Morning Joe - Graham Platner drops out of Maine Senate race, who will replace him?

Episode Date: July 9, 2026

July 9, 2026 - 6am:  Graham Platner drops out of race Ukraine ramps up pressure on Russia, strikes Russian oil tankers Picking Graham Platner's replacement U.S., Iran trade strikes for a second day Trump says U.S. will let Ukraine make Patriot missiles Lt. Gen. Mark Hertling (Ret.) talks NATO and Trump MS NOW's Kevin Frey has reaction from Maine voters on Graham Platner dropping out   To listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads, sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

President Putin said, I would love to meet in Moscow. And I said, I don't think, you know, I have to put myself in this position. I don't know that he'd go to Moscow. Maybe he would. Would you go to Moscow? It's difficult. There are a lot of Ukrainian drones today. It's dangerous.

All right. Ukrainian president for Lord of Mayor Zelenskyy, cracking a joke after President Trump put him on. the spot there. Well, well done. May it been a joke, but it's funny because it's true, Willie. I mean, it is for, for years, the Trump administration and people around Trump have been lying about Ukraine, lying about Russia, saying that Russia was going to win the war, that Ukraine, I mean, I literally heard it every week from them. This war's almost over. Ukraine's going to lose.

Yesterday, we finally saw what Ukraine has known for quite some time. They're winning this war. Intel out of Russia suggests maybe economically it's close to being over. I don't think it's close to being over, but man, Russia is in serious trouble right now, and it seems that Donald Trump, who loves winners and hates losers, understands this as well as anybody. Yeah, that was a really striking moment yesterday, Zelensky, that quickly saying, Well, I wouldn't go there because it's not safe because of the offensive position that we Ukraine have now taken. And we've got drones swarming around Moscow at will.

And interesting, too, to watch yesterday, the president, now, again, it may change today. But the president's at least his tone shifting as he sat next to Zelensky. His tone shifting when he talked about the war in Ukraine. He called Ukraine, quote, ingenious in the way that they've developed these drones and prosecuted this war over the last several years. and then talked about allowing them to produce weapons, defensive weapons, patriot missiles, things like that, long on the list of requests from Ukraine. So, again, was it a moment in time? We'll see. But at least yesterday, the President of the United States, really a tone shift in terms of Ukraine and Zelensky. Yeah, we'll get to more on that very significant shift in just a moment. We'll also bring you the latest on the strikes across the Middle East overnight.

coming after President Trump told reporters, the ceasefire was over. So good morning and welcome to morning, Joe. It is Thursday, July 9th. We have a lot of news this morning along with Joe, Willie and me. We've got the co-host of our 8 a.m. hours, staff writer at the Atlantic, Jonathan Lemire. Co-host of the rest is politics podcast.

The BBC's Caddy Kay is with us. And co-host of the weekend, Washington Reporter for MS Now, Jackie Elamaney doing way too early. Judy for us this morning. Thank you very much. Way too early. Way too well. Making us all look bad. Jackie does. And Katty Kay hanging out with the stars at Wimbledon. Katty, it's really, I don't know how you do it. I don't know how you stand the strain of being so beloved on both sides of the pond. So bad. It was such a good day. I was invited to the Royal Box at Wimbledon. I watched the Novak Jockovic match. It went on for five hours.

Can you imagine? He's, what, 40 odd? I was exhausted watching. I had to go get a cream tea in the middle just to give myself a little bit of sustenance. And then I realized that he was still paying. I mean, five hours of tennis and slamming that day.

Anyway, it was a great day. A great day. I would not have been watching tennis because you had Sherlock sitting just the right to the right of you. Benedict Cumberbatch. And the mooch. And the mooch came over. Yeah, it was a, it was just a very good day.

Two of the biggest stars on planet Earth. And before we get to our lead story, I got to say Jonathan, please. That's, you know. Exactly. And he's usually so quiet and retiring. So this would be quite a change for the mooch. But I've got to say, Lamere, a lot of big news coming out of New England,

a lot of huge earth-shattering news. I speak, of course, of your Boston Red Sox, now three games out of the playoffs. Surging Boston Red Sox. Joe, it's a good thing you and I never lost faith in this team. Never once. We have been there from the opening day. We believed. Unwavering confidence that Craig Breslo and the big spending ownership would put together this roster.

Yeah, they're playing better. They swept the Yankees two weekends ago. They then just swept the Angels over the weekend. They've won two in a row against the first place White Sox. Because the American League is so bad this year, we are still in the mix. Maybe that changes their calculus at the trade deadline. But at the very least, it's nice to see them finally play some good baseball. And the pitching's been terrific.

Yeah. I used to say, again, American League's so bad, I would usually say, well, we may end up being the tallest building in Schenectady. I think we're going to change this one to the tallest building in Utica. We'll take whatever we can take. Okay. We will get to the news now. We have a lot to get to, including the top political story this morning. Democrat Graham Platner has suspended his campaign for U.S. Senate in Maine after days of intense political pressure to drop out of the race ahead of Monday's ballot deadline.

His candidacy was thrown into chaos earlier this week after a former girlfriend accused him in the media of sexually assaulting her years ago. Platner has denied those allegations, but the controversy led to a number of top Democrats pulling their endorsements and a mass exodus of voter support. Here's part of the 11-minute social media video that the embattled candidate posted last night. I think as many of you know, over the past couple days, I have faced some very serious allegations, and I just want to make it clear. This is all false. the things that have been claimed did not happen. It's not real. There is a reason that this is happening now.

I only have until July 13th, until I am officially the nominee. This was the last week to try to get me off of the ballot. And that's why this is occurring. It's not the false allegations, though, that have brought us to where we are. It's the fact that they are being used by the political establishment, to put structural pressure on us. We live in a political system that is not built for normal people. It is a system that is built structurally to make sure that movements like ours cannot flourish.

That if they begin to succeed, they can be crushed. We are suspending campaign operations. This is incredibly difficult because, I know that some will think it's an admission of guilt, and it most certainly is not. We're not doing it because of the allegations. We're doing it because of the structures that are being taken away from us by those in power. Okay. All right.

Well, Maine has less than three weeks to find a new nominee. State law requires nominees be selected by the fourth Monday in July. Plotner addressed the replacement process in his announcement. warning that Washington Democrats should not get a say in this. What comes next needs to come from the people. Needs to come from the people of Maine. Needs to come from the voters who on June 9th, at a strength of over 150,000,

the largest number in the history of Maine primaries, said no to this kind of politics. I'm not trying to dictate to anyone who it should be or how we get there, but I will say this. It needs to be open, transparent, and democratic. People in D.C. need to stay in D.C. So, Willie, a couple things. First of all, he denied these charges as clearly and as strongly as you can deny these charges. I've got to say it's fascinating that there are people in the media, people that we know,

are just summarily calling him a rapist now. For Republicans listening, this is something that Meek and I also said about Brett Kavanaugh, so saying that people would come on this network and call Brett Kavanaugh a sexual harasser or a rapist without any due process at all. Perhaps they needed to take a deep breath. That said, regardless of how this was going to play out,

the Democratic Party said, we're not going to support you. They weren't going to fund him. So he had no pathway forward. I just want to say, Willie, I mean, Republicans that are spending their time on Fox News and social media. Oh, yeah. Outraged that Democrats would support, dare support a candidate who was accused of sexual impropriety, even when that candidate vehemently deny that, that is beyond hypocritical. That is, that is just sheer farce. This is, this is even beyond South Park levels of force.

What I am reading on X, what I am reading in social media, what I am seeing on TV after the past decade. And by the way, if you want to talk about morally challenged candidates, you don't have to look at the White House. You don't have to look at Republicans bowing and scraping for the past decade. Just look at Texas. Look at who Republicans are behind. Is there trying to suggest that Tala Rico is gay?

Well, look at Paxson. He's not. I mean, the hypocrisy for, you know, Republicans should just really just shut up. They really should just shut up if they're going to be critical of Democrats for supporting a morally, challenged candidate or one who has been accused of doing things that are morally challenged. It is so hypocritical, Willie, and they should just leave this to the Democrats to clean up their

own house. Yeah, you've had prominent Republicans, including the former Speaker of the House, Kevin McCarthy, coming out and saying, Republicans walk away from candidates with troubling past that include sexual allegations of sexual assault. I mean, come on. I guess they're just hoping that people have such short memories or are too dumb to remember or see in front of them what's happening. So you're totally right about that. They've surrendered the moral high ground a long time ago. So we'll thank them to have a seat in this conversation. But the larger question here at Jackie Alamania, as we listen to Graham Platner defiantly in that statement yesterday, saying these allegations are false, but I cannot move forward because the rug has been pulled out

from under me, despite the fact that won 72% of the primary vote, despite the fact that Maine Democrats, with all these other allegations out there, said they still wanted me to be the nominee. I can't go forward because people in Washington, let's say, for example, the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, led by Chuck Schumer and Kirsten Gillibrand, said, we're not funding your campaign, we're not giving you voter data, we're not going to help you at all. He's saying, I can't move forward. I want to move forward, but I cannot. So now the question will be, how much say does he have in this convention?

for next two and a half weeks that Maine Democrats are scrambling to put together to find a new candidate. How much say will he have or his movement have in who the candidate is? He believes it should look like someone like him in his progressive values. Yeah, and last night was the most public display that we have seen since the political article came out about this allegation of sexual assault of Graham Platner trying to exert some leverage here and have a say in tapping his replacement. I think the thing that he's going to run into, the problem that he's going to run into is, one, this obvious deadline. But two, it's also the lack of institutional support from not the establishment, but his own Mainers, his own supporters. I mean, we've had a

bunch of reporters who have been on the ground in Maine over the last few weeks. Kevin Fry has been there all week who are hearing that four voters, they have sort of crossed the Rubicon here. This has been sort of one infraction to many with this, obviously, being the most serious of a lot of these allegations. But as we walked through yesterday from the allegations, from the stories about his Nazi tattoo to all of these Reddit posts, to then allegations of infidelity, sexting to now this sexual assault allegation, there is a trust deficit that has emerged amongst voters. It might not have appeared in the polling just yet, but I'm not sure that Graham Platner has as much leverage as he thinks he does. And in the process, he is making, again,

not just establishment Democrats, but other Democrats even angrier because he is poisoning the well going forward. He is not necessarily setting up his replacement for success. It's just funny because for that list that Jackie just made, I mean, for some Republicans, that's just a Tuesday, but whatever. You know, there are some. many hypocrisies here that we could go through, but that's not constructive. I'm curious, Caddy Kay, what's your gut on how this went down, especially as it pertains to the media and the Democratic Party? Look, it's really interesting, Mika. I know I've told you my son is living in Rockland, Maine at the moment, and I've been talking to him about he's been to see Graham Platna

campaign. He's been excited about his campaign, and I've been talking to him on and off during the course of the last few weeks. I was up there with him a week ago. And he represents, I think, the view of many kind of younger Mainers who are saying, this is the Democratic Party establishment's fault. And they are kind of blaming Washington for these stories. Now, whether this has taken it one step further than that will be interesting to see. Do we start seeing all of those platinum signs that are all over kind of the more liberal areas of Maine? Do they start to come down now?

There had been polls showing that he was weak. can support with working class main voters, more than he was with college educated, main voters. But it's interesting the degree to which Platter himself and many of his followers are saying this is a story that has come out of Washington and we don't know that we trust Washington, so we don't know that we trust the story. Now, as Jackie says, you can run through that list. I mean, there are now multiple allegations and I think we have always thought when there is a pattern, you take these things more seriously than when there is just one allegation. But for many people who have supported Platner, I think they are still thinking this is about the Democratic Party.

And that's why they liked Platner in the first place because he wasn't out of Washington and he didn't represent the establishment. Yeah, and Jonathan Muir, a couple of things. First of all, on all of these allegations, this kept the last one. Democrats in Maine knew about that. They gave Platner about 75% of the vote. I think he got more votes in a primary. than anybody else. So again, and it's so rich Republicans who've basically been telling us for 10 years, there are no consequences to personal failings, personal faults. Suddenly, suddenly, they've become Jim and Tammy Faye Baker. They are shocked and stunned and deeply saddened. Jesus wouldn't approve of this. And yet, what have they been doing for 10 years? What? What is their Texas

Canada been doing his entire political life. The self-righteousness. Oh, they should be so ashamed. But you know they aren't because they haven't been for 10 years. When you have somebody like Kevin McCarthy that can go on the floor after January the 6th and blame a riot, an insurrection, an attempt to overthrow an American election on Donald Trump and then get on Fox News and go, well, we Republicans, if somebody does anything wrong. I don't know I'm doing Lindsey Graham. It just comes

natural. We get rid of them. That was more of a Lindsey Graham than I don't think I can do Central California. Let me work on that. But I will say this. And this is just a word of warning to Democrats in Washington, D.C. Grant Platner was losing support with independence, no doubt about it. But I will tell you, Meek and I have heard nothing. Let me underline that. Nothing but support from Maine Democrats on the ground for Platner. Platner signs are still up. They think that this is, this is Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries and the Washington establishment coming to get him. They all have the same story. They started hearing 10 days ago that people were coming up to Maine and they were desperate to try to get Platner off the ballot because they thought

Susan Collins had too much on him and would destroy him. I will tell you without revealing any names that we have been bombarded by phone calls and text messages from people who want Graham Platner off the ballot who are high up in Maine politics. And we've been getting that for the last two weeks. So why do I say this? because there's a conspiracy. No, not at all. Go back to what I said at the beginning. A warning to Washington Democrats. You do need to listen to Graham Platner because whether it's true or not, just as Caddy said about her son who has been working on this campaign, rank and file Democrats who have been supporting Platner from the very beginning think that this was cooked up

in Washington, D.C. with with a lot of money behind it to find anything that could be found to get Graham Black Platner off the ballot. And I will say, we know nothing about that. We just, Meek and I have been scratching our heads for the last couple of weeks going, why are we getting all these calls about Graham Platner needing to be off the ballot? 73-year-old woman who is just... Like, constant. constant calls. So anyway, that's what Democrats on the ground in Maine believe.

So Washington needs to stay out of this. And Maine Democrats need to figure out who is going to replace Graham Platner on the ballot. And if Washington thinks they can micromanage this and fix this, they need to listen to what Caddy Sun said, because they're going to, They're going to piss off their base, and their base won't come out and vote in the general election. They just won't. Yeah, we should not underestimate the excitement that Platner instilled in people, including voters who had told reporters in Maine, they hadn't voted in a while.

But they found a connection with him. For all of his flaws, and there are obviously many, he was a charismatic, a talented political athlete. People were drawn to him, and his messaging worked, and it's reflective. and we've seen this across the country right now. There's sort of a, not a civil war, but a real debate in the Democratic Party and about which direction to go. And there's real energy on the progressive side,

the anti-establishment side. We saw it in Colorado. We've seen it in New York. We've seen in other races saying, we're tired of same old, same old. Some of it is about age and generation, but some of it is about charisma energy and speaking to the issues that matter to voters.

like charging up new voters, progressive voters. And there are some Democrats very nervous about that. And certainly, you're right. I received a lot of these same concerns. There was institutional opposition to Platner within the Democratic Party. Now, some of that is because they feared other scandals were coming, and obviously that ended up being correct.

But there was more to it. And there really is a Washington feels very isolated from the rest of the Democratic Party throughout the rest of the country right now. And I think as we look, this main looks to replace Platner, they're going to have to be careful, to your point, because they risk losing some voters. But if they think that the next nominee is just sort of handpicked from D.C. or someone, you know, who doesn't resemble Platner at all, there's a chance Plattern will lose some of that support. When Susan Collins does appear vulnerable at a moment when Democrats at least look like they've got a real chance to have a wave this November. Yeah.

Washington was scared. Washington was scared. And again, this has nothing to do with the allegations and whether they're true or not. And again, that is something that, you know, over time, people can sort through everything and figure it out. I will tell you, though, in all my years in politics, I have never once when a candidate won a primary overwhelmingly. I've never once seen in a Senate race or a congressional race, I'd never had people calling. I've never. I've never had people like 10 days, two weeks out, basically saying, we're going to try to get him off the ballot. We're, we're, we're, we're like sending people up to Maine and, and basically, we're going to go through all of Maine because we think there's more and we're going to find more and we have two weeks. We have 10 days. We have eight days to get him off the ballot. That's what they were saying before these allegations came out. Well, he's off the ballot. So, if we've been hearing this as outsiders,

imagine what Democrats on the ground in Maine have been hearing. So we'll see what happens. We'll revisit this soon. We'll revisit this soon, yeah. We'll get to more because I do have some reflections on the allegations from Maine voters. Jackie Alamani, thank you very much for coming on this morning. We'll see you soon. And still ahead on morning, Joe, the latest on the growing tensions in the Middle East.

As the United States and Tehran trade new strikes overnight, Plus, amid the president's continued calls for more defense spending by NATO, our next guest says Trump's fixation on percentages has distorted what an alliance is and how members should address the matter. Retired Army Lieutenant General Mark Hurdling joins us with more on that. We'll be right back. Look, we're celebrating 250 years. The one thing I know about Republicans, when we had a very bad candidate and found out, we didn't vote for that person. We walked to it. For better or for worse. When Matt Gates came forward, we got rid of them. Two months ago, we had 100, I told this story yesterday, we had 111 missile shot by the Islamic Republic of Japan.

They were shot at the aircraft carrier over a period of about one hour. 111 missiles going to a very expensive ship, and every one of those missiles was knocked down. That's surprisingly yesterday with the soup of the tongue mixing up. Iran and Japan. Let me tell you, Willie, I am not the best man to cast stones at somebody who mixes things up, especially after a transatlantic flight. I mean, I still, you know, about every three times I'm talking about Macron, I call him Middron. When poor Jack Scarborough has to watch me, watch me watching the Red Sox at night, I'll be sitting there and we'll be talking and go, Who's that guy that hit the home? He'll go Ortiz. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And we had that kid reminds me of that. Who's that left hand? Ted Williams. Yeah, yeah, Ted Williams. It really is towards your far. But so I'm not going to criticize anybody who has to sleep in the tongue like that, again, especially after not getting sleep. That said, if Joe Biden had said that.

Oh my God. The world would come to an end. We would be like they would say put electrodes up to his brain right now because obviously the 25th Amendment must be put into effect at once. The double standard, I get to bite my tongue because I want to say something, but I'm not going to say something, but I cannot wait for certain people to write books about how we knew all along. We knew all along. He was demented. We knew all along. And how could we have just sat there and sat back and said that it happens. It happens. But we can say that.

But the Republicans can never say that about Joe Biden. No. And you could make that point several times per day. If you listen to the remarks that the president gives, the long speeches he gives, the rants he goes on, the rambling. You know, a slip of the tongue, Japan, Iran. He called President Zelensky President Putin yesterday. You know, it happens in the course of a day, I guess.

But you're right, the side by side, the comparison and the moniker of Sleepy Joe for a president who often falls asleep in public. You can do this all day if you want to. But there are weightier issues because the war with Iran has stepped up again. The United States, again, launching strikes across Iran last night, just hours after President Trump said he, believe the ceasefire is over. U.S. Central Command says it hit 90 targets, including missile and drone sites near the Strait of Hormuz, in an effort to further degrade Iran's ability to threaten shipping in that key waterway. Iranian state media and the IRGC also reported strikes on bridges in the country, which would be the first attacks of its kind from the United States

since April Iran's health ministry says the two days of U.S. strikes now have killed at least 14 people and wounded dozens more. President Trump called yesterday strikes retribution for Iran's attacks on commercial vessels. Warning on social media, if it happens again, it will get much worse. Iran hit back attacking U.S. bases in Kuwait and Bahrain for a second night with the country's parliamentary speaker and top negotiator issuing the warning to U.S., quote, if you strike, you'll get hit. As tensions and rhetoric ramp up again, President Trump was asked yesterday, why his opinion of Iran's leaders seem to have changed. Last month, you said Iranian leaders were very rational people, nice people to deal with,

strong people, smart people. Today, you said they were scum, sick people and being led by sick people. What changed and do you think they're... I got to know. I've said that about a lot. Now, when you say rational, I think they're much more rational than level one, level two. Level one is gone. Level two is gone.

This is level three. I think they are more rational, but based on their actions over the last week or two, they're not doing a service to the people. And I think more than anything else is I got to know them. And I'm not sure I want to make a deal with them. We can play games, but I'm not sure I want to make a deal. Let's just finish the job. Join us now, Decorated Combat Veteran, former commander of U.S. Army Europe,

retired Army Lieutenant General Mark Hurtling. He is an MS now military analyst general. Great to have you with us, as always. That flimsy memorandum of understanding has proven to be quite that flimsy over the last couple of weeks and now seems to have fallen apart. No negotiations. President Trump suggesting yesterday that Jared Kushner and Steve Whitkoff should just come home. It's a waste of time, he says, to talk to the Iranians, who he's now calling scum. What do you make of these new attacks by the United States and the attacks from Iran, which, again, go to American bases and threaten neighbors and allies of the United States in the Gulf?

Well, Willie, it gets back to the point you made at the very beginning, that it is not a ceasefire. It is a memorandum of understanding to start discussions. And there haven't been a whole lot of meat put on that bone of that agenda of the memorandum of understanding. So when ships started moving through the straight again, which Iran said they wanted to talk about during the meetings that would be held as a result of the memorandum of understanding, they were violated. what Iran believes is their territory. So it is just, you know, when the president says we're just going to bring people home, and when he again says, hey, these people are scum and we don't want to deal with them, it's only digging the whole deeper.

All wars end in some type of diplomatic measure. And if you don't have the capability to talk and get something accomplished, military force is not going to provide any kind of relief from the kinds of issues we've been seeing over the last four months or so. So General Hurtling, I co-wrote a piece for the Atlantic on this that came out last night. And in it, we quote a Middle East expert who fears that these two countries may, quote, sleepwalk our way back to war, that it's going to be this like low-level tit-for-tat and, you know, escalation or then retaliation. and it will grow back into more open hostilities. Now, President Trump, as we have seen so often, doesn't really want to do that.

Even yesterday, even after authorizing these two nights of strikes made clear, like, well, this could be over quickly. You know, he made sure to say that he wants his negotiators to keep talking. But as long as the Strait of Hormuz is in Iran's hands, and this is where I want you to get way in, it seems like fundamentally there can't be an agreement because as we report in the story, the White House nearly every day is getting calls from their allies in the Gulf. the other states there, who frankly have taken the brunt of Iran's attacks, who simply say it is unacceptable for us to pay tolls to use the straight-of-moose.

We're not going to refill Iran's coffers after they've pummeled us for weeks. Yeah, the issue hasn't been addressed, Jonathan, and I've read your piece. It's very good. And it goes back to the point that this is asymmetric warfare. Military activities by both sides. And by the way, the president still refuses to call this a war. and by very definition of what a war is, armed conflict between opposing parties, this is a war. It's not a military operation or a denuclearization, as he said in the press conference yesterday.

When you have these kinds of things going on without adequate discussions and through diplomacy, Iran has the upper hand in both information and economics, two of the powers of any nation. So if they control the straight and there are no ships willing to go through because of insurance purposes, they are still, they have the upper, they have the advantage. Let's just put it that way. And the president just returning to strikes is just more of the same. And you're looking to execute military operations to try and get to an objective. The objective hasn't been defined. The president's all over the map still on what the end state requirement is.

He said yesterday it was denuclearization and then proceeded to say that all the nuclear dust was buried underground and Iran could never get to it. It is all about economics right now. And, you know, you have to solve that through diplomatic talks and that's not happening. All right, General, if you could stand by and everybody stay right there. After a brave, we're going to move to Ukraine and another major shift in that war. We'll be right back. It's unbelievable. President Trump says the U.S. will allow Ukraine to manufacture Patriot Air Defense Systems

appearing to grant one of Kiev's biggest requests as Russia intensifies its missile attacks. Ukraine says it is running low on interceptors and more than 50 people have been killed in Russian strikes this week. Trump announced the move after meeting with Ukrainian President Volomir Zelensky at the NATO summit. The company that makes them, which is building now four plants, you know, all of our companies, we'll be able to do this in two to three months if you order a patriot. Now you have to wait a long time for them. Same thing with Tom Hawks. We have a lot of certain equipment, but with the, they call it the elite equipment,

and you don't need elite equipment necessarily for a war. So what are the things we're going to be talking about is we're going to give a license to you to make Patriots? That's pretty cool, right? This way he can't complain that we're not giving them enough. I say, make them yourself. While Trump said Ukraine would get a license to build the missiles, he acknowledged U.S. defense companies haven't yet been informed. And experts say it could take years before Ukraine is able to produce the sophisticated interceptors.

So Kati K, it's one thing to say that you can get these systems. Sounds like the actual action of getting them might take a lot longer. Yeah, and this is something, Mika, that the Ukrainians really do need. And we've seen it this summer. It's been brutally attacks with missiles from Russia into Ukraine that have really hit civilian areas and killed many Ukrainians. And that's why they so desperately need these interceptors. But General, let me ask you this, because in a way, these Patriot missiles

are what links the war in Ukraine and the war against Iran, because it was in the war against Iran that we ran down our supplies, that our Gulf allies ran down their supplies. Now we don't have that many. And even if we give the Ukrainians what they've been asking for, which is the license to make these Patriot Interceptors, the latest version of them in Ukraine, how long to Zelensky and Mekers' point,

how long is that going to take? Because they need these now. This is this summer is when they are really getting hit by Russia. Yeah, the devils are in the details, Katty. when I saw the press conference and the president announced that yesterday, the hair is on the back of my neck stood up. And the reason why is because he was using the example of an aircraft carrier, a point target, which has its own air defense system, defending against a hundred or so drones and a couple of missiles coming in. All very good action by the U.S. Navy. But when you're talking about Ukraine, a country the size of Texas with many point targets throughout the area, you need a lot of.

lot of air defense. And when the president says, hey, we're going to give you a license, Raytheon isn't going to go in the ground right now because they're, you know, it's the same thing as the Strait of Hormuz with ships. They're going to have insurance requirements for what they build there. If they put a brick in the ground in Ukraine right now to start a factory for Patriot missiles, it will take probably a few months to get that factory up and then the production of Patriots are, as you said, are probably going to take. months, if not years. It's a very technologically advanced weapon system, as we all know. So during this period time, the question then becomes, will the United States continue to

provide air defense systems, or are we just going to use the fact that we gave them a license as a reason to back away? And yes, we see Russia on the verge of collapse in this war. There has been an inflection point over the last couple of months with the capabilities of Ukraine linking battlefield operations to long range strikes and it's hurting Russia. They've hit every single oil production plant inside of Russia. Russia has not met any of the five strategic objectives they had that I wrote down in my hotel room in New York on the 24th of February 2022. and Ukraine just keeps growing. But they are still losing people. And in the case of Ukraine, the people they are losing are mostly civilians with the

strikes by the missiles and drones that Russia are using. So Ukraine is gaining an upper advantage. There's a lot of devils in the details for this Patriot missile deal. They need a whole lot more than just patriot missiles. And I'm not sure that this is more of a canard by the president. General, there's been a lot of talk at this NATO summit about spending. Who's paying for what? German Chancellor Friedrich Merz talked about NATO spending yesterday, suggesting

President Trump was justified in demanding European allies increase their defense spending. According to reporters, the German leader, called it unacceptable that the U.S. is spending 80% on mutual defense while Europe covered the other 20%. Merck was quoted as saying, the age of freebies for Europe is over. That's from the German chancellor. In general, your latest piece in the bulwark is titled the NATO defense spending canard. You write in part, defense spending is not unimportant as many NATO members neglected their military capabilities for far too long after the end of the Cold War.

But President Trump's fixation on percentages and on money generally has distorted the discussion of what an alliance is, how NATO generates collective strength, and what the members must do together to address the increasingly complex security environment they face. the spending debate has become a canard, not because nations should spend less on defense, but because the suggestion that a single fiscal measurement can determine whether a country is a good ally or whether NATO is becoming stronger substitutes accounting for strategy. In general, as you know, this is the way that President Trump has always looked at these alliances as a business transaction.

What are we getting out of the deal for what we're paying? So can you just underline the importance outside of who's paying for what of this alliance? Yeah, the defense spending issue, Willie, is very important. When I was commanding in Europe in 2013, it was a critical element. And Secretary Gates started the discussion about getting allies to the 2% level. The president who repeatedly says all of the allies are now reaching 5%. That's just untrue. There are no allies. There's no NATO country that's reaching 5%. The highest is Poland at 4.2% of GDP spent toward their military. But even that was something that started in 2004. When you know the history of what's going on, you can kind of push back on what the president is saying. And by the way,

the United States only spends 3.5 percent about on their military off their GDP. So even we aren't meeting that 5 percent. And certainly not all of it is going to our defense of European alliances. So, yeah, this is all important, but you have some countries in NATO, like I'm going to use the example of Estonia, one of the smaller countries. They are not spending over 3% right now, and yet they provide an incredible capability not only in special operations forces, which are relatively cheap to train and build, but also in cyber defense because of the Russian actions against that country back in 2007. They have become masters and they hold the NATO Cyber Center of Excellence inside of their capital. So, you know, it isn't a catch-all for everyone. Norway, Finland. I mean, you can talk about the contributions of every single country, which I work very hard to do as follow-on commanders did along with me,

to get different spending levels and get the capabilities of the NATO countries up to what they could contribute. but it isn't everyone buying a conventional force of tanks and artillery and drones and those kind of things. Each one of the 32 allies have a niche capability and they all contribute greatly and there's a whole lot of challenges which they face. And some of those things we're not even aware of as Americans of how much they contribute. Retired Army Lieutenant General Mark Hurdling, thank you as always for coming on the show this morning. We really appreciate it. Take care. And coming up, the latest on Republican Senator Mitch McConnell's health as the governor of Kentucky pushes for transparency. And as we go to break, a quick look at the Travelers

Forecast this morning from Accuethers Bernie Raynow. Bernie, how's it looking? Steamy with the return of storms, Mika. Although the AccuWeather forecast, let me show thunderstorm in Boston until this evening. But this afternoon, drenching thunderstorms, Albany, New York City, Philadelphia, downward Washington, D.C. Also, some storms, Green Bay, Chicago, toward Detroit. While there will be thunderstorms across the southeast, they're very spotty today.

You can see the heat building, though, in Dallas, in Oklahoma City with highs over 100 degrees. Delays today in Atlanta, also delays in New York City in Philadelphia. To help you make the best decisions, there'll be more in the know, download the Accuether App today.

Live look at Bar Harbor, Maine for you. At a few minutes before the top of the second hour of morning Joe, welcome back. Turning back to Maine's Senate race, now that Democratic nominee Graham Plotner has officially ended his campaign, the party is looking for someone to replace him. Democrats have less than three weeks to find a new candidate by July 27th. That's the deadline. In an emergency meeting yesterday, members voted in favor of a nominating convention process to select the new nominee. The date of the expedited convention has not been set just yet, but will reportedly

feature 500 delegates from the state's counties. State party executive director, Devin Murphy Anderson, spoke last night with Lawrence O'Donnell about what comes next. The process that we have put in place to convene a nominating convention, what's the voted on by those Maine Democrats. And that vote passed with over 82% of the vote, which is a full endorsement of the direction that we are taking to replace this nominee. We are of course going to require folks to talk to Maine voters in some way that's going to qualify them to be our U.S. Senate nominee beyond just declaring their intent. What that will

most likely look like is petition collection from Maine Democratic voters across the state. Let's go live to Bangor, Maine and MS now congressional reporter Kevin Fry. So, Kevin, talk about, first of all, the reaction you're seeing in Maine from Maine voters, and then I'd love to hear more analysis on the next steps here and how that's going to play out. Yeah, I mean, the general sense from, for example, one voter I was talking to last night, who I met the last time I was here a couple weeks ago, who was already kind of frustrated with the slew of stories that was coming out against Platner, about Plattenor's past, was finally, she texted me last night,

finally we can turn the page on all of this and maybe get a nominee without so much baggage being the implication. At the same time, there is a nervousness among some voters, amongst some Democrats, that, of course, all of this chaos of the last couple weeks could spell trouble for their effort to finally unseat Susan Collins in November. That, of course, has been an ambition that's gone back two decades now for Democrats here in Maine. Nonetheless, one of the things that kind of stood out to me from Graham Platner's remarks last night in that 11-minute video was how much he continued to lean into this message that this was the party going after him, trying to get him out of the way, and by inference, basically trying to eliminate the voices of those that supported him.

Now, will all voters rally behind that sort of call? It doesn't seem that way. There have been plenty that I have spoken to over the last several days who have basically said when I press them, like, if it's not Platner, if it's someone else, even if it's not as, you know, with the same platform that Platner may have espouse, would you still vote for them or would you sit out? And they were essentially like, well, I'm still going to vote for the Democrat, of course. But if there are some folks and we have found them here in Maine who will still be susceptible to that, our country. that this is all about the Democratic Party trying to push Plattenor out of the way, that he rallied against the party so much that they're trying to get rid of him. There are at least some voters, at least that I've talked to over the last several days,

where that will resonate with them. So will the messaging from last night have an implication? There's a possibility. The other thing, when you mentioned kind of the next steps here, they have about 18 days now to try to figure out who their nominee is going to be by that deadline. One of the things to keep an eye on, as you mentioned, is that over the next few days, we expect the various county parties to come up with their delegates. Will McDuffie and I, one of our other MSNL reporters, were told, as you mentioned, between 500, 600 delegates.

We don't know where that convention is going to take place or the exact timeline. But part of the argument from the party is that they're trying to be, as they phrase it, transparent. That is trying to, you can kind of read the tea leaves here, appease the Graham Platner folks and also his supporters to suggest that they're not being pushed aside. So, that is at least where we are today. We will be talking to more voters as the day proceeds to get a sense of kind of how the temperature is here on the ground, though. Willie?

In that video, Platner is saying categorically that the allegation against the most recent is false and that he believes this election where he won 50 by 53 points with 72% of the vote is being taken from him by the Washington establishment. Congressional reporter for MS now, Kevin Frye, reporting live for us from Bangor, Maine. Kevin, thanks so much. We've crossed the top of the hour just after 7 o'clock here in New York City. Jonathan Lemire, Mike Barnacle joins the table as well. President Trump was asked for his take on the Platner scandal yesterday aboard Air Force One.

Here's what he said. Well, so he won the primary. And others use your allegations. It's very hard for them to do. And surely your question of whether or not you believe the woman. A lot of people say big falsehoods. It's, he's in a bind. He's in a bind.

But should they be able to do it? I guess he's going to lose. I would imagine he's going to lose. President Trump aboard Air Force One, saying a lot of people spread falsehoods, perhaps referring to some of his own allegations against him. Let's bring in senior political correspondent at Wired. Hugo Lowell.

He's looking at how Republican operatives say they are confident Senator Susan Collins will hold her seat, no matter who replaces Graham Platner on the ticket. Hugo, it's great to see you. Welcome back to the table. So let's talk about this because I think you're right that Republicans thought even if Plattenor were, remained on the ballot. They liked their odds in Maine with Susan Collins, but they are now

sort of enjoying, as Kevin Frye just described it, the chaos that will ensue for the next couple of weeks here. I think that's correct. I think Republicans, you know, in general, wanted, planted to remain in the race because of all the baggage that came with that campaign. But it's pretty clear at this point that he obviously is not going to be in it, and they're going to have to find a new candidate. And it's not like Trump Baud is any more precedent than anyone else, and it's not like they know what's coming. But there are. are two things that they are looking at. One is, can they find a Democratic replacement who can carry that same progressive message forward without the baggage being tagged on their backside?

You know, if you look at some of the candidates that are kind of popping up as frontrunners, someone like Troy Jackson, you know, the former state Senate senator in Maine, you know, he was endorsed by platinum to be the government. So he still has platinum ties. People like Shanabellos, main secretary of state whose real record is trying to get Trump off the primary battle in 2023. Like, that might be great for Democrats in a special election, but is it going to

be particularly convincing in a general? Like, that's the sort of things Trump what is looking at. And then there's the fundraising thing. Is there enough of a cloud now over this race that Democrats might feel kind of leery of putting money behind the replacement candidate? And it's a very expensive

race. You know, at impact, think this will be a 300 million plus race. So, you know, 150 million each, you know, you're going to have to, there's some difficult decisions for Democrats to make because the DSCC is at a $10 million cash on on hand of disadvantage compared to Republicans. And a lot of this is going to have to be now raised from small dollar donors. And that's a really big deficit to cover. Mike, you understand Maine very well. It's not just the progressive message. It was the package it came in with Graham Platner, all the scandals previous to this one that led him to leave their race, by and large, Maine voters said, okay, I don't like it, but I'm willing to stick with this guy.

He seems like one of us. He's a veteran. He's an oyster fisherman, all the things we know about him. He doesn't look like a politician. So it will be important who comes next year. Well, the interesting thing is you speak to some people in Maine, and they tell you that Platner could still win if he had stayed in the race. Now, I don't know whether that's the case or not. But this is on Graham Platner. I mean, he knew all of these things were potentially out there. and the fact that he didn't step up and address it once and for all a couple of months ago is kind of ridiculous. But to your point, this is an incredibly short runway for any nominee who is now on the ballot in November, running for the United States Senate against Susan Collins, who according to people you talk to,

is very beatable in Maine. But we're talking about maybe a six-week window now to run against her, really, when people focus on the election. What do your people tell you about the short runway, the danger of the short runway? Well, I think in the main, I think Trump Wall thinks the short runway is beneficial for Collins. You know, I think their takeaway is Democrats have to run a perfect race now. From here on now, they have to run a perfect race. There's obviously been anything but that in the previous few weeks. There is the sense, though, that Collins could just eke out of victory because she won in 2008.

She won in 2020. She bucked Joe Biden's win. They see her as some like the least offensive Republican candidate out there that they could have possibly fielded. So I think they like their chances. But again, it's, you know, it's all marginal bearer right now. And if there is room to, if there is room to pick up a seat in the Senate, this is one of them. Yeah. Well, I would think, Katty Kay, if you want to look at any state that the Democrats have a chance of winning, a generic Democrat.

I mean, you know, the old saying in the South, a yellow dog Democrat, if you ran a yellow dog against a Republican that win, you can say that about Maine. I mean, Joe Biden won Maine by nine points. Kamala Harris, I think, won it by five. Republicans haven't won the state since 1988, I think, in a presidential election. This really isn't a purple state, except for when it comes to Susan Collins. And so it seems to me at this point, after all of this chaos, the Democrats' best hope is to find a generic candidate to put next to Susan Collins because, yes, she's strong in Maine. But of all the chances for pickups, Maine still has to be at the top of the list for Democrats. Which I guess was Janet Mills' argument all along, right, Joe? I mean, we had her on the program, and that's what she, the case that she was trying to make, that what you want in Maine is not.

not actually a Graham Platner. I mean, maybe Graham Platner is more of a Montana candidate. Maybe he's more of a West Virginia candidate. The average voting age, I was speaking to Maine politician, who said to me the average voting age is 52. The demographic you're trying to win over in Maine as a Democrat are those middle-aged female voters who lean Democratic but have voted for Susan Collins a couple of cycles

and like her because she comes across as a moderate republic. those are the people that you're trying to win back again if you really want to win the race in rain. And I think those are going to be the discussion. It's going to be interesting to see how does that discussion now carry forward to other states? How does it carry forward to the Michigan race for the Senate seat there? So I think the Democratic Party has a lot of questions to ask. And these are big questions about populism and energy and generational shift as we've been talking about. And to some extent, about policy.

And what does Maine do now for that wing of the demand? Democratic Party that feels the energy, but has taken such a knock in its actual ability or its attempt to try and win a race in Maine. Yeah. Very good points. Senior political correspondent at Wired, Hugo Lowell, thank you very much for coming on this morning. His latest reporting is available to read online now. And still ahead on Morning Joe, the latest on the renewed strikes between the U.S. and Iran and why Lebanon could be the bigger problem for hopes of ending the war. Plus, former Homeland Security Secretary Jay Johnson argues, quote, the Constitution's intended balance between the legislative and executive branches on the matters of war powers is broken.

He joins us with that part of the story. We'll be right back.