Morbid - The Murders of Billy Payne & Billie Jean Hayworth

Episode Date: January 25, 2023

The murders of Billy Payne and Billie Jean Hayworth were incredibly senseless. The case would end up being dubbed "The Facebook Murders" because of an ongoing feud between the victims and a woman named Jenelle Potter who had moved to their small town years earlier. Strangely enough, all three had been part of the same friend group at one time, but unreciprocated romantic feelings would tear the friend group apart. The case would involve catfishing, manipulation, Facebook.... and even the CIA.Thank you to the astounding David White for research assistance ReferencesDiaz, Joseph, and Alexa Valiente. 2015. "How a Social Media Feud Led to the Murder of a Young Tennessee Couple." ABC News, October 9.Ghianni, Tim. 2012. "Handguns Found at Home of 'Facebook' Murder Suspect." Fort McMurray Today, February 15.Lee, Murry, Ashley Sharp, and Slater Teague. 2021. Daughter, mother convicted in ‘Facebook murders’ case asking for new trials. July 12. Accessed December 23, 2022. https://www.wjhl.com/news/local/mother-daughter-convicted-in-facebook-murders-case-to-appear-in-court-tuesday/.Schoals, Gayle. 2016. "Tricked Into Murder: Obsession, CIA Conspiracies and Shocking Killings." The Sun, September 4.Sharp, Ashley. 2021. Attorneys respond to ‘guilty’ plea, reduced sentence of Barbara Potter in 2012 ‘Facebook Murders’. November 11. Accessed December 26, 2022. https://www.wjhl.com/news/local/attorneys-respond-to-guilty-plea-reduced-sentence-of-barbara-potter-in-2012-facebook-murders/.State of Tennessee v. Barbara Mae Potter. 2018. E2015-02262-CCA-R3-CD (Court of Criminal Appeals of Tennessee at Knoxville, September 26).State of Tennessee v. Marvin E. Potter. 2016. E2015-00013-CCA-R3-CD (Court of Criminal Appeals of Tennessee at Knoxville, March 8).Thompson, John. 2012. "Slaying Suspect's Daughter Interviewed ." Knoxville News Sentinel, February 10. Cowritten by Alaina Urquhart, Ash Kelley & Dave White (Since 10/2022)Produced & Edited by Mikie Sirois (Since 2023)Research by Dave White (Since 10/2022), Alaina Urquhart & Ash KelleyListener Correspondence & Collaboration by Debra LallyListener Tale Video Edited by Aidan McElman (Since 6/2025) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey weirdos, I'm Ash. And I'm Elena. And this is finally morbid again. Finally, guys. I feel some type of way that we're recording. It's very weird. It's been like two full weeks almost. Yeah. It feels like it's been two years. No, it feels like it's been a fucking eternity. It really does. We're very happy to be back. I missed you guys. I know. And let me be the first to say you guys have been absolutely fucking amazing. amazing. If you have not been on social media and you've been wondering where the hell we've been for two weeks. Like did morbid die? Like where did they go? Did they just stop? Never. One of my twins got very, very sick with invasive strep disease, pneumonia in RSV, all at the same time. And a fucking collapsed lung. Yeah, from the pneumonia, actually, in the invasive strep. So it was really bad.

And happened very suddenly right when we got home from the New York show, actually. Literally that night. Went from a very big high to a very big low. The lowest of lows, one might say. We are not even out of the woods yet. And it's been two full weeks. So it's been a really rough time. And she was in ICU for over a week.

And she's still in the hospital, but we're hoping that we'll change, you know, in the next day or two. And things are looking up now. so she's going to be okay. We can finally say that. For a while, it was like really hairy there, guys. It was like really bad for a while. It was really scary. Yeah.

And John and I have been living in the hospital, basically just trying to like switch back and forth between like going home for a night. Let me just quickly say that ash is a literal angel on earth. No. And you should all have an ash in your life because everyone on a lot. Because everyone on planet Earth needs an ash in their life. Stop. Because between her and my mother-in-law, we would not have been able to function without them.

Like, Ash has literally, like, taken over my house for me. Yeah, I did. It's been so fun. She's taken care of the baby. She's doing night feedings for us. Hell yeah. Amazing. Well, I just, I want five kids anyway.

Annie's like, what the fuck? Annie's like, excuse me, what? She's like, I wouldn't have dated you if I known that. No, not actually. But I want to have like many, many children. And I love kids. And like I love steady mom and like you have been steady mom. I've been driving a mom car.

Not to be like a bitch, but you have a mom car. I've been driving a mom car. I've been bringing kids to school. I've been fucking making dinner and shit. She has done it all. I've been living this whole. I mean, I've been horribly upset also. But you've been you've been like holding it down here.

Yeah. Mama's got to hold it down, honey. We are so, and also it's like anybody out there who has kids knows that if seeing your kids sick at all is like the worst thing ever, but this was by far the worst experience of my entire life. Invasive strep has a mortality rate. Like, I don't wish this experience on my worst enemies. Even like all the assholes who like say shitty things to us, I don't even wish this on them. I don't wish it on anyone from Naperville. No, no. Naperville, I do not wish this on you at all. No.

It's terrible. And, um, but I want to thank, obviously I want to, I wanted, I could never thank Ash enough for what she's done for me. It's unbelievable. I just did exactly what you would do for me. I love you. I do. I have a whole new appreciation for you.

How does this woman, this woman across from me in this laundry room, I don't care how long the intro is. How do you, how do you do all of the mom things? Like, wake up, homie. The other day, like, I love your kid, but she woke up every two hours. Yeah. And I was like, sweetie, you're cute and all, but damn, how does mama produce the podcast, edit the podcast, research all the things for the podcast and feed your ass every two hours? I just figure I'll sleep, you know, when I'm dead.

And then like the older one, she's like coughing in the middle of the night and like yelling at me because I can't she doesn't like to be comforted. Oh yeah, because that was the other thing. The other two kids got sick too. Yeah, everybody's sick. Not as bad. We got sick. We got sick too. But and then I realized that as a mom like not that I was your their mom but you can't be sick. No you can't. Like I was coughing but I was like it doesn't matter. Yeah you're like I don't feel good but I can't not feel good. I couldn't even take my favorite drug of choices which is NyQuil. No that's something you give up as a mom or a dad. And the other day all I wanted and I'm just going to keep it straight up 100 with you. All I wanted was a glass of wine. Yeah. And I was like but what if something happened in the middle of the night and I get it now. You want to. You want to keep it. I'm just going to keep it. I'm just going to keep it. I'm just. You want to. I'm just going to keep it. I'm just. I'm just. I'm just

Honestly, this has taught us. Shit can happen in the blink of a fucking eye. And suddenly she was sick out of nowhere. Like, really sick. So it's like, we always need to be aware. And it is. You see how, you know, like NyQuil, that's something you give up. I used to love NyQuil when I had a cold because you would be like, goodbye.

I love NyQuil. I love wine. I love edibles. Like, I still have about, I would say, five or six years of, like, not having kids just to, like, indulge in myself. And also, I have. I just want to say you guys listening, you right there. Hey, you. Hey. Hey. Hey.

You in your car. You on the treadmill. I was going to say on the treadmill. Washing some dishes. You're cleaning your dog. You at work. You just doing whatever you want to do. You pooping. You pooping. You have been amazing. Incredible. I want to thank each and every person for sending like good vibes. I'm not a religious person, but I really appreciated the people that were like we're sending prayers. Yeah. know what, that's awesome. That's a good vibe. I will take all the vibes, all the hugs, all the prayers, all the

thoughts. Somebody messaged me and said that she was doing witchy stuff for us. And I was like, sweetie child, yeah. I'm doing witchy stuff. Thank you. My ass was outside walking your dog talking to the moon. Your neighbors probably think I'm not okay. I was in the hospital room literally, because I was ready to do anything at that point. I was like, I will like, I will do some, I will sacrifice myself. I don't even know. So I was like looking up at the full moon, like, begging the moon to help me. It was it you do some you get weird when you get sick. I mean you keep it weird. You keep it real weird. But seriously, you guys, thank you so much. You've been so patient. Everybody's been amazing. Our moderators have been amazing on the Facebook page.

Once we updated everybody, everybody was awesome because I know everybody has been waiting for part two of Ariel Castro. And I appreciate everybody being so, so patient about it. And there was only like one or two people that were like nasty. And once you answered with, uh, hey, my kids in the hospital, they felt real stupid real quick. So that was a nice silver lining too to make some trolls feel like idiots. So that was good. You're welcome. Everyone else though, like the other 99.999% of everybody was so amazing, so understanding. And we love you. And we appreciate you so much. This was a humbling experience. Yeah. And John and I both appreciate you. This was awesome to see you guys just like be so like behind us. Yeah, it was like our community.

Yeah, and it like made me feel like, okay, she's got all these like good thoughts coming from like all these places. Yeah. You know what? She's doing great now. So everything's going to, everything's on the up and up. We're getting back into the grind here. Hopefully you're all ready to listen to some really fucked up shit in this episode. We have a little housekeeping first.

We do. We've never said that before. I got that because I was listening to Pod Save America and they said that. Yeah, Pod Save America. I'm trying to get political, but we won't talk about that here. How the fuck do you? open your phone without a home button. I have one of those fancy space phones.

I don't understand. Oh, that's another mom thing. I fucking dropped my phone in your bathtub tonight giving your kid a bath. I've done that. I was pissed. It happens, man. It's fine, though. So we really quickly just want to remind you of all the live shows that we have

coming up. Pretty soon. We're going to be in Philadelphia. Hey, Philadelphia. I'm going to eat a cheesecake. We're coming for you. Punchline Comedy Club, Baby, April 14th. Sold out.

April 15th sold out DC improv. We're coming all up in you, Washington, D.C. That's not a gross. May 6th, we're going to be in Huntsville, Alabama. We sure are. I think the week before that, we're going to be at CrimeCon. Yeah, we definitely are. I mean, I don't think we are.

It's going to be awesome. I was saying, like, I think it's the week before that. It is. So, yep, Huntsville, Alabama, the next fucking night, we're going to be in Nashville twice. Yes, Nashville. Two times one night, baby. Two times all up in you, Nashville.

May 7th early, May 7th late. And baby, if you don't. already know Chicago, June 12th, sold out. What up Chicago? So those are our live shows. We're working on some more. Yeah, everybody, make sure you stay tuned because there's going to be some fun announcements coming up in the next week or so, and we're real excited about it. Well, without further ado, why don't you go ahead and fuck up my world some more? I am ready to fuck up everybody's world right now. She's been waiting to fuck up worlds for like two weeks. I really have. This is kind this is very cathartic guys so i'm ready um and this this has like a happy ending so it's a good

where did we leave off i don't recall so where we left off because i know it's been like 400 years guys and again we it was not our intention to start a two-parter right before this happened obviously it was just really bad timing so uh we're you know glad you've all been hanging on the edge of your seats for this yeah um so we left off and let's see um he had kidnapped amanda barry yep um he had brought her into the home. He told Michelle that he was planning to bring two other women into the home. And he told her that that's when he would let her go. That's not true.

That was a lie. But Michelle also became pregnant by this asshole. I hate that. And he made her lose the baby by punching her in the stomach with a barbell. Oh, that's where we were. After he starved her for a week. Oh, my God. He starved her while she was pregnant?

Oh, yeah. And then he punched her in the stomach with a barbell while she was pregnant. I know, I love that. I was like, oh, my God, he didn't give her food. I'm like, yes, he also put a barbell into her stomach. Every time you say that, I feel like I've been punched in the stomach. It's awful. Michelle, I mean, they, let me be clear, they all were tortured, abused heinously in this house.

But Michelle seemed to be his, like, favorite punching bag. Which is no brain. Yeah, and she was the one who, like, suffered. And all in all, she suffered five terminating. pregnancies in that house. Wow. Terminated by him. Right.

Obviously. Five? Yeah. And when she came out of it, she was no longer allowed to, allowed. She was no longer able to conceive a child. Oh my God. He like shut down her like, because he, I mean, she,

he like fucked her up inside. I'm sure all three of them came out with physical and physical injuries that will never be able to know about. Wow. That was one of hers. So, and during the. the three, during the some of the like three, I think it's like three years that these women were locked up in his home. He was actually actively dating a woman named Lillian. Poor Lillian.

Which I had no idea. Sometimes she would, so she would come over sometimes, but she was never allowed to go upstairs and they were all held upstairs. Right. And sometimes she would hear Michelle's television upstairs and she would be like, what's that? Like, who's up there? And he would make an excuse. And she just kind of like went with it. Was like, I don't know. Imagine if you were dating somebody and they didn't allow you upstairs in their home. Yeah, that would be my first. I mean, that's a red flag, guys. That's weird. I'm no relationship expert, but I'm just going to say that that's a red flag. You should probably get the hell out of there. Leave. And if he looks like Ariel Castro, you should probably get the hell out of there, too, because that dude is yucco. Looking ugly.

So they broke up in October 2003, but, um, yeah, it's just, it's, and he, this shows to, and it's, and it gets more more apparent throughout this story. How much he like psychologically abused these women as well. Yeah. Like he, they for sure were like Stockholm syndrome at some point. Oh. And then it was also like they just,

he had taken every shred of them away from themselves. Yeah. Every piece of hope away from them. So there were even times where he would like allow them to kind of walk around a little bit in the house and they would be too scared to even try anything. Yeah. Because it just wasn't even. They were like.

No. It's not worth it. Yeah. Like, I won't think it would happen. So November 15th, 2000, 2003, America's Most Wanted covered the disappearance of Amanda Berry. Because Amanda had, her disappearance had been covered heavily. Her mother was on that case from like she was. Because she was young. All over the news. She was an, and she just had a different life than Michelle did, unfortunately. Because if you guys had listened to, if you've listened to Part 1, we really covered Michelle's upbringing. That poor woman.

She, like, barely had anybody. She has been traumatized her entire life. I'm so, it's nice to hear, and we'll update you on at the end of this podcast, how they're doing now. And it's nice to hear she is thriving right now. But holy shit, she had a time to get there. Her life is like, oh, my God. Yeah. And that was one of the things, like, Amanda Berry's mom was like, oh,

all over the news. She was on, like, TV shows, talk shows, just hosting vigils and, like, doing everything she can. And we'll find out that the third woman who's abducted Gina DeHesuz, her parents are also everywhere, all over the news, everything. And he would make sure to show them, their families looking for them. But he would also show Michelle, see no one's looking for you. No one gives a shit that you're gone. And she said she would try to act like, fuck you, dude. And then she was like, but inside, I'd be like, no one's looking for me. Of course. And she was like, and I read in her book, and I'll link her book, all of their books in the page notes for this. But she says at one point, she was like, I just like was thinking about how no one is looking for me.

No one gives a shit. And it was the loneliest feeling. And then I started thinking of what that would feel like to be in this situation, like this horrific, horrific situation. and then sit there and go, and no one cares. There's no one outside of these walls that even gives the shit. That's like depression on like another level. Like that is so dark. Yeah. I can't even bring my mind to go there.

Yeah. She had to go there for like 11 years. I can't imagine that. I can't even, I can't. So January 26th, 2004, police arrived at the home of Ariel Castro. Why? Why did they arrive there? They were investigating him on charges of child abduction

and child endangerment. I know you're like, what the fuck. Yeah. Well, if you remember, he's a school bus driver, an elementary school bus driver. Which is terrifying. Well, that same morning, he had picked two kids up to drop them off at, like, an after-school program. Mm-hmm. He decided he dropped one of them off.

And then he kept the other one, which was, I believe, a four-year-old. What? A four or five-year-olds, a very young kid. He kept that one in the bus. drove to a Wendy's and was like, I'm going to go eat lunch in this Wendy's. Force this child to hide in the back of the bus while he went into the Wendy's to eat. Told this kid lay down bitch. Oh my God.

Yep. And then he went inside, ate some food, came back, drove the bus around aimlessly for a while with this child in it. Probably like crying and screaming too, you would think. Yeah. And then dropped the kid back off at school two hours late. And did he not think anything was going to come of that? That's how fucked this dude is. So these two police officers, so obviously this all came to light, the parents were like, what the fuck?

So these two police officers show up at his door and ask him about this shit. And when he didn't answer the door, they just forget it and walk away. Oh, okay. Let me tell you, this is the first of many times that the Cleveland Police Department dropped the motherfucking ball on this. That's insane. The Cleveland Police Department arrived at this house. house and knocked on this door several more times. Are you kidding me?

And when he didn't answer, they would just leave. And that was it. Yeah. Like certain things, especially like abduction of a four-year-old, deserve a little follow-up. Yep. That definitely deserves follow-up. Well, this was also investigated by Cleveland's child and family services, obviously. They found it of child abuse and neglect, but they said it was unsubstantiated.

Oh. Okay. That makes perfect sense, except not at all. We're not going to press any charges against it. It's fine. Also, I'm never putting my kids on a bus ever. No, I'm not after many of these stories. Never. And again, if you drive a bus, I'm sure you're a wonderful person.

Oh, yeah, 100%. I'm not trying to tell you that like all bus drivers are the worst. I had great bus drivers growing up. But, oh, you know what? These two instances that I can think of I'm not into. I had a shitty bus driver one time and he missed the stop of my house. He like didn't stop at my house. And I was like, there was like a lot of other kids on the bus.

And then I like went to the front. And I was, I was literally five years old. And I was like, it's one of my first memories. And I was like, um, you didn't stop at my house. And he was so mean. And he was like, blah. Get off at the next stop. And I was like, oh my God.

It was like, it was when I lived over there. Oh my God. Yeah. And I remember my mom like when she gave a shit about me was rip shit. I would have killed that man with my bare hands. I think honestly, I think that my mom almost did. I'm going to be honest with you. Like, first of all, my kids aren't going on the bus.

that's just not happening anymore. But if they did, that happened, mark my words, I would kill that man. And I was so scared. It's one of my first memories. That's horrifying. I was wearing a pink jumper. That's horrifying because one of the things I keep thinking of is my twins are four. And I keep trying to think of like, okay, they're four.

So I'm like, hopefully she's not going to remember much of this. She won't. The whole situation, I keep thinking that. So I really hope she does. Most of my childhood was pretty traumatic and I don't remember. A lot of it. So that's good. Yeah.

That's good. Yeah, it's fine. It's perfect. Well, the good thing about this whole thing was the Cleveland School District did hold a disciplinary meeting. Well, that's good. And he was suspended from work for 60 days without pay. Oh, perfect punishment for that.

Yeah, let's not fire the guys who have adopted a child. No. Like, that makes sense. Wait. Obviously, it's a union situation, though. Yeah. It's a little harder to, which, I mean, we're a union. family so yeah come at me bro but it does make situations like this a little harder no totally does just

fire him he's got the union behind them and he just wanted a foe foe he just wanted a foe foe at wendies that's terrible uh but now so again he has michel he has amanda the police have already been at the house nothing's happening here do you think that they knew that the police were there like michel and amanda i wonder if they did because can you imagine you're like that close to oh my god oh god oh my god Honestly, I hope they didn't. I agree. Just for their sakes. So the third woman who was a girl, not a woman at this point.

She was a young girl. Gina DeHesuz. She went missing on April 2nd, 2004. Now, let me just get one thing out of the way here. Felix de Jesus, Gina's father. He was friends with Ariel Castro. Are you kidding me? I just got chills.

Yep. They were friends in school, all through school together. they went like way back. So she knew him. This fucker took one of his good friend's daughters. Yeah, that's insane. Yeah. Gina's name was Georgina, but she went by Gina.

Yeah. She was 14 years old at the time of the induct. How did he abduct her? So at 2.30 p.m., the day she went missing, she left Wilbur Wright Middle School. Mm-hmm. Because you're in like eighth grade. Middle school. Yeah.

She was a child to walk home with Arlene Castro, who was her best friend and Ariel's 13 year old daughter. Okay. Now, none of his kids knew about what was going on. Wow. Because he wouldn't let his kids upstairs when they were over. Like, they just, he would just be secretive and they were like, my dad's just weird. Right. And they also didn't live with him. So it was like, when you said like the house was a mess and like stuff like that, so you have to wonder how often they were even there. Exactly. I don't think they were there that much. And when they were, he was weird and secretive about this stuff. So they were like, whatever. I'm just not even going to push it. Right. So Arlene and Gina parted ways.

They were walking together. They wanted to hang out that night, but they ended up parting ways because Arlene couldn't come to Gina's house that day because she'd been grounded by her mother. Okay. I guess they had called her mother on a payphone on the way and we're like, please, can I go? And she was like, no. Oh, remember those days? Well, I don't remember pay phones, but I remember being like, please, can I?

I definitely remember it. So Gina was walking alone. Ariel drove past her and asked her, he said, have you seen Arlene? And she was like, oh yeah, I just saw her. Like, we were going to hang out, but we're not anymore. And he was like, okay, I don't know where she is. Can you help me find her? Oh, my God.

And she was like, oh, yeah, sure. Now, he later said he was turned on by her cleavage. Ew. She's 14. Ew. Now, again, Gina knew him. Right. She knew him.

It's her dad's friend. This is a family friend. So he, it's like, so she gets in the car. Yeah, it's not, that's. Because again, right. You think you know this person. All three. of these women knew him in some off way. Right. Like Michelle knew him through his daughter, Emily. And then

Amanda knew him through one of his kids. It was like, I think she knew Emily too. Yeah, like they all just knew who he was. Right. Like he wasn't in. Neighbors said later, like, he was a friendly guy. He was, he was totally, he was gross and dirty and like his house was disgusting. Yeah. We all know someone who's like that. And you're like, well, they're a nice person. Like, I don't know. Right. So it's not like he was like outwardly portraying this monster vibe. Right. So she gets in the car. And on the way, he asked her if she could help him.

He was like, you know what? Can you help me move some speakers into my house? Nope. And she was like, sure. Grown men don't need your help. No, grown men don't need your help. No. Grown-ass people don't need your help.

No. Grown-ass people don't need your help. No. And if you are, if you have a child or you are a child right now, listening to this and go to bed. But also, also. A grown-up never need your help. Maybe somebody's listening at like 1.30 and like study hall.

And they're like, well, shit. Fuck off, Elena. And you know what? If you have kids, you know, the easiest thing to tell them, I'm going to tell my kids all the time. Grownups don't need your help. And if they're asking you for your help, there's a problem. And then someday your kids are going to be like, mom, I'm not fucking emptying the dishwasher

because you don't need my help. I mean, like, can you just get this for me? They're like, oh, you don't need my help. You're a grown-up. But whatever. I'd rather them know that. So he got Gina inside the home and then immediately brought her upstairs saying the speakers were upstairs. No, they're not.

When they got upstairs, he brought her into a bathroom and he immediately said, show me your privates. Oh, ew, gross. That's how he put it. Oh. So she immediately gets weirded out and she's like, I want to leave. Ew, I just got straight up nauseous. Yeah, yeah. Because, so he was like, sure, but you have to leave.

So he was like, you know what, I'm sorry. That was rude of me and inappropriate So you can leave But you have to leave a different way than you came in So I'm gonna lead you out a different way And she was like okay cool I would have been like why And I'm sure in her head she's just thinking like I want to get the fuck way

Just get me the fuck out of here So sure So he tricked her into going into the basement Because he was like oh I'm gonna lead you out the back of the basement Now if anybody heard part one The basement is not a place you want to be So after putting plastic tie on her wrist and chaining her to the pole, he raped her.

Ew, gross. Oh, my God, nasty. When he was finished, he placed the motorcycle helmet over her head and left her there. Chained to the pole and sobbing. Like, the motorcycle helmet just adds an element of, like, terror. Straight up horror. Like, straight up horror. Like, that's a horror movie.

Yeah. It literally, that's the thing in the horror movie that you're like, that's a little too far. Yeah. Like that you're watching. Like, they didn't need to do that. That kind of takes me out of the realism of it. Nobody would do that. And then it's like, nope, somebody did.

They would. Now, Michelle said she could hear her screaming for help the entire time. Oh, my God. From the basement. She said she could literally hear her yell, somebody please help me. Oh, God. This is, I'm genuinely nauseous right now. I know.

That just gave me, like, blew off. This case is, like, turning my stomach. It really is. I promise there's a happy ending at the end. God. So at 3.45 p.m., Gina's mom, Nancy, wondered where her daughter was. Because she'd probably also just called her, too, like, hey, can we do a sleepover. Yep, and she's like, where the hell is she?

Right. She checked the places she usually went, and then she started calling her friends. No one had seen her, heard from her. At 5.09 p.m. she reported her missing to the Cleveland Police. According to the report, her mom told them her daughter was, quote, mentally

around the age of nine or ten years old and attends special ed classes. Oh, no. The report also stated, last seen by Castro Arlene of West 110 Lorraine, destination unknown. So it's just really creepy that in the missing port, it's like last scene with Arlene Castro. Right.

And it's like that's the father of which is the person who stole her. So yeah, so at the time she was mentally around the age of nine or ten. That's so horrific. Yeah. That Saturday morning there were roadblocks set up or police were stopping each car to show photos of Gina. They were using bloodhounds. I mean, the search was on. Yeah. This girl, this was a huge, huge missing person's case. The same afternoon, the police went to

Amanda's boyfriend's home, Amanda Barry's boyfriend. His name was Denizzo Diaz and they brought him in for questioning because at this time, he was a prime suspect. It's always the husband. It's always the husband did it. In fact, all of his neighbors, when he was like brought out of the house with the police, they were all like clapping and they were all just like, they got him. The poor dude. I know, because they were thinking like not only did he abduct Amanda Berry but they were like he probably knows where Gina is right right right right that um and according to the lost girls the true story of the Cleveland abductions and the incredible rescue of Michelle Knight Amanda Barry and Gina Dehajus by John Glatt it's a great book I'm going to put it in the show notes do it uh her boyfriend was stopped a lot

in the next few years following their abductions because he remained a suspect right and periodically they would just stop him show up at his door so he had he had And Ariel Castro fucked this guy's life up too. Yeah, exactly. According to the same source, that book, that day flyers were distributed by Gina's family and friends. And one flyer with her face on it was put outside of Ariel Castro's home on a tree. Also, Ariel joined the search.

It's always so fucked up to me when they do something like that or like go to the funerals. Exactly. It's so weird. It's such another level of fucked. It is. And remember, he was friends with. her father and her family. Right.

So he joined this search as a concerned friend of the family. Right. Meanwhile, he's got his daughter chained to a pole in his basement. With a motorcycle helmet on her head. And he's raped her. Yeah. Now, that Sunday, the FBI became involved because... There's three missing girls.

And it's a missing children's case at this point, and they usually get involved with that stuff. Like, we saw in, like, polyclass and stuff. At this point, Ariel figured he was fucked. All of a sudden, when the FBI came involved, he was like, oh oh I'm gonna be caught and I think he realized I stole three women in broad daylight yeah like eventually somebody's gonna catch on um so he decided to write a confession letter because he likely planned to kill himself really he didn't but he wrote about in the confession letter it's this ridiculous

letter it's like he he talks about him being a sexual predator which he's like I know I'm a sexual predator but he's like I'm sick no and it's like boo fucking who no um and he says like He says I'm sick. It's because I was sexually abused by a relative as a child. Okay, I'm sorry, but there's like plenty of fucking people that have experienced that nightmare. You can't use that as your excuse to then go and do the same fucking thing that some monster did to you. Exactly. I mean, look at Michelle Knight.

That makes me so angry. Look at Michelle Knight. Exactly. And it's like, that's a crutch. There's millions of people who are abused and suffer horrific indignities and atrocities. That doesn't mean. you go do the same exact thing. Most of them do not.

And it's like, so when people blame that, it's like, well, you're, fuck you. Right. Because you decided to take that path. And that would just be like, like, that would be like me just being like, I'm going to be negligent as fuck. Yeah. I'm just going to be an asshole now. Because I was neglected.

No. No. It's like, you choose your path. You do. And I hate when people use their past as like, oh, it drives me nuts. As a crutch to be an asshole. Exactly. I don't want to hear it.

That's a crutch in general. Yeah. It's just not. It's like, fuck you, man. So yeah. So he's like, me, man, a bad childhood. So I'm going to keep three women or two women and one child in my house and rape them every day and beat them for a decade. Like, it's fine.

Yeah, okay. That makes sense. And he legitimately blamed the three girls for their own kidnappings in this letter. What? Because he was like, well, they got in my car. They should have known better. Oh, okay. Cool.

And it's like, oh, okay, so it's their fault. Yeah, totally. So Ariel, like, honestly, now let me, spoiler alert. This fucker is dead now, which I'm sad about. I wish he was rotting. I mean, like straight up rotting. Same zies. But I hope he's dealing with bees with teeth in the bad place right now. I like that. If anyone has seen the good place, that's one of the punishments in the bad place. And I always thought it was a great punishment. Bees with teeth. Bees with teeth.

Ouch. You don't need any specifics. Like what the bees with teeth do? Just bees with teeth. I just hope he's living in a place with bees with teeth. That's kind of a tongue twister and I'm pretty impressed by you. It is. Bees with Teeth. Bees with Teeth. Piece with teeth. So I hope he's, I hope he's dealing with bees with teeth. So the same guy who was in charge of Amanda's abduction, special agent Robert Hawk, which I believe we talked about in part one.

Ball or name? I mean, you have to become a special FBI agent. Yeah, you do. If your name is Robert Hawk, like, you don't have another choice. Nope. Well, he could be a skateboarder. You could. That's true.

Yeah. But you know what? Become an FBI. Or a pilot, a pilot. Oh, Robert Hawk. Pilot, Robert Hawke. Like if somebody came off. He got a few options.

It was like, I'm your pilot today, pilot Robert Hawk. I'd be like, we're okay. Yeah, I'd be like, let's get it. He's a fucking hawk. I'm ready to fly. Or a Navy SEAL. He'd be a Navy SEAL. Oh, that's a great one.

Yep. That's a good. You got to do great things. Yeah. That's all. So he was put on as the lead of Gina's case as well. I'm glad. So it's a good hand with Robert Hawk.

Her parents, Nancy, and Felix were like literally not sleeping. Of course not. They are, because, I mean, I don't even want to fathom this. Nope. I'm not even sleep. I haven't slept for two weeks and I know where my child is. Yeah. I haven't slept for two weeks just worrying about her. When your child is in like some kind of danger or like yeah, anything like that, you don't. Not knowing where your child is and what is happening to them is a is a nightmare I can't even put. Not having your kin in your house. I feel like I've seen

that affect you like so much the past two weeks. Big time and it's like just like not having everybody under one roof. It's like I just couldn't imagine yeah this kind of situation. They had a command center at their house. They had flyers being sent out. They were canvassing everywhere themselves. Like, they were doing the damn thing. They never stopped. One day, Ariel Castro came to their fucking home,

hugged them and said how sorry he was to them. And then offered to distribute flyers. Are you shitting me? And took a pile of flyers. So weird. And you're going to find out what he did with one of those flyers. Did he give it to her? So everyone in the area at this point in Cleveland,

like we're terrified for kids. They were thinking there's some like child abductor flows there like curfews and shit instilled. It was just everyone was freaking out. No one was walking anywhere. It was crazy. So Friday, April 9th, the day after Gina turned 15 years old. Oh, it was her birthday.

Yep. An anonymous tip was called into the FBI. Mm-hmm. Now this tip said for them to look into a guy named Fernando Cologne, who was working as a security guard at Westtown Plaza. Not a Cologne sparinger at Macy's. No.

Close. He was also married to Ariel's ex-wife. Oh. So I wonder where this step come from. I don't know. It's hard to tell. It is. It's hard.

It's hard to connect these dots. It is. He was picked up on that morning and interviewed for hours. He was also given and passed a polygraph test, and his car was forensically searched and cleared. Later, he was being driven home by another FBI agent. And he literally said to this agent, quote, I told them, so he says, in, I read it in, I'm tired to remember, I'm going to find the article

and I'll post it. He says, quote, I told them to investigate Ariel Castro because he knows Gina and her parents and where they live. Oh shit. They ignored him and never questioned Ariel Castro. Makes sense. The FBI ignored him? Yep, and the FBI denies this

conversation ever took place just to be just in the, you know, just to be clear about everybody's thoughts on this. This is what Fernando Cologne says. FBI says that never happened. I don't know who's telling the truth. Only the two people in that car now. Right. But it's worth saying. It wasn't until Gina was in the house for two weeks that Michelle finally met her. So she was in the house for two weeks and she never met her. And she had met Amanda before, right?

She met Amanda, but she had only seen Amanda like once. Because they were all in different rooms. And Amanda was kept separate from them. He, as we'll see later, he starts calling Amanda like his wife and shit. Like, yeah, it was weird. So Ariel was pretending that she was, he would, he brought her in and was like, this is my daughter. Uh-huh. And Michelle was like, you're an idiot. Like, I've watched the TV. Like, you gave me a TV.

I've watched the news. And like I've heard the basement yelling. Yeah, like I heard her screaming in the basement. So he stuck them in a bathroom together. And he was like, she's going to do your hair. Gina's going to do your hair. Okay. And Michelle was like, why?

Like, what the fuck? So he was like, do her hair. And he was like, okay. So she just starts, like, doing twists in her hair. And she was like, okay. So he left them alone for like a second because he went in the kitchen, like turned his back. Uh-huh. And Michelle whispered to her, like, don't let him know that I know who you are, but I know who you are.

Like, I know that you're Gina. Yeah. I've been watching the news and she was like, holy shit. And then she was like, don't let him know because I don't know if he's going to be pissed that I know. He's trying to have done your daughter. And then she was like, when I can get closer to you. you, I will give you tips on how to like survive him. Like she was like, I felt like I had to take care of her.

What an angel. And she was like, and after it was done, she was like, oh, it looked really pretty. Like she did a really good job. So she was like, thank you. And he got pissed. Why? Like, he's just a psychopath. What the fuck?

So he put Gina in one of the upstairs bedrooms after keeping her in the basement for a while. And he hung one of those missing posters in the room. Oh, my God. Yeah. Like, why? hung the missing poster in her room so she had to sit there and stare at it because he chained her up to a mattress like he did Michelle so he chained it to the other end of the room so she would just sit there and have to look at the missing poster that's so like sitting there knowing her

family is out there missing her and trying to find her right it's awful so eventually he brought Gina into the room with Michelle okay and he padlocked them together with rusty chains okay So he was like on this like nasty mattress. Gross. So Michelle says that they bonded like a ton of course. Because they were chained to each other. Literally. Literally.

And they had like and they all of them only had like a pot to piss in and shit in and do whatever. And he would empty it like once in a while. So she said it smelled disgusting. It would overflow and he would just leave it. I wonder how sick they were when they got found. They said they were really sick. Yeah. really sick. This is really like trigger warning because it's going to be like we've already talked about rape, but like things get kind of hairy. I'm not going to go into like graphic detail. I'm like I'm already straight up nauseous. Yeah. And some of these things are just really like they can be triggering. Yeah. You don't want to hear it. So when he would come in to rape one of them, which he would rape them several times a day. Because he's the most disgusting vile human being ever. Well, they said when he would rape one of them, they would hold hands to try to like comfort.

each other. Right. And Michelle said she thought of Gina as, like, her little sister. And he was like, she was like, I always felt like I had to protect her. And he would come in and like try to like attack Gina. And she would take it. And Michelle would be like, no, take me, take me. Like she would try to be like, try to save her. And it would piss him off. Right. Of course. Because he's gross and horrible. I'm like, this is just a nightmare. Um, all the girls, he did give all the girls journals, which is weird. Which is weird. Yeah. It's so, it's, it's very weird. Um, Amanda was apparently the, apparently the, one who kept the most detailed records. I guess they all like drew a lot.

They all like, because what else are you going to fucking do? I was going to say. But she had several journals. One was called the Blue Journal, which was talked about basically in graphic detail, the sexual assaults and the rapes. You said this is Amanda? Yeah. She was, she named one of them Miss Shady Handcrafted items.

Okay. And these were like personal little, like, like drawings and like writings that she did. And then she had a black journal that was entitled, entitled Love. Oh. She also wrote letters to her mother every day. Oh my God. Stop. Yeah. Now, he started referring to Amanda, like I said, as his wife. Weird. And he started taking Gina and Michelle outside in the backyard to rape them. He raped them in the backyard? On tarps or up against his car. And what they think is that, because this was when he was referring to, he was literally like saying, like, me and Amanda are married. That's my wife. Okay. So they think he was literally

doing this in some sick, weird way to like keep it out of the house. So that Amanda like, so like Amanda wouldn't know that like he was. Even though she's like, homie, I'm not your wife. Yeah, that's weird. Their pink bedroom that they were chained up in together became so filthy and disgusting that they both had bed sores. Yeah. Ouch. Now, on Wednesday, November 17th, 2004, Luana Miller, who is Amanda Berry's mother.

She went on the Montel Williams show. Do you remember that show? No. You don't remember the Montel Williams show? How fucking old was I? It's 2004. How old were you? Eight.

Oh, shit. So, do you remember psychic Sylvia Brown? Sounds familiar. Fuck, all right. Well, all my oldies, where you at? I remember the Mori show. Everybody's going to remember Sylvia Brown, who's like my age. So they were having TV psychic Sylvia Brown on the show, and she was there because she was

going to tell her what happened to Amanda. Right. Sylvia Brown is a piece of shit. Oh. So just putting that up. Is she a liar? She's just an asshole. I think a lot of these people who claim to be psychics and tell people whether their children

are alive or dead, they're missing kids. are pieces of shit. I really do. I think they exploit people. I think that's fucked. Don't email me. I think even... Don't at me. Honestly, if you're one of those psychics who do that, like, don't at me. Don't message me because I don't give a shit. Like, I think it's really fucked. You know it is fucked. Because even if you know, you don't know. So it's like, stop. There's never, there's never been a point where this has been proven. What did she say? So Sylvie Brown said she saw Amanda's black hooded jacket in a dumpster. her. Okay. And she said it had the perpetrator's DNA all over it. Okay. And so Amanda's mother told her

that there were reports that Amanda may have gotten into a white car with three people in it, because that was one of the reports that, like, floated around. Um, and she was like, is there any truth to that? Because people just make shit up. So Sylvia said there was only one person. Okay. Um, and I mean, like, she got some of this like somewhat correct. Yeah. Um, but you have to wonder if that's like luck. Well, that's the thing. So she said, she said, nope, there was one person. And then Amanda's mom said, can you tell me if they'll ever find her? Is she out there?

And Sylvia said, oh, God. She's, see, I hate this when they're in water. I just hate this. Are you shitting me? She's not alive, honey. And I'll tell you why. Your daughter is not the type that wouldn't have checked in with you if she was alive. But I'm sorry they didn't find the jacket because that had DNA on it.

Like, where did you, like, what part of your ass did you pull that out of? Well, that's the thing. It's like, lady. Water? And to sit there and say, oh, I really hate it when they're in water. Literally, Sylvia, like, fuck. Oh, I'm so sorry to inconvenience you, Sylvia. To sit there and say to a grieving mother, I'm, I hate when they're in water.

What the fuck, lady? Like, you hate it and also, like, what? Because now you're sitting, you've now planted in her head that are poor, baby. Like, drowned or. Is rotting in water somewhere, probably. Right. It's like, God damn it. I just like fucking hate that shit. Yeah, no, that's not okay. Grieving parents. Like, that's unbelievable.

No. So Amanda's mother's sobbing at this point. Yeah. And asks, so do you think I'll ever get to see her again? And Sylvia said, yeah, in heaven on the other side. Oh, okay. Go fuck yourself, Sylvia. What the actual fuck. So, so yeah, so that was awesome. I'm sure that was a real boost to her fucking. Marow. Psychie, yeah. In late October, Gina DeHesus' parents appeared on the Mori Povich Show.

Hey-oh. Foreshadowing. They had a segment with Long Island psychic Jeffrey Wans. Not Teresa Caputo. Not Teresa Caputo. Damn it. See, that would have been great. Everything would have been fine. Because Teresa Caputo knows her damn shit. She's the shit. She'll stop you at the deli. She will. She will stop your ass at the grocery store and be like, let me tell you what your dead relative has to say. And she's always right. Tell me she's wrong. At me. So Jeffrey Wands said Gina was kidnapped by a sexual predator. Correct.

He was correct. He said that they had spoken to her several times. Who had spoken? The sexual predator. Oh, okay. Yeah. And he told them their daughter was still alive. Okay.

And that her abductor knew the area from where she was, from where he had taken her very well. Long Island's where it's at homey with them psychics. It seems like Long Island is breeding some real-ass psychics. I'm saying. They really are. Long Island is where it's at. apparently. But then he got it wrong. So he said, so he got it right up until then. Then he said, this guy was black. He is not. No. With facial hair in his late 20s to early 30s, around

five foot nine inches tall. He was wrong. Okay. Because Ariel Castro is not black and he is not five feet nine inches tall and he was not that age. He's like in his 40s, yeah? Yeah, I don't even know a little bit else at the time. But, um, but yeah, he was not any of that. So womp, so now they're looking for the wrong suspect. That's the other thing about that shit. It's like, no, dude. Don't lead people in a direction unless you're fully confident. Exactly.

Which he probably is, but that's another story. Whatever. April 2005, the FBI released a sketch of a person of interest who was seen lurking around Gina's school when she disappeared. Yucco. He looked just like Ariel Castro because he was Ariel Castro. Makes sense. Ariel later said that he was watching. He said he watched all of three of these girls.

And that he was lurking around Gina's school. and initially he said that he actually meant to kidnap another girl. Oh. And that he actually didn't mean to kidnap Gina, but he was like, oh, well. I meant to kid, like what? What do you mean you meant to? Like another girl that looked like her. And he was like, I got it wrong.

Wow. Yep. You're dumb. Now, on April 21st, 2005, it was the second anniversary of Amanda's disappearance. So she had been there for two years. Oh, my God. And there was a televised candlelit vigil for her where her mother was leading them and singing happy birthday to her.

Oh. My stomach just full on flipped. So tragic and horrible. Ariel had them watch it, and he served cake to celebrate. What? Yep. And from then on, he served cake to celebrate each of their anniversaries of when he abducted them. That is the most twisted thing.

So every year on the day he abducted them, he would serve them cake. Yep. Also, imagine eating anything he gave you. There was and the thing is all of them said that he just gave them like rotten food too so they just ate rotten food while they were there. Oh my God. Like spoiled beans and shit like that and like just leftovers from what he would like they it is a true unfathomable nightmare what they went through. And like I said earlier, he liked to play mind games with them. So he would rape and beat them in front of each other.

And sometimes he would pretend to leave for the day and then wait and see if one of them tried to move or leave. And if they did, he would ruthlessly beat them and then chain them to the pole in the basement. Oh, my God. So punishments were, like, holding food from them for, like, weeks at a time. He just wouldn't feed them. Jesus, crazy. He would withhold water from them for days.

He would take away the buckets he gave them as toilets. So he was like, don't know what to tell you. Go where you want. Oh, my God. So they would have to literally, like, pee on the floor. That's probably why they got, like, bed sores and stuff. He would lock them in the freezing basement in the winter or the small. boiling hot attic in the summer. Oh, God. Yep. He would also force them to play Russian roulette all the time.

Oh, no, no, no, no. Oh, God. Oh, God. And then he would do these weird trust exercises. Like, part of it was like when he would leave and see if they moved. And if they stayed to like put where they were, he would come back and be like, see, I need to be able to trust you. And like, that was part of his, like, psychological torture. And then he would do Russian roulette to them or he would give them the gun. say pull the trigger. And if they did it, if they, and obviously they were like, they would freak out. And he was like, see, I need to be able to trust you. That really, like Russian roulette scares me on a whole different level. Oh, it scares the shit out of me. I don't like that. Now, in March 2006, Amanda's mother passed away of heart failure. Oh my God.

This is, why did you choose this fucking story? I'm sorry. I'm sorry. It's a really, it's a tough. God damn it. People immediately, everyone around her said she died of a broken heart. Of course she did. Because her daughter had been missing two years at this point. After Sylvia fucking Brown told her that her daughter was dead. Yeah, thanks a lot, Sylvia. She kind of lost hope. Like she had been holding out hope. A reporter who knew her from the case agreed and said, quote,

and people asked me, how do you know that? And he said, because I was listening to her heartbreak for three years. Oh, my God. Wow. Now, what's even worse, Amanda found this out because Michelle and Gina watched the coverage of it on the news. news. And when a Michelle saw Amanda for a brief minute during the day, she said, I'm so sorry for your loss. And Amanda was like, what are you talking about? And she was like, and she was like, I didn't want her to find out any other way. So I was like, your mother passed away.

Oh my God. And she said she just sat and saw, she could hear her sobbing from the other room. And I was like that. How do you? And you're all alone. Like, how do you not just like dematerialized into nothing? I don't know. Like, like, I don't know. Like, I don't. Like, I don't. Like, feel like that whole situation and then hearing your mother passed away. Well, at that point, it's just like everything. What do I have here? Right. You know what I mean? Like, for them to keep going, I'm like, holy shit.

Yeah. Like, these women are on another level. This is horrific. Now, soon after this, Amanda got pregnant with Ariel's baby. No, thank you. And he was pleased. Well, that's his wife, Elena. Michelle gets the babies beaten out of her, but this one he was pleased with because this is his wife, of course.

This is also when Michelle got even worse treatment. He started taking more out on Michelle, which is weird. She was only fed once a day, and it was leftovers, Michelle. And she got one shower a week and got regular beatings. Now, he would also, one of the things he would do for like mind games, he would make them shower with him. Oh, oh my God, fucking gross. And then for allowing them to shower, even just with him, he would say, you owe me. Ew.

And then when he would rape them, after he would rape them, he would throw cash at them. Like, he would literally, like, treat it like it was a transaction. What? Like that they were part of. And they would be like, nope, you're a rapist. This was not a transaction. And, like, I'm in a fucking room. I don't need your...

What the fuck am I going to do with that? That's fucked up on so many different levels. They wanted something like a notebook or something. He would be like, well, you have to pay for it. Oh, my God. Yeah. It was so beyond. How does a monster's mind even like come up with this shit?

That's the thing. Like, how did he come up with all this awful shit? How is your mind that dark, awful, and horrific? Well, and at one point, he brought his grandson, who was a toddler. Oh, my God. And the son of his daughter, Angie, to the house. And he told the girls, the boys wanted to see upstairs. So he was like, you have to hide your chains.

so they don't scare him. Okay. So they're all like, what the fuck? So he comes in and they're all like, hi, buddy. And like Michelle said he was like, oh, you're so handsome. Like, they're just sitting there like,

the kid burst. Like, she said the kid looked around and was like, oh, fuck no. And he was a toddler. And he could see, like, shit's weird here. This is not okay. He started bursting into tears

and screaming for his mother. Oh, my God. A few weeks after this, Angie Castro, his mother, And Emily Castro arrived at Ariel's house because they were like, something weird is going on. Like, because that kid went back to his mother and was like, there's women up there. Right. And with them were Angie's husband and Emily's boyfriend.

So they were like, we're going to fuck you up, dude. What happened? Now, shortly before the family arrived, they had told him they were on their way coming. Oh, damn it. So Ariel unchained all the women, marched them all downstairs to the basement, chained them to the large pole in the middle. he wound duct tape around their heads and stuffed dirty socks in the house. He then told him if anyone made so much as a sound while his family was there, he would shoot them all. Oh my God.

Now, Michelle said soon she heard someone upstairs demand that he unlocked the basement so they could look downstairs. And she said, one of the guys up there said, they're down there. I hear music. And so, because he would, he blasted salsa music. And a, you know, the fact that it was like cheerful. I know, right? That's even scarier. It's like horns and shit.

It's just like so much. It's too much. But Ariel wouldn't allow them down there because he was like, oh, it's flooded and it's under construction. It's dangerous. You can't go down there. I'd be like, I'm going anyway. So everybody apparently was like, whatever. Like we can't.

What are we going to do? So once everyone left, he came back down to the basement, took off the duct tape over their mouths and fed them some like gross meal. And then he went back up and left them all together in the basement for the next three weeks. He left them chained together to a pole in the basement. And like didn't feed them or anything? Oh, no, yeah, he would barely feed them. But then he would come down every once every day and take one of them upstairs to rape them and then bring them back downstairs for three weeks. Wow. Now a little bit after this, his family was coming over again, probably to still make sure that things were not like, be like what is going on here. Yeah. So at this point, he forced all three of the girls into his van in the garage where he chained them in the summer heat with the windows up and locked them in there for five days. They could have died. I'm surprised they didn't die. They all said they passed out several times, like blacked out and no.

Like your organs are literally cooking at that point. Yeah. Now, in December that year, Michelle got pregnant for the fourth time. Oh, no. When Ariel found out he stopped feeding her and then force fed her soap. What? Yep. For three weeks, she was sick as a dog with like morning sickness until Ariel got frustrated and kicked and punched her stomach until he killed the unborn child. Wow. Yeah. And the way she describes this one and the last one is horrific. I didn't want to go into too much detail because it's honestly too much for me to even like comprehend. But it's too much for you.

If you want to read about it, it's in her book. She does say, like, what happened. And if you want to read it, by all means, go ahead. It's, I mean, you get the idea. She's kicked and punched until. But she goes into more detail about, like, watching it die, basically. Like, it's a really sad one. Wait.

Ugh, never mind. Yeah, it's pretty awful. So on Christmas Day, Amanda went into labor. Oh, wow. and was brought into So one of the things I read said she was brought into the basement The other one says she was on the filthy Filty mattress either way it's disgusting

And she was going to deliver the child in the house He wasn't going to bring into the hospital Right Michelle was forced to deliver it for her Okay So what happened was I think it was like early early morning Michelle was woken up by Ariel Castro And he was like get up

You need to deliver this child And she was like What the fuck do I know about? or doctor. Delivering a kid. She had no medical experience. Right. None.

So, and also, she had miscarried, or excuse me, not miscarried. She had had four children beaten out of her by this man. Right. Now he's telling her you have to deliver this other child. Right. Like, that is such another level of fucked up. One, he did that on. Oh, 100%.

So the baby was blue when it was born. Oh, no. And Michelle, who had zero experience, again, in the medical field, was forced to figure this out because Ariel started screaming at her that if the baby died, it was her fault and he was going to kill her. Oh my God. Like he was literally screaming, I will kill you if that baby dies. Like figure it out. So she was like, holy shit. So she gives the newborn baby CPR, like starts breathing for the baby, is figuring out, she had no idea what she was doing. She just figured it out. Ariel is screaming at her the entire time that he's going to murder her.

And suddenly the baby started crying. Oh my God. The baby is a baby girl named Jocelyn. Oh. Now, as the baby grew into a toddler, now apparently Ariel was like super into this kid. But like where did he, where was he able to like hide Jocelyn when his family came over? Well, that's the thing. He started referring to her as his girlfriend's kid. Oh.

He took her out and about. He like brought her to, he introduced her to everybody. Wow. And as she grew into a toddler, he made Michelle and Gina change the. their names around her because he was scared that she would understand someday or that she would get out of the house and be like, oh, Michelle and Amanda said this and people would be like, Michelle and Amanda. Right, right, right, right.

Like, what the fuck? That's actually like, like Michelle and Gina, you know what I mean? That's actually like, like, fucked up smart of him. I know. I hate when that happens. I know. I hate when they're actually like stumble into like, oh, fuck. That was like evilly smart.

Sort of smart. Yeah. So he named Michelle, Michelle decided to be named Juju because she loved Jujube Bees Candy. Oh. And Gina was like, I'll be named Chelsea, I guess. So they just, so she called them like Auntie Juju and Auntie Chelsea. He took their chains off because, or he took Amanda's chains off because he didn't want Jocelyn to be scared. Okay. She's like, what?

Like, did you have a bedroom? Or did she? She stayed in the bedroom with Amanda. The yucky bedroom. Yeah. Now, sometimes he had them all. So, like, he was like weird with her and he was like, he, they said they never saw him hit her. Okay.

Or, like, do anything like that. Like physically hurt her. There was a time when they said, like, she woke up and she had a nightmare and she was, like, screaming. And he, like, ran up the stairs and, like, was like, shut her up. Like, because he was worried the neighbors were going to hear and, like, come to the house and, like, something was going to happen. So Amanda was trying to comfort her like a mother does and was, like, rubbing her back and rocking her, but she was still sobbing. So he took his hand and, like, put it over her face. It was, like, shut up until she shut up.

So it's like, he was like, he. was not a fucking prince with this kid. Wow. But he had like weird, it was just weird. So sometimes he, this just was weird what I read. He had them all sit up with him while they watched keeping up with the Kardashians, which was his favorite show. Yep. I don't want to laugh at like any point of this episode, but like, can you just imagine like watching Courtney and Chloe be in a fight and you're like, wow, I'll literally like. Yeah. Like what? On top of this hellish situation that they're in, you sit me in front of fucking TV and make me watch Keeping Up with the Kardashians, that's the cherry on the fucking cake.

Like, wow. I love keeping up with the Kardashians, but it's like- Keeping up with the Kardashians is torture to me. So having to watch that well-being in this situation. Elena doesn't let me watch it in her house. Oh, fuck no. My dad, whenever I visit my dad, my stepmom will let me watch you. She's like, get that shit off my television.

I refuse. I will watch like some crap TV, like Vanderpump Rules, but I will not allow it. Well, that's not crap TV. get out of my face. But he also really liked Kim Kardashian and would make like disgusting comments about her while he was sitting there with them. I'm sure. And they're all just like cool.

Cool, cool, cool. So in Gina and Michelle would make Jocelyn like baby clothes out of their old clothes. Oh. Like they would literally like he gave them a sewing kit at one point because he was like, sure, whatever. And they started sewing her clothes out of like their old t-shirts and stuff. And it was all like disgusting stuff. Like they were like, we didn't know what to do.

Like we just wanted to help. And again, he started telling people that Jocelyn was his girlfriend's child. Right. Now, around 4 p.m. on April 3rd, Ariel Castro made an illegal U-turn outside of Robinson G. Jones Elementary School. Okay. When he did this, he had a school bus full of kids. And he was making a U-2 turn, which is illegal, but also really dangerous. You're not supposed to fucking do that in a bus.

He did this in front of several teachers and parents. Perfect. He was reported immediately to the Cleveland School District. They had a disciplinary hearing again. Two weeks later. He was charged with two charges of disregarding his passenger's safety and negligence, 60 days unpaid suspension. Okay. Again.

Wow. Work for a union. So in November 2010, a neighbor heard banging coming from Ariel's home. And they were like, what the fuck. Well, and they had probably heard some other shit too and were like, okay. And then you add everything up all together and you're like, okay. It's time to do something. Yeah.

And this person said they saw a woman in the window with a baby. And they were like, what? Like in the attic window with a baby. And they were like, what the fuck is going on? That's so spooky. Yeah, they were like, wait a second. Because they all thought he was just this single guy. Right.

So they're like, who's this person? Well, and we've never seen this woman enter or leave the house. So later, Michelle said it was her. Oh, wow. And she was trying to, like, get someone's attention. The woman called police. Police came. They walked around the outside of the house, knocked on the door.

No one answered. So they left. Left. Good. Perfect. Thanks, Cleveland. Right after another namer, Juan Perez, was in his basement. I think he was with a sister, and they heard screaming coming from Ariel's basement. They called the police. They said, quote, it was the kind of scream that made you uncomfortable. It gave us goosebumps and went on for 10 seconds. Wow. I had my sister call the police. Police came, knocked them the door. No one answered. So they left. You're like, you can't do that when nobody answers. It's like,

You got to do something. It's like, I'm sorry, do all criminals just answer the door when the police knock? Like, they're like, oh, he didn't. Do you know who they needed in this situation? Dog the Bounty Hunter? Yes. I knew you were going to say that. Leelands needed to break down the door.

Like, what the fuck Cleveland? Nobody understands how much I love Dog the Bounty Hunter. I do. I wish I didn't, but I do. You wish that I didn't love him? I just wish I didn't know that you loved him so much. It's a fact I wish to bury deep within. Well, no it.

It's out there now. Live it, learn it. What is that? What is that? Jawbreaker. Live it, learn it. Love it. So in November, a neighbor called, her name was Elsie Clinton, or Clintron, excuse me, was walking

home late one night, and she saw a little girl in the window at Ariel's house. She's like, that's weird. And she's like, the whole thing just seemed weird to me. like who's this little girl we've never seen why is she up late at night what the fuck is she out there um now she said she was like all right so she went home and she told her brother about this and she's like this is weird her brother's name was lugo i believe um and she was like you know what can you like double check can you go like knock on the door and like see what's going on because i'm worried about this so lugo's like sure i'll go over um and he said there was plywood on the windows

there was like bags on trash all over the place so spook spook it was like it was really weird weird. So he was like, you know what? I'm just going to call the cops. He'd be like, I don't want to go there. Yeah, he was like, I'm not going in there. So he says, the cops came maybe half an hour later. They pounded on the door for maybe like five or six minutes and there was no answer. That was it. They left. Also, do you think at some point they'd be like, maybe this house is abandoned and we should figure it out? Well, that's, it's like, you've got, you've now received several calls. Right. About this one house. From different people, not even the same people. Children and women in there. screaming coming from there.

I don't, I feel like maybe you can investigate for you. You could definitely get some sort of search thing. Yeah. And they both said Elsie and her brother said they just didn't take it seriously. Yeah, that's good. That's good. Like, we don't care. So a few weeks later, Lugo, the brother's niece, Nina, said she

saw a naked girl wearing a dog collar in the backyard. Oh my God. I mean, that's something to investigate, I would say. For sure. So soon after that, some people who lived at a retirement home nearby that could see into his backyard. Oh my God. Said they saw three naked girls in his backyard. Quote, they were naked on all fours with a leash and collar on them.

Oh, that's so fucked. Yep. And Lugo said, and they were being abused. The police were called again, but they never fucking came. Yeah. They just never even showed up to this one. How do you like arrest a police department? Right.

How does that work? Can somebody inform me? It's fucked. Now, Michelle- Shut that one down and start another. Yeah, yeah, seriously. Like, let's just start fresh because this is not working guys. No.

Now, Michelle got pregnant for a fifth time. Oh, no. And Ariel forced her, now this is fucked. She's deathly allergic to mustard. Oh, wow. And he knew that because he would bring, he was like really into McDonald's and fast food, and he would bring them like that shit.

And she was always like, I can't eat it if it has mustard on it. So he knew that. He forced her to eat a hot dog with mustard on it. Oh, I'm surprised she didn't die. And, well, she almost did. She went into anaphylactic shock, basically. On the mattress next to Gina, Gina nursed her back to health. How?

She said it took like two full weeks. And she said she was blown up, could barely breathe at points. She said she crossed over at one point. She knows she did. And she was like, and Gina literally was like, you can't leave. Like you can't leave you. And she was also like, you need to be here for Joey. Like think of Joey, your son.

And she, she's like credits Gina. She's like without Jean, I would not be here. Wow. So she made it three months into this pregnancy before he kicked her down a flight of stairs and punched and kicked her until she miscarried again. Oh, my God. And while she was miscarrying this child or while she, this child was murdered and she was having to basically allow it to exit her body. She was screaming and crying. Of course.

thing, he was blasting salsa music. Oh my God. Can you imagine what they, what happens to their psyche when they hear salsa music now? I was literally just thinking that. Like, I, even I'm thinking of it. I'm like, I don't ever, because you know what's weird? We had to go in an ambulance with my, my daughter, and it was the worst experience in my life. And now, I said it the other day. I was like, I have rarely been triggered by anything. I am triggered by ambulance now. Are they playing music? No, I'm just triggered by an ambulance. I was like, what the fuck? So I'm just thinking like, I, like, I saw an ambulance, like, we, like, we, like, a wee-oo, like I'd buy me the other day. And I was like, blah. Like, I just got this worse. Like, I'm fine. But it was like this, you know, like, I don't want to think about it. Oh, I want to

you. So I'm sitting there thinking, I'm like, this? Can you imagine this kind of fucking triggering? I can't imagine. That was, I can't imagine what that does to you. I don't know how you go on at all. I really don't. Like, these women are amazing. And I don't know how you trust anybody after this. Yeah, that's the thing. And it's like people do. They do. And these women did like these, you have to be such a strong fucking human. For anybody who's gone through like abuse like this and can now live a normal life, kudos. You're a goddamn warrior, so

just know that. So in summer 2012, Gina and Michelle's shared mattress got bedbugs. I'm surprised it took that long. They actually, in her book, in Michelle's book, she said I'm surprised it took that long. Because he found that, he found

that mattress in an alley. Perfect. And it had been, I mean, at this point, it had been stained with like blood, vomit, semen, pee, poop, sweat, everything. And he didn't do anything to fix it. He was like, yeah, sorry, that sucks. And then they were covered in bed bug bites. And Michelle said she saw them on the bed.

So he put a plastic sheet down on the bed in like the dead of summer. Good. Which did nothing. I would have just like, you would have to sleep on the floor. So that same summer, Michelle talks in her book about a time when he allowed Gina to read a newspaper and she saw a dress that she she thought Michelle would like so she begged him to buy it for her using the money he would throw at them after he would rape them so he did weirdly and Michelle wore it all the time it was like this colorful dress that like Gina just was like I know

Michelle would like that dress wow that that's heartfelt warm your heart yeah oh my god so just after 4 p.m on Monday May 6 this is the day hey yo so May 6th so May 6th so May 6th 2013. Jocelyn is running up and down the stairs saying something along the lines of like, Daddy's gone to Grandma's house. Daddy's car's not here. So they're all like, huh. So she runs into Amanda's room, her mom's room. And she's like, Daddy told me to come up here and stay. Uh-huh. So initially, no one did anything about it because he, again, he's done this before. Trust exercise. Yeah. So Amanda was like, so I sat there for a little bit and I was like,

Huh, I wonder. So Jocelyn, and he had also had Jocelyn tell them before that he was leaving, and then he would do the thing where he was like. So they were like, yeah, I'm not going to believe this right away. But eventually, Amanda was like, I peeked outside and saw his car was really gone. Now he's left before, obviously. But she was like, wait a second, my bedroom door's not locked, because Jocelyn just came in here. And it usually was. So she opened it. She was like, I'm going to walk downstairs. So she walks downstairs. Can you imagine that terror that must have been inside of her? So she's like, what the fuck? So she looks and she's like, I'm going to try the front door. So she tries the front door. And it opens. It's unlocked. Oh, my God. So she takes a breath,

opens it. Oh, shit. Between the outside world and that door was one more door that was locked with a chain lock. Of course. So she looks out the window and she's like, what the fuck am I going to do? Like this, I'm so close. I'm so close. I have to do this. So she looks out the window in the door because this is close. glass in the door and she sees someone across the street. So it was Aurora Marty and her two other neighbors and they were directly across the street sitting on the ports. So she does it. She starts pounding on the door and screaming, help me. I'm Amanda Berry. Help me. I'm Amanda Barry. Oh my God. Like screaming. I have full bod chills. Right. While she does this, she stuck her head between the door and the frame because it was like slightly ajar. Uh-huh. And she's waving out the door like literally

screaming as hard as she can. So these neighbors start coming over. They're like, what the fuck? And someone tells her, one of them is like, try to break the glass. Like, break the glass. So she's trying and it won't break. Another neighbor named Angel Kedara comes over with a man named Charles Ramsey. And they both are like, kick the bottom panel out. Like that's, that's a thinner panel. Like, so they're helping her. Yeah. They're both kicking the panel too. Oh my God. So after a few like crazy kicks on either side of them, the frame bends. Okay. Amanda manages to push it out and she can crawl out and she reaches and pulls Jocelyn out with her.

Oh my God. So they run across the street to someone named Altagrasha Tejeda's home. After 11 years. Yep. Her 911 call, she said, help me. I'm Amanda Berry. They said, do you need police fire or ambulance? And she said, I need police.

They said, what's going on there? And she said, I've been kidnapped. I've been missing 10 years. I'm here. I'm free now. Wozahs. No, this is the greatest. My legs are tingling.

Like, my elbows are tingling. So Charles Ramsey had also called 911 and was speaking to another dispatcher. And his 911 call is hilarious. He said, hey, check this out. I just came from McDonald's, right? I'm on my porch, eating my food, right? This is me making the 911 call. This brawn is trying to break out of the fucking house next to me.

She's like, this motherfucker done kidnapped me and my daughter. And we've been in this bitch. She said her name was Linda Berry or some shit. I don't know who the fuck that is. I just moved here, bro. That's awesome. Like, that's just awesome. No, check this out.

Who doesn't need that? Like, raise your hand if that didn't just delight you. Because I'm delighted. Can you imagine being the dispatcher that got that call? Yo, check the shit out. And then he's like, I don't know who the fuck that is. I just moved here. And then so the dispatcher said, can you ask her if she needs an ambulance?

And she said, she needs everything. She's in a panic, bro. I think she'd been kidnapped. So, you know, put yourself in her shoes. Oh, what a nice guy. He's like, fuck, get everybody. I have tears running down my face. That was, that's delightful.

It's this guy's name? That's delightful. Wow. So. Him for precedent. So Charles Remsey, 2020. So at 5.54 p.m., Cleveland police officers, Anthony Espada and Michael Tracy show up.

And they're skeptical because there's been hoaxes. Because they've been here before. 15 and a half times. And they get closer to her. And they're like, holy shit, that really is Amanda Berry. Yeah. So they were like, they were like, okay, who else is in the house? house is anybody here what's going on and she says yes so they're like is anyone else in the house

they're thinking is anyone else in the house like who's your abductor right and she goes yes gina de jesus and michel night and they're like what the fuck and they were like what the they hand her a mic and they're like drop it yeah drop this right now and can you imagine that no you're like we just found one missing person who's been missing person a missing person for a decade who was a huge case all over the news all over everywhere and now we're like hey who else is in the house and they're like oh the two other two main missing girls like what so amanda told police that ariel was around she was like she's like i don't know where he is but and she was like he's driving a blue 1993 Mazda meada so now an apb went out for this vehicle at 555 p.m and orders were to grab him

immediately if spotted yeah so meanwhile from michelle and jean's poohp. p.m. they're still in the house. So they heard some of this commotion, but they thought it was a trick. And when the police pounded on the door, they thought someone was breaking in because they were like, this is a bad neighborhood. So they thought this was like, oh, God, and now they're like, cool, now we're going to

die. Yeah, and Michelle says she was like, even after everything, I was like, I'm not dying that way. So they hid. Oh my God. So once they saw, so they said they, they like heard somebody come in and say like police, like police who's in here. And Gina was like, I want to say something. And Michelle

was like, anybody can say police. Like, we have to wait. So once they saw the uniforms come into the room, Gina began to sob and, like, came out of her hiding place. And Michelle said she ran out from hiding and jumped into the arms of the woman police officer. Oh, my God. And wouldn't let her go.

Oh, my God. I clamped onto her and was like, don't put me down. I'm crying. Now, at 6.04 p.m., Ariel Castro was spotted at McDonald's. I was, I fucking knew he was at McDonald's. I almost made a joke about it. He was in the car with his younger brother O'Neill, and police asked for ID and arrested both of them. Once they were brought to police headquarters, police also...

You know his brother was like, what the fuck? Oh, yeah. Because then police also brought in his other brother, Pedro as well. And all three were brought to Cleveland County Jail and booked. Oh, did they think it was like a ring or something? They thought it was. The brothers were let go because they didn't have anything to do that. Because they were like, yeah, we just wanted a big Mac.

And they actually gave info saying like, yeah, he was super secretive. We've been to the house, but he wouldn't like. us out of the kitchen. Like they were like, they gave them up. And his own son, Anthony, said that a couple of weeks before they were found, Ariel had asked him, he was like, do you think Amanda Berry's alive? That's so weird. And his son was like, no, I don't. Like, it's been too long. And he was like, and I guess Ariel was like, no, you don't think so? That's so weird. Yeah. And he said at the time he thought it was weird, but now he's like, oh, that's just creepy. So on July 26, 2013, Ariel Castro pled guilty to 937 crimes.

What? Including assault, rape, and murder. Because all of the babies. The murder charge was for purposely and with prior calculation and design causing the unlawful, unlawful termination of another's pregnancy. Wow. Which I'm like, yeah. Hell yeah.

937 crimes. He got life in prison without parole plus a thousand years. Yes. Those counts included 177 counts of. kidnapping, 139 counts of rape, seven counts of gross sexual imposition, three counts of felonious assault, and one count of possession of criminal tools. Wow. Now, a month later, September 3rd, he killed himself in Correctional Reception Center in Orient, Ohio, by hanging himself with a bed sheet. Are you kidding me? There were reports that it was during autoerotic

of spixiation. I believe it. I fucking believe it. He did all that. shit. And he was found with his pants down. But then there was reports from other inmates saying he had lost a ton of weight while he was there. So he was always losing his pants. And he never wore underwear. So it made sense that he wasn't wearing underwear. But like, he's the nastiest. He's disgusting. August 7th, 2013, the House of Horrors was torn down. Oh yeah. I was going to say. And they called it like the House of Horrors. Of course they did. Michelle has written two books. Finding me a decade of darkness, a life reclaimed, and then life after darkness, finding healing and happiness after the Cleveland kidnappings. Both of these books are amazing, and they were very instrumental

in writing this podcast, so I took a lot of her, like, first-hand account from that, but go read those books because they're fucking awesome. Yeah. She goes by Lily Rose Lee. Oh. She's married to a guy named Miguel Rodriguez. How? And they said, I think they met when they literally bumped into each other at a restaurant because she said they were both looking at their phones and like slammed into it like it was meant to be yeah they foster um shelter animals together stop it they got married on may 6th the second anniversary of her rescue wow yeah which i was like that's a bad bitch because why not make it yeah make it a great day the best day like the best day she runs a foundation called lily's ray of hope which is a place to aid and help women who have dealt with abuse and trauma wow uh her son joey yeah

So when she was rescued, she went straight to the hospital and spent like almost, I think like a week in the hospital because she had been so very, very sick. And I mean, like, and her jaw was all messed up and still is because he would punch her in the jaw or hit her in the jaw with a barbell. Oh, my God. Yeah. And so when she got to the hospital, one of the first things she said was, where's Joey? Can I see Joey? Yeah. And this was 11 years later.

Right. He's literally like, like a team. He's a full-ast teenager or something. He's like 13 or something like that. And she said throughout this whole experience, she would write letters to him every day. She drew pictures for him every day. He was what got her through everything. He was also like the thing she thought about in like the darkest moments.

Is she able to talk to him now? She said, so she was like, where's Joey? And her lawyer was like, okay, like it's been 11 years. So I want you to know like he's been adopted. Like he was adopted by his foster family. There's nothing we can do. And they said like his foster family was a. amazing. Like he's adopted into a wonderful family.

Can you imagine accepting that, though? And they were like, and she was like, am I ever going to see him again? And her lawyer was like, I don't know. Because they were like, the family has every right to say no. I mean, did they? So here's the thing. So they talked to the family and the family was like, no, we don't want her to have contact with him. I don't blame them one bit. Because your child is 13 years old. Yeah. All of a sudden, having his birth, mother be in the picture. Even after all this years, it could throw a wrench into his well-being. Yeah. And I understand why they were like, we need to think of him here. Yeah. And what is best for him is him having a stable household. This has been his home. We have been his parents for his whole life. That was probably a really hard decision for them to make.

Exactly. And they also, and Michelle says she understands. She gets it. Good for her. She was like, I'm not, which that's really badass of her to like be that much. sure about the situation. I can't say that I would be the same. That as badly as you want to see him and that's your son. It's better that he has. And she said she was like, I'm so glad that he has a family and that like he was taken care of this whole

time because she was like, all I wondered while I was in there was what was happening. Is he okay? Is he okay? Does he have a family? So like knowing that I think gave her a little comfort. And then she asked, she wrote them a letter saying like,

you know, I understand why I'm so grateful to you for like taking care of my child like I know he's your child like I understand this like that she's such a big person seriously and uh she asked them she was like one thing and I understand if you say no but like could I have pictures of him when he was a baby and a toddler and like a child yeah just so I can see what he looks like because I last I saw him was like he was two and a half or something so they did agree to send they sent her pictures and they do give her updates on his well-being and like I had You'll never know that. Well, they said that it's not out of the question.

I think just right now they're not willing to introduce this kind of thing into the situation, which I understand. Because, well, it's so horrific too. That's a big thing to introduce to a kid. So I think they're going to wait a while and maybe they'll reintroduce it. I don't know if they ever will, but she kind of understands. Good for her. I think everybody in that situation made the right decision. Yeah.

And handled it the best way for a kid. they possibly could for him. Because she was like, I don't even know if his name is Joey anymore. Like, I don't know if they renamed him. Who knows? So, yeah. So, again, doesn't have contact with him directly, but here's updates. So that's good.

Amanda Berry is still being an awesome mom to Jocelyn, who is thriving. I was going to say, is Jocelyn okay? She's a fucking teenager right now, and she's thriving. And just like, imagine, like, knowing now? Yeah. Like, oh, my goodness. And Amanda has said, like, she resembles him a lot. Oh, that must be so tough.

But she was like, I don't even care because she was like, I knew from the second she was born, she's mine. Yeah. Like, that's my baby. No, 100%. So she was like, I don't even, she's like, people ask me, like, does it bother me? She was like, it doesn't because she's mine. Good for her. Another amazing human.

Yeah. So Jocelyn's a teenager now. In 2017, Amanda joined the Fox 8 Cleveland News team. And she hosted a missing person segment called Missing. Oh, good for her. In 2015, Amanda and Gina co-authored a book. called Hope, A Memoir of Survival in Cleveland. That book I also used for part of this.

The book hit number one on the New York Times bestseller list. Wow. It's a great book. Another great book. Gina co-founded the Cleveland Family Center for Missing Children and Adults. From the website, its aim is founded to deter abductions, exploitation, and trafficking, establish a place for families and survivors to come for support and resources. provide prevention training to the community and raise awareness to create a safe and secure community for all citizens.

And so they're all thriving and doing amazing and giving back to the world and being fucking amazing warriors. And Ariel Castro is still dead and hopefully dealing with butthole spiders, all the bad place. But hole spiders. That's a thing too. But hole spiders. Wow. So I'm hoping he's dealing with some bees with teeth, some butthole spiders. and I think they also had a penis flattener.

So I hope they have that too. Ouch. All three. I hope that like everything he did to them is happening to him now, but like times a million, thousand, a gillian. Yes, it is. I'm really glad that that one's over because that. Yeah, I am too.

That was wow. Yeah, that one was a tough one. We have to go to bed now. We do. Can we watch America's next top model? We sure can. You know what, everybody? If you need a pick me up, I just want to let you know.

it's been there for a while but I just realized it old ass America's next stop model which and it's it's an eye opener yeah is on Amazon Prime you can find all the episodes holy shit this shit will ruin you it'll titillate you it'll delight you and it'll offend you what is titillate it'll just get you all like whoa what's going on here titillate you've never heard that no I love it I love you I love you you. But yeah, take a trip back in the way back machine and see a time when no one was offended by anything and then get real offended. It was a better time. There's a lot of shit in there that I was like, girl, you can get away with that. Some things I've been sitting on the couch and I've been like,

well, I'm offended. Yeah, no, I'm offended. But yeah, go watch that now because that'll make you laugh. You know that when I was little, not even little, I was like moderately a teenager almost. I would like practice my America's next top model poses in the mirror because I was going to try out. for that show. I totally believe that. And they were going to be like, yeah, sweetie. No, no, no. Yeah, sweetie. So yeah, go do that. And we hope you feel better now that it had a happy ending, I guess. Yeah, that ending was awesome. That a great ending. We love some good ending. We love it. Follow us on Instagram. Morbid Podcast. Hit us up on Twitter. A Morbid podcast. Send us a Gmail, but only a nice one, because if not, it's going in the delete folder. Sure is. Morbid Podcast at gmail.com.

Join the Facebook group. Morbid colon, a true crime podcast where all the awesome people are. Check out our website. It has all the information you could possibly ever need about us, our lives, and our live shows. Hell yeah. Morbidpodcast.com. I don't think we have anything else. No, we don't. We hope you keep listening. We hope you keep it weird. I can't. I can't. I can't. Just don't keep it so weird that we are forced to say that we hope you're dealing with bees with teeth and penis flatteners and but hole spiders. That was good. Yeah. Bye. No, as good as yours, but good. Bye. Thank you.