More Money Podcast - 210 How to Become a Master Networker - AJ Harbinger, CEO & Co-Founder at The Art of Charm

Episode Date: October 23, 2019

You may not know this about me, but I’m actually a huge introvert that used to be terrible at networking, or heck, even making new friends! I would get anxious, nervous and would never know how to start or end a conversation. But, I knew that networking and being a good conversationalist was a key component to advancing in life. Your network is your net worth as AJ Harbinger says, and since he’s the CEO and co-founder of The Art of Charm…he would know! In this episode, we dive deep into what we all should know about having the right social skills to help us advance in our social lives, relationships and of course career. I know for a fact that because I started practicing and just putting an effort into socializing more, that’s why I’ve now got a fairly large network of friends, acquaintances and work-related connections all over the world. If you know this is something that’s been holding you back from reaching your full potential, luckily this is a learned skill that anyone can master, and you can start today by listening to this episode and then binging The Art of Charm podcast as well. Visit jessicamoorhouse.com/contests to enter to win a copy of a book featured on Season 9 of the podcast! In-Person Bootcamps AJ mentioned on the show that he hosts personal bootcamps all over the world to help people level-up their social and networking skills. If this sounds up your alley, learn more at: https://theartofcharm.com/personal-bootcamp-2 Take the Social Skills Challenge Join over 50,000 others to learn how to make a great first impression, easily make new friends, and feel confident in any social situation! Sign up to take The Art of Charm’s fee 10-day social skills challenge. Learn more at: https://challenge.theartofcharm.com/begin For full episode show notes, visit: https://jessicamoorhouse.com/210 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello, hello, hello, and welcome back to the Mo Money Podcast. This is episode 210. I am your host, Jessica Morehouse, and I am excited that you're with me for this episode because it's honestly one of my favorite interviews I have done thus far and on a very different topic than I would normally do. Obviously, this show is about money, it's about personal finance first and foremost, but I also love to dive into other kind of topics adjacent to personal finance and success and entrepreneurship. And for this episode, I'm going to be talking about networking because, well, if you've read as many business books or success books or self-help books as I have, you will know that one of the key elements to grow as a person, to succeed in your career, to also, you know,

just look at all of the kind of wealthiest people in the world. What do they have? They have a network. They have people. You cannot become successful or get a lot of money on your own. Doesn't work like that. It's impossible. You need to have a good social skills, quite honestly. And I know a lot of us need a little help in that department, which is why I have AJ Harbinger on the show. You may recognize him because he's also a super popular podcaster. He is the podcaster behind the Art of Charm podcast. It's been around for 12 years and he is, he has so many amazing truth bombs and just suggestions and advice. And quite honestly, I think part of the reason I had him on the show is because I know social skills aren't my forte. It is something that's taken me

probably a lot longer than most people to really get ahold of. I'm an introvert. I can be shy. I get social anxiety. Um, you know, I, I, but I worked through it and I've made a ton of progress, honestly, in the past 10 years, quite honestly, from like 20, I'm 33. So like from 23 to 33, it's like, I'm a different person. Most people, when they meet me, they're like, you're an introvert or like, what? I'm like, yeah, it's, it's, it's a lot of work, but I, I've put the work in and, you know, I've, I've studied how to be better socially at networking and going to events and conferences and all this kind of stuff. And so, uh, when I recorded this podcast, I had just come back from FinCon, which is a massive conference that I always mentioned on the show because I go almost every year. I think there's 2,500 people there this year, which is insane. And for me, I felt like it was a success for me because

it was the first time I'd been to that conference where A, I was alone. Usually, I kind of have a roommate, so kind of some backup. This year, I didn't. I was totally alone, but I held my own and I felt good and I actually had a good time. There's hardly any times where I'm just like wanting to run to my room and just hang out under my covers because I was just like, this is too much. I am like, huh, okay. So I think the more you do it, the more you practice, the better you get at it. And so anyways, we're going to talk about all of these really interesting, you know, thoughts and topics in this interview. You're going to absolutely freaking love it. But before I get to that, just a few words about this episode's

sponsor. Have you ever heard of the phrase, you don't know what you don't know? Well, the Great Courses Plus is the perfect place to help fill in those gaps. Learning doesn't stop with this online service. There are thousands of lectures on virtually any topic you can think of, even those you might not think of, all presented by top professors. Dive into Mediterranean cooking, yoga for deep relaxation, even learn to play chess. There's a whole world of history, knowledge, and ideas to explore, and The Great Courses Plus makes it easy to watch or listen anytime and anywhere. I've been learning so much from the course, the everyday gourmet baking pastries and desserts.

I'm a huge Bake Off TV fan, FYI. So I wanted to finally up my baking skills and actually learn the secrets of baking like a professional master pastry chef and find out how they make pie crust so flaky and delicious. So if you would like to expand your mind too, sign up for The Great Courses Plus. And right now, all Mo Money Podcast listeners get an entire month of unlimited access for free. To start your free month today, just go to thegreatcoursesplus.com slash Mo Money.

Once again, that's thegreatcoursesplus.com slash Mo Money to get one month free. Thanks, AJ, for joining me on the MoMoney. Once again, that's thegreatcoursesplus.com slash MoMoney to get one month free. Thanks, AJ, for joining me on the MoMoney podcast. I can't wait to chat with you. So I mentioned before I hit the record button. This interview is very timely because I literally just got back yesterday from a big conference that I've mentioned on the show before called FinCon, which is the big, nerdy personal finance conference that every kind of content creator in the personal finance community goes to. And this was my fourth one. And it was probably the best one I've been to because I knew what to expect and how to navigate it. But basically the whole conference, even though you have other sessions and you can learn,

the point for me anyway is to network and to meet new people and connect with old people. A lot of these people I just talked to online. So this is our kind of one time to connect. So I feel like we're going to have, I'm going to ask you some questions that I'm like, I've been thinking about all week. So it's so timely that I have you on the show to talk about like connection and networking and making relationships with people. I think this is amazing timing. But before we get to that, I would love for listeners to get to know you a little bit more. Your background is very interesting because it seems like this is what you do now, but this is not where you started

because you started actually in biology. Do you want to kind of go back and explain what happened? Yeah. Growing up, I was a bit of a nerd, loved science, and also suffered from some introversion and a little bit of social anxiety. And as I started my science career in graduate school, I really felt a little lost. And I felt like my social skills or lack thereof were holding me back from connecting with my lab mates, connecting with my boss. And because of that, I started to lose some confidence in myself and my abilities and actually deal with some imposter syndrome. And of course, being a scientist, I wanted to get to the bottom of what was going on with me. Why was I feeling this social anxiety? And why was I feeling like I

wasn't good enough? And as I started to do some research on social skills, I realized that there was a lot more to first impressions, conversation, and how to be interesting. And I really just dove headfirst into that, starting a podcast about 12 years ago that turned into a coaching company. That's amazing. I'll be honest, when I started doing a deep dive, because I've known about your podcast forever because it has been around for so long. But when you started doing deep dive about really all the teaching that you do, this is something that, well, A, I can obviously really relate to, but when you started doing deep dive about really all the teaching that you do, I, this is something that, well, I can obviously really relate to you, but I think everyone can,

especially like the term imposter syndrome. Every single person I feel like I meet, they tell me, oh, I'm dealing with imposter syndrome. Like welcome to the club. But I always growing up thought that you either were good at, you know, you were like an extrovert and those people were good at networking and talking to people, or you just didn't have it. You weren't good at it. I never really understood that it was actually a learned skill. Do you want to talk a little bit more about that? Because I feel like maybe people tell you that too. They're like, oh, I thought you're just either good at it or you're not good at it. Yeah. A lot of people think it either comes natural to you or not. When in actuality, the science shows it's based on experience. And sometimes

it's growing up a single child at home with both parents who work and you don't really socialize as much. Sometimes it's through school and not really getting those opportunities to socialize. For me, my dad was a single dad, so he was working pretty diligently. And I was growing up with my sister who's very extroverted, and I just couldn't really keep up with her. So I relied on her a little bit through high school to make some friends. But then when I got to college and especially in graduate school, I really felt that I just didn't have the social skills necessary to connect. And I saw all of these people, really successful people had this vast network of allies to help support them and mentors. And I just really felt lost.

And that's what sort of led down the pathway of, hey, how can I figure out how to be more social and just feel more comfortable in my skin, whether it's at a conference, which obviously in science, we did a lot of, whether it's public speaking, getting in front of the room, but ultimately just having better friendships and better relationships in my life. Yeah, no, that's very interesting. So I guess what was your, when you did want to start learning more about this? Cause I feel like even though this is something that I think everyone deals with or wants to get better at, I wouldn't necessarily know where to start my research or learn about that. Cause when you talk to people about that, no one really knows the answer. So

where did you start learning about how to be better in social situations when you feel like I don't actually have that skill set yet? Yeah. So for me, Google search led me to Dale Carnegie's famous book, how to win friends and influence people. And I picked it up and I couldn't put it down. I just found it was so fascinating to learn all of these ways to be more interesting, more appealing, and ultimately to really influence people. So that was the start of my journey. And then being in graduate school, I had access to a lot of peer-reviewed journals. So I could go online after work and start punching in some searches to figure out how do I build confidence? How do I overcome these insecurities that I have around socializing? And I want to mention something too,

or ask you something rather. You mentioned that you're more of an introvert. And I feel like a lot of people that I know in the personal finance sphere, they are certainly introverts. And lots of people think that if you're an introvert, it is hard, like that also means like shyness or you have a harder time of talking to new people.

But that's not really the case. I mean, I'm an introvert too. And I feel like I've definitely been able to develop my skillset in terms of like being able to go to a party alone and not have like a panic attack and talk to people. So do you want to talk a little bit about like, it's not, I think this is kind of a myth. We need to kind of get rid of this idea of if you're an extrovert, introvert, that has something to do with being good in social situations. Yeah. The way I like to think of it is if you're an extrovert and you go out and socialize, it supercharges you. You feel energized and excited. And if you're an introvert going out and socializing, going to that conference, FinCon, that wears you down. It taps into your battery and you feel drained. So for me as an introvert, even running these classes, I'm about to teach a class here in

Vienna. I know that I'm going to give it my all, but at the end of the week, I'm going to be exhausted. I'm going to want some alone time to just decompress. Whereas an extrovert really enjoys that and really uses that to fuel them. Yep. No, exactly. That's exactly how I feel after coming back from this conference and seeing people for like five days straight. I'm like, please don't talk to me. Don't talk to me. Besides you, I'm excited to talk to you, but everyone else, please don't talk to me for a good day.

I need to, yeah, get back into my little shell for a minute. Yeah. I often laugh with my fiance that when I come back from a conference, I just need some alone time. I'm sorry, I missed you, practice. That's definitely what I found as well. One of the things that you did was you would go to bars and just like practice talking to people. That sounds terrifying to me. I can never do that. How did you get the balls to do that? At first it was very terrifying. I'm not going to lie. And I was fortunate enough to have a good friend who was also interested in this area. So we started working on it together, going out and trying to try some of these things that we were reading about and seeing online to see what really worked for us. And unfortunately, a lot of the advice out there is just be yourself and oh, it'll come

naturally and just do more of it. And unfortunately, that does wear you down and be yourself if you're not sure of who you are, isn't the best advice in the world. So as I started to look into the research around, okay, what really goes into a first impression, we learned that, well, there's really four levels to that first impression. And your body language is a big component of this. And for a lot of us, when we're nervous, that's the first signal that gets sent out is our body language. We'll do some nervous things. We'll do weird things with our hands.

We'll lose our smile. Our expression will be more tense because we're just dealing with that stress and anxiety. So one of the first things we do in our week-long program is we actually film all of our students interacting so they could see for themselves what they look like with their body language, as well as then listen to the words and the conversation itself. Oh my gosh. I would love, I mean, I actually wouldn't love if someone filmed me, but I also am very curious to know what I actually look like. Cause I've never, you don't know, like, I don't know what I look like. You know, do I talk a lot? I know I talk a lot with my hands,

but I'm like, do I look confident? Do I look shy? Like, what do I look like? I think that's, that's kind of the same kind of, I think that you're doing is, you know, with like sports, you know, they, they film it so they can take a look, so they can improve, basically. Yeah, I've taken golf lessons. I've done public speaking training. And I've always found those moments where I'm filmed clarifies for me what's truly going on. Because we all have this movie in our head that's playing out. But until we actually see it from the other person's perspective,

it's difficult for us to course correct and change. And you mentioned something interesting too. And this is something I have experienced with some people that I've met at this conference I just came back from was some people I think aren't as aware of what their body language looks like or even their facial expressions. And there's some people where for me, because you're also trying to read people. So you're always on the other side of it too, trying to read like, what did they mean? Or what did they feel like if I'm just meeting them? Like, do they not interest in this conversation? Are they interested in this conversation? And there's a couple people where

they, you know, are apparently like, oh, that person, they're very extroverted. They're, you know, such a great time. And then you meet them one-on-one and you're like, man, they weren't smiling. And I feel like they hate me, but maybe that's just their face. It's hard to tell, right? How do you navigate like also trying to, when you're on the other side of it, because you're focusing on you, but also trying to figure out what's going on with the other person. Yeah. Well, one of the simplest things to do is to start to assume in the positive that you're already friends, which as you saw from, I believe you said this is your fifth FinCon, the fourth and fifth get a lot easier because there's familiar faces now. You've had those initial conversations. You're not in small talk anymore. And there's that sense of relief and comfort that allows you to be more of yourself instead of being that, you know, stiff, little awkward,

a little nervous and tense around how other people are viewing you. So for me, when I'm going to an event, I try to do a little bit of research before on who's going to be speaking, who I'd like to meet. And then when I walk up there, I make sure that I'm treating them like I treat my friends. So a nice, warm welcome, standing closer to them and not directly facing them, but actually being shoulder to shoulder breaks a lot of that tension that we're feeling with strangers. Oh, I like that. I like that you also have like a very specific game plan. I think that's what's helped me too. I learned that you don't want to not have something to say if someone does come up to you and introduce themselves and say, oh, hi, I'm so-and-so,

who are you and what do you do? If you don't have that answer, that story in your head ready to go, it can get awkward real fast. So it's definitely something that as nerdy as it sounds, it's like you do kind of have to do A, your research. Who's going to be there? Who will you maybe bump into? So you have some kind of talking points. And social media is actually really great for that because a lot of these, you know, people, maybe they don't really share their personal lives,

you know, on their podcast or their blog or whatever, but they do on their Facebook page. So that's how I, a lot of times like, Oh, I saw you just got married or something like that. But yeah,

no, I think that's really, really key. Yeah. Travel. All of these are things that people are posting about. Why? Because they want attention.

They want acceptance. They want appreciation for it. So social media is a great way before the event to see exactly what's going on in the people's lives that you're going to be meeting. Mm-hmm. Now, one thing that I have gotten better at, but I've actually heard from a lot of other people that now come up to me who recognize me or whatever whatever the case is the anxiety of actually approaching someone new. Like the first conference I've ever went to, I didn't do that because I was terrified of just what if they don't like me? Or what if I

forget what I'm going to say? Or what if I'm awkward? And so I had a terrible time because I didn't put myself out there. I learned from that obviously. But what do you say to people when they're like, I can't even like make that first move. I'm so scared to say hi to a stranger. So actually, this is going to be a little counterintuitive, but it's easiest to approach two people who are already in conversation at an event. Oh, that does sound scary, though. Like that's like a gang of people. That's interesting. I'd be I would have been really scared of that. But you say that's actually better than talking to a person solo. Well, let's think about why we go to these events, right? We go to these events to meet people. So

socializing is a big part of it. And I find that the people who are already socializing are warmed up and a lot easier to talk to than the people who are on their phone, nervous, and tense like me. So it's actually piggybacking off of that existing conversation and asking a simple question. How do you guys know each other? Or how'd you find out about this event? Or who are you interested in seeing talk? Those questions actually open up the conversation a little bit more to give you that window of opportunity. And typically in these event settings, people are trying to meet a lot of other people. So that actually provides an opportunity for one of those people in conversation to exit and go meet someone new. So counterintuitively, it's easier to meet the people who are already jovial and having a conversation than the person who's staring at their phone

just as tense as you are. Absolutely. Okay. Two things came to mind. First, finding like, it's, it is kind of like a difficult thing at first, finding the right time to jump in when there's two people talking and you're like, I don't want to interrupt them. I want to like join them. How do you find that right moment to not, you know, it's always like, do I, do I just stand here until they're done? You know? Yeah. And for me, eye contact is key. So what I'm going to do is I'm going to walk up and make sure that I make eye contact with both people. And typically in that scenario, one of them will make eye contact with me, letting me know, okay, now I can jump into the conversation. conversation, then they're probably not open to having a third person join. But in these networking event scenarios, I found that typically most people even in conversation are looking around the room to see, oh, is the keynote speaker here? Is that other person I really want to get to know here? So just by allowing yourself to engage them with some eye contact, you can very easily find that window to jump in the conversation. Yeah. And another one is, and this was something that

I found very difficult at first when I was just kind of practicing networking, how to exit naturally a conversation. Because you don't want to look rude. You don't want to be like, I'm done talking to you. I want to leave now. What are some just simple ways to exit without not seeming like I just don't want to talk to you anymore. I'd like to move on to somebody new. I do that naturally nicely. Yeah. The biggest thing is to simply compliment someone. And typically when you compliment them on their personality or what excited you about that conversation, you're leaving now at a high point. So they feel really good about themselves. And that provides a window for you to exit versus exiting at a low point where the other person's like, man, did I say something wrong?

Does AJ like me? I don't know how I'm being perceived. So really being like, well, it was so nice chatting with you. I'm so glad that you're doing so well. I see someone I know or something like just something like that. Yeah. And we want to really focus on their personality with that compliment, right? So it's like, man, I love the tenacity you put into building out this podcast and coming to

this conference over the last five years. It was great meeting you, shake their hand. And that's leaving that interaction on the high point. So they feel, oh, okay, AJ really enjoyed this conversation. And that provides an opportunity for you to go meet someone else. It sounds like don't overthink it. Sometimes it can be like, it was great meeting you. And that is goodbye. Yeah. And listen, we all know these natural signals. I think when we get them, we don't judge the other people as negatively on them either. But we always think that we're going to come across as a little awkward and forced. But again, people are going to these events to meet a lot of people. They're not going to these events to meet a lot of people.

They're not going to these events to expect to get in a four hour long conversation with you. That's true. But yeah, I used to be in those like very long conversations because I never knew how to exit. You're like, how do I leave? I don't know how to leave. When in doubt, you could just drink a lot of coffee and that provides a very easy opportunity for you to go to the bathroom. Yeah yeah i've got a couple things where i can't if i can't think of an easy way to just like exit nicely i say i've got to go to the bathroom or i have to go get something or just i make an excuse that i'm like there's something i need to do that has nothing to do with you but this is great bye-bye and then as you exit the bathroom, find someone else to talk to, like go a little further so they can't see you. So they don't know what's about them.

But yeah, that's, those are, yeah, simple. I think maybe for most of my life I've overcomplicated it, but it sounds like you've got a lot of very simple and effective tools. I want to talk a little bit about the events that you're doing because you're doing one right now. So you do bootcamps. I absolutely love this because I've personally never heard of boot camps specific to kind of the topics that we're talking about now. But these are skills that everyone needs. And a lot of us don't actually learn. And lots of us are bad at it, like into our 30s, 40s, 50s. So can you tell me like what inspired you to start these events? Well, a big part of it was feeling like my own network was holding me back, and I was

missing out on opportunities. And being frustrated that the only resources really available was an outdated book by Dale Carnegie and some other tips online. And putting myself into the fire, going out and trying this stuff over and over, I actually got pretty burned out in graduate school. I ended up dropping out of graduate school to start the podcast and ultimately start the coaching company. So I don't recommend if you're trying to learn this, you go out every night for a couple of years in a row and drop out of school. Instead, realizing that the right experience is what we

need. So when we take our clients in for the week, the first thing we do is just go over the skill set that it takes to naturally strike up conversation. As we talked about how to exit conversation, how to introduce two people to one another, how to pitch yourself so that if someone asks you what you do, you can actually say it succinctly and meaningfully. Then we also focus on, okay, what does it really mean to connect and be vulnerable, which is something that I think a lot of us struggle with as well. And then the third area is really just going out and getting practice repetitions, talking to people. So we'll strike up conversations with about 200 people over the course of a week. And we really feel like that

creates an experience that allows everyone through the program to not only learn the skills, practice the skills, but really hone the skills. So they become something they can implement when they get back home. That's amazing. And so, and you do ones that look like specific for men and specific for women. Is that right? Yes. So the programs are unisex. So, or sorry, single sex. So basically we have men only programs and women only programs. And we find that men have slightly different goals for the program than women. I think for men, they're really focused on approaching more people and extending their network and women approaching people is not necessarily their concern. It's more, how can I be taken more seriously? And how can I not be taken in a more sexual light or a more romantic light?

So the goals for the two groups are slightly different. And then we also do corporate training, which is co-ed, and those are shorter programs. But most of our guys have either some slight social anxiety or they just feel like their network isn't where they need it to be. And for a lot of us, that impacts our career. Whether it's moving into a new job, whether it's sales, or even whether it's building out a podcast, your network is going to be a very key component of your success. And of course, there are some guys who are looking for some help dating. Women, on the other hand, they're in a place in their career where they have to manage people.

And a lot of times that involves delivering good and bad news and they want to be taken more seriously. So we really hone in on how to have confident body language and how to present yourself in a manner that is taken seriously and confidently. No, that's awesome. That's interesting. I also too, coming from being a woman, yeah, I totally agree. We have different goals. And I used to always never really think that men had a problem talking or networking. Like there's a few that I've met in my life that have been like, oh, you're not very good at this. Or, oh, you feel kind of socially awkward. But I always, maybe it's just like the, this old way of thinking of

like, oh no, men are, men have way more confidence. Women have a harder time kind of building that up. But it's interesting to actually, you know, and learn more about you by listening to your podcast episodes. One thing that I really liked is like, oh, I'm not the only one who thinks like this. Actually, a lot of people are thinking like this. Yeah, unfortunately, technology has made it easier

for us to get distracted and not socialize, right? And in those moments where we're nervous at the event, the first thing we'll do is pull out our phone. And that's that little safety blanket that we had. And unfortunately, you do this enough times and your social skills start to atrophy. And that could be either sex. But the main reason we separate men and women in our programs is so that we can get really vulnerable and get to the core issues. And unfortunately, when we're in a scenario that's co-ed, a lot of times we won't speak our truth. We won't actually talk about our feelings because we're concerned about the way we're perceived in that environment. So we try to create a safe

environment to really tackle these issues head on and be more open and honest about why we're here in the program so we can really reach those goals together. Yeah. So I feel like we touched on this for a second, but one thing that is very prevalent is this idea of imposter syndrome. Have you found through your teachings and your coachings, this is something that people can overcome? It is just about learning some of the tools. Yeah. So a lot of what we teach is steeped in acceptance commitment therapy and understanding that your emotions are just your emotions and they don't need to be fused with who your identity is.

And we're always going to have those moments where we doubt ourself. And we're going to have those moments where we feel really confident and allowing you to put both of those into perspective and start to build some new beliefs around what you're capable of is how we really blunt that imposter syndrome feeling that a lot of our clients are dealing with. And on top of that, a big part of this is the more social we are, the more connected we are, the easier it is to talk about these things and get that support that we need. You know, when we are isolating ourselves and feeling a little bit lonely, well, man, that imposter syndrome is even worse.

So you could imagine in a situation where we're all together in a group and everyone in the room is like, you know what? I've also struggled with that. You feel less alone. Amazing. Well, thanks so much for taking the time to chat with me. There's so many great resources on your website. It's theartofcharm.com. So that's where people can find it out. And also, I guess that is where you would also put information for any of your upcoming live events as well. Absolutely. You can check out more around the bootcamp itself, theartofcharm.com slash bootcamp. Thank you so much for having me. I love sharing the knowledge that I've spent the last 12 years trying to implement myself to break through some of my own introversion and have some more fun when it comes

to meeting people. Yeah, no, absolutely. No, this is so timely and I think so helpful. So I really appreciate you taking the time to chat with me. Thank you for having me. And that was episode 210 of the moment podcast with the amazing AJ Harbinger. Make sure to check out his podcast, the art of charm podcast. You're not going to want to miss it. So many great episodes. I'm a big fan, obviously. That's why I have him on the show. Also check out his website, the art of charm.com. But also if you are interested in his free social skills challenge, because why wouldn't you be? Just go to the art of charm dot com slash challenge to check it out because it's free. And I think we all need a little help when it comes to our social skills. Let's be honest, if you're

listening and you're probably nodding along while you're listening. Yeah, that's why we're all in this together. We're all doing the same thing, but we can, of course, improve ourselves. Of course, make sure to go to the show notes for this episode, jessicamorehouse.com slash 210 is where you can find that. You can find show notes for every single episode that airs just by going to jessicamorehouse.com slash the number of the episode. You can find everything on my website or just go to jessicamorehouse.com slash podcast. You'll find every episode all laid out for you there, of course. I've got some very important things to share. So do not go away. Just want to share a few words about this episode's sponsor. When's the last time you learned something new?

And I'm not talking about some new skill for work or something you needed to know. When's the last time that you learned something that you've always wanted to know more about? Well, I'm almost certain that The Great Courses Plus probably has a course on whatever that may be. You see, The Great Courses Plus is an online education streaming service that hosts thousands of lectures on virtually any topic you can think of, even those you might not think of, all presented by top professors. Dive into money management, communication skills, even learn to play an instrument or how to meditate. There's a whole world of history, knowledge, and ideas to explore. And the Great Courses Plus app

makes it easy to watch or listen anytime, anywhere. I personally recommend checking out the course called Thinking Like an Economist, A Guide to Rational Decision Making. This course is excellent because economics is where human behavior meets money. Learning how economists think can help us optimize the personal and financial decisions we make by improving our understanding of our own motivations, as well as those around us. So go ahead, expand your mind and sign up for The Great Courses Plus. Plus right now, all Mo Money Podcast listeners can get an entire month of unlimited access for free. So start your free month today by using my special link, thegreatcoursesplus.com slash mo money. Once again, that's thegreatcoursesplus.com slash mo money. Okay, so if you are listening to this on October 23, when it's, you know, the day it

was released, and you also live in Toronto, well, if you were interested, uh, I am doing a free workshop at the Toronto public library, Pape Danforth branch called money management essentials for freelancers. Um, you can find information if you just, you're like, what does she say? I forgot. I didn't write it down. If you just go to Jessica morehouse.com slash community, that is where I list all of my events coming up. So make sure to check that out. It is free. You don't have to register. You can just show up, but I do have a link and it says what time actually, let me just tell you, let me just click on this link and tell you what time it's at 7.00 PM. That's okay. Wednesday, October 23rd at 7.00 PM at the Pape Danforth branch, Toronto

public library. I'll be there talking about money management essentials for freelancers. If you cannot make that, well, I'm giving another workshop the day after. It's called How to Become a Side Hustler because I love talking about side hustles. And it is going down October 24th at the College and Shaw branch of the Toronto Public Library. It is also happening at, oh, nope, sorry. It's happening at 6 30 PM. But again, just go to Jessica Morales.com slash community. There's links to both free just show up or, you know, you can call them to let them know that you're coming, but they don't do like an online registration. So that's why I feel like I've been getting a lot of messages being like, it's sold out. I'm like, it's never sold out. It's not sold out. It's like a free library chat. It's fine. So hopefully I can see some of you there. That would be lovely. I, of course, am doing my Millennial Money Meetup again. Intakes are

still available, but I doubt they will be for very much longer. They're selling out kind of fast, which, you know, why wouldn't they? It's so much fun. There's drinks, there's appetizers. There's going to be a panel discussion with myself, Rubina Ahmed-Hakou, who is one of my, you know, great favorite personal finance people and a special guest from Capital One who is sponsoring the event. It is going down on November 19th at Joey Inn Center in Toronto. So come, I mean, tickets are only $15. You get a ton of value for that. And also to make you feel good, I am donating 100% of ticket sale proceeds to the Toronto Foundation for Student Success because I did it last year where I donated all of the

ticket sales to a charity and it made me feel really awesome and good. Like I should do this for all of my events when I can. I mean, sometimes, you know, I'm breakeven, but if I make a profit, I'd like to donate ticket sales to a charity because, you know, why not? We all got to help each other. We all got to give back. And so there you go. You can feel good about coming to my event because you're also helping out a charity in need. So yeah, so hope to see you there. It'll be super, super fun. Now, another thing that I did a few weeks ago was I was part of a webinar that I did on like TD Direct Investing's webinar platform. They do webinars all the time. They invited me as a special guest. And we did one all about how to ramp up your

investor confidence, something that I think is a topic I love, love, love, love to talk about. If you were not able to watch the live webinar, that is okay. I actually now have the link so you can watch the replay. You do not have to be a customer of them or anything like that to watch it. It's totally free. Anyone can watch it. So if you want to check me out on there, I would say the easiest place to go is just go to jessicabarras.com slash community in the list of events. It will be in there as a webinar. So yeah, I think that is it for me at the minute, but there's always things I'm working on and I will of course share them all. If you're not on my email list, that is where I share everything all the time, every week. Just go to jessicamorris.com slash subscribe to get on there. But yeah, I'll see you. I'll see you when

I see you, which is next week on the podcast with a fresh new episode that you're going to love. All right. Have a good rest of your week. I'll see you next Wednesday. This podcast is distributed by the Women in Media Podcast Network. Find out more at womeninmedia.network.