More Life with Carl Radke - Below Deck's Captain Sandy Yawn on Going from Rock Bottom to Captaining Million Dollar Yachts

Episode Date: June 30, 2026

Before she was running million-dollar yachts on Below Deck Mediterranean, Captain Sandy Yawn was hiding from police in the bushes, getting kicked out of halfway houses, and spending nights at a Denny's with nowhere to go. In this conversation, Carl and Captain Sandy get into how she clawed her way to 36 years sober, why she leads her crew with empathy instead of ego, and the ultimatum she once gave a crew member that may have saved their life. Tough, honest, and full of hard-won wisdom on what it actually takes to rebuild a life and become the captain fans know today. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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I'm Dr. Sanjay Gupta. CNN's chief medical correspondent brings you the secrets of the happiest and healthiest people on the planet so that you can live your best life. Are some people just born happier than others? And what might they be doing that the rest of us aren't? Follow Chasing Life with Dr. Sanjay Gupta on Apple, Spotify, IHeard Podcasts, Amazon Music, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, guys, I'm Carl Radke. Welcome to More Life. today's episode, we've got Captain Sandy Yon. You might know her from Below Deck Mediterranean.

She's 36 years sober. Love her for that. She's a powerful presence. So excited to dive in here today at Soft Bar coming live from Greenpoint Brooklyn. Captain Sandy, welcome to more life. It's so excited. We've been trying to do this now for what? A few months. A few months now. And you've always been on my Mount Rushmore and the Bravo world, especially your sobriety story, but also just, I've always admired, you know, you sharing, you know, your story, but also just below decks the show I always highly respect. Because not only you're filming, but you're working and filming. Yeah.

And a lot of our counterparts on Bravo aren't always working and filming. I mean, you're working. I get it, but you're like really working. So thank you for coming in today. It's great to have you in Brooklyn. I've had a few Bravo friends come through. So you are definitely someone I've been hoping to talk to you. But I want to give Captain Sandy her colors.

She's wearing the coolest boots I've ever seen. Moment for the boots. I have a quick question off the bat. Who are you hoping to have as a guest on your yacht from the Bravo world? You know, I used to say Lisa, but, you know, honestly, I would love Andy Cohen. Andy would be a great one. Who would be someone you don't want on board? I don't really have a don't want.

You know, everyone's welcome. Until they break some rules. You know, hey. I mean, you're there to break few rules, aren't you? That's why you charter a yacht. But there's lines you don't cross. That's with the crew and obviously really illegal stuff. But other than that, they can break the rules.

I don't care. Yeah. That's why people charter yachts. There was actually an article I just read. It's called the lawless sea. You know, people charter boats because they want to be lawless. Of course. Well, I feel like when as soon as you get out on the water, that's when it's someone like

myself who's not in, you know, the marine world is like you feel like you can just do whatever you want now. Yeah. Drinking and boating. Go nude. It's fine. We don't care. You play crazy loud of music, speed on the boat.

Yeah. Do whatever you want. We, you know, we want them to be careful and not get hurt. Yeah. But that's why you're there to keep us and pull us and track. Some people get hurt. You might see that happen this season. Somebody might get hurt.

Maybe a hospital and toe. I have a saying, so my name of my podcast is more life. But this saying that I said kind of is stuck with me. And now I've repurposed it as my podcast, as a mantra. But I've always wondered from Captain Sandy, is there a mantra that you live by or say out loud to your people? Do the next right thing. Love that. Just do the next right thing.

We all know what it is, right? So, because we have a moral compass. Of course. We all know. Yeah. Just choose to do the next right thing. If it feels good, it is good. I love that.

If it feels wrong, it is wrong. So profound. We're just getting started. Yeah. I mean, I want to jump into some of what you shared and some of you and I've connected on. And I'll never forget when I, we talked about before we started, but when I first talked about getting sober on Bravo, you know, I've had about four seasons of being on Bravo where I was

drinking, using cocaine, Adderall. Behavior was pretty eye-opening on the show. But more importantly, it was on. off camera, I was like really deteriorating. I was sat down by some executives and recommended I get some help. I then started to like open up on the show about I'm moderating. I'm taking breaks. Bronwyn reached out to me very early on and shout out to Bronwyn.

She was like, another sober Bravo girl here, want to be supportive, be a friend. And she's like, had you met Captain Sandy? And I knew who were, but maybe just in passing at BravoCon. She's like you got to meet Captain Sandy. She's like a North Star in the recovery world and sobriety. So I guess from like meeting you initially, I didn't know fully about some of your story, but I've seen some moments on below deck med where you've talked a little bit about it. But to kind of give it our audience a little bit of the background, alcoholism is running your family.

You've been obviously how many years now sober? 36. I mean, holy cow. Yeah. Incredible. 36. Going into 37. It's unbelievable.

Yeah. Bring us back to maybe in your teens or whenever you started drinking. Did you see your addiction coming because of family that was. you know, struggling or did you not? Because I'll give you an example, I didn't see mine coming because everybody else in my family, I was like, oh, it's just that I'm not me. Yeah, no, I did not, like you. I did not. In fact, my mom, my grandfather alcoholic, mom alcoholic, uncle alcoholic, family disease, right? Of course. I was a good kid. I rode in the front of the bus. My neighbor gave me a Kualoo to 714. That was my first high. Like, and I was in middle school.

And where did you grow up? Your youth? Florida. Florida. So, yeah, my neighbor. She, peer pressure, what we call it influencers today. Well, said. You know what I mean? So anyway, I take the drug, changed my life. Next thing you know, I'm smoking pot, drinking. And then, you know, I get kicked out of 11th grade. I've been arrested like 14 times, in and out of drug and alcohol treatment centers until I was 25.

Like, imagine that. Like, court ordered all the time I was in front of the judge. I knew the judicial system because I learned it from being in it. You know, like, I could have been a great lawyer. So anyway, I finally got sober and it changed my life. So was drinking other substances, really, or was, what was your drug a choice? Anything that would get me high. Alcohol was my main source because it's easy to get.

Of course. And it's more like normalized, let's say. I mean, I did Coke. I didn't, you know, I wasn't like, I tried crystal meth once. I'll never forget. I was walking around the football field. And I said to my friend, it was a football game, right? We all went to football games at high school.

And I go, this hill's getting really hard to walk out. She goes, Sandy, there's no hill. I'm like, the freaking hill is like that high. And then it started raining. It was like really weird. I had the worst experience. I never did that again. So basically my addiction was cocaine, alcohol, and pot.

Yeah, alcohol and cocaine were my minority. I loved, loved. You said you got arrested. Were you a fighter? No, I ran from the police all the time. I had motorcycle. Like, we grew up with motorcycles. I would outrun them on a motorcycle.

I'd hide in the bushes. You'd see the police with their lights. Oh, my God. Gosh. Cars, I have radios that I'd get pulled over. My dad, my stepdad was a cop. They'd say that's the Lang's daughter, take her home. But then came the time when they said take her to jail.

So when I would spend the night and they'd take your pillow away, like at 3 in the morning, you're like the blanket in the pillow. I mean, why? It's like punishment. It was weird. I never spent time only overnight. Sure. But I always got out.

The judge was always like, you know, treatment. I went through 28-day programs. I lived in halfway houses. Would you have a moment that you describe as your bottom? Every time, because I got arrested. It was my bottom. Like, it was the same. It was the same.

I will tell you this. The last time I did use, I had a job, which was unique. I still had employment. I got kicked out of the halfway house I was in. She said, I wasn't worth the paperwork. I'm just going to go out and drink again. I was like, no one's ever said that to me. And then I just kept showing up at that halfway house every day for breakfast,

lunch and dinner because they never kicked me out and she came and called me in her office and she said here's a deal your paycheck comes to me you get five dollars a week i got five dollars a week to live on and i stayed clean and what what age were you at this point 25 wow i think it's important for people to know that because like the journey of getting sober isn't linear you know it's not a direct line and i think it's important to people to see that up and down a lot of people doing the work on themselves hit a wall that they can't explain. They're sober, they're in therapy, they're putting in the effort, but there's still a thought that won't quit. What if I'm fundamentally broken and no amount of work will fix me? What if I can't trust my own mind? And no matter what you do to try to feel better,

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If any of this sounds familiar, visit NoCD. to book a free 15-minute call. That's nocd.com. Like that last time you were in that facility, the mustard seed, were you just done? I was in stepping stones. I'm in Fort Lauderdale. Okay. I was done every time. Yeah. You know, I used to go to meetings and they'd say, I wish these meetings were for people who need it, but it's for people who want it. I needed it, right? Because I couldn't navigate life in addiction. Sure. So finally, I got sober, and one day at a time, it started to grow on me. And I just one day at a time,

I didn't desire to drink. Sometimes I did. I'd talk about it. I went to meetings. I had a sponsor. I worked the steps. Those steps changed my life. And I went to a meeting every day,

sometimes twice a day. And I think that's like for me and that's what's worked best for you is the program of AA. Yeah. Had you tried other things prior to AA? I kept going back, though. I mean, because I knew that's where the answer was.

I just, every time I get money in my pocket, I feel better and I go you. And that's why when I went to stepping stone, and she goes, no more money for you. That was my downfall. I just needed to not have enough money to go buy it. Got it. You know, like...

Take that step out. Yeah. And they did. And it changed my life. And I'll never forget in the steps. Yeah. Would you say that it was like a spiritual awakening? Totally, spiritual awakening.

And I was forced to go to church. I never forget it. I was a kid. I'd skip and go play in the ditch. And it was Baptist. I was going to hell for everything. And I was like, well, if I'm going, I might as well have fun on the way.

You know, so, but now it's like I have a great connection with God. You know, we have conversations. I'm like, dude, you know, I need a little help here. Yep. Turning things over. Turning things over. Listen, I've been sober for a long time. I've had a lot of practice.

The meetings help. The steps help. The sponsor helps. But in life, when you don't have all that around you at sea, for years, I was at sea and I did AA loaners. We didn't have like, Zoom. You just rocked my world thinking about, you've been sober 36 years. I mean, the last five to six, things have gotten a lot more normalized and the more access

to resources. But you're doing this at a time where no one talked about it. And it was like taboo almost. Totally. And you didn't have access, especially at sea. And so I would just go in my cabin. We didn't have the phones that we have today where I could call internationally. I went online and to these chat groups, right?

So we weren't live. Now you're just like writing about it. Like a message board almost. Yeah, message board. Absolutely. So it was the commitment, the materials that I read, the books, right? So the big book, this 12 steps. And hit my knees every morning and every night.

So as you're working your steps with your sponsor, you mentioned some of the important components of those steps and like making amends and actually delivering some of those. Did you have any of those conversations that you remember that went maybe better than you thought or making amends to someone that you had harmed in the past? It's so interesting because you think, you know, I'm sure you said I'm taking this to the grave with me. You're never going to tell anyone. All the time. You know, right?

But then you go, wow, true freedom is sharing it with another person. Who gives a shit if they judge you? People judge you all the time. Yes. You know what I mean? Like, you're going to be judged. It's okay. Just don't judge yourself.

Accept yourself, right? So absolutely. Listen, I had nothing to lose and everything to gain because I had pink sings about it. I've already seen the bottom. I have nothing to fear. I've been on the bottom. I've been homeless. Like, I didn't have a place to go.

stay. I remember spending the entire night in a Denny's going, where the fuck am I going to go? Sorry for swearing. No, you're a lot of swear, especially something like that. And I appreciate your honest. Like no place to go. My family were done. My friends were done. Where was I had a motorcycle? You know, I couldn't sleep in my motorcycle. I'm like, why didn't I get a car? Why did I get a bike? So, yeah, in those moments, I just didn't, it didn't matter. And then when I had to make amends to people, remember they, they go, you could be on the 10th or 12th floor and everybody, except for maybe the third person and kind of wrecks your hole the rest of them. So my experience, I didn't have that, but I was prepared for someone to reject my amends. Got it. And then have you

had to make amends further down the line? I mean, you're always constantly... In sobriety. Yes, of course. And I learned to promptly do it. And I'll give you an example. I was on the bridge of the boat, had a phone call. Actually, I was in my cabin with the owner. He reined me a new one about the budget. I walk out, see my first officer, bite his head off. I saw his first. I saw his face, like totally change. And what I did to him, and I saw his little spirit just go sad. And I looked at him, I go, Rob, you didn't deserve that. I'm really sorry. I go, I just had a phone called. I go, it's no excuse. Please forgive me. I'm sorry. And so those moments really matter. Sure. And he, especially in a relationship. Yeah. I mean, you're, you still have to deal your emotions in life and have to

face that sober. And then reactivity and, you know, how you kind of bring that with you. I think, especially being a leader and a captain, and how much I want to get into, kind of like, becoming Captain Sandy. We didn't talk about anything relating to a boat yet. You spent your 20s, early 20s, really going through it. Were you thinking about boats, motorcycles mostly, and drinking? Yeah. Just I was going to live in Key West with flip-flops, a tank top, and shorts, and smoke pot the rest of my life. That was my goal. Yeah. After I got sober, that changed. Sure. So how quickly along in your sobriety were you been thinking about what's... I was in a halfway house, that halfway house, And then they sent me to school, so vocational rehabilitation.

I said, can I go to diving school? Because I knew I was not meant for inside a building. I'm a Pisces. I'm meant to be outside. You're meant to be in the water. I meant to be in the water. So they sent me to diving school, first time ever. So I became a dive master.

So this isn't like your mid-20s, you're sober now? 26. Wow. And you're diving. Yeah. Did you start to feel like a connection to like that kind of world? Yeah, totally. And then I needed to make real money to pay my,

rent. So they didn't really pay well. And I answered it and had in the paper washing boats. I had washed boats earlier in my career. I grew up in Florida. I was always around boats. Yeah, the boating community is pretty robust. Yeah, my whole life. We always had a boat. Not a yacht, but we water skied all the time. Sure. So I started washing boats. Do you remember what they paid you hourly? I got paid per boat. Per boat. Wow. So I was like, oh my God, what a cool job. I get a sun tan, I get a workout. And I get to play in the water. No, it's amazing. And so, okay, you're washing boats and then how to what's i got a job on a boat called soldier of fortune two years sober then i was like this isn't for me because they did a lot of drugs on board that couldn't be

around it so i left so i think that that's important for people to discuss like the people places and things totally yeah someone who summer house a lot of drinking i got sober and went right back to the house people like how are you and i'm curious just like yeah you have to make those decisions about those environments you're putting yourself in. And if a workplace, burning, drinking, drug use, how did you navigate kind of that early? Well, I left.

It was non-negotiable. I had a sponsor. Yeah. She's like, there's another boat. I love this. So, okay, how does sobriety make you a better captain and a better leader? I listen more.

Remember? Yeah. They'd say, shut up. I try even doing this podcast. Why did they say go to a meeting? Shut up, sit on your hands and listen. Yep. You know, so I listen and I hear them.

And I think about, Maybe their background and what they've been through. I don't know. So why would I attack? Why wouldn't I listen and my approach make it soft? Sure. Because you want people to be able to talk to you. Yep.

Because if they don't feel like they can come to you, then there's no. Yeah, you don't have that trust. No. Like I said, when I hire the crew, I say, I trust you, I respect you. It's my job to earn your trust and respect, but you have to respect the position. Yep. The problem is, is if you lose my trust. my trust and respect. It's really hard to get it back. Totally. And I think like I'm curious because

bosses that I've always admired, like your boat washing story. Do you tell that to some of these guys? Like I used to wash boats. Oh yeah, they know. They know. Oh yeah. So that almost. Sometimes I say get me the boat brush. I want to wash the boat. See? They do. They just don't show it on TV. I love that. We have a saying here even with my business soft bar, like I'll plunge the toilets here. Yeah. Nothing's above or below me. And I think the people that you're working with are below you for them to see that can actually bring another level of respect and kind of like they're in their position but they can still get down and dirty. I got a shoe story for you. So I'm in Monaco, Grand Prix, promoted my boats into first officer. He has his three stripes on. He's on Pasarral watch. That's where

they stand at the Passerrell and all the girls are passing. He's like feeling good. And by the Monaco is, that's a bucket list. Sounds amazing. So my client, he's about five foot six, walks in, goes, hey, mate, we clean my shoes. I saw, I was actually on the Pasoelle. And I saw Rob's face. And I went, No problem, sir. I grabbed the shoes. I motioned him to come down and watch me clean the shoes. And I'm like, do you clean your shoes? He's like, yeah, I goes, nope, we're not less of a person.

If we clean the shoes, we're just making them happy. Exactly. Let's just clean the shoes. I love that attitude. I love that attitude. I feel like sobriety gives you. Yeah. But you also said something like listening as a leader.

And I think at least my perception of boat captains or yacht captains, I mean, you're dealing with a million dollar vessels here. You're dealing with crew. You're dealing with customers or clients. on the boat, safety, maritime law, all the things. But I feel like leaders on a boat are loud and, like, overbearing. But I would imagine, like, you're not that way. And I think that's a really good approach, but maybe sobriety helped inform some of that.

I think in the yacht world, you find captains that are less like that. So because most captains have worked their way up to the bridge, right? Sure. They know what it's like to do the other jobs. And every captain that I know personally, they're chill. They're great captains, especially charter captains. You can't be this person that beats your chest and says, I am a captain. I heard a story the other day about a captain that actually sat all the crew down in the crew mess and says,

this is how we fold the cereal. Like actually show them how to fold it to make sure it doesn't go stale. I'm like, really? Yeah, I mean, some are like that. But I just, in my world, I haven't seen captains like that. Sure. I mean, I feel like you also, from some of the episodes I've seen, I've always been interested in this, is like you handling conflict with the crew.

Also, guess. You know, and I think, how do you know when to step in is kind of my question? I grew up with siblings. I think if you could work it out with your siblings, you can certainly work it out with your teammates. Yeah. You know, because with your siblings, it's even worse, right?

Because I think you start throwing things at each other. Of course. Is there such thing as, like, healthy conflict on a charter? I don't think conflict is healthy at all. Sure. I think to me it's like if you come to a place where you're disagreeing, Don't make it a conflict. Make it like, okay, an impasse, all right?

So we just, we're in an impasse. Agree to disagree. Exactly. To some degree. And I always say that it isn't about you being right or me being right. We just have differences of opinions. And as long as our goal is to continue service and to make it wonderful, whoever the boss is, we do what they say.

Sure. There's no, it's not a democratic. Totally. Yes, of course, you want people to have their, opinions, but the ultimate decision is the person in charge. Yeah. That's where the ego gets in the way sometimes. Yeah.

So, and I think when you have great crew, and I'm just going to name a few, Natasha, she was an excellent Chiefs Stew. Katie Flood, excellent Chiefs stew. Shout to Katie. I know Katie. Great Chief Stu. They're professional Chief Stews, right? They came from big boats.

I can tell the difference. Aisha, great Chiefs Stew. She learned on below deck. Shout with Asia, too. I know her. She's great. Yes. Natasha and Katie learned.

through yachting. You know, they were up there on big boats. So you see that passion and care that they have. Aisha left, continued her career, learned what took classes, and now she's excellent at what she does. And when you see people that put the time in, you don't really have conflict because they have the knowledge. Well, I would imagine you being the position you are.

You're almost kind of bringing Aisha up into the world you're in and almost like maybe mentoring some of these women, especially on your crew. Well, Aisha has a good, strong, I think Asia's kindness she was born with. I think her family, obviously, you have to be kind. Natasha was kind. Katie was kind. Like, you have to have a kind heart.

Yeah. I really believe that. Yeah, I mean, I feel like I'm a sports guy. So the reference I think of is like you're like the coaching tree. It's like you've got these amazing crew chief stew, all these people that you've like kind of worked with. but then their careers now have blossomed because of some of the work you've done. I mean, do you think Aisha will be a captain someday or that's not in... I think Aisha wants a baby.

Yeah. Just like Malia has a baby. Well, I think, I mean, seeing you on Below Deck, I mean, your career has been now 10 years. It's amazing. You were the first woman captain on the yacht. Talk to me about some of that. Maybe the pressure or... I never thought of it because I arrived in TV as a yacht captain.

so I wasn't becoming a yacht captain on TV. Sure. So it was established. Listen, I spent years in Europe. I was a Mediterranean captain, so it was my jam. I know everybody in all those ports. No matter where we go, I have friends. Yeah.

Because I had a career before TV. And I always say this. My career is maritime. I'm on TV. My career is not television. My career, my license is in the maritime industry. When TV runs out, which I hope it doesn't, because I love doing it, I still have a career.

Sure. Because when you look at people on television, it seems very roller coaster like. We're the only industry. I can't think of another industry where budgets go up. They all get cut. Our budgets go up. Fuel goes up, dockage goes up. You can't ask for less and expect more.

Totally. Like in so many other places that happens, you actually have to pay more. And so when you, just a very small number of people, billionaires, you have to have 30 million a year to blow to own a yacht, a super yacht. 30 million, no big deal. That's it. That's the sweet number. Is there a moment, I mean, just kind of back to being like a woman in yachting and woman captaining a boat. Is there anything you remember early on in your career where misogyny or any of that toxic?

No, I never did. Honestly. One time I didn't get hired by a guy because he said I was a woman, which was a blessing in disguise, because then I went to work for a, billionaire who founded a bank, best guy ever worked for. But I never really had that. Yes, I'd have the eyeballs. Here comes the woman. I would laugh and smile and wink. But you already like so comfortable with yourself. I just, it didn't matter because I'm sober. Yeah. Like I didn't have that feeling of, oh, I got to impress them. It was like, I'm just doing my job. And they would say, that's a good captain. I love it. I love it. Now, do you think none of this would be possible without

your sobriety? None of it. Because it was because I got sober. I went to school and got my license. Do you think you feel like, the passion you have for this world and the people you work with and the teams you've led, you're so passionate. Do you feel like you actually are working? No. Yeah. Oh, I love it. I knew you're going to say it. No, it's fun. It's fun. People go, do you like doing the show? I go, oh my God, I love it. I can't wait. I love the dynamics, the logistics between production and us. And we're all there for the same reason to make a great TV show. Nothing's scripted. Nothing on our show is scripted because we're actually doing a job. But they don't tell us what to say. We're not actors.

No. You know what I mean? Definitely not actors. Well, I want to say, too, one thing that I've always admired, too, about what you do is below decks the way it's shown and produced with the cameras in the galley and the kitchen and all throughout the boat, Summerhouse is also, I think, one of the only few shows filmed in that capacity where there's surveillance cameras. Talk to me about that surveillance element. You can't hide. You can't script. No, you can't hide.

You can't script. And that's so funny, because I'll never forget, Wes and Malia kissed on the bridge. And they were like, someone said something, and that's when the cameras went in the bridge. The cameras were not in the bridge before. Or maybe it was, and they got out of the angle of the camera, and then they put a GoPro. They hit a GoPro. They hit a GoPro. And caught him kissing.

I can relate to being, I had a spot in the house at one point, season three, it was the pantry. And there was no camera in the pantry. They hid the GoPro. They put a camera in the cereal box later on in the summer in the pantry to catch. me and Paige making out at the time. There's not script that we can't hide from them. We thought we could hide. No, you can't hide.

Now, is that something, you know, I guess walk me through that call you got from Bravo. Hey, Captain Sandy. What are you doing this summer? Nadine Rajabi knew a comedian, Monica. And she goes, you need a woman. And Nadine goes, oh, yeah, and you know one. She goes, yeah, I do. It's Captain Sandy.

She's the tits. That's exactly what she said to Nadine. So anyway, she goes, she's real. So Nadine goes, oh, yeah, whatever. So she Googles me and sees that I was a real captain. She reached out to me, connected me to the network. And they said, well, did you have any perception of what Bravo was prior to that? Well, I had seen a few episodes of Captain Lee.

And I was like, okay, that's cool. Yeah. I didn't really watch the show. And then I worked all the time. We're not watching TV. You don't have TV on the boat. Yeah. So I did it.

My friends are like, it's going to ruin your career. rear. I'm like, you know what? It landed in my lap. The door of opportunity opens. I say walk through it because you can always walk back out. Love that. Actually, that's the- I did it. The best thing in my life. Change my life. So the friends that were saying, don't do it. Did you have any like people in sobriety or recovery? After I did my first season, I went right to the editors of the yachting magazines and I said, you need to change the narrative. It is not what you write about. So I talked to the people that own the magazines and then they started changing the narrative. In fact, I was just at the Fort Lauderdale Boat Show last year at the end of the year, and I just talked about, I'm like, for those of you who don't agree with a show, it actually reaches.

Can you help us understand more about that? They think it highlights the worst of the worst of the crew, and they don't like it. Sure. Right? So they just want to sleep and rest because they want to do a good job. They like counting their cash. But I think it's interesting. I didn't realize some of the, it's almost like us in the Hamptons. Some of the local Hamptons at first was like, are these guys going to be like Jersey Shore. Are they going to bring all this negative? Are they going to fight at the bar? Are they going to be degenerate people? But also I think I forget the boating community probably holds themselves to a pretty high standard. Oh yeah. You're dealing with billionaires and their families. Yeah. I'm pretty high net worth folks who are very needy and wow. I get requests all the time from

captains. I'm like, I've been with them six weeks. So far so good. Please don't take what you see on TV. Yeah. Give them a chance. You're like a character witness. Yeah. Just give them a chance. That's what I say. Yeah, I mean, I feel like you're paving or breaking down that wall, at least a little bit of like... The industry has shifted because because of the industry, it highlights our jobs. And I have a charity that. Talk a little bit about that. Yeah, in school curriculum to teach kids that there is alternatives to college,

that this is an actual career. Our jobs pay a lot more than they do on land. So carpenters, plumbers, electricians, welders, in shipyards make about 40% more. Wow. hourly. They have the best benefits. If you go to sea, obviously, you see the cash we count. Of course. You know, and you're not really spending it because you're working all the time. And there's nowhere to spend it unless you have like a cash register on a boat. So so many great opportunities and you immerse in different cultures, different languages, different. It's just incredible.

I just, you're surrounded by, it's like many United Nations. Yeah. Was it an adjustment having to be miced up like that and maybe censoring yourself at all? Were you worried about? I didn't really think about censoring. They did have to come to me and say, because on a real boat and you're chartering and you've got Green Crew, you're training. We train all the time. So you don't really see the training. We train constantly. We train maneuverboard drills, fire drills, taking on water drills, launching the tender drills. Like, this isn't just here, take this, launch this. Yeah, you guys are constantly. Very expensive equipment. Very expensive tenders. You don't want to. And Bravo needs to have a training episode for Captain Sandy. We do train now. And I also have another suggestion. Summerhouse comes on your boat for a trip. I'm manifesting the low-deck Summerhouse crossover.

You watch episodes back or no? Yeah, of course. I've met some Bravo Leverties who say they don't watch, and I think... We have to. How do you comment on your show if you don't watch it? Thank you. Yeah. I agree.

I also enjoy... Do you white love your show, right? Oh, my God. I look at what they're up to. And I'm like, oh, my God, that explains everything. Because, you know, if they've had a squabble, I'm just going to take this one time. Luca was hooked up with one of the stewardesses on board. And I was on the bridge.

I didn't know they were hooked up. I was on the bridge. He was texting with Katie Flood. And I look over and I'm like, who's that? Because he got all giggly. And I'm like, ooh, you like her. Who is? He goes, Katie.

I was like, oh, you like Katie. And it was like fun, right? We were having fun. And then I go down. And the crew mess, all the crew are sitting around the table and he gets a text. And his smile goes really big. I go, is that your girlfriend, Katie? and he was sitting next to the girl that he was sleeping with.

And I didn't know that. So I outed him. So there are those moments. Sure. Wow. And he texted me. He goes, you totally outed me.

Oh, man. I'm like, I'm sorry. Captain Sandy. I mean, that's funny, because you'll watch back and the thing that I've always appreciated is like,

you know, you might be in your office and then the crew is doing something downstairs or in the galley or whatever. You're not there for that. And then rewatching that, however many months after it comes out, have you ever text?

texted one of the crew members and be like, hey, like, I'm sorry. Like, have you ever had, like, in the moment watching that episode and then reaching out to cast or crew? Well, I reach out to them because I don't, you know, sorry that that happened, of course. Sure. Because some things are very hard to watch. Definitely. Especially when it comes to their relationships. Girls fall hard.

And I think some people just aren't aware of their behavior. Sure. Without saying names. Yeah, I mean, the relationship component, too, below deck. and the romance and the hookups. And yeah, I think that's a really unique layer of what you have to deal with as a captain. Obviously, you are managing a very large vessel,

but you're also like kind of playing therapist. You know, and I would like to say, like if you come on a show and you're there for six weeks, you're going to meet someone, it's going to feel like forever. But remember, you have the rest of your life. That's kind of how Summer House gets. When you get into the house, things just accelerate. It's super fast-paced.

Next two weekends and you're meeting the parents. And it's like, whoa, I can pump the brakes here. It is accelerated. It is accelerated, which is, it gets exciting. It's almost like a drug in a way. Yeah. I want to get into, like, the drinking on the boats. I try to clean on my side of the street.

I try not to be judgmental. When I first got sober, I acted like a martyr. I was like, I got it all figured out. I'd be at a party. You're like, oh, they're just, they're alcoholic. I just had a lot to say, and I needed to still do the work on my end. And something I was talking to Annie, my producer about, it was like, you handle, I feel like that crossing of line,

incredibly well. I mean, I'm sure it's because you've got 36 years, but crew members who maybe you notice are drinking a little bit too much or there's conflict because of alcohol. How do you navigate that where it's like not crossing the line in an uncomfortable, disrespectful way, but being there? And I saw a really amazing conversation from a few seasons ago where you talk about some of your story where you were chatting with one of the crew members who had alcohol in his breath. And it was interesting how he talks because I'm hearing him speak and he's like, I drink more than everybody else. And I'm like, that's what people say who are.

But the way you handled it, I really admired. And I'm curious how you handle that. I'm just honest, to be honest. Like, you know, when I see that, it's interfering with their work. We have to save lives. Yeah. Safety is probably the most important. Like, if we can't save a life because we're impaired, that's a problem. And then I'm the one that's in trouble.

But I didn't do it because I'm the one responsible. I did it because he's suffering. or she. I had a crew member years ago. I was like, every, I go, where is Catherine? Where is Catherine? She was almost unlimited master, bigger license than me. She was my first officer.

And no one could tell me. We called the hospitals, the jails. She'd come walking up to the boat. Had a blackout. Didn't know where she was. And I said, you have two options. I can fire you. Or you can go to a meeting with me.

Wow. She chose to go to a meeting. She's still sober today. Incredible. Yeah. And that's like, I guess, the love and support and that's such a beautiful thing. I've had now in my five and a half years of being sober, do I have some friends that I'm maybe worried about a little bit?

Yeah. Some are on TV, some or not. But I've always found a little bit of uncomfort because I'm not full, I'm not perfect. I'm not a doctor. I know what works for me. I know my story. I want to be there for my friends or be there for someone who needs it. And that gesture you made to that person, that tough love saved their life and look at them now.

Yeah. I also worked for my best friend Kyle, who. who has sat me down at one point. He was like, he actually was more about the cocaine. He's like, you've got to stop that. Like, you're going to die. But it was almost because he was my boss at the time that gave that tough love that I kind of needed.

But I'm curious, like, the tough love of it all. Like, how do you navigate being a boss, but also showing care and respect for these? I think just being a human being. Yeah. And the boss hat isn't on. Sure. It's just being a human being, a good human being.

Yeah, you could feel that in some of those conversations that you've had. Yeah, just having that conversation because it's only going to help. I have nothing to lose. And I, you know, like I said, before everyone saw me as a mess. Why not help someone? So, and as you know, when we help others, we get so much in return. I feel selfish. It's like I'm getting so much out of this experience of supporting others or service of others.

It's so selfless, but also feels selfish, but it's not. It's just that's the circle of life. Totally. I have a, as an example, there's been a friend of mine who I have been worried about a little bit. And the confrontation of it or approaching him with this kind of conversation, he's not on any show that I'm on, but he's someone personally that I've been worried about with his drinking. I'll send him articles. I send him some information. And then he'll text me that he blacked out and had a crazy bender weekend. And then how would you recommend that I navigate? He needs to get

sober. He needs to go to a meeting. Whoa. I thought about writing a letter. Yeah. Because my texts and calls thus far have been very just friendly and supportive, but not like, hey, Because everything he's saying was the shit I used to say back in the day. That was just the insanity. You know the saying when the student's ready. You know what I mean? Like, just like me, you know how many people had conversations with me? And I'm sure just like you, I wasn't ready.

Yeah. But every conversation and every letter and every text pauses the moment where they think about it, which gets them closer to that moment of change, right? So you can't. They have to. Yeah, and that's the part is you can only help someone so much. Just continue having the conversation. Yeah, and the best example I get is a lot of, you know, the oxygen mask on an airplane. You know, you got to do that first. Take care of yourself so you can show up to this and, you know, try and support.

Years ago, I had a revolving door at this place called Glen Oaks, Glen Ridge, before they changed the name. And it was a detox for five days. And every time I'd say, I'm an alcoholic, take me to detox. Glen Ridge. They did every time. And the guy Bill Stiles, he goes, we're just reserving a bed once a month. on the food Sandy. And then he goes, you know, he said, you know, you can lead a horse to water. And they say you can't make them drink. He goes, but you could kick them in the ass. And they go in the waterhead first.

And they get some in their mouth. You know what I mean? So he goes, and that's what we're doing with you every time I come back. I love it. I wanted to talk about something on the charter too. Like, have you had to step in when you're noticing the drinking is turning dangerous? I mean, I know you have, but. I, the only was the one time.

I got to tell you, production's really good at. You know, they don't buy the alcohol, first and foremost. If production sees there's an issue, you know, we have psychologists on their, like, these crew have so much support from the production side. Sure. A lot has changed since we started filming. The shows evolved. We've all evolved together.

Production really looks out for the team. And they look out for their team and they look out for the crew. Yep. So when they see something, they are on it. And that's kind of how Summerhouse has been to be. And you've applauded Bravo for their support and same for me. I mean, they've given me so much. latitude and support, but also the friends that I'm with. I mean, I would imagine your crew also

they know in the back of their head, Captain Sandy doesn't drink. Let's make sure we show up for her too. Yeah. You know, I think that's a beautiful thing is it's, it is a community effort. Yes. To stay sober and to kind of carry that. But in Summerhouse, I got into a pretty large screaming fight with my best friend, Kyle, totally sober, but I mean, I lost my shit. Have you had any moments where you've looked back? Oh, my God. Yeah. You just lose your, yeah, listen, it'll live still there. Thank you. Yes, of course.

Captain Sadie said it. You can have your meltdowns too. Yes, we're human beings. We're not perfect. Like, we're going to have meltdowns. And then you realize, oh, man, I owe an amends. Yep. And that's really the important part is where you, but you've got to give the person's

space in order to calm down after you just attacked, like a lion. And you're like, I'm sorry, but they're like not taking your sorry. So you've got to sit with your feeling. What's like, I'm curious just from like, like, the morning routine of it all. When you're on the boat, is there a non-negotiable things you do that when you first wake up and get started with your day? Hey my knees, ask for help. Have that time for myself in the morning. When they knock on my door, I go, is anyone, is everybody okay? Yeah, okay. I'll be out in 20 minutes. You know, when I get a knock, as long as everybody's okay,

it'll be okay. Yeah, I need this time. Sure. So, I mean, people ask me, like, how do you stay sober in the summer house and I wake up in the morning. I turn on my meditation app. I will pray or say a few words. I say the serenity prayer. We'll look at some of the daily reflection or affirmations, text some sober friends, maybe go for a run or walk, movement or some sort of, you know, motion. And then I can face the summer house. But I've had mornings where maybe you sleep in a little bit longer, maybe you don't have the greatest morning. I notice it. And it's, I've realized like I've got to have this non-negotiable start to the day. Yeah.

How do you protect your mental health? I mean, what's your- Sponsor? You know, you have relationships in recovery, right? Of course. Who's known you for your whole recovery. They call you on your crowd. That's why when I did this show, my friends in sobriety goes, oh, no, back down on the

ground. They smack me down so hard. And people go, I'm not the typical Bravo. I go because my friends go, boom. And, you know, they're like, okay, Sandy. Yeah. So you know what it's like. Keep yourself right sized.

Yeah. Well, because I, yeah, I mean, I'm wondering with your sober friends or your community, do they watch? Yeah, they watch. Do they ever give you like? Yeah, no, they're very proud. You know what I mean? Like, and they'll, they have feedback. Yeah, that's what I'm getting it because like my fight I have, I get the dry drunk messages.

You know, why didn't you call your sponsor right after that? And I'm like, good point. Because I'm a human. I'm human. I did text the next morning. Yeah. But I was so flooded. and in it, but me and Kyle did resolve the fight not too long right after,

but to your point, there was like a pause cooling off. Oh my, I was crying in my room. I felt horrible. Yeah. Because I'm also like this is going to be on TV now. Eight months later, I look like a complete flaming a hole. But yeah, I would imagine, like I've had a lot of- Everything has consequences.

Every behavior, we have a consequence. Either a positive one or not so positive. It's up to us. It's in our behavior. And we have to sit through those consequences. And that's really the learning of not wanting to do that again. Because if we don't have that, we're going to continue doing that behavior. You've got to have the bad feeling in order to change to have the good feeling.

100%. Or are you going to keep... Yeah, you'll keep doing that shit a little over again. You mentioned something at the beginning of this conversation, which I want to just touch on one more time. You're out in the wild open sea early 15 years ago and you are having to stay sober. You are logging on a website with a forum and writing what you were going through and sharing your story. and then connecting with others. That was one of your tools.

That was my tool. And the big book and the 24-hour day book. I don't even know if Daily Reflections was printed yet. But the strength and resilience that you had, that's so amazing because the tools and resources we are now afforded. Because you get hungry for it, right? The hunger is there. You can't get enough of it.

I mean, some of these books I have here, I mean, sober shift was one of the ones, this Lori Gottlieb and then Tawny Laura dry-humping, sober dating. You know, all these different, I was like, I was devouring anything I could. But there's a lot more access now. Yeah. So back then, you were off to your own devices.

That was true commitment. Yeah, you really had to be dedicated. And I applaud you for that. And I think it's important for people to realize how much has changed and what you've had to, you know, endure and come through. Yeah. It's just really powerful. Well, it's even more to navigate now. So for me, it was probably easier, less to navigate.

I think the more distractions you have, the further that you go in, it's very difficult. Sure. The less distractions, it's much easier. How are we feeling about the new season? Amazing, because it's Croatia, and it's DeBrovnik. And I don't, I mean. Beautiful part of the world. For me, it's the location.

I'm always going to have crew dynamics. It comes with the territory. Sure. It's the location. Well, let me ask. And the beautiful scenery that you're going to get to see. I have a friend of mine. They were just in Croatia.

And he was struggling with the lack of options, non-alcoholic options. How do you navigate? Like, you're being plopped into Croatia, Dubrovnik, beautiful place, obviously. But do you ever have any, like, in the back of your head, like, wait, am I going to feel comfortable here? I don't think like that. You don't think like that.

No, but I got a mocktail coming out. You do? Yeah, Art and Rev. Captain Sandy's mocktail. It's coming out. Can we serve it here? Yeah, you can serve it here. We'd love to.

So we're starting with four different ones because I think it's so important because I used to say when I would go out and they'd pour the, you know, cranberry and soda in a glass that doesn't look sexy. I'm like, I want a sexy glass. Yes. I want a sexy cool glass. You nail with Captain Sandy. Yeah, even as champagne, you know, every time I toast with the champagne,

it's either Red Bull or peach tea or something in there, like that looks like champagne. It looks like champagne. That's what I do. Yeah. The Red Bull is sugar-free or that we have a sparkling tea that's just nice and bubbly but tastes good. I love that, yeah, that's so important to have like an option or just something in your hand. Because we don't want to be punished because we don't drink. We want to have fancy cocktails. I want to get dressed up.

I mean, look at that drink right now. Beautiful. Yeah, it's beautiful. I want to get dressed up. I want to wear a cool outfit. I want to drink a nice, sexy, fun drink and a cool glass. Yeah. So that's what we do here itself.

Yeah. When can we expect your mocktail to come out? October. Sweet. So you got season 11 of Below Deck Med. You've got a mocktail coming out. Anything else for our audience to know where they can find you. Obviously, public speaking.

Yeah. You know, and I have a charity. Like, honestly, the charity, we're through K through 12. We're in all the, most of the schools in Florida. Love it. It doesn't have even have my name on it. I just want you. kids to learn about the options because I wasn't the perfect student. I didn't go to college. I got

kicked out of 11th grade. I never got a GED. You know, my background was street survival, you know. I think it's important for people to know, like, especially the state of colleges in university now. There are people who are college-bound, attorneys, doctors. I get it. We need that. But at the same time, some parents can't afford college. Some kids can't get the college grants, you know. And it's for those kids who can't. There are so many different options. Yeah, I guess that's what I'm getting at is like you think in your head you go to college because that's what you're supposed to do.

Even if you're like going to be an electrician, you're like, I think I still need to go to college though because that's like what you're supposed to do. But having programs at a younger age that showcase. Yeah. Like my brother wasn't a college. He wasn't right for college. He went to college and partied and then got kicked out after a year. He should have gone to a vocational for bricklaying, construction.

Some people need to work with their hands. And sometimes they're not surgeon material, right? And it's okay. Like we need, if we don't have these electricians, plumbers, and carpenters and welders, we wouldn't have buildings. Totally. And the way now, we need. Or boats. Yeah.

We need people with their hands. And we need actual in person. Yes, craftsmen. You're making me want to get on a boat right now. Boats are fun. We're coming up to our end here. But I asked you at the beginning of this, kind of what's the more life concept. What's giving you more life right now?

My life with Leah, to be honest. You guys are two years married now? Yeah, two years. seven years together. Like I just, like right now, it's like going home. Like I get so excited when I see her. I love her so much. And we just living life, right? Changing lives. Like, however we can do that. Like, we're not takers. We're givers. But you got to take a little bit for yourself, that time for yourself. Of course. And for each other. So I think it's just that rotation of, you know, it's a give, give world. You know what I mean? And Leah and I are just, we're complete opposites in

so many ways that we're perfect for each other. I love that. It balances out. Totally. I love that. Well, shout out to Leah too. It's beautiful here. Thank you for coming in, Captain Sane. Thanks for having me. I love your space. Thank you. I'm very blessed to have you here. You've been a big inspiration to me, especially in the Bravo world and a lot of men and women look up to you and have been inspired. So I am really grateful for you. It's my favorite interview. There's one other one I had in the UK. You're my American favorite interview. you. I love that. Thank you. Honored for you to be here and you're helping so many people out, including me. And I think the more we share out loud, the more authentically we share,

it's just beautiful what can happen. And the growth you've had and 36 years of sobriety is, keep going, Captain Sandy. Five years. Five years. Yeah. So people like you are the reminder I need. And I put you up on my rush more for a reason because I want what you have. I want to be like what you have. Thank you. And it's been really powerful. So thank you for coming in. Thanks for having me. Appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you, for being here today on MoreLife. We're here with Captain Sandy. This has been incredible. I love you guys. Check us out again here at More Life here in Softbar in Greenpoint, Brooklyn. Have a great day. Thank you guys for joining us on More Life. Watch or listen on Spotify or wherever you get your

podcasts. And please like, review, subscribe. It really helps us out. More Life is produced by Annie Siegel and executive produced by Adam Reynolds of Denham Pictures. This episode was directed by Annie Siegel. edited by Mikey Ortiz and recorded at softbar studios in Brooklyn, New York. More Life is a production of Sony Music Entertainment. From Sony, our executive producers are Chris Skinner and Joanna Clay. Original music by Function Adams. Sound mixing by Ian Sorrentino.

Set designed by Michael Ignacio. Publicity by Caitlin Healy. Additional support from Abby Sharp. And a special thanks to Alison Shano and Joanna Orland. New episodes drop every Tuesday. We'll see you next time. Hey, y'all, it's Kelly Clarkson with Wayfair. Ever order furniture online and wonder, what if?

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