Morbid - The Horrific Murder of Ashley Young

Episode Date: February 7, 2021

If you knew Ashely Young she was probably the kindest, most genuine human being you’ve ever met. Her favorite thing to ask people was, “if I bought you a smile would you wear it?” Jared Chance didn’t deserve to know Ashley, and didn’t deserve her friendship, but that’s who Ashley was, someone who thought everyone had at least a little good in them. Unfortunately, she was wrong about Jared, who didn’t have even a fiber of goodness throughout him, and he was the one who took Ashley’s life in 2018. No one knows exactly what happened because Jared had help from his dad, a former police officer, and his mother to cover up the murder. As always, thank you to our sponsors, HelloFresh: Go to HelloFresh.com/10morbid and use code 10morbid for 10 free meals, including free shipping! BestFiends: Download Best Fiends FREE today on the Apple App Store or Google Play! Squarespace: Head to Squarespace.com/MORBID for a free trial and when you’re ready to launch, use the offer code MORBID to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain Lovebook: Visit LoveBookOnline.com/MORBID to receive a special 20% discount only for our listeners! Capsule: To sign up, visit capsule.com to get your prescription hand delivered today—for free. Cowritten by Alaina Urquhart, Ash Kelley & Dave White (Since 10/2022)Produced & Edited by Mikie Sirois (Since 2023)Research by Dave White (Since 10/2022), Alaina Urquhart & Ash KelleyListener Correspondence & Collaboration by Debra LallyListener Tale Video Edited by Aidan McElman (Since 6/2025) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, weirdos. I'm Elena. I'm Ash. And this is Crazy Morbent. Yeah, guys, I feel like I'm always saying that it's been a week. But it's really been a week this time. Every week just becomes more of a week. But damn, this has been a week.

Every week that I'm alive just gets harder and harder. It's just always a fucking week. But yeah, it was just a crazy. We've had a lot going on. And then, you know, it's been hard with the weather and the kids are stuck inside. so it feels like the walls are closing it on us a bit. Dear God, does it? I got a super gnarly migraine that, thank goodness, Ash, was around for.

I got you. Because she was like, go upstairs, you crazy, like, hyena, will you please go upstairs and sleep? And I went up for like 25 minutes in the pitch black silence. That's all it takes if I get to a certain part in my migraine, and she allowed me to have it. Was it silent, though? It was, because I closed all the doors, and then I put my... I usually put my head in like a vice grip of pillows when I have a migraine and it helps. I've never gotten a migraine, but I will get like really bad headaches from time to time.

I think probably from being on the computer and phone as much as I am. But like I can't imagine a migraine. It's gnarly. I also don't believe you that it was silent up here because wow, your kids can hit an octave. They definitely can. But I think when I want to go into my deep dark hole, I can. And thank goodness Ash was here to take care of them while I did. I got you.

Because now I'm able to record. Because before, I'm not going to lie. Earlier today, I was like, oh no. Oh, no, no, no. Every time somebody says, I know, it's all I think of. I'm officially addicted to TikTok. It's true. We can't get away from it.

Sorry. It's a part of everyone's lives now. Well, this week is Elena-centric, and Elena says that it's kind of- This is a real crazy one, guys. And this one was also chosen by our patronesses. I almost said patrons, which is weird. That's the real word for them, but the real, real-remonists. real word for them as Patrona says. So thank you Patrona Sai for picking this one because I was actually

really excited to do this one. And so you picked well. I mean, either one would have been awesome. But this one I was like, oh, it's not awesome. But it's like it's a terrible case that I wanted to get out there. Okay. And it's kind of recent. So thank you for choosing that. And, you know, that's going to happen all months. They're going to be choosing our cases for us. So that's kind of fun. And they picked all the ones that I like was leaning toward. You guys, you're doing a, Amazing, sweetie. You guys know me. It'll be enough. So let's just dive in, because I don't think, I think we talked about all our business on the last episode this week, so I think we can just kind of jump into it this week.

Yeah? This episode, I mean. I think you're right. I don't, I can't think of anything to say. All right. So let's start. This is the horrific murder of Ashley Young. Oh. So 31-year-old Ashley Young was a literal treasure to everyone around her. It's because, like, she seemed to, like, just. We say this a lot, but it's like, I swear. Like, she seemed like such an awesome person. Oh.

Yeah. So her mother was told, actually, at one point, her mother Christine was told when she was like in her teenage years that she would likely not be able to conceive children. Oh, really? And then she became pregnant with Ashley later. And she said that that just brought her, like every mother feels like their child is a treasure, of course. That adds a whole layer.

But she and her mother just had this, like, that extra bond because she just never thought she would have her. So I think it was just she appreciated her even more if you can. I worked with a girl that happened to and I remember her telling me she was pregnant. I like you've told me you were pregnant and like I was obviously like over the moon. But this girl I was like, oh my God, I'm so happy. Like it adds to it. It does because I mean when we thought we weren't going to be able to get pregnant with anybody. Literally. And we had the girls. It was you really do feel this like all of a sudden, oh my God. It's like it's like a feeling that there's no word for. for the feeling. No. And that's what her mother said. And she said they always had a close relationship.

She was definitely like a mom mom. She was not one of those moms that was like, I'm your best friend and that's it. It's like she was like, no, we were like best friends, but I was her mother. Like I took care of her. I protected her. I was the bad guy when I had to be the bad guy, which I think is like the greatest. That's like Ma. Yeah. That's what you want. Yeah. Like Ma was my best friend, but she also like laid down the law and I like lived in the convent when I first moved there. And then when you become older, Ma's still my best friend. Then you become like best friends. You know what I mean? Like that's, I feel like that's like the dream. That's what I want. Yeah, that's like what you want for like your kids. Oh, so bad. I'm like, I got to be your mom and we can be pals. But like, I'm your mom. Yeah.

But then when you cross around that dark side of the moon and you come around again later, we're going to be best friends and it's going to be awesome. I can't wait. But everyone said she was just someone who would go out of their way to make people's day better. Like she's. had a real need to see everybody happy around her because she was happy. Wow, this is a happy person. Gonna ruin me. Yeah, it is. I know a lot of these in cases, like I said, involved this kind of talk, but Ashley would do things like, I'm not used to saying Ashley. I'm used to saying Ashley. So you know what? I almost tweeted like five minutes ago, who's Ashley because somebody called me Ashley on Twitter and now I'm really glad that I didn't. Right? Oh, there you go. So, but Ashley would do this thing where she would write notes to people, like friends, to brighten their day. Like, that was her thing. Shut up. So, like, I know, like, a lot of, like, people will be, like,

in these cases, like, she lit up a room when she came in, you know, but, like, she actively was lighting up rooms. Like, she really was. And they said that, um, I read an article that said, her favorite saying was, quote, if I caught you, if I bought you a smile, would you wear it? Like, that's the kind of person she is. Throw me over the edge. Yeah. That just tells you who she was. Her mother described her by saying, quote, she was kind to people. She didn't like people being bullied. She was laughter and smiles most of the time. She was headstrong at times. You were lucky to have her as a friend. Oh, my goodness. So she graduated from Grand Haven High School in Michigan in 2005, and immediately she started working jobs that allowed her to do what she did

best, which was help people. She ended up working right out of high school at a group care home for adults with special needs? Yes, girl. Right. So, like, she's an angel. And at the time of her death, she was working in a call center for a bank and also taking classes

at Kalamazoo Valley Community College. Damn, she did it all. She did. She was working, and she was on her way to graduating in May of that year, and she had plans to go to a four-year school, Western Michigan University, and study language and culture

because she was so interested in, like, learning about people. Yeah, she's other people's cultures. she was always studying different religions. She was dating a guy at the time of, at the time of her murder, she was broken up with her boyfriend. They were like on a break, I guess. Oh, no. But she was, I believe he was Islam and she was studying to like learn more about his religion for him.

Like that was just, she was just really into like knowing about the world around her. I love that. Which is cool. I love people that are like super open to just, not necessarily like, you know, like converting to religion, but like, are just want to know about it. Yeah, just want to be educated. Because they are. They're interesting to learn about. Absolutely. Now, Ashley from the jump was also one of those people, and I'm sure everybody could probably tell this, that saw everyone's best sides. She did not look at people and look at bad. She gave people the benefit of the doubt. Always. She always looked for the good,

always thought everyone had a little bit of good in them, which is not true. It's just not. It's just not. As much as we all want it to be. Now, one of these kind of people, that she saw this in was Jared Chance. He was 30 years old, and those who were close to him said he was unpredictable. He was prone to be violent at the drop of a hat. And he had been really troubled since being a kid. He was just a troubled teen. He had a lot of issues with the law. Like he had shoplifting on his record DUI's assaults, drug possession. He was always in trouble. And he's like 30? He was 30 at this point, but these started from way before. Between 2006 and 2016,

he had 38 run-ins with the police. 38? 38. Holy. That weren't recorded. July 2009, just to give you a couple of instances, so you can really understand who Jared chances. Because otherwise, like a couple of these things,

they didn't tell you his record, and then you read what he did, and you're like, what did? This will give you a little bit of insight. July 2009, he headbutted a police officer in the nose in front of his parents. What the fuck? Which remember his parents, because those fuckers are going to come back later.

Uh-oh. The same year he did this, he crawled through the doggie door of his then-girlfriend's home when she had told him like he wasn't to come to her house. So he did it without her permission while he was under the influence. No. Yep. 2011, there was a ton of domestic shit at his parents' home between him and his, like, brother. And it was him coming after his parents, basically.

he would come in drunk, he would punch walls, he would throw things, just being totally violent. When police came at one point, he punched one officer in the head and ended up having to be tased. Did he have, do we know if he had, like, a troubled childhood? I don't know a lot about his childhood. I know his father is a retired police sergeant. Okay. Not that that has anything to do with it, but I'm just saying, like, that's really all I know about his family. Sure.

Like, that's literally it. There's no history of mental illness. There's no history of police being at the home when he was a child. Like, you know, domestic things between his parents or there's no CPS things like between. So it doesn't seem like. Weird. I mean, obviously, it's not always, it's not always nurture sometimes. It's nature.

But you wonder like what happened here. Because once you find out about what the parents also did here, you're like, all right, what happened here? Yeah. Like, what's going on? But in 2016. he had assaulted his younger brother a ton during this year. I mean, like, and he was only like a couple of years younger than him, so when they were like teenagers. And at one point when the police were called, the report read, quote, during a heated exchange between Conrad, which is his younger brother and Jared, Jared took a blow torch and kept getting closer to Conrad's face.

What the fuck? And was acting like he was going to burn Conrad. And then it says, when Jared was allegedly hitting Conrad with a. stick, he told him, I'm going to fucking kill you F word. What? Yeah. And when you say F word, you mean F-A-G? Oh, I hate that word.

That's why I can't say that word. I can't either. No, I can't either. But he's what he's calling his brother while he's beating him with a fucking stick. After using a blow torch near his face. Who the fuck left him near a blow torch is what I want to know? Hello, mom and dad. Why is there a blow torch near this kid? Yikes. He's violent.

Yikes. Well, so that's Jared. Oh, what a guy. Ashley wanted to help him. How did she know him? She met him. I believe they met somewhere through work. And they became like friendly because she said like she looked at him as like, you know,

he was just a troubled guy. He was a good guy deep down. And she said he made bad choices. He was struggling with some addictions. And she just felt like he was getting a raw deal out of life because of it. She sounds like a really good person. So she's looking at this with like rainbow. and roses and butterflies because that's who she is as a human being.

She like walked through life with rose-colored glasses. You know somebody in her literally, I think her mother actually said that. Oh, shit really. Yeah, I think she said that. I say that all the time. And she truly did. She's one of those people that absolutely you can say that about. And unfortunately, Jared wasn't this guy that got a raw deal that was just struggling

and both. He just sucked. He's just an asshole. That's just really the reality of it. Then, so they became slightly close, just friends. She was just trying to help them out, trying to get them on the right path. Sure. She thought she could do it.

We all do. I can change him. Then at one point, he broke into her apartment and stole some of her shit to sell. Yeah. So she cut ties with him after that. Good. Yeah, she was like, no, that's, you know, that's the end of my line. Not into that.

And I think it was mostly that her, like, family and friends were like, yeah, that's dangerous. And you need to not allow that to happen. I mean, I hate that her things were stolen. but like thank God that's all that happened thank goodness like he crawled through the doggy door of an ex-girlfriend exactly he's fucked up also get rid of your doggy door yeah no do not have a doggy door i never understand a doggy door no so then in 2017 a friend told her that she should give jared another chance oh and reconnect with him on facebook okay because i said you know he's just struggling he's sorry you guys should like maybe she you know what she did well it seems like she was the

kind of person where you could go to her if somebody, if you felt like somebody needed help and you weren't the one that was going to help. Exactly. And she would step in and do it. So they became friendly again. They were starting to talk again. She was she was trying to be like arm's length a little bit, but she was like starting to allow him in. They weren't like best friends. It's not like they were like together all the time. Everyone around her fucking hated this. Her mother especially told her a ton of times. He's a bad guy. Do not trust him. He doesn't deserve your help. He's not a good guy, Ashley. She was like, I know you think he is down there somewhere, but some people are just shit, and he's one of those people. I hate that she didn't get a chance to learn that.

She knew, though, that she couldn't control her adult daughter. Her daughter was early 30s at this point, but she was worried about their friendship. So her mother later said this. She said, quote, she just didn't believe that anything could ever happen. She wore rose-colored glasses. Hey, you. Now, because she trusted him, she's dead. Oh. So that lets you know what's happening. So let's get to the day that this all started. Already?

We're here. So Ashley was going to be getting an apartment. And she was going to be having her mother Christine was going to co-sign the lease for her. So this was on November 29th, 2018. Okay. Christine was going to be meeting Ashley to sign this leash. They had, you know, made this predetermined date at a predetermined time. She didn't show up.

Oh, no. This was strange. So her mom was like, because Ashley's not this girl that you're like, well, she didn't show up. That's Ashley. You know, like, and the other thing is like that it's her apartment. She's co-signing a lease for an apartment. Right. Yeah, like this is a big deal. Right. Christine attempted to call Ashley, got nothing. She was calling everywhere. She could, couldn't find her. It ended up being a couple of days of her trying to reach her and couldn't get anywhere. It was talking to anyone she could. And again, she's 30. So it's like this is hard to, it's not like a child or a child. She said weirdly at 5.45 a.m. that day, like early in the morning before she had gone and realized that Ashley hadn't shown up. So before anything happened. Before anything happened, she said in bed, she woke up at 5.45 a.m. And she said suddenly her arms and legs went numb. Oh, wow. And she says now she is positive that that is the moment her daughter was murdered. Wow. Isn't I get like chills just even. Because we. when you find out, keep what she just said.

Her arms and legs. Her arms and legs went numb. Okay. Just remember that? I got like, you know when you don't get a chill, but your whole body just does this like, ooh. Yes. Yes.

Yes. That's just what, and like, it's slightly tingly. Yes. You know that happened when I, um, when nanny passed away, I woke up in the middle of the night with a night terror. That happened to me. My, our grandmother. Mm-hmm.

That's like, like, or your great grandma, because I was like, wait, it's not my mom. But, uh, my, yeah, my grandmother. great-grandmother. I woke up at a certain time and I was like, ooh, and I just like jolted out of sleep. We have like a weird psychic gene in our family. A weird witchy gene. So Christine, the mom, knew Ashley, had just seen Jared Chance in the previous days. So she called some people, she got his contact information, and she tried to get in touch with him. She called him, she texted him, she sent him Facebook messages on Messenger, and just asking about Ashley. I can't imagine what this poor woman was feeling. Oh, it's horrific.

He responded and he said, sure, we were together. He said we were together the previous Wednesday, November 28th at the hookah lounge. And we also went to Mulligan's Pub in Grand Rapids. Okay. So he was like, this is where we were. We were out that night. He said they were there most of the evening and into the early hours of November 29th. Okay.

So then that same night, he said they went back to both of these places again. That's weird. So he's like, we went there at the 28th. We went there to the 29th. Oh, okay. That's not that weird. While they were there, he said Ashley had lost her phone. He believes that like the hookah lounge, and on the 30th, she went back to get it. So this was on the 30th and he was like, oh yeah, she's going back to get her. That's why you haven't been able to get in touch with her.

Knowing full well. Then this is what kills me. He bullshitted this mother like from, like, so much. Because imagine the little string of hope that she had like run throughout her veins as a mother. And you know what? That that ties into his sentencing later. Oh, it does. The judge says the fact that you dangled some hope in front of this woman. I'm intentionally. Like that's considered in this. Fuck, yeah. Which is awesome.

Good. Good. We love a good judge. We love a good judge. So then he said she went back to Kalamazoo to work the third shift at the call center. And her mother was like, no, that doesn't make sense because she doesn't work that shift that day. Right. And he was like, I know my daughter and I are close. I know.

Yeah, exactly. And he was like, yeah, I don't know what to tell you. So he was like, all right, well, you know, let me just. reassure you I just spoke to her. Like I just spoke to her. She was totally fine. How are you that fucking evil? So yeah. So he was like, well, that's all I can tell you. Like that's all I got. So he was like, you know what? If you really want, there's this guy named Demetrius, I think is named Demetrius Taylor. And he said, he's our friend. He saw Ashley with me that night. Like he can give you, maybe he can help you out. Maybe he's seen her. So he gives Christine his phone number. And

then he gives her a bunch of other phone numbers. And he's like, here's all these friends that you can call. He's just trying to make a fool out of this woman. Exactly, because all those phone numbers were fake. Are you fucking kidding? Every single one of them. And she finally, so he did give her the real name of a friend. Yeah. Demetrius Taylor. So she was like, well, now I'm going to find his real number. So she did. Right. And she finally got in touch with him, spoke to him. And he said, no, I have not seen your daughter. I've not met your daughter. I don't know where she is. So this was just his friend. Yeah. What the fuck?

Yeah. Why would you throw your friend under the bus like that? Oh, don't worry, because that comes back later, too. Okay, good. So she told Jared this. She calls him back and is like, he just said that you're like lying. Like, hey, fuck face. And he said, oh, I don't know why he would say that.

Like, he's lying. What are you talking about? I'd be like, I don't trust you like even a little bit. Well, and then he just stopped responding to her after that. Yeah, like a true dude she is. He stopped answering the phone. He stopped texting. He stopped messaging back.

So all calls and texts went on an interest. answered after this. So Christine is like, fuck. So she's like, this is shady, shady, shady. So she called the police immediately. She filed a missing person's report. And then she went down to Mulligans herself and asked to see the CCTV footage. Iconic. She's an icon. I love her mother. Love Christine. She's amazing. And she was like, I need to see these nights that Ashley was supposedly there. So she was on the footage one night. And she was there with Jared. So everything seemed fine. But what killed me was her mother said while watching this footage, she just wanted to pull her out of the screen and protect her. Obviously, because she knows.

Because you're sitting there being like something terrible happened. And I want to pull you in this moment to like stop the next moments from happening. So two days later on December 2nd, police were called by Jared's neighbor. And he lived in the same apartment building as Jared. His name was Mario Nelson. and he said that he was the downstairs neighbor of Jared, and he said to police that the basement of the apartment smelled like raw sewage, and it was so bad that he felt like he had to see what was going on down there

because it's a shared basement. Oh. So he was like, what the fuck? So he went down there and saw tarp with, quote, a stream of blood coming out of it. He just left that in a shared basement? Yep. What the fuck?

He said later on trial, because he took the stand later, this neighbor. Oh, okay, okay. And he later said, and the way he says it, he seems like, this guy kind of seems like a hot shit. Like, he's just funny. We love it. Because, like, what do you do when you find? Like, what the fuck? And on trial, he said, quote, there's blood in my basement. I don't know if it's normal for anyone else, but there's not supposed to be blood in my basement. Accurate, sir. Yes. So he was like, yeah, that's why I call? Because they ask you, like, stupid questions. Like, why did you call the police that day? And he's like, there's blood in my basement. Why the fuck wouldn't I? So that day on December 2nd, the Grand Rapids Police Department Sergeant Greg Alcala came first on scene. And he said when he got into the basement, it was clear and pungent the odor of decay. Because obviously, police officers know the smell. Yeah. And he's like, I walked in. First thing that smacked me in the nose was someone's dead down here.

Oh, no. He said as he approached the tarp, it got much, much worse, much, much stronger. And he looked inside the tarp and boom. He said the torso of a female and nothing else was in there. Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. Now, if you remember, her mother felt like her arms and legs went numb. And this is just a torso. I didn't even think that we were at that part yet.

Yep. She was missing her arms and legs. She was also missing her head. It was a headless, armless, legless torso. So it was literally just the middle. Yes. Yeah, it's in a shared basement in an apartment. in an apartment building.

That is fucking ballsy. Yeah. That's not the right word, but... It's unreal. It's truly unreal. That's why I hate living in an apartment. While they searched this area, they found a bloody sawblade in the basement. And in the furnace duct hidden were hundreds of unused casings, like bullet casings,

and two used casings from a 22 caliber of gun. They were clearly hidden from view. On James, so then they immediately are looking at James now. Also, I love that he hid those from you, but not the dead body. But not the actual torso. Yeah. Like what? So they go on to James's back patio porch thing that he had, and he had a black trash can with a mop in it.

And the trash can had two more saw blades in it, a boot, a bathtub drain cover, extra trash bags, a plastic bottle of ammonia, blue latex gloves, a pair of pants with James's name written on them, and a bunch of rolls of plastic wrap. Okay. Several of these items were soaked in blood. Just sitting on his back patio. No. They tested positive later for human blood. Obviously.

And they tested positive for Ashley Young's blood later. There were three shower curtain rings from Jared's apartment found in the backyard. His apartment was missing a shower curtain, like it had been torn down, then just like put somewhere. On the stairway leading up to his apartment were black women's boots, a few. fan box, like a cardboard box that like a fan came in. Okay. And a purple tote. And there was also a cardboard box with Jared's name and a dress on it. Can I explain to you really quickly that when you said fan, I wasn't thinking like what everyone else was thinking, because I watched drag way, drag race way too much. And I was thinking like thwart fan. Oh, no, I was too. Oh, when I first,

when I first read that, I was like fan box. What's that? But I was like, what was that? But I was like, what was that? No, like an electric fan. Actual fan. Like going to those like, who. Not a warp. Yeah, not a thwart. So they open this cardboard box and inside are two human legs, sans feet, and two human arms. No, sans hands. Yep. So now we have found a torso. We have found legs and arms. We have no hands. We have no feet. We have no neck. We have no head. So they open the purple tote. Inside is a pair of shoes, a medicine bottle, and some more shower rings, matching the other ones that matched his apartment shower rings. So I don't know why he scattered them everywhere. And I'm sorry, you said this was found in the stairway leading to his apartment?

Yeah. Okay. I just needed to confirm that. Everything's basically just like right out there. All righty. So they open this fan box and inside is duct tape and a black trash bag. They open the trash bag and it has bloodstained clothing belonging to a woman and bloodstained bedding. All of it has tested positive for human DNA and it is Ashley's DNA. Okay. They found that out. And there's also a couple of other unknown DNA matches, but that's kind of to be expected in that scenario.

Now, inside of his apartment, they found a kitchen tile that was stained a dark red color. They found, and actually a few kitchen tiles, not just one. I was like, why just one? They were big tiles, though. Like they weren't those little ones, so like those bigger kitchen tiles. Floor tile. And so it was a couple of them, though. a utility knife inside the trap of the toilet in his bathroom.

That's the little thing where you have to fix the flusher. And a white hand towel with a reddish brown stain. They also found a pair of blue jeans, size 30, with a brownish-colored stain on the left upper front. And the trap of his kitchen sink tested positive for human blood and contained a small piece of human tissue. Oh, my God. So it's literally like a mass, like a mass. slaughterhouse in there. And also, she's been missing for how many days and he's just living in this? Yeah. He hasn't cleaned this up. Oh, no. And we'll find out what he was doing.

Oh, no. I don't want to know. But I do. I have to know. Well, there was also human blood in the washing machine in his apartment. That's so crazy. And there was also a black hoodie and a bath mat that also tested positive for human blood. So there was just human blood all up in the crevices of everywhere. And they were like, yeah. And they were like, yeah. And they were like, okay, Jared, um, You're going to come with us because there's some stuff that we need to talk to you about. So he was taken in and he was charged. He was charged with mutilation of a dead body and concealing a death. Because at this point, that's all they can really do.

Yeah. Police interviewed more of his neighbors and one told them that he was like, oh yeah, he's like a really violent guy and like talks about violence a lot. And then he said he once told me he knew how to kill someone and get away with it. I feel like that's not true based on all of the evidence. I feel like you know how to kill someone, but you definitely don't know how to get away with that. We've determined that is a lie. You're the worst is what we've determined right now. So December 5th, they decide they've already talked to Jared.

He's not given him anything, but they have all this evidence, obviously. So now December 5th, they take their asses over to Holland, Michigan, to his parents' house. Okay. Because they now know from him that he, was with them in the days, like, after the murder. Sure. So they show up with a search warrant, and they find the shower curtain in the garage that was missing from Jared's apartment.

Okay. So he brought that with him to his parents' house. Oh, yeah. They searched the living room in their home and find normal things like a couch and some bookshelves and, like, maybe a television and some knick-knacks. And then they also find a black and red skill saw with blood and tissue on it under the couch. I really wish that you would set that up where you would.

you're like, you know, a sofa and a TV and a hacksaw and also a fireplace. But same thing. Yikes. Either way, under the couch, under the floral patterned couch, was a black and red skill saw with human tissue and blood on it. Why would you put that under your couch? Like, I'm not telling you how to cover up your murder, but like, that's... Also, like...

His father was a retired police sergeant. Right. So you'd think he'd be like, hey, we should bury that in the backyard. You know, getting away with murder 101, don't put that under the couch. I feel like they're going to come looking. And they might look under the couch. I don't know. Let's not leave that shower curtain just displayed in the garage.

In the garage. Well, they also found a washcloth in the basement that was soaked in blood. And in the Honda CRV that belonged to the parents, they found an empty bottle of ammonia in the trunk and an empty box of blue latex gloves. Oh, okay, Casey Anthony. Yeah. And there was a label on most of these things that was labeled misty. Tracy's party store, and it was a place in town. Where you can buy your ammonia and gloves. Exactly. So you can buy your after murder kid, apparently. So they immediately go to Miss

Tracy's party store, of course. Hi, we'd like to speak to Tracy, please. Hello is Miss Tracy here. We'd like to talk to her. They get the CCTV footage for that day, and they see that Jared was there. Oh, that's so crazy. So crazy. And he was purchasing so much stuff. Like ammonia and gloves and trash bags. Like balloons and, you know, utensils, wigs, those little party poppers. He was also getting ammonia and trash bags. And he was doing these things between the days of November 29th and December 1st. All righty. So the CCTV also showed behind the party store. And crazy, Jared went behind the party store where the dumpsters and shit are. And he dumped a bunch of stuff into the dumpsters. Do people not realize that there are security cameras? Airwear. Literally, airware.

Airware. Everywhere. Well, police were like, oh, let's go look in those dumpsters. So they went and looked in the dumpsters, and they got an orange bag in there that contained additional women's clothing, a prescription bottle with Ashley Young's name on it, and a purse containing Ashley's driver's license and school ID. Yep. I hate that. There was a stain on a pair of jeans that also tested positive for human blood, and there was a hoodie belonging to Ashley Young that had copious amounts of blood in the hood. Okay. Mm-hmm.

It's horrific. We have not located ahead. We have not. Now, back at this apartment, at Jared's apartment, they found Ashley's parked car down the street, abandoned. Uh-huh. So they finally located her car. So now they're like, okay, so what happened here?

How did all this stuff end up at his parents' home? What happened in these few days? Right. What's going on? So what happened was this. On December 1st, we don't know, here's the thing, we don't know what exactly happened to Ashley Young. Jared has not said it. He won't say it.

And we don't have enough body parts to determine it. We never get them. We have not have, I say we. They have not found her head. Oh. Or her feet or her hands. So all they have is the torso, torso, legs, and arms. Wow.

And I'll get into this in a minute, but like, we can't, we don't know what happened. And he won't say it. We know that she died somewhere between the 28th and the first. And there was copious amounts of blood. Copious amounts of blood in the kitchen. There was bedding that was covered in blood. I believe she was likely dismembered maybe partially in the kitchen and maybe partially in the bathroom due to the, you know, the shower curtain being torn down and brought to his

parents' house, but we don't know. Well, I'm wondering, because you said there were so much blood in the sweatshirt, like in the hood of the sweatshirt, and then there was hidden shell cases. I don't, do you think maybe he shot her in the head? That is a, that's a theory. And we'll get into that, but for sure, that's definitely a theory. So what happened was this, though, from what happened like with the parents. That we know. So on December 1st, Jared's parents, James and Barbara Chance and his brother Conrad drove to pick Jared up at his apartment and bring. him back to their home. They didn't know what was going on at this point. Did he call and say, like, can you pick me up? Yeah, I think he was just like, can you pick me up? So Jared carried with him

to the car a cardboard box that had a black plastic bag in it. We now know this had arms and legs in it. Now, December 2nd, James took, apparently he, apparently he told them what happened. He told them what was going on and they said, we got to cover this up. Wow, a retired police officer decided to cover up a murder for his son. Now, what happened on December 2nd, though, is that James took Jared to the Grand Rapids Police Department. And I think he was telling him, okay, I think they were trying to cover their tracks initially and make sure it looked like maybe.

Yeah, they were trying to figure something out. I don't know exactly what their idea was here. It doesn't seem like they did a very good job. But he did bring him to the Grand Rapids Police Department. And Jared's attorney claimed that they were told. to go tell the Kalamazoo police department because that's where the missing persons report was filed. Okay. Because I think what he was doing was he was going to bring him there to say he knows something about

her disappearance. Sure. I don't think he was going there to be like, he cut her into a lot of pieces. Like, I think he was going to try something here. But do you think maybe he just assumed they would take him into an interrogation room and just like finally break him? Yeah, I think it was maybe or like he was going to, I think what we'll see here is that it seems like Jared has been conditioned to not out what his parents have done, especially his dad to me.

Oh. And I think that his dad was like, we took care of this for you. You're going to take the heat for this, but we're going to try to keep it as like chill as possible. Like make it so that you don't admit anything, you don't tell them what happened. You just serve your time and that's it. That's horrific. Yeah. That's what it seems to me.

Sure. Because he's not talking. Right. So they were like, apparently what Jared's attorney is saying is that the Grand Rapids Police Department was like, you need to do this at Kalamazoo. Okay. Because that's where the missing person's report was like basically like we're like, go away, whatever. But the Grand Rapids police say, no, no, that's not how that went. And they said James came in with his son Jared and demanded an attorney for Jared before he would even, he said he will not speak a word without an attorney.

so get him one. Okay. And they were like, no. Yeah, like you're not arrested for anything yet. They were like, we haven't to take, like what? You don't have a right to counsel yet. Yeah, we haven't even read you. You're like, no, we don't even know who you are. What are you here for? Like they didn't even know what was going on. So they couldn't question him because he wanted an attorney, but they were also like, we don't know. You would think his father would remember that from back in the day. Well, so he just left with his dad and then he went back to his Grand Rapids apartment by himself carrying that cardboard box with the trash bag inside. Okay. So they just, he's back at his apartment now that's covered in blood and dropped the cardboard box outside his apartment and then just like went inside and was like, hmm, what do I do now? And then just like lived in that apartment. And that's when the police

showed up and we're like, what the fuck is all this shit? Oh, man. It's so bizarre. So the forensic pathologist who did the autopsy, the partial autopsy on the body parts that they did have was Dr. David Starrt. He obviously was only able to autopsy the top. He obviously was only able to autopsy the torso, arms and legs. Sure. He determined with DNA that it was Ashley Young. It was identified as her. Obviously missing head, neck, hands, and feet.

They couldn't determine the cause of death because there was nothing on those body parts that determined a cause of death. But they said because the head and neck were gone in particular and not found, like obviously being hidden very well, he was betting the cause of death had something to do with those two body parts. Yes. And he said that's why they're being hidden. better than the rest. Right. Now, the prosecutor Lawrence Boyvan said, quote, why do you hide the head? You hide the head because that shows

exactly how she died, which I agree. He said telling from the amount of blood and location of blood found on Ashley's like soaked clothing, the hoodie, where it all was really going, it was likely blunt force trauma, like repeated blunt force trauma hits or a gunshot or multiple gunshots to the head. Okay. But again, And he said, like you said, those casings they found. And they were, like, clearly hidden. He was like, there was two spent ones and there was some that were unspent. He was like, he was known to have a gun. And as we'll see when people are on testifying, he was known to use that gun in really

like reckless ways. That's so. Whenever I see like, oh, that just, that just stress. It's horrifying. It truly is. He said she was dismembered likely by a reciprocating saw or something like that because it was able to cut through the bone, which is not easy to. cut through bone. And also it created sharp edges, which he noted in this in these cuts.

And was that, was that like the saw that was found under the couch? It was like a skill saw. So, and that skill saw was tested. And it was tested for human tissue and blood. It had human tissue and blood on it. And it was identified as Ashley's. Wow. So James, the former police officer, remember James Chance, his father. Sounds like an idiot. And Barbara Chance were also, were charged with perjury and accessories after the fact once he was brought in. How would the father not think that that's not going to happen? That's what's shocking to me. Like the people, when I found out he was a like, like, former cop, I was like, right. What? I mean, unless he was just like, you know, like, I'll do this for my kid and knew that he probably wasn't going to get like that much.

Well, it's like, we were, I was talking about this case with John when I was when I was researching it. And I was like, I was like, I hope you feel the same way I do. I was like, I love my children. I will do anything for my children, I will walk through glass. Never in a million years. But if my child steals the life of someone else's child, you pay the price. Right. Like, you pay the price. Absolutely. Like, you, I'm not going back you if you murder someone. That's not like in cold blood. No way. Like, will I still visit you in jail because I love you? Absolutely. Self-defense? Sure. But if it's like, you're just cold-blooded murdering someone? No. What? No. No, you don't, you don't defend your child in that situation. And your who has shown violence towards you, violence towards your other children, like a disregard for any

kind of authority or law enforcement at all? Like, no. It's just the parent-child relationship is such an interesting one because parents can forgive their kids for a lot. Oh, for sure. Obviously. And it's like, if they want to forgive him for this, that's their business, whatever. They don't really have, honestly, they don't have a right to forgive him or not forgive them because it wasn't their child that was stolen. Yeah. But it's like, you, that's terrible parenting to not, you should always teach your kid that actions have consequences. I think you wasn't taught that. Your consequence is going to fucking jail. Like, you are serving time now. You did a terrible, terrible thing. Right. Because it's like, if you love your kid, that should be your reaction. Well, it's like if my child, God forbid,

ever killed somebody in that manner to, I would never cover it up just because I never would, like, period. No. But how are you going to sit there and not think about the fact that this could happen again? Exactly. If you help them out, they could do this again. They could do it again and then it's on you again to help them out. And two, you are a parent. Think of that the victim's parents. Your child stole someone's baby from them. As being selfish. Like you should be thinking of the other parents of being like, how could I ever call myself a parent and cover this up and allow these parents to grieve like that? No. Like no. It's, it's. It's just insane. So investigators said that they both knew about the mutilation of Ashley Young because he told them, obviously, and showed them things. But did not, they did not reveal this to investigators when they were questioned. They made sure to pretend they had nothing to do with this. They knew nothing. I'd be like, listen, there's a saw under your floral fucking couch. What do you know? And it's also like, okay, so you're sitting there trying to pretend you're going to bat for your kid. But what you're doing is trying to like hide shit for him. But then you're being like, I didn't know anything about this. But you're throwing them under the bus again. It doesn't make any sense. So it's like it doesn't make sense. That's why to me it seems like the father was trying to cover this up not to say that he didn't do it, but to cover it up to a point where he could only be charged for so much.

Because I think his father did know if we get rid of the head, that's where all the evidence is. That's where the cause of death is. That's where they can start to piece together what happened. If we get rid of this head, we don't have that. And they can only charge him with so much. And what we find out is they, I mean, he does get the highest sentence, so that's good. But in his thinking, I think he was like, maybe they won't be able to get him. Right.

Because maybe they'll only get him on mutilation of a body after death. Right. So I think he was thinking like that, but it trailed off. This is one of the strangest cases we have ever done. So their trial was set for October 2019, but we'll talk about that later. Jared was charged with open murder and four counts of tampering with evidence. Because again, they don't have a cause of death. They technically don't have the manner of death.

Right. Well, they have the manner of death homicide, but they don't. Without the head, they're struggling. Yeah. So an employee of Mulligan's pub actually testified at the trial and said that they did see Ashley with another man at the pub on the night of November 28th. And they said they thought that man was Jared, but they couldn't completely say it was him. Oh, then go away.

But this person said he did not see Ashley on the night of November 29th. So when Jared said we went back to that pub on November 29th, she didn't go back to that pub. So now they can start piecing together when she died. So Demetrius Taylor, remember that guy? He was the one that Jared gave the cell phone number to Christine, Ashley's mother, and said, call him. He saw us together. Yeah. Well, he testified at the trial. Oh, shit. And he said, sure, Jared told me to tell Christine that Ashley had come by my house to use my phone and then left. That's what he told me to tell her. And he didn't tell her that, right? No, he didn't. He said,

so Taylor said, I didn't want to, he said, I didn't know what had happened. Yeah. It's weird that Jared's telling me to lie about where this girl is. I don't, I know he's fucked up. And he's like, I didn't want to know anything else. Like, I wasn't trying to. to get myself involved in that. And then he said, I wasn't going to lie to this woman about her child. Like, I wasn't going to do that. I'm not a monster. No. So he said, I told her the truth that I've never met Ashley and that I didn't know where she was. And that was the truth. Yeah. And he was like, I just did that. Right. And he said, after Jared learned that he had told Christine that he didn't know her and that he didn't know where he was, that Jared sent him tons of text messages being like

you're a fucking asshole. He wrote, you're a fucking stupid bro. You just fucked me. Bro, delete all these messages. I'd be like, no. Yeah. You're the one that dragged me into this. Fuck you. You're stupid, bro. It's ridiculous. So then they also had Mario Nelson testify. He was the one who initially found the torso in the basement. He shared that basement. He was like his neighbor. He's the hot shot. Yeah, he said that he had known Jared to have a gun. He had a revolver. And he said at one point, he had seen him spin the gun around on the table during a visit with him, like when he went over his apartment once. And he said, this made him super uncomfortable. He was like, he plays with that fucking gun. Like, it's weird. That is bizarre. And he said that he also had bragged to him on one occasion that he knew how to get rid of a body because, quote, his dad used to be in the Irish mob. What?

Like, what? Also, like, you can't go around telling people that. I'm like, obviously he's not. Because if you were the child of like a former or present mob, and also used to be, what? And it's like, you don't get out of the Irish mom. And it's like, if you're a child of like a mobster, you know not to go around telling people you're the child of a mobster. Whatever. So he also, um, so he also said that he saw Ashley at Jared's apartment around the time she went missing.

Yeah. And he said he went over to Jared's apartment at one point to smoke weed with him, but he said he couldn't tell the exact date. And he said, after he did this, when he went over, he like smoked with him. He said right after that, Jared suddenly asked him to help unlock Ashley's car. And he was like, what do you mean unlock Ashley's car? Where is she? And he said, oh, he said Ashley locked her keys in the car, which was a Ford Focus. And he was like, can you just help me go get him?

She's out somewhere, like, with someone else. How is she out if she doesn't have her car? Also, wait. Did he, did Mario go to his apartment to smoke? Or, yeah. How? Was it already? It might have been outside or something.

Like, they didn't say if it was it inside or not. I'm like, I'm sure they would have asked him, like, did you see everything? Yeah, yeah, yeah. What I'm guessing is it was probably like outside or something like that. Weird. And he's, his girlfriend also. also testified Mario's girlfriend, also said that she saw Jared driving a Ford Focus on November 30th. This guy is, wow.

You're very brazen, sir. So much. So Jared's brother Conrad actually testified. Against him? Yes. Good. He said he had been at his brother's apartment when Ashley was there in the days before her death. And he said, in the days that he was there, his brother at one point went into another room to get a Smith and Wesson 22 caliber.

gun. And he said, then he came back into the room with him, pointed the gun at his brother's head, and pulled the trigger more than once without seeing if the gun was loaded. Like Russian roulette. What the fuck is? This kid was probably so excited to testify against his shit head of a brother. He was like, let me fuck his world up. I literally was like, here's this tea that I have. I'm going to pour it over your face. Yep. I'm going to, yeah, it's, well, then he said that when Ashley was there when that happened. And he said he testified that Ashley, actually, said, you're never supposed to do that to him. Oh, yeah. I love her. And he said he returned a couple of days later to the apartment with his parents, but he said he was foggy on the details of that day.

Conrad said that he went back. Okay. He said he remembered helping Jared get his things like a cardboard box into the car, and that Jared was very upset. He said the entire family drove around looking for Ashley's Ford Focus. Yeah, no, they were driving around looking for a place to put Ashley's head. And they found it eventually because he had moved it. Yeah. Jared had moved it, but he couldn't remember where he had moved it. And eventually they found it parked down the street, and Jared got out and took them some things from inside of it and then got back in the car with them. What is this family? Yeah, exactly. What is this family? I'm saying. The pathologist testified that because they were trying to say that this was possibly like negligent homicide because he was so careless with his

firearm that whoops, maybe he just accidentally shot her. But that's, no, because that's not an accident. Playing Russian roulette is not an accident. Exactly. And nope, because he also cut her into pieces. Yeah, like, that's our, that's a given. Can we not pretend that this was like, oh, no, like you, nope. That goes up my ass sideways. The pathologist testified, but no, this was not a negligent homicide. He said, even if he, even though he doesn't have the head where cause of death was. He said it was intentional based on the blood and evidence he saw an autopsy. He said this was totally, he said the amount of blood that was possibly coming from her head was not a whoops. No. You know? I can't believe he even had to like testify that. Yeah. Jared was offered a deal,

a plea deal that if he revealed where Ashley's head and neck were, then he would get 31 years. Okay. He refused. Can you say a sentence now? He, well, I'll tell you in one sec. So he refuses to tell where Ashley's head is. Or her hands or her feet. That is so bizarre, too, because it's like, no matter what, you would still get 31 years. This is your deal. Exactly.

No matter what. And the hands and feet to me, too, I'm like, she was bound. Oh, yeah. That's why he got rid of the hands and feet. Definitely. So you can't see the ligature marks. Yeah. And it's like, that's what this is.

Do you, this might be like a stupid question, but because the legs weren't found was, the legs were found. The legs were found. Legs, arms, and torso were found. So was there missing head, neck, hands and feet? Okay, sorry, it's hard to keep track. No, it's fine. Was there any evidence of like, no, sexual assault or anything?

Nope, not that was said in any of the sources I found. All right. He was convicted of second degree murder and mutilation of a body. The judge sentenced. him to a hundred years in prison. Iconic. And said he didn't want him to have the opportunity to get out of prison until he was 130 years old. I love that so much. Ashley's mom gave a statement standing in front of Jared, who was forced to stand in front of her while she did this. She held the box with Ashley's

cremated remains in her hand. She said a couple of things. She said, you do not deserve to breathe. She said, if I want to hug, I have to hug a box. She said, you will. never tell me where she is because you like to torment people. You like to hurt them. You enjoy it. Then she said she listens to the voicemail of her daughter every day and cries. And she said just hearing her voice and her laughter. She screamed at him, you had no right to take her from me. And then she said, Jared chants, I hate you. I want to rip you from limb to limb and discard you just like you did to Ashley. You threw her out like trash and she was your friend. Why? And she said, She said she had no idea what Ashley saw in him that was worth saving.

My goodness. And then Jared stood there, wouldn't look her in the eye, never made any kind of facial expression. I wish there was some way when like things like this happened that they have to look at the person. Oh, I feel like they should have, somebody should be holding their face to look at somebody. Like obviously we can't do that, but I so wish. They should. Jared said nothing. When he was given the opportunity to make a statement or apologize, he said no.

He would not. What an asshole. And he still, he refuses still to reveal where her head is and he won't give a motive and he won't give a cause of death because he's a fucking monster. Wow. Now, the trial court was presided over by Judge Mark Truesock and he really gave it to him. Yeah. He said, quote, he said the trial was one of the most gruesome he had ever seen.

And he said, you, sir, in my mind, are a very evil individual. You are clearly a monster without any conscience whatsoever. And then he said, you are someone who is a danger to society and should never be allowed free. He also, when talking about, because there's specific guidelines, obviously, that they have to take under account for like sentencing and all that. And when he spoke of this, he said, more significantly, the guidelines do not take into effect the level of brutality involved in this matter. And your lack of compassion and total lack of remorse. Unfortunately, I've been doing this type of work for 34 years. I've been on the bench for 13 years.

I personally have been involved in over 200 murder or death cases. This is without question the worst case that I have ever been involved in. What you did and what I saw in photographs was reprehensible and heinous. This goes beyond comprehension. For the jury to even have to see the limited number of pictures that I allowed was in this just incomprehensible. And yet you sat during trial and even today you make no comment. I haven't. I know you have the right to to not incriminate yourself.

However, I observed you during the course of this trial and you seemed at time to derive pleasure from the testimony in this trial that was at best described as gruesome. Wow. So he's literally like, I've been watching your ass this whole time and I can see that you're enjoying this. See, I hate, like I am so happy that people get to make their statements, but it's, It's like I hate that these criminals that do things like this, get off on that. Yeah, because you can tell he gets off on causing harm and hurt.

Right. Now, the parents went on trial in October, and at the time, 64-year-old Barbara Chance pleading no contest to accessory after the fact in perjury, and she was sentenced to 45 days in jail. That's ridiculous. James, who was 77 at the time, was convicted of accessory after the fact, but acquitted. of one count of perjury. That's interesting. Apparently, the jury was deadlocked on that, and he got a month in jail.

One month. Now, when they were sentenced, they did, because this was in 2020 that they were sentencing hearing for them, and they did this over Zoom, because it was 2020, obviously. Right. And both Ashley's parents, now, Ashley's biological father was there, her mother, and her mother's partner, Dana, were there. and they were able to give their statements. And I just want to play what Christine said because the parents, obviously, Jared's parents, Barbara and James were there and had to listen to this.

Right. Like, and it's her chance to talk to them. Yeah, to be like, and it was basically her chance to plead with them to tell her what happened to Ashley. And they won't do it. So the entire family sounds fucked other than Conrad. It's horrific. Now here is the sentencing hearing. So that was Christine, her mother.

I don't understand how they could sit there and listen to that and not want to tell her where her daughter is. That's what's shocking to me. And what we'll see after is I truly believe that James Chance did something to Ashley, obviously knows where Ashley's head is. I think he was the one who figured out what to do with it. And I think that Jared is not going to say what happened because he's got a weird allegiance to his father. And he's not going to say it because we'll get into that in a second. But let me play for you, Ashley's father, who also was able to say something. Now, he has an accent that's like a little, and he was like sobbing.

So it's hard to understand him. But he was basically saying, you a police officer, like you hold a badge, like you should be ashamed of yourself. And then he said, I grew up on a farm. Like, we, I've seen cattle and sheep slaughtered. I know what's involved. And then he said, you are a monster. Like, because he's like, I basically saying, I've seen dismemberment. I've seen what happens when you slaughter an animal and you slaughtered my child.

Absolutely. Like, how dare you? It's horrific. I don't know how you sit there as a parent to two children, knowing that you did that to somebody else's child. Yeah. And then I'll leave the last thing I'll play here. is just James and Barbara's response.

Oh, they got to respond? Yeah. Why? Well, wait until you hear it's nonsense. Nope, you're not. If you were sorry, you would say where she was. That's what's killing me. You're sitting in front of these parents

whose child was brutally murdered and dismembered by your fucking piece of shit son. And you, you know where her head is. You know where her fucking head is. The one thing that identifies us as a human being, you know where that thing is. And you're watching these two parents sit there and sob in front of you just saying, I want her head. I just want my child's head.

Like, especially the mother. Like, you sat there and you held two of your babies after you just had them. How could you not think of that mother sitting across from you holding her little baby? Yeah. And you know where she is. And you know where her fucking head is. Like mother to mother, I don't. Like.

And then you have the, you have the audacity to sit there and go, I'm so sorry. And I pray for you? Don't pray for me. Fucking James, we grieve for Ashley and her parents. Then where's her head, asshole? Right. Like, don't waste your time praying for me. Why don't you let me know where my child is?

Let her parents grieve. Give her back her head. It's unbelievable to me that these people can sit there and just say, I'm so sorry. You know where her head. Then tell us. And he probably told you what happened. Tell us what happened. Are you fucking kidding me, dude? Like, James had like a stroke before this. And I was like, you're on death's fucking door, motherfucker. You better clear that conscience because I don't know where the fuck you're going,

but it's not going to be a good place. He would make like a deathbed confession. I hope so, because I, those parents deserve to know what the fuck was going on. If you have a stroke, you're just done. And well, so, and then what really leads me to believe that the father, and the mother that they are the ones who really took care of this and did whatever they did with her head and that Jared is just holding that. A TV station went into the prison to talk to Jared. And the reporter basically was like, where's her head? Like, you know where it is. And she said to her, like, why won't you just give this to her parents? You're in jail for the rest of your life. Why does it matter?

And this was the reporter talking to Jared. She was like, why can't you just give this to people? Like, why wouldn't you give this to her parents? Right. And he's sitting there. He can barely speak. He's literally like about to cry. He has tears in his eyes. He looks like he's about to fucking lose his goddamn mind. The dude is so tightly wound. I've never seen anything like it. Well, and he's sitting there being like, I can't, I can't, I don't, I just, I can't, I want to, I can't. And he keeps saying, I want to. What do you? You're in prison for the rest of your life. That's why I'm like, what is this dynamic? Because this is fuck. Because he's literally sitting there saying, I can't, I want to, I can't. And she's like, you can. You're in fucking prison. I would literally be like, dude, you're not ever getting out of here. So like just let us know. And then she played him through the like thing, a video of Christine sobbing during an interview and just saying, I just want my baby's head. Can you please just tell me where my baby's head is? Oh, that's horrible. And he was literally like, and he's like literally saw like sitting there like about to lose his mind. And he can.

keeps going, I can't, I can't, I can't, I can't. No, because if you wanted to, you're a grown fucking adult, so go ahead and do it. Well, and he's like, I'd love to, I'd love to fix this, but I can't. And you're like, shut the fuck up. But you're like, what? And then he just goes, I can't, I'm sorry. And he gets up and just leaves the interview. He won't talk about it. Oh my, I don't know how the interviewer didn't like punch him in his face. His parents did something to her head. His parents were the one that took that responsibility and he's fucking holding it for them. And I don't know why. maybe when when they die he'll say because i think he literally is holding it so that they don't get i don't know if this is some weird loyalty thing where he doesn't want them thrown in prison forever

because if they find out what they did because right now they've got nothing on him right right now nobody can say that they did something with the head right but if he does then it's there and they could still go to jail because they weren't ever tried for exactly so it's like i and just do you fuck you guys like like give her parents this fucking club. Like that's so beyond evil to me. That's, it's, I don't even know. It's like Ted Bundy.

It's not worse than murdering her, obviously, but somehow it is in a different way. It's so, it's a long game. It's a long game of just grief and torture. When anybody loses a family member or especially a parent loses a child, it always breaks my heart when the parent can't bury their child or all of their child. Exactly. Like, or I just don't understand how you do that to somebody. No, I don't either.

Do you have any theory at all for what may have happened to her head? He's a police officer. Right. I'm sure he's got some tricks up his sleeve. Not that I'm saying police officers know what to do with like... Well, no, but they've seen many things. But they've seen many things. They've probably read many reports.

They've seen autopsies. They've been to, like, they've talked to pathologists. You know, they are skilled in, you know, you know, learning how other people cover up crimes. So I'm like, was there, is there, I mean, all I can think of is like, it's got to be like buried somewhere. Or do you think that there's a possibility that it doesn't fully exist intact anymore? I wonder that too. Like do you, I really hate to say this, but do you think they put it in some kind of grinder? Possibly. Can you do that with a head? Well, and also, if he, if it was blunt forced trauma to the head, if he like just smashed her head, this is horrible.

say, but like if he hit her head with something several times, he could have sunk it in. He could have caused a lot of damage that would make it easier to... Not exactly intact. So it's like, I wonder if, I don't know, the only thing I could think of is like they buried it somewhere that it's, they, you know, I don't know. I don't know what they could have done with this thing. This is probably one of the most horrific cases that we've ever covered. It really is. Because this is like a family. We've never covered a case where an entire family was involved. Where like the family, that the family wasn't involved with the initial crime, but went to such great lengths to become involved. And now, see, this to me, like, looking back into it, he has all these problems.

He's very clearly has, like, behavioral issues. Yep. And then they do this for them. To me, it seems like maybe something happened, this is total speculation. For sure. Maybe something happened in his childhood. And they feel like they. owe it to him because they fucked him up. That's a very good, I mean, that's a really good theory.

Yeah. And to me, this kind of behavior and the kind of behavior that he was showing. Right. And then to see how these parents enabled this whole thing, I'm like, oh, yeah. This dynamic in this household was way off from a long time ago. I really, like, just from, I mean, I only know, like, from this moment what you said, but I definitely think something. Yeah. I feel there's some weird shit. Yeah, I feel like, I need to like evaluate this on my own, like, later. Truly, I, it's just, it's really, somebody's got to tell these poor parents where the fucking head is and tell them what happened. I just, I, the fact that this guy's in jail for 100 years and he's not fucking talking is infuriating.

Well, and the fact that he could have gotten 30 years for just saying where she is. And he will not say it. I, is it like so. That's why I feel like it has to be. a protection of the parents thing. Well, and it's like, is it so horrible that, like, it's beyond even our comprehension what was done with the head? Maybe. And that, well, and it'll just tie to them. That's what it is. Her poor mom has to go to bed every single night and wondering where it is, what happened, where her head is not it. And what happened to

her daughter? Yeah. Because she doesn't, she doesn't even know how her daughter died. That's the thing. It's like, she doesn't even know. And the fact that she woke up and she said her arm, I can't believe Didn't that? I do believe that. Oh, it gave me like a pit in my stomach. Wow, Patrions. Great pick. So thanks, patrons for this one. But if, I mean, there's like tons of resources about this case and stuff, like a website for her. And I mean, it's just, I need these people to open up. It's like driving me nuts that they aren't. And it like seriously, like I believe a lot in karma. And you would think that she would have some kind of karma. surrounding her for what an amazing person that she was, where hopefully something comes out eventually. There's got to be something. And her parents get closure. Yeah, I would hope so. You know what I mean? Come on, Michigan. Come on, Jared. Show us what's going on. Jared. Grow a pair. Yeah, that's what's killing me. This reporter, too, he almost looked like he was ready to crack. Like, I feel like if they just

fucking hammer this kid, he's a little bitch. He's not going to, it's not going to take a lot to crack him, I feel. I feel like if you really hammered into him, he would eventually fall into a puddle of shit. Well, I wonder if now he'll just say no to interviews. He probably will because he can't handle it. Wow. He can't take the heat. Yeah. I also just looked at a picture of him and he has the deadest eyes. Yeah, he does. It's because he's a dead human being. Did they ever do a psychaval or anything on him? No, I don't think they did. Interesting. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Wow. Well, all right. Thank you, Patreon. Yeah, that ruined me. It's like nine o'clock at night now and I get to go. I don't think. drive home. Cool. Yeah, for sure. All right. Um, how do we finish? Yeah, follow us on Instagram.

At Morbid Podcast. Send us a Twitter. Send us a Twitter. Send us a Twitter. Send us any Twitter you like. Yeah, just send us. You got a good Twitter? Send it to us. Send it to me. And then Gmail me. And Morbid Podcasts at gmail. Oh, my God, especially if you wrote that fucking email. Yes, please. You're out there. Yeah. We hope we keep listening. And we hope you keep it weird. I'm going to leave now. Not, not even close. to this weird. Never ever even imagine keeping it this weird. Not close to being these parents. Oh, fuck that, no.