Morning Joe - Morning Joe 1/11/24

Episode Date: January 11, 2024

Trump 'proud' to have 'terminated' abortion rights

For 54 years, they were trying to get Roe v. Wade terminated, and I did it. And I'm proud to have done it. They wanted to get it back, right? You wouldn't have that. There would be no question. Nobody else was going to get that done but me. And we did it. And we did something that was a miracle.

When I walked onto the stage today, a gentleman in the back, probably works for Fox, nice guy, said, sir, I'd like to thank you. I said, for what? He said, you saved two million lives in the last three years. You saved two million lives. And I said, thank you very much. I knew exactly what he meant. Two million lives.

And nobody's done more in that regard. OK, that's perhaps the most important admission from Donald Trump last night. Again, bragging about being the one to eliminate a constitutional right for women's health care that has stood for over 50 years. And here's here's Donald Trump's problem is he goes into I would call it softball, a softball event. I've never seen one as, as, as, as fawning. I'm not even sure what, why did they have two hosts there? You know, they could have just had winding, just sit there and smile and say, you're great. Ask another softball question. It was like T-ball. Uh, and even T-ball on, on the biggest issue of the campaign, He swung and hit the tee and the ball rolled off because he bragged, Caddy, about terminating Roe v. Wade. He said, if it weren't

for me, that 10 year old girl in Ohio that was raped by an illegal immigrant, if it weren't for me, she wouldn't have had to flee the state. If it weren't for me, she wouldn't have had to flee the state. If it weren't for me, women wouldn't be like dying outside of emergency rooms because doctors are afraid to conduct women's health care. He admitted. And again, it was such an easy forum. It's not like he was backed into the corner. He admitted he was the one who terminated Roe v. Wade. And what did the Biden people do last night? They're just hanging out. They are probably laughing at all the Republican chaos in the debate and then laughing at the Fox News hosts who were just absolute jokes. It was just an embarrassment. Like Fox News. Oh, we're going to be for this. And even to Sanders's people were like, seriously, this is a paid advertisement for Donald Trump,

which it was even in that setting. He's grown so old and hobbled intellectually, I guess, because he thinks he's running against Barack Obama. He's worried about World War Two starting. Even in the most gentle of circumstances, he made an incredible political mistake and he knows it this morning. He knows it. Incredible political mistake last night going. I was the one who terminated Roe v. Wade. I was the one that just me, nobody else could have stripped away 50 years of women's rights the way I, Donald Trump, did. In the end, it's about me, right? But every conversation I've had with the Trump campaign over the last couple of months, there's been this effort to paint Donald Trump as moderate on abortion. He is the one who's going to say we cannot have a federal ban. He's the one who's going to say to other Republicans, roll back the way that you talk

about Roe v. Wade. Don't sound extreme on abortion. He said after the midterms that some candidates had jeopardized their positions on the Republican side because they had been too tough on abortion. He's pointed out Ron DeSantis in that respect respect for his campaign then, which is trying to get him to say, I'm against a federal ban. We'll have a 15 week ban because that's where the most of the American public is, that the most American public could accept. That's Nikki Haley's position, by the way. That's what his campaign wants Donald Trump's position to be. Nikki. Yeah, but he can't he can't do it. I mean, let's play the clip again, because,

again, I was shocked when I was sitting there. I was absolutely shocked sitting watching going, you know, are they going to like, you know, bring out some Dreamland ribs for him? They might just sit there and talk about football because it was, again, the easiest thing I've never seen. I've never seen a paid advertisement on Fox News like or anywhere else. This was like this was like Glenn Beck survival seeds back when he had a show there. It was like an advertisement for Donald Trump. And even in that setting, he did this. For 54 years, they were trying to get Roe v. Wade terminated. And I did it. And I'm proud to have done it. They wanted to get it back, right? You wouldn't be have that. There would be no question nobody else was going to get that done. And we did it. And we did something that was a miracle. When I walked onto the stage today, a gentleman in the back probably works for Fox.

Nice guy. You know, it's really something, Willie. He said, I did it. Nobody else could have done it. I terminated Roe v. Wade. And everybody in his campaign staff was like, oh, my God. They were trying to bury that. The old man did it again. He can't

help himself. Yeah. I mean, at this point, the Biden campaign doesn't have to put out statements. They just retweet clips of Donald Trump saying this thing over and over and over again. But it's literally what they're doing. Oh, there he goes again. He's taking credit for the three justices on the Supreme Court. He wants credit for getting rid of a 50-year right in this country. And watching, Joe, you're right, that town hall, you should just start with, rather than saying, here are what the lies were, almost everything he said last night was a lie. And then you can work backward from there, including the fact that he said that the economy is a disaster right now, when he was confronted about the question where he said on tape that

he hopes the economy crashes over the next 12 months under Joe Biden and then he can help to recover. He was asked about that last night. He was sort of led along to your point about, well, you didn't really mean that, right? He said, no, I think because the market will crash under Joe Biden. Actually, under Joe Biden, the economy has the market has gone over thirty seven thousand. That's the down number. And we can go through all the data about Donald Trump saying this economy is a disaster about unemployment, about GDP growth, about unemployment ticking down, all the things that have come in. Excuse me. Inflation ticking down. So you just go and you listen to that.

And if you're being honest with yourself, watching that town hall, how you could believe anything he was saying, because almost everything he said unchallenged was a lie last night. And people have to ask themselves if that's somebody they want to vote for. And we'll find out in four days if they do. I mean, there's a media question about this, too, Mark. The media question is,, too, Mark. The media question is, is this Fox News now? Right. Because Fox News was going to be like pushing back against

him. The Murdoch's we've heard all along. They don't like done. They don't like Donald Trump. But now suddenly he's he's allowed to lie. He's given a town hall meeting, a format where he's allowed to lie the entire time. They're not pushing him back. Here is a guy this past week, this past week, who said he hoped people lost their retirement savings, their 401ks. He hoped the economy crashed. He hoped the economy was destroyed. He hoped the stock market crashed. And he's just led down the primrose path last night. Here's a guy this past week who said Abraham Lincoln got it wrong by not caving to the pro-slavery forces in the South and settling that dispute and avoiding the civil war. Nothing, nothing. There's so many things this guy says every day and they just let him walk.

So the media, J6 hostages, you can go on and on. Terminating the Constitution, executing generals. I mean, you just go down the list. Is this I mean, it's fine if that's what Fox wants to do. Is this is this who they are now? Have they decided now we we endorse Donald Trump because it sure looked like it last night. Well, I mean, there are a lot of things to deal with here. I mean, first of all, I mean, yes, it's who Fox is. I mean, it's been who they've been for a long, long time. But it's not like Donald Trump needs prompting to go to these places.

And the stuff he just said, I mean, terminating. Well, first of all, he talked about terminating Roe v. Wade. I mean, interesting choice of words, by the way, terminate. That's the kind of, that soundbite is just gold. He keeps saying it all the time. I mean, the Biden campaign, I mean, they couldn't pay him to say something more dumb. Right, but you also lose, I mean, it all blurs in the mind.

I mean, wait, by the way, Abe Lincoln didn't overturn Roe v. Wade, did he? No. So you lose like that. He said he could have beaten Abraham Lincoln, too. No, I mean, look, the media, I certainly have no sympathy for Fox and certainly how they handle a thing like that. But where do you begin? I mean, in these last like five minutes, we've talked about what six different things that could have blown up any campaign in history. Right. And my point is they didn't mention one of them. It's not like they didn't. They didn't mention one. They didn't stop on one of them. I mean, look, I mean, those town halls are imperfect. And you have I mean, especially when I mean, let me put it this way. He made plenty of news last night, news in the Donald Trump context, because, I mean, what's going to really break through next week?

I mean, you know, we forgot the dictator thing. We forgot the vermin thing. I mean, there's every I mean, the same thing is like 2016. But it's not like you need someone to prompt him to this. I mean, this is more to the point. You don't need to prompt him, but it would be nice if once in a while people said, well, that's what you're saying right there's a lie. Right. And we get we get absolutely none of that. And and so that's fine. But even unprompted in that situation, again, Donald Trump forgets his campaign's message, goes out and just just gives again, gives the Biden campaign the greatest gift they could have gotten last night. Yeah, kind of rare when you see a moment literally change millions of dollars in political advertisement. Like one line, that line will be in millions of dollars of political advertisement over the next eight months. It's just packaged. It's easy.

He called it a miracle, right? You can see that repackaged. I wouldn't advise this as like a professional practice, softball interviews. But I will note to your point that the things we're talking about that Trump, the statements he's made, have all come when he's gone into exceedingly easy forms. So last night is one. The dictator for a day line. That was a Sean Hannity interview. The talk about his hope for an economic collapse.

That was a Lou Dobbs interview. Sometimes these interviews, again, not advising. That's like an interview practice. But sometimes these interviews do trip him up because he thinks he's in a very friendly forum. He gets overly comfortable and he slips. And, you know, this is going to hurt his campaign. I mean, we're talking about, well, there's so much and we just move on to the next thing. You know, people forget, like, there's a ceiling on his support for a reason.

I mean, obviously, we talk a lot about Joe Biden, his difficulty recruiting voters. Trump has the same problem. You know, I've got to say, one of the best columns I've seen this week, J.B. Last wrote in the poll work. He said, here's the deal. This is Biden's low watermark. Everybody's bitching and whining. Everybody's crying. Everybody's hair is on fire. They're all running around, all the Democrats bedwetting, all that. We know Donald Trump has a ceiling.

We know that Joe Biden has sort of a basement level of support and young voters are going to come home. Most black voters are going to come home. Good bit of Hispanic voters going to come home. Not as much historically, but enough voters of those of the base are going to come home. And this is going to be a tight race. By the way, you look at a Pennsylvania, a new Pennsylvania poll that came out and we're starting to see this not just for Joe Biden, but Fetterman is polling better than he has in a very long time. TJ, I'm going to do this. By the way, we have a new Pennsylvania. There it is. We have a new Pennsylvania poll that has Joe Biden up forty nine, forty six. It's only one poll. It's one snapshot. But I always looked at polls. I never believed him. But when I was running, I always looked at trend lines.

And you look at the state of Pennsylvania, the trend lines are very good right now for Democrats. That could change at the same time. What Sam said, what J.B. last said. Good point. Trump's at a ceiling and he goes out and he says things like that. It's we we we we basically admitted to taking foreign money as well while he was president of the United States, taking a hell of a lot more foreign money as as I guess his whole family seems to have. Then then Hunter Biden. And so he keeps stumbling over himself. They want us to play it, play it real quick and then I'll go. There is this report, House Democrats, documents that say that nearly $8 million in payments to your businesses from foreign governments, China included, Saudi Arabia, while you were in office. They say Article 1 of the Constitution says you can't accept money from foreign governments while president.

Would you pledge to divest from your business in the second term as other presidents have done? So that's what they're that's what they're reporting. I own hotels all over the I don't get free money. Somebody rents a hotel room, et cetera, et cetera. Much money I gave back. In fact, I didn't have to do it. I put everything in trust. And if I have a hotel and somebody comes in from China, that's a small amount of money. And it sounds like a lot of money. That's a small. But I was doing services for that. People were staying in these massive hotels, these beautiful hotels, because I have the best hotels. I have the best clubs. I have the best clubs. I have great stuff. And they stay there and they pay. I don't get eight million dollars for doing nothing like Hunter. Oh, yes, you do. Yes, yes, you do. And it's so funny.

All of the Saudis, all of the Chinese, all of the foreign business interests that funneled into the Trump hotel right by the White House. The second he leaves, he sells the hotel. He cashes in on it. Fascinating. Could have been a follow up question to say, well, what about you diverting Mike Pence? Like when he when he was in, I think, Ireland, they diverted Mike Pence's flight to go to the other side of the country to stay at a Trump hotel. I mean, using government money. There's one example after another example after another example. But again, not pushed on that. Well, just last week, we reported on this this big report that came

as a result of getting tax returns from Mazars, the House Democratic, the House Democrats on the Oversight Committee that that he made at least at a very bare minimum, you know, just shy of 10 million dollars in foreign government spending by foreign officials. And these countries like China, Saudi Arabia, you know, they're a laundry list. hearing to hold Hunter Biden in criminal contempt of Congress for for defying a congressional subpoena in the impeachment investigation into Joe Biden for allegedly being involved in his son's foreign business dealings. The contrast is really just remarkable at the end of which, by the way, they said they have absolutely no evidence. They keep they keep they keep making fools of themselves. Yesterday was another example. And again, like you said, the contrast contrast is just remarkable. And I mean, you saw Trump there trying to make this very bizarre distinction in the different types of corruption and why his is viable, because this is what he is, an industry that he has been in his whole life.

And Hunter Biden, meanwhile, has no experience in business. But, you know, you talk about a ceiling. It's also fascinating because Trump's advisers last night were texting my colleagues. We reported this morning that they were really happy with his performance on Fox News, that they did. They felt like he did appeal to a general election by coming out and saying, OK, you know, I know I said I was going to be a dictator on day one. I'm not going to do that anymore. You talk about a low bar. No, it was a good night for him, Willie.

Wow. Good night. And Willie, you can judge that by seeing what the Biden campaign did. They're just sitting back. Campaign ad. Terminate. Okay, cut, paste. Up on their site.

Making the social media team's job real easy over there. And Trump actually said, no, they cut it off. They took my quote out of context about wanting to be a dictator. If you're parsing your quote about wanting to be a dictator, it's probably not a great, great moment. And Jonathan Lemire, people are obviously after a decade of this a little bit numb to what Donald Trump says. But we ought to point out that

just this week, the man who wants to be president again, first through his attorney said they believe that he could order SEAL Team 6 under the right conditions to assassinate one of his political rivals. He said he would like to see the economy crash, the stock market crash this year. He pushed a birther conspiracy about Nikki Haley. He said there will be bedlam in the country if he's convicted in his federal trial around the 2020 election. Also, went after Abe Lincoln for not negotiating with the South to end the civil war. That's all within one week with how many months left to go in this campaign. He also suggested that he'd have beaten Abe Lincoln by about 30 points if they ran against each other. So, I mean, this is Donald Trump is just on full display this week.

In a week that we're sort of as we're going to get to all morning long, where sort of the political and legal forces are really kind of pushing together at coming to a head for him right now. And he'll be in court again so many times in the weeks ahead. This is for the Biden campaign. This is the contrast that they want to offer, that this is what they have been they have been hearing for months and months and that they they have taken the criticism that their campaign has been been slow to move. And then they they push back and say, well, last year, the second half of last year was about fundraising. This is going to be a two billion dollar campaign. We have to spend on those ads

that Donald Trump was so helpfully providing for us. We still need to pay for those. And we heard the president Friday in Valley Forge. You heard from, again, Monday in Charleston, drawing the contrast between what he offers America and the extremism and dangers that Donald Trump is presenting itself. And Joe mentioned briefly that Pennsylvania poll. Pennsylvania is probably the most important state on the map. It's one that Joe Biden likely can't be president without winning again. He has spent so much time there. He's going there again on Friday. He's going there again next week. And Pennsylvania is a state where they know there are pockets of that state that Donald Trump's going to win. They see how popular he is in the western part of that state, but they know they're just enough. They feel like they can turn out sort of the Democratic base, and they've got worries about Democratic base right now, but if they can turn

out the base in the cities and then those suburban voters who are going to be turned off by this, everything you just recapped, everything Donald Trump has said in the last week, that's not going to win him voters, the suburban women voters who are, who of course are outraged by so many of them, by the lack, the Roe v. Wade being overturned and Donald Trump taking credit for it. That's the rejection the Biden campaign is banking on. And they think that, yes, right now, everything Trump's doing is only helping the Republican primary, only going to hurt him in November. And also this week, guys, we've seen President Biden for the first time, first at Valley Forge, then South Carolina, taking Donald Trump head on and going directly at him, calling him a loser from the pulpit in

South Carolina. So the view of the Biden campaign, as you guys know, talking to them is just patience. Just we have a long campaign ahead of us. We know you've seen some polls you don't like. We understand young voters still need some time to come back home. Just wait. We have a long campaign ahead. And once that contrast is drawn as clearly as it has been this week, they like their chances. Well, and your list was incredible just this week. He made the argument that he could unleash Hill Team six to assassinate a political opponent and he would have immunity. That's a big part of last night, right? Yeah. No, not really. The birtherism of Nikki Haley.

I'm sure they brought that. No, no, they didn't. Attacked Abraham Lincoln. That must have been question number one. No, they didn't do that either. We could keep doing this all morning and we will. But first, I want to go back to that Pennsylvania poll because we showed you the headline. But Sam and Katty, I want us to talk about this part of it, because everybody is focusing on younger voters who right now are not moving towards him as much as they thought they're going to come home. May as well.

You look at this number, though, voters 65 and older, Joe Biden, 60 percent. Donald Trump's Sam. Nobody expected this. But we have seen this. Older voters have been moving toward Joe Biden steadily for quite some time. And of course, as we know, older voters, they vote. Yeah. No, I was picking up on this a couple of weeks ago. New York Times did a survey about who is actually concerned about Trump's legal troubles and if they thought that they were serious. And you saw the same age breakdown, 65 and older, way more concerned about it than the younger generations. It kind of piqued my interest. Why is that? I mean, one theory is

maybe they live through Watergate and they understand the severity of it, but you're seeing it in poll after poll after poll where older voters, traditionally conservative, more conservative, traditionally Republican, are backing Joe Biden. I mean, there's a whole number of theories around it. Maybe the age attacks on Biden are actually offending his cohort. I think that's a big part of it. Yeah, but either way, I mean, this explains to a degree Democratic success in the midterms. These are the reliable voters who come out no matter what, even in off years, and they're drifting Democratic. And, you know, it's just a remarkable tectonic shift in politics that kind of has gone

underappreciated. The Trump campaign has always felt that the thing they have going against them is Trump. I mean, the irony, right? Of course, lots of people love him, but it's exactly the kind of things that he said last night that get them worried or, you know, Mark Milley should be executed. It's that chaos factor that Nikki Haley is starting to play up in New Hampshire. We keep hearing her talking about you don't want the chaos of Donald Trump. If you're an older voter, chaos is chaos is scary for everybody.

But it's particularly scary, I think, when you're older and you're feeling more frail and you're feeling more fragile about the world anyway, to have that kind of level of chaos. And perhaps you're a little bit wiser and you pair that with what we heard mika when we were talking to chris coons the other day you know there are economic numbers that are starting to look good yeah for the biden campaign i mean you even considering inflation raises a white rising enough that people are better off in this country have we seen that reflect and i know the frustration in the white house that people don't feel that yet. Give that six months and the White House

is certainly hoping that you compare those two things with. Should we ask someone who's frail and fragile about old voter sentiment? Mark? Mark? Wow.

You're 401k? She's doing real. That is true. That's a transition. Let me redirect that. Let me redirect that and just say that we also understand that when you say the stock market's higher than it's ever been, setting records, who are the biggest beneficiaries of those? People who are 65 and older. They're looking at their retirement accounts.

They depend on those retirement accounts to get them through their retirement years, possibly to get them later on in a good medical end of life care. So they're looking at those numbers. And then they hear Donald Trump saying, we hope your retirement goes up in smoke because I want to get elected president of the United States. That seniors hear that it has an impact. And they vote. Yeah. I mean, I also I mean, to to Katty's point, I mean, the chaos message, the chaos, just the sense of chaos around him is especially disconcerting to older voters like like myself. I mean, I do know, you know, when I cold at night and my grandkids haven't looked in on me for a few days. You walk on one of the tennis balls, so your walker is off, and how do you replace it?

The chaos of having a president that you can't is very, very unnerving. Okay. Meek has heard enough. Coming up, we have so much more to get to. We're going to recap a chaotic day on Capitol Hill, where House Republicans continue to put their grievances over governance. What are they getting done? They continue to make fools of themselves. With the GOP led committees voted to formally recommend the full household Hunter Biden in

contempt of Congress. Because he wouldn't testify. What a day. He was there to testify. He was there and they were they were at a low point. You actually asked the first lady about this. I did. I sat down with First Lady Dr. Jill Biden for an exclusive interview and I asked her about that development in real time as it was playing out. We'll play for you her answer and why she says this is the most important campaign her husband has ever run. We're back in just a moment. It's a live picture of the United States Capitol coming up on 630 in the morning, the building where yesterday the House of Representatives again covered itself in glory

as two congressional committees voted along party lines to formally recommend the full household Hunter Biden in contempt of Congress for defying a subpoena in the Republican impeachment inquiry into his father, despite the fact he has shown up to testify. Earlier in the day, Hunter made a surprise appearance at the House Oversight Committee hearing, sitting in the audience with his attorneys for the first 30 minutes. Some members of Congress addressing him directly while sparring with each other. You are the epitome of white privilege coming into the Oversight Committee, spitting in our face, ignoring a congressional subpoena to be deposed. What are you afraid of?

You have no balls to come up here. Mr. Chairman, point of inquiry. Mr. Chairman. If the gentle lady wants to hear from Hunter Biden, we can hear from him right now, Mr. Chairman. Let's take a vote and hear from Hunter Biden. What are you afraid of? Hold on, hold on, hold him right now, Mr. Chairman. Let's take a vote and hear from Hunter Biden. What are you afraid of? Hold on, hold on, hold on. Order, order.

Hunter Biden should be arrested right here, right now, and go straight to jail. Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent to enter information for the record. What's the information? Oh, my God. State the information.

Thank you. I reserve the right to object. The minority has not provided a copy of the material. For the record, in the past, she's displayed pornography. Is pornography allowed to be, are pornographic photos allowed

to be displayed in this committee room, Mr. Chairman? It's not pornography. Okay, well, you're the expert. I'm not an expert, Mr. Rassman. He's like it. And she did, in fact, hold up a nude photograph of Hunter Biden in the United States House of Representatives. Meanwhile, Democratic Congressman Jared Moskowitz of Florida pointed out the obvious Republican hypocrisy on this matter.

Listen, I'll make this bipartisan. I'll vote for the Hunter contempt today. You can get my vote. You can get my vote. But I want you to show the American people that you're serious. Here is the subpoena to Representative Scott Perry, who did not comply. I'd like to enter this into the record. Here is the subpoena to Mark Meadows. I'd like to enter this into the record, who did not comply. Here is the subpoena to Jim Jordan, who did not comply with a lawful subpoena. I'd like to enter that

into the record. Here is the subpoena to Mo Brooks, who did not comply with a lawful subpoena. I'd like to enter that into the record. Here is the subpoena to Mo Brooks, who did not comply. I'd like to enter that into the record. Here is the subpoena to Mr. Biggs, who did not comply. I'd like to enter that into the record. And here's the subpoena to Mr. McCarthy, who did not comply. I'd like to enter that into the record. There's an amendment coming to add some of those names into the contempt order. You vote to add those names and show the American people that we apply the law equally, not just when it's Democrats, right? It's a crime when it's Democrats, but when it's Trump and the Republicans, it's just fine. No, show that you're serious and that everyone is not above the law. Vote for that amendment and I'll vote for the Hunter Biden contempt. And they did not vote for that amendment. Joe and Mika. So you had in that first clip,

Congresswoman Mace screaming at Hunter Biden for not having the stones, let's put it that way, to show up and testify as he's literally sitting in the room willing to testify. They don't want it to happen in an open forum like that. Also, Chairman Comer said with a straight face, Hunter Biden, no one is above the law in America as they spend most of their professional lives defending Donald Trump against the charges against him. I thought it was interesting. Arnold, the pig from Green Acres, it actually whispered that line into his ear and then he repeated it yeah yeah still the smartest smartest guy on that side of the aisle uh so oh it was an old tv series green acres where the pig was the smartest guy in town but anyway you get you get it old man I loved Arnold. That was one charming pig. The smartest also in town.

Here. So, first of all, Nancy Mace, it's just, it has to be dizzying. I'm a reasonable person. You don't have ball. I'm a reasonable person. I just had sex with my boyfriend. Seriously? Right.

We have a description for that Northwest Florida. That's called a runaway beer truck. And that's exactly what she is. But let's underline the hypocrisy that Jared Moskowitz showed. By the way, those were all members of Congress. Yeah. All members of Congress that were defying the Spanish like schoolyard Republicans. And then revolting. They said that Hunter Biden didn't have the stones, we shall say, to testify. He was there to testify in public, but they didn't have the guts to let him testify. They did not want transparency. They did not want the American people to hear the truth. They wanted to take it behind closed doors.

Again, Republicans shooting themselves in the political foot. First of all, why is it the Republicans don't have the guts, but Hunter Biden doesn't have the stones? This is just these are questions. By the way, thank you to you and Willie for saying stones, because this is an important distinction here. I mean, look, the hypocrisy is itself explanatory. I also remember the White House saying when it was a really close, when the House underperformed for Republicans in the last midterms, they loved the idea and they saw this coming, that this was going to be the circus that was going to be front and center for the Republican Party, you know, as sort of the sideshow to Donald Trump, which is saying something.

And Jackie. And what are they getting done, by the way, while they're doing all this? Anything, any good stuff on tab? Not a deal to fund the government. Right. But Jackie, also, historically, this is the least effective Congress in generation. And in generation, they've passed less legislation, done less. This House. Yeah, I mean, this vaudevillian circus-like show that we saw yesterday,

not just the Hunter Biden criminal contempt hearing, but also the first hearing to impeach Alejandro Mayorkas, sort of covered up the bigger issue that Mike Johnson is facing right now, which is the complete collapse of the deal that he claims he negotiated, which is really the same deal that Kevin McCarthy hashed out to uphold his agreement with Joe Biden and the Biden administration. Right. And the Republicans voted to kill. They voted against the rule, which you never vote against your own party. Exactly. You're seeing the exact same revolt happen again. Hardline right Republicans who are not in favor of this additional spending is the sixty nine billion dollars of a side agreement that has has held fast and headed for a government shutdown. The exact same problems again that Republicans faced three months ago when, you know, Mike Johnson made the case for why he would be a better speaker than Kevin McCarthy. Really quickly, I mean, is Ukraine going to get funded?

Is Israel going to get funded? And most importantly right now for domestic politics, are Republicans going to do the deal to toughen up protections at the southern border? That is also in limbo. You have these hardline Republicans who think the government is worth shutting down if H.R. 2, the very staunch border security bill that that the House passed last May and are not willing to accept this bipartisan package that's being negotiated in the Senate, which is now also falling apart over a few different provisions, specifically parole and the expediting of work permits. So there are a lot of unknowns on both sides here, which is all to say that there is at least another week of negotiations and no, we are not near funding Israel or Ukraine. Jackie. Yeah. Thank you so much, Jackie,

for being with us. We greatly appreciate it. Mark, if we bring some Geritol, milk of magnesia, a little bit of Bengay for your joints, will you stay another? Can I get a nap first? I can come back at nine o'clock hour or something before that. We do provide nap breaks for our seniors here. All right. Coming up on Morning Joe. That's why I come. President Biden is stepping up his attacks on Donald Trump, drawing a clear contrast between the two candidates. We're going to discuss the strategy for his reelection bid with one of the campaign managers next on Morning Joe.

I ask everybody that asked me that question, you know, are you going to be here for four years? Some players ask me, you know, when are you going to retire? I look at them and say, well, can you guarantee me that you're going to be here for four years? And they look at me like, you know, hell no, I'm not making it. That was Alabama head coach Nick Saban a week ago laughing off retirement

rumors during the interview on the Pat McAfee show last night. The legendary coach announced he's hanging up after 17 seasons with the Crimson Tide. Let's bring it right now. New York Times bestseller, author and ESPN commentator Paul Feinbaum. He really is has been the voice of Crimson Tide football and basketball, everything for years. And also the host of Pablo Torre finds out a metal arc media ESPN's Pablo Torre. You know, Paul, you and I spoke offline this past week and you sort of saw this coming. I couldn't I couldn't figure out exactly what he was going to do.

I don't don't see him guy just like kicking around the golf course. But but, you know, you said that you got the feeling that maybe it was just time. Tell us about that. There were little signs, Joe. I've been around him a number of times this year and he is 72, whatever that means. But every time I saw him, he just seemed a little closer to the end. And as I as the news broke last night and as I heard from your people in New York, I couldn't help but think back to January 4th, 2007, Joe. I was a guest on Scarborough Country. And the topic was how much money they were paying Nick Saban. He was making $4 million a year. And the head of the Alabama Board of Trustees, a coal mining executive, said, this is outrageous. We shouldn't be paying CEO-type money. And we all

know now Nick Saban has been worth hundreds of millions of dollars to this university. And I think he took that into consideration. He took a surprising season. We were here, what, seven weeks ago talking about that miracle in Auburn. And I think he just felt win or lose in Pasadena, it was a good time to pass the torch. Yeah. Pablo, you have some distance from this in a way that certainly I do not. I've never, I've always seen John Wooden as the epitome of coaching. Maybe, you know, Sir Alex with Man United could put him in Wooden's category. For anybody that's followed the Premier League, I think you'd probably agree with me there. But the past couple of years, I've started to put Saban in that Wooden category because for him to do what he did in this age of parity,

I still I I'd love to talk to him sometime, not about football, but about management, leadership and how he did it. It was really remarkable. Joe, this is an incredibly difficult job. College football coach who happens to become the greatest of all time and you mentioned the age of parody this feels like the end of an era part of the thing about him retiring at this moment is that the sport is also changing around him and yes this is the unbiased propaganda from joe scarborough on screen right now man who helped get this guy into office so to speak and joe whatever you saw in him when other people didn't, I'll give you credit for that. What he became is unfathomable because he's the sort of coach where you say things like,

hmm, he has more first round NFL draft picks 44 than he has losses as head coach of Alabama. That's amazing. This is a guy who has every four year player who ever played for him winning a national title. And so in this era now that is changing, of course, the transfer portal, name, image, and likeness payments, all of the stuff that complicates the advantage that Nick Saban, by dint of his greatness, had both as a recruiter and also as a coach and all the resources of Alabama behind him, I think he looked around and said, I maximized all that a human being could maximize during this time. And now my time is over. And so, too, is this time in college football. Yeah. You know, what I saw is a strong, strong leader, a smart guy in Alabama

needed one person in charge and not not a bunch of retired football players yapping and trying to take control of the situation. You know, Willie, Pablo brings up a great point. This is a chaotic time in college football, just an absolute mess. You look at the transfer portals. You look at all the money they're throwing at kids. You know, we for years would have people on saying that college players needed to be paid for for all they were doing. But it's it's gotten so chaotic and out of control. I can see why that also would be a good reason for Nick Saban to say,

yeah, we're moving into a new era. I think I'll just pack it up and go home. Yeah. I mean, it's a hard time to be a head football coach. You make a lot of money. I get that. No one's weeping for these guys. But someone like Nick Saban, who talks about family and keeping a team together at the end of every season, you have to recruit your own players not to leave for a better opportunity because LSU or Tennessee or A&M or somebody's offer offering your best wide receiver money and, you know, an endorsement deal with a local car dealership to leave. That's a totally different job. And Paul, I want to put a little meat on the bones for the case for Nick Saban. It's the greatest of all time. I guess Paul Bear Bryant is in the

conversation as well. Another Alabama great Saban, seven national titles, six of them at Alabama, 11 SEC championships for Heisman winners, far and away the most number one first round NFL picks. So he talked about that, you know, giving his his kids a chance to succeed and chase their NFL dreams. And he always did that. Another number that I couldn't believe I had to check it twice, Paul, was in his 17 seasons. Nick Saban had a number one ranked team at some point in the season 15 times. That just shouldn't happen. Over the course of that many years, you're bound to have some downtime, bad years, recruiting class injuries. But he always found a way to be in the conversation

for the national championship. Extraordinary over that length of time. Willie, two quick things. One about Bryant. First about the transfer portal. Before last season, the 21 season that Alabama did not make the playoffs, he had an opportunity to grab the top wide receiver in the entire country. And he was faced with having to pay the guy about $3 million.

Now, exactly how legal that is, it doesn't matter. But that's what the price was. He said, no way. I cannot deal with that on my team. That guy went elsewhere. Had that player been on Alabama's team last year, they would have been in the playoffs with a great shot at winning it all. Back to Bryant for a second. Living in Alabama all those years, and jokingly related to this, having been at school around the time of Bryant leaving,

as Saban started winning championships it was difficult nobody really wanted to say he was better than bryant and one day i was on the phone with mark tyson he happens to be paul bryant's grandson and i was dancing around the subject and finally he just cut to the chase he said listen you don't you don't need to sweet talk me he said my, my papa, my grandfather, I know how great he was. But please start saying Nick Saban is the greatest of all time because he is. Yeah, Bear Bryant was the greatest of all time, but he would be the first to say that Nick Saban is now. You know, in 2013, just talking about how tough this job is day in, day out, year in, year out.

I was talking, John Lemire, I was at the Orange Bowl. We were playing Notre Dame. And I was talking before the game, actually on the field with Joe Manchin, who's who's like, you know, a brother to Nick Saban. They both grew up in West Virginia right by each other. And, you know, as we were walking and I said, how long do you think you'll stay here? This was a decade ago. He goes, I just can't see him staying here very long, much longer. He said he said the pressure is overwhelming. He said, if you lose one game in Tuscaloosa now, it's, it's a failed season. The pressure on the kids, the pressure on the coaching

staff, just too much. And, and Joe Manchin had predicted that he would have, he was going to leave a long time ago. He stayed another decade and he just kept winning championships. Remarkable story. Yeah. And to do so in spite of that pressure to put up, as Willie just read the resume, I mean, the greatest college coaching record of all time and deserving of all the accolades he's going to get today. So, Pablo, I want to ask you about what's next. And it doesn't mean the Belichick to Tuscaloosa rumors that I know you're about to start. But it actually means the future of college football, because this does seem like the end of an era. And we just sort of mentioned how much more complicated it is now, that it's going to be that much harder, that much

more money into it. We know the playoffs are about to expand. There's a sense that the conferences are changing and realigning. For people who have followed it for a long time, there's a sense that sport is sort of spinning out of control. And Saban leaving, Saban such an anchor, is only going to add to that. Yeah, look, college football, as Paul Feinbaum can attest, has always been nuts. It's the craziest, most popular sport in America. For people who don't appreciate the institution, it's the second most popular sport in America, right behind the NFL. And this regional tribalism beset now by economic change. Like, kids, these players should be paid.

But also that demands, OK, a difference in how do we manage these egos? How do we manage all of these people? How do we manage expectations? And so the expectations at Alabama, I'm curious how Joe feels in his heart right now, because the replacement of Nick Saban at this specific time, that job is not a job I would ever want to have. I would like to replace that guy, Joe. I don't want to be that guy because there is no way with all of these pressures,

that job, I don't know, over under on three years, that guy lasts realistically at this point. You know, Willie, I learned a lot, actually, watching people try to replace Bear Bryant. I was in school when he left and it was savage, whether it was Ray Perkins or, you know, the spate of people that followed afterwards. And that's one of the reasons why I was calling for somebody tough and strong like Nick Saban because he had to stare down not just the boosters he had to stare down the legend and you need somebody big enough and Saban it's like yeah basically he's like yeah Bear Bryant he was great that was then this is now

let's build a new and and there just aren't many people that are going to do that and as hard as it is for me to believe Nick Saban's shadow is going to be even bigger. So who would want to follow follow it better be somebody who has a strong self sense of themselves and who's not going to listen to all the appers who are going to say for the first five years, he's no Nick Saban. Yeah. And as you said a minute ago, the standard is so wild that this year, Alabama lost one game at home to Texas and people's hair was on fire. What's wrong? Saban's done. Alabama's done. Well, he just went out and won every game the rest of the season, including beating Georgia in the SEC championship game and came one bad play at the end of overtime away from being in the national title game. Again, that's the standard. You lose one game in Tuscaloosa and there's a problem. So let's spin that question to you, Paul Feinbaum. Who is the clubhouse leader right now

to take this job? There's a lot of talk about Dan Lanning at Oregon. He was a graduate assistant at Alabama, a great defensive coordinator at Georgia after that, now doing a really good job out in Oregon. Steve Sarkeesian, who's got Texas back where it wants to be, a former assistant to Saban. So there's sort of all these Saban disciples in the conversation. Where do you think it's going to go? I think Dan Lanning, Willie, is the coach to watch right now. It seems too difficult for Sarkeesian, who coached under Saban. And really, Saban saved his career.

He got fired at USC because of a public intoxication. One quick story before you go, And I know we don't have a lot of time, but people, we started this conversation about what makes Nick Saban unique. When he was at the Miami Dolphins in 2005, in the preseason, his first preseason there, he got a call from the White House and George W. Bush was coming down and he wanted to have a dinner at the famed Joe Stone Crab House, which everybody knows about. He had Dan Marino lined up and Don Shula and he wanted Saban to come and Saban sent word back. And I later asked him about this. I said, how could you turn down dinner with the president of the United States?

He said, what do you mean? He said, I was two weeks into training camp. I had no time for that. I wasn't going to interrupt my job, nor would he have interrupted a major crisis to have dinner with me. And that was the end of the conversation. He didn't blink an eye, guys. Yeah, that is what you call focus. Paul Feinbaum and Paolo Torre, thank you guys both so much. And can't wait to be talking to you guys early next week after we get through the first round of the NFL playoffs. There we go. And, Mika, we're done. No, no, that's fine.

You were struggling through that. Very interesting. No, I was wondering about Nick Saban and what he was going to do, and this is a huge story. You know, can I say, I went to the Rose Bowl. Yeah. So I did not see, you know, usually football again, I've said this before, it's not really a game to see live. It's a TV game because you see all the reactions up close.

It's like a movie. And I didn't realize till I got back because we were in the road, Jack and Joey and I were watching the game. Didn't realize till I got back. You had said that Nick Saban was strangely passive on the sidelines. He just wasn't reacting. And you and your daughter, who's a massive football fan, said something was off. Well, he seemed reflective. That's all. So maybe a lot was on his mind. But we definitely both looked at each other and said, I wonder what's going on with him.

So it's kind of weird. Maybe he can run against Tommy Tuberville. Maybe. Anybody could. All right.