Morning Joe - Morning Joe 3/4/24

Episode Date: March 4, 2024

Trump confuses Biden for Obama in gaffe-filled weekend

We will restore peace through strength. Get that war settled. It's a bad war. And Putin, you know, has so little respect for Obama that he's starting to throw around the nuclear war. You heard that nuclear. Donald Trump over the weekend once again thinking he's running against Barack Obama. And when Trump wasn't confusing Biden with Obama. It's really sad. He apparently thought Biden with Obama. It's really sad.

He apparently thought he was Obama. It really is sad. Credit for legislation that was signed by his predecessor. For our great veterans, we passed VA accountability and VA choice. That was a big deal. I have no greater honor than serving as your president and commander in chief. And I have no greater privilege than the chance to help make sure that our country keeps the promises that we've made to everybody who signs up to serve. With that, I am going to sign this bill.

Thank you very much, everybody. Now watch me sign this bill. Good morning. So, a weekend. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. What a weekend. And the slurring. Seriously. I mean, I have to apologize to Fat Elvis in 77 because Fat Elvis never slurred his words like Donald Trump did this weekend. And he looked, his face was contorted and And something was going on. It's very weird. But again, though, it's Joe Biden who, you know, falls off his bike and whatever.

It's really a bizarre, bizarre thing. But they'll pretend. They'll pretend on other networks that it doesn't exist. And Trump people will pretend it doesn't exist. And then we'll have an election. And by the time the election comes, everybody will know it exists and everybody will know who actually has more of a problem. But here you had Jonathan Lemire.

I'm not really good at politics. That's true. You know, don't keep up with the news. You don't have to in this job. So help me out. I saw that that V.A. bill was signed in 2014. I was just looking at the clip there. Was Donald Trump was Donald Trump president in 2014 or who was president in 2014? I've got the trusty almanac here. And it says that in 2014. No, it was not Donald Trump. It was actually Barack Obama was president. Oh, OK. So he just again, his mind short circuited there. Also, he once again,

he says that Barack Obama is president of the United States right now. I've been following Liverpool. It's been exciting. I haven't been watching a lot of news lately. Great NFL season wrapped up as well. I mean, spring training is a fun. I don't have time for this. So who's president right now?

Is Barack Obama president right now? First of all, Liverpool, 90th plus 9th minute win. That was tremendous. I'm checking again here. Come on. Checking again here in the almanac. No. So Barack Obama was president in 2014, but he stopped being president in 2016. So no, he is not currently the occupant. And he stopped running being president in 2016. Right. Because as Donald Trump has said, a campaign event after campaign event after campaign event, that he beat Barack Obama in 2016, right?

So is that why Barack Obama is no longer president? Because as Donald Trump tells his crowds all the time, he beat Barack Obama in 2016. I've got a thumb a little further into the almanac for this one a little deeper research but no no he didn't um barack obama was term limited out he actually beat uh don trump beat hillary clinton in 2016 barack obama oh that's right so is that why he's but he wants that matchup this is like this is like ollie frazier three he wants he wants that matchup. This is like this is like Ali Frazier three. He wants he wants that third matchup. He wants to thrill him. So is that why he's running against him? Well, he said he beat him in 20 and then said he's running against him again in 24.

Right. What's all Max say? Yeah, the almanac here. So, first of all, Obama constitutionally prohibited from running against or no, that's Almanac say? Yeah, the Almanac here. So first of all, Obama constitutionally prohibited from running again. So no, that's, so it's not Obama. In fact, it was Joe Biden who beat Donald Trump in 2020. And that looks like we'll get that rematch round two this time around in 2024. And this was a weekend of pure meltdowns for Donald Trump, including one where he loses the ability to speak the English language. And I've seen the clip about a dozen times now. And I burst out laughing each and every time.

Well, it is. Yeah, he it's I think it's not good. Yeah, I'm not good. And I haven't laughed because there's at one point he he says Saudi Arabia, Russia, and he looks off into the distance and his face is like contorted and twisted. And it's like he's really struggling. Yeah. You know what I'm talking about? He's really struggling up there to get his thoughts together. So I thought he does that on Saturday night all week in The New York Times front page. Joe Biden, too. Oh, people think Joe Biden's too old. I mean, you know, let's just let's we're

going to talk about that story. I just have to say off the top, if you ask the question, is Joe Biden too old? That's like asking all the people that watch this show. They're a lot. Does Joe Scarborough talk too much? Oh, yeah. Eighty five percent. Ninety percent would say, yes, he talks too much. And if you ask the question. Would Morning Joe be better without Joe Scarborough on it? Hold on. Hold on. About 85 percent. Ninety percent would say yes. Well, yes, of course it would be right. And yet, in the words of the great Bob Seger, and still here we are, both of us lonely. My point, my point, Jim Palmieri is, Jim Palmieri is here today.

My point is this. The question is asked, is Joe Biden Paul Mary's here today. My point is this, the question is asked, is Joe Biden, the question answers itself. If you ask Joe Biden, am I too old? They go, yeah, I'm too old. In fact, he has said that, man, I'm just, I'm old, right? Yeah, he wants to be younger. But he's still, but he'd love to be younger and I'd love to talk less.

As we can tell in the first seven minutes of this show, it ain't gonna happen. Neither one's gonna happen. This is the choice Americans have. And this is a choice that Americans will be glad they have in the fall when Democrats return to Joe Biden and democracy is saved for another four years.

I find the bed wedding that goes along with these New York Times, Sienna polls every three months, every three months. I just find it ridiculous. I find especially when Donald Trump spent the weekend speaking incoherently in a way in ways that should disturb if they could be disturbed by anything which we know they can't because they're not disturbed by a guy saying he's going to be a dictator from day one not disturbed by a guy who says he's going to go after and destroy his political opponents and throw them in jail you know not not not concerned about the fact that he said he's going to get sealed team six to assassinate his prisoner, his his political opponents.

And he can't be held liable or guilty for that. A guy who a judge says raped a woman, lied about it, defamed her like they're never going to be like Charlottesville. Good people on both sides. COVID. COVID. Literally killing people by not telling them about the pandemic. Go on and on and on. If these people are going to be disturbed by anything, they would have been disturbed by it a long time ago.

That said, and Jen, God help me. You know this. If I have a fault, it's that I care too much. I care too much. If I have a fault, I care too much. And for my Republican brothers and sisters, I have been here for the past seven years trying to save them from themselves. But they insist not only putting their hand on the hot stove, but laying their face down gently on the hot stove, only to find out they're going to get burned again. Of this, I have no doubt. I think my irritation this weekend came with a news media that was talking about a guy who's very cogent, a guy who's doing a very good job managing all that he is

managing across the world and passing a record amount of bipartisan legislation and focusing on him saying, oh, he's too old. Well, they continue to ignore Donald Trump completely losing his mind, blanking out on stage. So there's a lot to talk about with the with the poll and the and the freak out. But, you know, the biggest takeaway for me is the is how is how Trump reacted this weekend, which I think is a reaction to Biden taking him on directly at the border. You know, it's like if there's one thing that comes out that New York Times poll that's productive, it is it is that we have attention deficit disorder when it comes to paying attention to what Joe Biden is doing and what his positions are. And I

think because Trump took the bait, Biden went to the border, Trump took the bait, he went to the border, too. That means Joe Biden finally broke through on the border and what he's trying to do because we paid attention to both of them. And then, you know, and by the way, it matters because now 63 percent, there was one poll that showed 63 percent of people think that House Republicans are to blame for stopping the bipartisan border bill. And they did it because they wanted to help Donald Trump. And then Trump freaks out and he has, you know, he has three days of the kind of display that we, you know, that we saw over the weekend. And so I think a way for Biden to break through is to find that direct confrontation.

Look at that guy. He's not well. I'm sorry, Jen. That guy. I'm serious. That guy is not well. Let's bring in the president of the National Action Network and host of MSNBC Politics Nation, Reverend Al Sharpton. We are so excited, Rev, to talk about Selma this weekend. Also have with us MSNBC contributor and author of the book, How the Right Lost Its Mind, Charlie Sykes. Speaking of the right losing the Trump right, losing their mind, Donald Trump was on the campaign trail this weekend in North Carolina and Virginia, and the guy just kept getting confused. Look at this series of clips.

In Venezuela, did you just see Maduro? Venezuela, it's unbelievable. We're getting rid of the Romneys of the world. We want to get Romneys and those out. But they know that we are the only ones who can stop them. We're the only ones. This is the greatest movement in the history of our country, maybe in the history of any country, even Argentina. They went MAGA. You know, Argentina, great guy. He's a big Trump guy.

He loves Trump. I love him because he loves Trump. When he called, I took his call. Anybody that loves me, I like them. I said, Abdul, he's still there. He's the head of the Taliban. He said, you're killing our soldiers. Don't do it anymore because terror will rain down on you. And he called you. Yes, yes, your highness. You call me your highness, which is interesting. We are a nation that just recently heard that Saudi Arabia and Russia will repeat.

I don't even know what what what happened. What happened there? Charlie Sykes, we see it more and more. He he gets in the middle of of of sentences. He's reading teleprompters and his mind still blanks out. He Nikki Haley for Nancy Pelosi, Barack Obama for Joe Biden. And it's it's just so pathetic and sad. They're going, oh, he's doing it on purpose. No, he's not doing it on purpose. He's not doing any of this stuff on purpose. And so you take the fact that he is his mind blanks out and he looks lost. It actually looks like a sad scene to me to see somebody up on stage and blanking out and getting lost. But then you have a guy. First of all, he thinks the person who runs the South

American country's name is Argentina. Argentina. Great guy. And and thank you for saying get rid of the Romneys and the Republican Party. That is torn out of Kerry Lake's book of loserdom. That's where I lead you. But but also, again, against all this madness and unfortunately, an old man who is who is losing his ability to communicate. He's he's praising the Taliban leader for calling him your highness. I mean, tell us, wrap up that speech for us. How do you? Well, what fresh hell. Unfortunately, I'm not a psychiatrist here. You know, what's on display is that, OK, Joe Biden is old, but the other guy is deranged,

demented and pathetic, as you point out, not to mention dangerous. And this is on display. And, you know, as we're sitting here talking about this, we're less than 48 hours away from that guy clinching the Republican presidential nomination. You know, the Republicans have one last off frame and they're not going to take it. They look at this guy and this is the extraordinary thing is that Republicans look at him and I don't have to repeat all the things you don't mean to have been found liable for for rape. He's facing 91 felony charges. You know,

you have these kinds of, you know, this this gaseous malice that you get from these gaffe-filled speeches. And they're looking at him thinking, yeah, we'd like four more years of that. So, you know, if there's any upside here is that Joe Biden will be able to say, yeah, I'm old. I'm very stiff when I walk. But this guy is also old and he's crazy and he's dangerous and he is incoherent. He needs to make that point. The other maybe upside is that now that there's no way of denying the fact that it's going to be Donald Trump again, it'll focus the mind. And I agree with you, Joe, that I think Democrats need to stop the bedwetting, but they need to get out of the bed and they need to freak out a little bit because the reality is maybe this is what it will take for them to realize this guy could become president of the United States.

This could actually happen, you know, and maybe we ought to treat that threat, you know, the way it ought to be treated. If it's an existential threat, let's start acting like it's an existential threat. So stop the bedwetting. But maybe a little bit of freak out wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. Well, maybe it'll wake a lot of Democrats up. I will say, though, you know, all this idea, you brought up the things, a judge determines that Donald Trump raped a woman. To me.

Evangelicals are cool with that. You know, it used to be like Bill Clinton. Oh, wait, did he do something with his intern or not? Character matters in the White House. He must be driven to the sea. I mean, these same evangelicals. I was there. I was hearing it every day as a congressman, every day. Republicans every day. I republicans every day you know man he doesn't have the morals bill clinton doesn't have the morals to be how dare us how you know like mr bible in the house what does he think about president trump grabbing women by their genitals or having sex with a porn star while he was married to his wife who was about to have a baby and then paying her off and apparently there are more that michael cohen took care of but okay go on i'm

sorry i digress but those things just should be looked at they ignore those things because let's just face it they're raging hypocrites when it comes to this bill clinton bad donald trump raped Donald Trump raped a woman, says a judge. A jury of his peers said he sexually assaulted and defamed a woman. A grand jury after grand jury after grand jury. Again, of his peers, not the deep state. A grand jury of voters, citizens have found him like found enough evidence to indict him on 91 counts. I mean, all all over all over the country, 91 counts. And yet and yet, Mika, everybody's fine with it. I mean, in the extreme MAGA world. And again, I think most most pathetically. And Pete Weiner's been writing about this evangelicals that were just so aghast.

Just shocked by Bill Clinton's behavior. Now, many of them, they basically said this guy's their savior. I mean, they have so abandoned the faith that they claim they had when Bill Clinton was president. They were so shocked that some of them, I'm talking about some of them, have so abandoned their faith that they are now idolizing Donald Trump. And they will tell you that. It's sad and pathetic. Well, you know, I think to these points that you're talking about, as opposed to the way we came into the show, you're talking about some of his weaknesses on stage.

People could react and say, oh, you know, that's that's that's not fair. That's just being mean. But you know what? There's there's legitimate records to look at here. As an American voter today, they have two candidates who have both been president. Reverend Al, you can look at their presidencies. Now, Donald Trump tries to lie about his presidency. So you really have to go and look at sources that you can trust.

And you have to look at these two presidencies or look at the two presidents at the border at the same time and listen to the speeches and base your decision on that. What do you really want to go back to? Yeah. And, you know, it's so funny. I mean, I had one person call me and we talked about the differences in the border. They said, yeah, but did you see how he walked at the border? I said, did you wait? You are looking you're giving him style points on how he walked instead of what they said. Do I need to remind you that one of the greatest presidents in the history of America was in a wheelchair and he did okay. He gave us the New Deal and saved the country from, along with our allies, he saved us from Hitler. But I think that when you look at the real difference between Donald Trump

and Joe Biden's walk is that Joe Biden has not had to do a perk walk in courtrooms as Donald Trump is doing. But when you look at the fact, people keep saying Joe Biden is too old. Was he too old to get the infrastructure bill passed? Was he too old to get the inflation reduction bill passed? Was he too old to bring us out of the heights of a pandemic and you're up against a guy that denied the pandemic was coming and then told us to take bleach and then put his name on a check that Nancy Pelosi got through Congress, and now he's incoherent even to himself. He can't even finish a sentence going off in Babel land. I mean, it is absolutely telling when we see people that try to defend what is indefensible. And as you say, Joe, at the top of my list are the evangelicals who brought down the wrath of God on Bill Clinton, but has excused Donald Trump for all kinds of things that they preach is sinful. It shows more of their hypocrisy than a babbling old man who's on his way to court. First on President Biden, his advisors know that age is

an issue. They see these polls. They push back against them. They believe a lot of this was litigated in 2020, and they feel like they will be able to highlight this issue again. And they don't think it will be that big of a deal for voters once we get to the stretch run of this election, and it's a binary choice. They also see this Thursday State of the Union as a real opportunity to prove President Biden's vitality. Let's remember, last year's State of the Union, he crushed it. He had that spontaneous moment shouting back and forth with MTG and others in the back where he was able to box in the Republicans on a campaign promise. And White House aides have shown us polling that suggests that Americans' concerns about President Biden's age went down after that strong State of the Union showing. They think that will happen again. And Joe Amico, let's remember also about Donald Trump.

Jen mentioned how it seemed like the pressure is building on him. He was melting down as the weekend was going on. Two other reasons for that. One is he lost. Yes, it was only the Washington, D.C. primary, but he took a defeat. We have seen him in other states not put up the numbers his team would have liked. Haley putting up a bigger share of the vote than you'd expect when Trump is running as an incumbent. Well, this incumbent just lost a primary. And secondly, and perhaps most importantly, three weeks from today,

three weeks from today, a Donald Trump criminal trial starts. That is uncharted territory for any presidential candidate that is clearly weighing on this one. And we and we simply do not know how that will impact him going forward. Well, let me also say, and Meek and I have known him for a long time, understand of all the things that are weighing on him is the crushing realization that he may have to start selling some of his real estate because he doesn't have the money to pay the bond. And that is what's crushing him the most. I want to get back to this, though. I know we live in an era of BS thrown against the wall by fascists and wannabe fascists. I've been talking, though, about gravity, gravity returning. And it has returned in the courtroom time and time again.

People that are getting hammered for the lies that they tell for the lot, the lot, the lives they've ruined, whether it's Rudy Giuliani in Georgia lying about that lied about Sandy Hook parents, adding just immeasurable pain to them. He got hammered. Donald Trump lying about a woman that a judge says he raped. Gravity returns. 83.3 million. I'm going to tell you, Jen, there's another place where gravity is going to return. And we started to see it. You couldn't tell because as you lifted as as we all lifted our soggy papers this weekend, the Democrats across Washington, D.C. had wet upon. Oh, come on. You could you could be mistaken for not seeing in the walls. Yes, exactly. In the wall. There's an image. Enjoy your oatmeal. You could be mistaken for not reading the line in The Wall Street Journal in their poll that said, well, Biden's still not getting the credit he deserves for the economy.

It's starting to move that direction. People are starting to say, oh, wait a second, this is a pretty good economy. And I want to read this for you from the Wall Street Journal yesterday. Unemployment's been below 4% for two years, the longest stretch since the 1960s. Inflation now down to 3.1%. A new Wall Street Journal poll shows views of the economy are moving to be more in line with those measures of economic strength. It's February. It's Feb-u-ary. Spring training. The World Series is in the fall, the election

in the fall. And as the economy continues to improve, Jen, we are seeing Americans waking up saying, wait, Hey, things are pretty good. Consumer confidence going up. Hey, wait, things are pretty good. It's starting to move in that direction. As Mika likes to tell women about their careers, there is a long, long runway ahead before this campaign is over. So the presidential approval ratings are usually a lagging indicator of people feeling better about the country. The economic numbers and people's confidence in that are going up. I have noticed, even though the president's approval ratings are low relative to other presidents, we are living in a different

time period. Look at look at approval ratings are long across the globe. And you see Joe Biden is doing pretty well. But I have noticed that they are that they are starting to tick up. And then, of course, Thursday night, the State of the Union, that is the opportunity to to lay out to, you know, for the president to lay out what will probably be a big audience. You know, linear television doesn't get big audiences anymore except for Sunday night football, Super Bowls and States of the Union. And so and way too early and way too. And well, yeah, yeah, obviously. I mean, as you know, I'm a big fan. But then but they get that's that's what he'll be able to lay out in context what he you know what he has accomplished. Sort of the journey that we've been on from, you know, taking over at the time of covid to now explain why inflation was as high as it was, what they did to bring it back down. And then, of course, what he'll do in a second term. But I feel like that's the real starting gun for him making the

arguments of what he's accomplished relative to the November election. And by the way, as far as ratings juggernauts, Mika, we know this of the 100 top shows last year, half of them were NFL games. Half of them were Reverend Al's Politics Nation. I mean, it's just it's just massive. Charlie Sykes, Charlie Sykes, let me end with you. I must admit, this is all a bit foreign for me when Republicans would my old Republican Party back before they Trump's party liked losing, owning the libs and losing. But we Republicans used to when we saw polls that didn't go our way, we go, OK, let's get how are we going to destroy them? Let's go. There was no bedwetting. I'm just

telling you, it was a cultural thing. We would get in a room, say these polls suck. We're not working hard enough. We're not getting our message out there. We have to work harder. And we're going, you know, I had somebody tell me once I wasn't going to win. I go, they said, the voters don't want you, Joe. I said, I don't care if the voters want me or not. They have no choice. I am going to will myself to victory. And everybody kind of slowly backed away. But I promise that was the attitude. Republicans used to have it. They don't have it now. Democrats bed wet in Washington, D.C.

What's your advice to the Democratic Party with democracy? I will say it on the line. Shine as bright a spotlight as you possibly can on this other guy. Ultimately, if this is a referendum on whether we want Donald Trump back in the White House, I think the Democrats are going to be in a stronger position. But you have to highlight all of this. You can't get distracted. And this is part of the problem, I think, of the way we cover these races. And I think it's Jay Rosen who made the point that the news media is addicted to novelty. You know, what is new as opposed to what are the stakes here? And part of the problem is, you know, Donald Trump goes out and says, you know, a series of, you know, racist, demented, dangerous things.

And people go, well, hey, yeah, same old, same old. You know, it's not like it's a new story. So we have to begin focusing more on the stakes, make it as dramatic as possible. And speaking of polls, I think it's really interesting. Look, Nikki Haley is not going to win tomorrow, but she has exposed some of the vulnerabilities of Donald Trump, including the number of disaffected Republicans that might vote for Nikki Haley but won't vote for Donald Trump. Now, how is Donald Trump reacting over the weekend? Basically saying we're 100 percent MAGA now. There's no room in this party for moderates like Mitt Romney.

So there's no indication that the Republicans or Donald Trump is doing anything to bring back disaffected Republicans or even to appeal to swing voters. So you have Nikki Haley out there pleading with other Republicans back away from the unhinged chaos. Right. Let's have a return to normalcy. I think what we're going to see tomorrow is that both Donald Trump and the Republican electorate is not interested in returning to normal. In fact, they like the chaos. They had a chance to end the drama. Instead, I think they're going to double down on the chaos. And let's see how that plays out for the rest of the year. Charlie Sykes, thank you very much.

And still ahead on Morning Joe, we'll have an update on two of Donald Trump's criminal cases. Former litigator Lisa Rubin will join us to break down the new developments. Plus, Vice President Kamala Harris calls for an immediate ceasefire in Gaza. What that could mean for the administration's approach to the ongoing war. You're watching Morning Joe. We'll be right back. If you look at the early states, he may have won them, yes, but he didn't get 40% of the vote. That's no small number. In Michigan, he campaigned there for eight years. I campaigned there for two days and we got 30%

of the vote. President Biden visited the southern border on Thursday and was horrified to discover it is being swarmed by criminals and rapists. That's right. Both Biden and Trump coincidentally visited the border on the same day, which sounds like the setup for the weirdest rom-com of all time. My favorite part of the visit was when Trump, who looks good behind bars, by the way, finally came face to face with his sworn enemies, the migrants, and he had a pretty harsh message for them. Take a look. They like Trump. Can you believe it? No, I can you believe it no i can't believe it the migrants don't like you they just walked a thousand miles to get to edge of this river and they're probably thinking is that weirdo in a trump costume waving us into the country can you wow they were on fire sat night, but great material to work with.

Let's get an update on Donald Trump's criminal cases. Joining us now, former litigator and MSNBC legal correspondent Lisa Rubin. We'll start with the classified documents hearing on Friday. What was the bottom line out of it? Bottom line we got out of it was there was no bottom line, which is we still don't have a trial date in that case. Judge Cannon has acknowledged that May 20th, which was her prior trial date, is no longer feasible. But we ended that hearing without a clear understanding from Judge Cannon what trial date she's going to set. If any, she was begged by the Trump lawyers really not to set a trial date until after the election due to a number of different factors,

including the fact that he has also moved to dismiss that case on presidential immunity grounds. OK, and then we'll go to Fulton County where we're waiting word on whether Fannie Willis can continue. And the question here is twofold. Are they winning just by the delay that's created? And how do you think what do you think the outcome of the Fannie Willis issue will be? Well, first of all, are they winning just by creating a delay? Trump always wins when he creates delay. And as you know, Mika, throughout his criminal cases, he has succeeded in creating quite a bit of delay, except here in New York, where his trial will begin later this month. In terms of the ultimate outcome, I think it's a

little bit hard to say because the legal standard that should govern whether or not there's a conflict of interest that would disqualify Fannie Willis is somewhat up in the air. There are folks that will say, as the state did, that there's only a conflict of interest, not only if there's a financial relationship, but one that disadvantaged the defendants. And here, because it wasn't the sort of financial relationship where, for example, it was contingent on winning the case, it's really hard to see how the defendants themselves were hurt by the relationship between Willis and Wade. But Steve Sado, on the other hand, made a fairly convincing case that the ethics that Bonnie Willis and Nathan Wade behaved with or without created such an appearance of impropriety that it would be a travesty of

justice not to disqualify her. I tend to think she will not be disqualified in the end, but the damage to her reputation and that of me and the cloud over them in terms of whether or not they were truthful with the court will linger for some time to come. And finally, we're expecting possibly, it seems probably, a decision by the Supreme Court on whether Donald Trump can remain on the ballot. There are some other states that are looking at this as well, but the bottom line is it probably has to come today. What do you think? I think it absolutely should come today.

After all, tomorrow is Super Tuesday, and Colorado is one of the Super Tuesday states. The status quo is that Donald Trump remains on the ballot. If the Supreme Court were going to uphold Colorado, you would think they would have done so one day, more than one day before the primary election. All right. MSNBC legal correspondent Lisa Rubin, thank you for keeping track of all of that for us. Now to the U.S. making its first airdrops of humanitarian aid into Gaza in a combined effort with the Royal Jordanian Air Force. The U.S. Air Force dropped over 38,000 meals on Saturday afternoon. The

packages were stacked on pallets for central Gaza, where thousands of people are starving. U.S. officials say they are looking into new ways to send more aid into Gaza, including by sea. It's really it's such a nightmare right now. 15 aid trucks were supposed to get to north northern Gaza, where the situation is right now so extraordinarily bleak. And they were stopped. They were swarmed. All the food was taken off before they were able to get to northern Gaza by people, obviously, in southern Gaza who are suffering and struggling, too. The airdrops are helpful, but they can't move as much as the convoys can move in. Now they're talking about coming in from the north,

desperately needed aid. But this is going to be difficult because there are so many people that are starving, so many people that want to feed their families that these aid trucks often get stopped and overrun by swarming crowds. These are the people who have survived. I mean, well over 30,000 people have been killed. Infrastructure has been ruined. It is a disaster of epic proportions that at this point is avoidable. They absolutely could stop what they're doing. Negotiators believe, by the way,

Hamas and Israel are making slow progress, saying a ceasefire and a hostage release deal could be reached before the Muslim holy month of Ramadan. An Israeli and U.S. official tell the Wall Street Journal Israel has agreed to the outlines of a deal that includes a six-week truce. But officials say Hamas has yet to provide answers on two key sticking points, which Palestinian prisoners the group wants freed and how many for each hostage released. Because of that, Israel has not sent a senior delegation to Cairo for negotiations. Members of Hamas, however, are there. Vice President Kamala Harris is set to meet with a member of Israel's war cabinet today at the White House. This just one day after Harris called for an immediate ceasefire in the war in Gaza.

Here she is speaking yesterday in Selma, Alabama. People in Gaza are starving. The conditions are inhumane. And our common humanity compels us to act. The Israeli government must do more to significantly increase the flow of aid. No excuses. They must open new border crossings. They must not impose any unnecessary restrictions on the delivery of aid. They must ensure humanitarian

personnel, sites, and convoys are not targeted. And they must work to restore basic services and promote order in Gaza so more food, water, and fuel can reach those in need. I will repeat, the threat of Hamas poses to the people of Israel must be eliminated. And given the immense scale of suffering in Gaza, there must be an immediate ceasefire for at least the next six weeks, which is what is currently on the table. Hamas claims it wants a ceasefire. Well, there is a deal on the table. And as we have said, Hamas needs to agree to that deal. Let's get a ceasefire.

Let's reunite the hostages with their families. And let's provide immediate relief to the people of Gaza. Joining us now is columnist and associate editor for The Washington Post, David Ignatius. His latest piece is entitled Food Convoy Carnage Distills What's Gone Terribly Wrong in Gaza. You know, David, thank you for being with us. You know, David, what Kamala Harris said publicly, Joe Biden, Tony Blinken, other officials inside the Biden administration have been urging Israel to do now for weeks and weeks and weeks. And there had been, as you know, quite a debate inside the White House about when was he going to break publicly with Netanyahu. That wasn't a break with Netanyahu, but the administration finally said publicly what it had been saying privately all along.

The conditions in Gaza are unacceptable. You have to provide relief. Talk about that and talk about just how dire the situation is in Gaza. So, Joe, first to the situation in this months of terrible war. I don't know that we saw an image more poignant than the drone footage of hundreds and hundreds of Palestinians in the pre-dawn on Thursday morning scrambling desperately after this convoy of aid trucks, climbing on the trucks, climbing over each other. It appears that in the panic, pre-dawn time, that there was a stampede of people, that they were crushed under the truck's wheels, that some Israeli troops opened fire. It's a scene, I likened it sadly to a chapter in Lord of the Flies come to life where you see when people are reduced

to this raw struggle for survival, what happens. So this is indicative, the Biden administration believes, of Israel's lack of a clear plan. It simply does not have a way of providing order and security in the areas that it has cleared of Hamas fighters in northern Gaza. The people who are maintaining order, and I put that in quotation marks, are criminal gangs. They're organized criminals looting the food. They intimidate convoy truck drivers who are poised to bring more food. So that led to, I think, an unusual decision by the administration to intervene more directly. That's what the airdrops are about. You can't get convoys in safely.

We're going to take over. We're going to begin dropping by air. They're going to build a port off Gaza. They're contracting now with people in Cyprus to bring in docks. The Gazan waters are very shallow. They're going to figure out a way to have long floating docks and bring aid in that way. They're going to figure out ways to do convoys that are more secure. The administration is fed up with the situation. Second really important thing that's happening is the visit today in Washington of Israeli War Cabinet member Benny Gantz, former Army Chief of Staff. He's going to meet with Kamala Harris. He's going to meet with Jake

Sullivan. But the importance of this visit is Bibi Netanyahu, the Israeli prime minister, did not want him to come. Bibi Netanyahu has still not been received in the White House. And here comes Benny Gantz, his chief rival, who's going to be received, who's going to have discussions with administration officials. And I see this as the beginning of a process that may see a splintering of the Israeli war cabinet. I think the prospect of elections in Israel that would probably displace Netanyahu is increasing. In the polls now, Gantz, who will meet with Kamala Harris today, is far ahead of Netanyahu. If the race were held tomorrow, Gantz would win it. So keep your eyes on that. And then the political repercussions back in Israel. But basically,

we're in a moment where the U.S. is going to play a much more significant role, both on the ground with aid and in these meetings with people like Gantz. David, please weigh in for us on two things. The fact that the U.S. has had to resort to these airlifts for the supplies, doesn't that also point to a weakness, an inability to push Netanyahu to provide more safety, to get better, more supplies in via the ground? And then secondly, speak to us about the urgency that the U.S. has, and it was a bit on display from the vice president over the weekend,

to get a ceasefire placed before Ramadan, the Muslim holy month, just about a week away. So, Jonathan, the convoy situation was going pretty well in January. There were more than 200 trucks a day that were coming in. And then things got tangled in part because the convoys were being protected by police from Gaza who were affiliated with Hamas. And Israel began targeting them. And the police said, we want guarantees we won't be shot at. And they didn't get those guarantees. So suddenly you had no protection for the convoys. Some of the openings,

the crossing at Karim Shalom into Gaza was closed. So suddenly there was a scarcity of food, and that, I think, has exacerbated the problem. In terms of what's coming up. The U.S. believes that if this ceasefire can be achieved in the next week, Ramadan starts in about seven days from now, that it will begin a process of de-escalation. So the ceasefire will last for six weeks initially. Forty Israeli hostages, wounded, sick, elderly women will be released. And then the hope is that at the end of that six weeks, there's still a lot of male hostages being held by Hamas, that there'll be another pause of additional time, another six weeks maybe, and that you'll begin to get conditions where you could really ratchet this conflict down. That's the hope. But first, they've got to get this initial agreement. That's what they're trying so hard to get conditions where you could really ratchet this conflict down. That's the hope.

But first, they've got to get this initial agreement. That's what they're trying so hard to get today. And I wonder where the difficulty lies for the most part, David, to Jonathan's point. And you also mentioned Israel's lack of a clear plan, whether it's hostage negotiations or getting to the table in Cairo or trying to actually get to a ceasefire. My question to you is, does Israel have the will? And specifically, does Benjamin Netanyahu have the will? Does he want a ceasefire? I think Israel is ready for the ceasefire. The U.S. has put a lot of pressure. I think the holdup right now is Hamas. Hamas had made demands for a corresponding release of Israeli prisoners that was,

in Israel's view, outlandish, asking for thousands in exchange for 40 hostages that are being released. I'm told that that's been worked out, but I have to be honest, at this point, I have to wait until the first hostage is released. On the larger issue, Mika, do they have a plan to bring this to a satisfactory end? The answer is no. Increasingly, officials of the administration, when you press them, say we don't see a plan. The Israelis have talked about storming Rafah, this large city at the southernmost edge of Gaza. And U.S. officials say they simply don't have a way to get

the more than one million refugees who went there out to safety before they conduct this military operation. That's the kind of thing that scares U.S. officials and makes them worry that Netanyahu for all his talk about ending the war simply doesn't have a plan yet. Well, and the humanitarian situation is such a condition right now. The meltdown is so complete. I mean, you look at the pictures coming out, you look at the reporting coming out, another full-scale attack with famine on the horizon. Just not acceptable. It's really not acceptable, and it shouldn't be acceptable to Israelis who obviously want to see Hamas destroyed. Most of us, at least, I certainly do. I think everybody around the table wants to see Hamas destroyed. But we also are seeing Israel's reputation around the

world. But also, I think Israelis should be more concerned at home with younger Americans who are going to be making policy for the next 20, 30, 40 years, turning, I would just, let me say, it's viciously against Israel. It's just, it is, it is, it is, it is going to cause so many problems, David. Talk about that. I also want to, you know, I want you to underline what you said before, though, that, that we look and the world looks at Gaza and say, well, why can't you just drive trucks in there? Come on, help the people. Why can't you get them in there? And we need to do that. We need to airdrop. We need to do whatever it takes. But there are even complications to that. Criminal gangs running the place right now, intimidating fathers, mothers who want to get food and get it to their kids.

Like we see in so many corrupt places, the aid often gets to the warlords, usually gets to the gangs. You now have Hamas in the middle of this as well. Hamas doesn't want the United States of America helping a young mother or a young father with food. I mean, it is extraordinarily complicated. And yet, of course, it has to be done. So, Joe, I've written that Israel unintentionally is creating a version of Somalia on its borders. What we're seeing is when you knock over existing structures of security. And, you know, I think after October 7, Israel was right to go after Hamas. Hamas was a terrorist adversary, and Hamas had been making miserable, life miserable for people in Gaza for a decade. So I think

that assault was just. The problem is that they didn't have a plan for what you put in to fill the vacuum after you've knocked over the existing authority. That's what we're watching now. On this question of how future generations, our children, young voters in upcoming Democratic Party elections are going to view Israel, I think that's something that Israelis do need to think about more. You know, our generation grew up with a vision of Israel as this proud country fighting off aggressors. There's a very different view now. I hope when Gantz comes to Washington,

he'll evoke the Israel that we remember as fighting democracy that also is trying to move toward peace. That's his that's his job when he meets today with Kamala Harris and Jake Sullivan. Yeah. And, you know, Mika, it is it is so personal to what are the defining moments of somebody's childhood, young adulthood, what they see. I can tell you the first time I ever heard the word Palestinian was when I was watching the 72 Munich Olympics. And it was a Palestinian terrorist organization that went in and killed Olympic athletes. That was defining for me as a young person watching. Oh, the Palestinians.

Oh, they're the terrorists. That was a defining moment for me. And then learning about how Israel had been attacked time and time and time again by all of its Arab neighbors. Right. Well, today, these are the defining images that young Americans are going to see. And of course, yes, they saw the horror and the hell of October the 7th, something that I wish would have more resonance with more young people than it does. I'm quite surprised that it hasn't. But it's these images of unspeakable suffering in Gaza that is going to define so many people's views, not only of of of Gazans, but also of Israelis. There is there is a cost to continued war. There is a cost of famine.

There is a cost to extreme human suffering. And it is a cost that unless things change very quickly, Israel will pay the consequences for in America and across the world for a very long time to come. I'm not saying what ought to be. I'm saying what is. The Washington Post. David Ignatius, thank you very much for coming on this morning. And we appreciate the piece you wrote. Thank you. Thank you, David.