More Money Podcast - 093 How to Plan Your Retirement the Smart Way - Fritz Gilbert, Blogger at The Retirement Manifesto

Episode Date: February 22, 2017

Saving for your retirement is simple. As Fritz Gilbert from The Retirement Manifesto shares, it all comes down to starting early, spending less than you make, and keeping to it. Long description: As I mentioned at the beginning of this episode, lots of us young people don't start thinking about planning for our retirement, well...until it's too late. Which isn't a good thing. It may be difficult wrapping your head around something that won't happen for another 40 or 50 years, but the only way to make sure you'll actually be able to relax and enjoy your retirement is if you start thinking and planning for it as early as possible. Fritz Gilbert, the blogger behind The Retirement Manifesto, joins me for this podcast episode to share what he's learned about retirement over the years and how he is only a few years away from his early retirement at 55. Make sure to check out the links below for more helpful resources and tips on how you can start taking action now so you can rest easy later. Fritz's Advice on How to Retire Early (or Well) Spend less than you make, and do it for a long time. Learn More About Fritz's Retirement Manifesto About Fritz His Top Personal Finance Resources Fritz's Blog Posts You Need to Read The First 6 Steps to Financial Wealth The Retirement Manifesto — How It Started Top 5 Regrets People Have On Their Deathbeds (& How To Avoid Them In Your Life) Follow Fritz on Social Like Desirae on Facebook Follow Desirae on Twitter Check Out Desirae on Instagram Subscribe to Desirae's YouTube Channel Learn How to Save Money with LowestRates My interview with LowestRates CEO Justin Thouin on saving money by comparing rates For more podcast episodes, check out the podcast page. Show notes: jessicamoorhouse.com/93 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello, hello, hello. Jessica Morehouse here, and you're listening to episode 93 of the Mo Money Podcast. And my next guest is Fritz Gilbert. He is the founder, the blogger behind the Retirement Manifesto. So as you can deduce, we will be talking about retirement, making the transition to retirement, saving for retirement, and even touching on early retirement, which is, I think, a dream in most of our lives when we're working and just wish we had a little bit more free time to do what we wanted. So I'm very excited to talk about Fritz and Picka's brain because he's very knowledgeable about this subject matter. But before we get to this episode, thank you so much to this episode's podcast sponsor, Lowest Rates. So in case you don't know,

Lowest Rates is where you can find the lowest rates in Canada for your mortgage, auto insurance, life insurance, and more just like that. Super simple. I've done it to find the best quote for my life insurance. So I highly recommend you check them out too at lowestrates.ca. Once again, that is lowestrates.ca. I will include a link in the show notes so you can find out more details about lowest rates. But again, if you are looking for a good rate, which you should always find, you shouldn't just go with the first rate you're offered by whoever. You definitely want to do your research to find the lowest rate on anything that you're getting. Lowest rates is definitely the website to check out so you get the best deal. So without further ado, here's my podcast interview with Fritz Gilbert from

The Retirement Manifesto. Thanks, Fritz, for joining me on the show today. Hey, a real pleasure to be here, Jessica. I appreciate you having me on. No problem. I'm excited to talk about a topic that I think a lot of millennials, you know, that's kind of largely my audience, don't really think about, I think, maybe as often as they should, which is retirement and early retirement too. I think that sometimes people don't believe that that's a possibility when really it could be, and you are proof of that fact because you are going to retire very soon, right? Yeah, I'm 53 and I'm looking at probably 55. So I'm going to be out early. And I really have a

heart for the millennials. My daughter's 21 and and she's, you know, started to move into the career world and making money and things like that. You know, there's so many lessons that apply to retirement, but you can only affect them when you're, you know, in your younger working years. for this message around compound interest and the importance of starting early that I really appreciate you having me on because as I've written more and more, I've realized how much of the value of later in life financial status is really a result of how responsible you are earlier in your career. So you're reaching a really important part of the population. Absolutely. I applaud you. Oh, well, thank you. No, I totally agree with what you're saying because I think retirement is one of those things that lots of millennials don't think is that important to think about now.

They have a lot of things that I think they want to check off the list first, paying off student debt first, paying off their credit card bill, and saving up some money so they can buy their first property. Retirement is kind of on the back burner. But just like you said, it's unfortunate that lots of people think like this because the younger you start, the better you're off, and it won't seem like such a struggle to save up that big amount of money that you may need to live off of in your older years. Yeah. And I'll tell you, Jessica, I mean, something that's really changed, you know, obviously the student loan thing is a huge issue for millennials. And, you know,

obviously you're in Canada and, you know, the property values up there trying to get into a house, rent versus buy, those issues are huge issues that, you know, I was fortunate in my generation that I didn't have to face those. But in spite of those headwinds, if you want to call rent versus buy. Those issues are huge issues that, you know, I was fortunate in my generation that I didn't have to face those. But in spite of those headwinds, if you want to call them that, the reality of it is, you know, if you're 25, whatever you want to say, 30, you know, in 25, 30 years, whether you want to or not, you're going to be retired. And you have to take responsibility for that because, you know, that sand through the hourglass just never stops dropping. And it seems so far away, but, you know, being 53 myself now, it passes like the wind. And it's the actions that you take in your late 20s, early 30s that can really favorably impact,

you know, your situation in your 50s. You know, can you retire at 55 or do you have to work to your 70? That's predominantly determined by what you do when you're in your late 20s and early 30s. It really is. So it's hugely important. Yeah, like retiring at 55 compared to 70, it's like, you know, that may not register right now, but man, when you turn 55 and you're like, I wish I could retire now, but now you have another 15 years to work, I bet you wish you'd, you know, saved up a little bit more when you were younger and didn't.

Exactly. Yeah. So that's kind of my mission right now is how do you reach people? And I'm especially attuned because of my daughter, obviously. But how do you reach people when they're young enough to really start? And I wrote an article. You guys can look at my blog. That's fine.

But I wrote The First Six Steps to Financial Wealth. And it was really written to my daughter. She's 21 years old. She just started her first job. And it's really a heartfelt, here's the first six things that I think you should do as you're starting your career. And she doesn't have to understand all the details of it. But I understand a lot of people don't want to individually manage their investments. You don't have to at this age.

You just have to get the fundamentals started. You have to automatically start a saving program where it comes out of your checking account. Even if you're paying student loans, you can still launch, you know, 50 bucks a month or whatever over into an RSP, you know, as you call it in Canada, 401k as we have down here. You can still do the fundamental blocking and tackling without really understanding it. And 20 years later, you're going to be so thankful that you took those steps because that's when you're going to start seeing the benefit of it. Well, even in just a shorter amount of time, I mean, I think I started kind of aggressively saving and really putting importance on my personal finances when I was about 24,

got my first job, moved out and all that stuff. And it's only been six years, I'm 30, and I can see that growth. And I'm like, holy crap, I'm so glad I started saving and, you know, kind of still living like a student when I was 24. And for years after that, because fast forward six years, which went by really freaking fast, even 10 years, like from 20 to 30, I still remember my being 20, like it was yesterday. And I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm 30. How did that happen? And it, you know, it just, it's one of those things where it's like, when you are living in the moment, sometimes it's hard to kind of grasp. That's right.

I'll tell you something you touched on there too, which is really important, is this whole concept of lifestyle inflation. I think when you're in college, you're dirt poor. You're barely getting by. You're eating canned stew or whatever you eat. Try to maintain that lifestyle for five to ten years after you start working. I mean the money's coming in. Hey, you know what? I can handle that car loan.

You look at a monthly payment mentality, and you can get in trouble really quick. Sure, you can get that new BMW. You're making $40,000 a year. You can afford that payment. Don't let that happen because once you get caught into that lifestyle creep, you never get out of it, and it's much, much better to kind of force yourself into that college lifestyle mentality and take that difference and sock it away because you've got time for that to compound and grow. 50s or 60s. And the compounding effect is not linear, right? It's exponential. And as you get later in life, that line goes kind of straight up and down. And it's just amazing what the savings will do when you start earlier in your life. So good for you for starting early and doing the podcast and doing the blog and trying to reach out to your peers. You know, that's the point in your

life when you can have the biggest impact on your future financial security. I'm hoping. And that's kind of, I think, why I'm so passionate about personal finance, but also specifically helping out people like me who are my age. Because this is such a critical time for our lives. And yeah, that's just my kind of, I think, mission or one of my kind of new missions, I think, for right now. What I feel very kind of called to do is to help millennials just like me learn. I mean, I have a lot of friends that come to me and they're like, what do I do? Or they're kind of reaching that point where they're about to pay off their student loans. They don't know what to do with their money now. And they're like, should I open up an RRSP? What's an RRSP? And I'm like, oh my gosh, you know, we're 30 and we should absolutely

know this. And we should have known this 10 years ago. So hopefully with the combination of you and me and some other awesome people that will grace this podcast, we'll be able to help some people make some good decisions so they could just, you know, live a better life and not have to worry about money. That's the main thing. I don't like worrying about money and I feel like no one should have to worry about money if they have the education and tools to back it up. Yeah. And, you know, I love your motto, money, life balance. You know, I think money is important, but it's certainly not the most important. You know, the point is be responsible, be responsible early, enjoy your life, but enjoy it in balance. And, you know, that money, life balance really captures that, you know, an important element, but there's other

pieces that you have to take into consideration as well. But don't overlook the money side, especially when you're starting out in your career. Exactly. So I would love to get more into your story specifically. Sure. Have you always been this, I mean, you know, you seem like you've always kind of made the right choices when it comes to your money and your career and everything like that. So were you always good with money? Was it something that you were always very passionate about?

Yeah, let me run you through that because I think it's a good story. I remember when I was a kid. I think it's a good story too. That's why you're on the show. And we talk about millennials. Well, there's no difference between I'm a baby boomer, right? So I'm mid-50s. There's no difference between us and millennials than 20, 30 years. So 20 or 30 years ago, you could say I was a millenner, right? So I'm mid-50s. There's no difference between us and millennials than,

you know, 20, 30 years. So 20 or 30 years ago, you could say I was a millennial, right? I was your age and I've lived that life. And if I look back at when I was in that age bracket, you know, I start out in my childhood. I guess my parents were very middle class. My parents were both teachers. My dad taught at a university. My mom taught in a public school. So we had a very modest lifestyle and I was never wrapped up in the materialism. You know, I was never, our family was never caught up in having the latest and greatest. We lived comfortably, but we didn't live extravagantly at all. And I've been very blessed with a wife that had a very similar upbringing and very similar values for money.

So that was a huge part of it. And then as I got out of college, I was very fortunate. My dad being a university professor, one of his benefits was that I could get free tuition at a variety of colleges that were in this network. So I basically got through college without any debt, which was huge. My parents paid for me for whatever was left. And I've returned that favor to my daughter now. And I've paid for her college, my wife and I have. So we're kind of paying it back, right? Which I think is great. So I got out of college with no debt. I landed a job with a major Canadian company. So I do have a connection with Canada and I go to Quebec quite a bit. I'm in the aluminum business. So I spent quite a bit of

time in Canada and I started at 21 years old, right out of college, you know, good job. And I've been with one company for 31 years now. And, you know, for my very first paycheck, I remember, you know, we have the 401k here, similar to the RSP. I signed up for the 401k, my very first paycheck, they took, you know, 15% out and I've been saving that plus, you know, basically every year when I get a, let's say you get a 3% raise, well, I'll take 2% of it and I'll add it to my savings contributions and I'll let 1% trickle into my checking account. So you always increase your savings rate as your salary goes up, and that kind of naturally controls that lifestyle inflation we were talking about earlier.

So I've been doing that for 31 years, and I'm very fortunate to still have the traditional pension. I realize those are gone, but I've got the pension and I spent 31 years with one company. So that's created quite a bit of value. But saving 15% to 20% of my salary since I was 21, combined with a traditional pension, I'm in pretty good shape. And I've had a good career. It's been a great variety. I've moved. I started in customer service, moved into sales, moved into operations, moved into supply chain. Now I'm in procurement. So I've had a full, a real nice move in our company through a lot of the different functions. And I've had a lot of nice promotions. We've moved nine times. I've moved all around the country and it's been a really good run. But the principles

that we're talking about here are principles that I practiced, you know, when I was 21, 22, getting out of university and starting my first job. So I, you know, I, I practice what I preach and, and, and I really did, um, you know, implement the things that I'm suggesting that millennials implement today. There, there are examples that I'm drawing from my personal life and now I'm looking back at it from my mid fifties and saying, man, I'm so thankful I did that because now I'm seeing the benefit of it. Exactly. Yeah. No, that's awesome.

And I think, you know, just like you mentioned, you are kind of proof of what you're teaching. You're a great example. And the crazy thing, though, is like, you know, what you did when you were 20 is exactly what 20-year-olds right now should do. So things haven't changed that much. So it's just, you know, at the end of the day, personal finance, being smart with your money isn't rocket science. That's right.

Actually, you'll like this. I'm writing a blog. You'll see it. It'll probably come out next week. But it's Yoda, you know, Yoda from Star Wars. He's such a weird little character, right? But a guy put a comment on my blog about Yoda and he put some comments in there, some of Yoda's quotes. And I was like, that's interesting. So I Googled Yoda's quotes. And

this guy had so many really awesome quotes that are so applicable to personal finance. You know, he's 800 years old, right? He's, you know, I mean, it's goofy. It's a funny little blog. But the principles are not new, right? They've been around a long time. And it's just a matter of prioritizing them in your life and not getting caught up in materialism and not spending all your money going out with your friends and running to the bar and spending a bunch of money on drinks and dinners out. You know, it's financial responsibility and started at a young age and let it compound over time and you'll be fine. But you know, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's pretty much that simple,

you know, spend less than you make and do it for a long time and you'll be fine. But it's pretty much that simple. Spend less than you make and do it for a long time, and you'll be fine. Exactly. And I think the thing that also some people may not believe or understand is just because you kind of have this routine of saving and living frugally and all that stuff, this shouldn't really affect your quality of life. No.

I mean, I've lived pretty, you know, like we've been living on a budget for as long as I can remember. And this is just how it is. You get used to it. But our quality of life is great. And I mean, let's be honest, like I work downtown, we live downtown, we eat out probably more than most people do. We have all the things that we really need. And if we really want something, we could afford to buy it in cash. Do we go out every weekend? No, we be, you know, we were very strategic in how we spend our money, but you know, it, it does, it doesn't really make me more or less happy, you know? Yeah. And, and, well, and I think that's where, you know, this whole perception that, oh, if you're, if you're financially responsible, then you're frugal and you're, you know, you're, you're living

in a cave and, you know, these really, you know, just foul misperceptions. It doesn't have to be that at all. You know, my wife and I, we went to Norway last summer, you know, we, my daughter's 21, but as she went through school, we'd take European vacations every summer. I frequent flyer miles, you know, we do it economically, but, you know, we'd find ways to really create valuable life memories. You don't have to live so that you're not enjoying life. You can accomplish both, and it's very achievable. The trick is to not let your expectations for material wealth get ahead of where you're actually at in terms of your financial earnings. You've got to live within your means, but you can live very enjoyably within your means

if you manage your expectations. And that's really what it's all about. Exactly. And if you want to buy something that's beyond your means, kind of the trend that's going on in my generation is just get another job or find another income stream. So make more money. Well, and I got to love the whole side hustle thing. My blog, I'm not making any money on it yet. Maybe I will at some point, but I'm not doing it for money. I'm doing it to try to share the lessons I've learned. But I read a really good article.

I'll send it to you if you need show notes or anything. You can blow it in there. But this guy had written 143 ideas for side hustle income, and it's on Instagram. There's a web post about it. And the reality of it is with technology and all you know, all the internet type stuff and, you know, blogging is so easy. There are so many ways, you know, I work full time. I write my blog. You and I are doing this podcast interview. You work full time. You know, we're doing all of this in our spare time and there are so many opportunities for people to do a little side hustle. And if you pick the

right one that's something you're really passionate about, you know, it's going to give you a lot of enthusiasm for life. And it might turn into something where it actually creates more money than your, your real job, quote unquote. And then you turn that into a full-time living where you've got that

entrepreneurial, you know, spirit, but you can do that while you're still working and generate these things and run them for a while. That was never available when I was your age. And that's a huge plus, I think, for millennials. It's huge. It's phenomenal what's out there. Absolutely. I think we, you know, sometimes maybe see it as a drawback that we may need a second job

or second stream of income to kind of be able to afford living in the city or, you know, buying a place. I mean, houses are just crazy expensive no matter where you live these days compared to, you know, the baby boomers generation. But then again, it's kind of easier to make money in some respects as long as you don't mind being a bit creative or, you know, spending that extra time not watching TV. Like, really. That's it. That's it. That's it. Exactly. And, you know, TV is such a brain suck. I mean, you know, you spend three hours a night in front of the TV. That's three hours that you could have been out generating income. You know, and if you find something you like to do, I mean, you like to write. Obviously, I like to write. I mean, you know, you find something that you like to do. It's not it's it's entertaining at the same time that it's generating income, where something like watching TV or, you know, non-value creating things, sure, it can be entertaining, but you can find entertaining things that also create income.

There's a wealth of opportunities now, and just get creative and go out and look for them. And they're also just good at – in my experience, I've been blogging for almost five years. I've made some really great friendships out of this. And I know, for instance, I helped my friend. I hooked her up with a friend of mine. She's a grant writer on the side. I have a friend who's a filmmaker who needed a grant. I hooked them up and then they worked out, they got the grant. So my friend was able to make her film. They became friends. It was just like kind of a beautiful moment of like side hustles and

friendship. It was just like, this is awesome. And you know, that's, that, that was, if I think about what I thought I would be getting into as I started my blog, I started my blog in April of 15. So it's been about a year and a half. And, and, you know, my, my thought was, okay, it'll be really financially focused. And I had all these ideas. Well, it's changed so much since then, you know, I probably write as much now about kind of work life balance and, you know, overall life, you know, priorities and things like that as I do about the financial stuff. So that was one surprise is that really the message that seemed to resonate more with my readers was more about finding a purpose in life and things like

that. That was the first surprise. The second surprise was this whole, you know, network of fellow bloggers and podcasters and, you know, the connections you make on Twitter. And, you know, network of fellow bloggers and podcasters and, you know, the connections you make on Twitter. And, you know, I've had lunch with a couple people now that are in my area. I live down in Georgia. I live in Atlanta. And then there's a, you know, there's a variety of people I hooked up with through Twitter that are, you know, really advanced bloggers and authors. They have published books and, you know, having lunch with these people. It's a really fun network, and there's a huge reward and appreciation that you don't expect that kind of comes from that network of people that have similar interests, and it's really enjoyable,

with or without the financial gain. Just that expansion of friendships is really rewarding. It's a lot of fun. And it's totally free. Exactly, yeah. It's a lot of fun. And it's totally free. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. It's free to do. Yeah. Exactly. Last kind of thing I'd love to know, because you are going to be retiring early, which I'm super, that's so awesome that you are. Very inspiring. What does retirement look like for you? What do you expect to do during retirement? It seems like you'll probably continue with the blog and maybe make that your kind of side hustle. Yeah, that's a great question,

Jessica. Ironically, I was working out today at lunch and there was a guy next to me on the treadmill and we're talking. He goes, aren't you worried about getting bored in retirement? I'm like, people always say that, hey, if you retire early, you're going to get bored. I think, I mean, is your life your job? There's so much to life beyond what you have to do. And if you're at the point where you can achieve financial independence early, then you have financial independence. You have a choice. I can continue to, you know, I can choose to continue working, not because I no longer need the paycheck, but it's because I choose that that's the best place where I'll get the most rewarding benefit for my time that I invest in it. Or I can choose to do something that I find more rewarding.

And to me, when you think about how long will you truly be healthy and able to go out and do things. And I love the Canadian Rockies and Banff and Jasper and that area. Okay, so let's just say you want to go climb one of the mountains's a, it's a, I don't know, a couple thousand meter hike. And you know, how, how old can you really expect yourself to be able to do that stuff? Right. Let's just say 70. So if you work till 60, then any given year that you give up is 10% of your really active life, right? It's not 10% of 100 years, it's 10% of those 10 remaining active years that you have. So to me, getting out early is really valuable, because those are early years when you know you're healthy, you know, you can go out and do the things you want to do. So,

you know, my wife, this is the part of the whole early retirement dream and plan that we've had, that's really exciting, because you can think about what do we really want to do and you know we've absolutely got plans we're going to get a fifth wheel we're going to we're going to spend probably six months of the year you know go up to Alaska for six months go out to the Pacific Northwest we love BC I know you're from Vancouver I love Vancouver it's wonderful you know so I could I could easily see go out to Vancouver Island and spend you know two months on Vancouver Island. I mean, why not?

You're free to do what you want to do. So we've got dreams to do things like that. And we might along the way. Financially, I don't think we're going to need to. But if we choose to kind of work a seasonal job somewhere, maybe work in a national park for a summer for the social network and connection as much as anything else, great. We'll do that. We're open to those types of options. But they're not going to be driven by financial need. It's going to be driven by, hey, let's decide to do this for a while.

And financial will be the last consideration, which is really, you know, a really nice place to be, you know, at this stage in life. So absolutely. I love the idea of, wow, being financially free enough to do exactly whatever you want, pretty much. Exactly. And then choosing to work, which for me, when I think of retirement, I certainly don't think I'm going to be on the beach. Sometimes a date room about being on the beach with a pina colada, but that would be like a week and then I'd get bored. So I would absolutely just, yeah, I'd find some other passion.

I'd probably still work, but I'd probably do whatever I want to work in. So be my own boss, so to speak. Yeah, and that's why I did start the blog. Part of what I – as your listeners, I mean they're young, but just remember this part in your brain and 30 years from now when you get to be in your 50s or whatever, think about it. As you get to within a few years of retirement, you know, one of the things that I think is really important is to start to develop these other interests that might turn into things that give you a purpose in retirement. So the whole purpose, you know, for starting this blog was, hey, let's experiment. Let's figure out how this works. You know, I got some good ideas to share. That's fine. But really, the goal was to create a platform that can live post-retirement. And you start building these platforms, be it charitable work. My wife and I, we live up in the mountains right where the

Appalachian Trail starts. So we're up in the North Georgia mountains. And we started on the weekends, I'm up there, and we started getting involved in some of the charity organizations. And we're starting to try to vet out some of those areas that might turn into post-retirement things that we decide to get involved with because you don't want to wait until you get to retirement and then suddenly go out and start looking. You start looking before you get there, right? I mean, you want to have those ideas drawn out and really have an idea of what you're going to get into.

So that's kind of where we're at right now. It's a lot of fun. We're enjoying it. Well, I'm excited to hear about how retirement goes in two years. I'll follow up with you. I'll follow up with you before that, but I'm excited to know how it is. That's very exciting. And what's really fun, I just did an article about, it was called Retirement Expectations Versus Reality. And one of the things I wrote about in there is, you know, as you're thinking about retirement, it's a really interesting stage in your life because by definition, you can't know what retirement is until you're retired, right? So it's one of those

future states that you're trying to imagine in your mind, but you can't really imagine what it's going to be like. It's kind of like when you're in university and you're trying to think about what's that first job going to be like. You don't really know until you get into your first job, right? And retirement is kind of the same thing. You're trying to imagine what's that retirement going to be like. And inevitably, when you get there, it's going to be different than you expected it to be. So what I've started to do now is I've had quite a few guest bloggers and things like that that have come in and written on my site that have gone through that transition. And I'm trying to encourage them, hey, share your lessons as you went through this transition.

What were some of the things that you didn't expect that you can advise those of us who are still a couple of years away so that when we get there, we're kind of more ready for some of those unexpected transitional things. And there's just so much stuff to write about. And I don't just write about retirement. I mean, for your audience, as I mentioned, I wrote this article for my daughter. I write about all areas of personal finance that ultimately affect retirement. But so many of those areas, if you haven't done them by the time you're 35, you know, you've kind of missed a huge opportunity.

So there's a really, really important part of this that is directly at your audience. And that's start early, you know, live below your means, force yourself to automate your savings and just get that piece done right. And you've conquered 90% of the challenge. You know, that's the challenge at your age right now is to live below your means and automate the savings on the balance of it. And you'll be fine. That's really the message. And it's a very good message. So thank you so much, Fritz, for joining me and sharing your wisdom. And that was episode 93 with the wonderful Fritz Gilbert from The Retirement Manifesto. Make sure to check out more info about him in the show notes, jessicamorehouse.com slash 93, or check out his fabulous website,

theretirementmanifesto.com. He has a bunch of great resources about retirement that you may want to check out. And thank you again to today's podcast episode sponsor, Lowest Rates. Thank you so much for supporting the Mo Money podcast. You will probably want to go to lowestrates.ca right now in case you are currently looking for the lowest rates on, say, a mortgage, auto insurance, life insurance, and more. Just like that is the easiest thing you can do to save money. I am telling you, I did it myself. Love their website. They also have a really good blog in case you want to learn more about how to find the best deals and save money and just live a financially slavish life. So

make sure to check them out at lowestrates.ca. We'll include a link to them in the show notes and a bit more information about what they are all about. And of course, I will also include a link to, or you can just, if you're on iTunes, just check it out. Episode 79 is one in which I interview lowest rate CEO Justin Thuen. He is super, super knowledgeable when it comes to personal finance and rates and credit and all of this great stuff. So make sure to check out episode 79 in case you want to figure out all that stuff because I know you will. So thank you again for listening to this episode, and I will see you back here next Wednesday. This podcast is distributed by the Women in Media Podcast Network.

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