Morning Joe - Morning Joe 11/2/23

Episode Date: November 2, 2023

GOP Senators confront Tuberville over military hold

Biden has been busy this week. On Monday, he signed an executive order to oversee AI, and there is no one I trust more to save us from the rise of the machines than Joe Biden, as long as none of those machines is a bicycle. He's fine. He's fine he's fine and the light show having fun with president biden's executive action earlier this week on artificial intelligence we'll have a lot more to get to on that this morning including donald trump jr taking the stand in his father's civil fraud how did that go uh we're gonna get legal analysis on his testimony, which I think will continue now. Plus the latest out of the Middle East. More wounded Palestinians and foreign nationals are leaving Gaza. It comes as there's a new threat from Hamas. And on Capitol Hill, Republican George Santos survives an effort to expel him from Congress.

That's thanks to some help from Democrats. Meanwhile, it appears Republicans are finally getting fed up with Senator Tommy Tuberville's antics. We'll show you what his colleagues had to say on the Senate floor. Good morning and welcome to Morning Joe. It is Thursday, November 2nd. Does this week feel long, Justice Midge? I was sure today was Friday. Yeah, no, it was not. Do I have something on my jacket? It's just breakfast. Anyhow, along with Willie.

That was going to be brunch. No, Joe and me. We have the host of way too early, White House Bureau Chief at Politico, Jonathan Lemire, and U.S. Special Correspondent for BBC News, Katty Kaye, the host of the podcast On Brand with Donny Deutch. Donny Deutch, an attorney and a contributing columnist at the Washington Post. George Conway joining us

this morning. Good to have you. I just got to say, Willie, we're obviously going to go to Israel and Gaza and everything that's happening there. But my gosh, last night Senate Republicans just finally had it with Tommy Tuberville. And you had military veterans like Johnny Ernst and others getting on and just eviscerating him five hours, held him on the floor for five hours.

And, you know, at one point, a Republican said, just because how dumb he did. He didn't say how dumb can you be? He said, how dumb can we be? And he's like, President, she is loving this. Tuberville, like Vladimir Putin is loving what you're doing. You are aiding and abetting the enemy is what basically his own Republican Party was saying. Yeah. And you had senators. Senator Tubera suggested the military is bloated and that these are just desk jockeys. And you had one of the senators that we're going to hear in just a second walking through who exactly these men and women are and why they're not desk jockeys. To quote the great Alex Corson, our executive

producer, quoting Die Hard, welcome to the party, pal. Where have these senators been for the last several months while this has been going on? They've been saying privately and sometimes in public that they don't like it, but doing nothing about it. So last night, Senator Tommy Tuberville of Alabama faced backlash from members of his own party who angrily challenged his months long blockade. They attempted to unanimously approve 61 military promotions by voice vote for more than four hours. Tuberville rejected each nomination as his colleagues' frustrations grew. We have done the best that we can to honor the request of a fellow senator

that these nominations be brought to the floor and voted on individually. And I really respect men of their word. I do not respect men who do not honor their word. No matter where you believe it or not, Senator Tarpoville, this is doing great damage to our military. I don't say that lightly. If this is the norm, who the hell wants to serve in the military when your promotion can be canned based on something you had nothing to do with? It's simply a, in my opinion, an abuse of the powers we have as senators to say if there's something we vehemently disagree with, that we're going

to use that power to hold up the promotion of over 350 men and women in our military. These are the people who are kicking in doors in Fallujah, shooting terrorists in the face. And we have people saying they're desk jockeys and they're not warriors. That's just ridiculous. It's ridiculous. We have people saying they're desk jockeys and they're not warriors. That's just ridiculous. It's ridiculous. And it's insulting. The Chinese admirals and their military, they're probably watching this debate right now going,

I can't believe my luck. I can't believe our luck. Maybe we should attack Taiwan tomorrow. No. We're going to look back at this episode and just be stunned at what a national security suicide mission this became. So Senator Sullivan served in the United States Marine Corps for many years. Joni Ernst, Senator Ernst served as well. You see the frustration there that, again, we've been hearing privately.

Sometimes we'll hear Mitch McConnell say sort of politely, I disagree with what Senator Tuberville is doing, but it's the way the system's set up. Somehow, for some reason yesterday, the dam broke and they all came out against. I think a lot of it, Jonathan, we're probably has to do with the fact that you had an episode with the Marine Corps commandant. And by the way, I guarantee you every one of those senators, first of all, were angry behind the scenes all along. Oh, yeah. But I guarantee you, every one of those senators got calls from the Pentagon going, what in the holy hell are you guys doing? We've got guys being sent to the hospital now because like one job is enough to just absolutely rip somebody apart. You're making them do two, three, four jobs because of this clown from Alabama that even people in Alabama don't support?

You know the pressure coming from the Pentagon with one of their own being sent to the hospital on a health issue. I mean, you know it's getting intense now. Yeah, and that Marine Corps leader hospitalized over the weekend. He had spoken openly days previously that he is working two jobs and simply couldn't do it. He couldn't. He was too much. And now we saw him have this health episode. My understanding is talking to a few Republicans involved with this yesterday,

that that played a role, as, of course, is the escalating crisis in the Middle East. This is not a moment where the U.S. military cannot be at anything other than at full readiness, as we have two aircraft carriers in the region. And, of course, there are still hot the war in Ukraine and concerns about China and Taiwan as well. And we saw from Lindsey Graham, who, of course, is a hawk and always been pro-military. He was very firm. Dan Sullivan from Alaska, the strongest voice there. Mitt Romney.

There were others all taking shot after shot after shot of trouble who says he won't back down. He says he's staying with this despite the onslaught from his own party. Yeah, I'll tell you what, Joni Ernst spoke quietly, but gave George one of one of the harshest eggs when she finished by saying, I don't respect men who don't keep their word. Yeah. Well, I mean, it really is just an absurd situation. I mean, somebody should tell they should. Maybe they have been telling this guy you can't you can't play football without a roster. And then he's just sitting there and not and blocking everything. And, you know, partly it's the Senate rules that we've all heard about.

But also, I've always wondered why it is that all of these officers have to have their commissions. I mean, they have to be confirmed by the Senate. It does not make any sense because I as I understand that the Constitution, the appointments clause of the Constitution only requires principal executive officers. It's essentially cabinet heads. Right. To be confirmed by the Senate. And by law, Congress can say that everyone else can be selected by just the president alone or even by the courts of law, depending on what they. Here you've got thousands of of of of people up for nomination. And it doesn't make it doesn't add up with the Senate rules that say that one senator can insist on debate on every single one of those. I mean, the rules that are set up now depend on good faith. And what we're seeing here is not

good faith. It's absolutely no good faith whatsoever. Has nothing to do with the military. It's gutting readiness, Donnie. And as you heard, Senator Sullivan say that we're going to look back on this and it's just going to be catastrophic suicide mission that we've put our military on. And and unfortunately, you have that happening in the Republican with the Republicans in the Senate, with Tommy Tuberville. And then in the House, you've had House members who constantly eviscerate and attack and beat down the United States military, hate the United States military, hate the generals that run the United States military, hate Mark Milley when he was chairman of the Joint Chiefs, was so disrespectful to him. It was sickening. It made me sick. Nobody, no, but not even the most left wing radical when I was on armed services

ever treated a general or an admiral with such such a little respect. And then you add on top of that that you've actually had Republicans in the past saying they wish the United States military was more like the Russian military, the same Russian military that tried to bum Russia's in Syria. And like two minutes later, 500 of them were dead because guess what? You know what? You know what those special ops said in Syria? Welcome to the party. You know, really do. Do we really want our troops to be like? Let me answer that. Hell no. Ask any general, not only in America, but anywhere across the world. Do you want your troops to be like the Russian troops or like American troops?

You know, I remember I remember way back 40. I don't know how many years ago I was in college. Maybe it was what was it an odd six or seven? I don't but anyway it was a long time ago and i remember even then that we were it was a it was a political science course on on soviet history and you know we're talking about cold war and everything and this professor happened to have a lot of experience dealing with the soviet she goes they look at our soldiers, regardless of what you hear, they think they're seven feet tall. They'll never say it. They're scared to death of American Marines. They want no part of it. And you know what's changed in all that? And nothing, nothing. Because the Chinese are scared of our military. The Russians are scared of our military. The North Koreans are scared of our military. The Russians are scared of our military.

The North Koreans are scared of our military. The world is scared of our military. They quake in fear. The only people that don't seem to respect our military right now are Republicans on Capitol Hill and the guy who's going to be the next president of the United States if the Republicans have their way. It is grotesque. They stand alone in the world in their disrespect for the strength and the power and the might of America's armed services. What a brand on that. Well, sir. Well,

said, sir. Beyond the grotesqueness of it, the stupidity of it, there's one thing that pretty much everybody agrees on. Republican, Democrat, of course, I'm not these knuckleheads, is a respect and a love and a reverence for military. I can go forward to 2024 and basically think about an we already have and just come forward and said, I understand the importance of readiness. I understand the importance of defending our country. And and by the way, I understand better than you, because as the senator said, we were in Fallujah. Yeah. Right. We were fighting across Afghanistan and in Iraq, Tommy Tuberville, while you were sitting there playing Appalachian State. So if you have the military supporting Democrats, that's about as strong as an endorsement. So, by the way, no disrespect to Appalachian State at all.

I mean, some of the best people I know, Appalachian State, they beat North Carolina. The point is, it's not military. I love Appalachian State. Some of the best people I know are from Appalachian State. They beat North Carolina. The point is it's not military. I love Appalachian State. Some of the best people I know are from Appalachian State. I'm just saying. Good program. From Auburn. You know, it's a different level and blah, blah, blah.

It's not Fallujah. Go ahead. But that's the campaign that I would run, generally speaking, and just have generals talk and just say, look, here's one side, here's the other side. Because if the Republicans lose military and they've lost law and order, what do they have? Kind of don't have that much left. They have nothing left,

if I really think about what they've been talking about lately. But I overthrew the government. And the other thing that Tommy Tuberville is, is I don't know where the university, the Republican University of stupid performative art, that the game is, whether you're Josh Hawley, whether you're uh josh hawley whether you're josh hawley

whether you're calling a guy whose mom survived the holocaust yeah an anti-semite and whose whose family a great number of them were lost in the holocaust calling them an anti-semite yesterday yeah our our cover bill i was hearing about this today. Yeah, well, Matt Gaetz and what he's done, he's like, here's the formula. Be really stupid. Be really obnoxious. Be completely, completely off your rocker. Get exposure on television.

Raise money. Put it on your Instagram, but only cut the part where you're insulting a person. I don't know where that school is that's teaching them these things. Yeah, isn't that funny? That's Josh Hawley. So Josh Hawley insults. Mayorkas. A man whose mother survived the Holocaust.

I think Auschwitz. And he's so proud of it. He puts it up on his Instagram because he is that shameless. You know, he should have gone. If he had any humanity at all, any humanity at all. He would have apologized. No humanity. No shame. This is your Republican Party. And that's one of the key rules to Donnie's point. Never apologize. Never apologize. Lean into it.

Even when you insult the son of a Holocaust survivor, lean into it, raise some money off of it. We've had a lot of people asking us, how can this be, Caddy? How can one man hold up this legislation, these promotions in this case? The truth is, in the United States Senate, one senator can hold up anything. Now, they usually go around them quickly, or the senator has made his or her point and then move along. But here now, Tommy Tuberville standing alone, as we saw yesterday, even among his Republican colleagues. So the question is, as he makes this stand choosing against the United States

military and its readiness and for abortion, you know, being against abortion so that members of the military cannot go state through state to have health care. What is the world thinking as it watches this? What does it look like from London, from Europe? What does it look like in the Middle East with all the crises that are exploding? I mean, it reminds me of something Bob Gates, when he was defense secretary, said to me when he was defense secretary under President Obama, that America faces three threats in the world. It faces a rising China, a declining Russia, and it faces threat of itself. And by that, he meant the dysfunction

in American politics. And, you know, perhaps back when he was talking to me at the beginning of the Obama administration, it seemed pretty mild compared to what it is today. Tommy Tuberville shows no signs of backing down. And you now have the consequence of that people in military positions who are extremely tired. They are working as this general who was hospitalized was working from 5 a.m. in the morning till 11 p.m. at night doing two jobs. You don't make good decisions when you're working those kind of hours. You don't make the right kind of decisions in America's best interests. And I think it's all part of this questioning of America's, whether America

is governable. Is this a country that works still? Joe and I were talking about this the other day. Does it work on guns? Does it work on security? Does it work on a Senate level? Does it work on being able to keep itself open? Does it work on being able to pay its bills? The dysfunction, you know, is something that is slightly, sadly being baked into the equation amongst America's allies and I'm sure amongst America's adversaries. And that's not a good place to be. You don't want them to say, oh, yeah, this is just more Washington dysfunction. We're kind of getting used to it. That's that's not a great position to be in. And it is so it is so strange. You usually have George, you'll have countries begin to fall apart. And that'll be a leading indicator of a political system starting to collapse because it can't keep up here you have the united states military stronger than

any military in the world and if you look at it relative to the rest of the world this is the strongest position we've been in since 1945 end of world war ii look at our economy. Caddy's talked about it all the time. We can have Ratner talk about it. Compare the United States economy to Britain's economy, to Europe's economy, to China's economy. We are light years ahead of everybody right now. Strong. I mean, the Fed is doing everything it can do to tap down and to beat down this economy. Can't do it. We just keep growing. I mean, you can look at the education and yes, woke and you've got all of these other problems. You've got you've got administrators that won't stand up to anti-Semitism at the same time. Best colleges and universities

on the planet. There's not a close second. Everybody across the world sends their kids here if they can, because they want them to come to America. We have a crisis on the southern border and even on the northern border now. Why? Not because America sucks, not because America is ungovernable, but because if you talk to any of those people crossing the border, if you talk to people in, you know, that have immigrated here legally, which is the way we have to do it, we have to get order and do it that way. What will they tell you? Well, they'll tell you what they've told me. They really do believe America's streets are paved with gold. They really do believe America is the last hope for a dying world. They believe it because compared to what they're living in and where they're living, we still are. And yet, why is it with all of these indicators, with teen

pregnancy at the lowest rate in 70 years, with childhood poverty going down. Why is it that we have a Washington, that we have politicians there that are so unworthy of the nation they govern? Because people vote for these politicians. And that is, to me, the big mystery. We live at a time where the standard of living we have today is as good as any group of human beings has had in human history. I mean, you know, everybody out there, including people who don't live so well, they have their fancy Google phones and whatever.

And they they they we have it so good that some people just are looking for something to gripe about. And we develop this as I'm trying to express it as it's a form of nihilism. They want to see institutions torn down because they're envious of other people. They don't have enough. They don't feel they have enough. They don't have enough satisfaction in their lives. So they vote for these people. And then these people cater to them and raise money by by by catering to their anger and their and I don't understand the dynamic, but there's a psychology here, the sickness that pervades the country. But the way it works is these people that are talking about tearing down institutions because they're not fair to working americans then get their money run for office get elected tear down america and then complain about and pass tax cuts that help the billionaires the multi-billionaires

that's insane all these 25 donations to go and get all these nihilists that say we're going to tear down the government. They don't do anything but to help billionaires get even richer. It's crazy. It's crazy. It's almost like they're all watching something that's brainwashing them. Are you looking for a real degree at a fair price? Then look no further and apply to Trump University, America's number one college, not a real college at a fair price, then look no further and apply to Trump University, America's number one college. Not a real college. We've got highly experienced professors in law, ethics, theater, and Spanish. El hombre del pelicuin. Trump University. Apply today. $900 application fee. There you go. Not a real college. I just want to go back really quickly to Josh Hawley.

Not only did he smear a Holocaust survivor's son and smear a guy whose family, a lot of his family was wiped out by the Holocaust, he then put the clip up on his Instagram and says, Holly smokes Mayorkas. So what, burn what in the ovens, Josh? Is that what you're saying? Seriously? Like, no shame. And then he goes on Fox News and they do a victory lap about him attacking a holocaust survivor's son that is sick and that's exactly how they get away with it yeah and people that are watching are too stupid in this case to actually see that he's attacking holocaust survivors families in the middle of the greatest anti-Semitic campaign against Jews. He knows what he's doing. Where there's a war, worldwide war against Jews. And he attacks a Jew and is shameless about it. And then goes on Fox News and they do victory lap about it.

Anyone with any integrity, as we were just saying when that moment happened, would have said, I'm so sorry. I did not know about your family's history. Let's talk about the policy. But of course, that's not who Josh Hawley is. And he was there to talk about policy. He was there to post that clip. I smoked my orcas. Now I'm going to go on Fox News.

We're going to do a touchdown dance about how I smoked my orcas. I smoked my orcas. Now I'm going to go on Fox News. We're going to do a touchdown dance about how I smoked my orcas. I smoked my orcas. Would you really, after you learned that his mother survived concentration camp and her family was burned in the ovens of Auschwitz and other, would you really say, I smoked my orcas? Would anybody be, it's really sick. It's sick. It's sick because they know he knows.

This is how it works. They're in a safe bubble. They're from a red state or a safe district. He goes on Fox News. He can post an alternate reality and raise money off of it. That's how he will get elected next time and raise money. And to our point, this is the playbook that Donald Trump taught him.

It's don't apologize and be utterly shameless. No humanity or humility. There has to be some standard. If you want to fight him on the border, fair game. Do it. Go after what's happening at the border. Guess what? We'll do that.

Yes. Go at it. We'll all do that. Go at it and go and sit with Hannity and talk about the border. But to your point, in the context of what's happening in this country right now with anti-semitism what's happening in the world to go celebrate an attack on a man who just told you his mother survived the holocaust it is it's sick but his voters they don't know the truth they're watching fox they're listening to his they don't know they think they're getting news they think they're getting information uh

and by the way i'd say i just got to say on the same network a couple weeks ago you had somebody actually saying elections don't matter right on on their on their biggest show elections don't matter we're going to have to resort to violence we're going to have to do what we're going to have to do what the north did during the civil war we're going to have to resort to violence. We're going to have to do what we're going to have to do what the North did during the Civil War. We're going to have to resort to violence. Elections don't matter. Think about it. Yeah, that's after they paid seven hundred and eighty seven million dollars. That's after Tucker Carlson. That's before the billion dollar settlement coming up before him. And they still let people go on their air saying elections don't matter. We're going to have to resort to violence. And then they sit there and go, oh, wait, well, you know, they're not to be taken seriously.

You know, like Tucker's lawyer said, oh, nobody believes him. Nobody believes you. No, you're not supposed to believe him. Yeah, well, a lot of people did, and four cops are dead. Okay. Donald Trump Jr. took the stand yesterday as a witness in the New York $250 million civil fraud trial. In his testimony that lasted just under an hour and a half, he insisted... Who does he look like there, Willie? Okay.

Now, who does he look like? I'm just asking who he looks like. It's not the greatest... Who does that look like in that sketch? That doesn't look like i'm just asking who he looks like it's not the great i really look like him that sketch that doesn't look like him but okay like a serpico all right oh that is a serpico thing great i think he insisted he never worked on his father's financial statements and that he relied nobody say anything no some of this might be funny i'm just curious what he looks like here. He's Rico Stark. He says he relied on other staff members to verify the accuracy of documents. Trump Jr. is an executive vice president of the Trump Organization and acted as a trustee of a trust set up from former President Trump's assets, Donald Trump was in office. The Associated Press reports at least one of the annual financial statements bore language,

saying the trustees are responsible for the document. But Donald Trump Jr. said he didn't recall ever working on any of the financial statements and had no specific knowledge of them. Don Jr. was the first of four members of the family to testify and will return to the stand today. Eric Trump is also scheduled to testify today. Ivanka Trump and former President Donald Trump will take the stand next week. Donald Trump was not in attendance for his son's testimony,

but did react on his Truth Social page, again, calling out the judge in the case, quote, leave my children alone. And Gorin, you're a disgrace to the legal profession. George Conway, where do we begin? First of all, did they glean anything from him, from the attorney general's side? Well, I think what they're trying to show is that nobody is taking responsibility for these financial statements. But is that? Well, yeah. I mean, the way it's supposed to work is, I mean, you know, they weren't going to take any. Right. They're not going to take any responsibility. They just point at the accountant. So they point at somebody or they don't recall things. And in a criminal case, that might work because you have to prove criminal intent beyond a

reasonable doubt. the problem is this is a civil case and the statements have already been found to be false and so right this isn't going to help at all because the judge can make findings say i don't believe that he didn't remember that i don't believe that he was relying on the countenance the story doesn't make any sense or that was negligent right if he didn't remember right and i think The story doesn't make any sense. Or that was negligent. Right. If he didn't remember. Right. And I think that it doesn't even matter that he's there. He could find beyond a, you know, all you have to do is find out 50.01 percent more likely than not that there was fraud committed. And they they they knew knowingly did that. And it's easy to do it. And it's going to be the judge will

will make credibility findings and say these people are all liars. And that's not really a power. So the defense here, as we've seen in other cases, is that they'll try and delay it. The Trump side, can they? Because this could be expensive. So if he finally gets his punishment, they decide it's a certain amount of money. How long can the Trump side drag it out? Because this is the decision on how much he pays. There will be already been found. There will be an appeal. The part of the judgment that has already been issued that cancels the business certificates of the Trump companies has been stayed.

Understandably, because once you do that, you can't re-unscramble the eggs. And they probably will get a stay pending appeal, but you have to post a large bond. So it may take a couple of years for this to pan out in the appellate courts. But there's already been an interim receiver appointed. Right. And, you know, how is that impacting the bill? Well, they they they basically they can't move assets around. They can't hide them. They're they're they're they're stuck. And that's one of the reasons I think Donald is so upset and showing up at the trial every day is that he's been it's basically

financial handcuffs already. And who's going to loan money to these people Right. Because, you know, they're going to go out of business. I see. I see. George Conway, thank you very much. Thank you, George. House Republicans stand alone bill for aid to Israel. Now, first of all, they said this bill was they just couldn't continue spending America into debt, even though they were the ones that were spending America into debt. That seems responsible. They said, we're going, I guess they're going to change their way. Like, you know, alcoholics, this is part of some seven step process or something or 12 or 13. And so the first step is, you know, you will admit you have a problem, right? They haven't done that yet. But so they come back and so they're like, we're going to pay for this Israeli aid, even though it's never been done before. Only problem is, it adds to the debt.

Oh, that doesn't really do it. But that's what Republicans do. Trump Republicans, biggest, biggest debt spenders in U.S. history. So House Republicans' standalone bill for aid to Israel would add billions more to the U.S. history. So House Republican standalone bill for aid to Israel would add billions more to the U.S. deficit. Billions. That's according to a new report by the nonpartisan congressional budget office. You know what I wish we could do right now, Willie? What do you wish? I wish we could go to the Southwest Wall. I wish Ratner was the Southwest Wall. Willie, joining us. Yes, yes. Okay. Life on the Southwest Wall. From the Southwest wall to your town, ladies and gentlemen.

Steve Ratner. Steve Ratner. It's so good to see you here. So, Steve, first of all, they lie and they say we're going to pay for the Israeli aid bill by cutting from the IRS. But it'll balance each other out. Tell me, in fact, what does it do? Well, Joe, you kind of stole my thunder. And I think you could probably come over here and do this as well as I could at this point, because I've heard you talk about this. But let's just go back and explain how the tax system works or doesn't work. And then we'll get to the impact on the budget. So the IRS collects $2.8 trillion a year, roughly, in taxes.

But besides that, they also collect $68 billion from what they call enforcement, we would think of as audits. But they've calculated in a study they've done that there's another $428 billion out there of taxes that don't get paid. You can call it tax avoidance. You can call it tax evasion, whatever you want, people who don't report all their income. But guess who it is who doesn't report all their income, and particularly large amounts? It's the wealthy. So if you look over here, this is by income, lowest income, highest income folks, and what percent of their income they don't report. But down here in the bottom 50 percent, there's pretty much a high level of tax compliance. When you get over here to the top 5 percent and the top 1 percent, it's a different picture. You're talking about people who are not reporting over 20 percent of their income to the IRS by various means of how they fill out their tax returns.

And these are folks who make over six hundred thousand dollars a year here. So there's there is a lot of money out there for the IRS to collect. And to the one percent also very high. You've got billionaires not paying money. You've got a million. You have some of the richest Americans not paying, avoiding taxes. And this is exactly who the Republicans are trying to protect. Right, Steve? It's who they're trying to protect. Yes, they're not they're not paying taxes. And what the IRS is trying to do is essentially allow them to continue to not pay their taxes. So, Steve, let me just go on over to the next chart, because what's so fascinating is that there are a lot of times you put money into agencies and people complain you don't see a return.

But as your next chart is going to point out, investments in IRS enforcement, especially when it's been underfunded for years, will actually pay for itself. Joe, I really think you should just come over here to the Southwest Wall and do this because you've got to hold down. I'm too shy. I'm too shy. You're too shy. Yes, I know that. Very quiet guy. So let's look back at the IRS's audit rates. So these are what percent of returns they audit by income, highest income down to lowest income back to 2010. And back in 2010, if you were in the upper income, the $10 million or more, you had over a 20% chance of getting audited. Today, that chance of getting audited is under 5%. And you can see the other curves for lower incomes have gone down also, but it's gone down the most for the wealthy. Why has it gone down the most for the wealthy? Because it costs the

most to audit them. And as we'll see, the IRS has been short of funds. And so they've cut back on auditing the wealthy, which obviously produces even less revenue. So to Joe's point, let's talk about what the IRS gets back. For every dollar the IRS spends auditing somebody in the top 0.1 percent, that's $9 million of income roughly a year, the IRS gets back $6.30. So $1 of spending yields $6.30 of revenue, a bit less for the top 1%. And then when you get down to the bottom 50%, actually the IRS loses a little bit of money auditing those folks.

But for the reasons I said, because it is so time intensive to audit the wealthy, they tend to cut back on those audits the most when they have budget issues. Because they have budget issues. Can you also speak really quickly to how these budget cuts have made the IRS just one of the least efficient bureaucracies in Washington, D.C., and how that usually falls, that usually impacts working Americans who can't afford lawyers, who can't afford accountants, who can't afford minders to take care of their IRS audits or to fight to get their refunds back. If you're a working American and the IRS owes you a tax refund, good luck.

Good luck getting somebody on the phone that's going to help get that money back or are good luck with letters, emails, whatever. It is it is like a lot of agencies in Washington, D.C. It's operating with computers out of the 1980s. Yeah. And because we have been because the Republicans in particular have been trying to starve the IRS's budget, it forced them over the years to cut back the number of agents they had. And things like call times shot up the amount of time you've been sitting on the phone just trying to get somebody to talk to you. What way up. But so here's what happened.

And this is after adjusting for inflation. The IRS's budget was pretty steady until about 2010. And then in the course of a bunch of other budget agreements, the Republicans succeeded in cutting the budget, resulting in this cutting of the IRS's headcount. Now, Joe Biden, in the Inflation Reduction Act, won $80 billion of new funding for the IRS over the next 10 years. The Republicans have been carving this back. First, in the debt ceiling debate that we had in June, they got $20 billion cut out of the IRS budget. And now the Johnson bill would cut another $14 billion out of the IRS budget. You'd still have an increase, but it would be a much, much smaller increase. And Joe, as you said in your lead in,

so here's the net net of the whole thing. The Johnson bill would cut $14 billion. It would offset that aid to Israel that we've been talking about. They would lose, the Treasury would lose $27 billion of revenue. So at the end, the deficit would actually go up by $12 billion because they're cutting this funding from the IRS. So, yeah, another $12 billion added on to the deficit with the new Speaker's first act. All right, Steve, well, thank you so much. I mean, the thing that really has been connected here, Steve, actually is when you look at all these charts together, it is very clear Republicans want to slash IRS funding because they want the line to continue going down on the richest one percent of Americans actually getting audited. And since they cheat disproportionately on their taxes, those are billions and billions of dollars more that are kept kept from balancing the budget. Yep. Four hundred and twenty eight billion dollars out there every year to be collected.

If we were to fund the IRS the way it should be funded instead of what the Republicans are trying to do. All right. All right. Steve Ratner on the Southwest Wall. Look at that. Ratner's charts. It's kind of like, wow, really is like the Green Monster. We got to play wiffle ball in here. We can play wiffle ball. I know we wanted to go to the MLB Network. I'm played over there for a second. Thanks, Steve. Ratner's Wall. You go over Ratner's wall with a wiffle ball. It's a grand slam. Thank you, Steve.

Yeah. Pull hitters. Some news from the world of sports. Legendary college basketball coach Bobby Knight has died. The Hall of Famer got his start at Army in 1965, but he's best known for his 29 seasons at Indiana University, where he led that school to three national championships. The first of those came in 1976 when Indiana went undefeated, seasons at Indiana University, where he led that school to three national championships.

The first of those came in 1976 when Indiana went undefeated, a feat no team has accomplished since. He would go on to coach at Texas Tech for seven seasons before retiring in 2008. Knight was the Big Ten Coach of the Year five times and a four-time National Coach of the Year. He's also one of only three coaches to have won an NCAA title, an NIT title, and an Olympic gold medal. Bob Knight was 83 years old. Let's bring in college basketball analyst for ESPN and ESPN insider,

Jay Billis, and longtime sports columnist and New York Times bestselling author, Mike Lupica. Guys, thanks so much for being on this morning to talk about this. Jay, I'll start with you. You were playing at Duke in the peak years of Bob Knight at Indiana. He won a national championship, I think right around your junior or senior year with Keith Smart and Steve Alford and those guys. And then you got to work alongside him at ESPN. So what are your reflections this morning on Coach Knight? Well, Willie, Bob Knight was an American original. And while he was not for everyone, he was a friend of mine. And we spent a lot of time together, not only when we worked together,

we played a lot of golf, went overseas several times. And he was one of the greatest coaches ever. When you would sit and watch practice, he got in and out of situations and dissected the game like no other coach I've ever been around. His ability, I think he could have coached anything, any sport and been great at it. That's how proficient he was in breaking things down. He had, but when I said he's not for everyone, at his best, there was nobody better. But when he wasn't at his best, I could always understand people that didn't care for him.

And I never argued with those people. He was unique. And I've never met anyone like him. But one of the true greats that have ever walked the sideline. He was smart. He was engaging. At times, he was uncommonly stubborn and thoughtless, but a very emotional person. I think that's one of the things that did cause him some problems. When he was let go at Indiana, when he was fired in 2000, I don't think it was anger that he had at Indiana. I think it was emotional hurt that manifested itself

and looked like anger to others, if that makes sense. But just an extraordinary coach. Hey, Mike Lupic, so for people who maybe in more recent years knew Bobby Knight as the guy that threw the chair across the floor and knew him for the outburst that they would see. And and that's all they knew of Bobby Knight. Can you talk about follow up on what Jay said? And there we go. That's for that's That's the moment a lot of people remember. Talk about the Bobby Knight that we don't see in videos on YouTube

or that you can't show in three seconds here about what he did for kids, what he did for high school students going into college, how he shaped them into champions and how he did it year after year, after year, after year, and how even in 1976, he did something that nobody has done since. Joe, he would have done it the year before Scott May hadn't gotten hurt. They would have gone two years without losing a game. Jay wrote a wonderful column last night on ESPN dot com. And what he said in the middle of it was he finally gave up trying to explain to people why he was Bob's friend. I knew him for over 40 years. We had a roller coaster relationship because a lot of people in my world did. His best friend was a sports writer, Bob Hamill from Bloomington.

We shared a love of the Chip Hilton sports books because the great coach, Claire B., who wrote them, had been one of Bob Knight's mentors. The thing that was so complicated about him and made it so hard to defend a guy who I believe is as great a basketball coach as ever lived was a larger than life figure who would sometimes sabotage himself by being smaller than life. And that's what he did constantly. But at his best, you talk to his ex-players and Jay knows this far better than I do. They are intensely loyal to him. I spoke to Mike Woodson, the current Indiana coach last night, who was extremely emotional. And he said, I can't speak to what other people think a coach. All I can talk about is what he meant to me and what he meant to

me is everything. And Jay knows this in the world in which he lives, which is college basketball. Knight did the winning he did, Joe, without cheating and graduating his players at a time when that really meant something in college sports. So here's Bob Knight in 1991 during his induction into the Basketball Hall of Fame. I've never felt comfortable with the award coach of the year or coach of anything I think there's a much more appropriate nomenclature that could be used and that would be team of the year because for a team to develop to a point where a coach is recognized for what that team has done is an indication that the players, the assistant coaches, everyone involved has really put forth an outstanding effort.

And that is truly a team honor. Jay, I'm not sure people outside the basketball world fully understand the legacy he's left because of your coach, Coach K, Mike Krzyzewski at Duke, having played under Bob Knight at West Point. How significant a figure was Bob Knight in Coach K's life? Oh, profound. You know, Willie, I think everyone can agree that the relationship that you have with the coach is similar to a parent. You seek the approval. Any praise you get from your coach lifts you up. Any criticism kind of weighs you down.

And Coach K had a profound love for Coach Knight. And when I was playing at Duke in the Final Four in 1986, we were playing in the championship game, and he brought Coach Knight in to talk to the team. And when Knight walked into a room, I mean, he was 6'4", and a big man, but his personality filled up the entire stadium when he spoke to us. And I still remember what he said.

He said, remember one thing, boys, nobody remembers who finished the second. And of course we lost by a bucket, finished the second, finished second. He was right. But he was a commanding president and any room he was in, I remember doing a thing with him and Bill Parcells, who he knew at army when Parcells was an assistant to red Blake and army. And at the time Parcells was head coach of the Dallas Cowboys. And I was hosting an event with those two kind of a discussion with them and

evening with them. And I was in a room with Parcells with kind of a VIP thing. And Parcells was, he filled up the whole room. And then Bob Knight came in and Knight filled up the room and Parcells kind of shrank a bit. And that's how big of a figure he was, especially in the 70s and 80s. There was no more profound influence on the game at that time than Bob Knight. And if there were a Mount Rushmore of basketball coaches, not just college coaches, but basketball coaches worldwide,

Bob Knight, his face would be on that Mount Rushmore. No question. Jay Billis saying, Coach Knight, not for everyone, but he was an American original and a good friend of yours. Jay, we appreciate you coming on and sharing your thoughts this morning. Thanks so much. Mike, let's talk quickly before I let you go about the World Series last night. The Texas Rangers getting it done in Arizona on the road in game five. First game of the series, a classic, and then not a whole lot after. This was a no-hitter from Gallin through the sixth, took it into the seventh inning of Arizona, no hits, and then the sort of

dam broke for the Rangers, and they win the first World Series in franchise history. Willie, this to me is one of the great baseball stories. They went from 102 losses to 94 losses to holding up the trophy last night. And Chris Young just did one of the great general managing jobs in history. But what I was thinking last night, even though this World Series in the end was just five games and not what we hoped it would be, there's still nothing like heroes of the fall that we get in baseball. Nate Evaldi, Corey Seager, Adoles Garcia before he got home. there's still nothing like heroes of the fall that we get in baseball nate avaldi cory seager adolos garcia before he got ho and and and by the way one of the great baseball men of all time the manager of the rangers bruce bochy won three times with the giants came out of retirement he

said a couple years ago he's watching mick jagger run up and down and he said to his wife he's 80 why am i not managing anymore chris young brought him back and and now he's won a fourth world series if you love this game and we all love this game what the rangers just did again is one of the great baseball stories of all time. All right. Mike Lupica celebrating the Texas Rangers' first title ever. Mike, thanks so much. Good for Dallas. Good for Fort Worth. And that's a good team.

They had a great season. They were in first place for a lot of the season. And the Astros stormed back on the last day and won the division. But the record on the road, Jonathan, in these playoffs, unbelievable. 11-0. That's never been done before. They were undefeated on the road. They did it

with getting nothing from Jacob deGrom, one of the race pitchers. Very little from Max Scherzer, who they got at the deadline. Barely pitched in the postseason. Nate Evaldi was brilliant. Jordan Montgomery was great. The lineup was hit all year long. Their bullpen stepped up when they needed. Bruce Bochy is the title. Corey Seager,

second World Series MVP. He was the only fourth player, I believe, ever to do that. The others are all Hall of Famers. And, yeah, I'm always a sucker for a fan base that has gone a long time or never won a title before. And the Texas Rangers have been around for 60-odd years. They now have a championship. Congrats to them. But I will say, this is one of the saddest days of the year

because we are now the longest we are until baseball again. Oh, there you go. It was in February? In February. In February. Okay, you can get there. Get there.