Morbid - The Torsåker Witch Trials

Episode Date: October 16, 2023

When it comes to the horrors of witch hunts and trials around the world, Sweden is not often cited as one of the more aggressive or egregious nations. Nevertheless, the Torsåker Witch Trials remain a shocking example of religious hysteria due to the way in which they unfolded, which included local leaders defying the Swedish Crown and taking it upon themselves to identify, try, and execute supposed witches without proper authority. Moreover, while the Torsåker case may have unfolded like most others across Europe, it remains an outlier in that those responsible for starting the hysteria weren’t just held accountable for their false accusations but were in fact murdered.Thank you to the lovely David White, of Bring Me the Axe podcast, for research assistance :)ReferencesGershon, Livia. 2022. "The Easter Witches of Sweden." JSTOR Daily, April 15.Hogman, Hans. n.d. Torsåker Witch Trials of 1674 - 1675. Accessed September 16, 2023. https://www.hhogman.se/witch-trials-sweden.htm.Jordan, Charlene Hanson. 2012. Whispers in the Church: Swedish Witch Hunt, 1672. Des Moines, IA: Abbott Press.Tiderman-Österberg, Jennie. 2021. "The Swedish Witch Trials: How to Confront Dark Heritage." Smithsonian Magazine, October 25. Cowritten by Alaina Urquhart, Ash Kelley & Dave White (Since 10/2022)Produced & Edited by Mikie Sirois (Since 2023)Research by Dave White (Since 10/2022), Alaina Urquhart & Ash KelleyListener Correspondence & Collaboration by Debra LallyListener Tale Video Edited by Aidan McElman (Since 6/2025) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, weirdos, I'm Ash. And I'm Elena. And this is morbid. So morbid. It's my New Year's resolution not to sing in the intros anymore because it's really funny. I don't listen to Morbid because I don't like my own voice. I like yours. You're like, I don't listen to Morbid. I don't even listen to Morbid. What the fuck is that? No, but I don't like my own voice. But I was listening to this like serious this morning. And on Alt Nation, there's this one DJ that sings all the time. And I hate her. I hate her so much. And like I feel bad because I'm like, but wait, I am her. Like, oh God, I am the pot. I am the thing I hate. And I'm calling the kettle black.

So you know what, weirdos? Some of you liked it, but I decided not to anymore. You feel, you feel some type of way about it. Yeah, I can't hate Alt Nation doing that when. I mean, it's true, I guess. When I'm doing the same thing. You do you. Whatever you feel is right.

Thank you. I'll support you. Thank you so much. So what's up, dude? Oh, man. A lot. So, what are we seven days in? And, you know, we've had to, we have that little sign up that says, like, we've gone this many days without incident.

And then it's like, we had the six. And then we just erase that. Just erase that. And we rate a zero. Good thing. It's a dry race board. We'll just start all over. So everybody, yay.

Day one of January. Okay. Let's give it a try. Let's try that again. Let's try 2021 and real quick. Some DJ in like an alternate universe was like, br. It says it record scratch. Literally. And we're back. Okay. So 2021. But what's exciting and something you can look forward to is in February for Valentine's Day, we have like a little fun thing planned for you. Maybe we want to check you out. Maybe we want to check you out. Love you. Maybe we want to throw a little anatomical heart at you. See, oh my God, that's where we differ. Again, here I am to say where we differ. Here I am. You were thinking throwing anatomical hearts. I was thinking about throwing those little.

sweetie hearts. There you go. Which are, I'm sorry if this is an unpopular opinion, I don't think it is, but actually I'm not sorry. Fuck that. Those are disgusting. Oh no, they definitely are the sweethearts. They're disgusting. If I wanted to eat tums, I would eat tums. Yeah, they're terrible. Put messages on my tums instead.

Terrible. Yeah. And most of them are that hard, like, crack your teeth kind of hard. And it's like, what? Every batch of those was made in 1493, and we're still selling them like they're brand new. I love it. I'm like, these are expired. They are older than America. That's how old they are. Literally.

Yeah, they're disgusting. Don't ever do that to anyone you love. Check your next heart. It probably says like, ye old sweetheart. Ye old sweetheart. My fair lady. Someday I hope to see your ankle. That's like the spicy one. The thought of your ankle makes me go, ooh. Slide that over to someone and just like, woo.

Yeah, so we don't want to tell you exactly what it is. yet, but don't worry, you'll find out soon. Yeah. But look forward to that because it's exciting, and yeah, Valentine's Day is weird and it's creepy, so let's make it weird and creepy. Hell, yeah. And I'm trying to, oh,

we also will have, you'll be seeing some random little episodes pop up on our feet every now and then, and we're going to start kind of having little chats with the other hosts on our network and kind of giving you little snippets of their episodes, just so you guys can get to know them and see if there's something you want to check out,

because I know sometimes people are like, I don't want to start a whole new podcast without knowing what I'm getting into. So we're doing the work for you. We're going to be like, here, look, here's a wonderful person that we talk to. Do you want to go listen to their podcasts? And I think we're kidding. I think we're hanging off. I'm actually like shit-faced right now.

We're kicking it off with Rachel O'Brien from Seven Deadly Sinners. Yeah. So I think that's a podcast that a lot of you will love. So we figured we'd have a little chat with Rachel so you could get to know her, see a few vibe with her. She's going to tell us about one of her upcoming episodes that you guys will dig and that will be basically how we do it with everybody. Yeah. So it'll just be an extra episode that you can, you know, choose to listen to or not. It's totally up to you, obviously. It's like dipping your toe into another podcast that we love and hold near and dear to our heart. Exactly. Part of our

family, because these are all our family. Law familia. So yeah, so look out for that. We just thought that would be fun to do. And besides that, I don't, what, ooh, besides that I do. I'm like, besides that, we got nothing. Besides that, that's it. No, this is like a stupid announcement, but if I see one more tweet yelling at me that I told you the wrong TikTok name, I'm sorry, okay? Oh, yeah. I announced it and I said my TikTok name was Ashley Kelly, but then I was able to change it. So it's Ashkell 83. I love that you changed it right after telling everybody. Yeah, it's who I am. I'm chaotic. A-S-H-K-E-L-L-E-L-E-3. But people got some, which I don't blame me. I'd be like really ash. I was going to say.

But, you are chaotic. I love it. I'm so chaotic. And also, oh, quick little, now that I thought about it from the Oklahoma Girl Scout Murder's episodes. You mispronounce that something else? I didn't missprone. I don't get a fuck what I miss pronounced.

So that I will never go back to. But I did one thing I misspoke about and I was like, ooh, that's dumb. So O negative blood is like super rare. But O blood is not. Is one of the most common blood. So I misspoke when I said that. What I meant was O negative. And I also meant that O is one of the most coveted kind of bloods because universal donors, universal taker kind of thing.

And I meant it was like highly coveted because they don't get a lot of it for like blood donations. But I misspoke. I made it seem like I was like, oh, O is one of the rarest blood types. It's O negative specifically. So O negative specifically is very rare, but O is very common. So I just wanted to clear that up that I know that. I got confused too. I should have said something on the air. On the air. I should have called your ass out.

I know, because I misspoke. I didn't, that's not what I meant. So I didn't say it clearly at all. I mean, when you talk for like an hour and a half and honestly, like some of it gets like cut down. So like when we talk for two hours, we're on to. Sometimes we're going to miss spike. So but that's one of those. Mish spark. We're going to miss spike. So we're only been talking for six minutes now and I've already misspoke. So I did too. But I just wanted to clear that one up because I don't want anyone. that I don't understand blood types because she was literally a scientist. But like I definitely said it wrong. So I just wanted to clear that up.

So thank you to everybody that was like, hey, you said this. And I was like, oh, shit. Oh, dang. Oh, thanks. Oh, dang. Well, should we get into this is the discussed? Satska does it to this cuss. Okay.

So in between people yelling at me, which is totally like, I know you weren't actually yelling at me. I'm kidding. But everybody also was tweeting at us and being like, oh, my God, you have to cover. Oh my God, cover the Susan Wright case, the blue-eyed butcher. Yes. She just got out of jail. And do you know what my favorite thing is?

I, when I saw that she got out of jail, I was like, oh, we have to cover that. Like, just happened. Like, can totally get into that. And then I love seeing people requesting it after I've already finished it. Oh, I love when that happens. Oh, like, you're going to be so excited. Yes. I do the same thing.

Whenever I'll see it, like, I saw an Oklahoma Girl Scout murder. Somebody was like, I'd really love, I know you don't like to do kids cases and like this is a long shot. Right. But like, can you cover it? And I had already finished all my research and we had already done like. And I was like, yes, we can. You're willing to love this. I was so excited.

I know. I was super stoked. So, yeah, I decided to do my episode on Susan Wright. So Suzanne. She's wild. She's chaotic. This is also a very controversial case. And I have some opinions and I feel like I'm at the point where I'm just going to say what they are because I really don't care.

Oh, let it. 2021 is the time where we don't give a fuck when it comes to opinions. I'm just feeling groovy. Yeah. Get groovy or get out. That's what I say. Oh my God. Groovy or bust, baby.

Groovy or leave. And it's just, you know what? When it comes to opinions, we're going to say it. You don't have to agree. Yeah. Opinions are like assholes. Everybody has one. Everybody's got them.

Yeah. So use them. Yeah. And honestly, it's what makes the difference makes the world go round. Yeah. And I think we've had a lot of feedback from you guys. And I think a lot of you have said, like, I want to hear your opinions. That's why I'll listen.

I listen to the podcast to hear what you have to say, not what you think everybody else wants to hear say. So here it is. So, yeah, what I'll do is I'll go through like the whole case and maybe like poop my opinion in there somewhere. And then at the end we'll really talk about what we think happened. Cool. Okay.

So Susan Wright was born on April 24th and 1976. Her parents were Jimmy Lawrence Weiss and Susan Wella. So throughout her life, into her teens. and 20s. She was like a very passive, timid kind of girl, and she really just wanted to make people around her happy. People please us. Same. And, you know, she had boyfriends throughout high school, but she really would kind of mold herself into whatever version, like, they wanted to see of her, which like, same. So I resonated with that. I was going to say. Not to the extent that Susan brought it to, but like, I would be like, oh my God, I'm so emo. Like, look at my hot topic.

And then I'd be like, yeah, I love rap music, which I do, I do. But like, I would get like really like heavy into it and just like lie. Yeah. Yeah. I love that artist. I'd be like, yeah. Or like, even Annie, when we first started dating, one night she was watching Greece and I was like, oh my God, I love Greece. I'm watching it right now too. Like Greece is a great movie, but like I definitely wasn't watching it. And you're like, I'm obsessed with it. I was that bitch. Danny Zucco forever. Like literally I didn't even know his last name. Like pink lady, cool. I love it. But I didn't take it to the extent that Susan did, but you feel her on some level.

Relatable, sister. So one of her boyfriend suggested, you know, Susan, you might have gained some weight, which I would have said. I would have been like, okay, bye. Anytime a significant other suggests that you might have gained some weight, you should suggest to that they go find someone else elsewhere. Yes, exactly. If you want somebody else, find her somewhere else.

I would like to suggest you go fuck yourself, fair? Exactly. Well, Susan was like, oh, no. So she went out of a crash diet and she lost close to 20 pounds. And she was, I mean, already, like, if you see her, she's like a pretty petite woman. I was like, oh, damn. Like, just lost 20 pounds, willy-nilly. Yeah, I'm like a crash diet. What did you do? Not good. No. I'm kidding. Crash diets are bad. I know. I know it's nothing. I drink daily harvest. Okay. So another one of her boyfriend suggested that she become a topless dancer, which I don't really know why. why he like requested that. I think whatever. But these are a lot of unsolicited suggestions that she's getting from. They truly are. But then if you think about the people that she probably surrounded herself with, you're like, yeah, it makes sense.

I've just never had suggestions even close to that. No, no, me either. But she was like, okay. So she did that for a few months. But she was like, she kind of had this like come to moment where she was like, I don't want to do this. Like I think Topless Dancing, like live your best life. if that's what you want to do, go ahead.

Oh, dude, if I, in another life, if I had the rack to do that, I say I do have power to do that. If I had, like, the bod-bod to do that, I would have raked in some cash in my early 20s. Hell yeah. For Susan, it was against what she stood for. She seems to be, like, a pretty religious woman. So for her, it was just against her religious views. And she was pushed into it.

She didn't decide. Yeah, it's not what she wanted to actually do. So she actually stayed at the club for a little bit in waitress instead, And then she kind of moved on and just had waitressing jobs. So in 1997, she met Jeff Wright one night while she was waitressing in Galveston, Texas. And remember when we did the case from there, that was crazy? Oh, the Galveston 11, yes. So nuts.

Ed Bell, I think his name is. So anyways, that's not about this. But she met him in Galveston. And I was like, oh. And they really hit it off when they met each other. And they began dating pretty quickly. I think Susan kind of seems to be somebody that, like, needed a boyfriend. Yeah, I was, immediately, I got the sense that she is one of those people that goes from relationship to relationship because she doesn't like being alone.

Hi. And she needed me. Me. There's a reason you did this case. It's more than what she just got out of jail. Yeah, exactly. I was like, wow, Susan. You're like, oh, hey, Susan.

No, but when we get into it, I'm like, Susan, we're not, we're not the same. You diverge at some point. We diverge. Yeah. There's two roads in the wood and you go the other way. Yeah. Like, two roads diver. She went the road less traveled.

What is it? Two roads diverged in a yellow wood. Yeah, yeah. I took the road less traveled. I was going to say diverse. But not you. She took the road less traveled. She certainly did.

So, you know, they hit it off, whatever. They start dating. But things weren't really like a fairy tale. Like, I think a lot of times I saw a couple documentaries on this and it was like, they hit it off and they loved each other. And it was so great for a little while. But it doesn't really sound like it was that great from the start. Because Susan later revealed that Jeff would have her hand.

over her paychecks to him, like pretty much right off the bat. Okay. So that's a red flag. That's pretty controlling. I'd be like, uh, did you waitress tonight? Yeah, no. Did I? Do your feet really hurt?

What's, what's you going to do with that? Do I smell like ketchup or do you? Are you buying groceries? Yeah. Fuck you. So, yeah, also, he allegedly only let her go anywhere other than work for like an hour and a half at a time. Yeah, no, that's not good.

So if somebody said that, I'd be like, ding, ding, ding, ding. Yeah. And I wish you could see me. right now because I'm literally just throwing both my little fingers up in the air. Like, no, go fuck yourself. This is a class of, it's classic like abuse shit. Yeah, like the big charmer. I'm in charge of Romeo and then immediately falls into like, okay, now I own you. Exactly. She also like went to him and wanted to take classes at a community college and he was like, no. Like the only reason that you want to do that is so that you can like flirt with other guys. Oh my gosh. She was like, I'd actually just like to advance my education, but okay. I actually

just have a thirst for knowledge, but okay. He was like, well, you're going to cheat on me. Because she was really pretty, too, so I think, I'm not like, Don't put your own fucking insecurities on other people. Yeah, he wasn't really much to look up. So early on in the relationship, Susan found out that she was pregnant with a son. Oh. So she and Jeff decided to get married.

They got married while she was eight and a half months pregnant. Damn. Which I was like, whoa. That's a lot. It is. Like, live your best life, but wow. and they had a son named Bradley. And he's the cutest little freaking nugget.

I love him. I love him. I love him so much. Everyone who knew Susan knew that she was going to be a really good mom. Like nobody was worried about her. And Jeff, like, obviously he has very controlling behavior. But he liked to really party before. He dabbled in drugs, like cocaine when he was a bachelor.

Damn. So people were like a little nervous at first, but it seemed like when they got married and they had Bradley, he kind of changed. and became kind of like a family man. Yeah. So people were like, he seemed like a great dad. He seemed like a great husband. Like everything seemed to be going really well once they had Bradley.

Yeah. I don't know if it really was, though. I don't know what all these weird voices that I'm doing are, but it's kind of fun. But those close to Susan were like, uh, I kind of feel like I see a big change in Jeff too. And like it's not really a great one. And it was clear to Susan too that pretty early on Jeff's. started using drugs again. She thought so at least.

Come on. A couple people close to her, did. You have a baby. She said that he would come home immediately and go out and smoke weed, which obviously that's one thing. But then that changed, and she found out that he was back on Coke. Oh. And she was not happy.

Or she suspected that he was back on Coke. Now, he would come home super angry. And Susan said that he would call her a fat ass. He would tell her she gained too much weight when she was pregnant. Oh, my gosh. He'd call her like a stupid bitch. he apparently forbid her from taking antidepressants that she had been

prescribed because she was suffering postpartum after having Bradley Oh wow And he was like no like you don't need those Like you're he was like your job is to take care of Bradley Like it's not rocket science Oh my god I'm gonna take a bat to his head Well don't worry Susan does that for you

That's fucking ridiculous He was like all you need to do is stay home with a baby Like why are you depressed? And also no man has any right to comment on anything that has to do with pregnancy or your body during pregnancy. If some guy does, you tell them to literally go fuck themselves into the stratosphere. Yeah. And while you're there, rub my feet.

Yeah. And just, again, this is all what Susan's saying. So we don't know if all of this is completely true, but like, it kind of sounds like it might have. So it wasn't long before the emotional and mental violence turned into physical violence, obviously. So Susan would visit with her friends, and she'd explain away a black eye and be like, oh, Bradley was playing with a toy and he threw it and it hit me. Like, that's why my eye is black. Or she would go see her mom and her mom would like give her a hug and she would wince and her mom would be like, what's wrong? And eventually she showed her mom her back like covered in bruises. Oh my god. Then there was another

occasion where she told her sister that Jeff threw her through her through a wall and her sister Cindy saw the hole in the wall and was like it was literally the size of Susan. Like it was very evident that her body had been shoved into the wall, like, throw it into the wall. But that's cool, like, not at all. Then they decided or somehow got pregnant again and they are having another child while all of this is going on. Guys, come on. Like Susan is telling, like, her friends and family, like at first she would cover it up, but then eventually she's like, he would just hit me until he wasn't angry anymore. Oh my God. And then you're having a kid with him again? Stop. So they became pregnant in 2002 with a daughter this time named Kaylee. Susan experienced postpartum again,

and it really pissed Jeff off that this was happening a second time. Oh yeah. So annoying for him. I know. Well, the new baby didn't give him like any soft side whatsoever. You would think having a baby in general would, but especially I feel like when guys have daughters, it kind of softens them sometimes. Yeah, it's just, I, it's blowing my mind that it doesn't, if it doesn't change you, something's wrong with you. Well, it definitely didn't change Jeff. Because, Susan later said it as well that before she had Kaylee, she was pregnant before and she lost the baby because Jeff kicked her super hard in the stomach. Oh my God. So she had a miscarriage because he literally, he killed the baby by beating her. And then she had Kaylee, but nothing changed. Wow.

So her sister, Cindy, was like, this is way too much. I love you. I love my niece and nephew. You need to get out of there. Yeah. And it was probably after like an incident. something happening. So she told her sister, pack up all your stuff. I'm going to rent you a U-Haul. You're going to stay with me for a little bit while we figure out what the next step is. Was he hurting the kids? I couldn't find any evidence of hurting the kids except for one incident that I'll talk about. That actually was the catalyst to the end of Jeff's life. Okay. All right. So she moves in with the sister literally for like a night. And Jeff came home to the empty house and immediately lost his fucking mind, called her and was like,

there will be a moving truck there tomorrow morning. You are to move back here or like shit will get real for you. Like you bring my kids home to me. You live with me. Wow. Yeah. So Susan told Cindy that she was too scared not to. She was like, I don't know what's going to happen if I don't go back.

So maybe I should just go back. And Cindy was like, no, like, not good. Don't do that. And she was like, he could kill me if I don't go back. He could kill you if you go back. Definitely. But I think she was more worried about not going back, which I understand. In an abusive relationship, you're not thinking straight.

You're just thinking of... Well, neither way is a good option. Well, that's the thing. There's really no good option here. You're just trying to think, like, what am I going to do to get through the next hour? Maybe I'll try to appease them. Right. So, everything clearly is boiling up.

And by January, Susan was a shell of herself. On New Year's Day that year, her husband said to her, according to her, Happy New Year, bitch. This will be the last one. What's a... What? Like, New Year's Day, happy New Year bitch. This is your last year. Like, I'm going to fucking kill you. That's so bizarre. Imagine waking out. You're like, I'm just picturing them like in the kitchen making

their coffee for some reason and that's what he says to her. Like, I'm going to be honest, that almost sounds a little far-fetched. Yeah, like that one of like, he's a drug addict. That's true. It's just, that's almost like, like theatrical, though. It is a That's a very weird thing. Like first, just be, happy New Year's bitch. Right. Like, this will be your last one. It's like, what?

It's a little much. I do agree with you. I think, I'm sure things were going on, but I'm also sure that things were embellished because of what happened. She needed to make it okay in her mind. For sure. I think there's a lot of things that you're just going to have to listen to one side and Right. Just pick and choose what you believe and what you don't.

Right. Because unfortunately, we don't really have another side. We don't have another side. We do have Jeff's dad who we'll talk about like briefly later who we'll get into that when we get there. So two weeks later after that, it was, it's January 13th. It's 2003. And Jeff comes home from a boxing lesson because he like to do boxing. Oh, that's shocking. Yeah. And he told Susan, I want to bro I want to box with Bradley. Go get him. And she's like, I don't really want you to box with our like, I think he was like four or something. I was just going to say how old was he? Four years old. And he's like, she's like, no, like I don't know. Like, no. And he's like, go get him. So she's like, I guess she didn't know what to do and hoped that this was going to be like kind of him teaching him. Like a fun father son thing.

It wasn't. Oh my God. Am I going to like get upset? Yeah. Trigger warning if you're a parent or somebody that's really close to kids because it's not, it's, it's sad. So Bradley didn't want, she goes to get Bradley. Bradley comes and he's like, I don't really want to. Like I don't want to box with dad because he's probably fucking terrified of his dad. He's fucking four. Exactly. So he says he doesn't want to. And Jeff was like, oh, don't be a sissy. Like, it's like, let's box. Ew. What a toxicly masculine thing. Just like, gross. Exactly. So he starts boxing with him. With this four-year-olds. And I guess he hit him in the cheek really hard and like knocked him over. Oh my God. And Bradley, when Bradley didn't get back up, he said he called him like a little girl or something.

Wow. I would lose it. Exactly. So Susan, like I, like we've clearly noticed, usually doesn't say anything. against her husband, she just kind of lets it go, because she's scared of him. She doesn't, she doesn't want him to hurt her even further. But that's her child. So the mama bear in her was like, you hit him. Like, why did you hit him? Like, you can't do that. Like, you did that way too hard. Like, he's a baby. He's a baby. And she's like, I'm going to leave again if you don't cut this shit out. Like, it's one, I don't know if she said this, but like it's one thing. She probably felt like it was one thing for it to happen to her, but a different thing completely to happen Oh, 100%.

So she was like, you need to get help, and I'm going to leave if you don't. So he did not want to hear that. And he apparently held her up against the wall and told her that she didn't have the right to tell him what to do. Wow. Yeah. And he said... And this is in front of their child. I don't know if Bradley, like, ran off.

I have no idea. But he also said that he wasn't going to listen to her fucking ultimatums. Wow. Yeah. So she said that night he also raped her later. and that it wasn't the first time that that happened, but he was angry, so he raped her that night. Jesus.

So after that, they went to sleep next to each other that night, but at some point, this is when, this is when she starts to talk to the police later on. She says at some point, she woke up and Jeff was leaning over her holding a knife, and this is where we get like a little theatrical again. She says that he whispered die bitch in her ear. Okay. Which definitely is a little theatrical, but also. I mean, I don't know.

People are fucking. do worse things. I mean, last week we saw somebody right in a cave, I am the killer, bye-bye, fools. I'm the real killer. Bye-bye, fools. So, like, I don't know. If I heard that, I'd be like, that's ridiculous. Right.

But you never know. So you never know. So Susan said that after this, she kneaded him in the groin area and she was able to take the knife from him at that point. Then she overtook him and stabbed him to death. Now, she later said that she stabbed him in the head, neck, chest, stomach, legs, feet, and penis. Wow. She said that she was stabbing his legs for all the times that he'd kicked her. She stabbed his penis, quote, for all the times he made me have sex and I didn't want to. And she also

said, I couldn't stop stabbing him. I couldn't stop. I knew as soon as I stopped, he was going to get the knife back and he was going to kill me. I didn't want to die. Wow. Yeah. So that is heavy. And to hear her say, like, this, I stabbed him in. I stabbed him in. Here for this. Yeah. Here for this. like, to me, that does sound like somebody that was just beaten to like pass the point of, yeah, even, I don't even know, like, logical reasoning. Right. So she just, I think she snapped. That's definitely a case of snapped. And knowing that, like, her family members were like, oh, no, we saw, like, the bruises. We saw her, like, her, like, being abused. We saw this happening. And, like, Bradley, at four years old, you remember, you can, I'm sure he remembers, like, getting hit in the face by his father. Yeah, well, we'll talk about that. And it's like, well, and it's just like, I, obviously, I would never condone killing someone ever.

No, no. But if someone hit my child, yeah, I can understand snapping. Snapping. There's something within you. I'm not condoning murder by any stretch of the imagination. Well, and we'll see that this wasn't a usual case of self-defense. Yeah. Because there are a lot of questionable decisions made after the murder.

a lot of decisions that would make it really hard for a jury to believe that this, like I said, was a usual case of self-defense. Right to hear, you're like, okay. You're like, okay. Like, again, not condoning it, but some part of my brain can understand snapping at some point. So now we're going to get into the facts of what I'm ready. 100% happened. Oh, good.

Okay. So the night Susan killed her husband, the police were never called. So immediately that kind of like takes your claim of self-defense and like puts a little damper on it. Put a little pin in it. She did not turn herself in that night. Instead, she tied Jeff's body to a dolly and wheeled him outside to bury him in the backyard. Yeah.

She put his body in a hole that he had actually dug himself for, like, a fountain, like they were going to put a fountain in the backyard. She buried him there. Later, she purchased potting soil and buried him underneath that. She emptied their joint bank account. And according to Jeff's father, Ron, she changed the answering machine message. so that Jeff's voice was not on it anymore. Oh, yeah. Okay, now it's getting bad, Susan. Now it's getting premeditated and not self-defensey at all.

No. So Jeff's family and his work start calling because he wasn't really one to miss work or not talk to his family. So they're like, hey, like, where's Jeff? And Susan told them that they had gotten into a fight. He attacked her and he left and she didn't know where he was, which is not the truth. He's in your backyard. You put him there and you know it. then she went about cleaning up the scene after dropping she dropped her kids off with her sister at least she painted the walls like she cleaned up some of the blood spatter and painted the walls has she said anything about like the children saw later anything like were they privy to any okay okay so she painted the walls she dragged the bed frame and the mattress out into the backyard and just left them

there which was really something okay She cut up some of the carpet in their bedroom where I'm assuming like a lot of blood spilled. Wow. And she, this is really like hook, line and sinker that she really just fucked herself because she filed a, she had never done this before. She filed a domestic abuse report against Jeff knowing full well that he was already dead. Okay. Sorry.

Yup. Nope. No. No. All right. Wow. You really set that one up. I know.

I wanted to do it on purpose. That was really good because I was like, I'm fucking reading. I know. I wanted everybody to be like on her side and then be like, wait a second. Wait a second. Yes. So of course I'm not negating any like the facts that like she showed up in black guys and shit. But like she could have gone about it differently.

And I think, you know, I'm not giving her any credit, but I think she realizes now that she probably should have done this differently. This is definitely a woman who has watched a lot of snapped. Yes. And like, you know, date line. I'm surprised my mom didn't do this shit. That lady loved snapped. And then she did snap. Just not in this way.

No, well, not yet. So it wasn't until five days later on January 18th that Susan called her attorney and told him what happened. Her attorney was Neil Davis. So he came out to the house and Susan told him that she stabbed Jeff. And Neil was like, okay, so I'm a lawyer and I work for law. So I have to report this. I work for law.

So he called the DA and reported the body in the backyard. Good on him. Yeah, but Susan was like, I'm not talking. Now, I am so confused about how. Like, you have a body buried in your backyard. Like, girl. You got to talk now. I don't understand how this happened.

And like, I Google searched a million times. I went to like page 10 on Google. So he reports the body on January 18th. She doesn't turn herself in until, uh, fucking January 24th. So I'm like, but they know that you murdered somebody and they, like, they're not coming to arrest you? Well, maybe it's because they didn't have any other evidence besides her, like that one thing. She has a body in her back yard.

But how do they know that? Because he reported it. Like, Neil Davis was like, yeah, she, like, I'm here. There's a body in the backyard. But like, maybe, I don't know. Maybe it had to do with warrants. Maybe. Isn't that crazy, though?

It's, I mean, the whole process is crazy. Like, wouldn't you think she'd be a flight risk? You would think that they would just immediately come do it. But maybe they were like, oh, Susan Wright. She's not going to go anywhere. It's not going to go in. Well, I guess if you think of it, like she had kids and stuff. Yeah.

And you hear of these cases where it's like you know, but like they can't do anything about it. Right. You know what I mean? Like there's like a smoking gun and they can't do anything about it. It's kind of like. It's bizarre. It's a bit reminiscent of the Betty Broderick case where you're like, why didn't release intervene a lot earlier like when she drove her car into his house.

Yeah. Exactly. So those things you're just like, yep. Yeah. Like shit goes down. That's wild. So she turned herself in, like I said, on January 24th. and her trial started exactly 13 months later on February 24th, so like a year and a month later.

Okay. Now, like I said, a lot of decisions that Susan made in the days after the murder and the whole story of how the murder played out was really questionable to the jury. Yeah. The bank account thing really sticks with me. The bank account. There is no reason to empty your bank account. That is huge.

And it seems little, but it's not the answering machine, just fully getting rid of him. That is, that's just so specific and niche and weird to do after. Like, you know what I mean? Like, even if you were trying to cover it up and like pretend it was like, why would you do that? That does, well, because if you were trying to cover it up, I feel like that would be the main thing that you wouldn't do. Exactly. That and leave that shit on there. Right.

Like, I don't know what happened. Very bizarre. That's weird. Well, she did not lock out with a prosecutor because, have you ever heard of Kelly Siegel? It sounds familiar. She is wild. She is cut throat. She will probably, like, I don't think she'd punch you in the face, but like, I'd be careful. She is cut throat. She's kind of a bad bitch alert. Wow. So Kelly Siegel was the prosecutor for Susan's case, and I bet Susan probably shat herself when she heard that. And Kelly was ready to drive the point home that Susan did this in cold blood, and she seduced Jeff that night. And it was all premeditated. Like, she knew what she was doing that night. She said that Susan plan was to keep. kill him so that she could benefit from his life insurance policy, which at the time was $200,000. Okay.

So that's a significant. It's a lot of money. And she said that she was angry with him about his drug use and that he had cheated on her and given herpes. Oh. So that is something to be pretty angry about. Yeah. If your husband gives you herpes, you might be a little mad. Yeah.

Now, Kelly Siegel made a lot of arguments against Susan to make her case. And she was really ruthless during her cross-examinations. Like, if you see her, you can watch the trial on, like, YouTube or any documentary. She, like, slams down on the table while she's talking about it. I love when they get crazy. She did something wild that, like, really nobody had ever, like, done before and we'll get into it later. But whoa. She's wild.

But whoa. So she argued, quote, for her to claim self-defense and say she got the knife away from a man who outweighed her by a hundred pounds is ridiculous. And then she went on to say, quote, she wasn't a bad or. wife. We never found any evidence of it. It was all part of an elaborate seduction scene. So I understand that she's the prosecutor and she needs to make her arguments. Of course. Totally. It's also 2004 at this point. So it's like, okay, we're still in the early odds. We don't understand domestic abuse fully. Because it's like, yeah, just because it's not reported. Doesn't mean it's not happening. In fact, that kind of leads you to believe that maybe

it is happening. Somebody's in fear for their life. More times than not. Exactly. But okay, Kelly. Now, this is what we're going to talk about that, like, really had not been seen before in a courtroom. She had the bed, along with the bloody mattress, brought into the courtroom to reenact the murder. You know that meme with the guy that's like just blinking? Literally like, oh, oh, he kind of looks like a knockoff gym from the office. Oh, okay, okay.

Yeah. Imagine being in that, like, one of the jurors or in that courtroom and you're like, oh. Okay, so it gets brought in and you're like, oh, okay. And then Kelly Segal has one of her colleagues tied to the bed, and she straight up straddles him like Susan's right would have. What? And just start showing the jury what it would have looked like the night that Susan murdered her husband. Which I'm laughing because I'm uncomfortable, FYI. Oh, we're laughing because she straddled somebody on a murder bed in front of an entire court.

And the poor guy that had to lay on top of a bloody, a bloody, like a bloodstained mattress. This doesn't have a few dabs of blood because I'm going to tell you how many times this man was stabbed. Wow. Jeff's autopsy showed that he had been stabbed. No, I'd like you to take a deep breath. If you know this case, you know. But a hundred and ninety three times. Again, for the people in the back.

Susan Wright stabbed her husband, quote unquote, in self-defense, a hundred and ninety-three times. Yes, I pronounce that T. because I'm really trying to drive that point home. That's a lot. Again, a hundred and ninety-three. I feel like you're about 190 stabs far from self-defense. Yeah, I feel. I would say so.

That's being generous. I would say so. All right, so let's get into where those all were. Wow. He suffered 41 of those stab wounds to the face. Oh, so there was no face anymore? Nope. Nope. 23 to the neck. 46 to the chest.

22 to the abdomen. Seven to the pubic region, including a superficial cut to the penis. What? 19 to his legs, which for some reason it's getting stabbed in the leg, like really fucks me up. I mean, getting stabbed in general to us, but. In the face, it would too. Yeah, face. But I feel like it's because your legs are like bonier.

Yeah. Like, a yah. Yeah. Ayah. 19 to the legs, 23 to his arms and hand and one to his back. She had also, I'm pretty sure she stabbed him in the eye. Well, yeah, I'm sure one of those, what was it, 40 to the face? 41, excuse me.

Yeah, I'm sure one of those hit his eye. Also, it had, it showed in the autopsy that the tip of a knife had broken in the top of his skull. Holy shit. Now, we get a little freaky with it. Candle wax was found on his thigh and his scrubs. Grotum. Oh. So that there seemed to be a little, a little freakie, a little bit going on. It also showed that there was cocaine and Jeff's system when he died. And the, they figured that he had used at least seven hours before he died. All right. So she wasn't lying that he was on cocaine. You know,

that kind of all those stabs, though, if she was just trying to kill him for his money, yeah. That's a lot. And it's like, that is rage. No, she does. I, I don't. I. I don't. I I'm sorry. This is pure unadulterated, right? Again, I'm not saying that you kill someone, but like... No, and I'm not saying you do this. This is far beyond just trying to kill someone. This is trying to absolutely destroy someone.

Right. Like you want to get rage. Well, I think she was so scared, and I'm not condoning this. I'm going to stop saying that because of the top of us. Yeah, I was going to say we don't just keep saying it. But I think that she was so scared that if she didn't get this done, like, quote unquote, the right way, he would come after her. I think stabbing him 193 times shows that she was fucking terrified that if she did not kill him,

he would kill her. Yeah. And she says that. Maybe it's a combo of like different things. I'm sure she was angry. But there was, this isn't, I just want his money and he's not that great of a husband. This is not money-motivated. Raging.

Mm-hmm. And who knows? Maybe it was like this, what happened with the kids? And, you know, I mean, Kelly Seagler, did make a good point, I would be fucking pissed if I got herpes from my spouse. Yeah. So that's a reason to be angry. That's true. You know, she did make a good point. And she said he cheated on her, like a lot. Yeah. And honestly, some people, people handled cheating different ways. We see. I mean, made her snap. Right. You don't know. It's just, it's, this is just bonkers. That's a lot.

It's nuts. It really is. Now, so like I said, his toxicology reports, the cocaine showed up. And it also showed that there was traces of alcohol and also GHB, the date rape drug. Oh. Was it in his system? Oh. Which it doesn't come back where it's like they accuse her of putting it in there. It just like says that it's in a system. That's interesting.

I don't know enough about that drug to know. I don't either. It's, I think it can be, people will tell us, it can be used as like obviously a sedative. So he maybe used it to, I don't know if he used it to sleep. I don't know if people do that. Or just to like chill out. Or like an anti-exiety kind of thing. Yeah.

Now, Susan's story was that, excuse me, Kelly's story, was that Susan seduced her husband that night. Now, she referenced the fact that Susan had been a topless dancer in the past. And so she probably knew how to tie someone up, which like, that's a little far-fetched. Wow, okay. And also, like, she was a topless dancer for a matter of months. Yeah, and it's like, you know, let's use that against her. Yeah, like, that's not fair.

I literally wrote down, big assumption, but okay. She said Susan tied up her husband, and then. then dripped the candle wax on him kind of like for him to believe that this was going to be some freaky kind of night. Can I just, can I scoot in here really quick? No. Sorry, because I googled GHB because I just wanted to see. It can be used to enhance sex.

Ah. So it seems like they were getting a little freaky, freaky. Maybe he took that to like enhance the whole process. Well, remember he raped her. Yeah. Like she says he raped her before this. So maybe he took that to perform better? He either did that or by the sounds of it, they were.

I mean, he had candle wax dripped on him. That sounds like some, like, foreplay of some sort. It definitely does. And to me, if they're getting that, like, freaky and into it, which, like, get it, then maybe he took that just to enhance the whole experience.

Maybe that's just something he did. Yeah. I mean, to me, that's what it seems like more to me. I could see that, but Susan has a story about the candle wax, like, because she says there was no seduction involved. There was no sex before or anything like that. I mean, my, my opinion of this whole thing already is that she definitely stabbed him while he was probably tied

in a vulnerable position. A hundred percent. You just can't overtake. He's a hundred bucks heavier. It doesn't make any sense. And if you see her, you're like, she's a very, she's a small built woman. So, I mean, women are strong. Yeah, for sure.

It just, it seems more likely that the candle wax was part of like a whole, it's supposed to be a night of. It's like the movie that, uh, the Valentine's. Yeah. Yeah. Allentine. Oh, great movie. So good. Watch that.

So I think you're right. I definitely think so. Now, I lost my play. Sorry. But I just, I figured instead of getting like a hundred thousand people telling us, like, you could have Googled that, I just figured I googled that. I did Google it. And then I like didn't write down what happened.

No, I definitely think you have a good point there. I definitely think that there was seduction involved. I think Kelly Siegler was like spot on with that. Yeah. Now, the other thing that's like like points to anger here. and especially about sex and probably being raped is that every other wound on Jeff's body was a stab. But to the penis, it had superficial nicks and slices. Oh.

Which we have seen that before. Yeah. With even women with their genitalia, that is usually anger about some kind of, that's like sexually motivated. Yeah. And that could be one of the first ones she was doing, like to. Well, and that's what Kelly Seagler said. kind of. That's exactly what Kelly Seeler said. She was like, you tortured him to death. Yeah. So when Kelly told Susan what she had done to the penis area, Susan sobbed on the stand saying

she didn't just nick it. She said he was going to kill me. I couldn't stop. Susan also said that Jeff wasn't tied up. She was like, I didn't tie him up initially. She said when she started stabbing him that Bradley came to the door. So when you said, were they privy to this? Now, I don't know if the door was shut or if it was open. I don't know. But he came to the door and she said that she had to stop stabbing Jeff and that's when she tied him because she had to go put Bradley back to bed. Oh my God. Which it's like everybody pointed out in anything I watched or read. She's probably covered in blood at this point. She's already started stabbing her husband and she stops. And that's another thing. She stops in the middle of this to put her son back to bed. Not only starts again, Elena.

she puts Bradley back to bed and then I don't know if the knife had already broken and that's what we see in the top of his skull. She stops in the kitchen and gets a new knife and then returns back and starts stabbing him again. Wow. Now her whole thing like I'm going to talk about later is that she was in a fog when this happened and it's like, I don't know. I don't know how foggy you were if you put your kid back to bed and then got a new knife because- is taking a turn. You realize that half of it's broken off in his head, not half, but you know what I mean? Wow.

I don't think it makes a lot of sense. So, yikes. To be able to walk your four-year-old back to bed and then continue, wow. Well, and you know some, I mean, nobody knows how long it takes to put a four-year-old back to bed. It's not the same every time, but I can imagine it takes, I would say, close to 10 minutes. You definitely don't, I mean, rarely do you get to just put them back into bed and be like, okay, a night, bye. Usually it's like, you got to give 100 kisses. You got to like, can you sit with me? This is what we'll do tomorrow. Especially he might be like, mom, why are you covered in blood and why

were you killing dad? Like that might be a conversation that they had to have. So I feel like that might have been a little bit longer than a normal. And not at least when I put my four year old to bed. I think it was a little different. For sure. Probably a little bit. A little bit. A little bit. Slightly different. And then so she does that and like I said, she goes and gets a new knife. Like to have the wherewithal to do that. And also it's like, if you were in a fog during the whole initial snap, that should have broken the fog. Right. And then you should have been like, and then you should have been like, oh, shit. And if you tied him up, you would call the police and be like, I'll stab my husband in self-defense.

I just tied him to the bed because like my kid. I'm scared he's going to wake up and freak down. Please come help me. So, yeah. That didn't happen like we know. Now, Kelly Siegel also stated it was like we're going to talk about. I talked about the fog. She said it was ridiculous to believe that Susan was in a fog, like she said, because Susan claimed this fog went on for like days after the murder. That's why she didn't turn

herself in. It's like the mist. Now, oh, it is. Kelly was like, like I said, how did she have the wear with all to take care of the kids, clean up the crime scene, empty the bank account, change the answering machine, and file a domestic abuse report knowing full well that her husband was dead. Yeah, that's a lot. You were in such a fog that you were in such a fog that you You were able to do that? Yeah, that's not foggy at all. That's pretty crystal clear. No, that's pretty like covering every base you could possibly cover.

Susan said the reason that she cleaned everything up was because in her mind, Jeff wasn't really dead. And she had to clean up the house because it was dirty. That, those blood stains, that was dirt. She had to clean it up. Or Jeff was, quote, already going to be so angry when he came home that I had to make the house perfect so he wouldn't be angrier at me. I don't know, man. I don't either. I don't know. She said the night that she buried Jeff in the backyard, she sat up on the sofa holding the knife all night because she was afraid Jeff was going to come to and go after her the second she put her head down and went to sleep. Which I don't know if you've suffered years of abuse. Yeah. Maybe you, I'm not here to say that you wouldn't, I don't know what that feels like, what that kind of terror feels like to be. I don't know what it feels like to be terrified of your spouse. I don't know what that is. And I'm glad.

I don't know what that is, but so I'm not going to sit here and pretend that that's a crazy way to feel. I have no idea. Well, and again, I mean, obviously, we've never murdered anybody. So that's a whole another layer of this. Like, she is in a totally different place of her brain that she's never been in before. I'm not going to sit there and say that. I can see both sides. I can see sitting here and being like, you fucking kidding me right now. Like, that's bananas. Like, you're a murderer. Like, you clearly murdered this man and, like, stole this money and blah. And then I can also see if she was, you know, I can see that it's, if it was the way she's saying it was, I can see that you would be fucked up from it.

Exactly. So this is really one of those that you're like, fuck. If I was on this jury, I would have been like, I don't fucking know. It's bad. I don't know. Like, I'm undecided. Yeah, I'm deadlocked. Well, by March 3rd, 2004, the jury did hear all the evidence for and against Susan.

They had heard her testimony and they deliberated for five hours. So like, not super long. and they found her guilty of murder, but they sentenced her to 25 years in prison. Okay. Which is not a long time for murder. Because it wasn't first degree, I imagine. No, it wasn't it? It just said murder.

Yeah, so it's not like premeditation. No. Now, Susan Wright appealed her conviction two times. In 2005, the Court of Appeals upheld their conviction. But then in 2008, she reappealed, and this time there were new witnesses ready to come forward and testify. Okay. So the appeal got granted in 2009 on the basis that her original counsel was ineffective. So there's this guy named Brian Weiss. He's a lawyer. And he was sitting in on the trial while it was had, like the original trial. And the whole time he was like, why are like this isn't going how it should be. Yeah. Now he decided to represent Susan pro bono at the time. Oh, wow. He was like, we'll figure it out later. Isn't that funny to, Weiss? Isn't that her maiden name? It's her father's name, I think. Yeah, it's her dad's last name. Yeah.

That's interesting. We'll talk about her dad later. I had to scroll up to find where she was. So, la, la, la, la, la, braise represented Susan. And he said, quote, the original trial just didn't explain anything, which really it didn't. I mean, we saw Kelly Siegel, like, have the time of her life up there. Have the time of her life. You know what, like, that was the performance of a lifetime.

And as a juror, I got to say, like, if I saw what was put out there in the court, yeah, I couldn't say beyond, I couldn't say that. she was just an unabused woman that was in self-defense. Like, they didn't prove that to me as a juror. First of all, Kelly Siegel bringing that into the courtroom.

Yeah. Like, right that in there, the bloody mattress and everything, I would be like, oh, okay. And then hearing the number 193, like, that would be insane. She brought a lot of visceral stuff to them that would shock them into. Exactly.

to convictor. And it sounds like the other side did not do enough. Well, and that's what the basis was. And she did get granted the new trial. So I guess a lot of people agree that they did that. Now, he said there should have been a battered woman expert that was brought in to testify. And there wasn't in the original trial. And he said there were plenty of other witnesses that should have been called on and could have testified on Susan's behalf, but they were never called to testify. Which is like, why weren't they called? Interesting. Now, this was super risky to do, though, because, she could have gotten more time added to her sentence. Like she could have gotten completely let off on the other hand, or she could have gotten the same or she could have gotten worse. Yeah, absolutely.

You're going into this. This is exactly a toss-up. But they felt like it was worth it. So two of the new witnesses that they planned to call to testify on Susan's behalf were a psychiatrist named Jerome Brown. And he had actually evaluated Susan because she was placed in a psychiatric center the week after she murdered Jeff, like when she turned herself in. And then there was another woman named Misty McMichael, and she was ready to testify.

She is actually married to Steve Mungo, McMichael. I don't know if you know who that is. The last name sounds familiar. I didn't know who the fuk that was, but he was on the Patriots. Oh, okay, maybe that's why the last name is familiar because I probably saw it on a jersey. He was on the Patriots. He was on the Chicago Bears. I think he won the Super Bowl with them.

I didn't really look super far into it. Yeah. And he was also on the Green Bay Packers. and then he, when he was done with pro football, the NFL, he wrestled professionally. Oh, okay. Yeah, and I think they're still married. Wow. It doesn't really matter.

So before Misty was married to Steve, she was actually engaged to Jeff Wright. Oh. And she had a lot to say. She testified that at first, everything was fine, just like it was with Susan, and he was everything she could have wanted in a man. But then there was a switch. Of course. And she saw this other side of him where he would get angry with her and totally just fucking explode and like lose his shit.

She said that he once threw her, or excuse me, not once, he threw her down a staircase on multiple occasions. Jesus. Would lock her in the apartment at night so that she couldn't like get out. And then one night they got into a really bad fight because they were out a bar together in Austin, Texas. And I guess another guy like looked at Misty and he felt like she looked back and like some kind a flirty, seductive way. And he got so mad that he picked up a glass and threw it at her face.

What? Like, don't throw a glass at anybody, but you're going to throw it at her face? Like, she didn't do anything. What the fuck? Crazy. And she said, I don't know how true this is, but she testified that there was still a piece of glass buried in her chin. What? Isn't that crazy? Holy shit. I know. Now, Jeff's dad Ron, this is where he says a little bit of controversial things, but I have to say it. He said he doesn't believe Susan or Misty, and that Misty was obsessed with Jeff, even going as far as saying

that she chased Jeff until the week he died. He said that she was not letting Jeff go, so the fact that she was testifying this is nuts. Wow. He said that Misty was also a topless dancer, and that because they were both dancers, they were, quote, or there was, quote, a sisterhood of the strippers, I guess.

Oh my God, is that a thing? I don't know. That sounds awesome. I would love to be involved in that sisterhood. But that sounds cool. You can't say that wrong. No, you can't say like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. The sisterhood of the strippers who just murder men, like that doesn't, what?

No. No. No. No, wrong. So Misty was like, nope, I wasn't obsessed with your son because he was a giant asshole to me, and I'm actually married to like a fucking NFL wrestler guy that I love. I've moved on. But on the stand, Missy was.

he was a little cry, cry. Uh-oh. She would get super defiant with the prosecution when she was like cross-examined. And at one point, the judge had the jury leave the room and was like, if you don't get your shit together, I'm going to have them strike everything that you've said from the record. Oh, shit. Like, get it together. So she's not exactly.

Yeah, she wasn't exactly. Killing it as a witness. A reliable witness. Yeah. Wow. They, he didn't end up having to have anything striked, but she was like this fucking close. The twists and turns in this fucking case. It's so good.

Because you're like, oh, okay. And then you're like, oh. Great, because you're like, oh, wow. Misty, all right. But then you see her on the stand and you're like, and you're like, misty. They also said, like, that she had dabbled in drugs and stuff, but I didn't find anything too extensive about that. And I think that's what the other side always tries to do.

Of course. Yeah. Now, this is another twisty turny, McTurn turn. Jerome Brown, like I said, the psychiatrist that evaluated Susan when she was in that psychiatric center. he planned to tell the jury that he believed Susan that she was emotionally and physically battered for the entire time that she was married to Jeff. And that, but, okay, so he believed that.

But he wasn't able to testify in court. Like, Brian decided it was a bad idea because the story that Jerome had planned to tell the jury wasn't the story that Susan had gone with at her previous trial. She had told a different story. She told Jerome that she waited until Jeff was asleep to go to the kitchen and get a knife. But the story that she told all her lawyers was that she woke up to him over her holding the knife saying, die bitch. Uh-oh. So they're like, you would have been a really fucking great witness because you are a battered woman expert, but it's too risky to bring you.

Because it's going to prove that she's lying. Right. Now, I don't know how prosecution didn't get wind of this guy and be like, nope, he has to come in. Yeah. But they just, he never got to testify. Because those are two extremely different stories. That's not even like, oh, it's like a little. No, that would make or break the case.

No, this is literally saying that you planned it. And when you change your story, you're fucked. Yeah. Like, you are absolutely screwed. And that's going from second degree murder or like self-defense to first degree murder. Planning. Right. Exactly.

And that probably would have gotten her life if he had testified or something worse than a 25 year sentence. Now, I guess when Susan has. had been evaluated, according to Jerome, she truly believed, he said I believed it, that she thought Jeff was still alive and coming to get her. I guess she kept asking him, is that him out there? I have a feeling he's out there. Are the doors locked? Which like sounds a little performative to me. It does a little bit. But again, like we said, we've never been in that position. I don't know. I've got to get in that position. But like I said, they were like, from an outside point of view, it seems a little performative. It definitely does. And they were like, we can't call him because

this will fuck everything up. Yeah. Now, the defense were not the only ones with new witnesses. The prosecution had a new witness as well. Oh. And wouldn't you believe it? Another woman who dated Jeff. Oh. But she's working for the prosecution.

Now, the woman testified that Jeff never laid a hand on her. Their relationship never became abusive. And she said that she actually stayed in touch with Jeff up until the point when Susan put it to an end. She said, one day she called Jeff to, like, shoot the shit. I don't know. which is like, he's married. Don't do that. But Susan picked up the phone and screamed at her.

She, and the woman screamed, like, to, like, to, like, imitate her and said that she screamed, stop calling or I'll find you and rip your head off. Whoa. So we're seeing a totally different, Susan. We are. One that I can, like, I can picture. Because I would be a little mad if some lady was calling my husband.

Yeah. If somebody I knew was not like his friend and was just, like, some, girls that we were having issues with, I would definitely have a problem. So if Annie's ex called her, I'd be like, hello. If John's ex called, I would probably tell her I'd rip her head off too. So I can't really get on her for that. No, I can't either. Now, one of Kelly's main arguments at the first trial was that Susan hadn't experienced abuse from her husband.

She was not a battered woman at all. But she said, now that this is another fucking turn. I love this case, but I don't love it. But you know what I mean? But it's crazy. I do love it. So she said she's not a battered woman at all. She saw violence growing up against her mother at the hands of her father.

And that's where her stories come from. Oh. Which is interesting because you can kind of place, like you can kind of like be reliving your childhood trauma and think that it's happening now. Oh, yeah. I mean, it's like displaced. Exactly. Exactly. So she was like, that's what happened.

So at the first trial, Susan's mother, Sue, testified that. her husband was not abusive, but then they questioned her at the second trial, and it was a new prosecution team, Kelly wasn't there. And Sue said, Susan's mother, Sue said, Kelly knew what she was doing when she asked that particular question, because at the time Sue's husband was still alive, and she said, he, quote, would have beaten the hell out of her. Yep. And she, quote, might never get up off the floor again. Oh. So she said she was like, Kelly Siegel knew that I, that that was going on and that my husband

was still alive and there was no fucking way I could have said, yes, he hits me because he would have killed me. Holy shit. Yeah. So to me, this says two things. One, that she could have seen it, that she obviously did see it growing up, and that she could have used that to put it on this new relationship. or that she did follow the pattern of her mother, which happens a lot, that she herself got into an abusive relationship.

She saw that her mother was never able to get out of it and continued to live it until that man died. And she thought the only way out of this is to kill this motherfucker. Exactly. Oh, my God. Exactly. Both ways make so much sense. I can't figure this out. Now, at the second trial, she said, like, yes, I lied because I was in fear for my life.

because at that point her husband had died. Holy shit. So she could say. Yeah. Yeah, he beat me literally almost every day. Until he died. Until he died. Oh my God.

That is so horrific. Which is horrific, but it worked in the prosecution's favor because it made Susan's mom look like an unreliable witness. Of course it did. It's like she lied under oath at the first trial. I mean, I would have lied under oath too if I was afraid for my life. Extenuating circumstances, but like, you know. But it's still lying under oath.

It's still perjuring. yourself. Right, exactly. So you're fucked. That's a big blow. Right. Now, and Susan doesn't say like, no, like that's not what happened. She told Skip Hollinsworth, I think is how you say it, of Texas Monthly. I'm going to link this article that Skip wrote because it's really fucking good. She said, quote, we learned to walk on eggshells. We did our best to put a smile and make everything look normal. When he got mad, we tried not to be seen. I thought that's what happened in every house. If you had told me every husband didn't yell at his wife or make her feel less than dirt, I. I I wouldn't have believed you. Wow. So she, like you said, she grew up, she saw this her whole life, she thought that this was what marriage was. Yeah. And she got herself into the same situation.

Yeah. You know? Because when he started doing it, she was like, well, this is just what happens. And you even see it in the relationships, how I started off this whole thing. She sat there and let people put her down and would change for them because she thought that you basically live to serve your man. You cater and they are supposed to treat you like shit and they're in charge of you. So on November 20th, 2010, the jury came back with their verdict.

Are you ready? I'm ready. This time, 20 years. Wow. So she only shaved five years off the sentence. And they did obviously take into account the time that she'd already served. Like, obviously. When she was sentenced, she looked at Jeff's family in the courtroom and told them, quote,

I'm sorry you don't have your son and your brother and your brother-in-law. And I'm sorry that the kids don't have their father. I'm sorry he's not here. We. Yeah. And she like said it. like barely above a whisper. She went up for parole in 2014 and was not granted parole.

She went up in 2017 and was not granted parole. And then she went up for parole again in 2019 and was granted parole as we know. So she was literally just let out of jail like what, like two weeks ago, not even. Oh, my Lord. On the morning of December 30th and she is under very strict supervised parole. she has to wear an ankle bracelet and she also has to complete like I think it was like a 13 month anger management course and she said about her kids because she's legally barred from seeing them and actually Jeff's brother adopted her children. So her brother-in-law is like their adoptive father. So she is probably never going to see them again.

But she said that she would quote do anything in the world to get them back, watch them grow and see who they are. And it's like, don't do anything. No. Like that's a little scary. That is a little scary. Don't say that, Susan. I know. I was like, when you say anything, it's like, like, because you did murder someone.

You did murder his brother. You're saying anything. So would you murder him? Don't say anything. Don't do that. Now, there were reporters at her parents' house. And if you have asked me to do this case or us to do this case, I'm sure that you have seen this.

Yeah. Because the reporters were outside of her parents' house when she got home. And she just turned to them and said, quote, please don't do this to my family. Please stop. Have a heart. Please. I would just like my privacy. Have a heart.

Please respect that. I'm sure y'all can understand, but don't do this to my family. Even if you do it to me, don't do it to them. Please. Have a heart. Have a heart. So, yeah, that is the fucking story of Susan Wright. I don't know what to make of it.

Life's what you make it, so let's make it rock. Yeah, I have no idea what to make of that. It's hard. I think that she was a woman that snapped. I think she was abused. I think she was definitely abused. I think that she did seduce her husband. Oh, I do too.

I forgot to even say about the candle wax part. She said that, so Kelly's whole thing was that like you dripped it on his pee-pee when you wanted to have. Sexy time. I'm 12. I don't know how to say that. But she said, Susan said that, excuse me, when she was wheeling him out of the room, like after she put him on that dolly, that she bumped into the dresser and that the candle wax spilled on him. No, I'm sorry. No.

Because also that, I mean, that doesn't make a lot of sense. No. Like, when did you blow out that candle or else if it fell, it would have started a fire? That's in the other thing is. It's like, okay. And how did it get in his scrotum? That's if he was standing up on the dolly. That leap she took, she deserves an Olympic medal because that's outrageous.

She definitely does. You're also saying this was like the middle of the night. Why were candles still going in your room in the middle of the night? And also it's like, and if they had already gone out, that wax dries pretty quickly. It's not going to stay there for hours. Exactly. It would have been done in like a minute. And it's like weird.

It just fell over and it just dripped only on his scrot house. I'm also I'm so fucking pissed off right now because the entire time that I was saying Kelly Siegel I was like is that her fucking name I thought it was Kelly Siegler Google Docs uh auto corrected to Siegel just FYI her name is Kelly Siegler okay I am so the whole time I was like Kelly Siegel you're like that's why I started calling her Kelly because I was like wait a second Google Docs you really just fucked me up I'm really sorry about that no that's fine at least you know it's Kelly Siegler yeah I was so confused um no It's, and when you're, when you put someone on a dolly, they're basically like standing up.

Yeah, like, I'm sure he was like a little slumped over, but like, his legs weren't spread. He tried him to the dolly. Right. So it's like, no. Right. It didn't just fall on his scleradive. Like that is, that's outrageous. It is outrageous.

Like, it's outrageous. And Kelly Siegler knew it. She was like, Kelly Siegler called the whole thing. I, 100% believe that she was like, let's get freaking. Yeah, I think Susan definitely was abused. Yes. She was ready to end it all. Yep.

She planned it. Yep. And I think she was like, let's get freaky, got him in a really vulnerable position. Which was stabbed the hell out of him. I don't want to say smart, but it was smart in that, like, conniving way. It was smart for a murderer. Exactly. It was murderous smart.

But then she wasn't smart at all. At all. And I have to say, I do think what made her snap was seeing it happened to her kid. Yeah, I could see that. CPS also got involved after everything happened because she's like saying they, that she was abused. Yeah. So they asked Bradley, like, do you remember, like, ever seeing your mom get hit?

And he said, no. He said he had never seen her, like, get hit. That's interesting. Right. That is very interesting. Because a four-year-old is very aware. Mm-hmm. But then you're like, maybe he wasn't around when she got hit?

Like, when is a four-year-old not around? Well, that's the other thing. It's like only at night when he's sleeping. Exactly. And I don't think that Jeff was. waiting only until nighttime. I don't think he's holding in all his rage all day and then just like letting it out. I actually meant to include this.

I just pulled it up really quick. So he was interviewed by Child Protective Services when he was four. And I guess the court didn't allow the video to be shown, but he's like coloring in the video. Oh. And I got, this is from ABC13.com. The interviewer says, have you ever seen your dad hit your mom? He says, no. Did you ever see bruises on your mom?

She has some on her legs. How did she get them? I don't know. I mean, I have bruises on my legs all the time. I literally like look at a corner and I'm like, oh, bruised. Yeah, exactly. So, I don't know. That's interesting.

It definitely is. It doesn't totally negate anything. It just is, it's an interesting little tidbit. It's definitely an interesting tidbit. I feel like every time I lean some way, something else weighs me the other way. It's like, holy shit. That is the thing about this case. And that's why I love cases like this.

Because you're like, oh yeah, like I'm writing this for Susan. Like, justice for my girl, Sue. And then you're like, Sue, what the fuck? Justice for my boy, Jeff Wright. And then you're like, Jeff Wright, what the fuck? Like, God damn it. And then you're like, Susan, what the fuck? Bradley.

And then Bradley, oh. And then you're like, Susan, don't say you do anything. And then you're like, Sue, I'm so sorry that you had to lie on oath because of what happened to you. But like, why did you lie on oath, sister? Oh, this is a lot. Yeah, I wrote this shit with furious fingers. I'm very interested to see what everybody else think, because I assume everyone

probably has a different view of this because I can't even land on one. So I'm sure people go back and forth a lot with it. I definitely can't land on one. I'm nebulous here. I have to say, I don't think that she would commit a crime again. Like I don't think she would murder somebody again. Yeah. I don't know.

I mean, unless she got into a similar situation, she would do it again. Well, that's the problem. And like you said, like... So that's a little... So I think the whole thing is that she kind of found somebody like her dad. Yeah, exactly. I do wonder if it's like... That might be her type.

She's going for people like her dad and then she's going to take them out. I know. Well, the parole board must have not thought that this was going to happen again. So let's hope they're right. I mean, let's hope. So yeah, guys, that was the case of Susan Wright. I am so happy that I got to cover it because so many people were asking and I was like, oh my God, I did it.

That was a crazy one. It was. Wow. If you would like to see our Instagram photos, I can post some at... Morbid Podcasts. At Instagram. I don't know. Morbid Podcasts.

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And guys, we hope you keep listening. And we hope you... Keep it weird. But not so weird that you're just so confused about how you feel about this case and you just can't land on one suspect. We're not suspect. We all know who done it, but, you know, I just don't know what that happened. Motive. Motus operandi.

Bye. Bye.