Morbid - Rodney Alcala: The Dating Game Killer (Part 2)

Episode Date: February 3, 2025

At the time of his appearance on The Dating Game in 1978, Alcala was a convicted sexual predator who had served time for sexual assault and had only avoided a charge of attempted murder on a technicality. After his arrest, investigators would learn that, by the time he appeared on the game show, he was also a killer. In the year that followed, Alcala would go on to murder several other women until he was finally caught and convicted for his crimes. At his trial, Rodney Alcala was found guilty of eight murders, among other crimes, but he is suspected of several other murders, perhaps as many as one hundred or more.Thank you to the Incredible Dave White of Bring Me the Axe Podcast for research and Writing support!ReferencesAssociated Press. 1980. "Forest worker tells of grisly body find, fingers defendent ." Daily Breeze (Torrence, CA), March 23: 7.—. 1980. "Witness in Alcala trial admits lying." Los Angeles Times, March 26: 44.—. 1980. "Jury deliberate murder charge." Oakland Tribune, April 30: E3.Brown, Doug. 1980. "Jury asks for the death penalty." Los Angeles Times, May 9: 32.—. 1980. "Prosecution rests case in penalty part of Alcala trial." Los Angeles Times, May 8: 63.CBS News. 2024. "Rodney Alcala: The Killing Game." 48 Hours .Dunn, Edward. 1977. "Oneida woman slain in L.A." Post-Standard (Syracuse, NY), November 15: 1.Esquivel, Paloma. 2010. "Alcala gets death penalty." Los Angeles Times, March 10: 72.Falcon, Gabriel. 2010. Convicted serial killer won on 'Dating Game'. March 10. Accessed November 18, 2024. https://web.archive.org/web/20240814201903/https://edition.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/03/08/dating.game.killer/index.html.Hicks, Jerry. 1986. "Alcala again given death sentence in slaying of girl, 12." Los Angeles Times, June 21: 50.—. 1986. "Alcala asks jury to spare him, insists he isn't a murderer." Los Angeles Times, June 19: 141.Jarlson, Gary. 1979. "Hunt for missing girls spreads to Oxnard." Los Angeles Times, June 28: 10.—. 1979. "In search for girl's killer, time is the principal foe." Los Angeles Times, July 14: 22.Kaye, Peter. 1981. "The long, painful path to justice." Daily Breeze (Torrence, CA), June 18: 19.Kirkman, Edward. 1971. "Fear of a new sex killing spurs 6 on trail." Daily News (New York, NY), August 8: 75.Levenson , Michael, and Eduardo Medina. 2021. "'Dating Game killer,' who preyed on woman in 1970s, dies in prison." New York Times, July 26.Liff, Mark, Joseph Martin, and Paul Meskil. 1977. "Attorney urges FBI to hunt daughter." Daily News (New York, NY), July 31: 3.Los Angeles Times. 1980. "Alcala defense wtiness's story repeated to jury." Los Angeles Times, April 30: 42.—. 1979. "The Southland." Los Angeles Times, June 22: 30.—. 1977. "Police now see link in strangulation murders of 10 LA women." Sacramento Bee, December 1: 22.Moynihan, Colin. 2012. "Convicted killer pleads guilty to 2 New York murders." New York Times, December 15: 20.OC Weekly. 2010. Rodney Alcala's murderous romp through polite society brings him to an Orange County courtroom again. January 21. Accessed November 19, 2024. https://www.ocweekly.com/rodney-alcalas-murderous-romp-through-polite-society-brings-him-to-an-orange-county-courtroom-again-6402172/.Pelisek, Christine. 2010. "Rodney Alcala: the fine art of killing." LA Weekly, January 21.Reyes, David. 1986. "Man convicted second time in murder of girl." Los Angeles Times, May 29: 43.Sands, Stella. 2011. The Dating Game Killer: The True Story of a TV Dating Show, a Violent Sociopath, and a Series of Brutal Murders. New York, NY: St. Martin's.Secret, Mosi. 2011. "After decades, charges in 2 Manhattan murders." New York Times, January 27: 24.Smith, David. 2024. "The terrifying true story behind Woman of the Hour." The Guardian, October 22.The People v. Rodney James Alcala. 1984. 36 Cal. 3d 605 (Supreme Court of California, August 23).Weinstein, Henry. 2003. "New trial, new charge in old cases." Los Angeles Times, June 28:32. Cowritten by Alaina Urquhart, Ash Kelley & Dave White (Since 10/2022)Produced & Edited by Mikie Sirois (Since 2023)Research by Dave White (Since 10/2022), Alaina Urquhart & Ash KelleyListener Correspondence & Collaboration by Debra LallyListener Tale Video Edited by Aidan McElman (Since 6/2025) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, weirdos. I am Ash. And I'm Elena. And this is morbid. It's a listener tales edition. And it's brought to you, by, you, for you from you, and all about you. See, I remember this time. Let's go. Last time I had a big old brain fart. You did. It was a little scary. Yeah, I feel like, like, just a brand new day today. Yeah, we scheduled a lot of things. I feel good today. I feel like we're like in a good vibe with the, with scheduling everything. I also think for the first time I'm actually feeling out of my COVID brain fog. Well, there you go. Yeah. I feel like for a while I was in like a post-COVID funk.

It hangs on, man. It does. Like I didn't, I was lucky enough to get out of that when I had it because I was asymptomatic. I knew it was coming. I didn't, but I didn't have to deal with any of the effects, which I feel like everybody else has had to deal with and I feel bad. I know. Also, sorry if you just heard my seat. I was going to say.

I wasn't actually farting because we were talking about farting. that's just a creek. But you know what? We're going to get new seats because these are not comfortable either. It annoys me that yours doesn't creak. Yeah. Mine is like rude to my butt. Yours is rude. And John had to sit in that chair when we recorded. And he was like, why the fuck do you sit in this chair? Like he was like, it's not comfortable. Why do you sit in these chairs? These are not comfortable. I'm like, I don't know. I feel like it keeps us on our game because we're not comfortable throughout. Yeah, you have a weird thing about not being comfy when we record. Because we used to record on the couch, which I'll give to you.

you, I would sink in and just be like, so next week. Yeah, it just makes you too dreamy. We get comfy office chairs. Yeah, that's allowed. Yeah, we need to get some comfy chairs. And we will. You know, we will. It'll happen.

For anybody, just like a little nostalgia moment, for anybody that was at our first Providence Live show, those are the chairs we're sitting in. Yeah, we're still sitting in those chairs. Yeah, so these chairs are, they're like from Target. They've been through it. Yeah. You know? They do the job right now.

We got our money's worth. We did. We've been using them for years. So there you go. Chairs. But you know what? Today is not about chairs. Today is about you. Not your chair, not your problem. But you know what? I hope you all have very comfortable chairs as you listen to this. I do too. You know, I'm giving out good chair vibes. And with that, let's do the first listener tale. This is going to be a fun one just judging by the names of these. All the, well, the intro as well, there you go. We're on the same page here, obviously. But no, all the titles of these. ones because again we haven't read these ahead of time but the titles they're they're giving it to me so I'm excited about this I'm just going to preview you one that I am dying to read we actually structured the episode so that I could read it and we're not reading it first it's third it's cuckoo for coca grandma and I just need to read that she did she was like I'm reading that one so how can we structure this to make sure that happens but before we get to that one I'm first going to read I'm sure an equally amazing listener tale and it was for you because it says ye There you go. And more specifically, it says, eat all the Ouija boards into the fire pits of hell, which, like, I shared the same sentiment. And we were just talking about this. We were, which is weird. All right. I'm not sure if I can say this person's name. So let me open it up. It says,

I've included a double-spaced put-a-fa for your reading pleasure. Appreciate it. I do. Hello, gorgeous ladies. Thank you. I love that it just starts with thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I discovered your podcast. in the beginning of COVID when my kids were doing their school from home. I was working from home, quote unquote, but it mostly consisted of like five emails a day. I didn't have much to do. So I decided to start getting active again. Oh, bless your soul. Good for you. In a nice way. I started jogging a few miles a day. Oh, wow, you're a great human. And walking like 10 more. Oh, hell yeah. When I see my step count at the end of the day, I want to sign up for like, well,

Barry's boot camp or something. Barry's boot camp. I'm never walking. apparently. Yeah, we're not doing a whole lot of walking here. You all kept me thoroughly entertained. And then you kept me entertained while I was laid up on my couch because of hip pain from said exercise. Oh, no. Oh, that's the worst. And then you kept me sane while recovering, oh no, from two hip surgeries. All right, maybe I won't go jogging. Oh, damn. Two hip surgeries in this last year. Oh, I'm so sorry. That escalated so quickly. It did. You were like, get active. Never mind. Just kidding. It's been a terrible couple years, but you were one of the bright spots.

So again, thank you for being badass bitches. You are also one of the bright spots, all of you. And a badass bitch, all of you. Sorry, I just bumped my microphone like an asshole. Now, this is not a first person story for me, but it is one of the scariest stories I've been told, so I need to share it. For me, the story starts when I was in high school in 1996,

the year of ash. The year of ash. My grandfather passed away, and a couple of my mom's high school best friends came down to, came to town for the funeral. When these particular friends came around, my mom always reverted her, to her high school self. There was an impressive amount of alcohol consumption and a lot of hilarious stories about them growing up in our small paper mill town in the Pacific Northwest.

Oh, it's like a book. I love this. This is literally a book. And when I say small paper mill town, our old high school mascot was the paper maker. Paper makers? Fuck yeah, it was. That's amazing. Hell yeah, it was.

One of my mascots was a woodchuck, and I thought that was like silly. Yeah, that is silly, but the paper makers is... That's iconic. Chefskis. Chefskis. Let's just say that having such a hilariously terrible mascot led to some pretty great pep assemblies with kids running around with toiletlets around their necks, and tossing toilet paper rolls into the crowd of students.

This is legendary. It's wonderful. Anyway, I digress. Many of the stories revolved around how badass my grandfather was. After most of a bottle of Jameson Irish whiskey, my mom's friend said, I still to this day can't even watch anything having to do with a Ouija board. The whole room went still and my mom left the room to get another drink. Being the pain in the ass 16 year old self, I started bugging them for the story behind that. So after many attempts at changing the story, I decided to use the fact that I was the only sober person in the room to my benefit and I finally convinced them to tell me what the hell they were talking about. Here's the legend as it goes. Oh, I'm excited. I'm stoked. One night, when they were all in the 10th grade,

my mom and these same friends came over to my mom's house to hang out. It was my mom and three friends. Harlan thought it would be funny to bring the Ouija board that his sister had gotten for Christmas because he was kind of a dick and wanted to fuck with the girls and freak them out. Of course Harlan wanted to do that. Ah, the 60s. When Ouija boards was a totally normal present to your preteen kids at Christmas.

I forget who we were talking to recently, but they were like, isn't it funny that the Ouija board is made by Mattel? Oh, yes. It was Trid. It was Trid. He was like, isn't that funny that it's just from Mattel? It is hilarious. Elena did a great episode about the history of Ouija boards.

If you want to go back and find it, I don't know the episode number. Thank you so much. Of course. My grandma was out for the evening and my grandpa was in his room in the basement. Yes. Now, I never got a straight answer on why grandpa was forced to sleep in the cold damp dungeon. I actually went back because I thought I had read it wrong. I was like, wait.

But my grandma claimed it. it was because his boots were stinky. I'm calling bullshit on that. I'm like, listen, I have stinky feet and I'd be pissed if Drew made me sleep in a basement. I was just going to say, the next line was what I was thinking. Yes. Maybe you just put his boots in the basement instead of grandpa. Like, why do we have to put the whole ass man in the basement?

Not just his boots. Just the way you weren't in that instead of grandpa. Anyway, their marriage is a whole. other side story, but it involves a lot of stomping down the stairs and muttering, god damn son of a bitch woman. Honestly, I feel like a lot of grandparents have that little, like, this dynamic is very of that time, I think. Yeah. Oh, this is funny. I'm like trying to get my breath. Anyway, the dumb ass teenager set the board up on the kitchen table that was right on the top of the stairs to the basement. They turned off all the lights, lit a couple candles, and sat down,

to quote unquote play. The first the first minutes consisted of all of them obviously pushing it around, giggling and not taking anything seriously. But all of a sudden, the glass piece pushed to the right of the middle, excuse me, to the right? It pushed right. Thank you. I don't know why I just short-circuited. I will start that sentence again. I just want it to. All of a sudden, the glass piece pushed right to the middle of the board and went completely rigid. It was so abrupt that all of them screamed, Harlan louder than any of them. Ha, Harlan. Take that dickhead.

They wrote that not me. But I agree. I do. None of them could push the glass piece for a few seconds. And then it started swirling around the board. They all looked at each other in what they described as, what in the holy fuck is going on kind of look. Perfect description.

I get it. I see it in my head. I do too. I kind of have the same look. Yeah. My mom was finally able to mutter, who is this? Just kept swirling.

After about a minute, it started going to what, seemed to be random letters, but after a couple of minutes, they noticed that it was going to the same eight letters in the same sequence over and over again. Ooh. F-I-C-K-D-I-C-H. Fick-D-C-H. Fick-D-D-H. They were all confused. This went on for like five to six minutes. They were so engrossed in what was going on that my mom didn't even noticed my grandpa had come upstairs and was standing by the table watching them. He's like, what the He's like, what did I get you? At that moment, they noticed that instead of just the eight letters over and over and over again, it added three.

Excuse me. It added three more. Now it was spelling out F-I-C-K-D-I-C-H-L-E, fict ditchly over and over and over again. My mom looked at my grandpa Lee and said, we don't know what it's saying. His face, now pale and white, slowly said. it's saying, fuck you Lee in German. When I said ditch or like dick, it sounded very like I've heard it before, but I was like, I don't know if I have, but fictically.

Yes, when I said it like that, because I had a grandma that was just a German and she taught me all the swear words. Yep. Amazing. At that point, everyone let go of the glass piece and it started spinning before flying 10 feet across the room. Fuck you, Lee. That's, that's hilarious.

want to know who was saying that. Everyone just kind of sat there and stunned silence for a minute, processing what just happened. Then my grandpa grabbed the board, hauled ass downstairs with the horrified teens closely behind. Oh, he went to the back door to his fire pit. They all stood there and watched as he poured gasoline on it and threw in a match. They all just stood there in another stunned silence, staring at the fire until my mom broke the silence as she looked at my grandpa and said, what just happened? Do you want to explain this, sir? Dad. My grandpa just stared at the fire for what seemed like a full minute as his daughter just

stared him down. He finally turned his head to her, looked her straight in the eye for like 30 seconds, said nothing, and then walked back inside and closed his bedroom door. Okay. I feel like I understand my grandma relegated him to the base. He's a little creepy. He's a little withholding. I know. Do I love your grandpa? My mom's friends decided that it was a good time to nope the fuck out of the house. Yes. While Harlan had to try to figure out how to explain to his little sister that her game was now a pile of fucked up creepy ash. Fuffed up creepy ash. That's what we call ash. Yeah, totally. That's what I'm known as. Fucked up creepy ash. When my grandmother finally came home that night, my mom had a lot of questions. She told her what had happened, and my grandma went as pale white

as my grandpa had been. My grandmother tried to evade the questions, but my mom was much better at getting her to talk. The story goes like this. When my grandpa was a World War II, him and another member of his platoon had been captured by a couple pretty sadistic German soldiers who tied them up in some little shack in the jungle. After the initial capture, one of the other German soldiers was never seen again, and just one of the men kept coming back. The second day in captivity, the German soldiers executed my grandpa's partner. That's really sad. Right in front of him. Oh. Oh, that's, I can't even imagine. Oh, got real sobering, real fast. Yes. My grandpa's,

knew that he was going to be next and that this man was getting off on the fear for my grandpa. He left the body right now. Oh my God. He left the body right next to my grandfather and left. He knew he was going to die if he didn't find a good way to get the hell out of there. So when the psycho left, he spent hours trying to loosen the ties. Right as he got loose enough to try to escape, he heard the soldier coming back. Being quick on his feet and the badass that he was, he pretended to still be tied up until the soldier walked past him. He then charged at him. He then charged at and tackled him to the ground. The man's rifle flew out of his hands and they both scrambled toward it, but my grandpa was able to grab it. As he was pointing the gun at the man, trying to

figure out what to do next, the man charged at him screaming fictit, fictic, I think. Fickdick, probably. Fickdick, right? I like how you just had to say it in like a somewhat German accent. Yeah, it didn't work out. I am German, but like not actively. Not actively. I'm not actively German. You know what I mean? So my grandfather shot him. I booked my mind. That's a tough thing to live through. That's hard too because it's like you probably felt like he had to for his escape. Yeah. And his original thoughts were probably I don't, you don't think anybody, you know, most people

don't want to kill another person. Of course. That's not what anybody wants to do. And it looks like he was trying to figure out what to do in this scenario. Yeah. That was kind of the only thing he could do. It was self-defense. It was self-defense.

Exactly. He then picked up his friend's body because he wanted to make sure he would get a proper burial and his mother would have closure. Oh, what a good guy. Your grandpa is amazing. She said the only reason she even knows this story is because after 10 years of marriage and him waking up screaming multiple times a week, I understand the basement now. Yep.

She finally got him to tell her about this. I'm now wondering if that's why he slept in the basement. My grandma did always talk about getting her beauty sleep, and I'm sure random screaming in the middle of the night gave my grandma, or my grandma, some unacceptable eyebags. Oh, my God. Me and your grandma would be friends. After they finished telling me the story, I realized why my very non-religious mom once had a panic attack when I came home from a sleepover, telling her about playing light as a feather, stiff as a board, and playing with, you guessed it, a Ouija board. I remember being baffled that she was so interested in what a bunch of 11-year-olds did at a sleepover.

She had made me promise never to touch a Ouija board again without telling me why. Luckily, there were no sadistic German ghosts coming through at our prepubescent party while I was sitting. in my new kids on the block sleeping bag. Amazing. I never did play with one after she asked me not to at 11 years old. But after finding out why when I was 16, I refused to even have one around. Which is really hard for my atheist ass to justify when I really don't think I believe in any of this shit.

But when you see the fear in your mother's eyes while telling you a story like this, it sticks with you. I just try to chalk all this stuff up to, oh my God, Elena. The thing science can't explain yet, but I don't even think I buy that. Oh my God, I'm with you. Did Elena write that? Seriously. Anyway, keep it weird and stay the fuck away from Ouija boards, Trish.

Trish. I got to play this for one of my favorite uncles because we're going on a family trip soon and he wanted to use a Ouija. And I was like, Billy, we can't. Billier. Shout out to Billy. I hope you're listening. That's what my kids call their uncle Billy. Yeah.

Billier. Billier. That's what they've called this adorable. Okay. Billier. So shout out to Bill yet. Shout out to Bill Ye. Trish.

First of all, like that was a phenomenal story to tell. And also now looking at how the grandpa reacted to that, can you imagine what he felt in that moment? Because he probably, I can't even know. I can't. It's this sadistic piece of shit who killed his friend. In front of him.

In front of him. Taunting him from beyond. Like that must have been such a harrowing. moment for him. Taunting him from beyond in his house. That makes you feel like the spirit is in your home. To his daughter and her friends. Yeah, I would be interested to hear like a little follow-up if anything else happened after that because some people think that you're not supposed to burn a Ouija board. Some people think that can like spread spirits everywhere. I think it can just spread spirits everywhere. You know, like ghost posters question mark. I don't know. It's like when you turn the hose onto mist,

you just missed spirits everywhere. It's like when you lift a big bag of. of money off of a pedal in a house in a glass house filled with inscriptions that are supposed to keep the spirits contained and they get out. They spray everywhere. Have you guys seen 13 ghosts? That's what that reference was from, by the way. We just covered it on screen. So that's why it's real fresh in our mind, but go listen to it on scream. It's great. Yay. It was my pick, and I'm glad I picked it. I think it comes out next. It might take a minute to come out. It'll be out someday. Keep an eye on it. It's out there someday. All right. My next one, is going to be called Salmanilla, a phone call, and I noped the fuck out of a murder. Maybe.

Ooh. Ooh. I mean, you're alive, so I assume. So you did. I'm assuming, though. I shouldn't assume. Now, hi, Elena, Ash, and all you weirdos, hello. Hi.

Hello. Hey. First off, I would like to take a moment to gush and fan girl over both of you. You don't have to do that, but you're amazing. Thank you. I absolutely love your podcast and really enjoy your banter. Thank you. I work from home and until the girls from work,

suggested morbid, I was only listening to my Audible app. Since I was going through a book a day, cha-ching, LOL, I decided to listen to my trusty co-workers and check out your podcast. Hello to Norma and the RCM girls. Hey, Norma and the RCM girls. Hey, friends. I am not quite caught up with all the episodes yet, but boy am I glad I took their advice because you two are great. Thank you. You're great. You Norma and all the RCM girls are also great. You're amazing. Everyone's great. Secondly, I must apologize in advance. This story will certainly be long-winded. and chaotic as I figuratively deadbolted the door and chucked the key to this memory ages ago. Just recently, my subconscious must have found the damn key and reopened the door because it all came crashing back.

Oh boy. For this tale, you may call me L. All right. Hey, Elle. Thank you so much. Buckle up, your Delorian awaits to take you back to the late 80s. I was around 18 years young then. Yes, I am that old.

You're not old. You are young. You're wonderful and magical. I grew up in a very small town in South Dakota while attending U.S. and working part-time, I made up my mind that even though I never really traveled or lived anywhere else, I didn't want to stay in my hometown and ultimately, quote, end up with my own bar stool. A cheers reference for all you young folks. Hey, we're from Boston. We get it. Hell yeah. Fast forward about five months later. And somehow I ended up in New Jersey.

A young 18-year-old kid from the sticks of South Dakota set off to get a job and make some friends. Yay, life is so exciting. It always feels that way. Well, on my quest to make a life for myself in a new place, fate slapped me in my plump wrinkle-free face. And I met, well, let's call him douche canoe. Let's, because I can already tell. We dated for a while, and naturally he introduced me to some of his friends. One friend, Matt and I, remained friendly, even after things fizzled out with douche canoe. Matt and I never dated, just casual friends.

I never called him to hang out, but he would randomly call me or stop by my house to catch up. One day, and for the first time, he invited me to his house. He was still living with his parents, so I got to meet his mom, dad, and brother. They were all very warm and welcoming, especially his mother. On the drive back to my house, Matt told me he was adopted. It was a brief conversation, but I recall saying to him, he is lucky to have such an awesome loving family, and he genuinely agreed. Throughout the two-ish years I'd gotten to know Matt,

there were some things he did that made me scratch my head. One night he came to my house with bullet holes in his car. Oh, that's something to do to someone. When I asked him about it, he made up some nonchalant excuse. So nonchalant, I can't even remember what it was. A nonchalant bullet hole excuse. How do you come up with one of those? Another time he visited me after returning from Ecuador.

He pulled pills from his pocket and took them with no explanation. But at the time, I was as worldly as a tadpole, and he was always very polite and kind to me. did my best to muffle the ringing of my inner alarm bells. I get it. Totally. We've all been there. Let's move to the beginning of January 1991. I was managing a local restaurant in the area. One night, I could not shake a haunting and overwhelming feeling that Matt was going to do something horrible. Ooh. I had no idea what, when or how. All night in between orders, running plates, putting out fires and greeting patrons, I could not shake this feeling. I even picked up the phone and called douche canoe to ask if he had heard from Matt. and to tell him and warn him about this horrible feeling I had that something bad was going to happen.

That's so crazy that it was such a specific feeling. It even made you call Dush Canoe. I know. That's how you know. Yeah. Within a few days of that phone call, I ended up with a case of salmonella. Oh. Oh, and spent an entire week at the hospital. Cook your food thoroughly, kids.

Oh, oh. Just for anybody that doesn't know, I'm sure everybody knows, but you can get like that Pillsbury or like Toll House cookie dough. I forget which one it is. It's the one with, yeah, Pillsbury. Yeah. with a little boy. Little boy. They make ones that you can eat now.

Oh, yeah. Yeah, the cookie dough. You're welcome. Around January 25th and out of the blue, Matt called me and asked if I wanted to come and hang out at his house. Quote, for a while. Yeah. Other than meeting his parents briefly about a year earlier, we never hung at his house. This coupled with that overwhelming feeling was enough for me to decline his seemingly

odd invitation. Matt did not take this well and was adamant and continued insisting. I go to his house. Although I had made a full recovery, I used that excuse and told him I was not fully recovered. And my then-boyfriend and now ex-husband, it took me over 20 years to get rid of that asshat. Good riddins. Yeah, good riddins, man. Dush canoes and ass hats, I'm sorry.

Always. Was coming over to take care of me. Four days later, on January 29th, I learned that Matt murdered his parents. Oh, my gosh. Holy shit. He shot them both. Later authorities discovered that he had written mom and dad on the bullets. I just got that like, um, yeah, boom.

I read that on the same day he murdered his parents. He took his girlfriend to dinner in New York City to celebrate her birthday. When they arrived back at Matt's house, he handcuffed her, showed her his dead parents, and said, for your birthday present, I'm going to kill both of us too. I don't even, what the fuck? Wow. Throughout the night, plans must have changed because he decided he was, would book two plane tickets to Jamaica instead. His girlfriend told him she needed to go home first to

get her passport. When they got to her house, her mom must have known something was wrong and refused to let her leave with Matt. Thank goodness. What is his deal? So after murdering his parents, Matt went to Jamaica by himself. Due to some trouble he'd gotten into during a previous trip, he was arrested shortly after he arrived. Who is this human? Why was he in trouble in Jamaica previously? When they ran his information through the system, they found out he fled the U.S. and was wanted for murdering his parents. He was caught five days after the murders.

This is easily one of the most crazy listener tales we've ever gotten. I believe I locked this memory away because I was so freaked out and wondering, oh, m.g, was that going to be me? Was I going to be handcuffed and murdered? Is that why he was so persistent in trying to get me back to his house only or a few short days before he did this to his girlfriend. Yep. Always trust your gut.

Even if you are as worldly as a tadpole. His name is Matthew, what is his name? Matthew. Hecla? Hickla? Although he may be going by Matthew Eric Debenabelto, as I think he had, he found his biological parents. He murdered his adoptive parents on January 29th, 1991 in Bernard's TWP, New Jersey,

and was sentenced to a minimum of 60 years. in case you or one of the other weirdos want to check into it further. I do. That is my tail. Keep it weird, but not so weird that. Take it away, Ash. Girl, you expect me to take it away after that. I don't even know what to say. Keep it weird, but not so weird that you murder your entire family, I guess,

and try to do the same thing to the girlfriend that you have and you run to Jamaica and you try to do this to our friend, Elle. Elle. I'm very glad that you did not go. Because that would not have ended well. I'm shook right now. My whole body. that would have been the detail of him writing mom and dad on the bullets and just uh i like obviously

we don't know the situation in depth so i'm just looking at this from a very like generalized point of view yeah thank you i needed that i can't even process thoughts right now but like these people adopted him and like like probably wanted a baby so badly and like yeah what well and from l she said they seemed great everybody seemed like they were loving and happy wow wow Wow, Elle. All right. I can see why you buried that for a little while. I could also see that as well.

Holy canoli. Woo. Oh my goodness. Our next tale is cuckoo for Cocoa Grandma. I love it. And it says, Hi there, my dudes. Says they would like to remain anonymous,

so we're going to call them Susie. Hey, Susie. It says, I won't write too much in this email because God knows that I'm, I rambled the fuck out in the potofa attached below. But I will say I love your podcast, your banter, and your unapologetic dismay for summer. Oh my God.

We've been saying it so often lately. It's this point in summer, like July. I'm done. Oh, July, I'm beyond. I'm already in fall. Like, by, I'm out. But June hits and I'm like, well, that was a nice day and a half of summer. Like, I'm like, get me out of here.

I think the only reason I like June is it's my birth month. Oh, I hate summer. They said, let's skip to October. Am I right? Yes. You are right. While my boyfriend tells me that I have spooky brains, The story attached below is more heartfelt than scary, so I totally get it if it's not the vibes you're looking for.

It's a nice little palate cleanser. It's a perfect palate cleanser because we had some gnarly ones. I know, right? And then they said, P.S., I found out that I met Drew at a house party a couple years back. Small world. That's wild. That's hilarious. I'm going to have to ask if you remembers us.

If you remembers you, Susie. I'm right. So the first thing you need to know about my grandma is that she was a total badass. Yes. I'm talking about a woman whom, yes, March. alongside MLK, published multiple novels, and raised a whole ass family. I'm like, literally, I'm sitting here like saying it with my hands and my arms. Just fist pumping as we go. I'm like, motherfucking yes. Hell yeah. Not only did she get life right, but she got death right too.

Get it. Grandma Sandy had been diagnosed with dementia when I was in high school. That's so hard. I'm sorry. And I decided to make a point of getting lunch with her once a week during study hall. Wow. You're a beautiful human. You're the grand kid that like we all hope we have someday. Truly. Each time I would take her to Uno's. and she would emphatically exclaim that they had added spaghetti squash to the menu, her favorite. I never had the heart to tell her that it had been on the menu for over a year because hell, it made her wicked happy and who gives a flying fuck. Exactly.

As my mom says with dementia, you have to appreciate the now because it only goes in one direction. And if you focus on what you've lost, you'll miss it on what you have. Oh, I love her. I do too. That was so beautiful. Now we are going to take a quick, a quick flippity flop back to 1971. when my mom was 10 years old and was woken up by her broken, no batteries, not plugged in, cuckoo clock in the witching hours of the night.

No thank you. Nope. She grogily stumbled into her parents' room to find them crying. Her grandfather, my grandma's dad, had passed away. Oh. Okay. Now back to 2018. My mom once again was woken up in the middle of the night to the sound of a clock.

Is this stranger things? Is Vecna here? I don't know. Oh, you all get it. Is Beckna here? I need to know. Dude, the amount of messages that I have that are like, why haven't you watched stranger things? I mean, it really is.

It's a valid question. Yeah. I don't. We're all insulted. I don't have a good answer. I'm watching Desperate Housewives. That's my answer. Close.

Now, I mean, fitting. Yeah. Now, we didn't have a cuckoo clock at our house, but instead a grandfather clock. It's Factor. Yes. The thing had never gone off before and never has since. my grandma's passing. My mom immediately called my grandpa with a sickening feeling in her stomach. He told her that grandma was in the hospital with a minor infection, but that everything should be

okay. Unfortunately, it's not uncommon for dementia patients to become worse when staying in a hospital for an extended period of time. It only took a couple of days before grandma entered the final stages of dementia, and my ever-selfless grandpa followed her wishes to stop medicating and enter hospice. That must have been just such a hard decision. Hardest. And just a hard thing to go through. Yeah. I feel for your family.

The thing is, my grandma technically had had an infection that would prevent her from entering any hospice home, meaning she would have to pass in the hospital, not comforting place to go or mourn. No. That's when my dad called. That's when my dad called. The grandfather clock was going off again. Minutes later, the doctor came in to let us know that her infection had subsided and she

was cleared for hospice. Damn. The night before she left the hospital, the clock was. in her room stopped for exactly 18 minutes. The significance of this? I have no fucking idea, but my my best guess is that in Hebrew 18 is high, which means life. Maybe it was a sign that life too would stop soon. Who knows on that one? Now once she got to hospice, she told my mom she was going to have a party and she fucking did. For 24 hours she was completely lucid. I'm talking more with it than she had been for the last 10 years. Holy shit. We had a lot of

lineup of people who wanted to come say their goodbyes. So many that we actually had to write down a lineup and had to turn some people away who were less close with her. What? You had to turn people away at the door? If that doesn't happen to me when I die, I don't want it. That's why. You had to have like a bouncer. That's iconic. We're like, sorry. We're at capacity. That is, I've never even heard of that happening before. Your grandma is amazing. I love it. It was a true testament to the person she was. After the party, we decided to close the doors to anybody who was not immediate family. That's when my mom asked her how she would know she was with us. Oh my gosh. Her answer, I'll see you at lunch. Oh, my God. Then she began to ramble some about an adventure

that she was going on. My mom asked her when she was leaving for this trip. Her answer, I'm waiting on my dad. I'm going to start crying. Oh, my God. Yeah. I'm waiting on my dad. He's going to pick me up on Friday, but he's running late. Working on clocks. Working on clocks. I have chill bumps and chill bumps and chill bumps. The chill bumps have overtaken my body at this point. I am a chill bump. My mom and I just about shit ourselves. My great-grandfather had never worked with clocks. He drove an oil truck. Still, there was something so comforting about the idea that her dad was going to be there for her when those of us trapped on this planet no longer could be. That Friday, she passed peacefully. in her sleep. I'm not kidding you, I have chills that are radiating throughout my body right now.

Like, in case you missed it, Ickyick, like, she had already said my dad is picking me up on Friday. He's running late. Working on clocks. Oh, I keep getting chills. She passed on Friday. They are literally like over and over. I keep getting them. This is so sweet. This is so beautiful. This is the palacosos. This was needed. Yeah. Now this story doesn't stop here and I apologize for how long this is. Never. Soon after her passing, my mom and grandpa were out to lunch. Before they could ask for the check, the waiter came over with a flowerless chocolate cake. Fuck me all. That's literally what it says. That's what it says, and that's what I would have said had you not said that. They politely told the waiter that they hadn't ordered any dessert, something my Jewish grandma would not stand for.

Hell no. And the waiter looked at them puzzled. It just showed up on my machine. He put it on the table and told them that they could have it for free. My mom and grandpa both looked at each other. and knew it was my grandma. She said you'll see me at lunch. Yup. There she is. Once? Maybe a coincidence.

But my grandma was not the type to leave us wondering if she was with us. That month had been one of the hardest of my life. I had just lost my grandma, my rescue pup, R-A-P, kazoo, I think. I'm sorry. And then my dumb-ass boyfriend, he's actually really sweet,

just emotionally enough, decided to dump me a week before my birthday. Oh, my God. Ugh. Not cool, man. He better have learned. I'm still mad at him. I'm pissed. I was in a dark place and I think my grandma knew it. Just like every other morning,

my coworker and I went to the coffee shop across the street from our work in order to coffee for him and a hot cocoa for me. That morning, I found myself standing by the glass case, holding all of the dankest looking chocolate treats. God, I love you. You're the best. Like a five-year-old, I asked the server, which was the most chocolatey? She seemed to find this endearing. Probably helps that I'm five feet with some big-ass puppy dog eyes that make me look like an actual child, even though... This is literally me. Even though I'm an old, cantankerous man on the inside.

Are we the same person, though? After a quick exchange, I went back to the register to pick up my hot cocoa. That's when the server came over with the fucking $40 chocolate dream of a cake that I had been buying. Oh, yeah. $40 chocolate cake. You know that's good. She told me that she just had a feeling I needed it, and she gave it to me.

Oh, my God. Next thing I know, the barista tells me the hot cocoa's on the house too, because she just wants to be in on the kindness. Oh, man, when I tell you I was shooketh, I was motherfucking shooketh. And it did not stop there. The next day, I went back determined to pay for a hot cocoa. But when I got there, they told me that my money was no longer accepted at this cafe, and I would be feasting on all the chocolate I could handle. My heart has never felt so warm, nor my artery is so clogged. Um, where is... this place? Yeah, we live in Boston. I was like, where is it? Wow. To end this ramble, I won't tell you not to keep it weird because, hell, Grandma Sandy was a weirdo herself. Hell yeah. So keep it so weird that you are so kind of strangers, spend time with family, and never say no to dessert.

Susie. Susie. That was fucking beautiful. Oh my goodness. Grandma Sandy. I hope we're all Grandma Sandy. We have to be. Everybody needs a Grandma Sandy. Everyone should be a Grandma Sandy. It's, That was beautiful. I just, I can't imagine walking into a place and them being like, your money's not accepted here. But like, you can have stuff. I'd be like, okay. Wow. You can have all the chocolate you can handle.

That is, like, some serious divine intervention. I love it. That was Grandma Sandy to the extreme. Yeah. All right. So my next one is called Salem did not disappoint. And you know what? It never will.

No, there's not a possibility that could ever happen. Never. So it says, hey, weirdos, my name is Julie. And as always in my listener tales, you can use my name. Julie! Julie! Let me start by reminding you fine ladies that I'm a huge fan and love listening to your podcast. It's like having girl time with some fabulous people who share my love for true crime and spooky things,

while driving to and from work, cleaning the house, in the shower, getting ready for bed, driving anywhere, waiting and drive-soil lines, doing dishes, folding clothes, you get the point. I love that. You were on 24-7, it seems. No kidding. If I'm not listening to you when I go to bed, I can't fall asleep. I love that we go to sleep with you all the time. My fiancé thinks I'm weird and is honestly scared if anyone ever pisses me off or wrongs me. Well, you know, we should all be that way. We now joke that I will be listening to Morbid while I'm in labor as I am due October 29th, 2022. Yay! Congratulations.

That's amazing. Hoping for the 31st because Halloween things. Well, he jokes, I'm serious. I also will make sure to have my copy of The Butcher and the Wren while trying to push my tiny morbid fan in the making. Wait. Well, yeah, tiny morbid fan in the making out. Yeah, I said that wrong, but you said it right. Thank you. Also, I love Libras. And also, thank you so much. You're the best. Tiny URL.com slash the butcher and the Wren. You can still pre-order it, guys. Anyways, so about my story, I tried to shorten it to allow for my stories, for any stories you guys wanted to add in about your own Salem experiences or such. Anyways, the Listener tale, let me enlighten you. I will start off by saying I have always been sensitive to the

paranormal since I was young. When I was four, my grandmother passed away and she visited me as I grew up occasionally to remind me that she is proud of me and she is still there. That's really sweet. When I was a teen, my great-grandfather passed away and it upset me. He never came to visit me like my grandma did. Now, these two people are going to come back in this story later, so remember them. So this year in 2022, my boyfriend, now fiancé, but at the time he hadn't purchased his upgrade to his membership. Why have I never put it that way? That's amazing. I love it.

My fiance or my boyfriend and I decided to go to Salem for my birthday. Oh, great birthday. Now, this would have been so much more exciting if I wasn't born in January. A, Capricorns. And it would be winter when we went. Oh, man. Now we went January 15th, and it was a whole ass negative 9 degrees outside. that day with hell of wind. Oh yeah, you're on the water, baby. There you are. New England

winter hit different. And I was not ready to freeze my ass off while wandering around the beauty of what is Salem. Living in Maryland has made me used to not having actual winters like I did when I lived in Colorado. While there, I got a tarot reading and my palm read because hello, it's Salem, bitches. That's right. But where, though? Yeah, I got to know. Because we got a great one when we were there. I was living my best spooky witchy life while wearing five layers and still freezing, but didn't care. During the terror reading, shout out to the wonderful staff at Crow Haven's Crow Haven Corner in their familiar star. Ooh, I got to go there. I very much want to go there. Thank you for shouting them out. So Crow Haven Corner in their familiar star. I found out that I would

indeed have children despite my struggle in the past. Oh, that just like touched my soul. Of course I cried because I have had three miscarriages and was currently struggling hard to try to get pregnant. I feel you so hard. So I'm so happy that this person gave you that hope. I'm so happy for you. And that you are currently with child. That's so exciting.

After a long day of shopping, buying all the spooky witchy things, collecting all the crystals and shiny things like the dragon I am, and having the best food ever at this little tavern, we headed to our Airbnb. This place was easily 150 years old and a few blocks away from the house that we used for Max's house

in hocus pocus. Yes. Let me just say, 69 degrees has never felt so amazing than it did after being in sub-zero temps all day. I was sweating the moment we walked in the door. I literally shed like four or five of my layers at the door. As I showed, my boyfriend decided to surprise me

that he bought me a ticket for the moment house show you guys did on my birthday. Yes. Holy shit. That's awesome. Amazing. Getting ready to enjoy some live morbid, I heard something. I love that this happened.

In Salem. Like we were all. there. Oh my God, I love this. I know. Like a woman calling to someone. I asked my boyfriend if you heard anything and he said no. I shook it off and thought nothing of it until I saw a shadow. I walked out of the room into the kitchen when the chandelier started to swing like someone had hit it. Cue my Broadway ass screaming. He's here. The phantom of the opera is here. I'm screaming. My boyfriend came around the corner, curious what the heck I was talking about to see the chandelier swinging as well because he was probably like, what?

Yeah, right? He's really like, what the hell is going on? Who's here? What's going on? He looked at me, shook his head, and tried saying it's an old house and it was a draft, saying these things happened. Like, excuse me, these things do happen? You have been here five minutes. What do you know? At that moment, you ladies went live, so I brushed it off and walked back to my room to enjoy me some morbid, but it didn't stop. The fact that this was happening as we were doing a live show is making me very happy. It's feared it. She can't even talk.

It's feeding my soul is what I was going to say before I died. But you know what? It didn't stop. Soon after the lights in the room started flickering and it got cold. This time, a woman stood at the edge of my bed looking at me like I wasn't supposed to be here. Nor am I supposed to be able to see her. You dropped to that like so casually. You said all of a sudden there was a lady in my damn room.

What, ma'am? I'm sorry. The lady looked like she could have been from. the 1800s and had bruises on her neck maybe from a rope or maybe from the 1600s. And maybe from she was hanged, maybe accused of witchcraft. She was also dripping like she had just went for a swim in the bay not far from the house. And you know what they used to do with witches in Salem that they didn't hang, before they hanged them.

Dunk. Before I could ask her anything, she opened her mouth and dark, dirty water fell out of her mouth and fell on the floor. And we were just sitting there unknowingly presenting a live show. Are you shitting my actual dick? Well, this is literally happening to you? And like not even that far away. No. We don't go far for the virtual ones. No. She pointed at my stomach and said something I couldn't understand. I just went home. She disappeared as soon as she appeared and I looked where she stood to see the water on the floor. I called my boyfriend in and he saw it as well. The water was still there. Oh, he tried to brush it off saying it could be from my boots because it had snowed a few days prior, but my boots were by the door. He walked away giving, he walked away again to give me privacy

while I enjoyed the show when he started seeing and hearing things. How did you just sit there and watch our show after that? After the show, he came in terrified like he saw something. I asked what was wrong and he stated, you're right. The Phantom of the opera is here and did not appreciate me watching TV. Apparently, the lady turned off the TV and caused the chandelier to swing again. At this point, we decided to reach out to the host to see if this was normal. They were like, you didn't put this in the Airbnb description. Apparently this is, and they thought they got rid of her. I'm screaming. They said they p-they said they sage the place once a month. And when I asked if they opened the windows or not, they didn't. We informed them that they need to open the windows when they do this, and so I got to

work as I was saging the place while playing the Phantom of the Opera album because I carry it with me as someone should. You're an icon. You're an icon. I could hear moaning and someone saying no. I'm freaking out. My boyfriend joke that she must not be a fan of the music. It must have left after that. I want to hang out with you guys. You guys are awesome. The rest of the night went uneventful and we left in the morning. As we left, I saw her standing in the window looking at us, smiling and waving. I am not well, bitch. Once we were By the way, that's from Bravo. I'm not calling you a bitch. Yeah, that's from Bravo. Not well, bitch.

Once we returned home after the weekend, complete with a ghost sighting, I tried seeing if I could find any information about this lady. According to the owners of the property, the lady had lost her child due to sickness, and the baby she was pregnant with shortly after due to her husband beating her, and then decided to try escaping him by jumping into the bay. Oh. However, she unfortunately. Unfortunately, drowned and now haunts the place and typically bothers young couples.

About a month later, I received a visit from my grandma in my dream. We were at the restaurant in Salem we had gone to on my birthday, and she was holding a young child. I'm crying. Oh, my whole body. She looked so happy, and my great-grandfather was there, too. I can't. They were both playing with the baby and saying, congrats to my boyfriend and I. At the table across from us was the lady from the Airbnb with a baby of her.

own and another woman was with her. The thing is, like, I am losing it. I don't know if my arms are going to be permanently like this from all these listener tales, everyone. Oh my God. This one is like, we had a conversation and she said, you are so blessed and congratulated me on the birth of my baby. That was not a dream.

That was like you were just in another space that we might not know about. The next day, I discovered I was pregnant on what would have been my grandma's birthday. I'm like actively trying not to cry right now. After doing the math, I discovered I did the dirty to get pregnant. I'm shitting myself. I did the dirty. I'm shitting myself. I can do it.

I did the dirty to get pregnant on my great grandparents anniversary. That is on some family shit. That is on some I made it nice. Shit. I found out that not only was I pregnant, but everything is perfectly normal and baby is happy and healthy. Yes, and it's going to be, or excuse me, baby's going to be a Libra. Fuck yeah. I'm so excited. And this all happened on our freaking show day. Like, that makes me feel like some cosmic awesomeness was happening. I kind of feel like we should go to that Airbnb and see

if we can shout to that woman. Just be like, hello. Hello? Hello. So healthy that it is kicking my ass with morning sickness and fatigue. That is great. I'm sorry. I know. I was like, that's this great. I'm sorry. That is so healthy. That sucks, but I'm glad that he, that this baby is so healthy that it's making you feel sick because that's great. That's on some like Rinesme type shit. There you go. I can't help but think that I was like, yep, I'm just going to move past that. I can't help but think that my visit to Salem had a hand in my pregnancy and that my grandma and great-grandfather might have helped as well. I fully believe that. I've been visited a few times in my dreams from the lady since and almost find a comfort in her visits. I tried to

keep this show. Oh, sorry, I didn't interrupt. Oh, no, I interrupted you. Maybe she's like a spirit guide. I think she is. You know? She's a fucking terrifying spirit guide, but she does great things. But you're spooky, so like you would have a terrifying spirit guide. And she honestly, I mean, she has every right to be a terrifying spirit guy with what she went through. Right. So it says, I tried to keep this as short as I could allow, I could to allow time for other tales of the listeners.

I hope this finds you ladies well as always and that you keep it weird. Take it away, Ash. I think you should keep it as weird as you kept it. I don't think you did anything wrong. You did everything right. I got to tell you guys, keep it this weird. Keep it as weird as like, Julie, that is beautiful. I am so glad that you're having the baby of your dreams, literally.

Like literally the baby of your dreams. Actually. I'm so happy for you and your fiancé. I'm so happy that it happened on your grandparents' anniversary. Oh, my God. That it was pointed out to you and you didn't even realize that in Salem. Right? By a spooky spirit guide.

What more could you ask for? And that this baby is due in October spooky season, only the greatest time of the year. I'm so happy for you I could burst. I also can't wait for you to tell your child this story, and I do expect the listener tale of that experience. Yes, 100%. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

All right. My next listener tale is called listener tale. My grandpa Bundy was on death row. I'm sorry, excuse me? Who's Grandpa Bundy? Excuse me now? Well, let's get into it. It says, hey, Ash and Elena.

First off, love you guys. This show gives me life and your dynamic reminds me of my cousin and I when we talk about literally anything. It makes me smile. Oh, I love that. I do too. Second, you're probably curious about the subject line of this story. Yep. You knew us.

So let me start by saying that I am 100% not related to Ted Bundy. I'm very glad for you. Me too. And this sucks. Heard it my whole life along with jokes about married with children. I was waiting for that one too. That's one of Drew's favorite shows. I have a sister named Kelly.

Let that sink in. Oh, man. Kelly Bunn. Oh, man. Amazing. Imagine if your mom's name was Peg. That'd be amazing. Anyways, this story is about my dad's dad, who was on death row back in the 1950s for a crime that he did not commit. That's just so intense already. It is. I know. Sounds super sketchy and crazy, but it's a real ass thing. I believe you. I do too. This is kind of a long one, so strap in. Also, I'm not going, yeah, I'm not going to mention the other guy's name as I'm not sure if he's still alive or not. Maybe he has a family. I'll be respectful in that aspect. Good for you, man. So my grandpa. Yeah. I just love the way you said that so earnestly. Like, good for you, man.

Yeah, good for you. I appreciate it. All right. So my grandpa, Harry Dale Bundy was convicted of a murder in 1956 for the murder of a grocery store clerk and was sentenced to fucking death in Stark County, Ohio. Whoa. Y'all, the shit is crazy and I wouldn't have believed it unless my dad had shown me the old newspaper clippings. Ooh, can we see them? Oh, damn.

Uh, uh, newspaper clippings of the whole damn thing. There's a whole article about this. Oh, I left the link for you below in case you're curious. Yeah, you did. Yeah, you did. Yeah, you did. I see you. I appreciate you.

Before I get into the nitty-gritty, a few things about my grandpa. I didn't know him as he passed away before I was born in the 90s. Yeah, 90s kids. But my family has told me stories. Apparently, he was super into roller skating and stuff. That's amazing. Just a really fun loving guy, and he loved my grandma and his kids. Aw.

Another thing you should know is that he was also an alcoholic. It is what it is, but it has kind of a big part in the story. When my grandpa was 38, he was friends with this 23-year-old guy that he had worked with at a warehouse. Work friends are hard to come by, so I'm sure my grandpa was like, yeah, let's do it. They hung out and drank together and even went on visits to our family in Zanesville, Ohio, for the holidays. At one point, when they visited, it had been reported in the news that two store clerks had been shot and killed in an apparent robbery attempt. I'll come back to this. I'm going to be real.

There are a lot of details to this story that the articles I've read get into, but I'm not going to give you the shorter version, but I'm going to give you the shorter version in a more personal way. My grandpa was working at the warehouse one night when this dude shows up and literally tells my grandpa that he had just fucking murdered his whole family and burned the house down. Oh. And then dead ass threatened him with a gun to keep quiet.

My grandpa, I'm sure, was just like, okay. What do you do with that? Yeah, thinking he was just drunk or something and not actually serious. Well, sure enough, the next day it was reported that this dude's family, this dude's family's house had burned to the ground and two people were found charred in the house with bullet wounds. Holy shit. So, of course, like any sane person, my grandpa was like, uh, yeah, I should probably report this. Yeah, apparently he was not just drunk. Mm-mm.

He was obviously hesitant because who wouldn't be after being threatened at gunpoint, but he tipped off police. He then asked them to guard the house because he was afraid for the family that this guy would come after them. Yeah. Oh my gosh, I can't even imagine. That must have been so stressful. After a few days, the police apparently decided it was no longer necessary and stopped standing guard. What the fuck? I never get that.

How? And it's always, that's when they decide to stop and things happen. Well, of course, the dude comes to the house to threaten my grandpa and the family once again, but eventually turned himself in. Now, I would love to tell you that. how the story ended, but it's not. You remember how I said that one night when they were in my grandpa's hometown that two store clerks were shot. After turning himself in, this guy told the police that my grandpa Dale was an accomplice to the murders that night. So that was his like way of getting back at him. What a jackass. Wow. This fucking guy even tried to drag my grandma into the loop saying

he slash, he stashed the guns at her house. I'm sure you're now thinking, that's what the, that's what witnesses are for right you would be correct but remember my grandpa was an alcoholic and he didn't remember where he was that night oh no that's so sad so my grandpa went to trial in june of 53 and once again this douche spun the story that my grandpa had come up with the plot to rob the store and get the money for christmas presents he told the jury that once inside his gun accidentally went off and then my grandpa shot and killed the other guy what wow who even is is this man? This man is terrible.

Seriously. Once again, I cannot stress this enough. This dude was a psychopath. After a long trial, my grandpa was sentenced to die by electric chair on November 8th, 1957. My grandma at this point was desperate and had somehow put out a plea across the country asking anyone for any information that could exonerate my grandpa. She had three kids. My dad only being five at the time and was not about to lose her husband to a crime.

she knew he didn't commit. Hell yeah, Grandma. Now get ready for this because it is bonkers. On November 5, 1957, three damn days before my grandpa was set to be executed, my grandma's prayers were answered. My fucking chill bumps again. Halfway across the country in Amarillo, Texas, as a girl was sitting at a bus terminal reading in a newspaper about my grandma's plea to save her husband and asking for any information on the whereabouts of the guy who actually committed the murders, you know, because of course the dude had effing bailed because he was guilty as hell. Of course. This girl recognized the guy's picture.

According to my dad, she worked in a liquor store or something, but she said she had talked to him and recalled him telling her that he had already committed four murders and was about to commit a fourth one legally. A fifth one. I don't know why I looked at the 95 and said four. About to commit a fifth one legally. I think I was stuck on the legally part, so I was like, bye. Bye number five.

Of course, this chick was like, yo, pretty sure no murder is legal. Pretty sure. Me as well. He told her that he would quote, he would, sorry, oh, my God. I'm so stressed out. He told her that he would quote, have the law do it for him. What? Wow.

So he was going to try to get that that's what this was. Yeah. He was committing a fifth one legally by pinning it on the grandpa to have the law murder the grandpa for him. Oh. That was his plan. Thank you. He had gone through the whole thing and he was like, you know what, this guy just fucked me over. So now I'm going to have it done legally, meaning I'm going to get him for murder and I'm going to have the police kill him for me.

This is why I need you in my life. I'm saying. That would have gone so over my head. What? Wow. Again, this dude was a psycho. Yeah. Luckily, three damn days before my grandpa was about to be electrocuted for a crime that he didn't commit, he was exonerated. Holy shit. This guy was sentenced to 25 years. He wasn't tried for all the murder. not sure why. I feel like that always fucking happens. That happens a lot, yeah. And he was paroled in 1986. Y'all, I'm not sure if he's died since, so I'm almost hesitant to give my name. But I think he'd be like 86 at this point, so I guess it's not a big deal. Thanks for reading, especially since this story could easily be a mini morbid as far as how much detail there really is. Love you guys. Don't ever change lovely ladies. Fellow weirdo, should I say their name? Because they were a little

hesitant. That's, uh, we won't. Uh, yeah. It's from, Jill. It's from Jill. Thank you Jill. Oh my goodness, Jill. Not Jill. Wow. Holy Canoli. Also, who's in this photo? Is this your grandma and grandpa? Oh my God. Please tell me it is. I need it to be. Please tell me it is. Oh, my goodness. My, my computer is being so weird, so it's like not telling me who this is. Also. Oh, no. Ah! What? It's the dad and the stepmom on their wedding day. Oh. And if you pull up the picture of her grandpa, her dad and her grandpa are like identical. Oh my God. What the hell? I love that. And also, uh, this listener sent this in pre-COVID times, but we didn't see it. Oh, we somehow miss. I mean, there's so many listener tales, so we're going through them like with a fine tooth comb now. Oh, yeah. So I'm so glad that

we see this now. Oh my God. This is bananas cuckoo nuts. You were absolutely correct. I'm astounded. And three days. Three days. Can you? Imagine if that woman had realized it, like, too late. And that this guy was going around saying, I'm going to have him murdered legally. I'm going to have the, like, the justice system do it for me. What? And get away with murder. The fuck.

Holy shit. That's insane, dude. That's wild. Okay, guys. You guys, again, delivered the shit out of listener tales. My goodness. I don't know how you do it. Wow, wow.

You're all living crazy lives out there. Yeah, what is the damn world? What's going on? But you know what? I love the grandma's story. Yes. Sandy, I love the, I love the pregnancy in Salem with a spooky spiritual guy. I love them all.

I love all of them so much. So with that being said, we do hope that you keep listening and writing these in. Yeah, we hope you. Keep it weird. But not so weird that you burned a Ouija board, but like, oh my God, I feel like you should have burned that Weegeeboard because that Weidaboard had some secrets from the that like we didn't even, oh my goodness, so scary. Not so weird that you get salmonella, but like do keep it so weird that you get salmonella at a pretty perfect time because you might have been murdered had you not gotten salmonella. Um, cuckoo for Cocoa, Grandma, just keep it so weird

that you have that grandma. Don't keep it so weird. No, do keep it so weird that a lady comes to the end of your bed and like kind of informs you that your preggers. Um, do keep it so weird. No, don't keep it so weird that you legally have the justice system murder someone, but I feel like I shouldn't have to tell you that. But also keep it so. So weird that you're the grandma who never stopped making sure that he was proven innocent. Boom. Boom. Bye.