Morning Joe - Iran fires on gulf neighbors after U.S. strikes

Episode Date: September 3, 2026

September 3, 2026: 8am — Iran fires on gulf neighbors after U.S. strikes  To listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads, sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

And you know, we have a guy named Ken Paxton. And some people don't like the way he dresses or some people don't like the way he interviews or talks. But you know the one thing about him? He was the best Attorney General in this country for the last 10 years or more. The most effective, the hardest working. He was the best Attorney General in the United States. And so I don't care about an interview, and I don't care about the way he dresses. We're going to go to Texas and work for Ken Paxson, who's a great guy.

I mean, so Ken Paxson, you might not like the way he dresses. And I say this. It's so insulting to him, but I might as well say it. You might not like the way he looks. You might not love his look. You might not love his television interviews. But he was the best attorney general in the country, perhaps. He was one of the best in the entire country.

And that speaks a lot louder than the suit he's wearing that doesn't look so. great. President Trump redefining the backhanded compliment talking about Texas Attorney General, Ken Paxton, trying his best to endorse a guy whose look he doesn't really approve of. We'll explain why there is a Texas-sized freakout among some Republicans ahead of the midterms. Comes as many Republican candidates are telling Politico this morning, they will not attend the president's midterm convention in Dallas next week, in part because they're busy campaigning, and they have to pay 25 grand a pop just to show up. Plus, Treasury Secretary Scott Besant is blaming Ukraine for high gas prices here in the United States. We'll show you his new comment. Good morning.

Welcome to morning. Joe. It is Thursday, September 3rd. I'm Willie Geist. With us, the co-host of our 8 a.m. hour staff writer at the Atlantic, Jonathan Lemire, senior writer at the Dispatch and columnist at Bloomberg opinion, David Drucker, contributing writer to the Atlantic, Eugene Robinson, and co-host of The Weekend and Washington Reporter for MS Now, Jackie Alamani. Good morning to you all. Let's dive right in with that dinner last night. President Trump hosted in the Rose Garden. You just saw part of it for a group of Republican lawmakers facing tough election fights this fall. Some of the guests included Congressman Mike Lawler of New York, Congressman Mike Collins of Georgia, who's running for Senate. Congresswoman Ashley Hinson of Iowa

also running for the Senate, several dozen others. It comes as many Republicans have pressed the president to use his massive war chest in some of the those competitive races. At the dinner, President Trump pledged to spend time campaigning in battleground states. All the way to November 3rd and beyond, we're going to be helping you. I'm going to be going around and doing a lot of speeches. I think I helped Darlene quite a bit. We went down to South Carolina, made a speech, and it worked. So we're going to take that little, that final 30 days. You don't want to go too much before that because people forget. but we're going to take that final 30 days, Mr. Speaker.

So I'm relying on you guys to give me some names where I say is either tied or you're winning by a little bit or you're losing by a little bit. In some cases, you can be losing by a lot and we'll bring you over the line. But mostly it's if you're close and we'll get, I think we'll get all those people elected, but I'm going to have to work. One of those places where it's very close is Texas, a growing number of reports. Republicans are voicing concern about that closely watched Senate race between Republican Ken Paxson and Democrat James Telerico. A race MS. Now's election desk currently considers a toss-up. Here's some of what Republican Senator Ted Cruz and Republican strategist Carl Rove had to say.

Yeah, look, Texas is a very serious fight and I'm very worried about it. Virtually all the public polling shows Talarico leading typically one to two points, but ahead a little bit. more broadly, and this is a Texas problem, but it's a problem in every one of the states we talked about. The left is energized. They're pissed off. They hate Donald Trump. They are showing up. On the right, look, some of us some folks on the right are demoralized or dispirited or angry or fighting back and forth. If conservatives and just common sense normal people stay home and the radicals and zealots show up in big numbers, that's how you get a terrible. election and end up instead of 53 Republicans with 45 Republicans in the Senate.

Paxton, remember, the week leading up to the 4th of July, he was in Washington the week before the 4th of July on that weekend. No fundraiser that I can find. And then on Tuesday, he was seen leaving for Iceland with his latest girlfriend. And then the two of them spent the 4th of July celebrating in London, England. Now, look, we have London, Texas. It's out in the West Texas, not a big town. But if he wanted to go to London, he should have gone to London, Texas rather than London, England. Time is running out. If the president wants to have Paxton win,

he needs to be tossing a lot of money, Paxton's way so that ads can be run that depict Calerico as the far left winger that he is. If not, Talarico is going to run the message of my opponent as the most corrupt politician in Texas history all the way to the victory line. That's Carl Rove talking there. Who knows Texas politics very, very well. Jonathan Lemire, so much to talk through there.

Let's start with the President of the United States who can't really bring himself to say something nice about Ken Paxson, just attacking his delivery, his campaign stump speech, the way he looks, the clothes he wears, saying he was, though, the best Attorney General in the history of the country. That's at the core of the problem, actually, as Carl Rove gets to there,

that he's among the most corrupt attorneys general in the history of the country. How deeply concerned are Republicans actually about this race? Well, Roe, have you heard him? urging President Trump to spend some money on behalf of Paxton in Texas. I suspect, though, Trump would earmark those funds for a new war drug. I think that seems to you what Trump is very clearly about. And it's classic Trump tell that, oh, many people are saying, I know some people might very clearly.

Donald Trump's on interview said this guy's outfit is terrible and that has colored his opinion of him forever. But yes, I mean, Republicans are the ones who try to impeach Paxton in Texas. He is, Talarico is a talented political figure, no doubt. But Texas is still Texas. It still leans red. It's been the white whale for Democrats forever. This race is close, yes, Tala Rico, but more because of Paxson's flaws. And it is going to take some money there.

Texas is an extremely expensive state. It's huge. There's some major media markets. It will take a real push. And I think we are seeing the alarm being sounded. Ted Cruz has been saying this for a few weeks now. And other Texas lawmakers as well, other colleagues in the Senate, who are partially informed because they're still so upset that John Corning got pushed out,

they also say, look, this is a problem. And I also want to highlight something else, Cruz said there. He's like what the margin is now. It gives 53 Republicans now, but it could have down in 45. There is a growing sentiment that an election like this, which could be a wave year. If it breaks one way, it breaks big that way. And Democrats certainly aren't going to get ahead of themselves. They aren't going to start celebrating.

But there is a scenario. We have seen this happen in cycles before where just the national moment as such where one party grabs it. The public is angry at the party in power. and it swings wildly one way. And Republicans are starting to get alarmed that they could be looking at that. And that alarm, David Drucker, spilling out into public. We've seen Senate Majority Leader John Thune go on TV. We've seen him go to the Oval Office pleading for Donald Trump to intervene in this race in Texas.

He's sitting on that $400 million war chess with MAGA Inc. A couple hundred million more in other fundraising as well. They're saying, we've got to start this now. It's a huge state. We need your money. We need your support. I believe, David, you said a month ago, correct me if I'm wrong, that Ken Paxton was the most corrupt political.

politician you've ever covered. You can check me on that, amend that if you'd like to, but how concerned do you find Republicans to be about him? No fact check needed there, Willie. I've been saying that for months, and Republicans are very concerned. I mean, going back to Ken Paxton's victory in the runoff, Republicans made it very clear to me, both operatives and otherwise, that they weren't going to expend a dime on this state. They wanted John Cornyn, because as bad as this cycle is, guys, bad as it is for Republicans, if John Cornyn's the nominee, the race might be close, but it wouldn't be in doubt, and Republicans wouldn't have to spend a dime. But they've got so many priorities,

including in states that are naturally competitive, that what they've told the president is, you wanted Ken Paxton, you broke it, you bought it. And because he has the money additionally, they're like, you can spend. And so far, they've wasted a summer, meaning the, uh, the president's team, and I doubt that this is their decision. I tend to think it's his decision. I think they've wasted a summer where they could have defined James Talleyco more succinctly and more clearly for voters, because even though the polling in Texas looks difficult for Ken Paxton, he still has a natural edge because of the way that state tends to vote. And so we're watching the suburbs. We're watching the real Grand Valley and those boards.

border counties that are majority Hispanic that the president flipped and went Republican for the first time in a century. But Ted Cruz is right, and he's been through this before. And so he knows what he's talking about. David, why is the president not listening to John Thune and Ted Cruz in the laundry list of other Republicans pleading for him to get involved? Why is he sitting on almost a billion dollars of money that could be very beneficial to these candidates in tight races? Well, because he doesn't listen to people that tell him that he's the problem. And of course, nobody's really telling him he's the problem, but they're kind of telling him he's the problem. And the president, even after a midterm, you know, the thing is, it's so funny, right?

But the president, as many presidents do, but this one in particular, believes his own press and believes that he's invulnerable. And to a degree, I understand it, because Trump ended back in the White House when, you know, as a matter of pure politics after January 6th and everything, you know, you just wouldn't think that would happen. but he has proven as an incumbent to be vulnerable and to be to be human, if you will, to not be Teflon. But he never believes that. And he hates to part with money in any event.

He raised this money. It's his. He said that in interviews. He has said, it's my money. I can do what I want with it. And so this is why many Republicans I've been talking for the past six months or so have been very skeptical about whether he's, one, going to invest the money and, two, invest it properly. in terms of timing and the price that outside groups have to pay for ads,

which is, of course, as you know, more than candidates. And to that point about the president being the problem, a new survey of more than 70 Republican candidates and party members reveals most either do not plan to attend or undecided on next week's Republican midterm convention in Dallas headlined by President Trump and being called by some Trumpapalooza. Politico reached out to a number of Republicans ahead of that event, 45, telling the outlet they will say, skip the convention, citing scheduling conflicts, personal obligations, or discomfort with the fact

they have to pay $25,000 for the right to attend. Political reports some other vulnerable Republicans are steering far clear of the gathering, reportedly nicknamed Trump-a-Pelous, as I said, due to concerns about associating closely with the president amid his slipping approval rating. So, Jackie, other than the president of the United States, who is this convention for exactly? Well, that's a really great question. You know, there are a number of lawmakers who are in competitive districts who have opted out, as you just noted, people like Congressman Tom Barrett of Michigan. I think we're going to see a lot of other lawmakers who fit a similar profile similarly opt out. I was actually surprised last night to see people like Mike Lawler so visibly

present at the Rose Garden. But I think that's part of the situation. that lawmakers are facing right now when they're waiting for this money that the president and his allies have promised to be dispersed to actually come their way because they do need it at the end of the day. And so they've sort of got to play along. But I think when you're looking to something like this convention, which seems to be a bit of an organizational mess and lacking in terms of the purpose that it's serving, you are going to say people more freely decide that actually the best strategy here is not to go along with Trump's plan to make this election, either a referendum on him or about himself, and rather run a more individual race,

especially as we're getting closer and closer. And Trump is running out of time, as Allie noted in the previous hour, to actually operationally carry out spending the money in a real and serious and strategic way, just in terms of even things as simple as reserving that airtime. But, Gene, why do you think they're holding this convention? You know, who was this convention for it? For Donald Trump? Yeah.

Maybe it also is singularly to save Ken Paxton, because that is going to be, is Trump going to be the person that finally turns Texas blue? And that's an embarrassing stain on his record. That would be extremely embarrassing because we've been here so many times before. It is Lucy in the football. And, you know, I remember Beto O'Rourke and others have been close. Beto, I didn't hire a pollster O'Rourke. Right.

He just recently disclosed. Right. So, but no, I mean, look, look, we all know what Trump's going to do, right? At this, he's going to give his some speech and talk about how wonderful he is. And the reason so many Republicans aren't coming is, you know, they don't want to be seen saying, I'm for the Iran war. I'm for $4 gallon gas. I'm for a ballroom at the White House as opposed to anything that might be affecting you, as opposed to affordability, as opposed to the issues that are going to matter.

And so the purpose of this, aside from, you know, glorification of Donald Trump, is to try to gin up some enthusiasm among Texas Republicans. If you can do that, it's a Republican state. But I don't know if they can do that. We'll see if they can do that this year. It hasn't been there so far. We'll get to the latest in the Iran War amid new reports. Defense Secretary Pete Heggzeth is quietly extending troop deployments to the Mideast into 2027.

And as we go to break, a look at the travelers' forecast this morning from Acqueweather's Bernie Reno. Bernie has a looking out there. Willie, it's a steamy stormy Thursday across the mid-Atlantic states and parts on the northeast. Boston, some rain. This morning, New York City, Philadelphia, then a drenching thunderstorm this afternoon. Watch out for some strong thunderstorms around Washington, D.C. Just hot in Chicago. How about 100 in St. Louis?

Thunderstorm around Dallas today because of tropical rainstorm, Edward, and some drenching thunderstorms in the Florida Peninsula. It stays dry in Atlanta and Charlotte today, but there are the delays in Miami, New York City, Philadelphia. They help you make the best decisions and be more in the no. Download. The ACUE weather up today. The Kuwaiti army says this morning it was under attack by missile and drone strikes from Iran as back and forth strikes between Washington and Tehran resumed earlier this week. This after President Trump again repeated to reporters yesterday, hostilities will not last in his words too long.

Recent resumption of U.S. strikes in Iran have sent oil prices back up to $95 a barrel. How long will this renewed campaign go for? I don't think it's too long. And also, given what you've said about having destroyed the Iranian military, what is there still left to strike and why? Okay, we've controlled and we are controlling the Hormor Strait. We are bringing lots of boats out every day with millions of barrels of oil. We are, for the most part, doing it without trouble.

Every once in a while they shoot a drone and we knock it down. But we have control of very strong. control. As you know by now, that's categorically untrue. The street is not wide open. There's a trickle of ships coming through. In a true social post yesterday, the president suggested renaming the Strait of Hormuz, the Trump Strait, insisting it's open and under U.S. control. Despite his continued claims, only a handful of ships are making the passage every day. Iran regularly attacking vessels in the strait. Just this week, a Saudi shipping company said two Filipino sailors were killed in an attack as their vessels.

transit at the Strait of Hormuz. It all comes as the Wall Street Journal reports, Defense Secretary Pete Hagezith is quietly extending troop deployments and a sign that conflict could drag well into next year. That's according to people familiar with the matter. The journal goes on to report. U.S. officials have said Trump is privately having discussions with senior aides about whether to just declare the Iran war over, noting Trump has said he favors that idea. The officials say Trump also tells AIDS he believes sticking with economic pressure will eventually force the regime either to dismantle its nuclear program or to collapse, John. He just wanted to turn the page on this for several months and just make it go away.

He can't do that. He hopes the economic pressure will help, but what would it look like to just declare the war over and walk away? I mean, you're certainly right that he wants this to be done. I reported that Trump was bored with the war back in May, and here we are in early September. I mean, I think what I have heard is that, yes, I mean, he's eager to move beyond this, that there is a sense that the Strait of Hormuz, despite his claims, there is acknowledgement within the administration.

It's not actually open. Is it a little more oil gain through today than it was a few weeks ago? Yes, but it's still not a lot. They need to have the straight more open than it is now. But if they do that, that might be enough for Trump actually to say, this is over, we win, we'll turn the page. And that's a problem for many in the region. It's a problem for America's foreign policy strategy writ large,

because it would still leave Iran with at least some semblance of control of the Strait of Ramos, and potentially still a lot, at the very least, they know they can close it at any time. It does nothing to affect regime change. That's not going to happen. In fact, the hard lighters in Tehran seem to be, have only tightened their grip on power. And it doesn't address the Iran nuclear issue, which allegedly this was all about. At minimum, it kicks the can down the road. And there's been reporting from a number of places that Iran is trying to ramp up construction

sites around the nation, leading some to believe they may dip back in as to try to accelerate the program to try thinking that that might be the only deterrent. from another war down the road. So this would be a disaster just to walk away from it. Even if for Trump, it might have some short-term, you know, political impact because it takes the war out of the headlines for a while ahead of the midterms. And it gives, it would give the economic pressure some more time. And Iran showed no interest in reopening the straight. That's the lever they have that they can pull, they know, and change the global economy. Treasury Secretary Scott Besant was on Fox News yesterday, partly blaming Ukraine for the global

energy shock and rising gas prices as a result of this war. Prices are too high. The American consumer got blown away under Joe Biden, 21.5% stated inflation, probably much higher for working Americans. And we are going through an energy shock right now due to both the war in Ukraine, because Ukraine has decided that they want to blow up Russian energy assets and refine products. So that is creating upward price, press. on a global basis, and then the conflict in Iran. And the conflict in Iran will end, and prices will come down. Overall, prices are coming down. Core inflation is very under control. Again, they're not coming down. It is true. Ukraine has used long-range drones to hit Russian oil infrastructure in recent months, but the war in Iran has virtually closed the Strait of Hormuz, blocking about one-fifth of global oil imports. And again, blaming the victim here in the war. the Vladimir Putin started Eugene Robinson in Ukraine. Another, I guess not shocking anymore,

although it should be development from this administration and just always deferring to Vladimir Putin, always deferring to Russia. Scott Besson again inviting the Russian finance minister to the G20 summit in Asheville, North Carolina this week, completely blindsiding European allies. Yeah. Actually, what Besson said was shocking to me. I can't believe he went there and said It's Ukraine's fault that we have such high gas and oil prices. That's absurd. That's a historical, and it sounded, frankly, desperate. The claim that prices are coming down is clearly false.

Look at the price of crude oil. Once again, it's inching up into the 90s. It's inching toward $100. and that's, that is certainly not prices coming down. And yes, there is always this deference to Vladimir Putin, whom Trump, let's face it, on some level, really admires and wants to be buddies with. And it's described as, you know, strong and powerful and essentially a great leader. And that is absurd.

And it's actually obscene to think of Putin in that way. It denies the reality of the war in Ukraine, which was unprovoked and unjustified invasion by Vladimir Putin of a sovereign country, Ukraine. And Ukraine is trying to fight back. I mean, that's just what happened. And no amount of Trump or Bessent or anybody else claiming otherwise is going to change that. Coming up, our next guest says Senator John Ossoff of Georgia understands something most Democrats do not. Michael Tamaski explains what that is straight ahead on Morning Joe. Welcome back, 8.30 in the morning here in New York.

Dozens of American citizens are still missing in the Himalayas following last week's devastating floods. Many were there on pilgrimage tours to hike around one of the most sacred mountains in the Hindu religion. MS Now's Nick McCool spoke to the son of one of the missing Americans. The search for survivors continues, more than a week after those devastating floods hit Nepal and Tibet. Nepal reporting hundreds of foreign nationals have been rescued as some missing tourists finally made contact. But the death toll has risen too, now more than 1,200 with more than 4,000. thousand still missing. Some locals now using zip lines to traverse the disaster zone and check on their homes. For those who may never be found, solemn memorial ceremonies taking place around the

region. But hope is not lost for everyone. I think it's important to just, you know, stay strong and just hold out until, you know, as long as we can. Sumerth Trevassov says his father Vivek, a U.S. citizen, was on a pilgrimage when the floods hit. He radiates, you know, warmth to everyone around him. I don't know a single person who doesn't like him. He had spoken to his father in the hours before disaster struck about taking the trip with him in the future. He kind of video called me. He showed me around. He was walking along the side of the river. He's showing me the mountains and everything. It was a beautiful scene. His last known location, not far from this immigration center, overrun by the floodwaters. We realized they were kind of right in the heart of

like the disaster zone. So that's when we started to really get worried. Summerth tells us it's been hard to get updates from the area where communication has been difficult. We've tried reaching out to, you know, the embassy in Beijing, the U.S. Embassy, the U.S. Embassy in Nepal, as well as our State Department here and the government, but there's not really much that we've heard back from any of them. But in the face of the unthinkable, he's leaned on his community, including others whose loved ones are still missing. I believe he's out there somewhere.

I want to believe he's, you know, stuck somewhere, you know, his phone's probably out of battery. They don't really have self-service, so they're just waiting for rescue efforts. to reach them. That's kind of what I'm hoping for right now. So I'm sure he's doing fine. We reached out and are waiting to hear back from the State Department, but the U.S. has announced more than $3 million in assistance and says it's delivered thousands of supplies to help with the search. Back to you. MS now is Nick McCool with that report. Up next here on Morning Joe, we're going to bring you more coverage on the life and legacy of feminist trailblazer Gloria Steinem,

who has died at the age of 92. Morning. Joe, we'll be right back. Welcome back. Our next guest argues in a new piece for the New Republic that Senator John Ossoff of Georgia has something that other Democrats don't. In a word, conflict. The piece's author, editor of the New Republic, Michael Tamaski, joins us now to explain. Also with us, co-founder and CEO of Allent Together, Lauren Leader. My thanks to you both for joining us this morning. So, Michael, we'll start with you. Indeed, what do you mean when you say John Ossoff has conflict? And is it a good thing? It's a very good thing to answer your second question first, and here's what I mean.

We live in an age, this age of Donald Trump, who gets out there publicly and creates conflict every single day, and in the age of social media, where merely taking positions isn't enough for a politician to do anymore. That's not going to attract any attention. What attracts attention, for better or perhaps for worse, is conflict. Assov knows how to make conflict. He knows how to throw punches at Trump and Maga World that land. The recent Natalie Harp episode being the most obvious example.

And that was very skillful. And a lot of people criticized him, of course, for including her and for just mentioning her first name, which I think was the particular genius of it. But it got him talked about it and it got millions of people to see that thing. So he really has an instinct for conflict and virality. and that's what has got people interested in him in the Democratic Party as a potential 2028 candidate. So, Michael, let's read a smidge from your new piece. You highlight how President Trump has indeed used conflict to his advantage, writing in part this.

Donald Trump gets it. He's out there every day creating conflict. Naturally, he creates far too much conflict, and his all-stick-no-carat brand of authoritarianism means that even his ostensible allies catch strays. But the fights he picks drive the agenda every day. I hope the next Democratic president understands this and gets out there nearly every day, taking questions and throwing punches at Republicans and oligarchs and monopolists. That's how you get people to pay attention and persuade them that you're on their side.

In politics, you're defined by the enemies you're willing to make. And we hope that the viewers at home are not paying attention to the beeping sound that we now have here in studio. Not sure if you can hear it on air or not. Sounds like a truck is backing up, hopefully not through the wall behind me. So Michael Tamaski, so that's Trump is the master of the attention economy. That's for sure. So you're saying that Asoff, it sounds like other Democrats, could take some notes. Absolutely. You know, the traditional posture of Democratic presidents toward their office, toward their bully pulpit has really been to use that pulpit rather sparingly. You know, Oval Office addresses in prime time, very, very rare.

press availability is quite rare, especially in Joe Biden's last couple of years. And it has just been thought that presidents should not get out there and do this personally and publicly too much. Now, you could argue that Trump over-exposes himself. Like three times a day is a little much. But I say, as I said in the piece, as you just quoted, he drives the agenda. He creates news. The Democrats have to respond to what he says. And he puts the issues that he wants out there, out there. He names names. He names bad guys. He names villains. And he sets the terms of debate. And I hope the next Democratic president, whether it's John Oshoff or whoever, does take a page from that playbook. Turn along, leader, what do you think?

Is this a winning strategy? Well, I mean, he's not the only one doing it. We've had Gavin Newsom, who's been using his social media for the better part of the last couple years, to sort of flip the script and hit back at Trump using the same kind of, like, ridiculous tropes that the president often uses as his social media. And it's garnered him a lot of attention. In the middle of a contentious Senate race, it certainly raised Asaf's profile nationally. By the way, he said repeatedly he's absolutely not running for president in 28. Gavin Newsom may be. So I think he's not the only one. There are a lot of people who are looking at this playbook. And voters are saying that they want this, right? That they want to feel that Democrats are strong and hitting back. So he's

He's testing the waters. Well, Asaf is running for Senate now. Correct. Then we suspect. All right. He's saying he's not going to. We'll just firm out. We'll just see.

We'll hold him to it. Michael, we've been talking a lot about Texas this morning. Next week, it will be the site of the Democratic midterm convention, which seems to not be generating a whole lot of enthusiasm, including among Republicans. But it also will shine a spotlight on that Senate race. And Ken Paxson, a deeply, deeply problematic candidate there. and polls show that Democrat James Tilarico has a shot. Texas is hard. It's really hard for Democrats, but this feels like their best chance yet.

Best chance in a long time. You know, Beto O'Rourke came close to Ted Cruz in 2018, three point something points. But Cruz won, obviously. This is different. Paxton, much more flawed candidate than Cruz. Tala Rico, in some ways, I think has more potential reach to independent voters maybe than Beto O'Rourke had. Beto O'Rourke, if you looked at, I looked over those results.

I remember Texas has, I think, 2112 counties. In a lot of counties, Beto O'Rourke got 21%, 17%. If Tala Rico can bump those numbers up to 30 and then really carry the urban districts and the cities, then I think he has a real, real shot at it. All right, well, hold on to that conversation for a moment. We now want to do a little more remembering of Gloria Steinem and who passed away earlier this week at the age of 92, legendary Fentimist. And joining us on the phone to share her thoughts on that as former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton.

Madam Secretary, thank you so much for joining us this morning. As you hear about her passing today, give us some of your thoughts of her life and legacy, please. Well, I am really sad personally, but also very grateful for the life. she led and the activism that placed her right in the middle of the women's movement over the last, oh my gosh, now 70 years. And I was lucky enough to get to know Gloria as a friend, but I started as just a young woman who began paying attention to what she was saying about the need for women to have full equality under the law because in the 1960s. 60s and early 70s when she began her career of advocacy, that just wasn't the case. And then Ms.

Magazine, which she spearheaded, came out, which was a revelation to many of us as we, you know, learned much more about disparities between the way boys and girls were treated and men and women were treated. But she did it with such grace. I mean, she was brilliant, beautiful, fun so connected to the world in which she lived and had friends literally around the globe. And so it's a personal loss, but it's also a reminder about the difference that, you know, one person can make who lives a purposeful life. So I want to read you a line from the New York Times obituary that was really striking to me, Madam Secretary.

Ms. Steinem deemed herself an entrepreneur of social change, and she helped usher in sweeping cultural transformations across virtually every facet of American life, from the boardroom to the courtroom to the bedroom. And I think that's a real part of her legacy here, is that she was so much to so many. I think that's a great way of, you know, putting the gloss on what the New York Times wrote in the obituary because it's a absolutely accurate description of her impact. And, you know, she was not. the Supreme Court, but Roe v. Wade was part of her advocacy. She wasn't in Congress, but Title IX,

opening up opportunities to girls in sports and academics was part of her legacy. She wasn't at NASA directing our space program, but Sally Ride, finally becoming the first woman astronaut, was, you know, part of what she stood for. And you could go on and on because the list is probably endless because her understanding of the need to create opportunities for women where they had not existed before or were they only existed to the very, very few exceptions, just really drove her until literally the end of her life. I was talking with a friend this morning who had been in her famous living room at one of her gatherings. And she was talking about how much progress had been made, about the pushback to that progress going.

on now, but how we can't ever be discouraged. We have to keep pushing forward and make sure that we don't lose the gain that she was part of achieving. And Secretary Clinton, that's exactly the area I wanted to explore with you now. You mentioned all the areas that she was involved in, and certainly progress made so much progress made over the decades of her life. But yes, there has been pushback. You mentioned Roe v. Wade just a moment ago. That, of course, overturned. And we see other sort of a reaction to some of that progress now. What are your thoughts and feelings? Are you troubled by where we are right now,

or do you still remain hopeful that even if the progress at times can be halting, it's moving in the right direction? I am both troubled and hopeful. I am troubled because there is a reaction, both in what we might call the real world and particularly online, where women are being targeted with viral, misogyny. But we're also seeing the chilling effect of the kind of rhetoric and actions taken by, you know, Trump and his administration. You know, when I look at the women that Hegseth is purging

from the military, women who went to the military academies who served 20, 30, 40 years in one of our, you know, military branches with great distinction, did everything they were supposed to do, and are literally being cashiered, kicked out of the positions that they had earned because they're women. And then you hear the kind of language that comes out of this administration under the guise of what they call DEI, which, you know, is code for we don't want women or minorities, people who don't fit the mold of what we consider to be real Americans, which, you know, is a pretty limited group, according to them. So, yes, I am troubled by the pushback and the retreats and the boardrooms and courtrooms and, you know, legislative halls.

I see it. I am speaking out about it. But I also remain hopeful because, you know, the spark of equality and opportunity for everyone that is at the root of the American dream is not going to die because Donald Trump is trying to, you know, dig a grave to put it in under his new ballroom, it's going to persist. And, you know, I think it's important to remember the, you know, the example of Gloria. She never held a position in elected or public life, but she was very influential because she, you know, never quit on making it clear that we had to live up to our values. and that included equality for all. So we're going to keep going, and I think her example is going to serve as a real spur to that.

And Secretary Clinton, we'd love to hear just your own personal thoughts and memories of Gloria Steinem. Your interactions, your conversations with her, including perhaps the last time you were able to speak with her. Well, she was very influential in my early life. I bought my first pair of aviator sunglasses because I saw her wearing them. I had my hair long in those days. And, you know, she really was iconic from the first time she burst onto the public scene. But as I got to know her, she campaigned for me. When I ran for office, she and I would talk about issues and strategize.

I went to the play about her life and sat there in the audience. with her and just marveled at how far she had come and what was kind of an unlikely path for a girl growing up in the circumstances she did. And I just found her to be a source of both inspiration and connection. I last saw her in her living room sometime earlier this year, where she would gather people together to keep talking about, you know, the changes we would need, but it was never heavy. It wasn't, you know, doom and gloom. It always had, you know, the element of light and hope, because that's who she was. She really wanted to bring out the best in people. And as I sat there talking with her in her living room and, you know, kind of

reminiscing about some of the fights that we both had been in, it was exhilarating because she brought out the best in you. And so I'm going to miss her personally. And but I also know, you know, she's going to live on. She's going to live on in the hearts and minds of people who, you know, really believe in what we said in the Declaration of Independence that all people, as Gloria would say, are created equal. And we have work to do. Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, we are so grateful that you were able to share some time with us and share these memories of Glory Stein with us. Thank you. Thank you so much.

Take care. Bye-bye. Lauren Leader, certainly Secretary Clinton, the perfect person to weigh in here. Her lives recently intertwined, significantly intertwined with Gloria Steinem's in recent decades. Let's have some of your thoughts about Gloria Steinem at her passing. I mean, entwined in mine as well. I mean, she was such a fixture at my childhood. And my mother was, you know, sort of a foot soldier for the women's rights movement, worked very closely with her throughout my childhood. And certainly, like, everything that is possible in my life is because of the work that she helped.

helped mobilize. And I'd shave a little bit at the word icon constantly being used already in the press this morning because she was so much more than that. Icon has this sort of like static connotation. She was such a mobilizer. And the secretary really nailed it that she was able to even outside of elected office affect such enormous change. And what was significant is that it was cultural change, right? Ms. Magazine was fundamental in changing the way women thought about ourselves, the way the culture thought about women's roles. then the laws and the real transformation in the legislative world for women starting in the 70s, just the most basic rights that we have come to believe are fundamental today to bank accounts and housing and job access,

all of that because of the political work that she helped organize. And then this long life, there's not one of us in the women's rights movement who hasn't spent time with her, who hasn't worked with her, who hasn't been inspired by her. I think she is probably one of the most important figures of the 20th century. I think that's exactly right. Michael Tamaski, in our last minute, just give us your thoughts, too, on Gloria Steinem, someone who you were able to watch for so many years. A titanic figure, very courageous, too.

I don't think anybody's used the word courageous yet, but nobody should be under the impression that it was easy for a woman to do the things she did in the 1960s and 70s. At the New Republic, my magazine, we did a poll of historians, and other public intellectuals over the summer in commemoration of our country's 250th anniversary. We ask these people to make a bunch of lists

for us. And one of the lists we asked them for was the most important women in the history of the United States. And it had the names you would expect. Eleanor Roosevelt, Francis Perkins, Harriet Tubman, Secretary Clinton, of course. Gloria Steinem was on that list too. I think it was 14 or 15 women.

So one of the 14 or 15 most important women in the history of our country in the estimation of these historians and intellectuals, and I think they got it exactly right. All right, well said. Editor of the New Republic, Michael Tamaski, and co-founder and CEO of Allent Together, Lauren Leader, thank you both, and our thanks again to Secretary Clinton for sharing her thoughts as well. That does it for us this morning. We will see you tomorrow at 6am Eastern for another morning, Joe. Money, power, politics of Stephanie Rule is up next here on MS now after a short final break.