Morbid - Listener Tales 55

Episode Date: October 28, 2022

This batch has a kidnapping that involved tic tacs, a mom that chased a murderer in her minivan and a very heartbreaking tale of one listener’s loss. If you have a listener tale please send it in to [e-mail] with “Listener Tale” somewhere in the subject line! :)ALSO: We are spreading Katie Palmer's light all the way to Massachusetts with the help of Ash’s soon to be brother in law. He and his fellow firefighters have teamed up and joined the Katie Palmer Project. If you have a family that you would like to nominate to have their Christmas lights hung up, check out this site!Katie Palmer Project Cowritten by Alaina Urquhart, Ash Kelley & Dave White (Since 10/2022)Produced & Edited by Mikie Sirois (Since 2023)Research by Dave White (Since 10/2022), Alaina Urquhart & Ash KelleyListener Correspondence & Collaboration by Debra LallyListener Tale Video Edited by Aidan McElman (Since 6/2025) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey weirdos, I'm Elena. And I'm Ash. And this is a mini morbid. Yeah, yeah. Mini, mini, mini, mini, mini, mini, mini morbid. Mini morbid, mini morbid, mini morbid. It's my mini morbid. And if you can't tell who this is, it's Elena.

Do you think people can't tell our voices apart? A lot of people say they can't tell our voices apart. I like your voice better than I like mine. I like your voice better. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. I was listening to the podcast the other day, and I was like, wow, I have the most annoying voice on planet Earth. But then everybody was like, your voice sounds like Elena's.

So that means I have the most annoying. No, I just meant that like my voice is annoying and I want yours. I'm totally kidding. I'm going to ursula it up and take your voice box. Again, you've been around my kids too much. I really have, honestly, pulling all these Disney references. So, yeah, tonight is Elena's mini morbid, which means it could be. slightly mini and it could be like four hours. It's not four hours. I'm going to fill you all in on

a little secret. Alina doesn't know what the word mini means. So this is a full ass morbid. Thank you. Strap into your seats. Hold on to your butts. Let's do this. We'll see. We'll see how long this is. Maybe I can get it to a good length. I think I can't. I love that my minis are actually 25 minutes and you're like, I have a mini tonight. It's sex. Oh, I meant to say six. It's sex. That's it. That's it. It is six hours long. Yeah. Yeah. I got to go now.

I got to go. So this is a good one. And by good one, I mean horrific. Yeah. But really interesting. Typically by good one, we mean absolutely gut-wrenchingly awful. Pretty much. This is one that has been sitting in my list of cases I wanted to cover forever.

And I just am waiting for that moment. I don't know why it feels like the right moment. moment, but it feels like the right moment. You know, if the sun is shining. It is. Also, side note, you can probably hear the sizzling again in the background. Indeed. It's another John cooking night. Just so. Guys, he's great. Yeah, just so you guys know. He's just cooking. So that's sizzling in the background. Not a lot I can do about it. Well, tonight's mini morbid is covering the case of the murders at Corpsewood Manor.

I don't know what that is. And I know it sounds like that is fake and like it's just like an Agatha Christie book or something. Yes, exactly. But it's not. It's real. Tell me all about it. So we're going to set the scene. We're not. We're just going to talk about.

I was like, we're actually just going to talk about victims really quick. I was like, do we do that? So Dr. Charles Scudder, which I think is a cool name, Scudder. Dr. Scudder. I don't know. I just think it's a cool name.

I could take it or leave. Dr. Charles Scudder was a professor of pharmacology at Loyola University in Chicago. Chicago. Now, at the moment, we're talking about like the 70s, late 70s. Oh, my time. This doesn't happen in the 70s, we're just beginning in the 70s. Oh, okay. It happens in the early 80s.

Not my time. Yeah. He was also co-director of the Institute for the Study of Mind, Drugs, and Behavior, where he basically did a ton of government, funded experiments on LSD. Oh. But not like LSD, like, you know, just like some dude you bought LSD from. Like this is government-created LSD.

Yo. And they were trying to discover what it does. That's that good good. It was that that's the stuff that Charles Manson was like, hand in out, like, come in my bus. That was like, he was looking for this stuff, but he couldn't get his hands on it. So this, and it was basically at Loyola University. they were like granted to do this study about like what it did to your mind you know behavior all that

good stuff how do you think they find people to like how do they find volunteers for that people that were like yup i will take that government in the 70s a bunch of people that were like government created LSD I don't know if I would want government created LSD I don't want any LSD anywhere near me yeah that's what I meant to say thank you moving on now I do not want LSD I just feel like the government like never mind. I mean, yeah, I feel you. They just never mind. Either way, Dr. Charles Scouter,

along with being the professor of pharmacology, was also the co-director of that institute. So he was like doing the damn thing. He was living his best life. He was a widowed father to four boys who were grown at that point. He lived with his two bull mastiff dogs named Beelzebub in Arsanath.

Isn't Beezelbub another word for the devil? Well, it's like one of the demons. Oh, okay. One of the hell demons, I believe. And it's funny. That is funny. What was the other one's name? And Arsenaeth or Arsanath, I'm sure many people are going to scream and yell at me,

and I'm going to get 400 messages because I'm sure I said that wrong, and they're going to tell me that they're taking away my horror card. Because it's an HP Lovecraft character. Oh. Sorry, I don't know this character. Sorry. Sorry. So it's arsenath or arsenath.

I'm not really positive. I like however you want to say it. Yeah. However, I like you having free will. Yeah. That's what I like. Do you, bro.

So they were two bo-mastiff, so there was those like big, just like jolly, but huge. I mean, these things are like gigantic. So he lives with those two and he loved them. They were like his beloved dogs. His beloved dogs. and he also lived with his housekeeper who was also described by many as his partner. Joseph, Joey, Odom. Okay.

Now, from what it seems, he served as Scudder's housekeeper for over 20 years. Oh, damn. Yeah. From what it seemed, Joey, or I'm going to call him Odom from now on because there's another Joey. Well, and there's another Joey that comes into play later, and I don't want to confuse everybody. So Odom the Housekeeper. So Odom the Housekeeper. Odom and Dr. Scudder were like definitely like intimate.

Mm-hmm. And they were definitely, you know, and they definitely like were partners. But I don't think they were like in a monogamous relationship. Like I think they were able to see other people. They were in an open relationship. It was kind of an open relationship. Okay. And it was the 70s.

Not exactly the greatest time to be like, you know. waving the pride flag so they weren't able to be as free as they wanted to be. So Dr. Scudder was described by all who knew him as fucking brilliant. This dude was brilliant. He had a wide array of interests

and he was super well read. When they, I mean, one look at his library and it was like the array of subject matters he was into and anything he needed to learn he just read a book about it and would do it. Damn. He was just one of those people that was like, I can figure that out. I love that. Right? Odom, he was like on the total opposite end of the spectrum. He came from kind of like a poor family.

He only had a fifth grade education. Oh, that's really sad. But he had like taught himself to cook. He was like very skilled in cooking. He loved cooking. And even though they were really opposite, they were totally like in sync and inseparable. Or like opposites attract. Yeah. And they just seemed like they, you know, they just really got along. Yeah. And Odom was like really adept at keeping house and taking care of everything and cooking and he liked doing it. So it's just like it's a win-win situation. Now Scudder like a lot of brilliant people was what some would refer to as eccentric at times. Yeah. He played a golden harp and he played it beautifully and he taught himself how to play it.

That's like really cool. And he also painted a ton. he made stained glass windows. And again, taught himself how to do all this stuff, just read it and figured it out. He also did things like dyeing his hair purple for a bit. Same. Yeah. And he had a pet monkey at one point.

Say it. I mean, nope. He's just living his life, to be honest. And what's funny is it's like he's like at a professor of pharmacology at like a very prestigious school and he's got like purple hair. I love that. So he's just, he's eccentric, but he's awesome. He seemed like an awesome dude. He seems really cool. I hope he doesn't murder someone later.

He was also very interested in the Church of Satan, which carried its own stigma because, and it still does, because people have no fucking clue what that is. People are very misinformed about what the Church of Satan is actually about. Yeah, it's actually like not that bad. Satanists don't worship the devil. It's not bad at all. Don't they just like worship like the earth? No. Satanists are, Satan is don't worship the devil.

They are atheists. Okay. So basically the religion is about seeing yourself as the quote unquote God kind of. I'm into it. Like you worship your own needs. Yeah. Kind of. Like it's all about looking at what you need and taking care of you and your, they don't worship any God.

Cool. That's not. They also don't see Satan or believe in Satan as a being or a person. Like they don't believe in that. Oh. They actually just use. Why are they called Satanus then? Because it's kind of.

of a symbol of like rebellion and kind of a symbol and it's I think from what I've read and I could be wrong if there's anybody who is listening right now who is a Satanist and would like to enlighten me on this I did read in a couple things that these the Satan like you know moniker and the Satan symbol is kind of like to thumb their nose at like Christianity you know I mean like it's kind of to be like yeah this dude is not what you guys are making him I kind of dig that he's not Like this is just a symbol. Yeah, like, fuck you guys. Yeah.

So they don't worship Satan, the devil, or anything like that. They don't worship anything except for themselves. Sounds lit. It is. It sounds like their website also describes them as, quote, We are a formidable threat to any who would halt progress in the name of spirituality. We are explorers on the untrodden paths of science, human motivation, and all mysteries awaiting understanding.

That which is most truly, quote, a cult. And if you read their website, it's like, they literally have a frequently asked question section that's like, hey, do you worship the devil? And they're like, nope. And then it's like, it's like, it's a great so anybody go

go look at the Church of Satan website. It'll enlighten yourself. It'll enlighten you. It really will. And that's why this plays a huge role in this whole thing that he was a follower of the Church of Satan because at that time, people had no fucking clue what that was. And it was like

so misconstrued. And it's, and I mean, I'd love to say we've moved forward as a society, but we haven't. We haven't. Like, people still look at that as like, oh, he's a Satanist. He's going to sacrifice children. It's like, no, they're atheists. That's basically all they are. So after holding down this super good job for a while and finding himself like, kind of alone, his children were grown. He was just living with Odom, you know what I mean? He was feeling the need to escape this life in the city in Chicago and he wanted to trade it for something more simple like connecting him back to the earth. I want to grow something in dirt. And he also wanted to kind of escape the binds of judgment about his sexuality and allow him to be freer. So he was looking

to get somewhere that he could be who he is. So interestingly, he wrote an article in 1981 for an online news outlet called Mother Earth News about this experience. You can read it online today. In the article, he said he had a good job, but it seemed like things were turning in this job, and it wasn't what it once was. Quote, as time passed, the medical students grew more unruly and less interested in learning. The standards of the school steadily dropped, and my department became a hotbed of office politics, backbiting, and resentment. And he said, quote, as soon as I got home each evening, I'd change into my old and not too clean or mended, jeans, and and muddle about in the garden, finding there the only moments of satisfaction left in my urban life.

I was even pleased when the city's wildlife, the rats, drank from my garden pool at night. I would not be pleased. So he decided that he was going to move out of his old mansion in Chicago, because he lived in a pretty big mansion house. And build a dream home away from everything. He wanted to be super secluded, and he didn't want any of the trappings of this urban lifestyle anymore. He said, quote, after some soul-searching conversations with Joey, I decided that we really needed to find some place in hilly country with the glamour of four seasons but without super cold winters,

with a good supply of pure water and wood for heating and cooking, and most important, with a measure of isolation. After years of enduring the sensory overload of city life, I desperately wanted to be situated where I could neither see nor hear my neighbors. All right, they should go to the bird. They should. Because it's so chic, but it's like also chill. Oh, they would have been so much better off there. But the Berkshires don't have great winters. No, they don't. It's super cold in the winter. So that is one thing. It is very chic. So what he did was he found 40 acres of woodland in northern Georgia. Now, it was completely surrounded by national forest land and miles away from anybody else. Like this was literally like as isolated. I like really scares me. He checked. it out and he purchased it immediately. Wow. So in 1976 on his 50th birthday, he resigned officially from Loyola University. He auctioned off like pretty much everything he owned. Oh wow. All his

valuable is everything. And he was like, I'm going to build my dream home in the wilderness. Odom is going to come live with me and my two dogs are going to come live with me. They called it their quote kingdom. Oh my God. And when he left Loyola, he took two, he, he was going to human skulls from his office, like real human skulls, and a bunch of LSD from the... Yes, that is exactly what I would take from my office. From the experiment. That is amazing. And it was something like when they actually found this LSD, because it was like in vials.

I don't know how LSD works. Again, I've not done many drugs in my time. Yeah. And by many, I mean any. So I have no idea how LSD works. but they said when they like measured it all out later it was something like 12,000 doses. Oh. Which I'm assuming LSD taken very tiny amounts.

Yeah. But that's still crazy. 12,000? Yeah. Holy fuck. I know. I mean, it was for the experiment, so I guess they needed it. Wow.

Wow. So to get to the location of the home that they were going to build, there was a long road that ended in this dirt road. and it was way at the end of that dirt road you took a turn off and then it was like way in the woods and like a mountain. Very, very, very isolated. So when they set off,

it was in the middle of a really bad bad. It was a middle of a blad blizzard. It was in the middle of a really bad blizzard. I didn't even call you out on that because I called you out so much last week. I called myself out. I felt really bad about it. I had a, it was a lot of tongue ties.

Yeah. But that was a long one. When it gets long, I get flubby. Oh, same. So they arrived in a really bad blizzard, and they had to spend the night in their Jeep, actually, because they couldn't find where the plot of land was, because it was so far in there. Where were they going to, what were they going to do anyways? It was just land. Well, so they were like, okay, we'll just figure it out in the morning. So when they set out again in the morning, they actually saw that there was a rotting dead horse in the middle of the dirt drive up to their property. You want to know what that is? A bad omen. You would think. You would think that you would turn right the fuck around. It might be.

I feel as though it's got to be. It just might be. Spoiler alert. This doesn't have a happy ending, guys. Just letting you know. You're listening to the podcast. So they took this, but they didn't look at it as bad omen. Because one thing about Scudder and Odom, it seemed like they had like a really good sense of humor.

Like they just kind of like went through life being like, eh. Yeah, huh. Like, just trying to, like, just be chill. Right. And so they looked at it and they were like, they were like, oh, perfect name for our road that leads up to our house, Dead Horse Road. I love that. So they literally named the road to drive up to their house, dead horse roads. Wait, that's wicked funny. Yeah, like, they seem like hot shit. They do. I love them. It's funny. So while they built this mansion by hand themselves, by the way. You know, as one does. They lived out. They lived. out of a camper on the property and their Jeep. They literally built it with brick, like this totally brick mansion. Oh, that's so sick. By hand, just the two of them. And they, he literally just said, he read a book to figure out how to build a house.

That's very casual of like what the, so this was, technically it was, I mean, they called it a manor. They called it like their castle, all that good stuff. That's cute. It wasn't gigantic. It was impressive. Like, I'm going to post photos of this on our Instagram because it's, very interesting to look at.

But when you actually look at it, you're like, how did they build this by hand? Like it's just, it's bonkers because it's all brick. It's like beautiful. I like brick buildings. They said it took two short years and they were living in an elegant mini castle. That's how he described.

I want to live in an elegant mini castle. What the fuck? It was a two-story brick mansion. They had an outhouse that they built out of brick. And they created a pump system for water and dug a well. That's how they got their water. They had no electricity. Why? They didn't want it. Oh. They didn't want to. Their whole thing, he said, I don't want to owe anybody anything. I don't want to pay electricity. I don't want to

pay water. I don't want to pay any of this shit. I want to be totally off the grid and just living my life. No electricity. They had a wood stove. They created a vineyard where they made their own wine. Fuck yeah. They did. And they made their own wine out of like everything, like fruits and vegetables so some of it was shit and some it was awesome but everybody who had their wine said it was like actually like really decent wine and they said it was like crazy strong so oh i'm there they had tons of it they were constantly making it no that actually comes up and that did that did not happen let me be the first to tell you that okay because they get accused of that oh fuck sorry i don't know this case i was just making a joke um they also you just caught your face was like mad because you know

At the end of this case, you're going to be mad. Oh. It's going to make you really mad. So they grew their own food. They lived off the land. They had fruit trees. They ground their own wheat and shit. They also became beekeepers where they harvested the honey and the wax to eat the honey

and to use the wax for candles to light their home. I literally feel like this would be easier if you just told me what they didn't do. Yeah. Like they did everything. They're awesome. Yeah. Like it's pretty bad. All the hobbies.

They had a pink painted gargoyle over a gazebo that was over a big, that was over a big rose garden that Odom, like, was very proud of tending to. A pink gargoyle. Pink gargoyle over a rose garden. Yes. Can I just live in the rose garden? I'm there. Right. Sign me up.

Inside the house, there was like a study, a library. It was very gothic, very like, cruel, right? I was so into it. Stained glass. A lot of art, tons of art, because they were really. into that. A lot of antiques. There was like some occult type pieces, you know, because like that's

the aesthetic he liked. Same. And when you go through this case, you realize you're like, my God. Like, I'm glad I'm in an area of the country at least. That me liking this shit doesn't automatically get me labeled.

Oh my God, keep going. I need to know what happens. I know it's crazy. And Charles had obviously had obviously brought the two human skull. with him that were decorated. Right house too. As I look around this room, there's like 55. I was going to say.

Not 55, but. Beside the house was a three-story chicken house, it was called, which literally house chickens on the first and second floor. It was like a chicken coop. And then the top floor was named the pink room. That served as kind of like a guest house in like a rec room. That's where they like entertained guests who came over. Because they did have guests come over.

of the chicken coop. In the pink room. Okay. Now the pink room had pink shag carpet. Yes. It had mattresses everywhere with pink sheets all over them. Yes. And the police who came to this place later claimed there was like a ton of sex stuff in there.

Like that this was like a like a pleasure room. Whatever. Which if it was. Like cool. Live your life. Do you. Yeah. Do you in the pink room and do everybody else in the pink room.

And honestly, I hope it was because I hope they were able to leave Chicago. leave like judgment and just go in the woods and be yeah yeah just exist i'm for it i'm for it you're not pissing anybody off and again they had a ton they did they did have guests over they did and they would entertain they were very like hospitable hosts like they always would just like give everyone their wine and just like they were cool so when they when they felt like they built everything everything was set up and they were like we have to name this yeah so they looked around and it was um I think it was just becoming or it was like ending autumn and going into winter when they had finished. So all the trees were really bare and like skeletal and everything.

So they were like corpsewood. Let's call this corpsewood Manor. They sound like I want to be their friend. Right? I'm like, damn. These people sound cool as fuck. That's awesome. So in the winter of 1982, a 17-year-old guy who was also a part-time truck driver named Kenneth Avery Brock,

who we are going to call Avery, because that's a little. what he liked to go by. Okay. Met Scutter and Odom, and they befriended him. The way they met was because Avery liked to hunt. He was like a deer hunter. And hunters often asked permission from Scudder and Odom to hunt on their property because it was so expansive.

And they were always really chill about it. They were always like, yeah, totally. As long as you asked permission, they didn't care. So Avery was just one of these people who happened to wander by and ask, and they befriended him. Now, after meeting Avery, they invited him in at one point, like, offered him at their wine, and they hung out a few times. There was some kind of sexual encounter that did happen. Okay.

But it's either that it just happened or that Avery tried to engage them in it and they kind of like rebuffed him. Okay. Nobody's really sure exactly what. Because Avery kind of flip-flops between what happened, like, depending on what. Is Avery a douche? Yeah, cool. In November of 1982, Avery had moved into one trailer with a 30-year-old, unemployed dude named Samuel Tony West.

Okay. We're going to call him Tone. They were living together. They were just like, basically just like garbage people. Like, because they just weren't doing anything. They just wanted the world to give them things. And they couldn't understand why, no, but why they weren't like super successful. And one night, Avery told Tony.

a tale about quote queer devil worshippers that he had met okay and he said they were living in isolation they lived in this big house he's telling them all about it so what it was was Avery looked at this whole place and looked at how Scudder and Odom lived and were like they're hiding a fortune I know it oh no like they're definitely rich like they chose to live this way and they're just like billionaires that have this like massive fortune hidden somewhere on this estate. I know it. Okay. Because he's an idiot.

And he just assumed that. Maybe they just like their things and they wanted to live there. Well, and this is why I think like this is why to me it seems like maybe Avery had tried to engage them in something and they might have her buffed because he's real mad at them suddenly. Yeah, which is interesting. Tony was straight. and he was in the deep south in the early 80s. So paint your own picture.

I'm not saying that everybody in the south in the early 80s felt the same way. Tony happened to be not super open-minded. Got it. But again, not saying everybody was like that. But Tony was like that. Yeah, and in that time, it seemed to be a little more prevalent. Yeah.

So Avery did mention, I guess, by all accounts, to Tony about this either sexual encounter he had or he said that, you know, they tried to or something. Like he kind of twisted it. Yeah, he made different stories. So, and Tony was kind of giving him shit about it because he was like, dude, are you gay? Like, what is going on here? Like, you need to tell me. So Avery got pissed and decided to say, you know, like, I'm not gay.

like, blah, blah, bah. They're gay. They're the queer. They came on to me. Like, we need to take them out. Okay. You know, they were like nice and invited you to their house and like gave you wine and they were like chill.

And it was basically because he was now getting bullied by his new roommate. Basically. Grow up. And now he's trying to save face. So he started being like, they took advantage of me. They took advantage of me. I am only 17 years old. They took advantage of me.

When nobody really knows what happened at all. If anything even happened. And his main thing. was I'm pissed at them now because I'm having to confront this whole thing about myself. I'm having, you know what I mean? Like he's clearly having some issues here. Right. But then on top of that, he was like, they're rich.

I want their money. Okay. Or you could get a job. Yeah. I mean, that's another really good option. Yeah, that's the option that I suggest. But Avery was like, no. Yeah.

I have a deal. So he came up with a plan with Tony. And actually, Avery. initially said, and this is really rough, trigger warning. He didn't actually do it, but this is what he wanted to do. Okay. He said he wanted to take a heated welding iron and rape scutter with it. Wow.

And even Tony was like, yeah, we should just rob them though. Like he was like maybe. Maybe we can just take their money though. Major yikes. Yeah. So he was already, clearly Avery was angry. And sadistic. And messed up. Now in November of 1982, Avery went to Scudder and Odom's homes a few times, like, to hang out with them.

After he said that. Yes, because it was an attempt to get the layout of the house down. Oh, fuck. But Scudder and Odom only allowed him to hang out in the pink room. They didn't let him in the actual. Which I guess they did a lot with people. Like, they didn't allow a whole lot of people to come into the main house. Their space.

like they're like sanctuary. So I think they mainly entertained in the pink room and that was where they kept him. So it didn't really work out for him that well to find the layout of the house but he kept trying. Now on the night of December 12th, 1982, that's when

their plan got set into motion. Oh no. I don't like this. No, it's not awesome. They picked up two teenagers. Okay. 17 year old Joey Wells who was Tony's nephew. and happened to be on a first date with a girl named Teresa Hudgens that night. He was on a first date and hanging out with other people.

Well, he was on a first date with Teresa Hudgens. And Tony and Avery met up with them somewhere and were like, do you guys want to go Joy riding with us? What a date. And they were like, cool. So Tony and Avery said Joey Wells knew the plan, but he claims to, and he's claimed he had no idea. Okay.

I don't think he had any idea. And that's Tony's nephew. Yeah, the 17-year-olds. And he actually refuses, like, he refused to ever speak about it again after the trial. Oh, no, I hadn't. And I really don't think he had any idea. And then what about Teresa? Definitely had no idea.

Oh, my God, wait, I don't know where this is going, but that's your first fucking date. Oh, this is a real bad first fucking date. Oh, no. Like, I'm going to make you all feel better about any shitty first date you've ever been on. Because I can pretty much guarantee you they're not working. than this. Oh, no. So Avery made a stop at his mother's trailer, and he picked up his 22-caliber

Ramington automatic rifle, and he told his mother that he wanted to go rabbit hunting that night, and that's why he needed it. Do people rabbit hunt at night? Apparently. Okay. So they had Teresa and Joey with them, and they said to them, hey, do you guys want to like stop by that corpsewood Manor place and, like, hang out with those dudes? Because they have good wine and blah, blah, blah.

and Joey Wells was like, hell yeah, I want free alcohol because he's 17. Teresa was like, I heard they're devil worshippers. I don't know, because that was the rumor around town. Like these weirdos, everybody,

and of course it's, you know, it's in the deep south in the early 80s. So people were looking at it as these are devil worshippers in the woods and they're also gay. Yikes. It's not good for,

you know, it's like a triple whammy. So all these horrible rumors were being, like, set into motion about them simply because they were gay and followed the Church of Satan. The whole way, so they all decided they were going to go to

Corpsewood Manor, the whole way there, the four of them were huffing something called Tudaloo. Huffing, Tudaloo, which is a wholesome combination of paint thinner, alcohol, and glue. What the fuck? Why would you willingly choose to do?

I can't. I just let me have that's called Tudoloulo. y'all want to huff some to to totoleu? Like, no, I don't. No. What? Yeah, no. So you do not want to huff some totaleau? Can you imagine if you were on a date and the guy was like, you want to huff some toodoo?

I'd be like, and my Uber is here. Bye. I am so busy that day. I actually have an appointment I have to get to yesterday. Thank you, sir. Good night. Thanks for dinner. So, yeah, they do it all, you know, just doing the tootaloo.

I just love the name of it, Tooteloo. Well, I feel like it's telling. Yeah, it really is like, Tudaloo. Tootoo. Tootoo. Tuttleu brain cells. That's exactly. Fucking glue.

Alcohol and paint fumes. Yeah, it's no good. So when they got to Corpsewood Manor, Teresa, who later talked to police and gave them every bit of information they needed. Yeah. She told police that Charles greeted them happily. Oh. Charles is Dr. Scudder.

And he just said, can I bum a cigarette from me? you guys. And then he was like, hey, you guys can go up to the chicken coop, like, guest house situation. And he was like, I'm just going to go get something. I'll be back. So they climbed the 40 foot ladder to the pink room. Was that how you always got up there? Yeah. That's like a 40 foot ladder. Yeah. And a scudder told them he was going to go get some of his wine and bring up. And he was like, we can all hang back and, you know, it'll be a nice night. Imagine climbing back down a 40 foot ladder drunk. Yeah, that's no good. Well, so he came back with the wine. everything was chill.

They were passing it around. It was like a nice little gathering. Everybody was just hanging out. Cool. And shortly into this whole thing, Avery just gets up and is like, oh, I just have to run out to my car real quick. Okay.

So they're like, okay. And I think he was like, I'm going to get some more Tudaloo. Oh, God. And so he came back and he was holding the rifle. And he was like super casual that it just like walked up there. Just holding it? And just like sat down with his rifle.

Oh, that's scary. That's what nightmares are made of. So he just like sits down on the mattress with the rifle. And. Nope. Scudder, Dr. Scudder, I think, was like, uh, like, you know, like. Can you get that out of my pink room? Is this, is this supposed to be weird?

Like, I don't know what the, like, he didn't. What's the protocol here? He wasn't like freaking out or anything, but he was just like, this is kind of odd. But again, they were in the deep south and there was a lot of hunters in the area who they were very familiar with. So maybe he was like, oh, you know. planning on hunting later? Yeah. Weird.

But what he did was he looked at him and he like jokingly was like bang bang. I'm dead. Shut the fuck up. That's amazing. Which I love. I love that so much. Like it makes you love him so much more. Like he just like this dude walks in with a rifle and he's just like bang bang.

Like that's adorable. Like that's his way of diffusing a situation. Yeah. Humor. That's amazing. So apparently like Avery just kind of like was like, yeah. That's funny. And then they just went back to drinking wine.

Like it did, no one was like, why do you have that? Well, and then it did diffuse the situation for a second. So he was like, okay. Well, Dr. Scudder stood up and he was like going to do something in the corner. I think he was like fixing, you know, a light or something like that. Suddenly Avery just jumped up. Oh, no. Grabbed him by his hair and got a knife out of his boot.

Oh. And pressed it against his throat. Jesus Christ, this escalated quickly. Out of nowhere. This was out of nowhere. Teresa and Joey tried to run away. Uh-huh. But they were stopped.

And they were basically told by Tony. Because they ran out the pincrum and were going down the ladder and like to their car. They were like, nope, I'm not here for this because again, they had no idea that this was what this was. Oh, this is fucked. So Tony grabbed them and was like, if you guys don't come back in here, we'll kill you too. We're going to kill you. So Avery basically had him, you know, the knife to his throat, demanded money. He was like, Where's All Your Money?

And then he tossed him onto the mattress and he cut strips from the pink sheet and he gagged Scudder with it. And then cut his coat and like kind of like weaved the pieces through his coat and tied him up that way. What? Yeah. The whole time he's literally screaming at him like, Where's the money? Tell me where the money is. I'd be like, look around. The money is.

is in these beautiful items that we have, idiot. And Scudder kept saying he didn't have any money there. He was like, we really don't because although he did have like a small inheritance from his father passing away, it was in the bank. Right. Like he didn't have it just like in a pile in like a bag with a fucking dollar sign on it. I don't even know what this would be. He's like, you're an idiot.

And so he also demanded to know who else is in the house here. Like who else is here? So he said, you know, Odom is in the house. house and the two dogs are in the house in the actual house so Avery said I'm going to go take care of that which to me it's like oh okay so you weren't coming just to rob him like this was your plan all along yeah and he said that now what Avery claims is that he went to the house he found Odom in the kitchen cleaning up after supper and he said Odom reached for a gun but they're The evidence disputes this completely because no gun was found anywhere near Odom.

Right. And they only had one pistol and it was up on the top floor. Okay. Like in a box somewhere. Like it was nowhere near. Right. Now Odom, what actually happened was Odom was interrupted in the kitchen where he had been cleaning up after supper by Avery. Avery screamed at him to get out of the house and he said he, that Odom just looked up at him really quick.

Like what the fuck? And he said as soon as he looked at him. he fired four rounds into Odom. What? Several more rounds killed the two bull mastiffs. No, no. The bull mastiffs were curled around the wood stove on like sleeping in their beds because they would sleep around the wood stove because it was nice and warm.

And they were still in their bed. They hadn't even woken up. That's my least favorite part. Now later, Avery would say that he shot, but he said he shot wildly. he didn't mean to shoot Odom. And he said that the bullets were just ricocheting everywhere. Can every murderer stop that excuse of like, I just shot blankly into the world and I was like, and hit someone?

What? Yeah, like, that's crazy. Well, in this one, he's like, I shot this and it just ricocheted everywhere. And it happened to shoot Odom four times in the head and the arm and then also hit both dogs and kill them where they slits. It was the weirdest thing. Seems legit. Like, Avery, go fuck yourself.

No. No. Idiot. So back in the pink room, they heard the gun. shots. Oh, no. And so they're like... Scudder's probably freaking out.

Yeah. So Avery came back into the pink room and announced, quote, well, I killed that man in those dogs. No, poor Scudder. And at this point, no one knows if Odom was actually dead at this point. Oh. Which it doesn't look like he was. Oh.

Unfortunately. So he just bled out probably? I think so. And so he decided now that him and Tony decided that now they were going to lead Scudder back into that manner. because they were going to get him to find the money and give it to them. But there was a money. There was no money.

So this was just literally a fruitless effort. He was telling the truth. So his hands were tied. Like he was all bound up. So they had to essentially carry him down this ladder. Oh my God. Like tied up. Teresa and Joey were forced to come as well.

Now, Scudder was brought into the manor. And as soon as he got into the manor, Odom is in front of him on the floor. Oh, God. Like that scene is right when he walks in. And Odom was shot in the kitchen, like we said, but they found him halfway between the kitchen and the hallway. Like he had tried to get somewhere,

and he, like, tried to escape out of the house, but he died where he was. Oh, that's awful. And Teresa told police that, now, Scudder is, like, gagged at this point and is being, like, held up by them. And he said when he looked down at, you know, Odom and his dogs that he just like moaned. Like it was just this like awful.

He was so sad. Grieving moan that came from him and she said it was like awful. Oh. And they just, and they didn't give shit. So they just kept demanding money. Where is it? Where is it? Like look what we just did.

Like tell me where your money is. So Tony threw Scudder down on a couch. Again screaming at him, where's the money? And also screamed at him, where's your soldering at him? And he said, we don't have a fucking soldering iron. I don't have electricity out here. Right.

So they didn't, obviously, nothing happened with that. Thank goodness. They did not have electricity, because if they did have a soldering iron, this could have been even more gruesome. But the fact that they were still on that? Yeah, that's fucked up. Like, you just killed this man's, like, partner and dogs. And now you're still thinking you're going to, like, prolong his awful torture. So apparently they're yelling at him.

Where's the money? Where's the money? He's on the couch. He's like, I don't have any. He's trying to tell them like, please, I swear, I don't have any. So then all of a sudden they said, Teresa, this is from Teresa's, like, first-hand account of this whole thing. And she's very truthful about it. Okay.

She said, Scudder stood. He, like, got himself to his feet. And he started shuffling over to Odom on the floor. and Tony was screaming at him to stop saying like sit back down I'm going to kill you if you don't sit but he just ignored him completely and they said that he and she said that he stopped right over Odom and just like stared down at him and he said quote I asked for this what what and those were his final words where I asked for this and Tony I think that. He shot Scudder in the face in the head at close range two to three times. He fell to his knees and he tried to say something and stand again, Teresa said. But he fired one more shot, which made him fall into the bookcase.

And he tried to say something else and he shot him three more times. Oh my God. All together, I know that sounded like a lot of shots. I think it was five times that he got shot in the head. And he said I asked for this. His last words were I asked for this. Well, and that's what I want to get into that later, like what we think that means. Because nobody, like, obviously we don't know what that means.

He only knows what that means. Right. But I do want to get into that later, like talk about what we think that means. So Tony, so now Scudder was gone. Tony told Avery and Joey to go upstairs and steal whatever they could. And Teresa's just, poor Teresa is literally sitting there. She's like, am I going to get home tonight? What they ended up leaving this manner with is a bag of dimes and nickels.

They fucking took dimes and nickels. One silver candelabra and a gold-plated dagger. That's it. Out of all the fucking shit. So they murdered these two men and their dogs for dimes and nickels. For literally like a handful of change. Yeah. They really were on Tudaloo, huh?

Yeah. Like fucking Tudaloo. It's awful That's so Senseless That's what kills me about this is like How senseless this is And that drives me bananas

How awful this is It's like this was his like dream You know life And he they poured everything they had into it And this is how into the Berkshires And it's like Ugh I know that's what I'm thinking

So what they ended up doing was They took Tony's red 1970 AMC Javelin and they also stole Scutters Black CJ 5 Jeep and they left in those two cars Okay

A guy named Raymond Williams actually came upon Corpstered Manor two days later because he was a friend of theirs And he was coming to let them know that another friend of theirs had passed away in Rome, Georgia Jesus Christ Christ and when he got there he saw bullet holes

in the kitchen door and he called police Teresa came forward as well and told police she knew who killed them. So she came on her own volition and came to the police and was like, I know what happened, I will tell you everything. Tony and Avery made it to Bonneva, Mississippi. And they pulled over at a rest stop to switch out cars because they were like, we need to get another car. Yeah.

Because they were in Scudder's car. Tony all of a sudden handcuffed a Navy lieutenant named Kirby Phelps to steal his car. Oh, big mistake. Yeah. Well, they took him by gunpoint into the woods and Tony was saying we're just going to tie him to a tree and steal his car. Did they shoot him? West shot him in head twice and killed him. Oh my God. Literally just an innocent man at a rest stop and in the wrong place at the wrong time.

The world is so fucked. And it's like they're just saying we're going to tie him to a tree and steal his car, which is shitty enough. Why did you kill him? Like you didn't have to kill that man. You were going to get his car regardless. It's all, yeah. So this is how like cold-blooded these motherfuckers are. Avery ended up turning himself in on December 20th, 1982.

Oh, big wolf. Yeah. And five days later, on Christmas Day, Tony turned himself in in Chattanooga, Tennessee. Like, cool. Don't know why it's suddenly, you know, I'm assuming it's like the heat was bearing down and they knew they were getting caught anyways, so they were figuring we'll just spin this story to try to. because I'm sure they knew there's already all these rumors about these guys.

People already have an opinion. We can turn this in our favor. Ugh. What a bunch of jackholes. In fact, during his confession, Tony told Chattanooga County Sheriff Tony Gilliland, he said, quote, all I can say is they were devils and I killed them.

That's how I feel about it. Oh. So he was just like, I don't go to fuck. Now when police started their investigation at Corpsewood Manor after they were called to the scene they found all the artwork that Scudder created and collected and some of it was darker because he liked the occult. He liked, you know.

Well, that doesn't mean anything. Just because you like dark shit doesn't make you like this bad person. And there was also a lot of antiques, like we said, and like Gothic aesthetic and skulls and books on paganism and the occult, along with every other fucking subject known to man, but they only focused on the... Of course. There was also a stained glass window that Charles had made himself of the trademark symbol of the Church of Satan, which is, I think, like, an inverted pentagram with like a goat's head on it.

Someone will tell you if you're wrong. They will. Somebody will yell at me, so I'm sorry. But I think that's what it was. That's what I read, at least. There was also one other piece of artwork that I'm not going to tell you what it is yet. Oh, I thought you were just like, I'm not going to. I'm never going to tell you what this was.

That's it. So thank you for listening. No, I'm going to leave it till the end because it's just going to blow your mind a little bit this piece of artwork. And I just feel like it's important. So there was one piece of artwork that was very, very interesting. Now, the day after they finished investigating the scene, the chicken coop and pink room burned down. Mysteriously.

And the manor was burned down soon after as well. Also mysteriously. Which is really sad. That's horrible after they worked so hard and, like, poured their heart and fucking soul into it. Like, put this together brick by brick with their own hands. And it's just like, oh, I'm a bummer. So, once the trial started, Scudder and Odom were immediately labeled, quote, homosexual devil worshippers. Great.

And remember, they were gay eccentric and in the deep south in the 80s. Not a good combo for sympathy. Mm-mm. And they were also isolated, reclusive, all that stuff. So people went wild with the rumors. Also, here's my deal, though. Like, they were reclusive and not bothering anybody. Exactly.

Like, did any fucking kids go missing in their fucking basement? Well, and that's, and so, Scudder's affiliation with the Church of Satan was, like, the kicker. But, like, he didn't do anything to anybody. Well, the problem with this was, this was smack dab in the middle of the satanic panic hysteria in the U.S. That was during the 80s and early 90s. It was bonkers.

I mean bonk. Him having an affiliation with the Church of Satan was the worst thing that could have been coming to it. Do you think that's why he said I asked for this? I wonder if that was perfect. This was when people like Geraldo Rivera were telling people that Satanists were everywhere and they were violent and going to sacrifice your children and like literally doing documentaries about this. and like it was all over the news and they're saying that like you know people with dark clothing on are going to come steal your pets and here I am and I know both of us there we are like well

a hairdresser is going to come and steal your kids a hairdresser is going to come steal your animals and your kids sacrifice them the West Memphis three case which we will cover oh yeah you better believe in multiple parts oh that's going to be a multi-party that's a good ass case that was a piece of lateral damage from this really disturbing time that resembled the witch trials a little too much with the hysteria that was caused. Homosexuality was seen by fundamentalist as the work of the devil at this time. So Scudder and Joey just really didn't stand a chance of being seen as anything other than evil demons who deserved what they got.

That makes me really sad. The media portrayed them as such. Of course. They referred back to the occult books, you know, all the other. cult stuff found in the house, any of the stuff like pentagrams and stuff that they found. And they essentially just kind of like made it an afterthought that these two innocent men were brutally murdered in their home for a bag of change. Right.

The public went nuts. This whole case was labeled the devil worshippers case. So it was like never about, it was never about the victims like painting them as victims. It was like the devil worshippers. Right. And that's not what they are. They don't worship the devil. there was also a documentary about the case that was created and hosted by unbelievably conservative religious bias and basically painted them as like asking for it.

I just people got murdered. I know you just said that, but I'm just like still at that point. No, it will never make sense. And the person who hosted this documentary actually tried to, she had Teresa interview with her. And Teresa was obviously fucking there. And she wanted her to kind of support her agenda of the victims actually being devil worshippers who drugged these people. Oh, is that where the wine LSD comes in? But Teresa adamantly claimed there were no drugs that night aside from the Tudaloo that they had huffed themselves.

Right. Brought themselves beforehand. She said, there was no drugs. We were drinking wine. And she said, I drank the same wine that they did. None of us were drugged because that was the big thing. now they were like, oh, they put LSD in the wine. And like these guys went nuts.

That's what happened. Oh, my God. And she was like, nope. And she said... Also, acid doesn't make you a fucking murderer. No. And she said she never even saw drug paraphernalia in the home or around it. She said there was nothing there that would suggest those drugs. But they were like, well, the devil.

Yeah, they were like, pretty sure you're dumb. So she then revealed in this interview that once Avery had shot Dr. Scudder, she said, He looked at Tony and said something along the lines of like, now tell me I don't have the guts to kill nobody. So this was like fucking truth or dare? So she was like, so he was fully aware of what he was doing. Like this wasn't him being crazy on drugs. He was very aware of what he was doing.

And it had been planned, obviously. So feeding into the public's craziness about this, defense attorneys said the two murderers, Tony and Avery, were given line, laced with LSD, by Sky. And even though they had literally zero evidence of this, there was none found in their systems, and none of the bottles tested had any LSD in them. This is so annoying. And like I had said earlier that they found LSD in the property because he did have it in the property. They found three vials of LSD 25, which is the government LSD.

They were found in a cigar box on Scudder's desk. Like they were in a scar box. They weren't like laying around. Yeah. So they weren't just like chilling in the pink room. Yeah. And like I said, they were trying to prove that they, that's it. He drugged the wine. But it came out via the evidence.

They couldn't prove that at all because in fact the evidence pointed that there was literally no LSD on anything. Right. Only in those vials. Wasn't on anything else. Wasn't anywhere. While in jail, Avery attempted suicide at one point. That's interesting. And he was offered the chance for life in prison instead of the death penalty.

He also confessed about eight times. Okay. And never, ever mentioned that he was drugged until all of a sudden it came out that they found those LSD vials. And all of a sudden it became sued for casual. Suddenly, I remember. Yeah. Suddenly, I remember that I was drugged. So suddenly I had a brand new story about being super trippy during the murders.

Oh, yeah. And he thought the dogs were these, like, giant monsters. Yeah. And he said everything was glowing all of a sudden. Totally. And he was an idiot because when he was asked during this whole thing about whether he had read up on LSD and its effects at all, he said, well, not till I got in here. You're fucking kidding me. Really?

So he researched it to pretend he had been drunk. Like, he researched the effects of it and then just, he just blurted it back. At trial, he was found guilty on all. counts and sentenced to three consecutive life terms. Well, at least the jury wasn't a bunch of fucking douchebags. Thank goodness. He's still currently serving his sentence in Georgia State prison. Good. Prision. Prision. He's in prison. They are in prison. They put him in prison. Is that worse than prison? That's different from prison. It's for special folks. It's for the real dumb ones. You know what? You don't even deserve prison. No. We're giving you an extra H in that because you're that

dumb. No. Because that's how you pronounce it. That's how you pronounce it because you're dumb. So Tony West was convicted of double homicide and sentenced to die in the electric chair. Yeah. But his

death sentence was repealed. The death sentence was repealed and he's currently serving out a life sentence at Augusta State Medical Prison. Okay. Prision. Is he in prison or prussian? I think he's a prison too. I think they both deserve to be

in prison and prison. plenty of other places I could be. There was a small private funeral held at Corpsewood for Odin, Odom and Scutter. This case really hurt my heart. Odom's ashes were scuttered, scuttered. Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh, my God. I meant scuttered. Wow. I know. That was like a slip. A really sad slip. It was so sad.

Odom's ashes were scattered in his rose garden. I know. I actually just started crying. Goodbye. Didn't that just like? You know the feeling when you're actually going to cry. Yeah. It's like when we were talking about Phoebe's Viking funeral in our Phoebe Handstuck episode. It's just too beautiful for me. It's just gives you like, oh. It's exactly all the things I want to do when I die.

Right. It's just like, oh my goodness. Like I just want to be in a rose garden and also get a Viking sent off. Because he loved that rose garden. Can you write that down? Yeah. Thank you. I will.

It's now being recorded for posterity. Scudder's body was sent home to Milwaukee because that's what his sister requested. Oh. Even now today, people still go and visit the spot of this Because there's still like some ruins up of the banner basically Which I'd love to see this place. I would love to go and see it. And of course, people think they see like ghosts there and hear voices there.

People say that they hear gunshot, sparking dogs and shattering glass. And they also say that they hear Scutters Golden Heart playing. I hope they hear that. I hope they do hear that. If I went there, I would. want to hear that and I hope he's like sitting just playing his heart yeah peacefully in the pink room earlier I mentioned that there was one piece of artwork that was oh what was it very intriguing that they took or that they no it was still there it was just a very it's very interesting they found

it when they were investigating so months before this whole thing happened Odom woke up in the middle of the night and told Scudder that he had a terrible nightmare about him and Charles so he described the whole thing to him and Charles was, or Scudder was so disturbed by it that he decided I have to paint this because it's therapeutic. I need to get this out. It was a self-portrait

that is literally a premonition of his death. No. In the painting, Scudder is gagged and has five bullet wounds in his head. No. He died, gagged, with five bullet wounds in his head.

Both Avery and Tony said they never saw that painting. Because of course people were like, well, maybe they were trying to recreate it. No, they're not that smart. They both said they were like, no, we never saw that. Also, they're just not fucking smart. And why? They're not artists.

They wouldn't even know that that was him probably in the painting. I'm going to post a photo of the painting. I just got goosebumps. Like how did, and this was months before this happened. Also, that's love. Right? Like, they were so in love. Right.

I feel like they were. Like, I feel like it was like, they had like real partnership. I don't know why. I just want to watch Heather's now. That's got on. I know. Well, now, like, what, now I just, like, want to know what he meant by I asked for this. Because there's so many different things.

Did he mean, like, because I painted it to life? It could be, it could be, I asked for this because I put us in this isolated area. It could be, I asked for this because we are two gay men living in the deep south in the 80s. And I, I asked for this. Like, why did I do this? Or, like, I invited this kid into our house. I, I, exactly, like, I, I was hospitable to strangers. I asked for this.

Like, I let people into my home. I think he meant that he was different than, like, what was acceptable in that area. That's what I think. And he asked for it. I think it was a combination of, like, I'm different. I'm what people are seeing as, like, eccentric and not okay and, like, dangerous. And I also allowed these people to come into my home. My heart.

I just collapsed. Which is just, she really did. I just needed a minute. Isn't that like such a tale? Oh, such a tale. No, that one, that one really hurt. Yeah, that one is like a really tough one. That's just really awful and so senseless.

And they fucking just took dimes and nickels. Senseless crime. Ever. And it's like these men invited you into their home and like we're giving you their wine that they made and it's just like I'm really sad about this. I'm so glad they're in prison forever. Me too. Thank goodness.

Actually, excuse me, their impression. That they're in prision forever. Thank you. Because that's what they deserve. You deserve prision. And then I feel bad. I'm like, I wonder what Teresa Hudgens is feeling these days. Well, I'd like to tell you that she never went on another date again. Like, I never would.

I'm like, no, that's how I think of. How would you ever? No, I just wouldn't. Ever trust another human? I just wouldn't. But then again, it's like poor, and I say poor Joey, I believe he didn't know what was going on. No, I don't think either of them did. And it's like, that guy is like, Jesus. Because I think Teresa would have been able to tell if he, and then she would have said so. Yeah, I think so too.

Because she was very upfront about everything that happened. And she has, like, I heard some interviews with her. And if I can post some, I will. I don't know if I can. She has, like, the cutest, just little, like, southern. Like we were huff and totelo. Like she sounds very much like the people from like the West Memphis 3 documentary. Oh.

She has that very like. She's just like down home. Just exact. Just that like that wholesome accent. Wholesome. And she just seems like she just, she just didn't know, man. And I just feel so bad.

Oh, honey. The whole thing. That's why you don't go on a first date and then go hang out with like two other dudes and huff paint with them. Yeah. If Tudaloo. is involved, Tooteloo. Get out of there. I love that. It's like dare, but different. It is. Just say no to drugs. Just say Tudaloo to drugs. Just say Tudaloo to drugs. Except LSD.

Yeah, unless it's in wine, which it wasn't, okay? Which it wasn't. Wow. So that's the murders at Corpsewood Manor. That was not a mini morbid. I don't think it was. All right, guys, if you want to follow us on Instagram, you can do so at Morbid Podcast. If you want to follow us on Twitter. Morbid podcast. Send us a Gmail. Morbidpodcast at gmail.com. Join the fucking Facebook group. Morbid, colon, a true crime podcast.

Uh, donate to the Patreon if you're feeling so inclined. Patreon.com slash morbid podcast. Uh, and also go check out the website that my lovely co-host so greatly designed at. Murderpodcast.com. Murderpodcast. What? I almost sit because I was thinking murder apparel. I was like, that's not the website.

Murder pot. I wonder with that. Long. Actually, I wonder what that website is. Murderpodcast.com. Right. Morbidpodcast.com. We hope you keep listening. And we hope you...

Keep it. Weird. I don't know if I can do it for this. I just wanted to say, but not so weird that you have to go to go live by. Yeah. Bye. Bye.