Morning Joe - Morning Joe 9/22/23

Episode Date: September 22, 2023

Rudy Giuliani snubbed judge’s order in defamation case, election worker says

He doesn't like it when he's taken on directly and he's confronted. I'm the only one on that stage who was unwilling to raise my hand beside Asa Hutchinson and say I wouldn't support a convicted felon for president of the United States. He doesn't like when people stand up to him and call him out on the nonsense that he's involved in. And I guess he had a bad night last night. Maybe he had some bad Chinese food or something, Wolf. We had 11.30 at night, a little indigestion, decided to attack me. Keep it coming, Donald.

And by the way, if he had any guts, he'd get on the debate stage and he's got things to say about me. Stop hiding behind your social media site, your failed social media site, Donald, and start taking me on directly. Show up. Stop being a coward. Chris Christie with more strong and direct criticism of Donald Trump, especially about why he's afraid to debate. Meanwhile, on Capitol Hill, far right Republicans are pushing the federal government closer to a shutdown. A small group of lawmakers once again blocked an attempt by Speaker McCarthy to bring a key funding bill up for a procedural vote. We're also following the autoworker strike and the possibility of more walking off the job today.

We'll have an update on the negotiations between the union and Detroit's big three. Plus, Rudy Giuliani's legal and financial troubles are starting negotiations to catch up with him. We'll go through the federal order that he ignored. Apparently, he's not paying these two women. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and his legal fees are piling up. And Cassidy Hesheton accused him of groping her. This guy, I mean, it just keeps coming every day, Willie. Every day gets worse for the guy who once called himself America's mayor.

It's I don't you know, I don't know if he faces prison, if he faces bankruptcy, if he faces additional charges. It's again, it's just from from all directions. And this is the cost, of course, when you turn your life over to Donald Trump. Yeah, America's deadbeat, it appears. He can't pay any of his legal bills. He's on the hook now for these women in Georgia who he clearly and explicitly defamed. Shea Moss and Ruby Freeman owes them a bunch of money. And it's only just beginning. As you say, it was all fun and games until the indictments started coming down when he was playing along with Donald Trump, doing whatever he said around the 2020 election, around January 6th. He had prominence. He had relevance. He was on TV all the time. And now, like for so many of

the people around Donald Trump, the bill is coming due. Bill is coming due. He doesn't have the money. No. I mean, from America's mayor to America's deadbeat. Following Donald Trump can get you thrown in jail or ruin you financially. You know, it used to be a sad story. You'd think of Rudy Giuliani and you'd say, what has happened to this guy? He used to be America's mayor. But it's no longer a sad story because he has talked himself into every legal difficulty that's hanging over his head today. He's done it to himself and largely selfishly for himself, thinking that he would carve himself out a bigger role in an ensuing Trump administration, which never happened.

Yeah, and Jen, you know, the impact of this is when he's lying about election workers in Georgia, guess what? I'm getting emails from friends saying, oh, have you heard this? There were these two women who whatever. I mean, it took off. It became very viral. He spread that lie that ended up, you know, causing great risk to them. Great pain, pain, risk, damage, people coming into their house. So, you know, he's he's now he's got to pay him off and he doesn't have the money to pay him off. The this is like, you know, this is where MAGA he's got to pay him off and he doesn't have the money to pay him off. The this is like, you know, this is where MAGA runs into when MAGA runs into reality in courts.

Right. It just stops. This is where like, yeah, all said money is due. All some people are held accountable. They're under indictment. They may be going to jail. Like it's the one place where people can still be held accountable. When MAGA runs into reality, reality wins when you're in the courtroom, Richard, every single time. I mean, we go down the list, 63 federal cases, judges saying, no, Donald, there's no there's there's no fraud, widespread fraud. His own Supreme Court, as he said before the election, his own Supreme Court, no, no, Donald, no widespread fraud. Alito and and Thomas, the most conservative members of the election, his own Supreme Court. They go, no, no, Donald, no widespread fraud. Alito and Thomas, the most conservative members of the court, actually write a concurrence, but say there's

not enough votes here to change the outcome. So again, time and time again, it's such a great way to put it. When MAGA runs into reality in the court of law, MAGA always loses. What's interesting, Rudy's part of a larger phenomena of the people who went along for the ride, like all those people on January 6th. And hundreds of them are in jail, are paying a price. So Donald Trump stays out. Meanwhile, all these other people who went along for this glorious ride are paying, like Rudy, are paying the ultimate personal price. Yeah. OK, so Jonathan Lemire, America's deadbeat. And when MAGA runs into reality, reality wins. Can you top it? Go. Good morning to you guys. I it does seem, though, that America's mayor may need more of Donald Trump's fundraisers to be able to float

his legal bills. And I guess there might be concerns whether he would perhaps join the January 6th convict choir, which, of course, has been so many of the former former rioters have turned to. But, yes, to Joe's point, this is reality. And Richard said so far, Donald Trump has not suffered the consequences. I think the key phrase there is, so far. He, of course, has four legal matters hanging over his head. He is going to be, in all likelihood, appearing in a courtroom on at least one of those trials, if maybe more, but at least one next year during an election. And as he so desperately seeks a return to the White House, in part to try to make some of this legal trouble go away,

he's going to be, day after day, have to try to make some of this legal trouble go away, he's going to be day after day have to sit there in front of a jury of his peers, and he may suffer those consequences, too. All right, we'll get back to this. But let's get to our top story this morning. Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky returned to Washington yesterday to shore up support for his nation's defense. On Capitol Hill, he was greeted by House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries and others. In the morning, Zelensky attended private meetings with lawmakers and reportedly assured them of Ukraine's solid war plan. House Speaker Kevin McCarthy praised Zelensky's candor in those meetings, but chose not to greet Zelensky when he arrived and also declined Zelensky's request for a joint session of Congress. In the afternoon, Zelensky and Ukraine's first lady arrived at the White House to meet with President Biden and First Lady Dr. Jill Biden.

There, President Biden announced an additional three hundred and twenty five million dollars in aid to Ukraine. Willie? Meanwhile, Poland no longer is sending weapons to Ukraine as a trade dispute over grain exports escalates. The Polish prime minister said Wednesday Warsaw no longer will arm Kyiv, instead focus on rebuilding its own weapon stocks. A government spokesman later clarified Poland is now only supplying Ukraine with already promised weapons. Poland has been one of Ukraine's most ardent supporters, of course, since Russia began its invasion and has been home to nearly two million Ukrainian refugees. So far, Warsaw has provided Kiev with more than three billion dollars in military aid. So, guys, this is kind of a complicated backstory.

And Richard can probably explain it to us better about the grain deal, the Black Sea grain deal, frustration from Poland that's been simmering. And then President Zelensky in his speech this week at the U.N. taking a veiled shot at Poland and other countries in Eastern Europe for stepping back from their support. Poland says, yes, they do reserve the right to resume those weapons shipments. But for now, they're pulling them back. Yeah. And, you know, Richard, there's an election in Poland in a couple of weeks. It's going to be heated, heated and just a critical election for the direction of Poland's democracy. That said, Zelensky could have picked a better time to start criticizing people in

Eastern Europe. I know when we were given $40 billion, I remember one time saying on the show, you know what, just saying thank you, just saying thank you might be a good start. I understand what he's going through, but you look at the history, you look at what Winston Churchill did with FDR, how he constantly worked him, constantlyied and constantly played him constantly. It was all over him and keeping FDR in the game. It meant the survival. I will say Zelensky time and again insults a lot of allies that are giving him billions of dollars. And the polls finally said enough. I think, again, the polls will come back. But if we all remember the beginning stages of the wars, Poland literally

threw open its door to millions and millions and millions of Ukrainian refugees. Nobody was more open. Nobody was more supportive. So, yeah, this is a really bad development. It's a bad development. But Poland will continue to transship all the arms from other places. You're right. It's about the elections coming up, cheap grain coming from Ukraine, Polish farmers unhappy with it. But Joe, I think there's a larger story going on here. There's a bit of war fatigue. We're seeing it in Poland, refugee fatigue. You're seeing it in Washington. We're seeing that the counteroffensive, quote unquote, is not going to deliver liberation of territory anytime soon, if ever. There's a gap increasingly between the war aims of Ukraine and what's happening on the battlefield and the patience of other places.

The war is losing its newness. And I think we're coming to some sort of a reckoning down the road where Ukraine has goals of getting all of its territory back, economic reparations, war crimes, accountability. People don't see it. So the question is, I mean, well, there's other political issues here in the United States, there in Poland. And I think what's happening is this issue now has to compete with others. The moment where this was the only issue on the agenda has faded. And Mr. Zelensky has to adapt to that. And we're seeing it in Poland. We're seeing it in the United States. Politics are beginning to reassert themselves. Yeah, they certainly are. By the way, I just just a quick,

quick, quick side note. We're going to continue with this, but we're going to be talking in a little bit about a new CNN University of New Hampshire poll between Joe Biden and Donald Trump. It shows what I suspect we're going to be seeing moving forward right now. Things are tight, but you're going to be seeing in swing states like New Hampshire a separation even between the national polls right now. In this latest poll, Joe Biden's at 52 percent. Donald Trump, I believe, is down at 40. We'll be following that. But it's not really again. It's not surprising to me. I know there's a lot of bedwetting, a lot of people screaming, a lot of people screeching, a lot of people crying. Just again, please, somebody tell me who didn't vote for Donald Trump in 2020 in the suburbs of Atlanta, in Philadelphia, in New Hampshire, in Detroit, the suburbs of any of these places that are going to run back to him now after January the 6th.

He's going to be inspired by him. After four indictments, after all of these things. So we're going to be talking about that in a little bit. Again, Joe Biden opening up a pretty sizable lead against Donald Trump. It is very early, but I think you're going to be seeing more of this as we move forward. Right now, let's continue with the story and bring in former Supreme Allied commander of NATO, retired four-star Navy Admiral James Trevitas. He is the chief international analyst for NBC News. From New Hampshire polls to Brzezinski polls.

So, Admiral, this is not good news for the Ukrainians. And with their future on the line, you would think they would be working a little bit more diligently to figure out a way to clean things up with Poland and its leaders. What's going on here? 100 percent right. And let's let's face the fact that Joe Biden's been pretty distracted with the United Nations. Zelensky has been 100 percent focused on coming here. I would guarantee you job one on his to do list when he gets back to Ukraine is going to be Poland. Also, the United States needs and will be leaning in to try and bring this back together. We've got an ace diplomat in the zone in Warsaw. That would be Mark Brzezinski, brother of Amika. So I think there's going to be a concerted effort in the West

and it won't just be Washington leaning in. I think you're going to see NATO do everything it can to shore up this crack. Look, it's a pretty good example that politics are local. And that's what's happening, as Richard said, as you said, Joe. Election coming up, the polls get through that. And hopefully that will combine with the efforts I just described to kind of move this in the right direction. Point two, and it's kind of step back. Let's remember who's at fault here. This is Russia that has created this situation by blockading the Black Sea, stopping the normal flow of these massive grain shipments, which ought to be going to North Africa, the Middle East, the Levant.

Putin has weaponized food. And as a side benefit of that, that grain now is flowing to the east. It is cheaper. It moves across the land. That's what's driving the discontent in Poland. So the problem, as usual, reverts back to Putin. And a good way to think about how to help solve this would be to break this blockade, get the grain shipments moving normally.

And I'll close with this. NATO can do that. We have the capability to escort grain shipments in and out. We have the capability to clear mines. There's some thinking there might be mines in the water. The big picture solution here is to break this blockade. So, Richard, let's talk about politics in Poland, because I really have a lot of questions as to why they would do this. And I don't think it's necessarily fair to blame it on the Ukrainians who are in a terrible situation right now. Poland showed themselves, showed the country to be a leader in the world in supporting Ukraine in a way, as already Joe described, that is unprecedented,

that no country would do. Definitely not the United States of America. They brought in millions of refugees at the drop of a hat and created stations across the border where they could process them and send them to different parts of Poland. It was historic. Literally opened their doors to all Ukraine, their homes. And they told the story of why they could make this unprecedented action, because of their shared history, because of their bond in that way. They worked alongside the U.S. military, the 82nd Airborne. More forces came in, Poland becoming central on this map, redefining NATO and the world. And now they're pulling back or threatening to pull back. It seems small. And

I wonder what the politics are that are involved with this in Poland, inside Poland. It is small, but I also think it's temporary. You got the elections next month. Poland, like a lot of other countries in Europe, like a lot like us, the far right is going up. The government coalition is worried going into the elections. Farmers are unhappy about the cheap grain from Ukraine. And again, they're worried about the polls in Poland, i.e. the far right is going up. So this is an issue. A little bit of war fatigue, a little bit of resentment against the refugees. So I think this is temporary. My guess is it'll be worked out. And again, it's not going to stop 90 percent or 95 percent of the arms getting there.

We're talking about stocks of Poland, which are pretty minimal right now. They're going into Ukraine. What the Polish government said, we're going to keep Polish arms for Poland, but it's not going to affect everything coming through Poland. So I think this is more politics and symbolic. Yes, President Zelensky needs to smooth things out and stop going after people. He's under a lot of stress and he's not as gracious, shall we say, or thanking as he should be with Poland, with the United States and others. It's not the first time he's gone off after somebody.

But I really think this is not this is temporary. The real problem facing Ukraine is the counteroffensive built up expectations. They can't be met. So the question is, as we end the second fighting season, what now? What are we looking to? More of the same? Will it deliver? And I think there's a gap between Ukrainian war aims and what is happening on the ground and what is happening diplomatically. That's the real issue. This is just a temporary hiccup. So, Admiral Savridis, is this exactly what Richard's describing here, what Vladimir Putin is counting on, which is to say fatigue from the West, that Western Europe, that the United States, that the people who live in our country and in Europe say, you know what, we've given them an awful lot of money.

It's time to look back toward ourselves and focus on that and that he can kind of wait out the world and then kind of step up his war again. And that's why I guess Zelensky spent so much time here in the United States at the White House up on Capitol Hill yesterday, moving up to Canada today to shore up the support and remind not just politicians, but the people of our country, Canada and others, that he needs us and needs us badly. That's exactly right. You know, we say in the military, in every war, there is a center of gravity, that about which everything else revolves. In this war, the center of gravity is the alignment of the West. Are we going to stand together here?

And that's why this is worrisome. You feel that kind of cracking in the alliance when Poland suddenly goes off in a different direction. I agree it's temporary, but it's worrisome. You feel that cracking in Washington where Kevin McCarthy won't go down and greet the leader of a nation fighting so courageously. You kind of feel that cracking sense, Willie, And that's concerning. And yes, that is what Putin absolutely is betting on because he doesn't really have a lot of other cards left. His generals are terrible. His military is incompetent. They have managed to dig in and hold off. And yes, we are headed toward a frozen

conflict, a stalemate, ultimately a negotiation of some kind. Our job in the West is to continue to support the Ukrainians. And I want to close on a point that I get a lot as I'm out speaking about this. People say, oh, you know, those Europeans, they're not pulling their load in Ukraine. That is factually wrong. We have given about 40 billion. The Europeans have given about 45 billion. The balance between humanitarian and military is different, but the Europeans are pulling their weight. And as Mika said a moment ago, as you said, Joe, have done so in the most open, embracing kind of way. I am cautiously optimistic after

we get through these elections, all these factors will pull this back because that center of gravity, that Western alignment has to remain in place to get to the right outcome in the negotiation. Well, and the polls know at the end of the day, after Ukraine, they're next. So I don't know that they have much of a choice. There's an election in a couple of weeks that everybody's been looking at for the last couple of years. We'll see what happens after that. But again, if Ukraine falls, Poland is next. So let's see what they do. I will say it is unfortunate, Mika, that the United States of America has a speaker of the House who who who there's only one way to put it. Made Vladimir Putin a very happy man yesterday when Kevin McCarthy proved he was too scared to be seen next to Zelensky because of a couple of freaks in his far right caucus. James McCaul, or not James McCaul, Michael McCaul,

that chairman and a lot of other Republicans would have met with Zelensky. Of course. Probably did. But to have a Speaker of the House being such a coward that he would provide aid and comfort, in effect, to Vladimir Putin, who, again, trust me, this is a huge win.

They will be talking about this on Russian state television. That's just shameful. And that tells you where this Republican Party is. Retired four-star Navy Admiral James Tavridis, thank you very much, as always, for being on this morning. And still ahead on Morning Joe, GOP infighting prevents movement on a key military spending bill for the second time this week. We'll have the latest on the looming government shutdown as Congress leaves for the weekend with no solution.

I mean, you just look you look at these Republicans. They they are making America less safe every day. They won't pass the budgets. They use it for political gamemanship. They won't promote military men and women that desperately need to move on to their next position. They won't meet with a leader on the on the edge of the fight for democracy. It's it's it's incredible. Plus, the ranking Democrat on the House Oversight Committee, Congressman Jamie Raskin will weigh in as his panel prepares to hold its first hearing on the impeachment inquiry into President Biden. Also ahead, two former secretaries of state, John Kerry and Condoleezza Rice, are our guests this morning. And the brand new poll this morning that shows President Biden opening up a pretty

significant lead on Donald Trump in New Hampshire. You're watching Morning Joe. We will be right back. He was strong on foreign policy and getting America's respect in the world. He was thin-skinned and easily distracted. He didn't do anything on fiscal policy and really spent a lot of money, and we're all paying the price for it. He did do a better job than Biden on the border, really trying to corral that in and stop that. He used to be good on foreign policy, and now he has started to walk it back and get weak in the knees when it comes to Ukraine. A terrible thing happened on January 6th,

and he called it a beautiful day. And in the eyes of America, it was a terrible thing happened on January 6th, and he called it a beautiful day. And in the eyes of America, it was a terrible day. Yeah, that's that. She got all that right, which I guess the reason why we're playing that clip is because Republicans that are running for president, other than Chris Christie and Ace Hutchinson, don't usually say that. Yeah, I think she's saying it. Republican presidential candidate Nikki Haley in New Hampshire yesterday responding to a question on how Trump's legacy will be remembered 100 years from now. Mike, this is a change. Again, you know, I'm always talking when you look at polls. Don't expect a 10 point or 20 point swing. Point two, five point five. Here you have Asa Hutchinson.

OK, not a lot to lose right now because he's so low in the bowl. Chris Christie focused on Donald Trump. Now you have Nikki Haley coming in, telling the truth about Donald Trump, the truth that everybody knows. They know it. And and, you know, that's three. Sometimes Mike Pence is in that group, too. That's significant. I mean, that's that's four more than it did it over Donald Trump's four years in office.

Yeah, but still, Nikki Haley, good for her yesterday because she did something that it's it's I can't understand why more of the candidates running against him for the nomination haven't done. If you're in a fight, what's the first instinct you have when someone throws a punch at you? You got to throw a punch back. Right. Nobody punches back. Nikki Haley punched back yesterday and it was effective to a certain extent. I think Jen watching her was very effective. It's just like, you know, it's kind of late. And also it took her a long time. You know, that that was like a great clip to watch here. But in terms of, you know, actually breaking through to voters, that is like much. You know, she's making a nuanced argument. She should have been doing this consistently from the from the get go.

In the beginning, she was just I don't kick sideways. But I think like the New Hampshire poll. You know what? New Hampshire folks have been hearing? What? A lot of Chris Christie. Yes. Right. Like so I think that may be the fact that you have Republicans in New Hampshire like Chris. That's his whole game, right, is New Hampshire. Right. And making this really forceful argument against Donald Trump. That's probably affecting. And by the way, Mike, as you know, in a state like New Hampshire, you know, we always talk about, oh, people see cable news, people do whatever. No, in New Hampshire, it goes town hall meeting to town hall meeting, church to church, school to school.

So if somebody heard Nikki Haley saying what Nikki Haley said, and last week they heard Chris Christie saying what Chris Christie says, that's getting around when they're in church. That's getting around when they're in the car line in school going, hey, did you see what Nikki said last night at the hall? Did you see what she said last night at the lot? And that does start to spread in New Hampshire and it starts to accumulate. You know, despite all the glittering media that we have around the country and every state and the nation focusing on politics, New Hampshire remains unique. And it still goes back to Mo Udall running for president in the early on politics. New Hampshire remains unique. And it still goes back to Mo Udall running for president in the early 1970s in New Hampshire, when he said he went into a barbershop and he asked a guy for his vote. And the guy said to me, he said, well, he said,

I haven't made up my mind about you. I've only met you twice. Right. I mean, people meet everyone in New Hampshire. If you go to Nashville, New Hampshire today, I was up there last week driving through Nashville, New Hampshire. You see signs of a Christie candidacy that's alive in Nashville, New Hampshire, because he's been up there so much. That's an old secret. It's not really a secret. You got to show up in New Hampshire. Yeah. And when you show up, the word spreads again, neighbor to neighbor, friend to friend, family to family. And and, you know, Chinese religious cults, their websites have a lot less impact. Right. And somebody talking to you again at school or in a car line saying, hey, so and so is like down the street last night. This is what they said. So here's that new survey of New Hampshire voters, which has President Biden leading former President Trump in a hypothetical rematch. The latest CNN University of New Hampshire poll finds 52 percent of potential 2024 voters

in the state would back Biden, while 40 percent would vote for Trump. Eight percent say they are either unsure or would back someone else. Really, it's early. This could be an outlier. But I think we're going to see this time and again. We're going to see national polls. We're going to be freaking out. And then we're going to see what people are saying in the suburbs, what people are saying in swing states like New Hampshire. And understand that Joe Biden is not buried quite yet. Yeah, he's not buried quite yet. And if you look inside that poll, there's been so much talk about Joe Biden's age and even Democrats want somebody else to run. And how many times have we heard this on this show privately when you go

have dinner with people? But if you look at this poll in New Hampshire, maybe they do have concerns about his age. Ninety four percent of Democrats say they will vote for Joe Biden. So there's your answer. I mean, he's they believe he's the guy in the absence of someone else coming along. They may not be thrilled. They may not be energized by him, but they're going to vote for him, especially if he's running against Donald Trump. And Jonathan Lemire, you look inside this poll. There are some concerns about the president's age, but he definitely has Democratic support in that 12 point margin. Again, it's one snapshot, one moment in time. Even Republicans appear to be fishing around. If you look through the numbers, they're not thrilled with the idea of Donald Trump, even as their nominee. It doesn't mean he won't win,

but there are some candidates kind of rising in New Hampshire below Donald Trump. They're not as far back as they are in some other states. Yeah, that's right. It does feel like every few weeks or a few months, like the talk about President Biden and his weaknesses for next year picks up again. And then you're reminded when we see polls like this or a piece of legislation done that actually he's in pretty good shape going into next year, though, of course, there are, as you say, Willie, those concerns about his age. That's top of mind for many, many voters. But the poll is interesting here. First, on the Republican side, the complete implosion of Ron DeSantis, who's now slid all the way to fifth.

That continues to, his campaign shows no signs of reversing that free fall. And some Republicans looking around, Haley has picked up some points. Christie does well in that state, though not others, which shows perhaps a little bit of softness there for Trump. But in terms of that Trump-Biden head-to-head for a general election, yes, one poll, but that's a pretty good number. Now, New Hampshire is not the battleground state that a Michigan or a Wisconsin or an Arizona or a Pennsylvania is. It has been trending blue the last few cycles. But still, it is one of those where both campaigns are going to put money in. They're going to put resources in. And it's clear that Joe Biden goes into that state with a

pretty significant lead. And the theory of the case from this White House from the get-go is that next year, as this campaign really ramps up and he starts hitting the road, that's when more Americans will feel the benefits of these economic policies. Well, they'll see those poll numbers pick up. Americans feeling feeling better about the progress made. And also, we're going to spend a year watching Donald Trump sit in the courtroom and that's going to turn off independents and swing voters. And even if they don't love Joe Biden, they'll still come back to him. Well, and they can turn off probably. I mean, here's here's my theory of the case right now. And if I thought Joe Biden was going to lose, I would say Joe Biden's going to lose. But my theory of the case all along has been these Democrats that are saying, you know, oh, he's too old.

And it's James Carville said a whole lot of bedwetting going on that it's 2023. They can say that as they get into 2024, as it gets closer to the election, as it becomes more obvious that Donald Trump could be the next president of the United States, I would be really surprised if the overwhelming majority of those Democrats not only came home, but they voted on the other side, not the case. And I told everybody this over the summer, I'm hearing from more and more friends and family members in suburbs say they will never vote for Donald Trump. Now, they will never vote for Joe Biden ever, but they will do what Republicans started to do in 2020. They'll vote for everybody on the ticket. They're not going to stay home.

They're going to vote for everybody on the ticket and they're going to leave the top line empty. And that's what's going to end up getting Donald Trump at the end of the day in the suburbs of Atlanta and Philly, New Hampshire, suburbs of Detroit, suburbs. I mean, you can go down the list. And Dobbs, right? I mean, they, you know, Jonathan says, you know, and Dobbs. I mean, that's so important. That's the issue. If you look at what's happened over the past year, it's just shocking how huge of an earthquake abortion. And like independent women being concerned about rights taken away from different states like that popped in a poll this week. You know, like this is it's very deep. And like Lemire says, the White House says the economy is going to get better next year and people are going to feel better about that.

That's the hope. That's that's the plan. I'm skeptical about that. Interest rates going up. Gas prices are going up joe it's the you know gonna be tight that is um but even recall in the midterms inflation was higher than it is now right it was not a great the economy was not doing great and what voters saw was the threat that was posed to democracy dobbs was such such a huge issue. You know, I just think fundamentally, and that this New Hampshire poll, I mean, yeah, it's one poll, whatever, but UNH and CNN, like this is a legit operation. Yeah.

That that state's been hearing a lot of anti-Trump messaging, the kind of messaging that you'll hear on saving democracy. They haven't been hearing a lot of Dobbs. And they're hearing about it from Republicans. They're hearing about it from Chris Christie. They're hearing about it from Republicans. Great. Yeah. I hope Chris Christie will when he's not the Republican nominee, will continue to help make that argument. Yes, exactly. And by the way, what you're hearing from Jen, you'll hear more of that in her new podcast with Claire McCaskill, How to Win 2024. This is an MSNBC original presentation, and it's good analysis with profanity that you will get between Claire and Jen.

And so it's a lot of fun. That's all Claire. Don't let that Missouri thing fool you. Oh, okay. It's just Claire. Artie being dubbed Willie, the Howard Stern of political analysis. Wow. High praise. High delay. High praise.

High praise. High praise. Coming up, the planet just had the hottest August ever, prompting a dire warning from the U.N. Secretary General. Just a caveat here. The hottest summer ever. The hottest August ever. The hottest July ever. And the hottest June ever.

Ever. Do we see a trend there, Republicans? Maybe. We'll talk with that with the U.S. Special Presidential Envoy for Climate, John Kerry, and our task is urgent. Humanity has opened the gates of hell, but the future is not fixed. It is for leaders like you to write it. The UN Secretary General delivering a stern message to world leaders during a climate change summit in New York City this week. It comes as we are learning more about just how hot the last few months have been historically. According to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, June,

July and August were the warmest, hottest those months have ever been globally since the group was founded 174 years ago. In the United States, this August was the ninth warmest on record, but the hottest ever for Florida, Mississippi and Louisiana. Last month, surface sea temperatures hit a record high for the fifth month in a row. I will tell you that. And that is here. Bad news, especially in hurricane season. But it's bad news year round. Let's bring in right now, Special Presidential Envoy for Climate,

former Secretary of State John Kerry. I want to talk about all that in a minute, but I have a couple of quick questions for you. You know, we were talking before you came on the air about about when we were over in Normandy, 75th anniversary of D-Day and walking through that cemetery of those fallen American soldiers. It was so extraordinarily moving. I can't help but think back to all of us walking through there back in 2019 and contrast that with the Speaker of the House who's afraid to even be seen in public with a freedom fighter like Zelensky. It's dramatic, Joe, and it's sad. I think that everybody understands that that President Biden has really done a remarkable job of bringing NATO together.

And and we really need to all of us as Americans focus. I mean, obviously, we see the challenges to democracy, but most importantly, the implications of Ukraine. You know, there are downstream impacts if we did not do what we're doing today. And the stakes in terms of foreign policy, in terms of relationships, America's word, our commitment to freedom, the meaning of freedom, everything is on the line in ukraine you can't allow an illegal uh grotesque uh criminal uh you know crossing of international border and attacking a country simply to change the border and take part of that country i mean that's what we stood up against all of world war ii and all the memorials around washington and the world to the heroism of that period of time. Right. We need to reflect on that. You know, we we just showed a poll out of New

Hampshire that shows Joe Biden ahead by a pretty good chunk right now. It's early, as you know, you've done this. You know all of this more than any of us do. But Jen brought up the fact that you know, New Hampshire, you know what it takes to win in New Hampshire. Curious your thoughts about the truth, actually staying a step ahead in New Hampshire from, let's say, larger states like Florida or Texas or California, where you run 30-second ads, and that's what people see. But in New Hampshire, it's neighbor to neighbor. People to people. It's church member to church member. Well, I'm not. As you know, I'm not in politics. I know, but I just want to talk about the process where maybe Chinese religious cult websites may fool people in a lot of places.

But in New Hampshire, the truth actually has a running start, doesn't it? Just as a generic comment, I love being in New Hampshire and I love being in Iowa. And the relationships that I built in those places during that time last today. And I still hear from the mayor of Manchester. I mean, it's incredibly personal. It's wonderful. It's what separates the United States from every other country in terms of our politics. It really is personal. You meet in the halls, you stay up till one in the morning answering questions, hopefully till every question is asked.

And it's a great part of the process. And it surprises. It's a reaffirmation of the basics of politics. And, you know, we'll see what happens. But I think, honestly, coming back to where we are here, if I may. Yeah. We'd like to keep you off track. You're so comfortable.

Purposeful diversion. Exactly. Nothing new on Morning Show. We're about to talk to you about the Giants game. So, yeah, you better move fast. No, but this is serious. What President Biden has been doing with respect to climate is quite remarkable. And you look at the the Inflation Reduction Act and I'm not here just to sort of, you know, the advertising or anything.

But it was a massive investment. It was a historic. It has set America up to lead. Right. In our economic future in ways that people haven't yet even fully tapped into. You know, it's really interesting because the transformation that we're going through economically is genuinely the largest economic transition since the Industrial Revolution. And we're going to see unbelievable amounts of new jobs created. Right now, there's a geothermal energy company where 60% of the employees of that company, which is fast growing, come out of oil and gas industry. So you're seeing the transformation already taking place.

And the International Energy Agency just told us we're about to reach a terminal downward trend in the demand for fossil fuel because of the amount of electric vehicles that are out there and the amount of renewable energy that's being deployed. So that is the future, Joe. It's absolutely cooked in now. CEOs, companies all around the world. We have 85 of the major corporations of America that have joined something that President Biden started called the First Movers Coalition. And they are buying, willingly paying a green premium. They're buying green products in order to send a message to the marketplace, a demand signal that you can have green steel, you can have green cement. Right.

That is a transformation that's taking place. And, you know, Mike, you get some of the top producers in the world talk to him privately and they'll tell you we may have 20, 25 more years of oil under the ground. We have got to race towards alternative. How are we doing in that? I mean, so so that is the race is on. Any CEO in America of an American company or global company knows reality, recognizes reality, recognizes what's coming down the road. But we're going to need partners. My question to you is, you just recently returned from Beijing. Where is China in all of this? Are they going to be with us, with the world,

or against the world? Are they going to be any help at all or a hindrance? Well, obviously, Mike, we really hope that we're going to be able to get somewhere with China in the course of the next months. We're meeting. We've been having discussions. I'm hopeful. I had meetings here in New York. We will be meeting in the next weeks. But we don't know the answer to that completely.

But we do know that China right now is outbuilding everybody in renewable energy. And they're deploying that energy at home. And literally, China is now deploying and manufacturing more than all the rest of the world put together. So China's made a decision. They had 52 degrees centigrade that last summer. They've had people dying because of the floods in China. So our hope is that we can depoliticize this issue, at least. It's a universal threat. We all need to be engaged in this. We need China, and we hope we can work with China in these next years.

So let's just be really blunt here, because I understand when politicians are running for office, they got to bash China. I get it. That's what they're doing on the Republican side, the Democratic side. There's a lot to be really concerned about with China. I'm as concerned as anybody else. But we really have no choice.

If we're talking about geopolitical stability, if we're talking about global economic growth for everybody, if we're talking about trade, if we're talking about the environment, we can't just tell China to go to hell. We got to figure out a way to make that relationship work for us. Right. Correct. And that is why President Biden has asked me and Secretary Blinken and Secretary Yellen and Secretary. I mean, you know, everybody has been engaged because the president understands that we have to find a way forward. Now, that doesn't mean he's moved back on any tough policy that is appropriate. But his hope is, I think, and our hope generally is that President Xi and President Biden may be able to meet or talk sometime in the future. Right now, we are trying to lay the groundwork to be able to cooperate to get this done.

We can't get it done without China. China has to be part of the table with us. And we can't get it done, actually, without. I just came back from Africa, where we had the African summit. It was really impressive the degree to which the leaders of Africa are now stepping up. But Africa has an entirely different challenge than we do. A lot of them don't have electricity. They want to develop.

And so there's this north-south tension that we must address intelligently, thoughtfully, to be able to help Africa to get development, but also not to do some of the things we did, which we now know are a problem. But Africa is also only 3% of all the emissions, Joe. So 80% of all the emissions in the world come from about 20 countries. And what percent come from China, India and the United States? China is 30% of all emissions. The United States is now about 10% and going down. And India is about 7%. I want to I want to get to Richard, but I just have to I just want to underline this because I had the CEO say this to me a couple of weeks ago. And he's right. You know, we bash this country so much. We always hear Republicans attacking the crunching for this. Democrats would say we're not doing enough there. Everybody.

When it comes to emissions, the United States over the past 15 years done a pretty damn good job, haven't we? Yes, but we need to do better. We need to do better. I completely agree. Yes, but we have done a great job. A lot of effort has gone into transitioning out of coal. Right. Right. And you're not going to see a new coal plant built in the United States now. The people are transitioning into alternatives. The fastest growing job in the United States a couple of years ago was wind turbine technician. The third fastest growing job was solar panel installer. Right. So that's happening now. There's a massive fusion. It's about one point seven trillion dollars of venture capital now moving into this sector. There's amazing stuff happening for the first time. Right. In a few years. Genuinely, I'm optimistic that we could win this battle. But if we do the things we have to do in this meeting we're going to have in Dubai, the UN meeting when we all come together.

Right. This is going to be one of the most important because we do have oil and gas at the table right now. And we need to be able to get oil and gas to be part of the solution because we don't win without that either. And Richard, you know, the thing is, people aren't investing in alternative energy sources to feel good about themselves. So I was trying to explain to people, if you don't like what a corporation is doing, it's not because they're trying to be good guys, good women. They're trying to make money. They talk. They respond to their shareholders. And that's exactly what's happening here.

The investments going into this area because this is this is not a feel good investment. This is about the bottom line and being a part of the future. Can I share something with you on that? The shipping, we've started a thing called the shipping challenge. We have the largest container shippers in the world. Maris, Yara, MSC, are now building carbon-free ships. And that's taken hold around the planet. So there's a massive shift in shipping. On the Amazon, we met with President Lula the other day. President Biden agreed with him that there's an incredible ability for us to be able to cooperate to deal with the Amazon, but also with the larger development issues of how Brazil can have the longevity in this transition. You know, I see just a host of things happening. Nuclear.

I was just in Romania where we are helping the Romanians to develop small modular reactors. Westinghouse is in Poland. Jobs. Right, building for nuclear plants. Your brother knows well about that. So there's just an amazing amount of economic energy right now. And the progress being made even in something like fusion, which has always been 30 years away, somewhere down the road. Now people are really beginning to see the potential of a prototype. That's a total game changer. That's exciting.

So there are exciting things. John, we just had the G20. Not a lot got accomplished there. Just had this week in New York. You mentioned the COP28 meeting in Dubai. What do you think is realistic that actually in a hard way can be accomplished? I know you're optimistic about the long run. What about the short and medium run?

What can we actually get done this time? I think, well, at this COP, there are three things that are already baked in. We have what's called a global stock take, which is a report card on how is everybody doing. And that report card is going to hold people accountable. It's going to hold them up to public scrutiny. We have a loss and damage fund, which has to be very delicately managed. It is being managed right now. I think we will do what we've set out to do, which is come up with a way to help those. Yesterday, I met with the Pacific Island states sitting around the table, our nation states, which are worried now about what happens if their island disappears, which they're really worried about.

And what happens to their statehood? Do they just no longer member of the UN? Where do their people go? How are they going to go? I mean, these are really big challenges. And these folks are on the front line of the disaster that is unfolding in front of everybody's eyes in the world. So, you know, at COP, we will have the ability, I think, to raise ambition and significantly and have a new finance mechanism with all the multilateral development banks,

with the private sector. No government has enough money to get this done. We need the private sector at the table. That's happening now. And you see more and more entrepreneurs putting money into innovation and creativity. U.S. Special Presidential Envoy for Climate, John Kerry. Thank you. And as always, it's great to see you.

Thanks. Good to see you guys. Richard Oss, thank you as well. Want to talk about the Giants? It's always good to have you. I think we run out of time. We can't talk about the Giants. Oh, really?

There's not a lot to talk about. Or the Yankees. It's not like the Patriots are so great of talking about our team. No, there's no reason. There's always next year. There's next year.