Morning Joe - Morning Joe 1/31/24

Episode Date: January 31, 2024

Sources: Trump complaining about Taylor Swift

I don't know if you've seen this, but there's some serious crazy talk about Taylor Swift and Joe Biden going around right now. This is one of those things, you know, you expect to hear this from a couple of nuts and then it disappears. But if anything, it's picking up steam. The not too Swifties got it started like this with tweets like this. The NFL is totally rigged for the Chiefs. Taylor Swift, Mr. Pfizer, all to spread Democrat propaganda. Calling it now, Casey Wentz goes to the Super Bowl. Swift comes out at a halftime show, endorses Joe Biden with Kelsey at midfield.

It's all been an op since day one. So let me get this straight, okay? The same people who believe Joe Biden has dementia and needs Kamala Harris to feed him butterscotch tapioca every night also believe that he has somehow planned and executed a diabolically brilliant scheme to fix the NFL playoffs so the biggest pop star in the world can pop up on the Jumbotron during the Super Bowl in between a Kia and a Tostitos commercial to hypnotize her 11-year-old fans into voting for Joe Biden. That is wacky stuff.

But that's what's happening. MAGA World continues to melt down over Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey's relationship. We'll have more about that, including reporting that Donald Trump is upset about her popularity and getting nervous about her

potentially endorsing Joe Biden. Come on. This is real. This cannot be real. Like Taylor Swift. You know, this is what I heard from the bozos back in. Was it 20? Maybe it was 16, 18, 20.

I don't know. 20, 20. Oh, we're going to stop watching the NFL. I heard I heard that her top Republican operatives. When I say top, top Republican operatives say we're running against the NFL. We're running against, you know, Colin Kaepernick. We're running against Black Lives Matter. We're running against never, you know, kneeling for the flag.

We're running against all of that. It's, you know, the NFL is left wing. They're this or that, the other. And we're never going to watch football again. That's what I heard from a lot of people. And Republicans hate the NFL now. Hate them. It's over. They're done. Again, we'll just say 19 of the top 20 primetime shows last year, NFL games, 82 of the top 100 TV broadcasts, excluding Jonathan Lemire and Way Too Early. Talk yesterday.

It's an asterisk. But the NFL will take any publicity they can get. 82 out of 100 NFL games. And so now these weenies, these little snowflakes, these triggered little snowflakes are now going after Taylor Swift. I mean, if you're Taylor Swift, you just can't win.

She was called, well, actually, she wins every day. But politically, remember the left used to attack her? Oh, she's like this right-wing Nazi-type figure, and now it's the right attacking her. It's just like, just shut, shut up.

Also, the attack on the NFL hasn't worked very well. The AFC championship game was watched by a record 56 million people. I think it peaked at like 65 million viewers. So that's not working very well. You have to wonder, Joe, is this some kind of an op on the other side to attack all of the most popular things in the world? To go after Disney, if you're Ron DeSantis, to go after the NFL and maybe the most one of the five most popular artists in the history of human civilization. Yes. Let's go after her. Let's go. Because she's dating a guy on the Chiefs and she might be a Democrat.

Let's go after Mickey Mouse, Taylor Swift. I mean, it's just, it's crazy. Remember what the great, the late great Jim Croce used to say. You know, you don't tug on Superman's cape. You don't spit in the wind. You don't pull the mask off the old arranger. You don't mess around with Taylor Swift.

You don't mess around with Taylor Swift. There's no way to win that fight. More on this coming up. There's no win. Meanwhile, Donald Trump is looking for new legal representation in his appeal. Wonder why. The E.G. and Carol defamation damages case.

Try to keep a straight face. No, I mean, she's very angry. At one point in the proceedings, and I've got to say, as a lawyer, I've never seen this myself. I've never seen anything like it. Maybe she had a reason to be upset. Willie, the... Don't. Willie, you know, they took away her coloring books.

There was a color by number thing on how to be a lawyer when you grow up, and the judge took them away. Yes, she... Some have said. Some have said. Not us. Nobody here. She didn't have the experience to try this case.

It doesn't mean she's not a good lawyer. And what she does in Bedminster, New Jersey, up the road from his club. But maybe not for this kind of federal case. Some have said that she was ill-prepared and one of the most ill. And I know because I was one of these. One of the most ill-prepared attorneys for a case of this magnitude. Maybe in the history of the planet. It is incredible.

We'll try and explain why Alina Haba is off the case. I can't. Well, I don't think they have any. I can't. I'm giving her 3.6 million reasons why she's off the case. It comes as we're learning. The question is, why was she on the case? Ever.

Well, seriously. Ever. Why was she ever on the case? The question is, why was she on the case? Ever. Well, seriously. Ever. Why was she ever on the case? Did she forget to check a box? They've usually given Donald Trump a consistently high standard for legal representation. He's always had such great lawyers. Well, no, he's had bad lawyers.

But I mean, at least they knew their way around a courtroom. And by the way, I mean, you either know your way around the courtroom or you don't. And speaking as a lawyer that didn't know his way around the courtroom, I can tell you it can be a very frightening thing, and you would not want to be in this type of case. You always knew where the vending machines were, though. In the hallway.

That was important. The water cooler. I'd ask the judge, please, I need to talk. And then I'd just leave. Okay. This is the longest opening tease. Smoke a cigarette. Get some BCOs.

I'd get some BC powder. They had them at that dispenser. Get some RC Cola. Smoked cigarette. Get some BCLs. I'd get some BC powder. They had them at that dispenser. Get some RC Cola. Have a smoke. Go back in. Dr. Pepper. No further questions. I'd ask for a continuous.

Elena Hava's departure from that case. Give me some time to read, but I wouldn't. I'd go off. As we're learning much more about how much donor money Trump is using to pay for as many legal issues. Willie, are we still in the teens? It's the runaway tease brought to you by Pringles. We're going to go through the new warning from the CIA director of the dire consequences of cutting support from Ukraine. Jonathan Lemire, John Heilman, Eddie Glaude Jr. are with us, along with special

correspondent, U.S. special correspondent for BBC News. Katty Kay is with us. OK. You did that very well. I feel like we should applaud you for getting through. With my sleep lines? Yeah, Willie has our top stories. Yeah. Right, Willie? Oh, do I? Sure. Yeah. All right. So the carefully crafted bipartisan Senate border security package still facing stiff resistance as House Speaker Mike Johnson reiterates the bill is a nonstarter in the House. The speaker yesterday sabotaged his own denial that he's being influenced within the span of one statement. Come on, man. Trying to deny, but then confirming that he's being influenced by former President Trump. He may not be ready for primetime.

Judging by his comments, he clearly wants to campaign on this issue. Have you spoken to him about the Senate proposal? And are you simply trying to kill this to help him on the campaign? No, Manu, that's absurd. We have a responsibility here to do our duty. Our duty is to do right by the American people, to protect the people. The first and most important job of the federal government is to do our duty. Our duty is to do right by the American people, to protect the people. The first and most important job of the federal government is protecting citizens. I have talked to former President Trump about this issue at length, and he understands that.

He understands that we have a responsibility to do here. The president, of course, President Trump, wants to secure the country. Oh, my. Does he know? The first words out of his mouth there were, Manu, that's absurd. That's absurd. That's absurd. The suggestion I would have spoken to Donald Trump about this, that's absurd. And then he follows with? The absurd.

Well, of course I've spoken to him many times because, you know, of course he talks to Donald Trump if you're me, I mean, Jonathan, Jonathan Lemire, it's it is absurd that you have, again, the impeachment of Mayorkas for not doing what Republicans are refusing to do. I just can't. We have to state this loudly and clearly because there is misinformation, disinformation on other networks that are constantly talking about how horrible this bill is. This is the most liberal bill ever. This is that. Go back to before Donald Trump said I'm against the bill for political reasons. And everybody was saying this was the toughest border security bill ever. You can't. I mean, you when you have a Gingrich going, I won't even say that the inane things that he said about this bill are the rest of the people in Fox News who are now just parroting what Donald Trump said. They overlook the fact that the Wall Street Journal editorial page was like, don't screw up here, Republicans, basically saying you've screwed

everything else up. Don't screw this up. Don't screw Ukraine up. Don't screw Israel up. Get it right. And then again, James Lankford, one of the most conservatives out there, talking about how this is the toughest border security bill of our time. And they're trying to paint this now as some left-wing deal because Donald Trump doesn't want to stop fentanyl and illegal immigrants from flooding into this country. As this bill was being drafted, the opposition was from the left. It was the progressives who said, this is too tough. There was concern the president wouldn't back it because he could lose parts of his own base.

The White House made the decision, we are going to be for this. We need to, we know there's a crisis at the border, political benefits to it as well. They go for it, and suddenly the opposition has switched. Some of the progressives still oppose it, but the problem now is the Republicans. And what changed? What changed is Donald Trump one day decided he was against it because he wanted it to be a campaign issue. And there are still some senators who hope

to get this across the finish line. But we heard yesterday there's pessimism now that's even going to get out of the upper chamber. And then how Speaker Johnson, you know, in a clumsy fashion, has put his cards all on the table. He's made it very clear. This is not going to happen, Eddie, because Donald Trump says he doesn't want it because he wants to campaign on it. And therefore, nothing will change the border. Right. It just it lets us know that the Republicans are interested in governing. It lets us know that the principles that so-called animate these Republicans aren't necessarily principles that they hold dearly and truly or genuinely. And just to be honest with you, those of us who are, quote unquote, on the left are still skeptical about this move. Right. I understand the triangulation. He has to

appeal to those swing voters in Wisconsin and the like. To be quiet in the face of it is a hard challenge. But look, we're in this moment and this moment is is full of folk who are, shall we say, not too bright politically, it seems to me. It really is. I mean, again, Jonathan, John Heilman, I mean, you look at what Donald Trump has admitted out loud over the last two weeks. Just this just a policy. Forget all the other things. Forget all the rapes and all, according to the judge. Forget the $83 million. Forget all of it. Forget the stolen nuclear secrets.

Forget the illegal payoffs to porn stars. I want you to even forget him talking about terminating the Constitution. Please, just keep out of your mind him telling his staff members that Vice President Mike Pence, his loyal vice president, deserved hanging. I don't want you to think about that or the fact that Donald Trump said he wanted the chairman of the Joint Chiefs executed for treason. Please.

And the economy. Am I remembering that? Don't forget that. Keep that out of your mind. That has nothing to do with this anymore than Donald Trump having, showing his campaign manager and saying, I shouldn't be showing you this because I'm not president of the United States and I can't declassify this. But here I'm going to illegally show you war plans for the invasion of Iran.

I'm forgetting that part. Donnie, you don't have to think about that. We're going to even push that off the table. That's a lot I've pushed off the table. I want you to, I want you to even forget, like he, I want you to forget what he forgets. Okay. That he's running against a guy named Joe Biden because he thinks he's running against Barack Obama. Put all that to the side and I can go on forever. I'm about to. But I just want you to remember two things. Forget about that too. Just remember two things this election season. Right one donald trump wants the economy to

crash and he admitted on television he wants a depression this year he admitted that that's number one number two donald trump has told the republican party to kill the toughest illegal immigration bill in history in history after making this the centerpiece of every one of his campaigns. And talk about him taking those two issues and Democrats taking those two issues to the American people. Well, to begin with, the notion that Donald Trump is self-interested above all in the first case, depression. I want a depression because it'll help me win. And the notion that he doesn't have any principles on immigration.

What's the issue? Not the substance. That he's a hypocrite. These are not news flashes to anybody who's been covering Donald Trump for a while. If the question is, can Democrats run on those issues? I would say particularly the first one, I would think yes. You would think that it would be a kind of a political malpractice if you, like many things that Trump says at this point, if you didn't see, you know, a half a billion dollars worth of advertising with Donald Trump standing, I want to see a depression before the next election. You know, the thing in the

immigration case that this is not to in any way credit him, but you do see the whole Republican Party here looking at what happened with abortion, which was dog that caught the bus. Right. We want to say we got man, we have got to stop abortion. We've got to make it take that rid of that Roe v. Wade. And now they got rid of Roe v. Wade. They're like, oh, so this isn't so great for us politically. In the immigration case, it's sort of the same thing. They've been, hey, build that wall.

Let's put armed troops on the southern border. Let's arm the northern border. Let's do all that stuff. And now you have a president who's not quite willing to go that far, but is willing to do things no Democratic president in our lifetime has been willing to do on the southern border. And Republicans are going, oh, yeah, maybe we don't want to catch that bus. The last time we caught the bus, it didn't work out too well. And by the way, the Wall Street Journal editorial page this morning, headline impeaching Mayorkas achieves nothing. It says a policy dispute does not qualify as a high crime or misdemeanor. They're saying the conclusion is walk away from

the nonsense about impeaching Mayorkas and take the border security. Take the bill. That's from The Wall Street Journal. Another ramification of not taking the deal. We're hearing from CIA Director William Burns, who's warning lawmakers against cutting off support from Ukraine. In a new place published in Foreign Affairs, Burns writes in part this. For the United States to walk away from the conflict at this crucial moment and cut off support to Ukraine would be an own goal of historic proportions. Burns points out Ukraine aid makes up less than 5 percent of the U.S. defense budget and argues it is a, quote, relatively modest investment with significant geopolitical returns for the United

States. Burns also warns that whatever the U.S. decides to do, it will send a clear message to China, writing, quote, No one is watching U.S. support for Ukraine more closely than Chinese leaders. Burns also describes how the war in Ukraine has quietly corroded the power of President Vladimir Putin, allowing the CIA to recruit more spies. Burns says the undercurrent of disaffection in Russia is creating a, quote, once in a generation recruiting opportunity for the CIA, adding we are not letting it go to waste. Can I just say everybody says Bill Burns is the best. That is such a Bill Burns move. To just put him there, oh, by the way, Vladimir Putin. Just, this is like the Black Friday of recruiting spies.

This is like a holiday. I mean, he's just planning it in Putin's mind. You're weak. We're coming after you. It's just a bonanza for recruiting spies. I mean, there are so many there are so many opportunities. And, Caddy, it's good to hear this from Bill Burns, because over the past couple of months, there have been obviously, you know, Putin winning, Putin getting the best of this, Putin getting the best of that. It's important to remember just how weakened Russia's military is. And as Burns says, five percent of the defense budget, basically talk about an investment that set Putin's military machine back 10, 15, 20 years. Yeah. I love the little George Smiley move, didn't you? You know,

that kind of little bit about by the way, by the way, by the way, Tinker Taylor. Look, I think this is the American administration and people who support the war in Ukraine have not done a very good job at making the public case to the American people about why they should carry on sending arms and weapons and supplies to Ukraine. And it is exactly the case that Bill Burns has just laid out. For less than 5 percent of the U.S. defense budget, Ukraine is doing America's work for it. It is Ukrainians who are dying. They are minimizing the power of Russia's military. They are hurting Russia economically. They are pushing Russia to try and have to find friends around the world who may not treat them very well. And I think, you know, it's a very good argument.

And it's the argument that basically Ukrainians are dying for America's own national interest. And that is it's a cheap way for America to degrade Russia's military and economic power. And I think having it laid out by Bill Burns, there is the kind of argument that American officials perhaps could have been making louder for longer because we've watched the erosion of support amongst both Republicans and Democrats for carrying on supporting Ukraine. But I think the key to what Bill Burns says at this moment is even if we head into a negotiating phase, if we carry on supplying the Ukrainians with the weapons that they need, it will give them a stronger hand and it will make sure that Russia is weakened further. And by the way, we can pick up a few spies along the way. And by the way, Putin, just oh, never mind. But yeah, open season on spies. So so Jonathan Lemire. U.S. Intel believes that Putin's in a position now where he's ready to negotiate. You know, he's showing as strong a hand as he can show, but that he's ready to negotiate.

But they can't get to that point until they get this aid package through. And if they don't get this aid package through, then Putin will wait for the possibility of Donald Trump being elected. Yeah, that's precisely. And by the way, Republicans are doing this. Republicans are doing this. They're helping the Russian invader. It's that clear. First, Republicans started to oppose just aiding Ukraine when it was a separate matter.

And now by opposing the border security bill, which is linked, they're doing it again. You're right. Officials that I talk to say this. I mean, there are two things can be true at once. Yes, the last few months have been kinder to Putin. That said, the war as a whole has still been a disaster for him. His military has been badly degraded. You know, it is corruption rife through the troops there. He's lost men and machine. He is someone who, and I'm sure Burns noted this with his piece, their little dig about spies, someone already really paranoid about his being able to hold

on to power. He's facing an election. Of course, he'll win, but he's trying to win by as much margin as possible. He is someone who officials tell me they do believe is waiting out for November, but he's not going to even think about going to the negotiating table if the U.S. cannot supply Ukraine. And we're hearing from the Ukrainians each and every day, they're running out of ammunition. And there's some issues there right now as Zelensky is pushing out the top military commander. Like, Putin does see a weakness right now to stay the course. But if there's billions upon billions of dollars of aid comes through and the U.S. can reinforce Ukraine to at least hold their positions and maybe push Russia further back, that's the moment Putin would go to the table. But he's not going

to do that if the U.S. walks away. Europe can't do it on its own. And can you believe, Willie, that the party of Reagan wants to concede Ukraine to an ex-KGB agent who said the greatest geopolitical tragedy of the 20th century was the collapse of the Soviet Union? And they're also the ones right now, the ones fighting against border security here in the United States. It's sick. And that's we've heard from just yesterday, actually, Republican senators, Republican senators saying to their colleagues in the House, you know who loves all this, what you're doing right now, this stunt with immigration, Vladimir Putin, you're handing him Ukraine if you don't get funding because you insist on it being

attached. One senator even suggested the opposition to the to the immigration bill was a Russian op somehow that they were pushing information in through social media and adding downward pressure. No evidence of that. But the point is, the Republicans in the Senate are making the case you're making, which is that get Ukraine the money it needs, get Israel the support it needs. And let's handle this immigration thing separately. And we've got it right in front of us. Take the deal. Yeah. And Burns is right.

China is watching. And the same Republicans that would bitch and whine about China moving on Taiwan because the United States looked weak because the House won't fund our allies. You know, those are the same people who are responsible for this. Absolutely. Still ahead on Morning Joe, what's driving the anger and hatred toward Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey. Our next guest is digging into the far right conspiracy theories and the power of pop culture. Is Trump really angry? I mean, he's always a little jelly when someone gets attention.

Anywho, we're also going to be joined by House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, who will weigh in on the effort by his Republican colleagues to impeach Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas. Also ahead, the CEOs

of several major social media platforms will head to Capitol Hill today for a hearing focused on protecting children online. We'll get a preview from a member of the Senate Judiciary Committee. You're watching Morning Joe. We'll be right back. I promise on another like me. MAGA Republicans are dialing up the conspiracy theories about Taylor Swift. Following a report, the Biden campaign is courting her endorsement. Now, in a piece on Monday, The New York Times wrote that Swift's name was on an endorsement wish list drafted by Biden aides.

Well, yeah. Would you want Taylor Swift to endorse you? Yeah, sure. OK, so this prompted a wave of outrage from the far right wing voices, many of them already critical of Swift for her previous endorsement of Democrats and for her public relationship with Kansas City Chiefs star Travis Kelsey, who is a vaccine supporter. Oh, my God. I kind of have a problem, though, with the hardcore Taylor Swift fans. This is a little bit what idolatry, I think, looks like. And you're not supposed to do that. In fact, if you look it up in the Bible, it's a sin. The Pentagon PSYOP unit pitched NATO on turning Taylor Swift into an asset. She's the perfect vehicle to go to those low propensity white liberal women. We can do this as well. We don't have a Taylor Swift on our side,

but you know who we have? We have Kid Rock. We have Ted Nug well. We don't have a Taylor Swift on our side, but you know who we have? We have Kid Rock. We have Ted Nugent. We have influencers, right? We have all these people. Jon Voight. She's going, let's effing go. If I heard that and my son was dating a girl

who has a mouth like a teamster, that's it. We both said that we were cheering for the opposite team, the Ravens, to beat out the Chiefs, just because we have had enough of Taylor Swift. Don't get involved in politics. We don't want to see you there. Major League Sports in and of itself is nothing but a psyop. Get kids plugged into the cycle of going to public indoctrination camps,

playing sports for their school, and going to games. By the way, the first guy saying this is really bad, it's idolatry. It's idolatry. It's idolatry. Imagine idolatry. Irony. I can't think of it. Irony. Talk about.

Who would know about that? Yeah, I mean. Pot. Kettle. Pot. Yeah. Idolatry. And then manners.

This from. Incredible. Very worried about potty mouths. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. Suddenly. How dare she? A lot of pearl clutching. How dare she? A lot of fanging couches on those networks. It's not just Trump supporters who were talking about Taylor Swift.

According to three sources who spoke with Rolling Stone, Trump himself recently claimed in private that he was, quote, more popular than the music star and that his fans were more committed than hers. Well, and her fans won't actually kill four cops. No, they won't do insurrection. They won't try to take the government over, if that's what you mean. If you're gauging commitment, they won't take American flags and turn them into spears and spear law enforcement officers if yeah that's what you're talking about right yeah all right also he's reported complained about time magazine's

decision to name her person of the year he doesn't like that saying it made no sense that he was not selected i think it's really funny the way this this story is sourced in a really hilarious way. It's also like, you know, a person close to Trump and another person familiar with the matter. What matter? What matter here? National security. Donald Trump is insecure about how famous he is. And whenever there's anybody who's more famous or gets on the cover of Time magazine, he gets mad.

That's, you know, and the sun rises in the east and sets in the west. And the court will be in session today. Somewhere. Well, wait. It's the 31st, right? I do think it's a distraction. The judge had said he would have the decision. It's not firm.

He doesn't have to give him the decision. Which one is this? Immunity. Which one is this? No, this is the next. Which one is this? 250 million. Which one is this? The, now this is which one is 250? The judge. There's nothing that says the judge has to decide today, but he's kept every deadline.

Which one is the civil case in New York? I like what we make it. Which one is this? Which judge? I care. I care. I know exactly why they want to talk about Taylor Swift and make up this fake stuff. I know, because honestly, folks on Fox News and all those other networks there, they can't talk about E. Jean Carroll. They won't cover it. If they do, it's a glancing mention. They can't talk about the legal woes facing this former president

because it messes up their entire money-making narrative. So they have to go after Taylor Swift. I'm sure they have. They certainly didn't when it was like in breaking news mode at 5 o'clock on Friday, which is fascinating. When the story actually broke. Fox Sports host, though. Cowherd. Cowherd.

Colin Cowherd took down the deep-seated misogyny that he thinks is driving much of this. There's a lot of really weird, lonely, insecure men out there. The fact that a pop star, the world's biggest pop star is dating a star tight end who had one of his greatest games ever. And a network puts them on the air briefly that it bothers you. What does that say about your life? Judge people sometimes on the silly stuff that bothers them. It'll tell you a lot about them. When I hear this whole thing about Taylor Swift, I just want to watch football. Liar. You're lying. That's not true. A football telecast is not just football. In fact, the commercials for four hours before the Super Bowl will be widely watched.

Did you know statistically in a three and a half hour NFL playoff broadcast or regular season broadcast, just 18 minutes are actual football. And we have the data. We have the numbers. You don't turn away. There's coaches cutaways. They show fans in Buffalo on fire, commercials, reviews, 18 minutes of real football. For the record, about the length of five Taylor Swift songs.

Listen to this. The New York Times measured how long she was actually on the broadcast. Do you know how long it is on average? 25 seconds in three and a half hours. Against the Ravens, it was up to a whopping 32 seconds. It was 14 Chiefs and Raiders on Christmas, 12 Chiefs and Bengals, 24 seconds Buffalo, Kansas City. She was on for a minute against the Dolphins, but it was an absolutely awful broadcast. They should have had a concert in the middle of it. That would have been more interesting. And why wouldn't CBS, which you know has the Grammys,

cross-promote the world's biggest pop star? Hey, listen, I worked at the other network. I work at Fox. I've seen us jam people on TV shows I would never watch during football games and sporting events. Don't forget to watch this right after the game. I've already forgot about it. Let's get back to the game. But I don't have to rush to social media.

I'm okay with it. Here's the other thing that strikes me. Matthew McConaughey. All right, all right, all right. Love him. Drake on everything. Spike Lee, Knicks games. M&M's, Michigan sporting events.

We celebrate it. 80s, 90s, Jack Nicholson, Laker games. It's cool. Saw Jack. But a talented and beautiful woman is on the air. One who would never pay attention to lonely men. And it bothers them. There's a stat out there, it's kind of uncomfortable for you sad guys,

that 50% of men never have real intimacy with a woman. That means the other 50% have multiple intimate relationships with women. And those ones that don't are angry and sad and lonely, and they are often misogynistic and resent women who didn't give them the time they think they deserve. We celebrate all these goofballs jumping on tables in Buffalo and cheese hats and men and men and Matthew McConaughey and Drake and Jack Nicholson, men and man and man and Eminem and it's cool and can I get a selfie and I can't believe I saw. And the young, attractive, beautiful, talented woman comes on for 25 seconds and you're bothered. Again, judge people by the silly things that bother them.

This says nothing. This anger. This says nothing about Taylor Swift. It says everything about the men bothered by it. Listen, I love that. That was strong and that was powerful. It's also very long. You know, you know, that reminded me of? You know what that reminded me of?

Our teas are open this morning. Remind me of Scarborough country when I wanted to take a break. And I'd go, you know, some right-wing thing would say, Jon Stewart's bad for America. And they'd go, it's Jon Stewart, bad for America. Let's see. And then we just got 30 minutes of clips. I'd walk outside, do some push-ups. This is actually true. Smoke a cigarette. Get a Red Bull. Smoke a cigarette. We just got 30 minutes of clips. I'd walk outside, do some push-ups.

Smoke a cigarette. Get a Red Bull. Smoke a cigarette. Scarborough country. Then I'd start, you know, I'd say, you know what? I want to learn a new language. I'd start learning a new language. You got your Berlitz language course going.

They'd still be showing Jon Stewart. I'd go, okay, I think I can visit, you know, Portugal this summer. I got I think I get the language. And then I go back in, Willie, and I go, nah, he's not bad for America. We'll be right back with Holly. Weird. Well, I did that like 20 times. It was that.

But let the ratings. You do that one night. Then the next night you go, has american idol gotten too mean let's watch yeah in 30 minutes you can't no i think it's fine american idol's fine really that was a good one too all right joining us now senior columnist for the daily beast matt lewis his latest piece is entitled far right snowflakes are terrified of the super bowl and Taylor Swift. Well, you know, Matt, Colin, who's great. We love him. We love him.

Colin. No, that was really good. Oh, I know. It's just kind of long. He did. He did bring up an underlying point that's really important. And it's really important as you see the rise of right wing populist movements across the world. of right-wing populist movements across the world, and that is a large collection of lonely, isolated young men

who are becoming more and more angry, becoming more and more misogynistic, becoming less and less decent, especially toward women. Absolutely. You know, the incel phenomenon. I think it's valid. It's not good for society to what is it? Just explain to everybody what is incel? big problem in America. And look, I think that marriage and women specifically are a civilizing force on men. There's a loneliness epidemic. And I do think kudos to Colin Coward, because this is part of the story. I also think, you know, a lot of these kind of right wing keyboard warrior types are obsessed with masculinity, kind of ironically, in some cases. And I think that they kind of resent Travis Kelsey, you know, this sort of macho guy dating Taylor Swift.

And look, if you saw Jason Kelsey. By the way, that's kind of a checkmate, right? Yeah. Like that's kind of the checkmate. You know, these snowflakes are like oh i'm so manly i know i have a trump hat on and uh my suspenders are all red and then they see travis kelsey and they're trying to say what he's not a man like it's it's just such a total checkmate against it's insane and and if you saw Travis Kelsey's brother Jason,

Jason at the Buffalo Bills game where he was drinking 30 beers, you know, shirtlessly, you know, and frigid Buffalo. I mean, good luck casting the Kelsey's as some woke, soy latte drinking pajama boys, right? There we have, there is.athan lemire had done this uh up in foxborough a few times and they kicked him out less lifetime 20 beers i didn't see the fourth quarter yeah so so caddy i do i do want to touch on on again let's go back to what colin had said and and what matt's talking about as well and in Britain, it's become such a problem with Andrew Tate that actually the British government is trying to work to counteract some of the harsher misogynistic statements that have spread among young, lonely British males.

Just like young, lonely American males. Yeah. And look, and it's hard to regulate. Right. I mean, yes, more regulation could probably be done around the world. But this kind of hate speech amongst incels, Matt's right. That's exactly what they are. Spreads in the kind of darkest corners of the Web and it pops up all over the place. And you try and regulate one bit of the web and it pops up all over the place and you try and regulate one bit of it and tamp it down as they're doing in the uk with andrew tate and it'll just come up somewhere else and because this is global it comes up everywhere and i think when you look at what's happening on the right with um taylor swift i mean i it's i just can't

see any other way to describe it it does feel feel like this is, you know, a talented young woman and suddenly she gets a bit of attention and it drives people crazy. But also, Matt, isn't there something else, which is just that they're jealous that they want to have Taylor Swift for themselves? And if they can't have Taylor Swift, then they're going to do everything. There was a Georgia district council chair from the Republican Party who called her Luciferian, which I thought was kind of wonderful use of old English. But isn't that really what it is? You just try and demonize her. You just try and make her look as terrible as possible because you think that's part of it. I think some of it's envy. You know, somebody on Twitter the other day kind of compared Travis Kelsey and Taylor Swift to like the homecoming king and queen at your high school.

And depending on where you sat and by the way, everything goes back to high school, as we know. And depending on where you were in the pecking order, you may resent that. You may not like that. And look, I will say this, though. And in fairness, these people who are attacking, you know, Travis Kelsey and Taylor Swift. I mean, I think there's misogyny here. I think there's a lot of paranoia and conspiracy. I think there's chasing clicks and trying to get YouTube views and hits. But there is an element of truth. Taylor Swift actually does pose a threat to MAGA and to Joe Biden. She sent out one Instagram post in 2020 that got 35,000 new people to register to vote. So this is an insane fight that they're making with the NFL.

And by the way, the number one most influential pop star in the world, probably. There's another element to this, Matt, which shows you where the, I don't even want to say the Republican Party, but MAGA Republicans and a lot of that online community you're talking about is because Travis Kelsey did ads for the vaccine for Pfizer, for the covid vaccine. Aaron Rodgers infamously calls Travis Kelsey, Mr. Pfizer. That's an insult, I guess, to get a vaccine against a disease that could kill you. So there is that element of it, too, all folding in all these different pieces of that movement, including anti-vaxxers. It's crazy. And it's something that we haven't maybe fully talked about yet this morning is there is a conspiracy theory that is very popular on the right, on Twitter, on X.

Millions of people are seeing this. And Vivek Ramaswamy sort of alluded to this in a tweet the other day, I think Monday, right after the Chiefs won and were headed to the Super Bowl. There is a theory that this is a deep state operation, that Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey are put together. They're not a real relationship. Somehow the NFL has rigged it so that the Chiefs, who, by the way, have gone to four of the last five Super Bowls, but the NFL has rigged it so that the Chiefs are going to the Super Bowl. And it's all a deep state psyops campaign to uh to beat donald trump insanity it is insanity for the daily beast matt lewis thank you very much the cia is good they went into texas 25 years ago and made patrick

mahomes they really did one of the greatest athletes in the history of sports got him up through college into the nfl made him who he is and they've been working on this a long time and kelsey they got as the red sox should be talking more to the cia we really should there's got to be some red sox cia talks the the biden administration is often thwarted by one senator from west virginia but yet they rigged this they pulled off they leaked the nfl and taylor swift i have no idea how they did it you You know, the thing is that Barack Obama was so good at is he figured out how to find stars. Not at this level, but find stars, especially he was brilliant on. He'd go do YouTube.

Oh, yeah. These offbeat YouTube interviews. The person with the root loops in the title. Exactly. Because he wanted to get low propensity voters. He wanted to get in front of them and get out there here with Taylor Swift. I mean, if we're just talking about the demographic right now that he's having the worst time with Biden, it's young voters. Yes. She's the biggest star in the world among young voters. So maybe that's why

the snowflakes on the far right are freaking out. You know, maybe it's a sign that I'm an egghead or, you know, I just you know, this is a symptom of the problem of American politics that, you know, you know, seriousness is a kind of we're running deficits. It's seriousness. Since I was sitting here thinking about Walter Lippman in 1922 writing Public Opinion and saying that the American public had been inundated by mass consumer culture and they were no longer capable of taking in information such that they could become the kind of deliberative citizens that democracies require.

And here we are. Well, do you know who said that, by the way? Travis Kelsey said that in the post-game press conference after the championship game. Well, they didn't just invoke the entire quote, but go ahead. What were you saying about Lippman? I was just thinking that, you know, what is it? You just made fun of me. No, I did not.

But I just I just think, you know, what does it mean that when around this table we've been talking about the seriousness of this election? Right. What's at stake? And you literally have political folk, media operatives talking about. Taylor Swift as a psycho. I mean, that just blows my mind. Wonderful. In terms of what we're facing as a country and what we're currently dealing with as we talk about football? Well, you know, I will quote an old bandy rooster in northwest Florida, W.D. Childers, who said, you got to put the grass down where the goats can eat them, eat it. And so I will just say the things that we are obsessed about four hours a day around this table, the people who don't vote a whole lot, they're not listening,

but they are watching this and they will see an Instagram post by Taylor Swift or a movement that'll make, I totally get what you're saying. But this, I do think this is relevant, one, because of the impact it could have with younger voters uh secondly i think the misogyny i think colin coward got that right uh for these lonely sad uh young men who strike out against the powerful women and that's the you know like the incel phenomenon is a very extreme version of a more, at the less extreme version of a, just a generally large problem that for Democrats, which is there is just a large group

of very frustrated young men, many of them white, some of them not white, who gravitate towards Joe Rogan and they gravitate towards the guy who runs X, that guy Musk. They have, there's- Andrew Tate. There's this, Andrew Tate's this world of-

I mean, it gets so toxic. This very powerful world of libertarian right, the people who are able to hold large audiences on podcasts that we don't listen to, on social media that we don't pay attention to. There's a, they are a large part of them are people who find Donald Trump appealing. And Democrats, without pandering to racists or incels, have this larger

challenge, which is, how do you talk to young voters, many of whom are not partisan political in that way, but they're just frustrated and pissed off and trying to figure out somewhere to land. And it does point to maybe part of the way is Travis Kelsey and part of the way is Taylor Swift is figuring out a way to have a conversation with a bunch of young voters who are up for grabs and that Democrats need to be able to talk to some of them or they're not going to win elections. Matt Lewis hit on something else important, which is a theme of our time, which is people who know better. Smart people. Cynically, Vivek Ramaswamy knows this is nonsense. The Fox News hosts know this is nonsense, but they think their voters, their viewers want to hear this stuff.

And so they amplify it. That's so painful. And I want to go back to what you're saying about Democrats having a problem with a certain group of people. What all of those people that you talked about, and even people that we like and watch and follow, and even the Bill Maher's Scott Galloway, who we've had on the show, who I think's really good. They push back against the extreme examples of wokeism. And they push back, and I'm not talking about like a Bud Light social meet one social media post that makes the whole world melt down. I'm just saying examples of what they're seeing on every college campus except at ease.

They're seeing that is that has been has it not? That has been rocket fuel for all of these people. And what they all have in common is they will find the most extreme examples of wokeism and they will use it and it fuels the audience. Yeah, totally. And that's it's it's that there are obviously a lot of these examples of wokeism run amok are ridiculous. But the feeling that a lot of people have that they don't, they're being lectured to and told what to do and constantly scolded and reprimanded for getting their language wrong or for doing this or that wrong. That is a thing that that's a problem. It's a problem for Democrats because they, the people want to be affirmed in some way.

This is another great Obama thing was that he didn't feel like he was constantly lecturing people. It's why a lot of young voters like Barack Obama because he didn't feel like he was constantly lecturing people. It's why a lot of young voters like Barack Obama, because he didn't feel like he was constantly scolding them. And he, above all, the Democratic Party has sort of seen there's a danger for progressives to be too much in that mode of sanctimony and scolding and telling people what schoolmarmish kind of language President Obama saw. Look what my invocation of Walter Littman generates. Well, I was just going to say, I was going to say, hey, man, shake it off. But that was going to end the whole conversation.

Well, I will say it's also, it just really is. I mean, we do need to talk about it. And we do need to talk about how younger voters, I'll just say it, I'm shocked. I'm really shocked by not my boys and not friends of my boys, but I am shocked by what I'm seeing and what I'm hearing from young men. And I'm shocked at, and I do think a lot of it is a reaction from an early age, getting the message, don't be boys. Don't do this. Don't do that. You're, you know, Willie, we've talked about this before.

Schools around here telling young boys in elementary school, what? That they're the oppressors. That they're toxic and they're the oppressors. And that was really, that was so 2018, 2017. I don't know if it's still going on, but I can tell you a lot of those boys have grown into a lot of really angry, pissed off teenagers. And I am really disheartened when you compare the friends I grew up with and I know Willie, you and John and how we were told. And I'm sorry if this like offends anybody that, you know, like this too old fashioned. We were told how to treat somebody that we went out on a date on and we were told how to be

respectful to anybody. And my God, if if I had ever said or if any of my children had ever said or if you had ever said or you have ever said like in front of women, what I hear young men saying in front of other women, ho, ho, holy, the the hammer would have come down from my parents. We just didn't do it. But Willie, I know, you know, because you've got it's being done now. And it's there is a there is a. And unfortunately, yeah, I'm going to point to Donald Trump, too. They see a guy who a judge says is a rapist and everybody celebrates him. They see a guy who, you know, pays off porn stars and then says she has a horse face and she's ugly.

They see guys that say the things that he said on the Access Hollywood tape. They see all of this and they see not only that that that he still can run, but that he is celebrated by their parents. Wait, mom and dad say that this guy who raped a woman, according to a judge, that this guy who a judge is of a permission structure for these boys treat women badly. There it is. And not just permission, but a reward. The guy became president of the United States based in large part on that big personality. And it started. We talk about this all the time when he insulted John McCain almost nine years ago and I guess July of 2015. And he said, well, we certainly don't insult war heroes in this country, disagree on politics.

Maybe he didn't like John McCain's politics. And then when he got more and more popular, he said, oh, there's an undercurrent of something in this country where people are enjoying this show, no matter the cost, no matter who he's insulting or what he's saying about people. And he became president of the United States.

And people forget, so much of that appeal, that 2015, 2016 appeal was his campaign against political correctness, which has now turned into sort of wokeism and the rest. And people resonated. People, I was at so many Trump rallies over that last year, those two years where people come up to me and just say like, he's saying things that we all say privately. Why can't we say that publicly anymore? Why is this not okay? And that resonated with people, that sort of anger that earned occurrence and the resentment, the grievance and the sense that the culture had gone too far was silencing them, that they were largely white people, white working class people who felt left behind. And he was their unlikely champion. And that's only that's only taken off. And I will say I will say it again. I mean, and I've said it on this show. Eddie, I grew up

in Atlanta, Georgia, Meridian, Mississippi, Tuscaloosa, Alabama, Northwest Florida, which, as you know, is the deep South. And I'll say it again. I mean, I grew up in the heart of Dixie and nobody, nobody in any of our schools and never, at least not around me and not around a lot of, never. I just didn't hear the N-word. I just didn't hear it. It was not said. I talk to my children now. All over the country. The racial slurs against black Americans, against Asian Americans, against Jewish Americans, against Muslim everywhere. It's everywhere. And it's in forget about being in public schools in meridian mississippi where i didn't hear it

they're saying it now in the like the best institutions the most elite areas in america it is a sea change we we have and this is how how I guess Donald Trump and extreme MAGA. I mean, it is how it's impacted our lives every day, because they'll say, you know, 16. Oh, he's saying publicly what we say privately. Well, maybe maybe more people are saying it privately now. But I'll tell you, 20 years ago, they weren't not at least in the world I grew up in and i grew up in the widest most deep south evangelical world there was yeah so i grew up in the deep south as well and and you know i was a couple of years behind you um and i heard the n-word it was called it uh by my neighbor right when we moved into the neighborhood um my sister beat up a neighbor for calling me one.

It was really great, actually. Wow. That is a sister to half. That's a sister to half, seriously. But I think the firewall that came out of the mid-20th century, there was a kind of tacit agreement that we were going to leave behind the explicit racism of Jim Crow. The New South leave behind the explicit racism. The New South, at least for us, the New South. And so the idea you had to you had to engage in a kind of,

you know, you had to code switch. You had to kind of engage in an appeal. It's school busing. It's you couldn't say things explicitly. Donald Trump broke that covenant. Yeah. And now the things that were the barnacles on the belly of the nation are now in full view. It wasn't as if they were removed. It was just a kind of agreement. So I think this is really important for us to acknowledge that, you know,

a certain kind of racial civility which actually hid a lot of things has been cast into the trash. I believe he slandered Mike Barnicle that way, just in the middle of that. It's like all of a sudden, I was thinking about, I don't know where to attack on Dick at that point.

I attack on Mike Barnicle out of nowhere. I don't understand that. By the way, Katty Kay, thank you for being on this morning. Great to see you. See you soon once again.