Morning Joe - Inside the 'tense' U.S. - Iran talks

Episode Date: June 22, 2026

June 22, 2026 - 7am: Inside the 'tense' negotiations between the U.S. and Iran Trump claims "vandals" damaged the Lincoln Memorial reflecting pool Alan Greenspan dies New book teaches Americans what’s REALLY in the U.S. Constitution   To listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads, sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Welcome back to Morning Show, beautiful skyline over Washington, D.C. looking straight at, I guess that's the reflecting pool. President Trump says the work there is going to begin immediately to fix the Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool, which has faced probably. It's still the reflecting pool. It's just a mess. It's a mess. An absolute mess. Who would ever think a no-bid contract would lead to a mess like this? I guess, anyhow, problems. Other channels, they're talking about vandalism. Yeah, their camera's up 24-7. He got a kayaker. And they're blaming a kayaker for all of this. I mean, really was the work so poorly done that a kayaker could destroy all of this? That's a good question.

I mean, really, it's incredible. Especially with the president saying a couple weeks ago that it's so strong that somebody could come with a knife. Yeah. Be fine. But, yeah, it's not going well. And now they're trying to arrest people saying, oh, they're the reason. why this no-bid contract is such a mess. No, it's a mess because it's a no-bid contract. And somebody who couldn't do it, the job properly was given the job on a no-bid contract.

Days after the project's completion carried out at Trump's request, the pool's water turned green from an algae bloom. And then the new blue paint liner began peeling off the bottom. Trump took to social media on Friday writing that vandals trying to destroy the work had damaged the pool without providing evidence. Also on Friday, Park Police arrested former Olympic canoe competitor David Hearn on a misdemeanor charge of destruction of government property. Though he told the Washington Post,

he simply reached into the water after noticing a part of the pool's liner had come loose. On Saturday, Trump posted a park police, the Park Police had arrested many additional people for vandalizing the pool. But Park officials have not responded to evidence. Jonathan Lear.

I think there's another vandalism issue. What's that? I think somebody put the tarp up at the Kennedy Center. Oh, yeah, that is. And it's like hanging over the Kennedy Center. Somebody did vandalize the front of the Kennedy Center. Last month, the Interior Department hired a Virginia-based Atlanta, Atlantic Industrial Coatings to repair the pool, bypass standard federal bidding requirements. The president said publicly he recommended the firm because of the good work they did on his swimming pools at one of his golf clubs. Jonathan and Mary, Katie Kay is still with us, and let's bring in right now.

President Beretis of Counsel in Foreign Relations, Richard Haas, he's the author of Substack Hewman, away. Also, of course, our golf analyst and also MSNANO national affairs analyst, John Heilman, he's a partner and chief political columnist at Puck. Just FYI, J.D. Vance is going to be speaking in Switzerland with the latest on the Iran talks. Can't wait to hear that. Can't wait to do that.

Yeah, we're going to get to Iran really quickly, but Jonathan O'Meer, this reflecting pool thing, it was an open contract. The guy had no right to get this deal. tell it from the very beginning. And now they're trying to pretend and other channels are trying to pretend that vandals cause this algae and a kayaker. And a kayaker, an Olympic kayaker. It is, okay, we've moved to just straight farce right now. Like, the people of South Park would be, like, be embarrassed to put this in, like, a plot because nobody, it would be so bizarre, nobody would believe it. Yeah, the metaphor for how things are going for the Trump

administration right now is it's too on the nose. Like, you can. couldn't write this. But it's reminiscent of what we saw in the first term. Remember the hurricane map and Trump literally claimed that Alabama was in the danger zone and it wasn't true and they took the map and he wrote on a Sharpie

and then he had the government try to reverse engineer the idea that yes, Alabama actually had been in damage because he couldn't admit a mistake. That's what's happening here. Right. His no big contract, they screwed up. And now they're inventing this whole story around it to try to justify

by what the president said. And it took also, Mika, I know this will hit home for you, a tragic turn because one of the botched efforts to fix this over the last couple of days, now they're gonna have to drain the whole thing. But a few days ago, they poured, and workers poured this sort of hydrogen peroxide into the waters there.

It only helped on the edges. The edges turned blue. The middle of it was still very green, but the water's still toxic, and they spotted yesterday a couple of dead ducks in the water. So they're now even killing wild life. because of this.

Oh. And now just straight from Ferris Bueller's Day off, now water towers across the greater Washington area have saved Ducky all over them. No, seriously, that's terrible. It is terrible. Negotiations are from Ducks to being in bad shape. Negotiations are expected to continue in Switzerland. That's not what I was going to say.

In Switzerland today, after 18 hours of discussion yesterday, involving J.D. Vance, Iran's parliamentary leader, along with mediators from Pakistan and Qatar. Iran's state media is reporting the country's parliamentary leaders on his way back to Tehran and that Iran's deputy foreign minister will lead a technical team still at the Swiss report. So Richard Os, let's talk about this. You have the Pakistanis claiming one thing. Oman claiming another thing.

Here's the bottom line. And it's been this way, as you know, for 15 years. enrichment is a red line for Iran. They're not going to back off of that. They would have if Donald Trump had won this war, but he didn't. So they're not going to back off of enrichment. And meanwhile, you have the Israeli people, not even Benjamin Netanyahu. He's feeling betrayed and abandoned.

But the Israeli people are feeling abandoned. And they are demanding that Netanyahu respond in Lebanon. respond in Iran and basically ignore what the president is demanding of him. This is, this is obviously a mess. Where are we this morning and where do you expect this to go? Well, it is a mess, Joe. And guess what? It's going to stay a mess. You can't have a document as short and as vague as this MOU is and not expect that every single issue, which was not negotiated, is going to be negotiated. And then you're going to have all the back and forth about whether people are actually doing. So Iran is going to exercise some right to enrich to be determined what the ceiling is.

Richard, I'm sorry to interrupt you. We have to go to Switzerland. J.D. Vance is speaking with an update on the Iran talks. Let's listen in. The coordination mechanism so that we could demine the straits of Hormuz so that when there are the conflicts that inevitably come up, we can make sure we work through them rather than that leading to escalation. And that is exactly what we did yesterday. Number two, we also wanted to build a mechanism, a similar mechanism, for deconfliction for the regional ceasefire. As the president of the United States, as himself said, sometimes these ceasefires just mean you're shooting a little bit less. but we wanted to make sure that we had the proper coordination set up so that if there is shooting, if Hezbollah fires at Israel or if Israel responds, if there are other conflicts that arise in the region,

we're actually talking to each other and figuring out how to stop the shooting, how to make the region safer, our allies, and everybody else. We set that up as well. Number three, we, and this is probably what we're most excited about as Americans, the Iranians have agreed to invite IAEA inspectors, back into their country. That is a major milestone for the American people and the first step in permanently denuclearizing or permanently ending a nuclear weapons program in Iran. And that's exactly what we wanted to do. That's exactly what we asked to happen. We made a lot of great progress on other nuclear talks. And that leads me to the final thing that we wanted to accomplish, which is actually set up the process for the technical negotiations that will follow. Our teams working with the Iranians,

Tataris and the Pakistanis made great progress yesterday. They will continue to work at the technical level with the teams here in Bergenstock. And then those technical negotiations are going to continue over the weeks and days to come. We wanted to set up a structure for that so that you could have proper political oversight. But obviously, as much as this place is very beautiful, I can't stay here for the next 60 days. I'm about to go back home to the United States. But the technical teams are going to be working with proper oversight to make sure that we're accomplishing the objectives that matter for everybody. So those are the things that we wanted to accomplish. We came here. We did exactly that.

The way that I think about it is very simple. We laid a very good foundation for a successful final deal. The final deal is the house. We set the foundation. We haven't built the house, but we've laid a successful foundation to get to a good place for the American people. I think it's important for all of us to appreciate how much was done. But honestly, there is still a lot to do as we continue to make progress on the nuclear talks, the economic talks as we continue to demine the straits and ensure that that flow of traffic continues to pick back up a lot of progress, but still some work to do and we're very committed to doing exactly that. So with that, I'm happy to take a few questions from guys in the audience.

I appreciate you guys being here. Let's start with you. Can you just clarify and tell us what happened? No, they didn't throw a wrench in the system. The thing with the Iranians, yes, they did threaten to walk out or at least there were social media threats that they would walk out. But we were negotiating well past. one in the morning yesterday. So they didn't walk out. And their technical team is still here in Bergenstock working with our technical team actually as we speak. Though I imagine maybe some of them are taking a break to watch this news conference. But look, what we told the Iranians yesterday is when you guys engage in what us millennials might call trash talk, you can't expect the president

of the United States not to respond and not to correct the record. So when they say things that aren't true, the president is going to respond to it. I'm going to respond to it. Americans are going to respond to it. When they make threats that aren't rooted in reality, they have to accept that the President of the United States is actually going to set the record straight. That's all that happened. So yes, there was a little bit of threatening. There was a little bit of whining. But at the end of the day, the talks continued and we made great progress. When do you expect them to? Well, he waits for the next question. We will be talking to John Heilman about how every statement from the Trump administration is either projection or

confession. That certainly was the case on that last preposterous answer about accusing the Iranians of, quote, trash talk. Just destroying civilizations? We'll go back to J.D. Vans. It's funny, we were trying to call some of the inspectors last night around two in the morning, as you can expect. Not many people were answering their phone at two in the morning. I expect that will happen at the minimum this week. But we, we, we, we, think even some of those conversations with the inspectors and with the IAEA could happen as soon as today. But I haven't checked in with our team since we made that 2 a.m. phone call to some of those inspectors. Sorry.

Mr. Vice President. Thank you, Mr. Vice President. Did you going in expect the Iranians to make Lebanon as much of a linchpin as they ended up doing? And how would you describe the progress on Lebanon? I know, Mr. Arachi said it was very good progress. but what's your characterization of it? Yeah, I would describe it as very good progress, too. I mean, look, we want a regional ceasefire, right? We want Hezbollah to stop firing at our friends in Israel.

We want Israelis to be able to live in peace. We also want to make sure that, you know, when things happen, they don't spiral into a broader escalation. And so we've been, I think, very good at setting up what we're calling a deconfliction mechanism, but what it really is is to say that when things happen, the sides are actually talking to one another. Sometimes, you know, you've got a bit of a chicken and egg problem, that you've got a junior guy who fires a drone that didn't have approval from the high command. Okay, of course, Israel has to respond to that.

But then sometimes that response, we could actually have a better and more peaceful situation if Israel responds in the context of a conversation that's ongoing between Hezbollah, Lebanon, Israel, and other partners in the region. there really hasn't been a mechanism to have those discussions until basically around 4 p.m. yesterday, Bergenstock time when we set that up. So what we're trying to do is to say, first of all, Israel and every other nation in the region has the right of self-defense, but we want to make sure that everybody has that right of self-defense in the background where we're talking about how to de-escalate these conflicts rather than spiraling out of control. Sometimes what will happen is that if the conflict spirals out of control, that's worse for everybody's self-defense and worse for everybody's security. So we've actually got the process in place to ensure that that escalation doesn't happen. Now, I will say you already see the fruits of that.

Over the past 24 hours, it's probably been the most peaceful that we've seen the situation in Lebanon. The previous 24 hours were pretty good. Obviously, there were some shooting about 72 hours ago. So this is a work in progress, but what we've done is actually set up the operation so that we can ensure it doesn't spiral out of control in the future. Does the U.S. want Israel to withdraw forces from southern Lebanon? Well, we want Israel's security to be protected, and we also want Lebanon's sovereignty to be protected. And this is going to be an ongoing conversation. The Israelis have been very clear.

They do not have territorial intentions on South Lebanon. The reason they feel they have to be there is because they're worried about Hezbollah fighters and South Lebanon. Lebanon firing into Israel. We do believe, of course, it's going to require a lot of hard work that we can get to a place where Lebanon's territorial integrity and sovereignty is protected, Israel's security is protected, and that's going to require some coordination with the Lebanese armed forces, and also it's going to require the Iranians to reign in Hezbollah. That's all the sort of things that we were talking about yesterday. And again, I think that we got much further compared to where we were just 24 hours ago. Have you spoken with Prime Minister Nanyahu during any of his

process at all in the recent days? Yeah, we were in constant contact with the Israelis yesterday, but also, of course, with the Saudis and the Emirates and others in the region. We talked to the Lebanese yesterday as well, so we're constantly trying to keep our regional friends updated about this. This is not a deal that the United States is imposing on the region. This is a deal that the region has desperately asked the United States to put in place. Obviously, the headlines have been very focused about what's going on between the United States and Iran, but this region has been a basket case for a very long time. And what the president has set us to do, again, lay the foundation, see if we can get

to a permanent peace. If we can't, the president of the United States still has a lot of options to accomplish America's security objectives, but he has certainly committed us to this pathway for now. And we're going to keep on working and seeing what we can accomplish. And then I want to just, before we depart here, I want to say one last thing. I've seen, some misreporting about frozen or unfrozen Iranian assets. One of the other things that we wanted to do, and it wasn't as high of a priority for us for obvious reasons, but we wanted to make sure that we set up a process

where if we ever unfreeze Iranian assets, we can ensure that that that money, that Iranian money, goes to help the people of Iran and not to fund terrorism. So Jared Kushner actually came up with a very interesting solution with the Qataris, basically, again, if there is any frozen Iranian assets that are unfrozen, then we have approval over that process. The Qataris have approval over that process. And then the money would actually go to buy American soy, American corn, and American wheat for the benefit of the Iranian people. And as much

as I see some of the press misreporting on this, and of course, you know, buttressed by what the Iranians are saying, or not all Iranians, I want to be clear. There are a lot of Iranians. who are telling the truth about what happened yesterday, but you see some social media reporting that gets this wrong. But fundamentally, what Jared and the Qataris and the entire team here and Bergenstock accomplished is, to me, a classic Trump deal, where if Iranian assets are ever unfrozen, they're going to go to make American farmers richer and to feed the Iranian people. That's a very, very good and very classic Trump deal. That's great for our people, great for the people of Iran and fundamentally, again, will contribute to this regional security architecture

that we've built and that we're going to work very hard to ensure that it endures. So from Switzerland, thank you all for being here. I appreciate the questions and I appreciate the engagement. I'm looking forward to going back home and we'll certainly keep everybody updated on what happens in the days and weeks to come. Thank you all. All right, Vice President, J.D. Vance, giving reporters there in Switzerland an update on the talks, the ongoing talks, to deal with a solution for the Iran war, saying there has now been a foundation for the deal put in place, which includes IAEA inspectors, who they called it two in the morning to try and mobilize. Yeah, fascinating. Katty Kay, the vice president, talked about the deconfliction that we had been talking about earlier,

setting up a structure to tamp down and talk through any conflicts that happened between Israel, also Lebanon. I think one thing he didn't say there, but probably something that is going to be a goal is just to make sure that if there are Hezbollah attacks, rocket attacks, that Israel's response is proportional. That's me talking. That's not them talking, but that's from what I've gathered over the weekend. That is the goal to make sure that the response is proportional and everybody's talking. Also, you can't help but find great irony in this. Number two, a huge breakthrough. AIA weapons inspectors are Iran is agreed to them. Just like they did under Barack Obama, just like they were doing until Donald Trump kicked them out and blew up

the deal in his first term. Number three, Iran agrees, Katty, write this down. This is big. It's a new one. That they will not build nuclear weapons. They've been saying that, I think, since before nuclear weapons were even invented. So, again, no breakthrough there. We did get some insight on the idea about the unfreezing of the funds, obviously the New York Post, the Wall Street Journal, a lot of Republicans on the Hill, I will say myself included, also very concerned about the hundreds of billions of dollars going their way, the hundred billion or so dollars, according to the Wall Street Journal and unfrozen funds that would be going their way.

You have J.D. Vance talking about a deal that Jared Kushner is working out where the United States would manage those unfrozen funds to manage those unfrozen funds to sure that the funds were spent on supplies for the Iranian people from the United States there. The devil's in the details, obviously. And finally, just the laughable statement that Donald Trump's not going to just sit back and take trash talk from people. Again, they were talking about a man who has said he would destroy Iranian civilization. And this weekend, I think, several times said he was going to destroy the country and kill the negotiators if they didn't do what he wanted to say. All of that, a lot of noise. I do think it's this deconfliction idea

as a positive idea if they want at least keep the talks open. But I will say at the center of this remains an Iran that is going to continue to enrich. And that's going to be something that Israel and Republicans will never be satisfied with. I think you're right on the deconfliction idea. And we heard the president over the weekend say in an interview, look to Netanyahu, you don't need to destroy a building every time you see somebody walk into it. He clearly wants some sense of proportionality around that. On the nuclear weapons, yes, they've always said that.

The inspectors, wow, who knew that that could be a thing. the money for farmers, this war has been great because there will be money for farmers, suddenly for American farmers growing soy beans and wheat. I mean, maybe. Let's see the details on this. I think the problem, the other problems are that they're going to get money anyway from selling oil immediately and the sanctions relief that comes with that. And that doesn't seem to be tied to wheat and soy beans from American farmers. So that is where people are assuming they're going to rebuild certainly their ballistic missiles program. And a pause, in their nuclear program isn't terrible for them

because they have so much rubble to sort through. What I have been told is that actually they quite like the idea of a pause while they reconstitute, but they've still got the know-how, they've still got the scientists, they've still got the ability to push ahead with a nuclear program whenever they want. And this idea that the Middle East has been a basket case

and somehow this war has made it less vulnerable to conflict, I think is what people in the international security space would find, frankly, laughable. I had a long conversation last night with somebody who looks specifically at arms control issues around the Middle East. And what they are saying is the Saudis are going to be stepping up their conversations with Islamabad over their own nuclear ambitions. The rift between the UAE and Saudi Arabia that has emerged because of this war in Iran or accelerated because of the war in Iran, inherently makes the region more unstable. Israel's activities of, frankly, ethnic cleansing in the West Bank make the region more unstable as well,

as well as what is happening with Hezbollah and Israel. So I think J.D. Vance stands up there and tells a very good tale, but when you look at this administration, there is very little evidence in history of strategic follow-through and technical detail-orientated follow-through. that this would take to actually produce something that looked more like a stable Middle East because of what's happened over the last four months. Yeah, saying the Trump administration does not often possess a real follow-through is quite

the understatement there, Caddy. This is certainly a difficult task for Vice President in advance here. He's made the face of these negotiations. And Richard, we saw a lot of really positive spin there, including using the phrase classic Trump deal more times than I can count. But sift through it here, set aside the spin. What stood out to you about what does sound like progress and also what parts feel like, well, a long way to go? Well, any statement about nuclear weapons and pledges are just that. Their words, their intentions, those are meaningless.

The idea of establishing a deconfliction hotline, essentially, potentially good. Those sorts of mechanisms that serve well on other issues, like with the U.S. and Soviet Union. So potentially, that's good. Inspectors, getting that back in is essential because Iran will have the ability to carry out some nuclear activities. there will be some right to enrich. But inspectors is a really complicated thing. They can't look under every roof in the country. In order for inspectors to succeed, they need a degree of cooperation from the host country.

There has to be a mechanism. One, if we have intelligence and we say we want the inspectors to go there, well, what happens when Iran says no? And they says, that's espionage. So to allow inspectors in is not the end of it. It's necessary, but it's the beginning of it. So this will be an incredibly elaborate, not just negotiation, but then implementation. This will never stop being, shall we say, an area of friction between the United States and Iran, Israel, and Iran.

And I think more broadly, what this tells you is what I was saying before the J.D. Vance started talking. When you get a memorandum like this, a memorandum of understanding that's so vague and so short, it ensures, it guarantees that the implementation is really 99% of it. of the work. So you can't be optimistic yet. All you can be is say, here's what we hope, but every single issue, the strait's going to be closed at various times. We know that. Tolls are going to be charged. What's this new Iran-O-Mond mechanism going to insist on, the nuclear issue and all that? What about the issues not covered by this? The ballistic missiles, the drone factories, the proxies. The idea that you could give Iran some money, and that wouldn't go directly to the proxy? Well, it doesn't have to. It frees money up to go to the proxies.

So no one should kid themselves that this is, if you will, that we've got the prerequisites of stability. This is not a peace agreement. Never forget that. And also, let's just, if you're looking at all this and trying to sort through it all, here's what you need to understand. Iran is not going to denuclearize. They are going to continue enriching. That's number one. Point of pride for them.

Number one, point of pride. And also, they're going to be richer after this war. That is an objective fact. You're going to look at the MOU and how everything's been laid out. If the Trump administration does what the Trump administration says it's going to do, then they literally have achieved none of their goals because their top goal was no nukes. And Iran, you'll notice it's very interesting J.D. Vance. When he started talking, he talked about denuclearization of Iran.

Then he corrected himself because he understood that he had stepped over a red line that the Iranian negotiators had set. They are going to continue to enrich. So then he backed up and said, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no weapons. And so when he stepped back over that red line, he was in the place where the Obama administration, where the Bush administration, where every administration, has been. Iran is going to continue to enrich. So what have we gotten out of this war? Well, a deal that's going to make Iran a lot richer. And it's just because John Hyamman,

here's the deal. The Iranians aren't going to back down from that red line. And the problem for the Trump administration is the fact that if they continue enriching, then you will have the Israelis who they've already said, well, we're not going to let them continue enriching. We're not going to let them get a weapon. We don't trust them. We're going to continue our war against Iran. And then on Donald Trump's right flank in the United States, Republican senators, Republican members of the House, Republican thought leaders, the New York Post editorial page, the Wall Street Journal editorial page, on and on and on, those people will also say, wait a second, you've got a deal that's actually worse than the Obama deal.

They're continuing their nuclear program. You're just making them a lot richer. So we're in a bit of a bind here is a good understatement. And then, of course, and I'll let you take this. You had the projection and confession about, quote, trashed. talk between these two parties. Go. Well, I mean, Joe,

to your point, I just, to your first set of points, the thing that I find, to the bind that the administration finds itself, and the thing that you have to remind people of when you hear J.D. Vance at the end trying to say

in that press conference, try to say, well, you know, yes, if we get to a final agreement, we are going to unfreeze, hundreds of billions of dollars in Iranian assets. But Jared Kushner's come up with a plan where they're going to have to use it to buy our soybeans, right? Even if that were not a fanciful notion and the notion that the Qataris in the United States

are somehow going to manage how Iran spends the dollars that they get when they get their unfrozen assets and that they're only going to go back to American farmers, even if that was a tenable arrangement, which is almost certainly not, money. Joe, as you know, is fungible. So if the Iranians are going to be bringing in revenue from the oil they're selling, revenue from the straight that they now, as they toll ships going through there,

if they have put in a position where they have to use some of their assets in some notional on paper way to buy American agricultural products, it just still leaves them with, it just frees up the money from the other sources of funds that they have, they're still on net richer than they were before the day that the war started. And that's the thing we have to keep our eye on the ball here, which is, as of now, under any scenario, is Iran better off today that it was before the war started or is it worse off?

I don't see a scenario in which it's not better off in the aggregate, right? Is the region more stable today on the day when they signed this deal or less stable? I don't see a scenario in which, especially given the burgeoning conflict between the United States and Israel over so many things, I don't see any world in which the region is more stable. And then finally, to come to my wheelhouse, are Donald Trump and the Republican Party's politics in any better place today than they were the day that the war started? I think the answer to that is self-evidently no. And as to trash talk, does Donald Trump do any other kind of talk besides trash talk? I mean, talk about in the projection confession model, talk about projection.

I don't really think Donald Trump and J.D. Vance as his surrogate or in position to accuse anyone of trash talking, given the way the president behaves in general and the way he's talked throughout this conflict. Well, and even talk this weekend, talking about destroying Iran, killing the leaders before they got back to Iran. I think most kids would, Gen Xers there, would call that trash. Josh talk. Yeah. Or Jinzir. So, so,

Richard, money off the straits, money off of oil, money to feed the Iranian people, $300 billion in reconstruction. They're not giving up enrichment. They control the straits more than before the war. Again, I don't see how this,

these negotiations continue with those terms laid out. With those, you know, at the end of the day, Joe, like it or not, what happens at the negotiating table reflects what happened on the battlefield, reflects the willingness of countries to embrace alternatives. Quite honestly, it's less difficult probably for Iran to see a resumption of hostilities than us because that would mean the reclosure of the straight of Hormuz. So I think, you know, the administration's going to spin it, but I think we kind of see what we're going to see.

We're going to see a strait that's reopened. Iran's going to have a degree of control, and it's going to charge tolls. They'll call them something else. The nuclear, as you said before, they're going to be able to enrich. We'll see to what extent inspectors can monitor it. They're going to rebuild missiles, rebuild drones,

send money to Hamas and and Hezbollah. So this is, and they're going to get richer. And by the way, that will both allow this regime, this even more radical regime to put down roots. It's terrible for the Iranian people and allow them to re-arm. So what this is going to show is why this war, you can choose your word, debacle, fiasco,

you know, we can have a competition here. But that's what, there's no way that history, historians, when they look back in this, are not going to be objectively brutal about what the United States and Israel have done that turned out to be so opposed to their own self-interest. But I don't see us in a position having the appetite to what? What's the alternative at this point? In some ways, we're going to reap what we've sowed. And that is where we are.

All right. Richard, thank you. We'll continue to bring you the latest developments out of Switzerland as U.S. and Iranian teams are expected to meet throughout the day. So we'll be following that. But first, we want to go through some of the big storylines coming out of the World Cup, including the optimism for the U.S. men's national team amid a historic start to the tournament. And a major underdog is showing a lot of fight against some of the world's top teams with a chance to advance to the knockout round. You're watching Morning Joe. We'll be right back. All right, we have breaking news. Alan,

Green Span has died. He served five terms as the chairman of the Federal Reserve, having been appointed to that job by four different presidents. Greenspan confronted a host of economic challenges over his tenure from the 1987 stock market crash to a pair of deep recessions. He was also in office during the September 11th, 2001 terrorist attacks. Alan Greenspan was 100 years. old. And now reading from NBC News, of course, Greenspan is survived by his wife of 29 years, our friend, Andrea Mitchell. And here's what Andrea reports. Alan passed away at our home this morning at the age of 100 from complications of Parkinson's disease. He was a giant of a man who helped shape the U.S. economy for decades under presidents of both parties. He was always honest in acknowledging

his mistakes, she said. To me, he was my husband who shaped my life from our very first date in 1984. He had irrational exuberance for baseball, the Washington commanders, tennis, golf, and music, especially jazz. Andrew Mitchell continued, he will be remembered for his brilliance and his kindness. Being his life partner was the joy of my life. Alan Greenspan. Alan Greensman. has died at the age of 100. We certainly are thinking about Andrea and all those who knew and loved Alan Greenspan. Just an absolute giant, an economic giant over the past half century. And also a man who warned about income disparity at one point saying growing income disparity

between the richest and the poorest in America is a threat to American capitalism itself. We'll be right back. Beautiful live shot there, New York City, looking south towards the World Trade Center, 744. The morning, which means it's time for sports. We'll begin with golf's U.S. Open Championship held out on Long Island this weekend, where Wyndham Clark battled the course and the New York crowd at Chinatok Hills yesterday. And during cheers from the gallery during miscues, it's not nice, as he nearly squandered a six-stroke lead in the final round

before he eventually held on for a one-shot victory. Clark denied world number one, Scotty Shephler, the Career Grand Slam on Shephler's birthday, capturing his second U.S. Open title as the ninth wire-to-wire winner of the tournament with a closing round of three over 73. Schaeffler will have more chances for the career grand slam, Richard. Give us your thoughts yesterday. You sat down at a break earlier. You sort of mentioned it was sort of an uninspiring tournament,

one that at least seemed to be really on the sort of sports consciousness, very much overshadowed by the World Cup. Overshadowed by the World Cup. I think we're still exhausted from the Knicks. But it was hardly anybody there. Talk about a sparse crowd, Jonathan, and rooting against the frontrunner. And the fact that he was a wire-to-wire.

There really wasn't competition. Yeah, he won by one stroke. But Sam Burns was sitting in a clubhouse for half an hour, and the real question was between Wyndham Clark and the course. And in this case, Wyndham Clark barely won. Virtually everybody else lost to the course. I think the only Clark and two others were under par. It's a rare pro tournament where people,

where people have that much trouble. The Greens were unbelievably hard and fast, and the players were clearly having difficulty with that, as well as with the Rupp. Yeah, but he's been unpopular ever since he trashed the locker room last year after he didn't do well in the U.S. Open, and he had to pay for repairs and all that.

He's got a bit of a hot temper. He throws clubs. He's getting therapy for it. I'm happy for him, but the crowd was so not on his side. Well, you know, though, first of all, First of all, it was strange, sparse crowds at Chinnecock because you will remember this. Lemire probably wasn't even born, but I think I remember the first time they had to open at Shenicock in 86. It was like, it's a special place.

Shinikai, what were you born, 99, 2000? I don't know, Lemire. Oh, you're not Sam Stein. Thank you, but. That's Sam Stein. But Richard, I remember watching the Open on TV at Shinnock, and you just knew it was a really special place. I was thrilled when it was going back there this year. But a couple of things. Number one, sparse crowds, I guess overshadowed by other things. I have no idea what would

overshadow that at Shinnock. But secondly, I've just got to say, and I'm not, this isn't tongue-in-cheek. Like, Long Island crowds, man, Long Island tournaments. We had the riders, Riter Cup. And then we had yesterday, it's unbecoming. It is. I will be old-fashioned. This is not how you behave if you're in a gallery. You don't cheer.

They certainly don't let you cheer against mistakes at the U.S. Open in tennis. Again, the Rider Cup was so ugly. And it took on it there. You don't want to see at PJ events. The same thing happened yesterday.

And yes, this guy this guy has temper problems. He lost his mom. He suffered through that. Yesterday, an extraordinary story. His father's apprising flew cross country. And there he was on Father's Day, kidding to embrace his dad. Just, I mean, it's a beautiful, incredible moment. And yeah, this kid made a mistake. Get over it. Okay. Just get over it. And I just, I don't know, Richard. Am I old-fashioned? I am old-fashioned, but are you old-fashioned with me? Don't cheer against golfers. 100%.

And golf's a sport of norms. There's all sorts of rules, but there's this way you play the game and you call penalties on yourself when no one else is looking. Golf is a character game, Joe. And this is a great course. It's a real challenge. So I'm with you. The kid made a mistake.

He's only 32 years old, I think. You're allowed to make. You're supposed to make mistakes when you're young. And you grow up. So, yeah, I think golf has a bit of, maybe it's just on Long Island. I don't know, but there's a raucousness to it. On one hand, I kind of like the idea that golf's getting beyond its country club image. And the reality is very different.

A lot of people who aren't wealthy play golf, but they've got to do something about the crowd behavior. Because it's ugly and it really has no place with it. So, yeah, we're both old fashion. I'll add my, I agree. That needs to change and change soon. We mentioned the World Cup. Let's take a look at another dramatic day of matches yesterday. Starting in Los Angeles, Iran took a major step toward the round of 32

after holding Belgium to a scoreless draw yesterday. Now, Iran has never made it out of the group stage in any of its previous six appearances in the tournament. Wouldn't it be something if it was this year? Meanwhile, up in Vancouver... Put it in the deconfliction zone. Yes, our good friend, Mo Salas, scored the go-ahead goal for Egypt as the Pharaohs defeated New Zealand three to one

for their first ever World Cup victory. It puts Egypt at the top of Group 6 and sets up a deciding game against Iran on Friday in Seattle. Great scenes last night, Egypt celebrating the streets of Seattle, including Mo. And then there's this. Gabe Bird is Cinderella run continued yesterday as the tiny island nation netted its very first World Cup goals and a two-two draw with Uruguay, remaining unbeaten after its stunning draw last week with tournament favorite Spain.

And Joe, pick your topic here. It's been a thrilling World Cup to this. this point. But this right here, one of the very best stories. Well, and I've got to say, first of all, with Iran, as you said to me yesterday, harder to get a ship through the Strait of Hormuz than a football past Iran's goalkeeper. He was extraordinary yesterday. But, Caddy, I'm sure you've seen the, here we go, here we we go. We're going to get this ship through the straight. No, you're not. No, you're not. That happened all day.

It was an extraordinary job. Here we go. Okay. Listen to ship through, mate. No. No, you won't. By the way, that's the strangest Belgian accent I've ever heard in my life. But, but, Katie, that was a pretty incredible story there.

But then Cape Verde, I hope you've seen the BBC clip that's gone viral where you have a BBC reporter interviewing Cape Verde's citizens. right before they score the goal. I sat there watching that, and I thought about Marshall McLuhan's Global Village, and I thought this is what makes the World Cup a one-of-a-kind sporting event. It is just so simply extraordinary that people on a little island off of Western Africa

are playing against giants and doing so well. Uruguay, which has won the World Cup twice, and who'd have thought, I agree with you, this is what I love about the World Cup. It's the Cinderella stories, and you get, whether it's Senegal one year or Morocco last time around, this time around Cape Verde. You know they're never going to make it even to the semifinals, let alone the finals. But it's when the world comes together. And I think there's something that's different between the World Cup and the Olympics. It's that it's one sport. And that it's, we're all focused on this one game for the,

process of one month. And you know the story that I really liked about that Iran game? Yes, it was the all the saved and not getting the ships through the Straits of Hormuz. It was the note that the Iranian players left in the locker room. They left a handwritten note saying, thank you for your hospitality and you're welcome. And here's to, you know, peace and love and harmony in the world. But what a nice gesture. What a nice thing. There they are. Two countries at all with each other. And they leave a note like that thanking. And I think America actually, there were a lot of negative stories as we went into this around visas and restrictions, and those were real and the ref who couldn't come into the country.

But actually, the welcome that these countries have had has done an awful lot to help America's reputation just at a time when America could do with a little bit of a hand. Well, you know, it's interesting. We and I were watching the Belgian-Iran match. and we heard people at the bar going, you know, the Iranian people love us. It's the government we have a problem with. And I shouted up, I said, well, are you trying to justify cheering for Iran? But it's fascinating that even this sport got people talking about how Iranians,

how a lot of Iranians do want to be free and don't like their government. and it was just something. And then the note, as Katty said at the end, those players leaving the note, beautiful. Richard Oz, thank you very much for coming on this morning. And still ahead on Morning Joe, today's major political and legal debates may feel unprecedented,

but our next guest is detailing how the headlines echo challenges America faced centuries ago. Professor at New York University School-in-law, Melissa Murray, joins us for the look at her new book. We're back. in just a moment.