Morbid - Episode 410: The Murder of Sophie Toscan du Plantier

Episode Date: December 28, 2022

Just two days before Christmas in 1996 the body of 39 year old, french filmmaker, wife, daughter and mother Sophie Toscan Du Plantier was found not far from her vacation home. Her cottage in Schull was supposed to be her happy getaway, but would soon turn into an absolute nightmare. This was a classic tale of a tight knit community that was absolutely shocked, terrified and deeply saddened by this heinous crime. Unfortunately the investigation was a shaky one which led to two countries and families arguing back and forth. In the end, even though someone was convicted, there were still doubts and no one has been put behind bars to serve a sentence for Sophie’s murder. Thank you to the glorious David White for research assistance on this case!ReferencesCoulter, Carol. 2003. "Bailey admits violence to partner:." The Irish Times, December 10: 3.—. 2003. "Bailey was 'the subject of trial by media', says his lawyer." The Irish Times, December 9: 3.Dooley, Edna. 2001. Homicide in Ireland, 1992-1996. Study, Dublin: Government of Ireland.Foster, Nick. 2021. Murder at Roaringwater. Leicester: W.F. Howes Ltd.Fox, Kara, and Antoine Crouin. 2019. More than two decades after a woman was killed in an Irish village, French prosecutors hope to close the case. May 26. Accessed November 27, 2022. https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/26/europe/sophie-toscan-du-plantier-trial-ian-bailey-france-intl.Hogan, Dick. 1997. "Dead woman's last days re-created." The Irish Times, January 21: 7.—. 1997. "Expatriates go where living is easy." The Irish Times, January 18: 7.—. 1997. "Two held in Cork murder inquiry released." The Irish Times, February 11: 1.Jacobson, Philip. 1998. "Deadlock." The Sunday Times, June 7.Marlowe, Lara. 1997. "Husband of murdered woman files criminal proceedings." The Irish Times, February 6: 6.Marlowe, Lara, Connor Lally, and Olivia Kelleher. 2018. "Son of murder victim welcomes GSoc report: Investigation's failings did not amount to conspiracy, says Toscan du Plantier's son." The Irish Times, August 4: 2.O'Brien, Carl. 2003. "Woman says she was 'terrorised' by Ian Bailey." The Irish Times, December 18: 6.O'Connor, Alison. 1997. "Brutal murder shocks holiday haven." The Irish Times, January 4: 4.—. 1996. "Man known to French woman may be on video." The Irish Times, December 30: 4.O'Riordan, Alison. 2020. "High Court rejects French request for Bailey to be extradited to serve 25-year murder sentence." The Irish Times, October 13: 4.Roche, Barry. 2010. "Bailey had met Toscan du Plantier says producer." The Irish Times, February 4: 1.—. 2006. "Bailey witness accuses gardai." The Irish Times, February 24: 4.—. 2006. "Family of murdered woman to abandon action." The Irish Times, April 27: 2.—. 2019. "From Paris to west Cork and back: The story of the Sophie Toscan du Plantier murder investigation." The Irish Times, May 31.The Irish Times. 1996. "Murder investigation as body of French woman is found in Cork." The Irish Times, December 24: 1.The Mirror. 1997. "Why murder victim lay out for 24 hours." The Mirror, January 1.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Hey, Prime members, you can listen to morbid, early, and ad-free on Amazon music. Download the app today. You're listening to Immorbid Network Podcast. Hi, I'm Lindsay Graham, the host of Wondries Podcast American Scandal. Our newest series looks at the Kids for Cash Scandal, a story about two judges who stood accused of making millions of dollars in a brazen scheme that shattered the lives of countless children. Listen to American scandal on Amazon Music or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, weirdoes. I'm Alina and I'm Ash and this is morbid during the holiday season.

But you do. Yeah, it's the holiday season, so everybody stressed out. Nobody knows how to drive lately. Nobody knows how to drive. Everyone's kind of mean. Yeah. But it's cozy as fuck. It is.

I did go to the Berkshire's last weekend and OMG, it was so gorge, it snowed, the first snow happened there. So that put me in like such a good mood to like do holidays and everything, but then I had to drive home on the mass pike. Yeah. So that didn't put me in a good mood. I was like, well, I'm over this. The Berkshire's is like a snow globe. Yeah. It's like a little, it's like a hallmark movie.

Yeah. When you walk down Railroad Street,. It's like a little, it's like a hallmark movie. Yeah. When you walk down Railroad Street, you're just like, oh, am I just, am I from the big city? And I'm gonna meet a, well, I don't need to. But like if I was single, what I would have met this, but whenever John and I go there, we just like come up with a movie. Yeah.

Like John's like, it's me, I own a bakery downtown. And if you're the big city CEO that's coming in to take over my bakery That's what I thought when I was leaving. I was like I feel like I'm watching a hallmark movie in reverse Yeah, I was like leaving the small quaint beautiful town to like come back to work Yeah, which I'm excited about cuz like hey guys, so but like hey, yeah, so yeah, do you guys love hallmark movies? I need to know you're gonna say horror movies because that's just like your soul is Like hey, do you guys have hallmark movies? Also, if you guys aren't listening to Scream yet,

you gotta listen because we're right that it just may be think of it because we're right in the middle of the Hellraiser series. We just did Numeros and I dipped halfway out because I had to go to the workshop. It's a lot of fun. And I think you need to go listen if you haven't yet and Caleb's a fucking gem of a human killer. this is one of the funniest people I've ever met.

Like, let's just talk about Caleb. Did you see him? Did you see him? I was in Instagram Story last night. No, there was just him in front of a bathroom mirror, like looking at himself. And then he just backed up. And I was like, what was the point of that? But I also loved it.

Yeah, it's just who he is as a human. He's one of those people. And I think you'll get this if you listen to the podcast, and if you know him as a human, yeah, he's just one of those people that's like a shot in the arm. Oh my god. You know how like those are rare people

that you don't wanna do something or you're having a bad day, and then you just like get around Caleb and you're like, well fuck, everything's great, right? Like it's like, oh shit. So he's just one of those people. Yeah, so this is Caleb appreciation day. Oh my god.. So you just want to those people. Yes. This is Caleb Appreciation Day. Oh, oh.

It's been days just make me happy. And Caleb makes me happy. We're trying to get him to move to Massachusetts. Yeah, we're going to bring him over here. Everyone message Caleb until I'm new to Massachusetts. He's one of his inbox. There you go. Let's harass him into coming.

I mean, I've been doing it for years at this place. Yeah, why not? But yeah, I think there's some, I'm excited about next year's horror movies. I think there's gonna be some good ones. I know. There's not some good ones. I mean, screen. Yeah.

Can we talk about that for a second? Yeah. I actually just saw that it's gonna be in New York. Like it's based in New York. Oh, really? Yeah. I don't know if that's like for real. I actually Caleb posted like a thing,

like a poster for the new scream, and it says like in New York, and then I saw this synopsis that said like, all the kids leave fucking, what's for, what's for, what's for, thank you. And go for like a fresh start in New York, and I was like, wait, is that real? And I mean, you would know,

I'll just, I'll text Chad. Yeah, in the last, I'm excited, it sounds cool Chad. Yeah. In the last few minutes. I'm excited. It sounds cool. But that's, wow. That's interesting. I was surprised, but I'm like, I'm excited to see it. And I think it's coming out March 10th.

Yeah, I know it's coming out in March. Yeah. I'm excited for it. I'm so fucking stoked. Like, keep, keep bringing me back into that world. I'm here. I'm here for the ride. Let's go.

Let's go. Let's go. Let's go. And you know what, you can go and listen to six. I was just thinking because there's so many screams that there's so many hellraisers. And we're just beginning. Are we going through all of them like week by week?

I think they'll be like spread out. I think they'll be like little things in between like your pick. I was gonna say because my next pick on screen, this is just like a screen stand pod at the moment. Mine is, uh, don't worry, darling. What you can tell, like, we have very specific picks. Yeah. I think you guys are gonna be surprised by don't worry, darling. And if you didn't like it, I don't want to hear it. It was such a beautiful fucking masterpiece. It's the very styles of it all. Honestly. As much as I love Harry,

wasn't phenomenally. Really? No. He wasn't horrible in it by any search of the imagination, but he wasn't, like, I don't think it's his big break by any means. Yeah, he wasn't flop you. No, I want him on, in New York, singing to me that all times. Yeah, that's one of the things. Sorry, we're just going to like rant for a little while before we start. You guys love when we do this. You know, you guys, you love this. You like this. You love having a little sit-down talk. You guys love when we do this. You know, you guys, you love this. You love having a little sit-down talk. I hope you have a coffee with you.

I hope you wrap it up, President. Let's just share it for a second. Don't worry, we're gonna get into the story. I promise you, of course. But just speaking of that, Ash and I keep, we're like, we both hit the concerts this year that are dreams. Like literally our dream concert.

And like, neither one of us have experienced that real, just like deep concert withdrawal before. Like I've gone to many concerts that I loved, that I said, wow, that was the best show I've ever been to. But it never has it stuck with me like ghost. Like I am literally months out and still every day and like why am I not at a ghost concert right now? That's how I feel about Harry Styles.

And the saddest thing about that concert is like, you had such a beautiful experience coming to the whole way through. I had a euphoric experience in that crowd. And I was on Cloud 11. I was further than nine. And then somebody stole Drew's wallet. And we realized it as we were at the merch counter

about to get me everything my heart dreamed of. He was like, just get what you want. And I was like, I love you so much. I love you so much. And then he was like, do you have my wallet? And I was like, wow, the fuck, when I have your wallet? And he was like, I don't know where my wallet is. And I was like, and that's a bad way to end it.

We didn't find it. And then this really sweet man who like worked at the garden was like, oh no, like wallets are never gone forever. Like we always recover them, just call back. And then some other story, I started seeing, people are still you trying to use my hand. Yeah, people are shit. Yeah, people suck.

It's really our shit. Like that's a real shit move. It really sucked. And it's a hairy listener too. I was like, whoa. That's the thing. Because come and listen to the smooth vibes of hairy styles and then you steal someone's wallet

and try to steal their money. Jam around to treat people with kindness and sing along to the GD words. And then you try to use my GD wallet, like buy. And you know what's even sadder is when Drew like went through his name change I got him that wallet and had his initials his new initials embossed on it. That's bullshit. Yeah so fuck you whoever took it. Six months ago. Fuck you. I know I feel bad that your concert experience ended that way

because mine just ended with you floating to the car. Me literally floating to the car. And actually a listener named Amanda who we actually met at the Ghost Concert. Yes. They came up and talked to us like so sweet. They have a crochet shop called Killer Cat Crochet. And you can find them on Etsy and Instagram. They're amazing. They crocheted us. Yeah, the cutest.

I died. As dolls, we need to post that. Yeah, but also Amanda, shout out to you because we're talking about the ghost concert right now. At one point during the ghost concert, they like shoot out confetti. And we were in like the, we were on like the side of the stage.

Yeah, like in a seat. And so we didn't get like, showered in the confetti. And I remember watching it and being, because I'm the shy crowd. And I was like, I don't want some of that because I was like,

it's like a cool thing to, because I could see people grabbing it. Yeah. Like, oh, I want ghost confetti. And I just thought it. I didn't say anything about it. And then to read your mind. And then we got a package. Like, oh, I want ghost confetti. And I just thought it. I didn't say anything about it. Amanda read your mind. And then we got a package.

Like a month later, because yes. I think it was just like, we had taken a minute to go to the post office. Yeah. And Amanda sent me a bag of the confetti. That she had got in front of us right now. And I can tell you right now, I am literally looking at it. It sits on my desk.

So when I record, it's sitting right in front of me So thank you so much for doing that But it was honestly we were just talking about it this morning. We were like we need that most concerts again Yeah 2023 they got to come back to the United States like Harry's in chilly right now and ghost is just in Sweden Yeah, like we kicked it out there right now. I want to go to Sweden We're going to Sweden guys see you there. Just taking a quick trip overseas to see Tobias. To see Toby. But yeah. Oh, you guys are on a nickname basis now. But yeah, we just wanted

to just rant about this. Listen to ghost, listen to Harry Styles, watch movies, listen to scream, harass Caleb. Do all of that. That's our assignment for you. That's our PSA. Also, I hope that everybody is doing really well right now. Because I know this is kind of like we were saying, like everybody's angry and not do. And I know seasonal depression gets really tough right now for people. And the holidays can be stressful.

Yeah, money, expectations and, and just just a lot. Everybody in your life loves you. And you don't need to get them a swanky gift so that they know they love you. No way. They love you. We love you. And you know what?

Like everyone takes some time off during Christmas. You deserve it. Yeah, we're not going to. We're not going to. But you absolutely should. We will still be what you'll get content through Christmas break. Content, content, content. Because it's going to be your Christmas break, but definitely not ours. And that's fine. That's, it's fine. I want to provide some entertainment for you when you're sitting

there wrapping gifts. Yes. And one thing I actually saw just going back to like the seasonal depression of it all, um, is that like lighting helps warm lighting Oh, I have heard that yeah, so like yeah, it's a little holiday lights a little twinkle lights. It really does yeah, like Twinkle lights like I don't know if you guys have seen that tick tock where it's like we don't use the big light like number one rule in my house We don't use the big like that's all like mood lighting. Yeah, but there's twinkle lights up. So much mood lighting in my house. I love it. Cozy Cozy. into a cult over shot nine times or fell in love with a vampire or went into a minor surgery

and woke up one week later, paralyzed. What would you do? I'm Whit Missaldine, the creator of this is actually happening, a podcast from Wondry that brings you extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. From a young man that dooms his entire future with one choice, to a woman who survived a notorious serial killer, you'll hear their first person account of how they overcame remarkable circumstances.

Each episode is an exploration of the human spirit and personal discovery. These haunting accounts sound like Hollywood movies, but I assure you this is actually happening. Follow this is actually happening wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen ad-free on the Amazon Music or Wundery app. Alright, well it's been 10 minutes of us just yapping, so we do all this. I know for real. And then if it is like the old days, you have to interrupt me a crazy amount. Like I used to interrupt you in the worst spot, sever.

Like I'm going to say in December and then you interrupt me. Okay. Cool. So I'm actually going to be telling a story. It's, I kind of want to get serious for a second because this is a really terrible story. Oh good. And it is technically unsolved. So it's kind of, it's unsolved in a very strange way because we've really never had a case

like this before. But it starts in 1996 in December. In December of 1996, a heinous murder occurred just a few miles outside of a tiny village of Schull in Ireland. Just two days before Christmas, the body of 39-year-old French filmmaker, wife, daughter, and mother, Sophie Tuscone Duplenty-A, was found not far from her vacation home. Ooh, yes. What a beautiful name. I know Sophie Tuscany du Plenty. Oh, like so pretty. Yeah, that's beautiful. And she was Absolutely stunning. Now I'll go up. I was gonna say go for it. The cottage was supposed to be her safe haven It was supposed to be a little getaway from the hustle and bustle of her busy life in France and when Sophie was discovered

She was wearing presumably what she had planned to go to bed in. Her leg was wrapped up in barbed wire and she had been savagely beaten, mostly to her face and head. When police checked the property where she was found and took a look also around her cottage, they really didn't find much to go on. And there were certainly no signs of a break in, which was strange. The only thing that they really did find that they were like, okay, like clearly something's bad here other than her, was that there was a bit of blood smeared on the outside door knob to her home. Oh, this was a classic tale, though, of a tight-knit community that was absolutely shocked, terrified, and of course, deeply saddened by this crime. People who had never locked their doors or even closed their windows at night were now doing so,

knowing that there was a cold-budded killer on the loose. Yeah. And they hoped that police would find the perpetrator soon, but many, many ridiculous mistakes were made throughout this investigation. And though a certain suspect was arrested on multiple occasions, he would never serve time. And not everybody is fully convinced that he had anything to do with this.

Some people are totally convinced of this suspect's guilt and think that there's still a murderer on the loose. But other people sit there and question the validity of the entire investigation and the integrity of those involved in the investigation. Oh, boy. Lots of questions lingering. Also so she was stunning.

She was stunning. And she seemed like she was just like a really nice person. Oh, she just has one of those faces. She's like, I want to know you. Exactly. And she was a mother. Yeah. It's awful.

So let's hear a little bit more about Sophie. She was a Leo, so a leader. And she was born on July 28th, 1957 in Paris, France. Her parents were George Boneyall. I'm sorry if I said that wrong. I did look up the pronunciation and that was what I got. All right. And he was a dentist and then her mother was Marguerite Boneyoll, Boneyoll, excuse me, who worked as a civil servant it said. Sophie was the oldest of their three children and all of them were raised in the family apartment where Sophie's father also had a space of his own to do his dentistry.

Not too much is public about Sophie's childhood, but she was known to be really bright and curious throughout her entire life. And again throughout her entire life, she took a very strong interest in culture, specifically Irish culture, which like rock on, brother, yeah. Now, when she became a teenager, she actually got multiple opportunities to travel to Ireland, and there she learned to speak English. She took every single chance she got to go, and she developed such a deep love for Ireland. She loved diving deeper in the history of the country. She wanted to know everything she could about the architecture, just the culture overall.

And there's actually a word for people that love Ireland. It is a hibernophile. Oh, that's cool, because you hear about like, Frank a file. Yeah. Or like, Bibli a file or something like that, but that's funny. It's a hibernophile,

which really to me sounds like somebody who loves hybranation, which is me, which is me. But I'm a hybrana file because I also love Ireland. There you go. And well, it's not just that you love it, but you see what I'm saying. I see what she's saying. But that is exactly what Sophie was. Ireland was her happy place.

So it's really tragic that that is where she ended up being brutally murdered. So when she finished high school in France, she stayed in Paris for a while, and at first she thought that she would get a law degree, but the subject really proved just to be way too dry for her. She wanted creativity, artistry, she wanted to be inspired. Law was just not for her. So after two years of trying to make it work,

she decided to drop out of the program. But it wasn't a total loss, because Sophie actually met her first husband while she was at University, Pierre Jean-Baudi. The two of them married in 1980 when Sophie was 22 years old. And when they first got married, Sophie worked at the video store that Pierre's father owned and also worked part-time at a little book shop. Oh, that's cute.

Now, they obviously weren't rolling in it financially, but at first they were really happy and they were making it work. Yeah. Now, one year into the marriage, the couple found out that they were expecting a baby boy and they decided on naming him after his father. And when Little Pierre was born,

he was given the middle name Louis. And most of the time they referred to him by his middle name. So he was little Louis. I love that. I think Louis is such a cute name. I do too. I love that name. Yeah. So Sophie and Pierre were absolutely over the moon about their baby. But at the same time, they were struggling as a couple. They were happy to be parents, but finding difficulty in

kind of run, managing a family, their relationship. Yeah, their relationship. Being parents was brand new to them, obviously, and're relationship. In their relationship. Being parents was brand new to them obviously and quite stressful. Pair that with the financial stress that they had, and it was really just a recipe for disaster. So sadly, they ended up separating just a few months after their son was born, and they did eventually divorce.

Now, clearly, you know, being a mom in general is one of the biggest and toughest jobs that someone can take on. But then you take away a partner and half of your financial income, that's going to be a serious struggle. Oh, I can't imagine. So, needless to say, Sophie was having a hard time after her divorce now being a single mom. And on top of that, her family was not super pleased with where she was at. They were said to be a bit conservative and religious so not only were they upset that she dropped out of school But also about the divorce. They didn't really see eye to eye with Sophie during this time

She was a liberal young woman trying to find her footing in a very different world than they were kind of used to and so There was a bit of a rift in their relationship during this point in time. Okay, but luckily all three of the adults in the situation this point in time. Okay. But luckily all three of the adults in the situation realized that they could put aside their differences and maintain a relationship for the sake of their son and grandson. And they put the work in, but I'm sure it was like a little bit tension-filled for a bit. Now, fortunately for Sophie, she landed a job in the mid-80s, working as a promotions officer at Uni France, which is a huge organization that puts together promotions for French films at big festivals and events all across the world. Kind of sounds like, is it Sundance?

Yeah, kind of something like that. Perfect. So Sophie would soon meet her second husband, Danielle Tuscon Duplante, he was a well-known and very well-respected French filmmaker who also had a pretty high-sitting title at Uni France. He was chairman. So he's really well-known, actually, for his work on hit films, Frederico Fellini and Maurice Pialotte.

I hope I said those correctly. I love it. It sounds great to me. Yeah, I love French. I think French is like so pretty. Oh, I love French. Speak French to me. Seriously. But he was really, like I said, well-known well-known well respected and there was a bit of an age difference between the two of them. Daniel was

16 years Sophie senior and he had kind of a reputation for being a bit of a playboy his reputation preceded him a bit but Anyways, the two of them really hit it off like regardless. Okay, And they actually ended up getting married in 1990. Wow, what about... Yeah, so Sophie's mother Margarit officiated the wedding. Oh, which I think is so beautiful. Oh, I love that. Like the sweetest thing ever. Yeah. And this was it. Sophie had found her footing. She was happy, she was in love at this point. She was more than financially secure. And she was kind of a celebrity in the film world at this point. Kind of killing it.

She's really killing it. And like I said, she was kind of a celebrity in the film world, but she wasn't totally comfortable with that, because she's still like her privacy. Yeah, absolutely. Who doesn't? Yeah.

So from the outside, people were probably jealous of Sophie because she's marrying this big shot. She has this beautiful marriage, like, yeah, Laudida do. They would spend their days working on creative projects and their mansion together. At night, they would join each other at different events, mostly for like, high-eil society in Paris.

And Daniel really loved the city. And Sophie liked it, but it wasn't always for her. She'd been born a city girl. She grew up in the city, but she always felt like there was somewhere else out there for her, somewhere where she could just go and dive into her creativity and find the inspiration that she'd been looking for. And for her, I'm sure you'll be shocked to hear

that place became our last place. She'd always pictured like a cozy home in the Irish countryside, which I'm just like, oh, I know, warm. I can feel that right now. I'm like, oh, there. I want to go to there. And although Daniel couldn't relate to the desire,

he respected it. He was like, I feel that. Yeah. And he knew it was important to his wife. So he actually bought her a holiday home toward the end of 1992. Now the car I wrote 1922, so that's why there was a weird bus. 19, we went back into. Yeah. 1992. Now the ca- I wrote 1922 so that's why that was a weird past.

19, we went back into it. He also bought our time machine. It was great. It was awesome. Yeah. He bought our Deloria. Yeah. No, no, just just home. Just that. Just home. Yeah. Now the cottage overlooked Roaring Water Bay and it was in this tiny little settlement known as Tormore. Well, super, super tiny, we're talking essentially a cold sack. Bring me there. Yes, I want to go to there. So Sophie was able to visit her country home

multiple times a year. Sometimes she'd go by herself, other times she'd go with her son and Daniel, she'd bring her parents, like she could just do whatever she wanted there. And the locals called her a blow in, which could blow in. Kind of sounds a little rude when you first hear it, but it's actually an endearing term for people who have second homes in Ireland that they kind of use

to blow in and out, kind of thing. Yeah, exactly. Coming on the wind, leave on the wind. Yeah, that's how they thought it. Yeah. So in the morning of December 20th, Sophie was blowing in to her pocket, but this time she was by herself.

She wanted a little creative time away before she was coming home to celebrate Christmas with her family. So she arrived at the cork airport in the morning and then headed to the local gas station to pick up some necessities. She had run to the car to drive to her cottage. Okay. She spent some time by herself at the cottage preparing it for her short stay. And then later that afternoon, she spent time at the courtyard bar in Restaurant and Shell, kind of just shooting the breeze with some of the locals, and then she headed home. It was a normal day in the place that she loved. And Sophie's neighbors, there weren't that many of them, but they loved her too. They knew her as a gentle and friendly soul, but they agreed she was a very private person. They knew what she wanted them to know. Yeah, and I think that's a good

way to be. Yeah, I name is no literally nothing about it. Yeah, I love that. It takes a village, but to an extent. Yes, exactly. We say hello, we know maybe each other's names, and that's it. There you go. So, according to my neighbors, do a little bit more about each other, but I think it's like, I have a weird neighborhood.

You have, like, yeah, you do. And I think it's different when you have kids. Yeah, because you kind of like half to me or you're doing this a little more. Yeah, because you're like, yeah, you do. And I think it's different when you have kids. Yeah, because you kind of like half to me or the kids a little more. Because you're like, I'm playing. Yeah, we just like, we all are like, and everybody's very much like neighborhood-witch. Chat each other, like everyone knows the first cars

are coming into everyone's driveway. Yes, the first couple of times that I like pulled into the neighborhood, I remember, literally people peering out their windows. And I was like, hello. Yeah, like we're an army in the neighborhood. I remember literally peeping out their windows and I was like, hello. Yeah, like we're an army in this neighborhood. I was like, we will get you. Now they probably think I live here.

They probably do. Because I do. Because you essentially do. I'm a dual resident. There you go. So according to the Irish time, Sophie definitely was somebody who tried to participate and engage with people in her home away from home.

But again, private. Yeah. So December 20th and 21st, kind of were like, it sounded like they were quiet in typical days for Sophie, but the 22nd had shaken her up a bit. She traveled to a place known as three castle head. It's actually something we should do in episode on because it's haunted as fuck. Oh, there's like castle ruins there. And all these different stories.

It's this area of open grassland. And it contains the ruins of Dunlow Castle. Ah, amazing. Now, allegedly, like I was just saying, the ruins are haunted. And there are a few bad omens that one could stumble across. So people thought maybe Sophie had stumbled upon one of these things. One of these omens, particularly the woman in white. And if you come across the woman in white, it's basically said that like you're going to die. Oh, yeah.

Okay. It's really kind of creepy that that one of us. It's up there. Now, yeah. So maybe Sophie encountered that or one of the other omens that kind of left her kind of like shaken up or maybe it was something else, but it was said something that day had freaked her out. So after her walk through the ruin, she did meet her friends for tea and made plans to see them the next day before she was due to head back to Paris.

So when tea was finished, she went home for the evening. She spoke with her husband that night around 10 or 11 p.m. Daniel said that their conversation was very convivial. Did I say that right or is it convivial? I don't know actually. That's a word. I'm not familiar with. Yeah, I think was very convivial. Did I say that right? Or is it convivial? I don't know, actually. It just means it's not familiar with. I think it's convivial. Yeah, that sounds good. I like it.

Oh, new word. I know. I love the good word. It's got a good mouth feel. It does. So yeah, their conversation was awesome. And he said that nothing seemed to be worrying her at all at that point. And she was her upbeat usual self.

They had been said to have been having some trouble in their marriage in recent months, but there were no harsh words between them during that conversation, thankfully. Okay. That would be the last time Daniel would speak to his wife. And she was coming home the next day. The next day. And I'm at least happy that they had a nice conversation, I think, especially if they were kind of having struggles.

Those kind of things, you're just like, wow, you guys didn't know. They didn't know. They didn't know. Like, you didn't know. Just talking about casual things and you have no idea that that's the last time you're going to talk to them. That's something about this job that has changed me. Yeah.

Completely changed. Absolutely. Absolutely. When I do not go to bed, and it's happened once in our entire relationship, we, like I always say I love you to people. I say I love you to you when I leave. Like you just, because you just never know what's gonna happen.

And I never want any juckiness lingering in the air. God forbid something. Yeah, you don't want regrets. No. So the next morning, right around 10 a.m., a woman named Shirley Foster was heading into town to get rid of her garbage from that week. I love how fucking quaint this is. It's adorable. I would be so pissed if I had to drive my garbage somewhere though. Yeah, that would suck. Yeah, but she did. And she also wanted

to get some last minute holiday shopping finished. Surely was one of Sophie's neighbors, and though she hadn't seen Sophie on her drive, she noticed that Sophie's backdoor light had been on all evening the night before, so she knew she was still home. So as she reached the end of their street, she saw what she thought was a large and broken doll lying in the grass near the side of the road. At first, she didn't think much of it because she was like, oh, it's trash day. Maybe that fell out or, you know. But then when she was driving back, she got a closer look and realized that this was no

doll. This was a body. So she starts, she's not far from her house at this point. She starts screaming, laying on her horn to try to get her husband's attention and actually ends up running back to their home to retrieve him. He immediately called the Irish police known as the Garda, which translates into the Guardians of the Peace. Oh, I love that. I'm not going to try to say their full name because it will be so heinous. But you know that that's what it translates to. No, that is so tough. I'm just going to shorten it to garter.

There you go. So after he hung up with them, he remembered that Sophie was in town and ran to her home to tell her what was going on. When he got there, he saw that her rental car was in the driveway. But nobody was answering his knocks at the door. And before leaving, he looked down at the knob

and noticed the blood smears that I had spoken about in the beginning of this. So the police arrived and they found the body of a woman who was still in her nightclothes. She was laying on her back in the grass slightly tilted to the right and she clearly had suffered a great deal. The area was immediately secured and cordoned off and a report began. Sergeant Gerard Prandaville reported that the body was, quote, scratched and cut, and her hair was covered with blood as was her face. However, there was an area under her nose that, quote, appeared wet as distinct from dried blood. So it hadn't been very long

it seems. Oh, wow. Her top had been pushed up and her pants pulled down slightly, seemingly from an intense struggle, not from like any kind of assault. They weren't positive about that. Her leggings had been caught and barbed wire, which was still wrapped around one of her legs, which she had been running and got caught and dragged it along with her. And this is going to get really intense. I just want to let you guys know.

They would soon learn that she had been struck to the back of the back of the, excuse me, to the side of the head more than 11 times. Oh my God. Rushing her skull. Then her killer used a concrete block from nearby and dropped it onto her head. Oh my God. The final blow was likely the cause of death. Her right ear had also been lacerated. Oh, yeah, it was very, very intense. But her head was not the only part of her body that sustained, or sustained brutal trauma. Multiple fingers were broken. Oh, and there were scratches all over her hands and arms. Some of those were from the barbed wire, but others were clearly defensive wounds. She fought hard for her life. But there were there were bootmarks imprinted on her forearm, neck and face. Oh my God. So this was

absolutely brutal. There were no signs of a sexual assault and also no drag marks nearby, which led the police to believe that she had been killed where they found her. Wow. So Shirley Foster and her husband Alfie knew that this was Sophie and they told the police that they hadn't seen her since she had arrived a couple days before. They explained though that they did see that light in the back of her house on all night,

but they said they hadn't heard any kind of commotion the night before or on any nights since she'd been here. Yeah, and it's like if she was killed out there, you would see something very loud. You would think, right? Yeah. Sophie's home was searched,

and the only sign of a struggle that police found was that small amount of blood on the doorknob, on the front door, which then led out to a lane to where her body had been found. But it sounds like it wasn't like a huge amount of blood. Yeah. And then they did see two chairs in front of the radiator and two wine glasses on the mantle of the fireplace

One of which still had a little bit of wine in it now Immediately you say okay, so she had somebody over. Yes Maybe she did but some of her friends also said that that was how she liked to read she sat in one chair and put her feet on the other Okay, but then we have the two wine glasses. There was another person. That's what I think. There's no doubt in my mind. That's exactly what I think.

So there was also a book of poetry next to the glasses. A look inside Sophie's rental car showed that the passenger seat was pushed back as far as it could go, which led them to believe that she'd recently been in the car with a very tall human. In the hour that Sophie's body was found, a local doctor, Lario Conner, arrived and pronounced Sophie dead on the scene, obviously. And shortly after that, father Dennis Cashman read Sophie, her last rites. Both men left very quickly after they finished their jobs. And for some reason, this is going to blow your fucking mind. and it is the most insane and ridiculous thing

I've ever heard in my life. Sophie's body was left where it had been discovered for the next 24 hours. What? I'll say that one more time for the people in the back. Sophie's body was left where it had been discovered for the next 24 hours. What? Because the police had to wait for the next 24 hours. What?

Because the police had to wait for the state pathologist, Dr. John Harbison, to arrive from Dublin. But like, I feel like maybe you could have brought her to a more secure location where there was no exposure to the elements. Well, that's the thing. I'm like, did they cover her with anything that they tinted off?

Did they have somebody patrol like gone guard all night? Doesn't sound like it. What the fuck? She's left there for 24 hours exposed to the elements and they lost crucial evidence. Like I understand that you need a pathologist, a medical examiner, a coroner to show up at the scene and that's when you can move the body. But like you gotta do something here. Well, it's like do we have anyone else we can call? That's a thing. It's like the mean time.

No one else in the area. Exactly. Like, you guys got to fix that. Mm-hmm. So 24 hours later, the doctor arrived and did his examination on the body. His first note was that there was a slight depression in the ground beneath Sophie's body,

indicating that the blows had been struck when she was lying on her back in the grass. OK. The cause of death was listed as laceration of the brain, fracture of the skull, and multiple head injuries. My God. But the time of death was not something that the doctor could provide. No, because Sophie's body had been left outside for 24 hours in the rain. Okay. Yeah. Okay. The best he could do was say that Sophie was killed sometime between Sunday night and into Monday morning. Helpful.

Wow. Wow. Yeah. That's wild. Yeah. After the exam was complete, the investigators started working on a theory as to what happened. Tormore, like I said, was a very, very tiny settlement, barely even a town, really just three houses in a cul-de-sac at the end of a very small lane.

It was highly unlikely that an stranger would go unnoticed, basically, because of what we were just talking about. Yeah, I was going to say, it's basically the same kind of neighborhood. And unknown car people are going to be like, who the hell's the hell you? They're like, what's going on? Exactly. And it was also unlikely that a stranger just stumbled upon Sophie's house. And again, no sign of a break in, so that just makes sense.

Investigators were confident that Sophie knew the killer. They also believed that this had to have been a large and powerful man who had carried out this heinous crime because the strength it would take to wield the 55-pound cement block that had been the final blow was pretty up. Yeah. And then those two wine glasses, the two wine glasses, feels like there was someone else. Exactly. And in addition to that, there was a heavy iron gate at the entrance to the road that was usually closed. But on the morning, so if he was found, the gate was wide open.

Police again believed it would have taken a lot of might to open that gate completely. Okay. Now, there's nothing stolen from the home. No evidence again of a sexual assault. Police again believed it would have taken a lot of might to open that gate completely. Okay. Now, there was nothing stolen from the home. No evidence again of a sexual assault. So they believed that this was somebody Sophie knew who would become angry with her for some reason or another.

Okay. Perhaps she even invited this person in, like you were saying for a glass of wine, and then things went awry, and this man turned on her, became so violent that she ran out of her home and was chased to where she'd been found. Yeah, that seems pretty likely. That's what I think happened. Yeah. So once the news started spreading across West Cork, excuse me,

the investigators thought it would be smart to hold a press conference to get in front of the story. The superintendent from the band and guarda station, Bernie Kelleyer, Kelleyer, explained to the press that this case was absolutely being treated as a homicide, but did say that the police were puzzled. I was gonna say, what else would you treat that as? I have no idea. Like what?

But they were like, don't worry, we're treating it. I was such a... Thank you. Thank you for informing us of that. But they're puzzled. They said there's a lack of evidence, robbery was clearly not a motive. And the neighbors had heard nothing. Yeah, that, I mean, that is puzzling. All of it is. And the fact that there's only blood

on the door knob. Right. And it's outside of the door knob, right? The outside of the door. Yeah. Weird. It's strange. So one odd thing of note also that had been shared was that the light in the back that Shirley had seen on all night was turned off sometime in between when she went to sleep and when she found Sophie's body. Because when she woke up the next morning, the light was off. But she had gone, I'm assuming she'd gone to bed late. Yeah. Saw that it was on pretty much all night. Now, none of Sophie's neighbors knew of anybody who would want it to kill her, but they said we don't know that much about her personal life. But we know

of her when she comes in. I don't know how anybody would want her. Yeah, like she's great. Yeah. But like you only know people, especially your neighbors, so well. Mm-hmm. And especially if they are not there full time. Exactly. So the only thing Shirley Foster could recall was that she'd met a man named Bruno once.

He was Sophie's friend and a painter, who they'd shared dinner with at Sophie's home a couple of times. And all Shirley and her husband could remember was that, yep, he was a painter and he was a fairish man, not very tall. So immediately people are like, I don't know about that. Yeah. And they also remembered he was around Sophie's age. What do I mean? Like the tall thing? I'm like, yeah, it makes sense. But like, he could also just like to have his seat back.

Yeah, or he could have had to be that been carrying something. Yeah. And like needed to put it in the front, you know, it doesn't necessarily. Yeah. You know, it really does. Like rule people out. Mm-hmm. The only thing that he would have to be is strong.

That's true. That's true. Five pound block. Exactly. So Sophie's housekeeper, Josephine Helen, was questioned. And she also didn't know that much about Sophie's personal life. She simply told investigators that she got a call from Sophie a couple days before her visit.

Sophie was just calling to say she was gonna be in Ireland, can you kind of get the house ready for me? I'll be spending some time in my cottage for a couple days before Christmas. Yeah. And Helen said she repeated this information to a man who had done some work at Sophie's house and a good amount of her own neighbors.

Okay, so really not super helpful. Yeah, it's like, she's like, I told some people, I told the handful of people. The police were trying, but they had released up themselves back to say the least on day one of the investigation. You can't just leave a body in the harsh winter weather for 24 hours and expect to have a lot to go off of. If anything. And you also can't expect to find much evidence on a murder weapon that was also left to the elements because they didn't find that concrete block and the other stone that had killed Sophie for a week. Are you kidding me? No. And at that point, key evidence have been

compromised and it rains multiple times. Of course. But nonetheless, they were trying now to make up for some serious fucking missteps. So they were working on a timeline that tracked Sophie's movements from the time her plane landed in quark until her murder. And another team was canvassing the area around where she lived. They were literally doing house-to-house searches at this point, and at some point would stumble across the home of Ian Bailey, a journalist that shared his home with his partner Jewels. I'm not going to say her last name just because some really crappy things happen and I just don't think there's a need to say her last name. Yeah. Their home was just two miles across the fields from Sophie's own home.

Okay. Ian Bailey had actually been one of the earliest journalists to start investigating Sophie's murder. Sophie was one of 55 people murdered in Ireland in 1996, so the press took to the story instantly because this didn't happen. Like before Sophie's body had even been moved, they wanted to know what was going on. Yeah. Now, Father Cashman, the priest who had read Sophie her last rights, remembered that he began getting calls almost instantly after he'd done so, asking him for a comment on the murder or if he could give them directions to the scene.

Jesus. Reporters were going nuts. I also just like as a quick side note, I had no idea that you could read last rights after someone died. Neither did I. I don't think it's something that like a common thing. Yeah, I don't think it's common, but I think you can. In these a common thing. Yeah, I don't think it's common But I think you can in these kind of circumstances. Yeah, that's kind of like a loophole I just didn't know that I did that's interesting. Hey, it's funny. Did you just Google that? Yeah, I was Google

I was like I had no idea that was a thing what I was doing I googled it too because I thought you had to do it before yeah, but I think it's like she really would have had no way of St. Wayne Yeah, it's generating she really would have had no way of staying. Yeah, it's like yeah, it's generating circumstances. Exactly. Interesting. So Ian, Ian was a journalist from Britain who had come to Ireland in the years previous.

He just like Sophie had found inspiration and fell in love with the village of Shell. It was this small place where he was just inspired. Yeah. And Britain, he had spent almost 15 years as a journalist. But when he moved to Shell, he actually focused more on poetry. And really only worked as a journalist. It was said when he needed money for cigarettes and beer.

But he may have needed money for other things. I don't know. People in town knew him from the pubs and they said that he was known to drink too much. They said he became disruptive and often times he was asked to leave the bar or escorted out. And he did show up leave the bar or escort it out. And he did show up to the crime scene right after the police had been called. Okay. When they asked what he was doing there, they were like, hello, like you can't be here.

He told them that he'd actually been tipped off by a reliable contact and decided to come along to the scene to report on journalistic. Yes. Other journalists hadn't even heard of the murder yet and Bailey was already sending well-informed reports to Irish newspapers. It seemed a little bit hairy at first. Yeah, it kind of seemed like he was always at least one step ahead of other journalists. Okay, so the investigators on the scene found him strange and suspicious. He arrived very early in the day. It wasn't like he was just passing by and saw the commotion. He arrived very early in the day. It wasn't like he was just passing by and saw the commotion and who was this reliable contact of his that already knew something was going on. It was just kind of fishy and it didn't leave anyone with a good feeling. Yeah. So they recognized him while they were doing their house to house visits and his partner Jules had first answered the door.

When she invited them in, they saw Ian as well. So they got to work asking them questions about where they'd been the previous night. And as the couple explained, they'd really just enjoyed a night at home together. They went to bed with each other, as they were saying all this, investigators took note of a myriad of scratches on Ian's face, arms and hands.

Oh. All they could think of were the defensive wounds that Sophie suffered, and that there were actually skin cells found underneath her fingers, which is lucky. They hadn't lost everything in those elements. She'd clearly fought her attacker. So after Jules and Anne, excuse me, and Ian gave their alibi, the investigators asked about the scratches. And Ian told them that he had gotten them while he was cutting down a tree and the rest of them

from a turkey that he had slaughtered recently. Jewels confirmed this. She said Ian had not left the house at any point on the night that Sophie had been killed. And she also backed up his story about being tipped off on the murder. And though the police weren't so sure, they thanked the couple and moved on with their search to the next house. They left without taking any photographs of the cuts and scratches on Ian's body. Why?

So it was said that he had those, but we don't know that for sure. We don't have photos. We don't have photos. That's fucked up. Not good. Yeah. I'm going to say it right now. I'm not going to share too much of my opinion on this because we don't really know what

happened to him. Yeah, it's kind of up in there. There are inklings. People think they know what happened, but we're not totally sure. This is one of those you just hear the facts, everyone aside for yourself. Exactly. I don't want to influence anyone into making a decision. Yeah, I'm just going to tell you what I know. Yeah. So New Year's came and went and though they were being scrutinized by the media, that's the other thing. The police in this case were being scrutinized by the media. And you know how that goes. You Just heard in the Yorkshire River case. They weren't

much closer to finding a suspect, though they were being scrutinized. But then a gas station employee, Sean Murray, reported to the police just days after Sophie's murder, actually, that he'd seen her at the Texaco gas station on the afternoon of December 23rd, the same night she was killed. And she was in the company of a man who had been sitting in the passenger seat. The police barely followed up on this tip and just disregarded it. Are you kidding? And then think it was important. A man in the passenger seat, like that's literally, yeah, that's what you're looking for. What the fuck? They just regarded that tip. Cool. They would get their next tip on January 11th,

after a show on crime line TV, aired a segment of Sophie's murder, asking that the public come forward with any tips they might have. So that night after the show, a woman who identified herself only as Fiona, called the station and said that on the night of December 23rd, she had seen a man in a black coat standing next

to the Kyl Fada bridge between 2.30 and 3 a.m. To her, it seemed like he was trying to hide his face in his hands. But before the police could take down any more information or any information about this woman, other than her name, she hung up. Huh. And when they traced the call,

they determined that it had been made from a public phone in shul. So there wasn't a lot they could do. Okay. So the next week, the Chief Superintendent Noel Smith of Westcork Guarda Division came on crime line a second time and asked Fiona to please contact detectives at the band in Garta station to give them some more information on the man she'd seen. So Fiona blushed. She called again. That's a public phone. I know. But she didn't really give any more information

than she had the first time. And again, hung up quickly before they could ask her any questions. Fiona, you know, it's not really helping. I love your name, but like come on. That's not even her name. Then a few days later, she made a third call to the station telling detectives that she would not come down to the station for questioning. Fortunately for the police though, this call was made from her landline and they were able to trace the call to a home in shull owned by a woman named Marie and her husband Chris. Marie, come on. Marie, girl. So the couple were known to run a small clothing boutique together in shull and an ice cream shop in west court. That's adorable. It's really fun

Thank you. That is fucking precious. It is so quaint. It is. I love it. Quaint is just like all I fucking desire Quaint and haunted That's all I want. No, I'm good with haunted, but like I just want I want some haunted in there, but like Ireland could provide I was gonna say yeah, and you can like kind of pick yeah for sure. Yeah, like choose your adventure. Yeah. But anyways, when they found out her real identity and you'll realize why she didn't want to give in too much more information, Marie explained that on December 21st, she had seen Sophie in the clothing shop that she owned and that those Sophie seemed to be alone. There was a quote unquote, weird looking man also in the shop lingering close behind her like weird looking man. That's like, what exactly does that mean? And also, like, can you, like, what was weird about it? Can you describe this weird looking man?

I think basically she was insinuating that he was creepy because he's so cute. That's why I was so. Yeah. And I don't think he would have been a weird looking man. Had he not been following so happy. Yeah. So the man she said was wearing a long black coat

and a beret. So fashionable. And she actually saw him again the next day hitchhiking. He tried to flag her down for a ride she said, but she didn't stop. And the next time she saw him was on that bridge, around 2.30 a.m. on the night that Sophie was killed. That is strange. Yes. And then she called the police a second time because she'd actually seen the man in the grocery store

and found out what his name was. What in Bailey? Oh, so after her, after she's actually like identified as Marie, they're like, okay, thanks for telling us everything. We're going to be following up, but she called them first. It was like, wait a second. I got a name for you. Wow, Marie. She told them that she called under the fake name previously because she didn't want to involve her husband in this case. The reason being was that when she had seen Ian Bailey on the bridge at 2.30 in the morning, she was out with an old boyfriend.

Oh, yes. But she said that both of them had seen Ian Bailey quote stumbling around in the dark. And what was most intriguing to the police was that the bridge was kind of a halfway mark between Sophie's home and Ian's home. So when they pulled out a map and connected the houses with the bridge, it did form a triangle. Okay. Weird. So even though they didn't have much in the beginning of 1997, what investigators did have all pointed to this Ian Bailey guy.

Yeah. Not only had he showed up at the crime scene, eerily premature in their opinion, he had scratches all over the him according to them and he'd also been spotted by Marie. And he was six foot four and had a heavy build. Oh, so he's exactly who they're looking to. Yeah, he definitely had the strength that it would take to lift and throw down that concrete block to murder Sophie. And then on February 4th, 1997, a boy named Malachi Reed reported to the police that he got in a ride home from Ian Bailey a few days earlier, and Ian had told him that he was the one who would kill Sophie. Oh, yep, he's just telling people.

Malachi allegedly. Malachi said very gruesomely that Ian had told him he, quote, went up there with a rock and bashed her fucking brains out. Ooh, dark. That is very dark. And this was the second time that the police had heard of a confession from Ian Bailey, because a woman named Helen Callanan had informed them that Ian Bailey had told her, he'd killed Sophie, to advance his journalism career. Yik. The comment came after she actually asked him to cover the story

for Dublin Sunday Tribune, but later found out that he'd become a suspect in the case, so she kept pressing him and pressing him, and she said that was the answer she got. My goodness. Now, on February 10th, Ian Bailey was arrested at his home and brought into the band and guard a station to be questioned. His partner, Jules, was also arrested about an hour later in shul and they were brought to the same station for questioning.

And there's no physical evidence yet connecting him. No physical evidence connecting him. But it's there is physical evidence. We don't have it yet, but like right now it's like yeah, it looks pretty good. Yeah, definitely Definitely can understand. Mm-hmm. You can totally understand why he was there why they kind of like pointed it on him at first place It gets a little shaky later gets a little hairy gets a little shaky. I'm not saying either way what I think but it does get shaky Yeah, so the couple spent the next 12 hours being questions separately. And most of the questions were focused on where Ian had really been on the night of Sophie's murder.

And also his history of quote unquote strange behavior in town. Ian explained to the two the detectives that he was simply eccentric. He was like, I'm kind of a weird guy. And I'm into shit that people aren't in too. So I think they think I'm weird. Which, that's a tough. It is tough.

This is a tough little area to live in. And I mean, where you're weird and then something like this happens and it's like, well, you can't like convict me because I'm weird. I can't even be because I'm weird and I drink a lot and I'm tall. That's not fair.

But it's a reason to talk to someone. And they have to. They're getting tips from these people that are saying, you can fast. They're saying you can fast allegedly. So it's like, you can't ignore that. You have to bring them in totally. So they then asked about his conversation with Helen. And he insisted to insisted to the police that he was simply joking. Said he was kidding. Okay, that it's not funny. What the f- and also like who jokes about that dude? You should not be joking. Yeah, that's weird. And he said, again, that he'd been joking

when he made that similar claim to Malachi. I know. It's not. It's not good. Yeah. So it's not a joke, my guy. No, never. No.

Fun fact, you should not ever joke about murder. If you are jokingly confessing to a crime, you deserve to be convicted of that crime. Because what are you doing? Like, why would you joke? Confess to a crime? No. Like, what are you doing? If you didn't do it and you're jokingly confessing, you're just fucking up the investigation. That's the thing. It's like, if you didn't do it and you're just joking about it, that's fucked up on a whole different level. It is. And you have derailed the investigation. And it's like the Yorkshire River. Exactly. We just literally pointed our hands at each other. That was great. We're really dope. So dope. The guy who called the hoax letters wrote the letters. Yeah.

derailed the investigation and caused some lives to be lost. Like, or at least cause them to them to not be able to catch him and time to save those lives. Exactly. So it's like, this kind of shit is not funny. It's not a joke. And you're gonna get yourself fucked. Because if you're confessing the shit you didn't do,

too bad, man, like, no one gives a shit if he joked about it. That's all they have is your confession. And the thing is, if Ian Bailey didn't do this because, again, I don't know. Yeah. He did, he absolutely did, do you really investigation if that's what happened? And the thing is, if Ian Bailey didn't do this because again, I don't know. Yeah. He did, he absolutely did, do you really investigation if that's what happened?

Which is not cool. Which sucks. So when they asked about Marie's claims, he told the police that yes, he had been in shawl on those few days that she'd seen him. And yes, he actually had been wearing a long black coat, but that he certainly was not the man she'd seen on the bridge because he was a sleep in bed. He was sticking to that same story. But what he didn't realize was that jewels, again, had also been arrested, and that she

was in a room of jeecent to the one he was in, telling the detectives that part of what she had originally told them about him being home all night wasn't exactly true. Oh, no. She said that he actually had gotten out of bed on the night of the murder and woken her up slightly. He didn't realize that she'd woken up and she didn't see him again. She said until the next morning he had come in with those scratches and she said they had not been there the night before. Oh, no. And that she actually knew nothing of a tree or a turkey being

the sources of the scratches. It's not good. That's not good. So the police were like, OK, jewels, thanks for that. And they walked back into the room with Ian. And they were like, hey, you want to hear what Jules has to say about this? Yeah. And then Ian started to backtrack a bit. He said that they had actually gone out that night

and that they got back around 2 in the morning. And he had actually been on the bridge that night, but that he was looking at the moon. And when he did look at the moon, he did get a premonition that something bad was going to happen. Okay. So he also did get up in the night. He said that was true. But he said only to go downstairs to write in the kitchen, and also that he went for a walk to his studio, which was not far from their home. Okay. The story was suspicious to say the least. Yeah. It's really never a good alibi

that you were looking at the moon because nobody's there to confirm that except for you and the moon. Yeah, like that's nice and calming. Yeah, but nobody getting the moon can't help you. Yeah, no. And weird that the moon would give you a dark combination about a woman

who you claim to have never met. Yeah. It's just strange. But I don't know. So they were like, yeah, this story is a bit suspicious. And throughout the entire interview, the police felt like he was being cagey and evasive and his responses to their questions. And then the second story also gave him a convenient explanation for what they'd thrown at him, but at the same time, he hadn't confessed to them.

And again, they still had no direct evidence to tie him to this crime. So with that, he was free to go. All right. The report from that night was at least filed with the director of public prosecutions and the chief superintendent. No, no, sorry. It was filed with the director of public prosecutions. And then the chief superintendent told the press that this was a

sign of progress in the case. Okay. Which like maybe it was like you didn't really get a whole lot. So I don't know if I would say that quite yet. But like, but sure, it's not my job. So I don't know your descriptions. I don't know your life. Yeah, I don't know your life. Now back in Paris, Sophie's husband, and now Widowire, Daniel, was getting increasingly frustrated with the lack of information that he was receiving from the Irish police.

Of course. Regarding his wife's murder investigation, he'd actually only learned that Sophie had been murdered from the French news. Oh, that's... He wasn't contacted. Are you kidding me? He found out via a news source that his wife had been murdered.

That's fucked up. Ridiculous. Every interaction since then that he'd had with the guarda, he said with sparse and did nothing to ease his fears that this case was getting colder and colder with each passing day. And he did learn in February that there was a potential suspect, but nothing more than that. So he took it upon himself to file criminal proceedings

in France against the unknown killer, because at this point he doesn't even have name, which he hoped would only encourage more communication between the French police and the Garda in Ireland. Yeah. It's an unusual step to take, filing a criminal complaint against an unknown person in another

country, but it was the step necessary to ensure that the French authorities would now actually be mandated to communicate with the Guarda. And share details about the investigation. It's also kind of important to point out that not everybody can do this. This kind of happened, I think, because he's a prominent man. I was going to say this makes sense. Exactly. I do just want to point that out, but not all of us.

Not everybody would get the same treatment. Right. But I'm happy that he was able to do that. Of course. So Daniel really only hoped that this would get him some kind of information about Sophie's murder, but ultimately there wasn't much to share. And Bailey was mentioned as a viable suspect, in a lengthy report that was filed with that director of public Prosecutions office in September of 1997, but still no charges had been brought against him.

So Daniel was feeling more and more frustrated because now a year had passed and Sophie had been murdered and nobody was in prison. Yes. He and his lawyers explained their frustrations to the French press in December of 1997, and in a response, Ireland's minister for justice, John O'Donohue, refuted claims that they were ignoring the family's requests intentionally, and explained that the French authorities were seeking information that was incredibly sensitive to Ireland's own investigation. And he was adamant that it was not the time to be judging the Guarda's investigation and essentially said that if they were to share information,

it would compromise their investigation. I mean, this is a mess. Yeah, and I understand. To a degree. That's a thing. There's so much we don't know about how investigations work. And especially within different as the public. As the public. That's a thing. And especially within different countries. As the public.

That's a thing. And in different countries, it's even more different than what it is here. And I know here, like what's going on with the Idaho murder case, like, people are going to frustrated with that. Wrong information is coming out because people are running with wrong information.

Like, there's a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of it has to do with the media. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that.

And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that.

And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And a lot of that. And it is frustrating. It is. It's totally frustrating. And none of us can really understand it unless we are in that

situation, which of some of you listening are like you probably know there are reasons. But you can see both sides of it. You can see I can totally see why the Irish police were like, God damn it. Like we can't share too much. Yeah. And I could see why France was like, this is one of our people. Like you have to let us know what's going on. And I can a thousand per cent see where Daniel was coming from. Yeah. What the fuck happened to my wife? Oh, it's, it's a mess. You can see

every single part of it. And I would hate to be involved in this on any level on any level. Yeah. I was going to say, I wouldn't sit in anybody's shoes here. No. And it's honestly, especially not Daniel. Oh my God. no. My heart seriously goes out to him. Yeah, that really brings my family. Yeah. So the detention, excuse me, the tension between Sophie's family and the guard up became a critical aspect to this story

with many, many public disagreements between everybody involved. Unfortunately, like I was just saying, the media got involved and kinda went crazy. They had a field day with reports on that. And it was really just hurting the investigation. Yeah, because that's spending time responding to claims and fighting with France and trying to refute things.

Exactly, yeah, correct things. Mm-hmm. And all at the same time, Ann Bailey was still being investigated quietly while all this fighting was going on. And now people connected to him were being interviewed. More and more people were coming forward with their own version of confessions

that Ian had made to them. Some people said he was drunk and confessed. Others said they'd just gone on a ride with him and he confessed. According to them, he was confessing left and right. Jesus. But it's tough because there's only two people there. Yeah.

You know? But if you're confessing all over the place, it's like Jesus, dude. Yeah. And like, tell me, it's like, you're looking pretty guilty here. Totally. So because of those further confessions, Ian was arrested again on January 27th. But again, due to a lack of evidence, he was released hours later. That's inferior.

This is a theme. He's gonna get arrested. He's gonna let go. He's gonna get arrested. He's gonna let go. And it's like, if you're joking, shut the fuck up. Yeah, you gotta stop. Stop.

Like, you're lying about these confessions and like, they didn't happen. Like, these other people, what are you doing? What are you doing? What are you doing? Goddamn. What's he? But Anne was persistent

in saying he'd actually never even met Sophie and most definitely didn't kill her. But as they were interviewing people connected to the two, it was becoming clear that they were very aware of each other's existence. People had claimed to see them together, whether it was at an event or in a store. In a 1999 interview with French filmmaker Guy Gerard, or Gerard, I'm sorry, the director actually told the guard that he'd had a conversation with Sophie, the December that she was killed that month, and she mentioned Ian Bailey by name and referred to him as a friend. Huh. Yes, that's interesting.

And she said that he was exploring themes of violence and his writing, which was true. So why was he so adamant that he didn't know her? Yeah, why would you lie about not knowing her? I don't know. Because that doesn't make you guilty that you knew her. No, of course. So why would you lie about it? It's weird.

So in 1998, new DNA tests were conducted, but they didn't produce any new clues. And by 2000, not much other movement had been made in this case. God, this is a very unique. But in September of that year, jewels and her daughter were arrested and her cork apartment, but neither interview gave the police anything new to work with, and they were let go. But that was not the last time that police would be connected with jewels or Ian. This is a trigger warning for domestic violence. If you don't want to hear this, I would skip forward a few times.

So, in August of 2001 Ian Bailey was arrested, not for murder. This time he was actually arrested for brutally assaulting his partner Jules. Oh, that's awful. He claimed that he had only pushed her while they were arguing in the car. But the report and jewels as injury showed that this was an incredibly violent attack. And also don't push your partner. No, even not touch the aggressive way. Yeah. It was violent. They had been out at a party and on the way home, they had gotten into some kind of argument with each other. And as things escalated, he engrossed by the hair and hit her in the face, according to the police report.

And again, according to the police report, quote, her eye was swollen to the size of a great fruit. And she was missing clumps of hair from her head. Oh my God. Her lip had been ripped away from her gums. She had bite marks on her arms and hands. Oh my God. It was brutal.

And in a later case, Anna agreed that it had been worse than he'd initially said, but that it really wasn't that severe and he was not usually a violent man. I don't give a fuck to which I say, sir, get real and get help and take several seats because there were actually five total reports of domestic violence, two jewels, Onions behalf.

Yeah, you don't just suddenly do something like that. So I'm so violent person. You are violent. If there are, yeah, clumps of hair missing from your partner's head and her eyes will into the size of a grapefruit. Fruit lip is ripped away from her gum. And there are bite marks on her body. Bite marks.

You are violent. You are violent on a new different level. Need help. Yeah. Like fucked. Maybe you're not a murderer. But you are violent. But you are violent.

Yeah, that is for sure. So in the years that followed, Ian would volunteer for interviews and he kind of seemed to be welcoming media attention. He would pose for pictures at Sophie's murder site and one he actually pretended to be looking into the window of her cottage. But his arrest for his attack on jewels really started to raise questions regarding his capacity

for violence, especially against women. Yeah. Many stories started writing about this. And Ian realized that being in the public eye and doing these different interviews probably wasn't making him look sober. No. So in December of 2003,

he filed a libel suit against seven different newspapers that he claimed were slandering him by linking him to Sophie's death. The suit said that he had been harassed by journalists since he was first arrested in 1997, and his lawyer said that he was the subject of a trial by media, regardless of his guilt in mistreating his partner. He did win two of those cases, and the judge on the case, Judge Patrick Moran, said that if sympathy seemed to be lacking, it was because, quote,

Bayley is a man who likes a certain amount of notoriety that he perhaps, that he likes perhaps to be in the limelight, that he likes a bit of self publicity. Okay. So you won two out of those seven. Ian Baile not only felt like he'd been lambasted by the media, but also by some of the witnesses in the case. And this is where things do fall apart a little bit. Okay. In 2003, Marie from the ice cream store

and the clothing store, she gave an interview to the Irish Times, claiming that she was being terrorized by Ian and had been for years since her initial report to the police. She said that he, quote, made her life a living nightmare. She actually said that he was the reason she had to close her ice cream shop.

Oh wow. He wanted her to retract her original statement to the police and said that when she refused to do so, she said he got threatening and aggressive with her. Now, a month after these claims, Ian's lawyer, Frank Butamari, I believe, sent a letter to Marie informing her that if she did not retract her claims that she'd given to the Irish Times,

he would have to file a suit for defamation. She refused to get rid of her claims, but then in 2004 her story did start to unravel. Oh, yes. Anne's lawyer apparently found out that there was a report that Marie had made with the Garda about Ian threatening her in shale. But on the time she said she was being threatened by Ian, he was with his lawyer. In a minute. Oh. She later contacted Ian's lawyer herself

to apologize allegedly and told him that she'd actually fabricated her entire story because she was being coerced by the detectives. She said even her story about seeing him on the bridge and the night of Sophie's murder was not the truth. Oh, so this entire investigation just turned all the way on it. So sadly, what was supposed to be a murder investigation had now turned into a media circus and a sue off with all these defamation suits and lies and everything. Yeah. And now

it was coming out that the police had potentially threatened or coerced one of their star witnesses into making her statement. Wow. So in October of 2005, Ian's lawyer Frank wrote to the minister of justice insisting that the Guarda Commissioner Noel Conroy launched an inquiry into the potential corruption involved in the investigation of Sophie's murder. Oh, no. So now, instead of continuing to search for the killer, the police are were supposed to

be doing so, were being investigated themselves. Oh, this is not looking good. No. So Conroy did launch that investigation and found out, indeed, that Marie had been pressured to lie. And since she had retracted her original statement, she was now being harassed by the local police, telling her that she wouldn't have a day's peace

if she stayed in shul and refused to stand by that original statement. They were like humanely stand by that statement, or like, you will be fucked. Whoa, that is bad. Real bad, because that is their main witness. Absolutely. Like we have all these people being like, Oh, Ian told me this, Ian told me that.

And oh, I saw him here. But hers was like. She was saying like, she had a timeline of that. She had a walk. She had a timeline. And now it seems as though she was being pressured into saying that. Ooh, not good.

So now that all this was going on, Sophie's brother felt like he needed to drop the civil suit that had been brought against Ian Bailey, because he basically said the intention of the suit to begin with was just to pressure the garter. And now that they were already being pressured, it really wasn't necessary. Yeah.

But because the case was so poorly mishandled from the beginning, it was going to be incredibly difficult from this point to separate the truth of the investigation from the lies. Oh man, that's so messy. And just because it was mishandled doesn't necessarily mean that Ian Bailey got off-scot free. Yeah, so if he wasn't an Ascent man, that sucks. Yeah, absolutely. So in February of 2010, the French authorities used a law under Section 44 of the European arrest warrant act of 2003, which allowed them to investigate crimes that were committed

on French citizens while they were outside of France. So now France is like, we're going to investigate this. And French judge Patrick Gouchon, I believe, issued an arrest for Ian Bailey's, uh, issued a warrant, excuse me, for Ian Bailey's arrest in connection with Sophie's murder. He demanded that Ian be extra dited and stand trial in France for this murder. The Irish authorities didn't endorse the arrest warrant and again arrested Ian on April 23rd. This time he was held again at the band and guard station to await a hearing before the high court. Okay.

So French authorities spent the next year conducting their own investigation all while he was being held there. They interviewed more than 30 witnesses in West Cork and they reviewed the active investigation files. And while they carried about out their investigation, Ian was brought before the high court in March of 2011. Wow.

Remember this started in 1996. Yeah. And they approved his extradition to France. Did I say that right? You did. Cool. However, he was able to file an appeal with the Supreme Court, which was heard in 2012.

And that court rejected the initial approval and stated that the current international law quote prohibited surrender because the alleged offense was committed outside of French territory and that there was no Irish law in existence that would allow for a person to be tried internationally for a crime committed in Ireland. That's a pretty loopy hole.

It's hairy. That's exactly it. It's a loophole, but they were like, no, we're not sending in that. Yeah, I don't love that. So with that, Ian was free to go. Okay, but it wasn't the last of this case. Ian stayed in Ireland and spent the next seven years filing case after case against the Irish authorities claiming that he'd been falsely arrested falsely imprisoned and that there had been illegal wiretaps on his phones at this point. Huh. All of these cases were unsuccessful, actually. But did shed additional light on potential more wrongdoing by the guarda? Yeah, and if he's, one thing, obviously, you can see both sides of this,

but if he's actively going so hard to try to go out of his name. Or to clear them and clear his name, That's opening him up to a lot. So it's like it wouldn't be in his best interest to do that if he was guilty. But then again, and I'm saying, I'm just doing like a devil's advocate thing. To me, I'm like, that doesn't be like, if you were guilty, I don't know if you'd go that hard, you kind of try to just like soak away and be like, oh, I got away with it, but. But it's like on the other side,

we have seen things where people do involve themself later and it ends up getting them caught. Right. But I feel like that's a little rarer on that side. I agree. So it's an interesting thing to watch. It's like a dichotomy. Yeah, I'm like, I can see this both ways.

It's true. It really is crazy too. I know. So there were additional and again, unsuccessful suits by Ian Bailey. And he was ordered to pay all the legal costs that occurred during these cases, which totaled between $2.5 million. Wow. Again, to your point, not something you would do, I would think.

I would think, yeah, if that's going to be ultimately what you have to pay. Yeah. There's a lot of twists and turns to be ultimately what you have to pay. Yeah. There's a lot of twists and turns here that I'm like I don't know. This case is wrong. Yeah. So while all that was going on, French authorities were still they were like I don't go fuck we're continuing our investigation. Yeah. And they believed that all of their interviews with witnesses and meetings with experts supported their belief that Ian Bailey was guilty. That's how France felt. They again filed for his extradition in 2017. Jesus. And again, Ireland Supreme Court declined.

Wow. So realizing that they were between a rock and a hard place, French authorities decided to try Ian Bailey in absentia. Oh, I was wondering. Meaning that they would hold a full trial in France without Ian Bailey in absentia. Ooh, I was wondering. Meaning that they would hold a full trial in France without Ian Bailey being there. Wow. I know, dude, isn't that bonkers? That's wild. I tried to find out how many times they've done that,

like it's a call, because it's not common at all. Yeah, it doesn't seem like it's easy to find. But I couldn't find out exactly how many times it's happened, but I do know it's rare. Yeah. So the trial started on May 27th, 2019, and after just four days of arguments, Ian Bailey was found guilty in this trial of Sophie Tuscon du Plantea's murder.

And in France, he was sentenced to 25 years in prison, but still, the Supreme Court in Ireland refuses to actuallyuate him. It has been 25 years since Sophie was murdered, 26 years, and still no one is behind bars. Wow. So much of the media attention surrounding this case focuses on the court battles, instead of the actual crime committed here. Yeah.

Now, interestingly, in 2018, another investigation was made into the guard as handling of this case. And this time, no evidence was found against them. There was no falsified evidence at all, but that the case was definitely poorly managed. What the hell are we supposed to believe here? That's the thing. It's like, who really knows what happened in this investigation? After all, he said she said in the investigations and the reinvestigations and the arrests and the liquefos and the truths and that.

It's fucking crazy. But what's really important to focus on here is that a woman was murdered. And because of the mismanagement, her killer, whether Ian Bailey or somebody else entirely, is freed of Rome the Earth while Sophie is gone and her family's left devastated. management, her killer, whether Ian Bailey or somebody else entirely, is free to roam the earth while Sophie is gone and her family's left devastated. Wow.

No, Ian Bailey still lives in shul, the last I saw, and is fully aware that him leaving Ireland would put him at great risk for being arrested and sent to serve time for murder in France. Yeah. But it is important to remember that though his behavior would could be perceived as incredibly strange and at times makes you question his guilt, there was no physical evidence tying him to the murder. That's what gets me. And I'm about to drop a mother fucking bomb on you. What? In fact, there were fragments of skin and hair found on Sophie's body, and they were not a match for Ian Bailey. Oh shit, not a match.

I mean, what? That's very West Memphis 3. It is. Where like no physical evidence ties them to the case, And in fact, physical evidence would seem to point away. Point away. Point to another direction. That's very interesting. Interesting.

So all we can do is hope that someday the real culprit is found, or that science advances enough to test new evidence in the case leading to the killer. And interestingly, you just found something that happened one day ago. Because as you tell me a story, I'm always looking at pictures of the people and stuff like that or questions that I have that I just found a quick way to look.

Yeah, and I just happened to find that the Irish examiner posted an article yesterday. Literally yesterday. And it's funny too, actually, we were meant to record this. Listen to me being like European. We were meant to, like a few days ago. Yeah. But it didn't work out. So we're recording this now. It's actually kind of meant to record this, listen to me being like European. We were meant to, like a few days ago. Yeah. But it didn't work out. So we're recording this now.

It's actually kind of meant to be. It really was, because the title of this is Ian Bailey says he has information which may be of use to the dupland TA. That's how you say dupland TA. Investigation. So he actually came forward and said that, what do you say here? It says, this is his quote in this article. He said, I am fully cognizant of the cold case review, which I had initially called for

in the new appeal. I'm standing ready to cooperate and assist the cold case review and have certain information which may be of use and interest. My full sympathies are with the family of Miss Duplante A. My prayer has and will always be that the truth comes out. I have nothing to do with this crime. And now the, I guess some of the detectives that are on the new case, he had what this name, his name is super intended more.

Okay. I believe it is. It's the new detective on the case. And he said that new witnesses in the case have been identified on almost a weekly basis. Wow. Wow. Yeah. That's wild. So hopefully it sounds like in this new investigation, a cold case investigation, they have more.

They've got more to go on. And it seems like they're motivated like, actually now. Yeah. It seems like they're really going for it because he said that he believes that there are still people who have information about this murder out there. And he said, maybe they weren't in the position to come forward 26 years ago, but now's the time to come forward. Because the thing is, that's a tiny, tiny town.

Yeah. No one saw anything that night. Someone knows something. No one heard anything. Someone knows something. And again, there, like, there was fragments found on her body. That don't match him. That match.

Embelly, that's why it was like who do those match? Regardless of what he has or hasn't done in his life and how, you know, any strange behavior or any strange coincidences like, if that doesn't match, that's an interesting information. That's an interesting kind of. For sure. And yeah, that doesn't mean he did it. That doesn't mean he doesn't. Didn't do it.

Absolutely. And that's why I'm so thankful that it's actually being re-investigated for like the 400 times. Wow. Which that's interesting. I'll be interested to follow this some more. See what comes out of it. Yeah. So Sophie's son actually now owns Herbal Loved beloved cottage, which makes me so happy.

That makes me happy. And he visits every year. Oh, I love that. And this will make you cry, and it made me cry when I got it. Sophie's jacket is still hung up on the kitchen door. The last place she hung it. That literally just made my entire body chill. Yeah, I got goosebumps again, and I know that.

Oh, yeah, because I think she has like grandchildren now, doesn't she? And her son says that he will never stop fighting for justice. Good. And I did see that he does believe that Ian Bailey is the man responsible for his mother's death. That was before this whole cold case investigation got open, so I'm not sure what he believes now, but he will never stop fighting. And honestly, all we can hope here is that the killer,

whoever it is is finally brought to justice. And put fine bars. And as we've seen, it can happen. Yeah. It can easily happen. Freakin' Loreta Jones. Yeah. Come on.

Look at that. Yeah. Golden State Killer. Joseph DiAngelo, like we can, this can Look at that. Yeah golden state killer. Mm-hmm. Joseph D'Angelo like we can this can happen There's never a time where you say well, it's been too long. We can't we don't know We're still looking for Jack the fucking ripper like seriously come on although Tobias thinks he found I think Tobias nailed this So I'll really back to Tobias always but I Really that's all I can hope for is that this new cold case investigation that

Some an answer comes out of it and it sounds like injustice sounds like it could happen I really hope for that I have a lot of hope that this case will be solved I really and I have a lot of faith for some reason that it will be and if you happen to be there in 26 years ago you saw someone you know was not in the position to say something now's the time now is absolutely They said that they will keep your shit in the utmost confidence. Yeah. And just remember this woman was a wife, a mother, a daughter, she's a grandmother, she deserves and her family deserves to know what happened. Yeah. So you know, you know, so yeah,

I really do work that someday we can come on here and get you an update and say, hey, this is really what happened. Yeah, because you know, we just don't know. Ugh, what a sad story. It really is. Should our whole life I had of her. Yeah. So, with that being said, guys, we hope you keep listening and we hope you keep it weird.

But not so weird that you don't really investigate things properly if that's your job, and not so weird that you ever confess to a murder because like like you really shouldn't do that if you didn't do the murder Yeah, you guys are better than not you do love you Hey, Prime Members! You can listen to Morvid, Early, and Add Free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen Add Free with Wondery Plus and Apple podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at Wondery.com slash survey.

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