Morning Joe - Morning Joe 2/20/23

Episode Date: February 20, 2023

Biden makes surprise visit to Ukraine

We're now past six o'clock. Welcome to Morning Joe at this moment. Joe Meeker, Willie, have the day off. I want to bring in Katty Kay, special U.S. correspondent for BBC News, into our coverage here, our live rolling coverage of this President's Day and President Biden's surprise trip to Ukraine, one meant to show a real symbol of solidarity, Katty, with Kiev as it has weathered Russia's invasion now for 12 months. Yeah, Jonathan, what a day for us all to kick off President's Day to see these images. We know that President Biden has wanted to go to Kiev for a while and he just had to wait on his security team to give him the OK. And it's partly a vindication of the situation in Kiev that his security team felt it is OK, that it is

safe enough for him to visit on this Monday morning, this surprise visit. But there's also a lot going on, of course, in Europe ahead of this anniversary. We've got the Munich Security Conference that's just wrapped up this weekend, which was effectively the Americans and the Europeans rallying more support for the Ukrainians. And Richard Haass, as you look at these images, yes, the symbolism, very powerful for the Ukrainians. This is a message of support for Ukraine. It's a message of defiance to Vladimir Putin and against Russia. What do you think it means in practice for Vladimir Zelensky, that man just there who's shaking Joe Biden's hand? What does

it mean for him in practice? Well, I think what it means in practice is he can expect American military and economic support to continue to flow. I think he can also expect that from the Europeans, even though the delivery of economic help has fallen short of the promises. I think the big question is what will be the impact of it. So just say he gets all the tanks, just say he gets the airplanes. What then? To what extent will it change the shape of the battlefield? Because ultimately, that's what counts the most. I'm sorry, there's alarms going off here. Okay. Richard, we'll let you deal with those alarms, because you've clearly got alarms. Everyone's got alarms going off everywhere.

There have been alarms going off, of course, all around Ukraine with that visit as well. But let's bring in former aide to George W. Bush's White House and State Department's Elise Jordan. Because, Elise, I was thinking, as I saw these images and got the first tweets that Joe Biden had landed in Kiev, the amount of organization it takes to pull something like this off in a war zone, the security people have to have the buy-in to do this. Just talk to us a little bit about the backstory of how he would have actually got there. Well, the closest parallel that I can remember, you know, in recent decades is probably President Bush when he made the Thanksgiving visit in 2003 to an American military base in Iraq. And that was shrouded in intense secrecy.

But at the end of the day, was at a U.S. military base. And that's what is so impressive and unprecedented about this trip that Joe Biden not just landed, he had to get on a train and take the same. He didn't. We don't know yet about the security arrangements, but I it definitely is not just your typical mission that the Secret Service goes from point A to point B and gets to the advance work that simply goes into a trip about this and envisioning it and had a bunch of moving pieces. And yet they finally gave the go ahead to say this can happen. Yeah. President Biden has wanted to do this for a while, has talked out of it by senior aides and Secret Service. There was some talk last summer when he was in Europe for NATO that might be an attached visit to Ukraine. Then he did not. We know that other leaders, world leaders, have taken that 10-hour train ride to Kyiv. We do not yet know how President Biden made this journey.

We're not going to know. U.S. officials have told us until he is safely out of the country. So that may be some hours before we can report as to how this president has made his way to Kyiv. Let's bring in now back into the conversation NBC News chief international correspondent Kir Simmons, who is in Moscow. Kir, give us a sense as to what this means to this moment in the war that they're in Russia, a war that has gone nowhere near as they planned, though they still do own about 20 percent of Ukraine's territory at this point, and show no signs of giving up their mission to topple Keith. Oh, yeah, there's no sign at all, Jonathan, of any compromise by President Putin, who the Kremlin says is currently working on a speech, a keynote speech that he will give tomorrow. That's his big moment of symbolism, if you like. But at

the same time, he will now be, if he's got his television on, be watching these pictures as he works on his speech, because Russian television just began to show these images. They actually went to special report and began to show these images of President Biden and President Zelensky together in Kyiv and really just reporting the facts that are being reported by U.S. media because quite extraordinarily, I think, the White House and the office of the Ukrainian president have managed to keep this unknown even to to the Russians. And we know that because we hear a lot from from the Russians and from Russian journalists on, for example, the Telegram app. Telegram channels are used to talk about everything that's going on in the conflict.

But there was no indication at all in the buildup to this news emerging that President Biden is in Ukraine. There was no sign at all that the Russians had any clue that that was what was coming. I imagine it will infuriate President Putin. Remember, Jonathan, that this is where he wanted to be a year ago. A year ago, we now know, he had hoped that his invasion would move very swiftly. His special military operation, as he calls it, would quickly get to the capital city of Ukraine. And frankly, he would have pictured himself standing there in Kiev, just as President Biden is standing next to a different leader of Ukraine and kind of wrapping up his mission, if you like, to change Ukraine. Instead, he hasn't been able to do that.

You're right, of course, he has managed to move forces into a large area of Donbass, but that's far short of what he had hoped for. And now what Russia is doing is fighting a war of attrition. It is hoping to continue to keep going and see the West lose interest or lose enthusiasm. And of course, what this trip by President Biden, Jonathan, is designed to do is to maintain that enthusiasm, maintain the support in America and in the West for the conflict that the White House describes as a defining conflict for the world, not just for Ukraine, not just here in Russia. Kir, Russia's had some limited success in recent weeks. The Wagner Group, this group of mercenaries,

has managed to capture a few towns that had been fought over for a while. There have been rumors for some time that President Putin may call up another mobilization, another huge mobilization of conscripts of men, pushing them into military service. He did that in the fall. Mixed results of some, obviously, some domestic upheaval to that. He did face images of some Russians fleeing the country to avoid that. Many of these men, ill-equipped, ill-trained, ended up into the meat grinder. But that is the one advantage Russia has, is superior manpower to what Ukraine can muster. Is there a sense that he may look to push another mobilization as the year mark approaches and he's desperate to make more progress in Ukraine?

Well, there is a fear of that, Jonathan. Now, remember, of course, that Russia has managed to mobilize hundreds of thousands already with the previous mobilization. And at the same time, it did shake many Russians when that happened. And we saw large numbers leave the country. Now, President Putin has an election in a year's time. So actually, and this is, you know, kind of, if you like, a law of unintended consequences, actually to have Russians who don't support him in his endeavors in Ukraine, his special military operation, leave the country,

might actually be a kind of electoral advantage for President Putin. That being said, though, he will be one of his key focuses is always on the opinion of the Russian people. The polling that there is does suggest that his support for him has actually increased in the last year. But he will be measuring the advantage of another mobilisation, if he is considering that, against the disadvantage of how that might be received here in Russia. I mean, we were talking earlier, Jonathan, I think it is just worth pointing out the light and shade of all of this. I mean, we were talking earlier, Jonathan, I think it is, you know, just worth pointing out the light and shade of all of this. I mean, the reason we're here in Russia is to

try to give people as clear a view as possible of what it's what the feeling is here. And you can see behind me that the streets are full. It's the middle of the day on a Monday. Economically, this country is not just surviving. The prediction is that the economy will grow just a little bit this year. So when you walk around the streets, you do see at night plenty of people in restaurants here in Moscow. I mean, it's a big country, 11 time zones. Moscow is not all there is of Russia, to say the least. But, you know, there is a sense, I think, of kind of just hunkering down. Many people don't want to talk about the conflict. They are anxious about saying the wrong thing,

if you like. But there are many Russians who also have swung into support of President Putin, even as it's got more difficult in Ukraine. In some ways, that has increased support among some Russians. So President Putin, I think tomorrow will be uncompromising when he speaks tomorrow, uncompromising. I think he will double down. I think he will try to say, stay with me. And so far, so far, the Russian people do appear to be doing that, albeit at the very top of Russian society. There are small signs of division. But that division, just to finish, really is between hardline officials and even more hardline outsiders who think that not that President Putin's special military operation is wrong, but that they should be doing more.

OK. Kirsten is there for us in Moscow. Thank you for all of that reporting. Richard, I think they fixed your alarm in the drama in London that you had. Glad you're back with us. I know you're on your way back from the Munich security conference. Give us a sense. There's Joe Biden in Kiev with Zelensky, this big show of American support, domestic politics notwithstanding, it seems that America, even if the Republicans were to say, we really don't want to carry on funding at this rate, Joe Biden, I understand, I've been told, has primed the pump and there are enough American weapons to last for a while. What about the European side of this equation? What was your

takeaway from Munich in terms of commitment, but also speed of delivery of what they have already pledged? Let me say a few things. One, these images here. The only thing I'd add to what Keir said is Putin's going to use this as part of his narrative that he's not fighting Ukraine. He's also fighting the United States and the West. And that's central to his narrative. And I think the big questions going ahead for us, and you're getting at a little bit in your question, is can we sustain the high rates of military delivery? We simply don't have the manufacturing base in this country. We don't have enough stores to do it. So it's a big question for the United States going forward. How do we supply Ukraine, maintain American readiness,

not simply for the European theater, but say for something involving Taiwan in Asia or something involving Iran and the Middle East? So I think there's fundamental questions there. Also, something that came up in Munich is the relationship between China and Russia. It was a year ago, exactly just days before the Russian invasion, that Russia and China signed the so-called no limits agreement. And one of the questions is now, after a year of some Chinese restraint, are we about to see this no limits relationship materialize? Will China start helping Russia more directly with arms and ammunition? Secretary Blinken put that on the table at Munich this weekend. I think the Europeans are pretty solidly behind Ukraine for now. Again, taking the lead from the United States, it was a mild winter. Energy stocks are high. I think what's slowly

sinking in, though, is this is going to be a long war. Neither side is prepared to make any compromises for peace. It's not clear to me either side can dominate the battlefield. And what's slowly sinking in, and people are trying to make sense of it, what happens if this goes on for one more year or two more years, albeit probably at a lower level of intensity? But increasingly, that's the uncomfortable thought that Europeans are trying to internalize. They all want a diplomatic breakthrough, but they're realistic to

understand that none is in the offing. To Richard's point, at the Munich Security Conference, not only was there a tense meeting between Secretary of State Blinken and his Chinese counterpart over the spy balloon, but yes, that warning from Blinken that China may be on the verge of increasing its assistance to Russia. And in fact, as President Biden is in Kiev right now, the Chinese foreign minister is in Moscow. So that's certainly we have a lot more on that angle to the story a little later. Janice Mackey-Frayer, in fact, will join us from Beijing. But I want to bring back in Richard Engel right now, who's in eastern Ukraine.

Richard, give us a sense just to the state of play in the conflict right now. We've heard for a while Ukrainian officials issuing urgent warnings, saying they believe Russia is going to step up its offensive as the weather improves. Certainly, President Biden's appearance here is a sign of solidarity. But what are the Ukrainian fears and what are they saying they need? The Ukrainians are running out of ammunition, and that's what they're most concerned about right now. The Russians have intensified the offensive over the last 10 days or so. The Russians have thrown a lot of troops into battle, both troops and mercenaries, particularly around the city of Bahmut, which is not very far from where I am right now. And I've been to Bahmut with our team and the surrounding area several times over the last several days.

The fighting is very intense, but Russia is not making significant gains. Even though Russia is trying to drive its front line forward, Russia has been suffering heavy casualties and is losing thousands every few days in order to gain meters on the battlefield. But it is costing Ukraine a tremendous amount of ammunition to keep back this Russian onslaught. And I spoke to a Ukrainian tank commander not long ago, and he said that right now the tanks have so few rounds that they can't fire at the same rates that they used to a few months ago, that they have to pick and choose every shot. They can't fire over the horizon or fire onto anything that they can't see. They are waiting like it used to be in the Revolutionary War days until they see the whites of their eyes.

They are waiting until they have a confirmed target that they can visually identify before they are firing one of those precious time rounds. So ammunition is a major factor that the Ukrainians say they hope is addressed very quickly. Richard Engel, thank you. Live reports there from eastern Ukraine. Stay safe. We appreciate it. We want to bring back in Josh Letterman, who's in Warsaw, Poland. And Josh, Warsaw, of course, is where we all a few days ago thought the president was heading. And before he made this surprise stop in Kiev. But of course, he is still planning to go there. Exact arrival time TBD, since, of course, there's such security concerns about getting him out of Ukraine. But once he does arrive in Warsaw, give us a sense as to what we're going to hear from him

there. What's his message going to be? Seems to be to two specific audiences. Domestically, Americans back home, Republicans in the House, as well as the European leaders who have been, to this point, rallied with Ukraine. And I'd add one more audience to that list, Jonathan, which is President Putin himself. And we just heard Keir Simmons talking about that major speech that we're expecting tomorrow from President Putin. And what a split screen day that is going to be as President Biden, assuming his schedule still holds, is here in Warsaw at the Royal Palace Garden, just a few blocks from where I'm standing right now.

The same location, by the way, where President Biden was almost a year ago when he came here to Warsaw in March. I was here for that visit. And it was that speech where President Biden was really able to lay out the stakes not only for Ukraine, but for Europe and for the West, to put this in the context of that tension between democracies and autocracies that President Biden has really staked his whole presidency on. And it was, frankly, that same speech where Biden made that off-the-cuff remark about President Putin, how important it was that President Putin, you know, how important it was that President Putin not be able to stay in power. Of course, White House officials had to walk back those remarks. But this is going to be a bookend of sorts for President Biden as he comes back to this same location and tries to make the

case to Europe and to the West that now is not the time to let up on the gas, that now is the time to double down on support for Ukraine. And in addition to that speech here, he's going to have an opportunity to meet with President Duda of Poland, who has been probably the most hawkish European leader really leaning forward on support for Ukraine. Of course, Poland has taken in more refugees from Ukraine than any other nation. It was Poland that was really out on its front foot warning that Russia plans to invade Ukraine before it did. But then President Biden will also, before he returns to Washington, have a chance to sit down with the Bucharest Nine, a group of NATO allies that are really on Russia's doorstep. We're talking about countries like the Baltics, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania,

and others who feel perhaps more profoundly than anyone else the sense that if Russia is able to invade its neighbor in Ukraine without consequences, that it may then go on to threaten other parts of Europe, including NATO members, which, of course, would then bring the U.S. potentially into a direct military conflict with Russia, given Article 5 of NATO, an attack on one is an attack on all. That is something that clearly NATO members and the U.S. still are very worried about and don't want to happen. It's the reason they are so carefully calibrating their level of military support to avoid providing the kinds of assistance that could potentially provoke Putin further and make this a direct conflict between Russia and the West. But it's also going to be an opportunity for Biden to remind everyone that,

yes, there is an energy crisis here in Europe. Yes, there is a cost of living crisis, much of that attributed to the war in Ukraine. Yes, there are Republicans and others back at home who feel like it's time to focus again on America first and not be sending billions and billions of dollars to a country halfway around the world, but that this is a matter of global security, that this is an investment that is well spent to ensure that a country like Russia is not able to then go on and threaten other parts of the world. And that will be the case that President Biden tries to make not only to Ukrainians, not only to Europeans, but of course

to the audience back at home, clearly understanding that President Putin in Russia will also be watching that speech, Jonathan. Yeah, certainly the Bucharest Nine, a group of growing import in a European continent at war. Our thanks to Josh Letterman in Warsaw for his reporting this morning. So, Ali Vitale, Josh has used the phrase America first, and that's part of Putin's calculation here, where he thinks he can wait this out. It's not just about Republicans having control of the House. It's a looming 2024 presidential election, this bet that a Republican, potentially even Donald Trump, will be back in power. Let's just remind viewers for a moment here. Donald Trump got impeached because he was trying to extort President Zelensky, trying to withhold military assistance.

Now we see the current president on President's Day, no less, to Kiev, pledging even more aid there. Trump has said he wants this war to end right now for fear of escalation, even if that means allowing Russia to keep its gains. Tell us how that looming election shadows this conflict. I mean, look, it's going to be a year and a half plus of stunning split screens between President Biden, who is, for all intents and purposes right now, running for reelection, at least until he says he's not. And then, of course, you have the Republican primary that is only just beginning to kick off. I mean, I spent last week in South Carolina with former Governor Nikki Haley, former ambassador to the U.N. And you already see the policy schisms happening there between Haley and President Trump right now.

The only two declared candidates, though, we're going to see this field grow to mostly current and past governors, Sununu, DeSantis, key names like that. But look, you're already seeing as Congress and some key players there in a game of very tight margins are saying that they at least want more accountability behind these dollars that are being sent. What you're starting to see on the campaign trail, though, and the divide that we're seeing between Trump and Haley is she's saying we should be sending F-16s, we should be sending actual, tangible military equipment to them as opposed to just dollars. And so that's going to be the

conversation on the campaign trail. It might be partly playing into the Putin calculus of just trying to wait it out and see if the political tides ebb and flow in a more Republican and Trumpian direction in the United States. But certainly all of that is in the calculus as you kind of play this game zooming in and out of domestic and foreign politics that are just so closely intertwined. No, we're really going to relive the foreign policy debate of the 2016 election. Yeah. As Republican candidates who tried to embrace MAGA America first, they really are probably at their core more hawkish and more old school Republicans. And we're seeing that play out on the Hill with some senators in support of robust aid to Ukraine and then other Republicans, newcomers usually like

Marjorie Taylor Greene, who are saying, no, America first, we're not going to fund this. And so Biden's trip today really is designed not just to reassure the world, not to just just to reassure Ukrainians and the diplomatic elements, of course, but to politically win over Americans again. You look at how support for funding Ukraine and sending arms. It was at 60 percent back in May. It's now down to around 48 percent in a recent AP poll. President Biden couldn't have been more clear. He said the U.S. will stay with Kiev for as long as it takes. Still ahead here on Morning Joe, we're going to continue to follow President's surprise visit to Kiev. Plus, we're going to get a live report from Beijing following a tense meeting in Munich between Secretary of State Antony Blinken and his Chinese counterpart.

Also ahead, we'll have an update on former President Jimmy Carter as he enters hospice care at his home in Georgia. You're watching Morning Joe. We will be right back. We are so troubled that Beijing has deepened its relationship with Moscow since the war began. Looking ahead, any steps by China to provide lethal support to Russia would only reward aggression, continue the killing, and further undermine a rules-based order. Vice President Kamala Harris with that warning to China at the Munich security conference on Saturday. NBC News reports the U.S. believes China may be providing non-lethal military assistance to Russia for use in the war in Ukraine. And Secretary of State Tony Blinken has said China is, quote, strongly considering providing lethal aid as well. Blinken met face

to face with his Chinese counterpart over the weekend in Munich. The two officials spoke for just over an hour where the State Department says Blinken warned of the, quote, implications and consequences if China does provide that support to Russia. Saturday's meeting was also the first between the two sides since the U.S. shot down a suspected Chinese spy balloon off the coast of South Carolina earlier this month. According to the State Department, Blinken told his counterpart on Saturday that the U.S., quote, will not stand for any violation of our sovereignty. China, for its part, continues to deny that the balloon was sent for surveillance

purposes. During Saturday's meeting, The State Department said China also made irresponsible and unfounded accusations against the United States. So a lot going on in the Chinese-U.S. relationship. Joining us now from Beijing is NBC News foreign correspondent Janice Mackey-Frayer. Janice, good morning. Thank you for joining us. Janice, look, it's clear there's been a sort of coordinated rollout of these concerns about China providing lethal weapons to Russia for the fight in Ukraine over the last few days? I heard it last week from a senior senator here in Washington, Tony Blinken, saying it over the weekend. There you've got Kamala Harris talking about it as well. What's been the reaction from Beijing to these warnings from senior U.S. officials? Well, it's no coincidence that these warnings that come with no details on underlying intelligence that would prompt such alarm are coming to coincide with the

visit of Wang Yi, who is China's top diplomat, to Moscow. He's there to lay the groundwork for a state visit for Chinese President Xi Jinping that could happen within the next month. Here, the reaction was it was not taken well. Foreign ministry spokesperson saying, quote, it's the U.S. who has been continuously providing weapons to the war. The U.S. is not qualified to give orders to China. Two things have happened over the last year since the Russian invasion, since Vladimir Putin was here with that 5,000-word manifesto declaring a friendship with no limits with Xi Jinping. The two things that have happened is that the U.S.-China relationship has steadily deteriorated. There is no cooperation on anything, not even talks on climate change. There have been no phone calls. The defense officials here are not picking up the hotline from the U.S. military since this

balloon incident. At the same time, there has been a deepening of ties between China and Russia. There is far more trade, especially in energy. There has been Russian propaganda and misinformation that's been allowed to flourish here in China's information space about China's role in the Ukraine war. And China seems to be getting on with diplomatic business with other people. Last week, having a state visit with Iran's president. So there is the sense that China is looking to build its ties elsewhere. And right now, a relationship between the U.S. and China that was once described as fraught now simply doesn't seem to exist. There's a greater gap in understanding.

There is greater mistrust on both sides. And there doesn't appear to be any conciliation on either side to resume talks toward perhaps rescheduling Secretary Blinken's visit. The secretary himself confirmed after that meeting with Wang Yi yesterday that China has made no apology for what has happened with this balloon incident. Richard, has the Chinese would, just kind of thinking of the repercussions potentially to the Chinese, if they were to go ahead and defy the U.S. on this and start providing weapons to the Russians? I mean, as Janice points out, there haven't been very many communications on the diplomatic front over the last year.

And I know that's alarming. But there's still a heck of a lot of trade goes on between China and the United States. America imports something like $500 billion worth of goods from China every year. So there could be economic repercussions if China was to go ahead and provide these weapons. Why would the Chinese do this at this point? I've been sitting here listening to Janice, thinking about exactly that, Cady. I think on one hand, strategically, at the risk of being, shall we say, cynical, the Chinese might see some advantages in a long war in Europe. It keeps the West and the United States tied down or reduces our military readiness for other parts of the world.

They certainly don't want Russia to lose. So I think that's partially it. Second of all, my guess is they see no possible upside in U.S. relations right now. So they don't see any reason from their point of view to exercise constraint. They may also, and this gets really interesting because it gets exactly your question, they may not see much downside. They may actually say, well, what is the United States, what do they have left to do to us? They've already cut off a lot of strategic trade. They've kept in place the tariffs. The United States is moving ever closer to Taiwan. So I think from the Chinese point of view, they probably don't see a lot of reason to hold off helping Russia. Also, Xi Jinping really cast his lot with Vladimir Putin. When he signed

this no-limits friendship agreement, he now put his own credibility on the line. So I don't think he can afford to see Putin do poorly. I have a question for Janice about Tony Blinken. Whether she has any sense from the Chinese point of view, whether they're even interested now in hosting a visit, or whether they think that ship has sailed for the time being, and they're just essentially prepared to live for an open-ended amount of time without any high-level diplomacy with the United States. Custom to not having to embrace relations with the U.S., certainly with the way things have been nosediving over the past year. There was a high level of embarrassment that Secretary Blinken canceled or postponed the visit. There have been no signs that there has been any discussion on either side

to try to get the visit rescheduled. It was an embarrassment to the leadership in Xi Jinping because he had been seen as being more conciliatory in his diplomacy. And there really is the sense that they are getting on with business with others, with this state visit to Moscow expected next month, with the trade deepening with Russia, with the support deepening for Russia, and also with the visit of the Iranian president last week. China was being cautious in the deals that it's been doing. They are very aware of the U.S. sanctions on Iran. But there really is the sense that they are been doing. They are very aware of the U.S. sanctions on Iran,

but there really is the sense that they are trying to fortify ties with countries that are going to be more friendly than the United States has appeared to be over the past several months and certainly in the past several weeks with the balloon incident. Okay, NBC's Janice McIffray in Beijing for us.

Janice, thank you very much. All eyes on China and what they're going to do next vis-a-vis Russia and Ukraine at the moment. Let's bring in Eugene Daniels, who's sitting next to me here in the studio in Washington. Eugene, when you look at the pictures, I'm assuming you were taken by surprise a little bit this morning. Oh, yeah. Which was the idea, right? So somebody that covers the White House as closely as you did was not getting a tip off that this was going to happen because of the security concerns. What's the thing? What goes into a visit like this? What are the security concerns that has to be weighed up? How much does President Biden have to overcome some kind of resistance from

his security team to do this? I mean, we were asking all of us White House reporters, because we knew President Biden was going to Poland. It's right there. We have seen other presidents go from Poland to Ukraine. So we were asking, is there a day that he's going to go over there? And, you know, in his schedule on Tuesday, is there a possibility that he will go over there? And they kept saying no, no, no, in a certain way, right, making sure that they also weren't lying to the press. But at the end of the day, this is something President Biden has wanted to do for a very long time, right? He's been talking to aides about this because he knew he was going to have to

continue to up the ante, as it were, for his support of Ukraine, right? You had President or Vice President Harris make like four trips over the last year to Europe talking about this, including two trips to the Munich Security Conference. You had President Biden and Zelensky meeting at the White House. And so, this was another show of support for the Ukrainians. But the kinds of security clearance—the kind of security is they don't—they were worried—they're probably worried about him walking the streets, right? He walked right in front of that palace. They're worried about him going to the embassy, which he just did going to the United States embassy. And that is something that the other leaders did not have to deal with as much. Right. President Biden is one of the final leaders to make that trip to Ukraine and to Kiev specifically.

And so trying to get here are the things we're worried about you doing, Mr. President. I guess what he does, he goes ahead and does both of them. Exactly. Because one that aides always tell us is you don't know, President Biden, what to do. But figuring it out, at the end of the day, the Secret Service kind of makes the final determinations on a lot of this. We also had only two of a small contingent of reporters that were with the president to keep it under wraps as this was kind of unfolding.

So we're going to learn more about how the president got there. Did he take that 10-hour train ride like other leaders did? But at this point, there's a lot of questions how they pulled this off. They will get him safely out of the country, John, before they give us any of that kind of information, I suspect, about how he got into the country. They just want to make sure that he is out of the danger zone. It was interesting, wasn't it, that we heard those air raid sirens go off because the one point the Ukrainians started getting worried that the Russians might have got some

tip off of this and were scrambling some kind of jets. But the moment all seems to have gone fine for the moment. Let's get him out of there. As if there was not enough to worry about, we spent the last hour and a half covering President Biden's surprise visit to Ukraine and the security implications around that. There are now also worries coming from right over the other side of the world, from North Korea. Is this just a periodic North Korean moment that they want a little bit of global attention? Yeah, we'll certainly have more on the president's visit to Kiev as we learn. As you mentioned, Katty, we, of course, are cooperating with security restrictions put in place by the White House. But you're right, as if there weren't enough going on, there's a

significant escalation from North Korea with the firing of at least two ballistic missiles toward Japan just today. This just two days after North Korea fired an intercontinental ballistic missile into the sea off Japan's West Coast, landing within the country's exclusive economic zone. That launch prompted the U.S. to hold joint air exercises with South Korea and then separately with Japan yesterday. The sister of North Korean leader Kim Jong-un warned more launchers are to come unless the United States halts military drills with South Korea. The South Korean and U.S. militaries plan to hold a tabletop exercise this week to hone a joint response to a potential use of nuclear weapons by North Korea. So, Richard Haass, I want to get your take as to what you think this is from North Korea, if indeed, as Cady says, just a periodic spasm of violence, of bluster, or if there's something

more to hear. But also talk to us about the role that China plays here as well at a moment of such tension with the United States. And we should note Secretary of State Blinken, when he confronted his Chinese counterpart in Munich about the spy balloon, made clear there were no apologies offered from China. You take the spy balloon, you take potentially increased aid to Russia. And now, of course, you have the role that China could play with Pyongyang. Give us your take. As you say, it's the role China could play with Pyongyang, and China's been a major disappointment here. Most of North Korea's trade goes in and out of China. China subsidizes North Korea. China could pressure them to show some restraint in their nuclear program or their missile program, and clearly China is not doing that. I think China essentially wants to keep the Korean Peninsula divided. It never wants to see North Korea crumble because it's worried about a united Korea that could be

against us. And China's not a partner here. It's quite disappointing. I think North Korea, it's their version of station identification, Jonathan. And I think it's only a matter of time, not just these missile tests, but also potentially a nuclear test. I think they're up to it would be number seven. And I think it's more a question of when, not if, that happens. And already this morning, we've talked about Russia. We've talked about China. Now it's North Korea.

If we had time, we could probably talk about Iran, which is getting ever closer to having nuclear weapons itself. It just shows how packed the national security foreign policy inbox is. You know, a lot of Americans may not want to focus a lot on the world. Well, the world's not going to let us forget it. And here we have our principal allies. And by the way, Japan is not only has to think about North Korea, but Japan would be our principal partner if push ever came to shove with Taiwan. Japan is the most strategically significant capable partner, ally we have in that part of the world. So, again, these things are all connected. The Taiwan thing, deteriorating U.S.-Chinese relations, which, by the way, could get even worse if Speaker McCarthy decides he can't resist the temptation to visit Taiwan sometime in his first six months as Speaker. So this is really a

fasten your seatbelt moment in the world. All at a time, again, we'd rather focus on all of our domestic challenges. Clearly, President Biden is not going to have that luxury. And unclear yet what the next communication will be between Washington and Beijing. Certainly a lot to discuss. Richard Haass, thank you for joining us live from London this morning. Coming up here on Morning Joe, we're going to get a live report from Georgia, where Jimmy Carter, America's longest living president, is now receiving end of life care at his home. We'll be right back.

Well, President Jimmy Carter is now receiving hospice care at his Georgia home following a series of hospital stays. According to a statement from his foundation, Carter has decided to spend his remaining time at home with his family instead of having additional medical intervention. The 98-year-old Carter is the longest living president in American history. The Carter Center did not provide additional details about what conditions prompted the recent hospital visits nor Carter's decision to enter hospice care. Joining us now is NBC News correspondent Priscilla Thompson live in Plains, Georgia, not far from the Carters' home. Priscilla, what's the latest that you're hearing? Yeah, well, Mr. Carter is here at his home receiving that hospice care as tributes and

messages of love and support are pouring in online for the former president with people sharing photos and treasured memories that they've had with him over the years. And of course, that including President Biden, who tweeted saying that he is praying for the family, praying for former President Carter and saying, quote, We admire you for the strength and humility you have shown in difficult times. May you continue your journey with grace and dignity and God grant you peace. And peace is really the mood here on the ground in Plains. We had an opportunity to go to the church where Mr. Carter was a member, where he taught Bible or teaches Bible study and taught Bible study for many decades.

And we spoke to folks there and they talked so much about how much they will love him and how much they love him and how when the time comes, they will certainly miss him. But they are so grateful that he will no longer be in pain and that he will be going on to meet his maker. And we heard a similar message from the grandson of President Carter, who said that his parents, his grandparents are at peace. And as always, their home is so full of love right now. And that peace is also something that former President Carter has spoken about. As you mentioned, when he was in his 80s, he was diagnosed with melanoma and that was in his liver and it spread to his brain and he defied the odds by defeating that cancer. But he spoke

about it after the fact, saying that at the time he thought he may only have a few weeks left. And he said that he felt at ease about it, that he had lived an extraordinary life that had been exciting and adventurous. And for that, he was grateful. And that has certainly been the case. While he only served one term as president, we know that he did so much in the years after he left the White House, really fighting tirelessly for peace and human rights around the world. And of course, being so active with Habitat for Humanity, working on more than 4,000 homes during his time doing that. And after he left the White House, he returned to Plains, Georgia. And, of course, he is here now where he intends to live out his remaining days.

Back to you. Priscilla Thompson, NBC's Priscilla Thompson, thank you very much for joining us from the Plains, Georgia. With that latest update, Eugene Daniels, the words grace, dignity, humility, we don't often associate with politicians today. But I think everybody would agree that there is a man, Jimmy Carter, who has had the clearest moral compass his whole life, and they are exactly the words you would use to think of him. That's exactly right. There's a bipartisan love for Jimmy Carter and what he did post-presidency, right? This is a man who, when he ran for re-election, lost by a landslide. I think 489 votes Ronald Reagan beat him by. But what he was able to do and have been

able to do, like Priscilla is saying, with his post-presidency is comparable and higher than most presidents have done during and after their presidencies. And I think that is something that is going to be his legacy. It's not just going to be that he was president. It's about how he worked to spread peace, how he was talked about bipartisanship and love and all of that as our politics continued to deteriorate here as he's home in Georgia. Well, look at those pictures of him. It is true that being president doesn't tend to make you humble. But in the case of Jimmy Carter, he kept that humility with him. Politico's Eugene Daniels, thank you for joining me on set this morning.

John, we will be, of course, watching the Carter family as well as they spend these last days with with Jimmy Carter. And it is, as as Eugene was saying, this outpouring, this by a rare thing in Washington, a bipartisan outpouring of affection for the former president. Yeah, there's no question there that in his post-presidency, he so very much transcended party lines that, you know, only spent four years in office and historians will weigh in on where to assess his legacy while president. But afterwards, unassailable in terms of habitat for humanity, he was called in so frequently to be an American voice on the world stage as well. Still a trusted diplomat, Elise Jordan. We don't know how much longer President Carter will be with us. It could be could still be some time. The family hasn't given those details yet, but we do know he's he's home now

to spend his remaining days. What do you think his legacy will be? I think that, of course, there's going to be the downside, the rough years of his presidency. But really, the human rights first focus that he really elevated to the forefront of his presidency. And then that continued in the years that followed. So while his presidency might get mixed reviews, at least the human rights element that was so central to the presidency, he continued it in so many ways over the following decades and really set a model for what the post-presidency could be in terms of not making money, almost a throwback to, you know, someone like Truman and Eisenhower. They live very simply. But Carter even perhaps live more simply than even Eisenhower, who still went to Palm Beach and golfed all the

time, Palm Springs and golfed all the time. So, Ali Vitale, you know, we've heard from President Biden and Republicans as well pay tribute to former President Carter. Talk to us about what you think Carter, the man, that legacy he left on Washington. Look, I think that's going to be the important thing as you talk about, as Eugene did, this moment that transcends the partisan politics that often completely dominate Washington and our political culture right now. This is yet another callback. I mean, I think of the other people who have sort of been elevated above the parties that

they came from within, people like Senator John McCain and others in recent years, that as they passed, it was a reminder to the country's better angels of the past when people could work aside from party lines. I think that when you see Carter, the man, someone who was so prayerful, God fearing the fact that he talked about how during the time, as Priscilla mentioned, he said he was at ease with death. He said that he talked with God about having a proper attitude about dying. I think that you don't see men in the public space have those kinds of reflections in the way that he did. I think that's going to be such a key part of his legacy in addition to the charity work and everything else that he did. Jimmy Carter, the man from Plains, Georgia. Ali Vitale, thank you so much for being here and for your efforts on way too early this morning. We greatly appreciate it.

Still ahead here on Morning Joe, we'll return live to Ukraine as we follow President Biden overseas this morning after he made a surprise and historic trip to Kiev. Plus, the latest from East Palestine, Ohio, where residents are still fearing for their health in the aftermath of a toxic train derailment. We'll get a live report. Morning Joe, we'll be right back.