More Money Podcast - 144 The Year of Less - Cait Flanders, Author & Blogger

Episode Date: February 14, 2018

How can a year of less change your life? Just listen to my episode with The Year of Less author Cait Flanders to learn how a shopping ban, getting rid of most of her belongings & being more mindful with her money helped her regain focus and control of her present and future. Long description: She was my first ever guest (excluding my husband) on the podcast when I launched it almost 3 years ago, and now my friend and blogger pal Cait Flanders is back to chat about what has happened since Episode 3 of the podcast. Well, a lot! For starters, she’s a full on author now, having just published her first book The Year of Less. And she’s not just a first-time author, her book is a hit. As she mentions in the episode, it’s still hard to find a copy at most book stores because they ran out of copies, so if you do still want to buy a copy, check Amazon first. When we sat down for Episode 3 of the show, Cait was just about to finish her one-year shopping ban. I still remember her sharing that she wasn’t sure what to do after it finished. She eventually decided to continue it for another year, and although now she’s no longer on a shopping ban, she’s integrated the lessons she learned into her daily life. The biggest lessons being to be more mindful when it comes to spending. It’s okay to spend money, but it’s about being more intentional with our spending and making sure we are spending money in alignment with our values that’s important. And when you do that, you’ll find that you can stick to a budget, you aren’t overspending as often (or anymore), and you don’t worry as much about your money. This is a big lesson I also took away from her book and something I’ve been actively trying to integrate into my own life. In this episode we also dive into other stories she shares in the book beyond the shopping ban, such as addiction and indulgence. Cait is now sober, but she used to have a problem with drinking, something she eventually realized was something she would do to fill a void or overcome other struggles in her life. It’s something I can relate to in that I definitely turn to certain things, like food or wine or even spending, to either deal with stress, unhappiness or hardship. If you haven’t already grabbed your copy of the book, I highly recommend. And like I mentioned in the episode, I’m not recommending it because Cait’s my friend, I’m recommending it because it’s really good! I literally whipped through it in a day (no lie!), and I can’t stop thinking about it or telling other friends about it. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello, hello, hello, and welcome to episode 144 of the Momentum Podcast. I'm your host, Jessica Morehouse. Thank you so much for joining me for another episode. And this one's a good one. I'm bringing back one of my past guests. Actually, one of my first guests. Actually, the first guest ever that I had on my show, not including my husband, Josh, who will never again be on my show or on my YouTube channel. He made that very clear. He does not like to be in the public eye, which I get. I understand that. So I'm talking about Kate Flanders. She was my guest for episode three of the show when I launched it back in 2015, which is insane because it's 2018. Like, where did the time go? And a ton of stuff has happened since we recorded that episode. Now she has a book.

She is an author, the author of The Year of Less. If you don't have your copy, make sure to grab it on Amazon or Chapters, Barnes & Noble, wherever they sell books. I know right now the best place to get it is online just because it's more popular than I think the bookstore is expected. So they're running out of copies. So make sure to go. I think Amazon is kind of the best place to go right now. Anywho, I was so delighted to have her record this episode with me. But we also did most recently a book club.

So if you're not familiar, I have this kind of online book club to encourage people to get together to pick up a personal finance book that maybe they wouldn't otherwise. And then we read it and then we join together online on Facebook for a Facebook live with myself and the author. So people can ask questions. We could talk about the book. And so we did that recently. If you missed it, that's cool. Well, it's not cool. You should have been there, but that is okay. You can check out the replay on my YouTube channel or on Facebook. But anyway, she's joined me for this podcast episode too. So I can ask her all of my burning questions because I read the book, loved the book, and it was so interesting to get,

you know, she obviously documented a lot of her journey doing her shopping ban on her blog, but there's a lot of stuff that she didn't talk about on the blog that she gets to in the book. We talk about lots of those themes and topics in this episode, so I know you are going to love it. But before I get to that interview, here's just a few words about this episode. So I know you are going to love it. But before I get to that interview, here's just a few words about this episode's sponsor. Support for this episode comes from Nest Wealth. You've probably heard about robo-advisors and how index-based investing is the way to go if you want to save on fees and outperform traditional mutual funds. But with so many investment companies to choose from, how do you know which one to go with? Enter NestWealth, Canada's first ever robo-advisor and also the

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To get started, visit learn.nestwealth.com slash Jessica Morehouse. Once again, that's learn.nestwealth.com slash Jessica Morehouse. And if you want to learn a little bit more about how it all works, check out my video review in the show notes or visit jessicamorehouse.com slash nestwealthreview. Thanks, Kate, for joining me on the show. Once again, you were episode number three, and now you're episode 144. That is wild. Isn't that crazy?

And also episode three? Yeah, you were my first guest. That wasn't my husband or myself. That is wild. Isn't that crazy? And also episode three. Yeah. You were my first guest. That wasn't my husband or myself. And if you remember correctly, we were sitting in your parents' basement. Yeah. Yeah, we were. I remember having to tell my mom, can you please just take your shoes off?

Because she has this tendency to always walk around the top, like the floor above us with her heels on. And I think, I think she still walked around, but somehow edited that out. Oh, I remember early days. Josh would have edited it out.

He did. I mean, yeah, not me. Josh for free. Thank you, Josh. Thank you,

Josh. Oh man. Do I owe him like Thank you, Josh. Oh, man. Do I owe him like a lot of money? Oh, my gosh. That is so funny. Oh, gosh. Yes. So, I mean, a lot has happened.

So when I first talked to you for episode three, you were, I feel like, near the end of your shopping ban, I want to say. That sounds familiar. When did you launch the podcast? Like, I have to check let me just check i'm gonna check on itunes right now i'm gonna say 20 is it's 2018 right now and your episode the shopping ban with k Flanders. Oh my gosh. June 3rd, 2015. What? Yeah. So I was just about done then. Wow. Yeah. I remember you're getting, and you were like, I don't know what I'm going to do after this. I remember you talking about that. Um, and then I did it for another year and then you're like, I can still just do it again. I'll just carry on. This is so much fun. I'll just do it again. Yeah, it was so much fun. During that period, actually, I don't know, were you preparing, like, did you already know about

possibly writing a book or was that, no, that wasn't at all a thing yet? No, it was so, um, yeah, that was like a complete whirlwind. So we are like, I finished the first year of the shopping van and I did this interview with someone who I knew, um, who wrote for Forbes.com. Oh yeah. And so there was this thing about it, I think because I knew Laura that it just didn't feel like a big thing. Yeah. Like, you know, like it's, it's great to have a feature on like another website, but I didn't realize that it might be a big thing. And then the morning it came out, she sent me an email and was like, Hey Kate, just wanted to let you know, this is live. And he just an FYI, these things have a tendency to go viral. And I was just like, oh, really? Okay.

Little old me? What? So I just, yeah, I didn't even know that that would happen. Like that the article would get a lot of attention. Um, but then within two weeks of that article coming out, I got contacted by six different literary agents. Holy jazz. And I had, like, I didn't know what to do with that. Yeah, that's crazy. Yeah, it felt like this, like, incredible honor.

Like, I was so just excited at the thought that someone would want to work with me. But I also, I had never, I had no intention of like writing a book about that and I didn't know how you how to pick somebody like how do you pick a literary agent I was and if you pick one does that mean you're basically saying no to all the others and they'll never want to talk to you again well you're definitely saying no to them and then it's like a question like I didn't know how to pick because this is also a person you're definitely saying no to them. And then it's like a question, like, I didn't know how to pick because this is also a person you're getting into like a pretty, it's a business relationship, but it's also a pretty intimate relationship. You're going to work together a lot in the,

like before your book actually becomes a book deal or hopefully a book deal. So yeah, I was super overwhelmed and just got some really great advice from a friend who had an agent. He's another Canadian author and he had an agent in New York because that was even actually just a big question I had was everyone was in New York. And I'm like, I'm like from little BC, Canada. And so, yeah. So, no, I had questions from him or like he helped a bit and then he ended up connecting me with his agent. And she gave me amazing advice about how to sort of interview these other agents. And then said, and if you don't like any of them, I would work with you.

So I'm like, all right, now I have seven options. So the overwhelm continued. I did talk to everyone, eventually made the decision that I actually just wanted to work with her. She was such like a straight shooter and it was something that I appreciate as a straight shooter. And yeah, so I ended up working with her and, but I, I never knew any of that was going to happen. But I know just cause you are a really good writer, like you are, that this is probably, it's been something that you've always wanted to do, write a book. I mean, that's kind of, we all dream. Yeah. I think

like, even just like as a little kid, always wanted to, like, I didn't have like hobbies as a kid. I read books. Yeah. I wasn't good at any sports. I remember trying things, but like, I just wasn't good at it. And, but I was like, I was good at reading. So I was always like an avid reader as a kid. And yeah, you have like thoughts of, oh, it'd be so cool to like go to a bookstore and see a book with your name on it. I know. So I don't know. I think like it always seemed cool,

but still, I mean, like even with the blog, I never thought having a blog would later mean I could have a book. I just never thought of that. You just write. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Have you done the thing where you've gone to a bookstore and just like walked by your book and be like, that's me. Did you, I would absolutely be that person where I just like tap someone that's looking at it be like that's me that's amazing I haven't had that but um actually what's been in like a little bit kind of just like sad or frustrating is that um people keep messaging me saying like oh I've like gone into Indigo and they're all sold out and like at local stores and they're all sold out.

And everyone's like, congratulations. And I'm like, no, it's actually a really big mess up that seems to have happened where Indigo hasn't gotten any of their orders. Oh no. Yeah. So it's been sort of like a, just a big hiccup in the whole thing so I did um like what's been

interesting is that I've been into some little stores and seen it there and so that's pretty cool and I've had friends like all over Canada and the states and like other places but send pictures of them seeing it at stores yeah um so yeah so it's like my friends have seen it yeah I've seen it at two stores so far it's definitely online though like is it on indigo online it is although I mean just saying this as of today um it seems like they are out of stock even online so amazon.ca for Canadians is definitely the place to go um and it's on Audible, which is great. Oh, yeah. Oh, my gosh. That reminds me. I haven't even. Oh, my gosh, I should. I should listen to the audio book. Oh, my gosh. How cool would that be? Listening to hours and hours of you.

Well, it is me. It is my voice, which is a really, really cool experience. Totally. voice, which was a really, really cool experience. I like, um, fun fact, unless you have done this before, um, you have to audition to do your audio book. Yeah. And that would be kind of soul crushing if they're like, not a good fit. And you're like, but I, it's my words though. Actually, you are not good at this, but you uh nailed your interview I did yeah and I was um it was really important to me that it was my voice especially because the book is a memoir it was very important to me that it was in my voice and not not read by someone else I know that some people also like some authors just don't want to do it but for me it was really important

that it was my voice even though I'm like I have no qualms about the fact that like, my voice is not amazing. But I was just like, it's, I think it's, you know, you, you know, which words to enunciate and what, what feelings you were experiencing in those moments. And I think that that needs to come across and only the actual author could, could do the best job of that. Totally, totally. Okay. Let's dive deep into your book. As I told you, I literally like read it in basically a day, like a night and an afternoon. I just whipped through it. And it's crazy because it's like, even though I know you, I clearly did not know everything in this little book. I did not know a lot of your backstory. So I thought it was very interesting. And some of the things I remember

you mentioned to me that you were going through. And so it was nice. It was interesting to have that different perspective because I'm like, oh, I remember, you know, we were chatting about this and then it kind of made its way into the book. Like some of your adventures, sometimes you said, oh, I'm going to this friend's wedding. And I'm like, oh, that made it in the book. I'm like, that was really, really cool. I guess my first question is, I really enjoyed how it was broken down into all the months of the shopping ban. I thought that was a really interesting way to organize it and kind of propelled it forward. Was that always your kind of intention to kind of, I just, I thought it was very interesting how you balanced the importance of the shopping ban and the effect it had on your life and then just like your life

story and just like the ups and downs. I think that, well, the first answer to that is that no, it wasn't my exact intention. My agent, like hands down, I picked the best agent to work with because she was so great at just like kind of bringing me back to how you outline a book. Yeah. I think that I really had, I mean, writing a book proposal, it was my first time ever doing it. And it's so different than writing a blog post. Yes. Like blogs are so different. And it was, it was challenging, but like a really good and kind of exciting challenge because blogging, like I write longer blog posts typically. So, but still like you present a problem and then, you know, share some stories and offer a solution all within like 1500 to 2500 words. Yeah. And with a book, it's like, well, you can't start solving the problem

to like word 50,000. You just have to tell a whole lot of stories and maybe offer some like tidbits of information, like you can't solve the problem until you're at the end yeah and you're like oh okay so it was pretty challenging so that wasn't quite my original intention but she was really great at just saying like I did a good job actually on the blog when I was going through that experiment of um writing either monthly or um an update every two months at least. She was like, all the information is there. It just makes sense. Think about what those themes might be if you did it in that way.

And I just happened to have like a lot of stories and examples already in the blog that could help me come up with the theme kind of for each month. And then so based on those themes, then I was able to bring in stories from my past as well of why it's not surprising I learned some of the hard lessons I did based on past behaviors or just, you know, ways I was brought up or whatever. So it wasn't my exact intention. I felt very good about like the end result, the just kind of the timeline of it. Like the timeline is the shopping ban. It's like a July to June of one year, but then yeah, lots of stuff woven throughout it. Yeah. Yeah. No, I really, I really liked it. It just made it more because I was kind of like,

oh, is it going to be a how-to book or a memoir? And I'm glad you went with the memoir because personally for me, I mean, that's how I kind of structured the podcast. It's not just like, tell me your five tips about blah, blah, blah. I don't care. No one cares. Tell me your story. Tell me your story and we'll find the tips in between because I feel like that's how I digest information best. And I think a lot more people do too, is by learning from other people's experiences and identifying with some of those experiences as well. I'm sure so many people have read this, no matter how similar their story is or not, there's definitely something in there for everybody that they're like, oh yeah,

I've been there or I did that or yeah, totally, totally. And that was really important to me too, to write it as a memoir. I did always know I wanted to do that versus like a how-to or a strict self-help book because number one, I just like wanted to write something I read. I read memoirs all the time. I love them. So I was like, it just like, I want to be in that category. That's, that's what I read the most. So that's what I would enjoy writing the most. But it was important to me too, because it's not like I could write a how to book or I could write more technical writing, but it's not my natural voice. And then in saying all of that, it's been kind of funny because like, there's obviously negative feedback with any book you write. And then in saying all of that, it's been kind of funny because like,

there's obviously negative feedback with any book you write. And it's the same way, like any blog post you write, like only some people will like it or whatever. So there's obviously been some negative criticism and, but it's funny because the majority of them are like it's just a memoir like yeah what section did you buy it in idiot it's not like how to do a year of less totally like the description literally says like kate's story kate's lessons kate's everything so yeah i just think it's someone wrote like just a memoir and then gave it a one star review like those two things don't even align though. Like, it's just like, it's a memoir. So I'm giving it a negative review. It's like, no. And to be fair though,

like you do have like some of the how to's at the end, like you actually have a guide. So they should have just flipped to the end. That's why you should, can you comment back? And we were just like, you know, just flip to page, page you know and you'll be okay yeah and it's totally fine i mean i knew especially actually too with writing a memoir that they can get a lot of um negative feedback it's just kind of part of it where yeah people will say like oh memoirs are only self-serving or this person thinks that they're so amazing or whatever. Oh my gosh.

Nope. I am like you actually. I've just always believed. And that's why I've always written my blog this way that we learn a lot from just other people's stories and sharing stories of all the things we're going through in life. So for me, it just thought like it was helpful really for me to write it all out in that way yeah and then yeah hopefully I mean there's not going to be something maybe that you or you might not identify with one part of it but I do think that there is a little bit of something that a lot of people could identify with so it was yeah I was very um it's like funny I've been realizing I don't have many boundaries in life, or like,

I'm learning to create better boundaries for myself. But I always had it with the book, I knew I wanted it to be a memoir. No, I'm and I'm glad. So speaking of that, there are a lot of very personal stories that you included in the book. Why did you I guess, it was it hard to really go that deep with, of the things from your childhood with dealing with sobriety? Why did you really want to make sure you included that in the book? Because I know you didn't blog about lots of these things because you wanted to maybe keep those private or you wanted to focus on, you know, your blog is really about, you know, personal finance and other aspects. Why did you really want to make sure those were part of the book I think that in a way like I had to I think that I mean so in the book it's like yeah we're talking about consumption maybe of objects spending money things like that but to me I've

been really looking at consumption as a whole so So all the things we're consuming, I think that when you talk about like, or I don't know, I just think we all need to recognize maybe that as a whole, like human beings, we are consumers, we are constantly consuming, whether it is what we eat and drink, what we spend our money on and bring into our home. Even honestly, like the media we watch, or how much media we watch, how much time we're spending on social media as another one, like consuming stuff all the time. And so I think it was just important for me and for the book to not just talk about shopping, like talking about consumption tendencies as a whole. And also because, I mean, it's always in kind of retrospect or in hindsight,

like you can look back, but I was able to realize some things like, you know, for, from my teens and most of my twenties, or at least the first seven years of my twenties, I think that I use drinking as a coping mechanism for a lot of things. And then it's not that surprising to me now that once I couldn't drink, I then spent money. Yeah. Like it's very related. Yeah. And it's not that surprising. Like it was like I lost one coping mechanism and well, what's my next one? Yeah. And then even, and this isn't in the book or anything, but then it's actually not that surprising to me that after the shopping ban, like after the second year, it didn't take that long for me to then realize I probably needed some therapy actually. Yeah. Therapy would be really helpful for me because I'm kind of out of coping mechanisms. I don't have anything anymore. Yeah.

Like I can't rely on something to sort of get me through a hard time or even a bad day or even like to treat yourself or whatever. Like I couldn't quickly reach for anything anymore. So I just think it was really important to talk about consumption tendencies as a whole, because realizing that, yeah, just like that, like removing one just meant I took on another. And the shopping ban was a really a huge way for me to realize that the biggest problem was I was never dealing with what was really going on in my life. I never dealt with anything. And that's why I was just reaching for other things. And there was bigger stuff that needed to be worked on. Yeah. And that's probably I feel like people listening or people that will read your book.

I mean, especially there's definitely points where I was reading, I'm like, huh, okay. I feel like, yeah, in this part of my life, that's probably why I did overeat. I shopped too much. I mean, you know, it had to do with my mental state. And I think we really need to, you know, talk more about, you know, personal finance isn't just about money. It's really about the mental state you're in and why you're doing these things. Like I can look back now a year ago or over a year ago when I was thinking about leaving my job and I was in a really dark, depressed state. And I overate, I overdrank, I overspent. And it's because I was then, you know, then in retrospect, you're like, oh, I know why I did all that. I know I was consuming like a crazy person. I was trying to make myself feel better but really it wasn't ever um you know actually attacking the problem yeah it makes sense and I remember when you like we sort of talked about it a little bit at that time because you were still self-aware I remember you were like I totally just bought something because I'm having a bad day yeah and. And like stupid stuff. I'm like, I just bought like 12 soaps. They're on sale, but I don't need 12. Three years supply. It actually did last me like

almost a year. Like it was like those soap pumps that you can get from bath and body works or whatever it's called. But still, I didn't need to get two bags of soap oh gosh yeah um well I guess talking kind of more about that what do you feel like was one of the hardest things that you put in the book and you're like you know it's important but it was still really hard to put in there and be vulnerable that way um I mean well it's funny I would say that year the hardest thing I went through was my parents divorce and that was really hard to write about but honestly the hardest stuff to write about was um about not just so I talk about breaking up with someone that year having a relationship end and that was hard but what was harder was to talk about a relationship I was in in my early 20s yeah that was really um

just toxic and like just we were not we were not nice to each other but there was a lot of abuse and I think I did a good job of sort of not saying too much or revealing too much that maybe wasn't actually relevant to the book but that was also hard like I hadn't thought about a lot of that stuff in a long time um to bring up memories that yeah you just like you do want to like kind of wrap it up in a box and store it away and never bring it out and look at that stuff again. So that was probably the hardest thing to write about in the whole book. And I've had a few people, women who have emailed me and said that they're, they're only one of them has told me which part and it was that part, but they said like, there was a part of

your book that was so uncomfortable for me to even read but because it brought up things for relationships they had been in ah um yeah so I'm I hope that I like I can only speak for myself but I hope that I don't know just like talking about that even a little bit was helpful for some others. Absolutely. And yeah, that was definitely the hardest part to write though. Yeah. That, yeah, it was, yeah. It was hard for me to read too. Cause I'm like, oh, okay. I don't want, like, it's hard hearing, you know, I mean, this was way before I knew you, of course, but yeah, it's, you never want to hear about someone being hurt when they're such an awesome person. But I am glad you put in that because I think that's an important part of your story to tell.

And also, I feel like that kind of situation is probably a lot more prevalent than we all think. A lot of people go through it and they never talk about it because they're ashamed. And they do want to wrap it in a box and never talk about it. But I think it's helpful when you know other people have gone through it because then you know you can speak up, you can ask for help, you can go see, you know, a counselor, get some more tools to kind of help yourself. I think that's very, very important. So I'm glad you put that in there. Well, and just to add to that, I think that it was also hard to write because now I feel like a very, just much more confident and definitely independent. And so it's like hard to write because now I feel like a very just much more confident and definitely independent and so it's like hard to look back and think that I let myself be in that situation

but it that is what life was like for me at that point and I also think it um was important in the sense too that it just shows like that is another example of why I'll say like my self-worth was lower than I wish it had been which also then causes people or definitely caused me to buy the wrong things and to consume the wrong things like when your self-worth is that low then you just don't don't know how to make the best decisions for you because you don't really even know who you are, like what the great things about you are already. So I just think it was, yeah, it was important for all kinds of reasons. And I'm glad I went through the emotional stuff it took to actually write it out. Yeah, that cannot be easy. So you mentioned self-worth. How were you able to build up your

self-worth to where you are today? I would say a whole bunch of ways. I think like if I look back at who I was even like five or six years ago, I just really didn't have a lot of confidence. So I think like you and I have privately talked a little bit about building confidence and ways to do that. I think, excuse me, I think that one of the ways to do that or one of the ways that helped me was I remember going back to school and doing it, number one, because I wanted to. It didn't matter like what anyone else thought. I wanted to finish my degree and that was really important to me. And it was, I don't know, it was like a challenge. I think whenever I've challenged myself, I've learned something about myself. And so it was a challenge to go back to school. I mean, managing it all was a challenge on its own. I was like working full-time, basically a full-time

student and that I was taking like two to three online courses at a time. Wow. Um, and I was writing my blog, like I was doing a lot. Um, so I think like going back to school was one, um, writing my blog even and maintaining my blog because it's again just a challenge like I've it's work like to maintain a blog for seven years is work yeah um and so like even just doing that um challenging myself even like to be I don't know just like do more things that um interest me like not just again it's the like not worrying about what other people would want you to do. And I think that that was something that I used to just do a lot of. I really cared about what other people thought. And so I would kind of say yes to whatever anyone else wanted.

And so for the first time, you know, like finally signing up for things I wanted to do. And then just things like, there's no doubt that kind of challenging myself like years ago to pay off my debt. It wasn't about the numbers. Like I don't, I don't, that would be a vanity metric. I don't have any like, like, oh, I'm because I have X amount in savings or anything like that has nothing to do with my self-worth. But like, I challenged myself to pay off my debt andworth, but like I challenged myself to pay off my debt and I did it. I challenged myself to do the shopping ban. Like, was it perfect or whatever? Like, no, but I did it. Exactly. And, um, yeah. So I think just really it's challenging

myself. Like you're getting slightly outside of your comfort zone. Um, and just seeing what you can do. I think it just, cause each time you do it, you either gain a skill or you learn about a quality of yourself that you didn't even realize you had. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Well, I know you can relate to that even just with like public speaking and with the podcast, I'm sure. Yeah. It's like every thing that I've challenged myself to do has been the most terrifying thing up until the point that I actually do it. And then you're like, oh my gosh, it's not the end of the world. This isn't the biggest deal. A bunch of people aren't behind me ready to say boo.

It's fine. And it's literally like, I say this to everybody, it's like, if I can do it, because I literally used to be the most shy, introverted, low self-esteem person, you know, in the world almost in my mind. If I can do all these different things, there's no – it's just because of choice. I just made different choices. I just started small and kind of built up from there. And, yeah, it's hard putting yourself out there because you do put yourself out there to critics, but also the community, the friendships, the relationships that you can gain is so, it just, you know, it makes those critics, you know, not even important. Absolutely. I think, well, number one, Carrie and I have talked about that

a lot before, just the idea that like, sometimes people will look at us and say things like, oh, like you've taken all these huge leaps or in like, no, like number one, everything we do that might look big, it has started very small. Yeah. And it is a very calculated risk. Like I remember even like quitting my job. Some people might have been like, oh, that's like terrifying. I'm like, I mean, I had a healthy amount of fear with it, but but it was a very calculated risk I took a lot of time crunched a lot of numbers lined up a lot of work like I had to feel feel like I I was going to be okay if I did that

yeah um so it wasn't like a giant leap yeah um and but yeah I mean I and my friend or our friend Sarah Peterson and I have talked about that too. We sort of have said that it's this idea that like every small change you make pays compound interest. I like that. So like one small change then gives you the confidence to try to change another thing or it might just naturally change life in a more positive way.

An opportunity may come your way that wouldn't have if you hadn't done that one thing differently. Yeah. Yeah. So no, I think the confidence stuff is still something I'm working on in some ways. Like I feel, I feel okay about some of the things I've done. I truly do feel like no, I mean, like not no, no critical responses or reviews of the book would upset me. I think maybe they would. But I think that I walked into it and published it very much knowing that, you know, I wrote it for me. And if it helps some people, great. And that's good enough. Like you can't help everyone. And some people just want to hate you because they hate you. Right. So that's okay. And it doesn't matter. Reading things too, like a lot of what

Brene Brown has written has really helped me just build that confidence or just like coming to decisions. Like it's okay. If someone doesn't like it, like, yeah. And why it's kind of okay. And as long as like my family and friends feel like I did them right. Then that's, that's the most important thing to me. Totally. So yeah, the confidence it's still, I mean, I'll always be a working. I think a lifelong that's like, it's funny. I feel like that topic to confidence, empowerment, especially being a woman in confidence and women in personal finance and how confidence really is a big factor in why lots of women are afraid to invest their money or do different things with their money.

It's become really, I don't know, trendy or not trendy, but I don't know, prevalent, I suppose. And I think it's just because as we all talk to each other, we all realize, oh my gosh, we all have confidence issues. We should talk about this more and help each other. Because the more you talk about it, the more you're like, oh, I'm not alone. I think that's the biggest thing too. It's like, that's what I really liked about your book. I felt like you went through this and I know so many other people have, I know I've gone through similar experiences while we're not alone. We're all together in this. I don't know if I can add any more to that. Sorry. Yeah, I know. Right. Uh, before I let you go, um, oh gosh, there's so many other questions. Could I, but you you know what i'm going to save some of

those for uh the book club book club um so i guess before i let you go what is well what are i guess what are some of your next steps what are you you've accomplished this huge thing i know you and me have also talked about it's kind of weird accomplishing such a big thing that you're like now what have you what are some of the thing that you're like, now what? What are some of the things that you would like to, big or small, that you would like to do now? Now that you're a published author, you've tackled this big thing. I know you've been working on this for a couple of years now, really. Yeah, like a year and a half.

I mean, the traditional book publishing process is interesting for that. We signed a deal in July of 2016 and the book came out in January, 2018. So it's a long process to go through. I feel like I'm excited for the next few months to do, try to set up some like speaking events, like just a bit of a book tour. I haven't planned the stuff in the states quite yet or like as of when this will come out but definitely have some stuff in the works like across Canada which is awesome yeah um I'm going to take a vacation in May yeah you deserve it I have booked a flight to London I'm going to the UK. I at the moment haven't booked a return ticket,

not because I'm staying forever, but because I kind of want to see how much I can save first and how long I could stay. I'd love to stay for a month. Yeah. I mean, I have, my family is from England or my dad's family is from England. So I just have this real desire to kind of like hang out there. And I want to see Wales too. That's where my grandparents retired. Um, I'd like to go up to Scotland. I really want to go to Ireland. Like I kind of just see myself hanging out. So those are hanging out for megan markle and harry's wedding

you know i will be in london on that day which is wild that is wild that's so funny yeah well you deserve a much needed vacation and uh trip and uh yeah i i highly recommend this book to to everyone and i tell i'm like i'm not just saying that because i'm a friend if i hated it i wouldn't have you on the podcast i'd be like i'm busy um thanks again before uh you sign off where can people find more info about this book and grab a copy yeah um well i hang out out at Kate Flanders.com. I mean,

they'll be able to see it on the, I guess Kate's not spelled K A T E. So yeah. K A no C A I T. Oh my God. Flanders.com. And there's stuff about the book there. And then just in general,

I hang out on Instagram more than anywhere else. And that's just at Kate Flanders.anders it's good instagram hiking all the time i just love hanging out there yeah it looks nice one day i might join you but maybe not probably not i just don't like Or like exercise. It's so funny. Yeah, it's true. It's true. Anyways, thanks for taking the time to chat with me, friend. No, this is great. Thanks.

And that was episode 144 with the fabulous Kate Flanders. Make sure to grab a copy of her new book, The Year of Less. Again, it's best to grab your copy online. Amazon is a great place. And if you've already read it, especially this is like so, so important, I feel like especially for new authors. If you've read the book, and you loved it, make sure to do your part and give it a review on like Amazon, Goodreads, wherever you bought the book, just because I know it helps them, you know, just get the word out and stuff like that. So I know I've done that. I went on Amazon, gave my review, but Goodreads is

also another great place to, you know, let the author know what you thought, all that kind of stuff. So also, I'll, of course, put a bunch of information about the stuff that we talked about in the show notes for this episode, where you can check it out at jessicamorehouse.com slash 144. But before you leave, a couple of things I need to announce and share with you that you're not going to want to miss. But before I get to that, just a few words about this episode's sponsor. Support for this episode comes from Nest Wealth. Want to start investing for your future? Luckily, nowadays, it doesn't mean you have to make an appointment with some suit in an office. Actually, you don't even have to leave your house. Nest Wealth, Canada's first ever robo-advisor and the largest independent wealth management

platform in the country, provides a new way to invest your money. Offering index-based portfolios with lower fees and better historical performance than actively managed mutual funds. Nest Wealth is focused on building personalized portfolios to best fit the needs, risk tolerance, and financial goals of each and every client they serve. And Nest Wealth is currently offering All My Money podcast listeners three months free. To get started, visit learn.nestwealth.com slash Jessica Morehouse. Once again, that's learn.nestwealth.com slash Jessica Morehouse. And things I want to announce. I mentioned at the beginning of this episode that I did a book club with Kate. We did online on Facebook. The replay can be watched on my Facebook page, facebook.com slash Jessica I. Morehouse or my YouTube channel. Just go to jessicamorehouse.com slash YouTube. It'll take you right there. And I will be announcing what book we're going to be reading next, which guest, which author I'm going to have with me next time.

But to make sure you get notified, make sure you're on my email list or just go to jessicamorehouse.com slash book club. Some more information about book club in case you're interested. Speaking of my email list, this or last week, rather, I emailed everyone on my weekly newsletter list some very important special info that they got to know first before anybody else because they're on my list. So, you know, get on there. But the things that I've revealed to them exclusively, I'm going to reveal to you now. So, number one is, you know, I've mentioned a couple times, you know, I'm going to eventually open up my kind of financial

counseling practice. And yeah, the time is now. The time is now. I finished my financial counseling program. I am now a fully accredited financial counselor in Canada. And I've been helping a few clients privately, but now I'm kind of opening it up in case anyone listening, uh, is looking for that kind of thing. If you're now, this is definitely, um, you know, very specific thing. I am not a financial advisor. I'm not a CFP. Um, I'm not, uh, you know, going to help you with investments.

A financial counseling is very similar to, I guess, a money coaching, um, except there is a very specific kind of education and programming. So it's basically very similar to a normal counselor, except we talk specifically about your finances and how that integrates with your life, things that you're struggling with, you need guidance on. So anyways, if you're interested to know more, if you want to see if this does make sense for you, you can sign up for a discovery call with me for free. 15 minutes, chat with me on the phone. Just go to jessicamorehouse.com slash discovery call and you can book a time slot with me and check it out. Now I am only opening this up for a limited time just because as much as I

am so excited to be opening this up, I have a lot of different elements of my business. This is just one of them. So I will be kind of only accepting a certain number of clients per year. But right now, it's fully open. So take this opportunity to sign up for a discovery call. See if it makes sense for what you're looking for. JessicaMorales.com slash discovery call. After that, some very exciting news. I will soon be launching the website I've been working really, really hard on for Rich and Fit. So you may know that the Rich and Fit Bootcamp is now an evergreen course. You can sign up at any time and get your finances, your fitness in order. Join me and Jacqueline Phillips, the fitness coach and my business partner to whip your money and body

into shape in six weeks. Now, most of the feedback that I've been getting too is, you know, that sounds great, but sometimes I just want to do one or the other one after the other. So we are working on our website. We are also working on splitting the bootcamp into two, just a financial course and a fitness course. So you can choose one and then the other or whatever you like. So that is coming. And I will share when the website is live and all that information is live in a future episode. But hoping that everything will be ready to go end of February, March. That's maybe some hopeful

thinking. But yeah, that's the plan. All right. Right now, as promised, I'm going to do some more shout outs. I've been getting a lot of awesome reviews for the podcast. And I want to say my thank you to all y'all who've given me a review by doing some special shout outs starting right now. All right. First review is from Jay Barshop from the US of A. Jessica and her guests share actionable and inspiring lessons on how to become a better investor and more importantly, a better overall person. Ooh. Highly recommend listening and subscribing to the Mo Money podcast if you want the knowledge and mindsets to reach your overall business goals and achieve financial freedom as a result. Well, thank you so much for that lovely review, Jay Barshop. Next, I've got

from Timber Chick from Canada. Great info on the basics plus a bit more. Perfect for those of us who know they need to learn more about money and financing. Awesome. Thank you so much for that review, Timberchick. After that, I've got Laptop Lynn from the USA. Glad Carson sent me over to listen, new fan. Well, yeah, I'm glad Carson, whoever Carson is, sent you over too. Thanks, Carson. You're great. And thank you, Laptop Lynn. Jigs J12 from USA. They say, checked out the real estate pod with Penelope Grant. Spot on stuff. Keep it up. Yeah, that's a great episode, especially for anyone who wants more info about mortgages and shopping around for a home. She knows her stuff. So there you go. I'll do a couple more. YankeeGal98 from the USA says, ha ha. Love the interview

about quitting the nine to five. Totally agree. As long as you're prepared for it. Absolutely. And I think she's talking about the, uh, one that I have with, uh, uh, Jill from screw the nine to five that Jill's amazing. She's the best. Um, okay. One more before I let y'all go. Jay Yen from Canada says, I love that this podcast covers so many topics, but all super relatable. Thanks, Jessica, for doing this amazing podcast. Well, thank you for being an amazing listener.

I thank everyone who has submitted a review to me. Thank you so, so, so, so much. It makes, you know, it's the icing on the cake that is this podcast. So I will be back here tomorrow because I have a listener series episode for you guys. So I will stop yabbering. I will see you tomorrow and have a great rest of your day. this podcast is distributed by the women in media podcast network