Morning Joe - Morning Joe 9/12/24

Episode Date: September 12, 2024

Despite disastrous debate, Trump claims he won

What made you come to the spin room? I just felt I wanted to. I was very happy with the result. We're looking at polls. The worst poll that we've had was 71 that I see. We had a 92% rating in one poll. 80 to 20. I told that to Brett Baer. And we sent him a lot of polls and we sent you a lot of polls this morning. We had an 86% rating in another. We had 77%. One poll is 92% to 6.

92 to 7. 92 to 6. 88 to 11. All of the polls are 60, 70 and 80. 86 to 3. I mean. But every single poll last night had me winning like 90 to 10. 71% to like 24 or 25%. Why don't you do a shout out poll who they thought

won the debate last night? It would be great. You know, we always do the poll at the end, Mr. President. Why don't you do it? The polls are indicating that we got 90%,, 60 percent, 72 percent, 71 percent and 89 percent. Where are you getting these numbers from? And there and there you have it, Willie. The race is over. Eighty six to three. He tells one person who responds with, wow, you want 86 to three.

Did you, comrade Stalin? Oh, all the Soviet people must love you. Really love you. No, but I mean, that's part of the well, that's not part of the problem. I mean, it's a huge problem. He lives in an alternate reality. And his handlers thought that they could somehow manage that going into the debate. And Republicans, mainstream Republicans that insist on staying with this man, regardless of the craziness, the lunacy, all the losses. You know, they always thought they could control him. They could manage him. He can't be managed.

And he lives in an alternate reality, at least politically. Yeah. When your debate performance is an unmitigated disaster, not by the account of you and me, but by the account of Republicans, by the account of his advisors talking privately now to the press about how bad it was. There has been this fallacy, this fantasy, this charade that if we can just get Donald Trump to settle in, prepare and focus on policy, he's going to have a great. It ain't happening. It's never happened. Today he stepped onto the scene.

I don't know why we keep trying to entertain that idea. He is who he is. It was on full display for an hour and a half, two nights ago. And he got whipped, frankly. And so now you have to go out and just make up polls. Joe, by the way, that mashup we just played there was from our friends at All In with Chris Hayes. He put that together, just showing the absurdity of Donald Trump's spin.

It's making up poll numbers. And of course, Joe, it was three against one up there whining about the debate moderators the whining is because they said for one thing you can't kill a baby in any state of a union after he or she is born and no haitian immigrants are not eating pets in ohio that's why it was three on one and unfair and unfair. And again, anybody that thinks that's why he lost the debate, that he was corrected three times on what, but, you know,

he got about seven minutes more than he was supposed to because the debate moderators allowed him to keep breaking the rules. Every answer she had, they would try to move on to something else. He would blurt something else, crazy stuff for a minute or two minutes, breaking the rules. And I was actually sitting

there going, are you going to enforce your rules or not? I mean, I don't know if you remember, but when he came on our show, he didn't talk over us. We hung up. So I wanted to show Jonathan O'Meara the headline in the New York Times today. Are you ready? Red Sox walk it off, Jonathan. Red Sox walk it off. You have a picture here of O'Neal trotting around the bases. Oh, wait, that's not the headline.

84 font there. Just screaming headlines. 84 font. War is over. Yeah. War is over. Red Sox within four. You know, why do I bring this up with Willie and you?

Because we have actually, and this is all we can hope for with this team. In September, middle of September, we actually have a Yankees-Red Sox series that means a lot to both teams. Yeah, no, you're right. Both teams had walk-off wins yesterday, as you just mentioned. Tyler O'Neal hit one to the moon way over the green monster, walking off the Orioles, frankly doing the Yankees a favor, taking two out of three from Baltimore. And the Yankees had a walk-off win against the Royals on a ball,

an errant throw to home plate after the Yankees had rallied there. But yeah, we've got a series that matters now. I mean, the Sox look four out of the wild card. They might need a sweep in the Bronx to really get there, at least two out of three. That's a tall order. But look, it's middle of September. These games matters. It's Red Sox, Yankees. It'll be fun. The sweep they need is with the Twins coming up after the Yankees. I mean, at least split with the Yankees, then sweep the Twins, and you actually have a shot there. So it's going to be exciting.

The Tigers coming out of nowhere. I mean, out of nowhere. Like lions and tigers, not the Bears. Oh, my. Willie, really quickly, and then I'll let you get to what you probably if I shut up five minutes ago, you could have done and introduce everybody. Headline here really sums it up. You know, I was talking about campaigns need to be bumper stickers. The headline today for to Trump, U.S. is failing to Harris. There's hope. I mean, that's the campaign wrapped up in a headline and a very accurate headline.

Trump Trump would say that that America is failing and he does say it all the time. And Kamala Harris would say there's hope. There's hope. Best days could be ahead. So I think it's fascinating if you want to know what this campaign's about right there, right there, right there, whichever camera there with that one right there. That's what it's about, Willie. And that's what we'll be talking about today, along with the Trump right. Melting down about the debate moderators, some saying they should be jailed, which tells you where we are in 2024 on the Trump right. They're talking about jailing moderators in a debate that Donald Trump had about six or seven more minutes to talk. And you talk about pathetic excuses.

And also Taylor Swift, Elon Musk, Travis Kelsey. It's, and now to you, Willie Geist. Oh my gosh. We'll get into all that. And that headline you held up, Joe, that was a takeaway for a lot of people. Huge audience, by the way. We'll get into some of those numbers. Really big audience watching across a number of networks the other night.

But that theme of her saying saying we're not going back to this looking forward joy instead of yesterday and American carnage. That's the message she's putting out. I'll give you as long as we're holding up newspapers, Joe. Another good number here, The Wall Street Journal. I'll head over here. Look at that top line. Inflation slows to three year low. That data we talked about live as it came in yesterday, that is great news for Americans going out trying to buy groceries and do other things in the country. In fact, there's an, of course, campaign. So around the table this morning, MSNBC political analyst Elise Jordan. She's former aide to George W. Bush White House in the State Department,

U.S. national editor at The Financial Times, Ed Luce, MSNBC contributor and author of the book How the Right Lost Its Mind, Charlie Sykes. Good morning to you all. So Trump debate performance frustrates Republicans. That is a headline from The Wall Street Journal following his debate on Tuesday with Vice President Kamala Harris. The journal states GOP lawmakers and others fretted that Trump had missed chances to challenge Harris on her record and instead let his own controversies become the bigger story as Harris's needling got under his skin. Republican Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, of course, a staunch ally of Donald Trump, called the debate a missed opportunity. And Republican Senator Kevin Cramer of North Dakota said, quote, he treated it like a mini rally in a lot of respects. You've got to be talking to those swing voters in swing states. He could do that better with details. We're also getting new reaction from inside the Trump camp.

One advisor telling NBC News, quote, it was not his best performance without question. That's from inside the Trump camp. A longtime Republican operative saying, I know everyone in the world has said this, but the inability or unwillingness to realize when he's being baited and not fall for it is constantly baffling. And how about this? Robert F. Kennedy Jr., of course, recently suspended his presidential campaign to endorse Donald Trump, criticize Trump's debate performance. Vice President Harris clearly won the debate in terms of her delivery, her polish, her organization and her preparation. I think on substance, President Trump wins in terms of his his governance.

And but he didn't tell that story. This is from a guy, John, with an affinity for eating animals that he hits on the side of the road. So, yeah, that's tough, tough criticism that that issue. Yeah, I could have decimated it. You know, the issue really resonating there with Arbiter Kennedy Jr., for sure. But there has been widespread consternation from both inside the Trump camp and other Republicans who who saw that he who said claimed that Trump was prepared, that he was going to go in there and really hammer home the economy and immigration. And he did try a couple of times to shoehorn immigration answers into questions. But then

he was derailed by talking like eating dogs and eating cats in Ohio to the point yesterday where the city manager of that town in Springfield, Ohio, had to come out and hold a news conference. A man named Brian Heck, who I'm sure two weeks ago did not have this on his bingo card for whether his life would carry him, had to have a news conference say that didn't happen. And then the Republican governor of that state, Governor DeWine, also said that's not true. That's not happening here. It is not dissuaded. Trump, however, who continues to push it yesterday, as well as suggesting that the FEC take away ABC's broadcast license because of perceived bias in that debate. And I think that for Republicans, their concern is twofold. One is they know that

Harris, still unknown to a lot of Americans, came out of there looking good, that she was able to show she passed the commander in chief test. But secondly, Trump's craziness was on full display. And she was able to bait him several times into looking unhinged, into getting angry, into reminding Americans why they got tired of him in the first place. And that, I think, Joe, is something that a lot in Trump's close advisors, including someone I spoke to yesterday afternoon, who said, as they go back and forth as to whether they'll debate with her again, that they really feel like they gave her a real assist and Trump formed a real impression in people's minds who are reminded, who may have had Trump amnesia.

Yeah. Like, oh, maybe things weren't that bad. Maybe we could maybe we'd like his economy or whatever it might be. And then they look at that and go, oh, we don't want to do that again. No, I mean, 60 million viewers saw that side of Donald Trump. I mean, 60 million. That's all. I mean, the only two TV shows in America that people watch more of the Super Bowl and way too early with Jonathan Amir. And outside of that, I mean, you know, you know what that pressure is like. But Willie, you know, I think everybody was focused, including Republicans, on on how badly that Donald Trump did. They didn't focus on how well Kamala Harris did. And it was really brought home last night. I was I was scrolling through the news and I saw a

couple of like watch parties, people watching Harris and her pausing at certain points, which, of course, you're watching it. You're like, you know, you're watching it in your own home and you don't get how everybody's reacting. But people were laughing at her. The pause is cheering. She really after starting the first couple of minutes, a bit nervous. She really commanded that Bob Schrum, obviously a Democrat who has worked on presidential campaigns, and Mark McKinnon, a Republican who's obviously worked on George W. Bush's campaigns and McCain's campaigns, both said the same thing, that this, they believe, was the best debate performance they have seen

since JFK's in 1960. So that is their opinion. And I think it's important when we think about how this debate is going to impact people, we take note of the fact that Donald Trump lost, but at the same time, in equal measures, Kamala Harris won. And by doing so with a massive TV audience, she did clear that hurdle. She proved that she was not what the Trump right has been calling her for the past four years. It was a huge test for her, because if you think about the DNC in Chicago, she had there was a great convention, but that's a pep rally. That's a home game. And she looked great in that. And the party was unified there. But now she steps into the arena with the opponent. She's in the boxing ring. This isn't sparring anymore. It was real. And you make a great point because Donald Trump's

atrocious, historically terrible performance overshadows in some ways the ways in which she instigated his performance, in which she provoked him and got him to go to his darkest places and then was able to just sit in a split screen. And sort of the subtext was, do you want this again, America? Rational, sane people who just want to live your lives and have a strong economy and take care of your families. Do you want to live through this for another four or five years? And then she would turn and say he wants to talk about himself. I want to talk about you, which I think is the message she wanted to drive home. So, Charlie Sykes, as you watched a couple of nights ago, we've heard from many pollsters, people like Frank Luntz with focus groups, people with dial tests saying those

dials went way down on Donald Trump when he launched into some of his more insane rants about eating dogs and other things, but also inconsistencies that he cannot explain away on the issue of abortion, for example. What did you see as you watched with your trained eye a couple of nights ago? Well, you know, a lot of what we saw with Donald Trump, you know, the bitterness, the angry, the fabulism is familiar to those of us who've watched Donald Trump over the last eight years, right? But this may have come as a revelation or a reminder to tens of millions of people who were turning in and go, oh, my gosh, who is this angry old man

yelling at the clouds here? And as you point out, Kamala Harris is an unknown factor for many, many, many voters. And she put on a really extraordinary performance, not just discipline. I mean, look, she also won that split screen in a rather dramatic fashion. I think that that's a little bit underappreciated. But a couple of things here, and I think you highlighted this at the top of the show. Donald Trump, I mean, and there's a warning here, too, that Donald Trump, as we know, lives in a bubble of delusion. But also what he demonstrated was Republicans refuse to take the L. They refuse to acknowledge. He refuses to acknowledge these laws. And also, they remain addicted to these fake Internet memes even after

they have been debunked. They will not let go of the big lie. And I think this is going to be, this is not a new pattern for those of us who will follow this. But think of this in the context of the election and the big lie. Donald Trump is creating an alternative reality where he never admits that he loses. And no matter how egregious the lie is, no matter how much it has been refuted, they will stick with it. And I think that's kind of extraordinary how deeply online they've gotten and how even in, you know, and by the way, talk about blatantly racist. You know, the imagery of Donald Trump saving kittens in America from angry black men. But they're not letting it go and they won't let these things go. And I think this is, again, a marker and a warning for our times. You know, Willie, there is there is a parallel.

It's not a strong, really strong parallel because nothing compares to Donald Trump. But you remember when we were covering the 2012 election, Mitt Romney, his campaign, his family lived inside that Fox News bubble. And you'll remember on the front page of Drudge every day was Romney plus 11 because Gallup, the Gallup polls were so wildly off. And you'll remember that night. And I'm just that this bubble that they live in, where people are going, oh, my God, they're saying that this bubble leads to disaster most times. And you'll remember that night, Mitt Romney and Ann Romney, two people I love, they laid into the evening. They were sure that there was something that was wrong with the numbers because it went against everything that was in that bubble in 2012 that Republicans lived in even pre-Trump. And you'll remember Karl Rove saying something's

wrong with these numbers. So I even late into the night, nobody could believe it because they had all been living in a bubble. And I'm sorry, but I just got to say it. This is what's happened every year since 2017. They live in a bubble and they convince themselves that by saying illegal immigrants are coming to America with leprosy, that that that caravans are coming to eat their children. You know, they think that by saying the most radical, wild things, that was an exaggeration, that somehow they're going to sway the middle. They never do. It doesn't work. It worked for one day in November, nine years ago. And when Donald Trump admitted afterwards to me that the election could have been held on 10 days and he may have only won it on that one day and they have tanked their entire party, destroyed the conservative movement based on that one day because a letter was written 10 days before that literally changed the outcome of the election.

Yeah. And you're talking about a 2012 Fox News bubble, which I mean, compare that to what the bubble looks like today, which is the farthest reaches of the Internet. The darkest conspiracy theories you can think of amplified and pushed to the top of a presidential campaign, which gets you a debate like we had two nights ago, at least, where, as we were saying yesterday, that was rally Donald Trump, where the curated audience at the rally knows all the lines to the songs. They know about the cat eating thing in Springfield and they cheer when they hear that. But there are 67 million people watched the other night. That's a lot of people who don't know about the cat eating conspiracy theory online or anything else Donald Trump's talking about going. I want to know which of these people is

going to take care of my family and protect my rights. What on earth is this man talking about? Well, and then when Donald Trump makes such a crazy comment, it just pops and it becomes the pull quote of the night establishing just how crazy he is and reminding voters, oh, this guy's not really all there. And also going back to the age issue when, you know, he seemed a little slower. He had plenty of facts wrong, you know, mixing up West Virginia and Virginia. And then you contrast that to Kamala Harris. And she came across as likable. At the end of the day, she came across as likable. And Donald Trump wasn't able to define her and paint her as an extreme liberal. And that's what he needed to do. Instead, voters got to see a woman who was collected. She was in command.

She was strong. She looked good. And she wasn't taking anything from this man ranting at her. You know, Ed, Luz, in your latest FT column, you talk about how triumphant Kamala Harris was at her convention, but said there were still fears. There were still lingering doubts about how she would do against Donald Trump. Let me read from your column. You say if there were doubts that Harris could stand up to Trump, they were dispelled in the first encounter. It may be their last. The fact that she ended Tuesday night's debate by calling for another speaks volumes.

And I love the subhead of this because you get to really the essence of all of this and why it's so important. Kamala Harris has actually Kamala Harris has the measure of Donald Trump. It's actually the headline. And she's the first, Ed. Think about those 16 Republicans in 2016, how lost and confused they were debating Donald Trump. Think about Hillary Clinton when Trump came over and stood behind instead of George Bush turning to Al Gore in 2000 going like, what's wrong with you, man? And everybody laughing at Al Gore. Hillary just sat there and didn't know quite how to react to it. She's talked about that a good bit, but he's always intimidated, blustered, always found his broke rules through debates, town hall meetings, et cetera.

But the headline says it all. Kamala Harris has the measure of Donald Trump, which means he wants no part of her in a second debate. And if he's stupid enough to debate her a second time, we know how it's going to end. Well, of course, as we know, Joe, he doesn't want to debate her because he's already won. And she's desperate because she lost so badly to debate again. And it's an extraordinary line that Trump has stuck to since then. But she has the measure of him. You remember back to Tuesday night. I think the moment where it really started to unravel for Trump was when she talked about his crowd sizes and invited people to watch them, a

unique thing in the history of presidential debates, to watch their opponents' rallies and watch how people leave during the rally and yawn and get bored. And that, I think, was where Trump's head started to be really messed with, and he never got it back, because Kamala Harris had really done her research on him. His foundational myth, really, of his presidency was the size of his inauguration crowd in 2017, something that, he said on day one, a direct lie was far bigger than the one Obama had had. And so this has been a sort of it's his gateway myth. You know, once you sort of go through the I've got the largest crowds in history, then all the other myths flow from that.

So she had the measure of him. She went back to the Central Park Five, you know, an issue that, you know, dates back more than 40 years, where he takes out an ad calling for the execution of what turned out to be innocent people. He doubles down on the Central Park Five. She managed to nail him on a potentially weak issue, which was Biden's withdrawal from Afghanistan by pointing out that this was his plan and getting him to say the bizarre, to me still, is a rich choice, the bizarrest bit in the whole debate, where he describes the leader of the Taliban as the guy called Abdul. Abdul. I mean, it's, you know, it's a completely non-existent person. He's just chosen the one Muslim name he can remember. It's like, I don't know, the leader of the Taliban saying that guy,

John, who leads the West or is it Billy? That that that's that's the kind of sort of wacky direction she sent his head in because she had prepared so well. She knew exactly what would trigger him. It did. She kept doing it. And I bet she would relish another debate. Yeah. And she's certainly, to your point, well prepared. She also had the dig about Wharton Business School. Of course, Trump's a proud alum. And she cited Wharton professors there criticizing his plan. And they sort of tipped their hand about the crowd size thing, because I should note earlier that day they ran an ad featuring Barack Obama and his DNC speech, where he memorably poked fun at Trump's crowd sizes with accompanying hand gesture.

And that ad ran in Philadelphia, where the debate was being held, and in West Palm Beach, basically two places where Trump might see it that day. So they knew they showed that punch was coming and he still couldn't react. But I want to go back to this idea of this ecosystem, this small shrinking right wing fever swamp where Trump lives that leads him to say things about eating cats. Eric Erickson, a conservative commentator who we quote every so often on this show, he in a rage on Twitter the other night said, look what you've done, yelling at Trump's aides saying you're showing him this stuff, you're allowing him to believe this stuff. And all it's doing is alienating the actual voters he needs to win, who not only have no idea what he's talking about, but thinks it makes him look crazy. And then Trump in response, conspiracy theorist Laura Loomer, a 9-11 truther, joined Trump yesterday on his flight to New York

for the ground zero September 11th commemoration. He hangs out a lot with Laura Loomer. I mean, we can mention other names, you know, more familiar or older standing ones like Stephen Miller, who have similar worldviews. But Laura Loomer is somebody who said tweeted something so racist, so nasty about Kamala Harris and the White House smelling of curry and call centers taking the calls if she became president that even Marjorie Taylor Greene asked her to take it down. Now, if you if you if you offend Marjorie Taylor Greene, I didn't think that was possible. And Marjorie Taylor Greene, I didn't think that was possible. And Marjorie Taylor Greene thinks you've gone too far.

Then that then that says something. And this is the kind of person Donald Trump is hanging out with. He's hanging out with people who tell him, yes, what you've just said about crowd sizes is true. Yes, what you said about you having the greatest economy in world history is true. What we've been hearing about people hanging other people's pet dogs or abducting their cats, that's true. He's hanging out with people who say yes back to him. And I doubt, frankly, that Chris LaCivita or Susie Wiles, who are professional campaign operatives, worked on many different Republican campaigns, are being listened to very much at all by Donald Trump. And the more we see of that, a bit like the debate the other night, the more rope he is given to hang himself, the more he will hang himself. Charlie, the woman that Ed and John are mentioning here is a reprehensible racist.

She calls herself a proud Islamophobe, conspiracy theorist on everything from 9-11 to school shootings and everything else. The tweet, which we won't read because it's so deeply ugly, gets at Kamala Harris's heritage, her identity, the fact that she's half Indian, leave it there, gets into all the ugliest possible stereotypes about that. But this is not a casual relationship. This woman is flying on the plane to the debate with Donald Trump. We also point out the vice president, J.D. Vance, is cozying up to people and sort of making excuses for someone entertaining the idea that actually Churchill was the villain of World War Two and not Adolf Hitler. These are choices. This is not a retweet of somebody. This is not accepting an endorsement and pretending you don't know the person.

This is elevating these people. And it is extraordinary. Laura Loomer is is not just a bigot. She is I mean, she is a freak. She is at the far edges of the fever swamp. You know, as Ed just mentioned, even Marjorie Taylor Greene describes her as racist and offensive. And yet Donald Trump is associating with her. These are the kinds of people who have his ear right now. So at this moment of the campaign, I mean, think about this. We're less than two months away from the election. Donald Trump is associating with some of the craziest, weirdest figures on the right. And in part, you know, this is kind of the J.D. Vance effect. You know, J.D. Vance and Don Trump Jr., who have decided that they want Donald Trump

to be extremely online. And you saw that play out during the debate. But you're also seeing it play out, you know, throughout this campaign and all of the rallies. In Donald Trump's head, you have people with the most extreme and bigoted ideas who are feeding him lines and memes and encouraging him to go places that no politician in our century and, you know, maybe for the last century and a half have even fought to go. And I think this is concerning in terms of this bubble of delusion that he's created himself, this bubble of extremism and delusion that he's going to carry up until the election and pass the election. Charlie Sykes, thanks very much. U.S. national editor of the Financial Times, Ed Luce. Thank you as well. We'll see you both soon. Still ahead on Morning Joe,

we'll take a look at how the Harris-Walls campaign is looking to build on momentum after the debate, plus how Speaker Mike Johnson cancels a planned vote on a government funding bill and growing Republican infighting. We'll get the very latest from Capitol Hill. And you hear the music. Here's why. An unbelievable story. Jon Bon Jovi, the music legend, being hailed as a hero this morning for possibly saving a woman's life, talking her off a bridge in Nashville. It's an incredible story.

Morning Joe's coming right back. Bit of a gloomy day here in New York City, 6.33 in the morning. Taylor Swift's endorsement of Vice President Kamala Harris may boost voter registration for Democrats. According to the General Services Administration, Swift's Instagram post drove at least 337,000 users to visit Vote.gov, a site that helps people to register to vote in their states. Donald Trump and his running mate, Senator J.D. Vance of Ohio, reacting now to the news of Swift's endorsement of their opponent, Vice President Harris. I was not a Taylor Swift fan.

It was just a question of time. She couldn't you couldn't possibly endorse Biden. You look at Biden, you couldn't possibly endorse him. But she's a very liberal person. She seems to always endorse a Democrat. And she'll probably probably pay a price for it at the in the marketplace. Well, look, we we admire Taylor Swift's music, but I don't think most Americans, whether they like her music or fans of hers or not, are going to be influenced by a billionaire

celebrity who I think is fundamentally disconnected from the interests and the problems of most Americans. I mean, Joe, this is too easy. This is T-ball. Walks right into it, said a billionaire who is disconnected from the lives of everyday Americans. Come on, man. Come on now. I mean, you see it. I don't think many people are going to be influenced by billionaire celebrity, who I think is disconnected from the interest and the problems of most Americans. It really, at least it is too easy. I will say, you know, I've never, yeah, I grew up listening to musicians who never supported people I supported and voted for as a conservative. And it's like, whatever. I didn't expect the Beatles to play at Barry Goldwater's convention in 1964.

So when people go, oh, they're liberal. Whatever. Listen to music. Most people do listen to music. And usually musicians' endorsements don't mean anything. I will say, if there is one that makes a difference, it would be Taylor Swift. And it would be Taylor Swift

because she has such an extraordinary following, a deep following with people of all ages. And I actually do think, you know, her getting them out to vote, we're starting to see the registration numbers go up, you know, when you may win by 50,000 votes in Michigan or 30,000 votes in Wisconsin or, you know, 15,000 votes in Pennsylvania, where I think Taylor Swift's from. Every little bit counts. And this may be more than just a little bit. Joe, I find it fascinating because she is just such a cultural icon and I mean, has fueled so many economies around the world by just merit of touring there. And it's hilarious to me that Trump thinks he's actually going to hurt her business because her business is doing

just fine. Who can actually afford tickets to even go to her concerts because she's so in demand. But when earlier in June with the Lincoln Democracy Institute, I did some focus groups that actually we used a video of Taylor Swift talking about politics with her dad and debating getting involved in speaking out in the Tennessee Senate election. And it was interesting as a way to explore how women talk to the men in their lives. And women are so connected under the age of 20, especially to Taylor Swift. And they relate to her and she's having fun and she's a good role model. You see at her concerts, it's all about going and being kind to each other and having fun. And that kind of, you know, echoes what Kamala Harris is doing. She is having fun.

She's way more likable than, you know, a lot of candidates we've had in the past. And so you have all those little girls talking to their dads who might lean conservative and their little girls are now pressuring them to give it another look. So I'm interested to see how this plays out. Well, we'll see. And certainly it's fascinating. And Jonathan Lemire, just in terms of momentum, having somebody that is a bigger cultural icon than anyone in music in just decades could have an impact. It is also interesting. I think it was Marsha Blackburn who who Taylor Swift wanted to go against and support Marsha Blackburn's opponent. And I think they asked Marsha Blackburn about it. And she handled it pretty well.

From from what I remember, she wasn't like, oh, Taylor Swift's evil. And Taylor's like, yeah, whatever, which I think in this case is really good. And it's a shame that Donald Trump, as everybody's saying, cannot pass up a slight. He's like Marty McFly in Back to the Future. He cannot pass up a slight. It always gets him in trouble. But in this case with Taylor Swift. She is a good role model for a lot of kids. If you look at what people like Kobe Bryant said of her, that it's work ethic. She got to where she got because she had a goal from a young age and she worked hard.

She worked around the clock. She never gave up. She put her head down. She had no contacts, just a middle class girl from Pennsylvania. And she achieved superstardom. And that's again, I think for most parents, that's a pretty good role model. That's somebody who, when they become massive cultural icons, actually could have an impact on, if not changing a lot of votes, getting a lot of people out working for Kamala Harris. Yeah. Taylor Swift works hard, writes her own songs, builds a connection with

her audience, cares about her audience. And that's why they listen to her. We see here, 337,000 people went to vote.gov and registered to vote in the first 24 hours after Swift put up on Instagram that she was endorsing Vice President Harris. I think that the there is a limit to how much celebrity endorsements matter. This one could, though, this is the exception. And I think it also adding to the theme of Tuesday night gets under Donald Trump's skin. He is obsessed with celebrity. He has repeatedly complained to advisers that they can't get bigger names to back him. And they asked to settle for Kid Rock at the convention and not getting the A-listers who

surround Democrats who are surrounding Vice President Harris remains to be seen. Her team has floated privately. They'd love to see if Taylor Swift perhaps would want to even do an event or two for her. That's not committed. There are more hopes, though, that Beyonce might. There have been talks there, Willie, that people expect that could happen in the stretch run of the campaign. And again, a celebrity concert, we know these things don't always work out. We remember the tens of thousands of people who showed up in front of Independence Hall in Philadelphia for Hillary Clinton listening to Bruce Springsteen the night before that election. That didn't work out.

But Taylor Swift is someone who, especially doing it now, early voting beginning, but there's still time to register to vote. That could have an impact. Yeah, it's funny to hear Donald Trump say it's going to hurt her in the marketplace. She might only sell out Wembley nine times instead of 10. In Washington, House Speaker Mike Johnson pulled the government funding bill off of the House floor just hours before a scheduled vote yesterday. The move came as several House Republicans vowed to tank it. Congress has about two weeks to pass government funding to avoid a shutdown. Let's bring in NBC News Capitol Hill correspondent Ali Allie Vitale. Allie, what happened here? Well, as hard as it was for me to listen to you guys talk about Taylor Swift

as a Swifty wanting so badly to jump in. Jump in, Allie. Start there. And we will. That's the kind of pain that Mike Johnson is in right now with his own conference, I have to tell you, because he is once again in a position of being squeezed by members of his own party who don't like the plan that he put forward on a six month extension of government funding. That is also then paired with the SAVE Act, which would prevent noncitizens from voting, which, as we've said here and on other shows before, is already illegal. Nevertheless, that's the plan he put forward. That's the plan that lacked the votes. And my understanding heading into yesterday and leadership knew this, they knew they had a vote margin of like 15 to 20 Republicans who were not going to get on board with this. There was a chance that they were going to just put it on the floor anyway and let it fail. That's embarrassing

to leadership. Certainly not the way that we've seen things done in Congress under people like Speaker Nancy Pelosi, who infamously always knew where her vote count was for McCarthy. And then, of course, now Johnson, they've seen things fail on the floor before they've received that embarrassment. Yesterday, it seems that they wanted to avoid that. But without a change of plan, they're going to keep running against that brick wall. And that's where it becomes a short term problem for Johnson on government funding, but also a longer-term problem for Johnson, who, if Republicans retain the majority, would like to keep his speakership. And if they don't, is also going to still be in a battle to keep his place as the top Republican, in that case as minority leader. All of that's

a thorny issue anyway. But this is now something that has both short term implications and longer term implications for Johnson as a leader of the party. And then, of course, that's nothing to say of the Donald Trump of it all, who has said that he's I think would shut down the government in a heartbeat, I think is the phrase that he used to keep the SAVE Act in there and to do government funding in this fashion. So when you've got all these different dynamics here, it makes it very difficult, once again, for the speaker. And then, of course, the Senate realities are they don't want to do it this way anyway. So we're at a stalemate, 19 days until a government shutdown. That's an eternity in Congress time. But nevertheless, we're watching them here kind of chase their tails as they try to find some kind of a fashion to fund the government and not shut down the government before an election. I think most Republicans are aware that doesn't behoove them. Nevertheless, Donald Trump is saying he's fine with it.

Yeah, he's writing in all caps and on his social media, close it down, talking about the government. If the SAVE Act, the voter ID piece is not in there, as we've seen from the immigration legislation that months long, he has the ability to pull that string and kill legislation. We'll see if it happens here. As you say, about what, 19 days until the deadline of October 1st. Do you want now, do you want in on Taylor Swift? I mean, we're going to open it up to you. I always want in on Taylor. Look, the only thing I was thinking about when you guys were talking is this idea that she doesn't have an impact. This is a woman who made grown people, adults make friendship bracelets.

Everyone from, you know, senators on Capitol Hill on the Democratic side to Nikki Haley when I was covering her campaign were wearing them and sporting every manner of slogan. So this idea that Taylor Swift doesn't have impact is insane to me. But also, she's a universal voice who speaks to universal experience, and she speaks predominantly to women. And I think that for most women who might be Swifties, who might not be in the zeitgeist of thinking about politics, what she's doing is bringing awareness. When you see 337,000 people go to vote.gov, not all of them necessarily registered to vote, but a good chunk of them probably did. And it gets them to start thinking about what's at stake in this election. Devaluing a Taylor Swift endorsement is generally saying that you don't understand how women who are Swifties, A, talk to people in their lives, are probably pretty type A, if I think about all of my friends who are Swifties. I mean, she is someone who has influence over a large swath of voters who are, again,

predominantly women and who will probably be motivated by the central issues of this election. So, Ali, I want to assure you and I want to assure all the Taylor fans in my life that nobody here is devaluing Taylor Swift's endorsement. I know that you guys. We're we're playing it. We're playing it careful, though, because I don't want to say the election's over. Taylor's. No, but I will say it is remarkable to me. And again, Willie, you remember we had this conversation after 1989 came out. Her album, 1989. You know, I'm a rock snob.

You know, my pantheon of greats in rock music are like, you know, the Beatles, the Rolling Stones, the Who, Stevie Wonder. You know, I mean, it's it's it's it's pretty, you know, Carole King, of course, our friend Carole King. But there aren't a lot of people that that I would put in the rock pantheon. But Willie, I mean, she was there after 1989 and her her her success is only just increased exponentially. So, yeah, this is about as significant. This is about as significant as the Beatles in 1964, you know, endorsing somebody. So, yeah, we're not devaluing it, but we're trying. No, you guys never were. OK, good. Well, Ali, then it might be safe for me to go home after the show.

We need Ali's Swifty stamp of approval. I'll go back to the Swifty group chat. Ali, Natali, thanks so much. We needed a Swifty on the panel this morning. Appreciate you being here. Thanks, Ali. Coming up, a fact check of Tuesday night's presidential debate and a lot to check. Steve Ratner over at the Southwest Wall where he belongs. Going to debunk some of Donald Trump's rock and roll icon John Bon Jovi is being hailed as a hero this morning for helping a woman in distress on a bridge in Nashville. Extraordinary pictures here, lower left of your screen. It happened on Tuesday. Nashville police were releasing a surveillance video of Bon Jovi talking a woman off the ledge of that bridge over the Cumberland River in Nashville. Bon Jovi, you can see walking over to her.

After about a minute, he and a member of his team helped the woman back onto the pedestrian walkway. Bon Jovi gives her a hug, clearly seen talking to her. A representative for the singer has not responded to NBC's request for comment, but the Nashville police posted this video saying that is Jon Bon Jovi, and they were grateful to him and his team member there for coaxing, we think, the woman off a bridge. Incredible, Jon. Yeah, remarkable moment. Bon Jovi apparently was shooting some sort of music video on the bridge. That's why he was there with his team. And they spotted this woman who appeared to be in some sort of distress on the other side, as you can see here on the other side of the ledge, several hundred feet up from the water. And Bon Jovi, the singer, walks over there and then proceeds to talk to her,

gives her a hug and helps her get back to safety. So just as remarkable as like just stepping up in a moment, in a moment of need. And Bon Jovi did it. And this woman, you know, she and her family, I'm sure, are deeply grateful. We had still images there. There's video of it where you can see that he sees something isn't quite right. And he and his friend walk over and he very calmly leans onto the ledge there of the bridge and is seen talking to the woman for some time. And then physically, the two of them lifting her over the bridge. Then he talks to her for a couple of more minutes before embracing her and getting her in a hug. So at least just really an extraordinary moment. It's a really nice human moment of realizing, I mean, he's busy shooting a music video just as we're rushing through our lives, trying to balance so many different things. But just being present and realizing what someone else is going through and noticing and taking the time to actually show some empathy and how important that is and how easy it is to overlook just slowing down for a second and considering what other people are going through.

And he saved a life. It's really moving and special. Anybody who's been around him knows he is a wonderful, wonderful man. And it was on display there in an impromptu moment, not for the cameras, just to help a woman on a bridge in Nashville.