More Money Podcast - 277 Finding Your Financial Joy - Ken Okoroafor, Founder and CEO of The Humble Penny and Financial Joy Academy

Episode Date: April 21, 2021

This week I have a first on the More Money Podcast…a guest from across the pond! In today’s episode, I welcome Ken Okoroafor, a first-generation immigrant from Lagos, Nigeria who at age 14 moved to the UK to start a new life. Ken is a trained Chartered Account with 15 years of experience working in both Asset Management and Venture Capital. In April 2020, he took the big leap to go full-time with his passion project turned business, The Humble Penny, which he started with his wife in 2017.  In today’s episode, we dive into The Humble Penny’s early beginnings and the whirlwind 18-month journey Ken has been on from starting The Humble Penny Youtube channel. Furthermore, we chat about his new platform, Financial Joy Academy, which seeks to help 10,000+ families achieve financial independence and money joy in their lives by 2030. Ken shares that his decision to step outside his comfort zone was the best thing he could’ve done for his business and his life. So, if you’re in need of some inspiration and a push to finally start that project you’ve been putting off then this is the episode for you. For full episode show notes visit Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello, hello, hello, and welcome back to the More Money Podcast. This is episode 277, and I'm your host, Jessica Morehouse. Welcome back to the show. I'm so excited. This is surprisingly, because I just said that I've done 276 episodes so far. This is 277. I have never had a guest from the UK on the show, which is, don't you think that's weird? Like that seems crazy to me. How has that happened? I don't know. It wasn't intentional. But luckily, I actually have two people from the UK that are going to be on the show. But for the first one, the kind of inaugural UK guest, I have someone I've been following on Instagram and YouTube for a while. I absolutely love what he's doing in the personal finance space and just love his way of sharing knowledge

and information about how to be financially independent and manage your money properly with just such a positive spin. Maybe it's his like lovely smile that just makes you feel so happy. But I love what he's doing. So I couldn't wait to have him on the show. And luckily, I got him. I got him. And of course, I'm talking about Ken Okorafor. He is the founder and CEO of the Humble Penny and the Financial Joy Academy platforms that he runs with his wife with the core missions of helping 10,000 families achieve financial independence and money joy in their lives this decade. So pretty cool, you know, kind of mission that he has with his platforms. So his work has been featured across so many media outlets, BBC, ITV, Financial Times, Sunday Times, The Guardian, Metro, just name them,

he's probably been on them. But what's really cool about his story, and he does share this in our interview, is just his origin story. So he began his life as a first generation immigrant from Lagos, which is in Nigeria, and started a new life in the UK, aged 14 with nothing at all. And then he started his career as a chartered accountant, which kind of makes sense how he kind of dived into the world of personal finance with his background, and working his way up through a successful 15-year career for multiple entrepreneurial businesses to become a CFO in the investment business. And then he took the big leap in April 2020, yes, very recently, to focus on the Humble Penny

full-time as a passion project. And he's been doing some amazing things ever since he took that big leap. So I can't wait to share that interview with you. But before I get to that interview with Ken, here's just a few words about this episode sponsor, which actually happens to meet me, I'm taking the spot. I, you know, always have some sort of external, you know, sponsor or advertiser for my episodes. And I'm like, you know what, I actually have something that I really want to share and make sure you hear and find out about because I know, you know, I do mention it usually at the end of an episode, but I know most people don't listen to the end of a podcast episodes. So says my husband,

because he says I never do. So I want to let you know, if you are unaware, I currently have a very new literally just launched a month and a half ago, investing course. So you may remember, I mean, if you've been a longtime listener of the podcast, I originally had a course called investing foundations for Canadians, I shut that down. And I believe December 2020, because I wanted to give it a huge overhaul, and then launched my wealth building blueprint for Canadians in February 2021. So it is basically the course that I wish existed when I was just learning about investing in my 20s, even in my late 20s, and was really trying to find answers to my questions. I just want someone to show me how to actually, you know, build my own

ETF portfolio. How do I rebalance that portfolio? Or should I use a robo-advisor? And what does that mean? Or what are some of the core things I need to know about investing and developing my own investment plan? These are things that I now know because I've had the podcast for almost six years. I'm working towards becoming a CFP. I've done the Canadian securities course. I've been teaching people about investing and personal finance and money management for years now. So finally, I was ready to package this in one comprehensive course so I can teach you, my wonderful podcast listener, how to do it. You can literally start this course with hardly any know-how when it comes to investing. I'm

going to walk you through it all. I'm going to talk about investment products, different investment accounts. So we are going to dive deep into registered accounts, unregistered accounts, taxes, all that kind of stuff, benchmarks, indexes, indexing, and diversification. All these buzzwords that you hear all the time on the show that you may or may not quite understand. I go through it in depth and really share. This is how you start investing if you want to invest in a passive way. So you can ultimately build your wealth. So if you want to learn more about my wealth building blueprint for Canadians course, of course, you can check out the show notes for this episode 277 is the episode number. So you'd go to jessicamorehouse.com slash 277 or just go to my shop page, jessicamorehouse.com slash shop.

That is where you can find the link to more information about the course. There's already over 100 people in the course, and they've been making some crazy strides on their journey to building wealth, getting out of those high fee actively managed mutual funds and into a portfolio of low cost index ETFs. And I really do walk you through every single thing. On top of that, there's a private Facebook group for students. And I also do a live bi-weekly Q&A call. So you can also ask me your questions directly live. So, so many exciting things in the course. Make sure to check it out, jessicamorehouse.com slash shop. Welcome to the More Money Podcast, Ken. I'm

so excited to have you on the show. Hey, hey, hey. Hi, Jessica. How are you doing? Good. I'm a huge fan. I feel like I've been following you for a while. First, I love the name of your brand, The Hum the humble penny maybe that's me being Canadian being humble I don't know but I just love your brand it really is so positive and brings a smile to my face whenever I see any of the content you put out it just makes me feel good which you know when you're online sometimes it's hard to find those kind of voices that make you feel good but also are educational so bravo thank you so much no no thank you thank online, sometimes it's hard to find those kind of voices that make you feel good, but also are educational. So thank you so much. No, no, thank you. Thank you. I mean, it was never really a brand when we started, we just came up, my wife came up with a name,

and we thought, yeah, this sounds kind of good. It's available, you know, for 99p, let's buy it and start. Yeah. So, so it's interesting to see see you know see see it becoming a brand and seeing people connect with it in a very different way so when you started it and you started it in 2017 what was kind of the the goal of it was it just oh let's start this just for fun or did you kind of have some um you know plans to maybe maybe make it more than that? Yeah, so it started as a passion project. So my background, I'm actually a trained chartered accountant. So I'm a finance guy. So I didn't think I had a creative muscle in me at all.

So the blog was my way of saying to myself, I've seen all these people, these internet people, making it happen and they're doing these really cool, fun things. And I'm in my cubicle. I just love to try something else. I just love to just try, you know, and see if I could maybe have myself heard by the world somehow. So the humble penny became essentially my, my blank canvas where I would just talk about stuff related to money but from my perspective because I felt there was no one really speaking to people who looked like me or who came from my background as a first generation immigrant to the UK I just felt there was just the narrative

out there I just didn't feel like you know there was people I could point to and say hey I followed that blog because I could really connect with him or her in a way that was quite close to who I was and where I came from. So I wanted to talk about money in a really simple way, a way that anyone could relate to, you know. And that's what became my concept for the Hum penny as a blog i'm curious what was kind of the landscape you know in your view before you started your blog of other blogs or other kind of content creators in the personal finance space in the uk i mean i i feel like i could totally identify with you like when i started my blog i mean a little bit earlier than you but it was the same thing there's not a lot of women um talking about money it was really just a bunch of old white men and you're

like cool cool cannot relate so cool. Do not relate. So I'm going to start something. And also similar to you, I wanted to have a creative outlet because I also worked in a cubicle. So I'm like, I need something to live for. But yeah, tell me, what did it kind of look like? And has it changed over the years

or is it still kind of the same? Oh yeah, no. So it's changed a lot. So back then, which it sounds like I'm saying, it's like, oh, back in the 20s. No, it was only three years ago. There were a handful of blogs that were, you know, had been created by people who were of a particular demographic. And those blogs had a particular readership.

And, you know know there wasn't really if I had to be really blunt a blog that was created by a black guy who who had a family which is my which was my situation um so I felt like I was coming in as a kind of a stranger to a party and I didn't know where I fitted in. I didn't have any allies. I didn't have any, you know, like people who I could point to. In fact, the people who I admired were people in America, you know, the American bloggers and people like that. Cause I thought, Oh, you know, there's blogging things taking off in America. And I've been heavily interested in the subject of financial independence as an area. Cause my wife and I, we met at a property investing seminar.

And we had set off together after reading this random book, which many people know about, called Rich Dad Poor Dad back in 2008. We set off together and became friends. And anyway, this subject of financial independence was actually an area i was interested in uh so starting the blog i felt that that was a an interesting area for me to talk about from my perspective because there were not really many people even people who look like me who talk about that subject let alone talk about it from an aspirational perspective so but since we started there's been all these sudden all these blogs have shown up and and it's been really interesting to see the change have been lots of blogs by women lots of blogs by black women lots of blogs by other people from other kind of

backgrounds they were very that was very different to what life looked like in December 2017 when I was kind of kicking off so So it's just very interesting, because in fact, I've had people message me saying, Ken, do you know what, because I saw you, and because I saw you doing it, I believe that I could do it as well. Wow. Like, that is pretty amazing, especially to when you, you know, when you started, you're like, well, I'm gonna start this thing, we'll just see how it goes but I'm just doing this as kind of a hobby I don't have like any you know big plans and you've inspired other people to do the same and I think that's the kind of amazing thing sometimes I feel like we uh you know as individuals are like what kind of impact can I make it's like you can make

a really big impact by just taking that chance and doing something outside of your comfort zone and because I think that's the other thing too, a lot of people may not realize this, but yeah, you like, if you don't see someone like you or a similar voice to you out there, then maybe that's, you know, kind of the opening for you to be that person. But sometimes that's, you know, you don't maybe think of it that way. And then that can kind of create that ripple effect. Yeah, I think it's, you know what it is, Jessica, it's the fear. The fear holds people back. Oh, yeah.

I had the same fear. I feared, I just feared being laughed at by people and being judged. And I'd come from a professional background. I'd worked in venture capital. I'd worked in, you know, just in asset management in a very, very kind of traditional areas of, you know, work, you know, there was a very clear career pathway. So for someone like me, who would be attending board meetings, and, you know, be wearing a suit and stuff, suddenly start talking about blogging and writing about like stuff on the internet,

was very much frowned upon, you know, people were just, just you know it was just not a normal thing to do and so i think to your point i think fear of being judged paralyzes a lot of people because they just they really fear telling their story you know and what i found is is that you know the story is actually the goldmine the story is the thing that people want to hear because like it's what connects and builds a bridge between the storyteller and the people the audience people listening and the blog provides the medium for that to happen but most people don't really realize that their stories no matter how bad their thing their stories are are actually their assets they're actually what they need to almost unravel and let the world see.

And it's that fear that holds people back from actually taking that leap. And I'm hoping that our journey is kind of helping people realize that, you know what, it's about time people heard your voice and kind of heard your story because that story is important, not just for you, that story is important for other people.

Right. I mean, that's the big reason why I got into this is I read other people's blogs and a lot of them from women. And I'm like, well, this is cool. I didn't know people were talking about this and they're being so vulnerable. I mean, people were sharing their how much they made, how much they spent, their net worth. I'm like, what?

Those are the numbers? This is wild. And it makes you feel like, oh numbers? This is wild. And it, you know, it makes you feel like, oh, okay, people are talking about it. Maybe not in my, you know, my friend group or at work, but there are kind of circles maybe online that are doing that. And then then you can kind of feel part of something different, which is really cool. Did you I'm curious, since you kind of mentioned, you know, the fear of being judged was, you know, a big thing for you. Did you feel like that actually happened? Or was

that just kind of a fear once you kind of did it? You're like, Oh, actually wasn't as bad as I expected. Oh, yeah. I mean, I was definitely judged. I mean, I mean, first of all, my friends would not talk about it, that, you know, they would not interact with my content, you know, people were not sure how to respond, you know you know like why does he feel he's the guy to talk about this why is he sharing about his personal journey what you know there were many question marks and it was and this is so interesting jessica is so fascinating the psychology of life it's not until you start to have some success that people suddenly feel oh i now want to talk about it they want to go oh i know that guy he's he's one of my friends or you know to have some success that people suddenly feel, oh, I now want to talk about it.

They want to go, oh, I know that guy. He's one of my friends or, you know, we used to work together. He's one of my ex-colleagues, you know, because I realized that people want to be associated with success, Jessica. This is it. But where does a question mark over what you're doing when they're not quite sure if it's going anywhere? are afraid to commit themselves to it no that's true at least now you can be like well told you so well you know it's well you know i kind of feel like we're still we're still at the inception stages i know we're only three years into this journey i kind of feel like wow it's just so much more ahead and it's really exciting as to what the possibilities are. Yeah.

So yeah, tell me, because yeah, it's for me, especially since I've been doing this for almost a decade. So it's been a bit of a slower burn for me to get to where I am. It's like, it's been a journey. You've been able to achieve so much in such a short amount of time, which is amazing. Tell me a little bit about what kind of changed. Obviously, you started the blog, but now you have a YouTube channel. You have a huge audience. Now you have, you know, your membership program kind of tell me how did things kind of evolve to where

you're now where now you're running your own business full time? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's very interesting. So it's interesting, because when because when I started the blog, the blog was just a place where I wrote stuff down. And I started to really reimagine what a blog was, having seen my kind of, call them American colleagues or maybe Canadian people, people basically who were, you know, who I was used to seeing in their blogs, and some UK people who were kind of upcoming and things like that, I started to ask myself, like, what this whole idea of blogging,

what does it actually mean beyond the creative pursuit? How can we turn this thing into a business, something that actually generated an income? How do we actually do it and do something? How do we take some risk with this stuff beyond just writing articles how else could we monetize this thing beyond advertising and affiliate income what else could we do and in 2019 in the summer around may 2019 my wife and i thought we've been sitting on this idea for some time we thought how about we just try video why don't we just try something else you know and see where it goes but I had a huge fear you see Jessica I've grown up being labeled as shy through my life and so you know I I had this thing where you know I just didn't know how people would react you know my story not everybody you

know where you know what how would people take it would I be judged a lot on the internet would people write hateful comments you know below videos but then in the end we said you know, how would people take it? Would I be judged a lot on the internet? Would people write hateful comments, you know, below videos? But then in the end, we said, you know what, we're just going to have a go. We're going to make one video. My wife said she was going to learn video editing. So we started learning video editing whilst I started to learn how to practice and record myself for a YouTube video. And we put the first video out and it went pretty well in that it did not go viral or anything like that but people did not you know the world did not fall apart and people responded fairly you know fairly decently to the video and so we then said you know what we're now going to turn this blogging thing into see the humble penny as a platform rather

than as a blog so the humble penny would become a platform that existed across different spheres one of those spheres would be the youtube platform and so we made a decision to create one piece of high quality content per week and then moved on to creating two pieces of quality content per week. And that became, I can tell you, the biggest change in building an audience because the likability and trust happened so much quicker via video. And also, we were able to attract, we reached our first million views on YouTube

so much quicker because people were able to connect with us and people felt like the way I explained things, they could understand it. It was very simple. I was able to break down complex topics into very simple ideas using very simple analogies. I was able to add humor, emotion, things that I struggled to articulate on a blog. Yeah. And plus they could see me. And so they're like, oh, this is the guy. This is the guy. I feel like I kind of like this guy, or I'm not sure if I like this guy, you know, at least they could make a judgment. They could decide, you know, and so it meant that people were reaching out a lot quicker you know so many comments so many emails that's when we knew actually this thing could begin to take off in the um the youtube platform and it's honestly

it's been the best decision ever the youtube platform is single-handedly the one thing that moves the needle the most in our in our lives right now. And I kid you not, because you are almost see as you are in complete control in that you decide what you create, you speak in your own voice, you speak to who you want to speak to, and the YouTube algorithm does the work of promoting your content,

rather than me having to go and do Pinterest and do, you know, work on organic traffic, which we still do on the blog, but the algorithm and the fact that we're building an authentic community on YouTube does the work for you. So the hardest part of actually creating on a platform like that is actually doing the creating. And once you're done, you're not spending so much time marketing the content, it markets itself. And so this became a huge game changer for us. Another big change was we got selected by YouTube for something called the Creator on the Rise Award. And, yeah, they reached out and said, look, our systems have told us that your channel, there's something about it that could really take off.

So we're giving you this award as the creator on the rise. And that was in January 2020 as the creator on the rise. And we were like, wow, this is incredible. And they basically took our channel and put it on the homepage of YouTube for an entire day. And our channel grew on the back of that. Like they put it on like their trending tab or whatever. And that became a big thing.

And so the biggest, almost the biggest game change for us has been about staying consistent, being very clear on our messaging on YouTube and building an authentic community on that platform. And then there's other stuff that happened, which we can speak about later around the YouTube black and, you know, being selected by Google. Yeah,'s i saw that and i'm like that is pretty cool tell me a little bit about that because that sounds so exciting yeah it's crazy right so google made an announcement in i think it was last year 2020 uh where they said they're gonna um they're gonna fund basically they've got 100 million dollars to fund um black

black creators globally and so they went on this this drive to try and find creators globally who they thought had the potential to grow um and have real impact uh in their communities and and and stuff like that and tell positive stories about their communities. And we got chosen to be one of those 112 global creators from literally everywhere across the world, from Africa, from America, from everywhere. You can think about Australia and so on. We were one of those 112 people. And I'll never forget the phone call. We got contacted by them.

They said, hey, come and meet us. Let's sit down and just have a chat about your channel. they sat down and said hey you know we're writing you guys a check and we would love for you to join an incubator we'd love to help you to grow your channel we see a lot of potential in what you do and that's a huge validation jessica because for the first time we've been we've been grafting working really hard for like a year and suddenly this comes about and they're like look look, we believe you can go so much further because you're seen as an authority on YouTube. And we thought, wow, you know, and this became a huge thing for us.

We've been on the incubator now for some time, learning basically the business of YouTube whilst obviously still running the blog and everything else related to that. Funny because it's I mean, I am not a YouTube sensation, but I do see the potential and it's like, I don't know how you were able to or still do create such consistent content. My God, video is so difficult to do, especially when you're doing other things in the background. You know, you've got your blog and all these other things like that is difficult, but it is, isn't it so fascinating that you try one thing and you're, you know, pretty successful with the blog, but then it was something else that was actually the game changer for me. It was the podcast and it was something that like, I'd been blogging for

like five or six years at that point. And it never really took off. And I'm like, should I just get up? Like like let's just try something new but again that fear kind of came in what if no one listens what if people hate it but it's like you just don't know and isn't that kind of cool that you can now look back you're like that was the thing that changed everything how cool is that yeah it's it's incredible and I think for anyone listening and this is a big lesson I've learned on this journey, is that it's really about having this experimental mindset of almost exploration. So when you're doing one thing, you know, always asking yourself, how else could I apply the same concept across a different medium? And just to see how that might turn out, you know, I must think to myself, wow, you know, it seems like a different life and just to see how that might turn out you know i must think to myself wow you

know it seems like a different life before youtube um had we not tried it god i wonder where we might have been been now you know yeah um in fact it was it became so good that youtube asked us to do a workshop for them teaching people how to create an authentic community on YouTube. Oh my gosh, you're like, we're teaching people? Yeah, exactly. We're teaching people. And we've only been on this journey ourselves for barely 18 months on YouTube. So it just shows what's possible. And honestly, if anyone who's listening who is maybe afraid to take the leap potentially to try things out, you do not lose anything for experimenting. Honestly, it's it's honestly, it's it's the best thing we've ever done trying out the YouTube platform.

And it's what it's done is actually expose our brand now more globally. Well, yeah, I'm in Canada and I discovered you. You know what I mean? So it's like there's a you can just reach so many more people, which is exciting. now more globally. Well, yeah, I'm in Canada and I discovered you. You know what I mean? So it's like, you can just reach so many more people, which is so exciting. Yeah, there's just so much more possibility. And let's not forget, you obviously get paid for creating on YouTube.

You get paid by Google AdSense for creating. And of course, the know, the best, you know, for those who are listening, you know, who might be interested in kind of content creation and online, online businesses and things like that. The best thing about YouTube for us, in fact, you mentioned our membership earlier, membership program. We know that anything between 65% and 75% of our members came from YouTube. Wow. Yeah. I mean, it makes sense when you think about the platform, because I mean, I love YouTube. I'm on

there all the time watching videos of other creators. You're an engaged watcher or viewer. A blog is a little bit more passive, great information, but you may not have that personal connection. But when you're watching someone on YouTube over and over, you feel like you know them, you know, and that's pretty special. Like you create this really strong connection with them, which is pretty cool. But yeah, I think so many people, and I mean, I still feel like this when I'm trying something new or want to experiment.

Like you said, there's really no downside to experimenting. I think we're just so focused or I don't know, we're conditioned to be afraid of failing instead of just try it out. If it doesn't work out, maybe let's not label it as a failure because that's so negative. Just be like, okay, it didn't work out. We learned a few things. Let's move on to the next. But I think sometimes we don't focus enough on, but what if it succeeds? I think we really don't focus enough on, but what if it actually works out. Yeah. We really don't focus enough on, but what if it actually works out? We're always just like, what's the worst case scenario? It's like guaranteed it won't be as bad as your worst case scenario. We haven't even really touched on this, but you were able to achieve, you know, fire financial independence by a very young age,

34, which is also crazy. So when in the process did that happen was that a little while ago was that on your kind of journey of creating the blog that actually happened in 2017 before we launched the blog so 2017 in the summer um was when we were able to say that had happened so i was 34 in 20 giving giving my age away here i was 34 in 2017 and then we started to tell the story we launched a blog in December 2017 on the 3rd of December and that that actually was instrumental in helping me have the confidence quit my job as well because because we were at a good place. We paid off our mortgage. We built up good investments and savings and so on. We had property assets.

So we're basically in a good place financially. But I always thought to myself, it would be incredible if this thing that I was starting to decide became something that was actually sustainable, i.e. it covered its own costs it broke even because we were starting to develop costs we've got a team of six people now you know a video editor a community manager a tech va a social media person and then there's me and then there's my wife right so in addition to uh obviously costs of running a platform technology and things like that so our goal then became how do we um how do we not just

rely on our own money but how do we like turn this thing into something that could actually generate some income and so the whole monetization journey began um about 12 months after we started a platform and that was to try and get ourselves monetized via media vine and you've probably heard of them um ad platform and once we did that that started to provide some regular income which we then reinvested back into the whole platform to start to explore other ways such as creating our own online courses and things like that amazing gosh yeah that will that i've heard you know lots of people on the show have come on the show and that's kind of what kind of inspired them to maybe try something new or experiment is like having that financial independence or at least on their way to financial independence.

And it seems like that's been something that you were, you know, even if you didn't do the blog, like that's something that you were, you know, trying to do. I'm curious because everyone seems to have a different strategy or system or even definition of FI. What does that mean for you? How did you determine, yes, we're now officially FI? Yeah, so for us, it was simply a point where our cost, first of all, our cost base had fallen significantly. So the home we live in, we bought in 2012, our primary residence, with the house paid off and with our investments in other assets so

our property other property assets outside of our primary residence as well as investments in the stock market which we started in 2009 slash 10 as soon as the income from those areas as well as from other we also run a nursery a childcare business outside of what we do that we do as a family they're not just me and my wife is broader siblings and my parents essentially the income from all our other activities was essentially able to cover our costs easily you know our kind of ongoing costs of operating our family life. So as we got to that stage, we knew, in addition to having a good savings buffer and, you know, investments and

so on, we knew that we were at that place where it'd become optional, really. The big question I then had, the big question mark really was, I've been building a career so far, I've spent the last 15, 16 years developing this career. You know, I'm a chief financial officer. I earn a good six-figure income. I've been earning six figures for some years now. Should I carry on? Do I have a desire to carry on doing what I'm doing, working 60, 70, 80 hours a week? Or is there something else I could do, really, especially as my children were getting older? I've got an eight-year-old and a six-year-old with my wife. Do I want to play a

better role in my own personal life? Do I want a different life altogether? My wife and I always did. I wanted to play more of a role as a father. I wanted to be more present. And also I wanted to have a go at really doing the things I've been doing for years lots of side hustles you know as immigrants to a country and I don't know if you know much about how immigrants kind of get through life but a lot of immigrants kind of you know start off with a focus on survival and for me that began with creating side hustles with family members joint ventures and things like that so I've always entrepreneurial, but I've never gone away and done it fully. And so getting our finances in order, getting our money journey to a place where we were

actually okay, we were not like we didn't have abundance in income. We were in a good place financially. It meant that we basically de-risked our lives to a large extent. You know, it gave me the opportunity to decide, well, actually, I might, this is now the best time. Essentially, 2020 was a gift, Jessica, because I'd been working these crazy hours in my day job, also working, you know, putting in 20, 30 hours a week on my own side, hustle on the side, and as well as being a husband, being a parent with two children, as well as homeschooling as a result of COVID, there's so

much going on. That point was essentially a turning point when I thought, okay, this is it, you know, enough, enough of being afraid. Now is the time to kind of back myself and see where this takes me. Did you find it? I mean, it sounds like you were ready to make that decision. But were you, I don't know, worried about, I guess, leaving that career built up or also even that salary? Was that a difficult decision to make? Or, you know, looking back, you're like, no, it was it was an easy decision at the end of the day. No, no, no, it was extremely difficult. Yeah. Because come on, who does not like getting a regular six-figure salary every year? I'd worked all my life to get to this stage. I'd taken professional qualifications. I'd done an MBA at the University of Cambridge. I'd worked hard to get to this stage. And this was

the only identity I had. It was really who I'd become after about 15 years of working in the city of London in the financial services area. So to give that up was very difficult. In fact, I had anxiety. I was very afraid of giving that up because, you know, you're used to on a particular date of each month, there would be, you know, a paycheck coming in. You were used to having that and that paycheck offered a specific lifestyle without you having to dip into your savings and things like that, you know? So it's quite hard, but I also knew given the buzz and the interest and the excitement and the impact we were seeing with the humble penny, that, do you know what, this thing could potentially become, in fact, my brother said to me, this thing would become your legacy. And I, yeah. And I, and I, and I, and I believed him. I believed him when he said that. And I thought, well, what's he, what if he is right? What if I gave up on this and I gave up on this legacy journey or what if, what if he's right? And I carried on and this became the thing that really changed our lives

and changed the lives of millions? And that was the bet I had to weigh up. I had to weigh up, you know, there's a good six-figure salary and a good job, a secure job, well, secure-ish. Their job's really secure. Versus the opportunity to really run something that I love that could actually

match my day job in income and but would have the potential to have impact for millions when I when I did that analysis it became very clear my wife said to me this is this is it this is the opportunity let's do it and and that was it yeah you don't want to regret you don't want like you know thinking about regret it's like I don't, like you'd probably regret not, you know, taking this chance, but you may regret staying in your job a little bit longer and just, you know, starting to really hate it. You never want to get to that point of super burnout. Did you get any pushback from anyone in your family or friends circle who, you know, because

it is, I mean, I got some pushback. I'll be honest when I decided to quit my corporate job, because I think most people are like, what are you crazy? You have a good job. What are you doing? No, I didn't tell anyone. Oh, that's a good strategy. Just don't tell anybody. No, I didn't tell anyone. I just went ahead and did it. And I called my mom, called my dad and said, okay, this is it. Now I'm running the business full-time and they were like uh are you sure I'm like yep we're doing it and then I explained this is where we are financially you know there's potential in what we're doing and you know this is how this is why it matters you know and they understood because I come from an entrepreneurial family you see mom and dad

my mom my dad my sisters my brother everybody runs a business i was the only one who had a normal day job so for them it was like welcoming back their son oh good yeah no one in my family is an entrepreneur um like no one in any part of my family and so when i said i'm going to start my own business they're like are you crazy like we're a family of employees yeah you know stay at your job for 30 to 40 years kind of thing so so is it but you know what I for me I got a lot of uh support for my husband who's been self-employed since I've known him so for like 13 14 years so so that was good and like you said it's one of those things you do it and you're like I'm so glad I did it now I wish I almost did this sooner, right? Yeah.

So I want to kind of talk a little bit about your membership program, which I think is so awesome. Because I also kind of feel like this is also, you know, my view. It's like, I don't know, is it is personal finance kind of a still a very niche kind of small thing in the UK? Are you kind of one of the leaders of it? So personal finance is become a bigger thing in the uk it did not used to be like that so our and we are one of the i'd say one of the key voices um in in this space here in the uk uh so we launched in in talk about timing, in Feb 2020, just before the pandemic hit in the UK,

we launched a platform, a sister company called Financial Joy Academy at financialjoyacademy.com. And that name, in case anyone wondered, came out of our tagline for the Humble Penny, which is Create Financial Joy. So we took the words from that tagline and created essentially this platform. And the reason we created it, and I'll tell you you why we had many people who would reach out to us as you probably do jessica who say hey can you offer me some mentoring can you offer me some coaching i need some help then you say to them this is how much it's going to cost because you know my time costs a lot of money and they'll go oh that's actually pretty expensive uh i'm not quite sure i can

afford that and then they disappear and so my wife and I thought well actually instead of not being able to help so many people who come to us how about if we created something that offered them so much value but at such a little price each month so the price of a takeaway people who buy you know order online on Deliveroo or whatever you know on a platform where they buy food whatever they spend what if they use that to actually invest in their lives for the future? And so we came up with the, we call it the UK's first ever platform catering to, with a goal of helping families practically work towards achieving financial independence. So we, our mission is to help 10,000 families in this 10-year decade from 2020 to 2030

to get on that journey and actually achieve that goal. It's a crazy goal for us, but we believe that it's actually possible because of what we're building. So essentially, the platform has a multi-dimensional value proposition. So it offers group coaching every two weeks. We have essentially all our resources. We've got about 30 different courses and action plans

and things like that within the platform. It's actually an actual platform itself, which we built. We have a super supportive community as part of the offering we also have a method for keeping people accountable on a weekly and a quarterly basis as well as we have experts so we have various people showing up to teach various things so and what we've noticed is that this has been the best thing so beyond actually we thought when we started that it would be about helping people build wealth but what we've noticed noticed is that this platform has actually become about helping people begin to believe that they can achieve their goals or to build good

friendships or to create strong relationships or, you know, stuff like that. You know, so, for example, one of the best parts of what we do is our 5am club so every day from monday to friday we show up at 5am and on zoom it's like a co-working space people use that to work on their side hustles to work on their various projects and this is a benefit they get and i show up i read a book for about 10 minutes uh to motivate people or my wife reads a book or she share something we've learned in the week. And what that has done for us is it's taken the whole blogging and YouTubing to create essentially a really intimate environment where you feel it's almost like a spiritual journey, like you're going on a journey with people that you know them so well you know their wives their children their dreams their goals and you're literally helping them as well

as everybody else almost crowdfunding their ideas to help each person build wealth forward yeah and for all of that they're paying a small monthly fee um which i think it works out to be about 50 a month or something like that that That's amazing. I think, yeah, so many people would need something like that. And like you said, there's such a big need. I think when people, you know, are looking for information on how to, you know, better their financial lives online, lots of free stuff. But when it comes down to it, lots of people are like, I need some actual like accountability and some help. And it's still very difficult to find someone who, I mean, I have conversations all the time,

you know, from people like, oh, can you help me? I'm like, there's only so many people I can help, you know, time is limited. And then when you're looking for other people who are kind of unbiased, they don't work for a financial institution, they're not trying to sell you some financial products, very hard to find that kind of help.

So that's awesome that you've been able to create a platform. Yeah, the one thing I'd say as well, which I hope will really resonate with a lot of people is that we've got to remember that when we share our stories, people buy into us. Yeah. So they really want to, what you're really, what you're really, what you're really giving people by creating a platform like that is proximity. So people feel they can actually get to know you and build a true relationship with

you but do it at an affordable price so it's a i almost think of it as an ethical way of monetizing a platform because you know you're essentially crowdfunding lots of um you know ideas lots of thoughts like in our community and learn there are so many experts in so many things, whether it's digital marketing, whether it's the law, whether it's accounting, whether it's how to build a website. There's so many people with different niches, whether it's property investing, they're all within the platform. And so when you ask a question outside of me and my wife giving you answers, there are people who are actual subject matter experts who can also give you answers. So it's actually like the best possible outcome. I highly recommend this idea to anyone

who's thinking about how else could they create a sustainable offering to their audience. This is actually a way that they might want to explore doing it. Yeah, definitely. I've got my wheels turning. Yeah. My gosh. Well, you know, it has been such a pleasure having you on the show. I feel more inspired just to kind of get keep on going quite honestly, get back on YouTube, make some more videos. But also, I feel like it's your, you know, again, just another example of someone who, you know, you didn't have a blog, you were just doing your own thing, working your job, and you've changed your life completely. And you took a lot of risks, but calculated risks. And it just goes to show, anyone can kind of change their life or do something different or get on a different path. It may not feel easy internally, but it's possible, especially when it comes to changing your own financial, you know, kind of destination. I think a lot of people get very focused on the present, we need to, you know, focus on the future. And then, you know, just be patient and humble. Stay humble. Absolutely. Stay humble. And have fun.

We always end by telling people, be thankful and seek joy. The joy is what it's about. You know, that's what it's really about at the end of it. You know, you have to, you have to feel like this whole thing is changing your life. Otherwise, there's no point doing it. So before I let you go, you know, I'm sure people will want to kind of check you out. Where can people find you online and find more information about the Financial Joy Academy? Yeah, so first of all, you can find us at The Humble Penny on Instagram, where we have fun just sharing our journey. You can learn more about our blog at thehumblepenny.com and The Humble Penny on YouTube. For Financial Joy Academy, just check it out at financialjoyacademy.com or at financialjoyacademy on Instagram. Amazing. Well, thank you so much

for being on the show, Ken. It was a pleasure having you. Likewise. No, thank you for having me, Jessica. And that was episode 277 with Ken Okorafor from The Humble Penny. Make sure to check him out at thehumblepenny.com. And you can find him at the Twitter and Instagram all at The Humble Penny. Very easy to find him. Of course, find him on YouTube because he's amazing on the YouTube. I need to take some tips from him. So go to youtube.com slash the humble penny. I'll, of course, link to all of the places where you could possibly find him and, you

know, start watching his YouTube channel or following on Instagram. I'm a huge fan of his Instagram in the show notes for this episode. So just go to jessicamorehouse.com slash 277. And of course, if you want to find out the show notes for any episode, you can either go to jessicamorehouse.com slash podcast, or just go jessicamorehouse.com slash the number of that particular episode. So so so okay, things I need to share with you. So first off, a little reminder, because I did share this at the beginning of the episode, in case you skipped through it, I'm going to let you know now I have my course that if you're interested in learning to invest and actually me showing you how, this is how,

this is why, I mean, this is why I created it. This is why so many students have started taking it and are really going through it and doing some big changes with their investments, like, you know, getting rid of their actively managed mutual funds, which are super high fee and into something better like a robo advisor or, you know, managing their own portfolio of ETFs using a discount brokerage. So you can, it's called Wealth blueprint for canadians it is specifically for canadians which i think canadians appreciate because we get a lot of information from our american friends which is lovely but also just like not helpful for us because you know we don't have 401ks here so i really do walk you through every single thing that you need to know

to really feel confident about investing and get started and actually take action that's the main thing so you learn about investment types, capital markets, account types, investment planning, retirement planning, how to use a robo advisor, I actually invest in 12345678 different robo advisors with my own money and show you exactly like I, you know, walk you through it. So you can see me do it. And I also go through self-directed investing or DIY investing as it's sometimes called and show you how to, you know, buy an asset allocation ETF or make your initial contribution to your DIY ETF portfolio or, you know, make additional contributions and rebalance your portfolio, how to do all these

different things to manage your own portfolio. And there's so many other things that I haven't even I didn't even share in the first part of this. So for example, I'm always creating kind of new lessons and new, you know, resources that are helpful to my students. Like that's a great thing. Once you're a student, you have you have access to the Facebook group and also the Q&A call us with me. And you can ask me your questions. And a lot of those questions turn into new parts of the course that will help you. For instance, someone asked, Hey, can you explain how my investments are protected? Like, should I be worried that you know, my money is with this robo advisor. And so I made a lesson about how your investments are protected. Spoiler

alert, there is some protections involved in case you're using a discount brokerage or a robo advisor and they go bankrupt. So you don't have to worry about that. I'm also doing these really cool series called expert interviews where I've interviewed experts from Tangerine, Quest Wealth Portfolios, Questrate and BMO ETFs. And there's more to come. I'm going to hit up everybody I know in the industry. So I can ask them specifically about their platform or their products because, you know, a lot of this is like, okay, we're ready to invest, but which one, you know, which platform should i use or which etf should i put in my portfolio so i'm going directly to the source to ask them all the questions that you want to know so there's so many amazing things in this course so just check it out you can find more information in the show

notes for this episode jessicamorehouse.com slash 277 or go to my shop page jessicamorehouse.com slash 277 or go to my shop page, Jessica more house.com slash shop. So that okay, so besides that, I also want to remind you, I am running my book giveaway. And you know, I'm going to be running it until this podcast season is over, which so far in my little calendar have at the beginning of June, We will see. But basically, if you go to JessicaMoorhouse.com slash contest, or again, there's the link in the show notes, I'm giving away copies of all the books featured on this season of the show. How many books am I giving away? Let's Google it. I think there's quite a few now. One, two, three, four, there's five different books I'm giving away. There's more to come because I have more authors coming on the show later in the season uh but enter to win and I will you know I

literally you know choose the people myself that or the the winners and buy the books and mail it to you so you even get a little special card from me which is always kind of nice um so make sure to check that out lastly just want to remind you since we talked a little bit about YouTube, and I'm obviously nowhere near as an expert with YouTube that Ken is with his channel, but I also have a YouTube channel that I am putting more effort into because I want to blow up. I want to do this. Let's be the go-to gal when it comes to personal finance content in Canada on the YouTube. So check me out, JessicaMorehouse.com slash YouTube or go into YouTube and just Google my name, Jessica Morehouse. You'll find me there. And also like hit me up over, you know, however you follow me on social media, Instagram, Twitter, or email,

and let me know specific topics you'd like me to see on my YouTube channel. That's always helpful for me when I'm kind of figuring out what are some things that people want to know. Let's see. That's that. Oh, hello. I forgot the thing that I was like kind of teasing for a while. I'm sorry. It's just like it happened and then I immediately like forgot. You know, when something happens, you just immediately move on with your life or it's like so traumatic or stressful that you just don't want to think about anymore. So thanks for sticking around for this a little bit. If you follow me on Instagram or Twitter, you already know the news. But like I mentioned in the past couple episodes, I was studying for a course called Financial Planning 1 through the Canadian Securities

Institute. It is one of the many courses that I have to take on the journey to become a certified financial planner. And good news, I passed. Oh my goodness. It really wasn't that bad. But, you know, it was still one of those things where it's like once I finished and then you immediately, you don't get your grade immediately, but you do get a pass or fail. And it said pass. I literally am like, oh my God. Oh my God. And then I just like wanted to take a nap after because it was just too much. It was just too much. So that's done. Thank you so much for sending me the support and the good vibes. Really, really appreciate it.

On to the next one, which unfortunately, unfortunate for me, is called Financial Planning 2. And it is two textbooks and way more intense. And it is giving me flashbacks of doing the Canadian securities course, which is, you know, you know, it that was just like, I still have like nightmares of taking the CSE exams. And, and I mean, you know, I'm not done. Like I've been talking to some friends who've done the CFP. And I mean, one friend said that she got an ulcer studying. So I don't know if I know what I'm getting myself into. But here we are, we're just going to keep it going, right? And I kind of feel like me pursuing this, because I have gotten some messages

from people, has been motivating for other people to either tackle something similar or this specifically. They're like, you know, I was thinking of doing this, and now I'm going to do it because you're doing it. And fair enough. If me, little gal who honestly never did very well in math in high school, though, I mean, I did, I just didn't really apply myself. Let's be and I also had some terrible teachers. So I do blame that. But anyways, I was never a math whiz, let's just say that, and then has a fine arts degree. If I can, you know, pivot and do this and do something totally different. I kind of think anyone can do this. Like I've

been getting so many questions about do you need to have any financial background to like do the Canadian securities course? I mean, obviously, it helps. It definitely helps. But I mean, it's kind of like anything. If you just read the textbooks and do all the work, you should be able to learn it, right? I mean, it's not easy. Hell, it is not easy, but it's not impossible. So I think that kind of a, you know, message I'm going to leave you here. Hell, it is not easy, but it's not impossible. So I think that kind of a, you know, message I'm going to leave you here with is, if you've been putting off something that you've wanted to try or wanted to pursue, take it from me, don't wait. The one thing I do kind of wish is I wish I started some of these things sooner, right? Because life is short,

and I'm also getting older. And I feel like by the time I actually achieve my CFP certification, I'll probably be closer to 40 than 30. So don't delay. Do that thing that scares you. And what's exciting is once you actually achieve it, because you probably will, because I believe in you too, that feeling of actually accomplishing something that you thought you could never do is probably like, honestly, is the best feeling in the world, right? You're like, wow, wow, I did that. You can

do that. I believe in you. So go do it. So that's it for me. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the more money podcast. I'll be back next week with another episode. And yeah, take it easy. I mean, no matter where you are in the world, hope you're staying safe. I'm in Toronto. We're in another, you know, never ending lockdown. I mean, as if anything's like lockdown again. Okay. Like nothing's happened. Like we've been locked down this whole time. So I'm just hanging out here in my home. So hopefully you're staying safe, staying sane, finding some joy in your life. And we're going to get to find the other side of this man. I can't wait until this is over to finally do like one of my millennial

money meetups. Maybe I'll take that on the road. I'm like so excited to see people. Oh, it's unreal. So anyways, thanks so much for listening. A big thank you to my podcast editor, Matthew Rideout. Have a good rest of your week. Good weekend. Stay safe. I will see you back here next Wednesday. This podcast is distributed by the Women in Media Podcast Network. Find out more at womeninmedia.network.