Morning Joe - DOD Abruptly Halts Troop Deployment to Poland

Episode Date: May 18, 2026

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You know what? I'm sorry I didn't take you with me to China, J.D. I would have, but I didn't want to. But I brought you a present that President Xi Jinping gave me. A finger trap. Very nice. What did you give him? Taiwan. Now, J.D., I need some time to relax and did not be around you.

Do you want me to leave? Is the Pope Catholic? Not enough for me. This week, President Trump traveled 14,000 miles a round trip to China for a 48-hour summit, which historians are already calling could have been an email. President Trump arrived in China, but instead of Xi Jinping, he was greeted by the country's vice president, Han Zhang, or as Trump called him, Xi Jinping. President Trump was greeted at the Great Hall of the People by school children,

jumping up and down in excitement. It's the man from the hats we make. Saturday night live with those jokes about Donald Trump's trip to China. Welcome to morning Joe. Good morning. It's Monday, May 18th, and with us, we have co-hosts of our 9 a.m. hour staff writer at the Atlantic, Jonathan Lemire. He's got a fascinating new article out. Also, co-hosts of The Rest is Politics Podcast, the BBC's Caddy Kay.

Editor at the Insider, Michael Weiss, columnist and associate editor at the Washington, Post, David Ignatius, and managing editor at the bulwark, Sam Stein. And so much to talk about really quickly, though, Jonathan Lemire. You know, an incredible NBA game last night you can talk about for a second. But I think yesterday proved to us answer the eternal question, would you rather the Red Sox win or the Yankees lose? I must say you were far more excited about the Yankees losing yesterday and the way they lost, then you've been excited about the Red Sox in a very long time. Well, there's not much to be excited about for the 2026 edition of the Boston Red Sox.

Now, for me, that's an ongoing question, even in good Red Sox seasons. I admit, sometimes I get happier about the Yankees losing. This year, it's not close. Red Sox, another lifeless loss. We don't want to see Bray and Bayo anywhere near the pitcher's mound again anytime soon. I was delighted in the Yankees, blowing a lead in the ninth, and then losing extra innings to their Croshtown rivals. The New York Mets, a ray of sunshine, Joe,

and otherwise a pretty dismal baseball season. And yes, we now have our conference finals set in the NBA. We already knew. We have Spurs Thunder out west. That's going to be a heavyweight fight. And then yesterday, in a game seven in Detroit, the Cleveland Cavaliers just took care of business. They led throughout.

They ended up winning handily on the road. So now we get Cavaliers Knicks. The New York Knicks feels like they have not played since February because they finished up their second round matchup so early. And they will be the heavy favorites in this round, four wins away from the finals. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. And Caddy Kay City's still chasing the Premier League championship. It's sitting closer and closer. We'll see how that goes. But also over the weekend, Donald Trump, once again, issuing threats to Iran. Iran. once again ignoring him. Yeah. Can I just say not a ton of optimism in my house about city's prospects?

No. My husband seems to be a little gloomy at the moment. My son, the Arsenal supporter, he's the happy one at home at the moment. It's very happy. President Trump, who knows if he's happy or not, but he is once again issuing an apocalyptic threat to Iran, as you said, posting on truth social yesterday, quote, the clock is ticking and they better get moving fast or there won't be anything left of them. That familiar, ominous warning came shortly after the president spoke with

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu about the war. It also comes as Axios is reporting that the president is expected to convene his top national security team in the situation room tomorrow to discuss all of the military options. That's according to two American officials. And as the future of that conflict remains uncertain, Ukraine, meanwhile, is escalating its attacks on Russia. Moscow with the deadliest strike in that city since Vladimir Putin's invasion more than four years ago. Three people were killed and at least a dozen injured yesterday, Saturday, in drone strikes on the Russian capital and surrounding areas. Russia's defense ministry claimed that more than 550 drones were shot down across the country over the weekend. The bombardment comes just days after a Russian

attack killed at least two dozen people in Kiev. Ukrainian president, Vladimir Zelensky, said on social media yesterday that the use of long-range attacks has, quote, significantly changed the situation and more broadly the world's perception of Russia's war. More on conflicts, meanwhile, the Trump administration is making a move in Eastern Europe that on its surface does appear to help Russia. The Department of Defense has cancelled the planned deployment of more than 4,000 troops to Poland. That comes after the DOD announced another withdrawal of, of 5,000 troops from Germany. That reduction is seen as a direct response

to a comment from Germany's chancellor, saying that Iran has, quote, humiliated the United States. The New York Times reports it was unclear why Defense Secretary Pete Hegeseth canceled the appointment to Poland, which has close relations with the United States and had been considered a possible location

for some of the forces that are now leaving Germany to go to. Reports say that Pentagon officials were blindsided by Secretary Hegsseth's order to stop the deployments, troops and equipment had already started to arrive in Poland before the decision to change came about. A Pentagon spokesperson has declined to comment on the decision. So that's Europe and those conflicts. Meanwhile, in Asia, President Trump is leaving another ally in limbo.

Suggesting in an interview with Fox News last week that a potential multi-billion dollar weapon sale with Taiwan could now be used as, quote, a negotiating chip with China. Should the people of Taiwan feel more or less secure after your meetings with President Xi? Neutral. Has the policy changed at all?

No, nothing's changed. But you're waiting on approving billions of dollars of weapons for Taiwan. Is that moving forward? Well, I haven't approved it yet. and we're going to see what happens. I may do it, I may not do it. Yeah, what's your hinge point? Well, I'm not going to say that, but I may do it, I may not do it.

But we're not looking to have wars, and if you kept it the way it is, I think China's going to be okay with that. But we're not looking to have somebody say, let's go independent because the United States is backing us, you know? So President Xi probably liked that you haven't approved the weapons to Taiwan? I would say, like is maybe too strong a word because he thinks I could do it. with just the signing of my signature, unlike Biden, who couldn't sign his signature. No, I'm holding that in abeyance, and it depends on China.

It depends. It's a very good negotiating ship for us, frankly. It's a lot of weapons. It's $12 billion. It's a lot of weapons. That sale is seen as a big test of this China visit that the president went on last week. And the president's comments come, of course, on the heels of his talks with Xi in Beijing, where the Chinese leader told Trump,

the Taiwan issue is the most critical issue in China-U.S. relations, warning that if the matter was mishandled, it could put the entire U.S.-China relationship in an extremely dangerous position. U.S. trade representative Jameson Greer tried to clarify the president's remarks, saying an interview on ABC News yesterday, there is, quote, no change in American policy on Taiwan.

House Speaker Mike Johnson also told Fox News yesterday, they quote, China cannot just go over and take the land, and we're going to stand strong and resolute by that. And I know the Congress will. And Joe, you also heard Marco Rubio saying that it wouldn't be a good idea if China just went over and took Taiwan by force, that that would be a disaster was the way that he put it. But this arm sale, if we're going to look at what comes out of that meeting in China, clearly

this arm sale, this long-delayed arm sale, is one of the key. tests of whether Trump has softened America's position on Taiwan for China. Right. Well, Taiwan and the world will not listen to what Marco Rubio's saying, won't listen to what a trade representative is saying, because David Ignatius, no president has ever kowtowed to a communist Chinese leader the way Donald Trump did in his words and in his interview. I just, there's so many things that Caddy read out. Any one of these would be a lead in a year.

I just want to go through them, and I will let you choose sort of a popery of horrors that you can choose from, David. We just saw the abandonment of Taiwan there, speaking in a way no American president ever has. And of course, his cowtowing to she, the things he said about Xi. Of course, the continued insults towards Ukraine and attacks on NATO, the cancellation of a deployment of troops to who even Donald Trump has said is a good ally, Poland, the abandonment of Germany, sending a message that we're taking troops out of Germany, and more threats from Donald Trump with Iran and less good options for him.

You look what's happening with Qatar. They're at a crisis moment. The UAE got attacked, but fortunately reports no radioactive fallout from that attack. But the president's poll numbers keep collapsing. But he seems, the theme here seems to be the embrace of enemies and the abandonment of allies. Talk about all of what you've seen over the past weekend. Joe, I'd have the same basic organizing theme that what we're seeing around the world is that it's hard to be America's friend and ally, and that it's easier to be a strong and sometimes belligerent adversary like China.

There's a lively debate taking on among people, I respect, about just how to think about President Trump's. China trip. Some people, prominent commentators, Fried Zakaria, of CNN is one, Graham Allison, who teaches at the Harvard Kennedy School, is another who say that this produced because Trump was so deferential, flattering, produced a degree of stability and cooperation in the relationship that's necessary. There's another group, and I would put myself in that, in that camp that would say, no, this really ratified. China's

rise. She's rise to position of real parity with the United States, what people call it G2, the two great superpowers. And it also ratified America's decline. Trump came back with very little of what was expected from this trip. He didn't get as many Boeing plane sales even. He didn't get as many agricultural goodies. And he also managed to put Taiwan in play. I don't think there's too much to say that he's capitulated on the Taiwan question. there's still ambiguous language. But Taiwan's in play. It's a negotiating chip.

You just hear in his voice that he's getting ready to deal. As you look around the map, the Trump administration's actions in Europe, to me, are incomprehensible at a time when Europe is threatened that in a way it hasn't been for decades by Russian expansionist power. Russians are fighting real sabotage campaigns in Europe right now, and this is the time that Donald Trump decides he's going to reduce

American support for Germany, and I think even more disturbing, to pull back these troops from Poland, a frontline state, which is right there on the Russian border, feeling very menaced by Russia. So it's a time when the basic principle that we often talk about on this show, the strength the United States has in having so many strong allies around the world, is, to my mind, being ignored. The debate over China is its biggest issue of our lifetimes, figuring out the right relationship between the United States and China. And this trip was a way station and a very long story. But you'd have to say at the end of that visit, the scorecard shows Xi getting what he wanted, and Trump generally not getting what he wanted. And that should be concerning for people

who want a strong America that can deter arising China rather than simply exceed to its power. Michael Weiss, I certainly respect people on both sides, trying to figure out exactly sort through why the president was so deferential to President Xi. And they can have that debate, but if If you just take a couple of steps back, you see a very clear pattern, as David said, the president being terrible to our closest historic allies, the same allies that help us take down the Soviet Union, and embracing actually people who consider the collapse of the Soviet Union, the greatest geopolitical tragedy of the 20th century. Again, let me just say it again, while the president's saying, I don't know, maybe we don't give Taiwan. on weapons because that's a lot of money. At the same time he's doing that, he's abandoning Germany. He's abandoning Poland, sending very clear messages to Vladimir Putin, just like he did when he supported Orban in a failing effort. I mean, and Ukraine, this is a crazy thing. Like, the president

is going all in with the losing side. It was one thing when they went around lying, and I talked about this repeatedly. They have lied repeatedly for years saying that Ukraine is about to collapse. They've continued the lying, and they've called out their lying repeatedly, saying, oh, they'll have the Dunbos next month. Oh, oh, Russia, Russia's about to overrun them. They need to, they, you've heard the lies. It has been constant. It has been continual. And even now that they know that they're on the losing side, they're upping the ante by abandoning Germany, by abandoning Poland, the country.

Putin would go to right after Ukraine. And then you have Taiwan hearing this. It has been, I suppose, a head-spinning weekend for American allies, except for the fact they've seen all too much of this over the past decade from Donald Trump. I spent the weekend talking to Polish government officials, Joe, and they were absolutely flabbergasted by this decision. You know, they were making a concerted play, a lobbying effort, if you like, to try and get those 5,000 troops that were pulling out of Germany onto Polish soil.

And then it turns out these 4,000 troops that were meant to be rotated in, are now canceled. You know, the polls make a big deal about trying to cater to what Bridge Colby, the head of policy planning at DOD calls NATO 3.0, strong stalwart allies that not only do their fair share, but go above and beyond, right? Poland is approaching 5% spending on GDP. It's going to become one of the most militarized countries in Europe. It has secure borders. It ticks all the boxes that MAGA pretends to want to care about with respect to the transatlantic relationship. And the best part, according to the polls, is, they pay for the infrastructure of hosting U.S. troops, which is something not even Germany does, right?

Fuel costs for American garrisons in Poland. They pay 50% of it. So they're actually footing the bill for this. They cannot understand for the life of them why the United States would want to pull troops away when everyone in Europe is preparing for the next confrontation with Russia, right? I mean, you talk about Ukraine over the weekend. The biggest drone bombardment of Moscow, I think, in a year's time, you know, we keep hearing that Zelenskyy, He has no cards. The Ukrainians are faded. It's inevitable. They're going to lose Don Bass. They're going to lose this war. Tulsi Gabbard goes on about how Russia has the upper hand. What did this demonstrate over the weekend? It demonstrated that there but for the grace of Volodymyr Zelenskyy, Putin's big parade, his Victory Day parade in Red Square, was allowed to take place. This is what the Ukrainians can now do. And these drones that they're using are domestically sourced. They're domestically manufactured at scale, which also signifies or telegraphs to the West. They are the center of gravity for all military technological innovation. We are at a state now, and I keep telling you this on the show because it's very important, I think. We need Ukraine more than they need us, right? We share intelligence with them for the purposes of striking Russian energy infrastructure, military targets.

But they share intelligence back with us. You know, they recruit Russian assets. They've been doing this since 2014. They speak the language fluently. They have a massive penetration inside Russian society and inside all levers. of all elements of the Russian state. We're going to need them. They're already a de facto NATO ally. You know, we just don't realize it yet, or some of us in the U.S. government don't realize it yet. Yeah. Yeah, I will say, Secretary of St. Marco Rubio said Ukraine has the best fighting force in all

of Europe. David Trey says, you want to see the future of warfare? It's happening right now in Ukraine. Had the Secretary of Army say the same thing. They're doing extraordinary things in Ukraine. And still, Donald Trump continues to do everything he can by abandoning our allies in Germany, abandoning our allies in Poland, constantly fighting NATO, abandoning the Ukrainians, continually abandoning the Ukrainians, anything to provide aid and comfort to Vladimir Putin, and none of it working. You know, this weekend, I was thinking, and we often see this as people get older Jonathan Lemire. I read your article, and I think you're so right. Any suggestion that Donald Trump has dementia or is losing my, whatever, it's ridiculous. I said the same thing about Joe Biden,

went and talked to him for three hours. And yes, Biden was moving very slow, very stiff. Donald Trump may be slowing down. But I think what we're really seeing here and what I really pulled from your article is that for the president who's about to turn 80 this month, this next month, for a president who has always been erratic, as he turns 80, we are seeing some diminished capacities with anybody who would turn 80. But that erraticism, we are seeing it exaggerated. And I wonder if that's what we see playing out. where he's just not just saying the quiet part out loud. He's screaming it.

He wants to abandon our Polish allies. He wants to abandon Ukraine as he continues to do. He wants to abandon our German allies. He wants to do everything he can do to help Vladimir Putin. Because make no mistake of it, all the people that have been going around yelling, Russia hoax, Russia hoax, Russia hoax, and will be triggered by this because of their own unique version of Trump derange. syndrome. What you actually have is a president doing everything that Vladimir Putin would want him to do. Just ask anybody that's been in this field that's been in format. Vladimir Putin

couldn't call these shots any better himself. And so whatever draws him to Vladimir Putin, whatever drew him to Putin in his 70s, it seems to be even more exaggerated now as he turns 80. Yeah, we can dig into my piece as the morning goes on. But one thing that really struck me is that there was so much conversation about Joe Biden aging, in part because Joe Biden's so visibly changed. He got quieter. He got sort of smaller. He seemed like he was frailer.

And while Donald Trump, you know, he still physically sort of looks the same. Yes, they're the bruises on his hands. And yes, he falls asleep frequently now in the Oval Office. But he's always, he's a big person. He's a big presence and he's loud. And that has allowed him to escape past accusations that he might be, in fact, aging or declining. But what's really here, and people I've talked to suggest that as he is aged, he has even less and less of a filter. Now, let's be clear, Donald Trump has never been one for self-censoring.

But he is someone who now is more purely himself as he ages. It's disinhibition. There's whatever pops in his head, he says, and he also relies more and more, as you just said, Joe, falls back on these instincts, one of them being reflexively, of deference to strong men, whether that is Xi Jinping in China. We saw that on vivid display last week, and certainly for a decade or more, what we have seen with Vladimir Putin. And there really is no other reason for this. As Michael just laid out, and as David has laid out, as you and I talk about on the show on a near daily basis, Ukraine's made real strides in this war. They, in fact, have so many of the cards. And yet they're still in the White House from Trump,

South and in his top officials, this sort of reflexive, oh, Russia's going to win this when, frankly, all evidence points to the other direction. And I must say that Michael has been saying it. I've been saying it, and Applebaum's been saying it. That's been a lie that they've been carrying for a year now. And make no mistake, right now, if you want to know where the Ukrainians are, they're not just on the front lines. They're all across the Gulf region.

because guess what? Everybody is asking them about the future of warfare and how they defend themselves against the war that Donald Trump started with Iran. Still at our morning jail, first of all, we're going to get Sam Stein's insights on all of this, even though this last segment may have been Sam's greatest yet. But coming up, new reporting on Cuba, recently acquiring hundreds of military drones, asymmetric warfare, with leaders there discussing plans to attack U.S. targets. Mark Caputo of Axis joins us straight ahead and we'll get David Ignatius's insights as well. Plus, there are new ethics questions concerning Donald Trump's massive number of recent stock trades and the timing of those trades. We're going to dig into that. And as we go to break a quick look at the travelers forecast this morning from Accuethers Bernie Rayno. Bernie is spring here for good because summer's just around the corner.

Joe, we have a severe weather outbreak late today. cities like Des Moines, Kansas, City, Wichita, Kansas, strong thunderstorm in Chicago this morning. Accuether says, beautiful day in Boston, warm. It feels like August. New York City, Philadelphia, Washington, D.C., warm and humid across the southeast. A few spotty thunderstorms. Some strong thunderstorms late today in Oklahoma City and Dallas.

Traveling along the East Coast, just Miami, some minor delays this afternoon. To help you make the best decisions and be more in the know, download the Acky Weather app today. Welcome back to morning, Joe, a live shot of Washington, D.C. I spent the weekend there with my graduate, my daughter, who is now a graduate of Georgetown. Absolutely wonderful ceremony. So David Ignatius, I'd love to get your take on everything we were talking about.

And again, let me just say, and I've talked. to John, just like I've talked to everybody about my meetings with Donald Trump or when I talk, when I've talked to Donald Trump, I haven't in a couple of months. But it was just like it was a lot like the Biden talk I heard. Oh, Biden's lost his mind. He's, you know, ambling around. And yeah, Biden was slow and awkward and stiff and quiet. But I sat there and talked to him for three hours, very detailed on foreign policy with Donald Trump. There was none of that, but there was the same, as Jonathan says, the same very vigorous Donald Trump, whose very presence fills up a room. So it is a very different situation with, I think, very different threats. But right now,

the threat is being felt by our allies, whether it's Taiwan or what's happened in Ukraine. I will say, we can't get clarity, even though there are reports at the $400 million that was authorized in the 26th Congressional Authorization Defense Authorization Act. I don't know if Ukraine has gotten that yet. We haven't gotten any signals from them that they have. But even that, even congressional funding becomes a battle on whether Pete Heggsett's Pentagon will release money that Congress has authorized to Ukraine. Joe, what I'm seeing is that, Ukraine in particular, but I think this is true for other countries in Europe, is beginning to realize that it simply can't depend on American aid promised in the pipeline, whatever you

wanted to say about it, that they have to begin planning to defend themselves. And we're seeing that. The extraordinary Ukrainian drone strike over the weekend, 650 Ukrainian drones flying toward Moscow and other targets, video footage of refineries in flames in Russia. This is from a country that, you know, when you talk to Trump's negotiating team, they say they're down and out, they're going to be finished. And, you know, in six months, doesn't look like it to me. And so Ukraine and others, I think, are deciding we have to do this ourselves. Talking to Germans, there's a recognition.

We have to arm ourselves. Americans are taking troops out of Germany. The old paradigm is really broken now. So if you're going to see Germany, a country rearm, even begin to think about, does it need nuclear weapons? We would have imagined that Germany would be having that debate. But that's, again, a result of Trump. Imagine if you're the Japanese prime minister watching this Trump visit to Beijing. She is way out there exposed in defying President Xi Jinping.

And she now feels that she's been basically cut off. what do the Japanese do to protect their security? So these are, Joe, questions around the world in terms of what you were specifically asking. What about the Ukraine aid? It's a measure of Washington these days. It's almost impossible, at least for me, to find out exactly where that package is when I ask, because I get so many different answers. So Michael Watts, put the same question to you, if we have any clarity at that aid. But more than that, talk to us about how Ukraine's sort of position has changed. over this last year or so, a little bit less reliant on the United States. Well, the economist just did an analysis saying that as many as half a million Russian soldiers

are dead. One point five million are wounded. That's about two to three percent of Russia's pre-war population taken off the chessboard, right? This was a war that was meant to be two weeks at the most. Russian columns at the Polish border, you know, after they take Kiev in three days. You now have a situation where Ukraine is clawing back territory on the battlefield for the first time since 2023. I think it's like 189 square kilometers. Beyond that, the ability of Ukraine to project its power well beyond its borders. They played a role in Mali and kicking Russian forces out of that country. I mentioned before. They played a minimal role in Syria, giving drone advice and aid to Syrian rebels when they wanted to overthrow Bashar al-Assad. They've done the same thing in

Sudan against the Wagner group. What did they do in the Middle East? This is one of the most unsung stories, I think, of the last several weeks. You know, Iranian Shahid drones, which basically were pioneered in the war in Ukraine, right? They were provided to Russia. Russia has wreaked havoc and terror on Ukrainian cities using these things. They're about $20,000 a pop. Iranian Shahid drones hit a U.S. military installation in Kuwait, killed six American servicemen. Then they took out an AWACS command and control aircraft, hard to replace something like over a billion dollars to replace it in Saudi Arabia. We asked the Ukrainians to come in and implement their sky map, which is a very sophisticated

piece of software using acoustics and artificial intelligence, basically an integrated air defense system designed for Iranian drones. And the Ukrainians have created anti-dron technology, counter-drones. They're about $2,000. What were we doing in the first weeks of the war in Iran? Using Patriot Missile interceptors, Thad missiles, again, millions and millions of dollars of pieces of equipment and kit to take down $20,000 Iranian drones. The Ukrainians were looking at us like we had three heads. What are you doing? We would not exist, they said, if we were spending money and having this kind of burn rate. So like to my point earlier, they are here to teach us now. You know, the joke in Kiev has been for the last two years. It's not a question of should Ukraine join

NATO? It's when will NATO want to join Ukraine, right? So we're getting way more than we've put in. This is a colossal return on investment. But Donald Trump and his allies and Sir, gets in the MAGA universe, don't see it that way. They still see Ukraine as this charity case. I want to just add to that. There's this incredible Washington Post story about just the unconventionality of warfare about how Ukrainian citizens have basically become accustomed to the drone warfare. And one of the ways they know is that they cut the fiber optic cables on these Russian drones. And this kid basically saved his village from a Russian drone attack because they just have become accustomed to this type of fighting. Just to pick up for Caddy on Michael's point there,

In a kind of saner universe, you would imagine Trump who said he could stop the Russian Ukraine war on day one and bring peace to this conflict. They would press the advantage now. You see Ukraine hitting in Moscow with these drones. You see all the data points that Michael pointed out there that now would be the actual time to say, okay, you know what? You've proven yourself worthy as an ally, and we're going to start funding you and collaborating more with your intelligence community, which I know they're doing it, but maybe more aggressively. we're not getting that now. If anything, Trump seems utterly distracted by a whole host of

different things that China visit, what's happening in Iran, obviously. And I know we're going to talk about it, but potentially an invasion of Cuba we're getting at. And it just seems like if he can compartmentalize a bit more, if he can actually see the strategic advantages that he possesses, things would be vastly different. I guess the question is, if he wanted to present. Perhaps that's the problem. If he wanted to put pressure on Moscow, as Sam Stein there doing his excellent host duties. You see that Joe? You see that Joe? Making the segue, turning the corner for us. A new report, as Sam has just suggested, from Axios, reveals that Cuba has acquired more than 300 military drones and could be preparing to use them against the United States. White House reporter

Mark Puto cites classified intelligence shared with Axios, detailing how Cuba has started discussing plans to possibly use the drones to attack the U.S. base at Guantanamo Bay, U.S. military vessels and Key West in Florida, which sits just 90 miles north of Havana. And Mark joins us now. Great reporting, Mark. We know that John Ratcliffe was down in Cuba, the director of the CIA, just last week. Is this part of the reason that he was down there to say to the Cubans, don't even try this?

Because clearly the Cubans, as is every other small country in the world, is studying asymmetric warfare at the moment. Yeah, my understanding, the answer to that is yes. One of the sources he spoke to for the story said that this was specifically raised by Rackcliffe. When he met with his Cuban counterparts down in Havana, it was also sort of a show of force for him to go down there. There's two ways to look at why the United States is coming out with this information now. And notably, Cuba is not denying it has the drones. It's just denying it would use them in an offensive way.

It's saying it would only react to an aggression that is suggesting they would use them defensively. is the United States either wants to put more pressure on the regime in Havana to come up with a deal and tell them, hey, we know what you have here, and so let's make a deal. Or, B, this could be a pretext for war for an invasion, as Sam had just mentioned. What's pretty clear is that though there have been talks, the talks haven't been that fruitful, and the United States just keeps piling pressure on pressure, on pressure on the regime in Havana. Not only did they happen to mention to us this report and this information about Cuba's national drone program and drone technology. On Wednesday, there are plans to formally indict Raul Castro for the 1996 shootdown of two aid planes from a group called Brothers to the Rescue that are based in Miami.

And then there are various sanctions that are being imposed in an increasingly difficult way on Havana that are starting to penalize private companies, foreign companies, that are doing business there and taking more and more money out of the already broke country. They barely have any fuel in some streets in Havana. The only lights that are now on are from trash fires that people are burning. It's a very difficult situation, and it looks like it's going to get worse. Mark, this is David Agenious in Washington. I want to ask you two things.

those of us who are old enough to remember 1962, think that the introduction of any kind of new offensive weapons into Cuba is potentially very dangerous Cuban missile crisis stuff. So first question is whether you get the sense that it's being taken that seriously by the Trump administration. Second question, this talk about indicting Roel Castro obviously reminds us of Venezuela. and essentially the kidnapping of the then-Menezuelan president Maduro. Do you see that as being in the early stages of actually being planned? As for the first part of the Cuban Missile Crisis comparison,

these aren't nuclear weapons. The United States, the sources that we spoke to said that though this is a concern, and it's a concern that there are IRGC, Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps members, from Iran who are in Havana, who do advise the regime that they're there and they don't want them there with these drones, that it's just not as much of a threat, say, as having a nuclear weapon. As for the second part, the indictment of Castro does certainly have these echoes to the operation in Venezuela. The difference that I think people need to understand between Venezuela and Cuba from the United States perspective is that Cuba is much less of a sort of.

sort of a cohesive nation where if you remove the dictator, you can have people you can do business there with. In this case, Castro is a de facto dictator. He sort of says yes and no to various ideas to move the nation forward. But it's ruled sort of by a Politburo. And there are just not people there who want to make a deal with the United States. They've been in a cold war with the U.S. since 1959, and so far there are no indications that they're going to move forward. Now, there are plans, obviously, to invade Cuba. There are plans not to invade Cuba. This is what the Pentagon does. And Trump hasn't made that decision. I'm being told, at least in the short term, that until the situation in Iran gets resolved, we're not going to see action in Cuba.

But I ask, well, what does that mean the situation in Iran get resolved and what's the timeline? There's no answer for that. And, you know, it's Trump. Tomorrow, he's, could suddenly decide, hey, let's invade Cuba, and it's going to happen. Or he could decide not to do anything, and therefore it won't. You know, it's Trump, which seems to be the kind of motto of this second administration. The new reports available online now at Axios, Whitehouse Reporter for Axis, Mark Carta. Thank you so much for joining us. Editor, the insider, Michael Weiss. Thank you as well for getting up early on this Monday morning. And coming up, President Trump is defending his comment from last week that he doesn't think about Americans' financial situation amid the

war with Iran. We'll play that for you just ahead on Morning Joe. Unbelievable. Aaron Rye buries a 68-foot putt on the 17th green. They put him up four strokes on his way to a three-stroke victory in the PGA championship. Rye becomes the first English-born player to win the Wanamaker trophy and more than essentially. What a just a great story. Let's bring in right now. The Pulitzer Prize winning. I mean, you just say that. It just rolls off the tarry to go to you. It does. It does.

Because when I think Pablo, I think Pulitzer, Pablo Pulitzer, Pull. I mean, and of course, they said for daring to commit brazen acts of journalism while conducting a sports podcast and hanging out in Bill Belichick's vacation homes. We have, of course, Pulitzer's Prize winning host of Pablo Tore finds out. Pablo, Pablo, let's not just fly past. What happened at the PGA Championship. That was great.

But I must say, I'm still blown away by the calves last night. So let's talk about the PGA Championship really quickly because I'm sure Richard Huss would expect no less of us. And then let's get to that. Caves blow out in Detroit. Nobody saw that coming. Yeah, so Aaron Rye, just the guy that we showed, you may have noticed on his hands, two gloves, right?

So already he's kind of a strange cat. He's a young guy. Of course, of a country that isn't well represented in the history of the PGA Tour Championship. And then here we have the two gloves. And he wears, you know, plastic iron covers on his clubs. And also, oh, yeah, he turned into Jack Nicholas over the last 10 holes yesterday. So the whole idea of a guy grew up admiring Tiger Woods watching those tapes, does it differently, is an underdog in all of these sort of like idiosyncratic ways.

And is this heartwarming story? I didn't know a lot about this guy until this weekend. And now here we are celebrating the fact that he is, you know, double-gloving it. Yeah, he's incredible. Yeah, Joey had to play in the cold, which is why he would do that. And also, it was striking to me seeing the reaction of some of the other players yesterday, seemed genuinely happy for him, that this is sort of an unlikely victor here yesterday. And he deserves credit.

And those who keep being against him said, hey, that he deserved this. He's a great guy. Paul, it is indeed turned to the NBA. The Cavaliers, we mentioned at the top of the show, too. Just steamrolled the Pistons last night in Detroit. Your boy, James Hardin, played reasonably well. Donovan Mitchell hit this half-court shot. It sort of such a tone at the end of the first quarter.

Caves cruised, which is, you know, as a Knicks fan, I know a lot of Knicks fans were nervous about Detroit because the Pistons, you know, handled the NICs in the regular season, and they would have had home court. So, again, we've been on this for a while. This path continues to break for the Nix. where they now get a Cleveland Cavaliers team who they beat up this year, you know,

who has plenty of postseason ghosts. Nix will have home court. They got to play tomorrow. The Cavs coming off of a grueling game seven series. Now go to MSG tomorrow night. I mean, are you already looking at airfare for Oklahoma City or San Antonio? It's hard not to feel like this is the best case scenario.

Yeah, I think that's fair. And many Nick seasons have ended. Musing is this the best case scenario. But this one, look, the lack of the last. of rest. Okay, so this was a seven-game series. It was a slug fest. The pistons are tough. The cabs. James Hardin didn't play his best yesterday, but my God. Pretty good series. The series that he played overall was impressive. And so if you're the Knicks, I mean, the only concern now is the benefit, the luxury of, was it too much time off?

And if that's your biggest problem and you get to host this team at the Garden, I think it is NBA finals or bust. And I say that knowing that I'm the guy who hates the reverse. jinx, but this is true. Yep. This is, it's objectively the case that disappointment is, that's what's on the line here. Are you disappointed if you don't make the NBA finals? The answer is yes. Yep.

Yeah, just a colossal loss of a season for them. And if the Yankees don't win the World Series in five, why did they even suit up in spring training? You know, we'll see what happens. And, you know, sometimes sitting for a week is great. Sometimes it ends up being a curse in and of itself. You never know. I want to ask you, though, let's just look back for one second. What happened to the Pistons?

They were a great team this year. Best in the East. They were tough. How do they collapse and lose that badly at home in game seven? I think the reality is the Pistons, we never totally trusted them. It felt like this season was, what a miraculous 82 game run. But in terms of, do they ever have the horses, Joe? I mean, look, in the NBA, the math is very simple.

Who are the best three players on your team? And the Pistons have some great young players. Kate Cunningham, fantastic. But they really didn't have the star power. And in the Cavs, in acquiring James Hardin and getting young guys, Evan Mowbly around him, just like these pieces for the future, they had these, the fundamentals of the Cavs Academy were strong. The Pistons, it felt like this was a bit of house money.

And it kind of, yeah, they couldn't cash it in in the end. unbelievable. Well, let's bring in right now, founder of Men and Blazers Media Network, Roger, because Roger, we have another story going along that really as compelling is what's happening, and it's going to be happening in Maddie K's Garden. And that's what's happening in Caddy Kay's household. It's as sad of a story as a civil war where brother fought against brother, father, against son. That is, that is once again showing itself to be true in Caddy Kay's household as her husband, a man, City fan, is sweating out this final week. Two matches remaining for City.

While her son, a long, suffering Arsenal fan, maybe just maybe they don't choke this year. Roger, what say you to Caddy and all the relatives of Arsenal fans who've been suffering? Which way do I go? Which way do I go, Roger? This is like the best episode of In Treatment I've ever watched before in my life. Cathy, there are no winners. There are no winners. It's football.

It is the only darkness looms behind every door. Let's look at your Manchester City, your happy, happy husband. Spoken like a true Everton fan. The FAC Cup final weekend, historic English knockout tournament, a bit like the NBA Cup, and which 747 teams up in that tiny little aisle all compete in a parallel tournament. Ultimately, two giants make it to the final.

At London's Wembley, Manchester City, relentless Abu Dhabian winners did this. It was a terrible game, but even terrible games in sports can have a moment like this. This is like Pablo Torre winning a pull-it to that little flick. Absolutely exquisite memory-making. Oh, Manchester City win. second trophy of the season.

We'll find out this week if they can land a third, the Premier League, which they desire at levels known only to Captain Ahab. That man is always pursuing Moby Dick. Back in the Premier League this weekend, stay with me here. Bottom feeders, West Ham, went to Newcastle, needing to win,

try and stave off relegation, which is where you get moved down, like from major leagues to AAA. Ultimately, that's German Yao Ming. Nick Voldemarde. It was like a Ronda Rousey, against Gina Carrano. They capitulated.

This goal by William Asula was followed up by him finding a glove on his person and doing the Michael Jackson thriller dance. I don't know, Joe, who's going to tell him? Ultimately, West Ham are going to get relegated. Good job, you don't have relegation in American sports, Jets fans.

Joe, I'm going to take you north of the border for a second. Stay with me again. We're going to Scotland. Last game of the season. Hearts in purple, attempting to become the first team outside the monopolistic giant, Celtic and Rangers, to win the title in 40 years. It's a bit like the Tennessee volunteers one day winning the SEC. They opened up the scoring. They just had to avoid defeat against Celtic on the last day.

Felt like it might be the greatest moment in Scottish history since the Battle of Bannockburn. But you can't have nice things. Celtic scored three times. A fate, honestly, this is harder to watch than the final scene in Bray. Dave Hart. Sports can be very cruel. And young children watching Morning, Joe. Heart's mistake was to dream. Never dream right, Joe. If you have no ambition in life, you two will never have your heartbroken. Yeah, you know, the more I think about it, the more I know, I have, I need to have a plaque hanging in my house as my kids walk into the home and see over the heart, it's not the hope that kills you. It's knowledge that it's a hope that kills you. That kills you.

Jackson Lamb speaks for all of us, Roger. As Jackson Lamb always, always does, this other great one. It's like trying to teach a dog about Denmark, which I also find very useful with my own patience, Joe. Cathy, good luck in the K-house. There can be no winners in life, only losers. You know that to the English way.

At least somebody's going to win. Hey, on the other hand, at least one. of them's going to win. And I can celebrate with that one. I'll just get to pick the winner. No loyalty. No loyalty from me. And that's how you make it to the top, Katty Kay. I was going to say, how very American of you. Roger Bennett, thank you so much. We need to go to break. But very quickly, Jonathan Lemire, will our Liverpool squad, will they limp over the finish line? or do they fall flat on their face to last week? They're not quite there yet.

Five teams make the Champions League next year. They are currently in fifth, not clinched. They can do it tomorrow if City helps them out. I wouldn't trust Liverpool at all this year. And the subplot there is also dissolves up. There seems to be a mutiny afoot. The players against Arnie, the slot, the coach will see. That's too much to get in.

Another mutiny on your teams? All my coaches. How many other teams do you guys have mutinies? having issues at this particular moment. We'll see. Liverpool needs a little help still to get in. It's just been a dreadful season all around of underachieving.

Still ahead, well, I'm talking about the Red Sox and Liverpool. Still ahead, an incumbent Republican senator gets ousted. We're going to talk about Bill Cassidy's primary election loss over the weekend. Yes, he's the man who gave you RFK Jr. And what it says about Donald Trump's continued grip on the Republican Party. Plus, we're going to be

joined by a lawmaker who left the Republican Party earlier this year. Independent Congressman Kevin Kiley joins us straight ahead to tell us why UkraineAid is so critical for Western freedom. That's when Morning Joe returns. When you hear Trump voters, Alex says, I voted for you three times. He just can't handle the costs. And he's not for this foreign conflict. I hate it.

He's not for the foreign conflict. But Roy in Pennsylvania, he's a. retired farmer, he can't handle the fuel going up. And he's just, he says he's going to come down very fast. And so, look, I'm disappointed. I'm just talking what they said to him. Roy, Alex, we got a problem. We just hit the highest stock market price ever. By the way, then when I went in, now again, it's higher with the war, it's higher than it was when I went. I think of that. I agree. The 401ks at their all-time high. Detroit Free Press, a mistake that you won. While champagne float on the trading floor and President Donald Trump celebrated record highs,

pessimism spread like wildfire outside Wall Street's doors straight into the kitchens of average American families. There is this sense that, you know, something is changing. Whether they can hold on and believe that you're going to get them to know. You know, I have to do what's right. I said to my people, we just hit 50,000 on the Dow, that wasn't supposed to happen for five or six years. I did it in my first year. We just hit 7,000 on the S&P. That wasn't super.

That was even less of a chance of the end of Dow. We just have, we have, it was just announced 401Ks are at the all-time highest that they've ever been. All these things happened. And I said, I'm sorry to do this to you, but we have to stop this group of very crazy people. It's fascinating. President Trump continuing to brag about the stock market in response to rising costs for

Americans during the war with Iran. Welcome back to morning, Joe. It's Monday, May 18th. Jonathan O'Meer, Caddy K. David Ignatius, are with us. Pablo Tori as well in joining the conversation. We're a former White House Communication Director of President Barack Obama, Jen Paul Mary, as well as independent Congressman Kevin Kiley of California. He's a member of the Judiciary and Infrastructure Committee. Thank you all for being with us. Hey, Jen, the president could say two things at once. He could say, I'm very sorry. I know it's very hard for Americans who are struggling with higher gas prices, the highest grocery prices in years.

All of these things are terrible, but we have to make a sacrifice right now. Every American does because Iran can't have nuclear weapons. Kind of does a shortcut, though. And he goes straight to affordability is BS. That's a made-up, funny crisis. It says he's not worried about how Americans are doing. that are struggling with higher prices. And he's now talking about the stock market going high.

I looked at the CBS poll this weekend, and we've seen this trend for a while, but I see that the president's underwater with white non-college Americans. And I just see that number every time, and I'm just jarred by it. But after continuing here to the president, talk down affordability and talk up the stock market, maybe it shouldn't be such a surprise to me. I mean, it is also surprising that number goes down, right? Because that is the base. But I don't know with him if it's the way the question is coming to him, that he can't say what you just suggested,

which is to acknowledge both things are true. This is tough what everybody is going through, but also we're trying to accomplish something in Iran that's important, explain what it is. But it is, but I think, but it's the knee-jerk reaction to being criticized or being told that something's not working that he can't handle. And as much as his base has hung in there with them, I think that they have believed that he understood what stands what their life is like,

and they have believed that he is ultimately on their side. And even at times where the economy hasn't done well, they hung in there with them, but I think the repeated dismissal of how they are feeling and what's actually happening in their lives economically is catching up. Yeah, you know, John Lemire, I just think it's, this is a, this is just a tick in Donald Trump.

He can't say, yes, things are not going as well as we would like them to go. No, inflation is high, prices are high, and that is terrible, and we're going to work on that. But we can't have, as he says, crazy people having a nuclear weapon. You certainly can see other presidents framing it in a way that more Americans might go along with him. But the problem here is there's no. wind and sight to this war. We talked about strikes. Cutter is having real economic problems. You have the UAE getting attacked. Again, fortunately, no radiation leak in that attack. But you have a war that continues to drag on and on, and all signs point higher oil prices and higher gas prices and

higher grocery prices as we get through a war that just continues because there is no easy off-ramp for the president of the United States. No, he's been looking for an off-ram for a while, has not found one. And you're right, it's pathological almost, where Trump simply cannot acknowledge anything is less than perfect. Everything's always got to be the biggest, best, greatest. If he's in charge, that means things are working inherently in his mind. And he's not able to reflect that some people out there are suffering. Let's remember a week of go, he flat out said, I'm paraphrasing only slightly, that he didn't care about Americans' personal finances because of the war in Iran. He was asked about that in that interview. He said it was a

perfect statement. He would say it again. So, Congressman, there are obviously a lot of people who would disagree with that. We see poll after poll suggests that Americans, even Republicans, unhappy with how the president has handled this economy. They think his priorities are misplaced. that has to be something in your district as well. Oh, absolutely. Affordability needs to be absolutely front and center, and it's certainly true in my district. It's especially true in California where we have the highest cost of living in the country, highest gas prices, highest electricity prices.

We're in the top three when it comes to groceries and water and housing. And so it is placing an enormous strain on folks in my state and all across the country. And I understand the idea that you don't want the Iranians to think, well, if you just inflict enough pain on American consumers, then, you know, we'll let you have a nuclear weapon. But at the same time, we need, as policymakers, need to be cognizant of the impact on the cost of living for every single decision we make. And Americans are telling us this is the most important issue right now. You know, David Ignatius, the problem for the president, the problem for working Americans is there's no wind inside. I mean, Donald Trump, more threats

over the weekend. The Iranians continue to mock those threats. Again, our regional allies getting hit. There doesn't seem to be any easy off ramp. I know we've talked about that for weeks now, but there is no wind inside, is there? So, Joe, the president has not found a way to reopen the straight-of-form moves, and that's a big problem, and it's getting worse week by week. It's been around now for months, so I think it tends to recede in our minds. but in terms of a real drag on the global economy, it's only getting worse.

And the present choices are bad in either direction. If he goes back to full-scale war, starts bombing targets all over Iran, takes Cargalland, you know, go down the list of things that he could do, he takes the U.S. deeper into war that the American people seem to feel is another Middle East quagmire. It's not a good option. if he exceeds to Iranian demands for control over the straits, for charging tolls for ships that pass through the strait, that he's obviously reinforcing the power of this hardline regime. I hear talk that the latter, some version of reopening the strait with an understanding that Iran,

which wants to be paid, which wants reparations, is going to take some money out perhaps as part of a, larger authorities, it may be the way that things are heading. But I think the baseline point to the larger discussion that you're having with Congressman Kylie is if the president's going to ask the country for sacrifices that hurt our standard of living, and that's going to happen this summer inevitably because of the energy situation, he has to explain it to the country, to the people. And that continues to me to be mystifying. He simply will. won't make the case in any detail as to why these sacrifices are necessary. He talks about how great 401Ks are. That does not speak to people who are paying more and more for gasoline.

Right. Obviously, the president is focusing now on a nuclear Iran. We can't have a nuclear Iran. And it seems to me he can pivot off of that, David. But like you said, is not doing that. He's just denying affordability is a real problem and says he's not concerned about Americans. I will say, though, he faces a couple of problems because of his past criticisms and the Republican parties' criticisms of how they thought that the Iranians got the better of Barack Obama. If Donald Trump leaves Iran and this war, after how much it's cost to American taxpayers, and Iran has nukes are more control of the strength than they did before the war, that just seems to be a catastrophic political loss and obviously weakens America catastrophically

and strengthens all of our enemies in China and in Russia. Unfortunately, at this moment, it's hard to see an ending to this war that doesn't reinforce at least some of the power of this regime. Their military has been battered. That's absolutely true. But their strategic leverage seems to be, if anything, enhanced. And Trump's going to own that. He's going to come out of this war, having put a lot at risk, significant consequences for the United States, and very little to show for it.

I'd say, just to link up the things we've been talking about over the last hour, it's sort of like this trip to Beijing. She got a lot, and Trump came back with very little. That's around the world. That's a problem that Donald Trump needs to take more seriously. Congressman, can we go back to another story that we've been following this morning, and that is Ukraine, and we were having a discussion with David and Joe earlier about whether the aid package is actually making its way to the Ukrainians or not. You actually gave the vote that forced the discharge position on Ukraine onto the floor. Is it your understanding that America is going to provide this other package of aid to you? Ukraine or not? Well, so we did vote, which is what I think you're referring to a couple years ago for a supplemental.

And of course, you know, that has been going. And there's been questions raised about whether it's, you know, being deployed as expeditiously as it should. But certainly, Congress has spoken in a bipartisan way before saying that we need to support Ukraine, we need to deter Russian aggression. But as I said, that was two years ago. And Congress has not really been actively involved as this conflict has worn on and as so many lives have been lost. So I provided the decisive signature on this discharge position, which is a way to bring a bill to the floor simply by the members of the House demanding it. And so now, yes, in the next couple weeks, we are going to see a vote in the House, which I think

will get pretty broad bipartisan support to say we're going to continue to support Ukraine, we're going to have a lend lease authority, and we're going to have aggressive sanctions against Russia. And then that will go to the Senate. I think it'll give it momentum. And I think ultimately, This could provide the needed leverage to eventually bring this conflict to a close in a way that will, you know, assure that we do not continue to have Russian aggression down the line. So, but Congress, let's stay on the idea of foreign affairs right now. It seems that the president has, I mean, the polls suggest he's out of step of the American people with the war in Iran, with the one in Ukraine that most Americans support Ukraine's cause here.

And yet he reflexively, you know, it seems to be siding with Moscow time and time again. And now there's talk of Cuba. Could be next. I mean, again, this sort of reinforces this idea that not just is he out of touch with what Americans want, but this international adventurism could really have some dangerous consequences and weaken the U.S. on the world stage. Well, I don't know if it's adventurism with respect to the Ukraine-Russia conflict. I mean, this was an act of aggression by Vladimir Putin that sort of undermined the cornerstone of the post-World War II international. Separating that from the other two. Yeah, exactly. And I think that, you know, the president does want the conflict to end, but of course we need it to end in a way that is in the interest of the United States and our NATO allies. And what we've seen is having Congress not engaged for the last couple years has not facilitated that outcome. And so I think that Congress has the capacity now to provide leverage, whether that's to the president or whoever's going to be involved in mediating an end to this conflict, to assure that it's a durable piece. But to your point, I think that that's a totally fair perspective. that Americans are struggling right now.

Gas prices are higher than they've been in a very long time. In California, they were actually higher before the conflicted Iran than they are for the rest of the country now. But for everyone, they've gone up considerably. And so on a day-to-day basis, that's what matters to people. And I think we need to be working in a bipartisan way in Congress to do everything we can. I think the problem is, you know, you had price of inflation during a Democrat presidency and Republicans blamed him. And now people are still feeling this strain during a Republican presidency, and Democrats are blaming him.

So each side is blaming the other for the problem. as opposed to finding way to come together to actually solve the problem. Congress, from the context for your commentary on bipartisanship, of course, is the fact that you left the Republican Party in March. You're now an independent that is not historically a real gangbusters moved to get elected to Congress. Could you explain how that connects to the redistricting conversation and the controversy around how America's maps are being redrawn? Yeah, exactly. There's, I think, been one independent elected Congress in the last 70 years. So, but I think we have a really good opportunity here to change that. I've been very frustrated with the hyperpartisan ship in Congress since I got there a few years ago. And that all kind of came to a head in this redistricting war that's cascaded across the country that I've opposed everywhere in Texas and California in every state that's done it. I actually introduced legislation when this all started saying, let's just not do this. Let's not, let's ban mid-decade redistricting in every state in the country. If that had passed, then we wouldn't be here right now. But as

it is, this is now escalating. And we're going to see many, many more states that are throwing out their map that are returning us to the era of gerrymandering. And it's going to further polarize Congress. It's undermining public trust in our democratic process. It's undermining the very idea of representation. And so my sort of antidote to this was to say, if gerrymandering elevates partisanship above everything else, let's just take partisanship out of the equation. Let's try to, you know, and when you elect your mayor, your city councilor, your district attorney, your sheriff, these are nonpartisan offices. They'd show up to work trying to solve problems

as opposed to aligning with the party agenda. I think maybe we could use a little more of that approach in Congress. And maybe Congress can get above a 10% approval rating or whatever it has right now. That would be a good thing. Independent Congressman Kevin Kiley of California, thank you so much for being with us. Thanks for having.