Morning Joe - Morning Joe 5/14/25

Episode Date: May 14, 2025

President meets Syrian leader in major breakthrough for former jihadi

I'm here today not merely to condemn the past chaos of Iran's leaders, but to offer them a new path and a much better path toward a far better and more hopeful future. And take all action required to stop the regime from ever having a nuclear weapon. Iran will never have a nuclear weapon. I will be ordering the cessation of sanctions against Syria in order to give them a chance at greatness. So I say good luck Syria. Show us something very special like they've done frankly in Saudi Arabia.

Okay, they're going to show us something special. President Trump speaking yesterday in Saudi Arabia announcing a major foreign policy change with Syria while also trying to maintain a hard line with Iran over nuclear talks. We'll bring you the latest from his trip to the Middle East. Meanwhile, the president is doubling down on accepting a luxury jet from Qatar, despite more objections from members of his own party. Plus, we'll have a look at the town hall that is fueling some speculation about Pete Buttigieg's plans for the 2028 election.

What was it? What was he in? What, Minnesota? Was he in Idaho? Where was he? It might've been a swing state. Just might've been. Iowa, okay.

And eight months after his death, Pete Rose has been reinstated by Major League Baseball. The commissioner, Rob Manfred, will go through that controversial decision in whether he could be inducted into the Hall of Fame. Good morning and welcome to Morning Joe. It's Wednesday, May 14th. Everybody doing good?

Look at the three of us, you guys. It's like old times, like 18 years ago. 2007. Oh, it's a caucus. When we had to call like Walter Isaacson on the phone to get him to talk to us. That's right. Yeah. Yeah.

Pat Buchanan. Pat was there? Yeah. Some of the originals. Wow. For another 15 minutes on the phone, Pat. Are you good for this? Yes, Joe.

Along with Joe, Willie and me, we have U.S. special correspondent for BBC News and the host of the Rest is Politics podcast, Cady K. Columnist and associate editor for The Washington Post, David Ignatius is back with us, and writer-at-large for The New York Times, Elizabeth Buhmiller joins us this morning. Good to have you guys on board. Great group. So a lot to do too. And we're going to be talking obviously the Syria decision by

the president also what's happening with Iran. Can we talk about that? Oh my gosh. I know what you're going to do. But let's talk about Willie, what they're talking about in New York right now. P-Devil for P-Diddy. Sex with Strangers on the front of the Daily News, P. Diddy's trial going on. But what New York's really thinking about right now and getting ready for tonight.

Leave to the New York Post, kick some mass. Sure. And also tough to watch. But you told me something coming in, surprising. Even with injuries, Celtics still favorites. Yeah, five point favorites tonight. Celtics are still very, very good. Some premature enthusiasm perhaps, not from the team, not from the Knicks, but from some fans. Because Jason Tatum's not there, they still have two Olympians on their team. They still have Jaylen

Brown who's an all-star level player. There's a reason they're the Boston Celtics and the defending champs. So nothing will be easy, especially on the road in Boston right you'd like to finish it tonight because if not you come back to the garden Friday night with a ton of pressure on that right because you don't want to go to game 7 back in Boston so no celebration here yet right and you said the Celtics have a great record even without Tatum yeah yeah they've they played well even without him that we confirm by the way, yesterday,

the team did that he did tear his Achilles tendon. The worst fear confirmed. It'll be a year or so of recovery for one of the best players in the league. So you truly, truly, no matter who you root for, hate to see that for such a great player. So isn't it crazy just a month or two after we were all complaining about the NCAA having no surprises. In fact, you know, all the best teams won. There were no Cinderella stories

that this NBA championship is just the opposite. Amazing. All surprises. I still, I'll never understand how the Cavs were as dominant as they were all year and then just collapsed at the Pacers. Yeah, I think they were banged up. They lost last night.

The Cavs lost at home to the Indiana Pacers. So the Cleveland Cavaliers, who had the best record in the East this year have been eliminated from the playoffs and on their home floor last night. Indiana moves on to the Eastern Conference Finals. Donovan Mitchell was a little hurt. He was good last night. Their point guard, Darius Garland, their belt zone was injured and their great center, Mobley, was hurt for part of the playoffs too. So they were banged up, but it's a shame for

the Cleveland fans, but Indiana now in the Eastern Conference. And Indiana looking great. By the way, speaking of being eliminated, it's a little shocking. It's kind of early, but the Boston Red Sox eliminated from the playoff contention mathematically. It's May the 14th after last night's game after another heartbreaking loss, eliminated from the playoffs. Here's the good news. Yeah, the at least it's so mediocre I know they're all going to be around in a

September it's a program it's the story of my life. All tallest building it's connected you know you know you know just hang around the party long and I just hold somebody might dance with you hold on hold on. Exactly. All right. Let's get to our top story this morning. President Trump is now headed to Qatar before boarding Air Force One. He took part in a summit with leaders from six Middle Eastern countries. This was the president's last meeting in Saudi Arabia.

Ahead of the summit, Trump sat down with Syria's new president, and he spoke about that meeting and the decision to lift sanctions earlier this morning. It gives them a chance for greatness. The sanctions were really crippling, very powerful. And I spoke to Mohammed and I spoke to a friend from Turkey who we just spoke to also by phone now. But felt very strongly that this would give them a chance. It's not going to be easy anyway, so it gives them a good, strong chance. And it was my honor to do so.

So we will be dropping all of the sanctions on Syria, which I think really is going to be a good thing. So, David Ignatius, obviously a lot of questions hanging over the new leadership in Syria. The Wall Street Journal cautiously optimistic, though, saying they need to be given a chance. I'm curious your thoughts. So Joe, after the terrible Syrian civil war, the awful loss of life, to see a chance for Syria to come back together as a country under President Amir al-Sharif is, I think, a very positive trend.

And lifting sanctions is a necessary part of that. The big bet that President Trump and really the whole Arab world is making is that Amir al-Sharif, the president who was formerly a member of an affiliate of al-Qaeda, really has changed, that he's going to be a leader who will put his terrorist background behind him and and will be able to unify the country Interestingly, this is something that is Israel is quite worried about But it was pressed by Turkey, which has been the biggest backer of al-shara been the biggest backer of Al-Sharah, encouraged to help train his forces before he took power. So it's a big move by President Trump.

We were all expecting that this trip to Saudi Arabia would be pop and, you know, elaborate meetings and it's been that, but it's also had a lot of substance. Well, I was going to say we obviously, for good reason, a lot of people are talking about the jet, the Qatari jet, possibility of corruption, the possibility of, again, I think for most Republicans who are critical of it, the possibility of espionage. So we are talking about that. It's important too. It's also important though not to miss actually the policy that's happening over there right

now that may have quite a substantial impact whether you're talking about Syria, whether you're talking about Iran. I am curious though, and I think more, one of the more intriguing storylines that we've talked about already coming out of this summit is the distancing of Donald Trump from Bibi Netanyahu and we saw it yet again yesterday with this Syria decision, didn't we? We did. There was a symbolism to Trump's first extended trip to the Middle East going to Saudi Arabia, which seems to be the center of US interest rather than Israel traditionally The the anchor for American policy in the region. We'll have to see how long that lasts. I don't see any real

weakening of the US commitment to Israel's security, but there the United States is doing things that make Israel nervous and I think that's only beginning to play out It's going to be a big debate in coming weeks. And, Katty, now the president moves on. In a short time from now he'll arrive in Qatar for the second leg of this three-stop tour. Expect to get the same lavish royal welcome that he got in Saudi Arabia, including discussions about that $400 million plane. Yeah the plane is the one that's going to dog him when he's in Qatar. He's doubled down on why he would be a fool not to take a plane like this and somebody else can pay for it. But it's been striking up on the hill you know much closer to home where we're all sitting right now just how many Republicans are feeling a little queasy about this and are prepared to say

so publicly. I mean you've got even somebody like Josh Hawley saying this may not be the best idea. Why don't we get a plane that's built in the United States? The security implications of having a plane that the Qataris are given, the conflict of interest questions that might arise about American policy towards Qatar if Qatar gives this plane. But for the moment, the president reiterating on his truth social posts that this is what he wants, I'm trying to figure out is this another sort of,

in the signal and noise bracket of the Trump administration, is this signal or is this noise? Is this a distraction from something else? Perhaps the distancing from Israel that may not go down so well on the Hill that David is talking about. I'm still trying to work that one out. For the moment, he's doubling down on it, but it's going to be in focus in Qatar, and clearly some of the Republicans are not happy about it.

Well, you know, that's a question that we've been asking. Is this one of those things that, again, is it signal? Is it noise? Is it noise to distract from something else? Because especially when you consider Republicans are against the Wall Street Journal editorial page, the National Review, so many conservatives, some of the most conservatives against it. Also, of course, the intel community, very concerned about the espionage threats there.

It's just, so again, that is the question that again, as Katty asked. Is this signal? Is this noise? Is this something that at the end he knows he's not going to be able to accept? It may be one issue whether it's a trolling noise or not. Where Republicans find their voice a bit. Here they are talking about the plane. This is a hypothetical and I'm sure that if and when there is, it's no longer a hypothetical, I can assure you

there will be plenty of scrutiny of whatever that arrangement might look like. Are you concerned with the national security implications of that jet being given as a gift to the president? Well, again, I mean, like I said, there will be plenty of scrutiny. There are lots of issues around that that I think will attract very serious questions, if and when it happens. Well, the only thing I'm concerned about is the safety of the president. I mean, Qatar's not, in my opinion, a great ally.

I mean, they support Hamas, and so what I'm worried about is the safety of the president of the United States. I mean, I'm a little concerned about accepting a gift from the federal government that way. I mean, it's a very odd offer. Obviously, people just don't give you things without expecting something in return. And, you know, Qatar may be useful, but I wouldn't say they're our strongest ally. When you get something of that value from a country, one typically thinks that there's something in it for the country that is offering it.

So I think there's certainly a lot of questions. I think we should have a big, beautiful plane built in the United States of America. The president's been very good on make America buy America. We probably ought to pass a law that requires the federal government to buy everything from and in the United States of America. I think this would be a good opportunity to do that. And I can think of other things, I bet the president can too, that Qatar can do to be helpful to us. If they'd like to be helpful, they could start by rooting out the Islamic radicalist

terrorists. That they find, that they find whether it's Hezbollah, whether it's Hamas, whether it's Islamic Jihad, we can go down the list. But Elizabeth, there's so many things that Republicans would naturally be against here in any normal times, and we're starting to hear actually some of it. You know, one is the fact that Hamas has been supported by Qatar for years now, and every other anti-Israeli terrorist group has been as well. So there's that problem.

There's a problem of getting Air Force One, potential Air Force One from any country, any country. Like this would be a problem if we were coming from France, let alone Qatar. her and then finally as Josh Hawley said there, the presidency and the Republican party that is so dedicated to buying America, building America, at least they say they are, actually not even having the president fly around in a plane built by Americans. Well, you know, can you imagine if this was Barack Obama wanting to accept the $400 million plane from Qatar? It just shows you how things have changed.

I mean, you know, Democratic presidents and their aides have talked about going to Riyadh and going into the rooms and finding literally briefcases of jewels, of diamonds and emeralds and rubies. And the first thing they did was they turned them over to the person at the State Department so they would not accept them. It just shows you how things have changed under Donald Trump and with his selling his meme coin. Listen, the trip to Saudi Arabia was the first day was focused largely on business deals, on commercial diplomacy, not just diplomatic diplomacy. And I think that there are so many problems here.

One of them is certainly is the cost of retrofitting the plane. Basically, people have said you have to take the whole thing apart and build it again because you have to look for all of the bugging devices that clearly will be in. I mean, no country would, it's unimaginable that this wouldn't be a problem. So it just shows how things have changed. And I love that the majority leader, John Thune, is saying that, well, you know, it's still a hypothetical, not exactly a stirring opposition there from John Thune. And to the point about the security concerns, aviation experts tell NBC News that it will

cost a billion dollars to retrofit the plane to give all the things you would need for a president to fly in it safely. And it may not even be finished before the end of Donald Trump's second term here. So may not ever end up being Air Force One. Might be something you could use later on. We'll see. During that speech yesterday in Saudi Arabia, the president also said he's willing to negotiate with Iran on a nuclear deal, but made it clear the United States will not allow Iran to develop

a nuclear weapon. I want to make a deal with Iran. If I can make a deal with Iran, I'll be very happy if we're going to make your region and the world a safer place. But if Iran's leadership rejects this olive branch and continues to attack their neighbors, then we will have no choice but to inflict massive maximum pressure, drive Iranian oil exports to zero like I did before. The choice is theirs to make.

We really want them to be a successful country. We want them to be a wonderful, safe, great country. But they cannot have a nuclear weapon. This is an offer that will not last forever. The time is right now for them to choose. Right now we don't have a lot of time to wait. So David Ignatius, the two sides, the United States and Iran, actually have been talking quite a bit for this relationship over the last couple of months and trying to get to a place where they can talk at least about the nuclear program in Iran the president talking about massive

Maximum pressure from the United States. So where does this all stand right now? So really it stands in mid negotiation. There have been four meetings between US representatives and Iranian They have not broken through the central issue which is whether Iran will be allowed to enrich uranium after a deal. The US is firm, as it has been for many, many years, in saying Iran will not have a nuclear weapon, but there's this additional demand. Iran will not enrich uranium.

The Iranians push back hard on that, saying they have a right to do this. It's just hard to predict where this is going to turn out, but I was struck by the language that Trump used in Saudi Arabia where he said the United States has no permanent enemies. The state of virtual war that's existed between the United States and Iran since 1979 is not a permanent condition of life in the Middle East. If Iran will move forward in these negotiations. That's a big shift. It illustrates that Trump, although sometimes it's hard, as we've been saying, to distinguish what's signal

and what's noise, has big ideas about change in this part of the world, his willingness to step back from conflict and consider negotiations, even with adversaries, to admit somebody who was formerly a member of an al-Qaeda affiliate as the legitimate ruler of Syria. Those are big changes. No question about it.

I mean, David, you look at what has happened. You look at the Abraham Accords that, again, were, I think, much like Operation Warp Speed, were sort of clouded by so much more chaos that was going on at the time. Abraham McCord's obviously, as you've said, very significant. You look what's happening in Syria. It's a risk, but it's a risk that obviously our allies in the region of Israel wants the president to take. And, of course, the president's promised peace in Ukraine. I will say, though, I'm not sure,

where did the Iran move come from? This obviously a country that loathed Donald Trump and the administration has, contracts out on people that work for him in the first administration because of the the death of Soleimani. So I'm a bit curious, what is the genesis of this of these talks? How did we even get to this point? So Joe, here's what my reporting tells me. At the very beginning of Trump's second term, Prime Minister Netanyahu came to Washington

with pretty elaborate plans for a military strike on Iran to take out what remains of the nuclear program. And the argument was, Iran has never been this weak. This is the time to do it. There's a window of opportunity. Trump listened to all that. There was a lot of speculation about whether a joint US or Israeli attack might be coming. And then Trump pulled back and he's pulled back more and more month by month to the point that he is now where he's you know really opening the door to a different kind of relationship with Iran. But I think it began with Trump's

resistance to the idea of getting into another conflict in the Middle East. He just wasn't sure about Israeli arguments. This was one and done. Hit him and you won't have to worry about it afterwards. He did worry about it. So I think that's the start of it and it illustrates that Trump, at least in the Middle East, is trying to look at policy issues through a different lens rather than automatic support of traditional allies. All right. Still ahead on Morning Joe, there are concerns of widespread starvation throughout Gaza as

Israel continues to block aid deliveries. We're going to talk to a physician with Doctors Without Borders who just returned from an assignment in Gaza. Plus, we'll be joined by House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries as Republicans push ahead with proposed Medicaid cuts. Morning Joe is back in 90 seconds. Welcome back. Time now for a look at some of the other stories making headlines this morning. For the first time a federal judge has ruled the Trump administration can invoke the Alien

Enemies Act to remove Venezuelan migrants from the country. What part of Texas is he from? The judge ruled yesterday that the government can use the centuries-old wartime law to expel alleged members of the Trende Aragua gang if it first provides adequate advanced notice and due process. Axios reports the judge said the government has to provide a 21-day notice in a language understood by the migrants and an opportunity to be heard before deporting people under the Alien Enemies Act. The administration had argued it only needed to give migrants 24 hours notice, so some strings attached.

Well, yeah, and Elizabeth Buhmiller, that is, that's not really the greatest news for the Trump administration. I thought the purpose of the Alien Enemies Act would be to be able to sweep them up off the street, throw them onto a plane and fly them out. This is sort of, this is sort of a difficult bargain for the Trump administration because if they're required notice and a 21 day pause before being swept out that well that

sort of undercuts the entire purpose of the alien enemies act correct if there's due process involved and so I mean judges consistently no judge has there I can't think of maybe there's one or two But basically most judges have not supported any of these deportation efforts of the president they've given him a little bit on the edges, so They are having a rough time with the deporting what they won't say is going to be a million people Yeah, within the year if they're just running into real difficulties. It's expensive It's time-consuming and they are, the face of it is often so ugly that it's, they're really alienating a lot of people, including some of their own voters.

The cruelty of it is what's so, I mean, that's the point in some of these cases, is to scare people, but I think it's really turning off a majority of Americans. And it's one of the reasons the Trump administration so, so I won't say desperate, but they are really encouraging self deportation because they need to get the numbers up. I think they're not going to get to the million that they need to get to for a variety of reasons. It's extraordinarily costly. It's extraordinarily costly. It's extraordinarily difficult. And it's also, again, it makes for very ugly images

that this president and this White House, while initially may have wanted in Venezuela, Dale, I mean, they have said they do not want the same images of children being separated from parents that they had in the first administration. But that is what's happening. I think the process of self-deportation has some challenges right now because of all the videos that you're seeing everywhere of people being dragged off. I think a lot of migrants,

a lot of people who want to self-deport are too scared to, and the person who is the voice of that, one of them, Christine Noem, it's too scary. She's standing in front of prisons. She's telling, there's got to be a way to tell people that they can do this safely. I don't think they don't have a reason to believe. They will be safe. But again, you look at the notice that's required here.

I said at the beginning, what judge from Texas was it? I think by the end, I'm asking, okay, what part of Vermont? Do they just have one? Was that a Vermont judge or somebody from the Ninth Circuit? Yeah, to your point, Mika, Secretary Noem has put out these glossy ads. If you watch any news network, you can see where she's smiling and saying,

all you have to do is go to the app, self-deport, and we'll start the process again, and there's a chance you could come back to America. You just have to do it the right way. So they're trying, as you say, Joe, to make this self-deportation happen to get the numbers up. I don't think she's the best voice for that. It would be a lot easier for them to get to the numbers they want to get to. All right. Democrats have ended a long-running era of Republican leadership in Omaha. Voters put Democrat John Ewing Jr. on track to become the city's new mayor, the first

black politician elected to that post. The Republican incumbent had been seeking a fourth term. It is the latest in a series of statewide victories for Democrats during the opening months of President Trump's second term. I'll tell you what, Katty Kay, it is, again, off your elections are important, but I will tell you, for 30 years, I remember before our big landslide victory in 94, and it was the first time Republicans were put back in power in a generation, All the races in 93 all broke Republican. It was all a shock.

We've seen that with Barack Obama. We saw Donald Trump's first term, the elections in 2017, especially in a state you know well, Virginia. Where in 17, Virginia broke hard and democratic. We've seen it now in an early race in Lancaster, Pennsylvania. We saw an early race in Iowa, of course Wisconsin Supreme Court race. Here Omaha, which is such an extraordinarily important swing

district for Congress and for the presidency and we're seeing one Democrat after another Democrat outperforming. Yeah, the party that's out of power always looks at off-year elections or special elections and thinks, OK, let's see if this is going to give us the roadmap to the next midterm election or the next presidential election. And this time around, it's the Democrats.

I mean, before Trump got back in in 2024, actually, it had been a pretty mixed picture, because Republicans had lost in some elections. And I remember, we all sat around the table saying, look, Republicans are losing in all of these off-year and special elections. And then, of course, Donald Trump took the White House, and they took the House, and they took the Senate,

again, back in the last general election. So let's see how much these ones give us a roadmap. But at the moment, the signs are that what we're hearing, which is the opinion polls are showing us as well, is that people are not necessarily very happy with the way that the president is enacting his policies, even if they like the ideas behind those policies. Yeah, no doubt about it. And the difference is, of course, 24, Trump's on the ballot. And what we've found time and again, what Republicans have found time and again,

when Trump is on the ballot, they do better. When Trump is not on the ballot, they do worse. And Trump's not gonna be on the ballot again. Yeah, some enthusiasm for the midterms next year. We'll see. ESPN is rolling out details about its new streaming service set to launch this fall at a cost of $29.99 a month. That's according to the Wall Street Journal.

The highly anticipated service will give sports fans all the content shown on ESPN's television channels, including pro and college football and basketball games. What do you think? This is the ultimate cord cutting. A lot of people, frankly, keep cable because of ESPN and watch sports. So you don't have to have cable to watch ESPN, watch out. Cable for ESPN, Morning Joe, and way too other things. Those are the three big things. But you know, I mean, if that's the only option, obviously, I mean, I would do that just to see Will von and Kornheiser.

Yeah, I mean, they're going to have all that talk stuff, but also more importantly, all the games. Wow. Major League Baseball, College Football, I mean you got if you're a sports fan you must have to have it. Yeah. And it'll bundle up with Disney and they'll have all kinds of packages that you can get. Coming up we'll dig into the controversial decision by the Commissioner of Major League

Baseball to reinstate Pete Rose after a decades long ban for gambling on the sport. Morning Joe is coming right back. Thirty-six past the hour, three Israeli military officials familiar with the conditions in Gaza tell The New York Times Palestinians in the territory face widespread starvation unless access to aid is restored within weeks. Israel has insisted on its blockade on Gaza, which has been in effect since early March. It does not threaten civilians despite famine warnings from the UN. Joining us now, Dr. Aqsa Dehraani.

She's a board member of Doctors Without Borders, and she just returned to the U.S. from an assignment in Gaza, working at a field hospital. Thank you so much for coming on the show. Can you tell us what you saw in that hospital? What I saw was the manifestation and the result of these inhumane policies that you've just mentioned. We, in our trauma field hospital, we saw children who were starving and hungry already. And in the ICU where I worked, even early on in the siege, we had a one-year-old infant who had presented with burns resulting

from an airstrike. And at that point, the cost of food was already prohibitive for vulnerable families. So his nutritional status overwhelmed, you know, was became, it led to an infection. And then he ended up succumbing to his injuries. He died and he was killed by this. So already we are seeing children who are impacted by this starvation. I also had another four-year-old patient who was also admitted for burns after an airstrike whose mother was begging me for more food and I had to tell her I had to look her in the eyes and say I don't have any you

know we don't have any additional food to give him and this is unconscionable given that there is food just miles away you know being blocked by the Israeli authorities it's it's systematic it's deliberate, and it's cruel. Dr. Durrani, thanks for being with us this morning. Where is the food coming from that they're getting at all, the people of Gaza, these children you're talking about, these families, if those humanitarian shipments aren't making it, and what's the source of their food? I'll tell you that for, you know,

I was there for a few months and for five weeks or six weeks before I left, I didn't see any, a single fruit. I didn't see any, you know, natural sources of protein like chicken or eggs. The sources of food that people have right now are, are processed canned foods that, you know foods that they may have had from before. But all of that is dwindling. We are seeing that even our staff, even the doctors, nurses, everyone who's working at the hospital are eating one meal per day. And they are still,

those are the conditions that they're living in and providing care for their community. those are the conditions that they're living in and providing care for their community. Doctor, The New York Times is reporting that some Israeli military officials are concluding that Gaza is on the brink of starvation. You were there for a few months. How much did you see the situation deteriorate while you were there, and how close do you think Gaza is to people starving to death? I can tell you that we have already seen, it is already too late. Every day that this continues, it is criminal. It is criminal. I have no other words.

We have already seen that, like I said, that children and women and men, that the people are suffering from this inhumane siege. And what makes us even more criminal is that their tiny bodies are being ravaged by airstrikes. And then we can't even manage to provide them with more food. We have already seen these impacts. We've already heard of deaths from malnutrition. We've already heard of deaths all across the strip. We are screening more and more children for malnutrition. So while we wait for this classification,

each day is just too late. I have to say, I think that we're While we wait for this classification, we are, each day is, it's just too late. I have no other words. Dr. Durrani, this is David of Ingenious in Washington. I want to just ask you, the pressure of denying food and water to the people of Gaza is obviously intended to force some sort of political change where people will demand an end to the war. Is that happening in Gaza? How do people react to these terrible conditions that you're describing? People are exhausted. I mean, there is no aspect of life in Gaza that has not

been touched by the violence. People are traumatized. This is exactly what international humanitarian law was intended to stop. We are witnessing the Israeli authorities using aid as a bargaining chip, using aid as a weapon of war. And this is exactly what the international framework that we have been providing. Our organization has been providing aid under this framework for decades. I have personally been doing this for decades. And this framework is being mocked before our eyes.

I mean, we are witnessing Israel using starvation as a weapon of war. Dr. Durrani, this is Elizabeth B. Miller from The New York Times. I wanted to ask you, you said that food is only a few miles away. Is it just sitting there behind a blockade? I mean, how—can you see it? What are you all—you said you only eat one meal a day. What, where does that food come from? Is that stockpiled?

Yeah, I mean, so when you, when I entered, I, you know, we actually saw the trucks that were lined up at the border waiting to enter. It's just surreal to look and see these trucks, that trucks beyond the field of vision that either lined up farther than the eye can see. And yes, like I said, people are eating right now sources of food that are whatever they can find,

canned food, things that are non-perishable, but people are having more and more trouble finding food. I, every day I'm hearing more, you know, I just returned, but I just heard from another staff member that he's having difficulty finding food for his children. And the, you know, it's becoming increasingly impossible to find any sources of food. Doctors Without Borders board member, Dr. Aksa Dehraani, thank you very much for coming on the show today and telling the story of your experience there and for your work in Gaza.

Really appreciate it. Yeah, really appreciate it. David Ignatius, I'm just curious. Obviously what's happening in Gaza not only is causing deep concern with international relief groups like the United Nations, Doctors Without Borders, but obviously talk about the growing concern inside of Israel itself. Of course the New York Times report was not based on Gazan health officials. It was based on Israeli generals and their growing concerns about the situation there. Take us inside Israel and talk about the growing concern about the humanitarian just meltdown in Gaza and the possible approaching of famine.

Joe, for nearly a year senior officials of the Israeli military have been telling me and others that they think that the military goals in Gaza have largely been achieved and it's time to move to a system of governance that shorthand is the day after the war and to think about how you'd get non-Hamas Palestinians in a position that they could take responsibility for law and order, for distribution of food, all these basics. And the governor, Bibi Netanyahu, simply has refused to deal with these issues for political reasons. It's a very fragile coalition, has right-wing members who don't want to see that. And so we move forward month by month, you know, with this situation getting more and more desperate for the people, without a plan for what comes next. And what I hear from Israeli military officials, security officials, the people who are closest

to this war is increasingly a sense of just, they're desperate. One of them said to me, we don't know how to communicate our fears about the future. We don't have anybody to talk to. The political leadership in Israel won't listen to us. So I think that the beginning of getting out of this terrible tragedy that Dr. Narani described is having a clear path for moving to post-war Gaza in which there's some stable leadership

with non-Hamas Palestinians. That's the basic, it's gotta be done. That's something I'd hope our ambitious president would turn his mind to. It's absolutely necessary because people are dying. The Washington Post's David Ignatius and writer-at-large for The New York Times, Elizabeth Buhmiller, thank you both very much for coming on this morning. And still ahead on Morning Joe, this is a live look at Capitol Hill where lawmakers on the House Ways and Means Committee are holding a marathon session on the Republican Party's sweeping domestic policy bill. Democratic Congressman Richie Torres of New York will join us to discuss that legislation and the proposed cuts to Medicaid.

Morning Joe, we will be right back. We are the sun's up in New York City and wake up 6.50AM major league baseball. By the way, did I tell you? What? Did I tell you, Willie, yesterday? Willie. I did something. Did you ever see the right stuff? Don't talk. You know what?

There's some trying times and the right stuff, right? Yeah. Takes a lot of risk, as Sam Shepard said. To know that you're putting yourself on top of something that could just blow up at any time. Yeah. Guess what I did yesterday. What I flew into Newark on United wow live to tell the

town here. Okay, I'm here tell the tale that's something I'm here I felt like one of those not Apollo as one of those mercury asked one more like a Katy Perry, let's call it like you got briefly and came back. like you briefly and came back. Yeah, the picture of it. Yeah, exactly. I was there for the door for it was already have open. So delayed how was the experience.

I liked about it. What I liked about it so much was was nobody within the terminal. Like in the United terminal Because a lot of people didn't wake up that morning and say, I'm going to fly into Newark on United. But you did. Yeah, I had Van De Hei yesterday going,

I would never fly in. I was just like, I'm going to. That's right. You know, it's a great way to beat the... This might be the time to fly into Newark. You know, and it is, because nobody else is doing it right. I mean they even change you go in instead of like by the friendly skies, it's like we'll get you there dot dot dot maybe

so it was an act of bravery to every but I tell you what you it's best way to beat the crowd we salute your service. And the newer terminals are beautiful. Oh my if you get in there if you get in there. By the way I was skateboarding. It's going to fly into in the Newark other than me we're glad you're here. I tried to get up here 2 days, I know it's just going to fly United into the problem.

Where do you want to sit? That's exactly, exactly. Okay. All right, so Major League Baseball has reinstated Pete Rose. Commissioner Rob Manfred announced yesterday the all-time hits leader has been posthumously removed from the league's permanently ineligible list, paving the way for his potential election to the Hall of Fame. In a letter written by Manfred and sent to the Rose family's attorney, Manfred writes

this, In my view, once an individual has passed away, the purposes of Rule 21 have been served. Manfred was referring to the MLB rule prohibiting gambling and other misconduct that threatens the integrity of the game, which led to Rose's decades-long ban. The rule does not address what happens after a banned individual dies, leaving the door open to Manfred's interpretation. The decision also applies to 16 others, including shoeless Joe Jackson and his 7, 1919

so-called Chicago Black Sox teammates who threw the World Series that year. Joining us now, senior MLB writer for the athletic, Jason Stark and MSNBC contributor, Mike Barnicle. Good to see you both up. So Jason, what's your read on what prompted this move from Commissioner Manfred? Willie, I think it's certainly possible

to connect the dots between the commissioner's meeting with Donald Trump a few weeks ago and this decision. Before that meeting, there had never been any indication that Rob Bamford was open to reinstating Pete Rose or any of these other men. And things changed rapidly. So is it possible to connect those dots? I think it is. Yeah, so I'm curious why. So you think it may be the the

meeting with Donald Trump. I'm curious what your thought is, just just in general about what's your position been about Pete Rose? Because mine, mine is completely different than it is for some of the guys, whether it's Sosa and McGuire,

whose numbers were artificially elevated in a way that Bonds and, you know, Bonds and Clemens, they were great even before the steroids era and probably should get in. But I never quite understood Rose being kept out after all those years. What was your view? Well, Joe, like all the members of the baseball writers, I've never had a chance to vote on Pete Rose, but it's been interesting to watch the evolution of what we think about gambling, gambling in baseball, gambling in sports, through the years.

When Bart Giamatti announced this ban in 1989, this was viewed as the cardinal sin of baseball. And within the sport, it still is. You cannot bet on baseball if you work in baseball. And yet, you walk into ballparks now, and you can bet on the game you're going to watch right there at the ballpark. And so it's blurring the lines between how great a sin this actually is now in the eyes of many people. But when it comes to whether Pete Rose is going to get into the Hall of Fame, his fate is now in the hands of a committee. This committee will be made up of Hall of Fame players,

executives, and members of the media. And their opinions don't have to mirror what the public's opinions are. They know everything about Pete Rose. But I just wrote a column that's in the athletic, as we speak, that says by doing this, Rob Manfred is essentially telling us Pete Rose has served his time. And Joe, if he served his time, doesn't that mean we should be voting on him as Pete Rose, the

baseball player? And Pete Rose, the guy who got more hits than anybody who ever lived, that would seem like a Hall of Fame player. Yeah. So Mike Barnicle, you've long said that would seem like a Hall of Fame player. Yeah. So Mike Barnicle, you've long said, put Pete Rose in the Hall of Fame and put it on the plaque. Explain what he did alongside all of his accomplishments on the baseball field, which were many, of course, including being the all-time hits king.

You know the commissioner well. You're very plugged into Major League Baseball. What's your sense of how this all came about? It remains the same. Pete Rose, Shoeless Joe Jackson, a bunch of others, Bonds, Clemens, put them out on the Hall of Fame. They're Hall of Fame baseball players and put it on the plaque. Put the allegations on the plaque.

Put Pete Rose's entire career on the plaque. Jason raised a really critical point though. In baseball, in every clubhouse, in every Major League Baseball clubhouse, there is a sign about gambling. If you gamble, you're dead, you're out of the game. It's right there. You can read it when you go in the clubhouse, any clubhouse. And yet you can go sit and watch a ball game

and have someone sitting in front of you or behind you betting on at bats as the game takes place in front of us. And you watch the commercials on TV baseball games the game gambling institutions have provided so much money advertising money to Major League Baseball that it's kind of hypocritical to sit there and say oh no no he gambled he gambled he can't win all of fame and yet you're taking all of this money from these gambling institutions it's interesting I mean given all that I mean I and Rose was such an and I guess fame and yet you're taking all of this money from these gambling institutions. It's it's interesting.

I mean given all that I I and Rose was such an and I guess because I grew up watching Pete Rose never like him as a player as a Braves fan never liked his attitude never he was rough to say it was rough around the edges is an understatement I he does if He belongs in the Hall of Fame, Mike, doesn't he? He was extraordinary, an extraordinary player in every way. You know, I was talking with someone yesterday about Pete Rose, and he does have that reputation,

and that image is lasting. An angry guy, practically illiterate, always angry, tired to get along with. But I distinctly remember the night after game six of the 1975 World Series, the afternoon after that game, approaching Pete Rose, who was on the field at Fenway, working out, it was about three or four hours before game seven, unfortunately Red Sox lost game seven, approaching Pete Rose to ask him a question about playing in a game like that. And I was kind of anxious about his,

was he gonna tell me to screw, whatever. And I went up to him and I said, Pete, let me ask you something. What do you think, what happens to a player the day after a game that you played like last night? And he paused for a few seconds and looked right at me and said, you know, he said it was an honor to play in a game like that. That was one of the greatest games I've ever participated in.

And I was shocked. Wow, that is, that's just straight love of the game right there. So Jason, it sounds like you're open to the idea now of voting for Pete Rose. I don't want to put you on the spot in this moment unless you want to announce your vote for the Hall of Fame. What do you think about the other writers, your colleagues, the guys you've kind of grown up in the business and worked alongside for so long, what's their attitude about Pete Rose?

And do you think this decision by the commissioner changes it? Well, Pete Rose is never going to appear on the baseball writers' ballot. His time, his eligibility for that is over. So he will only appear on a ballot, as I said, that's considered by one of these committees. And there will be a lot of living Hall of Famers in the room. And my sense is they're divided about this Just as the people have been divided about it for three decades

but again, are they willing to look at what Rob Manfred did yesterday and Come to the same conclusion that I came to that if he served his time We should be thinking about Pete Rose the the baseball player, and that's that. That means you have to overlook a lot of stuff. There are a lot of clouds that come with Pete and his candidacy and everything about him. But it's interesting to contemplate what would happen if those voters come to the same conclusion

that I came to and elect Pete Rose. Mike mentioned Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens. I'm glad he mentioned them because once you open the door and Pete Rose bursts through and walks into Cooperstown, don't you think Bonds and Clemens and that whole group will be knocking on that door? It was very easy to keep them out when the guy who had the most hits in history was not in the Hall of Fame. If he's in, who knows who's next. It'll be interesting to see where they come down on this. Let's talk about another guy who's headed for the Hall of Fame someday as a

Yankee fan. Your column last week caught my eye. The headline is Aaron Judge, the greatest right-handed hitter of modern times. Yankee star has a case. He's having an unbelievable season about a quarter of the way through. Now the sample size is big enough. He's leading major league baseball in hitting by like 50 points ahead of the next guy and hits home runs, RBI's OPS, all the things that you can add up. Incredible. Is he then to get to your question, the greatest right handed hitter of modern times. You know, if you want to write a column that gets everybody in the country mad at you,

write that column. Because it doesn't matter how old you are, what generation you were from, what city you live in other than New York. People don't want to hear that because if Aaron Judge is the greatest right-handed hitter of the last hundred years It means Willie Mays isn't and Henry Aaron is and Joe DiMaggio isn't and Albert Pujols isn't and I'm well aware of All of those men and what they've done The point I tried to make is we're watching Aaron Judge do things that none of those guys ever did that no Right-handed

hitter has ever done. Take a look. You know, we have great tools now that allow us to compare every hitter to his era and the hitting climate that they play in. And those tools rank players on a scale of one to 100. So 100 is league average. 200 means you're twice as productive as league average. Over the last four seasons, Aaron Judge is at 207. So he's more than twice as productive as everyone else in the sport over four seasons.

I couldn't find any right-handed hitter who has done that since Rogers Hornsby. That was a while ago, Willie. That was a while back. Mike Barnicle, your thoughts on Judge and on the Red Sox tragically being eliminated from playoff contention last night in early May. Oh man, the Red Sox have lost seven one game, seven one game losses in a row.

You know, it's not even the middle of May really, it's the middle of May. And Whitlock keeps giving up three runs, like in every one of our blown saves. It's horrible. You know, but I choose to think that what Jason just mentioned, the judge stats, I'm not going to get into Willie Mays, he's my guy for right-handed hitters of all time, but Jason, you know, he made a strong case for Aaron Judge. But the gift of baseball is what we're talking about.

It's the only sport where the ordinary fan can talk about numbers at a certain level and have it make sense in terms of his love of baseball or her love of baseball. Baseball is such an incredible game. It's a talking point every inning, a talking point every game, whether you win or lose. Unfortunately, we're going through a tough time here in Boston, but that's going to be manageable. We're going to take care of that. Alex's score is great, but the larger cosmic sense is Major League Baseball and Little League Baseball from all the way up is the greatest game ever created. Here here. And there you go. All right senior MLB writer for the Athletic Jason Stark thank you very much for coming on this morning. Thank you Jason.