Morning Joe - Morning Joe 9/29/23

Episode Date: September 29, 2023

House GOP impeachment inquiry witnesses: No evidence Biden committed a crime

I have been following these hearings, save an hour off to do my Fox Business show earlier today. I don't know what was achieved over these last six plus hours. None of the witnesses today were fact witnesses. That means that none were involved in the investigation into the alleged activities in the first place. What's more, none of the witnesses testified today of direct knowledge of what Republicans have been claiming about Joe Biden. Where there's smoke today, we just got a lot more smoke. It's Fox News host Neil Cavuto with the same assessment that came out of yesterday's impeachment hearing and came out hearings before about the inquiry into Hunter Biden and how Joe Biden got so fabulously wealthy off of his crack addled son. Yeah. Lots of luck, fellas. His House Republicans

failed to produce any evidence, once again, linking the president to his son's business dealings. We're going to have a lot more from that hearing. Meanwhile, on Capitol Hill, it may take a miracle to stop a government shutdown right now. We're going to have the latest on any last-ditch efforts to fund the government before Sunday's deadline. And we're going to show you the big moments from President Biden's speech last night in Arizona. He actually focused on the threats to our democracy.

You know, that was the idea that was supposed to be such a loser in 2022 that so many people mocked him about. It wasn't Democrats won. Welcome to Morning Joe, Mika. Welcome to Morning Joe, Willie. How are you guys doing? Good morning. A lot going on. It is Friday, finally. It's running smoothly. You know what I'm going to do? I'm going to just get off the set or actually I'm going to read the paper record.

Well, I think actually, Joe, a lot of what we saw and we saw Neil Cavuto actually kind of bringing it home. There is nothing that the Republicans have put on the table. That's nothing they already have put on the table. And none of it is adding up to evidence. And while I mean, it's kind of funny along the way to watch them twist and turn and try and figure out how to make this into an investigation. But they're wasting America's time while we edge closer to a government shutdown. And Willie, their conclusion was the same conclusion the Wall Street Journal editorial page had about a month ago. A lot of smoke. OK, great. There's a lot of smoke. Where's the fire?

That's exactly what Cavuto was saying yesterday. A lot of smoke. You guys keep showing a smoke. There's never any fire because the smoke is usually being puffed out by people who, I don't know, are international fugitives. Yeah. Did they ever catch that guy? I think he's still on the run. The one who's the agent of the Chinese Communist Party and an arms dealer in the Middle East. I don't think he's a star witness. And illegally smuggling Iranian oil to the Communist Chinese Party. Yeah, that's Comer's big, big witness. And, you know, there was six and a half hours, something like that yesterday. Again, we were open to hearing new evidence. There wasn't any. In fact, Jonathan Turley,

the constitutional scholar who was there, said effectively, you guys don't have it. If you're looking for impeachment, there's no evidence that would get us there at this point. Maybe you're going to roll out some more, but let's have it. Remember, this is going on for years. Jonathan Turley said that he kind of been in Donald Trump's corner over the past several years. Just he's been a defender. He's been a defender. And as Mika points out, rightly, this hearing was going on while tomorrow.

Now, at midnight, the government likely is going to shut down and that government workers are already getting emails. They're getting their notices that they're going to be furloughed, that they're not going to be paid. So take that snapshot of those guys and women in that room for six and a half hours on a road to nowhere while the government is about to shut down and people are going to be put out of their jobs. And word out that Comer is now actually designating, like, some of these impeachment people as essential workers who will work for a government shutdown. By the way, I'm going to let this show start soon. I promise I am. But, you know, Willie, the Post is, as we've always said, this is the paper of record for Morning Joe. And there's just something on here that I just have a little problem with.

Zach, don't stop believing. I mean, come on, man. I mean, how many Octobers do you wait for the great pumpkin to rise from the pumpkin patch and give candy and treats to good little boys and girls before you understand it's never going to happen. Yeah, you kind of feel for the head coach, Robert Sala, who's a good coach and a good guy. He has to keep going out there and saying, Zach's our guy. Zach's our guy. We hear the naysayers. We know Joe Namath ripped him. Aaron Rodgers came out and supported Zach Wilson as well. But he's going to be on a huge stage this weekend, by the way, because the Chiefs are coming to town. That means

maybe Taylor Swift is coming to town, too. Good. So the country is going to get a look at Zach Wilson. And he's in year three now. It hasn't gone great. It seems unlikely they're going to turn it around. They signed a backup this week. So it looks like a long, long season there. How do you know when you are wildly out of touch with the rest of America, when you are a right winger, a far, far right winger attacking Taylor Swift? And also when when you don't follow football and you go, hey, this Kelsey guy, he may start getting some good publicity now that Taylor Swift is following. He's won a few Super Bowls, right? He's won a few Super Bowls.

By the way, speaking of the great pumpkin never rising from the pumpkin patch, let's go to the Boston Red Sox contingency. You know it's bad when your starting pitcher that loses is announced as your home opener pitcher for 2024. Yeah, but the Red Sox, give them credit. I mean, they allowed the Baltimore Orioles to take complete command last night of the American League. They clinched the American League East last night. So you're saying we lost. We lost.

And by losing, we actually won. We gave a gift to the Charm City. OK. You know, Do you feel good about that, Jonathan O'Meara? Look at that. 76-83. No, I don't feel good about that. Yes, we're happy for the

Orioles fans. It's a great fan base. They deserve this. But we have finished under 500 again. We will now finish below the Yankees again. The Yankees won the fight for fourth that has captivated the nation for so long. It actually has. People in Central Time Zone are going, who's going to finish fourth in American politics?

Yeah, no. We just, we found out last night. We did. We clinched it. It was this topic of discussion. You've got to calm down. You're not going to make it. You've got to.

I've been doing this for a while. What is it? What is it? Is this the third? We're like Republicans who've lost seven out of the last eight presidential contests with popular vote. Like the Red Sox. Are we three out of four? We've been in last place three out of the last. It is. And I think six or seven last place finishes in the last decade. Yeah. But, you know, the thing the thing we got going for us,

though, is we're a small to midsize market team. So people don't expect a whole lot. We don't have all the money in the world. Fans don't really care. I think. And the fans don't care. No. They're a disengaged fan base. All right.

A lot of people going to the top of the Prudential Center building to celebrate the end of the year. And now with that, let's go to Mika with the news. Yeah. It's kind of about time, don't you think? Also with us, the president of the National Action Network and host of MSNBC's Politics Nation, Reverend Al Sharpton is with us. The host of the podcast On Brand with Donny Deutsch, Donny Deutsch, and congressional investigations reporter for The Washington Post here in D.C. with me, Jackie Alimany. Great to have you all on board. Mika, we showed up on a new show here.

I don't mean to interrupt you. We showed up on a new show and a fashion show actually just broke out on this side of the table. I mean, if you want to look at these guys, I mean, Tom Ford, eat your heart out. What do you I would ask you guys what you were wearing, but I know you both have tailors that make your suits, and you don't buy things off the rack like me. But, Ralph, that is a sharp suit.

You could not have worn that in 1982. Those buttons would have been popping off. I couldn't have buttoned it in 1982. We have a brown motif, a fall kind of crunch. It is. A leaf seal going on. Yeah, very nice. Okay.

Are you going to do the news or what? Yeah, I'm good. I'm going to ask that you zip it. We have a lot to get to this morning, including this. A panel has ruled that Donald Trump will go on trial for civil fraud on Monday, where his entire New York real estate portfolio could be at stake. You know, Attorney General Letitia James, she probably has hit this former president where it hurts more than any other legal action against him. And you can see it in different mannerisms

and reactions among the Trump family. Yesterday, five judges decided to lift a temporary stay on the start of the non-jury trial put in place while they considered challenges by Trump's legal team. The former president's attorneys claimed that some of the charges brought by New York Attorney General Letitia James fell outside the statute of limitations, an argument rejected yesterday. On Tuesday, Judge Arthur Nguyen ruled that the former president, his two oldest sons and his company itself were liable of fraud. That means next week's trial will simply be to determine how much they pay damages in this case, which could include a fine of up to $250 million and the possible seizure of Trump's New York properties.

Yesterday, prosecutors informed the judge that they plan to call the former president and his sons to testify in addition to his daughter, Ivanka, and former Trump Organization CFO Alan Weisselberg and Trump's ex-attorney, Michael Cohen. This is a dramatic turn of events in this week in terms of Trump's legal issues, Joe. And we've been talking all about whether or not Joe Biden needs to fight back and talk about the legal cases against Donald Trump. He made a pretty eloquent speech about democracy and went after the MAGA movement. And we'll talk about that coming up. But at the same time, one could argue that you

let the law play out. And boy, did it ever this week. You know, it's so fascinating, Donnie, is everybody's been focused on the criminal cases. Of course they've been focused on the criminal cases. But, you know, we've known Donald for a very long time. And you just get the sense that a lot of the criminal cases and the possibility of incarceration is still an abstract concept to this guy, right? There's nothing abstract about this. This is his life work. This is a guy coming in from Queens with a huge chip on his shoulder and doing everything he can to build a Manhattan real estate empire. And the last few days, especially with the appeal

being rejected yesterday, show him that very soon that New York empire is going to be shut down if things continue in this direction. And he may even be booted from his Wall Street location, from Trump Tower. It's being monitored from from his West. It's being yeah, it's being monitored. It's there are a lot of ways this could turn out, but it looks actually like this civil case may be what's hitting them the hardest right now. That's a great point. And despite him being president of the United States, everything has always been about money for Donald.

Right. Still comes back. And we always say that when people say, why is he doing it? Why is he doing it? We always say, follow the money. It's always about running for president, everything. Yeah, he likes the attention, but the attention he thinks he can use to generate money the real reason he ran for president was to just get publicity for his business and look this hits

him in the gut and there's a very good chance he is going to have to divest himself of his properties and you know he is a man and his buildings and his tall buildings and his big buildings and everything is about size i mean it it means so much to him that in a in a in a very sick moment of many sick moments on January on September 11th, 2001, you know, as he was watching the towers go down, he goes, now I have the tallest building on Wall Street. It's a lie. But again, that shows you in his fevered brain how much those buildings mean to him. You know, there are two things that always meant things to him. The money and the stature with people like the people around this table in the media and people in New York City and people in L.A. and celebrities.

And he's lost both. The money has shrunk. And, of course, his standing with outside of Tupelo, Mississippi, is a different place. He could not walk into a restaurant in New York City now. So kind of both of those flanks have been taken away. And I think your point is really well taken. Yes, a lot of to a lot of people going to jail would probably be the scariest specter. But to him, the thing that is really probably sitting with him right now is his big, tall, long buildings may be going away. Now, a rev you've known him for a very long time. Would you agree? Absolutely agree.

I think I think the criminal indictments are something that he can spar with and he feels he may get away with. But I think that the civil case is an existential threat to him. This is who he is and his family and his whole family and his desire to show his dad who's gone that I told you I could be somebody. This takes away any inkling of him proving to dad that he could rise up. I was thinking just yesterday, right down Fifth Avenue. I have one grandchild, four year old grandson, Marcus Al. How one day I'll be right now, Fifth Avenue with my grandson saying, you know, that building used to be called Trump Towers and telling the story. That is the thing that Donald Trump is scared about.

He will be removed from the memory of the next generation because there'll be nothing called Trump if this civil case goes through 90 percent. I was I was going to say it's it's really it's it's already happened even in our time. I, you know, used to when I lived up in Connecticut, New Canaan, I'd go up the West Side Highway. And as I left, you'd see seven, eight buildings in a row, huge buildings. Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump. And there would be people that would pay a lot of money to slap his name on the side of the building. Coming in the city in 17 and 18, one at a time, they were taken down. They were taken down up and down the highway.

Now they're talking about actually taking Trump Tower and and other towers away from me. And by the way, some idiot, idiot, idiot said, oh, this happens in Stalinist nations. No, this actually happens in nations where there's a rule of law in Stalinist nations. You say, this is a Stalinist nation, and they take you out back, and they shoot you. Here, we have a rule of law. And everybody, let's just, for people

that aren't from Manhattan, that haven't lived in Manhattan everybody for years have known that Donald Trump has lied about his net worth has lied about his buildings has lied on his loans this is this is no shock to anybody. If this is a Stalinist nation, then Stalin has been deaf, dumb and blind for like 40 years because this is not a surprise. You know, when he was running in 16, I'd say, what do you think about Trump? Don't do business with him. He lies. He cheats. He doesn't pay his bills. He said you hear that from everybody. And also he exaggerates how much he's worth. You can't trust this guy in any business deal. Yeah. This is the Trump that's always been. Right. He was

just celebrity real estate developer before he got into politics. I told the story the other day about how he just simply renumbered the floors in Trump Tower just to claim that it could be taller than any other building nearby. So this is who he's always been. But now he suffers some consequences and his business empire has already shrunk, to your point. His name has been stripped off of buildings throughout the city. He still has a number of golf courses, but he stands risk of losing those, including a few here in New York State. And then Trump Tower was his pride and joy. That was his signature building.

That was his home for decades. And yes, he is no longer. Which is beat up now, by the way. Yes, and he is no longer in New York. He only spends a few nights a year in Trump Tower. He lives at Mar-a-Lago. He lives at Bedminster. But the city has always been such a part of his identity.

And we forget it now, but his first campaign was about being America's CEO, being a businessman. That has long since dissipated. And now this, so much of what he has done is still about making that money, driving that attention. And now a huge part of what he has done is still about making that money, driving that attention. And now a huge part of it's going to be gone. He's going to have to appear next week and stand trial, likely to take the fifth. He'll have to appear.

You know, Mike, again, this is not surprising to anybody who's lived in New York, even people who voted for Donald Trump, not surprised by this when when he was selected to run The Apprentice and to go around saying you're fired, you're fired. Like, you know, I'm not saying this to be mean. I mean, this was in all the papers. Like people that actually ran businesses that, yeah, they laughed about it. They mocked him and the fact that this guy was going to be some big business genius. And, you know, they're laughing and it's something that he always resented. But, you know, there's a guy that inherited the equivalent of 400 million dollars from his father and lost it.

Well, that attitude that many people in New York, especially people in businesses in New York, had had a 30 year run. You're right. They laughed at him for over three decades for his supposed business acumen. What's happening in starting Monday in New York raises the question, why didn't it begin sooner? Why didn't anyone in public office, in power, in public office over these 20 to 30 years in the past, why didn't they take it? You know, Mike, we asked that question in real time. We've asked that question. It's just I don't I don't know if people remember, but I kept asking about Jeffrey Epstein on here. Yes. I said, what's going on with Jeffrey Epstein? Why is this guy still walking around? I don't get it. And, you know, a year or two later, of course, thanks to some extraordinary reporting, it happened.

Julie Brown in Miami. Justice came to him. But it was in plain sight. It's the same thing with Donald Trump. We've been asking this for some time. They know he's lying on his loans. They know he's lying in everything he's doing on his net worth. Where where are the charges? And everybody was afraid to bring charges. Right. Where was where was the enforcement? The other aspect of it is people will be delighted. Many people will be delighted when he's on trial beginning Monday. They'll say he's finally getting his comeuppance. He might. We don't know what verdict will be ruled. It's a civil case, I believe.

We don't know what will happen in the case. But at the end of the case, at the end of all of these federal cases, you know what's going to be left? The damage that Donald Trump has already done to this country. It's deep and part of it's going to be lasting and part of it's going to be irreparable. And that's what we have to figure out as a nation, how to deal with that. Joe Biden began last night. Right. He did begin last night. We'll get to that, Willie, in a second. But again, this is this is again, I do wonder.

I've always thought if I had one count leveled against me, you know, the Fed's coming after me on one count. It'd be hard to focus on anything other than that. He's got ninety one counts. He's got his business empire crumbling. It's hard to figure out how this guy who's 78 or whatever, 77, 78, it's hard to figure out how, you know, when I see him confusing 2016 with 2008 and confusing Obama with Clinton, I mean, I actually, I can understand that. I'm surprised the guy's even still walking with with with, you know, 40 years of lies catching up with him all at once. Yeah, all the bluster and all the projection, you know, there's a lot going on there in that mind of the man we're looking at right there. I mean, we've talked to defense lawyers who some of them even sympathetic to Donald Trump who say

I might be able to get you off nine counts, but 91, there's going to be something in there that sticks. And so he's got to be very worried about that. I'd also point out on Trump's real estate, as Donnie knows, he doesn't really own most of those buildings in New York. He licenses his name. So other people build the buildings. He sells his name to stick on it. But that's a story for another day. So Republicans in the House running interference for Donald Trump. The House Oversight Committee held its first hearing yesterday in the Republican led impeachment inquiry into President Biden. Not a single witness called by Republicans confirmed any evidence that President Biden has committed a crime.

I am not here today to even suggest that there was corruption, fraud or any wrongdoing. In fact, I do not believe that the current evidence would support articles of impeachment. You mentioned in your oral testimony that you had written a commentary entitled, you'd go to prison for what Biden did. That was, you'd go to prison for what Hunter Biden did. Isn't that? That's exactly right. I was I was cutting down words to stay within my five minutes. You realize you realize. Yeah. Yeah. That's an important word, though, that you left out, though. Right. So none of the witnesses during six plus hours that hearing involved in the investigation into Hunter Biden's business dealings. They weren't involved. They were not fact witnesses. They were analysts. But they suggested more bank records are needed from

President Biden and Hunter Biden to determine whether a crime may have been committed or at least something worthy of impeachment. Meanwhile, House Oversight Committee Chair James Comer has deemed his staff essential workers. That means if the government does shut down, and it looks like we're headed that way, their work on the impeachment inquiry into President Biden will not be interrupted. So, Jackie Alimany, you're reporting on this hearing. Walk us through a little bit of what we saw yesterday and then that detail at the end, which is the government looks like it's going to shut down at midnight tomorrow night. So James Comer is protecting his staff and the people we saw in that room yesterday. Yeah, it nine months of

investigative work that has borne no fruit whatsoever, no evidence and no new evidence connecting Joe Biden to any of these allegations that James Comer made yesterday presented at all, even by these handpicked GOP witnesses who Comer had assumed would vouch for this investigation. But you heard all of them say, sure, you can do you want to do an impeachment inquiry. There are enough questions here that you can open an inquiry, but there are certainly not enough evidence, nothing that arises to high crimes and misdemeanors for the House GOP conference to continue with any sort of impeachment articles. I had senior GOP aides yesterday texting me mid-hearing that they were sort of astounded at the way the hearing was playing out, that they couldn't believe that Comer and his staff

had actually called witnesses who they assumed would vouch for their entire narrative, who instead did the opposite. They said that Comer lost control of the hearing, that he allowed Democrats to sort of discredit and attack the witnesses as well and poke holes in the arguments that they were making, and that the media narrative as well had just completely collapsed. What is this about? I mean, you're writing how this is an impeachment inquiry like none other. Usually, do you come to the table with more than this? And you said that Republicans, even behind the scenes, were a little surprised. What are they hoping to get out of this at this point, especially when we are days, hours away from a government shutdown? This seems like a political loser for them. These are excellent questions, Mika, that even House lawmakers, Republican lawmakers have. People like Ken Buck, who have been asking them quite loudly on our airwaves and really across the media.

There is not a ton of buy-in. That's why Kevin McCarthy did not hold an actual formal vote on the House floor to authorize this impeachment inquiry. You know, I we don't talk enough about the context, but and I know we talk all the time about precedents here. But a slate of historians and constitutional experts I spoke to said that there is absolutely no constitutional basis for this. In fact, it's anathema to, you know, what the framers had in mind when they envisioned the impeachment lever, that glass box being broken to help in a time of crisis to hold the president accountable if they needed to. And that this is not that, that this is the first time we are trying to, Republicans are trying to impeach someone for the crimes of a presidential relative and actions that were taken by a presidential relative before Joe Biden was even in the Oval Office. My Lord. Yeah, I mean, it is it's really incredible. And we've been talking about for some

time about how this has been the gang that couldn't shoot straight. They've been promising one thing after another. Nothing's happened. And again, the fact that you would actually get people on that have actually been on Donald Trump's side through most of his presidency, you know, constitutional scholars who say you got nothing here. You wonder the degree of incompetence that would have a chairman of any committee calling somebody who, again, is going to actually undermine your case. Well, here's a history of that chairman saying doesn't really have a whole lot there. Take a look. Have you found anything illegal while he was actually in office? Well, we found a lot that's certainly unethical.

We found a lot that should be illegal. There's no evidence that Joe Biden did anything illegally. Well, if you look at the laptop and the emails between the president's son and his associates, they went to great lengths to hide Joe's involvement. Hold on a second, Congressman. Did you just say that the whistleblower or the informant is now missing? Well, we we're hopeful that we can find the informant. Make it easy for us.

What was the crime? Well, the crime is trading policy for money. Which policy? Well, we're going to get into that. Do you believe that this is now officially the Joe Biden bribery allegation? And do you believe that you will be able to prove that, Jim Comer? I sure hope so. And I do believe that there's a lot of smoke and where there's smoke, there's fire. I'm telling you, I'm telling you, it's better than Green Acres. It really is. You don't have Arnold the pig, but there's no Arnold the pig.

It would be funny if it wasn't so sad. You know, Mika, it would be funny if, oh wait, it's funny. No, no, it's ridiculous. They're making fools of themselves. You don't think the Biden White House is loving watching this? I mean, this is this is just and they keep doing it. My favorite part is where a certain host goes, wait a second, wait a second. You're telling me your informant has gone missing like we're supposed to think that I, this guy's covered in Iranian oil, hugging members of the Chinese Communist Party, Jonathan. Like everything they're doing is just it's a clown show. Yeah. The Biden White House didn't disappear. The witness. He's a fugitive overseas. There's real anger among Republicans on how this went down yesterday. There should be.

There's still some true believers, the Comers, the Jordans, who believe that they, or at least they're acting as if, that there's here, there's enough here to lead to an eventual impeachment of President Biden. There are other Republicans who are leery of coming to these proceedings,

but still want to see them go well, score political points, as you might will. And they thought yesterday was an abject disaster, that those witnesses undercut everything. Jonathan, there's nothing there. There's nothing there. And by the way, if there is something there, hold it until you got it till you can display it till you can prove it. They've got nothing. They know they've got

nothing. So they keep humiliating themselves. They do. And this is why McCarthy didn't want to go to a vote because he knew he didn't have the votes. And the speaker who's hanging on by a thread right now in terms of keeping that post, looming government shutdown, it looks like the Republicans are more focused on this clown show, on this nonsense, than trying to keep the lights on. And McCarthy may face a vote, a vacate vote in the coming days led by Matt Gaetz. And this isn't going to help, even if he's not directly involved. And it just makes the Republicans look completely out of touch. And certainly the White House staffers I did hear from yesterday were chortling as to how this went down. Of course they were chortling.

You know, we don't say that in the South, but I guess that's a Boston thing. But yes, they were chortling. But Mike Barnicle, what are they going to do? I mean, why are they doing this? And if if if McCarthy does have a no confidence vote, so to speak, if somebody calls to vacate the chair, all that does is make Republicans look like fools again, because it's going to be a repeat of what happened at the beginning of the session. The only person that's going to get 218 votes is going to be McCarthy. OK, so you've been there. You've actually been there. I am.

You were a member. I caused a lot of chaos myself. I remember that. Yeah. I remember all the chaos. Yes. But are we not talking about an impeachment hearing, a phony, fake, laugh out loud impeachment hearing only because Kevin McCarthy had to throw something to 10 members of his own party to keep his job as speaker.

Isn't that why this is being held? I mean, Donnie, management, you know, management 101. I mean, it's one of the things I learned very early on. Don't take a job if you're set up for failure. And McCarthy took a job where he was set up for failure, where he was begging people for it. Never beg people for a job. You know, anytime anybody calls me up, says what I want, you know, I won't say not this network, but let's just say it other places. And they start saying, well, why don't you do this?

I go, well, I'll tell you what. Why don't you come here and do this job? Because maybe you can do a better job than me. No, you take it on your own terms. McCarthy didn't do it. Nancy always did. And that's why McCarthy's suffering through this right now. McCarthy's a joke. Republicans are a joke. And I want to go back to something Willie said earlier. This is going against the backdrop of we are a day away from four million government workers losing their jobs, TSA people not showing up, the military not getting paid, our economy put at tremendous risk. Real, real, real devastation to real Americans.

And the clown show continues. And that's what's particularly galling at this moment in time. At this particular moment, as I said, where we real Americans are going to be affected. And this joke, this clown mobile with 80, 18 clowns getting out of a Volkswagen. Yeah. What's going on? Donnie Deutsch, ladies and gentlemen, at 6.32 a.m., called himself a real American. We real Americans. How about you just say real Americans? I thought I said real. I would never put myself in that rarefied.

I am a real American. Do you still have all the people running around cleaning your front sidewalk? No, I don't. You don't anymore. So you're a real American. I'm a real American? Do you still have all the people running around cleaning your front your front sidewalk? No, I don't. You don't anymore. So you're a real American. I move. OK, very good. Real proud American wearing brown with the Rev. Yeah. So so so Rev, I mean, at the end of the end of the day, this is just again, this is just more bad news for this Republican Party. I mean, you look at what's happened in this impeachment deal. There's chaos inside the House. The Wall Street Journal editorial page today is talking about the candidates. You know, we read the other day about, hey, Republicans, do you really want to do this again? Do you really want to lose? This morning is about the candidates giving Donald Trump a pass and the editorial says GOP candidates largely left the front runner off the hook.

All of it is to court irrelevance if they can't cut into Trump's commanding lead. And no one is going to become a credible, credible alternative fighting about curtains at the United Nations. Here's my favorite line. It is possible to challenge Mr. Trump's record without sounding like left wing scolds at CNN or MSNBC. Boom. Right. No. Well, you know, what is striking to me the other day when you and I were talking, you asked me about when I ran for president. Yeah. And I thought about the debates. What was very striking to me, and it deals with the brand of the Republican Party, if I can borrow the branding expert here. Guru. The guru. Okay. Is the brand of the Republican Party has been severely damaged that could have been advanced at the debate. When when Bob Menendez, Senator Menendez, was indicted the other day, not convicted, indicted, Democrats lined up and said he should leave the Senate.

Not one Republican candidate has said with four indictments that Donald Trump should step out of the race. If I was on that stage, I would have said, just like the Democrats say when you are accused, you should step aside. Right. Donald Trump, for the good of the party, should step aside, whether he did it or not. Right. The fact that no one has even called on him to step aside. Four indictments. Other than Christie, yeah.

Other than Christie. Four cases, 91 indictments and Other than Christie. Yeah. Other than Christie, four cases, 91 indictments and a civil case. Right. And you can't stand up and say what Democrats are saying about Bob Menendez. That is bad branding. Well, that's also one of the things that the Wall Street Journal editorial page said this morning about hopefully in the next debate, the questions that are asked from the moderators will actually push them more on these issues because none of these questions, including the incredible bombshell that dropped about him possibly being stripped of his businesses in New York, was even brought up. Hey, Willie, before we go, a full page ad this morning, or really not an ad, just an announcement by the Wall Street Journal.

Six months, hashtag, I stand with Evan. It has now been six months that he has been held in Russian jails for being a journalist. Yeah, six months. He had a hearing last week where he was appealing his pretrial detention, that he should be released before the trial, that was denied. Of course, we had Secretary Anthony Blinken on the set with us last week. We asked him about that. They say even as they secured the release of those five Americans from Iran last week, they continue to work on the case of Evan Gershkovitz and Paul Whelan. But, yes, six long months for a great Wall Street Journal reporter that we hope comes home very soon.

And we will be following that we hope comes home very soon. And we will be following that. Donnie, thank you. We're going to see you in our fourth hour with a new edition of Brand Up, Brand Down. Kids are staying home from school. It's so popular. But the negative is that the school system really takes the brunt of this because a lot of kids have to watch Brand Up, Brand Down so they can talk about it the weekend. They do. Bring it back here to D.C. Still ahead on Morning Joe. Congress has less than two days to reach a government funding deal. We'll have the latest on the looming shutdown and what it could mean. And we'll talk to Democratic Senators Chris Murphy and Gary Peters about a potential path forward through the upper chamber. Also ahead, Senator Bob Menendez received a muted response

after he addressed colleagues for the first time since his federal indictment. We'll show you what the New Jersey Democrat is saying about the growing calls from within the party for him to resign. Plus, just how much interest is there to watch the Republican presidential candidates debate without Donald Trump, especially when they're really not talking about him either. We'll have a look at how many people tuned in on Wednesday night as the former president is already planning to skip November's debate in Miami. You're watching Morning Joe. We'll be right back. Rainy Friday morning here in New York City, but still a beautiful shot of New York Harbor looking down into lower Manhattan at 642 in the morning. President Biden yesterday called former President Trump and the MAGA movement a direct threat

to American democracy. The president spoke in Tempe, Arizona, to celebrate a library being built there in honor of the late Republican senator, his old friend, John McCain. I've come to honor the McCain Institute and Library because they are a home of a proud Republican who put his country first. Our commitment should be no less because democracy should unite all Americans, regardless of political affiliation. And there's something dangerous happening in America now. There's an extremist movement that does not share the basic beliefs in our democracy. The MAGA movement.

Not every Republican, not even a majority of Republicans, adhere to the MAGA's extremist ideology. I know because I've been able to work with Republicans my whole career. But there's no question that today's Republican Party is driven and intimidated by MAGA Republican extremists. Their extreme agenda is carried out fundamentally all of the institutions of American democracy as we know it. They're pushing a notion the defeated former president expressed when he was in office and believes applies only to him. And this is a dangerous notion.

This president is above the law, no limits on power. Trump says the Constitution gave him, quote, the right to do whatever he wants as president, end of quote. I've never heard a president say that in jest. Not guided by the Constitution or by comment, service and decency toward our fellow Americans, but by vengeance and vindictiveness. So, Joe, yesterday was the

beginning of an explicit case that the president is going to now make throughout the campaign about democracy. On the one hand, talking about the economy. Look at all we've done, historically low unemployment, et cetera, but also presenting the stakes to voters that if Donald Trump is put back in the White House, here's what's going to happen. It's something a lot of people have been calling for. And it started yesterday. Yeah, it did start yesterday. I thought it was effective. I mean, this is this is a message. And I've got to say, I'm glad that when he talks about this, he talks specifically about MAGA Republicans and says explicitly not all Republicans, because I know an awful lot of Republicans very concerned about the fact that you have a president

talking about assassinating the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, talking about defunding the FBI, defunding the Department of Justice, tearing at the very institutions that have made this country, you know, what it is that that protected our rights and our freedoms. Let's bring in right now, though, President Emeritus of the Council on Foreign Relations, Richard Haass. Richard, I remember when Joe Biden started talking about democracy before the 22 election. So many pundits were laughing at him saying, oh, it's too abstract. People will never understand this. Experts were saying, no, what you want to do,

you want to talk about something they can understand at the dinner table. Ended up a lot of people at the dinner table did understand the threat to democracy, and it actually moved just like abortion, which wasn't supposed to be a big issue if you looked at the polls beforehand. It ended up that women's right to choose and the preservation of American democracy were actually two critical issues for voters. And they still are, aren't they? Absolutely. There's not going to be a line on the ballot in 13 months that says democracy.

But make no mistake about it. Democracy's on the ballot in all these races. I think what the president needs to do is build on the speech, which was a good speech, and talk about even almost state of Americans. You may disagree with me on this issue or that, but there's something larger at stake here, which is democracy. So I think he has to do that and also remind people not just about the stakes, not just about the rest. What's the case for democracy? He hinted at it. He didn't really develop that. Why does the average American have a stake that American democracy continues? He needs to remind

us how democracy historically is delivered, how we've done well despite our current problems, and what happens to us if democracy in this country, if we become another Hungary, if we become an illiberal democracy, what a president could do. And by the way, he's got a pretty good case study what happens when democracy fails. It's called the shutdown. It shows that we can't deliver and how average Americans really suffer. And it really does. It concerns our allies, the dysfunction. I will say, though, again, talking about the potency, potency and the power of the democracy message. A lot of us were surprised, even though we were hopeful, a lot of us were surprised

at how just about every top tier candidate that was running as an election denier. They lost. They lost in Arizona. They lost in state in Pennsylvania. They lost in state after state across the United States. This is a powerful message. Yeah. Plenty of House members were returned to their seats, but those high profile Senate and governor candidates lost. And most importantly, the secretary of state candidate also would be counting the votes. Largely lost. This is the fourth in a series of speeches the president has given on this topic. President Biden is, you know, is one who likes enjoying proving political pundits wrong. And senior White House aides I talked to say that he is really glad that this resonated last November and they think it will again. And this is what he's been saying behind closed doors

in recent weeks. He's been giving fundraisers across the country, and he's made this argument. And yesterday, he took it to the public. And he also tied in with current events. He linked the MAGA extremism to the government shutdown. He linked MAGA extremism to the threats against Chairman Milley, which happened just a few days before. He also used Donald Trump's name, which he almost never does. And he made it very clear as to what will be at stake this next time around. His favorite saying is, you know, don't compare me to the Almighty, compare me to the alternative. He made very clear what the alternative is. It's Donald Trump and what that would mean for the country. And look for a series of speeches like this in the next 15 months or so. And

yesterday, it was very personal to the president because he was able to, Mike, link it to the memory of his friend John McCain, who we have been just thinking about while in Vietnam a few weeks ago and dedicated this new library to his memory and point to him as a Republican who would stand up for patriotism over party and called for more to do the same. He was deeply moved in Hanoi at the tribute to McCain at the plaque that they have in central Hanoi by the lake where John McCain dropped into parachute when his plane was shot down. Deeply moved by that. It continues with the speech yesterday, as you're just talking about. And the fundraisers that he's had around the country, you hear anecdotally that within the fundraisers, he will talk off the record, obviously, because we're not there. But he will talk about the threat

that he was speaking about yesterday as if it's a contagion. It's out there. It's infected the culture. And he will talk about the culture more than he will about the politics, that what has happened to our culture as a result of the denials, the denials of who was rightfully elected president of the United States. And Richard, he will also talk about the fact that when he goes overseas, as he just did to India and Hanoi and other countries that he's visited as president of the United States, within the first five minutes, a leader of that country, whatever country he is in, will raise the prospect fearfully of what's going to happen next to you. You're going to run for reelection. What's going to happen if

you lose? 100 percent. I get that question more than any other. I meet with foreign leaders all the time. It used to be when we had an election for all the differences between the Republican and the Democrat, the similarities were greater. They were almost operating within the 40-yard lines. The fact that we now have a party and a likely nominee in one of the end zones, who then, if elected, would introduce all sorts of changes, it means our friends can't count on us. Look at the consequences to the debate about Ukraine. People literally don't know if in 13 months the spigot begins to get turned off. Clearly, the Russians, the Chinese and others are literally waiting us out. I do not remember, Mike, that that ever happened to this degree in American history.

Plus, in the meantime, how are we supposed to stand up and basically say democracy is an important form of government around the world? How can we if we don't walk the walk, how can we talk the talk? The best way we promote democracy is by setting the example that democracy works. If you're a democracy, you thrive politically, economically, culturally. We can't make that that argument anymore. You know, you know, Rev, you and I have talked at great lengths both on and off the show about the irony, but also the beautiful irony of the fact that Madisonian democracy was saved in large part in 2020 by the very people who on the surface, you would think would have the least stake in saving Madisonian democracy. But black women in Atlanta, black women in Philadelphia, in Milwaukee,

all across the country in these swing states, got in line, voted, made the difference in Wisconsin, made the difference in Michigan, made the difference in Philadelphia, made the difference, literally made the difference in the state of Georgia. And I've been talking to a lot of pollsters over the last three, four, five days about all the polling that's come out. And they say it's not the white voters right now that Biden needs to be the most concerned about because they are fleeing Donald Trump and numbers high enough for Joe Biden to win, not comfortably, but to win more comfortably than last time. The problem right now is he is not inspiring black voters. He's not inspiring Hispanics, people of color. He's sitting at 50 percent with a lot of people just completely disconnected right now.

They're not saying, hey, we're going to vote for Donald Trump. They just they don't have a buy in right now on Joe Biden. Why is that? I think that he began addressing that yesterday inadvertently because he's not made it clear that, yes, there are still many things you aspire to achieve. Yes, there are roadblocks. I represent you getting there. He represents you can never get there. When he raised this speech yesterday, which I thought was very important to black women, black people, Hispanics and others. He said this guy is about autocracy. He's about him in making the final decisions.

I'm about trying to keep our pursuit of a democratic state. And and and for that, it gives hope. My mother, who was raised, born and raised in the segregated Jim Crow South, came to New York, married my father, had us. My mother never enjoyed what I did, but she would vote and participate, hoping her children would have a better life. Right. And that's what Joe Biden has got to say. I know it's not perfect. I know there are things that you're still dealing with. But I represent what you hope for. He represents the end of that. He will make all the decisions. Him and his little group will decide everything. And he's not on your side. If you run with that, Ronald Reagan, who I disagree with politically, always gave us the hope and the shining light

on the hill. This guy is about glitz and me. And the more Biden runs on that, the more a lot of people will be energized in communities that are not energized because they can't see what is there, but they can see what they hope for. And Richard, before we let you go, I have to ask you one question.

And your position is Morning Joe official golf, a golf consultant. Apparently things not. I always say we went to Jerry Baker's party last night, book party last night, and there's a lot of talk about some of the things where America's on the decline. I always say America's not on the decline, that our greatest days lie ahead. That apparently, though, does not extend to our golfers. I see where you're going here. Yes, Joe, while you were sleeping.

While I was sleeping. The first foursomes, four foursomes were played in the Ryder Cup. Yeah. And for the first time. Did we win already? Pardon me? Did we win already? USA. USA. We're down four to nothing. It has never been this bad. Never happened. This is the first time held in Italy. And this is. But this afternoon, there's a chance for redemption, Joe. Yeah. At that famous golfer.

Yeah. Yogi Berra said it ain't over till it's over. It ain't over till it's over. I will tell you what is over, though. Willie and my golf clinic. We had over the last year, we had started actually doing this as a side hustle, side gig. We thought we could help the guys in the Ryder Cup. Yeah. Apparently.

Clearly you had an effect. Apparently we did have an effect, but not a positive one. Richard Haas, thank you so much. And Mika, what do we have next? Well, just wrapping up here with Jackie Alimany, we've been planning a wedding. But also, tell us what you're watching. Jackie's. Oh, good.

Thank God. Yeah. I haven't done. Jackie's. Oh, good. Thank God. Yeah. I haven't done that on TV. Oh, my God. Well, congratulations. I'm all about it. I love this. So but no, let's tell me now, professionally speaking, what are you watching for today? Well, we are likely headed for a shutdown. Lawmakers are going to throw a few Hail Marys. They're going to stay in session over the weekend. The House GOP conference is likely going to try to vote today on a continuing resolution that Byron Donalds penned. It's basically a $1.47 trillion annual clip fund that would keep the government funded for either 30 to 45 days. The timing is unclear, but McCarthy still lacks the support to even get that continuing resolution done. And meanwhile, the Senate is unclear, but McCarthy still lacks the support to even get that continuing resolution

done. And meanwhile, the Senate is headed towards passing a bipartisan continuing resolution. So that leaves us really at where we are this morning, which is headed for a shutdown. I'm also looking for a potential motion to vacate. My colleagues had an excellent scoop last night about Matt Gaetz's plans to bring that to the floor as soon as Sunday and potentially trying to get Tom Emmer, congressman from Minnesota, ramped up to replace McCarthy. We'll see if that happens. Could be a crazy weekend here in Washington, D.C. Jackie Alimany, thank you very much and congratulations. Thank you.