Morning Joe - Morning Joe 7/11/23

Episode Date: July 11, 2023

Ukraine tops Biden's agenda at key NATO meeting with alliance set to expand

I would take this opportunity to point out that in a lot of the coverage coming into the summit, I would say rumors of the death of NATO's unity were greatly exaggerated. Every few months, the question is called, can the West hang together? Can NATO hang together? Can transatlantic unity hang together? Every time allies gather, that question gets re-upped. And every time the allies come together and answer it forcefully and vehemently, yes, we can. National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan touting the strength and unity of the NATO allies as the group's summit gets underway in Lithuania.

NATO Secretary General is already calling this summit historic following a diplomatic breakthrough. We'll explain that in just a moment. Meanwhile, Ukraine's president continues to press the alliance for membership and military support. We'll go through his latest demand from NATO members and we'll get a live report from Lithuania as President Biden prepares for two high profile meetings on the sidelines. There are a lot going on on the world stage this morning. Good morning and welcome to Morning Joe. It is Tuesday, July 11th. Along with Joe, Willie and me, we have Pulitzer Prize winning columnist and associate editor of the Washington Post, Eugene Robinson, and President Emeritus of the Council on Foreign Relations,

Richard Haass, back with us this morning. He somehow becomes even more distinguished. It is. It's amazing. Erudite is the word that comes to mind. Yeah. There is a glow about it. So, Willie, first of all, and also we're going to be getting to, of course, that whistleblower that Koma couldn't find. Yeah. Then he said MSNBC, you know, must be humiliated. Ends up, they found him. Oh, boy.

In the Southern District of New York. Oh, no. A Chinese spy or something like that. We're going to get the details for that in a little bit. I mean, seriously, the gang that couldn't shoot straight, they keep getting the gun, political gun, aiming it right at

their foot. Right? It's just, it's absolutely crazy. And Willie last night, of course, Midsommar's, just one of the funnest Midsommar's annual traditions. No, I'm not the funnest Midsummer's annual traditions. No, I'm not talking about Joey Chestnut winning Nathan's hot dog eating contest for the 16th time. 16th time.

You've got to love the guy. But the Home Run Derby last night, how exciting. Yeah, it was amazing. Vlad Guerrero Jr. of the Blue Jays won the thing. His dad actually won it, Vlad Sr., Hall of Famer, in 2007. First father-son combo ever to do it. But really, this was in Seattle. The story early on was Julio Rodriguez of the Mariners, hometown guy, set a single-round record.

He had 41 home runs. He had a season's worth of home runs in one round. Turned out he kind of spent all his bullets in that first round and lost in the semifinals to Guerrero. This is Guerrero still here. Here's Rodriguez. I mean, they just kept coming. And look at Joe. Look at the BP. He's not even stepping. He's just chucking it

right where he wants it, right down the heart of the plate. And so that was an amazing display in front of the hometown fans. But he lost in the next round to Guerrero. What a show it was last night, though. And then we got the all-star game tonight, Joe. The Yankees' Garrett Cole getting the start for the American League in Seattle tonight.

That's very good, and it would be great to have a team that had a lot of people that are all-stars like the Yankees, but we don't, actually. We don't. It's sad to say we don't. We don't. We don't. Through all of you. And I think we have Kenley and that's it. But anyway, let's get to the news. There's actually big news. And I want to get to the the president emeritus.

So, yeah, we should get his analysis talking about development. The Sweden development. It's hard to hard to overestimate how important that is for NATO. And what an extraordinary year this has been for that group's vitality, for the growth. And for the world. Yeah. The safety of the world. Safety of the world. Let's get the headlines, though.

Join us now from the site of the NATO summit in Lithuania. Host of Way Too Early and White House Bear Chief at Politico, Jonathan Lemire. Jonathan, big takeaways this morning. Yeah. Hello there from Vilnius. Lovely morning here in Lithuania. And we should note there are Ukrainian flags everywhere in this city, a city that's completely turned out and show solidarity with the war effort, the resistance against Russia, of course, here in a former Soviet state in the Baltics. One, and I'm standing in George W. Bush Plaza, named after the former president because he gave a speech here in 2002 in which he urged Lithuania to be admitted to NATO. And NATO transformed then and has done so again now. A breakthrough last night as Turkish President Erdogan has dropped Turkey's objections

to Sweden entering the alliance. It is now a mere formality before Sweden does some technical stuff to get finished. But here in Vilnius, it is mission accomplished already for the alliance. Finland is already in. President Biden is going to mark that triumph later this week when he travels to Helsinki. And today it is all about Sweden and their military being at the alliance, expanding this group that, of course, is the exact opposite of what Vladimir Putin tried to do when he invaded Ukraine, claiming he wanted to diminish NATO. Instead, NATO is only stronger and larger. And we will hear from the president later today. The NATO summit has indeed kicked off. He's had a couple of meetings already. The big one later on today, he will meet with Turkish President Erdogan on the heels of Turkey, allowing Sweden to join NATO.

Wow. I will be watching for that. And Jonathan, talk a little bit about Ukraine in all of this, because obviously Sweden moving toward membership is huge news. And Ukraine, this is a bit of a debate as the NATO allies and America especially supports Ukraine in their war against Russia. They want membership as well. Yeah, and the war is certainly front of mind here in Lithuania. We're just a few miles from the border of Belarus. Belarus, of course, a close Russian ally. And we're just a few hundred miles from both Ukraine and Russia itself. And we've heard from President Zelensky repeatedly in recent days pushing the case for Ukraine to be admitted to NATO. But the president, Biden himself, has said they're not ready just yet.

And National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan, you played a little bit of him at the top. I was in that briefing this morning, and he reiterated that. First of all, if Ukraine were to be admitted to the alliance now, it would automatically trigger Article 5 and therefore put the whole alliance at war with Russia, which, of course, they don't want to do. And they also feel like Ukraine has some domestic housekeeping steps, some corruption to eliminate before it would be ready to join NATO. So the United States has said no. They do not feel like Ukraine is ready. Other members of NATO want to push that forward on a faster track. But what Jake Sullivan told us this morning is that the hope here in Vilnius, it won't be admission for Ukraine,

but a path could be created that the next steps, maybe not a specific timetable, but the next steps will be laid out to eventually get Ukraine in this alliance. And it will certainly be the number one talking point at the president's top, President Biden's top meeting tomorrow when he sits down with President Zelensky here in Vilnius. And we're just hearing that we may hear from President Biden and NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg in a matter of moments, an unscheduled set of comments. So we'll be looking for that and bringing it to you live. Jonathan Lemire reporting live.

By the way, can I just say, very professional for him to not go to his regular Lithuanian lake house. Oh, you're talking about... Yeah, do the hit from there. Right. Thanks for showing up. He's big in Lithuania, Lemire is. Yeah, I know.

They have a lot of property there. They do. Jonathan Lemire reporting live. Yeah, that's my August notification. I know where you'll be in August. Okay. Jonathan Lemire reporting live from the NATO summit in Lithuania.

Thank you very much. So, Willie, it is, again, it's fascinating. If we have, you know, our graphics department on Morning Joe, Willie, one of the most advanced in the world. Well, they are. No, they are. They're amazing. We use 3D maps. It's just a lot of things moving across.

So, TJ, if we could get the map up, the NATO map up. It's really it's just look at that. Look at that. It's great. It's kind of like it's moving towards you right now. Whoa. Oh, hey, wait. I think it looks fantastic. So, so, Willie, as we look at this extraordinarily rendered 3D map of the of Europe and NATO, this is this is just it's extraordinary to look at. And you see basically two blue patches there, one of them being Sweden, which is about to go green as well.

Wow. And this I know Richard can talk about this, but Willie, this is Vladimir Putin's worst nightmare. And the fact that the only thing that's not colored in green outside of Sweden, which will be soon, is Ukraine. I mean, that's that's the last remaining holdout. And the author of this Russian tragedy, Vladimir Putin himself. I mean, just looking at this map explains why this has been such a nightmare for him. I mean, Finland, Sweden and last week, Secretary General Stoltenberg said he sees Ukraine on a path, not imminently, but on a path toward NATO membership. And Richard, as Joe says, go back a year and a half, what Vladimir Putin thought was going to happen, that he was going to roll into Ukraine and raise the Russian flag over Kiev. And now look what has actually happened. It is extraordinary

how he, Vladimir Putin, has hastened this NATO membership for both Finland and Sweden and really rallied the West. We're seeing it on display this morning. We're going to see it again later today. Rallied the West to be stronger than it ever has been right on the border of Russia. The day will come when Russians will see Vladimir Putin as arguably one of the worst, if not the worst leaders in their history. He exposed Russian weakness. He then made Russia much weaker because of the economic price they've paid, military price they've paid, and so forth. And look how he's created thousands of miles, if I did the math, I hope I'm right, of new border with NATO.

And Sweden will become the 32nd member of NATO. So the strategic position of Russia is far, far worse. The internal problems of Russia are enormous, and he's not addressing those. So, no, again, he will be excoriated ultimately by history. What's your sense, Richard, of how this went down with Turkey, with President Erdogan? What did he get? What did he finally receive that made him say, OK, we're going to clear the path Sweden's in? If you remember years ago when Turkey started buying Russian air defense systems, we put on hold American advanced fighter jets. I think those are now going to have 16, 35 program.

You're going to see a deal there. What Erdogan was talking about was getting Turkey into the European Union. That's not going to happen anytime soon. It's just too big, too difficult, given the demographics. But I think, Willie, there's a pretty good chance that Turkey essentially will be able to get what it wants on the security front. Greece will not be happy with that, but Turkey will be happy with that. And obviously, this will pave the way for Sweden to get into NATO. Gene? Richard, I'm curious as to how you see this sort of conundrum here about Ukraine. On the one hand, President Biden, I think, is prudent and right that you don't admit Ukraine to NATO right now, that we put NATO in a state of war with Russia. That's something, obviously, we want to avoid. At the same time,

we don't want to give Vladimir Putin a kind of veto against Ukraine ever getting into NATO and give him an incentive to to sort of draw out and prolong the war and say we're still at war, even perhaps after the war is over. So how do you deal with with that sort of paradox? Well, you're right, Gene. It is a paradox. I think the president was right, if not quite for the reasons he said. It would be premature to let Ukraine in, not because the democracy isn't consolidated, but we're there at war. We don't want all of NATO to be at war with Russia, the cost of that, the risk of escalation to nuclear weapons.

Also, it's really not clear what Ukraine would NATO be committing to defend. Is it 1991 Ukraine or 2014 Ukraine or Ukraine of yesterday? And what about when the border changes a couple of kilometers tomorrow? So I just don't think it's a practical thing. The good news is NATO can make a clear long-term commitment on economic and military help, training, equipment, intelligence support for Ukraine, which sends the message to Vladimir Putin that time is not on his side there. Plus, NATO has something called Article 4. Article 5 is the traditional commitment. That's territorially

based. And as I said, I think that's premature. But NATO can make it clear that it is committed to Ukraine's independence and existence and will do whatever it needs to do in order to assure that. It's very much what the United States has done with Israel. And last I checked, Israel's done pretty well with that kind of an American commitment. So I think there's lots of things NATO could and should do short of giving an explicit Article 5 type commitment. That would come, I think, in the context of either a peace, a ceasefire, the kind of armistice you have on the Korean Peninsula. Once the territorial outlines are more clear, NATO could make a commitment to that. And then Ukraine could pursue its ultimate

territorial goals at the negotiating table. Well, Richard, I mean, you've talked about it. I've talked about it. There is, again, it doesn't have to be an all or nothing sort of NATO membership. We actually can strike a deal. And of course, nobody will like this, but that's why it's a deal. We can strike a deal with Russia, Ukraine and China and China can be part of the rebuilding with us. And by having China being part of the rebuilding with us, they make some money on the rebuild and also send a very strong message along with us. It's almost sort of a post-1945 solution to Vladimir Putin that Ukraine is now off limits.

And again, that'll offend, I'm sure, a lot of backbenchers. But if the goal is to secure Ukraine, if the goal is to send a very loud, clear message to Russia that they have completely isolated themselves in the world, then some sort of peace deal like that makes sense. And by the way, I think you'd agree with me also. There is no peace deal without China being a part of it, without China leaning on Russia saying, hey, the gig's up. 100 percent. Essentially, China needs to say the no limits relationship we signed 17 months ago, we changed our mind. They're now our limits. And it's contingent. We already see it, Joe. China has reportedly given the Russians very

tough messages about not using nuclear weapons. Hopefully, they've given them a tough message about not attacking the nuclear power plant. But yeah, I think the day will come when we need to rope China into the diplomacy. It would be a positive demonstration, a rare one, about what U.S.-China relations can accomplish. Send a powerful message to Vladimir Putin about his diplomatic isolation. Also, economically, China's in a position to put pressure on Russia. So I think that's critical. I actually think one of the, you know, you just said Treasury Secretary Yellen in China. You just said the Secretary of State there. I think the improvement of relations with China is setting the stage for this.

Richard, we're going to jump in here with President Biden and Jens Stoltenberg at the NATO summit. This summit is already historic because the agreement we made yesterday will make Sweden a full member of NATO. That will make our Alliance even more capable of defending all Allies. At this meeting we will also send a clear message to Ukraine that we stand by them as long as needed, and also that we agree on the united and positive message on the path forward for Ukraine and membership for Ukraine. Another major message from this summit will be that we need to invest more in our defence and we will agree a new defence investment pledge where we state clearly that 2% of GDP for defence is a minimum. The good news is that European allies and Canada are stepping up. This year we have new numbers showing that they have added 8.3% in real terms for their

defence budgets. This is record high, and that demonstrates that Allies are delivering on their commitments. So once again, Mr. President, it's great to have you here at the NATO Summit. SECRETARY KERRY, NATO UNION COMMISSIONER, It's good to be here, and thank you for continuing to deliver. I have made no mistake, the press is not at all surprised. I've been touting the fact that I think it's really important at this critical moment in the whole NATO issue that you continue to lead NATO. You're trusted. No one knows the situation that we're facing better than you do.

And this is a stark moment. The adding of Finland and Sweden to NATO is consequential, and your leadership really matters. And we agree on the language that you proposed relative to the future of Ukraine being able to join NATO. And we're looking forward to continuing to unite NATO. They've heard me say, my American president heard me say many times, I still think that President Putin thinks the way he succeeds is to break NATO. He's not going to do that, especially when he visits NATO. So thank you for willing to do it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Mr. President, what is your role in getting Turkey to agree? Mr. President, Mr. President, why weren't you at the signing? All right. Joint brief statement by President Biden and NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg. President Biden, especially marking this historic moment with Sweden on the way to being a member of NATO, calling it really a consequential moment and says leadership matters as it pertains to Ukraine. He said, we look toward a continued united NATO as they deal with the war. And, you know, leadership matters as it pertains to the United States as well. And there you see Joe Biden walking out once again.

And, of course, his critics wondering, you know, making comments about how he walks. I'm dead serious. Making comments about how he walks. Finland becomes a member of NATO, how he falls off a bike. Sweden becomes a member of NATO. He eats an ice cream cone. Yeah, he eats an ice cream cone. The United States of America puts together, Gene Robinson, perhaps not only the greatest alliance in European history in peacetime, but also around China. I mean, there is a reason. There's a reason why President Xi has been angry at the United States of America. And it's not because we shot down a balloon.

It's because we've ramped up pressure on them. And Joe Biden and the Biden administration has strengthened our military relationship with Japan, with the Philippines, with Guam, with Australia, with South Korea. They are getting hemmed in every day and they don't like it. This is the pivot to Asia that George W. Bush was going to do. This was a pivot to Asia that Barack Obama was going to do. This was a pivot to Asia that Donald Trump was going to do. This is a pivot to Asia that Joe Biden, a guy who can't really ride a bike that well, his critics will say, that Joe Biden's done. And again, there's so much fluff. There's so much, so many points scored on style instead of substance. You just look at the results. Look at the results. There's not a, there's just not a comparison

to what's happened over the past two and a half years and really what happened in the 15 years preceding that. Absolutely. He just gets stuff done. You talked about Asia, this quad group with Japan and Australia and India and the United States is something that China just kind of didn't see coming and has put them kind of on the back foot. And then you look at that map, the three-dimensional Morning Joe graphics map of Europe and NATO. And the Baltic Sea, you could now call it the NATO Sea if you wanted to. I mean, with Sweden, you make Sweden green and you are essentially encircling the Baltic Sea, which, of course, thanks to Peter the Great, is Russia's great sort of outlet to the Atlantic and to the world.

But there you have it. It's surrounded by NATO. It's really an extraordinary piece of statecraft and diplomacy that President Biden and Secretary Blinken and Secretary Austin and his team have put together to make this happen. And it happened faster than anybody could imagine. Nobody thought NATO would would would emerge this much stronger from this direct challenge from Vladimir Putin. And he's getting exactly the opposite of what he wanted. And you just have to credit Joe Biden's leadership. He's the leader of the free world.

Joe Biden's leadership, Willie, and an extraordinary team that's around him. And add, obviously, Jake Sullivan to that. Jake has been at the center of everything, along with with Secretary Blinken and Secretary Austin and the entire national security team. Yeah. Jake Sullivan helping to lead this trip. Right. He spoke just a few minutes ago to the press, as a matter of fact. And Richard, we expect to see President Biden meeting with President Zelensky maybe a little bit later today. Again, just showing physically, in this case, standing shoulder to shoulder with him. There's a story about cluster munitions potentially going, the F-16s a few weeks ago. The support is unrelenting up to this point. So where does this war stand now? And what does Vladimir Putin think as he's watching

countries added to NATO? He's watching all of these Western leaders gathered today standing in the face of Vladimir Putin. He's seeing that the United States and the West are not backing down from their support of Ukraine. What does that tell him about where this war is headed? I'd say in the right now, here we are, what, month 17 of the war. Ukraine has launched its so-called counteroffensive. It's going quite slowly, in part because you've got a lot of Russian troops heavily dug in. It always takes far more offense to dislodge defense. So it's a slog.

It's not transformational. And that could go on for quite a while. There could be breakthroughs. We'll see what the effect of clustered munitions are. They could make a difference. But my guess is, Willie, in a few months, the battlefield will kind of look familiar to what it looks like now. And if you're Vladimir Putin, you just want to hang in there. You basically are hoping for weakening in the West, people calling for an end to the war. Again, the 2024 American elections are going to be critical. Putin seems to have a

little bit murky, but short up his domestic position. We're not quite sure what's going on there, but my hunch is he, for the time being, seems fairly secure. So if you're Vladimir Putin, right now, you win by not losing. You hang in there and you see what time delivers for you. And Ukraine probably feels slightly greater urgency. That's why, again, what's important is what happens in Vilnius. The messages of long-term support are really important. And that sends a message to Vladimir Putin that the West is not going to fade with time. And then we circle back to what Joe said. Does this ultimately, the Chinese who are suffering, you know, having a real tough time economically. Do they finally decide this war isn't serving their interests?

They want to impress the Europeans about that. The Europeans ought to move closer to China rather than sign up with us on economic sanctions. So there's a lot of moving parts here. But I don't think the battlefield is going to be transformed anytime soon. All right. Still ahead on Morning Joe, we're going to speak with National Security Council spokesman John Kirby as the annual NATO summit is underway this morning. Plus, we'll take a look at why former President Donald Trump has launched a new attack on Iowa's Republican governor. Also ahead, new polling that shows Florida Governor Ron DeSantis lagging in the GOP presidential primary among voters in his own state.

And former New Jersey governor and 2024 Republican presidential candidate Chris Christie will be our guest this morning. And of course, we're going to be showing you the clips of the Russian. I'm not Russian. I'm sorry. That was a point slip. We're going to show you a clip of the Republican guy who said MSNBC should be humiliated or embarrassed or something because they found, they found, they're informant. Unfortunately, so did the feds. Looks he might be a russian spy you can't make this up you're watching morning joe we'll be right back sunshine i haven't seen that in a while. Where is the sun? It's beautiful. Capitol Hill, which is absolutely gorgeous at 631.

So, Willie, I don't follow news much. In my business, you really don't have to. I'm a little out of it. We're always trying to be clear about that. I would call myself a generalist, but that's a horrible insult to generalists the world over. So I got a couple of things wrong. This so-called whistleblower. Everything. They have not actually caught the so-called whistleblower that James Converse.

He is a fugitive from the run. That James Converse. So he is a fugitive from the law. So they they have embraced these these House Republicans, a fugitive on the law. And also just because, you know, we were going to break and we've been talking about Russia. I said that he might be a Russian spy. No, no, no, no. I'm so sorry. Not a Russian spy. He may be the Republicans. Great hope. Maybe a Chinese spy. So he's on the run. He's a fugitive from the law. And the fine people in the Southern District of New York think that Comer's like ace in his pocket,

that he's going to pull out and show the libs. He's going to he's going to own the libs with a suspected Chinese spy fugitive from the law. And there you have Willie Geist, your 2023 House Republican caucus? Your analysis is correct, though incomplete. He also is accused of being an illegal arms dealer and of lying to federal agents. So there's a lot going on here. The guy's name is Gal Luft. And he has, as you said, he is a man who this oversight committee led by Congressman James Comer of Kentucky. They have hung their case on this man. Gal Lou charged in the Southern District of New York. The U.S. attorney said he engaged in multiple serious criminal schemes.

He's a dual Israeli U.S. citizen, the head of a think tank in Maryland. It's an eight count indictment against him. It was unsealed yesterday. Includes conspiracy to violate the Foreign Agents Registration Act and the Arms Export Control Act and making false statements, among others. DOJ stated, quote, the man subverted foreign agent registration laws in the United States to seek to promote Chinese policies by acting through a former high ranking U.S. government official. He acted as a broker in deals for dangerous weapons in Iranian oil

and told multiple lies about his crimes to law enforcement. Luft was initially arrested in February before skipping bail. He skipped bail. He's a fugitive. Congressional Republicans said they spoke with Luft about the business dealings of the Biden family, told members of the press he had gone missing. Those same lawmakers also have called him, quote, very credible. As recently as Friday, Republican Congressman James Comer of Kentucky, as I said, he's the chair of the Oversight Committee, said this. He's very credible. And the people on MSNBC who made fun of me when I said we had an informant that was missing, they should feel like fools right now.

And this is their worst nightmare because again, this is a credible witness that the FBI flew all the way to Brussels to interview and sent several agents to interview. So to recap, Joe, this man, this man, Gal looked who they James Comer. Hold on. Go ahead. Go ahead. OK, so he's your man, that Congressman Comer, the head of oversight. Senator Ron Johnson has been on TV a lot talking about this man as well. They've hung their case. They said he can tell the story of the alleged Biden crime family doing business with China, et cetera. He is accused in eight count indictment, among other things, of being an illegal arms broker and unregistered arm, illegal arms dealer. OK, unregistered agent for the Chinese government. We're working with the Chinese illegally. OK, I get that one. Helping China to get Iranian oil in violation of U.S. sanctions.

OK, hold on. I've got to put down illegally. Hold on. Illegally smuggling, smuggling Iranian oil for the Chinese Communist Party. Okay, so wait, hold on a second. Okay, because this is a lot, and I'm a simple country lawyer. So we've got the Chinese espionage, we've got the illegal arms dealer, and we've got him illegally smuggling Iranian oil for the Chinese Communist Party. Does that have it? Does that well? And then just to just to put a period on the end of the sentence and then lying to federal agents about all of it. So this is an eight counted diamond. Again, this man is on the run, fugitive from from the U.S.

government. I got to say, Comer's right that comer feel like a fool i mean seriously how could we've ever doubted this guy how could we have doubted comer simpson seriously eugene eugene so he lied to the feds about engaging in i think it's chinese espionage he lied about being an arms dealer he lied about about illegally smuggling Iranian oil to the Chinese Communist Party. He is a fugitive on the run from the law. And this Comer guy says that we should feel foolish because they've got a really credible witness here. Joe, oh, the shame. Oh, the humanity.

How could we have doubted Congressman Comer? As always, he comes through with the Chinese spy smuggler arms dealer that we've all been waiting to hear from if we could ever find him. And, you know, they flew him into Brussels to interview him. Yeah, they probably flew to Brussels to try to arrest him and drag him down for his various crimes. But Comer has really proven, even in the constellation of crazy House Republicans trying to investigate and pin something on the Biden something, anything. Comer has actually distinguished himself as, I think,

the worst at this point. He is really incompetent at this and they should have picked somebody else. Yeah, no doubt about it. And, you know, Richard Haass, this is this is every time I bring this up, people that are actually inside the bubble in this right wing House Republican bubble are in this ecosystem that thinks Hunter Biden is going to unlock every door politically they ever need to unlock. I keep saying you guys just you keep shooting yourselves in the foot. All of these investigations, not just Hunter Biden, but they have that that poor Durham fella that that that that tried to indict people and tried to prove that the FBI somehow was, you know, Hillary and the FBI were spying on Donald Trump. I mean, juries laugh him out of the courtroom two times. He proves absolutely nothing. You then move on. Of course, there are a couple of hacks that that try to

protect the defending, but they can't. And then we move on to Comer and Hunter Biden's laptop and Hunter Biden's this and Hunter Biden's that. And they just again, I'm dead serious here. They keep making fools of themselves. And Comer, I mean, at some point, Comer, who I understand was once a fairly respected member of Congress, if I'm not mistaken from what I've read. At some point, you've got to you've got to quit while you're behind and they just can't do it now. Now he's going on TV bragging about having a guy who is a fugitive from the law, who who helped smuggle oil for Iran, Iranian oil to the Chinese Communist Party, is an illegal arms dealer and is suspected of illegally cooperating with the Chinese. I don't know if he's a Chinese spy, if it's Chinese espionage. I don't know exactly how the feds are going to turn that eventually,

but he's a fugitive on the run from the law for helping the Chinese, helping the Iranians, smuggling Iranian oil to the Chinese Communist Party. Again, quit while you're behind James Comer and Republican Party. Start talking about inflation. Look, so much of this is the alternative is having to defend Donald Trump and the various charges against him. So on the old adage that, you know, the best defense is a good offense. You have this serially unsuccessful attempt to play offense against President Biden, Hunter Biden and all that. And I think, Joe, this what this shows is that a lot of these Republicans realize there's no defense of the former president. They're just trying to distract and change the story. The good news out of all this, though, I think is we could get a remake, Joe, of The Fugitive.

And we could have a whole new series, a whole new movie based upon this character and just bring it up to date. The 2023 version of the fugitive. Well, Harrison Ford remade Indiana Jones. Why not? Why not the fugitive? You'll be not surprised at all to learn, Joe and Mika, that the response from Republicans in the last couple of days has been that the Justice Department is targeting Gal Luft, that the Justice Department is weaponized. They're trying to silence this man by pursuing these charges against him because he has all the answers to the alleged Biden crime family. Well, of course, this is this is again, Willie. I mean, they attack the FBI for trying to get nuclear secrets back and safeholding. They attack the FBI for trying to get secret Iranian war

war plans back into safeholding place. It's just it's a latest example. And I hope they all I mean, I hope I hope all of these people do expose themselves in supporting if if this is who they really are. I mean, if they want to support a guy that is illegally dealing with China and illegally smuggling Iranian oil, illegally being an arms dealer. I think that exposes them even more for who they are, people who don't give a damn about this country, people who don't give a damn about law enforcement, people who are going to attack law enforcement when they actually try to do their jobs. It's just really, I mean, but if there is, if there is a remake of The Fugitive, who is it?

Tommy Lee Jones? Who is the guy in The Fugitive? Yeah, at the end of this, yeah, yeah, at the end of this, you're going to have Harrison Ford playing Guy Luft. Is that his name? Gal. And they're going to be in that water drain.

And Tommy Lee Jones is going to say, Harrison Ford is going to say, let me go. And Guy Luft is going to say, you're guilty. And Harrison Ford is going to go, yeah, I am. I mean, it's just's it's really bad while we're at it meanwhile the federal prosecutor did you know that this guy smuggled this is oil arraigning oil illegally for the chinese communist party did you know that i didn't and james cover is on side. Did you know that this guy actually like worked with the Chinese communist government and James Comer likes this guy? And did you know this guy is an illegal arms dealer? And James Comer is proud to be on his side. I'm telling you, this is a whole new day for

the Republican Party. The Republican Party is embracing, and I just can't say it enough, people who illegally smuggle Iranian oil to the Chinese Communist Party. Bless your heart. Strike up the band, Mabel. It's going to be a hell of a 2024. Okay, go ahead, sweetie. Someone help me. Meanwhile, the

federal prosecutor who reached a plea deal with Hunter Biden is... Oh, boy. Now, this one is bad, right? Right? This one's bad for the Bidens. He's disputing claims made by an IRS whistleblower

and Republican lawmakers. Wait, what? Delaware U.S. Attorney David Weiss says. Wait, this guy's appointed by Trump, right? There's a Trump guy? He had the clearance to bring charges against the president's son in any jurisdiction. The whistleblower had claimed Weiss was blocked from doing so by Democratic-appointed U.S. attorneys. In a letter to the Senate Judiciary Committee, Weiss also wrote that he never asked to be named a special counsel, as some Republican lawmakers have claimed. He says

he did seek status as a special attorney, which would give him authority to file charges anywhere without permission of the U.S. attorney in that district. And Willie, again, as Greek philosopher Aristotle once said, now they're just making stuff up. I cleaned it up for the kids today. I cleaned it up for the kids today. But really, they're making all of these wild charges up. They all blow up in their faces and they wonder why they keep losing elections. Well, it resonates in a certain media ecosystem. As you said a minute ago, this is what people are talking about on certain TV shows and certain websites. And it does have the feeling of an important investigation to certain people. The question is, when you get out into the country and you walk around, do people feel like this is significant?

They understand if Hunter Biden did something wrong, if he committed a crime, he ought to be charged. If he did something serious enough, he ought to go to jail. That's it, period. Yes, that's true. But they're also, Joe, the Republicans have to make up their mind. Is Joe Biden a doddering old man who can't find the right door to leave after a press conference? Or is he the mastermind of an international criminal scheme that involves China and involves Russia and Ukraine and all these different places where he's enriching himself and his family?

Kind of can't be both. This is one of those situations where two things can't be true at the same time. There's no dialectical here. Richard Haass, thank you very much. I'm not sure that was worth your while. Thanks for coming on. Richard, do you have any closing thoughts as President Emeritus of Council on Foreign Relations? Joe, short answer is no.

I look forward to the game tonight. Wow. Good to see the Yankees have the starting pitcher in the game. And American League East, just saying, all five teams above 500 at the All-Star break. Impressive. Okay. Yeah, there we go. Coming up. Thank you, Richard. I kind of expected more from that emeritus status, but I guess he wants to get out. He wants to go. Coming up, hundreds of military promotions, including high-ranking officials, are on hold because of Republican Senator Tommy Tuberville of Alabama. We'll explain why he is blocking service members from moving up in the ranks.

Causing real problems, by the way. Also ahead. Real problems for America's national security. I hope he's proud of himself. Former Trump advisor Steve Bannon is on the hook for a $500,000 bill. He bought a lot of shirts. You know he wears three a day.

Yeah, he's got a big sweat through. We'll go through that new legal development ahead on Morning Joe. Welcome back. Fifty two past the hour. Republican Senator Tommy Tuberville of Alabama vowed to continue blocking the leader of the United States Marine Corps, which is now without a permanent chief for the first time in over a century. The Alabama senator is using a procedure to slow approvals that are usually completed with a unanimous consent vote. The senator is pushing for the Defense Department to scrap its policy that gives time off and travel reimbursements

to service members that have to travel out of state for abortion services. Tupperville, single-handedly, his stoppage is coming at a time when more than half of the current Joint Chiefs are expected to step down from their posts in the next few months without a successor in place. Take a listen to what the senator said yesterday about his actions. I've got a great deal of admiration for General Smith. Earlier today, General Smith became the acting head of the Marine Corps. He is doing the same exact job which he has been doing for several years. The only difference is today he is an acting official.

This has minimal effect of the ability to lead. There may be a delay in his planning guidance, and yet he cannot move into the commandant's residence. But there is little doubt about General Smith's ability to lead effectively. General Smith assured me that he was committed to keeping politics out of the military. And for me to vote for somebody, that's exactly what I'm looking for. Keep politics out of the military. I mean, this is so shocking to me. That's exactly what I'm looking for. Keep politics out of the military. I mean, this is this is so shocking to me. Mike Barnicle, I've been hearing Republicans whine about how much they love Russia and how they love the Russian military, how the Russian military is manly and America's military is not because they're too woke and they're too concerned about social policy issues invading the military's

readiness. That's all a lie. But of course, they project or maybe it's confession because it's exactly what Tommy Tuberville is doing here. The thought that he is bringing a he's being a cultural warrior and bringing a wedge issue into the United States Marine Corps to stop the Marines for the first time in 150 years from having a commandant to lead the Marine Corps is beyond shocking. And I really can't believe that other Republicans around Tommy Tuberville in the United States Senate, who are supposed to be the sane people, I can't believe that they're sitting by and letting this guy continue to do this. Well, Joe, I mean, you know this better than anybody. This is the 2023 version of the Republican Party. Let's take on the intelligence community of the United States of America. Let's take on the FBI, the vaunted legal arm of the Justice Department. Let's take on the military. That's what Tommy Tuberville is doing. He can't even pronounce the words. As you just indicated, he said, you know, the

Commandments House. It's the Commandant's House. And for the first time, as you pointed out, over 150 years, the United States Marine Corps is without a commandant. Dave Berger, the commandant of the Marine Corps right now, he retires in a couple of weeks. And because Tommy Tuberville has decided that he knows more than anybody else about the defense of the United States of America. He has held up line promotions now for a couple of months. He'll probably continue to do it. And who in the Republican Party is really speaking out loud about it?

But Mike, he's not saying that he knows more about defense. He's saying he doesn't want women to do what's legal. Yeah. For them to legally travel to another state. He is going to stop the United States Marine Corps from having a commandant for the first time in 150 years, not not for anything that has to do with America's readiness, not for anything that has to do with protecting and defending the United States of America. No, he's stopping the United States Marine Corps from having a commandant for the first time in 150 years because he doesn't want to allow women to get health care to do what's legal and that is go to a state where they can get an abortion if that's what they choose

to get or medically need for their life or they need to do it for for medical reasons and it's the united states marine Corps that he's declaring war against. Well, it's not just the Marine Corps, though, Joe. I mean, there were hundreds of line officers who were due promotions, and they can't get those promotions because of Tommy Tuberville. And this is a guy who represents a state, an honorable, noble state, who has committed over the years, over the decades, hundreds, hundreds of young people to the military in defense of this country. And he alone, he alone is standing against all of this progress because, as you said,

the ability of women to travel to other states to maintain their health. That's what he's doing. And where are the Republican voices in the United States Senate speaking out loudly against this? They might be talking to him off the floor and everything like that. Where are they speaking out loudly and publicly about this obscenity? Well, let's put that question to NBC News Capitol Hill correspondent Ali Vitale, who's been covering this story. Ali, good morning. So where is this going? Where does it end?

He's not going to get what he wants out of the Defense Department. It's not going to change its policy on this. So how does Senator Tuberville end this charade? I mean, it's been going on for months now at this point. And that's the question that we've been asking. I think he's gone to the floor. He said 11 times as of yesterday to reiterate the fact that he's not backing down on this. I think y'all are asking the right question in terms of where are other Republicans on this. I have spoken to Republican lawmakers who say that they vehemently disagree with what he's doing. But the reality of the Senate is he can do this. One senator can hold up anything that's trying to be done by unanimous consent.

That is just the way that this place works. It is built on collegiality and sort of rationality prevailing. Of course, that's not what's happening here. And we're watching the ways that the processes break down in this new current version of 2023 politics, especially on the Republican side. I think the other piece of this, too, that I've been reminded of consistently as I've been reporting on this and Democratic Senators Shaheen and Patty Murray reminded me of this just a few weeks ago when we did a story for your show to mark the Dobbs anniversary. It's that this is not a question of simply just accessing health care, but also a question of military readiness from the perspective of there are recruitment problems within the U.S. military.

Those metrics and milestones for recruitment numbers are being missed. And these veterans, or rather would-be veterans and military members, don't get to choose where they are stationed. And so they could be stationed in a state like Texas that is restricted or they could be stationed in a state like California that has less restrictions. It becomes very difficult to recruit people, but specifically women to the military. If you're telling them that they're not in charge of where they can go, but they're also not going to be in charge of their own health care based on states when they can get there. And so that's a really important piece of this, too. This is military readiness at its finest. And frankly, that's what most military officials have said in response to this as well. Well, I've been hearing I've heard from CEOs about decisions not to move to certain states that have more restrictive abortion laws.

And now here's a bigger problem for America, as you said. So it now becomes a readiness problem. If you're a woman who wants to get involved in the United States military, if you're a husband whose wife doesn't want to travel to you with a state that bans abortions or has a six-week ban on abortion and starts to hear about this sort of hostility towards women making health care choices again. It becomes a real readiness problem. I mean, does Tommy Tuberville, does he not want women to join the military? Is that what this is about? Or does he just not want women who have pregnancies in the military?

And that would be from men. OK, that's how it happens, Tommy. And they have some problems. They need Mifepristone. They need to get an abortion for whatever reason they may need to get one. And you want them to be denied. So what woman would actually want to join the military in an environment like that? A misogynistic, cruel environment.

And maybe that is the point, Senator. You know, there have been people on the right that have fought women being involved in the military for years. Maybe this is just sort of a workaround for Tommy Tuberville to do what he can to keep women out of the military. Now, let me ask you a procedural question, Ali, if I could. What can Chuck Schumer do? Obviously, if you're asking for unanimous consent, he can stop this. But can't Chuck Schumer take this to the floor and demand an up or down vote and get the commandant through? I think that could be one of the methods that he could try.

But again, there's a lot of other procedural rules that govern this. Typically, the way to do these the most quickly and frankly, like it would take days and days and days to do it the way that you're talking about. That's why this has sort of been done as like a non-issue that all 100 senators come together and say, all right, yeah, we're going to do the military promotions. It has to go quickly. Like speed is a pretty big function of this. And so to just put something on the floor for an up or down vote triggers all of these different hours of having to wait, having to debate. Yeah, you could do that. But like it's not the right way of getting it done because there's just hundreds of promotions that are now in a backlog.

It would just take way too long. And I think that's something that Senator Jack Reed was saying yesterday. At this point, all of these months of time that have elapsed at this point, you would be actually doing work on the Senate floor for just days and days on end. All right, NBC's Ali Vitale, thank you so much. Greatly appreciate the insight.