of like pure ecstasy like really like getting their personal questions but this is how we get to know someone and that's where the you know being a good lover can start and the communication also in say like physical intimacy if we're talking about actually being in a physical intimate sexual space also asking questions how do you like to be touched where do you like to be touched checking in to see if there's a certain technique or a certain way that this other person enjoys receiving touch and it goes the other way as well if you're the one receiving if what you're receiving doesn't feel good

don't assume like oh maybe i'll just hang on for another couple minutes and they'll be finished or maybe they'll move on to something else it's sharing about that hey you know this position is a little bit uncomfortable can we try this or oh I actually really enjoyed what you're doing with your tongue earlier can you go back and do that again sharing communicating is gonna like really like heighten any physical intimate or you know even like emotional experience that you're sharing. Yeah. And coming from as a woman, clearly, I think a lot of women need to learn how to speak up more. I think we are as lovers traditionally just, you know, here for the man's pleasure. And that's not the case. I want to emphasize how important both people's pleasure

is and it's okay to voice that. It's okay to show people that. I think there's such a, you know, it's so scary to say what I really truly want. Well, it should be like a priority. Yes. Yes. I, I so glad that you named that. I also, I'm very glad that you named, you know, both individuals, because I can also say again, that, you know, oftentimes with clients that I work with who are also who are men, their ideas, oh, well, I've got to do this thing in order to provide pleasure for my girlfriend, my spouse, my partner. It's not really my thing, but I'm going to do it anyway. And then I ask them, I understand that. And how often are you getting what you want or how often are you getting what feels good for you? Like, oh, well, we don't

really talk about that. So as you said as well, like being able to vocalize and speak up, like you said, there's, you know, generalizing, but like traditionally, like the way that women have been receiving pleasure for, you know, for a long, long time, um, is kind of whatever the man wants. And then once they're done, maybe not even in that long of a time period, then they roll over, they go to bed and then now it's on to the next thing. So being able to also have these conversations before, I want to emphasize that as well. Like you can talk about this during, and that's great, but if there's like something you want

of feel or experience in the connection you're about to go into with someone feel like having the confidence and feeling safe to share that if all you want to do is kiss and have your body massaged and never go to a penetrative experience or even had you know like your genitals or sensitive areas of your body touched you can share that and be met but if you don't if you just are like hoping that the person's not going to touch you there or that it's not going to escalate into something more erotic, then you might be met with disappointment. So being able to share that and if that person cannot meet you, if that person is pressuring you and saying, oh, I thought we were going to do this or I bought you dinner or you invited me up, why are we not? That is not

the person for you amen that is yeah we've too many of us men women have just said okay that's just the way it is and no it's not if you were uncomfortable and yeah i mean i of course i've done it in my younger years and oh i guess this is just what happens or this is what you're supposed to do but I'm I wish 20 years ago I had coaches that or somebody to talk to you know I really do it was just it was a counselor a therapist and that was also very stigmatized too and and I could never have been that comfortable but if I knew there was people out there like you on people that were educating that would just have been and probably made a big difference so um yeah to all the younger generations coming up hopefully they get to listen to these podcasts you know

yeah and also the older the you know i hope so many of my clients are in are in their you know 50s and 60s and i often hear the phrase oh it's too late or you know i i don't it's too late for me or there's not enough time and if you are still feeling in your heart if you still have breath in your lungs. If you're still desiring of something, it's never too late to learn to shift. And that can be in the partnership as well. I would say there's this idea that I don't know this or I haven't had this in my life. So I guess I'm either broken or I'm never going to be able to fix this or there's no way out of this scenario of sexless marriage or never having an orgasm or feeling of ecstasy or pleasure and i offer that there is always a time that you can change that there's

always a time that you can shift into what it is that you want and like you said celeste like there are people out there that can help you and it can be professionals like myself it could also be your friend like we're i i feel part of the connection piece is we don't want to ever feel fully alone. You might feel lonely, but as long as there are people around and people willing to have a conversation with you, you never know if that person's going to change your life in that day. So it takes courage. It takes practice. But being able to share when there's something that you're wanting and that you haven't had, that's how you can actually shift that. Because if you don't share it then no one will ever know yeah that's so beautifully said and it's something that

really really try to educate people friends clients whomever wants to listen it's never too late to be happy it's never too late to try something new and some people are well i've been married for 20 years and yada yada you know everybody has a story and i get it but you've got one life you've got to know how important you are and how much your pleasure means and how much happiness means to you because nobody's going to give it to you there's no outside source that's going to give you that pleasure that that you know you've got to find it from within and well so important sounds so basic but when you can love truly truly love yourself and come from that space then you're just going to you know attract that and I don't know I just

really I think it really hurts me when I see my friends who are maybe going through rough patches in their relationships or their marriages and I'm just like oh I could just see that so clearly and I know that's frustrating for me but I just try to be a space of you can talk to me if you want like i'm not going to tell you what to do of course you know but come to me if you want suggestions if you want any help or i have people like therapists because i'm not and you know doctors i'm not so and i would say this is a lesson that i've that i've learned and it took me a while to to get to this is sometimes people also just want to be heard they don't want suggestions. They don't want advice. They don't want you to fix them. They just want to be able to

just share what they're feeling and have someone else hear them. And that right there can be enough. So if you're someone listening, if you're someone who's either desiring to share or get something off your chest or you want help, but you're afraid that someone's going to just give you all the advice that you maybe you're not asking for you can ask for that being like hey i have a lot of things that are on my mind or i'm feeling this emotion or there's something really challenging going on in my life and i'm not really looking for anyone to like solve or fix anything i just want to be heard so that that's one example and then if you're the one who might be wanting to help someone or wanting to receive you can be like hey how can i support you

What would support look like in this moment? Do you want me to provide advice? Do you just want us to be heard? Let me know so I can show up in the best way. And it's those little communication tools that, again, I didn't like know growing up. I had to learn. I made mistakes. I'm constantly a work in progress. So as we talked about communication, communication, communication. yeah thank you for sharing that yeah that's well said that's exactly what i think a lot of people need so it's okay to voice what you need absolutely from your loved ones you know okay well i have one last question i think that we could go on and on on a lot of subjects and i love that i'll come back on just another episode yes i would love to what was one of your favorite dates one of my favorite dates that i can recall that's a great question is i'm a big supporter and proponent of plant medicine therapy i do it um in a guided from a guided experience where someone's holding space for me but i also do it in a recreational manner and one of my favorite moments was with my partner

where we were at this like beautiful campground in california and we had just ingested some plant medicine with one another and we just sat and we talked there was a creek nearby the sun was shining like there were birds we had like fruit and we didn't need all this other like external stimulation we didn't need music we didn't need her to be like a big beautiful like lavish kneel it was just her and i and thinking about that experience actually is making me feel a marching so yeah i would say yeah just being present with the one that i loved and sharing time with them because time is valuable. You know, I do believe in, you know, something else beyond us. I'm not

particularly a religious, like subscribing to a particular religion, but I do believe that after this body, that there is something else for me. But in this body, there's a finite amount of time. So I want to enjoy the experiences with the people that mean the most to me. I want to experience life, through travel, through food, through music, through all of these things. And what I often read about and what a lot of doctors will say when they're sitting with someone bedside towards the end of their life, and they're talking about their regrets, it's not about how much money they made. It's not about the car or the house that they owned. it's about the relationships they had or the relationships that they wish they would have

invested more time in so yeah that that was my best date oh I love that thank you for sharing that that was beautiful well as we wrap up is there anything that I did not ask you that you want to touch on um no I feel like we've given you a lot to think about I would love to come back if you ever want to have me again and um people if you're interested in finding me whether it be asking me questions or learning more about my offerings as a as a coach and a guide i have my website which is coming-closer.com i'm on instagram at coming closer with andre and as i mentioned we just started the second co-award actually this week but i have a program for men on how to be more proficient lovers

and intimate partners called Talented Lover. And I'm sure we can put that all in show notes and things like that. But yeah, again, I'm here as a resource. Celeste, thank you for having me. You're a beautiful resource. I got a chance to look at your website. I love how you mentioned

how you're the female version of Hitch or better. And Hitch is like one of my favorite movies. So I knew that this was going to be a lot of fun. So thank you for having me. Yes, thanks again. And I would love to have you on again. Thank you, Andre. I want to express my heartfelt thanks for sharing insights and experiences.

And to our listeners, your support and engagement makes this journey truly rewarding. So remember to follow and subscribe to the Down and Dirty Podcast. And until next time, keep exploring, stay curious, and thank you for tuning in. subscribe button, leave a five star rating and or invite others to listen. Your support is what helps us grow and continue to bring you valuable content. Thanks for hanging out with us on today's episode. Let's stay connected. You can find me on Instagram at Celeste Moore image and I'd love to hear your thoughts on today's discussion. For all the links, resources and additional information mentioned in this episode, check out the show notes on my website, Celeste Moore.com. That's

all for now. But stay tuned for our next episode where we'll dive into more exciting topics. Until then, see you next time, friends.