Morning Joe - Morning Joe 4/27/23

Episode Date: April 27, 2023

The Morning Joe panel discusses the latest in politics, U.S. and world news, sports and culture

Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! Now if you want to really drive them crazy, you say 12 more years. One of the many differences between President Biden and former President Trump as the two appear headed for a rematch of 2020. This morning, we have new polling that continues to show Americans do not want to see it. We'll dig into the numbers in just a moment. It appears also that we're just a few weeks away

from Ron DeSantis officially jumping into the 2024 presidential race. We'll explain what has to happen in Florida before he can announce. It comes as Disney takes action against the Florida governor. What did I say about Mickey Mouse with brass knuckles? I mean, come on.

Come on. This is Bob Iger. This ain't beanbag, as Tip O'Neill would say. The company is suing the Florida governor. We'll have the latest on the longstanding feud with the company. Plus, the woman who says Donald Trump raped her in a department store years ago takes the stand in her civil case against the former president. We'll have some of that testimony. And the judge excoriates Donald Trump through his lawyers.

Yeah, testimony very, very sad. And on Capitol Hill, House Speaker Kevin McCarthy notches a symbolic win with the passage of his debt limit plan. But the bill now seems likely to die in the Senate. We'll look at what's next in the fight to raise the debt ceiling. Good morning and welcome to Morning Joe. It is Thursday, April 27th. Along with Joe, Willie and me, we have U.S. special correspondent for BBC News, Katty Kaye and the host of Way Too Early, White House peer chief at Politico, Jonathan and me. We have U.S. special correspondent for BBC News, Katty Kay,

and the host of Way Too Early, White House peer chief at Politico, Jonathan Lemire. A lot to get to. A lot to get to. In these four hours. But a couple of things just off the top, Willie. First of all, Donald Trump, because if you really want to get to him, talk about terminating the Constitution. Right. He's like, oh, it's like it's like, hey, come on, let's own them. Retribution. Let's own the lives like 12, 12 years. Yeah. No, that's actually not what the Constitution says through the amendments. Doesn't work that way. But yeah. So but but he just he just can't help himself. But a couple of things to talk about. Speaking of not being able to help themselves. Jonathan Lemire and my and poor Mike Barnicle are Red Sox 500. We are at 500.

The massive mountain of mediocrity continues. But, man, the New York Knicks, they're in a strange new land, Willie. You know, it's funny you put it that way. It is a little disorienting. The New York Knicks won a playoff series last night. They did it for the first time in 10 years and only the second time in a generation. The last time before that they won a series was in 2001. It's been that long that the Knicks, they really ran the Cavs out of their own gym last night.

Jalen Brunson was great again, the new signee this year, the free agent they picked up from Dallas. And they're moving on, John, to play the Miami Heat, who upset the Bucs in that series last night. So now the Bucs are, listen, Jimmy Butler is amazing. Here's the play, by the way, Joe, at the end of regulation. Miami down two with under two seconds left. Come on. Inbound lob to jimmy butler from his

back puts it in to tie the game then they go on to win in overtime so they defeat the number one seed milwaukee bucks so now the knicks instead of playing the bucks play the miami heat john and knicks fans are feeling it right now this is stunning first of all yes the fact knicks are good that's new uh but not only are they, they now have home court advantage in the second round. I mean, this is a it can't it can't be overstated what a big upset this is for the Heat over the Bucs. The Heat, the number eight seed, Milwaukee, the number one seed. This has only happened a handful of times in NBA history. Then the Bucs have the NBA's best player in Giannis.

And it's in five games. Jimmy Butler, the last two days, heroic. Great final play there on the inbounds. 40 points plus two nights in a row, two big comebacks. And now we get Heat-Knicks, which is a throwback to those 90s, late 90s, early aughts series. We just need Jeff Van Gunney to jump onto the floor and grab Alonzo Mourning's leg again. That was a great moment in Knicks history. Those games, remember those, Joe, were like 68 to 65

and there'd be two fistfights in every game. A little bit different era in the NBA, but a lot of excitement this morning here in New York. A lot of excitement. I've got to also tell you. What? Nobody sees this coming at home. What? But we're about to talk sport with Caddy K.

A lot of excitement in Caddy's household yesterday as Man City annihilated. Annihilated Arsenal. Arsenal was supposed to be on their way to winning the Premier League. Man City said not so fast yesterday. Head-to-head matchup. Your household had to be thrilled. So I was upstairs trying to write, and every now and again I would hear these yells from downstairs. And somebody looked at me who was in the room with me and looked at me and thought,

do we need to go and check Tom's okay? And I said, no, no, no, that's a good sign. And then the yells would be repeated by four times we had those big yells. The sad news in my household is that my son is an Arsenal supporter, so... Oh, no. House divided. He's looking good. City looking good for the Prem, right? What do you think, Joe?

They actually do have it, and I feel very sorry for your son and Arsenal fans worldwide because this was theirs to blow, and they've blown it. All right. That's something, though, that we Red Sox fans don't have to worry about this year because

we're going to end up 500. Red Sox suck all the time. There will be no position. No, no, we never. We don't say that word. We're great. OK. We're great.

We we're the best 500 team in baseball right now. And, and, uh, Duran, uh, two for four yesterday. I'm sorry. I'm excited about this Red Sox team. Yes. They're mediocre, but then again, they speak to those of us who walked through life mediocre. Just trying to get by 81 and 81, Joe, 81 and 81. Okay. Just trying to get by. 81 and 81, Joe. 81 and 81. He never sees a new thing. That is. It is. I'll take it.

And, you know, usually Willie at the end, you know, beginning of the next season, they go, no, you're not 2018 world champions. And they scroll it down. They're going to take what Lemire just said, and they're going to scroll it next year, 81 and 81. Just trying to get by. There's a nice symmetry. There's a nice symmetry.

There's a nice symmetry to that. And by the way, with our two teams at the bottom of the ALEs, it takes a lot of pressure off the season. We can just go enjoy it. We don't have to worry about the playoffs. We can make plans for the fall. You and I can go on our annual Turning of the Leaves tour that we do through New England without worrying about the World Series.

We actually sometimes, you know, Willie and I do through New England without worrying about the World Series. We actually, sometimes, you know, Willie and I bike through New England a lot. And sometimes it gets kind of ugly, you know, when we're fighting about who's going to win and who's going to lose. Maybe this year, our trip up through Burlington

won't be quite as violent. We have so much news to get to. Some people believe what you say on this show, right? I mean, some people actually do believe you. Yeah, well, they should. And by the way, if you look at our Twitter feed, we will show you Willie and me on a tandem bike from 2007 actually going through Vermont.

It's a beautiful, beautiful shot. You talk about the triple line. Okay. Okay, now to the news. The New York Times has new reporting on Fox's firing of Tucker Carlson. Two sources tell The Times the day before the start of the Dominion defamation trial against the network. The Fox Board of Directors and top executives learned about private messages sent by Carlson that had been redacted in legal filings. According to the sources, the redacted material contained the highly offensive and crude remarks that went beyond the inflammatory, often racist comments of his primetime show and anything disclosed in the

lead up to the trial. Can I? Well, go ahead. Let's this is so important. Meanwhile, the Wall Street Journal reports that in one of the redacted messages, Carlson called a female senior executive a crude and misachlan Murdoch to sever ties with the hosts of their highest rated and highly profitable primetime program. And let me jump in here really quickly. I, you know, I I saw a clip from this weekend, Bill Maher, this past week, and he actually was reading some of the text messages and he read the ones that came out where Tucker Carlson called the head of Fox News, a woman, the C word, which I noticed. I mean, it's just in the United States. You just don't say it. It's a little different culturally in Britain, but we won't get into that conversation. But here it is as bad as it gets. And I noticed that even

in Bill Maher's hardened audience, there were like gasps throughout the crowd. And I thought, my gosh, he's saying this. This is out. This is shocking even to this crowd. And I remember saying to me, I said, I don't know if he's going to survive all of this. And she agreed. Yeah. I mean, so two things. One, it's it's very shocking. And it was used in the context of his boss, which is a very senior executive at the company, which is incredibly disrespectful, rude and dumb tactics if you work for that network. And I think is an indication or was an indication to Rupert and Lachlan about Tucker's belief that he was bigger than the network he was working for, which is clearly not the case. No one is too big to be pushed out in a cable news network. And then it was also the other messages

which show the kind of work environment and the attitude that existed in that work environment from Carlson downwards to women and more generally that made it a very toxic work environment. And just post-MeToo, that kind of work environment is not acceptable anymore. We've seen that at Fox as well with the departure of Bill O'Reilly having to go. And the bullying of that kind of nature is a sort of, you know, post Me Too, post work environment thing that is also not allowed. So he was rude to his bosses and he had a work environment that was not acceptable. And Rupert and Lackland made the decision he had to go. And on the Bill Maher show, he was calling another woman that in those texts was Sidney Powell. And then we find out that that was also talking about his boss, Suzanne Scott.

And then the lawyers came to him and said, hey, we think we have this redacted. And he said, I don't want it redacted. That's how I feel about her. I want people to know how I feel about her. And so, Willie, for everybody out there, and they're, well, not everybody, there are a few people out there, but some that are loyalists and Trumpists who were shocked and stunned and deeply sad and think this is part of some great conspiracy.

There's not a corporation in America. There's not a company in America where a worker could say that about a female boss and survive. Not one. There's no conspiracy theory here. This is just this is something that would literally get you fired anywhere in the United States. Well, what's interesting, too, is the reporting immediately after we learned that Tucker had been let go from Fox was that this had nothing to do with the Dominion settlement, that it wasn't about the seven hundred eighty seven million dollars they had to pay out. Well, it may not have been about what he was saying on the air, though I still think that was part of it. But that discovery that came out in that lawsuit,

in that case, did ultimately, it appears, according to all these sources, result in his firing. So it was everything that came to light around John, this Dominion case, all the discovery, the text, the emails from Tucker and others, that appears ultimately led to him being fired. Yeah, a raft of these emails and text messages, some of whom we don't know what's in there yet. You know, they were redacted. Fox knows their lawyers know we don't know. But it became untenable. And there's certainly there is a belief there's other subplots here that we haven't quite learned yet. But to the point, just just these messages enough is enough to get you fired. Like just know. Yeah. And there might be and there might be more.

And we will say Tucker Carlson didn't make a little appearance last night. He tweeted a video. It's his first real words since his dismissal. He didn't have much to say in terms of news. He didn't address the Fox situation, really. He just said, you'll be hearing more from me soon and argued for educated political debate or something like that. But he made no comment. He made no remarks about his current predicament or his dismissal. Mika, I understand that the word used in those text messages is similar to like one or two other words that you just don't use in America, let alone the American workplace. At the same time, women aren't babies. We're not. That's not the reason.

It can't be the only reason. Tucker Carlson was fired. When you look at all the other things he has said, also things on television that were stirred up in this lawsuit and are going to be stirred up in lawsuits to come. And I think about even just, you know, blatant lies about January 6th, which, you know, is as stunning as the word that was used. But I think the focus on the slur against women, and we're not babies, I think it's terrible. It's horrible to say that word, just horrible.

But there were 20,000, I mean, that's an exaggeration, but a lot of things that he said on the air that I find and that members of the journalistic community find absolutely like an assault on our democracy. So you kind of have to wonder, was just that the tipping point? Yeah, I think so. I think I think it was a combination. And I think most of us would agree with this. It's been a combination of many things. The text that came out where he was basically ridiculing his audience by saying one thing on the air and saying something else off the air. The judgment,

the lawsuit coming up with a producer that has something like 90 recorded messages. I think that where she's alleging a lot of anti-Semitic remarks, it's just an awful lot. And then on top of that, you have somebody taking pride in throwing slurs at the person that runs the network. You know, that probably is a tipping point, but that's one of many, many things. Yeah. We'll continue to follow that. I mean, it's sort of an earthquake in TV news for sure, but also sort of the impact on politics and what happens next at Fox and the lawsuit not only by the producer, Abby Grossberg, but also I think it's two other. No, it's a big, big story. All right. Moving on now, the woman suing Donald Trump for sexual assault and defamation took the stand in her civil trial against the former president. E. Jean Carroll described the encounter she says happened in a New York department store in the 90s, which Trump says never happened.

NBC News senior legal correspondent Laura Jarrett has more. E. Jean Carroll taking the stand in a packed courtroom, telling a Manhattan jury, quote, I'm here because Donald Trump raped me. And when I wrote about it, he said it didn't happen. It's a disturbing allegation the former president has always denied. The longtime advice columnist told the jury of six men and three women what began as a chance encounter at Bergdorf Goodman soon turned violent. She believes it happened in 1996, but can't say for sure. What she does recall is it started with playful banter as Trump wanted her help buying a gift. The two joked about trying on lingerie. She told the jury the next thing she knew, he shoved her against the

wall of a dressing room. Quote, I was pushing him back. It was quite clear that I didn't want anything else to happen. Then she says he assaulted her, an accusation Carol has described many times before. I fought. It hurt. It was against my will. She told the jury she confided in two friends when it happened, one who advised her to go to the police. The other said, stay quiet. Quote, he has 200 lawyers. He'll bury you.

Carol never went to the police, something Trump's defense team hammered in opening statements Tuesday. Instead, she filed a civil suit for battery last year using a new law that gives survivors of sexual assault a one-year window to file claims even when the statute of limitations has passed. She's also suing Trump for defamation, pointing to this post on Truth Social last fall, where he called her story a hoax and a lie. Other posts from Trump calling the case a scam, drawing a rebuke from the judge presiding over the trial, warning Trump's defense attorney such comments are,

quote, entirely inappropriate. NBC's Laura Jarrett with that report. Trump commented on the case yesterday before Carroll took the stand, calling her Miss Bergdorf Goodman. Writing on Truth Social, he called the allegations a, quote, made up scam, adding it's a fraudulent and false story witch hunt. The judge presiding over the case called the statement entirely inappropriate. All right. Let's talk about also, Willie, we talked about Disney actually stepping forward against Ron DeSantis. They're actually going to sue because they believe that he improperly used the power of state government to go after, you know, to go after Disney. And like we've said before, doesn't make a lot of sense in the state of Florida and especially doesn't make a lot of sense right now if Bob Iger's on the other side. Yeah, I think Governor DeSantis is finding out that this is a different animal now that Bob

Iger is back running the company. The comment that Governor DeSantis objected to from Disney about that legislation last year was from the previous CEO who's no longer there. Remember, he's fighting Disney, the largest private employer in the state. We're going to have charts from Steve Ratner in a few minutes showing just how big an impact Disney has on the state of Florida. He picked this fight because he was his feelings heard about one comment from the previous CEO about a piece of legislation. So now Disney is, in fact, suing back at him, saying this is not this isn't how it works. The government can't step in against a private entity and defame them and do all the things that Governor DeSantis is doing. So there may be in his private moments, Joe, some regret, perhaps, from Governor DeSantis that he picked up this fight to win favor with some sliver of his supporters,

but really trying in the process to hurt his state and potentially his political chances down the road. Yeah, I know that about him, Katty Kay. I mean, I don't mean to keep saying it, but, you know, you go up against the last guy, that's one thing. You go up against Bob Iger, you're going to get hurt politically. I think Ron DeSantis needs to sue for peace as fast as possible. Yeah, yeah, because the donors are watching this and what's happened over there. hurt politically. I think Ron DeSantis needs to sue for peace as fast as possible. Yeah. Yeah, because the donors are watching this and what's happened over, I mean, between the six weeks abortion ban and going up against Bob Iger and Disney and doing it so cack-handedly, it's been devastating for Ron DeSantis' donor fortunes with donors who had

been wanting to get on board with somebody who was not Donald Trump, now saying, hold on a second, we're going to hold off. And his own poll approval ratings in the Republican Party, he's looking less and less like somebody who is going to be the Republican nominee over a fight that he can't win in a state where Disney employs thousands of people and brings in billions of dollars. None of it makes sense. And I agree, he's going to, it'll be interesting to see what Steve gives us in those charts, but the numbers don't work for him. Yeah, the numbers, the numbers don't work in Jonathan O'Meara. This is again,

he's, he's gotten in way over his head. And again, let me say it again, Bob Iger is going to make him look like a rookie. He needs to get out of this thing. And also at, Bob Iger is going to make him look like a rookie. He needs to get out of this thing. And also, at some point, this is going to start costing him points in the state of Florida. Disney, as Steve's going to say, is the main economic driver of this state. It created modern Florida. I know Florida. And Disney created modern Florida. I remember I was a little kid when we

heard about it coming. It came, they built it. The state hasn't been the same since. And make no mistake about it. There's not a big debate in the state of Florida whether they love Disney or not. Maybe guys eating Cheetos, sitting in their underwear in their mother's basement, typing away on their blogs, on their like America online blogs. Maybe there's that small subset. I think they're like this. CompuServe. I think though, but you know what, you know what they do is, is after they do that and they get the Cheetos dust all over themselves, you know, they're walking out and and they're in one of the Imperial Guard uniforms and they go to Disney. Like everybody likes Disney. Who doesn't go to Disney? In the state of Florida, they wear Mandalorian outfits like this is not hard. Everybody in Florida loves Disney except Ron DeSantis.

Your credentials as a Florida man on full display right here, Joe. Thank you for that. You are a Florida man. But yet, no, this is an unpopular battle start to finish. I mean, outside of that sliver of perhaps DeSantis' most devoted fans who are going to just anything that he declares woke, they're going to fight. This is an economic engine in Florida. I know we're going to get to a little later how some of DeSantis' potential political opponents are capitalizing on this, saying, hey, you don't want Disney in Florida. We'll take Disney in our state and getting shots at DeSantis while doing so. Donald Trump, Nikki Haley now among those doing that. And this is something

where he just looks small. And to your point about Bob Iger, it's the big leagues. This is a corporate behemoth, but also a beloved American institution and an economic driver for the state of Florida. And it's happening. This fight, DeSantis won't let go. And we're seeing it and other things take a toll on his poll numbers seemingly by the day. Yeah, I know. You know, and the thing is, I mean, Willie has seen what a Florida man I am when it comes to you are Florida man comes down. Yeah. And we of course, we drive up. We love the Star Wars. And we drive up in my Datsun and I've got three Baby Yoda figurines right on my dashboard. It's cracking, but they kind of cover up. The three Baby Yodas cover that up.

You wear that Boba Fett costume when we go out to dinner. It's just so much. We have a great time. Just the two of us. Just Joe and Willie strolling through the park. We wanted to stay in the Star Wars hotel. It just costs way too much. Still ahead on Morning Show.

But you guys get great shag carpet. Nikki Haley relishes in DeSantis' fight with Disney, saying she will proudly take the company's thousands of jobs in her state. We'll show you that. Will you go up to Disney with Willie and me next time? No, plus the president addresses concerns about his age. Yes, this is so interesting. Following the launch of his 2024 re-election campaign,

those new remarks from the president are straight ahead. Also this morning, House Speaker Kevin McCarthy scores a win when it comes to the debt ceiling, escalating his standoff with the White House. What will the White House do next? You're watching Morning Joe. Look at that beautiful shot of the Capitol. It's so beautiful. Favorite building. We'll be right back. Wow. Look at New York City. I'll tell you what, these are the days.

You know what Willie and I long for? No. Those long bike rides. Okay. On our tandem bike. Well, thanks to former Mayor Bloomberg, you can take a bike ride in New York City. Okay. Welcome back to Morning Show. It's half past the hour, a cloudy day in New York City. We have the details now on that new lawsuit just filed by Disney. The company sued Governor Ron DeSantis yesterday, alleging DeSantis and other officials committed constitutional violations during a, quote, targeted campaign of government retaliation. That sounds about right, actually. It came minutes after a board, which was appointed by the governor to oversee Disney's district, voted to pass a resolution

that transfers some of Walt Disney World's self-governing power to the state. The federal civil suit argues DeSantis' actions are part of a, quote, relentless campaign to weaponize government power over the company. With his now former Treasury secretary. Yeah.

Treasury secretary. Former Treasury official. Cars are the guy who saved the car industry. Yeah. But, you know, as important as that was, the next title, the most important. Yes. Morning Joe, economic analyst. You put that in your pocket, smoke it wherever you go.

They love that title in China, don't they, Steve? I love Ratner's charts. Willie, look at those charts. Give us a sweep of the whole big board, if you will, TJ. Wow, that's great. Holy. You thought Disney was a powerful brand. It's got nothing on Ratner's charts.

Look at that. It's got nothing. The whole Southwest charts. Look at that. It's got nothing. Nothing. That's great. All right. So, Steve, take us through your charts this morning. Sure. Well, I think Steve Kornacki would be jealous of my charts, although I can't draw on them. They're a lot bigger than his anyway. So Steve or Steve. Let's start with how important Disney is. You guys talked a little bit about it at the top of the show. Let me put some numbers behind that for you. So Disney is actually the third

largest private employer in the state of Florida, although the largest at a single site, which it has, of course, in Orlando. And you can see that it has here about 75,000 employees at its parks in the Orlando area and is said to be responsible for as many as 450,000 jobs in total in the area. But also, besides the fact that it is such a big employer, it also actually pays relatively well. Disney's minimum pay is $18 an hour. Walmart, $14. Publix, $11. So these are good jobs, reasonably good jobs. They're not obviously, you know, millionaires, but these are reasonably good jobs for all those people in the state of Florida. And so you wonder why DeSantis would bite the hand that is in effect feeding him. It's also

feeding him in terms of tourism. Disney in 2022 had, I mean, Florida had almost 140 million visitors, of which 50,000 roughly, we believe, went to Disney World. And so it is a huge, huge part of Florida tourism. And then lastly, Disney pays, not surprisingly, a huge amount of taxes. They pay $1.1 billion directly to the state of Florida and to local communities in taxes. And again, by outside estimates, an Oxford analytics study, the total tax revenues to state and local governments in Florida from Disney related activities, four point seven billion dollars. So Disney is a huge economic force in Florida. And again, you wonder why DeSantis would take on his biggest economic engine.

Yeah, it's insanity. And those people are Republicans and they're Democrats and they may like him or not like him. But Disney is the biggest driver of the economy in Florida. And Steve, go to your next chart. This entire fight, at least Governor DeSantis says it is anyway, is about this special district that is not apparently uncommon in Florida. But Disney has the biggest one. What is that exactly? And why does Governor DeSantis want to take it away? Right. So here's what the fight is all about. So back in 1965, when Disney came to Florida, it said, we don't want it to be like L.A., where we have a park and we don't control anything around it. And we end up with a lot of seedy motels and fast food restaurants. So they made a deal with the state of Florida, which, as you say, is not uncommon, where they, in effect, control this 39 square

mile area. This is the city of Orlando, and to give you a sense of the size, and this is Disney. And so they have a board, had a board of five people that took care of all the water, the fire, the building codes, supervision, and they paid for it. And then DeSantis came along when he got mad at them and said, well, we're going to take this away from you and essentially make it another city or county in the state of Florida. Then DeSantis realized he was going to have to pay for all this stuff. And so he backed off that and said, OK, well, I'm not going to do that. But instead, I'm going to appoint this board and I'm going to take over control of this district. So he appointed a board. Then Disney turned around and they put a bunch of agreements in place before the board took effect. That effect that essentially limited the board's ability to do anything that Disney didn't want them to do.

And then the board came along and essentially tried to void those agreements. And that's where the lawsuit came in. And Disney said enough. And they sued them under the First Amendment, basically saying that by by going after Disney, because it had said some things about the don't say gay law that violated their First Amendment and they were entitled to take control about. As you said, really, this is not that unusual in Florida. The Villages, which is a big retirement community that politicians regularly stop at, has a special district. The Daytona Speedway has a special district.

It's nothing all that extraordinary. And Disney was a great corporate citizen that DeSantis just decided he wanted to take on in a stupid fight. It'd be interesting to know if Governor DeSantis also wants to take away the special district privileges of the villages and the Daytona Super Speedway. I suspect he would not. OK, let's go to your last chart, Steve. You talked about biting the hand that feeds you.

Well, it appears Governor DeSantis is doing it even with his donors because Disney has given to Florida Republicans. Yeah, that's the other really strange thing here. You might think of Disney as a left-leaning kind of company. But in fact, and for obvious good reasons from their business standpoint, they have been mostly giving their money to Republicans. And you can see going all the way back to 2002, all this red. This is money that Disney has given to Florida Republicans, both candidates and PACs.

And then this blue down here, these small blue bars down here, are money that Disney has given to Democrats. Just a few million dollars to Democrats and many millions of dollars to Republicans, including DeSantis. We don't know exactly how much DeSantis has gotten because a lot of this money went through PACs and things. But obviously a big beneficiary. And it's obviously why Disney did it. Florida is controlled by Republicans, has been for 20 years. And here's the other amusing thing, which is in 2022, after this started under Iger's predecessor, Bob Chapek, Disney basically stopped all their political contributions. So this is costing them a bit of money on the political side, as well as this terrible reputational thing.

But look, as Joe said, I said a couple of times in the earlier segment, taking on Bob Iger is not the smartest thing anyone's done. Bob is an incredibly not just capable executive, but has great kind of political skills. And and basically attacked attacked DeSantis as being anti-business and turn the whole thing around and put it on DeSantis, which I thought particularly was a very clever way to handle it. So DeSantis, I think, has taken on more than he can. He can bite off. Yeah, no doubt about it. And Bob Iger is such a successful businessman and also such a successful political thinker. He I for years he's had Democrats and other people who wanted to run as a Democrat or as an independent for president or for governor or for any position, because, again, he's he's

great at what he does. So, yeah, four different. Steve Ratner, as always, thank you so much. And, you know, it's so interesting, Cady, that you have Steve talking about the reason why Disney, back in 1965, when they were setting this up in Florida, wanted to have this special district because they didn't want to have seedy motels. They didn't want fast food restaurants right next to their theme park and all their other attractions. And what does Ron DeSantis say last week? That he might even put a prison right next to Disney. Yeah, I mean, it's a sort of, you know, poke in the eye of Disney that is particularly unnecessary. And what's going to

happen to the tourists? What does Rhonda Santis think that does to families coming to the Disney theme parks with their kids if what they're driving past is some kind of maximum security prison on their way in? I mean, it's not the most inviting route to go and see your princess or Mickey Mouse, right? It just seems to make no sense. And understandably, you've now got Nikki Haley, Chris Christie saying, hey, you don't want to have Disney. We're very happy to welcome them, and we probably won't put a prison on the front door either. Yeah. And, you know, you wonder, I mean, this is seems like he's shooting himself in the foot. Maybe he will go after Formula One and the others.

It's just so politically seems like malpractice. Let's just put it that way. Former South Carolina governor. Here's what former South Carolina governor and 2024 GOP presidential candidate Nikki Haley had to say on Fox News. As governor, I took a double digit unemployment state and I turned it into an economic powerhouse. Businesses were my partners, because if you take care of your businesses, you take care of your economy, your economy takes care of the people and everyone wins. And so that's the way we dealt with it. We are South Carolina was a very anti woke state. It still is. And if Disney would like to move their hundreds of thousands of jobs to South Carolina and bring the billions of dollars with them, I'll let them know.

I'll be happy to meet them in South Carolina and introduce them to the governor and the legislature that would that would welcome it. Haley later retweeted those remarks, adding in part this. Hey, Disney, my home state will happily accept your 70,000 plus jobs if you want to leave Florida. South Carolina, not woke, but we're not sanctimonious about it either. That is, Jonathan, a great approach. And let me just say too, how proud I am of Mika. No, I know. No, no, no, no. Because she knows that Formula One is coming to Miami. Everybody's excited about that. Of course, Mika knows that NASCAR is up in daytime. She knows that.

But she's a step ahead of us at all times. So when she said going after Formula One, she's talking about, hey, okay, we've heard all these other things. Now, please don't go after Formula One in Miami. They're very excited about Formula One going to about. She's got the she's got the race calendar set up there on her desk. She knew exactly that was coming. But yeah, this is what we were talking about earlier, how other Republicans now are really painting DeSantis in this fight against Disney is, first of all, anti-GOP, that they're not supposed to be the party that takes on private enterprise, that takes on big business. We've heard that from Chris Christie. Donald Trump has weighed in and taken shots at this.

And now Nikki Haley. And let's give a little credit here. Nikki Haley, she may kick sideways, and we're still not sure what that means. But that tweet is pretty clever. That's a good tweet. Sanctimonious, which is, of course, Trump's nickname for DeSantis here. So perhaps it's a it's a nice shot at the governor and also maybe a little nod to the former president saying, hey, you know, I could be your VP. That'd be OK. I'm on your side on this one.

I've got to say also, Willie, I like it. We're not woke, but we're also not sanctimonious about it either, which I've got to say for 98 percent of Americans that don't write newsletters any more every day about woke on this side or that side. The term has been used so much. It is meaningless in middle America. Meaningless. So then actually, I thought that showed a light touch. Hey, not woke, but we're not sanctimonious either. Bring your jobs to us because that's our job is getting people to work in the state of South Carolina, not being sanctimonious and picking imaginary fights. Yeah. And crystallizing how absurd this is that you're threatening 70,000 jobs and all the business that comes through Florida because your feelings were hurt by the previous CEO on one piece of legislation. It is kind of

mind boggling for somebody who wants to be president. We're hearing may announce that he's going to run for president sometime next month in the next few weeks here, that he's going to the mat with Disney, that he's signing a six week abortion ban that will be devastating in a general election. So the rollout, if this is the beginning of the rollout, not going well, to put it mildly. Well, and let me add one more step. He wanted to have open carry in the state of Florida. He wanted people to be able to strap AR-15s under their backs when they go to Publix, when they go to Walmart, when they go to Costco, when they go to Little League games, when they go, I don't know, church, wherever they go. And it was actually an obsequious Florida legislature who usually just follows him wherever he goes, says, no, no, no, no, no. We can't go quite that far.

So, yeah, crazy. All right. Taking the most extreme positions, not understanding that what Republicans want, what Main Street Republicans want, what independents want is a pro-business Republican. They don't want the chaos. They don't want the nonsense. They don't want the tweets. They don't want the culture battles, the extreme culture battles. They want a mainstream pro-business, pro-middle class, low tax, low spend, low regulation Republican without all the other garbage. Why can't these people figure it out? I mean, maybe Nikki Haley has figured it out because that's certainly what the tweet sounded like. Yeah, that was a good tweet. We'll see. Coming

up, new fighting in Sudan undermines a previously negotiated truce between the rival military groups battling for control. We'll be joined by a U.S. combat veteran working to rescue American citizens still inside the country. Plus, there is growing concern this morning over China's involvement in the war in Ukraine. NBC News chief international correspondent Keir Simmons joins us with the latest. That's next on Morning Joe. Ten minutes before the top of the hour, there are some in the U.S. intelligence community who are reportedly concerned by Chinese military activity in the Middle East. According to top secret documents obtained by The Washington Post, American spy services detected construction at a suspected Chinese military facility in the United Arab

Emirates this past December. Back in 2021, the UAE announced it had stopped construction at the same facility after U.S. officials expressed concern that Beijing intended to use it for military purposes. The trove of documents obtained by the Post includes this map, which reportedly shows the UAE facility as part of a larger campaign by Beijing to build a global military network by 2030. Defense officials say they will not allow the base to become operational because it could jeopardize sensitive military activity in the region. The Post notes, quote, the level of concern about China's actions in the UAE varies among U.S. officials, with some viewing the development as manageable and others seeing a significant threat that warrants more forceful pressure from the United States. There's also a lack of consensus about whether the UAE has made a strategic decision to deeply align with China or maintain a balancing act that includes the

United States, its longtime protector. Right. And there is right now sort of a battle between different people in the intel community with Jake Sullivan, national security advisor, Bill Burns, CIA, obviously not not as concerned, according to reports. And so we'll see how that shakes out right now, though, Willie. There's just, I think, a growing concern, not only the United States, but across the world with China and China's expansionist plans. Yeah. The Middle East, you can add Africa to that. There's concern about its influence in Africa and now China becoming more involved in the war in Ukraine, sending an official to Eastern Europe to, quote, help resolve the ongoing crisis. Joining us now with more NBC News chief international correspondent Keir Simmons. Keir, good morning.

So what exactly is China doing here? Well, Willie, the headline, of course, is President Xi's call with President Zelensky, effectively putting China at the center of negotiations, for good or bad, from President Xi's perspective. And let's just put this in context. After Secretary Blinken cancelled that trip to China over the spy balloon controversy, it's difficult for US officials to even get Chinese officials to pick up the phone and forget US officials sitting down with Russian officials. And yet what you have this morning is China preparing to send one of its most experienced Russian experts, diplomat, to Ukraine. So this guy's name is Li Hui. He's 70 years old. He's been reported overnight in the newspapers as a former Chinese ambassador to Russia. He's so much more than that. It goes back to 1981 when he was the second secretary to the Chinese embassy in Moscow.

That's during Soviet times, of course. He becomes the first secretary. He spent some time in the Chinese foreign ministry again in the Russian department. He spent some time in Kazakhstan. Then for 10 years, from 2009 to 2019, he's the Chinese ambassador to Russia. In 2019, President Putin awards him the Russian Order of Friendship. And we've got a photograph of the two of them, you know, kind of a Putin grip and grin there. And we spoke overnight to an academic who's known Lee Kuei for 10 years. This is how he describes him. He's a Russian academic describing Lee Kuei. He says he's fluent in Russian. He reads Russian classics like Tolstoy and Dostoevsky. He was ambassador during Crimea in 2014 and always was very supportive trying to

solve problems. From Moscow, this academic says, it's the best possible choice. He's very close to the present Chinese foreign minister, but he's not a wolf warrior. He can pick up the phone to the Russian Security Council. And he says, I believe that he has actually traveled to Ukraine several times. So what does that tell us? It's actually, frankly, potentially a pretty clever move by President Xi, because what you have is a move that seems to reassure the Europeans that the Chinese are moving to try and help with Ukraine, but sending a signal to the Russians, we're sending your friend. They're sending someone who the Russians really love. Let me just tell you, read for you a quote by Li Hui back in 2017 when he was the ambassador there in Moscow. In this quote, he says, the Chinese-Russian relations of comprehensive

strategic cooperation and partnership are the most important bilateral relations in the world, and moreover, the best relations between big countries. So again, Li Hui is deeply, over decades, considered to be a friend of Russia. And he's the guy that President Xi is sending to Ukraine. We don't know when he'll go. And another caveat, President Xi's hand, frankly, may have been forced by China's ambassador to France, who made those comments to French television, questioning the sovereignty of former Soviet states. I mean, Eastern European countries have been furious about that. I mean, it's nothing like China's position on territorial integrity.

So, you know, he may, Beijing may have had to feel like they had to do something to kind of wrestle back the agenda. And fundamentally, there is this fundamental question here, right? Which is Ukraine insists it wants its sovereign territory back.

Russia insists it won't withdraw. So China has a challenge. But again, it's now, frankly, after these moves at the center or very much in the center of potential negotiations over Ukraine in the future. All right. NBC's Keir Simmons, thank you very much for your reporting and analysis this morning. Greatly appreciated. And Katty Kay, there are two ways to look at it. I guess I'm always optimistic. If you're ever going to bring Vladimir Putin to the table and agree to a peace agreement, he's got to believe that he's got a friend in the room, that he's got an ally in the room who's telling him you've got to bring this war to an end for your sake, for the sake of China. Yeah, I mean, I'm actually interested from the other

angle as well. What does this tell us about Zelensky's thinking at the moment? The fact that Zelensky had this phone call with Xi, the fact that he's now sending a Ukrainian ambassador to Beijing, the fact that he is going to receive this guy who Kiyo was just telling about, who is very close to Moscow, and have him come to Ukraine. Is this the beginning of the Ukrainians saying, OK, look, you know, we are ready to start the negotiating process that up until now they very much said they're not ready to do yet until they get all their territory back again. Are they starting to want to put the parameters of something on the table? I mean, it's just interesting to me that Zelensky is making this outreach and that he is receiving somebody who he knows is this close to Moscow.