Morning Joe - Morning Joe 2/28/23

Episode Date: February 28, 2023

GOP stars flee CPAC

This weekend, Major League Baseball officially started spring training. Yeah. And the big story, I'm excited. The big story is that now there's a pitch clock that gives players just 15 seconds between pitches. And so far, it's really helped speed up the games. So now people are using the clock to speed up things in other places. Look at this interview with the president from this weekend. Is your age part of your own calculation into whether to run again?

Well, first of all, the, the, look, first of all, to, to, uh, uh, the, uh, look, they, the, they, the, uh, uh, no, uh, but yes. There you go. It works. Jimmy Fallon having some fun with baseball's new rule. We have a lot to get to this morning. A major conservative conference is going to be missing some star power. We'll go through the big names in the GOP who are skipping CPAC.

And we'll tell you which event many of them are attending instead. Meanwhile, Ron DeSantis takes control of a key figure in his so-called war on woke. We'll explain what is happening in Florida. And we'll have the latest bombshells to come out of court documents in a lawsuit against Fox News, including Rupert Murdoch's testimony on false claims about election fraud. Also ahead, we'll be joined by Education Secretary Miguel Cardona as President Joe Biden's plan to cancel student loan debt for some borrowers goes before the Supreme Court. Good morning and welcome to Morning Joe. It is Tuesday, February 28th. Along with Joe, Willie and me, we have the host of Way Too Early, White House

Bureau Chief at Politico, Jonathan Lemire. And guess what, guys? The circus is in town. Look at them all. Although not everyone is dressed, apparently. Not yet. Okay. The show starts at 6. If you could get ready, it's 6 a.m. Heilman. When you drag yourself straight from Madison Square Garden to the set, you sometimes have a little bit of, you know.

We're going to start with some excuses. I bet Jen Palmieri has no excuses. No, she never needs excuses. Women never do, but men are always late. I'm just saying. So Jen's here. Jen's here. Former advisor to President George W. Bush, Mark McKinnon's here.

They are all co-hosts of Showtime's The Circus, and we are glad to have them in town this morning, dressed or not. OK, so let's get to our top story. Many of the Republican Party's biggest names will not be attending the annual conservative political action conference in Maryland this week. Potential 2024 candidates, including Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, former Vice President Mike Pence and Virginia Governor Glenn Youngkin, will not be at the annual gathering. RNC Chairwoman Ronna McDaniel, Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, House Speaker Kevin McCarthy. They're all sitting it out this year as well. This year's conference comes as CPAC's chair, Matt Schlapp, faces a lawsuit that alleges he fondled a male aide and then Senate candidate Herschel Walker for Herschel Walker without consent in October. Schlapp's lawyers have said he denies the allegations. None of the politicians that have said they are not attending have cited Schlapp's allegations as reason for their absence.

However, several Republicans who spoke to NBC News anonymously have said the allegations are a factor in the broader movement away from the conference. The event, which in years past was one of the biggest events for conservatives, will feature speeches from former President Donald Trump, 2024 candidate Nikki Haley, Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene and others. What do you think, Joe? Well, I think it's early. It is early. And and you corrected yourself. But there was no there was no allegations about Matt and Herschel Walker. So it was an aide to Herschel Walker, not an aide and Herschel Walker. I know. It is early. It's early. It's early now.

I apologize. No, no, no, no. It is. This is fascinating, though, John Heilman, because, I mean, this is Reagan. This is where Reagan would always go. This is where every sort of conservative star used to go. And then at some point it became obvious that it was it was going for a field. And again, you would have it became a libertarian gathering, not a Republican or a conservative. And that's when you have Ron Paul and Rand Paul, you know, start winning every presidential poll there, straw poll there.

And they're just sort of just sort of this feeling like, seriously, am I going to really waste my time at CPAC when, you know, they're going further and further mainstream? But they still held on to mainstream Republicans until this year. And now it is interesting how many are just saying no. Yeah, I actually think, Joe, that it's a it's not that. Yes, there's always been that kind of that cranky libertarian thing that popped up at CPAC. And it's also always had that kind of whatever the flavor of college kind of broheme conservatism was in a given year. But really what happened to CPAC over the course of the last decade was it became MPAC. It became the MAGA Political Action Committee, Conference and Committee, frankly.

You know, Trump first spoke there in 2011 and was received rapturously with his, the early kind of larval version of what became the Make America Great Again Trump platform. It was, you know, attacking China, attacking immigrants, birtherism, all that stuff. And Trump was at that point trying to figure out, as you pointed out on the show so many times, not person to person, never been a Republican, had never been a conservative. CPAC became the sort of the kind of workshop for his early political development. He's like, I'm going to be a political figure. I'm going to try to figure out how to be a Republican now. And his version of conservatism, his version of radical,

grievance-based, nationalist, jingoist politics kind of took shape there. And every time he would come in 2011, it was so rapturous, it seemed, in 2011 that he thought about getting into the race in 2012 in a more serious way than a lot of people believe. And then in 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, everyone, he came back. Every time there was a bigger crowd, every time they liked the message more, that was the launching pad for him. And he has owned that place, basically, lock, stock, and barrel ever since then. So the fascinating thing right now is not only that a lot of these stars are staying away, Trump's still going to have his big stage on Saturday night,

so we'll get to see whether he's really lost his fastball or whether he's back. But a lot of people are just kind of like, let Trump have it. You know? If he wants to be the Trump back the Trump back, go, go forth and do whatever you're going to do with Matt Schlapp and have fun over there. While we go out, Ron DeSantis goes out

and hits the book trail and Vice President Pence goes to South Carolina and Chris Sununu stays far away and others decide that's not, the party must change. Here's a good place to start. Take away CPAC's power.

Well, and of course, they're also going to all be going to talk to donors The party must change. Here's a good place to start. Take away CPAC's power. Well, and of course, they're also going to all be going to talk to donors at Club for Growth. But that in a minute, you know, Mark McKinnon, conservative, I've said for such a long time, there's very little that's conservative about CPAC. You know, they again had this sort of college libertarian thing going. But if you're ideologically based at all, how do you go from being like pure as driven snow, supporting libertarians to then going in the authoritarian streak as hard as you can? And your new heroes are Donald Trump and Victor Orban. I mean, and not only have they been worshiping a guy in Victor Orban, both here and by having these things over in Hungary,

they're worshiping a guy politically who said he doesn't believe in Western democracy anymore, that he's a champion of illiberalism and illiberal democracy. I mean, Ronald Reagan, that is you and I know this. Maybe some of these so-called conservatives don't know it. That is literally the antithesis of Ronald Reagan and Reaganism. What Orban, what Trump preaches there, this sort of authoritarianism and waiting is the exact opposite of what Reagan and what these people who originally set CPAC up were supposed to believe in. Well, John McCain's rolling over in his grave. But also, Joe, I think I'm correct in noting that Bolsonaro is going to be speaking. So it's not just autocrats.

It's other election deniers from foreign countries. So, as you said, it's so contrary to the traditional ideology that we've known over the years through Reagan, through Bush, through McCain. And again, if you, as John talked about, you see the evolution of Donald Trump and where he started and the evolution through CPAC, it's hard to figure out where the ideological moorings are. But again, also, as John pointed out, this is his home turf. And if I were a strategist for somebody like Ron DeSantis, what I would say is, what should we do that week? How about a book tour? You know, let's, let's, let's, you know's don't go to his home turf. Let's create our own platform and our own bullhorn and show that we've got our own strength in another sphere. Exactly what DeSantis is doing. His book is out today. He's on a book tour. And you're right,

that Bolsonaro will be at CPAC this week. So, Jen, what's your assessment of what's going on here? We know it's likely not the allegations against Matt Schlapp. By that standard, they would have walked away from Donald Trump a long time ago if sexual misconduct bothered them that much. So is it just that CPAC has become such a Star Wars bar in recent years that they don't want to be a part of it? I think a lot of them would get booed. Right. Like if Mike Pence shows up at CPAC, like what is going to happen? You know what's going to happen? Mitch McConnell showed up at CPAC, I think he would get booed, too. So I think that some of them are probably concerned about that.

And then also just if it is if it is going to be such a Trump home game, it's a little bit humiliating. I mean, I've been in presidential campaigns where you're where you're working for underdogs and you want to have them present something new. And DeSantis is definitely you know, he is definitely doing that. He is not I don't think he's going to glub for glub for glub for growth. Again, it's easy for me to say, but he is you know, he's got a MAGA. He's the only one that has a true MAGA record to run on. And, you know, he's playing his he's playing his own game. So several of the potential presidential candidates this time around will attend the Club for Growth donor retreat this week. Florida Governor Ron DeSantis and former VP Mike Pence, both considering a run, will be there, as well as Nikki Haley.

Senators Tim Scott, Ted Cruz, Rick Scott, along with New Hampshire Governor Chris Sununu also will make appearances. Club for Growth has declined to invite former President Trump to the gathering. According to the group's president, he wants to introduce Republican donors to other possibilities, saying, quote, the party should be open to another candidate. Interesting journey for Club for Growth, John, over the last several years, all in with Donald Trump sort of changed who they were and what they were about to fall in line with him, but now saying they don't really believe he can win or that he's not the future of the party. Yeah, it's such a split screen here with CPAC being the Trump show and Club for Growth not even letting Trump come. One last note on CPAC. I'm interested to see how Nikki Haley is received, who she is the one

announced candidate who's in. Talk about someone who might face some boos there if they feel like she has been not sufficiently loyal to Donald Trump. And then Club for Growth is trying to steer, obviously, the party in another direction, at least for now. If Donald Trump, I think we all suspect that if Trump emerges as the heavyweight, if perhaps the CPAC speech launches a renewed campaign, if he is able to fend off these challengers, one assumes that Club for Growth would hop right back on. But the DeSantis thing is the shadow over all of this, where right, at least for now, the anti-Trump movement has coalesced around DeSantis, though he's more in theory than in practice. He's done what he's done

in Florida. Totally unclear whether that will play on the national stage, but he seems to have plenty of Fox News support right now, Joe. And that is going to be in the days ahead as we see Trump with CPAC and then DeSantis and others at the Club for Growth gathering. Just what does that tell us about where this Republican Party is right now? Still a long way from the election, but important first steps. Yeah, you know, we we had a tease on the Dominion lawsuit, but talking about Murdoch, John Heilman, Murdoch's never had any use for Donald Trump. Didn't like him, let people know he didn't like him, thought he was an idiot. He obviously played ball with him and dealt with him while Trump was very popular with the base.

But they flat out told people close to them they don't like Trump. They don't want Trump. Weirdly enough, they kind of like Glenn Youngkin. But I don't know that they're going to be able to sell that to their viewers. But I will say just the rolling, you know, you had DeSantis last night taking victory laps on Tucker's show. You're going to have DeSantis showing up. And, you know, this Trump is complaining about this. Trump understands, you know, you can attack Fox one day if you're running in a Republican primary, if you're Donald Trump. But you know what?

Big wheels keep on rolling as, you know, Proud Mary keeps on. I mean, and the thing is, day after day after day after day of ignoring Donald Trump, elevating Ron DeSantis and others. Trump knows it has a massive impact on Republican primaries. I mean, and the reason I know is, you know, I saw what Fox News did to my parents. I saw it did to my aunt. You know, you have these people that started, you know, coming at me with conspiracy theories. And I said, well, where did you get that? Glenn Beck. Don't watch Glenn Beck.

And then, you know, we've all heard those stories. Yeah. So it has a massive impact in the Republican primary, especially with the people who vote the most in Republican primary, older voters. I mean, look, first of all, I just noticed this earlier when we had a little, we had on screen, we had a little Murdoch. Can we get like, just put Murdoch, there was like some picture about Murdoch in the Dominion thing. Can somebody put that up just so we can like see what, Rupert Murdoch now when you look at him, it's impossible. I'm just, I just see it's like, when it went by, it won't make as much sense if you can't see him. When it went by. I'm just, I just see if like, when I went by, it won't make as much sense to me. You can't see him when he went by. I'm like, you can't look at Murdoch now and not

see Logan Roy. It's like, he looks like he just looks like succession. Now, every time I see him on screen, he's getting turned. He's turning more and more into a character in that show. Visually. I think Joe, I think by the way, no, hold on that. You brought him up. When does succession come back? Couple of weeks. It's like March 26th. Sunday, March 26th. This month. This month. Next month. And by the way, for the record, Mika and I saw 1923 again,

and Spencer still didn't make it back. We are like beyond ourselves. I'm done. I mean, I keep thinking, you know, we'll watch it, and one of these episodes he's going to get back. I'm done. Mika was not happy, and she predicted that at the start of the season. She said they are never going's going to get back. But no, Mika was not happy. And she predicted that at the start of the season.

She said, they are never going to let Spencer get back. When I can predict everything, I'm bored. So they're boring. No, they're not. No, you cannot live off of one narrative and suck it dry. Like, seriously, 1923. She's tired of that. Well, I was going to say. Mika loves 1923, but anyway, yeah,

you do. To bring it, to bring it back to politics, Mika, you know, that's the question for Donald Trump. Can you live off one narrative and suck it dry? Well, we'll see, you know, Donald Trump's been living off one narrative for a while. I just to give CPAC it's due when it goes to this, to this Murdoch thing, the generational question, the Republican party, you know, the Fox news things, Joe, you're right. Fox News is very powerful among older conservative voters. Everybody under 60, though, and this was Trump's bet in 2016, was that Breitbart News and Newsmax and these other conservative outlets that are now to the right of Fox were getting more and more of a hold among anti-establishment Republicans who were like, Fox News is basically like MSNBC as far as they're concerned. And now you've got the further right people who are out

looking at Facebook groups most of the time. So Fox News is still very powerful, but there are lots of other powerful outlets in conservative politics. And over this week at CPAC, we all, establishmentarians, one and all here at this table to some extent, a lot of Republican Party will laugh at us for being like, oh, the CPAC is dead. You know who's going to be at CPAC? Donald Trump Jr., Kimberly Guilfoyle, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Matt Gaetz, Steve Bannon, Carrie Lake giving the big speech on Friday night. Now, to a lot of Republicans in what used to be considered the conservative movement,

but now is the MAGA part of the party, which is still the biggest part of the party. They look at that list and say, Chris Sununu, Chris Christie, Glenn Youngkin, these are Wall Street Republicans. They don't speak for us. These are the descendants of Donald Trump. And so, you know, CPAC would say to all of us, hey, forget it. We're still the heart of the party. They are the people that lose. Insurrectionists, weirdos and freaks. And, you know, Mr. Pillow's coming, too, I saw. So, yeah, it's going to be fascinating. But, you know, on the other side, deniers, too, again, the people who lose and that's fine. If they want to have a party, a convention of losers, get to it, have fun. So on the other side of the equation, we keep having hand-wringing, Jen, about Joe Biden. Joe Biden needs to quit.

Joe Biden needs to step aside. Joe Biden this, Joe Biden that. Joe Biden needs a new running maid is the new thing, too. Yeah. Yeah. I saw a poll out that had like Biden at like 50 percent. I think it was Emerson. But you look at all the polls. He's going up. His his overall 538 average is going up. This is a guy who is, you know, he's sitting at 50 percent in some polls and other polls keep moving up. This isn't a guy that's going to say, oh, hey, yeah, I'm getting more popular. I think now's a great time to just quit after 2022, after a key, after making history. I mean, this guy's going. Yeah. And I, you know, I was texting with Kate Benningfield over the weekend, who is the outgoing White House communications director. This is her last week. And just congratulating her.

You know, Ron claimed that the team that had been in place for the last two years, they have. And the president has done absolutely everything to prove to the American people that he is more than capable of doing the job. And, you know, I think that is why we're in February. But that is why the Republican primary is starting this week and the Democratic primary is not. The age question, it's always that is always going to be there. Every every every administration has its crucible. That is his. It's all that will always be there. But in terms of what more could he have done to prove his to have a proof of concept that his presidency is working, that the theory is working, you know, economy still is a long way to go, but things are improving.

What he's done on the world stage, what he's sort of born physically, he can do this. And I think that is why you see no one suggesting that they would run. And I know there's been, you know, and likewise, I saw that there was some reporting and questioning whether the vice president will continue to be on the ticket. There is zero chance. Let me tell you, people, there is zero chance that Kamala Harris will not be on this, that she will not be his running mate. There is no way they are taking her off the ticket. Everything that she has brought to the administration, the support she has within the base, like this is the, you know, for now, unless something dramatically different happens, Democrats start to step up to run. And I see I just don't see a scenario where that happens. Like this is the ticket. Yeah. And to Jen's point, Willie, not only what more does

he need to do, what more do we need to know? President Biden stands by his decisions. We've seen that every step of the way. He's put a lot of points on the board, but even decisions like Afghanistan, he stood by. He has resolve on what he's doing. What more does he need to do? And what more do we need to know when Dr. Jill Biden says, yep, he's ready to go? Well, yeah, that's the question. But I guess, John, it doesn't really matter at this point, right? I mean, when he announces a sort of a it's a formality that that doesn't quite affect the race all that much because nobody else really is threatening to get back in.

So do we have a sense of his timetable where he may officially say, yeah, I'm going to make another run at it? Yeah, they're not too worried about the Marianne Williamson bid. She's expected to announce her candidacy this week to challenge the president. Yeah, we saw, I think, from the first lady this week, a little bit of growing frustration within the West Wing about these very questions as to whether he's going to run and when. Now, to be fair, the timeline has slipped some. They had been telegraphing.

They thought they had announced soon after the State of the Union in February. That's, of course, no longer the case. They're now coalescing around April. That, in part, for fundraising purposes. You let that first quarter come and go. Then you announce, and then you start raising money as opposed to having to report it in complete quarter. They also point out that in 2011, April was when Barack Obama announced his reelection bid. Of course, there were no questions as to whether or not Obama was going to run for a second term. There have been for Biden. But the White House believes

they have largely, they point to the resume and say, we've put those questions to rest. They point to his legislative record. They point to the contrast with the four years of Trump emerging out of the pandemic, the aftermath of January 6th. And of course, as was so vividly on display last week, his leadership in the war in Europe and supporting Ukraine against Russia's invasions. And they feel like that they think they're well positioned and they like the contrast they have, Joe, with the Republicans. And to Jen's point, the vice president is going to be on the ticket for many reasons, including, of course, that, as noted, the base is the foundation of the Democratic Party right now, black women. They're not going to alienate that by pushing Vice President Harris off as Joe Biden's running mate. Right. And, you know, Biden, again, he's he's continuing. It's slow and steady as far as his ratings go.

Alex said I accidentally said 50 percent. It's 44 percent. He's gone from the 30s to the low 40s. He's moving up. His average is moving up. He's now moving into the mid 40s. And I thought it was so interesting yesterday, Mark McKinnon, when we played the Jill Biden clip. She didn't say hope and change. She didn't play a rock star, didn't say Joe Biden was going to be a rock star. You know, like, you know, Donald Trump tried to play this big, bigger than life, strong rock star. She basically said what our parents always said that may sound boring in the age of TikTok, but she was basically saying slow and steady gets the job done. He's steady. Americans needed somebody who's steady, somebody with resolve, somebody with a foundation, somebody that was going to stay there and hold this country together.

And I thought, what what a great message, given the chaos that we've seen over the past six, seven years and just how exhausted American voters are by what they have seen every day in the age of Trump. Hey, I'll take steady any day of the week. You know, people make make fun of the the new prime minister in Britain suggesting that he's not up to the task. You talk to people in Britain, they say the same thing. Well, that's right. That's right, Joe. And that's how we won

in 2020. And a normal beats crazy as well. And if the Republican Party goes off the rails like it appears to be headed in that Republican primary, given all the MAGA physics, then I think Joe Biden's had a chance. But the one thing that he can't change, he can't get in a time machine. And 86 percent of American voters don't think anybody should be president over the age of 75. So that's where Republicans still have an advantage against Joe Biden. All right. Still ahead on Morning Joe, we'll continue that conversation. Also, while Russian troops focus their offensive in the eastern part of Ukraine, President Volodymyr Zelensky has a new objective, taking back Crimea. That's where NBC's Keir Simmons is this morning. We'll have

the latest on that and much more ahead on Morning Joe. Beautiful shot of the white house at just half past the hour here at 6 30 on the east coast the biden administration is reaching out personally to residents affected by the train derailment and toxic chemical spill along the ohioPennsylvania border. Teams from the Environmental Protection Agency, FEMA and the CDC knocked on doors of over 530 East Palestine households over the weekend. Officials are providing flyers with additional resources and conducting health surveys. EPA Administrator Michael Regan will also make his third visit to the town today. He's expected to announce a new community center where residents can meet with various agency staff members. Meanwhile, Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro says he's meeting with officials

from Norfolk Southern later this week. The Democrat says the rail operator refused to participate in the unified command in the early days of the crisis and did not provide enough information to federal officials. Clearly, they've been bad actors in this case, and they have a responsibility now to make it good for the good people of Pennsylvania, make it right, make sure that the air they breathe is safe, the water that they drink is safe, the farmland where their animals roam is safe

and where their crops are harvested are safe. They have a lot of work to do, and the cost will come out of their pocket. The federal government has made that very clear, and I'll make that clear as well. And then I think they have a responsibility going forward to make sure something like this never happens again. And I'll expect Norfolk Southern to be far more transparent with Pennsylvania if they bring these trains through our commonwealth in the future.

You know, it's so interesting, Willie, with Republicans trashing Joe Biden nonstop and constantly focused on Joe Biden. What they've done is they've deflected from Norfolk Southern. So people aren't talking about what Norfolk Southern's responsibility is all the time. Or the regulations that the Republicans stripped out, that Donald Trump stripped out. So they keep it on the Biden administration when, of course, we said whenever there were derailments, Trump never went to those derailments. But they keep talking about like Pete Buttigieg and how he looks in a hat so they can distract people from the fact that Norfolk Southern, who, you know, they've been supported by.

Right. They get the railroad out of people's mind. It's a bait and switch. It doesn't work. It's the railroad's fault. The EPA has been there on the ground from the beginning. It's not Pete Buttigieg. We've said on the show many times he went too late. But the EPA has been on the ground and said it's Norfolk Southern who's paying for all of this. You're going to pay for the cleanup. You're going to pay for any future damages and on and on and on. So that rail company is being held to account by

the Biden administration. Jen, whether or not President Biden goes, maybe he will go, maybe he won't go. We'll see. As Joe says, Donald Trump didn't go. And frankly, Elaine Chao, the transportation secretary, didn't go every time there was a train derailment. So this is obviously an awful tragedy there in that small town. But this has become more of a political fight and a cudgel for Republicans to use against the administration than it is a serious debate about who's responsible. Yeah. And it is, you know, it's hard for the minutes. I have been in these situations when I worked at the White House. It's hard. It's difficult for the administration because it's like, you know, the EPA administrator is the one that has the most to do here dealing with the toxic spill. Everyone assumes it's Pete Buttigieg's job because he's the transportation secretary

and this is a train wreck. So that is, you know, that is when you actually had the job of cleaning up and dealing with it as opposed to just pontificating about it. You know, it is like it's trickier to it's trickier to deal with. Trump has struck a chord with this, though, I have to say. You know, he was when he went to East Palestine last week, he was better than we had seen in other, you know, more recent times where all he does is complain about himself. And East Palestine, he was, you know, he was he was he was advocating on behalf of the people that were there, aggrieved on their behalf, not aggrieved on his own behalf. And I don't you know, that area of Ohio is a tough one.

But I think if for Democrats, but if the administration, you've got to go, you've got to, you know, Biden should show up at some point as well. Like you just there's not a lot of political payoff for that area, but there's a responsibility. And the rest of us want to see that the administration is doing everything they can. EPA Administrator Reagan going again today, his third time. So at this point, White House has not scheduled a presidential visit, but there's some conversations about potentially sending him or the vice president in the days ahead. So Mark McKinnon, obviously, this is really, this is a health crisis and a health story. And there's going to need to be systems put in place to track for years, if not decades,

this fallout from this. We all remember, of course, what happened after September 11th and the toxic fumes there. But there's also, of course, a political component to this. How much risk do you think this does pose to a sitting president? Well, I think it poses a risk, but I think it also poses a risk for Republicans and Donald Trump because the other story beyond health is regulation. I think a lot of people's eyes were like, boom, when they said, wait a minute, a train a mile long has maybe two engineers on it, people responsible for the train. I think a lot of people are realizing the extent to which there isn't any train safety right now in America. And this is just the latest example of it. And that's primarily due to deregulation on Republicans. Also, speaking of the hat thing with Pete Buttigieg, I asked McKinnon how he thought Buttigieg looked in the hat.

He's an authority on how men look in hats. He thought Pete Buttigieg looked fine in that hat. I think he's making hats great again. More of a helmet than a hat. Well, whatever. We're splitting our hairs. It was more of a helmet. OK, let's turn overseas now where Ukraine is reporting new casualty numbers coming out

of the decimated city of Bakhmut. The nation's defense minister posting on social media yesterday, Russian forces are using tactics of, quote, exhaustion and total destruction in that city. The minister added Ukraine believes Russia is losing between 600 and 1,000 soldiers per day. Bakhmut is just one of the cities in Ukraine's east experiencing heavy combat. Joining us from Crimea is NBC News chief international correspondent, Kir Simmons.

NBC News is the only Western news organization inside Crimea. Kir, what are you seeing there? Well, Willie, I'm standing inside Crimea right now. And behind me is the Kerch Bridge. We're going to give you a closer look at that now. This is the bridge that back in October was hit with an explosion that the Russians said was from Ukrainian special forces. And President Putin described as a terrorist attack. Last week, this bridge was fully reopened. But this bridge and we traveled across it, Willie, to get here to

Crimea. This bridge is also an illustration of why Mark Milley says that Crimea will be so difficult for Ukrainian forces to take, as President Zelensky has said he wants to do, because this bridge is one of two ways onto this peninsula. The other is a land bridge to the northwest of here. Now, when we came here to Crimea yesterday, we traveled about four hours across the peninsula to Sevastopol. And there we found another reason why Crimea will be a challenge for Ukrainian forces. We spoke to a number of people, all of them spoke in Russian, described themselves as Russian. One 73-year-old woman told us that if she was younger, she would fight. Another man in his 50s said, we aren't prepared to be slaves. So there

was a lot of propaganda in Sevastopol saying for President Putin, supporting Russia's so-called special military operation. But we did find a lot of opinion there that was supportive of Russia and opposed to what President Zelensky has said he wants to do, which is to take back Crimea. Another observation, important observation to note in Sevastopol was just how much military we saw there. Many soldiers and members of the Navy, President Putin's Black Sea Fleet is based in Sevastopol. So again, there is a lot of Russian military here, some estimates tens of thousands.

That, again, will be a challenge for the Ukrainians if they, as they say, they want to want to try to take back this territory. We then traveled to another town that was a home mostly for Crimean Tatars. And there we found a slightly different view where many people described themselves as frightened to speak out and saying that they don't want to see war. One woman telling us that, you know, mothers are crying, both Ukrainian and Russian. But here, just to underline something that you said earlier, you know, Vladimir Putin's argument has been for some time and Russian. But, Keir, just to underline something that you said earlier, you know, Vladimir Putin's argument has been for some time and others, Ben, that Crimea, the people in Crimea relate more to Russia than they do Ukraine. And is that what you're finding still in the middle of this war, that even though you have President Zelensky talking about wanting

to take back Crimea, that most people in Crimea relate more to Russia than they do a government in Kiev. A lot of the people that we spoke to, Joe, we've been here for 24 hours. A lot of people that we spoke to, one woman showed us her Russian passport. And that raises a question. I mean, there are all kinds of historical questions around that. This place has a unique history. But that, of course, raises a question and a concern, particularly for NATO. Would NATO weapons be used to take this place? And would there be civilian casualties? Would there be civilian casualties among the population that see themselves as Russian. Another very important point that we saw for ourselves here, Joe, is that Sevastopol, I mentioned that it is the Black Sea, the home of the Black Sea fleet. It has been since Soviet times and back to the times of the Russian Empire. And I think that underscores why President Putin considers this place to be so important to him. He's built a freeway from here in Kursh all the way to Sevastopol. It takes

about, as I mentioned, about four hours. That is an artery that then goes to the bridge behind me there into Russia, connecting that port to Russia, the Russian mainland, as the Moscow might describe it. And that's important to point out because one of the reasons why President Putin likely took the action that he did a year ago was because he wanted to defend and protect Sevastopol and his Black Sea fleet there. The irony is, of course, that by mounting that invasion, President Putin has made it more likely that the Ukrainians won't want the Black Sea fleet there because it would threaten their coastline. And that is an impossible to negotiate position, you might think, that would suggest that this conflict is likely to continue.

Great insight. NBC's Keir Simmons reporting exclusively from Crimea. Thank you very much for being on this morning. And John Heilman, as we move to and past the one-year anniversary, a lot of people talking about how this war could go on for quite some time. You know, it's fascinating. We hear often that that foreign policy doesn't have an impact on on presidential politics, on American politics. But we also we all saw Joe Biden's numbers drop after Afghanistan. So so so many people didn't like what happened there and blamed that on Joe Biden's numbers drop after Afghanistan. So so so many people didn't like what happened there and blamed that on Joe Biden. His numbers went under 50 percent for the first time. What's from from you all going around and from from things that you read and things that you've

been studying? What's your take on how this Ukraine war is impacting Joe Biden? Well, I think at the moment, Joe, I mean, look, one of the things when the big in the big quadrant box that that that that political consultants and strategists look at, you know, one of the key things and, you know, you got those like understands people like us and, you know, kind of issues boxes. But strong leader is always like the thing. One of the things you most want is to protect strength. And so at this stage, in kind of that amorphous sense, Biden, I think, gets some political benefit, not a huge amount with voters here at home, but some in the sense that reflects strength, constancy. And and he gets applauded for being kind of being we talked about this last week, a little bit being kind of the image of what a lot of a lot not hyper-partisan Americans want America to be the leader on the world stage. They see him leading on the world stage, and they think that's what

an American president should be doing, is leading. I think in the longer run, over the course of the next couple of years, we've seen many times that you can win a war and not get that much credit. George Herbert Walker Bush assembles a coalition of the Gulf in 1990. In 1991, has a 90% approval rating and gets beat by Bill Clinton in 1992. That's the best example where you can win a war and still lose the politics. And there's a lot of cases where, obviously, if the war goes south, if Vladimir Putin ends up, God forbid, owning Kiev 18 months from now, that's the kind of thing that Ron DeSantis and Donald Trump and whoever the Republican nominee, you know, could use to eviscerate Joe Biden with. It's like you spent all that time abroad and then you lost.

So it's a high stakes gambit. History, I think, will judge Joe Biden's work here kindly. And that may be the most important thing Joe Biden does in office if he helps the allies to repel Russian aggression in Ukraine. But the politics are tricky because the upside is not, except in that amorphous strong leader sense, the upside is not that tangible or great. And the downside can be really big. But I think Biden thinks right now he's doing what is the right thing to do right now for the sake of the cause of democracy and freedom around the world. And I don't think he's going to change no matter what the politics are. John Hellman, Jen Palmieri and Mark McKinnon,

thank you all for bringing the circus to town. We appreciate your being on this morning. And coming up, the new House Committee on China will hold its first major hearing today in prime time. We'll have a preview of what to expect. Plus, Congresswoman Barbara Lee has entered what is expected to be a crowded and expensive race for the U.S. Senate seat being vacated by Dianne Feinstein. The California Democrat will join us to discuss her bid. Morning Joe will be right back. It's just about 10 minutes before the top of the hour live look at Times Square for you this morning. Little rainy in New York City. TikTok will soon be banned from all U.S. government issued devices. That is according to White House guidance issued yesterday that federal agencies and those they contract with have 30 days to remove the app from official devices.

It comes after a bill passed last year requiring federal agencies to ditch the social media app. U.S. officials have raised concerns that the Chinese government could pressure TikTok's parent company to hand over information collected from users, which could be used for intelligence or disinformation purposes. A TikTok spokesperson said the company hopes Congress will explore solutions that won't have the effect of censoring the voices of millions of Americans. Willie. Pennsylvania Senator John Fetterman still is in the hospital, but on the path to recovery. That's according to his spokesperson, who says the senator is doing well and is, quote, visiting with staff and family daily. There's no word on when he'll be discharged, but his office says this will be a weeks long process. The 53 year old Democrat checked himself into Walter Reed Medical Center for clinical depression about two weeks ago. Fetterman had a stroke in May, you'll remember, just days before winning the Democratic

primary. Earlier this month, he was hospitalized again for lightheadedness, but doctors ruled out a second stroke. Shortly after that, a doctor suggested Fetterman be treated for depression. All right, we wish him well. Also, it is Election Day in Chicago. Voters are heading to the polls, nine candidates are on the ballot, all running as Democrats. If no candidate gets more than 50 percent of the total vote, the top two will face off in a runoff election on April 4th. And still ahead on Morning Joe, a look at the stories making front page headlines in newspapers across the country. Plus, one of our next guests makes the case for why Jimmy Carter was actually a very good foreign policy president. That's all ahead on Morning Joe. Welcome back to Morning Joe. It's a few minutes before the top of the hour.

Time now for a look at the morning papers. The Montgomery Advertiser leads with the Alabama Sheriffs Association, supporting a bill to penalize people who don't tell law enforcement if they're carrying a gun. The bill would make concealing a firearm from police a misdemeanor. Currently, the state's constitutional carry law requires people to disclose their gun information to police, but there are no consequences if they don't say anything. In South Carolina, the state has a front page feature on the latest developments in the Alec Murdoch trial. The disgraced county attorney is accused of killing his wife and son. Yesterday, a judge ruled to allow the jury to visit the scene of the crime. The defense argues this will help jurors understand how the

shootings happened. And finally, in D.C., The Washington Times highlights a survey that finds most recent college graduates are emotionally unprepared to survive in the workplace. A Boston nonprofit surveyed 1, thousand professionals age 22 to 28. More than half said they have sought help for anxiety, depression and other emotional problems. Parents rights advocates are blaming this on soft parenting, falling academic standards, which they say accelerated when school closed during the pandemic. Fascinating. We should dig deeper into that.