Morbid - Episode 362: The Source Family

Episode Date: September 7, 2022

It’s been a little while since we brought you a cult story so here we go!!!! Ash was chatting with her friend about The Source family and after diving deeper into it she just had to bring it to all you weirdos! The Source family was established in 1969 by a man named Jim Baker. He had this idea for a hip new restaurant that would bring new age ideas and organic, whole foods all together. It was a great idea in theory, but over time the whole thing would turn on its head. A cult was born and all kinds of wild things were going on, but what would be the most wild was the unexpected end of the cults ~Earthly Spiritual Father~ Jim Baker.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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of your home. Download the free Angie mobile app today or visit Angie.com. That's ANGI.com. Hey, weirdos. I'm Melina. I'm Ash. And this is morbid. Can I call you out for a second? Uh, yeah. In like a good way.

It's like a silly thing. Any time you do the Hey Weirdos, you outstretch your arms. I do I really. Every single time you hit record and you go, hey, weirdos. And it's like you're like lifting them all, you're kind of like a cult leader. Oh, how long theme today? You are. We're talking about a cult today, but does. I didn't know that.

I just watched you do it, and I've like thought about it before, but not said anything, and I just had to say it. I kind of love that I do that, and I also realize, yeah, you're a cult leader. You didn't know it. I'm a cult leader, and I had no idea. That's funny. Look at that.

That's funny. That is funny. Oh, ha, ha. So what's everybody watching on TV? Anybody watching good TV out there? Ooh, anybody? Are you? Yes, okay, actually.

I was watching The Real Housewives of Beverly Hills and I love The Housewives and I know, I know the recipe, you get a super fucking hyped for an episode and then all the goddamn, all the GD drama Happens in the last five minutes and they're like wait for next week. Yeah, I hate that. So they've been really hyping up this um, fucking ass-bun episode, and I was so excited I'm watching it last night All the end all at the end, and now I'm dying to know what happens. And I just want to say team Sutton.

Oh, I just want to say that. I'm a Beverly Hills, like I've gone in and out. Yeah, you haven't been in. I haven't been in, but I know Sutton. Yeah, and I'm interested to see why your team's like. I feel like Sutton is one of my soul's. Honestly, Sutton is getting like bullied to the season to the point where it's actually hard to watch.

That happens a lot on these shows and it's funny because when you watch it at a certain point, I think we've all kind of, maybe it's like the internet or something we've all kind of reached a point where we're like, oh yeah, that's not cool. Well, the sun here is like, oh shit, like what I thought was fun drama before you're like, hmm, yeah, that's really mean actually. And there's still like fun drama. Yeah, of course. The fun drama, you're like, mm, yeah, that's really mean actually. There's still like fun drama. Like I love the fun drama, but sometimes it just gets teased. I love that this is a house vibe,

spot cast at this point. I would fucking love that. But sometimes it just gets taken to a point where you're like too far. Yeah, I don't need to watch that. Like I don't want to watch Sutton crying because somebody's calling her a con. Yeah, I don't want to watch that. Like, I don't want to watch Sutton crying because somebody's calling her a con. Yeah, I don't want to watch that.

Sometimes there's parts of reality shows where you're like, I feel weird that I'm being allowed to watch this moment. Like, I don't think I should be allowed to watch this moment. And maybe it's like, it comes with age or something that you're just like, I'm not gaining the same kind of entertainment that I gained from watching somebody be upset

about something is not what I'm into anymore. Because a lot of people are talking about, I don't wanna say names, but there's some, honestly, there's so much drama going on on TikTok. And I know one person is breaking down on TikTok and everyone's talking about it. And I'm like, we're not supposed to watch people break down on the internet.

Yeah, you're not supposed to watch that for entertainment value. Yeah, it just really is one of those things that like, there's no way, and I saw somebody talk about it that there's no way the human brain was made. Yeah, it was a guy that was taking a break from TikTok. Yeah, to just scroll through and watch somebody like going through cancer treatments and like losing their You know their loved one to this horrible disease and like you watch their story and you get so upset and you cry and then you scroll Five seconds later and you're watching someone do a dance that makes you laugh and then you scroll again And if somebody's dog on their last day of life eating delicious food and you scroll again

And it's like yeah, there's no way our brains are and I know we're like fuck the internet right now But like aren't we? It's getting to a point and it's like, yeah, there's no way our brains are, and I know we're like, fuck, the internet right now, but like, aren't we? It's getting to a point where it's just like, ugh, like I love TikTok. I fucking love TikTok. My TikTok is I have very, it's my free U-Page is a fun place. Honestly, mine is really all happy.

It's just making me laugh and like, making me like, thought-provoking things. And a lot of strange things. I don't have a lot of sad, a lot of stranger things. I have a lot of ed, a lot of stranger things. I have a lot of edgy months. And on my, for you page, which is fine with me. But it's a lot of like,

I don't get any of the sad stuff, I think, because I'm like, I'm not interested. I'm not actually going, click the not interested button. But like, it's true that there's just like a lot of, there's a lot of, like I've seen a lot of creators that are having a like a really hard time right now, and I hope everybody's doing okay.

Like one of my favorite creators, and I know you really love her too, Michaela. Yeah. I mean, you just have to say Michaela. Oh yeah. On TikTok, people are being awful to her, and I'm like, ha, she just seems like that, like I don't know her personally, but she has a jam and I, so like, boom. But she's a Boston girl. And she's a Boston girl with like a full blown blast and accent.

She has the best. But how are you being mean to her? But she's a Boston girl. And she's a Boston girl with like a full blown blast and accent. She is the best. But how are you being mean to her? All she wants to do is bring joy. Show you how to do your fucking makeup like a boss. Yes, she's just bringing joy. And it's just like, I don't know. It's easy from another position to be like

anybody talking shit at somebody like that is clearly a very unhappy person. And that's where they get their positive little jollies out is by taking someone else into their darkness with them. And then even that makes me sad. But that doesn't make me sad because I'm like, get the fuck off the internet if you're doing, but I'm like,

it's easy for someone else. You can say it to someone else. It's easy to look in on some other creator and be like, I promise you, this is what these people are like. Right. But when it's happening to you, it's like, that's, you can't see that. Right. You can't see through it. And it's just all encompassing.

And when I've watched her videos, like, guys follow her because she's fucking amazing. Yeah. And because she does amazing makeup. And she's just saying, oh God, she's a joy. She's a light. She's a joy. She really is. That's the thing. She's a joy. She really is.

That's the thing. I feel like I've been meditating so much lately and I know that I'm fucking crazy and we're also gonna get into meditation in this episode. We're just, we're teaming up to this episode is what we do. But I feel like I'm just thinking a lot more about light and the light inside of people and what people project out into the world.

And I'm not just saying light. I'm just saying who you are and karma and into the world. And I'm not like, I'm not just like saying light. I'm just saying like who you are and like karma and all that stuff. And I just don't understand why when people see somebody shining so fucking brightly, you have to take it upon yourself to try to tear that down. That and that's the, I think we've all, like the internet is a scary place.

And it brings out the worst in people. It also brings out the best in people. Like the con kid. That's it. So it's like, there's some really great things and it's like, I wish everybody would just lean more that way of like lifting people up. Yeah.

And we've all like, you know, everybody's had moments where you've been a dick. And it's like, and it's like, but just, it's fine. Just grow. Right. Just grow as a person. Because I think you and I are,

we've been saying it a lot. We've been saying it for the last couple of years, I think, on this podcast. So we're just like, you know what? I just decided it's just like not, I don't find joy in watching, you know, public breakdowns and shit. It's just not something I like to,

it's like, I remember when like Amanda Bynes when that whole thing was happening and everybody was watching it and we all were. You all were. I was gonna like, I remember when like Amanda Bines, when that whole thing was happening, and everybody was watching it. And we all were. You all were. I was gonna say, I was watching that. And I look back now and I'm like, that wasn't funny. No, that wasn't funny.

It's just like, I know it was like, it's so fun, it's weird to see the difference when you start growing, even looking at that stuff, like how different you can feel about a situation. It's growth. And it's like when I just I want everybody just to like, that's why I just want to like, you know, shout out podcasts and like shout, like tell you to go listen to these things

and go read these books because like, let's just fucking lift cool people up. Right. And that's all, like the thing is, it feels if you're putting hate out into the world, you're getting it back. Yeah That's why you're miserable. That's why you're unhappy You got to start speaking good shit and who existed. It's true You got like you don't compliment somebody because you want something out of it. No, but like do it because it feels good

And it does it really does it feels a lot Everybody talks shit with their friends. Oh, we still talk shit a chum and I, of course I'm out here talking shit. We're not sitting there being like, don't say anything mean about it. No, of course not. Talk shit with your friends, whatever you want. I think it's when it goes public and when it just becomes this bullying thing.

When I saw my Kayla so upset, I was like, dude. Yeah, and I've seen so many creators like that lately. Some of them are leaving TikTok and stuff, and I'm like, man, it's a bummer. And that's the other thing. I'm like, you are gonna sit here, all these haters and like comment means shit on this video, but then you're gonna be the first person pissed off

when that person is like, I'm not creating. Yeah, exactly. So it's like, just remember that there's humans behind there. Like, and we're not talking about it. Like, you're not even talking about ourselves. We're not even talking about ourselves. I'm talking about you guys are fucking awesome. You guys are honestly, we have a great community.

Like I talked about like the book unboxing the other day and you guys like literally made me have like almost tears of, like if I was a human, I would have had tears in my eyes. Right? Also, I mean, I just have to like say this because like one positive, positive to another positive, positive, this bitch's waist was snatched in that video. I, like, you look beautiful, your face is gorgeous,

like, I, that goes without saying, and I'm so happy you wrote a book, but your, your waist was snatched. I was like, oh my god, look at this girl. Thank you. You're welcome. It was the jeans. No, it was.

It's you. I appreciate you wearing the jeans. The jeans weren't wearing you. You know what? You look fucking phenomenal, and your lashes are to die. Oh my god, go to Slaily Taylor. In the fact that I- Killy's like, you've been shouting me out on the podcast so much lately.

I'm like, I know. You're like, I love you. I know. It's- it's- it's due. It's women supporting women. That's right. That's women supporting women. That bitch put glitter eyelashes in my eyelashes. See? For a concert that I'm going to. Everybody's great. I love life.

But you guys are seriously fucking awesome. And we just like, we gotta like give you pets on the back because you make us happy. Yeah. And you make us excited to make you content. And you guys rule. And that's why when you see like other creators having like so many issues, I'm like,

oh no, can I give you some of my, my amazing community? And you think community like that's, and that's why I wanted to, because I'm like, you guys are so many issues. I'm like, oh no, can I give you some of my my amazing community? Like that's and that's why I wanted to because I'm like you guys are so fucking amazing. Yeah. And you lift us up all the time. So like can you here you go. Give me that love to like other people too. Yeah because you guys are just fucking awesome. Like you were so sweet on that unboxing video and like I just want to hug you all. Yeah. Just and I don't even like hugs. I fucking hate hugs. So we're both not huggers. Even like, I didn't know what to caption my picture the other day

and I'd just been thinking lately that I want more tattoos. So I just made it, I need some more tattoos. And so many of you guys were like, I'm a tattoo artist here. Like I would love to tattoo you. Yeah, you're just cool. Like that's cool. Yeah, I'm just spreading awesome. Yeah, you guys are great.

And we just, we want to let you know whenever we can how fucking great you are, and that we appreciate you. Right now we're love bombing you because we want you to join a cult. No, I'm just kidding. But we are gonna talk about a cult and we should probably get into it now because.

That was kind of like my attempt at a segue. So there you go. We just brought it old school for a second with like a 10 minute tangent in the beginning. But I thought it was important. It's just talking about like everybody be psyched. Yeah, exactly. So I'll just high five each other and tell each other,

good job. Great job. You're doing great today. You look great. You look great. You're gonna have a great day today. And if anybody feels like shit right now and you're having like a bad day,

you're gonna have a fucking great day. You make it all look great. You know what, I can tell from over here that you smell great. You do smell very good. You are projecting wonderful vibes. You're having a wicked good hair day. You're having an amazing hair day. Your face is radiant and you know what? Yeah. You're a wonderful human inside. And your coffee or tea or beverage of choice today is gonna be so good. What was I gonna say? I was gonna tell you something else about yourself. Wow. Wow, that just flew right out of my head. Maybe it'll pop in your head randomly in the middle of the episode. Oh, I can't. It's back. There it is. Our principal from high school. Oh, yeah. Make it a great day or not. The choice is yours.

There you go. All right. So let's get into the story. Now that we've no vibe doll over you, it's a whole bunch of woo so it's really on brand. It's really on brand. Something that I didn't realize I do is like I am one of those people where I eat my stress away. So if I realized it lately because I've been a lot more stressed but if I'm really really stressed out, I'm filling my face at a rate that is just, I can't even talk to you about. But ever since I've used NUME,

I kind of started realizing that I was doing that. And realizing something just gets you one step closer to kind of like rectifying that situation. And the NUME Weight App has some of the nicest coaches on the planet. And once I realized this was something I was doing, I talked to my coach about it. And she was like, all right, so what you're gonna do is

you're gonna sit there and try to figure out, am I eating because I'm stressed? Or am I eating because I'm hungry? And kind of differentiating between the hunger cues. And that's why I love the new weight app because there's no judgment involved. Like they're just people and they're just trying to help you. With their psychology first approach,

new weight empowers you to build more sustainable habits and behaviors. And let me tell you, once you realize again, what's going on in your psychology up here in your brain, those habits are going to be so much easier to change. The behaviors are going to be so much easier to change. And the thing is, every journey is different. So your daily lessons are maybe not going to be the same as mine because they're personalized to you and your goals.

This program is based on scientific principles like cognitive behavioral therapy, CBT, which is literally the therapy that I actively do. And then I'm actively doing it on noon because it helps me understand my relationship with food. Here's the thing, too, whatever your health goals are because again, everybody's are going to be different but the flexible non-restrictive program that that newm uses focuses on progress instead of

perfection. And that's something that I think is so much different than other apps out there. You can choose your level of support. You can have a five minute daily check in. You can have personal coaching, whatever you want. And progress is not a straight line. Off days are totally okay. Nume weights can help you get back on track.

95% of customers say that NUME weight is a good long-term solution, and active NUME's, that's what they call us, lose an average of 15 pounds in 16 weeks. NUME weights approach is grounded in science, which I think that's what I really like about it. It just kind of makes sense to me because it's very black and white.

They've published more than 30 peer reviewed scientific articles that inform users, practitioner, scientists, and the public about their black and white. They've published more than 30 peer-reviewed scientific articles that inform users, practitioner, scientists, and the public about their methods and effectiveness. Break the cycle with motivation and support from Noom Wait's psychology-based approach. Sign up for your trial today at num.com slash morbid. That's n-o-o-m dot com slash morbid to sign up for your trial two day. most importantly, there's cults. Of course. I do have to give a little shout out to my friend, not Kay Lee, but Kay Law.

We were talking a couple weeks ago about how we would have absolutely mistakenly joined a cult back in the 70s. Definitely would. And Kay Law was like, Ash, like you always say you would have gotten on the bus with Charlie Manson, unknowingly, of course.

Of course. And she was like, I don't know if that's the cult we would have ended up in. I think we might have ended up in the source family. Wow. So that's what I'm going to be talking about. Okay. So I start looking into this. Like she's like, oh, there's this documentary.

It's literally called The Source Family. I think it's on Amazon for free. There's commercials though. But it's okay though. I know how you guys feel about my commercials. That's all right. It's okay. I'm just kidding.

But I was like, I started looking into this. I'm like, I have to cover this on morbid because I think the last cult that I did, personally, was the Blackburn cult. Wow, and that was one of my favorite episodes you've done. Oh, thank you. That was also- That was a long time.

When we discovered fucking Johnny and Tyler from that spooky- Oh, my God, yes! Because they had covered it, and I listened to their episode after, to like, I was like, ooh, like, maybe did I get everything, you know? Ooh! And then I listened to their episode, and I said, these boys are great.

I love them. I love them. And then she told me, she said, that's spooky. You gotta listen to it. And I said, ooh, they're on a fucking network. Yeah, they're the best. Yeah, I think we're gonna go do like a collab with them in the next couple of months.

Yes. So check your eyes out for now. You'd be. Don't check your eyes out. But yeah, and I also, then I saw some of you suggest this case. Okay, so we're, we're with all that being said, all of the fucking shit. We gotta get into the source family cult

and it all begins with a man named James Jim Edward Baker. Yes. Okay, so there is really limited information on his early life. There's limited information on this case all around, but I did some newspapers.com action. And we love newspapers.com. It just helps you like piece the puzzle together. It's not an ad.

We just genuinely, like, this is organically, we just fucking love newspapers.com. I truly do. So I was able to find out that Jim was born in Cincinnati, Ohio on July 4th, 1922. Oh, the roaring 20s. That's what I was literally gonna say. So his father left when he was really young

and he was raised primarily by his mom, Korra, which really pretty name. Now from a young age, he was super fascinated with health and wellness. And he ended up growing up with the same neighborhood as Paul Bragg. Do you know who Paul Bragg is? That sounds very familiar.

You're gonna realize it because I realized it and I was like, I literally have his shit in my cabinets. Oh. You probably don't, but it's a little woo. Oh. That only put, like growing up in the same neighborhood as Paul Bragg only put more of an emphasis on Jim's fascination because Paul Bragg

actually became very well known over the years as kind of like an alternative health food advocate. And he believed he had like these wild beliefs for back then that in order to lead a healthy lifestyle, which it's going to sound funny now, because these are things that I think a lot of people kind of implement into their lives now.

Fasting, like I know a lot of people are into intermittent fasting. He was all about that. He was about no meat, like avoiding meat, and having a regular exercise routine. Yeah. Which we're not saying any of these things or things you should do or not or not do. No, I literally don't have a regular exercise routine, and I never fast. Yeah. Do what you want to do. And talk to a doctor first. So he was also one of the first people to make juicing popular. And eventually he would go on to have his own brand and it all started with apple cider vinegar.

Oh, right. For example cider vinegar. Oh, okay. Um, he thought that it had like really revitalizing ingredients that would promote a healthy gut and had all of these other like health benefits. People love an apple cider vinegar moment. They do. I don't know a lot about apple cider vinegar, but I do know that it helps with my heartburn.

And then I realized that the soy sauce alternative that I use is actually Bragg's brand. Oh, that's funny. Just sitting in my cabinet, this whole time. That's wild. It's called liquid aminos. But he was also one of the first people to open a health food store.

I think it was opened in 1912, and it was kind of like a whole foods trader Joe's kind of place. But anyway, Paul became a really big part of Jim's life, and he really became like a father figure because remember his father just up and left. So they would go hiking together all the time, and they'd, you know, Paul was talking a gym about this like alternative health lifestyle, and Jim was already interested. So I think that kind of planted the seed early on. Yeah.

And I think it's where a lot of Jim Baker's foundation came from. And he would later take his conversations with Paul Bragg and other people and different things he learned through his own studies of health and wellness to open his own health food stores and restaurants. But he had a few things to do before he got there. So when he was 12 years old, he was apparently named America's strongest boy. Oh, just casual. That's a thing.

I don't know if it's still is anymore. I don't know if you can like sign your boy up for that, but... The sign your boy up. Sign your boy's up for the America's strongest boy call on him. Don't say age range there. Great question. Yeah. I didn't look too much into it because I was just totally fine. Wow. Yeah. I'm good knowing just that amount of information. I'm glad. He took that though. He took that title in-run with it.

Hell yeah. Because as he was growing up, he was like really active. He took archery lessons. He played different kinds of sports. But the main thing that really spoke to Jim was judo. Yeah. You know, of course. It's unclear where exactly his mother worked. I really tried to figure out where she was working and I couldn't.

But she was said to have worked with an inmate, so I'm assuming like some kind of like prison system. And this inmate was a judo master before he became incarcerated. And this jududomaster was the one to teach Jim all about it. Okay. Jim basically became a judo master. Wow. Through the teachings of this man, it's very karate kid. Very. Very wax on wax off. Oh my god, I wanted to write that. And then I was like, is that too silly? No. Never. So once he became someone of his own judo master, Jim, he either enlisted or he was drafted into the Marines just in time for the start of World War II. And he was in the front lines. Like he saw hand-to-hand combat, they said.

And he was said to bring home a silver star for his courageous behavior after a ship that he was on was attacked. I will point out that his name doesn't appear on the list of men who did bring home silver stars over the years. So the thing about Jim is like he becomes a cult leader spoiler alert. So he's a tall tale teller. He's a tall tale teller

and then all over the years like his followers have heard these stories and it's like a game of telephones. Of course. So you don't really know what's true and what's not all the time. That's requirement for being a cult leader. Absolutely. Sorry if you just heard my chair squeak, I had to readjust. But so yeah, I didn't see his name on that list. But if you do watch the documentary, the source family documentary,

the flash this newspaper headline, and I paused and unpoused a million times so I could read it. And basically it said that Jim was aboard the ship called the Chicago, and it was attacked. And he seemed to like fight off the enemy, and then hit the ship that he was on sunk. And he floated in the water for hours, I guess, waiting

to be picked up. And that was all while he was still in training. Wow, allegedly. Allegedly. He has a time in the war. He does some wild crazy stuff. And then he comes home, and he gets married to this woman named Margaret, and they have a daughter named Peggy. And Jim is trying to adjust a family life and he opens up a fitness center that

he named after himself. It was called Baker's Jim. But that really only lasted a short while because a main theme in this story is that Jim was always looking for his purpose. Like he never felt like he was fulfilling his purpose. So he was like, I don't know, I feel like there's out there, there's more out there for me. So he kind of like William Desmond Taylor's at the end of Andean's wife and child to go find what's out there for him. So he's a shithead.

Yeah, exactly. I also love that he did Baker's Gym because his name is Gym Baker. Yeah, yeah, that is fun. It's also like, would you go to Baker's Gym? No. Do they have cookies there? Probably not. I hope so. it's like one planet fitness used to give out the free pizza And I'd be like isn't this kind of counter intuitive, but it's like now fuel up. I love people up for your workout

I would go for the free pizza all the time and then I feel like oh, I'm gonna hop on this for four minutes by Yeah, there you go. You didn't work out. Yeah, four minutes is great. It's more than zero. It's more than I'm doing right now. So you moved your shoulders, that's exercise. So he ends up, so he leaves. He abandoned his family, his little baby child. It's fun. And he ends up where everybody goes when they're trying to find themselves. Say it with me. Yeah. Work worked out. We were on the same page. We were there. As soon as the cows were like, whoops, you say in the whole screen, I forgot. Okay.

That really worked out. So he tried acting for a bit, obviously. Of course. That's what you do when you abandon your family. Always got to go for the acting. He screen tested for the role as Tarzan, but he didn't make the cut. I think this was before he grew all,

or it was before he grew all of his hair, so I guess I get it. He didn't have a long-flowing mane and have the mane. That's not Tarzan brand, so. So he was like, all right, that didn't work out. So then he was like, you know what I'll do? I think I want to become a stuntman. Yeah.

So we tried to sand at that. Unclear, really, how that turned out. It doesn't seem like too much came of it though. And there was still more that Jim felt like he should be doing. Yeah. He didn't know what it was, but he was like, like none of this is right. It doesn't feel right.

So while he's trying to figure out his life's purpose, he opens up a sandal shop. Okay, that's the obvious next step in your life's journey. He was like good with leather. like he was like a leather worker, so I think it was like how he made the sandals. Sweet. And he starts making sandals for this group called the Nature Boys.

I had never heard of the Nature Boys, had you? No. They're apparently famous, like well known. Oh. So Jim would make shoes for them, and they also would like hang on on the beach because they lived off the land. So the Nature Boys, they wore white robes and sandals,

they only ate fruits and vegetables, and they lived off of like very little money. Okay. They lived like I just said strictly outdoors and all about living off the land. So one of the nature boys, one of the very first, his name was even Abez, and he wrote the song Nature Boy that Nat King Cole later made famous.

Oh, okay. It's actually like a really beautiful song. I love it. Just like a little aside about him. I started reading more about him as soon as I got into this. One of his main beliefs was to give love and receive love is the greatest gift that one could ever get or give in life. Yeah, just as you and McGregor and move on, Rooch.

Oh my God. When they play Nature Boy and they, and he says that exact thing. I haven't seen that movie in so long, and now I want to watch it. He says, to love and be loved is the greatest thing of all. It is. And that's what Eben said. He said it too. He did also believe that no human should capitalize the first letter in their name or their last name,

like no capital letters in your name, because God and infinity were the only two things that were worthy of that much honor. I'm glad you explained that, because my next question was gonna be like, why the? Yeah, you're not worthy of that. I mean, I'm doing it.

So, I'm not worthy. Sorry, I don't know. I mean, I'm also doing that. Yeah, I'm gonna continue to. You should. I like it. Sorry, I don't know. I mean, I'm also doing that. Yeah, I'm going to continue to. You should. Yeah, I like it. So all that to say, that Jim would really start to think a bit more about his conversations with the nature boys and then think back to his conversations with Paul.

And I think the holistic, natural way of life really, really started speaking to him because he's getting older now. He's like nearing his 30s. Yeah. So by the time he's decided to now. He's like nearing his 30s. Yeah. So by the time he's decided to act on those beliefs by opening his very own natural food restaurant, he had met and married another woman. This is a lot of stuff, by the way,

that he said he's getting older now, nearing his 30s. Like, 80, 20 years old is old. I feel like that was wild. I feel like sorry. You're like, he was like 27. Look, you know. I feel like. I feel like that was wild. I feel like, sorry. You're like, he was like 27. You know. You know. I feel like.

I feel very old. I feel very old. Not really. I'm not, but I feel it. Sorry, just made it drop to you. I just, that was wild. How dare you. Well, I did insult you a little bit.

So I do apologize. 30 year olds. 30 year olds. I do apologize, elder millennials. It's okay. I feel fine about it. Third, I can't wait to turn 30. Turning 30 year olds. I do apologize, elder millennials. It's okay, I feel fine about it. I can't wait to turn 30. Turning 30 is great.

I think you figure a lot out in your 30s. I think that I'm approaching it a little sooner than I would because I got you. Yeah, your 30s is definitely when you're like, oh, that's how things work, okay. Yeah, I'm starting to feel that way. But yeah, so he's old. And he's an old 20 year old.

He meets another woman. He marries her. Her name is Elaine, beautiful name. And so he does all that. And also by the time he opened his restaurant, he had killed a man. Oh, yeah. You heard that right.

We went from a lot of peace, love, health, hippy ideals. And then we just went, boom, boom. Yeah. Just straight up murder. That came out of nowhere. Was it murder though, Alina, or was it self-defense? You decide.

I don't know, I wasn't there. Well, you weren't there, but also I'm gonna tell you about it so like maybe you can make an inference. Cool. All right, cool, I love the word inference. That's a great word. So the year was 1955 and he's 33. Yeah, so 33-year-old.

So old. So old. Was living in Topanga, Canyon. Topanga, thank you. He had a neighbor that he was friendly enough with. This guy's name was Edward A. Bowling, I believe. Edward was a mechanic and Edward had a dog named Candy, but he, I love that. That was like, yep, he did.

Correct. But he had run into a bit of trouble with the law. It seems like he was driving with a suspended license. I don't know, he was. I don't know if there were like previous charges that basically he had to go to jail. He was gonna be spending some time in the big house. Oh no.

And because of that, he was like, I'm gonna be gone, but I can't bring candy with me on. Oh. Do not let you bring your puppy to jail. Nope. So he said, hey Jim, would you mind watching candy while I'm gone? Like would you take her in?

And Jim's like, yeah, no problem. He takes the dog in, Edward heads off to jail. I think it was a short stand, because he hadn't killed anybody. Yeah. But when he gets back, he's fucking pissed at Jim. Oh no. Because he finds out that Jim wasn't letting Candy stay

inside at night. Oh no. He was like keeping her tied up outside, which I know some people do, you know? No judgment. No. But Edward had judgment. Yeah. It was his do, you know. No judgment. No. But Edward had judgment. It was his dog, so he can't say.

Exactly. He was pissed. He was like, what the fuck? So this big fight ensues and Edward ends up dead. Oh, no. And the way that Jim later explained it, he explained to the San Bernardino County son, that newspaper, what happened. He said, Edward was, quote, Bernardino County Sun that newspaper, what happened.

He said, Edward was, quote, incensed and kept screaming at me. Suddenly, he spun around and I caught a glimpse of metal. Without even thinking, I grabbed his arm in a judo hold and hurled him over a 20-foot embankment. What? He survived. He still had his knife in his hand when he started to get up again.

I leaped at him and he and used another judo hold. I meant to disarm him, not to kill him. So that's what he says happened. And when the police arrived on scene, they did find Edward's body right next to an eight-inch hunting knife. Okay. Jim's wife Elaine was there. She corroborated the story, Jim's story.

So he ends up getting off of murder charges and the attack was attributed to self-defense. Oh my. So he has killed one man. Oh man. Um, yeah. Now I found a couple of interesting tidbits and that San Bernardino County San article too. One of which was Jim explaining to the interviewer that his father was the Chicago detective who was killed by gangsters. Literally any other source I could find about his father

said that he just left when Jim was still a baby. So I think that was a little fib. That was a little cult leader moment. Yeah, I think he was just embellishing. And then the other tidbit is almost like a little bit of foreshadowing for something later in the story. So I'm just gonna have, I'm gonna tell you right now and you can hold on to it. You can put it in your back pocket. Woo! The article mentions that Jim won a World Judo Championship in 1948 against

opponent Wild Bill Zim of Argentina. Wow. Like how could I not tell you that? Yeah, you gotta tell us that. He wins the championship. He wins. You win wild build. You win anything against a wild bill or a wild anything for that matter.

A wild Thornberry. You've earned it. Yeah, but he, so he wins that. And he says, quote, however, that was my last match. I collapsed with a broken back right after the match. Oh. I was hospitalized for more than six months from the injury. It's a very deadly weapon referring to Judo,

but now I wish I had never heard of it. Oh. You heard it here first, but was certainly not Jim's last Judo match, and it's very interesting that he broke his back at one point in his life. That is very interesting. You'll come back later. Oh. Oh my gosh.

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they were going to open a restaurant and that it was going to be one of Yeah, of course. He and his wife decided together that they were gonna open a restaurant and that it was going to be one of the first of its kind in the California area. So their plan was to serve like super organic, whole foods, very health conscious. And they decided that they were going to name the place the aware inn. Cool, was he gonna invite his old family to come?

Yeah, I don't think so. No, no, I think, I think, I think, I think Peggy and Margaret said decline in that invitation. I think they were like, I'm good. We're gonna go eat cheeseburgers together because you left us and that's comfort food. So the original aware in opened up in 1957

at 888-28 Sunset Boulevard. And there were like quotes painted on the walls that said things like, food should be selected with confidence, eaten with pleasure and digested with ease. Yeah, like so motivational. And from the start, actually the awareness was a huge success.

A lot of celebrities were going there to order carrot juice, hoping that it would restore their youth or something. For sure. And there's a misconception that the aware inn only served vegetarian food, they didn't. They served meat.

There were dishes like burgers, beef stroganoff, things like that. So they had a little bit of everything, but it was a health conscious way of doing it. Okay, in their opinion. So with the aware inn becoming so popular so quickly, and with the business bringing in a really good amount of money, the baker said,

you know what, let's open a similar restaurant down the street a little bit, and they opened up this restaurant and it was called the Old World. Ooh. I like those names. I do like, yeah. That was that one. They're ended up being another one called the Discovery Inn. Like they're just like fun. They're pretty good at like those like, adventur-y. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So this restaurant, the Old World, had pretty much all the same values that the aware in had, just with like a slightly different menu,

and it was a little farther, Don Sunset Boulevard. All was well and fine, business was booming, the bakers even had a couple kids by now. I think they had two, but Jim still wasn't satisfied. Yeah, he can't get no satisfaction.

No, he can't. Now, it appears during this time he had at least two affairs on his wife. The first that we're going to talk about actually ended up with Jim killing another man. Oh. Yeah. So one of the actresses that frequented his restaurants and hung out on the beach with him from time to time was Jean Ingram. Okay.

She's best known for movies throughout the early 60s. I don't know if any of these sound familiar to you or anybody listening. She was in three came to kill in 1960, Burke's Law in 1963, and Sergeant Deadhead in 1965. Oh, that sounds familiar. That the last one sounded familiar to me as well.

But back to 1963 for a second, because that is when Jim actually killed Gene's estranged husband over his restaurant, the aware in. Wow. Yeah, wonderful, huh? Okay. So from the sounds of the setup,

there was an apartment above the restaurant. And on January 29th, 1963, Gene's husband, Robert, showed up while Jim was at his apartment. And Robert demands that Jim shows him where Jean is hiding. He's like, I know she's in here. I know what's going on between the two of you.

You have fought, like, let me not tell you the whole thing right away. Jean honestly very well could have been coming and going to that apartment and I don't doubt that Robert probably did see her venture into there at some point, but on that particular day, she was not there. Oh. So they had actually been together Jim and Jean the day before and Robert ran into them. And allegedly the day before he had threatened to kill Jim

when he saw him next. He said, the next time I see you, shit's going down. Yeah. He said, I know Jean's messing around on me. I know you're the guy and I'm literally gonna kill you. He said, one of these days when you least expect it, I'm gonna put a bullet through you. Oh boy.

According to Jim, this is messy. It's so messy. So the next day when Jim told Robert that Gene was not hiding anywhere in his apartment, Robert did not believe him. So Robert pulls out a gun and he says, you have five seconds to produce her or I'm gonna make good on my promise from yesterday

And according to Jim that is when he personally Lost it. He would later tell reporters and the police that he had a horrible temper and that as soon as Robert pulled out the gun He quote new he was going to kill him one way or the other Okay, well, that's pretty damning. That's called Malice of Fourth ofthorough. That's certainly his. So he later elaborated on the temper thing saying, I have a horrible temper and it doesn't come up very often. But when it does, I just go berserk.

Oh no. Like that's not good. You could talk to someone about that. Maybe we should look at that self defense thing a little harder. Yeah. The blue am, like you literally hurled a man over a 20 foot embankment. Was that the berserk you were reference at? Yeah defense thing a little harder. Yeah, yeah. And like you literally hurled a man over a 20 foot embankment.

Was that the berserk you were referring to? Yeah, I would say so. Yeah, self defense, huh? So when he later recalled the events, he said that Robert Flash the gun got him after Robert Flash the gun, excuse me, Jim got him in some kind of judo hold, of course. The judo holds.

He loves a good judo hold. And the two of them ended up on the ground at one point and started wrestling. Now, when Jim had the upper hand, like when Robert was below him, Jim said that he used two judo chops to Robert's neck as a way to disarm him. I guess that I've never wrestled a gun out of anybody's hands before, but why wouldn't you judo chop his arm

versus anything else? Yeah. If you judo chop his arm, my thought? Yeah. Like, if you judo chop his arm, my thought is like his hand will kind of raise and like the gun will fall. Yeah, at least like hurt, and he might loosen his grip. Right, like, I don't know why you need to judo chop his throat, but you know, I wasn't thinking,

and I don't know how to judo chop anything. Me neither. So yeah, once Jim got the gun, he got the gun after he judo chopped him into throat, and he shot Robert in the head. Geez. He would first say that he judo chopped him into throat and he shot Robert in the head. Geez. He would first say that he shot from about three feet away.

He said he was like further across the room. The coroner said, no, no, I disagree, sir. It was more like three inches away. Oh, close range. That is a big difference. Now, so that's what the coroner said. And then the coroner also said he couldn't determine what had actually killed Robert.

It could have been the gunshot wound to the head, but it also could have been the fact that when Jim judo chopped Robert to the throat, he crushed his windpipe. Oh my God. Oh, I have to take a deep breath just saying. I would go out on a limb and say that was probably going to be the cause of death

if the gunshot wound didn't happen. That's the thing, exactly. Damn. Crushed his wind, buddy. I think that's not disarming someone. No, that's killing someone. Murdering someone. Yeah.

And here's the thing. Jim tries to say that this is self-defense. No. Which maybe it started off that way. Yeah. But then you literally just told us as soon as things started, you knew you were going to kill him one way or another. Yeah, and that's not self-defense.

Because you were pissed. Right. It's not I knew I was going to incapacitate him or I knew I was going to disarm him. Right. No, you said you wanted to kill him. Exactly. Come on. It doesn't make any sense to me.

Come on, Jim. So his trial begins pretty quickly. Interestingly enough, I don't know how often this happens. I thought that Jury's had to be closer to even between men and women. His Jury was made up of 11 women and one man. Oh, wow. That's crazy. Yeah, isn't that kind of crazy?

Just like an interesting fun fact. So he explains to this Jury that his relationship with Jean was simply platonic and that the murder of Robert Ingram was in fact you guessed it self-defeat. Of course. He did admit he said, yep, Jean and I actually did kiss on one occasion, which just so happened to be the one time where Robert caught us. Oh yeah, that's so coincidental. So crazy. And he said that's when Robert's jealous obsession began. I would argue that like many people

might become jealous and obsessed with you if you kiss their wives. Yeah. I don't think you should do that. Yeah, I don't think you should do that. No, no. But he did tell the jury that Jean was not the type of girl to enter a love affair so callously.

Oh. He said, she's not that kind of gal. No. And Jean was actually called to testify for the defense. And she told them that she and Robert had actually been separated for the last two years. And that at the beginning of that separation or shortly into it, they had made the agreement to function as though they were divorced. Oh, but I'm like, that's you saying that? Yeah, I don't know. He's not here to say whether or not that's the case.

Exactly. And she, according to her, Robert didn't take that separation lightly, which doesn't sound like it. How could you? That's sad. That's a bummer. So she said, though, that he not only threatened to kill Jim, but also he had threatened to kill her on many occasions

and any man that she ever went on today. Ooh. She echoed Jim Samx's explanation. That's very possessive. She echoed Jim Samx's explanation of their relationship. She said they were not romantically involved and that their relationship Elena was more of a spiritual attraction.

Oh boy. She said there are conversations consisted of philosophy, religion, nature. Yeah. We just love to talk about the world, man. Oh, for sure. Please. That's what I saw.

Honestly, I feel like that's like my essence. But I was gonna say you love this. I do. Yeah, so moving on though, Jim's wife actually stuck by him throughout the trial and also believed that there was like nothing going on between him and Jim. Okay. And mind you, they still have children at this point. So this poor woman had to go through a trial that was basically like, is this guy having

an affair? Is that why he murdered this actress's fucking wife? Oh, they did smooch once and he's going to admit it in court and you have to sit there and hear it. This is bad. Like that's sad news. Bad news, bears. That really sucks.

So like I give her a lot of credit for sticking by him. For sure. So on July 3rd, 1963, just one day before Jim's 41st birthday, he was sentenced to, I don't know why, I just thought that I said sentence strong, but I do not. He was sentenced to spend one to 10 years in prison after he was found guilty of voluntary manslaughter. Damn. It's only one to 10. It's like, isn't that a thing? Oh, just wait. Oh, come on. And you know, I really don't think his comment

about making up his mind that he was going to kill Robert one way or the other didn't, you know, I don't think it helped the self. I don't think that helped at all. Now, even still, his lawyer, Maurice Harwick, immediately filed an appeal saying that Jim hadn't received a fair trial. I don't know on what grounds he was trying to say that he didn't because I just saw

this in newspapers.com that he was like, I'm filing an appeal. Yeah, they always try. But the honorable Kurtz Kaufman, what a fucking name. Kurtz Kaufman. Kurtz Kaufman. And it's Kurtz with a Z at the end. Oh, yeah. That's how I saw it in my head. Better be. He disagreed. He was like, no, I don't think so. And like, me, your appeal can go fuck itself. He did it. So Jim gets led away to go to prison. And his wife is standing there crying. And she's able to give him a kiss before they take him away.

And she yells after him, like, if you need me to do anything, you just call me, which is so sad. I feel really bad for her. I do too. Now, ultimately, Jim did not end up spending not much time in jail because he did appeal his sentence again in this time he won. I don't know on what grounds he appealed it.

I couldn't figure it out. But he ended up only spending, it's sources vary on how long he spent in jail from, or how long he spent in jail, excuse me, from one to five months. Okay. But a matter of literally not things. It's a sneeze.

It's essentially a matter of days, really. When you look at it. So Jim stayed quiet for a bit after he got out of prison, but then right around 1965, so about two, yep, three. Nope, I don't know. A couple years after he got out of jail, is kind of right when the hippie movement was starting to become a thing.

Like it was really starting to become more mainstream. Yeah. And he meets this young hippie chick named Dora. He's 43 when they meet and she's 19. It's legal, but Jim, you're supposed to be staying out of trouble. I don't know if looking up at the 19 year old is the best bet for you. Yeah, I'm just gonna stay over here. You have a wife and children.

Yep, there's that. You probably shouldn't be hanging out with 19 year olds. Can you imagine if you're 43 year old, well, the husband came home on day, I was like, I'm at this 19 year old hippie. I, I didn't even say John, like I'm just like, imagine another alternate, yeah, another alternate man that I could not.

She's also from France, so she's like cool. I'd be like, who's this young French girl that you're having with? Yeah, I'm gonna stay quiet over here, but what I do. Oh, I know. I'm just totally kidding. So, Dora was from France, like I said, she was fully immersed in the hippie lifestyle. She was doing loads of acids, smoke and tons of pot, experimenting with other drugs that I don't really think people realize back then would lead to some serious fucking issues.

Yeah. And looking back on the time that he met Dora, Jim said he had plenty of money because the restaurants were still doing well. But even though he had all that success and fortune, he was still absolutely miserable. He started drinking really heavily, and he said by the time he met her, he was an alcoholic who was bored of everything. But that all the time he met her, he was an alcoholic who was bored of everything. But that all changed when he met her. He was like, oh, this is exciting. Like, I want to hang out with you. Now, it's unclear whether or not he was separated from his wife at this point in time. I don't think they were separated. And I think this might have been a big tipping point

in their relationship. He's so annoying. He's the most annoying because, listen, I'm all about finding yourself. Like, I feel like I'm kind of finding myself a little bit right now. I'm 26 and I don't have children. But that's the thing. Stop producing children and getting married if you're not sure of yourself.

Yeah, you're like, you already abandoned one family and now you're on your way to abandon another and there's children. Like, you just said, involved in these scenarios. That's a thing. I feel like you're always finding yourself in some way. Right. But like, he's doing in such destructive ways and hurting everybody around him, and like

pulling his family that he's creating into these situations. Right. And it's like, dude, fuck off into the desert and do it by yourself, but stop having kids. And stop getting married. Like, this guy's so fucking annoying. I just wanna like, ugh. He gets increasingly more annoying as the story goes on.

Your scowl is gonna turn into a scowl. Yeah, I'm just like, ugh. Like every time you bring, he just brings us 19 year old and is like, yeah, you're just like so much fun. Like, fuck off. And you're for it. Like you're having a, sir, you're having a midlife crisis.

Yeah, like, please leave. You've also literally just got let out of jail for killing the second man that you've killed in your lifetime. I think we should focus on the business. Yeah, you need to like, he's consistently having a midlife crisis. And it's really a little bit.

Since he was like in his 20s. Yeah, and I'm over it now. Same. I'm over it. And you know who else is over it? His damn wife. So Doran and Jim gem they start spending a lot of time together and he said he wanted to know more about these flower children and what they were all about. Shut up. And he certainly starts finding out rather quickly. So he starts, remember he's an alcoholic at

this point. And then he starts smoking pot with Doran, her friends. And then he makes his way to acid. And then eventually he tries and gets really, really hooked on the speed. And back then, this is like even a different kind of speed because back then, I'm sure you've heard of it. There was a different form of speed, excuse me, that was known on the street as black beauties. Yep. Instead of just the powder that people would inhale

nasally most of the time, black beauties were Yep. Instead of just the powder that people would inhale nasally most of the time, black beauties were a pill taken orally that would give you the same effects or even deeper effects because the two main ingredients in a black beauty pill are infetamine and dextro infetamine, both of which are scheduled to control substances, meaning they are both extremely,

extremely addictive and have it forming. So I guess their effect essentially creates kind of like a buzz, hence the name speed, but when they're taken long term, they can lead to some serious psychological side effects like depression, anxiety, aggressive or violent behavior, which Jim already is displaying. And then I bolded these next couple of them. Unrealistic ideas of power, confidence and strength. And in some cases, the psychological effects could also be hallucinations and complete psychosis. So this is just like a recipe for a call later.

It's the recipe for a call later. Unrealistic ideas of power, confidence, hallucinations, and eventually complete psychosis. Like bake for 20 minutes and like cool on the counter. Like you know, I don't know if you know it, but like you people, you know like the opening scene of the Power Puff Girls, where he's like sprinkling in sugar and spice and all that shit.

No, but that makes sense. They were, that's what they do when they make a culture of cults. There you go. They were, that's what they do when they make a cultured of cult. There you go. They sprinkle in unrealistic ideas of how they're fucking hallucinations and all the stereotypes and confidence. Yeah, all of it. I literally can't.

So yeah, Jim, he was really into block beauties and sadly, like I said, he became very addicted. And then he starts dipping into the restaurant profits to be able to afford more and more of this and to make up for the lost money This is wild that there's not any fucking information on this. I don't know if it's true I don't know if it's not true. He would later say that to make up for the money He was dipping into from the restaurants that he robbed between two and 11 banks that he robbed between two and 11 banks. Between two and 11? It was about two, it was kind of like 11. Like, could have been three, could have been eight.

Between, those are 68 and 412. Vastly different numbers, my dude. What? What? I mean, he was on speed, so like, I guess I understand why you can't. That's wild. That's wild. I'm also like, were there a lot of bank speed robbed at the time?

Yeah, like, there is a report in it. No, no. But nothing that I could find. Okay. Yeah, he was never caught, so I don't know if it's true or not, but he sure talked about it a lot, and it's one of the first things in that documentary that you'll hear. Either way though, the investors and the restaurants were like, yeah, you need to fucking stop doing this because we're not making any money.

You can't just keep robbing banks about it if that's even what you're doing. So they're like, yeah, we're gonna cut you out of all of this. Like you're done. You're done. You're done. You're done. And they basically pushed him out of the restaurants

to save them. Good, they told them to fuck off into the desert. They certainly did. So Elaine would go on to run the awareness for the next some odd years. Good for her. She and Jim officially divorced in 1969. Good for her.

She said, I'm going into the 70s and you're not invited. Yeah, I'm not bringing you into the 70s with me. No, no, no. No way. So yeah, he's literally completely like moved on now, just abandoned that entire family. Cool, you're the worst. Yeah, like even William Desmond Taylor

only abandoned one family. Yeah, that's a joke. So that is a joke in case it was not clear. Hey, joke, you've pressed an incorrect. So in the time between meeting Dora and getting divorced, Jim dove headfirst into a life that, like I've said, he seemed to be curious about since he was younger. Dora introduced him into the world of yoga and it seems like at some point he kind of got off the hard shit. I'm not sure. He definitely still smoked weed. I'm sure he did some acid about it. So like, I don't know. He was doing a little bit better, but again, he abandoned another family, so how good is he really doing?

But again, he's really getting into the study of different religions. So he's see where we're headed. It's like normal people, and you wanna study that stuff like sure. Yeah, this guy, I don't know. We're on a path. We are on a freaking path.

And he's getting more and more into like mysticism. Like, did I say that right? Yeah, good. That's good. Good. And he gets the itch And he's getting more and more into like mysticism. Like, did I say that right? Yeah, good. That's good. Good. And he gets the itch. He's like, you know what, I've been cut out of all of these restaurants.

So he gets the itch to open another restaurant. And this is the wildest story. And this is reported the same in many different sources. So I think this happened. Oh man. So one day, he meets this guy on a hike. And he's talking to this guy. He's like, I got all these great ideas for this new restaurant.

I want to open. I have a ton of experience as a restaurant owner. You might have heard of me, like for my other restaurants, and he left out the part where he got cut out of those deals. Yeah. And he said, I learned a lot over the years about cooking and about the body and how it breaks down food. And I really want to take that wisdom and open up a new restaurant that's gonna incorporate

the values of healthy eating, wellness, and also the secret teachings of Jesus Christ as revealed through the essence, the scene gospels of peace. Okay. It's a restaurant. Yeah. Like I love a cool vibe in a restaurant.

Yeah, I love the feeling. I love it. I love it. I love it. I love when the walls are a cool color. I don't know if you need to think this deeply into it. Yeah, I mean, you're going to have a certain clientele. Like you're going to limit your clientele a little bit by like really only focusing on that.

But yeah. But you know, like that's on you, man. Look, I'm like, off gym., like that's on you, man. But go off, Jim. You have not been killing it so far, so this does not shock me that you are already narrowing down that customer base right from the jump. I think a lot of times when you're stuck in this kind of like loop of frustration, you really start to focus on problems and like everything that's going wrong instead of what you can do to fix it, aka a solution.

I've been there before. I've been like, I really hate this person. I don't want to be around them. I'm just, I hate it. Oh my god. But like, what was I going to do about it? I went to therapy. That's what I did.

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I was like, I don't need to go. I am just fine. Oh my God, looking back on who I was back then and who I am now, I feel like I'm a much more understanding person. I'm way less stressed than I used to be and honestly I think I approach situations with a little more confidence and you know Tools just tools to cope. I have so many of those. There's laying around my house all over the place

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it because that really, I don't think that became a huge part of a restaurant at all. Well, it was a secret. Yeah, yeah, you're right. So maybe you didn't hear about it. Maybe it was like just secret and greeting. Yeah, it's like the secret teachings you don't know about it. I don't, I don't need to. So, so this guy that he's on the hike with just fucking shooting the shit, his name is

Ray Feldman, excuse me, he's like the hike with, just fucking shooting the shit, his name's Ray Feltman, excuse me. He's like, I think you're the bee's niece. I think you're even the cat's pajamas. And you know what, I want to invest in your restaurant. Sounds like a great opportunity. He's like, I also want to mix chicken bowl and aes with the secret teachings of Jesus Christ. Don't we all?

Yes. That's my favorite part of the entire exchange is that this restaurant literally didn't even exist yet. And he's like, I want to invest in that. And he's like, take my money. Like, wow. That's about to start up.

Wow. So on the, I don't know if it happened on the trailer, like when they made their way back down, but he just hands this man a $35,000 loan. Oh, he, this is a cult leader. Right? This is, he's a cult leader already. He just got somebody to hand them him $35,000 with just the idea of a restaurant

that makes his food in religion. Yeah, and like, it would be ideal. It's like, what? And just, you know, I did the conversion. $35,000 back then, this is like 1969. Today, that would be like handing somebody $300,000 dollars back then. This is like 1969. Today, that would be like handing somebody $300,000. Wow. Sure. That's a lot. That's called leadership. That's the thing. He was said to be

super, super charismatic. Yeah, he has to be obviously. Carousel. I know I said that super weird. So with that, the source was born. All right, let's work on. The source had a very, I'm sure, you're shocked to hear it. Hippy feel to it. What? Unlike the restaurants that he'd opened with his ex-wife,

the source was 100% vegetarian. Apparently the salads were really to die for. I did look at them and you and some of it looks absolutely fucking delicious. Get out of here. They had like a secret sauce too. Yeah, I'm sure they did. I wonder what a lot of secrets up in here. It's so big, it's full of secrets. Yeah, anytime there's too many secrets in a restaurant, I don't want to be a part of it. But fucking get this dude. This restaurant, like he's really good at opening a restaurant. I don't know what he knows. He

knows what makes people tick. And it started getting a very notable clientele. John Lennon and Yoko Ono were like obsessed with this place. They were frequent flyers. Makes sense. I'm not shocked at all. Goldie Hahn loved it there. Joni Mitchell, Marlon Brando, Greta Gabo. Wow.

All these people are frequenting the restaurant. It also was actually featured in the movie Annie Hall. I've never seen that movie. Oh. But Alvi orders at the restaurant, Alfelta Sprouts, and mashed yeast. Oh, that's weird. Mm-mm.

So, the thing is though, the celebrities were not the only people stopping by. The source really ended up being kind of like this hot spot in town for a lot of like lost younger kids and their pre and early teens to just hang out. And Jim was given jobs to the youth, the youth's excuse me, there's just something about him again like with all Cole leader something about him that just felt really comforting to them. And by this time he had started

dressing exclusively in like white robes from head to toe. You know? Yeah, of course. Of course. He's a co-leader. He's been a co-leader his whole life. I'm just kidding. He very much. He was born with a robot,

and I was just waiting for it to come out. That's the thing. A lot of times, too, he'd wear a really long tunic style top and loose white pants. Just very co-leader chic. You have to dress the part. No, but the weird thing is like he, like you look like a cult leader sir,

but I don't think the younger people hanging around the source really got the impression that this is what he was going to become. Though what many people say is that he became like more of a father figure to these kids, because they are young and impressionable. Well, and it's good that he was fathering somebody. Yeah, not his own kids.

Yeah, we'll get to that. But a lot of these kids, I think, were lacking this at home, because you have to think this is like the late 60s, early 70s. I think during that period, most dads weren't super mushy-gushy with their kids. There was a lot of untreated PTSD going on from the war years, a lot of stress because of the general shape of the world at this point. And I think it wasn't considered manly to be home and hanging out with your kids about time.

Yeah, shitty, but that's how it kind of was. And this is exactly what you need to start a cult. It's people in a vulnerable, they're gonna listen, they're gonna be gullible, they're gonna be looking for love, they're gonna be looking for attention, they're gonna be looking for some kind of comfort. It's the perfect source. It is. Haha. But um, and of course I just want to note that like I'm generalizing there, I'm sure your dad from the 70s was fucking awesome. I'm sure your dad fucking ruled in the 70s.

I mean, my grandpa ruled in the 70s. It's true, so there's that. My dad was just like born in the 70s and think so. He was ruling. He was ruling. But all these preteens and teens, they start hanging out at the source and Jim is teaching them all about Spiritualism and wellness and he starts teaching yoga classes and the kids are just kind of not leaving They're getting jobs there and then they're kind of like Like moving in sleeping in the apartments above the restaurant setting up camp outside

Living and working at the source 24-7 with Jim serving as a Zadi. So around this time again, still 1969, Jim meets another young woman, and her name is Robin. And oh my God, she is absolutely fucking stunning. If you see a picture of her, like retroactively, I wanna be like, what the fuck are you doing? What, you have the world? Take your fingertips out of here. Robin, I want to be like, what the fuck are you doing? You have the world, you have your fingertips and out of here.

Robin, I also was just thinking, when you said the source, and you started talking about like preteens and everything, I was like, what am I thinking of? The boy meets the world episode when John joins the center. This sounds exactly like that. I think it's probably based on this.

I was gonna say this is, it feels like this might be based on it. God, I need somebody to go through our episodes and listen how many times we have referenced that one specific episode. Oh yeah, it's an iconic episode. I love that episode. I also, which is an off topic. I also recently watched the Thanksgiving episode.

That'll change. That's a great one. The one with like where Sean Stanley joins Cory's family. Of course, but love. The one with the center, when Mr. Hunter, or excuse me, when Mr. Matthews pushes him against the wall, in the best. Wow.

And then when he became a Zadi, when Mr. Feedy says you can't have Sean, and I was like, oh, Mr. It's a lot. That's a great episode. It's a great episode. Boys meets words. Boys meets words. Boys. Boys.

Boys. Boys. Only chorus. Singular boy meets world. Honestly, it should have been boys though, because it was Quarry Sean and Eric. Yeah, but it's really just, it's falling, Quarry. Yes, yes, yes.

But I lost my train of life. It was just a great show. But anyways, you're right. Very, very similar to the center. So he meets Gorgeous, Gorgeous Robin.'re right. Very, very center. Very center. So he meets gorgeous, gorgeous Robin. And it's honestly unclear what happens to Dora. I don't know if she just kind of faded off in a acid trip or like what happened,

but she was gone. She got out of here. And Jim really sets his eyes on Robin. And he keeps telling her like, you gotta come by, you gotta take one of my yoga classes. Because by now, again, he's teaching regular night yoga classes at the source once the restaurants like closed for the day. Yeah of course. So Robin didn't really seem interested at first

and she kept brushing off the invitations and to be fair at Jim really loves 19 year olds. Robin's also 19. Jim needs to go away. He needs to go far far away. She's 19 years old at this point and she's like why is this like old man trying so hard to take for me to take his yoga class? Like this is kind of weird. You get out of there. But finally one night she's like, you know what? Let me just go see what this is all about. Like I do like the source restaurant. I'll like sure I'll take her yoga class like she's into the hippie ideals. And this night was Friday, August 8th 1969. A date that might sound familiar to some regarding another cult.

So Robin blows off plans with her friend Sharon and heads to the source to see what Jim's yoga classes are all about. Now, she loved the class. She thought it was awesome. And the two of them start talking after class. And they actually, it was like this sudden switch, like they really start to hit it off.

And again, there's just something about Jim. People couldn't put their finger on it, but he's got this charm, he's got this charisma, he knows how to talk. And as she was leaving that night, Robin was like, I feel like there was like a reason I was supposed to meet Jim. And the next morning, that feeling would overwhelm her entire being. Because the next morning, Robyn's friend Sharon, that she had

canceled plans with that previous night, was found murdered in her home. Wow. Sharon Tate. Whoa. Had she gone to Sharon's home that night. Whoa. She would have been killed. Okay When you said that date that popped into my head, but I wasn't thinking it was gonna connect it anyway I thought it was gonna be like a oh that happened and it made them like form more into a cult kind of thing like I Had wow I tried to be like she blew up for plans with her friend Sharon. And I could tell I wasn't, oh no, was not connecting, was not, wow. So she blew off plans that night. And I didn't realize this in the original.

I want to actually redo the Manson episodes. I think I could do them a lot better now. Yeah, that's what we've been doing that with a couple of them, just like going further into stuff. I didn't realize the day that satir, so you just kept murdered on a Friday, technically a Saturday, because it was like in the early morning hours, the next day was supposed to be her baby shower.

Oh, I had no idea. I didn't know that either. I was like, oh that's awful. I found out, like when I was researching this part of it, that's like terrible. Awful. But so then, like she's already thinking I was supposed to meet Jim, and then this happens,

of course you're gonna line those two events up and be like, no, I was supposed to meet him. then this happens. Of course you're going to line those two events up and be like, no, I was supposed to meet him. Well, in what a traumatic event that's going to push you further into looking for meaning somewhere. Exactly. Like, you're the meaning. I was supposed to meet him. Exactly. So everything shifted for Robin in that moment. Like you just said, losing a friend and coming to terms with the fact that she could have been killed, it only made her lean closer into Jim.

Yeah. And pretty quickly, the only made her lean closer into Jim. Yeah. And pretty quickly, the two of them started falling in love. Now, Robin later recalled that she said, I'd never been loved the way that Jim loved me. She called him her night in shining armor. She recalled that he really opened up her mind. She said, he opened me up to a world that was filled with light and love

and protection and consciousness. OK. And from that day forward, the two of them became inseparable. And by 1970, they were married. That's what I say about John. I was like, he just opened me up to it. What was it?

Light, love, protection and consciousness. There it is. That's what I say. I always forget. I always forget what I say. I would say that drew open me up to light love, protection and consciousness too, actually. It sounds great. It's beautiful when...

Sounds man's as cool. Yeah, it's wonderful. Yeah, and another thing that you should watch the documentary, I don't want to tell you everything about it, but one thing I will mention is Robin had been really sick and her childhood. She was like a very sickly child. And I guess she almost died.

Oh wow. And Jim obviously gets her on this holistic kind of venture. And you know, that can sometimes turn things around. So she was in the best health of her life She felt in the moment. So I think that was like another thing that made her lean into him. Of course. Now so they get married And then you know, Jim loves religion and theology and all this stuff So they start talking about that and meditation and yoga and all of it and around this time Jim really starts falling in love with the teachings of

Around this time, Jim really starts falling in love with the teachings of Yogi Bajan. So Yogi had his own following and he taught Kundalini yoga, which was something that Jim would later use in his own teachings. Kundalini I think is just like all about like energy. It's like some energy that sits at the base of your spine and the yoga practice

brings it throughout your body. I don't know a lot about it. That's what you do during yoga. Sitting at the base of your spine and it's got to leave you're not long. I'm never mind. I feel like a mark. But yeah, he kind of takes that and brings it into his own teachings later on. And actually Robin and Jim went out to me, Yogi, as well as many other prominent spiritual leaders. And they finally said to each other after meeting with all these different people, potential cult leaders, that they want to start their own religion. But they're not looking at this as like,

we want to start a cult. They're like, we want to start our own beautiful religion. Yeah, I don't know. I feel like 100% of the time when you say that, you're looking for a cult. Yeah. That's just me. I'm going to say that Jim probably was thinking of it more from a cult. Yeah. So that's just me. I'm gonna say that Jim probably was thinking of it more from a cult like perspective. I think to Robin, she was like a young hippie. Oh yeah, these were like young people that are being, I'm believing him completely. She was abused by him.

Yeah, he 100% was looking to form a cult. Absolutely. I've 100%. I believe he was. The only reason I said that was because I don't think Robin was. No, I can definitely was because I don't think Robin was no I can definitely get behind that she was just kind of brown in especially in like a traumatic part of her life and 19 years old Your fucking I was a baby

wreck you don't know it, but you are like at 19 years old I was making the worst decisions of my life. Oh Like I was doing things that now I look back on and I'm like, what the fuck were you doing? Like, I can see why she followed him into the dark because I was following someone into the dark at 19, so I can totally understand that. I was a miserable human at 19. Yeah, same, not good, but him definitely was looking

to start a call. When he was like, freaking 47 by this point, like, what are you doing, Jim? Start a call. Literally. So Robin explained that after carefully studying each religion, she and Jim, she said they cherry picked the best parts of separate religions and they worked them

into their own philosophies, like many, many equal intersting. Exactly. To the kids who never left the source, Jim became their earthly spiritual father. Of course he did. And Robin became known as mother-um. I love that. Yeah.

Jim, who later also became known as father-yod or yahala, said of starting his own religion, I realized I had to do it on my own. I had to get my own children, because I believed that he was prevailing through me. And that's what he wanted me to do. I left, never went back. I get my own children because I believed that he was prevailing through me and that's what he wanted me to do. I left, never went back.

Jim, you have several children. You have, I believe, three children. At least three that we know of. Yeah, there's probably more. What the fuck? I had to get my own children. Yeah, you have to get your own children. Oh my God, fuck off into the sun.

This guy can get fucked. Yeah, he does. Ew. You're gonna be so happy. No, I shouldn't say you. This guy can get fucked. Yeah, he does. Ew. You're gonna be so happy. No, I shouldn't say you're gonna be so happy at the end, but like you're gonna be like, and I'm gonna be like, ugh.

Yeah, I'll make that sound. I'll make sure to do it. You should. Okay. So eventually, 140 members of the source family, they become known as the source family. Yeah. Move into Jim's home in Hollywood Hills. I'm not shocked by this.

This is 140 of them. It was a rented home from the Chandler family who were very famous for owning a ton of newspaper, companies, and building and developing a lot of different areas, like the San Fernando Valley and the Hollywood Hills. Now Harry was the patriarch of that family, but he had died in 1944, and his wife still ran his estate, and in 1972 she rents it out to Jim Baker, or as we will now call him

father. Father. And he paid $1,000 a month, which does not sound like a lot if you're renting a one-bedroom somewhere now that is like way more than that. But today that $1,000 would be like paying seven thousand eighty seven dollars for rent. So pretty penny. Yeah. Now the home was massive, it was a mansion.

It had been built in 1914. There were 24 rooms inside. There was a guest house outside. Eight bedrooms, four bathrooms, a library, a solarium, a huge solarium. So solarium sounds cool. I think all of solarium is as a huge alarm. So salarium sounds cool. I think all of salarium is as a sunroom. Yeah, it is.

Yeah, it just sounds really cool. Oh yeah, I thought it was somewhere where you looked at the stars. Yeah, I mean, you can. I think it's like a sunroom. Yeah, just don't look at the sun. Yeah, don't do that. No, it also had a huge pool.

It had a four car garage that father used to store beautiful cars. The main one that he really loved, his baby car, was a white Rolls Royce. Wow. Motherfucker. I'm just putting it out there. If you're natural, holistic, only fill my body

with greens and carrot juice and give yourself fun to me, the spiritual father who is whipping around a Rolls Royce, you're in a fucking cult. You're in a fucking cult. Also, if you're co-living with 140 members of a quote-unquote family that you're literally not actually related to in a giant house, and all of you co-own all of your earthly possessions because you're not supposed to have any of your own, but Father can, he doesn't subscribe to the co-owning of possessions. It's a cult.

You are so totally officially occult. Like, remember in those a UFO episode, we did where it was like, you've been proved. You've been culted. You are in a cult. You're in a cult. That's like, it's just the way it is. He is making you give up all your possessions,

but he's whipping you around in a Rolls Royce. And like maybe you think that like you call, oh, not Rolls Royce with him. Who's names on the title, but who's names on the title? That's his Rolls. So the new source family, they didn't yet feel like this was a cult. And they said it was just like a family

of like-minded people. They had a goal of spreading good throughout the world. And while they were in this first house, a cult, world. And while they were in this first house, a cult, yes. Well, they were in this first house. They started referring to it as the mother house. Yeah. They started talking amongst themselves while they were spending more and more time at the mother house. And this is when they decided that they really wanted to unite their ties together. And they said, what better way to become a real family than have the same last name? Yeah.

So they settled on the surname Aquarian because it was the age of Aquarian. I was just going to say it's the age of Aquarian. Yes, exactly. I don't know. I tried to look into what the age of Aquarian says, and I felt like I was joining a cult. I was going to say it's basically when, you know,

the Manson family happens. It's very deep, it's very hard to explain. It's interesting to look into, but just don't go too far. Be careful. They decided, yeah, they were gonna change their name to Aquarian and many of them made their name changes official with the Social Security Office.

Like they made this official. Wow. And pretty much all of them changed their own first names to things like orbit, electricity, heaven, harvest moon, and sunflower, et cetera, et cetera. I like harvest moon. I love harvest moon. That's pretty metal.

I also love that song. Harvest moon aquarium. Yeah. Whoa. Yeah. Harvest moon month, through some shit. Yeah. So Father you'd set up a list of 10 commandments to follow. And I got them right here for you. Also, if anybody sets up a list and says these are the commandments

that you are to follow, you're in a cult. One, obey and live by the teachings of your earthly spiritual Father because you're in a cult. Yeah. Number two, love your earthly spiritual father more than yourself because this is a cult. Cultie cult, cult, cult. Number three, harm not one of your body parts either by neglect, food, drink, or knife. That's just a good, pretty good. Alat-4, allow each vibration to complete its own cycle without interference. You're an occult.

I don't even know what that means. It's culty. Number five, possess nothing you do not need and share all you have. See you LT cults. Also, I'd be like, so who, like, do I get to deem if I needed or not? No.

Because I do be needing my Botox and I do be needing my car and I do be needing a lot of things. No, you don't, because you're in a cult. Sure, all you have. Yeah. Number six, the man and his woman are one. Let nothing separate them. I want you to listen to that one again.

Number six, the man and his woman are one. Let nothing separate them. Okay, wonderful. A union, I love it. Maybe Jim should subscribe to his own rule. I was like, but we'll look at that. But Jim. Number seven, squander not by create a force and lust, but come together only when three vibrations of the physical, the mental and emotional are in harmony with spiritual love, you're an occult. Number eight, each morning, join your vibration with the

ascending currents of the universal life energy, using the keys that your earthly spiritual father has taught you because I don't know if you realize this yet, but like, you're in a cult. Number nine, do every act energetically, intelligently, truthfully, and lovingly, that's not humanly possible. No.

Number 10, when these commandments are mastered, leave the house. Leave the house of your earthly spiritual father. Get the fuck out after this. And do the work of your heavenly father. Oh, no. You're okay. You're in a cult.

So father also set up a morning routine that was called spiritual boot camp. Okay. Yeah. Everything seemed like conflicting notions, but let's go. Let's go. Let's go.

I've never done a boot camp. Well, I've done like an exercise boot camp and nothing about it was spiritual. Well, I was like. I've never done a boot camp. Well, I've done an exercise boot camp and nothing about it was spiritual. Well, I was like, I have done a good little. I know it actually. It's really, I haven't done boot camp. Now, everybody in the family for the spiritual boot camp would wake up at four in the morning

and upon waking, they were to take a deep breath. Ready? And then they were to exhale the word, Yahweh. Father told them that this was God's name, yahuwah. And he was the son of God who went by the same name because he was equally as good as God. Oh, to do that.

Oh, okay. Then they were to either say aloud or in their head, just like whatever feels good to you that day, you still have like one or two choices left. Be still and know I am God. But I thought the other guy was God and I thought that you were the sun. So like, why do I have to wake up and say that?

I'm God, what? I just like, like, be still. I like to wake up and say, where is the fucking coffee? Yeah. I like to wake up and text Elena coffee question mark. Yep. So I just wake up to my youngest being like can I go downstairs?

No, she says I'm running. Now watch stinky and dirty and then you say not yet She's like, I want to watch sticky and dirty. Yeah, and you're like, oh good morning. Stinky and dirty is a great show It is now once they were finished with you know their personal moments of I am God and Noah They were ready for the boot camp of it all So they would all file out into the backyard and they would get into the pool, no matter what the temperature was, you were to get into the pool

because you know, you have to read your body of all sleep and negativity. No, I'm out already. Got that. I'm out. I'm out. I'm out. Once that was finished,

they had to do an exercise routine that included pull ups, dips, a little jog, and push ups on their fingertips. Okay. But why, though? Can anybody even do that? I was just going to say is that possible? Not apparently. Wow. The routine was referred to as star exercise, and the whole point was to, quote, tune yourself into the universal energy

currents of the morning. Meanwhile, the morning universe is like, what the fuck are you all doing? The morning universe is like, I'm not doing that. And your neighbors are annoyed. Yeah. For me, like, I love a good coffee. I love a breakfast sandwich. And if I'm really feeling one with myself in the universe, some morning affirmations. There you go. But that's really it. So once the star exercises were completed, they were to take one, six second inhale of marijuana in this practice.

Second. Don't you feel like that's long? I know everyone always yells at me because I like know nothing about drugs. Like I'm the worst drug person ever. But yeah, like that feels like a lot, right? because I like know nothing about drugs. Like I'm the worst drug person ever. But yeah, like that feels like a lot, right? I smoke a lot of weed and can you count?

Yeah, no. I haven't even gone to six yet. That's a long inhale as far as I concerned. Whenever I've talked about like smoking weed on the podcast before people are like, you don't even know anything that has to do with anything. So maybe this is a very normal inhale but it feels real long. It feels long to me. I also had childhood asthma and I'm a little overweight so like leave me alone. But this practice and

I, the stoner people will love this. I thought this was really funny. This practice was referred to as the sacred breath. The sacred, which I agreed. So for the most part. Everybody actually seemed really happy at the mother house. Like they were happy to do star exercise. They were real stoked about the sacred breath. Yeah, I'm sure. I mean, people said though, like,

you wake up and you do that crazy routine and then you take this wild, in my opinion, inhale of weed. There was one guy in the documentary that was like, you don't understand, like when you're in that frame of mind and then you get like high, like right after that, you feel like you're tripping balls. Oh, I'm sure. He was like, I felt like I was on LSD.

I didn't feel like I was high from like weed. Because it's like a mixture of just like adrenaline and like all the dopamine and all the things. Yeah, and then your body's trying to like chill out for that, but it's, it can't. It's two different things. She just started tripping. And then you go right into like morning meditation

and like some crazy shit and like chanting and like all the wild stuff. So it's a lot. But everybody seemed happy at the mother house for the most part. But there were some run-ins with the police from time to time because a lot of underage girls were on that property, and a lot of them had fathers and mothers that were like,

hey, I think there were the source family, and we're not too cool with that. Yeah. So the police were like, yeah, you're gonna be in some serious hot water if this keeps happening. You gotta send these girls home. Yeah.

You can't do what you want, but you can't do what you want unless they're 18. With underage children. Precisely. Totally fine, guys. Father has a solution. It's not to tell them all that they need to go home, however. He just married off all the underage girls to older boys in the community. So it's legal, because they're married. He is so gross. He's fucking disgusting. He's disgusting. Crisis averted though, am I right? Yeah, totally. So when this thing happened, a couple, or I don't know how many in general, but like some of the family members were concerned that this might be a catalyst to more power moves in the

future. This might be a cult. So I think that's when people started like kind of realizing, but it wasn't a big awakening. I think it was just like some of realizing, but it wasn't a big awakening I think it was just like some people left, but it was like not a very big amount. So those people They were on to something because sure enough there were more power moves to be made What is it? What is it? Why is it one of the first things that a cult leader does when he starts to realize all the power He has especially over the women connected to him, what does he do? He says, plural marriage rules. Of course.

I love plural marriage. It's just the first thing. Always. Always. So, for a new playbook. Honestly, honestly, try something new. Father goes to Robin or mother at home one day. And he says to her, you know, I'm thinking of taking more wives

and she's like, hey, what about commandment number six where like the woman and his, uh, the woman and her husband are one and you should do nothing to come in between that. And he was like, yeah, I'm so happy. Yeah, but you can totally count. I don't count. I'm the virtually spiritual father. Of course. Of course. So she said he's sitting there talking to her about this and her blood is boiling because she's like, I didn't sign up for this. Like, well, that's the problem. It's like, if you guys went into this relationship

and you were like, we are going to have multiple wives and husbands. Whatever it is that you want to do, like that's fine. You just have to be as long as you are both consenting to it and our have in our adults and everything is On the up and up on that situation Whatever do which you want to do nobody gives shit

I mean I don't and but it's like when you enter into a marriage and then like years into it You're like I think I'm gonna marry a few more gals. It's like No, I didn't enter into this and if I if she not cool with it, and she's not. That's not cool, man. Then you'll buy. Because she's, her whole thing, she was like, those were not the vows we took. No, we took vows for each other. Yeah.

And so she said he's like sitting there explaining that she's getting pissed. And he's like, what do you think? And she tells him, I think you're a dirty old man on a lust trip. That's what I think. Robb is. She literally said that.

But she's absolutely crushed. And she feels cheated and lied to. And she goes through this like really terrible period where she's just in front of everybody like crumbling, you know, it's awful. And she's trying to figure out if she should leave, but she's also like, I don't know where I'm going to go. How am I going to explain this to my family? Can I even divorce him? Like, yeah. I love him. I love the people here, it's awful.

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plus 20% off with interactive monitoring. Go to simplysafe.com slash morbid. There is no safe, like simply safe. So she stays. And eventually, Father goes on to take 13 wives in total. My God. 13 wives in total. And when that started happening, there was like another shift and some more people left the family because they were like, what about commandments? Yeah, like what the fuck, dude? So, and it's like, that is the hallmark of a cult.

The hallmark? The hallmark is like, he's suddenly. No, no, no, no, we haven't gotten to the full hallmark yet. That's like, that's like the hall and then the mark is, because this is the thing.

I'm like so hyped that I'm stuttering. It would have been one thing if he was pairing up with women of age. Oh God. And deciding to make them his second, third, fourth, and third wife. He's taking on underage girls. Yes, he's a disgusting girl. He's a big.

He's a big. And one of them in the documentary, she said when she was asked to become his wife, she was only just about to turn 17. Oh my God. You're a 16 year old and this man's like 50 at this point. You're like in his late 40s. That's not okay. No. That's not okay. That's not okay.

Nope. So people were like, yeah, like you're bringing underage girls and marrying them, like we're out. Ew. But there were so people that stuck around, of course. So, and then father, he starts taking his wives out. He parades them around town.

They're dressed in any picture you see of them. They're all dressed like very glamorous hippies. Like it was very Hollywood. Yeah. They're just out spreading the you see of them. They're all dressed like very glamorous hippies. Like it was very Hollywood. Yeah. And they're just out spreading the good word, you know? But really things were not going so well at the mother house as we could very much tell now. And also because this was the time

that all the Manson family trials were going on. And obviously we know how public that was and how fucking crazy it got. So the public gets very, very nervous about cult activity in general. And most of the neighbors close by to the source family mother house were like, yeah, I don't really want 140 cult members

living so close by because I do feel like I might get murdered about that. Yeah. So they start calling the landlord of the home and urging her to get them out of there. So when the lease is up at the mother house, father was told that the property was actually being sold and they were not going to be able to renew the lease. Like, you got to get out of here. Yeah. I also wonder if she said anything to him. Like, I also don't remember you adding 139 other people's names to this lease. Yeah, about that.

That was talked about. But now instead of finding another mansion to live in, because remember, the source family restaurant still exists and is doing very well by all accounts. Like he has money. That's so wild. He's driving around a fucking Rolls Royce. I'm looking at pictures of this while you're talking. Isn't it crazy?

Yeah, it's wild. So the source family had to move in to a much smaller home at this point. This home had three bedrooms and three bathrooms, which would have been great for like a small family, but not very ideal for the large source family. They moved into this house in 1973. Only three years were spent in the original mother house

and that's how much it changed. Oh, wow. So this house was named the Father House. And I just feel like, I don't know if I'm just in a place of deep and like reflection, but isn't it so interesting how it started off with the mother house? Oh yeah.

Some people had this pure idea going into it of how beautiful this was going to be, and then slowly it starts to fade out, and they can't stay at the mother house and the next place is the father house. Is the father house. So that's the thing. And like you think about the first house

being named the mother house, you think of who Robin is. Yeah. And it makes sense that things started off beautifully. And then we move on to the father house and let me tell you, it was a steady fucking decline once they got into the father house. In the father house, the family started doing jam band sessions. And father would sing, you could call it that.

And the band would, I played some of it for you. Yeah, you did. It's a lot. You are correct. The band would play this really far out psychedelic music. Personally, I love the music of it. The singing, not so much. Today, their records, their recordings, excuse me,

actually are really heavily sought after by collectors. That makes sense. And they're really hard to come by, I guess. Yeah. I like really won't want to. I just want to have that. I just want it. I won't. I won't. So the band would started like traveling together. And of course, father is the front man. And they're going to different high schools and colleges to play their music, which is a very pointed exercise. I was going to say, of course. You're trying to spread the message to young people to join the family. And father, he would do these performances and, you know, he's singing on stage. And in, like, you know, like the singer talks to you in the middle of it.

Yeah. He'd go into these fields and he'd be like, Come, join us! Have a morning meditation! Find out what the source family is all about. Youth of America. No thank you, it was wild. No thank you.

He's like bringing all these people in. And all in all, they actually ended up recording over 65 albums. And I don't know if it was the music or perhaps some drug use that led to what happened next. I'm sure it maybe was a combination of the two. But around this time, father got really into sex magic.

You did hear that correctly, sex magic. Blood sugar sex magic, that's a red-up chili pepper cell. Correct, there you go. You had to participate though in the sex magic ceremonies that were being held. No, thank you. It was not, what's the thing?

It was not voluntary. Yeah, it was mandatory. No, thank you. It was not, what's the thing, it was not voluntary. Yeah, it was mandatory. You had to go. And the goal, like you had to go, because the goal was to bring everybody's consciousness to a higher level and to quote unquote bond together on a molecular level. No, thank you. Like, there's some people that I just don't want to be bonded to molecular. Oh, there's a whole host of people that I don't want to be bonded to molecular. Oh, there's a whole host of people

that I don't want to be bonded to in any way. There's a lot of love for love. Oh, yeah. Of people that I don't want to be bonded to molecularly. They believed that after these sex magic sessions, the energy that you created during the ceremony would lead you to possessing some kind of magic afterward that you could then use in the world

to probably like cultivate things even more. We could just do spin class together and create a lot of energy. It started off with morning meditation. It was a wild morning meditation for sure. But like, just leave it there. Just gather, vibe. Don't make people do sex magic if they don't want to.

If you want to do sex magic, that's great. How that means. But like, don't make underage girls for discipline. No, don't make anyone participate in any kind of sexual magic. Called abuse. Yeah. And actually it's sexual abuse. So people, oh, excuse me, I skipped a line. At this point, people really started to believe that father

was God. He was not the son of God anymore. He was God himself. Okay. So people I'd left in the past, right, like I said, this was when there was a big exit of members from the family because they were like, I don't wanna do this. I don't wanna do this alongside children. I'm good.

Like this was not what I signed up for. Not at all. So they left, but again, still plenty of people that stuck around. Those who did stick around did not realize that they were nearing the end of this journey with father, the end of this earthly spiritual journey. Oh boy. So he's going out into town like I said more often in his role's voice with a whole slew

on both arms of women all around him. This is just like, he's going out into public being like, I'm a fucking cult leader. Yeah, I have this gaggle of women with that. And the whispers about the family become louder and the gossip about them is spreading pretty much all around California and probably Arizona too. And there were also still parents looking for their children

who had joined the source family. And there were so many other illegal things going on that the city was worried about. Yeah. It wasn't long before the police came knocking again. They were investigating kind of on the low. I think they were trying to build a case to prove that this was not OK.

Yeah. And they were trying to prove that the family was harboring runaway, juveniles. They were violating labor laws. They were keeping a place where minors were sheltered without a license. Like, that's all illegal. And eventually, child services got involved and started their own investigation because

they're having children with this family now, and they don't believe in modern medicine. Oh, yeah. There were also building inspectors that started coming out and ensuring not like the living conditions were up to code. So father sees what's going on here. Oh, yeah, it's close and in. Yeah. And for obvious reasons, he's not a fan of the sudden interest in his family. No. And he starts talking about what all cult leaders talk about when they get desperate. Say it with me, Armageddon. I was gonna say the end

of the world. That's the next word, the end of times, nuclear wars between nations. It's all coming. Oh, it's all coming. And just all the things that Nightmare's are made of. And he decides abruptly we're selling the restaurant. We gotta get out of here. Oh no. So the restaurant, like I said, it was doing incredibly well, just to tell you how well it was doing,

it was bringing in a reported $300,000 a year back then. Wow. I think I forgot to do the conversion on the one. That's okay. It's a lot. Yeah, math. But he decides to sell the restaurant and he says we're moving to then. Wow. I think I forgot to do the conversion on that one. That's okay. It's a lot. Yeah, math. But he decides to sell the restaurant and he says we're moving to Hawaii. Oh, yes.

My birth land. I was going to say. I really was born there. So they used the money that they got to sell the source to fund their trip to also buy a large boat. Essentially, it was like a really big boat. I don't know what class it was. Like a yacht.

But it was big. And they also got an airplane because their plan was to live off the land in Kaua'i and make their living as fisher people. And the airplane was so that they could spot the fish. Oh, yeah. I don't know if like every beginning fisher people. Yeah, I don't think that's how that's done.

But, okay. Also, they wanted to open a spa. Okay, yeah, obviously. Yep, yep. So the only's how that's done. But, okay. Also, they wanted to open a spa. Okay, yeah, obviously. Yep, yep. So the only problem is that once they got there, everyone on the island was like, get the fuck out of here. We don't want that.

They really do not disrupt our existence up here. At this point, we're already other kind of like cult like things and people settling on the islands that they didn't want there. Like Taylor Camp had moved in on that island before and they were like, yeah, we're done with this. Like, we're not going to keep teaming. We've had our fill of cults. We don't need any more. Yeah, we're set. They were just not into it. And nobody would hire anybody on the source family at all. They weren't able to get jobs. And the locals were especially worried

that this manson-like family had just settled on their island. Yeah. So members of the family, they said later on that people started shooting toward the home that they had set up. And police were intimidating them, like, tailing them wherever they went. Basically, they were trying to trace them off the island.

Yeah, of course, but it's like there's kids in there. Exactly, yeah, you I think of that. So father was incredibly stressed about this whole thing, and he tried to defend the family by stationing men at different points throughout the camp, but there were men that had never shot guns. Yeah. They're like, I don't know how to do this. Like, what are you talking about? It all becomes way too much. So one day during morning meditation, there was a bowl passed around of beautiful magic mushrooms, and everybody is on trumze,

and they decide to go for a nature walk. Oh, no. And on this walk, father says to them, I gotta tell you something, I'm not God. I don't have any power, and I don't know what the fuck we're gonna do. He told them that their entire belief system that he has sold them for years is complete bullshit.

Well, they were all tripping balls on mushroom. But they were like, no, you are the earthly spiritual father. And he's like, no, you gotta listen to me. I am not. I'm not. I don't know what's happening. I'll show you my social security card. It does not say God, I am not God. I'm't know what's happening. I'll show you my social security card. It does not say God. I am not gone.

I'm literally a man named Jim. Jim Baker. I'm Jim. Just Jim. Like not even Jim from the office. Just Jim. I'm not Jim Halpert. I am Jim. Just Jim. If your name is Jim, sorry that we just like did that. No, Jim is a wonderful name.

I let the name James. I mean, come on. Yeah. So they're like, no, you're a whole father. You are God. Absolutely. And shortly after that day, there was another regularly scheduled morning meditation. This day was August 25th, 1975, and it had only been about six years of this cult. And father said to the family, I feel like going flying today. And they said, what, what he really was that he wanted to try hang gliding. But that was something that he had never done before. And all of his wives were like, I would prefer if you didn't try to learn how to fly in the state that you're currently in,

maybe we could take a couple lessons first. And one of the main wives at this point, I think she was kind of like the headwife was Makushla, and she was wearing black that morning, and she said she never wore black. She usually always wore white. And when she came down for morning meditation, father told her that she was dressed appropriately. And she, and there's a recording of this morning meditation. It's actually so haunting, the documentary, hyping up docs, hyping it up, hyping it up. And so he says to her, like, oh, you're dressed so appropriately,

and she screams in response, and you can hear her scream. And she said, I don't know why I did that. It was just there was this certain energy in the air, and it was like off, and that was like a release. Okay. So she was like, I don't know, something didn't feel right, but we had, we wanted to do as Father said. We still thought he was the earthly spiritual Father

and if he wants to climb up a mountain and hang glide off of it, then so be it. Yeah. Now looking back, everybody agreed that it was incredibly windy that day. The weather just seemed to be perfect for hang gliding. I think you need wind for that. But there was still like this weird energy in the air. And as they climbed the mountain,

they passed this woman who's like on a hike. She's just living her life. And father speaks in Latin to her. And in English, the translation was, we who are about to die today salute you. Oh. So they make it to the top of the mountain and there's this huge gust of wind. Just as father gets launched off the side of the cliff. But as soon as that wind came, it fucking went. And he just ended up falling like, I don't even know how many, like many, many, many, many, many feet crashed on the ground below. So everybody makes their way down to him. He's still alive. He did not die on impact.

Ooh. And they're like, what can we, like, what do we do? And he just keeps telling them. And like, there is recordings of this because I forget her name. If you watch the documentary, you'll know it. But there was this one woman who was like the journalist of the, or not, like, she took all the pictures.

Yeah. And like, all the videos of everything. Like, or not like she took all the pictures and like all the videos of everything. Like there's like a whole birth event. Just be warned you will see the entire thing. So if you don't wanna see that, the password. But he keeps telling them transmute the pain, transmute the pain. Transmute the pain.

Like make it like move the shift, the energy, like bring it somewhere. Bring my Kundalini back to normal. Yeah. So at one point, someone says, I think we don't really have another option. We should go to the hospital. Yeah, because we don't know how to actually

transmute plane. No. You just fell from the sky, sir. You also literally told us that you're not God, so I don't know what I'm supposed to do if you're not God, because I'm simply Lucuschla. I do not know. But then, so somebody was like, I think we should go to the hospital.

But like I said, hospitals in modern medicine were against their belief system. In fact, I think one of the reasons, one of the main reasons why CPS had shown up was because a member had left in the past because his young son, like he was like a toddler, almost died of an ear infection because they were trying to shine all these different colored lights on him and stuff, but you need a anti-biotics for that. An infection will kill you. It's certainly not. Just like the way it is.

They wouldn't give him medicine so his dad was like, we're out. So they were like, no, we can't go to the hospital. They decide against the hospital visit. And they all carry out of the sky. Straight up fell out of the sky. And they're like, no. So they all carry father of the sky. Straight up fell out of the sky and they're like, no. So they all carry father back to the house and he,

it's unclear. Some, some sources say he like survived for like a couple more days, other say only hours. I saw five days and then I saw nine hours. He ends up dying. And some sources say that he had no broken bones, no fractures, no nothing, he just died. Others say that he broke his back that day,

which I'm gonna go ahead and believe those ones. Yeah, I was going to. His body simply couldn't handle the amount of pain he was in and he died. And I'm sure, and at least in my opinion, and I think you would probably share the same belief, he probably had some internal bleeding after falling in that far and that hard.

And if he did have something that an infection can happen, I don't get a treat in. It exactly. So he passes away. And shortly after father passes, there was this really strange phenomenon, which this happened, and it is kind of crazy. A new star, like a Nova appeared in the sky over Hawaii.

It's like literally reported on a paper article about it. And the members of the family took this as a sign that father and his energy had simply shifted into that star. You can believe what you want. I can tell you what I believe. A star happened. A star was born.

A star was born in that he's an asshole who is a murderer. He's like, yeah, he's gross. And he did not turn into that wonderful star over Hawaii that did not happen. Yeah, I don't really want to believe that Jim Baker is shining over. He's not.

So you don't have to worry about it. Yeah, because he's not. No. I can tell you with 100% certainty, I'm here to break the news. Breaking news. Buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-buh-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub-bub- cremated and his ashes were spread along a beach in Hawaii. It literally says a beach. I'm more hoping the water. Yeah, I hope it's not actually.

I mean, I just like throw that in with the sand, but like, okay. But cool. Now the family went on to stay together for about two more years. And Makushla was like the head of the family for a while, but it slowly started to fade apart. Yeah.

And some people actually went on to keep their aquarium names and lived off the grid. Like there was people at the end of the documentary that were like, I still fully believe in his teachings. I practice them to this day and you know, all the energy them as long as you're not involving underage children. Other people just moved on completely. There was one guy that ended up like founding some corporation that made him a millionaire. All right. Wild. But, you know, that's the source family. Wow. And at the end of it, one thing is for sure,

Jim Baker was one wild fucking cult leader. Yeah. Like, call it like you see it. That's a cult. He was a cult leader. Oh, yes. Fucking crazy. That was a wild ride.

A wild ride indeed. That was a wild ride. A wild ride, indeed. That ended with a star being born. Isn't that crazy? And I think I had said it before to put it in your back pocket. He had broken his back previous. Yeah. So isn't that kind of crazy that that's how he died? Yeah.

He was like, I was done with judo and like after that match, but then he ends up going on and killing a man. And he's like with judo. Wow. Maybe that one. I don't know. Maybe the, I don't know. You know, you believed in karma, Jim. I know, that's, woof. Is that kinda weird? Woof! Is that kinda weird? What did I suppose, what sound was I supposed to make? What? I don't even like that. I forget what it says. People are yelling at you. Yeah, they are, and I'm sorry about it.

I think it was that. I think it was, uh. Yeah, that's just like that sound. I think it was, oh. Yeah, that's a thing, that's that. Kuku nuts bananas. Wow. Yeah, we hadn't done a Colton a while, so I figured I'd bring you a gnarly one. You know what your friend was, 100% right, when she said that, you probably would have joined this.

Yeah, it's true. I would have left when things got weird in the beginning. Like I would have left like probably really early on, but you would have been there. I do love a yummy salad and I do love natural holistic ideals and meditation and stuff like that. So you love a hippie moment. I just, I do, but I also don't want to share my possessions. No.

Like with 400 to 40 people. That would be when you dip. Yeah, I'd be like, you can get flipped. Yeah. This is mine. Don't touch it. This is mine, don't touch it. This is mine. I'm an only child kind of, so.

People are like, what? I know that just through everybody in the room. She or all of the sheep are fucking. Why is it a sheer sister? You're an only child, how? So, and with that, it's fun. We hope you keep listening, and we hope you. Keep it.

Wee! But that's everything you do in a cult, don't call. Don't do that, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't do that. Don't call, don't call. Hey, Prime Members! You can listen to Morvid, Early, and Add Free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at Wondery.com slash survey. and on my podcast Killer Psychie Daily, which you can find exclusively on Amazon Music. I share a quick 10-minute rundown every weekday on the motivations and behaviors of the criminal masterminds you read about in the news. I have decades of experience as a psychiatric nurse,

FBI agent, and a criminal profiler. On Killer Psychie Daily, I'll give you my expert perspective on cases like the mysterious New York City drugings. Breaking down Lori Vallow, a.k.a. Mommy Doom stays motives and what drove Caitlin Armstrong to murder? I'll also bring on expert guests who add even more insight into these criminal minds. I promise you won't regret adding these 10 minutes to your morning routine. Hey, Prime members, listen to the Amazon Music Exclusive Podcast Killer Psychie Daily in the Amazon Music app. Download the app today!